# Colitis and Raw Diet



## Fuzzy_moo (Mar 9, 2011)

My dog has colitis and has done for a few years. Certain foods trigger it, i.e. eggs, beef, pork, turkey. She is currently fed on Royal Canin Sensitivity Control SC24 and has a wainwrights tray mixed in with it (lamb or duck flavours only) and has been doing great on it since.

I've been reading up about the Raw Diet and as previously mentioned on another thread i posted I've had a bad experience with it before. 

I wondered though if anyone has fed a dog the raw diet with colitis? Is it suitable?

I currently spend £60 on the kibble which last her about 8 weeks and I pay £8.50 for 12 trays which lasts me 24 days. So I roughly spend about £35 a month on her food. 

Could I feed her on the Raw Diet for less than this? She weighs around 28kg and gets walked for 1-1.5 hours a day. Also, as she can only really have white fish, poatatoes, rice, chicken, lamb, duck and vegetables, would this be okay?

I don't have a local butchers where I live either. Tesco is the only place I can get my meat and veg from, so again would it be cheaper for me to buy her stuff for a raw diet from Tesco? Or should I stick to her current kibble?


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## LexiLou2 (Mar 15, 2011)

Hi, I'm not sure if i can answer your specific question but my dog has a really senstive stomach, she has only ever been able to eat chicken and rice flavoured burns complete however i am switching her to raw I am starting with all chicken based, chicken mince and chicken drumsticks with veg thrown in, i will then introduce chicken liver. Then i am going to introduce other meats very slowly avoiding beef and pork totally as these are supposed to be bad for hypersenstivity. I have had issues with lamb flavoured complete dry foods but apprantly i should try her on lamb meat raw as it is digested differently and she coudl react differently.

Hope that helps a little.


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## Fuzzy_moo (Mar 9, 2011)

LexiLou2 said:


> Hi, I'm not sure if i can answer your specific question but my dog has a really senstive stomach, she has only ever been able to eat chicken and rice flavoured burns complete however i am switching her to raw I am starting with all chicken based, chicken mince and chicken drumsticks with veg thrown in, i will then introduce chicken liver. Then i am going to introduce other meats very slowly avoiding beef and pork totally as these are supposed to be bad for hypersenstivity. I have had issues with lamb flavoured complete dry foods but apprantly i should try her on lamb meat raw as it is digested differently and she coudl react differently.
> 
> Hope that helps a little.


Thanks, it would be great if you could let me know how your dog gets on with it? I used to feed mine on burns before she had colitis. It's a shame I can't give her any meat, her diet is so restricted.


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## Sparkle (Jan 28, 2010)

I feed raw have done since daisy was 10 weeks she came to me with chronic soft stools to the point she had blood pouring out of her bum (literally she was on my lap I ended up with spots of blood on me  ) anyway it was never diagnosed as colitis but she was very poorly the vet tried everything so I put her on Raw and haven't turned back I just had to keep her bone heavy for a long time!

She couldn't have any form of grains not that they need it and if she snuck one piece of dry food from my friends house we were back at the vets with blood pouring out her bum

Anyway Just start with one protein and stay bone heavy for a while and slowly cut the bone down and add more meat it's a very long process but done correctly it does work!!

Also wanted to add that just because your dog can't stomach some proteins in processed form doesn't mean they can't in their raw natural form I know a lot of dogs with allergies to chicken or pork that can eat them raw no problem they just stayed bone heavy for a while.

Good luck


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## Fuzzy_moo (Mar 9, 2011)

Sparkle said:


> I feed raw have done since daisy was 10 weeks she came to me with chronic soft stools to the point she had blood pouring out of her bum (literally she was on my lap I ended up with spots of blood on me  ) anyway it was never diagnosed as colitis but she was very poorly the vet tried everything so I put her on Raw and haven't turned back I just had to keep her bone heavy for a long time!
> 
> She couldn't have any form of grains not that they need it and if she snuck one piece of dry food from my friends house we were back at the vets with blood pouring out her bum
> 
> ...


She has been given fresh turkey and beef etc before (we like to give her meat when we can along with her kibble) and she gets a poorly tummy, so I know she can't eat it cooked, I haven't tried it raw though.


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## Souris (May 24, 2010)

For starters, it certainly won't be cheaper to feed her from Tesco, in fact I'd say it'll be almost twice as expensive. The only way you could make tesco work is to say get the reduced meat at the end of the day, but that's very much a gamble as to what will be there.

If you wanted to feed raw 'cheaply' then your best bet is to look at an online supplier if you haven't got an butcher/abattoir near you. However, you'd need to buy in bulk to make your postage and packaging work out for you. So, you'd really in an ideal world need a second freezer dedicated to the dog: you could more than likely pick one up second hand for about half the price of retail if you shopped around online for this. Gumtree/freecycle: websites like these would be your best bet for used freezers if you have a car and can go and collect it.

If she's 28kg then she'd need around 700g of food a day (working by 2.5% of her bodyweight). Lets say you decide (as an example) to go with minces from raw to go (raw to go is complete if you don't feel confident initially with getting the balance right) as the bulk of her meals and then supplement it with various bones during the week for her teeth- say lamb ribs, turkey drumsticks, chicken etc etc. 

A packet of mince from raw to go costs around 48-72p and contains 454g. So, she'd need a packet and a half roughly a day (a packet and a half is around 725g give or take a few grams for exactly what you class as a half). So, say you go with the chicken mince (48p a packet), you are looking at around 75p a day if you fed just the chicken mince. However, whilst on a raw diet she will need quite a bit of variety, so whilst a 75p a day mince would be on the cheaper side if you wanted to feed say the rabbit one you're looking at £1.08 a day. 

On top of the minces (if you did decide to go down the mince rule) you'd need to top it up with bones such as chicken drumsticks, turkey drumsticks, lamb ribs, necks etc etc which could be bought online. Raw to go has a good selection of bones, as does the dog food company, I believe natural instinct does turkey carcasses too and of course you could get her bones from Tesco as well. I'd imagine this will be an extra ten pounds to twenty pounds a month-ish.

Say you didn't fancy raw to gos complete meals, you could possibly look at something like DAF's minces instead which come in slightly cheaper. Going for the minced chicken again you're looking at 41p per lb if you go for 1-5 boxes or 40p per lb if you went for more than 6 boxes (so 60p a day ish with the DAF minces). 

However, the issue here is that the meals aren't complete, so you'd need to get hold of DAF to find out how much bone is in their minces and then substitute more bone (say in the form of a chicken wing) if their mince isn't very boney and then of course there's offal on top of it (if you're looking at a pray style diet then you want 10% of her food to be offal- 5% liver, 5% another type of offal like kidney. So, you're looking at 490g of offal a week- now, you can get offal quite cheaply at tesco, however you can also order it online. 8kg of liver from DAF is £9.36 which if you went halves with something like kidney which is £6.66 per 8kg you are looking at an 8kg box of both lasting you around 8 months (looking at feeding 1kg each a month). Not a clue about BARF I'm afraid- hopefully someone like Sleeping Lion will come along and help). Also, you will need to keep up the variety- so prices will vary between minces.

There are of course other suppliers: the dog food company, darlings (BARF) and Natural instinct (BARF) to name just a few. It'd be worth shopping around to see what deals you could get.

Now, if you don't fancy feeding her the minces you are then looking at chunks of meat. So, chunks of chicken, duck etc etc at 700g a day- with a picture of 80% meat, 10%-15% bone, 10% offal over the face of a week (every meal does not have to be balanced but you do need to get the rough balance over a period of time). Now you could buy that from tesco but I'd imagine it'd be extremely expensive.

As for the suitability, you will have to introduce raw carefully and slowly. Going slowly is the key: do not rush it or you will have a dog with a poorly tummy. Start with chicken (just chicken- no offal) and see how she gets along with it, if it's fine after a week or two then ever so slowly add in a second protein source. Transition it carefully and slowly- so say you wanted to bring in lamb as a second source I'd feed her 95% chicken the first day and say 5% lamb that day. See how she is, if she's fine, slowly up the amount she's ok with day by day.

When I first introduced Pixel to offal I would freeze it in tiny 5g strips and he'd have one of those a day. If he was fine with the offal then I'd slowly up the portion sizes until he's now on his weekly allowance four times a week.

Overall, unless you can find a good supplier that's willing to go cheaper than the online prices I'd guess you'd be looking at about the thirty five to forty five pounds a month mark with bones included. As for suitability, I can't say as my pup is fine in general, however I can say that you may find she is completely fine with say raw beef/turkey/eggs if they're introduced slowly and carefully.

Best of luck- I hope this helps somewhat with the practicalities of pricing and such!


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## Fuzzy_moo (Mar 9, 2011)

Souris said:


> For starters, it certainly won't be cheaper to feed her from Tesco, in fact I'd say it'll be almost twice as expensive. The only way you could make tesco work is to say get the reduced meat at the end of the day, but that's very much a gamble as to what will be there.
> 
> If you wanted to feed raw 'cheaply' then your best bet is to look at an online supplier if you haven't got an butcher/abattoir near you. However, you'd need to buy in bulk to make your postage and packaging work out for you. So, you'd really in an ideal world need a second freezer dedicated to the dog: you could more than likely pick one up second hand for about half the price of retail if you shopped around online for this. Gumtree/freecycle: websites like these would be your best bet for used freezers if you have a car and can go and collect it.
> 
> ...


Thanks for that, so I would be looking at a similar price or possibly more money, if i read all that correct? I'm struggling to afford the £35 a month at the moment unfortinately, so I couldn't stretch to anymore than that


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## Souris (May 24, 2010)

Unless you could find a cheaper supplier- I'm afraid you would be looking at about the same price/more expensive. DAF is the cheapest supplier that I know of online, and say if you fed her solely on the chicken mince you'd be looking at around twenty pounds- but I really do feel strongly that a raw fed dog needs variety, and unfortunately that will up the cost when you start factoring that and bones in as well.

It might be worth perhaps making up a supposed meal plan for a month up, seeing how much mince/bones that'd use and pricing it up but I doubt it's going to be much cheaper than the thirty five mark.

I know Sleeping Lion feeds her big dogs for next to nothing on raw but I believe she gets hers from a local abattoir and has locally sourced tripe.


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## hobbs2004 (Mar 12, 2010)

Souris said:


> Unless you could find a cheaper supplier- I'm afraid you would be looking at about the same price/more expensive. DAF is the cheapest supplier that I know of online, and say if you fed her solely on the chicken mince you'd be looking at around twenty pounds- but I really do feel strongly that a raw fed dog needs variety, and unfortunately that will up the cost when you start factoring that and bones in as well.
> 
> It might be worth perhaps making up a supposed meal plan for a month up, seeing how much mince/bones that'd use and pricing it up but I doubt it's going to be much cheaper than the thirty five mark.
> 
> I know Sleeping Lion feeds her big dogs for next to nothing on raw but I believe she gets hers from a local abattoir and has locally sourced tripe.


Unless I am very much mistaken, Raw to Go is just a supplier of DAF minces in Wales who are willing to post nationally (unlike other suppliers across the country).

Personally, and after many conversations with the makers of DAF minces I am not convinced that the minces really are complete or are following the 80/10/5/5 ratio. It very much depends on the flavour. Some contain way too much bone, others not enough, some contain no offal. I guess as long as you feed a variety of flavours than it should even itself out but I feed raw because I want to know what is in my cats' food!


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## Fuzzy_moo (Mar 9, 2011)

Souris said:


> Unless you could find a cheaper supplier- I'm afraid you would be looking at about the same price/more expensive. DAF is the cheapest supplier that I know of online, and say if you fed her solely on the chicken mince you'd be looking at around twenty pounds- but I really do feel strongly that a raw fed dog needs variety, and unfortunately that will up the cost when you start factoring that and bones in as well.
> 
> It might be worth perhaps making up a supposed meal plan for a month up, seeing how much mince/bones that'd use and pricing it up but I doubt it's going to be much cheaper than the thirty five mark.
> 
> I know Sleeping Lion feeds her big dogs for next to nothing on raw but I believe she gets hers from a local abattoir and has locally sourced tripe.


It's unfortinate I don't have a local butchers and I also can't drive so I can't even travel to find one. I'd like to give her variety within her diet as I try to now as I know she gets bored. I mean whether she could have raw beef, turkey and pork without it upsetting her stomach I'm not sure. Do people find it really time consuming as well? It seems like a lot of preperation and planning and being a uni student and doing a part time job, i don't have too much time on my hands either. Some of the benefits of the diet interested me though - hence this thread.


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## Souris (May 24, 2010)

Hobbs: I just mentioned raw to go as somebody else was talking about it in another thread with it being complete. (Edit: With it being complete I mean i.e as it's one of the cheaper completes- Natural instinct and Darlings are a lot more expensive and follow BARF) I didn't know it was a supplier of DAF- I know the DAF minces aren't complete, but the raw to go advertises itself as the complete 80/10/5/5 which is why I mentioned it. 

I don't feed minces at all myself, well apart from minced tripe. I'll have to have a look into raw to go- I'm interested myself if they are just a DAF supplier!


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## hobbs2004 (Mar 12, 2010)

Souris said:


> Hobbs: I just mentioned raw to go as somebody else was talking about it in another thread with it being complete. I didn't know it was a supplier of DAF- I know the DAF minces aren't complete, but the raw to go advertises itself as the complete 80/10/5/5 which is why I mentioned it.
> 
> I don't feed minces at all myself, well apart from minced tripe. I'll have to have a look into raw to go- I'm interested myself if they are just a DAF supplier!


Let me know what you find out! They certainly started off as DAF suppliers!

Yes, they do mention the right ratios but it all fell apart when I talked to Lee at DAF and dug a bit further. The content of the minces (meat -offal - bone ratio) is all subject to seasonal variations. But every single time I talked to them I got a different story. So, personally I am a bit wary.


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## Souris (May 24, 2010)

Will do! I'll have to enquire, it's naughty if they are just a supplier of DAF really, I thought they'd have to state that on their website.

Fuzzy_Moo: It can be time consuming, yes. What I tend to do is bag all the food up on a monthly basis and label it (I have a calendar with exact meal plans in the kitchen on a week by week basis), then I can take it out of the freezer the night before to feed it. 

It does take a whole day to sort out once a month, but once it's bagged and sorted it's no more complicated then taking a handful of kibble and pouring it into a bowl.


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## hobbs2004 (Mar 12, 2010)

Souris said:


> It does take a whole day to sort out once a month, but once it's bagged and sorted it's no more complicated then taking a handful of kibble and pouring it into a bowl.


Agreed! I prepare my cats' raw one weekend every 6-8 weeks, bag it up into daily portions, then just defrost a bag in the fridge overnight, warm it up slightly in a bain marie (my cats like it blood-temperature warm) and feed it much to their purring delight. *Almost* as easy as opening a tin of food!


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## Fuzzy_moo (Mar 9, 2011)

Souris said:


> Will do! I'll have to enquire, it's naughty if they are just a supplier of DAF really, I thought they'd have to state that on their website.
> 
> Fuzzy_Moo: It can be time consuming, yes. What I tend to do is bag all the food up on a monthly basis and label it (I have a calendar with exact meal plans in the kitchen on a week by week basis), then I can take it out of the freezer the night before to feed it.
> 
> It does take a whole day to sort out once a month, but once it's bagged and sorted it's no more complicated then taking a handful of kibble and pouring it into a bowl.


Thanks, I only live in a small flat though and the freezers only big enough for our food. I don't have space to get a sceond freezer. Not sure whether I can physically change her on to this diet then with lack of money and freezer space?


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## Souris (May 24, 2010)

If you price it up and think you could possibly afford it then you can actually get small tabletop freezers. They're great for kitchens without much room, our kitchen isn't massive, so we decided to go down the tabletop freezer size: it fits perfectly on the top and holds a lot more than you'd think for it's size! 

On a second glance around, the dog food companies minces are slightly cheaper than DAF, but I do believe they're not complete again (I've not actually ever been able to get hold of the dog food company so I'm not 100% sure what their percentages are in their food), so you'd need to add in the offal plus bones. 

Sorry I can't be of more help. The only thing I can suggest if you want to liven up her meals is to perhaps buy say some chicken thighs/drumsticks/wings and feed them to her once or twice a week for teeth cleaning and enjoyment purposes.


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## Fuzzy_moo (Mar 9, 2011)

Souris said:


> If you price it up and think you could possibly afford it then you can actually get small tabletop freezers. They're great for kitchens without much room, our kitchen isn't massive, so we decided to go down the tabletop freezer size: it fits perfectly on the top and holds a lot more than you'd think for it's size!
> 
> On a second glance around, the dog food companies minces are slightly cheaper than DAF, but I do believe they're not complete again (I've not actually ever been able to get hold of the dog food company so I'm not 100% sure what their percentages are in their food), so you'd need to add in the offal plus bones.
> 
> Sorry I can't be of more help. The only thing I can suggest if you want to liven up her meals is to perhaps buy say some chicken thighs/drumsticks/wings and feed them to her once or twice a week for teeth cleaning and enjoyment purposes.


Thanks that might be a good idea to continue with the kibble but to give her chicken wings etc like a treat once or twice a week. I know she'd enjoy it!


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## Souris (May 24, 2010)

Sounds like a plan! Just remember that kibble takes much longer to digest than raw does, so feed them a good few hours apart- or say feed her the wings in the morning and then kibble for tea.


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## dvnbiker (Dec 2, 2009)

I currently use rawtogo specially as I didnt need to think about the ratios as this was what I was worried about. 

This is off their website: Each contains ground meat, bones and offal in the ratio of 80% 10% 10% and simply goes into the pet food bowl. No cooking, no recipes, just Raw to Go.

As I understand it these are the ratios that are required.


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## hobbs2004 (Mar 12, 2010)

dvnbiker said:


> I currently use rawtogo specially as I didnt need to think about the ratios as this was what I was worried about.
> 
> This is off their website: Each contains ground meat, bones and offal in the ratio of 80% 10% 10% and simply goes into the pet food bowl. No cooking, no recipes, just Raw to Go.
> 
> As I understand it these are the ratios that are required.


Yes, these are indeed the ratios that most would follow (perhaps slightly more bones for dogs) but unless it has all changed within the last few months, I can only say that based on my conversations with the manufacturers (particularly Lee directly at DAF) probably none of their minces follows the 80/10/5/5. I don't have any of this in writing as we just talked on the phone - numerous times lol. *However*, despite the variation that there is in the make-up of the minces as long as you feed a variety of their flavours it should even itself out.

But things could have changed (they were subject to seasonal variations anyhow - not only in terms of the meats that are available but also in the degree to which offal and bones are included) and the only thing I can suggest that you phone Lee at DAF and talk to them about the make-up of their minces.

From where I am standing, Darlings are the minces that I suggest people try out on their cats. They do working dog ones, which don't contain any veggies, but they consistently follow roughly the ratios. But because they use organic, free-range, as local as possible, meat they are more expensive than the DAF ones.

However, to me the main attraction is that raw feeding allows you to control what your pets are eating and to some extent you still rely on other people when using preprepared minces and are bombarded by their PR etc. Yes, they are a great way into raw feeding but once you (one) have (has) read up on how to provide a raw diet in a conscientious manner then it really isn't that difficult to prepare the meals yourself


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## GoldenShadow (Jun 15, 2009)

Fuzzy_moo said:


> Thanks that might be a good idea to continue with the kibble but to give her chicken wings etc like a treat once or twice a week. I know she'd enjoy it!


It sounds like you're in a very similar situation to me 

http://www.petforums.co.uk/dog-heal...fic-advice-i-will-luff-yoohs-all-forever.html

My dog can't eat beef or pork and does best on Fish4Dogs kibble and a wet food, he can't seem to tolerate cereals at all and I want to go part raw, no space for full etc sadly 

I think I will do a couple days/mornings a week raw. Everyone used to say it was real cheap but tbh I'm not finding it very cheap at all unless you have tonnes of space sadly! Time will tell I guess


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

I feed all my six from the dogfood co. and an order of £40 lasts me a month. I belive the minimum order is £25 and with one dog i's expect that to last you a month easily. As you probably know my dogs are, 60kgs, 57kgs, 43kgs, 10kgs, 8kgs, & 2kgs (awe) he's so titchy, lol. So with the cost of mine in mind i'd expect an order of £25 to last you more like two months tbh.

You can order pancreas from them and it contains lots of lovely enzymes to boost your dogs intake and help with a dicky tum. It is a little more expensive, because obviously each animal only has one and they're not all that big but i'm sure Scott would be able to mince a little in each of your minces if you asked, as he makes food to order but if he can't you can add a little pancreas each day for a couple of weeks to get her on track, then add once a week. 

Have a browse here. The Dog Food Company - Products Page


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## Guest (Mar 21, 2011)

Fuzzy_moo said:


> My dog has colitis and has done for a few years. Certain foods trigger it, i.e. eggs, beef, pork, turkey. She is currently fed on Royal Canin Sensitivity Control SC24 and has a wainwrights tray mixed in with it (lamb or duck flavours only) and has been doing great on it since.
> 
> I've been reading up about the Raw Diet and as previously mentioned on another thread i posted I've had a bad experience with it before.
> 
> ...


Personally I prefer a good quality wet, nature diet and rinti spring to mind!


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## Souris (May 24, 2010)

Malmum said:


> I feed all my six from the dogfood co. and an order of £40 lasts me a month. I belive the minimum order is £25 and with one dog i's expect that to last you a month easily. As you probably know my dogs are, 60kgs, 57kgs, 43kgs, 10kgs, 8kgs, & 2kgs (awe) he's so titchy, lol. So with the cost of mine in mind i'd expect an order of £25 to last you more like two months tbh.[/url]


What do you feed on a daily/weekly basis if you don't mind me asking to get those prices?

I don't order from the dog food company, but even with Pixel alone I'm looking at between twenty and thirty pounds a month depending what he has, and he's only 7kg. Admitting I don't feed any mince (bar the tripe) which would lower the cost mind, but I'd love to know how you keep the cost so low.


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

They have a lot of minces because they also have a lot of carcasses and wings, so I have to make sure they have enough meaty meals too.

The minces they have are, economy mince (lamb/beef) - this is lovely as it has some offal added, quite boody but they like the "gravy", rabbit mince, chicken mince, venison mince and tripe mince. Meaty rib bones/necks, box of carcasses or wings, but I usually now get the carcasses or wings from my butcher when the freezer is a little less full, he charges a fiver for a 15kgs box. I also get liver and heart from the dogfood co. as well as kidney.

My buthcher save me bones, not weight bearing cow bones though but his bones have hardly any meat, so if they have them they just get mince for their last meal and liver to help the bone through. 

The only problem I ever had was giving Flynn a marrow bone last year the day before his birthday, as I wanted to do some gardening and keep him quiet. By the time I remembered he'd eaten the WHOLE thing and it was HUGE!!! Spent the whole of his birthday trying to poo to no avail, next day had to have a GA, enema and manual evacuation - cost me £300!!  And completely ruined my baby's birthday - i'm still just as angry at myself now as I was then!


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## Souris (May 24, 2010)

Ahh, righteo!

Do the dog food companies rabbit/chicken etc mince have bone in it too?


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

Yep all the minces contain bone - he also sells whole rabbits (£2) - yuk! but Marty is the only one who will eat them and has to do it when three of my grown kids aren't about as they think it's rank! He only has them on special occasions though, like his birthday, christmas and easter - well everyone likes an easter bunny!


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## Guest (Mar 21, 2011)

Malmum said:


> Yep all the minces contain bone - he also sells whole rabbits (£2) - yuk! but Marty is the only one who will eat them and has to do it when three of my grown kids aren't about as they think it's rank! He only has them on special occasions though, like his birthday, christmas and easter - well everyone likes an easter bunny!


Re the bone - cannot see the importance her myslef - the problem with colitis and raw I would think would be the 'bad' bactaria fermenting in the gut! 
Those that know - correct me if you know better!
DT


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## Petloversdigest (Dec 10, 2010)

DoubleTrouble said:


> Re the bone - cannot see the importance her myslef - the problem with colitis and raw I would think would be the 'bad' bactaria fermenting in the gut!
> Those that know - correct me if you know better!
> DT


I might be wrong but the diarrhoea is from gut motility issues surely - where the irritated large intestine does not process the food well and it gets spat out rather more quickly than normal without the water being reabsorbed - hence the 'wetness' of the diarrhoea. Bones do slow down the motility so will help prevent this. Also, gut bacteria change frequently, and original enthusiasts of RMB diets used to recommend feeding probotics in the form of live yoghurt (before the days of powdered forms) weekly. So I guess if you introduce a new diet slowly then the gut bacteria have time to adjust to the new food source too. It was good to engage brain to think about this question DT! 

I am just starting to convert my new dog over so this thread has been really helpful regarding suppliers and price.


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## Guest (Mar 21, 2011)

Petloversdigest said:


> I might be wrong but the diarrhoea is from gut motility issues surely - where the irritated large intestine does not process the food well and it gets spat out rather more quickly than normal without the water being reabsorbed - hence the 'wetness' of the diarrhoea. Bones do slow down the motility so will help prevent this. Also, gut bacteria change frequently, and original enthusiasts of RMB diets used to recommend feeding probotics in the form of live yoghurt (before the days of powdered forms) weekly. So I guess if you introduce a new diet slowly then the gut bacteria have time to adjust to the new food source too. It was good to engage brain to think about this question DT!
> 
> I am just starting to convert my new dog over so this thread has been really helpful regarding suppliers and price.


Raw fermenting in gut is what I think about! and if the gut aint healthy then not summat I would risk!
A high fibre diet is SAID to help colitus.


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## Petloversdigest (Dec 10, 2010)

DoubleTrouble said:


> Raw fermenting in gut is what I think about! and if the gut aint healthy then not summat I would risk!


I wince slightly when I picture this - just as I did when I read about feeding whole rabbit - stupid to be so squeamish really....but anyway, most of the nutrients and proteins are gone by the time the food hits the large intestine, so there may not be alot left to ferment at that stage...


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## Guest (Mar 21, 2011)

Petloversdigest said:


> I wince slightly when I picture this - just as I did when I read about feeding whole rabbit - stupid to be so squeamish really....but anyway, most of the nutrients and proteins are gone by the time the food hits the large intestine, so there may not be alot left to ferment at that stage...


There is no problem with feeding whole rabbit to a dog with a healthy digestion system!


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## Petloversdigest (Dec 10, 2010)

DoubleTrouble said:


> There is no problem with feeding whole rabbit to a dog with a healthy digestion system!


Yup, it's me. I'm a complete wimp - I'd probably have to adminster last rites of something if it still looked like a bunny......(I have been vegan for many many years, which doesn't help...)


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

If you look back at some old threads people often change to raw because of diarrhoea with other food and are amazed at the results on barf - we did with Marty as he had terrible problems when a pup which went on for three months, all the tests the vet did were negetive, bloods fine and lots of different foods. Changed him straight over to barf, as we thought he had nothing to lose and hoepfully something to gain and within 48 hours had his first solid poo since we got him, never a runny poo since in over six years. That's the reason all the other's are now fed barf as we could see how beneficial it was for him and wanted the same for all of them.

T-Bo was changed over after he settled here too, no half and half either, just straight on to barf and has not had any runny poo issues - he didn't have on commercial either, he just started to refuse to eat it as he could smell the barf everytime I dished up the other dogs food and was scrounging for some too. Hasn't had commercial for over two weeks and eats every bit of his meals now.


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## dvnbiker (Dec 2, 2009)

well I emailed Lesley at rawtogo and she has confirmed that the minces do come from DAF so she is up front and honest about that. She has told me that DAF minces are on the proper ratio so have emailed DAF about it. 

I am certainly going to continue to use rawtogo as it suits me and as someone has said elsewhere in this thread as long as you are feeding variety then it should balance over time. Tonight we start to introduce lamb mince. Hopefully in another few days will be able to try the chicken & beef mince I have and then I can do another order with a huge variety of stuff for next month. 

My lot have always had bones every week anyway so fingers crossed I am getting the balance right :0


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## newlynk (Mar 19, 2011)

My elderly boy suddenly developed colitis and I tried various foods (he has always been allergic to poultry - gives him bloody stools.) I have never tried raw food though. However I read that grains can aggravate the gut and give the runs/blood/mucus and so I switched to a white fish and potato dry food from fish4dogs. I purchased a small bag from my local pet store first to see if it suited and then ordered a bigger bag online to get cheaper prices by shopping around. They do a white fish and potato and a salmon and potato.

I did try some other brands with fish and vegetable but that didn't suit him either so stuck to this one.

I did moisten it with some warm water for him but he prefers it dry. What a difference!! I could not believe how quickly he was back to solid stools, no blood or mucus. Only a dog lover could cheer madly when their dog has a solid poo for the first time in months!! I do not feed him ANYTHING else though - just this food - I use it as treats too.

Seems if I mix anything else in he starts to get softer stools.

I feel awful just giving him what to me seems boring food but he loves it and it keeps his tummy healthy and I know he is getting all the proper nutrients too - especially as he is an old chap! 

Might be worth a go for anyone out there with this problem.


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## dvnbiker (Dec 2, 2009)

hobbs2004 said:


> Let me know what you find out! They certainly started off as DAF suppliers!
> 
> Yes, they do mention the right ratios but it all fell apart when I talked to Lee at DAF and dug a bit further. The content of the minces (meat -offal - bone ratio) is all subject to seasonal variations. But every single time I talked to them I got a different story. So, personally I am a bit wary.


Well I have emailed DAF and they have confirmed that their minces are on the 80/10/10 ratio and therefore this is on the raw feeding basis so personally I dont have concerns as long as I am feeding a varied diet and add in bones etc as well.


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## LexiLou2 (Mar 15, 2011)

Lesley at raw2go has emailed me too, her exact phrasing was roughly 80:10:10 split however i still want to feed bone etc for her teeth so she gave me some suggestions as to how to get round it feeding mince some days and chunks of meats, meaty bones and offal others. I have been impressed with raw feeding so far i must say, she gots to doggy day camp on a tuesday so i dropped her off this morning and told them she is on a blanket ban of all treats, I'm sure she will love me for that but its for her own good.


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## shoreset (Apr 19, 2008)

Just before Xmas I ordered £90 worth of food from berriwoods, and put it in a chest freezer we got for free on freegle. And the freezer was FULL when i put everything in there, roughly 2 months on I have not even gone through 1/4 of stuff in there, although granted I have bought the odd bits and pieces as well, but I generally get my meaty bones/marrow bones for free from the butchers many of which have alot of meat on then which can usually make a meal.

My dog has 1000-1200g a day


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## MarKalAm (Sep 6, 2008)

dvnbiker said:


> Well I have emailed DAF and they have confirmed that their minces are on the 80/10/10 ratio and therefore this is on the raw feeding basis so personally I dont have concerns as long as I am feeding a varied diet and add in bones etc as well.


Is this a new thing? They don't state on their website the minces are 'complete'.

When I was looking for a new supplier from Landywoods (before I found TDFC) and considered DAF they said nothing about complete minces.

I hope they are telling people now, because some like to know what their dogs are getting!


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## dvnbiker (Dec 2, 2009)

I emailed them and said 'I am interested in the minces that you do. Are these based on the 80/10/10 ratio for raw feeding'. Their response was 'Yes there are on that ratio, Let me know if there is any other way I can help'


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## hobbs2004 (Mar 12, 2010)

dvnbiker said:


> I emailed them and said 'I am interested in the minces that you do. Are these based on the 80/10/10 ratio for raw feeding'. Their response was 'Yes there are on that ratio, Let me know if there is any other way I can help'


Maybe they have tidied up their act. But that was also the blanket response I got, which all fell apart when you started quizzing about particular minces. I personally have lost faith in them. But as I have said before, variations in the ratio are perhaps negligible as long as you feed a variety of flavours.


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## dvnbiker (Dec 2, 2009)

I don't expect perfection but it has got to be easier than me messing about with it but then the plan is to introduce a whole variety so something different everyday


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## Andrew141 (Mar 23, 2011)

Chronic colitis answer to one of two dietary approaches: 1) Improving the volume of fiber in the animal's diet or 2) Feeding a diet that is not likely to stimulate an allergic reaction.There is no way to presume which approach might be better for your pet.


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## Guest (Mar 23, 2011)

Andrew141 said:


> Chronic colitis answer to one of two dietary approaches: 1) Improving the volume of fiber in the animal's diet or 2) Feeding a diet that is not likely to stimulate an allergic reaction.There is no way to presume which approach might be better for your pet.


I said that two pages back, folk do tend to overlook the fibre when their dogs are suffering Colitis, wrongly thinking that increasing the fibre would make them worse.

Colitis is a immune related condition. And I fear often wrongly diagnosed (not the chronic ).


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