# Urgent advice on ham bone required



## Xenophya (Sep 25, 2011)

Hello,

I recently bought an 'Armitage Good Boy Ham Bone (325g)' from Sainsburys like this Armitage Good Boy Ham Bone (325g) in Sainsbury's | mySupermarket For our 11 year Gsd collie cross. He was very enthusiastic and ate the majority of it in around 30mins. I wasn't sure if this was good (i didn't expect him to eat the bone i thought he'd just chew on it) so I googled and found some horror stories from the united states where dogs eating ham bones have died after getting bone splinters lodged in their digestive tract. Consumer complaints about Dynamic Pet Products

As this is being sold in a major super market I assumed it would be fine but it turns out the owners in these cases in the states bought the dynamic pet bone from walmart.

I am obviously now extremely concerned that this might cause our dog health problems. Is he potentially at risk and if so is there anything we can do other than wait to see if he displays any symptoms?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Cheers,
Mark.


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## Jasper's Bloke (Oct 30, 2009)

When did he eat the bone? Has he eaten bones before?

These bones are boiled and sterilised until they are relatively soft, then chemical flavours and preservatives are added. It is possible that if the bone is brittle enough it could shatter and cause problems but probably the greater risk to your dogs health is the amount and type of additives used, especially if they are fed regularly. We are not just talking blue smartie e-numbers that send your dog hyper here, we are talking things like formaldehyde and known carcinogens. It is amazing what you can put into food that is not for human consumption.

They are certainly not the ideal treat for a dog but as well as the horror stories that you hear, you also have to remember that many other dogs eat them regularly with no problems, after all, dogs are designed to eat and digest bones. Keep a close eye on your dog for the next few days and if you are at all concerned, get him vet checked.

The very best treat you can give your dog is a fresh meaty bone straight from the butcher, and always, always, always fed raw. Almost anything will do as long as you avoid the weight bearing bones (hips/thigh inc knuckle bone) of larger animals like pigs or cows, these bones are so strong and dense that they have been known to break teeth, even raw. Cooked bones dry out and become brittle, so they shatter and leave sharp edges. Raw bones break more cleanly and are softer and easier to digest. Try it yourself next time you cook chicken, keep one drumstick raw and cook the other as normal, then strip the meat off them both and compare the two. Break or smash the bones and you will see an incredible difference, then give the raw drumstick to your dog.


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## Goblin (Jun 21, 2011)

Will also say you should try to avoid leg bones of large herbivores such as cattle. They are known to break dog's teeth as they are dense despite being sold frequently as "recreational bones".


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## Jasper's Bloke (Oct 30, 2009)

Also don't trust a butcher to know what bones your dog can and can't eat. Many of the ones that I have spoken to either refuse to give bones at all or give you unsuitably large/hard ones. The good news though is that many butchers give them away for free.

Anything from chicken or other fowl is fine (bird bones are naturally less dense) as are things like ribs or smaller necks like lamb. As well as being extremely nutritious, raw bones help to keep teeth clean and they also satisfy every dogs hard wired desire to chew.


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## Xenophya (Sep 25, 2011)

Hello,

Thanks so much for the speedy replies. Duke (my dog) is my first dog. He is an 11 year old rescue dog. We have only had him 2 weeks and this is the first bone we have given him. As I said previously I expected him to chew on it not devour it. 

He is a lovely old boy we wanted to give a home to in his Elder years. He has some separation anxiety issues which don't cause us too many issues as he comes to work with me during the day. We do want to work on it though so we can pop out to the shops every now and then and not worry about leaving him in the house alone for an hour. We got the bone as a distraction whilst we practiced leaving the house over increasing time lengths. It worked from that point of view. It appears he chewed it up well, he has shown no symptoms in the last 5 hours. I took him for a walk and he did his business which seems pretty normal.

Thanks for the reassurance it will help me sleep a little better slough I will still check on him part way through the night.

Cheers 
Mark.


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## Goblin (Jun 21, 2011)

Can I recommend a http://www.amazon.co.uk/Extreme-Kon...?s=pet-supplies&ie=UTF8&qid=1316995241&sr=1-1 (probably able to get it cheaper but I can't advise as I don't live in the UK). You can fill them with treats/paste and they can be played with for hours without being destroyed.


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## babycham2002 (Oct 18, 2009)

Youve already recieved great advise
Just wanted to congratualte you on your new addition, so lovely to give an oldie a forever home
and welcome to the forum 




Vicki


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## Jasper's Bloke (Oct 30, 2009)

Xenophya said:


> Hello,
> 
> Thanks so much for the speedy replies. Duke (my dog) is my first dog. He is an 11 year old rescue dog. We have only had him 2 weeks and this is the first bone we have given him. As I said previously I expected him to chew on it not devour it.


I am sure the old boy will be fine and that he is loving his new home. How are his teeth? If they are looking brown then a lamb rib every couple of days will have them sparkling in no time.


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## Marley boy (Sep 6, 2010)

just keep an eye out on him. My Marley had these type of bones all the time before i joined this forum and found out they were unsafe. Marley is none the worse for it so dont worry your self too much.


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## Manoy Moneelil (Sep 1, 2011)

Raw bones good.

Cooked bones bad.​
Many dogs find the long bones (limbs) of pigs hard to eat. I would say it's not a beginner's bone. My dogs can make most of a femur disappear, they leave just the most solid part.

You might print the image below and take to your butcher to get the right bones. (Also see what they get - some bones will be striped further up the processing chain.) We get the pelvis (hips) and shoulder bones. Also trotters and tails are great.










IME supermarkets and pet shops sell cooked pig femurs as the 'classic' dogs bone. These are no good for dogs - unless you break them open and extract the marrow. Many pet shops buy in bulk from wholesalers that import the bones from South America.

A cooked bone is stronger than a dog's tooth, a keen dog can exert enough pressure via their jaw muscle and the bone to break the weakest link - doggie dentists are expensive. Raw bones are cheap.

A cooked bone can not be fully digested within a dog's stomach and risks being passed whole with the rough/sharp edges into the intestine - this can lead to blockages and an impacted gut - doggie operations are expensive. raw bones are cheap.

Personally I would never feed such a shop bought cook bone, £2 a bone :scared:​
The difference between a raw and cooked bone is *not that it dries out*, but the structure changes there is a chemical change facilitated by heating much like the chemical change in concrete as it cures it becomes hot during the setting process as a result of the chemical change - this is why concrete can set/cure underwater - this has been known since the Roman period.

The *only* reason that shops sell cooked bones is because of the shelf life. (Oh! and to screw you for £2 profit.)


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## lisaloo1 (Aug 8, 2011)

what are the best bones to get, i get buddy bones from the butchers, as i read here cooked ones are not good, so what animal are the best coming from, also i was always told not to give dogs chicken bones, but i see on here that its ok??
thanx


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## wyntersmum (Jul 31, 2011)

lisaloo1 said:


> what are the best bones to get, i get buddy bones from the butchers, as i read here cooked ones are not good, so what animal are the best coming from, also i was always told not to give dogs chicken bones, but i see on here that its ok??
> thanx


im feeding my puppy raw at the min. (in the prosess of transfering him)
chicken bones are ok as long as there raw. 
at first i smashed them up a bit with a hammer and held it with a tea towel but now i just hold it and let him get on with it.
most bones are ok as long as there raw. its the cooked bones that splinter as they dry out


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## Manoy Moneelil (Sep 1, 2011)

Sorry for the chity formatting of this post - the large image distorts the text.

Start on raw chicken necks, the bones and the connective tissue gives the molars, premolars and incisors a work out. As other threads in this forum suggest some people have problems with chicken wings as the dog swallows them without chewing enough. If you worry about this use the back of a large (+10" chef's knife) to break the wing's long bones.

If you have access to chicken processors you can get a whole carcass; this is the body complete with legs,wings, breast and head removed. About 13-15" long and provides plenty to eat and a young rottie to hold onto while chewing. If offered a bite sized lump it will be gone in one.

Try a full length pork rib, most butchers take the full rib cage (one side) and cut in half to make is suitable for domestic use. If you can get the full length from back bone to end it can be served cut into three rib sections, again a big enough lump to hold on to and work those teeth.

If you compare a half pig vs what is sold as a domestic rack of ribs you will see that a lot of the animal is missing. The price you pay for the ribs as cut for human food carries a lot of the production and processing costs of the rest of those parts of that cut around that prize part, which would otherwise often be binned. (I don't mean the loin or chops etc - you really need to see the carcass cut up into parts to see what bits are low grade in terms of human use.) Pigs sell for about £1-£1.50/Kg live weight, at each step in the processing stage from pen to plate adds a percentage from £7/Kg for simple bacon to £150/Kg for a high quality Spanish cured ham (Harrods price).

Ideally to see what's available locally talk to the butcher (not supermarket person who just unpacks chilled boxes on the meat counter). Butchers are in business so watch the per Kg cost of the trimmed for human meals vs the lower cost for a cut that includes the less desirable back bone sections.

Just look at the ribs and the structure at either end of the rib compared to the second image. 









*vs​*


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## Goblin (Jun 21, 2011)

Lisaloo1, I would recommend you browse through the following thread: http://www.petforums.co.uk/dog-health-nutrition/111437-raw-feeding-everything-you-need-know.html Whilst many people give occasional bones it's worth knowing about those who feed raw full time and their methodologies. It's a large thread but will answer many questions you may have. Don't feel afraid to ask questions as there are many people here experienced with feeding raw meaty bones "full" or "part" time.


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## Jasper's Bloke (Oct 30, 2009)

lisaloo1 said:


> what are the best bones to get, i get buddy bones from the butchers, as i read here cooked ones are not good, so what animal are the best coming from, also i was always told not to give dogs chicken bones, but i see on here that its ok??
> thanx


As long as you avoid large weight bearing bones then anything that is an appropriate size for your dog should be fine. By appropriate size I mean something that is big enough that it has to be chewed before it can be swallowed. I know it might sound odd but you also have to bear in mind that most dogs, especially if they have never had a bone before, will need to learn how to chew them. Presenting your dog with a chicken wing can lead to some quite humorous looks as if to say 'What am I supposed to do with that?' but after licking at it for a while, curiosity normally gets the better of them and nature takes over.


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