# Akita puppy



## kipper889 (Feb 9, 2011)

Hello,

I am a new member to your forum because I am looking for advice about being a first time dog owner.

Our family (Mum, Dad and three teenage sons) have decided that we would really like to share our home with a dog. We have 'argued' and discussed for over a year about what kind of dog we would like and have come to an agreement that an Akita would perhaps like to share our life. 

As this is all new to me, I have done as much research as I can about what is involved with looking after dogs in particular Akitas and fully understand that it's not something to go into lightly. We are confident that we can provide a good loving home for our new pet.

My question is how can I be sure that I am buying from a reputable breeder? I have found a beautiful puppy for sale through pets4u and have spoken with the owner on the telephone. 

Thanks for any advice you can give me. 

Ruth


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## PoisonGirl (Oct 24, 2008)

I would look on the kennel club for an acredited breeder, dont look somewhere like epupz as they are full of bad breeders.


Personally I would not reccomend an Akita as a first dog. They need firm training and set rules. You can't let them walk all over you. I've met two and one the owner was not firm enough with her, she would decide certain people she did not like and growl at them but overall she was a lovely dog.
The other the owner was too hard on him and ended up biting him.

You WILL need to enroll in puppy class and I would advice to stay in dog class until the dog has gone through the teenage puberty stage.

Also don't be offended if you do call a reputable breeder and they say no, due to their temperament etc I think many people would not advise them as a first dog.


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## Old Shep (Oct 17, 2010)

The Kennel Clun Accredited Breeders Scheme. Check, though, that the breeders have been through a visit from the Breeder Advisor and check what the outcome of that visit is.
Accredited Breeder Scheme | The Kennel Club

The breed club will also be able to give you some pointers in the right direction.
However, if you have done your research you should already know this.

I really don't know much about akitas, but I wouldn't think they are suitable as a first dog.

Sorry! That took me so long I cross posted (and I see we are saying the same thing!)


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## kipper889 (Feb 9, 2011)

Thank you Poisongirl, (I don't like calling you that. lol)

I have read much about Akitas not being that friendly with strangers and am prepared to attend classes for us both to learn. I did hope that if we are well trained from the start this may not be a problem.

Do you think we should give up the idea of owning an Akita?

Ruth


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## kipper889 (Feb 9, 2011)

Thanks Old Shep,

The owner has assured me that they are KC registered but I'm not sure how to check that. Will she have a registration Number?

Ruth


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## PoisonGirl (Oct 24, 2008)

Do you know anyone with an Akita, or are there a breeder near you who wouldn't mind you coming to meet and spend some time with the dogs?

I know for sure I wouldn't have been able to bring up an Akita properly when I was new to dogs.
I went to my local rescue instead and got a collie cross Lol.


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## Shrap (Nov 22, 2010)

I would have to agree with everyone here that an Akita really isn't a great idea for a first time dog owner. But if you do really want one:

Decide whether you want an American or Japanese Akita. I looovee Japanese ones, they're so much more elegant looking. In my experience there are far more badly bred American ones. Make sure you go to a reputable breeder, even if pups are advertised on Epups or anything with health tested parents. This breed needs to be socialised VERY well from day 1 and that is why you need someone very knowledgable and experienced with them.

I'm not sure exactly what health tests the parents should have, but at the very least hip and elbow scored, and all the dogs in the 5 generation pedigree should be hip scored also.

With an Akita you really do need to be firm, you can't let it get away with anything, and you cannot get angry with it. Anger is weakness which is wuite hard to avoid with such a breed, they take the piss and not in a funny way sometimes!!

If you can train them though, they are a wonderful breed.
I have looked into them but don't feel ready for one yet. They are a lot of hard work and I don't feel I have the experience to give one a happy home.

Have you considered something like a Leonberger? Or a Boxer? Labrador?

Although do bare in mind that larger breeds can be VERY expensive to insure, and they really must be insured. Too much can go wrong and something even as simple as getting a grass seed stuck can cost several thousands of pounds.

Try to rethink your breed a bit and then come back to us with what you think


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## Maiisiku (Feb 20, 2009)

She should have papers with her. I don't think it's impossible to have an Akita as a first pet but they do need bounderies, socialisation and lots of training (which someone with more experiance would be able to understand it easier). Yuri is my first dog and is a Border Collie/sibe/GSD mix and it has taken me a lot to get him where he will sit down and do things for me. We are starting training classes on the 23rd as he jumps up at my guests and tries to jump up on walks. He is a large boy, not as large as an Akita, but large enough to scare people if he jumps at them.

It will take a lot of comitment from the whole family to get your dog trained and socialised and you will have to agree on words for training and what the rules are.

I dog walked for 2 Akitas up until one of them died. I did walk for the family again recently but I sprained my foot walking him and sadly can't go again as they only have him till the 20th as they had to rehome him. 

They are lovely, loving dogs, very strong, do you think your strong enough to handle one? I can tell you on my best days when I don't have a sprained ankle if one of them had seen another dog it took all my strenth to hold him back.

You will get a lot of random comments from people and you may find that people tend to cross the road when they see you. If your still not put off by this then by all means give it a go. But remember once you have the dog it's for life and they can live up to 16 years. So you will have to give all that commitment to them!


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

What is it about the Akita that attracts you?

It isn't really the right dog for a first time owner, but there may be similar breeds that would be more suitable for a first dog if you give us some idea of what attracts you to it.

PS KC registration alone is not enough to ensure a reputable breeder.


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## kipper889 (Feb 9, 2011)

Thank you all for your help and advice.

I am beginning to think that perhaps we have made a wrong choice, my 18 year old son was the first to suggest an Akita, I printed everything I could find about it on the internet and it seemed the ideal dog for us. 

It is the size we would like, not too long haired, doesn't need too many hours of walking (we are prepared to walk for two hours per day in fields close to us) very loyal and loving within the family, doesn't bark much, intelligent and easy to train. I did read that it will be aloof with strangers but didn't read that it can be overly aggressive. I have read that they are good guard dogs and will alert us if there is something wrong.

The look of a dog is not really our first thought but we were also swayed by how beautiful Akitas are.

I think we need to think again.

Ruth


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Not a breed I would recomend for a first dog. If you can get yourself to Discover Dogs at Crufts and talk to the people on the stand there. You should get the good and the bad points from experienced owners and get a list of breed club contacts


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

they r not overly aggressive .... any dog can be very aggressive if is not been given the right education if I can say that .
Yes they can be aloof with strangers and dominant ( is a breed trait) but provided they got good socialisation u can have a fantastic dog .

can I suggest u to visit some breeders , visit some rescue places , meet with people who have akita in your area.... before u commit .

American akita or Akita inu in my opinion they have same temperaments .
They r very intelligent dogs (despite the fact they play u allot by giving the typical akita eyes ...'is not me , on my word was not me the one who rummaged in the bin again' ) they think allot for themselves ...

where about u r in Uk ?
some times rescues do make walks in the parks , we r overdue one at Friends of akitas ... if u live in yorkshire area u can join us and u can see the beasts ( I really need to show my snout to one of the walks as I have not been in year ...oops) 

oh and before anything ... I have a question to u ....
what hair colour would u like to have in your coffee /tea? because when the beastie moults is everywhere and come in chunks ... as someone I know once jokingly said 
the akita moults from january till june and from July till december ( they moult twice a year )


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

yes good idea 
Friends of akitas has a stand at crufts and from what I gathered there would be a battalion of our girls coming down to birmingham there would be few doggies ..usually r


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## Shrap (Nov 22, 2010)

I wish I was there for the Akitas I love them 
Maybe I'll go for the whole weekend next year. Will have to settle for working/pastoral this year though


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Is it an Akita thing for them to rub their heads on you like a cat would and to hold your hand in their mouth?


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## kipper889 (Feb 9, 2011)

Hawksport,

Now you are making me want one even more..lol

Ruth:


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## Maiisiku (Feb 20, 2009)

I certainly think you should go to crufts in march before you make up your mind. Getting a dog is a huge comitment that shouldn't be taken lightly. 

An Akita is a huge dog! I love them to bits please don't get me wrong, but having met the breed and getting to know them very well, I can tell you that I would not be able to commit to an Akita at this time in my life as they are even stronger than my siberian husky sized Border collie who pulls very strongly and I am working on his lead work so he doesn't yank me over! If an Akita wanted to they could very well pull you over when you are walking them by lead.

I really do think it's very important that you meet people with Akitas and perhaps even walk with one and get to know the breed a bit more before you decide if they are right for you as a family or not. They are a beautiful breed if in the correct hands.


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## Maiisiku (Feb 20, 2009)

hawksport said:


> Is it an Akita thing for them to rub their heads on you like a cat would and to hold your hand in their mouth?


From my hands on knowlage of the breed they are very cat like, gentil giants. But I didn't have to train them, I just walked them 

They are quite destructive (like sibes can be) and moult like mad too!


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## kipper889 (Feb 9, 2011)

Thanks all,

You have certainly given me food for thought.

We will all have to sit down and think again, as you say, this is not something we should rush into.

Ruth


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Maiisiku said:


> From my hands on knowlage of the breed they are very cat like, gentil giants. But I didn't have to train them, I just walked them
> 
> They are quite destructive (like sibes can be) and moult like mad too!


We have one that has just started training, the first time he saw me he dragged his owner over rubbed his head all over me then put his feet on my shoulders and licked my face. This week he was holding my hand with his mouth. He's a bit grumbly about having his feet picked up and looked at so we need to sort that out but apart from that he's no trouble.


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## Maiisiku (Feb 20, 2009)

The lady I dog walked for left a bag of sponges by the sink when I went out to walk them they were shreded :lol:


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## Balto-x (Nov 7, 2010)

Hi
Aslong as u have researched the breed and train the pup u will be fine any puppy is a challenge no matter the breed, we started with a Alaskan malamute (some said to us they are impossible to train!) he is now 5 months now and at puppy school and he is a gorgeous friendly little big man!! Good luck and I want to see pics xx


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## pinklady (Feb 6, 2010)

Akitas are amazing, why do people always insist on sqaying they are not for first time dog owners? we all started somewhere!!!!!! So long as you socialise them and give them lots of love and give them boudaries to follow i wouldnt say you will have a problem. Please do not let it put you off, if you want an Akita, its your decision. 

Where abouts are you?


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Bcause if it does go wrong it can go wrong in a much bigger way than most breeds.


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

kipper889 said:


> Hello,
> 
> I am a new member to your forum because I am looking for advice about being a first time dog owner.
> 
> ...


ruth whereabouts are you?


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## Nicky10 (Jan 11, 2010)

Akitas aren't the easiest dogs but amazing if you put the work into training and socialising them and that is a lot of work. Have a word with your local breed club they tend to have higher breeder ethics and should be able to point you in the direction of a good local breeder/owner. Spend some time with their dogs and learn about them first hand before you make up your mind. They're big powerful dogs and like any dog like that if it goes wrong it goes horribly wrong. You need to think carefully before you get a big dog.


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## frodos_electric_guitar (Nov 19, 2010)

Akitas are wonderful dogs, however I'd voice a similar concern as a few others - they're not the easiest first dog. Before making a final decision it might be an idea (as has been suggested) to meet a breeder or get yourselves to Discover Dogs to take a closer look in person.

If you like that bulky Asian type breed have you considered a Chow Chow instead? They are fairly low energy, medium sized and have that same cat-like aloofness of the Akita. It might just be more managable.


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

anyone who wants to visit Friends of Akitas stands at Crufts ...info here 
http://www.petforums.co.uk/dog-shows-events/146754-friends-akitas-crufts-2011-a.html


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

hawksport said:


> Is it an Akita thing for them to rub their heads on you like a cat would and to hold your hand in their mouth?


yah it is ... the only difference they do not meow lol
they can grab u gentle and guide u to show u what they want .... my monster usually grabs my husbands hand , also he has a habit on gently chewing/cleaning with the front teeth a section of the hand , very very gentle .


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

michaelasi said:


> yah it is ... the only difference they do not meow lol
> they can grab u gentle and guide u to show u what they want .... my monster usually grabs my husbands hand , also he has a habit on gently chewing/cleaning with the front teeth a section of the hand , very very gentle .


Dobes do the hand holding aswell. It must be a bit un nerving for anyone not familiar with the behaviour. I'll get a pic of the neww boy and put it up for you


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

Hiya have you considered a rescue Akita. Although an Akita is not a recommended first time dog, you could hold on and wait for the perfect one to come up.

I say this because the rescue will have a very good idea of the temp of the dogs they have in (as long as they are not stray). You could have a look at breed specific rescues who will have a wide variety of dogs with different temps.

There are a few I have seen who are quite young but are great with strangers /kids/ dogs etc.

If you chose this route you would prob be able to take the dog on a trail to see if it works for you... if not the rescue will take the dog back.

Its also easier for a first time owner I think because you dont have the hastle of researching lines to find good temps / health etc this can be very hard work and you can still end up with a nutter of a dog lol.

If you want any links just shout :thumbup:


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## pinklady (Feb 6, 2010)

Just a quick question, for everyone who has said they are not 1st time dogs, have you all been Akita owners????? If not, how can you say this? everyone has an opinion but it is unfare for you to judge a breed.


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

pinklady said:


> Just a quick question, for everyone who has said they are not 1st time dogs, have you all been Akita owners????? If not, how can you say this? everyone has an opinion but it is unfare for you to judge a breed.


No. What I have regularly had though are calls from people with Akitas Dobes Rotties ect who are first time owners who have serious problems with a dog,.usually male and usually 8 to 14 months old.
It sounds as though you think those saying they are not suitable for a first time owner don't like them. I think you will find that they like them enough to want them to be in the right home which in my opinion is an experienced one.


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## SpringerHusky (Nov 6, 2008)

I've grown up around dogs from great danes to sibes, I own a malamute and still don't feel prepaired to take on a akita. I adore akitas but they really just arn't for first time dog owners, these dogs already ahve a bad rep and if a mistake is made which first time dog owners do (i've done my own fair share) then things could easily go wrong.

I really reccomend going to discover dogs at crufts in march, there's so many dog breeds there and you and your family can meet themm and find out about them.

There is a chance an akita could be for you if you went with an older already trained rescue. :thumbup:


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

can't wait can't wait for the pic


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## SpringerHusky (Nov 6, 2008)

michaelasi said:


> can't wait can't wait for the pic


I agree, we're sat here very paitently waiting for pics :thumbup:


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

michaelasi said:


> can't wait can't wait for the pic





SpringerHusky said:


> I agree, we're sat here very paitently waiting for pics :thumbup:


It's test night Monday but he won't be there because he has only just started but I will get one the following week. He is a BIG black male


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## SpringerHusky (Nov 6, 2008)

hawksport said:


> It's test night Monday but he won't be there because he has only just started but I will get one the following week. He is a BIG black male


Oh wow don't think i've actually seen a black akita before, I bet he's a real stunner :thumbup:


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

me either ...
although my in law's mechanic has a cross samoyed with akita and apparently he is black . I am yet to see pics of him 
akitax samoyed and black ...wonder if they dyed his fur lol


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

pinklady said:


> Just a quick question, for everyone who has said they are not 1st time dogs, have you all been Akita owners????? If not, how can you say this? everyone has an opinion but it is unfare for you to judge a breed.


as far as I am aware you dont need to own a dog to know the traits of one. Akitas are not easy dogs to deal with. Yes you can get easy ones with a laid back temps but as a whole they are not easy to train, they are power houses who are aloof with strangers.

If said dog happens to show fear aggression to strangers and happens to be owned by a novice first time dog owner, how do you think they would cope? not very well I should imagine and if the owner happened to make a mistake trying to rectify this behaviour they could easily end up on the wrong side of a big powerfull, stubborn dog.

which is probably the reason there are so many in rescue centres, cute little ball of fluff who goes through the stroppy teenage phase and are too much to cope with.

I think its great that there are so many experienced people on here who do not fluff things up. If people want advice that is what they get, nothing put on here is lies about the breed, whenever people on here give advice they do it to help not only the owner but to ensure the welfare of the dog too. 

JMO though


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## sskmick (Feb 4, 2008)

kipper889 said:


> Thanks all,
> 
> You have certainly given me food for thought.
> 
> ...


I haven't owned a large powerful breed, but I have to hand it to the Akitas, they are magnificiant breed.

It annoys me when I see something along the lines of "only experience Breed owners to apply" how the hell do you get experience. A dog lives approximately 15 years, so you go for your second choice breed - you could have been gaining experience within that time with an Akita.

My advice to you would be to contact the KC for a breeder close to you and see if the breeder will let you spend time with their dogs. If not find one that will. A good breeder will be able to assess a puppy that would be suitable for you, and will offer advice and support throughout the dogs life.

I am sure Akita breeders will agree there will be the pups in the litter that will need experienced handling and there will be the ones that will need firm handling.

Socialisation and puppy class will be a must, the pup is going to become large and powerful, and you will need to be able to handle the dog in all possible situations.


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Everyone makes mistakes with dogs no matter how experienced they are but a first time owner will make more, will recognise them later and will be less able to correct them. If you make those mistakes with a Lab or a Whippet it's annoying, if you make them with one of the large "aggressive" breeds it's potentially fatal
And when I say "aggressive" breeds I include my own chosen breed.


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

.... my akita female thinks is a mare .... 
.....my male akita thinks is a monkey/donkey.....
so what on earth do I hold under my roof a bunch of dwarf apes/horses :lol:


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

michaelasi said:


> me either ...
> although my in law's mechanic has a cross samoyed with akita and apparently he is black . I am yet to see pics of him
> akitax samoyed and black ...wonder if they dyed his fur lol


a samoyed mated to any other colour will produce black off spring.


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## pinklady (Feb 6, 2010)

People only remember the bad things about Akitas and seem to think that they are all bad. They are NOT all aggressive and i would say it is a very small persentage that are. Providing you give them the correct boudaries then it isnt a problem. My large male was walked off lead past three dogs that were going nuts to get to him, now most people would think it would be him doing the snarling but he just walked past without a care in the world. Please do not tar this beautiful breed with the same brush. As with any breed you need them to know who is the boss and all will be fine.


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## SpringerHusky (Nov 6, 2008)

dexter said:


> a samoyed mated to any other colour will produce black off spring.


Oh wow intresting, taht explains why most sammie mixes i've met are black. Intresting.


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

when we picked our girlie up from devon , the breeder had a litter of accidental sammie x rc's . . they were cute but looked like bc's x.


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

pinklady said:


> People only remember the bad things about Akitas and seem to think that they are all bad. They are NOT all aggressive and i would say it is a very small persentage that are. Providing you give them the correct boudaries then it isnt a problem. My large male was walked off lead past three dogs that were going nuts to get to him, now most people would think it would be him doing the snarling but he just walked past without a care in the world. Please do not tar this beautiful breed with the same brush. As with any breed you need them to know who is the boss and all will be fine.


I can't see where anyone has said they are all bad but it is obvious to me that a dog bred to hunt bears needs a higher potential for aggression than a dog bred to retrieve shot ducks from a pond


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

there are some beautiful akitas about,certainly in my area. I'd be very selective where i bought one from and would certainly research as much as i could about them.

Ruth if you give us your location i'm sure one of us could put you on to someone reputable


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## catz4m8z (Aug 27, 2008)

I should think you would have to be prepared to be quite unpopular with strangers and other dog walkers too??
Im afraid to say Akitas are one of the few breeds I would go out of my way to avoid, (even with no provocation). Im sure some are lovely its just the only 2 I see round my way are dog aggressive, and usually looking like they will break free from their struggling owners any minute!!
They are beautiful looking though and I bet with the correct breeding and training they are great dogs.


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

dexter said:


> a samoyed mated to any other colour will produce black off spring.


dose he ... I did not know that .... cheers dexter


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

pinklady said:


> People only remember the bad things about Akitas and seem to think that they are all bad. They are NOT all aggressive and i would say it is a very small persentage that are. Providing you give them the correct boudaries then it isnt a problem. My large male was walked off lead past three dogs that were going nuts to get to him, now most people would think it would be him doing the snarling but he just walked past without a care in the world. Please do not tar this beautiful breed with the same brush. As with any breed you need them to know who is the boss and all will be fine.


nobody has said they are bad 

A dog is what you make it, the point people are trying to get across is that an Akita is not an easy dog to say the least add that with an inexperienced owner who knows little about training (or who is starting from scratch) could potentailly be asking for trouble.

Here is an example

You have a collie who is people aggressive, on lead and is not well trained due to inexperienced owners, that dog lunges for someone and you hold on for dear life...... you should be able to stop the dog as it is not a massively powerful breed and your strenght against it should be enough to get you out of trouble.

You have an Akita who is people aggressive and not well trained, no matter how much you dig your heals in you are going to be taken down the street if the dog decides it wants to go over to the person.

This is obv just an example and I hope it comes across in the way it was intended but an untrained or badly trained Akita is a burden and accidents can and do happen because people take on dogs beyond their means 

People are just trying to get the facts across.

Your dog sounds lovely but he had obv been trained well or is very laid back.

My Gsd is the same, people say they are not for first time dog owners but anyone could own her she is so easy..... my dads boy on the other hand is very hard work and would run rings around an inexperienced person :scared:


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

no pinklady nobody highlighted bad points to an akita , just been mentioned the fact not quite everyone would be ready for an akita ownership .


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## SpringerHusky (Nov 6, 2008)

cutekiaro1 said:


> My Gsd is the same, people say they are not for first time dog owners but anyone could own her she is so easy..... my dads boy on the other hand is very hard work and would run rings around an inexperienced person :scared:


Maya is exactly the same and would be great for a first time owner because she's no trouble but a normal mal would such a risk to a first time owner. Maya dosen't pull, run or even want long walks and would rather cuddle people than pull a sled.


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

SpringerHusky said:


> Maya is exactly the same and would be great for a first time owner because she's no trouble but a normal mal would such a risk to a first time owner. Maya dosen't pull, run or even want long walks and would rather cuddle people than pull a sled.


ha ha bless her. Akira is a very people person and although she loves a good run she also loves a lap to snuggle on :lol: She should have been born a yorkie :lol:


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

Just wondered if anyone had suggested any alternative breeds for the OP  (sorry have skipped all the posts )

To the OP.

Check out the EURASIER as an alternative 

This is a picture of my friends lad as a puppy, they are roughly labrador size (hers is bigger though), a bit less challanging than an an Akita but still a stunning dog.


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## sskmick (Feb 4, 2008)

hawksport said:


> I can't see where anyone has said they are all bad but it is obvious to me that a dog bred to hunt bears needs a higher potential for aggression than a dog bred to retrieve shot ducks from a pond


In some ways I can understand where you are coming from and in other ways I can't.

All dogs were originally breed for a particular purpose, even today there are working lines and show lines. A dog from working lines has a totally different outlook temperament to a dog from show lines, I'm referring to BCs.

All good reputable dog breeders should be breeding from a good temperament stock, with minimal genetic health issues.

Yes I could pick up an Akita pup from round the corner no papers etc and I will have picked up a bag of potential trouble. I used the word potential because it has been said that environment plays a big part in the dogs overall temperament, and I firmly believe this to be true.

I can't see how an owner can make a mistake causing the dog to become aggressive. Owners have two choices, bring the dog up to be friendly and social or bring the dog up to be fearful and aggressive. The same can be said for any breed.

My own dog is a Staffie the way I train him is important, if I were to cuff him he would raise the anti, so I use treat reinforcement positive training.


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## sskmick (Feb 4, 2008)

RAINYBOW said:


> Just wondered if anyone had suggested any alternative breeds for the OP  (sorry have skipped all the posts )
> 
> To the OP.
> 
> ...


 a few breeds have been mentioned.

I love your choice of words challenging, which the powerful breeds are. I class my lad as a rebellious teenager. :lol:


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## SpringerHusky (Nov 6, 2008)

cutekiaro1 said:


> ha ha bless her. Akira is a very people person and although she loves a good run she also loves a lap to snuggle on :lol: She should have been born a yorkie :lol:


Maya has an awful habit of running up to strangers and wooing at them :lol: my lovely neighbors have family over and they were out having a smoke, maya ran up to them and gave a full woo woo. My neighbor is used to it but her family member looked as though she was havinga heart attack, i think maya had really surprised her :lol: oh god and then when they all started petting her, well that's it I have to psyically drag her away :scared: :lol:


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

sskmick said:


> I used the word potential because it has been said that environment plays a big part in the dogs overall temperament, and I firmly believe this to be true.
> 
> I can't see how an owner can make a mistake causing the dog to become aggressive.


 I find those two statements to be a bit contradictory


----------



## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

sskmick said:


> In some ways I can understand where you are coming from and in other ways I can't.
> 
> All dogs were originally breed for a particular purpose, even today there are working lines and show lines. A dog from working lines has a totally different outlook temperament to a dog from show lines, I'm referring to BCs.
> 
> ...


I dont think it is a case of choice really, most people who are novice owners esp the ones I know of dont really get books etc to research training or even attend classes through ignorance, they copy things they see from the TV and most have their own idea of how a dog should be trained. I dont think a responsible dog owner deliberatly tries to make their dog aggressive but it happens anyway because they lack the skills and experience to deal with such dogs traits.

I have seen a lot of dog owners have an issue with their dog but instead of trying to fix the issue or find out what caused it, they take the dog away and avoid having to face the same problem again...... Low and behold lies the start of a a badly behaved dog. Masking issues makes situations worse and I have seen many many dog owners do this

We on this forum are mostly like minded but we are only a small % of dog owners, so although we may all see things in a similar light other people might not.


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

sskmick said:


> a few breeds have been mentioned.
> 
> I love your choice of words challenging, which the powerful breeds are. I class my lad as a rebellious teenager. :lol:


I just think thats the best way to describe it . Some breeds are challenging by nature, more stubborn, less biddable, Having said that Oscar has hardly been a walk in the park and he is a spaniel :lol:

I think the trouble with the big powerful breeds is if you get it wrong/can't handle the chanllenge the consequences are more serious hence why a fair few end up in rescue  Doesn't make them a bad breed and some people love that challenge and the rewards that come with it when you get it right 

I really love the Earasier (which again is by no means a pushover) but then i am bias, who could not love that gorgeous boy


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

RAINYBOW said:


> Just wondered if anyone had suggested any alternative breeds for the OP  (sorry have skipped all the posts )
> 
> To the OP.
> 
> ...


funnily enough the breeder near me thats has akitas has these too. they're lovely.


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

dexter said:


> funnily enough the breeder near me thats has akitas has these too. they're lovely.


I have met 2, one purebred and one assitance dog who is a Eurasier/Goldie cross plus a load at Discover Dogs.

I think they are a great alternative to someone who loves these types of dogs but is nervous about the challenging aspects and always flag them up on here when i can.

They are still relatively uncommon so as long as you are prepared to pay the £1000 they cost then it is relatively easy to buy a decent well bred one that has had the relevant health tests.  Much less of a minefield than some of the other arctic breeds


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## kipper889 (Feb 9, 2011)

Hi Everyone,

Thanks again for all your advice.

I am in Hertfordshire. I have had so much conflicting advice that I am just confused now. Last night I had given up the thought of owning an Akita but today I think I am capable of owning one. I am prepared to put in as much work as necessary, I don't want an unruly dog that I can't control. I will be a responsible owner and have confidence that I am strong enough mentally and physically to cope. I would like a puppy so that we can learn together.

Thanks again.

Ruth


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## SpringerHusky (Nov 6, 2008)

kipper889 said:


> Hi Everyone,
> 
> Thanks again for all your advice.
> 
> ...


I still advice against a puppy and woul reccomend a 2-3 year old adult from rescue.

If still go through just make sure you find a good breeder who does health test, offer life time suport but most impotantly enroll in dog training classes.

No one can stop you, all we can do is offer advice.


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

kipper889 said:


> Hi Everyone,
> 
> Thanks again for all your advice.
> 
> ...


Glad you have taken time to go through the advice on here and you have come to a decision.

I dont know of any Akita breeders worthy of buying a pup from so will leave that to people who know better but good luck in your search and looking forward to piccies when you bring your bundle of fluff home as others have said though I would start to look into training classes as soon as, maybe go along to a few minus the dog and see what you think. I had a nightmare finding a good one that I liked, there are a lot of rubbish ones out there :thumbup:


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Would you mind if I asked how many adult Akitas you had met?


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

hawksport said:


> Would you mind if I asked how many adult Akitas you had met?


who is this for hawksport?


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

cutekiaro1 said:


> who is this for hawksport?


Sorry, the op


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## kipper889 (Feb 9, 2011)

Thanks Springer,

But.. if I get a 2-3 year old from rescue (I would dearly love to give a rescue dog a new loving home) how will I know it's history? How will I know what training it has received? What about the old saying 'Can't teach an old dog new tricks?'

Much like if I buy a puppy that is not KC registered. Is all the advice about not encouraging breeders who are not registered? So sorry for all the questions but I really want to do the right thing.

Ruth


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## frodos_electric_guitar (Nov 19, 2010)

kipper889 said:


> What about the old saying 'Can't teach an old dog new tricks?


Don't worry, with time and dedication you can.


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

kipper889 said:


> Thanks Springer,
> 
> But.. if I get a 2-3 year old from rescue (I would dearly love to give a rescue dog a new loving home) how will I know it's history? How will I know what training it has received? What about the old saying 'Can't teach an old dog new tricks?'
> 
> ...


If you go to breed specific rescues a lot of those dogs have come from loving family homes who due to circumstances can no longer keep the dogs.
There are quite a few who have full history with children / dogs / people etc.
They are all assessed by the rescue as well as just taking the owners word for it 

A lot of the time you can also take the dog on trail to make sure it is the right dog for you.

The staff usually tell you which dogs would best match your family life etc


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## sskmick (Feb 4, 2008)

hawksport said:


> I find those two statements to be a bit contradictory


Aww I see what you mean if I were to acquire a dog from an unknown source that would be a mistake, as the dog may well already have issues.

I am no expert by any means but I bring my dog up to suit my lifestyle. I set the boundaries.

Where there tends to be problems with dogs where I live is that they are not trained properly, hardly ever see them exercised, you only know these people have a dog because its trying desperately to out of garden, with a "don't mess with me, unless you think you are hard enough" attitude. These dogs range from powerful breeds to small pouches. However I can take you round the same estate show you the same breed of dog with a different owner and its a completely different dog lovely temperament, social, friendly etc., etc..

I do believe a good dog comes from a good owner, irrespective of breed.


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## kipper889 (Feb 9, 2011)

Sorry Hawksport, I missed your post.

I have never met an Akita, saying that, I don't know any Labs or Spaniels, Dobermans, dalmations or Bulldogs. I have socialised with my Brothers Staffs and adore my Sister in law's bearded terrier cross named Harvey. I walk him a lot. Perhaps I should just find a copy of Harvey and be done with it.  

Ruth


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## frodos_electric_guitar (Nov 19, 2010)

I read that and the first thing I thought of was "every home needs a Harvey"


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

kipper889 said:


> Sorry Hawksport, I missed your post.
> 
> I have never met an Akita, saying that, I don't know any Labs or Spaniels, Dobermans, dalmations or Bulldogs. I have socialised with my Brothers Staffs and adore my Sister in law's bearded terrier cross named Harvey. I walk him a lot. Perhaps I should just find a copy of Harvey and be done with it.
> 
> Ruth


I think getting some hands on Akita time before you make your decision with an experienced breeder or owner would be a good idea 

Did you check out the Eurasier at all ??


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## HWAR (Jul 19, 2010)

kipper889 said:


> Thanks Springer,
> 
> But.. if I get a 2-3 year old from rescue (I would dearly love to give a rescue dog a new loving home) how will I know it's history? How will I know what training it has received? What about the old saying 'Can't teach an old dog new tricks?'
> 
> ...


Lots of rescues now use foster homes and this would be a good avenue to take for your first dog. The dog comes in as a stray, an assessment is done and then the dog is placed in a suitable foster home. Whilst in the foster home a good picture is built up around what the dog is like in a home environment (what he/she likes, housetraining, training, personality etc) you can also meet your potential dog in that home environment and see for yourself roughly what you will be taking on :thumbup:

As for old dogs and new tricks, my latest rescue is a 7 year old girl who ecieved no training throughout her life other than 'sit' and 'paw'. She is 90% blind but in 4 months she has learnt to walk to heel, stay at distance, sit from distance, touch, crawl, recall, speak, quiet etc etc - she is a brilliant blank canvass for me to work with and she is so so willing. Don't discount an adult dog


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## kipper889 (Feb 9, 2011)

Hi Rainybow,

Thanks for that, just had a quick look and they certainly look like an alternative. My Son did some research last night and came up with a Finnish Spitz. I suspect this will open a whole new can of worms!!:scared:

I will carry on with our research but difficult to get the image of that georgous white Akita waiting for us out of my mind. Purely sentimental, must not let heart rule my head.

Ruth


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## frodos_electric_guitar (Nov 19, 2010)

kipper889 said:


> Hi Rainybow,
> 
> Thanks for that, just had a quick look and they certainly look like an alternative. My Son did some research last night and came up with a Finnish Spitz. I suspect this will open a whole new can of worms!!:scared:
> 
> ...


If you like Spitz breeds take a look here:
Spitz - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

You could get something with the sort of look you like that might be a bit more managable. I still think a Chow might be a good alternative. Medium-sized, lower energy and still have the aloof, cat-like nature of the Akita.


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

kipper889 said:


> Sorry Hawksport, I missed your post.
> 
> I have never met an Akita, saying that, I don't know any Labs or Spaniels, Dobermans, dalmations or Bulldogs. I have socialised with my Brothers Staffs and adore my Sister in law's bearded terrier cross named Harvey. I walk him a lot. Perhaps I should just find a copy of Harvey and be done with it.
> 
> Ruth


Get yourself and your family to discover dogs. Talk to the owners, meet the dogs and look at the alternative breeds. So many people come and completely change their mind once they look at the contents rather than the packaging


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

kipper889 said:


> Hi Rainybow,
> 
> Thanks for that, just had a quick look and they certainly look like an alternative. My Son did some research last night and came up with a Finnish Spitz. I suspect this will open a whole new can of worms!!:scared:
> 
> ...


Do a Google and check out the pics of Eurasiers, they are a stunning dog. My friend ended up with one because she too loved the Akitas/sibes Mals etc but really felt she wasn't able to manage one as this was her first dog.

She really did her research too and kept coming back to the Eurasier  I would describe his personality as very similar to a Labrador, full of energy and life, great with the kids and cats, very well behaved around the home. They need a reasonable amount of walking and he does have the pulling instinct but all round a lovely (if a little exhuberant) family dog. As with any puppy a good training class is essential


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## kipper889 (Feb 9, 2011)

Thanks Frodos,

I knew a black Chow (Named Chan) when I was quite young, I think perhaps he was not trained well or not used to children, I remember he snapped at me and I was frightened of him so I haven't considered a Chow because of this. Just shows that ones experience of a meeting with a particular breed can prejudice our views.

Thanks for the suggestion, my concern is the amount of grooming needed? I have always thought they have very long coats.

Ruth


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

I can't pretend to know a vast amount about the breed, but from what I have read and heard, I would not think an akita would be suitable as a first time dog. If you want a dog that size, how about a newfoundland? They are actually a bit bigger, and much hairier, but so, so friendly and gentle, easy to train, very intelligent and all they want is to please you. They do not need vast amounts of exercise and do not have an aggressive bone in their bodies.

A good place to look is champdogs.co.uk. They do not let just anybody advertise, you can view the dogs entire pedigree and therefore look up his ancestors.

I met a lady once who had a rottweiller and an akita out walking. I went and spoke to the dogs, after asking of course, and she told me that the akita was the most difficult dog she had ever owned. He could not be trusted with other dogs, except the rottie, could not be off lead for that reason and although she loved him, would never have another.

As I said, there are plenty of Akita owners on this forum who know a lot more than I do, just telling my own experience.


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## frodos_electric_guitar (Nov 19, 2010)

You can actually get smooth coated Chows however I'm not sure of how popular they are in the UK.

No you're right, Chow's tend to have a very poor reputation, especially state-side. It's the sad case of people buying them because they're fluffy and cute looking and not considering they require lots of socialisation and doing their research. However like I mentioned before they do tend to share some traits with the Akita. Aloof, can be suspicious of strangers, often thought as a one-person dog. The dog that took a snap at you was most likely not socialised very well, they can be absolute sweethearts - just like Akitas in the right hands.

I mean really, how mean does this guy look? 

YouTube - Mochi, the Dancing Chow Chow! * the CUTEST *


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

kipper889 said:


> Thanks Frodos,
> 
> I knew a black Chow (Named Chan) when I was quite young, I think perhaps he was not trained well or not used to children, I remember he snapped at me and I was frightened of him so I haven't considered a Chow because of this. Just shows that ones experience of a meeting with a particular breed can prejudice our views.
> 
> ...


Any long haired dog needs a lot of grooming, including the akita. Unless you get a non shedding dog or a short haired dog, and even they can moult all over the place and short hair is harder to get out.

Golden retrievers are also lovely dogs. They need a fair bit of grooming and they will shed, but their hair sort of stays on top so it easy to vacuum up.


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## kipper889 (Feb 9, 2011)

Have just looked again at the Eurasiers.

Thanks for the suggestion Rainybow. It looks like there are some local breeders, would be worth us going to visit to learn more.

Your chow is adorable Frodos. You see??? I want him now. 

Why is this so difficult? When I had my three kids I didn't care what breed, length of hair or how much training they needed. I just loved them whatever. 

So much choice, too much choice. I need someone to knock on my door with a bundle of fluff and say 'here you go'!! 

Ruth


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

> Why is this so difficult? When I had my three kids I didn't care what breed, length of hair or how much training they needed. I just loved them whatever.


now that was a good one hahahahah

ok worth to take a look on our friends of akitas rescue

UK Based Akita Rescue - Friends of Akitas Trust (UK), Rehoming Akitas around the UK

we do have couple fur-babies and there is allot of help 
that;s the front page with our boys and girls who r for adoption


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

gosh how beautiful are harley & spike :001_wub:


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

troy the fluffy one is going to be down to crufts


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

michaelasi said:


> now that was a good one hahahahah
> 
> ok worth to take a look on our friends of akitas rescue
> 
> ...


Looking on there you have 24 male and 13 females is that sort of percentage usual?


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

looks that way ....
will ask the lady who keeps the stats


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

michaelasi said:


> looks that way ....
> will ask the lady who keeps the stats


That would be about the same as our breed recue


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## Darkstitch (Feb 17, 2010)

Just a thought, if you like akitas you could look into shiba inus. They're like akitas but a fair bit smaller.


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## Liquidsunshine (Jan 24, 2011)

Hi, have had similar dilemma recently, and seriously wish you luck it's hard!!
Read through the posts, and I would agree (purely personal opinion, I don't have any experience of akita's) that you should go to a breed rescue and even ask them if you can volunteer to walk their dogs, or try and get any experience you can. Maybe you could get a different dog, and when you have more experience with training in general you could get an akita. I love great danes, but we can't afford the insurance, and not having any experience with a large breed we're slightly nervous about having one as our first dog. Maybe in the future, when we feel more ready! Take your time, and if you have any doubts, just don't go there. I know when you look at pups you're like aww I want one now, but if it doesn't work out, you can go on living your life, but the poor pup would end up in a home(sorry meant shelter ). I'm havig the exact same trouble and it is so difficult. Good luck!


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

Liquidsunshine said:


> Hi, have had similar dilemma recently, and seriously wish you luck it's hard!!
> Read through the posts, and I would agree (purely personal opinion, I don't have any experience of akita's) that you should go to a breed rescue and even ask them if you can volunteer to walk their dogs, or try and get any experience you can. Maybe you could get a different dog, and when you have more experience with training in general you could get an akita. I love great danes, but we can't afford the insurance, and not having any experience with a large breed we're slightly nervous about having one as our first dog. Maybe in the future, when we feel more ready! Take your time, and if you have any doubts, just don't go there. I know when you look at pups you're like aww I want one now, but if it doesn't work out, you can go on living your life, but the poor pup would end up in a home. I'm havig the exact same trouble and it is so difficult. Good luck!


Great honest post, good luck to you finding the right dog  I got it horribly wrong once, took on the wrong breed at the wrong time and it still hurts now as we had to rehome her, i waited over 10 years til i took the plunge again and made sure it was the right dog at the right time


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## Liquidsunshine (Jan 24, 2011)

Yeah we want to take our time and get it right, and by the way your cocker is gorgeous  Since being on this board, we've had so many breed suggestions, 100% opposites of what we first thought we wanted. We've looked at greyhounds, whippets,GSD, bernese mountain dogs and cockers. I've learned so much more about these breeds and it makes your decision so much harder, because they all have great traits and you only have to hear people talk about their dogs on here to make you think "hey, having an "x" sounds great!!" The one thing everyone says, no matter the breed is take your time to find a truly great breeder. Theres a great thread at the top of the breeding forum which was a great help to me.


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

Liquidsunshine said:


> Yeah we want to take our time and get it right, and by the way your cocker is gorgeous  Since being on this board, we've had so many breed suggestions, 100% opposites of what we first thought we wanted. We've looked at greyhounds, whippets,GSD, bernese mountain dogs and cockers. I've learned so much more about these breeds and it makes your decision so much harder, because they all have great traits and you only have to hear people talk about their dogs on here to make you think "hey, having an "x" sounds great!!" The one thing everyone says, no matter the breed is take your time to find a truly great breeder. Theres a great thread at the top of the breeding forum which was a great help to me.


Have you thought about a newfie? Wonderful creatures.


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## Liquidsunshine (Jan 24, 2011)

We did, you told us they were hard to insure these days and with an 18 month old she was at hazard of being constantly knocked over 
See, I was paying attention


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

have u look in to samoyed ? I love this breed as much as GSD and Alaskan malamute on top of my kita bears


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

Liquidsunshine said:


> We did, you told us they were hard to insure these days and with an 18 month old she was at hazard of being constantly knocked over
> See, I was paying attention


I obviously wasn't!! Not hard to insure, just expensive. Yes, could have caused a hazard especially when they are puppies. Ferdie used to sink his teeth into my office chair and drag me across the floor on it!


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## Liquidsunshine (Jan 24, 2011)

Hahaha no worries! No, I do like big breeds, we're just going to have to wait though. Was looking at someone's newfoundland pups on here the other day, absolutely adorable! Although saying that, all the puppies on here are gorgeous looking. In some ways this forum is no help for us folks looking to buy dogs! Too much temptation after looking at cute puppy photos!!


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## frodos_electric_guitar (Nov 19, 2010)

kipper889 said:


> Have just looked again at the Eurasiers.
> 
> Thanks for the suggestion Rainybow. It looks like there are some local breeders, would be worth us going to visit to learn more.
> 
> ...


Haha he isn't mine, I wish.  Just wanted to show that dogs are whatever you make them. You can get nasty chows and nasty akitas but generally it's the people at fault not the dogs. I agree with all the people saying that you should try and get yourself to Discover Dogs, it would be a great opportunity for you to take a look at these breeds fully-grown and in person.

Whatever you decide do keep us updated though!


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## Magnus (Oct 9, 2008)

Shrap said:


> I would have to agree with everyone here that an Akita really isn't a great idea for a first time dog owner..........
> 
> Have you considered something like a Leonberger?


    

WHAT - I can't believe that you would suggest a giant breed for a first time dog owner. Definitely not.


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

Just to add on the Eurasier front i checked with my friend today and although they are big hairy dogs they are double coated and grooming is minimal, i thought she spent hours on his coat, he always looks fab but apparently its low maintenance :thumbup: They do "blow" their coats twice a year though so that has to be considered


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## Shrap (Nov 22, 2010)

Magnus said:


> WHAT - I can't believe that you would suggest a giant breed for a first time dog owner. Definitely not.


IMO it's not to do with the size so much as the breed characteristics. Nobody, no matter how experienced, can hold back a large or giant breed dog. It's about how well you can deal with a breed mentally. Otherwise everyone would be suggesting small breeds! It's clear the OP likes big dogs, so o suggested some more easy going breeds. Don't really see the problem?


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

newfies , r a breed I would suggest as well and the samoyeds 9 AGAIN ) ;-P


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

Magnus said:


> WHAT - I can't believe that you would suggest a giant breed for a first time dog owner. Definitely not.


I think that depends on the breed, really. The OP says that they like the size of an Akita so what is wrong with going with a dog of a similar size but with a more gentle nature. That is why I suggested a newfoundland instead. I don't know enough about leonbergers to comment, but nothing wrong with a giant breed as long as you do your research.


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## Magnus (Oct 9, 2008)

Shrap said:


> IMO it's not to do with the size so much as the breed characteristics. Nobody, no matter how experienced, can hold back a large or giant breed dog. It's about how well you can deal with a breed mentally. Otherwise everyone would be suggesting small breeds! It's clear the OP likes big dogs, so o suggested some more easy going breeds. Don't really see the problem?





newfiesmum said:


> I think that depends on the breed, really. The OP says that they like the size of an Akita so what is wrong with going with a dog of a similar size but with a more gentle nature. That is why I suggested a newfoundland instead. I don't know enough about leonbergers to comment, but nothing wrong with a giant breed as long as you do your research.


The assumption that all Leonbergers are "easy going" is similar to the assumption that all Bull Terriers are aggressive; i.e. flawed.
The dog's character is shaped more by nurture than nature and I know of some mental Leonbergers that would make the (smaller) Akitas look like teddy bears.

Giant breeds bring with them additonal issues which have to be managed carefully at the puppy stage to ensure that long term damage is not done, much more so than "large" breeds.

A Leonberger is likely to end up being one and a half times the size and weight of an Akita and potentially could be just as difficult to train.

I stand by my comment that suggesting a Leonberger as a first dog is crazy.


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

Magnus said:


> The assumption that all Leonbergers are "easy going" is similar to the assumption that all Bull Terriers are aggressive; i.e. flawed.
> The dog's character is shaped more by nurture than nature and I know of some mental Leonbergers that would make the (smaller) Akitas look like teddy bears.
> 
> Giant breeds bring with them additonal issues which have to be managed carefully at the puppy stage to ensure that long term damage is not done, much more so than "large" breeds.
> ...


You said any giant breed is definitely out. As I said, don't know enough about leonbergers to comment, but newfies are extremely gentle dogs. However, any dog can be a pain in the wrong hands. There is a newfie round the corner to me who is absolutely loopy, guy doesn't have a clue, but he is still nice natured.

I can see how a giant breed would magnify any training problems, but the OP did say she liked the size.


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## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

I must admit before I got my first dog I kept seeing phrases about certain breeds/dogs such as 'experienced dog owner' & not for a 'first time dog owner' & didn't fully understand them as I was prepared to put work in, walk for hours & attend training classes, etc. 

However .... as I now have two dogs & understand a bit more about breeds, problems you may have, training & socialisation, etc I do think that that when people say things like that it is with very good reason!


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## Tapir (Mar 20, 2010)

......................................................................


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## Guest (Feb 14, 2011)

hawksport said:


> I can't see where anyone has said they are all bad but it is obvious to me that a dog bred to hunt bears needs a higher potential for aggression than a dog bred to retrieve shot ducks from a pond


WELL SAID!!!

can't agree more.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

pinklady said:


> Akitas are amazing, why do people always insist on [saying] they are not
> for first-time dog-owners? we all started somewhere!


because most first-time dog-owners IME can't properly *housetrain* a pup of ANY breed, let alone properly 
socialize a large, powerful, naturally-suspicious & wary guarding-breed? :scared:

i had been training & doing B-Mod with many, many breeds including Rotts & Dobes & LGDs for 20-years plus, 
when i got my Akita-puppy at 9.5-WO - when she was 12-WO i seriously questioned whether i'd made a terrible, 
terrible mistake in getting her. She went on to become my [second] heart-dog, but it was not easy. 


pinklady said:


> So long as you socialise them and give them lots of love and give them [boundaries] to follow,
> i wouldnt say you will have a problem. Please do not let it put you off, if you want an Akita, its your decision.


*love* is not the solution - *socialization*, training, impulse control, manners, bite inhibition, 
habituation to settings of all kinds, SEEING & MEETING people of all sorts & ages & sizes & colors, fast-moving 
loud people, quiet calm people, erratic weird people who dress funny, mirrored sunglasses, hats, noisy 
nylon clothing, canes & walkers, wheelchairs, limps, spastic movements, kids who scream...

novice owners have never done this before; adding a tough breed *who is willing & able to bite, & does not 
suffer fools gladly,* to all the other learning, stacks the odds against that family's success, and very likely 
means the pup will be at a shelter or on a Net-board for adoption by the time they are 6-MO, if not sooner.

good intentions are not enuf to get one thru the first 12-Mos of a pup's life, with a happy family & happy pup, 
who has a good foundation laid - the first 12-mos of a pup's life MAKES THE DOG for the next decade. 
- terry


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

pinklady said:


> Just a quick question, for everyone who has said they are not 1st time dogs, have you all been Akita owners?
> If not, how can you say this? everyone has an opinion, but it is [unfair] for you to judge a breed.


A - yes.

B - don't take it personally; i also do not suggest ANY guarding breed, primitive, LGD, former-fighter breed, 
terrierrrist, any thin-skinned reactive dogs, highly-aerobic types, very vocal breeds [Shelty, Doxy, Beagle, Pom...], 
over-attached dogs who bite readily [often a perfect descriptor of a Chihuahua], etc.

yes, i do *judge* breeds - all the time! also individual dogs, whose temp & behavior also vary widely. 
making a good match between dog & home / family is critical stuff; their compatibility is essential. 
an outgoing, social, affectionate dog in a very quiet household with no visitors, and a couch-spud human, 
will NOT be happy in that setting. the owner is a near-hermit and the dog thrives on social contact - 
this is no different than getting a Kuvasz or an Anatolian in an apartment surrounded by other residents, 
with kids, other dogs, visitors, schedules that vary, cars coming & going, radios & TVs playing, package & mail 
& pizza deliveries, and on & on. 
an LGD in that setting [livestock guarding dog] is as out of place as a fish on a sidewalk in full sun - they are LOST.

making a good match is quintessential.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

sskmick said:


> I haven't owned a large powerful breed, but I have to hand it to the Akitas, they are [magnificent]...
> 
> It annoys me when I see something along the lines of "only experience Breed owners to apply"
> how the hell do you get experience. A dog lives approximately 15 years, so you go for your second choice breed -
> you could have been gaining experience within that time with an Akita.


how annoying!  those breeders think they know everything, sheesh. 
and U know what? they're often right.

*U get experience by living with an easier dog first - which IMO is not a puppy of any breed, but an easygoing 
young-adult or even senior dog, who is already housetrained, has some leash-manners, is dog-social and 
human-tolerant, knows some basic cues well - like COME, SIT, WAIT, LEAVE IT, etc - and is forgiving of errors. *

U don't start out with a puppy - 
let alone a pup from a breed which is frequently dog-aggressive, is territorial and suspicious of strangers, has a strong 
tendency to resource-guard objects, food, bones, toys, crates, SELF and their humans, and is otherwise 
also an intelligent, boundary-testing, self-driven breed with few fears who questions authority. 


sskmick said:


> I am sure Akita breeders will agree there will be the pups in the litter that will need experienced handling
> and there will be the ones that will need firm handling.
> Socialisation and puppy class will be a must, the pup is going to become large and powerful,
> and you will need to be able to handle the dog in all possible situations.


there are no soft-natured, easygoing, slightly dumb, super-friendly Akitas, tho - 
who like 99% of all the people they ever see, tolerate all dogs from their first encounter, accept direction gladly 
and are eager to work or play with us no matter what we are doing, will bring us our slippers and love cats, 
small dogs, pocket-pets, growling barking Yorkies, ignore livestock, etc.

*Akitas without excellent socialization eat small dogs, kill cats, may fight other dogs especially same-sex dogs, 
are extremely predatory, will chase livestock, chase game including large predators, & have few fears, generally - 
which is not a good thing; fears are healthy & keep us out of trouble. 
people who have no fear of heights & climb 60-foot trees without safety gear often have short lives - 
and long falls. *


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## Luvdogs (Aug 15, 2008)

HWAR said:


> Lots of rescues now use foster homes and this would be a good avenue to take for your first dog. The dog comes in as a stray, an assessment is done and then the dog is placed in a suitable foster home. Whilst in the foster home a good picture is built up around what the dog is like in a home environment (what he/she likes, housetraining, training, personality etc) you can also meet your potential dog in that home environment and see for yourself roughly what you will be taking on :thumbup:
> 
> As for old dogs and new tricks, my latest rescue is a 7 year old girl who ecieved no training throughout her life other than 'sit' and 'paw'. She is 90% blind but in 4 months she has learnt to walk to heel, stay at distance, sit from distance, touch, crawl, recall, speak, quiet etc etc - she is a brilliant blank canvass for me to work with and she is so so willing. Don't discount an adult dog


My sister did just this.......she had always wanted a dalmatian so ended up fostering a four year old male for 5 months.
He was absolutely lovely though he was a nightmare on a lead...she had callous's on her hand from walking him at the start.
She didn't take him on....but will be will be getting one in the near future.


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## pinklady (Feb 6, 2010)

leashedForLife said:


> A - yes.
> 
> B - don't take it personally; i also do not suggest ANY guarding breed, primitive, LGD, former-fighter breed,
> terrierrrist, any thin-skinned reactive dogs, highly-aerobic types, very vocal breeds [Shelty, Doxy, Beagle, Pom...],
> ...


When you have quite finished. Just because you didnt have a good start with an Akita pup doesnt mean that other people will have the same experience. Everyone has their own opinion on breeds and everybody apart from you has not owned an Akita so they can only speculate on what the breed are like. I am a member of a welfare group that do lots of charity work for Akitas to promote the breed, to show people that they are great dogs and not all what you read in the papers. The way everybody is going on would make you think you are only allowed a small/med dog as a first dog!!!! why????? If you love a breed and have done your research i cant see what the problem is. My dog will walk off lead to heal whilest passing snarling Staffs, JR and Rotties to name a few but i wouldnt discriminate against these breeds so why do people find it acceptable to do this against Akitas?? If these breeds are so bad surely he would be retaliating? Like i said not all dogs are the same but i am sick of people hearing the name Akita and thinking the worst.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

catz4m8z said:


> I should think you would have to be prepared to be quite unpopular with strangers and other dog walkers too?
> 
> ...Akitas are one of the few breeds I would go out of my way to avoid, (even with no provocation).
> Im sure some are lovely its just the only 2 I see round my way are dog aggressive, and usually [look] like
> they will break free from their struggling owners any minute!!


 i met a Greyhound-rescuer one day at my vets in the waiting room - 
she was waiting for another foster to come out of desex surgery, i was waiting for a heartworm check. 
she asked what breed my dog was, and i was surprised that she was surprised - i thought she'd know 
an Akita on sight, but she thought my bitch was a Siberian *because she was quiet, well-behaved and offered 
no aggressive displays at all - * she had 3 friends, one in Norfolk, 1 in Chesapeake & one in Virginia Beach, 
ALL OF WHOM could not let any non-family visitors into the house, without sequestering the Akita; no friends, 
unless they were frequent visitors & preferably *female - not men;* no repair persons, no rug-cleaners, 
no deliverynik, nobody - period.

Akitas will own their homes unless they are taught that we make the decisions as to who visits, and who 
is welcome; they do not have to love all visitors, but they must be civil; WARNING visitors not to pet the dog 
is generally a wise precaution, altho most Akitas won't get close-enuf to touch except to sniff, and duck 
approaching hands.

they need to be socialized like pups - intensively & extensively - thru their second YEAR, and it must be 
maintained as a skill set by frequent exposures to friendly strangers, not necessarily being petted, 
but being around strangers & seeing them as no threat. 
my Akita-girl was a therapy-dog and visited a rehab-hospital regularly, as well as other facilities - but i spent 
BUCKETS of time getting her to that level of tolerance, it was not native to her by any means.


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## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

pinklady said:


> When you have quite finished. Just because you didnt have a good start with an Akita pup doesnt mean that other people will have the same experience. Everyone has their own opinion on breeds and everybody apart from you has not owned an Akita so they can only speculate on what the breed are like. I am a member of a welfare group that do lots of charity work for Akitas to promote the breed, to show people that they are great dogs and not all what you read in the papers. The way everybody is going on would make you think you are only allowed a small/med dog as a first dog!!!! why????? If you love a breed and have done your research i cant see what the problem is. My dog will walk off lead to heal whilest passing snarling Staffs, JR and Rotties to name a few but i wouldnt discriminate against these breeds so why do people find it acceptable to do this against Akitas?? If these breeds are so bad surely he would be retaliating? Like i said not all dogs are the same but i am sick of people hearing the name Akita and thinking the worst.


From reading the posts I really don't think people are discriminating against Akitas, they are showing concern for getting a breed known to have characteristics that could prove difficult for a first time dog owner.

I think the numerous posts on here regarding rescue centres being full, people abandoning animals or links to ads on Preloved listing many poor dogs that are being rehomed makes people want to ensure that prospective dog owners really are thinking about the breed they choose. Personally I think it's a good thing that the 'bad' bits are highlighted first so people are under no illusions when making their choice. I read an ad the other day where an Akita was being rehomed because he had grown too big :confused1:


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

pinklady said:


> When you have quite finished. Just because you didnt have a good start with an Akita pup doesnt mean that other people will have the same experience. Everyone has their own opinion on breeds and everybody apart from you has not owned an Akita so they can only speculate on what the breed are like. I am a member of a welfare group that do lots of charity work for Akitas to promote the breed, to show people that they are great dogs and not all what you read in the papers. The way everybody is going on would make you think you are only allowed a small/med dog as a first dog!!!! why????? If you love a breed and have done your research i cant see what the problem is. My dog will walk off lead to heal whilest passing snarling Staffs, JR and Rotties to name a few but i wouldnt discriminate against these breeds so why do people find it acceptable to do this against Akitas?? If these breeds are so bad surely he would be retaliating? Like i said not all dogs are the same but i am sick of people hearing the name Akita and thinking the worst.


Nobody is saying that an Akita is a dangerous or bad breed to own, only that any dog with those traits and particularly one that size, should not be owned by a first time dog owner. It doesn't matter how much research you have done, if you have never owned a dog at all, any puppy is going to be a shock to the system, and an Akita is not the place to start for the sake of the family and the dog.



Cleo38 said:


> From reading the posts I really don't think people are discriminating against Akitas, they are showing concern for getting a breed known to have characteristics that could prove difficult for a first time dog owner.
> 
> I think the numerous posts on here regarding rescue centres being full, people abandoning animals or links to ads on Preloved listing many poor dogs that are being rehomed makes people want to ensure that prospective dog owners really are thinking about the breed they choose. Personally I think it's a good thing that the 'bad' bits are highlighted first so people are under no illusions when making their choice. *I read an ad the other day where an Akita was being rehomed because he had grown too big :confused1*:


My dogs' breeder has had two brought back because they got too big. What the hell did they think a giant breed puppy was going to do? Shrink?


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

sskmick said:


> All dogs were originally breed for a particular purpose, even today there are working lines
> and show lines. A dog from working lines has a totally different outlook temperament to a dog
> from show lines, I'm referring to BCs.


no one has split Akitas into a pet-line & a non-pet line yet; they come with built-in tendencies, *which as they grow
from happy, friendly puphood toward puberty becomes increasingly intolerant & suspicious of strangers, 
at home or abroad.* 
my Akita pup came home at 9.5-WO and the very next morning, she gave an alarm-bark *at the first person 
she saw, walking briskly up the street toward the campus, head down and with no readable expression.* 
i called her over, said _Thank U, hush,_... and she did that _*every single morning,*_* for the next 3-mos.* 
the first 'suspicious' person got a bark - or a chuff, an alert-alarm - EVERY bloody day, for 3-months. 


sskmick said:


> All good reputable dog breeders should be breeding from a good temperament stock, with minimal genetic health issues.


dream on, that's a wonderful future goal. :thumbup: right now, it's a wild-eyed fantasy - but nice to think about.


sskmick said:


> ...I could pick... an Akita pup... round the corner no papers etc and [pick] a bag of potential trouble.
> I [say] *potential* because ...environment plays a big part in the dogs overall temperament, and I firmly believe this to be true.


will choosing a Border Collie from a badly-bred litter give u a pup who *will not chase moving creatures or objects?* 
i very much doubt it - a strong tendency to chase moving things is a herding trait, and BCs are a herding breed. 
if U choose a badly-bred pitbull, will that puppy NOT like tug nor hang happily on a rope, all 4 feet off the floor? 
again, i doubt it - loving to engage & being very-mouthy are bully-breed traits. 
ENVIRONMENT & Nurture will not 'erase' them.


sskmick said:


> I can't see how an owner can make a mistake causing the dog to become aggressive.


too little socialization, too much of the wrong kind, allowing the pup to draw the boundaries on the house, failing 
to teach the pup that handling by strangers [vets, groomers, dog-walker...] IS O-K, over-correcting the pup - 
*Akitas will defend YOU from all comers in a dangerous moment, OR they will defend themselves FROM YOU - 
all guarding breeds want allies, but harsh punishments or eroding trust creates a dog who sees YOU - the owner - 
as an enemy, or at the very least, not a trusted ally. very few breeds are **willing** to bite - most are reluctant. 
Akitas are willing to bite - they need to LEARN to warn; like Chow-Chows, Shibas, etc, they tend to freeze - 
that IS their warning; then they BITE, and it may or may not be a well-inhibited bite.*



sskmick said:


> Owners have two choices, bring the dog up to be friendly and social or bring the dog up
> to be fearful and aggressive. The same can be said for any breed.


that's not true; an Ovtcharka, Kuvasz, Akita, Rott, Dalmatian, & similar guarding breeds will greet an invader 
in the backyard much differently than a Lab, Golden or Siberian raised with precisely the same training.
the Akita or Ovtcharka are likely to bite, the Rott to growl & bark, & the Dal to bark & bite U when Ur back is turned. 


sskmick said:


> ...the way I train [my Staffy] is important, if I were to cuff him he'd raise the [ante], so I use treat reinforcement positive training.


that's great - but Staffies were not bred to defend property or BITE people, they were bred for dogfighting 
and can still be dog-aggressive or dog-reactive, even if their PARENTS were not, it can arise; they are rarely 
human-aggro, and not typically highly territorial; if i were doing a yard-job and a Staffy was home alone, 
so long as s/he met me happily at the gate, i'd go in - i would NOT enter the yard with an Akita, Rott or Ovtcharka, 
as boundaries mean a lot to those breeds - however friendly they were THRU the gate, entering the yard is another 
entirely different context, and highly fraught.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

kipper889 said:


> ...if I get a 2-3 year old from rescue (I would dearly love to give a rescue dog a new loving home)
> how will I know [her / his] history?
> How will I know what training it has received?


breed rescue takes in dogs from their owners regularly - they often have the pedigree, vet records, behavior history, 
the training class the pup went to, any certificates, etc, etc. 
besides which, *they usually live with the dogs - as fosters, in their homes - * and so know them quite well. 
if they've lived with a cat, other dogs, kids, etc, etc, - they Know. 
if the dog pulls on leash - they know!


kipper889 said:


> What about the old saying 'Can't teach an old dog new tricks?'


it's an old-husbands' tale; the oldest dog i've ever trained was an utterly untrained Rough Collie; 
Risa was 16-YO and did not even know how to SIT on cue. she learned very readily, in fact faster than most pups, 
as she could focus for longer periods & wanted to learn, while pups are learning EVERYthing, distractable, 
& have short attention spans.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

kipper889 said:


> My Son did some research last night and came up with a Finnish Spitz.
> I suspect this will open a whole new can of worms!! :scared:


um - do U like barking? LOTS of barking? :lol: the Finkers engage in barking-contests at dog shows; they crown 
a KING OF THE BARKERS - these dogs can produce 90 barks in 30-seconds.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

kipper889 said:


> I knew a... Chow... when I was quite young, ...perhaps he was not trained well or not used to children, ...he snapped at me and I was frightened of him so I haven't considered a Chow...
> ...ones experience of... a particular breed can prejudice our views.
> 
> ... my concern is the amount of grooming needed? I have always thought they have very long coats.


there are smooth coated Chows, just as there are smooth Collies & rough-coated Collies.


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## ClaireLouise (Oct 11, 2009)

I would agree with the majority on here. Akitas are not really for first time dog owners.

I own a rather moody, poorly socialised(we had her from 6 months onwards) Akita and its been hard work...... worth it but hard work.

Beautiful dogs but can be hard work esp around 2+. Im a member of a Akita forum and its the same old story. people expect little fluff happy pups which they are untill 2+ and the can become grumpy and challenging which is difficult for someone who has never owned a dog to deal with. Due to there size and power they are the NOT sort of breed you want to make many mistakes with.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

ClaireLouise said:


> I would agree with the majority on here. Akitas are not really for first time dog owners.
> 
> I own a rather moody, poorly socialised (we had her from 6 months onwards) Akita and its been hard work... worth it but hard work.
> 
> ...


i think U left out something?  
"Due to there size and power they are [Not?] the sort of breed you want to make many mistakes with. " 
just a guess, i could easily be wrong.


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## ClaireLouise (Oct 11, 2009)

leashedForLife said:


> i think U left out something?
> "Due to there size and power they are [Not?] the sort of breed you want to make many mistakes with. "
> just a guess, i could easily be wrong.


have edited it, I most definatly ment to have a NOT in there hahahaha


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## HWAR (Jul 19, 2010)

pinklady said:


> When you have quite finished. Just because you didnt have a good start with an Akita pup doesnt mean that other people will have the same experience. Everyone has their own opinion on breeds and everybody apart from you has not owned an Akita so they can only speculate on what the breed are like. I am a member of a welfare group that do lots of charity work for Akitas to promote the breed, to show people that they are great dogs and not all what you read in the papers. The way everybody is going on would make you think you are only allowed a small/med dog as a first dog!!!! why????? If you love a breed and have done your research i cant see what the problem is. My dog will walk off lead to heal whilest passing snarling Staffs, JR and Rotties to name a few but i wouldnt discriminate against these breeds so why do people find it acceptable to do this against Akitas?? If these breeds are so bad surely he would be retaliating? Like i said not all dogs are the same but i am sick of people hearing the name Akita and thinking the worst.


'My' breed is the Rott, I adore them and everything about them, it hurts me personally when I see them stuck in rescue with little hope and being abandoned or worse neglected or abused, I get upset with the bad press they get and peoples reactions to them based on media reports etc, however, I would never recommend them as a breed for the average first time owner. Part of the reason so many end up in rescue (a lot like the Akita) is because people who have very little real dog expeience take them on with the best intentions but can't offer the direction and environment that they need to be good, well trained, happy go lucky dogs that they are underneath that bad reputation.

That's exactly why people are suggestion that, on this occasion, the OP looks at alternative breeds - perhaps in a few years when the OP has had a more straightforward dog they will come back to the Akita and have a long and happy life with one. That's not slating the Akita as a breed just being realistic about the type of owner the average Akita will need to keep them happy, well socialised and well trained.


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## ClaireLouise (Oct 11, 2009)

pinklady said:


> When you have quite finished. Just because you didnt have a good start with an Akita pup doesnt mean that other people will have the same experience. Everyone has their own opinion on breeds and everybody apart from you has not owned an Akita so they can only speculate on what the breed are like.* I am a member of a welfare group that do lots of charity work for Akitas to promote the breed*, to show people that they are great dogs and not all what you read in the papers. The way everybody is going on would make you think you are only allowed a small/med dog as a first dog!!!! why????? If you love a breed and have done your research i cant see what the problem is. My dog will walk off lead to heal whilest passing snarling Staffs, JR and Rotties to name a few but i wouldnt discriminate against these breeds so why do people find it acceptable to do this against Akitas?? If these breeds are so bad surely he would be retaliating? Like i said not all dogs are the same but i am sick of people hearing the name Akita and thinking the worst.


Im also a member of an Akita welfare Trust. They promote the breed-Yes
BUT the promote sensible ownership and most wouldnt advise the Akita as a first dog. They give sound advise regarding the breed and the fact the can be challenging. 
No one here has said Akitas and thought of the worst but the fact is Akitas arent the easiest breed to own for many reasons but just to name a few
Size
Strength
Hunt instinct
Dog agression
Ability to ignore commands
Easily bored
Dislike of strangers
Guarding

And im not calling the breed(im an akita owner and love the breed) I just think people should know the facts and then they can make a choice if this breed is for them. People arent always prepared for these triats and thats why they end up in rescues.


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## Magnus (Oct 9, 2008)

newfiesmum said:


> You said any giant breed is definitely out. As I said, don't know enough about leonbergers to comment, but newfies are extremely gentle dogs. However, any dog can be a pain in the wrong hands. There is a newfie round the corner to me who is absolutely loopy, guy doesn't have a clue, but he is still nice natured.
> 
> I can see how a giant breed would magnify any training problems, but the OP did say she liked the size.


There is a Newfie about 300 yards from my house that is completely unapproachable and very, very aggressive. *Breeds* are not docile or aggressive, dogs are.

All this about a dog bred to hunt bears will be harder work than a dog bred to take shot duck from a pond (I presume that's the Newfie as a Leonberger was bred only to look like a lion) is tosh in my opinion. 
Nurture not nature will dictate any dog's behaviour - have you never seen a vicious Labrador?

Giant breeds for a first time owner are in my opinion (and let's be honest; we're all entitled to them) would be foolish.


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Magnus said:


> There is a Newfie about 300 yards from my house that is completely unapproachable and very, very aggressive. *Breeds* are not docile or aggressive, dogs are.
> 
> All this about a dog bred to hunt bears will be harder work than a dog bred to take shot duck from a pond (I presume that's the Newfie as a Leonberger was bred only to look like a lion) is tosh in my opinion.
> Nurture not nature will dictate any dog's behaviour - have you never seen a vicious Labrador?
> ...


When was the last time you saw the police or the military use a Labrador or a Newfoundland or a pointer as a patrol dog?
Why do you think that is?


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

Magnus said:


> There is a Newfie about 300 yards from my house that is completely unapproachable and very, very aggressive. *Breeds* are not docile or aggressive, dogs are.
> 
> All this about a dog bred to hunt bears will be harder work than a dog bred to take shot duck from a pond (I presume that's the Newfie as a Leonberger was bred only to look like a lion) is tosh in my opinion.
> Nurture not nature will dictate any dog's behaviour - have you never seen a vicious Labrador?
> ...


Actually newfoundlands are originally bred as rescue dogs to dig people out of snowdrifts and jump in icy lakes. They still to this day use them as lifeguards in Cornwall.

I am not saying you cannot get a nasty one, but that would be purely nuture, not nature. There is one near me who, although friendly enough, is completely loopy. Why? Because the owner does not have a clue. He told me he doesn't like other dogs. I have never come across one who did not like other dogs and I imagine that he was a little overenthusiastic for his size when he was a pup, and the result is that the owner always keeps him away from them.

An Akita has traits which would make him difficult for a first time owner. I would not suggest a pyrranean either, as they have been known to become a bit of a handful once they reach puberty.

Yes, you are certainly entitled to your opinion, as are we all.


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## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

Magnus said:


> *Breeds* are not docile or aggressive, dogs are.


Nobody was saying specific breeds are aggressive - they were pointing out that certain breeds have traits (guarding breeds for example) that require more socialisation or the consequnces can be harder to deal with.

My rescue GSD has had little socialisation around other dogs so is VERY reactive when we meet any. As she is so big this is more of a problem than say a JRT acting in such a way both physically (as in I'm lucky I'm quite strong so can keep hold of her) & other peoples reactions when it is a big dog lunging & barking.

You can't get away from the fact that dogs were bred to do certain jobs so will (usually, not always) exhibit certain characteristics associated with their breed & therefore you need to be aware of these in order to accomodate their needs & manage behaviour.

I think it's quite naive & could be detrimental to the dog to ignore these.


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## Luvdogs (Aug 15, 2008)

ClaireLouise said:


> Im also a member of an Akita welfare Trust. They promote the breed-Yes
> BUT the promote sensible ownership and most wouldnt advise the Akita as a first dog. They give sound advise regarding the breed and the fact the can be challenging.
> No one here has said Akitas and thought of the worst but the fact is Akitas arent the easiest breed to own for many reasons but just to name a few
> Size
> ...


Exactly it's good to know the down side as well, some people look pass this. that's why it's so important to research and spend lot's of time doing this, talking to the breed club,breeders, owners etc..... I like to know exactly what i am getting into! personally they are too much dog for me, but VERY gorgeous 
There are lot's of breeds i like the look of, but are not suitable to my lifestyle.

LOL watched Hachi yesterday....oh my i cried my eyes out!


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## michaelasi (Oct 29, 2009)

i owned before my 2 bears different breeds from small to large , when I got my girl ( luckily she is a very very laid back dog I did not felt a big difference from my old GSD boy who could be a bit of a bugger with male black GSD's but a treasure with the rest of the dogs and cats ) however when we adopted our male bear ,I started to feel what it means an akita dog .
No he did not challenged me as such , but because of some of his issues i.e . fear of fast moving cars , loud noises ,crowded places this could it be a big problem if I would not spend the time to educate and correct this issues . 
From fear a dog can bite - dogs and humans 
however we r nearly a year since we got him and the results r amazing , he is still a bit afraid of passing by buses , but nowhere near what used to be , he has quite few doggie friends on playground , but he can not stand male akita's (I think he thinks is the only male akita in the 'village' lol) .
Is been alot of work with him , but it never was a burden , his temperament was a bit wild because he had not been given the right education and I have reasons to believe he was beaten badly by his first owners . 
the guys in the rescue had done a very good job with him to calm him down and give him some more confidence , but the rest of the job laid on our shoulders and our female akita who he copy's her , hence the reason our big pup was to be re-homed with another female (I believe they r a perfect match) .
It was not easy but it was not impossible ,however because we had dogs before and had experience with challenging issues we had the patience to give him time to learn . 
i told u thins to understand the OP what is from the stray /rescue point of view owner the challenge ( of course not in detail). 

The first owners of our lad had let him on his own device in the pound because he was to much of a wimp for them ....

Oh not long ago someone on a different thread was asking about an appropriate muzzle for his rescue girl who she is walked off lead and shows dominance and toy aggression , also has a poor recall . I would like to remember to all akita owners who they walk there dogs off lead to think again . As alaskan malamutes , or husky's the akita have a very poor recall , of course there would be exceptions , however because of there dominance trait there can be a surprise . Be aware of this fact and work very hard .
Let your dog's off lead in enclosed areas with the dogs they r friends . 
Reason is , if they r walked on the street off lead and at one point they see a dog cross the street they can run across and it can happen a very nasty accident . Just bear that in mind , a dog is a dog and we all know how stubborn and strong minded they can be . 
This is my advice to u all , if I come across to arogant , I do apologise in advance but before u hammer me on this plz do take the time and think of what I said


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## Liquidsunshine (Jan 24, 2011)

I agree with everyone who has said that akitas might be too much hardwork. Currently I'm talking to breeders about GSDs and I'm still a tiny bit nervous that we're biting off more than we chew. GSD need a hell of a lot of work, socialisation etc, and If we don't do it right then the dog pays the price. I think research is 50% of the battle and 9 times out of ten when you see a dog you like, then research it, you'll change your mind. There are so many dogs that I would love to own, but it's daunting, and personally, I didn't even look at akita's or any of the "malamute etc" breeds, because they are known to be hard work. While I don't take having a GSD lightly, I think I'm capable of doing the dog justice. I stand by my earlier post, and even then, when you're working in a breed rescue, you can still leave at night and go home and not fret. It's only an indication. Most people wouldn't be able to cope 24/7, on their own, knowing they were 100% responsible and 100% culpable for how the dog turns out.


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## Magnus (Oct 9, 2008)

hawksport said:


> When was the last time you saw the police or the military use a Labrador or a Newfoundland or a pointer as a patrol dog?
> Why do you think that is?


Quite obviously because the German Shepherd has a look and an accepted popular perception of a dog which can be aggressive, and the biggest role the dog plays is to help prevent trouble by its presence. That and their intelligence and athleticism is why they are used.

In fact the German Shepherd (originally bred for herding sheep rather than chewing football hooligans) is statistically less aggressive than 17 other breeds including the Dachshund, Border Collie, Springer Spaniel and the Beagle. None of which will strike fear into the heart of your average ne'er do well like the wolf-like appearance of a GSD.

Look, all I am saying is that getting a giant breed, like a Leonberger, as a first time owner is ludicrously difficult because whether it was originally bred for serial killing and torture or rescue work, knitting or baking bloody cakes, it will be huge and extremely strong and will take the p!ss if you let it.

The lessons we all inevitably learn through mistakes will be exagerated and the consequences of getting it wrong with a giant breed will be worse for both owner and dog. 
I have owned German Shepherds all my life but Bear is my first "giant breed" and I have had to adapt my training and nurturing to fit the peculiar requirements and physical development of the breed. My previous dog experience has been invaluable. So, I cannot put my hand on my heart and say that a Leonberger, or any of the giant breeds, is suitable for a first time owner.


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## mrswoodwoose (Jan 23, 2011)

I am just thinking that there are thousands of beautiful healthy dogs put down each year as they cannot find homes for them - perhaps you would consider at least visiting one or two re-homing centres and talk to staff etc? Sometimes one just falls in love..

I agree with everyone who thinks they are unsuitable for first time owners. They are VERY strong: I saw one break away from his handler, snapped the leash, run into the road, and got hit by a car - the dog was fine, the car bumper had a dent. 

Also, thinking back to my teenage years, will your son be around for a long time to care for the dog too? Once children leave home to go to Uni or have a more active social life, walking the dog can get to be very boring, as does being home for feeding times etc, and you may be faced with the greater burden of day to day care. Fine if you are happy with this, I know I love looking after my cats, it's part of the pleasure having them. 

Do they have to be muzzled when out on walks?


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## ClaireLouise (Oct 11, 2009)

mrswoodwoose said:


> I am just thinking that there are thousands of beautiful healthy dogs put down each year as they cannot find homes for them - perhaps you would consider at least visiting one or two re-homing centres and talk to staff etc? Sometimes one just falls in love..
> 
> I agree with everyone who thinks they are unsuitable for first time owners. They are VERY strong: I saw one break away from his handler, snapped the leash, run into the road, and got hit by a car - the dog was fine, the car bumper had a dent.
> 
> ...


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

Liquidsunshine said:


> I agree with everyone who has said that akitas might be too much hardwork. Currently I'm talking to breeders about GSDs and I'm still a tiny bit nervous that we're biting off more than we chew. GSD need a hell of a lot of work, socialisation etc, and If we don't do it right then the dog pays the price. I think research is 50% of the battle and 9 times out of ten when you see a dog you like, then research it, you'll change your mind. There are so many dogs that I would love to own, but it's daunting, and personally, I didn't even look at akita's or any of the "malamute etc" breeds, because they are known to be hard work. While I don't take having a GSD lightly, I think I'm capable of doing the dog justice. I stand by my earlier post, and even then, when you're working in a breed rescue, you can still leave at night and go home and not fret. It's only an indication. Most people wouldn't be able to cope 24/7, on their own, knowing they were 100% responsible and 100% culpable for how the dog turns out.


I totally agree

Me and the OH had a chat about GSDs the other day in the pub, there is a bloke who brings one into the pub with him and this thing is a nightmare, totally explosive, no warning full on GSD when he goes (he has even gone at my little girl before out in the street and she had done nothing), no biting just really aggressive barking.

Now this bloke insists on bringing this dog into the pub and from what my OH sais there is an "incident" everytime he sees him in there, last week it went bonkers because someone brought another dog into the pub, this week it didn't like the fact someone walked in the side door.

This dog has had problems for at least 2 years and the bloke seems clueless as to how to address them so just carries on regardless, it's an accident waiting to happen and no doubt the dog will sufffer ultimately.

I love GSDs and have always said i would have one when the time was right but I have to accept that time may never be right and i might never be the "right" person for that particular breed. I think if you are taking on a living breathing thing you have to be really honest with yourself about your own limitations as an owner, are you firm enough, patient enough, strong enough etc etc. 

Ended up telling the OH i had decided on a Pug next instead of a Big Dog :lol:

Big Dogs when the kids are off hand


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## pearltheplank (Oct 2, 2010)

mrswoodwoose said:


> I am just thinking that there are thousands of beautiful healthy dogs put down each year as they cannot find homes for them - perhaps you would consider at least visiting one or two re-homing centres and talk to staff etc? Sometimes one just falls in love..


Having read throught this topic, I had to pick up on this comment, as even a lot of staff at rescues are clueless when it comes to specialised breeds. I am not picking on the Akita but I feel they can't go to just anyone, same as the my breed

The local RSPCA to me let an 80 year old slightly built lady have an 8 year old male Akita :scared: fortunately everything went well. The lady had experience of large dominant breeds all her life but if this boy had decided to bolt, she would have stood no chance


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## Liquidsunshine (Jan 24, 2011)

We have an 18 month old daughter , but as we have no plans for any more anytime soon, we'd like to have the pup now, rather than leave it and maybe never get one. At the min, I have the time to devote to socialisation. Not many people can go and spend the morning sitting outside a supermarket. So the timing is right for us. I don't think you can evr be 100% prepared, but we're confident enough to talk to breeders. At the end of the day, a good breeder isn't going to let us walk off with a puppy if they think we're not ready.


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

Liquidsunshine said:


> We have an 18 month old daughter , but as we have no plans for any more anytime soon, we'd like to have the pup now, rather than leave it and maybe never get one. At the min, I have the time to devote to socialisation. Not many people can go and spend the morning sitting outside a supermarket. So the timing is right for us. I don't think you can evr be 100% prepared, but we're confident enough to talk to breeders. At the end of the day, a good breeder isn't going to let us walk off with a puppy if they think we're not ready.


I got Oscar when my little one was about 2 and to be totally honest i wish i had waited another year or so.

The difference between giving a 2 year old instruction and a 3 year old (like DON'T shove your toast in the dogs face ) is massive and i found it really hard work with my 2 year old however she is actually more dog savvy than my 7 year old and at just 4 yrs old can make Oscar sit, heel, stay and come :lol:. Also there is quite a big physical difference between 2 and 3 in terms of robustness to being jumped up etc.

It's not impossible but the mouthing was a nightmare (Oscar was a total crocodile) and with a larger breed that would have been a total nightmare.

Also at 3 they should hopefully be having some time at pre school which allows for a longer dog walk/training session


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## Liquidsunshine (Jan 24, 2011)

Haha yeah, I don't know though, our Daughter is about 6 months ahead of other kids her age, she's bloody massive, the same height as my nephew who is a year older! She isn't really bothered about dogs either, we lived with my mum for a few months who has a bichon, and she just wouldn't be bothered about going near him, she likes dogs, but isn't in their face excited, because she grew up thinking that they're just another thing around the house, nothing special! I don't know, again it's going to depend on the breeder, and we may not even find the dog for us immediately, but another thing is, although my OH works full time when he's off, it's for 3-4 days at a time, and at most I;m only on my own throughout the day 2 days at a time. So it wouldn't be too much to drag our daughter out in her pram for those two days. We know it's a commitment, and like you said maybe we'd be better off waiting til she's three, it's something to think about and take into consideration


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

Liquidsunshine said:


> Haha yeah, I don't know though, our Daughter is about 6 months ahead of other kids her age, she's bloody massive, the same height as my nephew who is a year older! She isn't really bothered about dogs either, we lived with my mum for a few months who has a bichon, and she just wouldn't be bothered about going near him, she likes dogs, but isn't in their face excited, because she grew up thinking that they're just another thing around the house, nothing special! I don't know, again it's going to depend on the breeder, and we may not even find the dog for us immediately, but another thing is, although my OH works full time when he's off, it's for 3-4 days at a time, and at most I;m only on my own throughout the day 2 days at a time. So it wouldn't be too much to drag our daughter out in her pram for those two days. We know it's a commitment, and like you said maybe we'd be better off waiting til she's three, it's something to think about and take into consideration


My daughter is pretty robust too but i just described Oscar like a small terrorist crocodile for the first few months, he was particularly "mouthy" though.

I got through it and it was OK (but there were days when OMG i wondered WTF i had done :scared Just on reflection i think another year or so would have been alot easier, there again that could just be wishful thinking, not sure any time is right for the onslaught of a puppy :lol:


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## Liquidsunshine (Jan 24, 2011)

Had to laugh at the "small terrorist crocodile",


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## ClaireLouise (Oct 11, 2009)

Liquidsunshine said:


> Had to laugh at the "small terrorist crocodile",


it made me laugh too


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

Liquidsunshine said:


> Had to laugh at the "small terrorist crocodile",





ClaireLouise said:


> it made me laugh too


There were other things i called him but this is a family site  :scared:


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## NicoleW (Aug 28, 2010)

We got our pups when my daughter was 4 and my other daughter was 8 weeks old (born same day as our pup)



With her being 4 I think it's made a huge difference because she's learnt how rough she can be with them, not that she ever is but she's old enough to understand WHY to treat them with respect.

In regards to my baby, I'm hoping because she's grown up with them it won't be much of a problem but if they stick their head too much near hers she tends to grab their eyes so the dogs stay out of her way most of the time lol.


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## Emmastace (Feb 11, 2011)

I am trying to play devil's advocate here because I really do not know much about the Akita and I firmly believe that there is no bad dog (barring illness etc where they can't help it) but maybe anyone looking to get an Akita should read the opinion of 'The Akita Rescue and Welfare Trust' especially the section about the breed personality. These people obviously love and care about the breed or they would not be involved in the welfare and rescue of them, but they do suggest that they are a breed that needs very careful handling. An Akita breeder may be a little more biased. My little GSP girly has had my 6ft, 18 stone rugby playing OH off his feet before now just because she spotted a pigeon. GSP's are pretty powerful for their size but nothing compared to an Akita if they wanted to get to something and weren't in a good mood.
However much someone may like a certain breed I think you must be realistic in your capabilities. First time dog owners sometimes forget that, taken in isolation, time needed to exercise, time needed to train at home, time needed to take puppy classes, time needed to clear up accidents, time needed to shop for replacements of anything that has been chewed or destroyed doesn't seem much for each aspect but when you need the time for all of them to be added to your other commitments in life it is very easy to put off doing some of them. If you only have time to clean your wee'd on carpet or replace your son's school shoes you do that before walks and training and that's when the trouble starts. With a big powerful dog any shortfalls in training are potentially much more dangerous than with a smaller breed. It is also easy to put off training when puppies are small and cute and controllable.


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

Emmastace said:


> I am trying to play devil's advocate here because I really do not know much about the Akita and I firmly believe that there is no bad dog (barring illness etc where they can't help it) but maybe anyone looking to get an Akita should read the opinion of 'The Akita Rescue and Welfare Trust' especially the section about the breed personality. These people obviously love and care about the breed or they would not be involved in the welfare and rescue of them, but they do suggest that they are a breed that needs very careful handling. An Akita breeder may be a little more biased. My little GSP girly has had my 6ft, 18 stone rugby playing OH off his feet before now just because she spotted a pigeon. GSP's are pretty powerful for their size but nothing compared to an Akita if they wanted to get to something and weren't in a good mood.
> However much someone may like a certain breed I think you must be realistic in your capabilities. First time dog owners sometimes forget that, taken in isolation, time needed to exercise, time needed to train at home, time needed to take puppy classes, time needed to clear up accidents, time needed to shop for replacements of anything that has been chewed or destroyed doesn't seem much for each aspect but when you need the time for all of them to be added to your other commitments in life it is very easy to put off doing some of them. If you only have time to clean your wee'd on carpet or replace your son's school shoes you do that before walks and training and that's when the trouble starts. With a big powerful dog any shortfalls in training are potentially much more dangerous than with a smaller breed. It is also easy to put off training when puppies are small and cute and controllable.


Excellent Post 

I have looked into Newfies and i totally agree you will get a much more honest overview of a breed by checking out the Breed Club Sites or National Breed rescue sites because often they are the ones who clean up after those who buy with their rose tinted specs on


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

Emmastace said:


> I am trying to play devil's advocate here because I really do not know much about the Akita and I firmly believe that there is no bad dog (barring illness etc where they can't help it) but maybe anyone looking to get an Akita should read the opinion of 'The Akita Rescue and Welfare Trust' especially the section about the breed personality. These people obviously love and care about the breed or they would not be involved in the welfare and rescue of them, but they do suggest that they are a breed that needs very careful handling. *An Akita breeder may be a little more biased.* My little GSP girly has had my 6ft, 18 stone rugby playing OH off his feet before now just because she spotted a pigeon. GSP's are pretty powerful for their size but nothing compared to an Akita if they wanted to get to something and weren't in a good mood.
> However much someone may like a certain breed I think you must be realistic in your capabilities. First time dog owners sometimes forget that, taken in isolation, time needed to exercise, time needed to train at home, time needed to take puppy classes, time needed to clear up accidents, time needed to shop for replacements of anything that has been chewed or destroyed doesn't seem much for each aspect but when you need the time for all of them to be added to your other commitments in life it is very easy to put off doing some of them. If you only have time to clean your wee'd on carpet or replace your son's school shoes you do that before walks and training and that's when the trouble starts. With a big powerful dog any shortfalls in training are potentially much more dangerous than with a smaller breed. It is also easy to put off training when puppies are small and cute and controllable.


Unfortunately, the Akita is becoming so popular that they are being taken up in a big way by the puppy farmers and byb's who couldn't care less where they go as long as they get paid. No health checks, no temperament checks, nothing. There was someone on here a while back who had bought one and wanted to know how soon he could start breeding. Didn't even know what their lifespan was, just thought it would be an easy way to make money. People will always think they have found a bargain when they buy a pedigree dog, going cheap because not registered, and never stop to ask why. A friend who has always admired my dogs told me once that he had found a litter of newfies going for only £500 because they weren't registered. He truly believed that this was the only reason they were being sold at less than half the going price, until I asked him about health checks, temperament checks etc. He did not even know there was such a thing.

Until we can stamp out these sorts of breeders, the Akita is going to get as bad a name as the staffies and pitbulls and everything else that has been badly bred and badly raised.


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Magnus said:


> Quite obviously because the German Shepherd has a look and an accepted popular perception of a dog which can be aggressive, and the biggest role the dog plays is to help prevent trouble by its presence. That and their intelligence and athleticism is why they are used.


I think you will find that it's because if you run at a Lab or a Pointer or a Spaniiel shouting and waving a stick it will run off. The job it was bred to do didn't require it to have the mentality/temperement/character call it whatever you like to make and sustain an attack on a threat.



Magnus said:


> In fact the German Shepherd (originally bred for herding sheep rather than chewing football hooligans) is statistically less aggressive than 17 other breeds including the Dachshund, Border Collie, Springer Spaniel and the Beagle. None of which will strike fear into the heart of your average ne'er do well like the wolf-like appearance of a GSD.


Actually I did know herding sheep was part of the GSDs original purpose. 
17 other breeds with a higher bite statistic than GSDs. Do you think that might be because GSDs and similar breeds are given more respect? As an example when I was on a park with one of my GSDs. A young girl 5 or 6 years old 
"Mummy can I stroke that dog?"
"No they're nasty, go and stroke that one" points at a little white terrier type
Girl runs over on her own, never asked the owner, went to stroke the dog and got bit.

Generally speaking, because there are always exceptions
Sight hounds chase things they can see
Scent hounds follow scents
Gun dogs retrieve thing and like to swim
Collies herd things including their family
Guarding breeds guard they take threats and bad handling seriously, they are easier to provoke and they have what it takes mentally not to back down.


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## Magnus (Oct 9, 2008)

*I think you'll find* (_what a patronising expression that is _) that there are plenty of German Shepherds that would run away from someone just clapping their hands never mind waving a stick and shouting. 
It depends on how they've been trained and treated.

You get bold Labradors and cowardly Rottweilers - nurture not nature.

I'm going to stop now because there is little to be gained from peeing into the wind except moist trousers.


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

Magnus said:


> *I think you'll find* (_what a patronising expression that is _) that there are plenty of German Shepherds that would run away from someone just clapping their hands never mind waving a stick and shouting.
> It depends on how they've been trained and treated.
> 
> You get bold Labradors and cowardly Rottweilers - nurture not nature.
> ...


exceptions not rules


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Magnus said:


> *I think you'll find* (_what a patronising expression that is _) that there are plenty of German Shepherds that would run away from someone just clapping their hands never mind waving a stick and shouting.
> It depends on how they've been trained and treated.
> 
> You get bold Labradors and cowardly Rottweilers - nurture not nature.
> ...


Like I said there are exceptions to rules. Dogs a bred for different purposes and that requires different character just as much as different physical characteristics. To say a dog is a dog is like saying a car is a car, you don't see many Ferraris towing horse boxes over muddy fields.
I'd be interested to know what breeds you have kept and what breeds you have trained


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## Magnus (Oct 9, 2008)

hawksport said:


> To say a dog is a dog is like saying a car is a car, you don't see many Ferraris towing horse boxes over muddy fields.


Oh FFS - you see plenty of dog friendly bull terriers, cowardly GSD's, aggressive Labs etc. etc. to realise that bred in characteristics can easily be reshaped.



hawksport said:


> I'd be interested to know what breeds you have kept and what breeds you have trained


Enough to know that breed stereo-types are worthless and that nurture not nature shapes dogs behaviour.

Anyway, just accept we disagree; you think I'm wrong and I know you are.


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## cheekyscrip (Feb 8, 2010)

still if someone wants spitz-looking dog and akita is a not the easiest one - the are smaller and much easier to handle alternatives in spitz family...


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Magnus said:


> Oh FFS - you see plenty of dog friendly bull terriers, cowardly GSD's, aggressive Labs etc. etc. to realise that bred in characteristics can easily be reshaped.


Nobody is saying you don't but to get an aggressive Lab you need to make more mistakes in every stage of it's life from selecting breeding stock right through training and early socialisation



Magnus said:


> Enough to know that breed stereo-types are worthless and that nurture not nature shapes dogs behaviour.


Avoidence, always the best policy. Ask a politian


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

well, then!  if breed is utterly immaterial, we should STOP breeding for behavior - as it's a complete waste of time.

and if that's true, then i can cheerfully agree with the burban couple with 3 kids under the age of 7, 
who want a Border Collie pup - to go with their dual-jobs, dual-income, small condo family, 
where mum, dad & the kids are all scheduled every 15-mins relentlessly Monday thru Sunday, 
where free time is scheduled and space in the house is at a premium, and the 9-MO is just beginning 
to wobble short distances.

they want a loving, affectionate, smart pet - and BCs are smart, right? and they want to have the dog hang-out 
whenever the family *has time* to hang-out, and be content to be left in a shared concrete-floored patio 
outdoors in nice weather, or be unobtrusive in the house when they are home, but busy with other things, 
or be well-behaved and patient when they are out of the house - for work, taking the kids to school events, 
visiting family & friends, work-training seminars, and so on.

they have a sitter for the children, so the puppy can be cared for by the sitter - that should be easy! 
how much trouble can one puppy be? the youngest is feeding himself, most of the time, now... 
and the older children can help with the puppy!  it'll be great!


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

leashedForLife said:


> well, then!  if breed is utterly immaterial, we should STOP breeding for behavior - as it's a complete waste of time.
> 
> and if that's true, then i can cheerfully agree with the burban couple with 3 kids under the age of 7,
> who want a Border Collie pup - to go with their dual-jobs, dual-income, small condo family,
> ...


Sounds like the perfect breed for them. Sleep all day like a whippet and when it does wake up it's smart enough to train itself


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## jamie1977 (Jan 17, 2011)

To the OP - I considered Akitas for my "1st" dog (I say 1st as it would of been the 1st of my own, opposed to a family dog). I too got all the posts about the bad side to Akitas. I also got the good points, and then used this to make the decision not to get one for now at least. I think you should use everyones posts, to make your decision, and it sounds like you have been reading each post and then questioning your choice of an Akita. This is good because if you do get an Akita you will have given it alot of thought.

As hinted at here, you can get good Akitas, you can get bad Akitas. That is mainly down to it's training etc, only you know if you can put that effort in, as Akitas need alot of training etc compared to some other breeds. On the other hand I used to know a well behaved Akita and a unruly Yorkie. Only you know if you and your family can cope with the work that's needed.

I echo what has been said here, unless you have met an Akita, I would visit one first before making that first step. That goes for any breed you decide on, that you have not actually met. As photos/words online do not give the full picture.

Also give some thought to what will you do when your kids move out. Would you and your OH be able to cope with an Akita (or any breed).

I wish you luck in your decision.

Also to add to the disagreements here, I do not think anyone is slating Akita's as a breed. They are just highlighting the negative traits of the breed, which has had a positive impact in making the OP question her choice. At least if she choices an Akita she will have given it some thought using both sides of the "coin".

Every breed has it's good and bad points, and people highlighting each side is a good thing.


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## Liquidsunshine (Jan 24, 2011)

Well said, Jamie 1977...


and Leashedforlife, I think i've changed my mind, border collies sound great


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

Liquidsunshine said:


> ...I think i've changed my mind, border collies sound great


ya young scamp, watch out or i'll warm yer bottom :lol: better yet, i'll find a 6-MO BC with no manners, 
U can pet-sit for a month and we'll see how ya both get on, eh?...


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## Magnus (Oct 9, 2008)

hawksport said:


> Avoidence, always the best policy. Ask a politian


I would if I knew what a _Politian_ was.


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## kanhulk13 (Feb 12, 2011)

Just to throw a spanner in the works...I didn't go through the 17 pages but...

If it is the looks that attracted you to the Akita but you are worried about dog-dog aggression, size, first time owner etc. then you are CORRECT. I too fell in love with the breed..but decided against it due to my location (too many neighbours / dogs etc). 

Try the NORWEGIAN BUHUND, which has a strong following in the UK.

Easier to train, less stubborn (but still a challenge), not aggressive, great with kids, smaller, outdoorsy, sheds twice per year...lovely character and doable for a first time owner. The main negatives are that they love to escape for adventures, chase & chew things, and bark a lot. First 2 years can be tiresome...but this is a FUN dog.

Note - don't believe everything written about any breed esp from the net. Often the dog has it's own 'energy level' irrespective of the breed eg. the runt of the litter vs the most active pup or most nervous pup. Key is to get a dog with equal or less energy than you (are you couch potato ; fairly active ; or athletic type etc),


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## Liquidsunshine (Jan 24, 2011)

leashedForLife said:


> i'll find a 6-MO BC with no manners,
> U can pet-sit for a month and we'll see how ya both get on, eh?...


:scared:
I take it all back!!!!!


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

Magnus said:


> I would if I knew what a _Politian_ was.


Singing: _'o-oh, say can U C... I...'_


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## ClaireLouise (Oct 11, 2009)

I love a good spelling lesson :lol:


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

kanhulk13 said:


> ...I didn't go through the 17 pages but..


re-set the pages to FORTY posts per page. :thumbup: much less hassle! 
easy reading, less marginalia.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

hawksport said:


> Avoidance, always the best policy. Ask a politician


raised to an art-form by our late Teflon-Ron, the [acting] Presidential ex-President, Reagan - 
ask him *any*thing - if he didn't like the question, he'd throw a quip and steer the chat another way. 
it worked for him... by the time they stopped chuckling, he was off and gone.


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## Lady3131 (Nov 26, 2009)

Can I suggest going along to Crufts this year and having a good look at all the breeds? Meeting breeders etc?

If you can't make Crufts, pop along to Discover Dogs in November down in London and have a look round there! 

Akitas are beautiful dogs but a quite a bit to handle for first time owners! Make sure you are certain they are the dog for you before committing yourself to such a breed! 

Hope you find the right dog for you!


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Magnus said:


> I would if I knew what a _Politian_ was.


I do apologise for my spelling mistake.
Would you like me to go back and correct it?
If I wanted to be as childish as you I would have pointed out to you several pages ago that someone who claims to have as much knowledge about dogs as you really should know a Newfoundland isn't and never has been a gundog.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

Magnus said:


> All this about *a dog bred to hunt bears* will be harder work than *a dog bred to take
> [a] shot duck from a pond* (I presume that's the *Newfie *as a Leonberger was bred only to look like a lion) is tosh IMO.


Newfies are descendants of the early St. John's Waterdog - but much more massive. 
they were boat-draft dogs, net fetchers, helped move oyster drags, etc - the poor man's horse & marine helper. 
*they were never gundogs - fetching ducks is not their thing; boats, nets & crew overboard; not ducks.*

Akitas were big-game hunters in their early history - then they were kept by wealthy elite in pairs, guarding 
walled estates that were practically small cities - servants, slaves, peasants, their kids, the lord's family. 
the habit of keeping them sequestered & in opp-sex pairs, PLUS the later dog-fighting, means that many Akitas 
will not tolerate same-sex dogs sharing their home; even if desexed, they may fight seriously - opp-sex 
is a simple and recommended precaution.

between 1880 & 1930, dog-fighting & gambling on the fights became extremely popular - the smaller 
traditional Japanese breeds were *outcrossed* to bigger Western dog-breeds, like GSDs, Great Danes, 
Saints, Boxers, Bullmastiffs, English Mastiffs, etc; many of these breeds are masked [black muzzles];
dark masks, pied bodies, brindle markings, sox, blazes, lockets on chests, etc, came from the Western breeds -

the traditional Japanese Akitas have white chins & no mask at all, or a white mask. 
they are shades of strawberry blonde or red above, with or without brown or black TIPPING 
[called sesame] on the guard-hairs, and countershaded below - white cream or buff chin and underside 
plus INside the legs - or they're solid white; very uniform; they are also SMALLER than the Western-type. 
[approx 2/3 the size or even 1/2 the size.]


Magnus said:


> Nurture not nature will dictate any dog's behaviour - have you never seen a vicious Labrador?


pish & tosh; we are not discussing the individual variations in single dogs; we are discussing *breed traits.*
herding types tend to chase moving objects; GSDs who chase cars are as common as ducks who dabble. 
Corgis & ACDs / heelers who nip the grandkid's calves and pull their pantslegs are a dime a dozen. :lol: 
terrierrrrists are excited easily, react to squeaky or squealing noises, are predatory and often more aggro 
than many bigger breeds; they were bred to take on animals often bigger than themselves, *in a dark burrow.* 
they can be pugnacious and start things they have no hope of finishing successfully - like p*ssing off big-dogs 
and starting a fight.


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Magnus said:


> Nurture not nature will dictate any dog's behaviour


So breeders who take care to only breed from dogs with good sound temperaments are wasting their time. An interesting theory and one I hope no breeder on here agrees with

and FYI Dobermann is spelt with a double n in the UK


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## Bijou (Aug 26, 2009)

My friends used to breed Akita's under the Wolfen affix wolfen.me.uk they gave up after many years and switched to Leonbergers - they found the Akitas impressive and stunning looking dogs but incredibly hard work - I'm sure they'd be happy for you to give them a call to get an honest appraisal of the Akita character and temperrment and their suitability as a first time owners dog - I do know that they can be *very* dominant with other dogs and very often cannot mix with the same sex

I would go for an Elkhound if you want this type of spitzy medium coated breed - lovely 'sensible' dogs or a Buhund if you want something a little smaller....I've never understood why these two breeds are so often overlooked - they make delightful family dogs with almost without exception very sound construction and temperament and very few helath issues.


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## Magnus (Oct 9, 2008)

hawksport said:


> I do apologise for my spelling mistake.
> Would you like me to go back and correct it?
> If I wanted to be as childish as you I would have pointed out to you several pages ago that someone who claims to have as much knowledge about dogs as you really should know a Newfoundland isn't and never has been a gundog.





hawksport said:


> So breeders who take care to only breed from dogs with good sound temperaments are wasting their time. An interesting theory and one I hope no breeder on here agrees with
> 
> and FYI Dobermann is spelt with a double n in the UK


F*cking hell - you seem to have "childish" really well covered already fella!

One at time:

It was someone else who mentioned ducks and Newfies I merely said I presumed *they* were talking about Newfies as Leos were bred only to look like lions.

I have never _claimed_ to be anything I simply have an opinion based on a lifetime of training dogs, I'll leave the claims to others.

I have not mentioned Dobermanns at all in this thread. 

My comment on "Politian" was followed by a big laughy face - this means a joke.

You insist on missing my point so I'll have one more go -

*no matter how much a breeder breeds behavioural tendency into their litters this can be countered and turned on its head by poor or ineffective training and treatment.*

Now, all your little pals who like to support you in trying to browbeat anyone who dares to suggest anything different to "_breeding is everything_" can say what they like but that, my budgie fancying friend, is fact.  (This means joke about the budgies)


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

One thing I've learnt while teaching is that you can't teach anything to those that already know everything. So I'm going to leave this thread. If there is anything I have said that the op would like to discus further then I will direct you to a KC recognised training club where you can see exactly who I am, and get all my contact details. Maybe someone else will make a similar offer, or maybe they wont


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## Magnus (Oct 9, 2008)

hawksport said:


> you can't teach anything to those that already know everything.


Never a truer word spoken.


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## Colette (Jan 2, 2010)

Just my two pence...

I a a firm believer that behaviour is governed by both nature *and* nurture. Of course every dog is different, and yes you can certainly get aggressive labs, lazy collies, and dog-friendly staffies etc. 
But we have more than 200 recognised breeds in the UK for a reason - and it isn't all cosmetics. There is a reason you rarely see companion breeds herding sheep, or gundogs being used as security dogs, or bulldogs catching bunnies. Many of these breeds have been developed for a specific purpose, with breeders selecting for the desired traits and abilities generation after generation.

Getting any dog should be a matter of mathcing up the requirements and capabilities of the owner to the requirements an capabilities of the dog. Getting a dog on looks alone - or worse, simply denying its likely character - is asking for trouble, and imo irresponsible.

This is especialy true for a first dog. Research and planning is of course important - even vital - but it isn't everything.

Look at training... you can read up on the basics of training and you may understand it completely. Sounds easy doesn't it. 
But do you have the timing? Can you keep it fun if the dog gets bored easily? What would you do if your dog turns out not to be food motivated? Can you judge when to change the reinfocrement schedule? Can you hold your temper when the dog just doesn't get it?
Think you wil be fine teaching loose lead walking to a pup? What if you struggle? Could you still control that dog when it weighs almost as much as you do?

With a dog that is likely to be biddable, easy going and forgiving of your mistakes - a novice trainer may still do very well. With a dog that is notoriously hard to train, easily bored, and difficult to motivate life becomes much harder.

Socialisation - I believe it was Dunbar (please someone correct me if I got it wrong) that said you should aim for a pup to meet at least 100 strangers before the age of 12 weeks (ie before vaccinations are finished).
Most owners don't make this number. Does it matter? That depends. I would suggest from my experience that with a bichon frise - probably not. You might only meet 30 strangers in that time, but chances are you will not cause any serious problems. Bichons just don't do "suspicious" or "guarding". They seem to assume everyone is innocent until proven guilty; hell they are more likely to have the opposite problem of going to potentially dangerous people or dogs because they don't recognise the threat.
With a breed prone to suspicion, with high guarding instincts, I would for well over the 100 mark. And it has to be done right, not just gt out there and hope for the best.

Theory is the easy bit - and even then there are a great many people who, despite research and advice, still don't understand how to socialise and train. But the theory is childsplay to actually doing it. And mess it up and you will get problems.

Breed traits come in again here. If you "mess up" with a bichon you may well get poor recal because the dog wants to play with every dog, human, small furry, car etc it sees. You may have trouble housetraining. Mess up with a lab and it will chew through your home. Mess up with a collie and you get a neurotic, highly strung animal that tries to herd your children. Mess up with a terrier and you're likely to end up with a yappy little ankle biter. Mess up with an akita - and you get a large, powerful dog that will bite first, ask questions later and will willingly attack other dogs (and people) on site.

Nobody on here can stop you getting an akita as your first dog if you insist on doing so. But if you must do it, please, please take all precautions. Go along to Crufts or DD and meet some, talk to the owners and breeders. Read all the books, all the websites. Accept that the downsides and risks people here have been telling you are real and decide for yourself if you are capable of dealing with them. 
And most importantly get some experience. Dog sit for a friend. Volunteer for a rescue. See if your local training classes will let you sit in and watch. Hell, as I'm currently dogless I'm keeping my hand in clicker training my cats!

But please don't get an akita thinking it is just a golden retriever in disguise, then wonder why it all goes wrong!


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Magnus said:


> Never a truer word spoken.


Bet you already knew that


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

Colette - an excellent post. 

And I couldn't agree more with you here. I do think this is a big problem at the moment and a reason why we are seeing more aggression from dogs both towards other dogs and humans. So many people choose a breed on looks.



> Getting any dog should be a matter of mathcing up the requirements and capabilities of the owner to the requirements an capabilities of the dog. Getting a dog on looks alone - or worse, simply denying its likely character - is asking for trouble, and imo irresponsible.


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## Nicky10 (Jan 11, 2010)

No one's saying a first time owner can't handle an akita or any other large guard/hunting breed but that would be the exception IMO. They require a lot of training and socialisation for nothing else than they're huge and powerful with poor recall. Even the friendliest dog that size that's out of control could be a danger to the owner and other people. Akitas are big, powerful, have a high prey drive, are suspicious of strangers and are deaf to commands when they want to be. They're amazing in the right hands loyal and devoted to their owners but in the wrong hands like any large breed especially a guard/hunting breed they're dangerous. They have a bad enough reputation at the moment and that can hinder socialisation how many people are going to cross the street to avoid it or want to cuddle the cute fluffy puppy then run when they find out what it is? Research any breed you get very carefully find a breed that matches you as best as you can.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

Just another thought, but I wonder if a 'reputable' breed would actually sell an akita pup to a first time owner. I know breeders of other breeds that need an experienced owner who would not sell a pup to a first time owner, which would mean the only way of getting such a pup would be from a byb or puppy farmer who does't care where the pup goes as long as it's paid for.


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

rocco33 said:


> Just another thought, but I wonder if a 'reputable' breed would actually sell an akita pup to a first time owner. I know breeders of other breeds that need an experienced owner who would not sell a pup to a first time owner, which would mean the only way of getting such a pup would be from a byb or puppy farmer who does't care where the pup goes as long as it's paid for.


or from a rescue


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## jamie1977 (Jan 17, 2011)

cutekiaro1 said:


> or from a rescue


There are a fair few in rescues, some pure but more crosses, especially GSD x Akita and Staff x Akita.


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

jamie1977 said:


> There are a fair few in rescues, some pure but more crosses, especially GSD x Akita and Staff x Akita.


its a shame isnt it


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## Magnus (Oct 9, 2008)

hawksport said:


> Bet you already knew that


Good grief you're tedious


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> or from a rescue


A good rescue will be as selective about prospective owners as a good breeder. I appreciate that not all rescues/pounds are as selective and that is why so many end up going back into rescue again.

The odds of getting a well behaved easy dog of this breed (or any other testing breed) are not high. Even with easy going breeds, rescues rarely get well behaved, well trained dogs in.

This is from a rescue I help with and it sums in up nicely (and these are labradors - a very easy going breed 



> Note to adopters:
> 
> Lassie, Rin Tin Tin and Toto don't show up in rescue. We don't get the elegantly coiffed, classically beautiful, completely well trained, perfect dog. Many never had good veterinary care, kind or consistent training, or sufficient company. Some have lived outside, or left alone for many hours every day. When rehomed they're scared or depressed and anxious and will act out of character but time, patience and love will solve this. When you take on a rescue dog you need to be 100% committed to making it work, "ride the storm" but don't ever give up. We at rescue never give up on a dog. We know that a dog is a living being, with a spirit and a heart and feelings. Our dogs are not commodities, things, or garbage. They are part of life's sacred creation and they deserve as much love and care and respect as Lassie, Rin Tin Tin or Toto. So please, please don't come to rescue in the hopes of getting a "bargain," or "a fully trained dog". Come to Rescue to give, to love, to save a life -- and to mend your own spirit. For Rescue will reward you in ways you never thought possible. We can promise you this -- a rescue dog will make you a better person.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> Nurture not nature will dictate any dog's behaviour


Sorry, that's just not true. Both nature AND nuture dictates a dog's behaviour.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

rocco33 said:


> Both nature AND nurture dictates a dog's behaviour.


true not only for dogs - teasing apart the strands of upbringing, personal experience, the times one lives thru, 
family heritage, genetics, epigenetics, etc, is a complex task for any species. 
humans born in the USA of the Roaring Twenties were different in many ways from USA-kids of the Depression, 
and it stamped them lifelong. the Baby-Boomers & Gen-X are not the same people at different ages - 
they have distinct experiences & attitudes, as a cohort, which reach above & beyond personal experiences.

nature & nurture together shape a whole creature. Of the two, *nature* is the harder to alter - 
making a Dalmatian a winning herding-trials competitor is harder than making a Dal into a marathon runner, 
or a buddy for a rider-and-horse endurance team.


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