# poppies puppies



## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

2 pups

first girl - got stuck 21:05 pm

then boy 21:35

mum feeding and waiting for next one

first one was scary but OH was wonderful, got her out

beautiful babies

pics to follow when all done


xxx


amazing!


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## kaisa624 (Mar 5, 2010)

Aww, well done!! Looking forward to pictures


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## Cavalierlover123 (May 27, 2009)

Oh welldone Poppie !! cant wait to see her little bundle of joys  :thumbup:


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## paddyjulie (May 9, 2009)

brilliant :thumbup: :thumbup:

well done Poppy xxx ( and to you of course)

juliex


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## BeagleOesx (Oct 9, 2009)

Oh wow, well done. fingers & paws crossed for safe delivery of rest

Keep up the good work.


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## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

:thumbup: have you stopped crying now well done you and poppy only another 6 to go!!!


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## Tula&Iver~cavs (Sep 16, 2010)

Yay well done to poppy, you and your OH :thumbup:

The champagne is opening 

I said first one would be a girl


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## XxZoexX (Sep 8, 2010)

Wahey Congrats and well done!


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## Stellabella (Jan 8, 2009)

Congratulations!! :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

Soo happy for you


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## Sophiekins (Oct 20, 2009)

AAAhhh congratulations :thumbup: CONGRATULATIONS  Just on my way to bed but thought I would pop in to see if any news - made up for you, well done Poppy!


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## harrysmum03 (Nov 5, 2010)

woohoo, brilliant news xxx
well done all of u xxx
:thumbup::lol::thumbup:


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## Tula&Iver~cavs (Sep 16, 2010)

Come on Poppy.... Push push.. Pop them pups out 

Hope all is going well.


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## shazalhasa (Jul 21, 2009)

Well Done Poppy :thumbup:

xxxx

can't wait to see pics and vid ??


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

pup 3 born 22:37 - girl


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## Guest (Nov 11, 2010)

OMG.....
Congrats I am so happy for you and her. 

Keep us updated and pictures...it may just convince the OH to let me get a pug. :lol:


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## harrysmum03 (Nov 5, 2010)

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:


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## Ducky (Nov 23, 2008)

yaaaaaaay! cant wait to see the pug puppies!! :thumbup:


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

they are gorgeous!!!


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## XxZoexX (Sep 8, 2010)

<< Waiting patiently for puppie pics


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## Tula&Iver~cavs (Sep 16, 2010)

How's mum doing?


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## momentofmadness (Jul 19, 2008)

Thats great news.. 

Looks like you are in for a long night so I hope you have your refreshments ready..


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

boy just born

mum doing fabulously!


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## Oenoke (Oct 17, 2009)

Congratulations, I can't wait to see pics!


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

Oh wow - how lovely, well done Poppy and you guys.


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## Guest (Nov 11, 2010)

Omg..... You are so lucky.

Glad mums doing great......

I will keep waiting for those pictures so I can die from cuteness but mums and pups are first and formost...

Are you looking forward to no sleep tonight? :lol:

:yikes:


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

last boy has cleft palet


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## Guest (Nov 11, 2010)

Pug_D said:


> last boy has cleft palet


Oh no. 
Hows mum doing?


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

mum is doing brilliantly, shes a complete star,

looks tired but still going strong


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## momentofmadness (Jul 19, 2008)

Pug_D said:


> last boy has cleft palet


Thats so sad.. 

Have you got everything you need to nurse him..


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## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

Pug_D said:


> last boy has cleft palet


aww so sorry, how bad is it? i really hope everything goes ok pugd but i have to go to bed now but will check in first thing in the morning, just try to put the little boy on and see if you can get him to suckle anything until you have seen the vet in the morning if it is only very slight they may be able to do something for him


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

Pug_D said:


> last boy has cleft palet


Might sound harsh as he is only just born, but will you be keeping him or taking him for a trip to the vets if its bad enough? Im generally sorry to hear this.


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## momentofmadness (Jul 19, 2008)

archiebaby said:


> aww so sorry, how bad is it? i really hope everything goes ok pugd but i have to go to bed now but will check in first thing in the morning, just try to put the little boy on and see if you can get him to suckle anything until you have seen the vet in the morning if it is only very slight they may be able to do something for him


I would worry if he suckles that fluid would go into his lunges I may be wrong in thinking this??

I really hope its not severe and the little man is ok.. xxx


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## XxZoexX (Sep 8, 2010)

So sorry to hear this.. Sending hugs to mummy pug and hoping all goes well x


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

momentofmadness said:


> I would worry if he suckles that fluid would go into his lunges I may be wrong in thinking this??
> 
> I really hope its not severe and the little man is ok.. xxx


 I to hope its not severe. Puppies with cleft palate can not suckle no matter how much they try because they cant get an suction to latch on, and anything they can get is more than likely going into the nasal passages.


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## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

momentofmadness said:


> I would worry if he suckles that fluid would go into his lunges I may be wrong in thinking this??
> 
> I really hope its not severe and the little man is ok.. xxx


if its not really bad and you can still get a little milk in him i would try this until the morning


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## Guest (Nov 11, 2010)

I am glad mums doing okay....bet shes loving the attention!

If you decide to keep him on bottle feed and need a hand give me a shout. I only live a few miles away and dont mind taking over if you need a nap or even just someone to rant to on a bad day.


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## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

Devil-Dogz said:


> I to hope its not severe. Puppies with cleft palate can not suckle no matter how much they try because they cant get an suction.


im only saying if it isnt really,really bad she can try at least to let him have some milk it may just be a tiny bit


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

archiebaby said:


> im only saying if it isnt really,really bad she can try at least to let him have some milk it may just be a tiny bit


Know I know what you mean, and its a hard situation to be in. I would personally have pup to the vets as soon as whelping was over, if Pug_D cant get to vets till morning then in my opinion the pup suffering from it needs to be tube fed (no point with bottle as will have the same problem suckling).


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

its not bad, its just a thin line

he suckled on mum, didn't see anything going wrong??

will take him to vets in morning and see what they say

am inclined to give him a chance and keep him ourselves if vets say its not that bad


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

number 5 - girl born 10 mins ago


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## momentofmadness (Jul 19, 2008)

Devil-Dogz said:


> Know I know what you mean, and its a hard situation to be in. I would personally have pup to the vets as soon as whelping was over, if Pug_D cant get to vets till morning then in my opinion the pup suffering from it needs to be tube fed (no point with bottle as will have the same problem suckling).


Hence me asking if pug d had appropriate feeding instruments.. I imagine Pug d is very tired and quite possibly we will be stressing her out discussing this.. xxx


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## momentofmadness (Jul 19, 2008)

Pug_D said:


> number 5 - girl born 10 mins ago


Thats great news hun.. how many you expecting.. xxx


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

Thats good to hear just keep an eye (which of course you will), make sure you see none coming back out the nose, as this can led onto pneumonia 
Congrats on pup 5.


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

vet scanned for 4

think we can feel another inside?

please discuss away re: palet, i need to consider things properly in the morning


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

Vets always seem to scan less than there are  ohh maybe you have another one to come then if you can feel something, did all placentas come out?

we will all have different views on keeping pups with defects, your best bet is to keep him comfy and fed up 9I do personally feel tube feeding would be best) tonight until you can get to the vets in the morning and talk with them about what quality of life he will have as he grows, how bad it will affect him ect..and then make the choice you feel best for him


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## momentofmadness (Jul 19, 2008)

Pug_D said:


> vet scanned for 4
> 
> think we can feel another inside?
> 
> please discuss away re: palet, i need to consider things properly in the morning


I was just worried about stressing you out on the situ seen as its possibly may hem there.. I have known of puppies that have survived perfectly well... just keep an eye on him to make sure the milk doesn't bubble through his nose.. Wish him all the best and you guys.. xxx


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2010)

Devil-Dogz said:


> we will all have different views on keeping pups with defects


I would say, if you intend to keep him for yourself or sell him to a friend or someone who knows this issue then I am sure with the right care he can live a great life (obviously depending on how bad the vet thinks it is).


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

shetlandlover said:


> I would say, if you intend to keep him for yourself or sell him to a friend or someone who knows this issue then I am sure with the right care he can live a great life (obviously depending on how bad the vet thinks it is).


Totally but the quality of life for the dog comes first!


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2010)

Devil-Dogz said:


> Totally but the quality of life for the dog comes first!


I agree with you there...but if the dog can live with this pefectly fine (I believe there is even a op they can have to fix it correct me if wrong) then I dont see why he should be pts.

However........If its bad and he cant live a good life with it then it maybe for the best.

Its one of those things..

However my offer stands if PugD needs help with anything I am not to far away.


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## momentofmadness (Jul 19, 2008)

shetlandlover said:


> I agree with you there...but if the dog can live with this pefectly fine (I believe there is even a op they can have to fix it correct me if wrong) then I dont see why he should be pts.
> 
> However........If its bad and he cant live a good life with it then it maybe for the best.
> 
> ...


There is an op if the vet thinks its viable. Pretty sure they have to be around 8 weeks.... Lets hope and pray the little chap is fine.. Big hugs little ones.. and to mommy .. xxx


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## maltesemomxoxo (Oct 28, 2010)

*Congratualations on the puppies!!! *Hope all is well and poppy!!!


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

How are things going?


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## mitch4 (Oct 31, 2009)

Congratulations on the arrivals :thumbup:

Sorry to hear about the little boy pup


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

pups are all fed

even the ;little cleft boy

am so tired going to try to sleep now

x


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## maltesemomxoxo (Oct 28, 2010)

Pug_D said:


> pups are all fed
> 
> even the ;little cleft boy
> 
> ...


So how many did she have???


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## DRM (Jul 18, 2010)

Ahh congrats 2 u, poppy n rest of family how amazing, hope u enjoyed it pugd look forward to watching there progress over the weeks  again we'll done gr8 job!


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## new westie owner (Apr 30, 2010)

Well done all :thumbup:


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## kaisa624 (Mar 5, 2010)

Congrats  xx


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## vizzy24 (Aug 31, 2008)

Congratulations:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup: i can't believe I missed it all!!! What was the final count?


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

She had 5 

3 girls 2 boys

she was amazing


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## harrysmum03 (Nov 5, 2010)

really pleased for u all, you all did a fantastic job and i was sitting here getting updates most of last night lol.
cant wait to see the pictures
:thumbup::lol::thumbup::lol::thumbup::lol::thumbup::lol::thumbup:


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

harrysmum03 said:


> really pleased for u all, you all did a fantastic job and i was sitting here getting updates most of last night lol.
> cant wait to see the pictures
> :thumbup::lol::thumbup::lol::thumbup::lol::thumbup::lol::thumbup:


will put piccies up soon, trying to get through to vet x


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

What a clever girl Poppy is :thumbup: good luck at the vets with the little one and Congratulations to all.


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## Bearpaw (Dec 10, 2009)

Oh congratualtions to you all,You certainly had a busy night.Sorry to hear the little fella has a cleft,i really hope the vets can sort it.  Well done Poppy x


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

We have come to the agonising descision that we are going to take the little boy with a CP to be PTS tomorrow morning.

I have found this so hard but we cannot change the fact this pup has something very wrong with it however much we wish we could.


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Pug_D said:


> We have come to the agonising descision that we are going to take the little boy with a CP to be PTS tomorrow morning.
> 
> I have found this so hard but we cannot change the fact this pup has something very wrong with it however much we wish we could.


I'm so sorry lots of hugs coming your way


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

I for one respect your decision, its not an easy one to make. But more than likely the best one.


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Devil-Dogz said:


> I for one respect your decision, its not an easy one to make. But more than likely the best one.


Yes got to be a hard decison i would not like to be in


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## basi (Nov 9, 2007)

So sorry to hear you have had to make the decision as it is never an easy one to make


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## Val001 (Aug 25, 2010)

So sorry when you said you would keep him but I guess there are more complications now. Better to have it done now rather than wait but a horrid decision to have to make.


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## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

Pug_D said:


> We have come to the agonising descision that we are going to take the little boy with a CP to be PTS tomorrow morning.
> 
> I have found this so hard but we cannot change the fact this pup has something very wrong with it however much we wish we could.


it is a horrible decision, i know what you are going through how is the little girl


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## BeagleOesx (Oct 9, 2009)

So sorry about this little boy. Will be thinking of you tomorrow morning, what a hard decision to have to make.

Hope the others are thriving


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

Thankyou

I can't stop crying

he has been really restless today I don't think hes been getting much milk from poppy and the last 2 times ive fed him he has choked on the milk and its come through his nose

when he was choking i saw the hole opens up into a 'Y' shape and is very open at the back

I feel truely devestated and can't believe we had to even make this descision

just goes to show breeding is not all fluffy puupies and smiles

i really wanted to try for him

but i just don't think he will make it

and i DO NOT want to carry on for him to get to 4 weeks and not be able to take solids and then have to think about taking an older puppy to the vets,

I could not sell him, i would feel bad giving himn to someone to face years of vet bills and surgery

i just feel this is best

painful and hurtful

but best for Him. he can't even drink 

sorry I'm finding this really hard


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

i have gave him as much milk as he will take and he is snuggled up with mum now

trying to give him a happy night


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## XxZoexX (Sep 8, 2010)

Oh im so sorry sending hugs to you, mum and the little ones. Its a decision i would hate to have to make xxx


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## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

Pug_D said:


> Thankyou
> 
> I can't stop crying
> 
> ...


you are making the right decision for him you wouldnt want him to suffer at all, i know that is the little girl ok? you mentioned in another thread you thought she might have a problem?


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## momentofmadness (Jul 19, 2008)

I personally think you are making the right decision.. There is no point in prolonging the suffering this pup will go through if you were to keep him... 

All My Love Hayley....


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

Thankyou all for being so kind.

The little girl is fine as far as I can see, her mouth isn't smooth like the other 3 that are normal, but there doesn't appear to be a gap and she doesn't struggle to feed.

The vet is checking her tomorrow.

Will see if she has weight gained in an hour so so.

Meanwhile Poppy is being super mum 

Does anyone know if she will notice he is gone?


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## momentofmadness (Jul 19, 2008)

Pug_D said:


> Thankyou all for being so kind.
> 
> The little girl is fine as far as I can see, her mouth isn't smooth like the other 3 that are normal, but there doesn't appear to be a gap and she doesn't struggle to feed.
> 
> ...


Quite possibly.. My friends GSD accidently lay on a pup.. unfortunately suffocated the pup.. they buried him and she spent some time searching and then took a toy, and seem to have it as one of the pups... Carried it moved it and cleaned it.. Imagine it was quite confusing for her.. xxx


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

momentofmadness said:


> Quite possibly.. My friends GSD accidently lay on a pup.. unfortunately suffocated the pup.. they buried him and she spent some time searching and then took a toy, and seem to have it as one of the pups... Carried it moved it and cleaned it.. Imagine it was quite confusing for her.. xxx


oh how heartbreaking 

she seems well aware of them individually, she didn't mind me taking him to feed him bottles but OH took the girl in the kitchen to look at her mouth in a better light and she was trying to get after the box to go after him.


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## luvmydogs (Dec 30, 2009)

Depends on the bitch. One of my Bullmastiffs had a few CLP's in both litters. She didn't notice when they were gone.


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2010)

I am sorry that you have to make this choice.

What did the vet think is it a big or small cleft?

Is there no way you can find him a special home with someone who knows what they are getting into?

Either way you are doing 100% the right thing and I cant wait to see some amazingly cute puppy pictures so I can koo over them.:lol:


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## vizzy24 (Aug 31, 2008)

Its a hard decision for you but you are doing the right thing. I am sorry you have had to make I have the upmost respect for you for putting the puppy first. I will be thinking of you tomorrow


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

shetlandlover said:


> I am sorry that you have to make this choice.
> 
> What did the vet think is it a big or small cleft?
> 
> Is there no way you can find him a special home with someone who knows what they are getting into?


We are there at 9am tomorrow morning, we showed photos to our mentor whos bred pugs for 10 years and they said its not a small one,

I assume the vet will agree and with him spurting out milk and choking I don't know how I would go about comftably feeding him? and then what about slid food? and drinking from a bowl?

I really don't know who could have him and who would take on a pup knowing he had this problem and potentially would cost them thousands in vet bills.

Christ, this is so difficult


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Pug_D said:


> oh how heartbreaking
> 
> she seems well aware of them individually, she didn't mind me taking him to feed him bottles but OH took the girl in the kitchen to look at her mouth in a better light and she was trying to get after the box to go after him.


She may know something is not right with that pup


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

I am assuming the girl has a small one and am going to do my best for her as I feel she has a very high chance of having a normal life as it is closed, so would not consider the same for her as she has a chance of a normal life IMO.

but will see what the vet says

i couldn't stand to loose them both.

My OH wants to keep the first girl that was stuck too so looks like we will only be calling a few people from our list,lol.


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2010)

Pug_D said:


> We are there at 9am tomorrow morning, we showed photos to our mentor whos bred pugs for 10 years and they said its not a small one,
> 
> I assume the vet will agree and with him spurting out milk and choking I don't know how I would go about comftably feeding him? and then what about slid food? and drinking from a bowl?
> 
> ...


Dont worry I am sure you will make the right choice. I mean the vet might have a way you can feed him and so on. However you have all those other cuties to be taking care of too.

I helped take on a litter (when I worked at the vets) and it had two pups with cleft. It was hard and we lost the one with the bigger cleft but the other lived a great life and I still see her owner walking round town sometimes. Each vet is different but you need to know what you can do.
If you feel he is suffering and isnt going to have a great chance at life then you know what needs to be done.

Its never a easy choice. I hope mummy's doing well...I am suprised you two are not tired from all the hard work.

Loves to you both and the pups.


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

oh i am tired but can't go to bed till the kids are asleep. OH is tucking them in now... then he will be duty till 2am then its my turn!


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

on a much lighter note my 4 year old son has told me the dogs are called...Vesky, Jackson, Daisy and Bill :thumbup:

(they won't be!)


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Pug_D said:


> on a much lighter note my 4 year old son has told me the dogs are called...Vesky, Jackson, Daisy and Bill :thumbup:
> 
> (they won't be!)


Awww bless him


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

archielee said:


> She may know something is not right with that pup


i think you may be right there as the other 4 sleep near her belly and I keep finding him round the back of her alone


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Pug_D said:


> i think you may be right there as the other 4 sleep near her belly and I keep finding him round the back of her alone


Its so hard but you are doing the right thing hun

Try get some sleep tonight if you can


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## JohnMorris (Oct 15, 2010)

Just caught up with this thread so congratulations to you and Poppy. Well done Poppy x


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

little girls has dropped 12g. i thought she was latching but must not have been

tried to hand feed her just now and she was choking and bubbling through the nose

absolutly devestated

just don't know what to do

am not breeding again

will get the girls spayed when i can, just not cut out fo this


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

3 pugs with fat bellies sleeping by mama

2 with empty bellies and i cant feed them - they just choke

i cn't stand this


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

Pug_D said:


> 3 pugs with fat bellies sleeping by mama
> 
> 2 with empty bellies and i cant feed them - they just choke
> 
> i cn't stand this


Sending hugs as thats all i have  xxx


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## Guest (Nov 12, 2010)

Oh no. :frown:

I really hope the vet can do something for her and the little boy.


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## Maz&Oozy (Mar 29, 2010)

Im sorry I have no advice but wanted to send you some hugs, really wish there was something I could do to help.


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## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

this is the side that many dont see it is heartbraking try just putting the little girl on poppys teats to see if she can actually latch on and watch her belly to see if you can see it filling up, it may just be the way you are feeding her


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## PennyH (Dec 30, 2008)

So sorry - hope you have a peaceful night tonight and that the vet can help you either way in the morning. Thinking of you all.xxxx


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

archiebaby said:


> this is the side that many dont see it is heartbraking try just putting the little girl on poppys teats to see if she can actually latch on and watch her belly to see if you can see it filling up, it may just be the way you are feeding her


OH is doing it now,

im just in pieces.

I'm not made for it, i love my dogs too much to do this again. Pop doesn't understand why we keep taking them two (to weigh - feed) and i dont want her to be upset tomorrow


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## Sophiekins (Oct 20, 2009)

Oh bless you, I really feel for you this is just awful!!

Don't know if this helps... but here is a video of a lady syringe feeding a boston terrier. I don't want to make the decision's any harder for you but thought it might make the night more comfortable for you all?

YouTube - How to Feed a Cleft Palate Puppy

Will say a prayer x


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## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

Pug_D said:


> OH is doing it now,
> 
> im just in pieces.
> 
> I'm not made for it, i love my dogs too much to do this again. Pop doesn't understand why we keep taking them two (to weigh - feed) and i dont want her to be upset tomorrow


i do understand how you feel believe me i am sure poppy will cope with tomorrow whatever it may bring she will still have at least 3 babies and will concentrate on them it will take you a lot longer than poppy imo just see if you can actually get her to latch and feed, if you can and can see her little belly filling then you are in with a good chance for her you say you cannot see a opening in the roof of her mouth just a ridge so she may be ok, fingers crossed for you it is sadly what happens with breeding , it is not all sweetness and light and little fluffy puppies,but at least you still have poppy and some of the puppies


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

archiebaby said:


> i do understand how you feel believe me i am sure poppy will cope with tomorrow whatever it may bring she will still have at least 3 babies and will concentrate on them it will take you a lot longer than poppy imo just see if you can actually get her to latch and feed, if you can and can see her little belly filling then you are in with a good chance for her you say you cannot see a opening in the roof of her mouth just a ridge so she may be ok, fingers crossed for you it is sadly what happens with breeding , it is not all sweetness and light and little fluffy puppies,but at least you still have poppy and some of the puppies


i agree, i need to toughen up, im sorry this has just been a shock to me.

i have pop and 3 fat pups, i don't know what tomorrow will bring at the vets but i need to be thankful my girl is safe, much worse has happened in whelp.

the ridge is closed at the front but we got a torch and there is a big opening at the back


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

she was just trying to suck and squeling cause nothing was happening.

poppy was just looking distressed

she was doing mouth movememnts but the milk wasn't flowing

i dont think theres enough suck??


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## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

Pug_D said:


> she was just trying to suck and squeling cause nothing was happening.
> 
> poppy was just looking distressed
> 
> ...


ahh, so sorry pugd let you vet have a good look at her tomorrow,you never know


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## Ridgielover (Apr 16, 2008)

Have you had a look at the video? I haven't had a puppy with a cleft palate but I have partly hand reared a large litter of puppies and I used a syringe rather than a bottle (at the vet's suggestion). Timing is the key, I put my finger into the pup's mouth, waited til it started sucking and then slipped the end of the syringe over the side of the tongue (from the side of the mouth, not the front) and slowly pushed the plunger of the syringe. You have to do it slowly or the milk will go down too fast and the pup will choke.

I don't know if this will work with a pup with a cleft palate, but it might be worth a try to get some milk into the pup and then it might settle and then Poppy would be more settled. 

If Tanya is still on, maybe she would say whether she thinks it's worth a try.


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## Stellabella (Jan 8, 2009)

So sorry you are going through this with the 2 pups. Nature can be too cruel on times, and you're so tired and emotional you must feel indescribably awful.

BUT though you won't feel it, you are being amazingly strong and doing the best you can for Poppy and ALL the pups. You have done a FANTASTIC job!

Is there any way you can tube feed, until the morning at least when you can take them to the vets? It may not affect the outcome, but it'll help you feel like you've done something for them, there's nothing worse than feeling so helpless. 

((huggs)) to you all x


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## mitch4 (Oct 31, 2009)

So So sorry to read you and the 2 little pups are going through this awful situation, your being very brave and have made the right decision for the little boy, im sure you will do whats best also for the little girl, so hard for you though xxx


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

So very sorry to hear of all your problems and hope you find a solution. Just not fair when you've done everything right that this should happen. 

Lots of good wishes from all here and hugs to you and the little ones.


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## Bijou (Aug 26, 2009)

so sorry to hear of the problems you're having - breeding can be heart breaking - just a thought... can you get some Nutridrops or Lactade ? if you can syringe in some of this it may well help - good luck


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## harrysmum03 (Nov 5, 2010)

just so so sad, thinking of u and puppies xxx


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

OH is taking them in a min, have tried to feed them (been using syringe so they don't have to suck) but it just comes out of their noses and they choke.

I don't think they will be coming home 

Poppy KNOWS something is up as shes gone from chilled with us taking the pups, to being upset at us taking them yesterday

to standing up against the box going mad barking when DH took them to feed them a minute ago.


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

she just keeps them 2 near her front betwen her arms like she knows theres no point them being near her teats

its heartbreaking


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## Ridgielover (Apr 16, 2008)

Make sure she doesn't see you taking them away to take them to the vet.


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

Ridgielover said:


> Make sure she doesn't see you taking them away to take them to the vet.


No, we took her food in and she was distracted with that,

she was looking for them when she went back in

i just got in with her (well half in!) and was cuddling her then brought the other 3 to her face to sniff and lick,

i then put them on the teat to feed and shes lay down now feeding to and licking one.


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## pop pop (Nov 4, 2010)

any news yet of the other two, although it feels hard for you at the moment you are doing the right thing by putting the pups first and doing what is best for them,realy hope the vet can do something for the little girl but if not at least they were loved by you and the family and given the best care you could, sending hugs to poppy xx


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

pop pop said:


> any news yet of the other two, although it feels hard for you at the moment you are doing the right thing by putting the pups first and doing what is best for them,realy hope the vet can do something for the little girl but if not at least they were loved by you and the family and given the best care you could, sending hugs to poppy xx


Thankyou that really means alot to me.

I've never had such a bad headache, i think I've aged about 3 years in 24 hours.

I am grateful to this place because although EVERY one of us here loves our dogs you can see that the problems that come with these poorly pups can greatly out weigh the urge to try and 'save' them. Sometimes 'saving' them means giving them a short, but warm and comftable pain free life rather than dragging it out and prolonging their hunger and pain because our hearts would rather we did.


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

I feel so terribly sorry for you and your OH, also Poppy and the poorly pups. You have done everything in your power to help them and for that you should be proud of yourself.

So heartbreaking all this breeding can be definitely not for the faint hearted, hopefully if anyone thinking of breeding reads your experience it may help to put them off.

Hugs to you all and at least little Poppy is okay bless her. xx


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

I agree Mal,

The 2 pups were PTS this morning, been a hard day, Poppy is looking for them all over.


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## vizzy24 (Aug 31, 2008)

I'm so sorry nothing could have been done but you did your best to make their time here comfortable. My heart goes out to you, your oh and of course little Poppy.Big hug


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

thankyou

she said the boys was really bad and there was no option there.

She said the girl wasn't as severe but she would need surgery and she couldn't guarentee it would fix her, she agreed it was best to put her to sleep as she was choking so badly on the milk we gave her from a syringe, 

i thought it would be the outcome but there are no words to describe how I felt when OH came home without them.


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## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

so.so sorry


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

So very sorry that nothing could be done for them. 

Run free at the bridge little darlings where all your health problems will be fixed and new friends await you. xxx


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## Guest (Nov 13, 2010)

I am so sorry for your loss.

On the bright side at least mum is okay and you still have 3 healthy babies left to see grow up.

Still want those pictures. :arf:


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## Cavalierlover123 (May 27, 2009)

So sorry to hear about the two pups, fun free at rainbow bridge ! you did the best you could  Just try and look forward to the next few weeks with the other three pups  Congrats to all btw :thumbup:


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## pop pop (Nov 4, 2010)

So sorry to hear the two littleones couldnt be saved, at least they went knowing you loved them and that you cared for them the best way you could, and they went together to run at the bridge.
Wishing you all the best with the rest and im sure poppy will be a wonderfull mum to the others x


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## harrys_mum (Aug 18, 2010)

so sorry about the two pups, but she has done well having 3 lovely healthy pups, and im sure you will be very busy in the coming days and weeks.
im looking forward to seeing pics when you can, 
sleep well little babies,
michelle xx


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## Tula&Iver~cavs (Sep 16, 2010)

Oh hun  I'm so sorry, its heartbreaking and you really did the best for the 2 little angels.
I can't even begin to imagine the heartache your going through. Iv just read through this and I'm in tears.

My thoughts are with you and your family. Xxx


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

Thanks everyone

wheras its been a horrible day its also been the start of better days as Poppy is more relaxed when shes feeding the others tonight as the other 2 aren't squealing at her.

The other 3 are feeding fantastically, their bellies are big and fat and full of milk and that makes me SO happy! :thumbup:

I'm in love with the little lad and DH is besotted with the girl who came out first (and was stuck) as he saved her life I think he is hoping to keep her.

Maybe we will only need to call one person on our list :eek6:


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

Girl one has put 10g on and is now 178gs

Boy has put 28gs on and is now 216gs!

and girl two has put 30gs on and is now 198g

:thumbup:


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## sequeena (Apr 30, 2009)

Aww congratulations!


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## comfortcreature (Oct 11, 2008)

Sounds like they are doing wonderfully. That is great news . How is Poppy?

CC


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## Tula&Iver~cavs (Sep 16, 2010)

Things are looking bright :thumbup:

What a fatty 2nd girl is  :thumbup:


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## Pug_D (Feb 21, 2010)

she IS a fatty!

Poppy is doing so well, shes an amazing mummy.

Am a bit sad as shes got more protective over them, obviously because 2 have gone 'missing' 

I got a warm blanket and hot water bottle and hoped to sit with the lad for a few minutes but poppy just wanted to get up and was trying to sit on me and lay down across me to feed him - so I just had to put him back in the box.

I just need to give her some time

But I would love a 'proper' quick cuddle with one.

She fine with me handling them in the box but not outside.

Which is fine, shes the mama!


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## mitch4 (Oct 31, 2009)

Sorry to hear about the 2 poorly pups but was for the best although heartbreaking

Im sure now mum can stop fretting about her sick pups and get on with looking after her others and herself

Photo update soon please xxx


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## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

I'm sorry I missed the posts. You have my number incase you need further advice or just a pep talk x


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## First timer (Nov 2, 2010)

Im so sorry for what has happened I cried my eyes out when I read and then again when i told my husband, even he had tears when I told him. Im pleased mum and the remaining pups are doing well and I praise you for your bravery, I would have just went to pieces xxx
Love to you all x


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