# New royal python owner and concerned...please help



## jenw6 (Jul 30, 2012)

Hi, I was recently given a royal python and he was bought from a garden centre. We were told he is 6months old but he is only 22inches long and weighs 102g, he is so small i doubt he can be 6months old?! He is going through a shed and it's a really bad one, it won't come off his head/neck or his tail and he has patchy bits down his sides. He has also apparently only eaten one fuzzie mouse in the last 3weeks and he feels "empty", like an empty sack almost. I don't want to return him as I feel so attached already but can't help thinking we have purchased an unhealthy snake. Please can I have some opinions on this? And some advice  when do i attempt to feed? Should I bath him to try get the remaining skin off even though he has only had 3 days to settle into a new environment? Sorry for the long post I am just worried, thanks.


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## Paul Dunham (Apr 1, 2010)

Royal Pythons are by no means a beginners snake.. They are well known for feeding problems and often cause a great deal of heartache.. 22" doesn't sound ridiculously small for a 6 month old Royal Python... Hatchlings range beteen 60-90g's.. Males grow only to 3/4ft and females about 5ft.. I've heard stories of 6 footers, but never seen one after probably seeing a few thousand over the years.. Your snake doesn't sound overly small.. It does sound unhealthy by the description you've given..

Shops are notorious for lying about Royals Pythons feeding for them in the shop.. Royal Pythons are usually pretty firm feeling snakes to the touch.. If yours feels like an empty sack then there's a good chance it's empty, not fed in a good while, weak, and you've been sold a none feeder.. If I were you I'd take it back and demand my money back.. Never buy snakes from a shop.. Buy them from a breeder... Every city's got people who breed snakes.. You can usually find them on the internet.. Even a reptile club or society could put you in touch with local breeders/enthusiasts.. Shops give keeping reptiles a bad name.. Bad experiences such as yours can put someone off reptiles for good...

His shedding problems could also be an indication of bad health.. but more likely the environment he's in is too dry and his skin isn't coming away cleanly because it's sticking too his body.. What I usually do is put some damp moss in a cloth bag with the snake and leave the bag inside the vivarium until his skin comes off.. (humidity builds up and softens the skin and it comes away).. The skins only sticking to him because it's too dry.. I tend to leave it overnight and see what they're like in the morning... They use to use damp newspaper years ago, but I've always been worried about the chemicals impregnated in newspaper...

Don't bathe him.. that will stress him out even more and make it less likely he'll feed.. Your snake needs complete silence and left alone as much as possible before he's likely to begin feeding again.. I guess what I would do is offer him food roughly every 2/3 days until he begins to feed once again.. Don't pick him up for a few days after he's fed because stress of being picked up can make them regurgitate their food...


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## jenw6 (Jul 30, 2012)

Thanks for the reply, I'm surprised you say royals aren't a beginners snake as all the forums and websites and people I've spoken to said corn or royals are perfect first time snakes. I knew they were notorious for eating problems it's purely because he seems thin that I'm anxious for him to eat asap. I've heard stories of 6ft royals too but we went for a male as they are smaller than females and being a first time snake I didn't want anything too monsterous haha from the shop we were given a copy of his feeding log and before the last 3 weeks he was eating ok, it's just the last 3 weeks he has only had one fuzzie and this concerned me as he is a baby I know they need to eat more regularly than adults. We have been advised to feed 10-15% of their bodyweight every 5 days when 0-400g, every 7days when 400-800g, and it increases like that. His viv is set up with a hot end at 32'C and cool end at 26'C, humidity is between 50-60% and I have a damp moss hide in there for him as well as water bowl so I don't think it's down to a bad environment. Maybe he is just a bad shedder? Hoping it improves over time as he settles. He has plenty hides as I know they are reclusive and like to hide, he spends most his time under the hide at the warm end of his viv. I noticed today actually that a lot of the excess skin has now come away  so I think I just worried un-necessarily and started imagining the worst! Now just need him to eat, I'll offer food every few days as suggested and keep my fingers crossed. Thank you for your reply


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## Paul Dunham (Apr 1, 2010)

Hello Jen,

The current record for a non-feeding Royal python is 22 months at Cincinnati Zoo in the USA.. I've also seen on other forums including reptile forums some people which recommend Royal Pythons for beginners.. You can usually get a good idea of the quality of advice if someone recommends a Royal Python to a beginner without qualifying that advice.. They're definitely not a first choice.. Just because many newcomers have had a good experience themselves they think they're the perfect snake for beginners.. In certain respects they are the ideal snake "IF" you get a good feeder, and in all fairness captive bred Royals are much better than they were many years ago.. You have to understand they are very erratic feeders often binge eating and then going many months without eating.. You cannot apply a slide rule and statistical feeding to snakes.. They all have different feeding regimes.. There is no ideal amount to feed a snake.. You can overfeed them and wind up with a fat snake.. One snake will eat just one fuzzie at a feed and another may take three or four.. They grow at different rates.. You can have two snake hatched from the same clutch at the same time yet one is a better feeder and four or five times bigger than the other.. There is no ideal feeding regime to follow.. 
The good thing about your snake is at least it has fed for you.. That's a good sign..

Here is a very good website I've read through and the advice contained within it appears to be excellent.. I hope this is of help to you in getting your snake feeding and it gives you a better understanding of the species you've chosen..

Feeding Ball Pythons - Articles - World of Ball Pythons


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## Guest (Feb 1, 2013)

many , many moons ago i were also advised of taking on a royal as my first , i went against that advice after doing the research , years down the line i've had many , many friends with non feeders and watched the panic set in when their royal hasn't eaten for months and all those years ago i'm glad i made the choice not to go with one back then. general rule of the thumb with royals is to actually see them feeding before you bring them home so you know you have one that is actually feeding because you have seen it with your own eyes , as a beginner to snakes it's definitely the right choice to walk away if you don't see them taking a feed.
good beginner snakes are corns , kingsnakes , milksnakes (kings and milks can be ever so slightly nippy when youngsters but they soon calm down with regular handling) rosy boa's are a good choice for the beginner and so are childrens pythons and at a push if you can keep on top of humidity requirements so are brazilian rainbow boa's (very gentle snakes).
there are so many other species suited as beginners snakes (the above are of the top of my head) i've never actually recommended royals as a beginner unless you know your stuff as like yourself , newbies to reptiles very often do panic when they get non feeders , and it is a real worry.
paul has given you some excellent advice there's not really any more i can add , i do hope you get your snake feeding soon , let us know how you get on


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## Kaori (Sep 26, 2012)

Definitely not beginner snakes.
In some cases they can be good, but that will be in the case of established feeders from a quality breeder. But the Royals you get it pet shops (not reptile specialist shops) are more than likely not established feeders, they can and will lie to you to make money and new owners are especially vulnerable to this.
I don't know what to recommend since I've not owned a Royal personally but I would go for advice on an active reptile forum (Google is your friend).

Hope it works for you and your snake, keep us updated!


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## Paul Dunham (Apr 1, 2010)

For as long as I can remember Royal Pythons have always been the number one heart attack snake.. The number one snake which causes the most anxiety.. Since animal forums began non-feeding Royals Pythons have always been the number one reoccurring problem time and time and time again.. Closely followed by &#8221;My Terrapin tank stinks, how can I fix it&#8221;? Apart from this one problem they are perfect in every other respect.. They&#8217;re friendly&#8230; They don&#8217;t grow too big.. They're like a real snake.. not a skinny piece of string.. Take up little space.. Easy to keep once you understand how to feed them and their periods of fasting.. One of the easiest snakes to keep once they&#8217;re settled&#8230;

I think many people just can&#8217;t get their heads around the fact they can go so long without food.. Telling people they&#8217;re cold blooded doesn't seem to be enough.. More than 90% of what we eat goes purely to generate body heat.. Nothing else.. Snakes physiology doesn't have to bother generating body heat.. This is why it seems they can go on forever without eating&#8230; The key with Royals is if they look healthy,(despite going months without food)&#8230; They probably are&#8230;


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## Marcia (Mar 10, 2009)

I agree, not a beginners snake but only with regards to feeding.

But can we please not tar all reptile shops with the same brush. I work in one and the owner has had a great deal of success getting non feeders back feeding. 

When I first kept a non feeding royal, it did panic me but with the help of a experienced person I knew personally, he was eating again within 3 weeks, been brilliant ever since  although there is the odd week where it will refuse


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## Paul Dunham (Apr 1, 2010)

Marcia said:


> I agree, not a beginners snake but only with regards to feeding.
> 
> But can we please not tar all reptile shops with the same brush. I work in one and the owner has had a great deal of success getting non feeders back feeding.
> 
> When I first kept a non feeding royal, it did panic me but with the help of a experienced person I knew personally, he was eating again within 3 weeks, been brilliant ever since  although there is the odd week where it will refuse


I agree not all reptile shops are bad.. I owned a Pet/Reptile shop myself.. What I found was honest shops told the truth to customers gave honest advice which often involved turning people away and giving them time to think about what they wanted and to prepare for the species they chose.. The trouble was these shops floundered and the lying rip-off shops which told customers what they wanted to hear thrived.. I knew all the main dealers.. The biggest bunch of lying thieves you could meet.. Their policy was if you had the money, give them it.. Everything was easy to keep.. Even selling specimens on deaths door as healthy animals.. I've seen them sell Anacondas and Reticulated Pythons as a good beginners snake.. I remember when all Royal Pythons were wild caught.. The first captive reared Royal Pythons came from eggs from wild caught gravid females imported into the UK.. I've watched people slowly learn how to breed them, how to rear them, how to deal with non feeders.. I've watched people learn to deal with every aspect of their husbandry..

You said yourself you had the benefit of an experienced keeper to help you.. When selling a snake to a newcomer you have to assume they do not have the same benefit...

Some of the most successful and most respected people in the reptile trade were the worst offenders.. There's few of today's well known experts I've seen sell animals which were dead before customers arrived home with them..


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## Marcia (Mar 10, 2009)

We keep feeding records of every snake. I'd rather turn away a customer with the truth than lie.

We do have one royal in at the moment who's old owner fed live rats to her. Until we get her onto defrost and have her eating like this for a few weeks at the minimum, she won't be sold. 

I don't want to see anyone get upset or heartbroken over a reptile that wasn't fit to sell. If in doubt, keep it back and wait. 

We did have a 2 year old 7ft albino burm in for a while. You'd be surprised how many people I had to turn down because they'd never owned a snake before, and they wanted her. 
She was amazing though, would've had her myself if it wasn't for the huge size she would've got to lol


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## jordanlaviper (Mar 16, 2013)

I keep some of the more difficult species personally and find Royals a nightmare... But yes people call them beginner snakes!
The size of the snake is often regardless not age as I have 5 year old royal ay yearling size due to bring slow feeders.
I would suggest soaking him in some lukewarm/cool water for 15 mins a day. Even better to get some blue power aid and bath him in that. Not only will he receive the electrolytes he needs by drinking but he will soak much through his cloaca. This bathing may also help soften the skin. 
The skin is not at the top of your to do list at the moment, as long as its not pulling his skin too much or join his face. Your biggest problem is hydration first! Do this for till he is nice and solid then leave him a few days to see how he is. If he's looking better then offer him a smallish meal with its head dipped in boiling water.
If she isn't interested then leave him be a week, not touching him at all and try again. Keep doing this, Ive had royals live a year with out food and not so much as loose a kg.
Now if he's getting poorly again, looking flacid and skinny then go back to bathing him again and maybe pop the meal into his mouth using the mouses noes to open his mouth... This is not force feeding but assist feeding. 
If he doesn't snatch it, then leave him be. Force feeding it self can be dangerous but should only be used in an emergency. 
If you are at the point of force feeding there are some good vids on you tube but I would suggest you get some one who is experienced to show you. Usually after a few feeds they pick up eventually.


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## Skyeli (Feb 22, 2012)

I recall my Breeder talking about a client that bought a ball from him, saying it didnt eat for 3 months, turned out the snake had about 3 layers of old shedding still on the poor guy and it was the reason why it wouldnt eat as it couldnt even open its mouth. 

Also make sure to see whether you are giving the snake the correct size food as if its bigger they also tend not to eat.


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## kimjenkinsmustbemad (Mar 24, 2013)

hope u get him sorted soon xx


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## LeedsFox (Mar 27, 2013)

any luck getting him going?


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## SnakeLoverNikki (May 8, 2013)

I've heard or a few tricks, like 1 is to bath its prey in chicken broth, dry it after u bath it, and should pick up the scent and smell appetizing, another thing I heard, is to get gerbil scent on the rodent u are feeding it, it will smell appetizing and your python should take the food, its what I've heard I don't know is its true, but I hope it helps, and maybe take I to a vet to get it checked to make sure its healthy.


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