# my dog becomes aggressive sometimes when being touched



## Fion345 (Aug 3, 2011)

We have Zeus, a Jack Russell Terrier since when he was 3 months old. He pretty well behaved until he had neuter operation (6-month old). I noticed that he didn't want us to touch him after the operation. When my hand got closer to him, he became aggressive. We couldn't touch/hold him the way that it used to be. I tried to train him to accept my hand and touching. However, it still doesn't turn out the way I want. When Zeus comes to snuggle with us in the sofa, he wouldn't let us to touch his body with our hands. He would growl and snap sometimes. When he slept on my feet, he might growl and try to bite my feet if I moved or turned. He konws it's not right to growl or bite, but he just couldn't help it. It seems that he couldn't trust hands on him. I could lay arm/leg on his body when snuggling, but not hand! I never asked the vet. It may not be related to the operation at all..... Any advice to train him will be appreciated!


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

Fion345 said:


> We've [had] Zeus, a JRT, since he was 3-MO.


hey, Fi! 
unfortunately, 12-Wo is the very end of the primary-socialization period. Did U get him from a breeder, 
& did he live in the house with the family, his dam & his litter? Or did he live in a kennel, a barn, or a pen? 
did he come from a shelter? was he born there, or living with a litter? or was he found stray, or surrendered?

it sounds as tho he was not well-socialized as a puppy; unfortunately we cannot change that past, it is 
what it is - & the window of socialization has closed, BUT we can teach him ways to cope & relax about touch.

the first thing i'd suggest is teach him to TARGET. that way *he does the touching - U are touched.* 
this builds his confidence & then touch becomes less scary. this is only step-One, but it's a valuable step.

- get a *clicker* OR choose another marker: a small LED flashlight, a bottle or jar cap with a vacuum-dome 
that can be popped [hold the lid flat on one palm, press firmly on the dome with the thumb of the other hand], 
a loudly-clicking ballpoint pen... anything.

CHARGE The marker: make it work [click, flash, squeak... whatever it does] and *immediately* give a treat. 
for simplicity i'll use *** as my MARKER [click, flash, beep...]. So what do we do?

***, treat; ***, treat, ***, treat, ***, treat... 5 or 6 times, *take a break.* we're teaching the pup *** = *'treat coming!'*
*the marker predicts a treat or other reward - * soon it will mean _*'that's RIGHT! yes!'*_

for a full week of FREE lessons, go to 7 Day FREE Clickertraining Course 
all they ask for is a first-name & an e-mail address.

‪Attention: Hand Targeting‬‏ - YouTube

‪Petey learning to target a post it note with his paw (shaping)‬‏ - YouTube

a series with a Sheltie pup
1 - very beginner version; both human & puppy uncertain
‪Clicker Training of "Target" 1‬‏ - YouTube

2 - much better!
‪Clicker Training of "Target" 2‬‏ - YouTube

3 - smaller target, better training
‪Clicker Training of "Target" 3‬‏ - YouTube

4 - getting quite polished 
‪Clicker Training of "Target" 4‬‏ - YouTube

5 - small size becomes challenging
‪Clicker Training of "Target" 5‬‏ - YouTube

7 - ooh, tough to do!
‪Clicker Training of "Target" 7‬‏ - YouTube

once he understands that the marker *predicts* a good thing, & means 'yes! that's what i want', 
he can learn anything - & targeting the palm or back of a stranger's hand is safer & easier 
by far than asking him to *stand still while a stranger approaches => him! & tries to pet him. *  
this way, he ==> goes to the stranger & touches THEM, then U give him a treat for coming to U, 
away from the stranger.

for now, he can go from person to person in the household - then when it's well-practiced, 
go a quiet place & do some target-training outside, or invite friends or family to Ur house.


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## Fion345 (Aug 3, 2011)

Sorry. I'd like to add more information. Zeus accepts touching him when he is awake. He aceepts strangers touching him outside, actually. As long as your hand moves on his body, it's Okay. But, you can not lay your hand on his body and not moving. He would get very neveous for that. However, He becomes aggressive (growl or snap) for even a very brief touching when he is sleeping..


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## grandad (Apr 14, 2011)

Fion345 said:


> Sorry. I'd like to add more information. Zeus accepts touching him when he is awake. He aceepts strangers touching him outside, actually. As long as your hand moves on his body, it's Okay. But, you can not lay your hand on his body and not moving. He would get very neveous for that. However, He becomes aggressive (growl or snap) for even a very brief touching when he is sleeping..


So he was ok before he went to the vets and now he's different after the vets. Seems like something may have occured at the vets. Might be worth asking.


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## Jobeth (May 23, 2010)

Maybe he is in pain and keeping your hand in one place increases the pressure?


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

If have understood correctly when awake and alert, you can use stroking movements and he is quite happy to accept it. But if you actually just put your hand on him motionless or try to hold him which means your hands are still in one position he becomes agressive. If this is correct and this has all occured after he was in the vets for neutering then my best guess would be he could now have an association with being restrained or held and something unpleasant or frightening happening.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

Fion345 said:


> He becomes aggressive (growl or snap) for even a very brief touching when he is sleeping...


simple solution: *Don't touch him*_ when he's sleeping._ :nono:

there is a *reason* for the saying, _'Let sleeping dogs lie.'_ 
it means don't trouble them, leave them ALONE; a dog's bite-inhibition is only 'on' when they're *awake*, 
messing with a sleeping or especially a dreaming dog is a wonderful way to be very-badly bitten. :yikes:

besides which, it's an invasion of the dog's personal space & a violation of trust - they lie-down to sleep 
in our presence with the assumption that we will watch out for them [as they do for us], & not worry them - 
dogs don't normally JUMP-ONTO a sleeping person; jump-up beside them or onto the foot of the bed/sofa, yes. 
but not ON the person - unless it's puppy-rudeness.

it's startling to be touched while sleeping, it makes getting *back to sleep* difficult because it's 
startling & adrenaline is running thru us like electricity, it scares the bejabbers out of us - or dogs. 
we don't usually wake someone by touching them unless it's an emergency; we call them, by name or otherwise.

please STOP doing that; if U need to wake the dog *for a good reason*, call the puppy's name quietly. 
otherwise for DoG's sake, _*let him sleep*_ & don't interrupt his sleep. 
especially if he's dreaming! if he's twitching, shivers, whines, his feet are moving, his EYES move 
back & forth under closed eyelids, he's DREAMING - don't interrupt. Dreams are part of the memory's work 
of consolidating emotional events & new learning; interrupting dreams leaves holes in memory that can't be fixed.


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## wyntersmum (Jul 31, 2011)

Sled dog hotel said:


> If have understood correctly when awake and alert, you can use stroking movements and he is quite happy to accept it. But if you actually just put your hand on him motionless or try to hold him which means your hands are still in one position he becomes agressive. If this is correct and this has all occured after he was in the vets for neutering then my best guess would be he could now have an association with being restrained or held and something unpleasant or frightening happening.


I was thinking the same thing. as they hold animale to give the injections ect so associates pain with still hands. you doing it when hes asleep is probable startiling him, but depends on the vet if he will tell you if there was any problems. this is going off the subject completely but may shed a bit of light (bere with me i ramble a bit). i had to go the dentist when i was about 9. (army dentist) was told had to have a filling taken out and renewed. well he gave me the jab and left me to long. anistetic war off and e was drilling into my nerv. my mum was locked out the room and i was held down by the nurse. didnt go back to dentist till i was 18. maybe something like that had happened. not saying thats whats happened but worth thinking about.:crying::


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

Fion345 said:


> Sorry. I'd like to add more information. Zeus accepts touching him when he is awake. He aceepts strangers touching him outside, actually. As long as your hand moves on his body, it's Okay. But, you can not lay your hand on his body and not moving. He would get very neveous for that. However, He becomes aggressive (growl or snap) for even a very brief touching when he is sleeping..


They probably held him down at the vet and that is what is scaring him. Dogs usually become aggressive when they are scared.



Sled dog hotel said:


> If have understood correctly when awake and alert, you can use stroking movements and he is quite happy to accept it. But if you actually just put your hand on him motionless or try to hold him which means your hands are still in one position he becomes agressive. If this is correct and this has all occured after he was in the vets for neutering then my best guess would be he could now have an association with being restrained or held and something unpleasant or frightening happening.


Agree



leashedForLife said:


> simple solution: *Don't touch him*_ when he's sleeping._ :nono:
> 
> there is a *reason* for the saying, _'Let sleeping dogs lie.'_
> it means don't trouble them, leave them ALONE; a dog's bite-inhibition is only one when they're *awake*,
> ...


You should never disturb a dog whilst he is sleeping. You wouldn't like it if someone came pawing at you while you were in a nice deep sleep, neither does he.

As said, leave him alone while he is sleeping and you won't have a problem.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

newfiesmum said:


> They probably held him down at the vet and that is what is scaring him. Dogs usually become aggressive when they are scared.
> 
> Agree
> 
> ...


Its very true if they are shocked awake they can defensively react and snap and snarl. I do it too, if my family want to wake me up if I fall asleep on the sofa, they stand down the other end of the room and throw cushions and yell (Dont do this to the dog btw) so they are out of range. Sometimes they just leave me be. Ive actually woke up and punched OH on occasion. So people can be like it too. Sometimes we expect too much from our dogs and forget they have natural instincts and reactions. (Perhaps Im just an Old dog at heart)


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

Sled dog hotel said:


> Its very true if they are shocked awake they can defensively react and snap and snarl. I do it too, if my family want to wake me up if I fall asleep on the sofa, they stand down the other end of the room and throw cushions and yell (Dont do this to the dog btw) so they are out of range. Sometimes they just leave me be. Ive actually woke up and punched OH on occasion. So people can be like it too. Sometimes we expect too much from our dogs and forget they have natural instincts and reactions. (*Perhaps Im just an Old dog at heart)*




You could do a lot worse!!


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## NicoleW (Aug 28, 2010)

leashedForLife said:


> simple solution: *Don't touch him*_ when he's sleeping._ :nono:
> 
> there is a *reason* for the saying, _'Let sleeping dogs lie.'_
> it means don't trouble them, leave them ALONE; a dog's bite-inhibition is only one when they're *awake*,
> ...


Oh Balls! I always touch Duke when he's asleep. Sometimes I creep up on him and jolt him to scare him, like I do with the kids. I know it sounds cruel, but it isn't honest! As soon as I do he wakes up giving me kisses and then we have a good ol' play.

Now my daughter is crawling around, Duke and Bailey now sleep in the kitchen with the gate closed. So no idea why I stroke him while he's sleeping.

Thanks for that though, feel like a horrid cow now.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

NicoleW said:


> Oh Balls! I always touch Duke when he's asleep. Sometimes I creep up on him and jolt him
> to scare him, like I do with the kids. I know it sounds cruel, but it isn't honest! As soon as I do he wakes up giving me kisses
> and then we have a good ol' play.


wow! hmy: all i can say is, U've been very lucky.

my Akita woke me once by fussing while she was dreaming, & i was not very awake myself; i'd had a lingering cold, 
& while it was mostly gone, i was still more tired & less intelligent than usual [my excuse ], *plus* it was 
the middle of the bloody night when i hear her yelp softly, whimper & snarl... eejit that i am & half-asleep, 
i wasn't thinking at all - *i reached over in the dark where she was lying a foot or two from the bed & stroked her.* 
_believe me when i say BOTH of us were snapped broad-awake in the next moment, 
as she snarled horribly & woke-up snapping at me - thank DoG she pulled her punch, or i'd have been 
at the E-R reception desk at 2 or 3-AM. She woke with a huge startle, her HAIR actually sprang up 
all down her back, & she was halfway to her feet before she realized where she was, & then looked 
very confused and upset._

i felt like a total idiot; i apologized very humbly, but she licked her lips, looked very hangdog, 
& took herself off to curl-up in her crate for the rest of that night - & the next. :nonod: i felt so thankful 
that i hadn't been bitten badly by my own dog, she DID mouth my arm but left just 2 dime-sized bruises. 
unfortunately she'd startled me so badly when she roared in that fashion, i was awake for over an hour, 
getting my blood-pressure & respiration back to normal & watching my hands shake. Never again!

unless i develop dementia, from then on i could not be PAID-enuf to touch a sleeping dog - not without 
talking to them or gently thumping the floor to wake the dog, *first!* :wink:


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## Andromeda (Nov 21, 2010)

NicoleW said:


> Thanks for that though, feel like a horrid cow now.


You shouldn't. 
Everything depends on dog and if you are doing it constantly your dog get used to it. Of course you have to watch out when he sleeps in deep sleep.
Halle loves to be touched, she can curly up next to you, put her head on you and sometimes when you will change your position in the bed (I don't have to touch her) she will growl and go to sleep on her bed 

You have to know your own dog and if you do you know when you should leave him alone.


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## NicoleW (Aug 28, 2010)

Amazing self-control your Akita had though, to not actually bite you.

I think I may stop doing it with Duke now, sounds a bit safer to let him sleep LOL. Poor dog 


I love it when we play together outside, he'll be in the field watching me coming towards me. I'll stop still, put my body low to the ground and look at him dead in the eye, he bows - staring at me comes jolting over and jumps up while I knock him down and roll around on the ground with him like I'm a dog myself! He goes nuts licking me all over, doing this high-pitched bark and little jumps in the air.

Sometimes, I wish I was a dog


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

Andromeda said:


> Halle loves to be touched, she can curly up next to you, put her head on you and sometimes when you will change
> your position in the bed (I don't have to touch her) *she will growl* and go to sleep on her bed


that reminds me - when i was 9 or 10-YO, i stayed at my girlfriend's house overnight.

Susan had a double-bed [unheard of, for kids in our family], so we shared it. 
unfortunately she also had a 5 or 6-YO Rat Terrier who did not have a nice disposition - 
and she told me *after we were in bed* in our PJs when the dog *jumped-up on the bed* not to roll over, 
nor to touch him... as he'd *bite.* Great!... 

i did not so much as twitch while i was awake, but twice during the night i either rolled-over or moved my feet, 
and that rotten dog growled loudly both times *& bit me - not bloodily, but left bruises thru the blankets!* 
i never stayed over at her house again. :lol: we would play at her house, but no more overnights - & it wasn't 
my decision, i'm not sure whose it was - the grown-ups did not consult or inform me.

he was a real stinker; smart, but unlike the typical Rat Terrier, had a nasty streak wider than his shoulders. :nonod:


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## Andromeda (Nov 21, 2010)

She is not allowed to bite only to talk and walk away 

Some dogs are horrible. I do understand that they want to sleep without been touched but there are limits. 
What worries me is lack of balance. I still remember my Mum saying
"Go away form dog, leave her alone and let her sleep. You will woke up her, she will be ready to play and you will change your mind."

Okay she wasn't that nice to me


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

NicoleW said:


> Oh Balls! I always touch Duke when he's asleep. Sometimes I creep up on him and jolt him to scare him, like I do with the kids. I know it sounds cruel, but it isn't honest! As soon as I do he wakes up giving me kisses and then we have a good ol' play.
> 
> Now my daughter is crawling around, Duke and Bailey now sleep in the kitchen with the gate closed. So no idea why I stroke him while he's sleeping.
> 
> Thanks for that though, feel like a horrid cow now.


And does she laugh?


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## NicoleW (Aug 28, 2010)

Who the child when I scare her?

Bursts into a fit of hysterical laughter, then pretends to be asleep and asks me to do it again.

My 14 month old regularly loves being scared/shocked so she jumps, finds it highly amusing


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## daniellla (Aug 5, 2011)

you must slowlly with him..and everything will be ok..i wish you a lucy


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## Fion345 (Aug 3, 2011)

Zeus likes to snuggle with us. He curls with us in the sofa often. I do not intentionly interrupt him when he is asleep. The problem is when I move my legs to stretch, he would growl and show his teeth (sometimes he snaps me). And, when I move my hand to get something over part of his body/head (I didn't touch him, but he could feel my movement), he would snap me... When he curls with me and puts his head on my thigh, I can't put my hand on his body. He will growl/snap and jump out of the sofa. He doesn't show these kinds of aggression when he is awake or when we play. Zeus is very alert. I can't touch him and massage him when he is awake. However, I can't keep my hand on his body without movement. He is scared and stays away from me....
Before the netuer operation, we snuggled all the time without any problem mentioned above. I did ask the vet indirectly one time. But he didn't say anything wrong...


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

then put Zeus off the sofa _*before he falls asleep*_, & have him sleep elsewhere.


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## Irish Setter Gal (Mar 17, 2011)

leashedForLife said:


> then put Zeus off the sofa _*before he falls asleep*_, & have him sleep elsewhere.


Doh :wink:


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