# Help with weaning kittens & taming the feral mother



## reubenjones (May 28, 2012)

Hello everyone 

Recently, a feral cat, Opal, which lives somewhere near my house, has had 2 kittens which I've called Mew and Onyx.

I have volunteered my room for the kittens and mother, owing to the 2 quite rowdy newfoundland dogs which occupy the house. What I am hoping to do is successfully wean Mew and Onyx, and find them a new home whilst taming Opal and eventually getting her spayed and treated for fleas. Unfortunately I don't know a lot about cats so I'm in need of advice.

This is the story so far:

Opal was given to my tenants as a kitten approximately 5 years ago. I've been told she has always been feral. Since she has been living here she has had 5+ litters, some inbred (I know, slightly wrong). She is starting to look rather unhealthy, probably owing to the fact that she rarely comes into the house for food and is pregnant a lot of the time, so I have decided she should be spayed (this is the best thing for her, right?) Unfortunately this is quite difficult owing to the fact she has 2 kittens who are still feeding off her (they are 4-5 weeks I think). She is currently residing in my room with her kittens (I trapped her there when she followed the calls of her kittens). I don't let her out or she will just take her kittens and hide them somewhere outside which will not end well for Mew and Onyx.

Opal is a really nice cat, and although I've been told she is totally feral I have successfully fed her out of my hand and she often smells my hand if I put it near her when she is feeding. I really want to tame her, get her spayed and get her de-flead as she doesn't seem to have a particuarly nice life.

What I need to know is: 

-If the kittens remain with her for too long will they too become feral? Or is that just to do with how much I hold them?

-Is it wasted time trying to tame her BEFORE getting her spayed? I'm guessing her trust of humans will drop dramatically after a traumatic visit to the vets

-What age do the kittens have to be before I can attempt to get Opal Spayed?

The kittens seem quite healthy. Mew, the bigger of the two is attempting to eat solid food, though Onyx is still only drinking milk.



I have essentially no knowledge of cats so any help is greatly appreciated


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## Lel (Mar 21, 2012)

How brilliant that you are looking after these cats when no one else is 

From what you've said she doesn't sound totally feral, just a cat who has been living rough for a long time. If she started out as a pet and then gradually turned into an outdoor/stray type lifestyle then she may well adjust to a life at home quicker than you might expect.

I don't think you need to worry about "taming" her before she is spayed, when her kittens are weaned and it's safe to do so then get her spayed, and then you can return to your efforts to make her into a house pet. 

She might never be a lap cat but that doesn't mean she wouldn't be happy as a pet, I suppose time will tell.

ETA regarding kittens, if they are being brought up in a home with lots of human contact I don't think you need to worry about them being feral.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

You need to treat for fleas asap rather than wait. They are constantly laying eggs which fall into the environment, hatch and turn into larvae and pupae. Before you know it you will have a big flea problem in the house.

There are drop-ons that are safe for pregnant and nursing mothers. Really she should be wormed as well, some of the drop-ons do that as well but I can't remember if they are OK for nursing cats. Ring your vets and ask what you can use.


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

She's not feral. If she will let you handle the kittens then you should certainly be doing that. Generally you can get them spayed when the kittens are about 8 weeks old, the key is that the milk needs to have dried up first.

Liz


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## scatchy (Nov 29, 2011)

I would start taming Onyx straight away. Getting her spayed should not set back her taming too much and I would get this done when the kittens are 7 or 8 weeks old, no later.
The kittens should be fine if you spend plenty of time petting them and playing with them.
It also helps if other people can handle them too. The more they are socialised at a young age the more confident they tend to be.
If both kittens are eating solids happily I would suggest weaning them at 8 weeks as this will take the strain off mum and allow her to regain condition.
Feed the kittens a good quality food little and often, just very tiny amounts to start with. Don't let them overeat by helping themselves to mum's food as this often causes tummy problems.
They can all be treated for fleas and worms but it might be best to visit a vet about this as you are a novice cat owner.
Well done for helping them and I hope you enjoy the experience.


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## koekemakranka (Aug 2, 2010)

reubenjones said:


> -If the kittens remain with her for too long will they too become feral? Or is that just to do with how much I hold them? *Not necessarily. However, if the mother spits and hisses at you, then her attitude will rub off on the kittens. However, if she is calm when you enter the room and doesn't mind you touching the kits, then it shouldn't be a problem. However, I found that as soon as the feral mom is removed, spayed and released, the kittens rapidly attech themselves to the foster human*.
> -Is it wasted time trying to tame her BEFORE getting her spayed? I'm guessing her trust of humans will drop dramatically after a traumatic visit to the vets
> *No, in my experience, the spaying and the visit to the vet has no effect on the mother cat. In fact, oddly enough, there are quite a few ferals that I have spayed that seemed to become tamer after the op*.
> -What age do the kittens have to be before I can attempt to get Opal Spayed?
> *Ideally after 8 weeks, but if mom's feral ways are hindering the taming, then the spaying can be done a week or two earlier*


Good luck and well done for taking in this mom and kits.


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## Ingrid25 (Oct 1, 2011)

reubenjones said:


> Hello everyone
> 
> What I need to know is:
> 
> ...


First of all, good job for taking on opal and her kittens
1. No, if you handle them and socilaise them with lots of different people they wont
2. No, probably not maybe a tinsy wincy bit but if she is eating from your hand she isnt feral
3. Around 8 weeks, as has been said

Keep us updated, we are all happy to help.
It is disgusting to hear that she has been bred like that and then inbred
Its a good thing that she has a nice owner like you that will psay her and treat her well and like family!


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## reubenjones (May 28, 2012)

Hi all, thanks for all the comments =)

All is going well with the cats, Opal is now eating without being hidden under my bed and is comfortable enough to go the toilet with me in the room (not sure if I like this or not lol). The kittens are both attempting to eat Opal's food, are getting very playful and Mew is now purring . Both have gotten lots bigger too.



> You need to treat for fleas asap rather than wait....
> There are drop-ons that are safe for pregnant and nursing mothers.


I did want to this, not only because I have to live in the room but also I've read that fleas can give kittens anaemia but unfortunately Opal is not yet tame enough to allow me very near her neck, so actually getting it on her skin would be quite difficult... However when I phone the vet to book her in to be spayed I will ask what the best thing to do is. Worst case scenario I'll have her treated when she gets spayed, get the kittens done at around the same time and thoroughly treat my room then and maybe a fortnight later.



> Feed the kittens a good quality food little and often, just very tiny amounts to start with. Don't let them overeat by helping themselves to mum's food as this often causes tummy problems.


I was unaware of this, will start feeding them gruel made from cat milk and kitten food (is cat milk ok for kittens?) instead of allowing them to eat with mum. Unfortunately I am away on the 6th-11th June but hopefully my neighbours will be happy to help (They have 2 of Opal's previous kittens)



> Ideally after 8 weeks, but if mom's feral ways are hindering the taming, then the spaying can be done a week or two earlier


Ok, is there a good indication that they are both ready? As I am unsure of their exact age, 4-5 weeks may have been an underestimate because they were a bit underfed, but in only 6 days they have both grown considerably.


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## reubenjones (May 28, 2012)

Oh and in terms of playing and socialising with them, I can't resist picking them up whenever I go in my room , so they get played with maybe 3-5 times a day, much more if my girlfriend is over. They will sometimes have a day with just mum because I'll be away but I will normally play with them at least once on that day when I get back.

A few pictures of the kittens if anyone is interested. First one is on the day we got them (a bit traumatised) and second one is 4 days later:


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## koekemakranka (Aug 2, 2010)

Regarding the food, we normally advise feral fosterers to keep it simple and feed both mom and kittens the same good quality kitten food (we normally recommend Royal Canin Babycat). Mom will eat the food and so teach kittens to eat it. Plus it is quite calorific so helps build mom up as well. For wet, we also feed both Mom and babies either kitten wet food or boiled chicken gruel.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

koekemakranka said:


> Regarding the food, we normally advise feral fosterers to keep it simple and feed both mom and kittens the same good quality kitten food (we normally recommend Royal Canin Babycat). Mom will eat the food and so teach kittens to eat it. Plus it is quite calorific so helps build mom up as well. For wet, we also feed both Mom and babies either kitten wet food or boiled chicken gruel.


This is how I'd feed any kittens with their mother. They really don't need us making all sorts of weaning foods or trying to make them eat solids, they will wean themselves when they are ready.


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## reubenjones (May 28, 2012)

> Regarding the food, we normally advise feral fosterers to keep it simple and feed both mom and kittens the same good quality kitten food


Ok, I was originally feeding mother and kittens 3 pouches of kitten food a day, I was just worried it was inappropriate for the kittens because it said 3 months or more, but the kittens are eating it fine and seem problem free! 

As I am unsure of the exact age of the kittens, can you suggest some way I can tell if they are old enough for the mother to be spayed?


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## koekemakranka (Aug 2, 2010)

Well, from what you say, she is not really feral. I have fostered a number of truly feral cats. They hide, spit, hiss, lash out and growl and you cannot go near them or touch them. This often rubs off on the babies and hinders their taming (basically truly feral kittens older than 4 weeks are extremely difficult to tame). However, if your mom doesn't run away and hide, comes up to you and feeds from your hand, then she is not very feral and you do not necessarily have to remove her from the kittens earlier. It may help if you post a clear pic of the kittens taken today, then perhaps we can assist you in estimating their age. How do they eat? Do they run for the food as soon as you set it down and wolf it, or do they just eat a little bit? How do they eat : do they snuffle/suck at the soft food or do they eat normally? How independent are they? Do they hang around their mom most of the day or do they play and nap in other parts of the room? That said, remember that it is better to keep them with their mom as long as possible (if they are taming well) as they can learn many things from their mom and it is better for them health-wise/ socially. It is only when mom is very feral that an earlier removal may be necessary.


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## reubenjones (May 28, 2012)

Hi, I don't think Opal is entirely Feral, no, though she does hiss at me, run away from the food if I move too suddenly, "Growl" (sounds a bit like she is saying moo) if she is uncomfortable. The mum does come up to me for food (though nothing else yet) and will eat out of my hand but this is progress as she would not eat with me in sight before. I am currently working on her getting comfortable with me touching her gently while she is eating. (I have been using this article as a rough guide How to Tame Feral Cats)

Regarding the kittens, they eat the solid lumps of food as well as the jelly now. They sleep separately from the mum and are constantly play fighting with each other and the curtains. They have begun going to the toilet all around the litter tray (though not in it yet :thumbdown

I put a video up on facebook of them play fighting as I figured it would probably be better than a picture. (This is normal kitten behaviour, right?) Link is below.

Thanks again for help. 

Kittens Fighting | Facebook


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## Ingrid25 (Oct 1, 2011)

aww they are so cute and have grown SO much! They look like they have been getting a lot fatter


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