# Recommended Cockapoo breeders in Wales?..



## xBuddyx (Jun 5, 2017)

Hi, im looking for some recomendations in Wales, UK please, we found a few but are unsure?

Thanks


----------



## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

Have a look at this site.
http://www.cockapooclubgb.co.uk/
Be aware that Cockapoos are highly favoured by puppy farmers and many are unethically bred. Avoid breeder who have numerous and frequent litters, look for an accredited breeder who health tests both parents appropriately and appears to have the welfare of their dogs at heart.
Is there a particular reason why you want a cross breed rather than a purebred cocker spaniel or poodle ?Being a cross breed means there is no knowing which parent the pup will take after and a non-shedding coat + hyoallergenic properties can't be guaranteed.


----------



## xBuddyx (Jun 5, 2017)

Hi, thanks for your reply and info, yes we had a look at the Cockapoo club, the only thing holding us back is the cost, the Cockapoos are very expensive and we are on a bit of a budget, we have seen other breeders selling them from between £400 and £1800, so naturally we started from the bottom and the ones that seem legit to us and then worked our way up, we are not experienced in this process, we are just trying to make the best decision for us and that our budget will allow, we want 2, brother and sister if possible from the same litter?, reason being we had 2 yorkies for 14 years, brother and sister, and despite having cancers several times, pyometra, diabetes and several strokes, they lived a decent and comfortable long life with us against all the odds, we lost them both this year a month apart from each other, it was hard letting them both go and i tried to convince my wife we should leave it for a while, but shes adament she wants to move on in this way with new life and a new chapter so our little one can grow with them and vice versa, so KC registered unfortunatly is out of our budget so alternatively we are looking for other experienced, well known registered breeders who are genuine and perform the relevant tests that are needed, and above all else have the puppies health and well being as a top priority, we've been looking around for a while now, we potentially found several so far but one in particular has stood out to us, we wanted to know if anyone has used them?, or has any other recommendations in my area?, the breeder we want info about is Castellan House Kennels in Carmarthenshire, Wales, they seem legit to us but any other opinions and recommendations from the community would be welcome and very helpful.

Thank you.


----------



## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

That screams Puppy farm to me, several litters on the ground , several different breeds on the ground, wouldn't go within 100 miles of them, sorry ! You could be buying a broken heart and spending thousands at the vets.


----------



## lullabydream (Jun 25, 2013)

No legit breeder will allow litter mates to go together either...

There is too much risk involved in litter mates syndrome happening, and with high energy breed such as a cockapoo then it's just would be a disaster waiting to happen as having two puppies is way more than twice the work.

The price of cockapoos with the relevant health tests will be no more than a KC registered poodle or cocker. If not cheaper to go to a good breeder of a KC pup...it would be wiser to spend your money on one good solid pup from a reputable breeder, than buy two within your budget and spend a Lifetime at the vets.

Health tests will not guarantee a healthy pup, but it's putting the odds for health than against. You are also breeding for temperament when finding a great breeder. Say you were to look at a cocker, resource guarding is rife in the breed, so there is every chance a cockapoos could have major issues with this and you would need help from a behaviourist not a trainer to sort this out. Any DIY fixes could make the matter worse, it's that simple. Good breeders will be picking dogs to breed from who haven't had any issues with resource guarding, not just mum but generations to lessen the chances.

You have had 2 yorkies, that worked out in the past for you. That's great...I will tell you now my yorkie is a true terrier by heart and wouldn't suit most people looking for a nice placid yorkie home. Which is why he was past from pillar to post till 18 months of age, because he didn't fit the script of what most people expected from him. Having two at the same time would have been unbearable for most at the puppy stage, and cocker spaniel crossed with a poodle who are highly intelligent beautiful dogs, who love nothing more to work and be active may be a complete nightmare.
You may get lucky and get the cocker side, unless the dog is a working cocker then that's such a busy dog too. Having a cross breed you just never know.


----------



## xBuddyx (Jun 5, 2017)

I think you potentially take that risk with all breeders though, (if they are not KC registered), these in particular have all the tests done and have proof of that apparently, both parents checked and available to see, they are also registered with Pembrokeshire council, and well established, they have several breeds, yes, but all look comfortable and happy tbh, i am by far no expert but does this really sound bad?, is this the definition of a puppy farm?, if so why is that a bad thing when looking to buy a puppy?, they look very comfortable and happy, we are trying to understand where this stigmata comes from and why a lot if not all other breeders being labled as evil puppy farms?, to be fair the puppies we have seen from Castellan kennels all look great and very healthy and happy, im hoping some of this community here can chime in on this and prehaps give some personal experience from visiting and dealing with Castallen House Kennels or as i said other recommendations, thanks for your replies..


----------



## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

Knowing how high energy many of the poodle crosses can be, especially Cockapoos, having two of them together would be my worse nightmare. Google littermate syndrome for information on is subject.

It would be far better to buy one more expensive puppy from someone who is health and temperament testing the parents, raise and train your pup well to an adult, then buy another puppy if you want to. A well trained adult dog will help you entertain and train a new puppy.


----------



## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

I think it's unlikely you'll find any one with experience of the named breeding establishment, we haveto be careful what we publish anyway. 
This is a good article on the possibe pitfalls of puppy buying and what to look out for.
https://www.pets4homes.co.uk/pet-advice/puppy-farms-how-and-why-to-avoid-buying-a-farmed-puppy.html


----------



## SingingWhippet (Feb 25, 2015)

Raising a litter of puppies is (or at least should be) a lot of work, not just in terms of meeting the puppies' basic needs but doing all the work which sets them up to be well rounded individuals when they go off to their new homes. If someone has many litters on the ground at once the chances that they putting in all the work they should be with each litter is very, _very_ slim. This website has a breakdown of the different developmental stages of puppies and has lists of things that the breeder should be doing during each. This is really the minimum that a breeder should be doing with their puppies. The more effort a breeder puts in the better prepared the puppies are, just to give you an idea of the gold standard of puppy raising I'd recommend having a look at the Puppy Culture website and having a browse through the accompanying Facebook group. This is the sort of effort breeders should be going to with their litters and someone with at least seven litters on the ground at once is going to be struggling to do more than the absolute bare minimum care wise. It's very easy to make a litter of puppies look clean and well fed for a photoshoot or a brief visit from prospective buyers, it takes a lot more to properly set those puppies up to go out into the world and make wonderful family pets.

Good breeders aim for quality (in health, temperament and conformation) not sheer quantity. They want to see each litter grow and develop so they can assess whether the choices they've made have resulted in the type of dogs they were aiming to produce. If someone is churning out litter after litter after litter are they really breeding with clear aims, matching each bitch to the best stud dog available (not just the stud dog they happen to own) to compliment her temperament, conformation and health status as shown by utilising all the appropriate screening schemes?

I also echo what has been said about allowing littermates to go together, a reputable breeder would not let two puppies of similar age (littermate syndrome doesn't just apply to actual siblings but to any pups close in age living together) go to a normal pet home. In exceptional circumstances (or when people are very lucky) it can work out but quite often it doesn't and then one or other of the puppies will need to be rehomed. Have a read of this article on littermate syndrome (as well as those linked to at the bottom) then think whether you really want to take such a risk in getting two puppies at once and whether handing over two puppies from the same litter is something a breeder would really do if they cared about the future of those pups.......

The relevant health tests (bearing in mind that although all good breeders health test it is just one single facet of breeding responsibly) that should be done vary depending on the cross. If you're specifically looking at a first cross between a cocker spaniel and miniature poodle then the absolute minimum you should be looking for is:

both parents to have had a BVA eye test within the last year
the cocker parent to have had a BVA gonioscopy within the last three years
both parents should have either been DNA tested for prcd-PRA (with at least one testing clear) or be clear by parentage
the poodle parent should have been DNA tested for vWD 1(preferably testing clear) or be clear by parentage
That really is the absolute _minimum_ level of testing that should be done for this cross. Ideally the breeder should also be having numerous other DNA tests done which are available for both breeds as whilst the conditions aren't shared between them and so puppies can't be affected a responsible breeder would want to know if they're potentially producing puppies which are carriers for (some really quite nasty) heritable conditions. You can see all the DNA currently available for cockers here and here, plus those available for miniature poodles here.

This guide to buying a puppy is well worth a read, as is the accompanying list of questions to ask a breeder. I really do agree with the sentiment at the bottom of that guide. A breeder who really cares about their dogs (both the ones they own and the ones they produce), who puts their all into breeding and raising well rounded dogs who are sound in body and temperament, who wants to keep in touch throughout the lives of the puppies they've bred, who will offer any amount of support and backup to the new owners again throughout the lives of their puppies really is worth their weight in gold. I cannot emphasise that enough!!


----------



## xBuddyx (Jun 5, 2017)

Just for info purposes, but on further inspection it appears that Castellan House Kennels has a facebook page, website and has been featured on the BBC in a positive light, they are not KC registered but they are a fully licensed breeder that has inspections..

http://castellanhousekennels.co.uk/

http://pupsrus.co.uk/


----------



## lullabydream (Jun 25, 2013)

Council licenced inspected kennels mean very little, their are so many loop holes that allow these to be licensed when they shouldn't.

A media piece means very little...

There are still good cross breed breeders out there, just as there are still bad KC registered breeders that are appalling. 

Flashy websites often mean nothing in the big scheme of things...

However price seems important to you, and whatever we say, seems very much like you have made your mind up, even with brilliant advice.


----------



## Smuge (Feb 6, 2017)

xBuddyx said:


> Just for info purposes, but on further inspection it appears that Castellan House Kennels has a facebook page, website and has been featured on the BBC in a positive light, they are not KC registered but they are a fully licensed breeder that has inspections..
> 
> http://castellanhousekennels.co.uk/
> 
> http://pupsrus.co.uk/


Yikes that looks horrible to me, I would much prefer a home raised pet


----------



## xBuddyx (Jun 5, 2017)

Of course the price is important us, we are not made of money, we are on a budget, and my wife wants to move on with this breed, i have not seen anyone here comment from personal experience about the kennels i asked about, im learning very quickly that it seems anyone not KC registered is probably a puppy farmer and should steer clear of them which i think is unfair tbh, all i see when i look at reviews is good reviews from people who have delt with them before, i could easily go to Kidwelly to buy if i didnt care and wanted them dirt cheap as there are several obvious puppy farms there but in fact we do care and above all else we put the puppies welfare at the top of our list before commiting, the relevant checks must be done or we are willing to walk away, i think that was a silly thing to say to me tbh, you dont know whats important to me so please dont think that you do, we are on a budget, and that budget is £1300 for 2, thanks for the excellent advice here, but ill continue looking and ask elsewhere as you have clearly made up your mind about me and i am not here to be judged by anyone, have a nice day!


----------



## SingingWhippet (Feb 25, 2015)

It does seem like you've already made your mind up to go this breeder. Presumably because they have puppies available now, they're cheap and they will hand you two over even though it's really not in the best interests of the puppies to do so.

I would ask though, do you really think being born and raised in outbuildings like that is the best way to set puppies up for going into a family home? Do you think it's a good life for the bitches either living out there full time or being shunted out there once they're pregnant? How many litters does the breeder take from each bitch and what happens to them once they're too old to continue breeding from?

Compare how the breeder you're looking at keeps their dogs and puppies versus the clips you can see in this video about Puppy Culture. As I've said, Puppy Culture is the absolute gold standard and a breeder doesn't have to follow all their protocols to the letter to be responsible but they do need to be providing plenty of enrichment, socialisation and learning experiences for their puppies.

Again, I ask do you honestly think the breeder you want to buy from is doing their best to set their pups up to go into family homes as confident, well rounded individuals?


----------



## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

Did you read the article link I sent you? To be fair you've had some excellent advice based on members' experiences, both personal and based on the forum.All we say is research very carefully to avoid heartbreak. We have had so many members contact us with tragic events from ill-bred puppies, we would hate it to happen to you.
We would love to see your pup(s) whn you get them !
ETA - you won't find KC reg Cockapoos anyway as they are a crossbreed.


----------



## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

xBuddyx said:


> Of course the price is important us, we are not made of money, we are on a budget, and my wife wants to move on with this breed, i have not seen anyone here comment from personal experience about the kennels i asked about, im learning very quickly that it seems anyone not KC registered is probably a puppy farmer and should steer clear of them which i think is unfair tbh, all i see when i look at reviews is good reviews from people who have delt with them before, i could easily go to Kidwelly to buy if i didnt care and wanted them dirt cheap as there are several obvious puppy farms there but in fact we do care and above all else we put the puppies welfare at the top of our list before commiting, the relevant checks must be done or we are willing to walk away, i think that was a silly thing to say to me tbh, you dont know whats important to me so please dont think that you do, we are on a budget, and that budget is £1300 for 2, thanks for the excellent advice here, but ill continue looking and ask elsewhere as you have clearly made up your mind about me and i am not here to be judged by anyone, have a nice day!


You really have got the wrong end of the stick here, no one is judging you at all, but we are trying to give you good advice based on many years of experience. No one has said that those breeding dogs that are not KC registered are puppy farmers. What we are trying to impart is that it is easy to get dragged in to a puppy farmed dog because they are extremely clever in covering their tracks.

You and your partner have obviously made up your minds and plan to get two high energy puppies perhaps not from the best sources. I wish you the best of luck because you will need it.

PS. Just so you know, Cockerpoos are not a breed they are a crossbreed


----------



## SingingWhippet (Feb 25, 2015)

I'm just linking this article on littermate syndrome for you again. _Please_ give it (and the other articles linked to from it) a read before going ahead and getting two puppies. It is _not_ in the best interests of the puppies to get two at once.

I realise you've raised two puppies at the same time before however all dogs are individuals and just because you were lucky enough that it worked out once doesn't mean it will be the same thing time round, especially as you're looking at a cross of two high energy breeds which will require a lot of (completely separate) exercise and mental stimulation.

It is far more than double the work to have two puppies at once. You can't just do everything with them together. They'll need to be walked separately, trained separately, given plenty of individual one to one time at home, kept separately for at least part of every day. They will need to learn to be happy apart from each other both when people are there and when they're left alone. They will need to go to training classes separately. Etc., etc., etc.

You clearly have a very healthy budget and could, if you chose, find a single puppy from an excellent breeder for well under the price you're prepared to pay for two from very less than ideal conditions. I understand the desire to have a puppy right away once you've made the decision to get one but you're hopefully getting a companion for the next maybe fifteen years or so, it's worth putting in a little extra time and effort now to stack the odds as far in your favour as possible that you're getting a healthy, happy and well rounded family pet.


----------



## Jamesgoeswalkies (May 8, 2014)

SingingWhippet said:


> this video about Puppy Culture.


Yes. Yes. Yes. Just watching the clip puts a smile on my face. That's a way a puppy should be raised.

The breeder you have found clearly runs a tight ship and yes, runs it as a business. I know nothing about the kennel or their puppies. They are certainly not a 'puppy farmer' of the kind that needs to be shut down ...those are horrendous. Would I wish to get my puppy from there though ...no ...personally I like to see a puppy bred within a home environment with care taken to handling and social welfare not one produced on an impersonal production line. But that's me ......

And no, siblings are not a good idea unless you are ready for all that extra time and training.

J


----------



## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

Jamesgoeswalkies said:


> Yes. Yes. Yes. Just watching the clip puts a smile on my face. That's a way a puppy should be raised.
> 
> The breeder you have found clearly runs a tight ship and yes, runs it as a business. I know nothing about the kennel or their puppies. They are certainly not a 'puppy farmer' of the kind that needs to be shut down ...those are horrendous. Would I wish to get my puppy from there though ...no ...personally I like to see a puppy bred within a home environment with care taken to handling and social welfare not one produced on an impersonal production line. But that's me ......
> 
> ...


But I wonder if they do Health test, I couldn't finid any reference to it.


----------



## Jamesgoeswalkies (May 8, 2014)

SusieRainbow said:


> But I wonder if they do Health test, I couldn't finid any reference to it.


She was quoting £400 to £600 so I suspect that they don't do all the health tests ...... health tested puppies born in good environments tend to be more expensive than that.

J


----------



## magpie (Jan 3, 2009)

I have a cockapoo who is now 5 years old, and my sister also has one, he is nearly 12 months. Benji was quite an easy puppy in many ways, but really I cannot imagine how hard it would be raising two at the same time. He's very chilled out now but as a pup he was quite nutty, and my sisters boy is the same. His coat is quite woolly and requires a lot of brushing when it is long, and he does like a lot of attention, he brings you toys and would play fetch or football in the garden all day long if he could!

Honestly, in your situation I'd go for one well-raised pup from fully health tested parents, you can always get a second in a few years time when the first pup has matured. I don't see any mention of health tests on the websites of the breeder you're looking at, nor does there seem to be any information at all on their females? I can only see pictures of the studs. Perhaps they're not the worst, but they do look like they are producing an awful lot of puppies. Personally I don't like the idea of breeding puppies as a business, and I wouldn't want to support people like that.


----------



## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

xBuddyx said:


> Just for info purposes, but on further inspection it appears that Castellan House Kennels has a facebook page, website and has been featured on the BBC in a positive light, they are not KC registered but they are a fully licensed breeder that has inspections..
> 
> http://castellanhousekennels.co.uk/
> 
> http://pupsrus.co.uk/


I have heard of them.

They are a puppy farm, avoid them like the plague.

Buying from places like this will make you a part of the problem we currently have, it's entirely up to you where you choose to spend your money, but it would be a decision the vast majority of people on here will not agree with, because we care about dogs.


----------



## Laney_Lemons (Mar 23, 2016)

This thread has made me so sad... what amazing advice given and such good information and things to look out for and it seems you have taken it very defensively for some reason. 


I do understand trying to find a good breeder is a mind field, I looked briefly at breeders out of couristy but opted for a rescue pup as I didnt know where to even start and was scared of getting a puppy farm pup and paying money for this cruel industry

Puppy farmers are very sneaky they know how to sell their pups, know what to say and know how they can look and have a answer for everything I'm sure. 

But if u obv see lots of pups and bitches and kept In Outbuildings ... run ... I certainly wouldn't hand over £600 and certainly wouldn't get two 

What about putting you name down at rescue centres? as if it's a cross breed you like there is plenty in rescue? Does it really need to be a cocker x poodle?


----------



## Blitz (Feb 12, 2009)

The OP seems to be a bit confused. Breeders are not KC registered, the dogs are. Some breeders are on the KC assured scheme but not if they are breeding crossbreeds as this is not allowed. No cockapoo pups are KC registered, they cant be, they are crossbreeds.


----------



## Elles (Aug 15, 2011)

The dogs from there aren't health tested, they say they're health checked by their vet. Phone them up and ask.


----------

