# Post whelp body changes



## Strawberryearth (Apr 5, 2012)

Hello all,

I haven't posted a question in this section before (as I have no intention of breeding!) however I have just taken on an adult dog who has clearly been bred from and I have a couple of questions. 

I don't know too much about her history- I don't really believe the age I was told (2yrs, I think she is older than this) and because of this I also don't believe that she has "only had 1 litter of pups".

I am wondering if anyone can tell me what a bitch's belly looks like some time after the pups are born? Likewise the teats and vulva.

Ruby has very pronounced teats- 8 out of 10 are about the size of the end of your finger (from the tip to the first knuckle, if that helps).

She also has a lot of loose skin on her belly, it hangs down a fair bit, its not fatty- just skin, when she lies on her back (and gravity takes over) you can see she has a slim belly underneath it.

Her vulva is also quite swollen. I was made aware that she may come into season soon however I am finding it difficult to look for changes and swelling not knowing what it looked like before. I don't have any experience with a bitch season either as we had Betty spayed prior to her first season (as advised by the vet, I know now I should have waited). We intend on having Ruby spayed but know it can't be done if she is coming into season...but I don't know if the swelling is from delivering her pups (and are natural changes that come from whelping) or if it is due to a season.

What I am (crudely) attempting to establish is whether she has indeed only had 1 litter of pups, and these are normal permanent changes that occur. Whether she has had multiple litters of pups, because after 1 litter the body returns to pretty much what it was... and if so perhaps how recently she last had pups. If the body returns to (almost) its pre-pup state, how long does this take? Given the description of her teats/vulva/belly is there a chance she had pups a couple of months ago.

I know these questions are very much "how long's a piece of string", but I have ZERO experience in this, I don't even know what a dog looks like after she has had pups (I met Betty's mum but cannot remember her belly!).

Any insight is appreciated. I cannot upload pictures of her as she will not sit still (untrained) but there is a picture of her with Betty in Dog Chat (she is the shaded red) where you can see some of her belly and teats.

http://www.petforums.co.uk/attachments/dog-chat/115814d1370705182-betty-ruby-image.jpg


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## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

Sorry , me again with my 2 pennorth !!
Regarding teats and belly post whelp, we were told by Tango's breeder that she had only 1 litter and this I believe. Her belly is quite saggy but need to take her age into account ( she's 9 yr old ) and related loss of skin tone / elasticity. Her teats are probably as large, proprtionately, as you describe Ruby's . When I mentioned it to the vet she told me that her dog's teats were prominent and she'd not had any pups at all. So I don't think that's necessarily much to go on. 
Hopefully an experienced breeder will have more specific advice , but just thought I'd share what I know.

Edit to add : your vet may be able to estimate her age through the condition of her teeth, I believe they are significant ?


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## Strawberryearth (Apr 5, 2012)

SusieRainbow said:


> Sorry , me again with my 2 pennorth !!
> Regarding teats and belly post whelp, we were told by Tango's breeder that she had only 1 litter and this I believe. Her belly is quite saggy but need to take her age into account ( she's 9 yr old ) and related loss of skin tone / elasticity. Her teats are probably as large, proprtionately, as you describe Ruby's . When I mentioned it to the vet she told me that her dog's teats were prominent and she'd not had any pups at all. So I don't think that's necessarily much to go on.
> Hopefully an experienced breeder will have more specific advice , but just thought I'd share what I know.
> 
> Edit to add : your vet may be able to estimate her age through the condition of her teeth, I believe they are significant ?


Thanks Susierainbow! I forgot that Tango has had a litter in the past!

I am going to speak to the vet about all manner of things, including this, I just wondered from people who breed and still have their dogs post breeding.

I have looked at her teeth and they are in pretty poor condition- I am working on them with some cleaning gel and some bones! Hopefully we can get them as sparkling as Betty's soon!


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

Bitches, like humans, are different - in addition to the individual dog, fitness and age of bitch and size of litter will have a bearing - but from what you describe I'd be surprised if she'd only had one litter. 

On the whole, apart from slightly larger nipples (probably only noticeable by me) my bitches are back to their pre pregnancy state very quickly, once the pups are weaned. I certainly wouldn't expect a saggy undercarriage after one litter unless they had only recently weaned the pups. The vulva swells after the first season anyway, so if you were comparing to your pre-season spayed girl, there will be a difference.

Do you know how long ago she had the puppies? Did you get her from someone who's word you would trust? What was the reason for rehoming her? They will probably give you better clues to whether she has only had one litter or if she has been used as a money maker and bred several times.

PS - exercise, particularly swimming is great to get them back into condition, but if she has had quite a few litters, then there may be a limited benefit.


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## 2Hounds (Jun 24, 2009)

Have you tried Googling their phone number to see if any other adverts come up? I'be also been curious with the many tears ex-breeders if the saggy undercarriage shrinks back or stays as is.


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## Strawberryearth (Apr 5, 2012)

2Hounds said:


> Have you tried Googling their phone number to see if any other adverts come up? I'be also been curious with the many tears ex-breeders if the saggy undercarriage shrinks back or stays as is.


The guy I got her from seemed pretty genuine, although I just googled his number and found an old ad for Shar Pei pups (from 2011), but nothing else (well a car and some garden furniture!). Made me a bit sad as now I don't know whether to believe what he told me (different post, he'd had her a month but she wasn't settling due to being bullied by the other dog. Prior to this she was bred and he didn't have much history). However I am glad she has come to me where I can make sure (by spaying) that she never has to have another pup again.


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Missy came to us with a very saggy belly - she was also very overweight having been kept caged most of her life - I found regular steady exercise and a decent diet soon sorted her tummy out (It's not as tight as Lilly's who's never had puppies but you wouldn't notice looking at her) but her nipples are a lot larger and they are quite prominent and easily seen, they haven't got any smaller, that I've noticed, in the time we've had her.


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

Strawberryearth said:


> She also has a lot of loose skin on her belly, it hangs down a fair bit, its not fatty- just skin, when she lies on her back (and gravity takes over) you can see she has a slim belly underneath it.


Ohhhh this is sooooo Maisie

She has had 3 litters and has a *very* saggy belly - it makes her look quite overweight as it hang really low but when she's upside down (having tum tickles ) it's flat and I can see ribs easily defined .... but with an inch or so of skin forming a ring around her whole body 

TBH I don't think it's going to go with her (although I would like to get 1-2kg off her) as it is really just skin - a bit like really overweight people who lose weight & are left with excess skin that's been stretched beyond its limits

Maisie's teats were still quite large (and she was still really swollen too and her "boobs" hung right down and got in the way when she walked ) when I got her (her pups had gone a few days before so maybe 9 weeks after birth)

However, apart from the excess skin, both the "boobs" (sorry I've no idea what you call these in a dog when they're feeding ) and teats have gone back to normal size

Someone did tell me to starve her for a fortnight & she'd use the excess skin for nutrition .... can you believe that!


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

Judging by what I can see of her tum in that pic she doesn't look too bad to me. I think because of her breed and low set belly it likely looks more prominent than it did in my Mal Kali but I'd be surprised if after some good exercise and a proper diet she doesn't return back to more of her pre whelp tone. 

As has been said women differ too, some hardly show when pregnant while others gain weight all round. If she is due a season then she could be a few months post whelp but even a season varies after a litter and is not so predictable as they normally are. 

I think she looks pretty good and only having the one litter myself would say Kali didn't return to her full pre pregnant condition until five/six months or so, her belly remained flabby for a time but I thought that was through eight large puppies hanging off her like little wolves as she mostly fed them standing up. You'd expect some flab for a while and if she's only had the one litter you could find she loses all of it in time, Kali has a very tight under carriage now and did so around five or six months post whelp. Only time will tell but she's a little cracker and well done for taking her on, she must feel so much better in your care.


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## Strawberryearth (Apr 5, 2012)

Thanks for the responses everyone. They have been really helpful. 

I am hopeful that she will tighten up a little bit but I am not too concerned as long as it doesn't cause her any discomfort. 

I am still very unsure about this impending season- I have literally nothing to go on! Her swelling could be due to having had pups in the past, I have no idea when she had her pups, when her last season was or anything....! Can the vet give me an idea by looking at her, do you reckon, or will I be advised to wait for it to come and go (so we know for sure) and then spay her a couple of months after?


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

Ideally you want to spay them bang in the middle of 2 seasons (so 3 months after one's ended and 3 months before the next one)

How long have you had her?

Just wondering if a season is likely to be soon (in which case I'd probably hang on) ....


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

Strawberryearth said:


> Thanks for the responses everyone. They have been really helpful.
> 
> I am hopeful that she will tighten up a little bit but I am not too concerned as long as it doesn't cause her any discomfort.
> 
> I am still very unsure about this impending season- I have literally nothing to go on! Her swelling could be due to having had pups in the past, I have no idea when she had her pups, when her last season was or anything....! Can the vet give me an idea by looking at her, do you reckon, *or will I be advised to wait for it to come and go (so we know for sure) and then spay her a couple of months after*?


That's what I'd do - you'd know better where you stand with regard to timing of the spay. To be extra extra safe, you'd wait 2 seasons in case she had a short cycle and was about to come in again 3 months after the first.

I remember meeting a dog in the park with the most enormous teats, and asked the owner how many pups she'd had. He said she'd never had any!

The only dog I know who's had 3 (I think) litters is a Jack Russell, and she looks just the same as before.


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## Strawberryearth (Apr 5, 2012)

Thank you, I think I will wait until she has had a season then so I know where I stand. 

With the teat thing I think all dogs, like people, must be different. It isn't something that bothers me, I was just wondering about the number of litters- if that made an impact. 

Vet soon!


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