# Loud bang/explosion in Manchester



## PawsOnMe (Nov 1, 2012)

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...grande-concert-england?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

Hoping it's just a speaker blown up and not a terror attack.

Got a few friends at the concert so just waiting to hear from them now


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

Don't think it was in the auditorium, waiting on details myself.


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## kimthecat (Aug 11, 2009)

Hope your friends are ok .

ETA I just saw about this on the BBC news and they think people were hurt in the panic to get to the exits .


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

No indication so far of any of the audience harmed, just frightened. I don't think you should worry.


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## PawsOnMe (Nov 1, 2012)

Oh god a number of comfirmed fatalities the police have just said. My stomach has just dropped.


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## kimthecat (Aug 11, 2009)

Oh No !


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

Just had that message - not good.


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## Guest (May 22, 2017)

People are reporting that one of the large balloons that were full of gas exploded and there was a stampede. That wouldn't explain why the train station was closed though.


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## kimthecat (Aug 11, 2009)

perhaps closing the station as a precaution?


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

kimthecat said:


> perhaps closing the station as a precaution


I think arena and station are counted as one venue for dealing with any incident like this.


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

There are a number of fatalities at Manchester Arena after explosions.


















http://www.manchestereveningnews.co...ter-arena-explosion-evacuated-ariana-13075807


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## PawsOnMe (Nov 1, 2012)

One of my friends has checked in as safe and on her way home. She said there were people receiving cpr covered in blood and that there was a horrific smell.


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

Greater Manchester Police said there has been a number of fatalities.


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

havoc said:


> I think arena and station are counted as one venue for dealing with any incident like this.


You are correct.
Manchester Arena is above Manchester Victoria Station so it is one venue.


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## PawsOnMe (Nov 1, 2012)

Been comfirmed as an explosion in the foyer area of the arena.


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

Armed police have now lined the streets around the arena and officers are moving members of the public away.


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

G M Police @gmpolice
Police statement on incident at Manchester Arena









https://twitter.com/gmpolice?ref_sr...lities-in-manchester-arena-explosion-10889460


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

PawsOnMe said:


> Been comfirmed as an explosion in the foyer area of the arena


Do you have a source for that - it isn't that I don't believe you but some eye witness reports are say it happened in tiered seats stage right. Other footage gives the impression of people running from back to front of the arena which would tie in with the foyer.


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## PawsOnMe (Nov 1, 2012)

havoc said:


> Do you have a source for that - it isn't that I don't believe you but some eye witness reports are say it happened in tiered seats stage right. Other footage gives the impression of people running from back to front of the arena which would tie in with the foyer.


I'm just watching it on sky news and reading on different news pages. Not sure where I read it sorry.


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## PawsOnMe (Nov 1, 2012)

PawsOnMe said:


> I'm just watching it on sky news and reading on different news pages. Not sure where I read it sorry.


On my post I meant confirmed explosion and should have put suspected in foyer as i dont think thays been confimed. Sorry about that


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## Elles (Aug 15, 2011)

Oh crap, it's sounding quite bad. I hope it isn't as bad as they're saying and people are ok.


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

Just this moment got confirmation those I know are safe. One of them is still on site helping as she's a nurse.


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## Guest (May 23, 2017)

Oh no, 19 confirmed dead according to the news here. 
How awful....


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## Mercgirl (Feb 18, 2017)

The BBC now reporting it is a suspected terror attack. 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-40007886


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## Lucy Haygarth (May 21, 2017)

Claimed by ISIS before the attack apparently


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Just got in from work and only just seeing the news. Absolutely shocking & very frightening too. Suspected suicide bomber. The amount of young lives in the arena somehow makes it even more brutal and devastating.

I know we can't live in fear of these kind of incidents, but it really does make you think just where is safe these days.....


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## tantrumbean (Aug 23, 2011)

Dogloverlou said:


> Just got in from work and only just seeing the news. Absolutely shocking & very frightening too. Suspected suicide bomber. The amount of young lives in the arena somehow makes it even more brutal and devastating.
> 
> I know we can't live in fear of these kind of incidents, but it really does make you think just where is safe these days.....


I know what you mean, anywhere with crowds is starting to feel scary these days. Sounds like there were 2 suicide bombers according to the latest news. Suppose in the greater scheme of things, it's a miracle that not more people got killed or injured, considering there were apparently 20,000 people in the arena, but that doesn't help those who lost loved ones...


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

I've always thought the arena was overly strict about the no pass out rule but it makes such sense now. It would have been so much worse if someone got an explosive device into the arena.


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## noushka05 (Mar 28, 2008)

OMG I've just seen the news


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## Creativecat (Dec 20, 2016)

Such terrible news . I watched as it unfolded over night . Such a sad day 
On such a beautiful breaking morning . God bless Manchester 
Hopes and prayers for all the people caught up in this terrible atrocity


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

Just woke up to this, just awful, there aren't words.

@PawsOnMe I hope your friends are safe x


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## Charity (Apr 17, 2013)

We have family in Manchester. Heartfelt condolences to all involved and those who have lost loved ones. A lovely sunny day has turned into a very dark one.


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## picaresque (Jun 25, 2009)

I just can't believe this keeps happening. They say there are children among the dead.


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## noushka05 (Mar 28, 2008)

On twitter there are appeals for help to locate missing people. How dreadful.


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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

I just can't understand the mindset that would allow you to target young people having fun at a pop concert.

It's lower than low. Despicable cowards.


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## Guest (May 23, 2017)

Those poor people who just wanted to go to a gig. All over twitter, the racists are already trying to make it political and not even giving families time to grieve and recover.


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

So heartbreaking  they were just kids and adults at a music concert


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

Just seen the update on Sky News 22 dead 59 injured after a lone attacker detonated an improvised device in Manchester Arena.

It has been confirmed by Greater Manchester Police and Andy Burnham it was a suicide attack.

My thoughts are with everyone caught up in this incident.


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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

stockwellcat said:


> Just seen the update on Sky News 22 dead 59 injured after a lone attacker detonated an improvised device in Manchester Arena.


Was he actually in the arena? If so, their security has something to be desired. Last time I went there (admittedly to a boxing match so a different demographic) they were getting people to empty handbags and had sniffer dogs.


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

MilleD said:


> Was he actually in the arena? If so, their security has something to be desired. Last time I went there (admittedly to a boxing match so a different demographic) they were getting people to empty handbags and had sniffer dogs.


It was the foyer area which is the entrance/exit to the arena as thousands of people were leaving the concert. The foyer area is a public area so there is no security checks in this area.


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## Dr Pepper (Jan 17, 2017)

noushka05 said:


> On twitter there are appeals for help to locate missing people. How dreadful.


Just got Good Morning Britain on and some poor mother appealing for anyone who knows where here 15 year old daughter is who was at the concert and hasn't come home yet. Heartbreaking, I'm not usually overly emotional but it brought a tear to my eye.


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## Guest (May 23, 2017)

I follow manchester arena on twitter and they have confirmed in their words there was an incident last night at manchester arena, the incident happened as people were leaving an Ariana show, it happened outside in a public space. Tragic.


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## Serenity123 (May 24, 2016)

So heartbreaking, my heart goes out to everyone affected by this attack and RIP to all those who sadly lost their lives


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## Phoenix Rising (Jan 25, 2016)

OMG! I've only just seen this news! Latest is showing 22 dead and 59 injured. Do you think future concerts will be affected? A friend has tickets booked for the Celine Dion concert in June for her birthday. I'm meant to be one of the people going, but there's no way I want to go now, but it awful for friend if concerts are still running but no-one now wants to go with her because of this? Do you think they'll refund her so we can all go do something else instead together?


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## Dr Pepper (Jan 17, 2017)

Phoenix Rising said:


> OMG! I've only just seen this news! Do you think future concerts will be affected? A friend has tickets booked for the Celine Dion concert in June for her birthday. I'm meant to be one of the people going, but there's no way I want to go now, but it awful for friend if concerts are still running but no-one now wants to go with her because of this? Do you think they'll refund her so we can all go do something else instead together?


Seariously


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

Phoenix Rising said:


> OMG! I've only just seen this news! Latest is showing 22 dead and 59 injured. Do you think future concerts will be affected? A friend has tickets booked for the Celine Dion concert in June for her birthday. I'm meant to be one of the people going, but there's no way I want to go now, but it awful for friend if concerts are still running but no-one now wants to go with her because of this? Do you think they'll refund her so we can all go do something else instead together?


Congrats for being, ignorant, selfish and insensitive.


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

Phoenix Rising said:


> Do you think they'll refund her so we can all go do something else instead together?


No - but you can hope she'll cancel I suppose.


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

MilleD said:


> Was he actually in the arena? If so, their security has something to be desired. Last time I went there (admittedly to a boxing match so a different demographic) they were getting people to empty handbags and had sniffer dogs


It wasn't in the arena. For anyone who doesn't know the layout it was an area that's the equivalent of just outside the turnstiles at a football stadium. Bags are checked going in and once you're in - you're in. There are no pass-outs, if you leave you can't go back in.


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## Guest (May 23, 2017)

havoc said:


> It wasn't in the arena. For anyone who doesn't know the layout it was an area that's the equivalent of just outside the turnstiles at a football stadium. Bags are checked going in and once you're in - you're in. There are no pass-outs, if you leave you can't go back in.


Manchester arena themselves said on twitter it happened outside in a public space. As you say they check bags so the bomber knew not to try taking the bomb inside.


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## Phoenix Rising (Jan 25, 2016)

Nonnie said:


> Congrats for being, ignorant, selfish and insensitive.


Who in their right mind would want to go somewhere after something like this had happened there! I've literally just woke up and seen this all over the news. Yes it terrible for all those already been killed and injured, but then I realised it's somewhere that someone is expecting me to go to at the end of next month! If it was me with the tickets I'd say it was cancelled and wouldn't expect anyone to risk to their lives to go to a concert with me!

What's selfish is the suicide bomber who went in there with the intention to kill or injure as many other people as he could when he decided to take his own life!


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## Guest (May 23, 2017)

Phoenix Rising said:


> Who in their right mind would want to go somewhere after something like this had happened there! I've literally just woke up and seen this all over the news. Yes it terrible for all those already been killed and injured, but then I realised it's somewhere that someone is expecting me to go to at the end of next month! If it was me with the tickets I'd say it was cancelled and wouldn't expect anyone to risk to their lives to go to a concert with me!
> 
> What's selfish is the suicide bomber who went in there with the intention to kill or injure as many other people as he could when he decided to take his own life!


The bomber was very selfish. Some sick people in this world.


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## Creativecat (Dec 20, 2016)

I'm wondering now if this piece of s**t had flown in to do this atrocity or home grown . I guess now is the time to grieve and not point fingers so i apologise . But I'm just trying to get my head around this mess that is becoming the norm now . No dought we will know more as the day goes on :0(


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## Satori (Apr 7, 2013)

Phoenix Rising said:


> Who in their right mind would want to go somewhere after something like this had happened there! I've literally just woke up and seen this all over the news. Yes it terrible for all those already been killed and injured, but then I realised it's somewhere that someone is expecting me to go to at the end of next month! If it was me with the tickets I'd say it was cancelled and wouldn't expect anyone to risk to their lives to go to a concert with me!
> 
> What's selfish is the suicide bomber who went in there with the intention to kill or injure as many other people as he could when he decided to take his own life!


I would have the exact opposite reaction and would not hesitate for a second to go to your concert. It is likely to be the safest venue ever for the foreseeable future. One assumes, after a security review, they will push the security out to the public space perimeters for big events or lock down the public spaces after start time depending on the logistics. We are rather good at securing venues in this country but the terrorists obviously look for loopholes. I assume that venue will only re-open after a through security review. You would be thousands of times more likely to be killed in a rta on the way to the venue that at the venue by a terrorist.

ETA: I didn't really check the statistics so last sentence is probably an exaggeration but you get the point.


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## Laney_Lemons (Mar 23, 2016)

Very very sad new this morning  

teenagers and adults just going to a concert and some not coming home.. what is the world coming to?!


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

So very sad. So many are still missing, their parents must be going out of their minds with worry


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## Mercgirl (Feb 18, 2017)

I am so sad and angry this morning. I didn't sleep well last night, thinking about all the families who would be waiting in vain for their loved ones to come home. These terrorists are the lowest of the low. These were just ordinary adults and children, enjoying an evening, and now 22 of them are dead and many others will have had their lives changed for ever.


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## Matrod (Dec 22, 2014)

Just horrendous


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

Satori said:


> I would have the exact opposite reaction and would not hesitate for a second to go to your concert. It is likely to be the safest venue ever for the foreseeable future. One assumes, after a security review, they will push the security out to the public space perimeters for big events or lock down the public spaces after start time depending on the logistics. We are rather good at securing venues in this country but the terrorists obviously look for loopholes. I assume that venue will only re-open after a through security review. You would be thousands of times more likely to be killed in a rta on the way to the venue that at the venue by a terrorist.
> 
> ETA: I didn't really check the statistics so last sentence is probably an exaggeration but you get the point.


This in buckets.

I travelled (for the first time in my life) to the USA just 3 weeks after 9/11. Alone.

Tbh, i had never felt more safe in my life. High security; armed officers EVERYWHERE, high military presence on the US side.

I find it sad that peoples first thoughts when something like this happen is their own enjoyment, or worse, finances.

The mother of this child, doesnt even know if she is dead or alive http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-40010366

Who really gives a toss about upcoming concerts or if they can get a refund? Selfish, self-centred people i guess.


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## Odin_cat (Mar 14, 2017)

Such a terrible thing to happen at an event that should be so happy. Thoughts with the families and hope that as many as possible are reunited.


Phoenix Rising said:


> Who in their right mind would want to go somewhere after something like this had happened there! I've literally just woke up and seen this all over the news. Yes it terrible for all those already been killed and injured, but then I realised it's somewhere that someone is expecting me to go to at the end of next month! If it was me with the tickets I'd say it was cancelled and wouldn't expect anyone to risk to their lives to go to a concert with me!
> 
> What's selfish is the suicide bomber who went in there with the intention to kill or injure as many other people as he could when he decided to take his own life!


I'm sorry but now really isn't the time to worry about a concert happening next month. So what if you lose £50? Some people have lost their children.

Personally, I refuse to live in fear. The pathetic terrorists want us to be scared, I won't give them that satisfaction.


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## PetloverJo (Nov 4, 2011)

Just reading Sky news about the horrendous selfish act. On Facebook so many children missing and mothers sharing their picture to find them. Then I come across this post by Miley Cyrus which really got my goat.
The bit about so so sorry you had to be part of this tragic event really really annoyed me is it just me or do you think the same.

RIP to all those that died at this event. Thinking of all those affected personally by this tragic event.


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

PetloverJo said:


> Just reading Sky news about the horrendous selfish act. On Facebook so many children missing and mothers sharing their picture to find them. Then I come across this post by Miley Cyrus which really got my goat.
> The bit about so so sorry you had to be part of this tragic event really really annoyed me is it just me or do you think the same.
> 
> RIP to all those that died at this event. Thinking of all those affected personally by this tragic event.
> ...


Her friend was part of a tragic and horrific event.

Those people were there BECAUSE of her. I think giving her sympathy and support is very much the right thing to do. Cant imagine how she must be feeling.

Celebs are still allowed to feel, and be offered words of comfort, especially from their friends are they not?


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## PetloverJo (Nov 4, 2011)

Nonnie said:


> Her friend was part of a tragic and horrific event.
> 
> Those people were there BECAUSE of her. I think giving her sympathy and support is very much the right thing to do. Cant imagine how she must be feeling.
> 
> Celebs are still allowed to feel, and be offered words of comfort, especially from their friends are they not?


Depends which celeb it is I suppose.


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## Nagini (Jan 13, 2014)

Phoenix Rising said:


> OMG! I've only just seen this news! Latest is showing 22 dead and 59 injured. Do you think future concerts will be affected? A friend has tickets booked for the Celine Dion concert in June for her birthday. I'm meant to be one of the people going, but there's no way I want to go now, but it awful for friend if concerts are still running but no-one now wants to go with her because of this? Do you think they'll refund her so we can all go do something else instead together?


does it really matter? i wouldn't even be bothered if the concert i am attending on saturday evening was cancelled and no refund was forthcoming, or offered, i truely believe lots of people would understand in this instance. it's just money that was spent months ago and nothing in comparision to those that are suffering this morning


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## Pappychi (Aug 12, 2015)

They targeted children...

That's all I've got in my brain at the minute. Young teenagers. Children.


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

There is a candle light vigil tonight at Albert Square. 

I will be attending as I am currently in Lancaster with my dad so will travel down for this vigil.


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## PawsOnMe (Nov 1, 2012)

It's all just so awful  I'm thankful my friends are all safe and back home. 

I can't stop thinking about all those still separated from their family not knowing if they're safe yet and all those who have died or been injured by this attack. It's horrific.


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## Jesthar (May 16, 2011)

PetloverJo said:


> Just reading Sky news about the horrendous selfish act. On Facebook so many children missing and mothers sharing their picture to find them. Then I come across this post by Miley Cyrus which really got my goat.
> *The bit about so so sorry you had to be part of this tragic event really really annoyed me is it just me or do you think the same*.
> 
> RIP to all those that died at this event. Thinking of all those affected personally by this tragic event.]


Actually, I feel sorry for Arianna too. Can't say I know her by anything other than name, but if I were the reason many thousands of people had come together when they were targetted for a terrorist attack, I suspect at this point I'd probably be feeling personally responsible for every single death and injury.


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## Phoenix Rising (Jan 25, 2016)

Nagini said:


> does it really matter? i wouldn't even be bothered if the concert i am attending on saturday evening was cancelled and no refund was forthcoming, or offered, i truely believe lots of people would understand in this instance. it's just money that was spent months ago and nothing in comparision to those that are suffering this morning


I'm not bothered about it being cancelled and whether money is refunded! More that if it's NOT cancelled that I would still be expected to be going. It's terrible for the people who were there yesterday when it happened but I don't want to be one of the next however many dead if it was targeted again and that happened to be one the night I was supposed to be there. I'd rather cut my losses regarding costs of tickets already paid for there and just not go, even if concerts are back on by then.

I'm just a very nervous person in crowded places anyway, so wasn't that thrilled that my friend chose a packed concert for her birthday celebrations anyway, but was willing to endure it. Expecting me to go somewhere I now see as 'dangerous' to go to is something else entirely. She may as well be saying I want you to join me standing on a cliff edge in an an hurricane, you might be lucky and not get injured or killed or your life might end that day!

I do feel for those that are suffering and the thought these bombers can be anywhere busy like arenas, shopping centre's (I had a lucky escape many years ago when the Arndale shopping centre was bombed) is terrifying enough, without having to worry about whether they're going to be there on the day I'm meant to be there...sorry if that sounds selfish.... and I never went back to Arndale Shopping Centre ever after that incident either.


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## Guest (May 23, 2017)

Phoenix Rising said:


> I'm not bothered about it being cancelled and whether money is refunded! More that if it's NOT cancelled that I would still be expected to be going. It's terrible for the people who were there yesterday when it happened but I don't want to be one of the next however many dead if it was targeted again and that happened to be one the night I was supposed to be there. I'd rather cut my losses regarding costs of tickets already paid for there and just not go, even if concerts are back on by then.
> 
> I'm just a very nervous person in crowded places anyway, so wasn't that thrilled that my friend chose a packed concert for her birthday celebrations anyway, but was willing to endure it. Expecting me to go somewhere I now see as 'dangerous' to go to is something else entirely. She may as well be saying I want you to join me standing on a cliff edge in an an hurricane, you might be lucky and not get injured or killed or your life might end that day!
> 
> I do feel for those that are suffering and the thought these bombers can be anywhere busy like arenas, shopping centre's (I had a lucky escape many years ago when the Arndale shopping centre was bombed) is terrifying enough, without having to worry about whether they're going to be there on the day I'm meant to be there...sorry if that sounds selfish.... and I never went back to Arndale Shopping Centre ever after that incident either.


Just put the shovel down, really.

22 young people lost their lives last night. This isn't about you, it's about the lives lost and forever changed by this attack


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## Nagini (Jan 13, 2014)

Phoenix Rising said:


> I'm not bothered about it being cancelled and whether money is refunded! More that if it's NOT cancelled that I would still be expected to be going. It's terrible for the people who were there yesterday when it happened but I don't want to be one of the next however many dead if it was targeted again and that happened to be one the night I was supposed to be there. I'd rather cut my losses regarding costs of tickets already paid for there and just not go, even if concerts are back on by then.
> 
> I'm just a very nervous person in crowded places anyway, so wasn't that thrilled that my friend chose a packed concert for her birthday celebrations anyway, but was willing to endure it. Expecting me to go somewhere I now see as 'dangerous' to go to is something else entirely. She may as well be saying I want you to join me standing on a cliff edge in an an hurricane, you might be lucky and not get injured or killed or your life might end that day!
> 
> I do feel for those that are suffering and the thought these bombers can be anywhere busy like arenas, shopping centre's (I had a lucky escape many years ago when the Arndale shopping centre was bombed) is terrifying enough, without having to worry about whether they're going to be there on the day I'm meant to be there...sorry if that sounds selfish.... and I never went back to Arndale Shopping Centre ever after that incident either.


you can't live your life worrying what may or may not happen, i could get hit by a bus today, tomorrow, next week, next year etc 
this is how terrorists would like you to feel, and if you really feel like that they've 'won' and you'd never leave the house again.


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## Honeys mum (Jan 11, 2013)

This is terrible,my heart goes out to all those families involved, so tragic. What scumbags would to this ,knowing there would be lots of children there.
Those poor children and everyone else there must have been terrified.

My grandaugther goes to some of those concerts. But my son thank goodness won't take her to any week night ones because of school the next day, as she is only 15yrs old.


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## Mercgirl (Feb 18, 2017)

It's just been reported that the police believe they know the identity of the suicide bomber, but cannot yet confirm.

The first victim has also been named.


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## Mercgirl (Feb 18, 2017)

The Arndale centre is now being evacuated.


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## Guest (May 23, 2017)

Mercgirl said:


> The Arndale centre is now being evacuated.


Just been reading about that. Conflicting reports about a man with suspicious package.


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

There is a lot of people on social media changing their photos to include icons or hearts for Manchester. Whilst people are still missing (my friend is looking for his daughter), this image below could be just as, if not, more useful. It is issued by Greater Manchester police and contains all the contact details. Manchester City's Ethihad stadium Gate 11 is the coordination point for the police.


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## LinznMilly (Jun 24, 2011)

Phoenix Rising said:


> Who in their right mind would want to go somewhere after something like this had happened there! I've literally just woke up and seen this all over the news. Yes it terrible for all those already been killed and injured, but then I realised it's somewhere that someone is expecting me to go to at the end of next month! If it was me with the tickets I'd say it was cancelled and wouldn't expect anyone to risk to their lives to go to a concert with me!
> 
> What's selfish is the suicide bomber who went in there with the intention to kill or injure as many other people as he could when he decided to take his own life!


That the suicide bomber decided to take 22 young, innocent lives with him to the Great Beyond doesn't make your comments any less selfish and thoughtless. Really? To think about money and a concert that's more than a month away .... and to later try to justify this because you're "a very nervous person in crowds, anyway"?

You don't want to go to the Celine Dion concert next month? Fine. Make your excuses to your friend. Tell her, if you so wish, that it's because of what happened yesterday. But you know something? 81 families would give _anything_ to be in your situation right about now.



Nonnie said:


> This in buckets.
> 
> I travelled (for the first time in my life) to the USA just 3 weeks after 9/11. Alone.
> 
> ...


South Shields (Chloe and Liam) is pretty close to where I live. Hope they're safe and well and their families hear from them soon.


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

Phoenix Rising said:


> I'm not bothered about it being cancelled and whether money is refunded! More that if it's NOT cancelled that I would still be expected to be going. It's terrible for the people who were there yesterday when it happened but I don't want to be one of the next however many dead if it was targeted again and that happened to be one the night I was supposed to be there. I'd rather cut my losses regarding costs of tickets already paid for there and just not go, even if concerts are back on by then.
> 
> I'm just a very nervous person in crowded places anyway, so wasn't that thrilled that my friend chose a packed concert for her birthday celebrations anyway, but was willing to endure it. Expecting me to go somewhere I now see as 'dangerous' to go to is something else entirely. She may as well be saying I want you to join me standing on a cliff edge in an an hurricane, you might be lucky and not get injured or killed or your life might end that day!
> 
> I do feel for those that are suffering and the thought these bombers can be anywhere busy like arenas, shopping centre's (I had a lucky escape many years ago when the Arndale shopping centre was bombed) is terrifying enough, without having to worry about whether they're going to be there on the day I'm meant to be there...sorry if that sounds selfish.... and I never went back to Arndale Shopping Centre ever after that incident either.


This country is incredibly secure and sadly we never hear of the situations that the amazing security services prevent, only the tragic ones. Everyone will have these concerns but I suspect that no concerts will be cancelled because that's giving up. Life has to go on otherwise the impact is emotively bigger than we can ever begin to imagine. Today there will be the lives of many utterly changed and seeking much bigger answers that they will never get. They would pay the price of your ticket I'm sure, to go back in time and never go through it.

For the sake of your worries, I suggest you seen counselling or don't go, consider the money lost and put it down to your reaction and fears but truthfully, if you are this worried seek out some counselling and tentatively speak to your friend at an appropriate time. I was caught up in the London bombings of 7/7, caught in a train near Kings Cross and I did continue to commute to the city because it was my job. It is scary but you have to give this some context in amongst the thousands of event that take place across the world and this country ever year.


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## Guest (May 23, 2017)

MollySmith said:


> This country is incredibly secure and sadly we never hear of the situations that the amazing security services prevent, only the tragic ones. Everyone will have these concerns but I suspect that no concerts will be cancelled because that's giving up. Life has to go on otherwise the impact is emotively bigger than we can ever begin to imagine. Today there will be the lives of many utterly changed and seeking much bigger answers that they will never get. They would pay the price of your ticket I'm sure, to go back in time and never go through it.
> 
> For the sake of your worries, I suggest you seen counselling or don't go, consider the money lost and put it down to your reaction and fears but truthfully, if you are this worried seek out some counselling and tentatively speak to your friend at an appropriate time. I was caught up in the London bombings of 7/7, caught in a train near Kings Cross and I did continue to commute to the city because it was my job. It is scary but you have to give this some context in amongst the thousands of event that take place across the world and this country ever year.


Well said. I could break a leg or anything just stepping out of my house at any time, I could fall down the concrete steps leading to our front door at any time too. Life is full of risks. All being well I will be at manchester arena on 3rd december 2017 to see Steps. Yes it is a scary world we live in. No doubting that.


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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

Pappychi said:


> They targeted children...
> 
> That's all I've got in my brain at the minute. Young teenagers. Children.


The first thing that jumped out at me is the demographic of this concert. Teenage girls in the main I would assume.

Then a horrible thought that this was retribution for the BBC showing the Three Girls drama last week.

Probably nothing to do with it, but it was the first thing I thought.

Shameful that recent events make me think like this.


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

No words


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

The second victim has been named, an 8 year old girl


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## Rafa (Jun 18, 2012)

Phoenix Rising said:


> OMG! I've only just seen this news! Latest is showing 22 dead and 59 injured. Do you think future concerts will be affected? A friend has tickets booked for the Celine Dion concert in June for her birthday. I'm meant to be one of the people going, but there's no way I want to go now, but it awful for friend if concerts are still running but no-one now wants to go with her because of this? Do you think they'll refund her so we can all go do something else instead together?


Really?

In the wake of such a tragic and horrific event, your first concern is for yourself?

Who cares whether you get a refund?

I've read some uncaring and selfish posts on here over the years, but yours takes the biscuit.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

There are reports one of the next confirmed victims was just 8 years old. Absolutely horrific.

ETA: Actually confirmed on the news just now.


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## Nagini (Jan 13, 2014)

Hanwombat said:


> The second victim has been named, an 8 year old girl


so sad don't bare thinking about, just too sad
can't even begin to imagine what loved ones are going through


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)




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## Honeys mum (Jan 11, 2013)

This is soul destroying.
Just watched a poor mother on TV with a picture of her lovely daughter, pleading if anyone has seen her to please tell the police.I sat and cried.
I cannot imagine how everyone who is affected by the dispicable act is feeling.
What is happening to our country.


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## Serenity123 (May 24, 2016)

My heart is broke right now thinking of al those injured and dead. My 9 year old daughter had been invited to go with her friend and her mum but I said no because it was a school night, my blood went cold this morning when i saw the news


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## PetloverJo (Nov 4, 2011)

Serenity123 said:


> My heart is broke right now thinking of al those injured and dead. My 9 year old daughter had been invited to go with her friend and her mum but I said no because it was a school night, my blood went cold this morning when i saw the news


Are her friend and mum ok?


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## Serenity123 (May 24, 2016)

PetloverJo said:


> Are her friend and mum ok?


 Very shook up but they are ok luckily x


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## Honeys mum (Jan 11, 2013)

Just saw this on Battle for Britain FB page.

*Battle for Britain*
9 mins ·
There are currently 43 unidentified children at The Holiday Inn Express, local to the venue & Victoria St station: If you're missing a child please call in to The Holiday Inn Express on;

T: 0161 8369600

Address;

Holiday Inn Express Manchester City Centre Arena
Goadsby Road off Swan Street
Manchester
M4 5JY


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

ouesi said:


> 22 young people lost their lives last night


So many devastated families today feeling totally numb with grief ...and the hurt and anger. It's difficult to describe or imagine.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Sweety said:


> Really?


The thing Phoenix Rising should bear in mind is that if Celine Dion had been booked there yesterday instead of next month, she and her friends might be in hospital themselves right now...or worse. So in fact they are 'the lucky ones' compared to these youngsters and their families.


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## MrJsk (Mar 14, 2014)

This is so awful!
All over my newsfeed on facebook 

Hope everybody here and their family/friends are all safe


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

Honeys mum said:


> Just saw this on Battle for Britain FB page.
> 
> *Battle for Britain*
> 9 mins ·
> ...


Apparently that isn't true.
FB have removed the post.


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## sesmo (Mar 6, 2016)

Honeys mum said:


> This is soul destroying.
> Just watched a poor mother on TV with a picture of her lovely daughter, pleading if anyone has seen her to please tell the police.I sat and cried.
> I cannot imagine how everyone who is affected by the dispicable act is feeling.
> What is happening to our country.


There's BBC page with a number of people appealing for info on missing friends and relatives. Hope they get some good news soon. I can't imagine what it must be like not knowing after this length of time.


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

*My heart goes out to all, such sad times.*
* But i can't help thinking, if we stopped bombing places, and selling weapons to unsavoury people, our country would be a safer place.*


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## sesmo (Mar 6, 2016)

Just found this:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...r-mancunians-rally-support-caught-manchester/
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...r-mancunians-rally-support-caught-manchester/
Amazing show of strength and solidarity in the face of atrocity.


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## 3dogs2cats (Aug 15, 2012)

This is just so tragic, last night when the news first broke there had been reports of an explosion I googled Ariana Grande just out of curiosity as I no idea who they are. I saw she is a singer who probably appeals to young people. While I was reading about her I was thinking that whatever had caused the explosion, at that point I presumed some electrical fault, hadn`t caused anyone to be hurt or to be distressed I just couldn`t believe it when I switched back to the news and they were talking fatalities and treating it as a terrorist attack. Just unbelieving shocking, those poor, poor people.


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## Royoyo (Feb 21, 2013)

I can't believe what has happened, absolutely horrific especially more as it's so close to home 

There was a controlled explosion a couple of streets over from me in Fallowfield and a house raided also. I'm not sure on the full details as police haven't released those yet but I definitely heard the explosion today.

The Arndale was also evacuated this morning but I'm not sure if it was related to what happened last night. 

So sorry to anyone who's been affected by last night .


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

JANICE199 said:


> *My heart goes out to all, such sad times.*
> * But i can't help thinking, if we stopped bombing places, and selling weapons to unsavoury people, our country would be a safer place.*


I understand the point you are making,@JANICE199, it's a vicious circle, it really is. The extremists' response to the justifiable public outrage over a bombing targeting children is to shrug their shoulders and say it is in retaliation for the children being killed in Syria. You have to wonder what the solution is.


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## Charity (Apr 17, 2013)

Appears they have arrested someone and carried out a controlled explosion somewhere so more must have been planned. We shouldn't look at it as them winning because there are a lot of plots which are foiled that we don't hear about. Its absolutely impossible to stop every one sadly.


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## Serenity123 (May 24, 2016)

Phoenix Rising said:


> OMG! I've only just seen this news! Latest is showing 22 dead and 59 injured. Do you think future concerts will be affected? A friend has tickets booked for the Celine Dion concert in June for her birthday. I'm meant to be one of the people going, but there's no way I want to go now, but it awful for friend if concerts are still running but no-one now wants to go with her because of this? Do you think they'll refund her so we can all go do something else instead together?


I wouldn't worry about that, I think it's the last thing on anyone's mind right now.


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## Guest (May 23, 2017)

I hope all your friends and family are safe in UK. What a horrible and tragic attack.


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

I've only picked up on this recently as we are away from the UK. We've been listening to Irish RTE radio and they have been very sympathetic with many callers phoning in to express their shock and sorrow.

Those poor parents searching for their children not knowing if they are alive or dead. My heart goes out to them.


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## Honeys mum (Jan 11, 2013)

Manchester attack: Salman Abedi named as bomber by police - BBC News


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## Guest (May 23, 2017)

Latest figure is 22 dead 120 injured.

My friends daughter was there aged 15 and she heard the large bang and then everyone started screaming she was about to leave so lucky she hadn't gone into the foyer 5 mins earlier she would have been bombed. She suffered from a nail through her foot. Being treated in hospital. My heart goes out to her and the family.


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## Serenity123 (May 24, 2016)

wagg4life said:


> Latest figure is 22 dead 120 injured.
> 
> My friends daughter was there aged 15 and she heard the large bang and then everyone started screaming she was about to leave so lucky she hadn't gone into the foyer 5 mins earlier she would have been bombed. She suffered from a nail through her foot. Being treated in hospital. My heart goes out to her and the family.


I'm glad she's ok Hun, it's horrible to think that so many people have been injured or worse. My heart has broken for them all. My daughter is asking questions and struggling with it all, and asking questions I sadly don't have answers for


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## Elles (Aug 15, 2011)




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## Royoyo (Feb 21, 2013)




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## Honeys mum (Jan 11, 2013)




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## stuaz (Sep 22, 2012)

So yesterday was the also the day Lee Rigby was killed on the streets of London. I wonder if that bares any significance with the timing of this brutal attack?

It got me wondering about other dates as well. 

22/05/13 - Lee Rigby
22/03/16 - Brussels
22/07/16 - Munich
22/03/17 - Westminster Bridge
22/05/17 - Manchester. 

Now I know there have been other attacks between these events but strange how there is a pattern. 

Not that I am trying to make logic from what are ultimately illogical people, it is does none the less indicate some significance around 22 and a pattern can be seen..


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

stuaz said:


> So yesterday was the also the day Lee Rigby was killed on the streets of London. I wonder if that bares any significance with the timing of this brutal attack?
> 
> It got me wondering about other dates as well.
> 
> ...


You arent trying to do anything. You're just copying and pasting like all the other sheep, trying to make something of nothing.

My friend sent me this hours ago.

Of course if you ignore all the 8 other attacks that dont fit the narrative of a pattern....


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## Phoenix Rising (Jan 25, 2016)

Well I know people say you shouldn't let them 'win' by not going to these types of things after such an event, but someone posted a link on their wall about ISIS celebrating the 'successful slaughter of kids' on Twitter and saying worse was to come. With another half term coming up and then summer hols I can only imagine they are planning to target another popular venue with large numbers of kids present in the holidays.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3625751/manchester-arena-bombing-isis-claimed-terror-attack-latest/

My family has been talking about this and we (as a family) are not willing to risk the lives of our youngest members just to prove to ISIS that we're not scared of them or their threats.


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## Serenity123 (May 24, 2016)

Phoenix Rising said:


> Well I know people say you shouldn't let them 'win' by not going to these types of things after such an event, but someone posted a link on their wall about ISIS celebrating the 'successful slaughter of kids' on Twitter and saying worse was to come. With another half term coming up and then summer hols I can only imagine they are planning to target another popular venue with large numbers of kids present in the holidays.
> 
> https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3625751/manchester-arena-bombing-isis-claimed-terror-attack-latest/
> 
> My family has been talking about this and we (as a family) are not willing to risk the lives of our youngest members just to prove to ISIS that we're not scared of them or their threats.


I understand (I'm meant to be seeing Steps there in December) however I honestly wouldn't believe anything that the sun says, it's worse then the daily mail. It's a horrible thing to happen but we have to stay united x


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## stuaz (Sep 22, 2012)

Nonnie said:


> You arent trying to do anything. You're just copying and pasting like all the other sheep, trying to make something of nothing.
> 
> My friend sent me this hours ago.
> 
> Of course if you ignore all the 8 other attacks that dont fit the narrative of a pattern....


I did say about the other attacks were not included. Saw it mentioned on twitter I think though probably on the other social networks as well.


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## Phoenix Rising (Jan 25, 2016)

Serenity123 said:


> I understand (I'm meant to be seeing Steps there in December) however I honestly wouldn't believe anything that the sun says, it's worse then the daily mail. It's a horrible thing to happen but we have to stay united x


It's not just about what the Sun said these were apparently tweets on Twitter by ISIS, so should be able to be found if not removed. It says

"One jihadi shared a shot of injured children, saying: "It seems that bombs of the British airforce over children of Mosul and Raqqa has just came back to Manchester." ..so looks like a revenge attack???

I'm not on Twitter but if anyone is it should be easy to find out if the Tweets are there, unless they have been removed since.


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## Phoenix Rising (Jan 25, 2016)

stuaz said:


> So yesterday was the also the day Lee Rigby was killed on the streets of London. I wonder if that bares any significance with the timing of this brutal attack?
> 
> It got me wondering about other dates as well.
> 
> ...


They're not all in school hols or national/bank holidays of whatever country the attacks happened in are they?


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## stuaz (Sep 22, 2012)

Phoenix Rising said:


> They're not all in school hols or national/bank holidays of whatever country the attacks happened in are they?


I don't believe so. There is probably no significance to it as the other poster said, but just something that some people have noticed.


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## cheekyscrip (Feb 8, 2010)

Someone told me today everything happens for a reason.
This has no sense, no reason at all.

It just absurd, tragic, wrong.

My sympathy.


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## Phoenix Rising (Jan 25, 2016)

cheekyscrip said:


> Someone told me today everything happens for a reason.
> This has no sense, no reason at all.
> 
> It just absurd, tragic, wrong.
> ...


I think the phrase was originally meant that In nature everything happens for a reason. Suicide bombers are not a natural product of Mother Nature though!


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## Creativecat (Dec 20, 2016)

Am I right in thinking it was the 4 th anniversary of lee rigbys murder yesterday . If it was thts a deliberate . What really troubled me is yet again this guy was known to the authority's on a watch list . This is really bad in my eyes . I'm sick of being told well we can't watch everyone and pull them in over a few twitter rants . Apperantly there's 4000 on the watch list . Oh my lord Batton down the hatches .


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## Serenity123 (May 24, 2016)

yeah Lee Rigby was killed 22/05/2013


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## rona (Aug 18, 2011)

Theresa May going to make a statement imminently. Assume it's about this


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## rona (Aug 18, 2011)

The army are taking over for a while


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## bearcub (Jul 19, 2011)

Phoenix Rising said:


> Well I know people say you shouldn't let them 'win' by not going to these types of things after such an event, but someone posted a link on their wall about ISIS celebrating the 'successful slaughter of kids' on Twitter and saying worse was to come. With another half term coming up and then summer hols I can only imagine they are planning to target another popular venue with large numbers of kids present in the holidays.
> 
> https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3625751/manchester-arena-bombing-isis-claimed-terror-attack-latest/
> 
> My family has been talking about this and we (as a family) are not willing to risk the lives of our youngest members just to prove to ISIS that we're not scared of them or their threats.


Do you honestly believe that the families of the children murdered last night willingly put them at risk?


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## stuaz (Sep 22, 2012)

rona said:


> The army are taking over for a while


There must a perceived threat or something known. They have kept saying about wanting to find out if its part of a "larger network" so I suspect its related to that and helps reassures the public to a certain degree.

Not a decision I think the Government would make lightly.


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## Phoenix Rising (Jan 25, 2016)

bearcub said:


> Do you honestly believe that the families of the children murdered last night willingly put them at risk?


well this attack wasn't known about in advance, but on News at Ten just now they are increasing the threat level to Critical saying another attack maybe imminent so it would be foolish to go to to such places now knowing the possibility of another attack is possible and that they were definitely targeting young people and children. They mention armed forces been on the streets from tomorrow.


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

UK terror threat level has been raised to critical. Thousands of armed soldiers are going to be deployed onto the streets with armed police. This means the terror threat level is imminent.


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## Honeys mum (Jan 11, 2013)

Manchester attack: UK threat level raised to highest - BBC News

They think there may more be people involved, and cannot take the risk, as there may be more attacks. I pray they are wrong.


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

*PM Theresa May raises UK threat level to 'critical'*

The UK's terror threat level has been raised from severe to critical, meaning a terrorist attack is considered imminent.

Prime Minister Theresa May made the sombre announcement in a live television statement from Downing Street.

The move comes because authorities have been unable to say for certain that the perpetrator of the Manchester Arena attack, in which 22 people were killed and 59 others injured, was working alone.

"It is a possibility that we cannot ignore that there is a wider group of individuals linked to this attack," Mrs May said.

Raising the level to critical means that military personnel could be deployed to support armed police officers - part of a plan known as Operation Temperer.

"The change in the threat level means there will be additional support available to the police as they work to keep us safe," she said.

"Operation Temperer is now in force."

The UK's international terrorism threat level is set by the Joint Terrorism Analysis Centre (JTAC), based in MI5 headquarters in London.

http://www.itv.com/news/2017-05-23/uk-threat-level-raised-to-critical-severe/


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

Candle lite vigil tonight at Albert Square


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## kimthecat (Aug 11, 2009)

perhaps they should postpone the election .

What about people that have to travel on public transport cities or live in cities, they have no choice but to carry on .

ETA , have any of the missing teenagers been found yet. Must be very worrying for their parents .

edited to remove rude word . Apologies for being disrespectful .


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## Phoenix Rising (Jan 25, 2016)

kimthecat said:


> oh f *ck !
> 
> perhaps they should postpone the election .
> 
> ...


Not sure they showed some people on the news that still haven't been found yet.


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

kimthecat said:


> *perhaps they should postpone the election .*


The campaigning for the elections has been suspended until further notice.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

kimthecat said:


> oh f *ck !
> 
> perhaps they should postpone the election .
> 
> ...


I was wondering that too. Saw that mum on the News today of the 15 year old girl and have been looking for updates on/off throughout the day. Appears she is still missing, as are other youngsters


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

Army special forces (SAS) have been deployed in Manchester which ties into reports of army helicopters landing at MCFC (Etihad) Stadium earlier.


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## picaresque (Jun 25, 2009)

Morrissey now being hauled over the coals by illiberal liberals on Twitter for this comment

I don't know Morrissey's politics and tbh I think he can be a bit of a **** but 'right wing nutjob' (one example of many similar tweets) because he won't toe the line? Disagree by all means but maybe use your brain instead of immediately throwing stones.


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## Sacrechat (Feb 27, 2011)

Phoenix Rising said:


> I'm not bothered about it being cancelled and whether money is refunded! More that if it's NOT cancelled that I would still be expected to be going. It's terrible for the people who were there yesterday when it happened but I don't want to be one of the next however many dead if it was targeted again and that happened to be one the night I was supposed to be there. I'd rather cut my losses regarding costs of tickets already paid for there and just not go, even if concerts are back on by then.
> 
> I'm just a very nervous person in crowded places anyway, so wasn't that thrilled that my friend chose a packed concert for her birthday celebrations anyway, but was willing to endure it. Expecting me to go somewhere I now see as 'dangerous' to go to is something else entirely. She may as well be saying I want you to join me standing on a cliff edge in an an hurricane, you might be lucky and not get injured or killed or your life might end that day!
> 
> I do feel for those that are suffering and the thought these bombers can be anywhere busy like arenas, shopping centre's (I had a lucky escape many years ago when the Arndale shopping centre was bombed) is terrifying enough, without having to worry about whether they're going to be there on the day I'm meant to be there...sorry if that sounds selfish.... and I never went back to Arndale Shopping Centre ever after that incident either.


When you're in hole, stop digging!


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

The 15 year old girl whose mum appealed for help in finding her has been confirmed as one of the victims. There are just no words really.


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## Nagini (Jan 13, 2014)

Phoenix Rising said:


> Well I know people say you shouldn't let them 'win' by not going to these types of things after such an event, but someone posted a link on their wall about ISIS celebrating the 'successful slaughter of kids' on Twitter and saying worse was to come. With another half term coming up and then summer hols I can only imagine they are planning to target another popular venue with large numbers of kids present in the holidays.
> 
> https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3625751/manchester-arena-bombing-isis-claimed-terror-attack-latest/
> 
> My family has been talking about this and we (as a family) are not willing to risk the lives of our youngest members just to prove to ISIS that we're not scared of them or their threats.


do you honestly believe everything you read, posted over the internet?
i think we all know isis have claimed responsibility for the attack as it's been broadcast over several news outlets, that they have.
if they specifically wanted to target children, there are enough busy places around with much less security,it don't bare thinking about, it really doesn't
i'm still sitting on the fence whether i believe the scumbags who were responsible for this, did so specifically to target children, whether they actually did remains to be seen, there were people of all age groups there, also sadly, children.
they targeted a full music venue for mass effect, to cause fear, panic and terror in a busy city, sadly it worked
there's no logic in the way you are thinking, everywhere in this country is on high alert, now especially, wrapping yourself up in a bubble certainly isn't going to stop anything from happening to anyone. in doing so, the fanatic's - have you, exactly where they want you.
none of this is about you, how you feel, or how you want to live your life, whether that be doing everything you possibly can in the very short amount of time we are here, or not, that is completely your decision.
there are still families out there this morning missing people, and grieving for their loved ones, spare a thought for those, as believe me, how you are feeling is nothing in comparison to how many people are suffering and grieving due to the selfishness of those responsible for this


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## Mr Gizmo (Jul 1, 2009)

We may moan and groan about a lot of things (mainly at work, about work) but at least I have never been caught up in anything like this.
I was at Twickenham on Saturday, going to watch Rugby this evening, later this year I will going to cricket, athletics and going on a cruise.
All of these are potential targets, will it stop me doing any of them, not a hope I will enjoy them all and not give them the satisfaction of scaring me of.


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

@Phoenix Rising you posted a link to the Sun, the same paper who posted the abhorrent article that somehow wants to blame the attacks on Jeremy Corbyn in a random seven degrees of separation that breaches all the press guidelines which they certainly knew that they were doing. It is lies and supporters of all parties have complained to the Press Standards Agency. The Sun really published a message that's really no better than a ISIS video, it's inflamatory, threatening and breaks all moral codes. They will be fined but idiots with no concept of what the Sun stands for and how it operates, those who are unwilling to go out and read a more balanced range of newspapers, believe this tripe. You believe this tripe.

Until then I felt a tiny bit of empathy because I know that going to London was nerve wracking, everyone on the train felt it. But I'm running out of patience. Can I please urge you to stop reading that crap and find a better paper, ideally not the Daily Mail

Go or don't, but know that it's your choice and you can't except a refund. Nobody from the events of yesterday, or in any part of the world wants their loved ones to die but you have more chance of dying crossing the road, than you do being bombed. Get a flipping grip.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Another 'homegrown' murderer who was 'known to the authorities' (apparently). I wonder what his parents think...?


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## Honeys mum (Jan 11, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> The 15 year old girl whose mum appealed for help in finding her has been confirmed as one of the victims. There are
> just no words really


Yes , its the poor mum I saw on the news yesterday, which reduced me to tears.
As you say Dogloverlou, there are just no words.

Olivia Campbell, 15, among Manchester victims The teenager's mother had launched a desperate appeal to find her missing daughter, but tragically, it's been confirmed she died in the attack. Mum's poignant tribute »


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## Jamesgoeswalkies (May 8, 2014)

picaresque said:


> Morrissey now being hauled over the coals by illiberal liberals on Twitter for this comment
> 
> I don't know Morrissey's politics and tbh I think he can be a bit of a **** but 'right wing nutjob' (one example of many similar tweets) because he won't toe the line? Disagree by all means but maybe use your brain instead of immediately throwing stones.


Sorry but has Morrissey actually heard of Jo Cox? And I politely suggest that he looks a little deeper into political history before making such pointless statements as "Politicians tell us they are not afraid but they are never the victims". Politicians across the world very often are the targets actually ........

It's also very tasteless for Morissey to be using a time like this to score political points. Or create an Us and Them. I for one have no wish to see world leaders sobbing into their hankies and telling us they are afraid.

Acts of terrorism are cowardly acts. This was an especially despicable act on a soft target .....what animal attacks children and young people. 

J


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## Guest (May 24, 2017)

MollySmith said:


> @Phoenix Rising you posted a link to the Sun, the same paper who posted the abhorrent article that somehow wants to blame the attacks on Jeremy Corbyn in a random seven degrees of separation that breaches all the press guidelines which they certainly knew that they were doing. It is lies and supporters of all parties have complained to the Press Standards Agency. The Sun really published a message that's really no better than a ISIS video, it's inflamatory, threatening and breaks all moral codes. They will be fined but idiots with no concept of what the Sun stands for and how it operates, those who are unwilling to go out and read a more balanced range of newspapers, believe this tripe. You believe this tripe.
> 
> Until then I felt a tiny bit of empathy because I know that going to London was nerve wracking, everyone on the train felt it. But I'm running out of patience. Can I please urge you to stop reading that crap and find a better paper, ideally not the Daily Mail
> 
> Go or don't, but know that it's your choice and you can't except a refund. Nobody from the events of yesterday, or in any part of the world wants their loved ones to die but you have more chance of dying crossing the road, than you do being bombed. Get a flipping grip.


Newspapers like the sun and daily fail might as well be tories because they seem to like the tories. I try and avoid the likes of the sun and daily fail. I prefer independant newspapers even online. Online are the only ones I can read.


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## noushka05 (Mar 28, 2008)

Thank you Germany. #WeStandTogether










Heartfelt message from Man U hero Eric Cantona.


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

Creativecat said:


> Am I right in thinking it was the 4 th anniversary of lee rigbys murder yesterday . If it was thts a deliberate . What really troubled me is yet again this guy was known to the authority's on a watch list . This is really bad in my eyes . I'm sick of being told well we can't watch everyone and pull them in over a few twitter rants . Apperantly there's 4000 on the watch list . Oh my lord Batton down the hatches .


Let us all pray that the 4000 on the hit list don't all strike at once,


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## Honeys mum (Jan 11, 2013)

Calvine said:


> Another 'homegrown' murderer who was 'known to the authorities' (apparently). I wonder what his parents think...?


Seems he had just returned from Libya.
Manchester suicide bomber Salman Abedi 'returned home from Libya days before deadly attack' | London Evening Standard

Salman Abedi named as the Manchester suicide bomber - what we know about him


----------



## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

Calvine said:


> Another 'homegrown' murderer who was 'known to the authorities' (apparently). I wonder what his parents think...?


I suppose it depends if they have the same ideology as him. Which isn't beyond the realms unfortunately.

I was a little perturbed when watching the vigil in Manchester yesterday that there was a group of Asians laughing and messing about in the crowd. Not good form when everyone is talking about 'pulling together' IMO.


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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

Honeys mum said:


> Seems he had just returned from Libya.
> Manchester suicide bomber Salman Abedi 'returned home from Libya days before deadly attack' | London Evening Standard


And he is being watched by police? Something amiss there isn't there?

Or is Libya just a popular tourist destination now?


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## Satori (Apr 7, 2013)

picaresque said:


> Morrissey now being hauled over the coals by illiberal liberals on Twitter for this comment
> 
> I don't know Morrissey's politics and tbh I think he can be a bit of a **** but 'right wing nutjob' (one example of many similar tweets) because he won't toe the line? Disagree by all means but maybe use your brain instead of immediately throwing stones.


What an absolute prize [email protected] Even by the standards of pampered media luvvies this is dross. The biggest pile of festering garbage I have heard on this, or perhaps any, subject. I just wish slime like this would stay back under their rocks, especially at times like this.


----------



## Honeys mum (Jan 11, 2013)

I can't believe I have just read this, shame on you D.Hicks.

UPDATED: Stroud Labour vice-chairman says Manchester Arena terror attack is 'wonderful timing for Theresa May' (From Stroud News and Journal)

Stroud Labour vice-chair suspended by party after Manchester attack comments (From Stroud News and Journal)


----------



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

:Jawdrop what a insensitive thing to say.


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## noushka05 (Mar 28, 2008)

MilleD said:


> And he is being watched by police? Something amiss there isn't there?
> 
> Or is Libya just a popular tourist destination now?


We have destroyed Libya. Western intervention to bring about a regime change in Libya (& elsewhere), arming Saudi is directly empowering terrorists, it is fuelling radicalisation. The media is not reporting the bigger picture.


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

Honeys mum said:


> Seems he had just returned from Libya.
> Manchester suicide bomber Salman Abedi 'returned home from Libya days before deadly attack' | London Evening Standard
> 
> Salman Abedi named as the Manchester suicide bomber - what we know about him


And suggests his n pArents were refugees, given refuse here when fleeing gaddiffi


----------



## noushka05 (Mar 28, 2008)




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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

Honeys mum said:


> I can't believe I have just read this, shame on you D.Hicks.
> 
> UPDATED: Stroud Labour vice-chairman says Manchester Arena terror attack is 'wonderful timing for Theresa May' (From Stroud News and Journal)
> 
> Stroud Labour vice-chair suspended by party after Manchester attack comments (From Stroud News and Journal)


But I wouldn't mind betting it's just what many were thinking!


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## noushka05 (Mar 28, 2008)

,At the request of Juncker, flags at half-mast in EU Commission in solidarity with the British people #*Manchester*










Statement from the Muslim Council of Britain.


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## Mr Gizmo (Jul 1, 2009)

MilleD said:


> I suppose it depends if they have the same ideology as him. Which isn't beyond the realms unfortunately.
> 
> I was a little perturbed when watching the vigil in Manchester yesterday that there was* a group of Asians laughing and messing about in the crowd*. Not good form when everyone is talking about 'pulling together' IMO.


Product placement.


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## noushka05 (Mar 28, 2008)

I'm fed up of seeing attacks on the Muslim community all over the place because of this atrocity. People seem to forget there are good & bad in all.










This American guy stirring up racial hatred got it with two barrels! 
*
Geraldo Rivera*‏Verified [email protected]*GeraldoRivera* May 22

Many terrorists arrested in mowing down of pedestrians outside Westminster London in
March were from #*Manchester* hotbed of Islamic radicals

*Glenn Kitson*‏@*Glenn_Kitson* May 23

Glenn Kitson Retweeted Geraldo Rivera

_Manchester Muslim doctors working through the night, Manchester Muslim taxi drivers taking people home for free. 
You don't know Manchester_.

69,334 retweets 114,848 likes


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## kimthecat (Aug 11, 2009)

Morrisey conveniently forgot Jo Cox, What a dick .


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

I'm confused by what Morrisey means with "...what we all say in private"  did he just imply that everyone in Britain is a closet bigot? Hand on heart - I don't know anyone who has views that he needs to hide and are so dark that they can only be expressed in private. But maybe that's just my circle of friend/ community.
It is terrible what has happened. this morning I had to visit a class where 2 girls were at the concert. This afternoon I'm going to a different school, different class where a little Syrian refugee boy is petrified to come to school because him and his mum were shouted at in Asda last night. This comes just a month since his older teenage brother and dad got assaulted by a few young men on the street.
I guess the parents of the suicide bomber are most likely feeling the same as the white Christian or atheist parents of school shooters - confused, lost, scared, heartbroken, ashamed, guilty. And they will spend the rest of their lives feeling like that because they are the parents who failed to see what was happening right in front of their eyes.
All of this happening few days after I watchced TED talk by Deeyah Khan about young European muslims and then followed it up with her documentary "JIHAD: the story of others". An interesting film and useful for those who believe that it is the parents to blame for suicide bombers. The fact is that most of these young men are vulnerable young people the same as vulnerable white Christian people. It's not about religion. It's about vulnerability and need to belong to some sort of community.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Honeys mum said:


> I can't believe I have just read this, shame on you D.Hicks.


Reminiscent of someone in America saying that 'today is a good day to bury bad news' (referring to the day the Twin Towers went down).


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Just heard on the radio that many of the injured survivors have 'life-changing injuries which will need long-term care and support'. Taking into account the fact that most of them are still so very young, that is like a life sentence.


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## Gemmaa (Jul 19, 2009)

stuaz said:


> So yesterday was the also the day Lee Rigby was killed on the streets of London. I wonder if that bares any significance with the timing of this brutal attack?
> 
> It got me wondering about other dates as well.
> 
> ...


Nah, just had a quick google, and there seems to be attack somewhere in the world everyday
https://thereligionofpeace.com/attacks/attacks.aspx?Yr=2017


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## Creativecat (Dec 20, 2016)

DT said:


> Let us all pray that the 4000 on the hit list don't all strike at once,


Well yes that would be very large dangerous fly in the ointment
For all concerned . But as Teresa may says we shouldn't be concerned.
Wtf. This radicalisation shit has got rite out of hand now and the public are in the cross hairs of this mess


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-civilians-swap-bashar-al-assad-a7686241.html


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

Calvine said:


> Just heard on the radio that many of the injured survivors have 'life-changing injuries which will need long-term care and support'. Taking into account the fact that most of them are still so very young, that is like a life sentence.


My second cousin lost his right leg aged 12 two months ago in a car accident and I can attest to this being a very long road to recovery.


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Creativecat said:


> I agree not everyone one does think like tht .
> But to say everyone is vulnerable like white Christian men also I agree
> But but it's the lost Muslim men that go out and kill innocents in there warped idiology


Is there an actual statistic available showing that they are actual Muslim? Genuine question. Everyone calls them Muslim. But if tomorrow I will go buy a bible and join some Christian cult, then 4 months later go to my old work that employs a lot of gay men and shoot everyone while waving the bible in my hand, does that make me a Christian? 
I also forgot to add to my last post about Morrisey... what is it with weirdos feeling like anyone Muslim or Asian or Middle East decent must publicly condemn every terror act? Why is there such a need for that? No one asks all men around the world to condemn an act of rape every time someone gets raped. No one asks mothers to condemn a woman who kills her child. No one asks every driver to condemn a guy who drove drunk and killed someone. Why? Because somehow we accept that these actions are not normal and no one in heir right mind would accept them. Why does the Muslim community have to condemn every lunatic separately and give them time of their day to begin with? Why do some people feel like the Muslim community have to continuously prove that they are not supporting these acts of violence?


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## Creativecat (Dec 20, 2016)

Lost is being polite and politically correct but what he did is unforgivable . But I agree whoever or whatever group do such things shouldn't have to keep apologising
What I'm saying is why are these acts so prevalent in such groups who ever they are . Look what happened in Rochdale and they managed to get away with so much
By the police because they didnt want to offend the local community . All im saying these problems must be addressed with other than tea and sympathy as clearley it's not working


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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

shadowmare said:


> Is there an actual statistic available showing that they are actual Muslim? Genuine question. Everyone calls them Muslim. But if tomorrow I will go buy a bible and join some Christian cult, then 4 months later go to my old work that employs a lot of gay men and shoot everyone while waving the bible in my hand, does that make me a Christian?
> I also forgot to add to my last post about Morrisey... what is it with weirdos feeling like anyone Muslim or Asian or Middle East decent must publicly condemn every terror act? Why is there such a need for that? No one asks all men around the world to condemn an act of rape every time someone gets raped. No one asks mothers to condemn a woman who kills her child. No one asks every driver to condemn a guy who drove drunk and killed someone. Why? Because somehow we accept that these actions are not normal and no one in heir right mind would accept them. Why does the Muslim community have to condemn every lunatic separately and give them time of their day to begin with? Why do some people feel like the Muslim community have to continuously prove that they are not supporting these acts of violence?


Well pretty sure Salman Abedi was muslim. This is derived from the fact that his imam has said he isn't surprised that he did it. Mind you, that does beg the question why didn't he report that?


----------



## sesmo (Mar 6, 2016)

Honeys mum said:


> I can't believe I have just read this, shame on you D.Hicks.
> 
> UPDATED: Stroud Labour vice-chairman says Manchester Arena terror attack is 'wonderful timing for Theresa May' (From Stroud News and Journal)
> 
> Stroud Labour vice-chair suspended by party after Manchester attack comments (From Stroud News and Journal)





Happy Paws said:


> :Jawdrop what a insensitive thing to say.


Unfortunately, there will always be those who look to make the most capital (whether political or other) out of such events. Who remembers Jo Moore and the "good day to bury bad news"

Quoted from the Telegraph:

Miss Moore's memo, written at 2.55pm on September 11, when millions of people were transfixed by the terrible television images of the terrorist attack, said: "It is now a very good day to get out anything we want to bury. Councillors expenses?"

I hope that suspension is made permanent.


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## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

@Phoenix Rising if you are feeling worried about being in public places here is a short video about keeping safe by an expert in risk and terror

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-40023613/advice-for-keeping-safe-in-a-dangerous-situation


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

MilleD said:


> Well pretty sure Salman Abedi was muslim. This is derived from the fact that his imam has said he isn't surprised that he did it. Mind you, that does beg the question why didn't he report that?


They say that the guy was known to the authorities so clearly someone has reported something. It is quite pointless to ask questions like "why didn't X Y or Z reported it?" Unless you are much more informed on the subject of how much intelligence there was on him and where it came from?


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Creativecat said:


> But as Teresa may says we shouldn't be concerned.


I think we should; I was shocked when Sadiq Khan said that 'living with terrorism is part and parcel of living in London' (and presumably Manchester).


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

havoc said:


> Whenever we give them a label,


Most labels are too flattering for what they really are. I understand they like to call themselves ''freedom fighters''.


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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

shadowmare said:


> They say that the guy was known to the authorities so clearly someone has reported something. It is quite pointless to ask questions like "why didn't X Y or Z reported it?" Unless you are much more informed on the subject of how much intelligence there was on him and where it came from?


It's not pointless, it's how things get improved to potentially stop future incidents.


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## Elles (Aug 15, 2011)

I can't imagine what makes a young man, only 22 years old, commit suicide and take young innocents with him. It's not a religion, it's a violent cult and the reason its known members aren't all rounded up, is because there's nowhere to put them, even if the law permitted it. They can't be watched 24/7, because we don't have the manpower to do it. The authorities have intercepted attacks, unfortunately some slip through the net. 

It's a terrible, terrible thing and it is heartbreaking reading of those left in their wake. Those, poor, poor children and families. Devastating.


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

Creativecat said:


> Look what happened in Rochdale and they managed to get away with so much


They got away with it for so long in no small part because white, possibly Christian, individuals who could have stopped it chose to see those girls as less than worthy of help.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

noushka05 said:


> I'm fed up of seeing attacks on the Muslim community all over the place because of this atrocity


No doubt some of the people caught up in this atrocity were themselves Muslim...employees at the stadium, people who came forward to help...and doubtless some of the hospital and other emergency staff..


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

Elles said:


> The police admitted that one of the reasons they didn't act, was fear of causing racial unrest and being accused of racism


The police were not the only agency nvolved. The constant across all agencies was the attitude to the victims. They were not viewed as abused children. Supposed fear of racial tension is the easy excuse.


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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

shadowmare said:


> If you're throwing around the word "fact" like confetti. You do know that the majority of the men who were caught were from North Africa, right??? How about we address the issue of where you get your truths from?


I'm not making any comment on the % mentioned, but you do know there are majority muslim countries in North Africa right?

Sadly, more people have been named today including a couple that were waiting to pick up their daughters. How awful for those poor girls


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## Elles (Aug 15, 2011)

havoc said:


> The police were not the only agency nvolved. The constant across all agencies was the attitude to the victims. They were not viewed as abused children. Supposed fear of racial tension is the easy excuse.


No, they weren't when they were abused by the wealthy and the famous too. However, it is still a contributory factor. If the miscreants in all of these cases were poor, chances are action would have been taken and the authorities would have been more interested in what the health worker had to say. So both the perceived lack of value of the girls and the perceived value of the men, were factors. The authorities have been told that Joe Public doesn't care about your excuses, get on with it, so hopefully they will.

The abused are often not believed, or their distress swept under the carpet, whoever they are sadly. History teaches us that.


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

Nonnie said:


> Because it helps fuel the Muslim hating agenda that so many develop when these atrocities happen.
> 
> There is a band wagon, and the ignorant are more than happy to jump on board.


This 

Whatever the atrocity, it's human nature to be angry and look to place blame. I think it's important that we place it on the individual and not allow that anger to spill over into generalisations. That Creativecat has been misled by such generalisations or screwing of stats on other threads shows how easily it does happen.


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

Some balance... on emergency planning (with actual links and sources)

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/may/24/emergency-planner-manchester-heal-terror-hurts

_"But mainly yesterday I thought back to one of the starkest moments of my career when Gordon Brown stated in a speech to the Royal United Services Institute in February 2006 that "the global terrorist threat is such that we cannot afford not to be vigilant at all times." By that point I had seen up close what a suicide bomber does to the fragile human frame. Brown's words devastated me. He was always a measured speaker and I knew that what he was saying was so, so much worse than the way it was perhaps interpreted. I glimpsed a future of repeated attacks - I believe we are in that era now. *I glimpsed the carnage and the loss and the pain; attacks designed by terrorists to try to create a tear in the relationship between Muslims and their friends and neighbours*. And I cursed Brown for not spelling out in this speech, bluntly, what his words really meant: that my colleagues would spend the next 11 years quietly training people to sit patiently with a mother and ask her gently for permission to swab her mouth for DNA, while she prayed to any god she knew that her small daughter, lip-glossed and growing too fast, was currently being sheltered in a Holiday Inn rather than carefully tended in a mortuary we have purpose built for when the call comes in."_


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## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

Closing for a read through and edit.


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

Elles said:


> There's no shame in being ignorant, most of us are, we can't know everything. Creativecat has apologised, can we put this horrible thread back on the track it was meant for? Or maybe lock it and start another.


The wonderful thing about this place is that we can learn from each other. If we don't know, ask. Check sources. Doing that could have been easily avoided offensive several times in this thread.


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## Creativecat (Dec 20, 2016)

I agree 
I'm sad how these atrocities can turn people against each other for a micro second but we are all decent people with our own views and respect each other .


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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

Security is being stepped up in the town I work in. A couple of policemen with machine guns have just wandered past. I always sort of thought it would just be big cities where they do that for some reason.


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## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

I'm actually reading through and editing now !


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

Sorry @SusieRainbow - think we have crossed posted on this. I have removed a lot of unnecessary posts and perhaps some that had some relevance but lost context without the others.
Keep it on track and let's not get sidelined by racist issues


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## Honeys mum (Jan 11, 2013)

Calvine said:


> ; I was shocked when Sadiq Khan said that 'living with terrorism is part and parcel of living in London' (and presumably Manchester)


Me too Calvine.


----------



## catz4m8z (Aug 27, 2008)

noushka05 said:


> I'm fed up of seeing attacks on the Muslim community all over the place because of this atrocity. People seem to forget there are good & bad in all.


True. Personally I dont see these people as muslim or christian or sikh, etc. They are fanatics and psychopaths who use religion as an excuse for their crimes.



shadowmare said:


> They say that the guy was known to the authorities so clearly someone has reported something. It is quite pointless to ask questions like "why didn't X Y or Z reported it?" Unless you are much more informed on the subject of how much intelligence there was on him and where it came from?


I now have to do a study day at work on how to recognize if someone if being radicalized or if you actively suspect them of being a terrorist. All public sector workers do this I believe and its just a sign of how depressing the times we live in are.
Cant imagine how horible it is for those people involved, I hope they have all the support they need.


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## Creativecat (Dec 20, 2016)

I think Facebook twitter and other platforms could and should do more to combat all negativity that's posted


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## kimthecat (Aug 11, 2009)

I'm not sure if appropriate but I didn't want to start another thread. 
Simple minds didn't cancel their concert and Jim kerr gives his reasons . I can see his point of view .

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-40023903

This photo makes me feel proud.


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Honeys mum said:


> Me too Calvine.


The difference being that Japan has the smallest ratio of immigrants in the developed world and is not very known for its tendency to get involved in wars of other countries... ISIS literally has nothing to do there. Japan is literally at the bottom of any tables showing ethnic diversity, cultural diversity, foreign born population etc. You name it. Data from 2013 shows Japan's foreign born population is 3 times lower than in UK, Germany, France, Greece even Iceland and two times lower than in Italy.


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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

kimthecat said:


> I'm not sure if appropriate but I didn't want to start another thread.
> Simple minds didn't cancel their concert and Jim kerr gives his reasons . I can see his point of view .
> 
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-40023903
> ...


On a slight side note, my neighbour who is 80 went to see them at the weekend and said they were excellent.


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## Jesthar (May 16, 2011)

kimthecat said:


> I'm not sure if appropriate but I didn't want to start another thread.
> Simple minds didn't cancel their concert and Jim kerr gives his reasons . I can see his point of view .
> 
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-40023903
> ...


In a similar vein, there's a new hashtag, #BritishThreatLevels , trending on Twitter. Apparently this was the tweet that started it all off:

Jeremy Cook @Jeremy_JCook 

_*
We're British. I don't get scared until the threat level hits "Replacement Bus Service".*_


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

Honeys mum said:


> Me too Calvine.


I understood it as encouraging us to be alert. He went onto say that (source: The Independent)
_'major cities around the world "have got to be prepared for these sorts of things" to happen when people least expect them.

"That means being vigilant, having a police force that is in touch with communities, it means the security services being ready, but it also means exchanging ideas and best practice",

_
When I was a child it was at the height of IRA attacks and my dad managed a busy railway station, they had very frequent practice and kind of understood that to be the context. Not that we should accept this but that we have to find tools to handle these things.


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

Creativecat said:


> I think Facebook twitter and other platforms could and should do more to combat all negativity that's posted


Yes, agree. There has been an interesting Panorama programme and a Guardian investigation these past few weeks. Here's the link of the Guardian reports

http://www.theguardian.com/technology/facebook


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

MollySmith said:


> I understood it as encouraging us to be alert. He went onto say that (source: The Independent)
> _'major cities around the world "have got to be prepared for these sorts of things" to happen when people least expect them.
> 
> "That means being vigilant, having a police force that is in touch with communities, it means the security services being ready, but it also means exchanging ideas and best practice",
> ...


Same here. I didn't take his words as "suck it up and live with it". It's just a terrible sad fact that in our current day context, living in a big city in Europe you are at a higher risk of terror attack happening near you than when living in a small town or village. I know that when my cousin and her boyfriend moved back to London from Glasgow last summer, they realised that this type of risk has grown. The same way that every time my father travels to London from Lithuania for work, I am scared for all 3 days of his trip because I know that the nature of his position, the nature of venues that he attends the meeting at and the fact that he goes to London from the small insignificant Lithuania immediately puts him in a considerable risk. I also know that I am more likely to be a victim of a terror attack in Glasgow than my friend who lives in the capital of Lithuania. It's a terrible truth but it is so.


----------



## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

shadowmare said:


> Same here. I didn't take his words as "suck it up and live with it". It's just a terrible sad fact that in our current day context, living in a big city in Europe you are at a higher risk of terror attack happening near you than when living in a small town or village. I know that when my cousin and her boyfriend moved back to London from Glasgow last summer, they realised that this type of risk has grown. The same way that every time my father travels to London from Lithuania for work, I am scared for all 3 days of his trip because I know that the nature of his position, the nature of venues that he attends the meeting at and the fact that he goes to London from the small insignificant Lithuania immediately puts him in a considerable risk. I also know that I am more likely to be a victim of a terror attack in Glasgow than my friend who lives in the capital of Lithuania. It's a terrible truth but it is so.


I am sorry that you have to worry so much for your dad. I worried about my dad and his job - railways were a prime target and still are. But I think we've had so many times of fear (cold war, IRA) that whilst it's scary times, it has been scary for a long time.


----------



## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

MollySmith said:


> I understood it as encouraging us to be alert. He went onto say that (source: The Independent)
> _'major cities around the world "have got to be prepared for these sorts of things" to happen when people least expect them.
> 
> "That means being vigilant, having a police force that is in touch with communities, it means the security services being ready, but it also means exchanging ideas and best practice",
> ...


Handle how, how do you handle a suicide bomber? Correct me if I'm wrong, yes I remember the ira, they were ruthless, but I don't recall them deploying suicide bombers.

We are now fighting a breed that is prepared to die for their cause regardless, I've never been to war so can't really comment, I am sure we had heros who did go beyond the expected to save their comrades, but seriously, you tell anyone in the forces that a condition of joining up is that you have to be prepared to strap on a suicide vest at some time or other how many would join up!


----------



## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

Just to add @ mollysmith, wasn't being disrespectful to your post, just don't think we can expect relational human beings to be pitched against these barbaric things


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

I know exactly how I would start to deal with it, but I wouldn't be the most popular egg in the basket, nothing new there.


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

DT said:


> Just to add @ mollysmith, wasn't being disrespectful to your post, just don't think we can expect relational human beings to be pitched against these barbaric things





DT said:


> Handle how, how do you handle a suicide bomber? Correct me if I'm wrong, yes I remember the ira, they were ruthless, but I don't recall them deploying suicide bombers.
> 
> We are now fighting a breed that is prepared to die for their cause regardless, I've never been to war so can't really comment, I am sure we had heros who did go beyond the expected to save their comrades, but seriously, you tell anyone in the forces that a condition of joining up is that you have to be prepared to strap on a suicide vest at some time or other how many would join up!


Maybe vigilant? Tools might have been the wrong word to use. I really don't think Sadiq Khan means we roll over but we have to accept that being in a city - I live in one and also used to commute to London and as I said to another PF'er, was in London on 7/7 - it's about knowing this will happen and keeping a watchful eye out. Small signs may mean something and reporting them and I guess being prepared get stuck into the support afterwards.

That's how I saw it but yes I take your point, I don't know that I'd know how to react to a suicide bomber. And yes,the IRA didn't use suicide bomber but they still carried out attacks in high population areas with no warning at all.


----------



## Guest (May 24, 2017)

I can't help thinking that if we are creating a whole thread about the bombing and having so many people reply to it in uproar is what they want. We shouldn't be giving them a reason to do another attack. I know it is extremely natural for many people to be angry and reply because this will be a very largely remembered point in history. Do you think we should stop commenting? 

Just so you know I am upset myself and don't really want this talking to stop as it does help me and everyone get their sorrows out if they need to. I am fully supporting anyone suffering at this horrible moment in history. My heart goes out to you all.:Sorry


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## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

wagg4life said:


> I can't help thinking that if we are creating a whole thread about the bombing and having so many people reply to it in uproar is what they want. We shouldn't be giving them a reason to do another attack. I know it is extremely natural for many people to be angry and reply because this will be a very largely remembered point in history. Do you think we should stop commenting?
> 
> Just so you know I am upset myself and don't really want this talking to stop as it does help me and everyone get their sorrows out if they need to. I am fully supporting anyone suffering at this horrible moment in history. My heart goes out to you all.:Sorry


I doubt if ISIS read pet forums to be fair. Talking about things helps and do bear in mind a lot of members of this forum live alone and this might be their only outlet to share their fears/worries or just to talk about their feelings.


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## Guest (May 24, 2017)

rottiepointerhouse said:


> I doubt if ISIS read pet forums to be fair. Talking about things helps and do bear in mind a lot of members of this forum live alone and this might be their only outlet to share their fears/worries or just to talk about their feelings.


Well, is it just me or am I sure I mentioned how I understood how commenting on this thread may help relieve the sorrow? 
I don't think ISIS read PF either.. but it doesn't mean any reputable journalist may not.


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## PawsOnMe (Nov 1, 2012)

wagg4life said:


> Well, is it just me or am I sure I mentioned how I understood how commenting on this thread may help relieve the sorrow?
> I don't think ISIS read PF either.. but it doesn't mean any reputable journalist may not.


What's being said on here isn't already being said on any other social media sites. I posted the thread when it was first happening and although I'm not really reading it anymore people should be able to comment and talk about it. This thread isn't giving them reason for another attack.


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## Nagini (Jan 13, 2014)

Creativecat said:


> I think Facebook twitter and other platforms could and should do more to combat all negativity that's posted


i think facebook, twitter and similar platforms should go offline in these instances, it would prevent an awful lot of misuse. i can see the arguments for keeping everything up and running, people trying to get hold of loved ones etc, generally, think they do more harm than good though for spreading hatred and fear in these instances.


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## kimthecat (Aug 11, 2009)

Jesthar said:


> In a similar vein, there's a new hashtag, #BritishThreatLevels , trending on Twitter. Apparently this was the tweet that started it all off:
> 
> Jeremy Cook @Jeremy_JCook
> 
> ...


 Yeah I saw it. It was funny, lots of jokes about tea but some people were unhappy with it.


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## Rafa (Jun 18, 2012)

wagg4life said:


> I can't help thinking that if we are creating a whole thread about the bombing and having so many people reply to it in uproar is what they want. We shouldn't be giving them a reason to do another attack. I know it is extremely natural for many people to be angry and reply because this will be a very largely remembered point in history. Do you think we should stop commenting?
> 
> Just so you know I am upset myself and don't really want this talking to stop as it does help me and everyone get their sorrows out if they need to. I am fully supporting anyone suffering at this horrible moment in history. My heart goes out to you all.:Sorry


I wouldn't worry.

I'm sure we're all capable of judging for ourselves what is and what isn't appropriate.


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## Jesthar (May 16, 2011)

Nagini said:


> i think facebook, twitter and similar platforms should go offline in these instances, it would prevent an awful lot of misuse.


That may also eliminate one of the primary ways for people to contact family, though. Voice networks are likely to be jammed after an event like this, and being able to put up a post saying 'I'm OK' could be a huge relief to a lot of worried relatives whilst at the same time removing the need for multiple phone calls.

I remember when the 7/7 attack happened all the phones went down (telecoms were taken offline for emergency use only I think) - this was before the days of mobile broadband of course. E-mail, internet and TV were the only ways we could get updates.


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

wagg4life said:


> Well, is it just me or am I sure I mentioned how I understood how commenting on this thread may help relieve the sorrow?
> I don't think ISIS read PF either.. but it doesn't mean any reputable journalist may not.


Oh! Do they exsist, these reputable journalists then?


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## kimthecat (Aug 11, 2009)

MollySmith said:


> I am sorry that you have to worry so much for your dad. I worried about my dad and his job - railways were a prime target and still are. But I think we've had so many times of fear (cold war, IRA) that whilst it's scary times, it has been scary for a long time.


I well remember the IRA attacks as a teenager in the 70s , I _still _don't stand next to a waste bin on stations.
It became normal to be evacuated from stores and at work.


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

Nagini said:


> i think facebook, twitter and similar platforms should go offline in these instances, it would prevent an awful lot of misuse. i can see the arguments for keeping everything up and running, people trying to get hold of loved ones etc, generally, think they do more harm than good though for spreading hatred and fear in these instances.


How about we all go indoors and button down the hatches?
If we did that then they would have won!


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## Nagini (Jan 13, 2014)

DT said:


> How about we all go indoors and button down the hatches?
> If we did that then they would have won!


you do exactly as you wish, i won't be doing either..how on earth did we manage before facebook, twitter and the like? i'm not a fan of social media, never have, never will be.


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## Guest (May 24, 2017)

I guess the reason I said the whole thing about giving them what they want is my friend's daughter is among the injured.  I guess keeping optimistic and saying it is lucky she isn't among the victims is the way to go. I'm getting myself all worked up, I am sort of feeling the pain even though she is not my own daughter, the children were good friends of the daughter and are not themselves. It is so hard to deal with. You don't know what to say to the kids, you can't even chat freely without wondering whether you've said to much. I can just feel the tension in the air. She has not been badly hurt apart from I think a nail has gone right through top to bottom of her foot. She was literally about to come out into the foyer but stayed as everyone was piling out. So relieved she hasn't decided to leave 5 mins earlier otherwise I am sure she would have been blasted in the foyer. My hands are shaking as I type. Willow the families' puppy knows something's up so she has come to sit beside me. Amazing what dogs can sense. Then there's Jupiter the Siamese asleep in his cat basket. So sorry to make you all feel even worse its just as all of you say, it was on my chest and I needed to find a way to stop myself from drowning, I guess I found it.

A 9 year old girl shouldn't have to experience any of this, its so so sad. Then switching on the computer you see this on the latest news articles http://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/m...lman-abedi-says-son-is-innocent-a3547806.html . How can he even think his son is innocent? He has been found with explosives and has blasted himself along with many innocent adults and children with him. Despicable. Thank you for putting up with all this sh*t.:Bag


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

Nagini said:


> you do exactly as you wish, i won't be doing either..how on earth did we manage before facebook, twitter and the like? i'm not a fan of social media, never have, never will be.


Neither am I, I m of age when the only phone in our village was in a box at the end of the road, heck I still have a penpal albeit we email these days. Yes ill show respect but I'll be damned if I believe we should shut anything down due to the actions of these barbaric heathens


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

So, there are claims that the suicide bomber had been reported to the authorities on numerous occasions for suspicious behaviour, hope there are going to be some answers to this one!


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

I don't think, well I certainly hope, that there is not one single one of us on here who can say they have walked in the shoes of those poor people who have lost family, loved ones, friends in that horrific attack. The age of many of the victims make that attack doublely vile. How the hell do you ever come to terms with that? The fact that some of us choose to voice our revulsion verbally is in my view not disrespectful. Thank you


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## Nagini (Jan 13, 2014)

DT said:


> Neither am I, I m of age when the only phone in our village was in a box at the end of the road


i remember those days too. 
as you gathered, not a fan of social media, i agree with you that we shouldn't randomly knock anything offline, and we should not 'bow' to them. but realistically, where does it all end?


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

Nagini said:


> i think facebook, twitter and similar platforms should go offline in these instances, it would prevent an awful lot of misuse. i can see the arguments for keeping everything up and running, people trying to get hold of loved ones etc, generally, think they do more harm than good though for spreading hatred and fear in these instances.


I'm exactly the opposite, I'm no fan of them in normal circumstances but when something like this happens they come into their own. Who knows phone numbers these days? If there's ever a time they're worthwhile it's a time like this.


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

Nagini said:


> i remember those days too.
> as you gathered, not a fan of social media, i agree with you that we shouldn't randomly knock anything offline, and we should not 'bow' to them. but realistically, where does it all end?


Sadly, I don't think it will, I seriously fear this is the way of the world today. Believe you me, I'd prefer to step back in time, let's start with 60 years, I would only be an infant, but don't think these atrocities were heard of X


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## Nagini (Jan 13, 2014)

havoc said:


> I'm exactly the opposite, I'm no fan of them in normal circumstances but when something like this happens they come into their own. Who knows phone numbers these days? If there's ever a time they're worthwhile it's a time like this.


i agree and did mention that in my post, social media does have it's uses, i'm old school afraid though, i like to keep my phone by me for emergencies, thats it though. you won't find me on facebook, or twitter - only instagram, which i use for posting photo's..that's it though, i've not used it to communicate directly with other people, or likely to.


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

Nagini said:


> i agree and did mention that in my post, social media does have it's uses, i'm old school afraid though, i like to keep my phone by me for emergencies, thats it though. you won't find me on facebook, or twitter - only instagram, which i use for posting photo's..that's it though, i've not used it to communicate with other people over, or likely to.


I'm on FB, but not Twitter, now please share, what am I missing with this Instagran?


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## Lurch-er (Apr 6, 2017)

Armed police,paras on the street,the country is critical risk stepped up security at concerts etc ....... And then the goverment say carry on as normal


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## Bullbreedlover (Nov 14, 2014)

Something positive x

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-bombing-explosion-salman-abedi-a7752256.html


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

Nagini said:


> i like to keep my phone by me for emergencies


Of course you do, most young people are glued to their phones. How many do you suppose were dropped/lost on Monday night? How many of those youngsters do you think knew, off the tops of their heads and in shock while herded into a holding place, the phone numbers of the people who were desperate to hear from them? I can only speak of Facebook because that's the only one I had experience of at the time but it was invaluable.


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## Nagini (Jan 13, 2014)

DT said:


> I'm on FB, but not Twitter, now please share, what am I missing with this Instagran?


i use it for showing off my work/art - thats pretty much it really - more of a photo sharing site than anything else, pretty popular, some share there entire lives on there in photos, showing off pets, sharing memes etc others use it for reasons like me, so unless you like looking at photo's, your not really missing much


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

Nagini said:


> i use it for showing off my work/art - thats pretty much it really - more of a photo sharing site than anything else, pretty popular, some share there entire lives on there in photos, showing off pets, sharing memes etc others use it for reasons like me, so unless you like looking at photo's, your not really missing much


Oh I love looking at photographs especially animal ones


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## urbantigers (Apr 13, 2014)

My heart goes out to everyone affected by these events. I live in Manchester but thankfully do not know anyone at or near the arena at the time. The mood here is sombre and uneasy, but defiant also. It reminds me of the IRA bomb in Manchester - I was in the city centre when that went off and although received only very minor injuries it's not something I'll ever forget.


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## Jobeth (May 23, 2010)

Lurch-er said:


> Armed police,paras on the street,the country is critical risk stepped up security at concerts etc ....... And then the goverment say carry on as normal


Why not? I was in London when the IRA placed over 30 incendiary devices there in a year. Travelling on the tube often meant cancellations if there was an unattended package. I don't think you should take unnecessary risks, but you shouldn't put your life on hold either. Just make sure you know what to do in an emergency.


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

Jobeth said:


> Why not? I was in London when the IRA placed over 30 incendiary devices there in a year. Travelling on the tube often meant cancellations if there was an unattended package. I don't think you should take unnecessary risks, but you shouldn't put your life on hold either. Just make sure you know what to do in an emergency.


Bringing back memories, my bag was almost blown up at nottingham station.
Yes, we display the stiff upper lip carry on regardless


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

I don't want to take the thread back to politics as such but I owe @KittenKong an apology. You said about party feedback and this popped up on my feed on FB which records that Theresa May's immediate response (as opposed to the later one) was on the BBC 5 times more than Corbyn. I don't know the stats for Lib Dem et al but I guess yes, if you'd been watching the BBC you might think nobody had said a word! 
https://www.thecanary.co/2017/05/24...missing-bbc-yesterday-publishing-today-video/


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## Lurch-er (Apr 6, 2017)

I just mentioned all that extra stuff I fully agree carry on as normal,I was in London during the 7/7 bombings fortunately not injured but it was one of the worst days I've ever witnessed but yes I agree fully carry on as usual the uk is a great place to live and when anything happens like this we all pull together and bugger everything else


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

Jobeth said:


> Why not? I was in London when the IRA placed over 30 incendiary devices there in a year. Travelling on the tube often meant cancellations if there was an unattended package. I don't think you should take unnecessary risks, but you shouldn't put your life on hold either. Just make sure you know what to do in an emergency.





DT said:


> Bringing back memories, my bag was almost blown up at nottingham station.
> Yes, we display the stiff upper lip carry on regardless


When the train stations had packages which was very often, the train either were stopped or if that wasn't safe, ran through a very high speed. My dad said BR used to have so many complaints :Banghead For probably saving lives. Even in 7/7 sat, I think it was near Finsbury Park and realising what was happening as the news began to be broadcast there were people having a moan - they are the minority and most see it's sense and I imagine some of it is fear and a need to act normal - i.e complain about trains!


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

Lurch-er said:


> I just mentioned all that extra stuff I fully agree carry on as normal,I was in London during the 7/7 bombings fortunately not injured but it was one of the worst days I've ever witnessed but yes I agree fully carry on as usual the uk is a great place to live and when anything happens like this we all pull together and bugger everything else


Yes same here, it was a terrible day.

The only exception is snow. I maintain that if you want to grind this country to a stop drop a months' worth of snow. The internet would crash from stories of 'back in the day' and 'those young un' dunno what it's like' comments and mobile networks would fail because of instagram snow pics.


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

MollySmith said:


> Yes same here, it was a terrible day.
> 
> The only exception is snow. I maintain that if you want to grind this country to a stop drop a months' worth of snow. The internet would crash from stories of 'back in the day' and 'those young un' dunno what it's like' comments and mobile networks would fail because of instagram snow pics.


Doesnt work in scotland


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## Guest (May 24, 2017)

Read this whole article and ended up nearly in tears. Just shows how people in a bad situation themselves are sometimes way kinder than people in a perfect position in life such as the suicide bomber. 
http://metro.co.uk/2017/05/23/fundr...eld-dying-woman-in-manchester-attack-6655996/


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## Lurch-er (Apr 6, 2017)

The wrong sort of snow and that's it we knackered still wouldn't live anywhere else though best move my great grandad ever done was move here from France


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

wagg4life said:


> I guess the reason I said the whole thing about giving them what they want is my friend's daughter is among the injured.  I guess keeping optimistic and saying it is lucky she isn't among the victims is the way to go. I'm getting myself all worked up, I am sort of feeling the pain even though she is not my own daughter, the children were good friends of the daughter and are not themselves. It is so hard to deal with. You don't know what to say to the kids, you can't even chat freely without wondering whether you've said to much. I can just feel the tension in the air. She has not been badly hurt apart from I think a nail has gone right through top to bottom of her foot. She was literally about to come out into the foyer but stayed as everyone was piling out. So relieved she hasn't decided to leave 5 mins earlier otherwise I am sure she would have been blasted in the foyer. My hands are shaking as I type. Willow the families' puppy knows something's up so she has come to sit beside me. Amazing what dogs can sense. Then there's Jupiter the Siamese asleep in his cat basket. So sorry to make you all feel even worse its just as all of you say, it was on my chest and I needed to find a way to stop myself from drowning, I guess I found it.
> 
> A 9 year old girl shouldn't have to experience any of this, its so so sad. Then switching on the computer you see this on the latest news articles http://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/m...lman-abedi-says-son-is-innocent-a3547806.html . How can he even think his son is innocent? He has been found with explosives and has blasted himself along with many innocent adults and children with him. Despicable. Thank you for putting up with all this sh*t.:Bag


Oh sweetheart I am so so sorry. My friend and his daughter were separated, and thankfully reunited and she should be home this evening recovering from minor injuries but how she copes mentally is going to be harder to know. Can I share the link below with you? I found it helpful. Take care and if it helps to talk in confidence here then do.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-40011787


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

DT said:


> Doesnt work in scotland


Or indeed Newcastle, my aunt used to entertain me with stories of walking on the tops of cars in snow!


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## Guest (May 24, 2017)

Thank you for this @MollySmith I have explained enough for them to understand without the gruesome details. As a dad I hate hiding stuff from them.  I hope when she comes out of hospital everything will calm down.


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## Lurch-er (Apr 6, 2017)

When my kids were little they were very aware of the circle of life,being a single dad with three kids I used to sit them down and explain stuff like this to them it was never an easy thing to do they then used to go to school and talk to their teacher about what ever it was I used to get quite good feedback from the teachers


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## Honeys mum (Jan 11, 2013)

Just saw this, surely some one must have know something.

Father and brother of Manchester bomber arrested in Libya


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## Creativecat (Dec 20, 2016)

Honeys mum said:


> Just saw this, surely some one must have know something.
> 
> Father and brother of Manchester bomber arrested in Libya


Yes me too
In tripoli . Wht there claiming is breathtaking . I think more is gonna come out regarding this animal .
Apperantly he wasn't on the watch list even after suspicions raised . I know the mosque where he went
Was concerned from sky sources I don't know if they confided in the police . That's breathtaking I think the intelligence services have alot of explaining especially if one of my family was caught up in this terrible act I'd want to know .
Can't be confirmed but the New York post have images of the death scene and the device used battery's aswell including the trigger device how the hell did this happen 
When were supposed to be sharing information with our so called allies in this nonsensical special relationship


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## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

MollySmith said:


> I don't want to take the thread back to politics as such but I owe @KittenKong an apology. You said about party feedback and this popped up on my feed on FB which records that Theresa May's immediate response (as opposed to the later one) was on the BBC 5 times more than Corbyn. I don't know the stats for Lib Dem et al but I guess yes, if you'd been watching the BBC you might think nobody had said a word!
> https://www.thecanary.co/2017/05/24...missing-bbc-yesterday-publishing-today-video/


But surely that isn't surprising given she is the prime minister still.


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## katie200 (May 11, 2009)

This was so heartbreaking, when I heard about it on the news it made me cry, my thoughts are with the people concerned and there families who are still looking or have injured and have lost loved one. I was reading about those homeless guys who went in regardless of their own safety and helped the injured and some who passed away, it made me think they were earths angels that night, and it just goes to show that even if they had hard lives they had their humanity and kind hearts. I think they touched a lot of hearts, not just those who they helped, or reached out too, but those who heard about it, they kinda give you hope in people in the mist of something so tragic and heartbreaking. I hope all pet forum who live in Manchester are okay and their friends and family too. 

I'm keeping you all in my thoughts. (((hugs))) xxxx


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## Dr Pepper (Jan 17, 2017)

rottiepointerhouse said:


> But surely that isn't surprising given she is the prime minister still.


It beggars belief some people can sink so low as to cry political unfairness under such circumstances. As you say Mrs May is the Prime Minister, if this happened in the USA you would expect Mr Trump to be far more reported than Mrs Clinton. Or in France who would you be expecting to hear speak Emmanuel Marcon or Marine Le Pen?


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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

Honeys mum said:


> Just saw this, surely some one must have know something.
> 
> Father and brother of Manchester bomber arrested in Libya


His older brother is said to be one of the people arrested in Manchester too. Sounds like the whole family are suspected.

His sister has been 'justifying' what he did in interview as well.


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## Charity (Apr 17, 2013)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4539428/The-shattering-human-stories-Manchester-victims.html

Reading about these poor families has just left me in tears.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

MilleD said:


> His older brother is said to be one of the people arrested in Manchester too. Sounds like the whole family are suspected.
> 
> His sister has been 'justifying' what he did in interview as well.


I read the parents came here as refugees (genuine or otherwise I don't know) ; but what a way to treat your host country.


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## Dr Pepper (Jan 17, 2017)

Calvine said:


> I read the parents came here as refugees (genuine or otherwise I don't know) ; but what a way to treat your host country.


This is what all those that say how wonderful a multicultural society is miss, some cultures are so far apart on many issues they simply can't coexist. I think the UK has been a remarkably tolerant country, so far.


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

Dr Pepper said:


> It beggars belief some people can sink so low as to cry political unfairness under such circumstances. As you say Mrs May is the Prime Minister, if this happened in the USA you would expect Mr Trump to be far more reported than Mrs Clinton. Or in France who would you be expecting to hear speak Emmanuel Marcon or Marine Le Pen?


Yes true good point. Also @rottiepointerhouse

On another point, I've arrived at my part time job and we're having a minutes silence at 11am. I think that's such a lovely gesture and a collection which my employer is going to match £1 for £1.


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

On the point of donations there is this -

Meanwhile, Greater Manchester police have warned of fraudulent fund-raising pages on the internet, urging well-wishers to only donate to *the official JustGiving page, which has now raised well over £1m.*

I can't believe there are those prepared to make personal gain out of such a tragedy but there are apparently such donation sites springing up.


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## stockwellcat. (Jun 5, 2015)

The Queen has gone to Manchester Children's hospital to see staff consultants and those that treated the victims and the 14 child victims that are still in a critical condition in hospital.


----------



## DoodlesRule (Jul 7, 2011)

kimthecat said:


> I well remember the IRA attacks as a teenager in the 70s , I _still _don't stand next to a waste bin on stations.
> It became normal to be evacuated from stores and at work.


You don't even have to go back to the 70's - 20 years ago our office was just below the army recruiting office. When we moved in one of their officers visited to discuss security, evacuation and what we should do in the event of a bomb.



wagg4life said:


> I guess the reason I said the whole thing about giving them what they want is my friend's daughter is among the injured.  I guess keeping optimistic and saying it is lucky she isn't among the victims is the way to go. I'm getting myself all worked up, I am sort of feeling the pain even though she is not my own daughter, the children were good friends of the daughter and are not themselves. It is so hard to deal with. You don't know what to say to the kids, you can't even chat freely without wondering whether you've said to much. I can just feel the tension in the air. She has not been badly hurt apart from I think a nail has gone right through top to bottom of her foot. She was literally about to come out into the foyer but stayed as everyone was piling out. So relieved she hasn't decided to leave 5 mins earlier otherwise I am sure she would have been blasted in the foyer. My hands are shaking as I type. Willow the families' puppy knows something's up so she has come to sit beside me. Amazing what dogs can sense. Then there's Jupiter the Siamese asleep in his cat basket. So sorry to make you all feel even worse its just as all of you say, it was on my chest and I needed to find a way to stop myself from drowning, I guess I found it.
> 
> A 9 year old girl shouldn't have to experience any of this, its so so sad. Then switching on the computer you see this on the latest news articles http://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/m...lman-abedi-says-son-is-innocent-a3547806.html . How can he even think his son is innocent? He has been found with explosives and has blasted himself along with many innocent adults and children with him. Despicable. Thank you for putting up with all this sh*t.:Bag


I hope your friends little girl has a speedy recovery. No child should have to see/go through such things


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## Jesthar (May 16, 2011)

DoodlesRule said:


> You don't even have to go back to the 70's - 20 years ago our office was just below the army recruiting office. When we moved in one of their officers visited to discuss security, evacuation and what we should do in the event of a bomb.


My school got evacuated mid exam season once because of a bomb threat. Thankfully it was one of the many hoaxes (and a nice day!)


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## DoodlesRule (Jul 7, 2011)

Jesthar said:


> My school got evacuated mid exam season once because of a bomb threat. Thankfully it was one of the many hoaxes (and a nice day!)


I was a child in the 70's and the only way the IRA bombings affected me personally was that parents wouldn't let us go on a school trip to London. Whilst it was awful what they did I really don't think its comparable with ISIS, there is no way to talk a peace solution with them and never will be


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## Jobeth (May 23, 2010)

I'm not sure the victims of the IRA would agree with you. They were setting off bombs for decades and they only just found the body of one of the 'disappeared'.


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

Lurch-er said:


> When my kids were little they were very aware of the circle of life,being a single dad with three kids I used to sit them down and explain stuff like this to them it was never an easy thing to do they then used to go to school and talk to their teacher about what ever it was I used to get quite good feedback from the teachers


Raising awareness without living life in terror. I have discussed what happened with both girls. Last Monday we (their dad and me) were " mean and horrible " for saying we would have to think about eldest going to an event in London later in the year. Their dad just said no, I said we would see what the situation was nearer the time. Discussed with her group leader on collection at 8:30pm Monday, who thought would it would be fine. Now eldest says she doesn't want to go, and realises that sometimes parents saying no is to protect them without having to go into too many details.

But keeping it real and in context is needed as well. As I talked through with them, these events are devastating when they happen, but are exceptionally rare. From a crowd of 20,000, there were 20 dead. The following day a lorry driver was arrested for causing a crash which killed 5 people in the same car, a quarter as many dead from a random accident as deliberately targeted. Yesterday evening I nearly witnessesed the little brother of a schoolfriend being hit by a car as he ran out to cross the road behind a parked school bus, nearly getting hit ( maybe 6 inches to spare) by car coming the other way.

I guess it's being aware, and cautious, without being scared to even step in a car or let your young child walk to collect their big brother from school.


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

I had to share this with you all, too good not too or maybe too alarming that someone can make this claim..

http://metro.co.uk/2017/05/24/ex-ukip-mep-calls-for-death-penalty-for-suicide-bombers-6658334/


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

wagg4life said:


> Thank you for this @MollySmith I have explained enough for them to understand without the gruesome details. As a dad I hate hiding stuff from them.  I hope when she comes out of hospital everything will calm down.


How are things with you today?


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## kimthecat (Aug 11, 2009)

MollySmith said:


> I had to share this with you all, too good not too or maybe too alarming that someone can make this claim..
> 
> http://metro.co.uk/2017/05/24/ex-ukip-mep-calls-for-death-penalty-for-suicide-bombers-6658334/


 i think this is more suitable for the General election thread .


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

MollySmith said:


> I had to share this with you all, too good not too or maybe too alarming that someone can make this claim..
> 
> http://metro.co.uk/2017/05/24/ex-ukip-mep-calls-for-death-penalty-for-suicide-bombers-6658334/


Bless you MollySmith - that's the first time I've laughed out loud since Monday night


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## Nagini (Jan 13, 2014)

MollySmith said:


> How are things with you today?


they were removed for trolling


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

Nagini said:


> they were removed for trolling


Oh goodness, I genuinely thought they were okay.. oh no  that's so horrible.


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## Colliebarmy (Sep 27, 2012)

About time HMG let loose the dogs (Mi6, Mi5, GCHQ, SAS, assorted "spooks" without fear of stupid human rights campaigners) and posted big cash rewards for info leading to prosecution, there should be all out total war on those intent on disrupting the way of life in a country who has given so many of then a safe haven.

Retribution should be harsh and swift


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

kimthecat said:


> i think this is more suitable for the General election thread .


Oh yes, that thread too!!


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## DoodlesRule (Jul 7, 2011)

Nagini said:


> they were removed for trolling


 Really? WTH is wrong with some pople


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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

Pretty worrying bbc interview with fawzi haffar who is a trustee of the mosque albedi went to tonight on the news. 

Said it's not his responsibility to check issues with members if they had been reported to intelligence agencies.


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## Goblin (Jun 21, 2011)

Colliebarmy said:


> About time HMG let loose the dogs (Mi6, Mi5, GCHQ, SAS, assorted "spooks" without fear of stupid human rights campaigners


Human rights protect you, not simply others.



> in a country who has given so many of then a safe haven.


Most terrorists responsible for attacks are british, born in this country.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Goblin said:


> Most terrorists responsible for attacks are british, born in this country


Of course, being a British passport holder does not guarantee that they will ever have British values or loyalty to this country. Yes, many have parents who claimed asylum and have received education here, medical care...the lot.


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## Mercgirl (Feb 18, 2017)

Just wanted to share the words below with you.

I'm just in from a night shift in Manchester city centre and I have never felt so welcomed and valued in my role. We were given some food by locals and had so many people stop and just say thank-you. It was a humbling experience. Thank you to everyone who said a kind word or shared a smile. It meant a lot. 
The memorial of flowers at St. Anne's Square is so moving. In the midst of a city in full party flow, even at two in the morning, the square was silent, despite there being a steady flow of people coming to see the flowers, baloons and messages left in memory of the dead. I was moved to tears, not just by the horror of what the flowers represent, but also by the way the people of Manchester showed such respect.

Those are words from an old biking buddy of ours, who is a traffic cop in Manchester.


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## LinznMilly (Jun 24, 2011)

Goblin said:


> Human rights protect you, not simply others.
> 
> Most terrorists responsible for attacks are british, born in this country.


Glad I'm not the only one to see this. It's not just the tragedy of suffering felt the victims and their families, even though they must take priority. It's also just the kind of excuse racists (closet or otherwise) want.

Had to pull up a relative yesterday because she shared racist bigotry on FB. Never felt so alone as I did then because while she posted it, I suspect ,most, if not all of my family, would agree with her. It did, however, make me see the errors of my ways when I was younger, and sent a friend and her Asian partner a long overdue apology for being as narrow-minded and bigoted as the rest of them, which cleared the air and opened doors (she's far more gracious and forgiving than I would have been).


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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

Goblin said:


> Human rights protect you, not simply others.
> 
> Most terrorists responsible for attacks are british, born in this country.


Do you think they see themselves as British?


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## cows573 (Apr 20, 2017)

I grew up in Northern Ireland during the height of the troubles...

I and my family, did alter our actions in order to stay safe... It was practical, where we lived to do so.

We were 'banned' from walking or cycling to school. They gave up giving us new buses for our school as they just got petrol bombed.

The first year, first day 'talk' covered what to do if you are attacked....

I, and my family, thankfully lived through many bombs. Unfortunately, other members of my family were not so fortunate from attacks...

The difference in Northern Ireland that prevented attacks such as Manchester, was that they valued their own lives. I don't know how we can prevent a suicide bomber with any allegiance causing an attack such as this again...

Please remember, Islam does allow jihad towards someone who threatens the faith of Islam. However, as a country that allows the freedom of religion, we should not be a target, and innocent civilians and children Never should be!

These are bad and mis-guided people, doing bad things, in the name of religion.


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## Jannor (Oct 26, 2013)

I work in Manchester City Centre and have been in all week - I'm totally drained with the shock, emotion and stress of it, as are most of us. It seems everyone in Manchester knows someone who died 

I was at St Ann's Square for the minute silence - everyone was in tears, it was very moving. It was already almost full with flowers then, I don't think you'll be able to get into it for flowers come Tuesday. Massive queues in Tesco from Thursday onwards with people buying flowers and they were giving away tealights for the memorials.

Tuesday was difficult, there were people running past the office screaming at one point, it was when they evacuated the Arndale Centre, someone was arrested and they re-opened it after a couple of hours. We could have gone home but we said we'd stay. 

It's become normal to see Special Forces wandering about the shops with machine guns (I think they're machine guns anyway). SAS have been around too, on all the raids and there have been 3 or 4 a day around Greater Manchester but only 1 in the actual centre. More Police than people here on Tuesday and Wednesday but people started to come in again from Thursday. 

We have a young guy who works in the office next door, he usually gets the train in but they've given him a free parking space for now. The trains are unbelievable packed with Victoria Station closed but because he's Asian he had 3 empty seats next to him  

There is talk about how it happened too - the Arena is over Victoria and is usually policed well, did they relax it because it was late? Maybe no-one was watching the CCTV cameras at that time? It was a warm night and he seems to have just walked in (and he had to walk through Victoria first and up the steps to the arena foyer) with a padded coat on and a rucksack? It is a public area and would've been busy but doubt anyone else had coats on .


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

Jannor said:


> There is talk about how it happened too - the Arena is over Victoria and is usually policed well, did they relax it because it was late? Maybe no-one was watching the CCTV cameras at that time?


They are all 'what ifs' and I do take your point about him wearing a coat on a warm night. Maybe there was a time that would have been noticed as unusual but with so many homeless on the streets it isn't such an unusual sight. It made me think and I'm not so sure I'd see it as unusual as once I might.

I do feel for you. I know others in the same situation - some still not able to get back into work because their offices are still closed. The longer they have to stay away the more difficult it will be for them but go back they will just as tube and bus staff went back after the London bombings. Every one of them must have had to overcome extreme anxiety to get life back to normal and they got little public acknowledgement.

I'm determined to go to something (anything) at the arena at the earliest possible opportunity. Will I be anxious? Strangely not in the arena itself. Presuming that the bomber had researched his target he knew the arena security was too tight and he wouldn't get in - that's why he did it where he did. Will I use the City Rooms exit anytime soon? Not so sure on that one but of course there's no logic in that


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## Jannor (Oct 26, 2013)

havoc said:


> They are all 'what ifs' and I do take your point about him wearing a coat on a warm night. Maybe there was a time that would have been noticed as unusual but with so many homeless on the streets it isn't such an unusual sight. It made me think and I'm not so sure I'd see it as unusual as once I might.
> 
> I do feel for you. I know others in the same situation - some still not able to get back into work because their offices are still closed. The longer they have to stay away the more difficult it will be for them but go back they will just as tube and bus staff went back after the London bombings. Every one of them must have had to overcome extreme anxiety to get life back to normal and they got little public acknowledgement.
> 
> I'm determined to go to something (anything) at the arena at the earliest possible opportunity. Will I be anxious? Strangely not in the arena itself. Presuming that the bomber had researched his target he knew the arena security was too tight and he wouldn't get in - that's why he did it where he did. Will I use the City Rooms exit anytime soon? Not so sure on that one but of course there's no logic in that


Yes, I did think of the homeless too re the coat ... unfortunately so many of them. We will wait to hear what the powers that be say.

Some people are very frightened - some took the view that with so many Police around it was safe enough. And a lot o f us worked in Manchester when the IRA bomb took out half the city so have sort of been here before, although this was worse as so many died and were injured.

The Great Manchester run has gone ahead today - there was talk of cancelling it earlier in the week, so its very much an "open as usual" attitude. I'll go through Victoria twice a day once its open again - a lot have been off work because of transport but I've been able to go into Piccadilly.

The funerals will start to be held soon  I just can't imagine what those poor families are going through.


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

Here's something written by the father of a nurse who was at the concert and stayed on when requested to help. It's a great message that when something does go wrong there are always those who will help, that we can pull together and that we will, as a society, keep going.

_There's been much in the news about the NHS' response to Manchester. The stories of HCP's responding and it is commendable BUT..._

_Let's not forget the first responders, those first aiders and off duty HCP's who were in situ and who responded immediately and fearlessly despite their own shock, injuries and experience. Also to The paramedics who work day in and out with such carnage without thanks or praise.

These people are not in the news, not seeking the news. These people are my daughter, my colleagues, my heroes because it's just what they do.

They are our heart, our conscience and I praise them today.

We are now slowly as a family picking up the pieces, with love, a million cups of tea and the support of other selfless colleagues, yet what we as a family are experiencing is not a 10th of the horror and agony of others. We were fortunate and although in pain, we are proud.

My heart and my tears, for I have nothing else to give, are with each and every one those injured and those now absent. Whilst the world carries on (as it must) whilst your world has ground to a halt (as it should) My thoughts are with those reeling, mentally wounded, confounded and confused.

For what it is worth my family and I say this... 'we see you' , we see you and we won't let go'_


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## Jannor (Oct 26, 2013)

Yes, it must have been horrendous for them having to deal with that. I think someone mentioned the fund will also be used for counselling for those who need it but am not sure about that. I hope it does and includes these people who helped so much.

I am related to a paramedic who was there but haven't seen him yet - he is ex forces so he could have seen similar injuries before - doubt that would have made it any easier though


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## Jannor (Oct 26, 2013)

Everyone is having the Manchester Bee tattoo and the tattooists are donating the money to the appeal - one of the girls at work had one done yesterday. This is off a facebook post from a local tattooist that made me smile:

"Tattooing friends.
I'm loving the Manchester tattoo appeal & I'd like to try and do my bit. I need an alternative way to try and raise money rather than doing the bees. It's not because I'm a prima-donna, it's because my fingers are knackered and tend to lock up after lining for any length of time. I could maybe just offer a full day's tattooing? 
Who's going to moan if I try and raise money a different way? I know you're all a set of fickle cocknockers."


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## Mercgirl (Feb 18, 2017)

Jannor said:


> Yes, it must have been horrendous for them having to deal with that. I think someone mentioned the fund will also be used for counselling for those who need it but am not sure about that. I hope it does and includes these people who helped so much.
> 
> I am related to a paramedic who was there but haven't seen him yet - he is ex forces so he could have seen similar injuries before - doubt that would have made it any easier though


I don't think anyone from the emergency services who had to deal with the aftermath will be unaffected by it. How can they be? How could they ever have had to deal with anything as horrific as that? I don't think it matters what their training, background or length of service are, they are human beings, with emotions and feelings, and they have just seen horrors that most of us will luckily never have to witness.

They deserve our deepest thanks, our utmost respect, and our heartfelt empathy.


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## Bullbreedlover (Nov 14, 2014)

I just got sent this on facebook

https://mic.com/articles/151681/ove...of-course-you-didn-t-hear-about-it#.orsG66zAr


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## Jannor (Oct 26, 2013)

I shared this earlier in the week:

This needs to be seen by as many people as possible.


Hundreds of Muslim children marched to the Manchester Arena tonight...
MANCHESTEREVENINGNEWS.CO.UK

it was on the MEN Facebook page - http://www.manchestereveningnews.co...ws/muslims-march-to-manchester-arena-13100687


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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

Bullbreedlover said:


> I just got sent this on facebook
> 
> https://mic.com/articles/151681/ove...of-course-you-didn-t-hear-about-it#.orsG66zAr


They belong to the sect of Islam which the shopkeeper murdered by a fellow muslim in Glasgow followed.


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## KittenKong (Oct 30, 2015)




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## MilleD (Feb 15, 2016)

KittenKong said:


> View attachment 312443


Two wrongs don't make a right you know.


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## KittenKong (Oct 30, 2015)

MilleD said:


> Two wrongs don't make a right you know.


Didn't you see the comment at the bottom? "Terrorism comes in many packages".


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## Honeys mum (Jan 11, 2013)

Well done Manchester, you did Manchester and everyone proud today. It was very emotional to watch on T.V this morning.

Defiance of Manchester: Thousands take to streets for run | Daily Mail Online


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## Charity (Apr 17, 2013)

There isn't a day goes by when I don't think about the tragedy in Manchester, the victims and their families, the people who helped and the members of the emergency services and feel real pain in my heart. I feel so very proud of the people of Manchester and admire how they have risen up to support each other and show solidarity, it must be so awful for them all. I also feel extremely angry about the fact that the Muslim community who marched in support in London have been ignored by the news media....that's typical.


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## rona (Aug 18, 2011)




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## suewhite (Oct 31, 2009)

I don't do hugs but if I did I would hug him, it must have took guts to stand there.


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## Charity (Apr 17, 2013)

Well done that man, that's lovely.


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