# 5 Month Old Sprocker Agression



## Matthew86 (Mar 12, 2016)

Evening,

Myself and my partner have a 5 month old sprocker spaniel called Ben. Over the past month or so he has been having aggressive bouts on a regular basis. They tend to happen most often in the evenings but can come out of nowhere during the day as well. They can be completely unprovoked (normally if one of us is sitting or doing something on the floor) but normally if he isn't getting his way (he's stolen a sock and we ask for it back!).

He will bark and growl, run around the room, he particularly likes to go under the armchair then growl and look at us with demon eyes and will nip as well. He does seem to know not to bite too hard but it still leaves a mark and we'd rather stop this behaviour now before anything bad happens.

Out and about he's a very good dog! Great meeting new people and children, great with other dogs too, he may bark from a far but as soon as he meets the dog he's very friendly and gentle. He's a very smart dog as well, learns tricks so quickly! His recall and retrieval skills are coming on nicely. He doesn't get anything without doing something first, he's alaways asked to sit or lie down before eating or going out. He gives up toys etc very well (when treats are involved). 

A normal weekday for Ben would consist of;
Us getting him up at 6:30, letting out for the toilet.
Breakfast then some play time.
20 minute off the lead run down farm tracks.
Drive in to town followed by 20 minute lead walk in to work.
In to work with myself where he'll sleep I'm his crate for most of the day, he'll be allowed out for a few bouts of playing and toilet breaks. Lunch served at 13:00.
20 minute walk back to the car followed by drive home.
20 minutes off the lead run on far tracks.
Dinner
Some training and play in the house until he starts going mad!
Several time outs until he's tired
Then he goes to bed around 22:30

We've tried various discipline techniques;
Ignoring (but he just nips your ankles til you can't take it)
Timeouts in his crate
Timeouts in a room without us
Tried scruffing a couple of times but just made things worse!
Latest one we've found his holding his mouth shut while holding him close to our chest to calm him down, doesn't seem to be working 

It just seems that if he's out of his crate, he needs constant interaction/stimulation otherwise he'll eventually lose it. Anyone's input would be greatly appreciated, we're not at our wits end and understand it may be a phase, we just want to make sure we're doing the right thing. We want a calm, happy, healthy puppy that grows in to a great dog!


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Possibly sounds like the beginning of resource guarding? sadly very common in Spaniel breeds. I think I would try and get an assessment from a qualified behaviourist and go from there.


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## Matthew86 (Mar 12, 2016)

Thanks for the quick reply labradrk. Just started reading a few things online about resource guarding, definitely sounds like it could be the culprit.

Have you mad much experience with this?


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## Jamesgoeswalkies (May 8, 2014)

Matthew86 said:


> Over the past month or so he has been having aggressive bouts on a regular basis. They tend to happen most often in the evenings but can come out of nowhere during the day as well. They can be completely unprovoked (normally if one of us is sitting or doing something on the floor) but normally if he isn't getting his way (he's stolen a sock and we ask for it back!).
> 
> He will bark and growl, run around the room, he particularly likes to go under the armchair then growl and look at us with demon eyes and will nip as well. He does seem to know not to bite too hard but it still leaves a mark and we'd rather stop this behaviour now before anything bad happens.


I would actually separate those two behaviours. The 'aggressive bouts' that 'often come in the evening' but can appear randomly I would suspect are simply the puppy zoomies. Some puppies look as if they are having a fit lol but it's quite normal. Excitable behaviours (like grabbing or nipping) are often hightened during the zoomies ....I just tend to say get out of the way and let it happen.

Then we look at stealing things. Stealing things is normal. Everything has to be mouth tested to a puppy. What we do next sets their behaviour. You talk about him 'not getting his way' and 'scruff shakes' and 'holding his mouth shut'. These 'remedies' *will *exacerbate the behaviour and will increase the probability of an aggressive response later on. He is only 5 months. We do have to be extremely careful that we do not inadvertently create resource guarding situations. Your puppy didn't know that sock was so valuable until you tried to get it back. You talk about devil eyes and nipping you ...that would suggest to me that he thinks you are challenging him for it!

As Labradrk says, resource guarding is something that behaviourists can advice you on and maybe a session may help (do you attend puppy classes?). In the meanwhile stop chasing him if he steals something especially when he's over excited ... who cares if he has a sock ......just ignore and walk away. And slowly extend the reward based training to retrieving all items ensuring that you are teaching him that handing over items is a positive experience.

I am sure you do but looking at his 'normal day' I can't see any time when he is actually being left on his own ...puppies do have to learn how to be left lest they get too demanding/develop separation anxiety.

Apart from that, welcome to the crazy world of puppydom 

J


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## Matthew86 (Mar 12, 2016)

Thanks for the reply J, interesting points.

If the aggressive bouts are just puppy zoomies, what do you find is the best way of dealing with them? If we put him in his crate he'll normally whine for 10 mins or so then give up and lie down. We're more than happy to do this, just don't want him to develop negative feelings about his crate.

Glad you disagree with the scruff shakes etc, there's so much contradicting advice online (as with anything online I guess!). They never seem to help and my girlfriend really doesn't like doing them. We'll stop them immediately.

We haven't attended puppy classes yet as he's out and about a lot, meeting new dogs and people and his training is generally going very well but will certainly look in to enrolling him.

We are working on him retreiving various toys by name, didn't think to add in the sock or anything else he steals! He gets so much enjoyment when he gets it right so will start to bring this in to his training. Last night I removed anything I thought he could try and steal and it did make for a calmer evening.

He does get left in a quiet room in the office in his crate between play time and lunch. One thing I did wonder is if he's perhaps over-tired? 

Thanks again.


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## CuddleMonster (Mar 9, 2016)

In this house, it is known as 'mad dog'. All my dogs have done it (and continue to do it in adulthood, though less extremely). I just let them get on with it unless they are likely to do damage. Bonnie's 'mad dog' is a bit too excitable in the house, even at aged 7, so I just shoo her out into the garden. She knows now that it's not allowed inside, so she goes to the door and bounces up and down, waiting to be let out! 

If you're worried about it getting out of control, you could try playing a game with him or doing some training just before he is likely to start, to use up his energy that way. Mine actually knows the phrase 'mad dog' now, so if she is building up to one and I want to get it out of the way, I just take her out and say the words - it usually triggers the craziness! 

Totally agree with Jamesgoeswalkies advice against physical punishment /restraint. I was advised to do this by an 'expert' when I had my first dog and it actually made her MORE aggressive. Fortunately, I went with my gut instinct and stopped following the trainer's advice before it was too late to undo the damage. Since then I have only used positive methods (reward good behaviour, ignore bad behaviour) If you decide to go to a training class or behaviourist, make sure you find one that uses only positive training methods. Avoid anyone advising smacking/shaking/jerking the lead to 'train' the dog.


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## Jamesgoeswalkies (May 8, 2014)

Matthew86 said:


> If the aggressive bouts are just puppy zoomies, what do you find is the best way of dealing with them? If we put him in his crate he'll normally whine for 10 mins or so then give up and lie down. We're more than happy to do this, just don't want him to develop negative feelings about his crate.


In regard to zoomies, have always tended to just 'let them happen' (my 'puppies' are now 18 months old and I have siblings so I had two sets of zoomies lol). Either I would get up and leave the puppy to it (tends to calm them quite quickly if you leave) or go outside and if pup follows I would leave them out there for a few minutes. If they wanted zoom - to run/bounce/grab/hit the settee - I used to say to anybody in the room just make yourself safe and get your feet off the floor! I watched the other dogs just get up and get out of the way (I have six dogs) so i copied what they did.

If you can predict the timing then as Cuddlemonster says, take puppy out for a play *before *the crazy time starts. I used to try that, too.

But tiredness does play a part in puppy behaviour so using the crate to enforce a little rest is fine ... so long as it's not used as a 'naughty step' (never be cross when you put them in the crate) then their association will be positive. Give him something to lick/chew/nibble when you pop him in the create maybe.

You sound as if you are doing great with socialisation and training .... classes are a great add on though and if you get a good (reward based) trainer they should be able to offer advice in any little problems that arise.

J


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

Matthew86 said:


> Evening,
> 
> Myself and my partner have a 5 month old sprocker spaniel called Ben. Over the past month or so he has been having aggressive bouts on a regular basis. They tend to happen most often in the evenings but can come out of nowhere during the day as well. They can be completely unprovoked (normally if one of us is sitting or doing something on the floor) but normally if he isn't getting his way (he's stolen a sock and we ask for it back!).
> 
> ...


Most sprockers are the result of crossing a working cocker spaniel and working springer spaniel rather than the pet/show types, is this true of your dog?

If so I am afraid they need far more mental stimulation than your average pet also a lot more training.

Please do not scruff your dog or hold his mouth shut at some point in time it is entirely forseeable that your dog will bite you.

Have you got some toys for him to chew as he may still be teething, although most dogs have all their teeth through by 6 months or so.

So items such as Gough Nuts (very tough), nylabones, raw bones, etc

Also have you considered environmental enrichment ie not feeding for free but giving his meals via a stuffed kong, or a dispenser such as a Kong Wobbler, Tug a Jug, Bob a Lot etc?

These dogs are very smart and like a job to do, is there a reputable trainer near you where you could have a couple of 1:1s ?


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## Matthew86 (Mar 12, 2016)

Thanks for the info Cuddlemonster, really appreciate it.

Thanks as well J, really useful to hear how other people deal with the 'zoomies'!

Ben is a cross between a working cocker and working springer Smokeybear and we have stopped scruffing him. Pretty sure his adult teeth are almost all in, he still likes a chew but we have toys/bone that he'll happily get to work on.

We are aware of the breed's need for high levels of mental stimulation. At the moment, during walks, we're trying to hide/throw his ball in to harder to find/get to places. At his current age this seems to be enough to keep him interested out and about. We're also constantly working on his recall out on walks and at home. At home we also try to do short bursts of training involving retrieving various toys/items by name, using hand signals/the whistle for sit and lie down as well introducing the fun, less useful tricks!

We'd love some more suggestions of activities/toys to keep his mind stimulated at home in between training. His Kong keeps him busy for a while but I think we're relying on it too much.

Thanks


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## Matthew86 (Mar 12, 2016)

Also Smokeybear, just had a look at the dispensers mentioned, they look great! Sure we'll order at least one of them!


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## Nettles (Mar 24, 2011)

The best thing (and I really do mean the BEST THING!) to tire my springer out is getting her to use her nose. We do lots of scent games and tracking on walks which she absolutely loves. I'll discretely drop something like an old glove or an old set of keys, walk on for a minute or so and then send her back to find it. In the house I'll hide a treat and let her sniff it out or hide a particular toy in the garden for her to search for. Works wonders, especially when you spot the crazy puppy zoomies starting


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

Matthew86 said:


> Thanks for the info Cuddlemonster, really appreciate it.
> 
> Thanks as well J, really useful to hear how other people deal with the 'zoomies'!
> 
> ...


It is simple to create an adrenaline junkie with this type of dog, what can be more beneficial is something that actually engages his brain without raising is arousal levels. Scentwork can be done indoors or out and no special equipment is really needed

*Scentwork Resources*

*Books*

Anne Lill Kvam The Canine Kingdom of Scent

Martina Nau Snooping Around

Pam McKinnon Talking Dogs Scentwork; The Manual

Roy Hunter Fun Nosework for Dogs

Vivian Theby Smellorama; nose games for dogs

*DVDs*

Scent 1 Pam Mackinnon

Scent 2 Pam Mackinnon

*Website*

http://talkingdogsscentwork.co.uk/Talking_Dogs_Scentwork/Welcome.html

http://suzanneclothier.com/the-articles/scent-games-educating-your-dogs-nose


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## Crispin Green (Mar 22, 2016)

Matthew86 - I am producing a film for BBC 3 following a leading animal behaviourist as they improve different dogs' behaviour. Might you be interested in talking to me (on the phone at this point) about your dog and its behaviour? If you are, please send me an email to [email protected]. Thank you.


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## Matthew86 (Mar 12, 2016)

Apologies for the lack of response guys, thank you for everyone's input.

We've actually seen a great improvement in Ben's behaviour since making a few suggested changes so thank you to everyone who's replied on this thread.

We're using a couple of different food dispensers at meal times including the tug-a-jug. This has turned a 10 minute feed in to an hour long game!

We're including scent based games in the evening, mainly hiding treats around the house which he loves. We're slowly working through the various games described by Suzanne Clothier and starting to introduce these out on walks too.

We had a dog walker take him out this week on a pack walk which seemed to do wonders for him, he was perfect that night so think we might do this once and week. We're also thinking about taking him to a junior dog class which starts in May.

We're continuing his training as well as slowly getting him used to the idea that dropping and leaving something he as stolen to be a good thing! This started by moving anything he might steal out of reach initially.

We still get the odd biting bout but we have found a couple of his baby teeth recently so think he is still teething. His growling and barking at us is almost non existent now as well! This does still seem to be most prominent around 20:30, however we'll normally distract him with some scent work and then put him to bed. He'll wriggle about for a bit and then fall fast asleep right through to 6:30 in the morn.

Hopefully by continuing and building on the work above we're on the straight and narrow to a pretty darn good dog! Can't thank everyone enough for their input and we'll post back on here with his progress should anyone stumble across this thread looking for some help!

Matthew


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## MiffyMoo (Sep 15, 2015)

Matthew86 said:


> Apologies for the lack of response guys, thank you for everyone's input.
> 
> We've actually seen a great improvement in Ben's behaviour since making a few suggested changes so thank you to everyone who's replied on this thread.
> 
> ...


That's fabulous! Nothing beats the feeling when you know that your dog is happy and all the work you're putting in is helping


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