# My Sneezy hedgie!



## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

I've just been on the phone to the out of hours vets about him because the other day my african pygmy hedgehog had a sneezing fit for a short time and then it went away but this evening he was sneezing and freaking out in his cage and on my bed for over half an hour, backing up every time he sneezed and bunching his whole body up! Then he would wipe his face on whatever was near him presumably to scratch his little nose.

She was extremely helpful, very knowledgeable and said she could speak with the other vet who is more knowledgeable about them. . .so if he is more knowledgeable than she is I am more than pleased! His sneezing has calmed down, he's still doing it but less frequently and less violently. ..she is leaning towards the idea of allergies. . .she said if he gets lethargic or the sneezing gets bad again she will come out to see him so that's brilliant. . .she has also told me she will ring me between 9 and 11 tomorrow and if she hasn't rang me by 11 I have to call them. . .for him to have an appointment tomorrow with herself and the vet she says knows more about them, they want to listen to his chest and give him a good check over. So I'm really pleased, I'm counting down the hours until I can take him though because I am so worried about him. . .if he could tell me what was wrong I wouldn't panic but because I don't know I'm really worried. . . 

He's not got mucous coming out of his nose, when he sneezes it is just wet like spit and he's licking his nose quite a bit so it could actually just be spit 

I just want to hurry up and know he's okay though :cryin: trust this to happen now that I'm back on placement and have an assignment due in the day after tomorrow!

Poor baby he comes first though! If necessary I will be ringing work and saying I'm not coming in because I'm not risking leaving him all day. . .I'm meant to be doing a 12:30-21:30 shift so I wont be if his appointment is later in the day. . I'll probably have to say it's my dad who's poorly or something though because people just don't understand these things!!!

awww he was asleep under my t-shirt and i just woke him up checking on him  bless him I hope he's not feeling poorly


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## sullivan (Aug 29, 2008)

ahh bless your hedgy...im sure it might be allergy or something irritating his nose could be something is been sniffing about and gone up its nose and irratiatng. hope hes ok x


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## Carla-Jade (Jul 28, 2010)

what substrate is he on?

i take it hes not showing signs og WHS?


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## Guest (Jun 8, 2011)

Carla-Jade said:


> what substrate is he on?
> 
> i take it hes not showing signs og WHS?


I was gonna ask this too


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## Carla-Jade (Jul 28, 2010)

B3rnie said:


> I was gonna ask this too


maybe see if a video of him could be uploaded to see what he loks like?

always a bad question to ask about whs though


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## Guest (Jun 8, 2011)

Carla-Jade said:


> always a bad question to ask about whs though


I think it is every hog owners worst nightmare


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## Carla-Jade (Jul 28, 2010)

B3rnie said:


> I think it is every hog owners worst nightmare


yeah it really is  heartbreaking worry is that

my little fella has started to jump when startled bless him!


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## sullivan (Aug 29, 2008)

b3rnie said:


> i think it is every hog owners worst nightmare


whats is that ?


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## Carla-Jade (Jul 28, 2010)

sullivan said:


> whats is that ?


wobbly hedgehog syndrome


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## Guest (Jun 8, 2011)

sullivan said:


> whats is that ?


Wobbly Hedgehog Syndrome In African Pygmy Hedgehogs That will explain it better than I can hun...


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## sullivan (Aug 29, 2008)

Carla-Jade said:


> wobbly hedgehog syndrome


Ive never heard of it. is it new in the breeding or something thats always been in there breed.


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## Guest (Jun 8, 2011)

sullivan said:


> Ive never heard of it. is it new in the breeding or something thats always been in there breed.


No one fully understands it yet unfortunately, but and decent breeder will not breed any that have either developed it or had any babies develop it


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## Guest (Jun 8, 2011)

> Sneezing  Can be an irritation caused by dusty bedding. If its just sneezing place your hedgie onto fleece liners for 24 hours to see if it helps  any other signs including lethargy, loss of appetite, runny nose accompanying sneezing should not be left and treated by a vet immediately as it is indicative of an upper respiratory tract infection which is serious to hedgies. It is not uncommon for a hedgie to sneeze from time to time whilst taking a drink or clearing their nostrils.


Taken from the APH forum.

However......

If he has a runny nose or other conditions and is coming across OVERALL under the weather I would take him to the 24 hour vet. Upper Respiratory Infections can kill hedgehogs upon other conditions.

I suggest because it was a sneezing fit and not just 1 sneeze that you keep him warm and a close eye on him IF you are unable to get him to a vet tonight. Although I would strongly suggest it.

Good luck and keep us updated.


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

having had a WHS hog (necropsy confirmed) i can say that sneezing wasnt a symtom for her, neither was backing up...

WHS is thought to be linked to genetics
video of huffy shortly before her final vet trip


the first signs of onset was a slight weakness in her back legs, backing up and sneezing were never apparent

i would lean more to questioning the bedding, if you use any air fresheners in the room or anything like that


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## Carla-Jade (Jul 28, 2010)

B3rnie said:


> No one fully understands it yet unfortunately, but and decent breeder will not breed any that have either developed it or had any babies develop it


yeah thats why the registry is a good idea to trace the lines. poor hoggles


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## sullivan (Aug 29, 2008)

Interesting as i dont have a hedgy but still good to know about these things


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

sullivan said:


> ahh bless your hedgy...im sure it might be allergy or something irritating his nose could be something is been sniffing about and gone up its nose and irratiatng. hope hes ok x


I suggested to the vet it could be something up his nose because he seems to be snorting and trying to get something out . . .either that or just sneezing violently. . .he's not sneezed for about 5 minutes now though so I'm feeling a lot better. . .he's had some food and gone and got in his bed on his heat pad.
which he often does when I have my light on bright. . .



Carla-Jade said:


> what substrate is he on?
> 
> i take it hes not showing signs og WHS?


He's currently on a pair of fleece pjs trousers and a top . . .because at the weekend when he was sneezing I was worried it could be washing powder in the liner I made for his cage and took it out and replaced it with the only thing I could find that had been washed at the same time as his liner was washed before (because he'd not had any problems before) we haven't changed washing powder or anything though

I suggested to the vet that it could be due to us living near fields and I had to window open a crack the other day which is about when he started with the sneezing. . well when he had it the first time. . but not as bad, then it went away and now it's come back worse. . .he's still not showing signs of actually being poorly like his eye is bright (his other eye is grey due to scarring when he was a baby so I can't really judge it from that one . . that one looks exactly the same as it always did though.) He's not actually snotty he's just got an itchy nose I think. . .

he's not showing signs of WHS no he's as energetic as always and not shaky,not got any weakness on any of his limbs etc

like I said he's just been eating some cat biscuits. . .I've got a video of him eating his cat biscuits but you'll have to excuse the fact he has got cat biscuits scattered all over his cage in the video. . .he always does it. . . and I don't want to disturb his bedding to get it out in case it causes dust and makes him worse.

The video has only got him sneezing a couple of times at the end. . .and you can barely see him but he's not sneezed for a long time which is leading to me checking on him every 2 seconds!

When he was sneezing really violently though him back was wrinkling up like. . .I can only describe it as being like the back of a bald man's head! you know them creases they get? and he was stepping backwards and looking around like he didn't know where it was coming from



shetlandlover said:


> Taken from the APH forum.
> 
> However......
> 
> ...


he doesn't seem unwell that's the strange thing, he is acting perfectly normal. . .I believe his nose is wet because he's licked it because there's no mucous. . .when he sneezes it's like tiny little droplets of water tiny tiny tiny little ones on my skin and it's clear. . .i have suspicions it's coming from his mouth rather than his nose. . he can still smell fine and he's still eating, drinking, running around, pooing and weeing. . .I'll be taking his poo from tonight with me to the vets tomorrow I think. . they haven't requested it but I thought it might be wise anyway despite it being a perfectly normal piece of poo for him.
the vet said to ring her if he starts sneezing continuously again but as it has subsided and he's acting like his normal self she's just going to see him tomorrow. She said she's more than happy to come out though if I have any concerns but I'm relatively happy that he's feeling okay, his breathing from what I can hear is clear too. I'm going to be up all night checking on him anyway so if anything at all happens I'll be straight on the phone, she'd get here in about 15 minutes at the most because there's no traffic.

He's really not acting poorly at all though he is acting perfectly normal, then sneezing, wiping his nose on stuff (presumably itchy) and then carrying on as normal. . .he's not lethargic or anything.

Sorry if I've repeated myself I wrote this in small sections whilst checking on him and waiting for the video to upload

it's a shame I didn't film him at his worst but obviously I don't want him to start doing it again just for me to film it! :cryin:

08062011058.mp4 video by nico0lagouldsmith - Photobucket

the way he is wandering around aimlessly is perfectly normal for him, that's what he's always been like he doesn't sit still for long
oh and the way he is sitting funny eating his biscuits is normal for him too, he sits back on his bum to eat  like I said ignore the cat biscuits he's scattered everywhere!

Oh and WHS is sometimes described as being the hedgie equivalent to MS isn't it? poor little babies 

thanks for all your replies, I haven't even had a reply on the hedgehog forums!!!!


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

he hasn't sneezed for a while and last time he sneezed he sneezed on my t-shirt and afterwards there was a tiny pale brown hair on my top. . .like really tiny. . .smaller and thinner than what you would pluck out of your eyebrow . . .is the best way I can think to describe it. . .like a fine brown hair, only a few mm in length. . .I have no idea where it came from. . .it may have been on my top already but it looks too thin to be my hair and the wrong colour to be his . . .so I have no idea. . .but it was just strange that it was exactly where he sneezed on me. . .it may have been there before like I said but it's strange he hasn't sneezed since. . :/ even if he doesn't sneeze again tonight I'm still taking him to the vets tomorrow. . .there's no chance I'm leaving him. .I'd rather get into trouble at work than leave him in any discomfort


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## Carla-Jade (Jul 28, 2010)

hes gorgeous! i love his house too!

i use finacard for sprite, i found other things irritated or hurt him so hes ok with that. good luck at vets tomorrow- is there an exotics vet there? mine was fantasti on the phone when he showed early signs of hibernation


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## Guest (Jun 8, 2011)

> he doesn't seem unwell that's the strange thing, he is acting perfectly normal.


If he seems well within himself and his nose is not running then something may have irritated his nose. Keep a close eye on him incase but overall, its not unheard of.

Good luck and let us know how he gets on at the vets!!


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## sullivan (Aug 29, 2008)

Hopefully it was a hair and it was tickling him up his nose. best to get him checked though to be on the safe side if worried. good luck


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

which vets are you taking him to hun?

i would maybe change his bedding, i have mine on megazorb and they do great on it


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

yeah he sounds brilliant. . .the lady I spoke to tonight seemed really knowledgeable and yet she said "I'll contact Ian and see what he says because he'll come to see him tomorrow too, he knows more than me about them" and I've previously spoken to Ian via email and he really seems to know his stuff. . .she knew loads though so maybe she's learned a lot from working with him. . .but I'm really pleased I found him. . . it's Ark veterinary surgery at Killamarsh and Dronfield (Sheffield) so it's not far from me at all. . .thank god I've got a sat nav though because I wouldn't find it! He's not even been for his registration check-up yet because he was so healthy and I've been so busy but they're going to do that tomorrow too. . .maybe they wont charge me since the registration medical is free anyway  haha I don't mind if they do though, he's insured and I have a credit card  and if I didn't I'd sell everything I owned to make sure he got the treatment he needs because obviously I love him so much he's such a little sweety and I'm so much more careful with him when it comes to checking on him for any signs of illness because he just seems to tiny and frail compared to all my other pets. . .

I was impressed when the vet said "how old is he?" and I said "he was born 10/10/10" and she said "so he's not very heavy is he?" and I said "ummmm 200 and umm something. .hold on he's quite small anyway" (whilst I was looking in my diary) and she said "about 250?" and I said "257g!!" so she must know a bit about them to have guessed that so close! I'm going to weigh him again in a minute just to make sure he's not lost any since last week. .. 

he really seems fine right now, he just made a bit of a snuffly sound but I think it was because he was moving his bed around with his nose. . .but I'm going to turn my light off shortly when I've made a list of everything I need to take with me tomorrow and see if he wheels


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

i know where you mean Ian does seem to know his stuff about hoggies, i wouldnt trust him with my rabbits though, but thats a different matter, he has been given the full Q & A session by me :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: dont think he was quite expecting it but oh well


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

Lil Miss said:


> which vets are you taking him to hun?
> 
> i would maybe change his bedding, i have mine on megazorb and they do great on it


I've got some "Pets at Home Small Safe Pet Bedding. none toxic paper and wool flakes" them little white soft strips. . .but as he's not sneezing at the moment I'm going to leave him as he is. . .he does have another sneezing fit I will change it to that tonight I think because it's dust free etc

is that megazorb wood based? I wonder if it would benefit him if I washed his cage liners I made in just really hot water in the washing machine with no washing powder or anything in it


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

megazorb is a by product of the paper making process, it is virgin wood pulp dried out at really high temperatures, its really good you can get it at argo feeds (in penistone) for £7.32 (i think) my maths is terrible its £6.10 +VAT


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

I just got him out to check on him and he started sneezing again, not as bad as earlier but it's so strange if you pick him up he completely stops, still breathes but stops sneezing and if you touch him he stops too. . .so maybe there is something irritating him as it seems a little more voluntary. . . It's such a good job he's not a huffy hedgehog because if he was they would have a right job checking him out tomorrow!


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

Lil Miss said:


> i know where you mean Ian does seem to know his stuff about hoggies, i wouldnt trust him with my rabbits though, but thats a different matter, he has been given the full Q & A session by me :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: dont think he was quite expecting it but oh well


oh I'm glad you know who it is  I feel even more at ease now 



Lil Miss said:


> megazorb is a by product of the paper making process, it is virgin wood pulp dried out at really high temperatures, its really good you can get it at argo feeds (in penistone) for £7.32 (i think) my maths is terrible its £6.10 +VAT


That sounds really good actually I might try that. . .since he seems to be so sensitive though I think I'll buy it and then try him on in it a litter tray on my bed for play time to make sure he doesn't react . . .if he doesn't like it i'll use it on the G pigs. . .


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

and now I'm bloody sneezing. . .I said to the vet earlier that maybe it's because the dog comes in my room but she's always in my room and he's never had a problem before. . . but I've been thinking. . .she could very easily carry pollen and allergens in with her. . .probably even easier than I could because of all her fur (she's only a yorkie but still)


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

Nico0laGouldsmith said:


> oh I'm glad you know who it is  I feel even more at ease now
> 
> That sounds really good actually I might try that. . .since he seems to be so sensitive though I think I'll buy it and then try him on in it a litter tray on my bed for play time to make sure he doesn't react . . .if he doesn't like it i'll use it on the G pigs. . .


oh yes, i know who he is, his eyes lit up when i mentioned APH's to him :lol:
i would trust him with my hogs

word of warning though, if you are going to the surgery at killimarsh, make sure you put the post code in sat nav, theres 2 sheffield roads really close to each other, mums sat nav wouldnt register the postcode and took her to the wrong sheffield road :lol:


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

Lil Miss said:


> oh yes, i know who he is, his eyes lit up when i mentioned APH's to him :lol:
> i would trust him with my hogs
> 
> word of warning though, if you are going to the surgery at killimarsh, make sure you put the post code in sat nav, theres 2 sheffield roads really close to each other, mums sat nav wouldnt register the postcode and took her to the wrong sheffield road :lol:


oh i will do then. . .fortunately my dad is a HGV driver, he knows pretty much the whole of yorkshire like the back of his hand. .. down to shop names, road names and landmarks so if I do get lost I'll ring him but I'll put the post code in they have on the site. . .

I'm glad you would trust him that definitely makes me feel better 

I've kind of caused myself a problem here because I've had him out on my bed for much longer than I normally would so he's now tired, he's been pottering about in his cage but he's not on his wheel and the light has been off for about 10 minutes now. . . 
:/


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

HE'S WHEELING

THANK GOD hahaha that must be a good sign

I've never been so happy to hear his wheel squeek!


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

appointment at 12:10  So I'm going to have to call work and tell them I'm either going to be late or not coming in at all. . . .


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## Carla-Jade (Jul 28, 2010)

hope its all ok.... how id it go? tell meeee!!! 

cuddles for him


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

howd you get on hun? did Ian hog nap him :lol: :lol:


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

he kept saying how tame he was  because he didn't ball up once. . he just huffed a bit later in the appointment time because he had fallen asleep inside of his carrier and I woke him up so he was a bit grumpy. . .but at the beginning and the end he was perfectly happy to be picked up and poked and prodded 

I'm really pleased with him, I couldn't have found a better vet I don't think. . . he got a book out with hedgies in and went through his whole living arrangement with me, he made suggestions on how I can make sure heat is retained etc and wrote down lots of things such as he knows someone who works in the exotics place in Dinnington and he sells a range of stuff that's perfect as substrate in the bottom. . .he said I want it to be pretty thick so he can dig around because he digs at his bedding so he obviously enjoys digging. . . he seemed happy with the food mix I've got him on, he checked his breathing and said it sounds okay and he's not snotty etc. . . he has weighed him and written a prescription ready for antibiotics in case he gets poorly over the weekend because he isn't on call but because he's done the prescription anyone else who is on call can just give me it. He gave me the choice to have the antibiotics today or to leave it, he said it was entirely up to me but as he doesn't look poorly and his breathing is okay today it isn't a necessity so I said that I'd rather not give him anything he doesn't absolutely need so that's why he did me the prescription. . . he's given me some wormer in a pre-filled syringe. . .it's for rabbits so he only has a tiny tiny amount. . .I've just got to somehow make him let me put it in his mouth every day for 5 days. . .then none for 10 then more again for 5. He said it will make sure he doesn't have lung worm or any other types of worms and obviously making sure he has no lung worm will rule that out if he has another sneezing fit and also worming him in general is a good idea isn't it 

I'm more than pleased actually. . . he said to ring if he even shows any signs of being poorly at all just don't hesitate. . . it cost me £41.70 which I didn't think was bad at all because we were in there for absolutely ages, he was very thorough especially with it being his first visit. . . it's lower than the excess I'd have to pay for the insurance so I'm going to ring the insurance and let them know he's been to the vets but I'm not going to make a claim (because if I don't they wont pay out if anything else happens)


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## Carla-Jade (Jul 28, 2010)

im pleased they were so thorough with him  glad he has a good bill of heath

what susbstrate did he recommend? sprite digs in his finacard, its warm too for winter


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

he said the shop in dinnington sells various different ones and they have sold hedgehogs in the past, he trusts them and thinks they're really informed about them so he says they will offer me lots of different types and I can pick what I like the best. . .he said it's best to get something that is soft and comfortable, not able to get stuck up any willies or in eyes/noses (obviously) and something he can dig in and it needs to be a really thick layer.. . he suggested a ceramic heat lamp at the top of the cage to regulate the temperature from top and bottom because apparently with the heat pad if you looked at the cage with heat goggles on you'd see a dome of heat coming up from the bottom but it wouldn't go very far.

He's currently in a large rabbit cage so I said I have been intending to get him a zoozone 2 for a while now and he said that's a good idea because they help keep the heat in obviously 

I'm so glad I had all your support guys through this. . .I was absolutely terrified last night!


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## Carla-Jade (Jul 28, 2010)

Nico0laGouldsmith said:


> he said the shop in dinnington sells various different ones and they have sold hedgehogs in the past, he trusts them and thinks they're really informed about them so he says they will offer me lots of different types and I can pick what I like the best. . .he said it's best to get something that is soft and comfortable, not able to get stuck up any willies or in eyes/noses (obviously) and something he can dig in and it needs to be a really thick layer.. . he suggested a *ceramic heat lamp at the top of the cage to regulate the temperature from top *and bottom because apparently with the heat pad if you looked at the cage with heat goggles on you'd see a dome of heat coming up from the bottom but it wouldn't go very far.
> 
> He's currently in a large rabbit cage so I said I have been intending to get him a zoozone 2 for a while now and he said that's a good idea because they help keep the heat in obviously
> 
> I'm so glad I had all your support guys through this. . .I was absolutely terrified last night!


i have a CHE as well as a heat pad for the base but i took that out- he also has a slate tile for if he gets too warm. i have a ZZ2- i bathesd him today so will put p some pics of his clean fresh set up! anytime- its so hard with APH cos you really have to have another owner to talk to sometimes which there are few of us about! xx


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

i just have heat mats under their houses, my room is normally very warm, and the heat pad offers them a snuggly place

personally i wouldnt buy anything from a pet shop that sells live hedgehogs on principle!
megazorb is perfect for hogs in my experience though


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

Lil Miss said:


> i just have heat mats under their houses, my room is normally very warm, and the heat pad offers them a snuggly place
> 
> personally i wouldnt buy anything from a pet shop that sells live hedgehogs on principle!
> megazorb is perfect for hogs in my experience though


 well I thought that but he said they sold them and knew a lot about them. . as a vet he would probably have said something if he thought it was a bad idea for them to sell them. . .It's an exotics shop that sells reptiles and things like sugar gliders though so at least they sold them with the correct set up! Like most pet shops don't even suggest a heat pad or give advice on temperatures!

I thought my room is normally really warm. . like I actually sweat if I've been in here too long but the temperature on his cage is only at 75 which isn't even 24 degrees Celsius and they should be at 29-30 . ..he suggest getting 2 digital thermometers for different parts of the cage because he said any sudden change in temp like in the opposite side of the cage will cause them too much stress. . . . I'm really glad I talked to him. . I'd rather be overly equipped than have even a chance of him being cold. . . we had a powercut and I had to walk around with him inside my top because we have an electric stove so I couldn't even heat up water for a hot water bottle!!!!! If it had've continued I would have had to go and ask round all the neighbours houses!



Carla-Jade said:


> i have a CHE as well as a heat pad for the base but i took that out- he also has a slate tile for if he gets too warm. i have a ZZ2- i bathesd him today so will put p some pics of his clean fresh set up! anytime- its so hard with APH cos you really have to have another owner to talk to sometimes which there are few of us about! xx


awesome I'd love to see it


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## Carla-Jade (Jul 28, 2010)

ok i will get them uploaaded, you on fb? io have some up there too x


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

yeah Nicky Gould | Facebook


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## Carla-Jade (Jul 28, 2010)

added you. you will recogise my avatar


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

you would be surprised, his ethics in a few things are questionable, they only recently changed to the lappinject VHD vaccine in rabbits and he sees no issue at all in using the cylap (which should NEVER be used) so no, i really wouldnt trust his ethics in that, he is not big on rescue either.....

so yes, while he knows about hogs, and i would trust him to treat mine, i wouldnt trust him with any of my other fluffs, and i would not trust his ethics :lol:


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

there's not much information on hedgehogs though is there so like I guess if he had an interest in them it wouldn't take him too long to learn loads about them. . . whereas rabbits are like cats and dogs there's absolutely loads of information out there about them so it's very hard to keep up with it all

I guess it's only like in the NHS . . .some doctors say one thing due to new evidence, others will swear by something they've followed for 10 years. . . you're meant to keep up to date but some don't like the new evidence. . .

I'm always wary about injections anyway and when he was suggesting things I was thinking that if he suggested an injection I might actually ask him to search on his computer behind him for any kind of contradictions on any forums hahaha

the wormer he has given me is for rabbits but it's a very very small dose so i'm not worried about that


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

I've got a feeling the vet thought I think hedgehogs only live a really short time because he asked me if I had thought about ever getting another one and I said "no because they can't live together anyway. . .plus I would have to get it whilst he's still alive because it would make me feel like I was replacing him if I got it after he died" it sounded like I meant I've got a really short time to decide whether to get another! hahaha I really hope he didn't think I meant that  I want him to live forever


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