# Chrysanthemums - toxic or not?



## Themis (Dec 18, 2009)

I'm finding conflicting stuff when I google it.

I have one in my bedroom that I'm tying to keep away from my cats but I'm not sure if its necessary?


----------



## buffie (May 31, 2010)

I tried googling" chrysanthemums toxic to cats "and it seems to confirm that it is!In particular leaves and stem.


----------



## tyrole (May 5, 2009)

And lilies which are my favourite


----------



## ibbica (Aug 9, 2010)

Chrysanthemums produce and contain pyrethrum, the insecticide on which the synthetic pyrethroids are based - including the dreaded permethrins. Pyrethroids are designed to have the same insecticidal characteristics as pyrethrum (which is actually a combination of a number of different chemicals, including the pair of pyrethrins - NOT the same as the permethrins, btw), but to be more stable (particularly in sunlight).

Confusing terminology, I know! The gist of it is this: the toxins found in the chrysanthemum plant itself are not nearly as dangerous as their synthetic cousins, because they are more readily degraded and/or eliminated - even by cats. That being said, yes, they are still toxic to cats (and to other mammals) _in sufficient concentrations_ (and to fish in very low concentrations, btw!).

Personally, I'd play it safe and keep kitty away from the mums (or vice versa). If you must keep your mums within kitty's reach, odds are good that if they have a source of catgrass or other 'safe' plants they'll leave it alone anyway (...or ingest so little that it won't harm them, though they might vomit a bit ).


----------



## ibbica (Aug 9, 2010)

tyrole said:


> And lilies which are my favourite


Lilies are absolutely highly toxic to cats - and to people, for that matter! They contain high levels of oxalates (as do many popular houseplants, including Calla lilies, Diffenbachia, and Philodendron), which can cause acute (and potentially fatal) kidney failure. If you own a cat... keep lilies out of your home. Even the pollen falling on a passing cat can be licked off later, potentially causing a fatal poisoning.

Note that a number of plants contain oxalates... but in much lower concentrations. Do your research to keep your kitties safe :001_cool:


----------



## HannahKate (Jun 6, 2010)

I would love to see some research into how many cats actually get poisoned by this stuff. I would imagine that its a tiny tiny percentage. Often, poisonous stuff tastes like crap and animals are highly unlikely to ingest it anyway.


----------



## hobbs2004 (Mar 12, 2010)

I am with HK on this. Does anyone know how frequent such poisonings are?


----------



## Philski (May 28, 2010)

ibbica said:


> Lilies are absolutely highly toxic to cats - and to people, for that matter! Even the pollen falling on a passing cat can be licked off later, potentially causing a fatal poisoning.


I just Wikied lilies and although I knew that they are toxic to cats, the article says that 'many varieties are extremely toxic' - does that imply that some are not, or just that other varieties are _quite_ toxic, etc? I suspect it's the latter, but I like lilies too and if there are any varieties that are safe I would be interested to know.


----------



## ibbica (Aug 9, 2010)

As far as I know, no species of lily is entirely safe.

I do, however, want to correct something I said in my previous post... apparently, "true" lilies (Liliaceae) don't necessarily contain high concentrations of oxalates. HOWEVER, this doesn't mean they're not toxic! A kitten mouthing a lily plant can become extremely ill even without any ingestion.

We don't know just what it in lilies that makes them so incredibly toxic to cats  (I suspect it's the alkaloids they produce, but not all lilies produce the same alkaloids, and concentrations are unknown, and and and...)

I don't know of any lily that's demonstrably "safe" for cats... this article includes (in the introduction) a list of known- and suspected-toxic lilies, as well as an attempt at identifying the toxin in Easter Lilies specifically:
A comprehensive study of Easter lily poisoning in ... [J Vet Diagn Invest. 2004] - PubMed result

If you can't live without your lilies, you could plant lilies outside (in the garden, or window boxes) and keep your cats indoors. Or put the lilies in hanging pots where the cats can't get to them. Or find some nice silk lilies to keep in a vase. Of course, you could also take your chances and hope that (1) the species of lily you choose isn't "highly" toxic (i.e. is on a 'suspected toxic' list rather than a 'known to be fatally toxic' list, and/or requires ingestion rather than passive contact) and/or (2) your cat will ignore them. Personally, I wouldn't take the chance, but of course it's up to you.


----------



## Philski (May 28, 2010)

No, I wouldn't take the risk, and I can certainly live without lilies! However, I used to have them in the house before I learned better, but I must have been very lucky that my two cats at the time didn't go near them...


----------



## Themis (Dec 18, 2009)

Thanks for the replies.

I have a long list on my fridge that tells me which plants are toxic and which are ok but Chrysanthemums dont appear on it at all.

I keep it in my bedroom where they cant get at it so they should be ok anyway.

I wouldn't risk liliies at all as I have heard that the pollen causes kidney damage. I heard of someone who had to get their cats kidneys flushed out. I'm not sure if that was true though as it was on the net but it's put me off.


----------



## tyrole (May 5, 2009)

I can live without lilies.
My husband bought me a bunch last month before we realised how toxic they were  I googled them within minutes of them being in the house as Max was showing a big interest in them. I gave them to my neighbour who as you can imagine was chuffed to bits  she in return gave me 4 nice pieces of filleted trout which Max really enjoyed  not all 4 though


----------

