# Im struggling with Mias premature kittens



## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

im really struggling with Mias premature babies. I have 3 surviving kittens. they are really small and she keeps leaving them and when she does all they do is cry and she doesnt go back to them!! Ive tried hand feeding them and they dont wanna know. She is a first time mother and doesnt know what to do with them?? Im completely lost?


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## Alansw8 (May 25, 2008)

If you can , make sure the babies are warm, then go and find mum and give her some reassurance by giving her a cuddle and as long as the kittens are not too far away you may be able to get them all laid with mum whilst you give mum plenty of attention and hopefully she will setle down with the kitts.

Hope this helps , also how premature are the kits? 2-3 days?


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Can you wrap them up over a hot water bottle or pad when mum leaves them, is she just wandering away and not coming back when they cry ?

You've been doing really well with them.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

She has gone back to them now but little one is still crying they are having trouble latching onto her on their own. They should have been due saturday or sunday. One of the kittens the smallest one doesnt seem to be able to suck?? even when I syringe feed he shows no sign of wanting to suckle at all could this be due to the premature nature of him? Ive just this minute manage to get the little bluecream girl (the noisy one) and the big cream one to suckle of mum. PHEW! Still nothing from littlest one think im lsing that battle.

Also do you cats remain with a full rounded tummy after their births? Mia still looks quite rounded?


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

I have them on a heat pad which i place them on when she leaves. She get up moves out of the puppy cage and lays on the floor int he room but only goes back when they really really cry. Little Blue cream seems to have a case of seperation anxiety. ( i know how she feels me ad my bed are having a similar problem)

Thanks for your replies it really helps me to hear some rational responses.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

becbec31 said:


> She has gone back to them now but little one is still crying they are having trouble latching onto her on their own. They should have been due saturday or sunday. One of the kittens the smallest one doesnt seem to be able to suck?? even when I syringe feed he shows no sign of wanting to suckle at all could this be due to the premature nature of him? Ive just this minute manage to get the little bluecream girl (the noisy one) and the big cream one to suckle of mum. PHEW! Still nothing from littlest one think im lsing that battle.
> 
> Also do you cats remain with a full rounded tummy after their births? Mia still looks quite rounded?


All you can do is try your best with the little one, you've done the nutridrops, your feeding them, you're rubbing him after feeeing him 1ml at a time, you're keeping him warm.

Mum sounds like she is doing just as Misty did, don't worry about that she probably is just coming out for a little spell, good that she is going back. Misty was quite swollen but not hugely, are you thinking there may be more ? If yes, can your vet call-out tomorrow?



becbec31 said:


> I have them on a heat pad which i place them on when she leaves. She get up moves out of the puppy cage and lays on the floor int he room but only goes back when they really really cry. Little Blue cream seems to have a case of seperation anxiety. ( i know how she feels me ad my bed are having a similar problem)
> 
> Thanks for your replies it really helps me to hear some rational responses.


You're doing great. So is this day 59 or 61 ?


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

today should have been day 61! 

I doing my very best its just hard when they are crying so much, my last litter was small but they didnt cry nearly as much as this!

xx


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

becbec31 said:


> today should have been day 61!
> 
> I doing my very best its just hard when they are crying so much, my last litter was small but they didnt cry nearly as much as this!
> 
> xx


Okay, so maybe a little early but not too bad, you're struggling because you are tired, your Mum is stuck abroad, the babies are possibly crying due to their immaturity, have you checked mum is producing cololstrum?


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Colostrum in the milk? she started producing a cloudy liquid straight off now it is much more milky an d if you squeeze them you get a decent amount out.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Yes, that's fine.  Will PM you where else you can get help. x


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## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

have you checked the little one that wont suckle for cleft palete?


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

archiebaby said:


> have you checked the little one that wont suckle for cleft palete?


I think she checked for that yesterday. 

How are they today ?


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## ChinaBlue (Feb 3, 2008)

Just a thought - have you got vet bed in the kitten pen? If the mum is leaving them it could be she is too hot. If so it may be an idea to use an old cotton sheet instead of vet bed though of course the downside is making sure the kittens are warm enough but the head pad should sort that out.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

yes it is vet bed. To be honest i think she keeps leaving them to go lie with m dog. Its her fav place to be. Good thing is she is now starting to return to them when they really yell. 

Yeah checked for cleft pallete pretty much as soon as they were born all looks ok. To be honest i think it is cos he is so small and easnt really ready to be born. I have spoen to vet and he says if can keep him going for just a couple of days through handfeeding his suck reflex should come.

Good news is he took 2ml from a syringe at 5 o clock and another 0.5 ml half an hour ago so hopefully it will be enough to keep him going.

The other two have been feeding off mum on and off all night although they do need help finding her nipples. Bless them like looking for a needle in a haystack.

Thanks again everyone.


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

You need to tube feed for a few days. Give it a try, there's nothing to lose by the sound of it.

Liz


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

hi liz.

ive never tube fed before, wouldnt know where to start?? 

xx


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## Leah100 (Aug 17, 2008)

Here's a link to a website which gives good directions for tube feeding. You would need to get the equipment quickly, try your vets or look online and try and get over night delivery.

http://www.hayaji.com/faqTube.html

If you have a hot water bottle, put it to one side so mum can be in with them and not over heat. Keep checking the temp in the nest, if mum is in there take the bottle out, her body heat will be enough to keep them warm, and tiny kittens can over heat and become dehydrated dangerously fast.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Mias two smallest babies are now in the care of a vet nurse at my local vets. Their chances are slim but i had to try for them. They are being tube fed and the wonderful lady even said she will nurse them at her home over the weekend if they make it.

The biggest strongest kitten is still with mum doing great feeding well and putting on weight. he has gone from a birth weight of 65g to 75g. All steps in the right direction.

Thanks again for all your kind words and advice.


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

Gosh, 65g is very small, but that is a great weight increase.

Liz


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## colliemerles (Nov 2, 2007)

aww i hope they all make it, fingers crossed, do keep us posted.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Yes it is small Liz, but i have had smaller ones survive so fingers crossed. My last litter one only weight 48g and he survived he had a great spirit hes now 8months old and in fine shape.

He is feeding lots and just been toileting and all looks good.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

I hope they are all okay. They are in the best hands now. I would be terrified to tube feed without having done so before.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Yes me too, and the vets werent keen on the idea either as you can drown them if you get it in their lungs. 

but she said she is quite experienced with neonates so fingers crossed. However I will be pleased if just the bigger one and my lovely Mia are ok.

Shes been a star bless her after all shes been through and shes still purring.


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## colliemerles (Nov 2, 2007)

becbec31 said:


> Yes me too, and the vets werent keen on the idea either as you can drown them if you get it in their lungs.
> 
> but she said she is quite experienced with neonates so fingers crossed. However I will be pleased if just the bigger one and my lovely Mia are ok.
> 
> Shes been a star bless her after all shes been through and shes still purring.


will the vets tube feed them for afew days then try to get them back to mum to feed, or do they then put them onto a bottle.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

colliemerles said:


> will the vets tube feed them for afew days then try to get them back to mum to feed, or do they then put them onto a bottle.


Depends how they go? If they will feed from mum then this is preferable, but bottle feeding would do. Sometimes I have done a bit of both if the kittens needed topping up. Sometimes mums need a bit of help.

Havent heard anything yet but the chances werent too good for the two little ones. However i am a firm believer in always doing your best.

The main problem with the weaker of the 2 is that he does not have his suck reflex yet. im told by the nurse this is the last reflex to come and with him being prem it hasnt developed yet. Hopefully tube feeding will build him up and make him stronger and it will come. However there is always a possibility he may rely on the tube which would be a problem.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Keeping everything crossed for you.

It's amazing what a few days difference in birth can make. I have a link I found which shows when they grow and what they look like, it's a tad in-depth to put on here but they keep on growing/developing right up the last day.

What weights are the little ones with the vet ?


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

becbec31 said:


> Yes it is small Liz, but i have had smaller ones survive so fingers crossed. My last litter one only weight 48g and he survived he had a great spirit hes now 8months old and in fine shape.
> 
> He is feeding lots and just been toileting and all looks good.


48g is amazing!

Liz


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

They are teeny tiny at only 45g! And they don't have all their fur yet! However having said that as I mentioned before i have succesfully raised one who was only 48g at birth. 

vet nurse just phoned kittens are holding their own at present been suckling!!!! havent had to tube feed anymore they are being syringe fed again!! Obviously its still very early days as there may be some kind of problem inside but its a positive sign! im well chuffed!

An Buster (thats the one i still have here) is also doing well!


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

aww bless. Clever babies.


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## colliemerles (Nov 2, 2007)

glad the vets phoned with some good news, lets pray they get stronger and all pull through,xx


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## purrlover (Mar 27, 2009)

mellowma said:


> Keeping everything crossed for you.
> 
> It's amazing what a few days difference in birth can make. I have a link I found which shows when they grow and what they look like, it's a tad in-depth to put on here but they keep on growing/developing right up the last day.
> 
> What weights are the little ones with the vet ?


hi melloma is there any chance you could send me the link you mention ...i can pm you with my email address if thats easier

great news about the kittens hope they pull through for you .. the signs are all positive so im sending you lots of positive thought too, also great news about the one left at home with mummy .. bet hes gonna be a mummys boy! lol
julie x


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

yes, just pm your email and I will send a copy of the link over, it is very graphic but I think it's very educational, unfortunately breeding isn't always straight forward though, so I believe it's a must to read.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

can you send it to me 2 please


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

becbec31 said:


> can you send it to me 2 please


yes of course, I just read it again. pm your email address


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## purrlover (Mar 27, 2009)

WOW... how good is that link ... yes very graphic but thank you so much , i big blob for you thanks alot :thumbup:
julie


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Mias doing well and little buster is also doing good he now weighs 77g ad is always looking to feed. However i have noticed he only wants to feed off the two middle nipples. Any ideas? The bottom two seem full of milk but he just doesnt latch onto them, there doesnt look to be anything wrong with them?


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Hi everyone,

not good news im afraid. The two little ones didnt make it, we lost them this morning. The vet nurse thinks they werent developed properly inside as there lungs sounded bad and their tummies started to look black.

Natures way I suppose, I am sad but consider myself lucky that I have my loevly mia and her little buster.


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

O that is a pity. How many days gestation were they when they were born? I'm glad the other one is doing so well. Don't worry about what nipple he wants, the fact that there is no milk in that one just means he's taking it all, that's all. It's what you want.

Liz


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

That's sad Becky, you did your best for them. I hope Buster continues to thrive.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Hi liz,

They were born on day 59 or 60 i think but apparently its more than enough for them to be very underdeveloped. The vet thinks Buster survived because he was first out and somewhat protected from the toxins the stillborns were beginning to give off. He has advised that Mia is in good health and it is just one of those things. But i am going to have her fully health checks before breeding her again and if she has problems again i will spay her do you agree?

Thanks Mellowma, im dealing with it ok as i know i did my best, they were poorly and i didnt want them to suffer.


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

Yes that is a bit too early. There's probably no reason why it should happen again.

Liz


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

I hope not i wouldn't want to put her through it or myself. I suppose this is the downside to breeding.

Thanks again everyone for your support during this horrid time. This forum is wonderful and i hope one day i can help people like people have helped me.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Yes Becky there is the down side unfortunately and I for one cannot count the amount of times I have thought about giving up this year (month) alone but we still do it, I am sure Mia and your other girls will go on to have some lovely kittens for you this year.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Oh i do hope so mellowma!

Buster is still doing well he has put on some more weight he is now 81g! thats a gain of 16g in 2 days so im quite pleased considering his bad start. I know is still early days but a step in the right direction.

My mother has just boarded her flight home so will be here to help in 5 hours! Phew maybe i can have a bit more sleep.


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## colliemerles (Nov 2, 2007)

sorry to hear you lost the two small babies, hope mum and buster are doing ok.xxxx


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

becbec31 said:


> Oh i do hope so mellowma!
> 
> Buster is still doing well he has put on some more weight he is now 81g! thats a gain of 16g in 2 days so im quite pleased considering his bad start. I know is still early days but a step in the right direction.
> 
> My mother has just boarded her flight home so will be here to help in 5 hours! Phew maybe i can have a bit more sleep.


That's good gains, he is a little fighter, glad your Mum is back today I was reading of people having to wait weeks, so that's great news. Tell her not to go get stuck abroad like that ever again! Enjoy your sleep.  Hope you got the link of I sent it via pm. x


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

I did get it thanks. Im gonna have a more careful look at it when im more alert and have bit more time.

She was one of the lucky ones only 4 days overdue coming home someone else i know cannot get back for another week so they will have been away a month! 

I feel sorry for her something always goes wrong when shes goes away!! 

ill get some photos up in a few days (god willing) of little buster and my gorgeous Mia.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Morning everyone,

Quick update on Buster, he weigh 86g this morning, is still feeding well and showing no obvious problems. Mia is also doing a fabulous job as a first time mummy!

I'm so proud of her.


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## tylow (Feb 11, 2009)

I've read your thread with much interest and am so glad Mia and Buster are doing well. As a novice breeder threads like yours are invaluable


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

I know the feeling! This forum is a great place to learn and someone is always available with advice and moral support.

What cats do you breed?


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## tylow (Feb 11, 2009)

Birman, one queen at the moment


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## Mum2Alfie (Jan 4, 2010)

Aww I am sorry to hear of the 2 little ones! RIP liluns! 

Glad to hear about lil buster though! Thats great that he is doing so well!


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Glad Buster is doing well. Hope you had a good rest. x


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Thanks i have, hes a bit more independent now too hes learning how to latch on without help. I'm just getting up every couple of hours to check hes feeding I'll keep doing this till he gets up to a good weight.

Just weighed him and hes 90g. So if they had been today like they were supposed to be he would have been a much better weight.

I'm also so relieved Mia is doing such a good job, one of my other girls needed much more help and assistance for the first week as she couldn't figure out what to do with them.

All in all its a much happier house!


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## purrlover (Mar 27, 2009)

becbec31 said:


> Thanks i have, hes a bit more independent now too hes learning how to latch on without help. I'm just getting up every couple of hours to check hes feeding I'll keep doing this till he gets up to a good weight.
> 
> Just weighed him and hes 90g. So if they had been today like they were supposed to be he would have been a much better weight.
> 
> ...


thats great news ...as im waiting on my 1st 2 queens 1 in 6 weeks (she pinked up last thursday , and the other had confirmed matings 2 weeks ago ).. i read these threads ... to gain much more knowledge etc
julie x


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

The more knowledge you can get the better, although nothing really prepares you for the real thing! 

I find the advice of breeders absolutely invaluable! Vets are also helpful but sometimes can be a little limited in knowledge of certain breeds. What do you have?


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## Missymoo (May 19, 2009)

Awww im sorry to hear you lost 2 but pleased t hear the one lil un is doing well!!

Can i just ask i hope this doesnt come across as rude its really not meant too but you've said this isnt the first prem lot are they from the same cat or different cos im just wondering why you would do it over again? I do hope the little one is ok!!


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

No not the same cat. The first lot were not premature in fact they were dead on time. Just 2 were very small as there was a few in litter and it was the cats first pregnancy which is always challenging and she is quite a small cat, she is a British Shorthair colourpoint and seems to have a look of siamese about her even though she is a full pedigree. The vet at the time said they were very healthy kittens just a bit small and in a few days they were up to a good weight.

I dont think you are being rude at all just perhaps a little naive, (please dont take offense not meant in that way) prem births can happen for numerous reasons just like in women and I wouldn't expect a lady who had a prem birth never to have more children. If it happened twice with one cat I would spay her, but Mia has been thoroughly checked out and in the vets words she is a picture of health its just an unfortunate turn of events. 

I have just weighed Buster again and he is now 93g. He is thriving thank goodness.


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## Missymoo (May 19, 2009)

I don't think you can compare a cat to a woman.. but you are right i wouldn't have not had another child is my son was prem BUT if my cat had had trouble with a first litter i wouldn't have put her through it again thats why i asked if it was the same cat.

Glad to hear Buster is doing well :thumbup:


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

She didnt have trouble with the birthing process it all went fine in fact much better than some births. The kittens were just a bit underdeveloped due to being early. If she had had to have a c section due to a difficult labour this may be a different matter. 

Pedigree cats are slightly more difficult to breed than moggies and any vet or breeder would say so, it would be your personal choice not to breed your cat again if she has a premature birth. Mia basically had 2 kittens die (stillborns are quite common in cats as i'm sure you know) inside her and her body aborted them as the placentas had started dying. The vet was very keen to tell me this s just what her body should have done, and there is absolutely no reason why it should happen again.

If we spayed our queens after one tragic event we would never have any queens. Don't know if any other breeders have any views on this? I would hate to think i would breed her again if im wrong in thinking this was perhaps just unfortunate?


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Missymoo said:


> I don't think you can compare a cat to a woman.. but you are right i wouldn't have not had another child is my son was prem BUT if my cat had had trouble with a first litter i wouldn't have put her through it again thats why i asked if it was the same cat.


There is no reason not to breed from her again, perhaps if the vet found something seriously wrong or if she went onto have another pregnancy and had problems but I certainly wouldn't have a girl spayed after one problem which may never happen again.

These things happen sadly but no reason why Mum shouldn't go on to have another litter imo.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Quick update on Buster. Hes weighing in at 125g now, very lively (or as lively as a just under week old kitten can be) and he is feeding and latching on without any help.

Think hes gonna be an absolute Beauty.


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## Mum2Alfie (Jan 4, 2010)

:thumbup: Thats great news!! You have worked hard with them all! Your work has paid off! Well done!

Piccys!!!


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## tylow (Feb 11, 2009)

Glad all is well


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## Honeybunch (Apr 25, 2010)

Hi, I'm a new member but have been following your thread am so pleased that Buster is doing very well after what you've been through. You have done very well. Congratulations!:thumbup:


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Thanks everyone, I'll keep you all posted on how he's doing and will post some pics when he is a little bigger.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Glad he is doing well! :thumbup:


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## colliemerles (Nov 2, 2007)

glad Buster is doing well. and look forward to some pictures when he is a little bigger.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Morning everyone,

Another quick update, Buster is still doing brilliantly. He weighs 142g now and is getting quite chunky in fact think im gonna have to watch he doesnt get fat when hes a few weeks older.

:thumbup:Another Happy day here! Just waiting to see if Blossom my colourpoint girl is expecting she should be pinking up next week.


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## rhian d (Jan 26, 2010)

i have been following your post and i am glad lil buster is doin well there is just one more thing needed and that is pictures  and fingers crossed for your colourpoint girl


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Glad he is doing well.

We *do* need pictures now though.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

I will try and get some photos on tonight, Im just setting up a new laptop so havent had chance to get my photos uploaded yet.


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