# not sure..........Long



## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Hi all,

As you may remember i got a new cat, Crystal on the 12th november. There was a possability that she may have been pregnant.

Well i took her to the vets 30th nov and the vet comfirmed that she wasnt pregnant. She was due to be speyed on 13th dec. She, what seemed like, came in to heat on the 8th dec, BUT onthe 9th dec my young daughter decided to let her out to play in the snow!  I tried to call her back in but she had vanished.

I called every vet, shelter, dog walker, rescue, cat sitter, RSPCA and CPL within a 25 mile radius. No one had seen or heard of her. I posted it everywhere on the internet, posted 300 flyers, knocked on peoples doors, nothing. I even emptied my hoover in to the garden and put her litter tray out for smells!

She was missing until the 26th dec of dec when i saw her in a neighbours garden, i tried to coax her in but she ran away, i then saw her again on the 28th in the same garden, she ran away again. Finally on the 1st Jan another neighbour saw her and knocked to tell me, i went straight out to her (in my pjs and OHs shoes in the snow and dark) and looked with food in hand, i managed to catch her and bring her home thank god! She ate like a pig when i got her back, she had lost weight and was dirty but she was home and safe.

Now she had been missing for 23 days in total, she has been home for 5 days.
She is looking very obviously pregnant, i have vets on 11th jan, eating loads, firm round belly, much more affectionate.

I thought they normally started showing after being 4 weeks preg, is there a chance that the vet could of missed it first time round and she has been pregnant since and is due anyday or is she showing because she is so slim? im sure iv felt a kitten about 2 inches long?! 

I am now free feeding her with hills science plan kitten dry and pouches, and giving her one carton of kitten milk a day.

Why didnt she come back when my daughter let her out? Is it because ther was snow on the ground and she couldnt smell her way back? She was out in both the snow blizzards we had!

Thanks


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## alisondalziel (Oct 8, 2008)

What a situation and how stressful for you!!

I don't mean to be rude but your young child DECIDED to let her out!! What?
I am a mother of 2 myself and my children certainly would NOT be deciding anything here!!

How old is the cat?

It's difficult to tell how far along she is, i wouldn't bother with the vet, it will just stress her out. If she is fine in herself then leave her to it.

Once they are moving and you can see/feel it she will have approx 2 weeks to go.

Dry food isn't really necessary unless you are out a lot. Wet is much better for her.

If you must feed dry i would try Orijen, Fish4Cats or Royal Canin Babycat34 or Kitten36.

Good wet foods are Animonda Carny, Smilia, Grau, Nature's Menu, Hi Life to name a few.

Kitten milk isn't needed at all, won't do her any good and cause diahorrea.

When your daughter let her out if she was calling she wouldn't have been already pregnant so went off to find a mate. She may have gone a fair distance so it took her time to find her way back.

It's now IMPERATIVE she doesn't get back outside until she is speyed.

Going on your dates, she will be due between 12th feb-7th march, probably nearer the start of those days.

If you need anything else just shout, i wish you the best of luck


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

alisondalziel said:


> What a situation and how stressful for you!!
> 
> I don't mean to be rude but your young child DECIDED to let her out!! What?
> I am a mother of 2 myself and my children certainly would NOT be deciding anything here!!
> ...


Hi thanks for your reply.

I say young daughter but she is 10, she has ADHD and although she knew it was wrong to let her out she does things on impulse and thinks about it after. Yes she did decide let her out but this wasnt to my knowlage!

When i got her i was told she was about a year old, that was 2 months ago.

She does seem well in herself.

I thought she was calling but couldnt be 100% sure as iv never experienced this before, although i have bred 2 litters before my queen was a silent caller.

I was thinking about the 14th feb.

x


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

Vets can't feel a pregnancy before at least 3 weeks, so it's entirely possible that the cat was up to three weeks gone by the time she escaped.

She may very well be two-timing you. There are an awful lot of well-meaning people out there who think any pretty cat is bound to be homeless, especially if the cat is out in the snow. I'd keep her in now if you can, if she was three weeks pregnant when you got her the kittens are due next week!

Liz


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

A few pics of the beautiful Crystal. :001_wub:





































You can see her rounded tummy in this one.....










You can sort of see how slim she is towards her hips.


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## Guest (Jan 6, 2011)

Looking at those pictures i think she does look pregnant. Good luck with her birth and make sure you have funds available should anything go wrong and needs to see a vet. ive read cats tend to have their babies at night and needing a vet out of hours can be very expensive should you need one


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## alisondalziel (Oct 8, 2008)

Aww she is cute, and has the same name as my daughter so must be extra special!! 

Shame it has happened, she does look pregnant. At least she is mature enough to deal with a pregnancy and birth so that's a relief!

All you can do is be ready, you can always call the vet if you need to or feel you need advice.

Most births go well so try not to worry too much.

14th of feb would be such a lovely valentines present!!


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## celicababe1986 (Jun 22, 2009)

What a lovely looking cat! I think she looks pregnant in those pics. best of luck!


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## GeordieBabe (Apr 7, 2009)

what a gorgeous cat,surprised you could find her in the snow  j\k
now my daughters cat looked about the same size as your cat when pregnant then some days she didn't look pregnant so she thought nothing of it, one day she was stroking Meg then felt kittens move,following week Meg had 2 kittens sadly both still born  nothing she could do, now i'm NOT saying this will happen to yours just preparing you as it does happen...........i do hope she has some lovely kittens and everything is fine,but do keep her in after kittens come as she can get pregnant straight away


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

Unless it is a very small litter, I'd say she's only about 4 or 5 weeks gone. 4 weeks would tie in with when you thought she was calling and your daughter let her out, so that all seems to add up fairly conclusively to a due date of Feb 12th.

Liz


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

Should she had had them by now? I think she also looks small about 5-weekish, I wonder who she mated with / how many, what colour they will be?
daughter needs a smacked bum!   

Get in good quality food, get a good vet behind you, strt prepareing for birth, birthing items etc, read up as much as you can!!!!


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

I'd recomend you get her to the vet to be checked over having been gone for so long. Not only that but if she is in kitten she could do with a check over anyway to make sure she's healthy and not picked anything up on her adventure.

I'd also recommend you discuss spay/abortion with your vet too. You know how I feel about it as I remember the last thread you made, so I'll spare you the repetition  But it really would be best all round for it to be considered ... especially for your girl who will have lost a lot of condition without being AWOL. 

I wish people would stop saying there is no need for a vet.


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## alisondalziel (Oct 8, 2008)

The OP already said she was going to the vets on the 11th Feb.


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

alisondalziel said:


> The OP already said she was going to the vets on the 11th Feb.


thats 5 weeks away lol;!

Edit: its the 11th jan not feb lol!


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## momentofmadness (Jul 19, 2008)

I think I would consider going to the vets now and having her done and kits aborted im afraid.... 

But that is just my opinion..


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

My lil Babies said:


> Looking at those pictures i think she does look pregnant. Good luck with her birth





celicababe1986 said:


> What a lovely looking cat! I think she looks pregnant in those pics. best of luck!


Thanks 



GeordieBabe said:


> what a gorgeous cat,surprised you could find her in the snow  j\k
> now my daughters cat looked about the same size as your cat when pregnant then some days she didn't look pregnant so she thought nothing of it, one day she was stroking Meg then felt kittens move,following week Meg had 2 kittens sadly both still born  nothing she could do, now i'm NOT saying this will happen to yours just preparing you as it does happen...........i do hope she has some lovely kittens and everything is fine,but do keep her in after kittens come as she can get pregnant straight away


Thanks, luckily i have had 2 litters of kittens before so i know what to expect. 



Taylorbaby said:


> Should she had had them by now? I think she also looks small about 5-weekish, I wonder who she mated with / how many, what colour they will be?
> daughter needs a smacked bum!
> 
> Get in good quality food, get a good vet behind you, strt prepareing for birth, birthing items etc, read up as much as you can!!!!


Yea, I think if the vet had missed she would of done, or would be due any day, which I don't think she is. I know she had a litter before I had had her, she had 4 kittens, 1 white, 1 black & 2 blk/white. there are quite a few toms round here most of them are blk/white but 2 of them are tabby. iv put her on a good food already.

Thanks


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

momentofmadness said:


> I think I would consider going to the vets now and having her done and kits aborted im afraid....
> 
> But that is just my opinion..


Thanks for your opinion but that's not an option. x


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

11th January is still 5 days away.

Why is it not an option? Have you not brought enough crossbred animals in to the world already?

I realise that might get a few peoples backs up, but seriously ... how many accidental pregnancies can one person excuse?


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Aurelia said:


> 11th January is still 5 days away.
> 
> Why is it not an option? Have you not brought enough crossbred animals in to the world already?
> 
> *I realise that might get a few peoples backs up, but seriously ... how many accidental pregnancies can one person excuse?*


It is not something I agree with, that's just my opinion.

I do not regret any of the animals I have bought into this world.

in bold = if this is aimed at me when were the other accidental pregnancies?? :confused1:


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Firstly, to answer your question I had a look at your post history so I could be accurate. While doing so I noticed you claim to be a fosterer for your local rescue? 
Anyway ... From what I've seen just checking a couple of pages you've previously breed at least one other moggie (by accident) and have purposefully bred your cross breed dogs ... which looks planned, and you even claim to of health tested.

I just don't get it I suppose. How can you work for a rescue centre, yet willing let your animals reproduce instead of being sensible about it? It's just a bit hypocritical to me.

But it is just my opinion which I'm sure you'll ignore, and no doubt the fluffies will be along any moment and tell me how mean I'm being


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Aurelia said:


> Firstly, to answer your question I had a look at your post history so I could be accurate. While doing so I noticed you claim to be a fosterer for your local rescue?
> Anyway ... From what I've seen just checking a couple of pages you've previously breed at least one other moggie (by accident) and have purposefully bred your cross breed dogs ... which looks planned, and you even claim to of health tested.
> 
> I just don't get it I suppose. How can you work for a rescue centre, yet willing let your animals reproduce instead of being sensible about it? It's just a bit hypocritical to me.
> ...


Aurelia, I am going to be frank with you, as you have been with me, for a start I suggest you go back and re read my past posts! not once did I say that it was an accident when I bred my tortie moggie, can I add that this is the only other cat I have bred but have done so twice! she is healthy and I wanted to breed her, I done everything by the book and still to this day I have her off spring, all bar 2 which 1 my sister has got and 1 is with my cousin. I am not one for pure breeds and not all rescues will allow you to adopt with young children/having bull breed dogs. I made sure they were all neutered so they couldn't reproduce with siblings/mother/father! they are all healthy, loved, well looked after, happy, have everything they could need or want.

Yes I have also bred my border terrier cross lady to a 5 gen ped border terrier. if you also re read these posts you will see that I didn't claim to have health tested my dog as there are not currently any recommended BUT they have both been health checked/tested by the vets. again I done everything by the book, I sadly lost 2 of the puppies but I do not regret a thing. the pups are all in excellent vetted homes and im in contact with them all. I even had one of the pups back at Christmas while his family went on holiday, which was lovely. I would and will happily do it again!

As for my 'claim' to have worked within rescue this is all absolutely true. I am completely passionate about Staffordshire bull terriers and do not agree with them being bred so irresponsibly, being labelled as a 'hard mans' dog and the way they are seen as dangerous. I will do anything within my power to help the SBT. the rescues I have worked within are not breed specific so occasionally you do get other breeds which I will happily help. I also help out with a local rabbit rescue.

I hope this is all OK with you as seems that anyone that posts on here with something that you disagree with gets 'told off' like a naughty school child.

I posted to share my experience and get advice/opinions off those that have manners!!!!!!!!


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

kiara said:


> Aurelia, I am going to be frank with you, as you have been with me, for a start I suggest you go back and re read my past posts! not once did I say that it was an accident when I bred my tortie moggie, can I add that this is the only other cat I have bred but have done so twice! she is healthy and I wanted to breed her, I done everything by the book and still to this day I have her off spring, all bar 2 which 1 my sister has got and 1 is with my cousin. I am not one for pure breeds and not all rescues will allow you to adopt with young children/having bull breed dogs. I made sure they were all neutered so they couldn't reproduce with siblings/mother/father! they are all healthy, loved, well looked after, happy, have everything they could need or want.
> 
> Yes I have also bred my border terrier cross lady to a 5 gen ped border terrier. if you also re read these posts you will see that I didn't claim to have health tested my dog as there are not currently any recommended BUT they have both been health checked/tested by the vets. again I done everything by the book, I sadly lost 2 of the puppies but I do not regret a thing. the pups are all in excellent vetted homes and im in contact with them all. I even had one of the pups back at Christmas while his family went on holiday, which was lovely. I would and will happily do it again!
> 
> ...


:lol: I'm not telling you off!

What I am doing (and I've said this once already tonight) is standing up for the animals that have no voice.

What you have just wrote all sounds lovely on the surface. But when you think about it properly you really are just jazzing up and irresponsible act.

There is NO reason for you to breed any cross breed animal, and if I'm reading what you say correctly ... you're not even health testing, so you're taking a risk with genetic problems at least!

It doesn't matter that you try and justify the fact you have homed all of those you have bred with family and friends, it really doesn't. For every cross breed animal you reproduce you are potentially denying an animal in shelter a home. YOU should know this as you work FOR rescue  (now that probably was a telling off of sorts).

You can pretty it up all you like but it doesn't change the facts. Your argument about rescues not rehoming to certain people ... that too is just an excuse. Nothing stopping people going further afield and putting effort into finding a rescue centre that doesn't have such rules ... and they are about! You just have to look.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Aurelia said:


> :lol: I'm not telling you off!
> 
> What I am doing (and I've said this once already tonight) is standing up for the animals that have no voice.
> 
> ...


I think we will have to agree to disagree as you and I could probably 'argue' about our opinions all night. My last comment regarding this,

people who breed ANY animal, pure bred or not, are taking up the homes for those in rescue, NOT just cross breeds.


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## Guest (Jan 6, 2011)

How come you are waiting until the 11th to get her to a vet?

I dont understand why you wont consider spaying your cat as she may be within the time to do so?

And as for your statement above yes even pedigree's have a chance at ending up in shelters but those good breeders 1) vet homes that the dog/cat go to. 2) do not have litters when there are to many of the breed already out there. 3) health test so the new owners dont find out its sick 4 years down the line nad dump it somewhere (I have seen it done many times). 4) Put their details on the chip too and keep in regular contact with the owners.

I have 3 moggies.....I have not kept in touch with any of their breeders because well...their breeders couldnt care.

Not having a go but I fail to see why this is a good enough reason.


> I am not one for pure breeds


I really do hope that you get her spayed either before or after the kittens are born because if she's run off once she will do it again.


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

well, Thats a bit hit and miss.

'typical' (loosely) moggie 'breeder' lets cat go outside, gets pregnant, mum has kittens, goes outside gets pregnant, kittens off to new homess at 5-8weeks, mum is in kitten again same circle, no health tests, no idea how many dads farther the litter, could be 1 could be 5, not wormed, mum might be vaccs but no boosters upkept, fed basic cheap food. 

Thats about 4-5litters in a year, average 4-7kittens per litter, so on average 1 mum produces, say 20 kittens in a year, say half go to people who neuer, half go to people who are the same as moggie breeder. Mum has litters until she passes on or is dumped or they finally neuter her, who knows when?

*****

Good breeder: health tests, researchs stud lines, stud is health tests, sometimes homes are found before kittens are born, breeder keeps a kitten back, kittens fully vac, if homes arent found breeder keeps them, vet checked twice etc etc mum produces 1 or 2 litters in over a year, around 8 kittens say, all go to homes where they are neutered (or some some reason not neutered) mum is spayed at about 3/4years of age.

so it isnt as cut % dry as 'pedigree v moggie' or for that fact cross breeds. those just letting cats breeder (and they are like rabbits they breed!) need to be stopped. 

a sort of policy should be brought in where you cant sell them under 12weeks without beinf vet checked twice fully vac, wormed with insurance kitten pack etc. As I think A hell of alot of people would stop letting their cats out to get pregnant, and esp trying to cut corners to do it for money! Then I feel rescue cases would go down if everyone did it properly. And all pets to be neutered at 5/6months then accidents would happen!


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## koekemakranka (Aug 2, 2010)

Please spay her. For the sake of all the unwanted ones still waiting (mostly in vain) for a new home. If you want more cats, go to your local rescue centre: there are beautiful babies waiting just for you. if you want to play with kittens, do what I do and volunteer at a rescue centre to help socialise the kittens there. Please...do the right thing.


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

kiara said:


> I think we will have to agree to disagree as you and I could probably 'argue' about our opinions all night. My last comment regarding this,
> 
> people who breed ANY animal, pure bred or not, are taking up the homes for those in rescue, NOT just cross breeds.


my thoughs EXACTLY!


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## tashi (Dec 5, 2007)

Very old thread not sure why it has been resurrected


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