# New to this



## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Hi, first post so please be gentle!

I am hoping to breed my bsh girl Mia in the future. I have done all of the research I can via the internet and books but nothing beats talking to experts so here I am! I would go to shows etc but being in cornwall, having children and a part time job means I can't travel too far unfortunately. 

She is only 5 months old at the moment but I want to know as much as I can about it before even thinking about finding a stud. 

So I'm just after a bit of advice really. This is just a hobby thing for me, although I know it requires a lot of time and effort I only plan on having the one queen. She is a very much loved family pet first and foremost.


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## Jellypi3 (Jan 3, 2014)

Welcome to the forums 

Most people looking in to breeding get a "mentor", ie someone to shadow for a few births to get the hang of all the things that can happen. Shows are a big help for networking and meeting fellow breeders. The breeder you bought her from should be willing to give you advice and maybe even mentor you. 

Most importantly, make sure you have her tested for all the relevant hereditary illnesses and have certificates of those tests. Also do you have her pedigree papers? 

Good luck with it!  (I'm by no means an expert so I'd wait for someone else to come along with more detail!)


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

I'm not trying to be mean, but I do question why you want to breed since you tell us you only plan having the one queen. Breeding in my view is about producing a better cat, and with just one queen you are cutting yourself off from trying to breed a cat better than your first queen, then one better than your second and so on.

Also, in my experience (I live in Fife) breeding means a lot of travelling. Driving 5 hours each way to see my prospective queen, the same to collect her, the same twice to take her to stud for the first time, and quite a lot of driving going to shows.

Having said that, the breeder you got her from should be supporting you every step of the way especially with choice of stud.

And whilst I appreciate that being in Cornwall means a lot of shows are an awful long way away, attending those you can should help. Get a catalogue, mark up who won the Open classes, read the critiques on the GCCF website. When you are there look at the BSH and chat to the owners, epecially if they are the breeders.

There is one near Exeter on the 29th March, and the South West British Shorthair Cat Club are having their show jointly with the Kernow. That looks a 'must' to me for you as a BSH breeder.

the Governing Council of the Cat Fancy


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Thankyou both for replying.

I have looked at the Exeter cat shows and I am waiting to see if I can have the time off work to go. I certainly would love to! 

Well I should have said my plans at the moment are to have one queen and see how it goes. I can see it's not an easy thing and I may find it is just not for me, guess I won't find out til I try it.

I have just applied for her pedigree, looking forward to finding out more about her. She is fully registered so I am trying to do it properly.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Oh and it was a 4 hour drive (one way) just to get my queen. I am smitten by her, she has the most wonderful temperament.


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## Cosmills (Oct 3, 2012)

CattingYou said:


> Thankyou both for replying.
> 
> I have looked at the Exeter cat shows and I am waiting to see if I can have the time off work to go. I certainly would love to!
> 
> ...


Is she on the active register ... Did you agree with her breeder about breeding her ... If she is not on the active register she is only suitable for a pet , ie not for breeding

If she isn't active then you will not be able to register the kittens are use t he services of a stud from a reputable breeder, they will not touch you


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

She is on the active register, well that's what it says on her registration certificate anyway. 

I didn't realise the breeder was supposed to give me her pedigree. I have messaged him and he is going to send it on with his apologies.


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## Cosmills (Oct 3, 2012)

CattingYou said:


> She is on the active register, well that's what it says on her registration certificate anyway.
> 
> I didn't realise the breeder was supposed to give me her pedigree. I have messaged him and he is going to send it on with his apologies.


Pleased she is on the active and yes you need her full perigee

You will also need the DNA test her for blood type and PKD and other genetics

I breed BSH so any question please ask if you are unsure


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Thankyou for that  I wanted to do it properly that's why I got an active registered BSH. She is a blue self, a total lap cat.

When is the best time to get all of those tests done? I knew they had to be done before I find a stud cat but can I do it now? I'm a bit worried the vet will disapprove of my choosing to breed a cat, she was very vocal about spaying when I took her for a checkup.

Also, what is the best way to go about finding a stud? I'm aware I will have to travel as I can't see any in my area. I have seen some advertised, are these the only ones available? I would like to build up a great relationship with the stud owner that is all.


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## Cosmills (Oct 3, 2012)

You can test her now , using Langfords

Diagnostic Laboratories | Langford Veterinary Services

Request a swab , it's very simple ... So you need to test Blood Group and PKD

If you want to know want she carries , you can also do this with the same swab

Until you get all the results back they is little point in finding a stud plus she may not call until 16/18 months old

Then you have to know what colour kittens you would like from a mating , blue to blue doesn't always give you blue kits depending on the genetics makeup of both cats , that's why we test

I always test for blood, PKD, longhair ap, dilute if not a dilute cat , agouti and chocolate

You need to know her 
faults so you can put them right with a stud, ie eye, ears , coats etc .. No point in putting her to a stud that will not compliment her


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## Soupie (Sep 2, 2008)

The absolute must for Brits by way of DNA test are PKD and Blood Group. Blood Group will dictate stud choices and PKD negativity or 'normal' as a negative result shows on the slip is essential for breeding. PKD positive cats should be speyed and removed from the gene pool.

I wouldn't do colour tests until you get her ped - for a blue self, you know she is dilute and non agouti. You might want to test for longhair and depending on her pedigree, chocolate, cinnamon and/or colourpoint. However if she comes back with a 5 gen ped of blues and blacks I probably wouldn't bother testing for those colours.

There are plenty of experienced breeders who will help you - Misskins and Alejandro catteries are both extremely experienced breeders in the South West who are always happy to help  Shows are a great way of meeting people and networking for stud choices.

I never have to search these days - I tend to find I get offered studs as soon as people see my latest girl on the show bench!!


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## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

Soupie said:


> I never have to search these days - I tend to find I get offered studs as soon as people see my latest girl on the show bench!!


One of the great things about showing before breeding, you'll have offers if you're lucky, and often access to 'closed' studs.
It's far easier doing that work first, rather than just settling for the first person who allows access to their stud, or someone who advertises as open stud. Some breeders simply offer an open stud for the stud fee.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Some things to do alongside the DNA test:

Send off to transfer her to your name if you haven't already done this;
Join a cat club, apply for a GCCF prefix - you have to do the first to do the second;
Set up a website. Wordpress.com is good and free but there are other free easy solutions;
Buy a matching domain name - I use 123-reg.co.uk. They are cheap, I don't use mine but I've made sure it's mine;
Sign up for the GCCF online services which are free. It's easier to register kittens on-line;
Start learning about the genetics of coat colours and so on;

I'm sure there is plenty more but these are some ideas.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Forgot to mention the following:


Pawpeds is a very large online database of cat pedigrees and can be useful for finding out what is further back than the pedigree you get from a breeder. http://www.pawpeds.com/db/?a=sf&g=4&p=bri&date=iso
You will have to prepare pedigrees for your kittens. It can be done with Word, but you might want to spend some time looking around at pedigree software. There are several packages available, some are free and some cost.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Thankyou for that, very helpful. I will get on to testing her right away.

I know her mum had a lilac sister but all of Mia's litter were blue. My husband has been online looking at all of the different combinations of genes, I find it fascinating!


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

So there is chocolate / lilac in her pedigree if this was a full sister. Are you fussed if lilacs arrive? Personally I prefer it to blue, but blues may be easier to find homes for.


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## Cosmills (Oct 3, 2012)

Lilacs are getting very popular.. I love them and prefer them to the blues .. 

Genetics is interesting confusing at times


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## Kotanushka (Oct 25, 2013)

spotty cats said:


> One of the great things about showing before breeding, you'll have offers if you're lucky, and often access to 'closed' studs.
> It's far easier doing that work first, rather than just settling for the first person who allows access to their stud, or someone who advertises as open stud. Some breeders simply offer an open stud for the stud fee.


This is so true! I managed to get my girl to a very good stud and I know it would not have happened had I not met his owner at a few Cat Shows. With this lady I knew my girl was in safe hands and now I can always get a good advice from her when needed.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

spotty cats said:


> One of the great things about showing before breeding, you'll have offers if you're lucky, and often access to 'closed' studs.
> It's far easier doing that work first, rather than just settling for the first person who allows access to their stud, or someone who advertises as open stud. Some breeders simply offer an open stud for the stud fee.


Yes, I got lucky with a stud for Lola this way. His owner approached me rather than the other way round. Lola is with him this week so hopefully I'll have April 1st kittens.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

I've talked my husband into going to the Exeter show in April. I will need to read more about them first so it may just be to have a look and get a feel of the environment. 

There were 7 kittens in her litter, all blues. My friend has a lilac boy (pet) and he is beautiful so I do not mind lilacs at all. But I could see that blues would be easier to home. 

I have so far;

Registered online with the GCCF
Had her transferred over to my name. 
Joined a cat club

I am looking at prefixes, this is next to do on the list. Will get the husband to do the website, that's his job in all this


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Also do cats have to be a certain age before you can show them?


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## Time flies (Jul 23, 2013)

Sorry to go off subject a bit but is it possible to transfer ownership online? It's probably just me but I can never seem to find what I'm looking for on the gccf website, even when I've accidentally found it before!


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Yes but its 13 weeks.

If oh does the website how will he feel about all the updating? If you website doesn't get kept up to date it wont help sell kittens. It doesn't have to be fancy. Mine is WordPress and works for me, my friends I do for her ditto. Take a look at what other people have to get ideas.


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## gskinner123 (Mar 10, 2010)

Time flies said:


> Sorry to go off subject a bit but is it possible to transfer ownership online? It's probably just me but I can never seem to find what I'm looking for on the gccf website, even when I've accidentally found it before!


Yes, online transfers are now available. But I too can only ever find stuff on GCCF web site accidentally by clicking randomly all over the site


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

To do online transfers click on 'Online Services' and register then all you have to do is log into the 'Online Services' and there's a menu of things to do like transfers.
CattingYou - to register a prefix you have to have your application signed by the secretary of a cat club and the majority of clubs ask that you have been a member for a minimum of 12 months before they will sign.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Ah I see. I am going to join the Kernow cat club. Is one cat club enough or should I join a bsh one too? If she has kittens before this do I have to use the standard prefix then? Does that make much of a difference?

My oh makes websites as part of his job hence leaving it up to him. He's very technically minded and he will have time to update it whilst he's at work anyway so hopefully that side of things will be covered.

I transferred her registration online and it was quite simple to do really. Fingers crossed you can find it!


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

Breed clubs are a good place to advertise kittens and can offer discounts on genetic tests at Langfords. You usually need a proposer and seconder to join. There's nothing wrong with joining your local area club too though.
If you have kittens before you get a prefix then, yes, they will have that year's administrative prefix.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

This is Mia.

It's not the best photo (most of them have me or my children in!) and I think I've done it properly from my phone


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## Kotanushka (Oct 25, 2013)

CattingYou said:


> Ah I see. I am going to join the Kernow cat club. Is one cat club enough or should I join a bsh one too? If she has kittens before this do I have to use the standard prefix then? Does that make much of a difference?


Most people seem to have the first litter under an artificial prefix from GCCF. 
The GCCF web site it very useful for novices. You can find out there most things you need to know with regards to showing, prefixes and all the rules basically. 
Good luck! Breeding cats if you want to do it right can be very difficult and costly but so rewarding emotionally!


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

Kotanushka said:


> Most people seem to have the first litter under an artificial prefix from GCCF.
> The GCCF web site it very useful for novices. You can find out there most things you need to know with regards to showing, prefixes and all the rules basically.
> Good luck! Breeding cats if you want to do it right can be very difficult and costly but *so rewarding emotionally*!


And devastatingly emotional when things go wrong  Do be prepared for the downs as well as the ups CattingYou


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

I was able to get my prefix application signed immediately, I have no idea if that is normal for that club (a breed club) or not. The woman I brought Max from had her prefix before her first litter had to be registered as well.

Joining a breed club might help you to know more people that are worth knowing. I belong to two but one of them is because it was cheaper taking 2 cats to their show that way! However I'll stay a member as it's one for my area and I will advertise my kittens on it. It's only a few quid per year.

Registering under the administrative prefix costs more, but don't be tempted to simply declare instead unless you can early neuter your kittens. You will have to give the new kitten owner all the details for them to register them themselves and there is nothing to stop them registering them as active.

So long as your OH is happy to update several times a week when you have kittens... I think some sort of blog is good, which is why Wordpress scores for me as it's originally a blogging platform though it's much more these days.


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## wicket (Aug 22, 2012)

I believe the signing of prefix applications varies from club to club - the Southern British Shorthair Club signed mine immediately on joining, you also get a breeders discount for Langfords tests.


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## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

OrientalSlave said:


> but don't be tempted to simply declare instead unless you can early neuter your kittens.


Do look into early neutering, there are so many bybs in your breed, EN guarantees your kittens will never be used that way.

Many who end up having "just one litter for family & friends" don't start out that way, they're not going to contact you and identify themselves as a future byb.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

So today I've had another email from the breeder saying actually he doesn't have the pedigree for Mia because he had to pay for it!!

Contacted the GCCF who told me it was a legal requirement for him to provide it as she was sold as a pedigree cat. I am unsure if I should make a formal complaint or not?


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## gskinner123 (Mar 10, 2010)

Can you remind us what paperwork you DO have for your girl? Did the breeder give you her registration document which, depending upon when (if) she was registered by the breeder will be a pink, flimsy slip of paper or a white card showing her registration details.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

I have the white bit of card, I have the one he have me and another one the GCCF sent me when I changed her registration over to me. I have a pink flimsy bit of paper too but no details on that? I think it's something to do with her microchip.


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## gskinner123 (Mar 10, 2010)

CattingYou said:


> I have the white bit of card, I have the one he have me and another one the GCCF sent me when I changed her registration over to me. I have a pink flimsy bit of paper too but no details on that? I think it's something to do with her microchip.


I'm not sure what the pink piece of paper is in this case; the white registration cards replaced the older, flimsy pink slips. Perhaps it just happens to be pink and, as you say, is something to do with her chip.

The pedigree wouldn't have cost the breeder anything, bar the piece of paper he printed it on and the ink! I would write to him, formally requesting the pedigree again. If he's of no help then fortunately you can request a certified pedigree from GCCF as she is now registered in your name. It will cost you and it's something you shouldn't have to do as the breeder should have supplied it... but at least all is not lost if he won't give you a pedigree.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

He just said to me he doesn't have it? I think well surely he must have one for his cat? And both parents are registered cats, she was sold to me as having champion lines but obviously I cannot check.

I am going to get the information from the GCCF myself. Yes it's going to cost me but I would like that information. I have contacted the breeder and asked if he can help me with it but I haven't heard back yet.


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## gskinner123 (Mar 10, 2010)

CattingYou said:


> He just said to me he doesn't have it? I think well surely he must have one for his cat? And both parents are registered cats, she was sold to me as having champion lines but obviously I cannot check.
> 
> I am going to get the information from the GCCF myself. Yes it's going to cost me but I would like that information. I have contacted the breeder and asked if he can help me with it but I haven't heard back yet.


Well, maybe he's lost it but he could just simply write up or print off another. Honestly 

A four generation certified pedigree from GCCF is around £28; money you shouldn't have to spend. Have you asked GCCF to drop the breeder a line by email? They're usually pretty good with that kind of thing and it sometimes produces the desired effect!


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

CattingYou said:


> So today I've had another email from the breeder saying actually he doesn't have the pedigree for Mia because he had to pay for it!!
> 
> Contacted the GCCF who told me it was a legal requirement for him to provide it as she was sold as a pedigree cat. I am unsure if I should make a formal complaint or not?


He would have to pay for one from the GCCF, but what most of us do is provide one we have created ourselves.

Have you signed up for the GCCF online services yet? If not do so, and double-check her registration assuming you have transferred her to your name.

PS I expected to see and did see the pedigree for my breeding girl BEFORE I brought her.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Yes I should have asked to see it. But he told me I was supposed to get it after I had transferred her over to me. He was the breeder so I took his word or if and that's my own fault. 

I'm a bit annoyed as I obviously paid him a lot of money, he had more than enough to afford a pedigree. 

I have contacted the GCCF. They said either make a formal complaint (which I have to pay for) or go to trading standards.


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## Cosmills (Oct 3, 2012)

It's not on really is it, Sounds like he is not that bothered , as her was sold on active and cannot see why he doesn't feel the need to supply a ped.. 

A breeding girls without one is not a good move in my book

Well a lesson learnt I guess 

Hope you get it sorted soon


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Thankyou 

I'm going to get her pedigree from the GCCF and just accept it's going to cost me. Then I am going to make a complaint because you are right, he cannot sell kittens on active without their pedigree! If he had got back to me about it properly then I wouldn't complain but he has been no help at all.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

If you sign up with their online service you can see 3 generations of her pedigree there. I would make the complaint first and only pay the GCCF for one as a last resort. 

It's going to be some time before you need to be able to produce a pedigree for her kittens and with the 3 generations on the GCCF's website plus the stud's pedigree you have what you need to produce a 4-generation pedigree.


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## wicket (Aug 22, 2012)

Doesnt sound like a very good breeder to me, a pedigree is a basic requirement. No pedigree, no help obtaining it let alone any mentoring, Im guessing his only interest in selling on the active is a large purchase price?


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## Kotanushka (Oct 25, 2013)

Pedigree can be easily produced by the breeder on the basis of the mating certificate. You do not even necessarily need a special software, even Excel would do. Just make sure all the data on it is correct. This breeder must be computer illiterate or extremely lazy.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Before the days of PCs being ubiquitous hand written pedigrees were the norm, and I had to transcribe a handwritten stud's pedigree late last year for producing pedigrees on my PC for my friend's kittens. 

There is no reason to not give one - you can make one with a bit of A4 paper, a pen and a ruler if necessary though the one I transcribed was on a form the breeder had got from somewhere.


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

The pedigree of my first Siamese was hand written - there really is no excuse not to produce a pedigree and it's essential for a breeding cat.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Thankyou OrientalSlave I didn't think to check there! 

I have had a look, it's very interesting. She has all sorts of colours in her ancestors, lilacs, blacks, blue-creams.

Some very good champions too by the looks if it. Feel a bit relieved now


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Those are the colours I'd expect for a BSH. You can obviously transcribe her part of the pedigree of her kittens from it, into Word or Excel, or pedigree software if you decide to go that route. You might also be able to fill in further back if you visit Pawpeds:

The British Shorthair Database

BTW I suggest you download and fill in this form, and send a copy to him with a letter stating you will send it to the GCCF if he doesn't get his finger out and provide a copy of her pedigree. When you get it, check it against the one on the GCCF website!

http://www.gccfcats.org/pdf/ic2.pdf


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

I should have said they are the colours I expect to see in a Blue Self pedigree.

Also if you get up to 25 posts (I think) I can Private Message (PM) you.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Oh right, I have only made 16 posts! Do I need to just post random stuff?

The pedigree on her father's side looks great. A few of them I had actually come across whilst researching BSH's. They are all black and blue. 

Her maternal grandfather was lilac and grandmother blue-cream. Does this make it likely she carries the gene for lilac?


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

A grandparent is lilac so the intervening parent carries it. It's 50/50 that it gets passed on. If you are interested in trying to breed lilac and want to know to help choose a suitable stud (e.g. a lilac stud!) you can get her gene tested for chocolate (lilac is dilute chocolate) by Langford, along with her blood group test and any others you have to do. If both parents have tested PKD negative there's no need to test her.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

CattingYou said:


> Oh right, I have only made 16 posts! Do I need to just post random stuff?
> 
> <snip>


Not exactly random! You don't want to look like a Really Mad Cat Woman.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Well yes I wouldn't want to _look_like a mad cat woman 

I have no particular preference to breeding Lilacs but I think I'm going to get her tested to see if she carries it.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

I suspect homes are easier to come by for Blues as most people have heard of the 'British Blue'. 

Maybe the other BSH breeders here who breed both colours (in self!) can comment?

Do you have any interest in the 'with white' colours?


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## wicket (Aug 22, 2012)

OrientalSlave said:


> I suspect homes are easier to come by for Blues as most people have heard of the 'British Blue'.
> 
> Maybe the other BSH breeders here who breed both colours (in self!) can comment?
> 
> Do you have any interest in the 'with white' colours?


Blues sell within a few days of advertising, pretty much any time of the year and lots of interest allows me to be really picky. Speaking to other breeders lilacs also sell well - My blue self girl has just come back from a gorgeous bi-colour stud, unfortunately she wouldnt play ball with him - the stud owner did warm me to advertise bi-colour kittens early as she stated you do have to work harder to sell them compared with the blue and lilac self - on the other hand she said you also got the more discerning BSH owner rather than those who just want a "blue cat".


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

wicket said:


> Blues sell within a few days of advertising, pretty much any time of the year and lots of interest allows me to be really picky. Speaking to other breeders lilacs also sell well - My blue self girl has just come back from a gorgeous bi-colour stud, unfortunately she wouldnt play ball with him - the stud owner did warm me to advertise bi-colour kittens early as she stated you do have to work harder to sell them compared with the blue and lilac self - on the other hand she said you also got the more discerning BSH owner rather than those who just want a "blue cat".


I have Bi colour British Shorthairs as they are my passion! Never ever had a problem with finding owners, most people were waiting, I still get enquires now for them, and my last litter was about 22months ago?

I had one owner drive from the other end of the country for one!! I often have litters of 50-50 bi-solid, as I use a solid stud, or end up with more solids, of course most people know these, and still loads don't know they some in a HUGE range of colours patterns, if you take a look at my website under 'colours & patterns' scroll down to look, some people had no idea these were pedigree British cats!!

Most people would come for a solid and would then want a bi-colour, they just have a extra spark for me and of course are Stunning! 

I would assume that black would be the hardest to home? Just due to them being hardest to home moggie wise? I would always start out with basic colours if you are learning e.g. blue/lilac instead of reds/torties. And research the lines, research the studs, don't just use a stud closet to you (unless he is a great match!) health tests are important as well as handling and socialising the kittens. Look into early neutering before they leave you, what you want from a litter, pop to a show, see what your girls faults are, speak and get to know other breeders to help match her to a good boy


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Thankyou TaylorBaby.

We are taking her to a show in March, looking forward to that! I think if anything her eyes maybe aren't orange enough but she is only 5 months old so that might change? 

I love the blacks. Mia has a lot in her pedigree and I could look some of them up, they are beautiful. The more I look the more I want one  but I could see how they would be more difficult to home. 

Tbh I just want a house full of cats


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## Kotanushka (Oct 25, 2013)

Taylorbaby said:


> Most people would come for a solid and would then want a bi-colour, they just have a extra spark for me and of course are Stunning!


The most striking BBS I saw at Cat Shows were a bi-colour and a blue-cream-white tortie! My friend and I just could not get over it! Although I do breed Burmese. And my friend vowed to have a red-white BBS similar to the one she fell in love with at the show! 
No offense to the solid colours though. They are lovely too. Velvety bears with fat cheeks.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

I do think the tortie & white cats are lovely, I prefer the patches of colour to the mingling in a normal tortie. I saw a lilac tortie & white once, the colours were stunning. 

I've also seen photos of black tortie & white Maine Coons and I liked the effect on the long coat. For me long coats with tabby and/or tortie patterns get a bit messy.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Taylorbaby said:


> <snip>
> I would assume that black would be the hardest to home? Just due to them being hardest to home moggie wise?
> <snip>


One of the first Olympian Gold cats is a black BSH stud, not sure if his success is rubbing off on the breed as a whole or if just for cats from his breeder.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

OrientalSlave I just had a look at your website and I must say your cat is lovely. I'm not usually a fan of Oriental cats but those kittens, awww! 

There's something different about bsh blacks. I dunno what it is but I know I want one


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

Kotanushka said:


> The most striking BBS I saw at Cat Shows were a bi-colour and a blue-cream-white tortie! My friend and I just could not get over it! Although I do breed Burmese. And my friend vowed to have a red-white BBS similar to the one she fell in love with at the show!
> No offense to the solid colours though. They are lovely too. Velvety bears with fat cheeks.


Ohhhh don't get me started lol!  I LOVE the blue creams and whites!! I love the black tips, goldens, solids!! All are stunning! :scared:



OrientalSlave said:


> One of the first Olympian Gold cats is a black BSH stud, not sure if his success is rubbing off on the breed as a whole or if just for cats from his breeder.


I have seen a few black studs, their eyes are stunning! I think the chocolates are gaining more popularity, but Id say 90% of my enquires are for solid blues, then bi colours, then oddly enough, never had a enquiry for one before, but my last 3 have been for colourpoints! I passed them onto my friend who has CPs I think she had trouble with her last kitten to home (but could just be time of year) which was a red & white van pattern brit, stunning looking!!!

OK Picture time lol 

Do you all remember CaramelDreams Rolo? The Only bi colour boy in the litter?


He went to live with his brother? Here they are then & now!! (bottom right is one of my other boys, top left & top right is a girl!) :001_wub: 

Then few more of Rolo lol


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Taylor I would say Mia looks most like the cat in the second picture, top left. 

That bi colour boy is stunning. There are just so many of them I want now. 

I thought I would be really simple, get a cat, mate it and voila. But everyday I'm learning something new, I was so naive before. I would really love to get into this properly but I think I will have to wait til my children are grown up or at least a bit older.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

CattingYou said:


> OrientalSlave I just had a look at your website and I must say your cat is lovely. I'm not usually a fan of Oriental cats but those kittens, awww!
> 
> There's something different about bsh blacks. I dunno what it is but I know I want one


Ta muchly, and there is something special about all black cats!

BTW here are the GCCF rules:
http://www.gccfcats.org/pdf/Rules.pdf

Look for Section 1 rule 10a. It's the one the breeder of your kitten is breaking by not giving you a copy of her pedigree.


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

CattingYou said:


> Taylor I would say Mia looks most like the cat in the second picture, top left.
> 
> That bi colour boy is stunning. There are just so many of them I want now.
> 
> I thought I would be really simple, get a cat, mate it and voila. But everyday I'm learning something new, I was so naive before. I would really love to get into this properly but I think I will have to wait til my children are grown up or at least a bit older.


There is so much to learn, can you take many weeks off work if needed? Can you hand rear a litter of kittens properly every 2 hours, sleeping when they do, not being able to leave your home? Can you revive a kitten at birth or help mum give birth? Brits have big heads and I have had problems before with a kitten stuck you may lose kittens, need a C-section costing anywhere from £500-1000, stud fees, health tests, the list is endless, I have written a cost of breeding list here, take a look!

http://www.petforums.co.uk/cat-breeding/215985-cost-breeding.html

It has to be done properly at all times, if you think its better to wait until your children are older, don't do it now and wait, show your girl, get to know the breed standard and breeders, maybe look after some foster kittens for experience?


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## wicket (Aug 22, 2012)

Taylorbaby said:


> Most people would come for a solid and would then want a bi-colour, they just have a extra spark for me and of course are Stunning!


Thats exactly what I was hoping when I took my girl to a bi-colour stud this time, unfortunately she didnt want to know, but we shall be persevering on her next call


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Well I only work three evenings a week so there is always someone at home, either me or dh. So that isn't a problem.

I definitely am prepared and have everything for one queen and one litter. I don't think I could handle more than that atm, it wouldn't be fair on them. My mil breeds dogs so I'm hoping she will be a help when it comes to the birth. Luckily the vets is only 2 mins away if anything ever did go wrong (touch wood it wouldn't). Cost of breeding not an issue, I'm not doing it to make a quick buck. I just want happy healthy mum and kittens


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## we love bsh's (Mar 28, 2011)

OrientalSlave said:


> One of the first Olympian Gold cats is a black BSH stud, not sure if his success is rubbing off on the breed as a whole or if just for cats from his breeder.


You mean bear owned by vicky..he's amazing.

I bred a black self once he was sold within 15 mins of me placing his ad.As with his blue sister.

I find cps sell more slowly unless they are a seal or choccy point.


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## we love bsh's (Mar 28, 2011)

Oh and yes the chocolate are popping up alot now iv noticed,i get lots of calls for chocolates.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

So... I've got her pedigree information, is this all I need to make my own? Or do I need a certified one? I have included a photo of it, just to make sure it's right! TIA


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

This plus her details from her card make the lower half and give you the required 4 generations.

You need the stud's pedigree to create the top half.

You don't need to put dates of birth on, you do need to put the breed number & registration number.

They are showing two breed numbers now, the new ones using the EMS system (BRI a for example) followed by the old one (16) in brackets.

This is why it's so stupid the breeder hasn't (yet) provided you with her pedigree - as you can see it's not hard to do! If you use Google you will find some templates for Word, or maybe someone here has one.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

You also asked about her carrying chocolate. Unlikely from the sire's side, but since her maternal grandmother is lilac, her mother does carry chocolate. That means it's 50/50 that she does.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Thanks for that. The oh is going to make one for me and then do the kittens ones when we have some.

Yes that's what I thought too with regards to her carrying the chocolate gene. I will get her tested for it anyway just to make sure and then I can find a suitable stud.


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## we love bsh's (Mar 28, 2011)

CattingYou said:


> So... I've got her pedigree information, is this all I need to make my own? Or do I need a certified one? I have included a photo of it, just to make sure it's right! TIA


few prefix's there that are in my chocolate boys ped.


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## CattingYou (Jan 28, 2014)

Your chocolate boy is absolutely beautiful. 

Just said to the oh I can't wait til the kids have moved out and I can have one of each colour haha!


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## Time flies (Jul 23, 2013)

One of my girls grandpa is in your girls ped. Petticote goes west


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## Time flies (Jul 23, 2013)

I agree!! WLBSHs choccy boy looks like he gives good cuddles


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## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

CattingYou said:


> I would really love to get into this properly but I think I will have to wait til my children are grown up or at least a bit older.


Nothing wrong with waiting, I know lots of people who've done that. One of my friends even stopped breeding for 20 years waiting until her kids grew up, mind you she had adopted 7 kids in that time so had to wait that long.

As TB said, you can always neuter this girl and show her while learning and making good contacts for when you are ready to breed.


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## Soupie (Sep 2, 2008)

The top half of that pedigree in particular is bloody impressive - some fabulous cats for type and progeny - Zambezi was an amazing sire - I remember him from his show days as Softee beat him for an Imperial and I was floored as he's seriously good. The bottom half isn't shabby either - whoever bred your cat had some seriously nice lines there


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