# new puppy sleeping outside



## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

we are getting a new puppy 10-12 weeks old in about 3 month
He will be sleeping outside so far to make him settle in i am going to be putting his kennel in a large shed dog bed toys and t shirts ect so he can smell us 
the shed will be insulated and have puppy pads in or the door open to a small enclosed garden area for him to do his wee/poo 
we will check on him last thing at night ie 11pm and first thing in the morning 5am/6am he will be brought inside for the day and back out to his kennel at about 9.30pm 
any one have any tips how to settle him in the best we are getting a spaniel i know he will cry bark for a few nights but hopefully he will learn to love his new home 
i did think about some straw in there to keep him warmer or a hot water botlel any other ideas please

thanks x


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

Why does he have to be outside at night?

Toilet training will be very difficult if he is going to be outside on his own from 11pm until 5am, as you won't know if he needs to go out. Leaving the door open won't train him, which may cause issues when he is in the house during the day. He is going to be very confused and lonely.


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

Lurcherlad said:


> Why does he have to be outside at night?
> 
> Toilet training will be very difficult if he is going to be outside on his own from 11pm until 5am, as you won't know if he needs to go out. Leaving the door open won't train him, which may cause issues when he is in the house during the day. He is going to be very confused and lonely.


Absolutely 100% agree with this - it will be very cold and he'll have absolutely no idea why he's shut outside part fo the time and inside other times and it will be very confusing.

Are you planning to put him out there straight away - he'll be very little to be outside by himself (most kennelled dogs do have other dogs around for company), not to mention just coming up to winter.

House training will be a complete nightmare ...... what if he gets stolen / escapes / or howls the place down all night

Sorry but imho I can't imagine why anyone would get a pup / dog and then banish it outside when it's still a baby


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

You are going to put a tiny little puppy, that has just been taken away from all he/she knows and put her/him outside at night?
Are you jesting? 
It's going to be hard and frightening for the poor thing enough without being banished to outside every night.
Please, please re-think this.


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

the breeder keeps them outside all year round on a farm and they recommended this approach to us i also used to live on a farm and dogs where always outside at night thats why i said straw ect to keep him warm


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

nightdreamer said:


> new puppy 10-12 weeks old in about 3 month


He will be three months old (max) when you get him in December and you will keep him outside? In winter? What are your reasons for this?


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

he will be in an insulated dog kennel in an insulated shed with lots of bedding we may leave it till spring 
tbh the place where he will sleep will prob be warmer than the cold kitchen with no central heating


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

just to add i have checked with 3 vets who all agreed this would be fine


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## Rafa (Jun 18, 2012)

If he will have been recently separated from his Mother and siblings and finds himself outside, alone, cold and in the dark, he may well shriek the neighbourhood down.

How will those living around you feel about that?


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

nightdreamer said:


> the breeder keeps them outside all year round on a farm and they recommended this approach to us i also used to live on a farm and dogs where always outside at night thats why i said straw ect to keep him warm


Working dogs, kept with others for company is an entirely different matter

Why would you want to get a dog & keep them outside?


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

So long as it's cared for, fed, watered, loved, stimulated etc etc.
To a dog, a bed in a warm, sheltered kennel is no different to having a bed in the utility room/ dining room/ in the basement etc.
and it would not be outside 24/7
i know lots of people who have dogs sleep outside from day 1


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## kimnevie (Aug 6, 2016)

nightdreamer said:


> So long as it's cared for, fed, watered, loved, stimulated etc etc.
> To a dog, a bed in a warm, sheltered kennel is no different to having a bed in the utility room/ dining room/ in the basement etc.
> and it would not be outside 24/7
> *i know lots of people who have dogs sleep outside from day 1*


You might be better off asking those people for advice on this.


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

i have but they said just let them bark wine and cry and slap them when they bite i would never do that thats why i asked on here to get other peoples opinions does noone else keep a dog outside at night i have my reasons but not going into all that 
my neighbours used to breed dogs they had outdoor cages all year round


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## Rafa (Jun 18, 2012)

nightdreamer said:


> i have but they said just let them bark wine and cry and slap them when they bite i would never do that thats why i asked on here to get other peoples opinions does noone else keep a dog outside at night i have my reasons but not going into all that
> my neighbours used to breed dogs they had outdoor cages all year round


Did they? Not something I would ever have done.

I don't personally have an issue with dogs living outside. One of my close neighbours has two Working Springers and two Working Cockers living outside. Their accommodation is modern, heated and scrupulously clean.

However, they have each other for company. Your problem could well be that you are going to leave a young pup outside, in the dark and totally alone. It seems a little unkind.

To me, leaving him in your kitchen/utility room, crated is a better option than leaving him outside.

He will definitely need some form of heat if you do go down that route.


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

thank u so much yes a heated garage or something may be a better alternative 
i know loads of people who are so strict on there dogs its sad 
i will also look into a create in the ut room x


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

500w Kennel Heater Puppy Litter Dog Heat Lamp Infra Red

on ebay this looks like it could be useful x


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## tantrumbean (Aug 23, 2011)

Why can't he just live inside? Surely he's a member of the family and I suspect you wouldn't put any human children in the shed overnight?


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

nightdreamer said:


> i have but they said just let them bark wine and cry and slap them when they bite i would never do that thats why i asked on here to get other peoples opinions does noone else keep a dog outside at night i have my reasons but not going into all that
> my neighbours used to breed dogs they had outdoor cages all year round


No, I'm not aware of a single person who posts on here regularly that keeps a pet dog outside overnight

As already said, working dogs, kept in groups in kennels, is an entirely different matter than taking a single pup, just separated from mum & siblings & leaving them outside in the cold - and alone! - for approx 9 hours

You still haven't said why pup can't be inside?


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

tantrumbean said:


> Why can't he just live inside? Surely he's a member of the family and I suspect you wouldn't put any human children in the shed overnight?


because he is an animal not a human you cant compare the two


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## tantrumbean (Aug 23, 2011)

nightdreamer said:


> because he is an animal not a human you cant compare the two


He still is (or should be as far as I'm concerned) a family member. Like others have said, if it was working dogs, fair enough, but this is a young pup on his own!


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

nightdreamer said:


> just to add i have checked with 3 vets who all agreed this would be fine


Unicorn specialists?


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

This has to be a wind up surely?


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

Siskin said:


> This has to be a wind up surely?


Makes you wonder in light of recent events - hard to give the benefit of doubt but tryjng!


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

we had a very bad experience with a pup who had been abused in the past living inside it scared me 
what about a create whats that all about could he be in that in our bedroom or something would he cry bark in our bedroom obviously if he has been taken out ect
do i have to get a create for downstairs as well to pop him in when we are eating ect before he is trained i dont want him grabbing the kids food 
i would like to keep him inside we will have full lino throughout the house so cleaning is no problem 
just worried something will go wrong like last time but i suppose all dogs are different like people
everyone else i spoke to just said put him outside i thought thats what most people did till i joined on here xx
any advise is welcome thank you eveyone for opening my eyes to all this x


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

Lilylass said:


> Makes you wonder in light of recent events - hard to give the benefit of doubt but tryjng!


not sure what recent events you mean ? thank you


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

Siskin said:


> This has to be a wind up surely?


no i just wanted advice a lot of people i know just leave the dogs outside roaming the streets getting in bins we live in a shit area tbh 1 dog even strangled itself because it was left out in a dangerous place
i thought most people just kept there dogs outside at night ?


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

havoc said:


> Unicorn specialists?


i came on here for advice i find this rather rude 
no its was vets who advised me there is nothing wrong with leaving a dog outside from day 1


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## tantrumbean (Aug 23, 2011)

Medically, it might be fine provided he's warm enough, etc. If he would be happy and settled is a completely different matter!


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## tantrumbean (Aug 23, 2011)

And what exactly happened to the last pup?


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2016)

Why get a dog just to put it outside? How will you toilet train him.


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## Laney_Lemons (Mar 23, 2016)

Don't agree personally with them living outside however i do know a lot of people mainly farmers that have dogs that live outside... possibly quite happily (so they say) 

However i don't understand your reasons tbh, a previous dog scared you so you don't want him in at night but its OK through the day?? mmmm


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2016)

Elaine2016 said:


> Don't agree personally with them living outside however i do know a lot of people mainly farmers that have dogs that live outside... possibly quite happily (so they say)
> 
> However i don't understand your reasons tbh, a previous dog scared you so you don't want him in at night but its OK through the day?? mmmm


My thought exactly, poor puppy will be taken away from mum and siblings and dumped outside at night.


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## Rafa (Jun 18, 2012)

nightdreamer said:


> we had a very bad experience with a pup who had been abused in the past living inside it scared me
> what about a create whats that all about could he be in that in our bedroom or something would he cry bark in our bedroom obviously if he has been taken out ect
> do i have to get a create for downstairs as well to pop him in when we are eating ect before he is trained i dont want him grabbing the kids food
> i would like to keep him inside we will have full lino throughout the house so cleaning is no problem
> ...


Are you seriously saying you want this pup outside at night because you're afraid of it?

What on Earth do you think is going to happen?


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

nightdreamer said:


> i came on here for advice i find this rather rude
> no its was vets who advised me there is nothing wrong with leaving a dog outside from day 1


Terribly sorry I'm sure. Just seems a touch strange to look for advice from strangers on the internet if you have a panel of vets on hand. I might consult one - two if I wanted a second opinion but three does seem a touch excessive for a simple question over a dog you don't have.


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

nightdreamer said:


> not sure what recent events you mean ? thank you


 I was replying to siskin about an incident on here last week


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

nightdreamer said:


> we had a very bad experience with a pup who had been abused in the past living inside it scared me
> what about a create whats that all about could he be in that in our bedroom or something would he cry bark in our bedroom obviously if he has been taken out ect
> do i have to get a create for downstairs as well to pop him in when we are eating ect before he is trained i dont want him grabbing the kids food
> i would like to keep him inside we will have full lino throughout the house so cleaning is no problem
> ...


What was this bad experience?
What would you consider would be the 'something has gone wrong'?
Why are you happy with a puppy indoors during the day but not at night?

If you are so scared of a puppy that it must be outside at night, how are you going to cope in the day?

Puppies mouth, and if anything like my boy can get rather persistent, and it hurts - how will you cope with that?


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

tantrumbean said:


> And what exactly happened to the last pup?


i dont want to go over all that would take me all day


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## Laney_Lemons (Mar 23, 2016)

my 10month old just ripped open my sofa yesterday  and still is touch and go with his toileting ....


at night they are a breeze ....


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

if everyone must know i woke to my dead puppy next to me i was not scared of the dog just scared that something would happen again and i would wake and see that
and no its was not me that caused him to die it was where i got him from he had internal injures 
but thanks for making me go over that
i did ask about a create a few posts back but as everyone decided to just ignore that and pick me to bits


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## tantrumbean (Aug 23, 2011)

nightdreamer said:


> if everyone must know i woke to my dead puppy next to me i was not scared of the dog just scared that something would happen again and i would wake and see that
> and no its was not me that caused him to die it was where i got him from he had internal injures
> but thanks for making me go over that
> i did ask about a create a few posts back but as everyone decided to just ignore that and pick me to bits


But surely if you are worried, you'd want to be able to keep an eye on him rather than him being in the shed? And yes, crates are great if properly trained and the dogs usually learn to love their crate very quickly


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## Moobli (Feb 20, 2012)

Hi - my husband is a shepherd and all (bar two) of his working dogs live outside in kennels. We currently have two pups (4 months now) that have lived outside from day one. If we get a singleton pup though they live in the house for the first few months until they are old enough to cope with being alone at night. 

A pup being taken from its mother and litter mates is likely to be scared and lonely initially, so why not crate train your puppy and have him in the house - at least for the few first months of his life - and then gradually acclimatise him to life in a kennel if that is what you prefer. However, I would only really consider kennelling outdoors if you have more than one dog.


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## Laney_Lemons (Mar 23, 2016)

its hard to get a full picture with how you were portraying the situation.. you want advice but only gave us bits and pieces of the full picture....

I don't think putting your new pup outside will relieve you of your worries and anxiety, to be honest it would increase them if it was me...why not just downstairs in the kitchen or living room... in a crate ... bed in the landing? you don't need them sleeping beside you 

No matter where you found your last pup it would have been traumatic, it just so happened it was beside you that morning


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## Sarah1983 (Nov 2, 2011)

tantrumbean said:


> Why can't he just live inside? Surely he's a member of the family and I suspect you wouldn't put any human children in the shed overnight?


I'd actually be more inclined to lock the toddler in the shed at night than the dog lol.

If you live in a built up area then leaving the pup to bark and whine all night is really going to endear you to your neighbours. You run the risk of pup being stolen, escaping, poisoned, injured too. Personally I would not be leaving him outside where he can get into all sorts of trouble. And yes, dogs DO see a difference between being shut out in the garden and a crate in the house. Or at least mine certainly have. My current one loves his crate and while he loves being out in the garden if you shut him out there he's miserable.


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

That must have been an upsetting experience to find your pup had died beside you during the night, but unless it was something specific to do with the pup sleeping beside you, then it's unlikely to happen again. However leaving an eight week old pup totally alone for 8-9 hours in a shed however well insulated is not very kind imo. Anything could happen during the night and you would not be aware of it. Do you have rats in your area for instance? If you're pup is a small dog, a rat could seriously injure it.

My advice, for what it's worth, is to have your puppy in a crate either beside your bed, on the landing or in the kitchen during the night. This will allow you to hear if the puppy is distressed and need to toilet during the night and attend to him and to begin toilet training. You must allow your pup to get used to and like a crate and feel it is a safe place not a cage. There is plenty of information on this forum and others on how to do that.
What you do with your pup when he is an adult is entirely up to you, but dogs are social creatures and bond with their family and prefer to spend the night in your company. How ever some dogs do like spending time outdoors, farm bred collies often do even when in pet homes, but I would prefer my dogs to be be in the house where I know they are safe and secure.


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

thank you


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## kimnevie (Aug 6, 2016)

You still have plenty of time to do more research, how about looking into crate training and learning as much about that as you can then deciding which you think would be better for suited for your family and the pup?

I honestly feel that if you are getting a dog that will be a big part of the family then it needs to be in the house at night. You may have some rough nights to start with but I promise it gets better  Our puppy sleeps in her crate beside our bed, she has settled in lovely. 

Good luck with whatever you decide.


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2016)

nightdreamer said:


> if everyone must know i woke to my dead puppy next to me i was not scared of the dog just scared that something would happen again and i would wake and see that
> and no its was not me that caused him to die it was where i got him from he had internal injures
> but thanks for making me go over that
> i did ask about a create a few posts back but as everyone decided to just ignore that and pick me to bits


So you apparently woke up to a dead puppy because the puppy had internal injuries and you've now decided that the best way to avoid that happening again is to put the puppy outside in a shed in December? Mkay...

Here's an idea. Get your puppy from a ethical, responsible breeder who health tests and doesn't sell injured/sick/diseased puppies. 
The other cool thing ethical, responsible breeders do is give you advice and support on how to care for your pup, the best way to introduce them to their new home, and what you should expect those first few weeks.

What breed are you looking at anyway?


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

ouesi said:


> So you apparently woke up to a dead puppy because the puppy had internal injuries and you've now decided that the best way to avoid that happening again is to put the puppy outside in a shed in December? Mkay...
> 
> Here's an idea. Get your puppy from a ethical, responsible breeder who health tests and doesn't sell injured/sick/diseased puppies.
> The other cool thing ethical, responsible breeders do is give you advice and support on how to care for your pup, the best way to introduce them to their new home, and what you should expect those first few weeks.
> ...


please dont reply again thank you


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

The chances of your puppy dying in the same way your last puppy did are practically zero. Very rare and unfortunate incident.

I'd have the puppy indoors and yes, crate trained if that's what you prefer. As for things such as stealing the kids food, that's where training comes into play. If you want to kennel the puppy outside for convenience sake and therefore not having to put the work in to train the puppy appropriate manners/behavior, than you'd be best not getting a dog at all.


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2016)

nightdreamer said:


> please dont reply again thank you


Is "what breed" too hard of a question to answer?
BTW, you don't have a say in who comments on your thread  Though you're more than welcome to report any posts if you feel they violate the TOU. (Mine doesn't.)


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## Wiz201 (Jun 13, 2012)

nightdreamer said:


> if everyone must know i woke to my dead puppy next to me i was not scared of the dog just scared that something would happen again and i would wake and see that
> and no its was not me that caused him to die it was where i got him from he had internal injures
> but thanks for making me go over that
> i did ask about a create a few posts back but as everyone decided to just ignore that and pick me to bits


Ok now we know what happened we can answer your query a bit better.



Dogloverlou said:


> The chances of your puppy dying in the same way your last puppy did are practically zero. Very rare and unfortunate incident.
> 
> I'd have the puppy indoors and yes, crate trained if that's what you prefer. As for things such as stealing the kids food, that's where training comes into play. If you want to kennel the puppy outside for convenience sake and therefore not having to put the work in to train the puppy appropriate manners/behavior, than you'd be best not getting a dog at all.


This absolutely.


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

I am very sorry you found your puppy the way you did, but why do you think having the puppy outside will make any difference? If (and its a big if because if you get a healthy puppy, her/him to die like that in the middle of the night is highly unlikely) if it happened again you'll still have the horror of discovering the puppy outside, instead of inside. 

Like others have said crate train, or have a puppy pen and let the pup get used to it and the pup can sleep in there.


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

This was the original reason given for why a pup can't sleep inside.



nightdreamer said:


> because he is an animal not a human you cant compare the two


Escalation of emotive issues as a thread evolves is pretty indicative.


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## CuddleMonster (Mar 9, 2016)

I can understand losing a puppy in this way would be very traumatic, but as long as your new puppy comes from a reputable source, there is no reason why anything like this should happen again. Leaving the puppy outside overnight certainly won't reduce the chances of this happening again. And if you are emotionally unable to cope with the puppy being inside at night because of bad memories I think you need to give yourself more time to heal before getting another pup. 

You mentioned the alternative of a crate - this would be my choice, as you can then ensure the puppy doesn't do any damage to the house at night, while still being nearby for you to monitor. There is lots of information available both on this forum and the internet at large which will help you get the puppy used to a crate. Why don't you read up on crates and see if you think one would work for your situation.


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

Why do you want a dog?


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## Laney_Lemons (Mar 23, 2016)

what breed of dog are you thinking about?


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2016)

nightdreamer said:


> please dont reply again thank you


You can't tell peopke what to do on here, if they want to reply to this thread that is up to members who reply.


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## Zaros (Nov 24, 2009)

This has to be a wind up...........


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

@Zaros: I have to say that a) the familiar lack of punctuation and b) the tragic death of a young puppy has me thinking too...


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2016)

havoc said:


> This was the original reason given for why a pup can't sleep inside.
> 
> Escalation of emotive issues as a thread evolves is pretty indicative.


This.
Does anyone really believe the reason this poster wants a brand new puppy sleeping outside in December is because they were so emotionally traumatized by the prior puppy dying while inside? 'Cause I don't.


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2016)

ouesi said:


> This.
> Does anyone really believe the reason this poster wants a brand new puppy sleeping outside in December is because they were so emotionally traumatized by the prior puppy dying while inside? 'Cause I don't.


No I don't.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

ouesi said:


> This.
> Does anyone really believe the reason this poster wants a brand new puppy sleeping outside in December is because they were so emotionally traumatized by the prior puppy dying while inside? 'Cause I don't.


It will just as easily die outside if a fox gets it.


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

I tried to give a decent answer to the op just in case, but can't help but wonder whether is for real or not.

I'm now curious where the op apparently lives as it sounds like the place from hell. Would prefer to move rather have the expense of a puppy


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2016)

Calvine said:


> It will just as easily die outside if a fox gets it.


Or if god forbid it escaped and found a road and went how my cat went.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Siskin said:


> I tried to give a decent answer to the op just in case, but can't help but wonder whether is for real or not.
> 
> I'm now curious where the op apparently lives as it sounds like the place from hell. Would prefer to move rather have the expense of a puppy


Yes, think there was a comment about how all the local dogs wander about all day and most of the night? Where is this do we suppose?


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

Siskin said:


> I tried to give a decent answer to the op just in case, but can't help but wonder whether is for real or not.
> 
> I'm now curious where the op apparently lives as it sounds like the place from hell. Would prefer to move rather have the expense of a puppy


This basically ^ The whole time I was typing I thought this must be make-believe surely. However benefit of the doubt and all that.


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## Laney_Lemons (Mar 23, 2016)

nightdreamer said:


> i dont want to go over all that would take me all day


literally took a short sentence...


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

i see this forum clearly has had some issues with some kind of trolling so i will leave it here and move onto another forum
you know admin check ip address so if you think i am someone else feel free to check
this is the first time i have been on this website and the last i might add very judged 
thanks for everyone who gave positive advice 
it will be a bad review from me about petforums.co.uk i am afraid 
goodbye


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

oh and btw we live on a council estate yes a shit one but we cant move as we dont work plenty of money though


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## Team_Trouble (Apr 11, 2016)

nightdreamer said:


> i see this forum clearly has had some issues with some kind of trolling so i will leave it here and move onto another forum
> you know admin check ip address so if you think i am someone else feel free to check
> this is the first time i have been on this website and the last i might add very judged
> thanks for everyone who gave positive advice
> ...


Where do people review forums? It is possible to change IP addresses.


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## nightdreamer (Sep 5, 2016)

you cant change ip adress without changing supplier i am not sure who you think i am for goodness sake what a wired forum thinking i am someone else i only just posted and joined yesterday


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## Zaros (Nov 24, 2009)

Calvine said:


> Yes, think* there was a comment about how all the local dogs wander about all day and most of the night? Where is this do we suppose?*


There's a fair few just over the border from us. Moscow street dogs, for example, are smart and some are even smarter still. They have learned to travel around the city using the subway network and have come to recognise the stations they want by sight and sound.


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## Team_Trouble (Apr 11, 2016)

nightdreamer said:


> you cant change ip adress without changing supplier i am not sure who you think i am for goodness sake what a wired forum thinking i am someone else i only just posted and joined yesterday


There are many easy ways to change your ip address.


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## kittih (Jan 19, 2014)

I think crate training would be a good option to consider. Susan Garrett has got some great information about how to make crates fun with her crate training games.

http://www.localdogdaily.com/how-to-use-crate-games-to-crate-train-your-puppy/


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## MiffyMoo (Sep 15, 2015)

Zaros said:


> There's a fair few just over the border from us. Moscow street dogs, for example, are smart and some are even smarter still. They have learned to travel around the city using the subway network and have come to recognise the stations they want by sight and sound.


I remember reading about that!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencet...p-master-complex-routes-claims-scientist.html


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## chissy 15 (Mar 13, 2013)

Zaros said:


> This has to be a wind up...........
> Thinking this to. The style and lack of punctuation seems too much of a coincidence





Calvine said:


> @Zaros: I have to say that a) the familiar lack of punctuation and b) the tragic death of a young puppy has me thinking too...


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## Rafa (Jun 18, 2012)

nightdreamer said:


> oh and btw we live on a council estate yes a shit one but we cant move as we dont work plenty of money though


So you don't work, live in a Council House and have plenty of money?

Hmmm .........

You do know it's against the law to allow a dog to wander loose? Has anyone considered contacting the Dog Warden?


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2016)

nightdreamer said:


> oh and btw we live on a council estate yes a shit one but we cant move as we dont work plenty of money though


Then how can you afford a puppy when you don't have much money?


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## MiffyMoo (Sep 15, 2015)

danielled said:


> Then how can you afford a puppy when you don't have much money?


I think he was bragging about how they have tons of money, despite not working


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2016)

MiffyMoo said:


> I think he was bragging about how they have tons of money, despite not working


Love to know how that works. Please do share OP.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

QUOTE, nightdreamer:

because he is an animal, not a human - you can't compare the two.

/QUOTE
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Let's look at that statement factually, rather than emotionally. *Humans are also animals * - as a species, we aren't in some special-snowflake category, there are only 3 classes of things on this planet, animal, vegetable, or mineral. Clearly we aren't exclusively mineral; there's more to us than a skeleton. Mayhap for some personal reason, U prefer to identify as 'vegetable', but as a species, we fit the animal category.
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Humans also share 65% of the genome of domestic dogs. That's a long way from the 98% we share with chimpanzees & bonobos, but it's still a lot of genetic overlap. We're not all _that _dissimilar. Yes, all mammals share many traits, but dogs are genetically more similar to us than many other mammals, & that's one reason why they are used in medical research - dogs were the Guinea-pigs who perfected insulin pumps for diabetics, cardiac pacemakers, & many other human-medical advances.
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I think it's gratifying that U can now donate Ur outdated pacemaker to be used to extend a dog's life - or that insulin pumps can be used to help dogs. It's only fair that their species should also benefit from risky research conducted, originally, on their kin.
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However, IMO the most-important thing we share with dogs is an incredibly long history of co-evolution, as dogs have lived with us in our homes - cabins, tents, yurts, caves & teepees, grass huts & palm-thatched houses, Iroquois longhouse & Inuit igloo - for hundreds of thousands of years.
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We've lived with one another for so long, puppies are hard-wired to grasp human communication gestures [pointing with a finger, eye-gaze] & they comprehend it far better than our closest living primate relatives.
The pups of domestic dogs are born wanting to connect to humans - they may lack words to express it, but they are literally born yearning for human contact.
It takes a tiny, tiny amount of exposure to humans to permanently change a young pup from a potential feral, fearful of ppl & wanting nothing but to be left alone, into a clearly domesticated animal, eliciting contact, wagging at the mere sight of any human, & approaching any stranger. 15-mins a day of friendly handling, from 56 to 63-DO, was enuf to have those pups, at 84-DO with no further contact for 5 long weeks, whine, jump, & wag for attention when they saw *any *human from their pens.
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We aren't dogs, & they aren't humans, but we are closer to dogs [& they to us] than to any other species, in our long habitation on earth - which is actually, in geological time, a brief instant. If all Earth's history were represented by one 24-hour day, the entire existence of humans as hominids would span just 11:59 to 12.
Dogs treat us as conspecifics in many ways - given half a chance, they'll lick our wounds, groom us or our clothing for burrs or parasites, bring us food or even water if possible when we're helpless, save us from certain death in disasters, & defend us from threats. We're partners.
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I'm late to this thread, but i, too, don't see why U'd want to *distance* a pup from his human family at a critical time in his development. Completely ignoring the fact that he's just lost every emotional contact, every familiar scent, sound, & sight from his first home, & all his past family, human & dog, it makes no sense to leave him solo at night, outside - separated even from the scent & sound of his new family, in another building altogether.
Even if they have no intention of having their dog sleep in the bedroom as an ongoing habit, i encourage my clients to have their pup or newly-adopted dog sleep in their bedroom at night when they arrive, to help settle them & to enhance their connection. Dogs don't sleep piled in a squirming heap like puppies, most adult dogs sleep separately - but GROUP activities are bonding, & dogs who live together often sleep at the same time, explore or play at the same time, rest simultaneously, & so on.
Simultaneous periods of activity & rest are a way of connecting that may not be as obvious as feeding pets or stroking them, but the reassurance a pup gets from hearing their humans breathing, smelling their scents - breath, skin, hair, soap, sweat... - while s/he tries to fall asleep in a novel, scary place, is IME, priceless.
What else can U possibly _*do*_ while sleeping, or even while awake, that could even remotely compare to that simple sensory contact, as a source of comfort & a means to strengthen their bond to U? It takes no effort whatever, just shared space.
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## MiffyMoo (Sep 15, 2015)

danielled said:


> Love to know how that works. Please do share OP.


Little boys think this sort of statement is impressive


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Seems OP has got his thrilly pink knickers in a great big twist. Unsure if this story is believeable or not.. but anyways sound advice was given but OP chose to throw all his hard 'earned' toys out of his pram.


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2016)

Hanwombat said:


> Seems OP has got his thrilly pink knickers in a great big twist. Unsure if this story is believeable or not.. but anyways sound advice was given but OP chose to throw all his hard 'earned' toys out of his pram.


Always the way on here with trolls.


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## Guest (Sep 6, 2016)

MiffyMoo said:


> Little boys think this sort of statement is impressive


I'll say, somebody is mistaken lol.


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## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

Very sad that your previous pup died in such circumstances, but how much better to die in the presence and warmth of his human than alone in a cold, dark shed.
Please don't consider putting a helpless little pup in a dark, soul-less shed alone.


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

leashedForLife said:


> What else can U possibly _*do*_ while sleeping, or even while awake, that could even remotely compare to that simple sensory contact, as a source of comfort & a means to strengthen their bond to U? It takes no effort whatever, just shared space.


It's a two way street and you've just summed up the complete joy of true companionship in one sentence, the very reason for having a dog


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

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Having read the OP's horrifying tale of past trauma  i don't know if the entire thread's a send-up, but it may well be. OTOH, some other clueless person might come to this thread for actual advice - & it would be good if s/he got some, B4 similarly parking their poor, confused pup alone in a garden shed, however well-insulated. 
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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

Closing for now :Locktopic


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