# EMERGANCY HELP



## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

KITTENS C SECTIONS JUST NOW MOTHER IS YOUNG AND KITTENS ARE COLD AND NOT RESPONDING HOW DO I ET THEM TO WARLM UP AND TO BRING THEM TO LIFE


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## Ceiling Kitty (Mar 7, 2010)

Has the vet or nurse not told you? I'm confused.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

NO, THEY JUST SAID THEY WILL PROB DIE
FRIENDS CAT, COULDNT AFFORD C SECT, SO I TOOK HER,
KITTENS COLD GOT THEM ON HEAT MAT, MUM NOT INTERESTED, HOW DO I KNOW IF THEY ALIVE


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

2 kittens gasping sometimes,

have nutri drops, puppy stim, dopram v, all a year old though


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

have cimicat bottles teats and syringes


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

vet left them in carrier with mum, mum standing on them, they were cold, she was trying to tell me how they will die, i took them out carrier, wrapped them up in towel, and got in car.


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

kiara said:


> NO, THEY JUST SAID THEY WILL PROB DIE
> FRIENDS CAT, COULDNT AFFORD C SECT, SO I TOOK HER,
> KITTENS COLD GOT THEM ON HEAT MAT, MUM NOT INTERESTED, HOW DO I KNOW IF THEY ALIVE


A friend of mine had quite a few caesareans when she was breeding and she used a hair dryer. The vet nurses were most impressed and, I think, converted to the practice.

When I had a kitten born normally but needing reviving, I used to hold it a few feet above a convector heater and it would revive. You could tell it was responding to the warmth because it would flag if you moved it further away.


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## Ceiling Kitty (Mar 7, 2010)

Yes, I think a hairdryer is a good idea - be careful not to burn them. If using heat pads, hot water bottles etc, always make sure a blanket or towel separates kittens from heat source to avoid burns.

Do they try to suck your finger? Can you feel heartbeats?


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

kiara said:


> 2 kittens gasping sometimes,
> 
> have nutri drops, puppy stim, dopram v, all a year old though


Have you swung them in case they have fluid in their lungs.? Unfortunately you have to know how to cup their head and neck or it can be dangerous.What about a rough towel to rub them as you would normal kittens when they are born? That can stimulate them.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

have been rubbing, had hair dryer on, only one responding


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

kiara said:


> have been rubbing, had hair dryer on, only one responding


One is better than none. Keep trying a bit longer. Sorry to be gruesome but it is usually fairly easy to tell a dead kitten because its head lolls in a horrible way.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

even one thats breathing is head lolls, mums nudging them, only one, smallest is responding, have swung them


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

kiara said:


> even one thats breathing is head lolls, mums nudging them, only one, smallest is responding, have swung them


Forget what I said about head lolling. If the live one is doing it, it is a different loll.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

ok, sadly iv done everything, been working on these kittens for nearly 2 hours, only one responding. just. what do i need to do to get this kitten going properly. x


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

mum keeps trying to bite kitten??


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

kiara said:


> mum keeps trying to bite kitten??


She probably is still suffering the effects of the anaesthetic. Take the kitten away from her until she calms down and just make sure you keep it warm. Is the kitten breathing well now?


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

kiara said:


> ok, sadly iv done everything, been working on these kittens for nearly 2 hours, only one responding. just. what do i need to do to get this kitten going properly. x


Did you try your nutridrops? I never gave them to kittens only the mothers very occasionally but I think other breeders use them.


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## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Warmth is key here. Every C Section I've had kittens have been cold and lethargic. Hold them in hands above hot radiator and breathe out slowly on them in cupped hands. Keep rubbing and stimulating them. Give NutriDrops, just 1 drop on tongue. Will help energy. Don't feed yet as they're too cold. Don't put with mum until she's ready for them. Sometimes that's straight away, sometimes it's up to a day or two. Your vets sound pretty abrupt. Mine don't give them back to me until they're breathing and at least semi warm. Have saved many kittens after C Section so it can be done. If you want moral support, have a look on the Moonspun Cats website. My phone number is on there and I'm happy to have a chat whatever time of the day or night.


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## lisajjl1 (Jun 23, 2010)

Agree 100% with Carly - the important thing here right now is to get the kitten to the right temperature, cold kittens will be limp and unresponsive and as you start to get some warmth going and the kittens temperature starts to rise you should start to see an increase in its movements. Nutridrops are the way to go too and preferable to the following but in a crisis situation and as a last resort a few drops of honey or sugary water, in my own experience and friends, just may give the kitten a boost but you need to get the kitten stable enough to be able to get any benefit and warmth is what the kitten needs - may take some time to gradually raise the kittens temperature but just keep going.


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

Am only going to be on internet a few seconds and won't be able to get back on til tomorrow, but keep going with nutridrops and keeping warm. If you can make up cimicat and they take it ( must be every 2 hours, throughout night as well I'm afraid) remember to stimulate to wee too by rubbing with damp cotton wool or similar. Have you a heat pad or hot water bottle? If you really have nothing else even a potato microwaved, wrapped in a flannel and popped next to them will be something. Bless you for trying, will be thinking of you all.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Thanks everyone.

I posted earlier for a friend that had a young cat that was struggling. She went to the vet and vet said she needed a c section, she couldn't afford it so said she would keep an eye on her. After I spoke to her we agreed I would take her to my vets. 

My vets agreed she needed a c sect, my friend said you can have her then..............

Vet said mum cat is underweight and is struggling to grow babies and herself. So sad

I wasnt to pleased with my vet as her only concern was mum cat, nothing for the kittens, called the kittens parasites!!!!! I asked if I could go in the room with them, was told no, I asked if I could help when the kittens were delivered, was told no.

I asked for mum cat to be spayed at the same time. 

They gave me cimicat and bottle and syringe.

Mum cat is fine, they said her uterus was stretched to max. She has come back to mine and eaten already. She weighed 3.2kg before delivery. Mum is laying on my bed sleeping, bless her.

Now Iv got this tiny pure black kitten next to me, breathing seems to be OK. Its twitching every now and then, I think thats a good sign. I have given one drop of nutri drops. Iv got a bottle made up. Kitten will suckle but Im not sure if its getting anything. Would it be better to syringe. Kitten weighs 69g, the biggest kitten was 84g.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Is the heat mat enough to keep this kitten warm, should I put a blanket on it too? What about making sure its warm if I fall asleep for a little while. When should I get it to take some milk? I just tried it with the teat again and it didnt suckle. x


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

carly87 said:


> Warmth is key here. Every C Section I've had kittens have been cold and lethargic. Hold them in hands above hot radiator and breathe out slowly on them in cupped hands. Keep rubbing and stimulating them. Give NutriDrops, just 1 drop on tongue. Will help energy. Don't feed yet as they're too cold. Don't put with mum until she's ready for them. Sometimes that's straight away, sometimes it's up to a day or two. Your vets sound pretty abrupt. Mine don't give them back to me until they're breathing and at least semi warm. Have saved many kittens after C Section so it can be done. If you want moral support, have a look on the Moonspun Cats website. My phone number is on there and I'm happy to have a chat whatever time of the day or night.


Kiara, as Carly has said, do try to wait a while before intervening with feeding. Give the mother a chance to recover and be re-introduced to the kitten, who needs its mother's colostrum.


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

kiara said:


> Is the heat mat enough to keep this kitten warm, should I put a blanket on it too? What about making sure its warm if I fall asleep for a little while. When should I get it to take some milk? I just tried it with the teat again and it didnt suckle. x


The first thing you need to achieve is the mother happy with the kitten. Has the mother any milk yet? If so, when she is amenable, squeeze her teat gently at the base until a little milk appears and wipe the kitten's mouth across it. In the meantime, a blanket nest and possibly a soft toy for company will help the kitten keep warm on the heated pad.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)




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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

QOTN said:


> The first thing you need to achieve is the mother happy with the kitten. Has the mother any milk yet? If so, when she is amenable, squeeze her teat gently at the base until a little milk appears and wipe the kitten's mouth across it. In the meantime, a blanket nest and possibly a soft toy for company will help the kitten keep warm on the heated pad.


Mum has no milk what so ever. Kitten is very still is this ok. x


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

kiara said:


> Mum has no milk what so ever. Kitten is very still is this ok. x


I think you will have to wait a while because the caesarean may have affected the milk flow. Why don't you take up Carly's kind offer of a phone call whatever the time of day or night? It will be much easier if you have somebody to talk it through with you.


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## auspiciousmind (Sep 2, 2012)

QOTN said:


> I think you will have to wait a while because the caesarean may have affected the milk flow. Why don't you take up Carly's kind offer of a phone call whatever the time of day or night? It will be much easier if you have somebody to talk it through with you.


I concur with QOTN.. if I was in your position I'd be calling Carly x


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## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Please don't forget to stimulate the kitten to wee and poo. This is the e only thing I forgot to mention on the phone to you. You do it by rubbing the lower belly and anus in a circular motion with warm, damp cotton wool or a flannel.


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## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

I also wouldn't worry about the milk flow just yet. Some girls take a while to let it down, and unfortunately, as she hasn't had all the oxytosin which is stimulated by labour, this can take longer. As mum isn't happy and has no milk, I'd do what I said on the phone to you. Hand feed tonight but keep trying on and off with mum before each feed. If she wants baby, then great. You need to confine her to a box though, not just sleeping on your bed. Again, just ring whenever you like. Popping off to bed now but I'll have my phone with me. Don't know where you're based, but if you're local, I can try and get organised to pop up tomorrow and see if I can help at all.


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## gskinner123 (Mar 10, 2010)

Nothing to add to all the great advice and help but the only thing I would say is that the kitten doesn't look quite full term; the ear (that we can see in the photo) isn't fully furred and the front limbs (possibly the back too but cannot quite see from the photo) are hairless and 'rubbery' looking. I think this may be contributing (or even the sole cause) of him/her being as 'slow' as s/he is.


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## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

kiara said:


> I asked if I could go in the room with them, was told no, I asked if I could help when the kittens were delivered, was told no.


Not had a c-section with my girls, but everyone I know who has was in the room and handed the kittens as the come out. What a stressful time for you, but great you stepped in for your friend.

Best of luck with the little kitten.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Morning all.

Baby is still here this morning. I tried to feed throughout the night every 2 hours but it would take, so gave 1 drop of nutri drops each time. tried on mum this morning but kitten couldn't latch on and mum still has no milk. The vet seemed to think that she won't get any milk either.

Baby is much more responsive today, letting out little cries and squirming around. Has done a wee and poo.

I managed to syringe feed 0.7mls at 7am. Kitten was swallowing so thats great. Kitten has lost weight and is now 63g.

Mum is a lot perkier today. Very sweet cat, just a kitten herself. She keeps meowing for kitten but I daren't leave them alone for a second as she is very clumsy. I have set up a crate next to my bed with litter tray, food, water, scratching post and a box with vetbed for her. kitten is the other side of my bed in another box with a heat mat and tea towel.

@carly87 Thanks for all your help. Im in Romford, Essex. Think thats quite far from you.

@gskinner123 I also think kitten is prem. Legs are rubbery, no fur on legs, ears or tail.


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## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

If she' scrying for him, then I'd definitely give kitten to her. Sounds definitely prem. Putting kitten with mum may trigger milk let down. Keep feeling her boobies and massaging if she'll let you as this will also stimulate. Good to hear that baby is swallowing. If this stops, then you will need to get someone to show you how to tube feed. Either your vet (please not the same one as you used for the section) or another breeder (can put the word out for you if you need it).

SC, it's not uncommon here for vets not to allow you in during C Section. I've never been allowed despite my amazingly good relationship with my vet.


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## Ceiling Kitty (Mar 7, 2010)

carly87 said:


> If she' scrying for him, then I'd definitely give kitten to her. Sounds definitely prem. Putting kitten with mum may trigger milk let down. Keep feeling her boobies and massaging if she'll let you as this will also stimulate. Good to hear that baby is swallowing. If this stops, then you will need to get someone to show you how to tube feed. Either your vet (please not the same one as you used for the section) or another breeder (can put the word out for you if you need it).
> 
> SC, it's not uncommon here for vets not to allow you in during C Section. I've never been allowed despite my amazingly good relationship with my vet.


I don't do many cat caesareans, fortunately, but when it comes to dogs we will generally not let the owner into theatre. TBF, we don't really let owners into theatre for anything full stop - it's supposed to be a semi-sterile environment - plus our theatre is quite cramped. Sometimes in an after-hours situation when we need 'all hands on deck' I've had (trusted) owners come into the prep room, but it's not the norm.

Plus I hate doing surgery with the world and his neighbour looking over me, lol.

@kiara, glad the kitten seems to be rallying today. Fingers crossed he/she continues to improve!


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

Such wonderful and caring advice from the lovely breeders on here. Hoping your little one makes it, having had the upset of losing premature kittens here xx
My girl who had to have a C. section (not with prematures) didn't want to know her baby for a couple of days but then had a great bond with him so I would say keep trying in putting baby to mum.


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## PembrokeMadhouse (May 18, 2009)

I know very little about little about sick newborn kittens, although I fostered mums and their kittens for a while - I regularly put them down my jumper to keep them warm and to socialise... one of my cats that I kept used to go down my jumper as a fully grown adult (RIP) .... keep trying kitten with the mother ... and hope he/she survives - you're doing really well x


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Sorry if I am repeating what has already be said, or what you know - the kitten must be fed on it's tummy, in the position it would feed from it's mum in. A lot of the photos on the internet aren't clear as you don't know what angle they are taken from.

If you don't have a set of digital kitchen scales that weigh to a gram, get a cheap set - they are as little as approx. £10. Weigh the kitten each day at about the same time and keep a record. You want to see it gradually gaining weight.

More info:

http://www.icatcare.org:8080/advice/hand-rearing-kittens


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Put baby wish mum for half an hour. kitten was searching for nipple but couldn't 'find' one, although I kept pointing him in the right direction.
I was massaging mum at the time as @carly87 recommended. Mum licked kitten once and tried to bite a few times but not hard biting, I think she wants to play.

Are there any foods in particular that could help with mums milk?

Kitten has had another 0.8mls at 10am. Kitten was suckling the syringe and swallowing. Had a wee after but its quite dark.

Im going to try and get an hour kip then do the same things again.

Thanks again all. x


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

Was scared to check thread this morning, great you've managed to get one through so far. I also thought front leg looked "shiny" in the photo, looks a bit premature to me too, but if swallowing you're in with a chance. Carly87 is the kind of breeder you need on your side at a time like this, brilliant advice without going back over could haves and should haves. Glad you got her spayed at the same time, if your friend had wanted her back you'd have had to wait before a second op. She can now recover and get on with learning how to be a mum. As and when you feel able to introduce them and leave them be careful the kitten can't get stuck in the crate or squiggle out if it's a big dog crate. As mum is struggling with weight it won't hurt her at all to be fed kitten food rather than grown up, and she could have some of the Cimicat too. You're doing really well.


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## The Wild Bunch (Jul 16, 2014)

kiara said:


> Are there any foods in particular that could help with mums milk?


As has already been suggested, give her some wet kitten food, it's higher in calories and since vet thinks she is underweight, it will do her good, I think free feeding might be the way to go here too. Good on you for helping this girl and her baby


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

kiara said:


> Morning all.
> Baby is still here this morning. I tried to feed throughout the night every 2 hours but it would take, so gave 1 drop of nutri drops each time. tried on mum this morning but kitten couldn't latch on and mum still has no milk. The vet seemed to think that she won't get any milk either.
> Baby is much more responsive today, letting out little cries and squirming around. Has done a wee and poo.
> I managed to syringe feed 0.7mls at 7am. Kitten was swallowing so thats great. Kitten has lost weight and is now 63g.
> Mum is a lot perkier today. Very sweet cat, just a kitten herself. She keeps meowing for kitten but I daren't leave them alone for a second as she is very clumsy. I have set up a crate next to my bed with litter tray, food, water, scratching post and a box with vetbed for her. kitten is the other side of my bed in another box with a heat mat and tea towel.


I am so glad Baby survived the night. You have done a brilliant job so far. I agree you need to keep trying to put Mum and Baby together especially now Baby can suck because that will stimulate milk production. New mothers can be a bit rough with their kittens. If Baby can squeak when that happens she will soon learn but obviously you will have to continue to keep a close eye on them. I have no experience of premature kittens or hand rearing but you really do need to try to get the kitten feeding from her or you will be so exhausted. Friends who have hand reared singletons seem to suffer just as much as those who rear whole litters.

I am concerned that the kitten's urine looks dark because this could mean dehydration. If so the fluid intake needs to be increased.


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## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

There's no milk that will help with food unfortunately. you could try Homeopathy, Urtica 30C, although by the time it gets to you it'll prob do little good. Speak to your vet about Oxytosin. I know some use that to bring the milk in but not sure of protocol after C Section as I've never needed it. Thankfully, girls milk here has always let down within a few hours, but then they've also always let me put babies straight to them with reassurance. That's good that it's taking milk, but do remember that the kitten needs feeding every 2 hours, not every 3. I do know how exhausted you must be but for a prem baby, I'm afraid there's no room for movement on that. Do chart the weight regularly and make sure that the heatpad isn't any warmer than body temp.Overheating is as dangerous as underheating. Feed mum as much as she can eat, something high calory like kitten food would be best. you could also pop some NutriDrops onto the kitten. This is a trick I use to get mum to clean kittens when she's unsure, as this cleaning will strengthen the bond. Still have fingers firmly crossed, and you know where I am if you want to talk things over.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Taken 1ml at 12. Mum is cleaning baby. x


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## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Really, really positive. Remember to toilet before every feed. Wee should be lighter in colour now that the kitten isn't so dehydrated.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

If the wee is dark the kitten might be a bit dehydrated. However I wonder what 'dark' means? And how 'dark' is normal for kitten pee?

I found that if I held a kitten to a nipple it would eventually latch on - just popping it against it didn't work.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Great news that mum is cleaning it.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Baby has had another 1ml at 2pm. Before that it had spent a good hour suckling on mum, no milk yet but can only be a good sign. x


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Mum has all the food she could possibly eat plus water and cimicat. x


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## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Wow, it actually latched? Now that is something I didn't expect to read! Well done! Really would speak to the vet about Oxytosin in that case.


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

You're doing great. Keep it up.


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## ScampiCat (Oct 11, 2014)

I don't have any advice but just wanted to say you're an angel for taking on the mum and baby. You deserve a gold medal.

Sending positive vibes that the kitten will continue to improve and that the mums milk will come in so you can at least get a little break.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Great news everyone, mum has a tiny bit of milk 

Baby has been latched on again so hoping hes getting some colostrum.

Took 1.4mls at 4pm. weighed 61g so weight still dropping. Will feed again at 6pm and weigh. Baby with mum atm.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

You can drive yourself nuts if you keep weighing the kitten. If you stick to once a day, at about the same time, you will get a decent picture of the trend. If mum is getting milk hopefully you only have another day or two of feeding him or her. Fingers crossed!


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

Everything crossed for you - it is starting to look more positive :Cat


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

kiara said:


> Great news everyone, mum has a tiny bit of milk
> 
> Baby has been latched on again so hoping hes getting some colostrum.
> 
> Took 1.4mls at 4pm. weighed 61g so weight still dropping. Will feed again at 6pm and weigh. Baby with mum atm.


That pic is wonderful. Mum loves her baby. As Oriental Slave says, you will only worry yourself silly if you keep weighing Baby. I only weighed my babies last thing at night. If you do it at random times you cannot compare the weights. I must say this is so much better than I feared last night. Fingers crossed for more good news.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Thanks.

I just wanted to check, baby was due a feed at 6pm but was suckling mum so i left him with her, was that the right thing to do?

Hes come off now so just warming the milk.

Will weigh at 6pm daily from now on as that was the first time he was weighed. 

Also tonight, should I leave him in with mum between feeds? as i'll most probably fall asleep in between I wont be watching. x


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

kiara said:


> Thanks.
> 
> I just wanted to check, baby was due a feed at 6pm but was suckling mum so i left him with her, was that the right thing to do?
> 
> ...


I am sure you should leave Baby with mum as much as possible if she is caring for him well now. I think it is a good idea to top up after he has had a suckle because then you will be able to tell how much of his needs are being met by mother's milk. If you are asleep within earshot surely you will hear if he squeaks and be woken up.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Baby took 0.4ml after being with mum, wasn't really interested and belly seemed round so I am hoping hes getting something from mum. Baby back with mum now. If he wasnt getting anything from mum would he continue to suckle? or would he be crying?

17/6/15 Birth weight 69g 6pm
18/06/15 60g 6pm


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## chloe1975 (Mar 17, 2013)

Well done for taking on this mum and baby. I hope it all works out, keeping everything crossed for you  I had to hand rear a premature kitten born at 58 days last year. Sadly the rest of the litter passed away but she held on. The hardest thing was keeping her warm. But I kept mum and baby together and although mum's milk dried up sadly and I had to take over fully she stayed with her baby and looked after her in every other way. Like your little one, Koda weighed around 70g (tiny for a Maine Coon kitten) and looked so small next to mum. But mother cats are normally pretty good and once we got through the first couple of weeks she didn't look so swamped by mum.

As others have said don't get too hung up on weight. I don't weigh kittens every day unless I have big concerns (which I know will be against what everyone else here will say!) but I think sometimes too much emphasis is put on weight gain. Koda consistently lost weight and gained a bit for around a month. By 4 weeks old she was around 150g still. Feeding two hourly for the first week unless you are confident that mum is feeding but even then I left it four hours over night as I needed sleep too! She used to take a couple of mls to begin with but soon built up and by around 6 weeks she used to have 5 feeds a day of around 40mls per feed! Hand reared kittens have a weak immune system so if you can get mum to take over that would be fantastic. Unfortunately Koda suffered a number of bacterial infections.

However she is now 10 months old and proof that premature and hand reared babies can survive but it is a hard road


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## The Wild Bunch (Jul 16, 2014)

I would imagine if he's got a full belly and isn't fussing then he must be getting fed from mum which is fantastic! I would keep them together, going by the picture you've posted, mama loves her baby and keeping them together should stimulate milk production I would think


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Click to watch x


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Another 1 ml taken. Constantly attached to mum in between. Wee is a lot lighter.

I have got a dilemma though, my niece is pregnant and was due 2 days ago, she thinks shes starting to have contractions and I am her birthing partner! I cant let her down she is only 15. Do you think mum would be OK? If I feed baby last thing before I go and go at the last minute? x


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

1ml 10pm


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

1ml 12am


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## purplemonkeydishwasher (Jun 3, 2015)

Whilst I can't help with advice etc, I wanted to let you know that you are awesome for doing this and a lesser person would have given up. When it is all safe, you deserve a stiff drink :Nurse


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

Hope everything ok. In an ideal world you'd be there for kitten pretty much constantly for another few days at least, but the world isn't ideal and it sounds like you're the one everybody turns to in a crisis to take charge and get stuff done. It all depends really on how well mum and kitten have bonded, if mum's milk has come in properly, how far you are from hospital and how long it takes your niece to push out your grandniece, grandnephew. You realise that now makes you a Great Aunt! Visions of an elderly spinster like Miss Marple keep popping up in my head. I'd stay home as long as poss and do a last feed before going, once your niece is in hospital the midwives will either tell you to stick around as it's imminent or tell you she's hours away yet, in which case you could nip home again. As a breeder my advice is stay with kitten, but I'm a mum too, and no 15 year old should have to go through labour alone, she'll be scared stiff. Please let us know how it goes, but kitten has a very good chance now mum has bonded and started feeding it ( him/her? close up photo sometime?). Good luck.


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## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

I know it's pretty extreme and they'll probably say no, but could you sneak kitten into hospital with you, then just pop to café, toilet etc to feed? I normally pop babies down my top to keep them warm and you could heat milk in a syringe in a mug of hot water. I know in principle you shouldn't have animals in hospital but all things considered, might be worth asking. Otherwise, could you leave him in your car on a heat pad in a carrier? Again not ideal. How far are you from the hospital? Could you nip home in between?

See if he will take more than 1 ml and bulk feed him every hour for an hour or two, then he should be able to go up to 4 in between for a feed or two. Not ideal but I don't know which of the options is best to be honest.


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

I'd go for option 2 if you had to, kittens in maternity wards would be a definite no -no, supposed to be clean areas. Would probably be asked to leave, and if not then supposing there was a problem at the hospital and it emerged that someone had had a kitten in the ward, the nurse who said it was ok could well lose her job for trying to be kind and that's just not fair. Even without that hospitals not the best place for a newborn kitten, all sorts of bugs floating around. And cars can get hot really quickly unless under cover like a multi-storey car park. You might go at night and end up parked somewhere hot when the sun came up/moved round Also, mum just bonding, don't separate them now, but good idea to try to up the feeding if will take it.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Hi all.

I got home from the hospital around 11.30pm last night, didn't go in until 12pm yesterday. She had a whooping 9lb baby boy bless her. She named him Kenny after my Dad. She done so well. No drugs whatsoever. An amazing experience.

My son stayed home and fed the kitten every 2 hours for me, he's only 18, and done a great job. He said baby was very reluctant to take the milk but he persevered. Baby weighed 62g when I got home so has put on 2g in 24 hours.

I fed baby last night and only took 0.5ml, mum looks to have milk. I left the feeds last night and this morning he still weighed 62g and was reluctant to take a feed and only took 0.5ml so I think mum has enough milk for him. Is this the best way to tell? How should I continue?

@Catharinem I'm very pleased to be a great Aunt, please halt those images. lol. I'm only 32. I will get a close up pic today.

Thanks again x


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## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

As he's not gaining weight, I'd still continue to offer top ups until he's gaining consistently, but only after he's had a good suck from mum, i.e don't interrupt a suckle to top him up. Milk should be at full strength now so you should see more of a weight gain in the next few days. For such a tiny baby any weight gain is good, but aim for at least 5G in a 24 hour period. 10 would be better, but with my premmies last year 5-7 was about the norm.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Morning all.

Baby has put on 2g overnight and has a big round belly, I didn't feed overnight. I have decided to top up throughout the day and leave them at night. So I will weigh morning and night to give me a good idea of how things are going. Although baby really doesn't like the top ups.

Mum is doing brilliantly. some of her mammary glands feel hard so I am massaging at every feed. Shes eating well and drinking lots. Milk is coming out white now and she has milk in 6 teats. I gave her a good brush today which she seemed to appreciate.

I think baby is a girly. What do you think?





And a big fat belly....


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## chloe1975 (Mar 17, 2013)

Sounds like she is doing well. I personally wouldn't be too worried about how much weight is being gained as long as some is and preferably not losing. I would only top up if absolutely nescessary tbh as in my experience the more they get used to feeding from a bottle the less inclined they are to suckle from mum. Babies who are hand reared get lazy as drinking from a bottle is much less effort for them. But others might disagree. Anyway sounds like you are doing great x


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Looks like a boy to me!


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Baby weighed 65g at 6pm


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## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

OrientalSlave said:


> Looks like a boy to me!


I think girl, but the angle is off. Can you take a photo of her resting on the ground or your palm so the belly isn't pushed up.


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

Looks more boy than girl to me. Openings a bit close together, but bottom one for wee seems more round and less of a slit. Ignore the swellings either side, even my breeding girls have little fluffy pom poms where their boy bits would be if they were boys. He's (?probably) looking great, still quite naked on his legs isn't he? I'd cut out feeds between 11:30?midnight and 7/8 am unless he starts dropping weight, otherwise you'll be a zombie. If he struggles away from milk feeds from you in the day cut them out too, don't want him getting in his lungs if not sucking eagerly. He should take it, don't try to get into him if he doesn't want it ( as long as fighting strong, not lethargic). How is your niece managing being a new mum? Hope she's getting a lot of support at home.


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

spotty cats said:


> I think girl, but the angle is off. Can you take a photo of her resting on the ground or your palm so the belly isn't pushed up.


Those pics look more like a girl to me but I agree a different pic not lifting the tail so high may help decide.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Baby weighs 72g this morning, that's 7g gain overnight without a top up. He is really struggling when i try to feed. Cries, spits it out, doesn't suckle and a bit came out of his nose, so i've stopped now. im so worried about over feeding. I will continue to weigh and if he doesn't gain enough or loses i will step in again.

@spotty cats I will get some better pics later on.

@Catharinem legs are still quite bald, 6 days today, when will they catch up? Thanks for asking after my niece. Shes doing really well thank you. She's been very lucky so far, he has slept all night every night and hasn't cried since he was born. She has got lots of support from our family. We are very close and there's lots of us. and Dad and his parents have come up trumps so things are looking good. I'm soooo proud of her.


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

kiara said:


> Baby weighs 72g this morning, that's 7g gain overnight without a top up. He is really struggling when i try to feed. Cries, spits it out, doesn't suckle and a bit came out of his nose, so i've stopped now. im so worried about over feeding. I will continue to weigh and if he doesn't gain enough or loses i will step in again.


Baby sounds as though (s)he is doing well without topping-up. Please do not force her/him. If (s)he gets milk in her/his lungs you could lose her/him. It would be a tragedy after everything you have done to keep her/him alive.


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## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Absolutely do not force baby to read! Probably missed in your panic when you called, but I was really clear that you must only give milk after the baby has swallowed the first drops. If it's coming out the nose then you're in very, very real danger of flooding the lungs. If baby has a fat belly, is gaining weight, fighting the feeds and sucking from mum, then your work is done. Keep a close eye, weigh regularly, but other than that, just take a step back now.


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

You've done really well, now let mum take over completely for feeding unless weight drops again. Can't say how long to catch up, each in their own time and depends if just lacking fur or if other bits of metabolism behind as well. Assuming he survives, which is looking hopeful now, I'd not expect to tell him as a premature baby by the time he's weaned. He might be slower off the mark to take solids, but take one step at a time and he'll get there.


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