# Could do with some advice for stroppy cat



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

As some of you know, I have recently moved house. Along with adding a human of the male variety to the household (I know, I'm mad for doing this voluntarily!) I have also inherited his cat. Sookie is a sweet little thing with D, the man, most of the time, but there are times when even he is very wary of handling her. I, on the other hand, am very frightened of her. I minimise this massively when I'm around her as I know they pick up on it, but I'm tired of being frightened in my own home, so am hoping for advice. Let me tell you the whole saga.

Sook was a rescue kitten found in a suitcase. She was homed with D at about 6-8 weeks old (mum wasn't in the suitcase with them). She's been an only cat ever since, but has had lots of human interaction.

She hisses, growls and screams at anyone new entering her house (this being the old one where she used to live), even friends that D has had for years who come to feed and cuddle her when she's away. She still screams and lashes out at his dad despite him never doing anything cruel to her. She will come and rub round your legs for attention, then when you reach down to stroke her, she rubs against your hand no problem, then suddenly turns into all teeth and claws. Having had cats for years I do spot the signs of over stimulation, so it's not this, and it can happen within seconds despite her going out of her way to solicit the attention in the first place.

At other times, she can be as sweet as pie, rubbing, cuddling, talking away with no signs of aggression.

She yells when you pick her up, so I don't do this, allowing her to come to me only on her own terms. I always show her the back of my hand so she self strokes with it, so can walk away as soon as she's had enough. However, she still blocks me from going into rooms by sitting in front of the door and yowling. If I step forward, she goes for me. I try not to walk away too often as it gives her the upper hand and she knows it and it's a lot harder to then pass her the next time.

After almost 9 months of visiting D in his house, she would 90% of the time scream at me when I came in, but 10% would come and sit on my knee and be made a fuss of. If I tried to move her because her claws were digging in or because I wanted to get up, she went mad.

I've also tried to start introducing her to my other cats, Tango and the kitten. Zippy is understandably terrified of her and just lies still or runs away. Tango started well, giving her her space, chirping to her, making all the right moves, but last night she growled at the kitten once too often and he'd had enough, so went and whacked her. Luckily we managed to intervene before world war 3 broke out, but I'm fed up. She howls and screams at them through a screen door, proper catterwalling not just talking, when they're over the other side of a room doing nothing. My kitten is hardly eating unless I'm in the room with her, but I need to split my time equally as D is out at work, and as much as I'm frightened of her, she clearly needs and wants attention as she cries if left alone.

We've been scent swapping with the cats for months now which is why I think Mr T is not bothered by being in the same room as her. We continue to do this to no avail.

I have PetRemedy plugged in in 4 rooms of the house, and she gets Spot On once a week. She won't eat Zylkene, but even when we've managed to force the issue, it just makes her worse. Feliway has no effect.

When D is here, she's a different cat with me, all chats and no bother.

However, I'm thinking long thoughts. She's quite happily gone for my face before, missing my eye by milimeters. What if she does that to a baby? I also want to keep breeding, and don't know how I'm going to bring new cats in if she's like this. Quite apart from anything else, being on edge the whole time is really tiring. I've only been here since Friday, and I already feel physically and mentally completely exhausted.

He's said he doesn't want to rehome her, but the selfish part of me wants him to. I gave up 4 of my adult cats, 3 of whom were specifically because he said he didn't want to run a household that was divided into camps, and my heart cat specifically because I knew she wouldn't get on with Sookie. Now I find that my kitten is terrified, my previously gentle giant is so upset that he's hitting her, and I'm afraid to go to the loo in case I get swiped!

I need solutions to fix her, but I don't know what else I can try. I never push myself on her, never pick her up, never even approach her unless I have to. She's obviously fine with me as she'll sleep on my llegs at night and happily come for a fuss when she chooses. I don't know if she's in-bred and has these problems as a result, or what's going on.

Help! Please!


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Hi Carly, the situation sounds tremendously stressful and you have my utmost sympathy as I too would find it tiring and unsettling having to cope with such a scenario. What is particularly upsetting is that Tango and Zippy are so disturbed by Sookie, and to the extent that Zippy is terrified of her, bless him.

It seems Sookie is ruling the household with an iron paw which is understandable as she has been an only cat all her life. She is evidently devoted to D, very possessive of him and finding it hard to share him. It must be hard for her to accept the arrival in her territory of not only a new human, but 2 strange cats. The fact she got to know you for 9 months when you were a visitor is not the same thing to her as you moving in permanently. She is feeling overwhelmed at present.

I can well understand you feel that rehoming Sookie would resolve things, but surely D is very attached to her ? Also I wonder how easy would it be to re-home a cat whose behaviour is as unpredictable as Sookie's? If you, with all your years of experience, are finding it hard to live with her, perhaps others would find it more so. If Sookie was moved to a strange environment with new humans her behaviour may become more volatile, which could lead to her being rejected and rehomed again, or maybe even labelled as unsuitable to live with people at all.

Sookie is probably one of those cats for whom every contact must be on her own terms, and you have recognised this and you allow her to initiate all contact. You may never be able to progress beyond that with her. Perhaps Sookie is a one person cat and D will only ever be the person whom she allows the privilege of stroking her whenever he chooses. I once adopted a 15 year old stray female cat like that. She eventually allowed me to stroke her a little when she was on my bed, never anywhere else, but she never permitted my OH (who is very gentle) to touch her. If he tried she lashed out at him with claws and teeth viciously.

For the moment, for the sake of reducing Tango and Zippy's stress levels, and also for the sake of your sanity, I think it would be better if your two and Sookie could not see each other at all. Screen doors are a useful tool for introducing cats to each other safely, but if there is howling, yowling, growling, then them being able to see each other becomes counterproductive, because stress levels keep rising exponentially. So I would put a solid door between the two feline social groups and let everyone have a respite.

Having divided the two groups you would then need to go through a very slow process of reintroduction, allowing the two groups to see each other through the screen door for short periods each day, and only proceeding beyond the stage of seeing each other through the screen once there is no more yowling, howling or growling. In fact close the solid door as soon as there is any yowling etc. (hissing is OK though) Note, this stage may take months, but don't be tempted to rush it. I appreciate it would be time consuming and painstaking, but I think it is the only chance you have of the two groups being able to coexist peacefully in the same home.

A lengthy, slow reintroduction would give Sookie the time she needs hopefully, to adapt to sharing her home. Her most valued resource (apart from food & water) is her close relationship with D, and she needs to find the confidence to trust that even though there have been big changes within her environment her special relationship with D is safe and will not be threatened by the presence of new comers (both human and feline ) Perhaps D needs to give her lots of reassurance at present, in whatever ways suit her best.

With regard to Sookie blocking doorways so you can't get past, she must not be allowed to do that, it is giving her too much power. There are some things she must give way on, and this is one of them. I have found the most effective way to move an angry cat from a doorway is to _gently _ flap a few sheets of newspaper near them. Not a rolled up newspaper, just one folded as it comes normally. The rustling noise and the gentle flapping movement of the paper seem to put the cat off and make them run away. It means you don't need to resort to measures such as handling the cat to move her out of the way. Make sure not to flap it right on her as this could make her feel her space is being invaded, I tend to do it about an arm's length away.

I'll give it some more thought Carly and see if I have anything further to add later, that might possibly useful.


----------



## Ceiling Kitty (Mar 7, 2010)

How old is she @carly87? Could she turn quickly after being touched because she's sore with arthritis? We now know that arthritis can occur even in young cats, so while this does sound 100% behavioural it would still be a good starting point to see the vet and rule out medical issues, especially if something as drastic as rehoming is on the cards.


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

She's always done this Shosh, from day 1, and it's not confined to me. As I say, she does it with his dad, with his long term friends that've been around since she was a baby, with everyone, even D if he touches her when she decides she doesn't want to be touched. She's only 2, and the behaviour hasn't got worse and it isn't stimulated by touch, but by her. It's not specific to one part of her body either, as I was watching for arthritis when I first met her.

CM, thank you very much for your post. I really do appreciate it.

I don't know if Sook is feeling threatened by me. When D is around, she is happy to come and be social, even choosing me over him quite a lot of the time, i.e, she sleeps on my legs, prefers my lap to his etc. The behaviour was exactly the same in the old house when I was visiting as it is here. It's just that there, I knew it was only for a weekend and I could leave, whereas here it's constant.

I'd love to shut the doors between them if I could, but when we did this, or even shut one party in a room, there was door scratching and carpet pulling from Sookie, and howling from my two who went completely off their food because they couldn't see me. The kitten is only 15 weeks old, so I can't have her not eating for long periods, and I can't have Sook damaging the doors or carpet as it's a rented property. Carpet tiles are an option, but she still scratches the door, and just pulls it off and carries on, or starts yowling herself.

The flapping newspaper would be a lovely idea except when I tried it, having the same thought process as you, she went ballistic, launching herself at me and putting me into a full blown retreat.

To clarify another point, I have not moved in with him. We have moved to a new house together, and have been very, very careful not to let her claim one part of the house as her own as we both know she is incredibly territorial, to the point where D had to cover his windows because she was going nuts when another cat came into the garden to visit. I know that in turn this will make her feel unsettled, but also know that once she claims, the behaviour escalates rather than decreasing. I've dealt with this by making sure she has her own things which move with her when we swap rooms, blanket, bed, box, food bowls, feeding mat etc.

I'm also thinking more long term as well CM, and I do appreciate that this is very, very selfish. She does this to people she trusts, even D although to a much lesser extent. I can't tell a tiny baby not to touch her, and while I would of course make sure that the baby was gentle and all cats had loads of hiding spots, Sook doesn't back down from a situation she doesn't like. Her response is to whack first, think later.

I'm going to do nothing drastic, and to be honest, if I wasn't frightened of her I'd just put up with as much of this as I could for as long as I could, but I'm really on edge every time I move, and feel like I'm walking on egg-shells. Attacks are frightening enough, but when you can't see them coming, it's much, much worse.


----------



## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

Many years ago I had a cat with similar traits but not as ferocious as yours sounds ! I read loads about cat behaviour , no Google in those days , and was pointed towards brain damage.It does sound feasible given the unpredictability of her behaviour and possibly she was deprived of some oxygen when shut in that suitcase. Would it be possible to get a neurological assessment on her ?


----------



## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

With the best will in the world, we know that Sooki's behaviour is not normal feline behaviour. Even being found in a suitcase at a few weeks old cannot account for her unpredictability. You know so much about cats and their behaviour Carly but I wonder if you ought to consider calling in a behaviorist. You cannot carry on being terrorised by her. Does D know how scared and upset you are?


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

I've been thinking along the lines of brain damage myself, but unfortunately, as it's not a new issue, the insurance won't cover it and he won't have the money to do a full neuro assessment, MRI etc.

Lynn, I spoke to a behaviourist about her hence all the bits I'm trying, i.e, letting her self stroke with my hand, not letting her claim territory but moving hers with her, etc etc. The problem that I have with someone coming in is that this behaviour only happens, well, mostly happens, when I'm alone with her. Many behaviourists will tell you to watch for visual pointers, and this will be the same with Sook as I get no physical or audible warning before she starts, so even with their help, I don't know how I'd reinforce or implement the things they give me to do.

I'm sorry. I realise that I'm coming across as poopooing a lot of what you guys are suggesting. I really am grateful for all the suggestions, but have been through a lot of them in my head already which is why I have a lot of answers.

She's so unpredictable. Just now for example, I've said "oi!" not in an aggressive voice but a firm, calm one as she was really having a good scratch on the back of the chair behind me. In response, she yowled and grabbed my head, drawing blood. No more than 20 seconds later, she's back rubbing round my legs and asking for affection.


----------



## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

I really feel for you Carly. It must be a nightmare for you and so upsetting during what should be the lovely time of starting a new life with your young man.
In relation to the problem being caused by brain damage, when you say it isn't a new issue do you mean that she has been checked before or has been seen by a vet for her behaviourial problems?


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

No Lynn. What I mean is that she has exhibited this behaviour since kittenhood. She has always hissed, screamed at and blocked his friends/family when they come into the house. I think because they can see they can work around her much more easily, stepping wide of her and circling to get in front of her. I can'd do that as she moves with me, and I need to touch furniture etc even if only briefly to know where I am as my spatial awareness does go a bit out the window in times of stress.

She's always been unpredictable with everyone,even D. Thought it was quite telling last night when, on putting the cats back into their separate areas after a very brief meeting, he said "I wouldn't dare pick her up just yet," and, "I won't touch her just yet as she'd have me." Perhaps I'm a bit spoiled by breeding the Persians, but if I couldn't even handle my own cat, I'd think there was something wrong. Even my Russian, who was the most highly strung, stroppy girl ever when she was in a mood, would be able to be picked up, and while she wasn't happy about it and nobody else would have been able to do it while she was in that temper, she would not have gone for me all guns blazing.


----------



## The Wild Bunch (Jul 16, 2014)

Really awful situation for you Carly. Daisy can be a moody boot but she would never go for any of us and even when Ernie is dangling from her tail, we only get a little hiss. So sorry that this is happening and dampening spirits when it should be an exciting and lovely time moving somewhere new with someone special.


----------



## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

I wonder if, under the circumstances, the insurance would cover an investigation. You could please your case by saying that while her behaviour has been difficult from the first, for a blind person it is impossible to deal with.


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

I'm going to give that angle a go. If she's brain damaged though, what can they do for her? It's the good outcome I want, so if BD means meds, then I'll go for it all the way.


----------



## The Wild Bunch (Jul 16, 2014)

I don't know if they can medicate a BD cat unless they put her on downers to keep her calm- not ideal either


----------



## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

I've no experience of what can be done but I do hope that there will be a good outcome for all of you.


----------



## moggie14 (Sep 11, 2013)

Sounds a very tricky situation 
Does Sooki go out? I was wondering if a stables type of environment would suit her - she gets fed, warmth and human interaction but can do her own thing.


----------



## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

I do realise there are many of you more knowledgeable than me and wouldn't presume to tell you anything you might well know. It just seemed to me that her behaviour is so abnormal and extreme that there must be an underlying cause and_ possibly_ treatment. Obviously a job for the experts !
I really feel for you Carly , an awful upsetting situation.
My brother also had an unpredictable cat that savaged him whenever he tried to pet her, or bizarrely tried to get things out of his bag !He has mild autism and mental health problems and is not good at interpreting body language, but she just wasn't the right cat for him.Luckily a friend took her and is able to manage her moods.


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Carly, it may be that if D and you had a talk with the vet about Sookie and preferably took along a video to show the kind of behaviour Sookie often displays, the vet might feel Sookie has an anxiety disorder (whether due to a brain injury or due to behavioural problems) and may consider putting her Sookie on a tricyclic antidepressant such as amitryptiline (or similar) as a way of stabilising her moods. Heavy duty stuff medicine, and there can be unpleasant side effects, but for a cat who is so volatile and unpredictable it may be the answer. I think it could be justified as a treatment if she herself would benefit from it, as well as those she lives with.


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Sook is an indoor only mog, but in my opinion, is one of those rare birds that could very, very easily adjust to outdoor living!

I had "the chat" with him last night after he picked her up and, on catching just the mere sight of one of the other cats, she flew into a screaming, yowling rage. Just the noise was enough to trigger tears as I was feeling so on edge anyway, which naturally upset him. I explained that this was the noise I was getting when I was trying to get in and out of rooms etc and that I didn't know how to handle it.

We've now decided that when I'm in alone, Sook is to be shut in a room that I don't need to go into for any reason. It makes me feel incredibly bad for her as it means she's getting very little attention at all, and to be honest, I don't think this is any life for a cat. He did say that if it came to it, he wouldn't let his life or relationship be dictated by a cat, and to be honest, long-term, I suspect this is what will happen as, when it comes to kids, we have a huge issue.

He's very against drugging her understandably, as the side effects are so massive. I'll continue to chat to him and we'll explore all the options you guys have suggested. I've booked a vet appointment for next week for them all anyway as they need to be registered, so will chat to him about it then and see what we can come up with between us.


----------



## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

I am relieved that D is taking your fear seriously and wish you the very best in sorting the problem out. Maybe being an outdoor cat would suit Sooki - a better option than medication perhaps.


----------

