# Severe stomatitis



## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

Hi all. Need some advice 
My 9 years old cat Ruby had all her teeth out due to severe stomatitis 6 weeks ago. Little or no improvement 
She's Been on morphine loxicom daily and gabipentin twice daily 
She lives in a cat bed. Rarely lrqs the bed. All she eats is bits of shredded ham chicken and the webbox cat lick yoghurt. Won't venture to the good bowls. I bring food to her. Hit and miss really sometimes ears it others not. I've offered many types of food blended crushed warmef etc, limited success. Started syringe feeding her. Goes everywhere too
Hard to get meds in her 
Rarely drinks or uses a toilet 
Snores loudly and makes many noises. I love her to bits
Her brother has same condition but he's recovered well
She's not grooming, matted fur. Drooling runny eyes
Many trips to vets and 1500 pounds lighter my vet wants to put her down
She's had a biopsy. Severe ulcers everywhere gins still inflamed 
I lost a cat 7 weeks ago cannot bare to lose another
She's startef getting aggressive gojng for me 
Is there any alternative medicine please
I thought about a hostilic vet. I emailed one. No reply 
Can anyone suggest anything 
I hand reared her 
Please help
Thanks


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Hi @pussycatz

I am very sorry to hear about poor Ruby's condition, She sounds very unwell and in a lot of pain and discomfort and with a poor quality of life at present.

As she is only 9 yrs old I would want to do everything possible to see if she can be helped, and have a better quality of life.

My advice would be to ask your vet for an urgent referral to a specialist veterinary dental consultant. I really think this is your best option as Ruby is so ill.

I read in another of your posts that you are located in County Durham. The nearest veterinary dental consultant specialist to you is unfortunately over 100 miles away, but I have heard he is very good. I expect he would want to admit Ruby so that she can be given fluids by IV and her pain managed.

The vet specialist's name is Norman Johnstone.

https://www.dentalvets.co.uk/about-us/meet-the-team/veterinary-surgeons/norman-johnston

The fees will be more expensive than the fees of a general vet practice but if anyone can help Ruby I think someone like this dental consultant may be able to.

I would not take her to a holistic vet - they may possibly be OK for less serious illnesses, but not for something as serious as Ruby's condition. I really think she needs urgent treatment in a veterinary hospital from a highly skilled and experienced dental specialist a.s.a.p.

Sending many good wishes and healing thoughts to dear Ruby.x Please let us know how things go for her. Thank you.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

hello and thanks for replying she has already had all her teeth out so how could a specialist vet help? im not happy with my current vet westways they are very overpriced and only care about money 
ive heard laser treatment could be used to removed the legions? would my vet have to refer me? the local refferal vets here is whitley bay very expensive

i want to save her as ive only just lost a cat westways said was no hope and put her down she had chronic diarhea due to ibs and coronavirus which i didnt kow she had when i bought her
to lose another cat so soon would finish me off

are there any herbal meds or home treatments that would ease the imflammtion?

shesnot good this morning she s in her igloo bed with head down
i woke up with her on my head as normal
she has an amazing personailty
the vet could not say why or how she got severe stomatitis faucis but said its common and could be plaque build up and a suto immune dieseae ive tried morphime loxicon and gabipentin

no change
shes eatig the odd bit no significant weight loss at present ive not seen her go to the loo or water bowl .i syriged some water in her this morning she hates me going near her mouth vet says i have to get the meds in her anyway i can
can i get a second opinion?ad does my current vet have to refer me to a specialist?eventhoigh they are reccommending euthanasia
thanks jayne


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

I am assuming her current illness is due partly to the after effects of the multiple extractions and also due to the stomatitis. Inflammation due to severe stomatitis does not always end once the teeth have all been removed. It can be a life long disease which requires managing with regular courses of steroids.

Chronic diarrhoea can often be managed with diet. Her current diet may be playing a part in the diarrhoea.

Coronavirus is endemic in the cat population and usually doesn't cause a problem long term. It may be that the coronavirus is more of a problem because of the other aspects of Ruby's health at present.

Yes, specialists are very expensive in fees. They are at the top of their profession and one is paying for their expertise and experience. But more and more they seem to being used when there are difficult cases that the general vets are not able to resolve. We used them at the Shelter for a very poorly kitten who had a massive infection in both eyes. The specialist vet saved her, and her sight in both eyes.

Your vet has recommended Ruby being pts. It doesn't mean you have to go along with his recommendation. On the other hand I don't think she can be left in the state she is in at present as she is most probably suffering, and it doesn't sound as though her problems are being fully addressed medically at present.

You can ask your vet for a referral to the local referral vets in Whitley Bay. I doubt they will refuse.

Alternatively, make an appointment to see a different vet at a different vet practice near you. Say to them you would like a second opinion. You are entitled to that. Your current vet is obliged to send over Ruby's notes to the new vet.

You could try asking on your local social media group "Nextdoor" for recommendations of good local vets, from other pet owners. I have met some very kind and helpful people through my local group in the South East. I would not be guided so much by fees, what you need is a very experienced vet who is willing to help.

https://nextdoor.co.uk/

There are no safe herbal treatments you can give Ruby at home to ease the inflammation. And homeopathic treatment is IMO unlikely to do anything for her.


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

Unfortunately, whole mouth extraction is far more likely to be curative if the teeth are removed before the stomatitis is severe. I had a girl with stomatitis. Some of her teeth were removed by a general practice vet and, when I went to my current vet who is a dental specialist, he discovered that there were still fragments of teeth left in the gum. These were removed but unfortunately we were only able to manage her condition with steroids for a certain amount of time. This is because the steroids eventually fail to work. This was many years ago before Vetergesic was available.

It may be worthwhile to have injections of Vetergesic until your girl is more comfortable and then she may be more willing to allow you to drop it on her gums. You do not have to open her mouth. Simply raise the top lip with the tiny syringe and apply.

Your poor girl's pain must be relieved one way or another. In the end, my girl stopped eating and told me she did not want to go on so I had to put her first and let her go


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

cindy had the coronavirus and diarhhea not ruby ive been googling other things to try yes maybe a referal vet might help ive not heard of vetergsic injectons

she ate a pouch this morning nothing since its so far cost a fortune vetuk online sellnutribound its like a appetite stimulant would you reccommend that?aslo someone told be cbd oil?


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

pussycatzs said:


> ive not heard of vetergsic injectons


When you mentioned morphine I assumed you meant she was having buprenorphine. Vetergesic is buprenorphine. We have it to drop on the cat's gums but it is originally designed for injection. Obviously injection will be more effective if she will not always take the meds.


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

@pussycatzs - I wouldn't give CBD oil to a very poorly cat. The strength of the oil (or its efficacy) is unpredictable as it is unregulated at present. Far too risky, you may do more harm that good.

The vet can give Ruby an appetite stimulant injection but the main thing now is to get Ruby's pain under control. She is not going to feel like eating if she is in pain from her gums. You mentioned she is drooling and is not grooming herself and both these are sure signs of mouth pain. You said she has severe ulcers on her gums so those need treating urgently. She will be in a lot of pain. Please take the good advice of QOTN and ask your vet for vetergesic for Ruby, so you could drip it on to her gums.

[Sorry I misunderstood about the diarrhoea and Coronavirus, that is was your other cat who had it and the vet pts.]


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

QOTN said:


> When you mentioned morphine I assumed you meant she was having buprenorphine. Vetergesic is buprenorphine. We have it to drop on the cat's gums but it is originally designed for injection. Obviously injection will be more effective if she will not always take the meds.


Yes she's had the buprrnophone. Didn't work at all

Someones recommended traumeel. Natural homeopathic oral drops. Apparently amazing

So many people swear by cbd oil
I can't try thrm all I know 
I don't know what else to. Try. Loxicom gabipentin not made a difference. The beaumorphine was syringef directly into her mouth no change. She's leths quiet and makes grunting noises and snores loudly
What do you think about traumeel


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

chillminx said:


> @pussycatzs - I wouldn't give CBD oil to a very poorly cat. The strength of the oil (or its efficacy) is unpredictable as it is unregulated at present. Far too risky, you may do more harm that good.
> 
> The vet can give Ruby an appetite stimulant injection but the main thing now is to get Ruby's pain under control. She is not going to feel like eating if she is in pain from her gums. You mentioned she is drooling and is not grooming herself and both these are sure signs of mouth pain. You said she has severe ulcers on her gums so those need treating urgently. She will be in a lot of pain. Please take the good advice of QOTN and ask your vet for vetergesic for Ruby, so you could drip it on to her gums.
> 
> [Sorry I misunderstood about the diarrhoea and Coronavirus, that is was your other cat who had it and the vet pts.]


She had several syringes of beaumorphine. Made no difference 
Whst else can I. Put on her gums. I realise she's not eating much due to the gums.. Thry bled other day when the syringe caught her mouth. Appetite stimulant?
Baby food OK?


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

No I wouldn't feed baby food to Ruby, it often contains ingredients that are unsuitable for cats e,g, salt, sugar, onions or other vegetables.

The best thing is to liquidise some high protein wet food in your blender, and feed it to her with a food syringe. Ensure you put the syringe in the side of her mouth not the front . Only give her a little in every mouthful and make sure you allow her plenty of time to swallow it before you give more. Or she may choke, aspirate the food into her lungs and get pneumonia as a result.

Or it's possible she may lap some food from a flat plate if it is liquidised. You don't need to add water to the liquidised food - the blender will make it liquid enough for her to lap it like a soup.

I would urgently get her some Hills A/D Recovery food from the vet first thing tomorrow morning. It is very highly nutritious and she won't need much to keep her going. You can syringe it in to her mouth very carefully. Stop as soon as she has had enough. Forcing her to continue eating when she is in such pain would be cruel.

https://www.hillspet.com/cat-food/pd-ad-canine-feline-canned

The priority for Ruby is effective pain relief as she is not going to eat when her mouth hurts. The last thing I would want is to eat food if every mouthful hurts me.

If all the pain relief is not working then you need to see the vet and ask for something else. As soon as possible. If necessary Ruby can have a pain relief injection from the vet every 24 hours.

Is Ruby still on steroids? What is the dose?

You need to watch her fluid intake, and check for any signs of dehydration (gums, and scruff) If she is becoming dehydrated she needs to go to the vets for IV fluids a.s.a.p. If your current vet won't help go somewhere else - another vet.

Please insist you need help for Ruby. Vets are there to help our pets.


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

pussycatzs said:


> Yes she's had the buprrnophone. Didn't work at all


I am very surprised the buprenorphine did not work at all. Perhaps she swallowed it. If that is the case it will not work. It must be on the mucous membrane. To make sure it does not work, ask the vet for an injection.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

imat the vets wed night yes she still on 4ml loxicom once daily
i do blend pouches but goes all over i will get the hills tomorrow night
what are 24 hours injections

someone mentioned depo medrol?


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

yes the beaumorpine as syringed into her mouth so she did swallow it i was given syringes totake home expensive too


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

All my vet said was meds not working so should put her down
I'm not listening. I need to try alternative s first 
The pain meds from vet not working
Need alternative 
I have a list I can try to show vets fro. A cats fb page. All offering helpful advice
It's called cats are are my life
I'm jayne cat Ruby. Please read and give me your opinion


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

pussycatzs said:


> yes the beaumorpine as syringed into her mouth so she did swallow it i was given syringes totake home expensive too


PLEASE try to administer the buprenorphine correctly before you say it does not work. It will not work if she swallows it. It must be absorbed through the gum or under the tongue.

I am worried about the level of pain your poor girl is suffering because that must be our main concern with our cats. I would have no confidence in 'alternative' remedies to tackle this situation but anyway, you have the buprenorphine and her pain relief is a matter of urgency.. If you find out it really works after all, you can get Vetergesic from Viovet on a prescription if you are in this country if the price is a problem.


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

pussycatzs said:


> imat the vets wed night yes she still on 4ml loxicom once daily
> i do blend pouches but goes all over i will get the hills tomorrow night
> *what are 24 hours injections*


You could have the buprenorphine administered by injection.



pussycatzs said:


> someone mentioned *depo medrol?*


Steroid injections may reduce inflammation but are unlikely to deal effectively with this level of pain.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

Vet says nothing ekse can. Give her apart ftlm what's she's on now. Loxicom


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

Is there anything I can put on her gums


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

QOTN has said you need to ensure the buprenorphine is given either *under the tongue, or on her gums. * If you can't manage this then she can be given the buprenorphine by injection by the vet.

If your vet is not willing to help Ruby with injections then I advise you to find another vet urgently today. Please do not delay.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

I just put it in her mouth


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

Get appointment is Wed 6pm


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

Is there's anything else for psin. On the fb page soooo many people have suggested homeopathic remedies like aloe Vera eccinea tincture and cbd oil all available at Holland and barret. They swear they work 
Also traumeel drops


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Aloe Vera Echinacea tincture is not homeopathic, it is a herbal remedy. Some parts of the aloe vera plant are toxic to cats. I wouldn't risk using it on a cat unless you are 100% sure it does not contain the toxic part of the plant or you could make Ruby very ill indeed.

Also, tinctures usually contain alcohol and alcohol, even a small amount, is very toxic to cats. So you'd need to find a version of the stuff than does not contain any alcohol.

Echinacea is a herbal treatment given to treat the symptoms of Upper Respiratory infection. It can be given to cats, dogs, horses etc (as well as humans) . There is no scientific evidence that is has any beneficial effect in humans or animals. But it probably won't do any harm. However Ruby doesn't have a URI, as far as I understand so I can't see any benefit to her of echinacea.

CBD oil is another herbal remedy. The one sold at H & B is not medicinal. For it to do any good at all it needs to be medicinal grade CBD oil from a reputable source. The proper stuff is very expensive. e.g. several hundred pounds for a small amount.

Traumeel is a clear, "homeopathic" gel which is good for skin injuries, strains, sprains, skin irritation and muscle problems. It is not intended for internal use. It contains Arnica, which is excellent stuff for treating external pain relief from bruising or pulled muscles. I have often used Arnica myself in the past with good effect. I always have some in the house. It is not suitable for Ruby's gums.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

why have soo many people on a fb cat site swear by traumeel and the eccinnea rinture and cbd oil saying itworked for theircats

do ia sk vet to give her injection of brunophine


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Some 'alternative' medicines work simply because of the placebo effect. The placebo effect works on the owner, not the cat, but the belief of the owner means they are calm and feel something is being done to help their poorly cat. The cat feels calmer and this is better for their immune system. The cat gets better anyway if he/she was going to. 

No-one posts on a social media group about their cat who didn't get better on these herbal supplements, so we don't know about them. 

Yes I would ask your vet for an injection of buprenorphine for Ruby.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

morning just to let you know ruby has just ate a full tin of the hills ad recovery plus 2 slies of cbicken and 5 10g webbox cat lick yoghurt is that good?
vet only gave me 2 tins where else can i buy it please as pets home dont have it and vet charged me 11 pound s for 4 tins 

she is now curled up in igloo bed snoring she still very quiet seeing vet at 6pm


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

pussycatzs said:


> morning just to let you know ruby has just ate a full tin of the hills ad recovery plus 2 slies of cbicken and 5 10g webbox cat lick yoghurt is that good?
> vet only gave me 2 tins where else can i buy it please as pets home dont have it and vet charged me 11 pound s for 4 tins
> 
> she is now curled up in igloo bed snoring she still very quiet seeing vet at 6pm


Have you looked on Zooplus? They do stock some Hills prescription stuff - you're right, it is dreadfully expensive. Great news tho' that she ate a full meal, tho' I wouldn't give quite that much webbox yoghurt (I know it's a temptation when you are worried about their appetite, you just want to get everything into them). I've also had cats have loads of teeth removed and seen no improvement. It's sad to see them in pain, wanting to eat and not able to. Good luck with the vet this evening!


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Zooplus have it: https://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/dogs...=6m1fgbkwnn0h-5CARZR0QMMoUMSaIS0sCQC#Recovery

However £11 for 4 tins isn't outrageous - it's an expensive produce, but invaluable in the right place.


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

@pussycatzs - I am very pleased to hear Ruby has eaten well with the Hills Recovery food! Excellent news. 

For the Hills Recovery food online this is about the cheapest I can find (24 tins).

https://www.vetuk.co.uk/hills-presc...prescription-diet-ad-tins-for-cats-dogs-p-345

Or you could try her with Royal Canin Recovery food, which is cheaper:

https://www.viovet.co.uk/Royal-Canin-Canine-Veterinary-Clinical-Diets-Recovery-Dog-Cat-Food/c1527/

I hope the vet's appointment goes well.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

hello
the vet said she has a stay of execution for now theres a glimmer of hope her gums look a little better still red m#but improved ruby let her look in her mouth too without attackingher she has gained 200grams she looked perkier too wasnt curled up in a ball lthis time

she s to stay on loxicom and gaibipentin but vet ran out of meds! so no gabipenton they ordered it so i hope she doesnt go backwards with no meds i had to pay up front for the meds
shes hadhalf a tin of hillsnowon my lap
vet says she l need her fur shaving when she s better

vet wouldnotgive her injection of burpophine as shes on loxiocm she says injection only lasts 5 hours not 24
i cantry trameel but not any of the others


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

morning
ruby was on acatbed in the lounge this morning
she refused the hills so i maged to spoonfeed 5 teaspoons in her he ate 3 yoghurt licks
im wondering its because shes no gabipentinleft? awaiitng vet ringing m to say its in stock
i syringed a little water in her her ears was up and she did follow me into the kitchen i offeredher chicken but she ran off now shes back on the cat bed
someone on the fb catpage said i should never give loxiocm to cats as its dangerous
and i should only use homopathic remedies


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

pussycatzs said:


> *someone on the fb catpage said i should never give loxiocm to cats as its dangerous
> and i should only use homopathic remedies*


PLEASE do not believe everything you read. You can check the advice we give you by googling *responsible* web sites and asking your vet. As Chillminx has already said, homeopathic substances 'work' because of the placebo effect. Your cat is in severe pain and I agree the lack of gabapentin is probably the reason she is not so well this morning.

To be brutally frank, if she were my cat and I could not control her pain more effectively than this, I would let her go.

I do wish I had never read this thread. It is so upsetting to think of her suffering.


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## Orla (Sep 16, 2015)

I personally am disgusted with the vets refusal to help. Clearly she has very poor quality of life and is in a lot of pain. At this stage, surely the vet should be doing everything they can to control her pain. If she isn't eating properly (lick e lix do not count as eating, they are treat foods, so have calories but no real nutrition in them) then she is unlikely to heal as she needs adequate nutrition for her gums to heal anyway. Could you ask your vet if they could phone the prescription through to another vet surgery where you can purchase the gabapentin? I'm afraid I have to agree with QOTN and say that if you cannot get on top of her pain, I would be thinking of letting her go. I'd get an opinion from another vet as clearly this one doesn't seem to have her best interests at heart.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

The vets rang just now saying no gabipentin for 4 days even. Though I've paid in full
Then she said they gave found 20 tablets at another branch so I have to go there after work to collect it

She has been. Eating t h e hills just quiet this morning 
Vet Says hums better and as Ruby key her look I get mouth she much better 
I font believe every thing I read


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## Orla (Sep 16, 2015)

I’m glad they have found you some at another branch. How long will that cover her for? If you can keep her eating well and control her pain, her gums may heal but she does need adequate nutrition for this to happen. My lad had most of his teeth removed but as he was a greedy lad even when his mouth was very bad, he bounced back quickly and his mouth healed well. I found pate style foods mushed with extra water helped him.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

ive got a 10 day supply they still owe me another 20 tablets

she was in the catigloobed still went i came in i put down the ad she wasnt bothered so i picked her up in a towel spoon fed half a tin of ad and her loxicom and gabipentin and some water she was getting distressed so i put her back in the igloo bed and left the remaining ad on a plate she licked the plate clean plu small amount of gourmet plouch and 7 webbox licks then stopped shes now in bsck ofigloo bed head down


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

morning this morning ruby was sat in a cat bed in my lounge i put down the ad she wasnt interested she followed me into the cat toilet area and had a massive pee then stayed sat in the loo for 20mins
so i picked her uo and tried to give her meds shes very feisty this morning spat tabletout 4 times not sure if she s had it i onlygot 1 spoonful of ad inher as she wouldntkeepstull and scratched my hands to death shes now sat on top of my fridge freezer i threw up some sliced ham and chicken and she ate that


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

It sounds as though Ruby is perking up now her pain is being better controlled. 

You say she sat in the loo for 20 minutes? Do you mean she sat in the litter tray for 20 minutes? Was she trying to poo? Is she passing stools or is she constipated? You must not let her strain to poo.

Half a tin of AD sounds a lot to give her at a time. It is a very nutritious food and a little goes a long way. Are they 100 gram tins? I would feed her about 35 grams per meal. Once she has her appetite back you can go back to ordinary wet cat food. AD is not intended for long term use as I expect the vet explained. 

Btw, please give only a tiny bit of ham as an occasional treat, as it contains a lot of salt [as well as preservatives], so it's bad for her kidneys.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

morning
yes yesterdayshe just sat in the litter tray after having a huge wee not shewas no straining nor had a poo
someone on a fb cat site says gabipenton is a very nasty drug for cats and vets should not prescribe it, this person is a hompath and says gabipentin does not control pain but makes them letharic and causes cancer she also said i should never feed tinned cat foods as it contains carrageegan which is dangrerous for cats and i should be feed pure raw meatr with taurine and egg yolk mix wahts your opinion?

ive ordered and got delivered 24 ad tins veryexpensive she was eating itvoluntary but now turns her nose up last night and this morning i got half a tin of ad in her by spoon feeding her
shethen had a yoghurt lick on her own but now backin cat bed quiet
the ad tins are 158g each

my vet says 2 to 4 tins ad ay is good shes never going to eat that mch! how much is enought per day for a poorly cat
i saw her mouth when i fed her, they do look better than they werestillred but getting there i know these things take a while im still worried

runs brother also has this awful diesease and he took ages to revcover but he never had the ulcers he is now like a kitten and eats anything


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

Please try to look up more reputable sites to help you cope with your girl's mouth. This link is the BVDA's explanation of stomatitis. The specialist dentists see this condition all the time so perhaps you should believe what they say. https://www.bvda.co.uk/specials/687-chronic-gingivostomatitis

Your girl may well be able to heal but she must be kept as pain-free as possible during the process. This means she must have a painkiller of some sort. The reason I would always go for buprenorphine rather than a tablet is that it is easier to administer to a cat in extreme pain as long as you ensure it is not swallowed. Obviously all drugs have side effects but the fanatics who say you should not use them are simply cruel. I have never had Gabapentin for my cats so I do not know how effective it is as a painkiller. Perhaps somebody can provide a link to any research.

Whatever the merits or otherwise of a raw diet, you would be taking unnecessary risks introducing it to your girl when her mouth is so bad. You need to get her eating whatever food she can bear to have touching her sores at the moment. By the way, not all wet cat food contains carrageenan so you were not told the complete truth there.


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## Orla (Sep 16, 2015)

Ignore the homeopath. Personally I like and use a lot of alternative therapies for myself but you have an extremely poorly kitty so in this case I think it’s more sensible to use evidence based medication recommended by and monitored by your vet. If she has been hugely unwell and is improving on the gabapentin why would you deviate from this so early? Is it ideal? No. Does it have potential side effects? Yes. But a cat in pain and unable to take on adequate nutrition is a cat who is unlikely to make a good recovery so you have to balance any potential risks. Also I would just like to echo chillminx’s recommendation to limit sliced ham, and also the chicken if that is heavily processed chicken slices rather than fresh chicken. If she is currently refusing the specialist food you could try offering her other pate style foods. Easier to eat with a sore mouth than chunked foods although not as nutrient dense as the vet convalescence foods. Try Lily’s kitchen or natures menu perhaps from your local pets at home before placing any large orders. She might just want some variety, especially if her appetite isn’t great. She does sound livelier though so hopefully feeling better.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

thank you im off this weekend so can keep closer eye on her
this person who is a homopath seems obsssed withraw foods and her remedies
ruby is like one min eats foodthe next leaves it
she gone of the ham atm i will limit it
she evem left a lick i gave her 10 mins ok

shes just sat quietly in the cat bed doesnt want anything else
i spoon fed her half ad at 8 ish this morning
shall i just leave her be?
also this fanatic hompath keeps insisitng on traumeel will heal her gums
shes been sending me links to horror stories about loxicom and gabipentin too and links to how bad normal pet food is


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

@pussycatzs -

*"Gabapentin*
Gabapentin, an anticonvulsant drug, is used in cats as an adjunct for chronic pain management, especially neuropathic pain; it has been used in combination with opioids, NSAIDs, and amantadine. This drug can prevent allodynia (sensation of pain from non-noxious stimulus) and hyperalgesia (increased sensitivity to pain response).

Administration:- A dose of 5 mg to 10 mg/kg PO Q 8 to 12 H is commonly recommended.

Cautions:-
_
Side Effects_: Sedation and/or ataxia (loss of muscular co-ordination) are the most common adverse effects. They can be alleviated by starting treatment at a low dose; then gradually titrating up to effect.
_Concurrent Disease_: Use with caution in patients with renal dysfunction (dose reduction may be required since drug is eliminated through the kidneys).

https://todaysveterinarypractice.com/focus-on-pharmacology-management-of-chronic-pain-in-cats/

If you are concerned about Ruby being over-sedated, or unable to walk/move about normally you should contact the vet.


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

pussycatzs said:


> thank you im off this weekend so can keep closer eye on her
> this person who is a homeopath seems obsssed withraw foods and her remedies [..]
> also this fanatic homeopath keeps insisitng on traumeel will heal her gums
> shes been sending me links to horror stories about loxicom and gabipentin too and links to how bad normal pet food is


As QOTN and Orla have advised I would ignore this person's advice. It is not appropriate advice to follow for a cat who is suffering as much post operative pain as Ruby. Who knows whether the homeopath's cat was in terrible pain and left to suffer in agony without proper treatment, just given homeopathic remedies?? I would be suspicious frankly.

I suggest you just say to the person, thank you, but I am following the vet's advice for now. And if you want to check the vet's advice (and ours) then spend your time reading reputable veterinary websites (as QOTN advised you).

The facts, as I understand them, are that Ruby is making gradual progress under her present drug protocol of pain management and anti-inflammatory drugs. And she is also eating some Hills AD Recovery food. This is all good progress but she still has a way to go.

I would stick to feeding her only soft pate type foods [like the texture of the recovery food] and forget about giving her chicken or ham at present.

Orla has given you some suggestions of other soft pate foods to consider.  Lily's Kitchen is very soft and if you mash it up with a fork. Ruby may be able to lick it up.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

i wont follow the homopaths advice nor will i give her raw food

shes been very quiet today not left cat bed in hours refused all foodso twice today ive ahd to force feed her shes not been loo or drank i managed to get little water in her she had saliva and spit almost foamy coming from her mouth when i fed her 2 half tins of ad
she s now snoring

could the meds be making her drowsy?


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

shes just ate a ful pouch on her own and now shes grooming herself is that good?


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Eating a full pouch on her own is excellent news! Hopefully she is on the mend now and will be able to feed herself from now on. Grooming herself is also a very good sign!  

Yes, the Gabapentin will make her sleepy. Once she is eating well again and grooming herself you will be able to reduce the dose of Gabapentin - do it gradually. Discuss the dose with the vet when the time comes to reduce it. 

Well done !


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

this morning she is still in the cat bed shes very quiet possibly the gabipenton? she ate a lick then stopped so i started to spoon feed her ad got 6 spoonsfuls in her and she sgtarted coughing so i put her back in her bed shes a sleep now imin all day today so i can keep an eye on her

oh that homopath from canada has asked me for my postal address how odd
she also says to use l lysyne powder on cats foods as it protects from viruses etc


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

pussycatzs said:


> oh that homopath from canada has asked me for my postal address how odd
> she also says to use l lysyne powder on cats foods as it protects from viruses etc


Be very careful! It sounds really dodgy. There was a time when Lysine was advocated for cats with Feline Herpesvirus because it can be used effectively in humans with a different herpesvirus but research has proved otherwise. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4647294/

It never claimed to protect AGAINST FHV only prevent carriers from shedding virus but even that is not true.

When you see your vet again ask if your girl seems to be in less pain. They can often tell better than the owner who sees them all the time even though cats usually make an effort when they see the vet to pretend nothing is wrong!


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

@pussycatzs - how many days has Ruby been on the gabapentin now? If it's more than a week it might be an idea to phone the vet tomorrow and ask if the dose should be reduced.

I am not keen on the idea of you still feeding her by spoon when she had already begin feeding herself yesterday. As she coughed it suggests some of the food may have gone down her windpipe. It is dangerous if that happens, and can cause pneumonia.

If she won't eat from a dish or plate can you get her to lick the food off your fingers?


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

i paid for 40 gabientin but only got 20 i need to pick up the remainder when in stock theres a westways branch oppoiste where i work 
all rubys wanted this morning has been the yohurt licks ive left plenty of food in the large igloo bed she is sat in she never leave the bed! should i worry
vet says when she s better all her fur will have to be shaved off

im doing my best shes awake but looks drowsy
not easy getting meds into a cat with a sore mouth

when i get to end of gabipenton i will see vet again 
she s not lost any weight

willthe ad help her gain weight too?

why is this homopathafter my address? a nd keeps sending me links to fb pages re harmful ingriredents in pet foods and links to homothaoc meds i should try and she says they work
so far shes suggested traumeel coloidal silver llysyne chamolmile tea bags for sore eyes her own ear drop remedy which consisits of hydrgen perixide . witch hazel braggs apple cider with colidial silver mix togther in jar and make up pads to clean out dirty ears
whsts your opinion pleas


she also says ruby got sick because im not following a raw diet and the carageegan will kill them and says tahts what prob caused my cindy tobe put down as she had ibd and corina virus and she says uts because of the carageegan hmmm


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

It almost sounds to me like she is harassing you. Are you able to block her posts? Or delete without reading?


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

@pussycatzs - why will Ruby's fur have to be shaved off? Is she a longhaired cat and her fur is matted? As she has not been able to groom herself with her sore mouth have you been grooming her every day with a comb?

When are you due to see the vet again with Ruby? It would be best if the vet can look at her gums and see how they are before you reduce the gabapentin. But if she is too drowsy to eat and only stays in bed all day then you need some advice from the vet soon.

I would add some warm water from the kettle to the Recovery food and mix it well to make a thick soup, with no lumps, and put a little on a saucer or plate. Test the temperature to make sure it is not too hot or cold. Ruby might be able to lap it, as she can lick the Lick-e-lix.

If she has not lost weight despite her illness, then you do not need to worry about her not being so hungry today. The main thing is she must have fluids or she will soon get dehydrated and ill. Hence the need for thin soupy food she can lap.

I would not force feed her the soupy food with a syringe because of the risk of getting it down her windpipe by mistake. But if you can get Ruby to lap some of the soupy liquid off a tablespoon, then that should be OK.

As for your internet stalker, why are you allowing her to pester you and bully you? If she doesn't know where you live she can't hurt you! Stand up to her and tell her "thank you for your advice but please leave me alone now".


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

she is short haired and its all matted she wont let me comb her, she goes for me if i put her comb near her back i did have a furminatorbut cannot find it vet says it all needs to be shaved of as its prob uncomfortable for her 

what about cat soup? 

shes not lost any weight all at


some days she eats herself from plate if she not ate much after several hours, then i wrap her in a towel and spoon feed her with a small placsic baby spoon just so she gets some nutrition into her i can use my finger but thought it would be unhygeinic?

io do worry she s not drinking and peeing enough
vet said she was not dehydrated and lots of water in food vet says
will see vet once meds almost sued up so be another 2 weeks

im back to work tomorrow too it does worry me
how much water? just a little and warm it up? i worried that the ad could go offr overnight and that was why she left it but i put remainder in air tight container

i thought it could be the meds thats making her sleepy and not hungry?

i tried a syringe but its hard and very messy and not much goes down ive tried syringing water again goes everywhere too and she dribbles it out

she never leaves the igloo bed she was there at 8 am and still in it now

yes i can block this homopath shes nice enough, not rude just offering me her advice going on about sprinkiling llysine powder twice a day over foods


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

She sounds very ''New Age'' I must say. I'd be careful about hydrogen peroxide /vinegar/alcohol in the ears if they are sore or inflamed at all. I got some stuff from amazon, think it was called ''Otodex'', smells really sweet and sickly but it did clean out most of the black wax, tho' it tends to come back. No idea why she would want your address, maybe she wants to send you some ''samples''? She may be vey well-meaning; I had a neighbour like that - I'd dive into the bushes if I saw her coming down the road.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

otodex? yes 3 of my cats keep getting black wax ive bought zymox opic online works but it comes back agian

ive no idea who this well meaning homopath is but she says one of her cats died from dementia

im not going to try her ear mix dont worry lol


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

ive had to spoon fed her again asshe ignored teh warmed ad mixedwith water

she s been to theloo very smelly lol ran straight back into the lounge no wonky walking ears perked up looked ok ran straight back into bed now snoring

shes been on gabipentin 3 weeks she s on ahight dose too 100mg a day 50 in morning 50 at night im not 100% shes alwasy swalloed it as not easy to getmeds in her

that homopath says i shouldnt give loxicom her and her brother oscar and bruce are on it for like  ive been unlucky to have 3 cats with this diesease ruby got it the worst


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

For pain control in cats, doses of gabapentin range from 1.25 to 2.5 mg/kg every 12 hours. Higher doses (up to 50 mg per cat 1 to 3 times daily) are recommended by some vets. How much does Ruby weigh?

As she has been on 100 mg for 3 weeks and is sleeping most of the time I would phone the vet in the morning and ask if the vet thinks it'd be OK to reduce the dose a bit.

Her poo will be smelly because the Hills AD is very concentrated protein etc. It may be better to add some normal wet food to her diet now and reduce the AD. The cat soups you mentioned would be OK.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

shes 4 .1 kilos yes 3 weeks on that high dose
i tried adding water to the ad like soup she left it

this morning she was sat on the cat bed i put half a tinof ad for her wasnt interested in any food so ive just had to wrap her in a towel yer again to get the half a tin in her, as im at work 

today

that homopath says i should not vacciante my cats as it causes dementita

i do worry about her 
i hate leaving her whilst i go work im already broke due to vetsbeills cat food etc pay day 24th


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

ive ordered some special soups in a tin from viovet, my vet reccomended them hopefully should come today


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

pussycatzs said:


> ive ordered some special soups in a tin


I got soup for mine (Liquivite) - she was not that taken with it, but it's thin enough to syringe small amounts into the side of the mouth. It's not cheap, but supposed to be very nutritious.
https://www.animeddirect.co.uk/liqu...MI7a_4146A5wIVxrHtCh1e7Qv8EAQYASABEgIvQvD_BwE
Think they just do the chicken flavour. What always annoys me about mine is that the cat you buy the stuff for will turn up her nose, but the ones who don't need it will form a queue for it!


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

LOL @Calvine that is so familiar. I think it must be lesson 101 in the cat instruction manual


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## Jackie C (Feb 16, 2016)

Only just read this thread. I'm sorry to hear your cat is so poorly, @pussycatzs. x I'm glad you're ignoring this homeopath. Apologies if someone has suggested it, or you're already doing it, but softer foods are ideal. Special soups are good, although some aren't nutritious and are just complementary, but if she's dehydrated, it will give her liquid. When my Betty had a poorly mouth, she liked the soft "mousse-style" or pate food, like the Purina Gourmet Pate. 
The other thing you can do, is make some soup yourself for her. Simply boil and then gently simmer some chicken thighs in boiling water for an hour. Wait until it cools, then carefully separate the bones, making sure you carefully remove all the pin bones. The broth is quite nutritious, and you can shred the chicken. It's not "complete" in that it doesn't contain taurine, but it's better than her having nothing, and it's hydrating. My cat will testify that it's delicious.

If your cat likes it, you can then add "felini", which is a supplement that contains all the vitamins, minerals and taurine that she needs. It does cost, but it lasts ages. https://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats/supplements_specialty_cat_food/vitamins/155860 You must read the instructions as you have to add exact amounts, but there is a little spoon with it and you just have to add the right amount. It's easy enough. It's also available on Amazon, but the Zooplus site explains everything better.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

Yes it's liquvute I've ordered 
Hope she likes it. She's turning her nose up at everything now 

True t h e other cars form a queue to pinch her food


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

pussycatzs said:


> Yes it's liquvute I've ordered
> Hope she likes it. She's turning her nose up at everything now
> 
> True t h e other cars form a queue to pinch her food


Fingers crossed she likes the Liquivite! None of my cats, [past or present], when poorly, would ever have it.

I had success liquidising a cheap food such as Felix AGAIL, a food they never eat when they are well. But they loved it as a soup when they had a poor appetite. I now keep a box of AGAIL in the store cupboard only for use when one of them is off their food. .


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

I hope she does too
I've spent a fortune on food and tablets and vets fees 
Leaving work at 6. Hopes she ok


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

shes refused the hills ad agian but ate 2 licks so i picked her up and spoon fed her half a tin

she been loo and spent the last hour purring in my arns

but i need to gi to bed so must move her


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

morning
the liquidite i rodered never turned up i paid extra for next dy delivery and it did not arrive
found her sat on topp of the cat bed this morning
she had a little ouch and a lick refused the ad so i managed to spoon feedher almost ahalf a tin
shes just ate some chicken on her own
as im at work all day i like to see her get a decent meal before i leave just in case she doesnt leave the cat bed plenty of other food in the bowls

that homopath sent me another link abot how driefood and all tinned foods kill cats and cause ckd and all cats who are ill the kidney diesease is down to eatihg dried food


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

pussycatzs said:


> morning
> the liquidite i rodered never turned up i paid extra for next dy delivery and it did not arrive
> found her sat on topp of the cat bed this morning
> she had a little ouch and a lick refused the ad so i managed to spoon feedher almost ahalf a tin
> ...


She sounds as tho' she is obsessed with you and your cat/s. OK, dried food is not the best, but plenty cats live a long and healthy life on it. I lost my beautiful Gatsby who was only five-ish to kidney disease and Grace had a liver tumour (aged seven). They were fed raw from the day I got them - so you just can't tell. So now I tend to give them what they enjoy. But if you are managing to spoonfeed your girl, you're doing well.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

I'm at work atm but yes she's accepting a spoon


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## Gallifreyangirl (Feb 11, 2015)

Sorry to hear about your poor cat. But I would reiterate please ignore the homeopaths views as she sounds as if she is harassing you.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

I'm getting ready to leave work 
I'm really not feeling very well either 
I hope Ruby's ok


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

im home she left the food i put in her cat bed this morning
refused the ad so ihad to spoon feed her again she ate some sliced chicken
she wont leave thecat bed so fristrating
the liquidite still hasnt come apparantly they could not find my address
wish i knew when she will come out of the bed and be like the old ruby before she got ill


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Sorry to hear Ruby is not as well today. Is she still very drowsy all the time? If so it will be affecting her appetite. Is she drinking plenty to keep herself hydrated? 
If you feel her progress is stalling, you should speak to the vet again.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

morning
shes very feisty this morning
i really dont know whats she s doing when im at work itry to syringe little water in her every morning and night
yet agshes ignored 4 types of food so i spoon fed her half a tin of ad hills
yet then she ate 6 slcies of chicken on her own! i cannot work her out
some days she eats bits of a pouch others refuses 
hard to tell if shes drowsy she just sits all day all night in cat igloo bed

shes still on full dose of gabioentin atm altjough i think lasts night got spat out
shes on loxicom too

the homopath messaged me again to tell me to buy coloidail silver alongside traumeel and llysene as it will make her well


ipick up rubys reduced dose of gabipentin tomorrow as im not allowed to cut them in half vet said
i will see vet agian when she near end of tablets

her left eye is quite runny right one normal no runny nose nor sick etc


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

my soups stillnot arrived she not ate anythng i left her this morning
very feistu tonight refused everything i got quarter of ad in her ive tried alsorts shes just got her head down in the cat bed refused the licks tonight
its all so frustrating if only she could talk
what else can i do


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

her eyes are streaming


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

pussycatzs said:


> her eyes are streaming


If her eyes are streaming it possible she has an allergic reaction to one of the drugs she is on. I would phone the Out of Hours emergency vet for advice. If you phone your own vet there will be a number on the answerphone you can call.

Or she may have an infection in her gums. Is she still on antibiotics?

Please take advice from the vet tonight.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

i was told to wipe away her eyes with coton wool
this morning were dry
she was sat on scratching post this morning she saw me and ran to the kitchen looking perky so i offered her food declined then she ran back to the scarcting post i offered food agiian no i ut a bit on a spoon and got 7 spoons in her then if fell out of her mouth and she licked it up off the towel how odd
she then ran back into the igloo bed shes stillin it now

i had another message from the hompath when i woke up saying i should cut her meds in halffor a few daysthen take her off all the meds the vet gave me all togther as she thinks shes quiet due to the loxicom and gabientin and says it damages the body hmmmm


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

pussycatzs said:


> i was told to wipe away her eyes with coton wool
> this morning were dry
> she was sat on scratching post this morning she saw me and ran to the kitchen looking perky so i offered her food declined then she ran back to the scarcting post i offered food agiian no i ut a bit on a spoon and got 7 spoons in her then if fell out of her mouth and she licked it up off the towel how odd
> she then ran back into the igloo bed shes stillin it now
> ...


I do feel for you: it is so frustrating when the fridge and cupboard are full of cat food and they refuse all of it. It's been six/seven weeks now that Ruby has not been eating properly and to be honest, I'd expect her to see some improvement by now (tho' I've had cats who did not improve at all after dental procedures). Has the vet checked to see that there is ''nothing else going on'' as my vet puts it?


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

Vet said gums are improving slowly 
But expected her to be fully recovered in 2 weeks post op!


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Honestly I would recommend you to continue to take the advice of your vet, and not from some alternative therapist whose credentials you know nothing about.  

It sounds from what you say that Ruby is eating, but only if you give it to her on a spoon. Can you keep a record of how much Recovery food she is eating a day? And can you weigh her on digital scales to see if she is losing weight? The Hills AD is high in calories so it is possible she is getting enough to keep her going.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

when i came in she ate 6 slices of chicken she d left the food i put out this morning
i spoon fed her half tin of ad
she now jumped on my knee purring and enjoying me rubbing her head and chin is that good sign

yes i know what shes eating each day yes i do weight her on digital scales last weighed at vets 4,1 kilos
i will weigh her tonight
of course i wont take any notice of the homopath
when ruby opened her mouth right at the back on left hand side looked very red raw on one side


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

1 tin of ad a day atm


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

If Ruby's gums are very red and sore on one side it is possible she still has an infection. When did you finish the antibiotics course? 

If she is eating one tin of Hills AD a day plus some cooked meat it sounds as though she is not doing too badly. If she is not losing weight I wouldn't worry about her not eating enough.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

chillminx said:


> If she is eating one tin of Hills AD a day plus some cooked meat it sounds as though she is not doing too badly.


 That's what I was going to say; and 4kg sounds not too bad (for an average sized cat).


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

shes not had antibiotics in weeks vet gave her an injection that lasts 2w eeks ages ago

ive spoon fed her haf ad hills shes ate 6 slices of chocken on her own shes now just drank from the water fountain and is on my red rug grooming


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

vet says the redness is the stomatitis and i asked before for more antiiotics to be told they wont help


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Grooming herself is a very good sign. It shows her mouth is feeling a bit better.  

Is she still on the steroids? What dose a day are you giving her? 

Unfortunately removing the teeth doesn't always resolve the stomatitis.She may continue to need some pain relief and frequent courses of steroids for some time to come, or even permanently.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

chillminx said:


> Grooming herself is a very good sign. It shows her mouth is feeling a bit better.
> 
> Is she still on the steroids? What dose a day are you giving her?
> 
> Unfortunately removing the teeth doesn't always resolve the stomatitis.She may continue to need some pain relief and frequent courses of steroids for some time to come, or even permanently.


I'm at the vets now, this morning I noticed her scratch her ear and head shaking 
She had blood pouring from one ear, she's a nasty ear infection now
This poor cat has Bern through the mill
How on earth has she got it?
She's on loxicom 4ml daily. Gabipentin twice a day


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

I am afraid that stomatitis is an auto-immune condition so her immune system will not be working properly. You will probably find she has other problems too. I am so glad to hear you are taking no notice of the homeopath. How dare she keep trying to convince you to make your cat suffer.

As Chillminx says, your girl may need pain relief for the rest of her life. Her body is already damaged but she does not deserve to suffer because of that.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

been to the vets she has a nasty ear infection too poor thing was a locum vet french didnt speak good english i asked to lookin her mouth she didnt say anything
ruby has gained weight was 4,1 now 4,265
poor ruby now on 4 meds a day
she had loxicom gabinpentin amoxicillian surolan
hope that helps
ive gave her half tin ad
she should her head like bad went crackers when i put the amoxicillian in her mouth jumped

she now in cat bed
all meds twice a day


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Poor Ruby, I feel so sorry for her. I hope her ear gets better soon. 

I'm glad she has gained a bit of weight.  

Sending many healing vibes to Ruby. xx


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

pussycatzs said:


> she's a nasty ear infection now


 My Gatsby got an ear infection shortly after his perineal uresthrostomy. I think the fact was, he was on antibiotics after his op, and when those wore off he became susceptible to other infections, having stopped the AB's. 
Poor little Ruby has really been thro' the wars, but good news that she is eating.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

morning all im off this weekend so i can watch her im ill msyelf
shes had half a tin of ad
haes all the meds
now in cat bed


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

pussycatzs said:


> morning all im off this weekend so i can watch her im ill msyelf
> shes had half a tin of ad
> haes all the meds
> now in cat bed


Hope its nothing too serious, look after yourself too. You've had such a worrying time with your girl.


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Thank you for the update @pussycatzs. I am glad Ruby is still eating OK. 

Good that you will be able to be with her all weekend. I hope things continue to go OK, and you can get some rest yourself.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

i have a chest infection and cold she has ahd fulltin today of hills all her meds some chicken and shes just ate 7 cat yoghurts
she doesnt like the amoxixillan wonder if the cold medicine hurts her gumsshes now on the sofa alseep she has been grooming

im hoping the meds help


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

ruby was in a different cat bed this morning i stroked her and she purred ispoon fed her half ad tin gave her all her meds
she ate some chicken and cat yoghurt on her own


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Well done Ruby!  

I hope you are feeling a bit better too.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

imnot much better, but rubys had half a pouch on her own and some cat yoghurt shes still in the cat bed snoring

will the amoxicilain help


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Is she on a course of Amoxicillan now? It should clear up any infection she has.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

Yes she's on amoxicillan

Was purring this morning 
Just fed her 
She's had half tin ad hills and she ate some chicken too
Seems brighter


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

That's good news!!  . Fingers crossed she continues to make progress, bless her. x 

I hope you are feeling a bit better too.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

I'm on the bus home now 
I still feel bit rubbish 
I will try her with food once I'm home


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

ruby still having the ad hill s by spoon but yet eats other bits herself shes still purring and still in the igloo bed above the boiler lol she s not daft is she? getting warmth from the boiler
slight runny eye in1 eye
she seems ok i need her matts out of her fur but she goesmad if i touch thematted fur
any suggestions as i cannot afford rge vets 300 pounds again plus i dont want to put her though any more sedation


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Have you tried a slicker brush? Also don't try to go right through the mat head to toe. Use the slicker from the middle to the outside of the matt, a tiny bit at a time, over several sessions. If she still won't let you I'm afraid you might have to cough up at the vets, though £300 strikes me as excessive to dematt a cat. I wouldn't worry about sedation, but if her matts are causing her pain I would worry about that.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

What's a slicker brush 

I think the matts must be uncomfortable 

The matts start all on her back
None on face or under neath her


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Google is your best friend: https://www.google.com/search?q=sli...droid-oneplus&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

rubys had her meds and half adhills again ate small bit of chicken shes stillin the cat bed


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

oh ive got one of those brushes not sure she l let me comb her

oh the hompath has semt me more messages asking me if i have took ruby of the loxicom and gabipentin saying it causes kidney probs and upset sromach and diarhea and i should put all my cats and a raw diet saysing canned food is the reason ive ruby got the ear infections and says the reason she s still quiet and in the cat bed is down to loxicom!
bruce and oscar are on loxicom for stomatits and they run and play they def not dopey


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

If Ruby's fur is very matted the only thing you can do is to get the vet to shave off the worst bits. You can't drag a comb through matted fur without hurting the cat. It would not be fair to put Ruby through that. 

I don't see why it should cost £300 to have her matts shaved off. It will not take the vet long and many vets do not sedate the cat when they shave the fur. There will be some areas on Ruby which are not matted, which can be left as they are. 

The fur on the back of the cat is usually more coarse and does not often matt. I have groomed many cats in the Shelter and have never had one with matted fur on their back. It has always been matted on their flanks, around their neck, on the tummy, or at the tops of legs.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

all the matts are on her back only 

she s had half tin ad hills by spoon then she licked a little yoghurt


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Do you mean the matts are along her spine area? This is fairly unusual IME with grooming the Shelter cats. Could Ruby have rolled in something sticky which has caused the matts?


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

yesall on her back no shes not rolled in anything i just thought it was because she s not groomed her back with the pain she had and thats why she got matts

she seems quiet tonight
still in cat bed i spoon fed her half tin hills again she was very fesity and scratched me then she ran off to the loo came back jumped back in cat bed doesnt want anything elseatm

i touched her matts and she hissed and tried to bite me
how uncomfotable can these matts get?

shes just about out of amoxicilan


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

pussycatzs said:


> I think the matts must be uncomfortable


 My Maggie is long-haired and got badly matted in the summer (think because she was sweating) mainly tummy and between front legs. Those I couldn't brush or comb out I just snip off with the scissors. She never got any along her back though.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

with my other cats i can get scissors on the matts with ruby they are very tight and im not sure she l let me

she s had some hills food this morning and been loo
her nose was running a little and she s been dribbling
shes been in warm hooded bed above the boiler all night so cannot be cold


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

morning
ruby has ate some hills
last night she wandered about and was gorrming
she seems bright this morning
purring away


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Sounds as though things are going better for Ruby! I am so pleased. You have looked after her well.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

shes had some more hills and a little chicken and yoghurt half an hour ago purring away


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

Ruby's much better today
She's are half hills, some chicken and now just a tin of purina gourmet gold chicken melting heart on her own. I'm so pleased
She's purring away


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Excellent news!  Good girl Ruby. x 

Sounds like she is feeling a lot better, bless her. You are a good nurse.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

shes still in cat bed but purring


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

I hope she is OK and yesterday's improvements are continuing. Remember that cats also purr to comfort themselves when in pain, not just when they are happy. But if she is purring in response to you stroking her then it probably means she is OK.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

ruby has ate half a tin of gourmet gold on her own thismorning and i gave her 8 spoons of ad she wtill in the cat bed but purring looks brighter


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

rubys still lives in a cat bed should i be worried? im back to work today socant check on her til tonight shes had some gourment chicken i had to spoon it to her though
she purrs when i touch her
ive been adding water to her food

i do stillworry

thehomopath messsaged me again saying have i started raw feeding well no i havent she insists none of my cats and myself should take meds for the vet and dr and only natural meds work


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

When are you going to block the homeopath?


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

She's harmless. I don't take any notice of her


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

rubys had a gourmet tin and had a big wee


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

Ruby came out of the cat bed, ran around the house like a crazy cat, then went back to the cat bed
She must be feeling better?
She's are a gourmet tin and some chicken


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

This is excellent news! Way to go Ruby!!  x


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

It's a very slow process, but hopefully she's on the mend. I just need her matts out if her fur. I did try this morning. But she went for me


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

pussycatzs said:


> She's harmless. I don't take any notice of her


 It's difficult, especially if you think they are trying to be helpful; or is she trying to get you to buy something from her? Or just telling you that raw is best?


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

pussycatzs said:


> It's a very slow process, but hopefully she's on the mend. I just need her matts out if her fur. I did try this morning. But she went for me


You can';t comb out matts that are really bad. You need to cut them out with a pair of rounded end safety scissors. Buy don't pull them while you are cutting. It might be easier and less painful for Ruby if you got the vet to shave the matts off with the clippers once Ruby is feeling better.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

morning
no shes not trying to get me to buy from her
but she is pushing raw is best and says it brings tears to her eyes when people feed s **T to cats
she really beleives vet meds are full of nastys that kill our cats and only natural is best
and says cat biscuits she calls them kibble is rancid and full of bacteria

rubyshas been to the toilet she had some gourmet and purring


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

ive not had time to get the matts out she goes for me if i touch them vet wil have to do it


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

@pussycatzs - well, it is true that kibble (dry food) contains bacteria and fungus, but it's inactive unless the kibble gets moist or wet. If it gets wet then the bacteria and fungus start to multiply.

Kibble does not keep very well once the bag has been opened, and it can become rancid if kept too long. Manufacturers of kibble recommend a bag is used up within 6 weeks of being opened. Any kibble not used within that time is best thrown away. The expiry date on the bags only applies before the bag has been opened.

I'm glad Ruby is still making good progress. Yes, I would ask the vet to shave off the matts on her back. The fur will soon grow back again.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

A large bag of kibble only lasts a week so it won't go off


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

pussycatzs said:


> A large bag of kibble only lasts a week so it won't go off


Goodness, you must have a large household of cats, LOL!


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

no 6 but there greedy males lol

rubys had some gourmet gold i spoon fed it her to get her meds in
had really good look in her mouth she let me right at the back on left jadm side still looksvery red and inflammed but shes much better in herself
she has a check u saturday


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

I'm glad to hear Ruby is eating. But sorry to hear her part of her mouth still looks red and inflamed. She has been through a lot and been very brave, hasn't she! Bless her x

Pleased to hear she is seeing the vet on Saturday for a checkup.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

ruby has ate she now out of the cat bed and wandering around shes been grooming she ran on the stairs then my computer desk now sat on the sofa grooming

are they signs she feeling a little better?


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

shes trying to pull the matts out must be good sign dont think she can though to matted least shes out ofthe cat bed for now anyway


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

pussycatzs said:


> shes trying to pull the matts out must be good sign dont think she can though to matted least shes out ofthe cat bed for now anyway


Sounds as though Ruby is feeling much better if she is out of her bed and wandering around. Bless her for trying to groom herself! x

Can you ask the vet on Saturday, to use his/her clippers to shave off the matted fur on Ruby's back? It should only take 5 or 10 minutes. He does not need to shave her fur in places where she is not matted.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

Morning 
I've took today off as a holiday as I'm going to the doctors later
Least I can keep an eye on her 
She's sat on the scratching post 

Yes I shall ask the vet to clip the matts out


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

just came back from the vets
vet is happy with her progress shes much improved
shes to continue with the loxicom and gabipentin
she has gained 200g now wieghs 4.4 kilos

her ear infection has cleared up
vet shaved off her matts


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Excellent news.  I'm very pleased things are going so well and the vet is happy.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

me too
hopefully her fur will grow back

shes still like to sit for hours in a cat igloo bed though


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

ruby came uostrair on trhe bed for a bit last night

she now back in the igloo bed she s had some gourmet


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

rubys doing ok purring will keeep an eye on her


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

pussycatzs said:


> just came back from the vets
> vet is happy with her progress shes much improved
> shes to continue with the loxicom and gabipentin
> she has gained 200g now wieghs 4.4 kilos
> ...


 All good news. And 4.4 is a very good weight for a normal-sized cat.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

this morning she came out of the cat bed had a run around then went back into the cat bed purring


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

ruby got in my duvet last night but her feet on mya rms and started purring shes like a differentcat to what she was 4 weeks ago


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

I am so happy to hear this news @pussycatzs !  Well done Ruby! x


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

agian last night she came into my duvet at 3 30 am and stayed on my arms all night purring shes like a new cat


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

pussycatzs said:


> agian last night she came into my duvet at 3 30 am and stayed on my arms all night purring shes like a new cat


 You must be so happy - it's always a relief when you see them looking better. Have you got a photo of Ruby? (Maybe we've seen one and I missed it.)


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

this is my darling ruby 10 years old yesterday


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Awww, what a pretty girl Ruby is! I love torties! :One of our family cats when I was a child was a tortie, and I adored her.  

I am very glad Ruby is so much better. xx


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## Gallifreyangirl (Feb 11, 2015)

Glad Ruby is now on the mend.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

she is so sweet


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## Gallifreyangirl (Feb 11, 2015)

Ruby is gorgeous from the pic you posted.


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## pussycatzs (Feb 4, 2016)

thanks i have her 2 brothers 2


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

She's lovely; belated Happy Birthday to you, Ruby!


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## Tabbytail (Feb 16, 2020)

pussycatzs said:


> Hi all. Need some advice
> My 9 years old cat Ruby had all her teeth out due to severe stomatitis 6 weeks ago. Little or no improvement
> She's Been on morphine loxicom daily and gabipentin twice daily
> She lives in a cat bed. Rarely lrqs the bed. All she eats is bits of shredded ham chicken and the webbox cat lick yoghurt. Won't venture to the good bowls. I bring food to her. Hit and miss really sometimes ears it others not. I've offered many types of food blended crushed warmef etc, limited success. Started syringe feeding her. Goes everywhere too
> ...


I


chillminx said:


> QOTN has said you need to ensure the buprenorphine is given either *under the tongue, or on her gums. * If you can't manage this then she can be given the buprenorphine by injection by the vet.
> 
> If your vet is not willing to help Ruby with injections then I advise you to find another vet urgently today. Please do not delay.


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## Tabbytail (Feb 16, 2020)

I have a rescue cat with severe stomatitis. She has always been skittish and only lets us stroke her when we're in bed or settled on the settee. Then she loves the attention. As soon as we move to get up or walk anywhere near her she's off. She's now 16 so ingrained habit. Every visit to the vet is a hugely stressful nightmare for her as we have to grab her (and corner her in the room if the first attempt to grab is unsuccessful) and force her into a carrier. This memory stays with her and she's harder to grab each time. A few years ago she started with stomatitis and after a couple of years on prednicare, with occasional flare-ups requiring antibiotics, another vet recommended tooth extraction. She had all but her canines and the incisors in between the canines removed. It worked and she was free from stomatitis for a couple more years (it took a few weeks after the extraction for her to get back to eating and behaving normally as the whole thing was traumatic for her and her gums were obviously sore with irritating stitches in place). It flared up again last June 2019 and she was again put on steroids - prednisolone - which hasn't worked so well. She's had to have pain killers and antibiotics intermittently which luckily she takes in the soft treat Lik-e-lix, available from most supermarkets. The liver ones are her favourite possibly due to a stronger smell (green and blue packets). However, she's going downhill. She's currently in agony and pawing at her mouth. She's on steroids - 1 prednisolone a day - and painkiller 0.25 ml vetergesic (metacam/loxicom can't be taken at the same time as steroids). I wondered why the vetergesic wasn't working this time and discovered online that it HAS to be given directly into the mouth, into the cheeck, to be absorbed through the skin. There is no way we can do this. We've been giving it in Lik-e-lix and now I'm thinking this is pointless. The vet knew her nature and how we'd have to administer it so possibly thought it was better than nothing. But I'm going to bring it up with him tomorrow and ask if there's an alternative. One food she IS eating in small doses is uncooked raw cod - I defrost it naturally and cut it up into small pieces, and give her only a small amount at a time. I imagine eating soft icy cold food might be soothing to an inflamed mouth/throat. We have used homeopathic vets in the past who highly recommend raw meat and fish, defrosted naturally and not in the microwave. It works wonders for many cat problems - cats eat raw meat when they catch prey, and processed food can cause so many problems. I'm buying chicken today. Do give it a try if you haven't already.  If anyone else can let me know the success of vetergesic that can't be given directly into the cat's mouth I'd be grateful for any info. I don't want to give up.


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Hi @Tabbytail - I am sorry to hear of your poor cat's problem with severe stomatitis.

If she is in agony and pawing at her mouth then she needs some better pain relief urgently. If the vetergesic can't be given into her cheek then you need to ask the vet for another solution for pain management. If her pain can't be controlled then she has a very poor quality of life. And day to day quality of life is what is important to an animal.

I had a previous cat with severe gingivo-stomatitis and in the later years of her life she used to have Tramadol. I hated giving it to her as it made her spaced out and not her normal self.

Vetergesic can be given by injection, which lasts 24 hours (as I recall) so you would have to take your cat to the vet every day. However, I have heard that some vets are willing to teach cat owners how to inject their cats at home with vetergesic when long term pain relief is needed. It is worth asking your vet about this.

Be cautious about feeding raw fish to your cat. Certain species of fish and shellfish contain an enzyme called thiaminase, an enzyme that metabolises thiamine. Fortunately cod and salmon do not contain thiaminase. Thiaminase causes a deficiency in vitamin B1.

I found my previous cat's stomatitis improved a bit when I withdrew all chicken, beef and fish from her diet. Although stomatitis is not caused by diet (the condition is genetic), it seems possible that certain meat proteins can exacerbate the inflammation. Chicken, beef and fish are the most common feline food allergens statistically.


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