# Is My Akita Inu Underweight?



## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

Hi guys my akita is 10 months old and weighing 36-37kg..he is alot thinner than other akitas in the area...is he underweight?


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## Dogless (Feb 26, 2010)

It is impossible to say on weight alone; if you put up some photos hopefully some experienced owners will be able to help you...if you look at Body Condition Scores on the internet, such as this: Purina.Com | Dog | Caring | Understanding your Dog's Body Condition
it may give you some idea too.


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

Here is my lovely boy Samson looking..well.. rather slim


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## Ducky (Nov 23, 2008)

he is stunning!!! 

still got plenty of growth in him though so i wouldnt worry. i think he looks great though.


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## shazalhasa (Jul 21, 2009)

Don't be guided too much by figures and standards, go by the dog itself 
Looking at the photos, he doesn't look underweight at all but photos can be deceiving. If you feel the space between his hipbones, is it level or sunken ?


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## kaiyaakita (Feb 24, 2010)

he looks lovely is he akita or akita inu ? Akitas do go through some strange growth phases and can look really out of proportion sometimes don't worry though will sort its self out in time.


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## Dogless (Feb 26, 2010)

He looks perfectly OK to me; but I do not have any breed knowledge so hopefully some people that do will be along. I tend to look at my dog from the top view to see a 'waist' and can always see exactly what shape he is as he is short haired, I find it harder to tell with dogs with longer coats.

I have noticed a trend in the area I am in for bigger, bulkier dogs; they are usually not representative of what the breed should look like, but do make true examples of the breeds look rather slight in comparison.

ETA; was obviously typing at the same time as people who know more than I do, sorry!!


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## SpringerHusky (Nov 6, 2008)

Looks in fine weight, my only thing that puzzles me is he looks like he maybe crossed to a husky. His coat should be much thicker and something abiut him to me dosen't scream full akita, i've met two akita x huskies and both looked simular. I can't say i'm no expert though, do you have papers for him?


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

According to the breeder he is full Akita Inu, his father had papers which i saw but mother did not. The breeder owned both mother and father so i did get to see both the dogs along with the pups.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

5rivers79 said:


> Hi guys my akita is 10 months old and weighing 36-37kg..he is alot thinner than other akitas in the area...is he underweight?


Body condition is the most important, you should be able to feel his ribs comfortably but not see them, and he should have a "shape" from behind his rib cage so it curves upwards where his tum is. he looks fine to me. Thats a rough rule of thumb.
Im not so familiar with Akitas, but with Siberians and Malamutes who are the spitz group as well, they tend to go through a gangly stage. Mals especially can go through periods where s even some can look out of proportion. He is likely just a bit of a gangly adolescent at the moment, he looks like he has some filling out to do yet, which he will, its just a matter of maturing.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

SpringerHusky said:


> Looks in fine weight, my only thing that puzzles me is he looks like he maybe crossed to a husky. His coat should be much thicker and something abiut him to me dosen't scream full akita, i've met two akita x huskies and both looked simular. I can't say i'm no expert though, do you have papers for him?


In all honesty I must admit the same thing crossed my mind. 
Dont suppose you have a picture of mum and dad OP


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## SpringerHusky (Nov 6, 2008)

5rivers79 said:


> According to the breeder he is full Akita Inu, his father had papers which i saw but mother did not. The breeder owned both mother and father so i did get to see both the dogs along with the pups.


Hmm I don't think he's akita inu, he may be the american type akita but then i've not seen his colour before in any akitas only huskies.



> The Akita Inu comes in only five colors: Red, Fawn, Sesame, Brindle, and Pure White. All except white must have whitish hair on the sides of the muzzle, on the cheeks, the neck, chest, body and tail, known as "Urajiro". Black masks, as seen in the American Akita, are not permitted in the Japanese Akita Inu. In contrast, all colors are accepted in the American Akita. The Pinto color is not accepted as an Akita Inu color, but is as an accepted American Akita color.


Akita inus tend to look like this









Japanese (also know as American) akitas look more like this









I guess it's hard to say for sure as i'm no expert but i'm sure someone who really knows the breed will know for sure


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

SpringerHusky said:


> Hmm I don't think he's akita inu, he may be the american type akita but then i've not seen his colour before in any akitas only huskies.
> 
> Akita inus tend to look like this
> 
> ...


I didnt say because Im not familiar enough with Akitas, it was the colouring that I picked up on too. However they do go through the ganglys and the Akita Inus Im pretty sure are not so large as the American type any way, in bone structure or size in general. Hopefully someone who knows Akitas better will be able to tell you more. But as far as his size goes and his age I think personally he is fine.


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

mum and dad


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## ballybee (Aug 25, 2010)

He looks like he's got some filling out to do yet so i wouldn't worry too much, he looks very healthy  his parents are stunning as is he


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## Nekkyousha (Jun 24, 2011)

he looks perfectly fine to me, he is still growing, but my mal always seemed weirdly slim to me but i knew she wasnt underweight... so i didnt give her more food i gave her more exercise instead, she built muscle and filled out without an increase of food.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

5rivers79 said:


> mum and dad


it's hard to tell with her lying-down, & half-hidden by the male, too - but the dam looks more true-to-type 
than the papered sire.

however, this is not a breed-ring, & i very much agree - Ur dog looks fine re weight, he is a youth yet, 
& FIT beats *F-A-T* any day. :thumbup: sheer weight means zip - muscle, fitness & BMI are far more accurate 
measures of a dog's state of health in terms of obesity, muscle-mass, etc.

the Lab who won the breed at Westminster-KC show this year was as fat as an ox for slaughter - 
i can't believe the judge put up that dog as a breed-model & good prospective sire.  Dreadful.


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## Nekkyousha (Jun 24, 2011)

i have to agree with other though,he does not look like an akita. an american akita has a black mask, a japanese akita (or akita inu) has a white mask. maybe there is something else in him.


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

I also thought Akita x Husky but he looks fit as a fiddle all the same and as he grows will probably be more true to type. Lovely boy.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

Looking at mum and dad and akita inu pictures on the net, they do seem to vary quite a bit in colours and markings and a lot of them do look more streamlined anyway, so he quite likely is fine. At the end of the day he is a stunning boy, and mum and dad look sweet natured too. So if he has a terrific temperament then really at the end of the day if it were me that would be all that counted.


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

Funny thing is his dad has full paper work from the Kennel Club and has been a show dog Akita Inu. Dad was very friendly when i went to see the pups, mum was a little cautious. The parents especially the sire look very wolfish.

Akitas do seem to come in very different colours and shapes, especially those that originate from Japan.

japanese akita - spitz breed dogs - online dog encyclopedia - dogs in depth.com

To me Samson's mum and dad, and even Samson himself seems to resemble Hachiko a very old and famous Akita in Japan.

Hachik



















I dont want him to be fat and bulky..but i do think he needs to pack on more muscle..even though he is very strong already lol


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

5rivers79 said:


> Funny thing is his dad has full paper work from the Kennel Club and has been a show dog Akita Inu. Dad was very friendly when i went to see the pups, mum was a little cautious. The parents especially the sire look very wolfish.
> 
> Akitas do seem to come in very different colours and shapes, especially those that originate from Japan.
> 
> ...


He will fill out in time, as someone else said better fit then fat.
Amazing story about Hachi though isnt it, just shows you dogs can be hell of a lot more loyal then people.


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## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

What is the dad's KC name? I know the main breeder of Akita Inu's in the country


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

I shall try finding out by contacting the breeder, the guy is pain in the ass to get in touch with lol


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

5rivers79 said:


> [*His*] *parents*, especially the sire, *look very wolfish*.


say what? :huh: wolves are leggy in relation to their body-size for an extended trot, used for cross-country travel, 
have GINORMOUS feet in northern-temperate zones to spread their weight on snow & help prevent break-thru, 
have larger backskulls, longer forefaces, & bigger premolars & molars than dogs.

unless they are black or white, wolves also have STRONG shadings & markings on face & body, which highlight 
their posture & expressions, even at a distance - which many dogs, even those not self-colored, lack entirely 
or the markings are low-contrast.

a 1930s or 40s GSD looked 'wolfy' - as most were sable; modern-day B&Ts or blanketed GSDs don't.


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

leashedForLife said:


> say what? :huh: wolves are leggy in relation to their body-size for an extended trot, used for cross-country travel,
> have GINORMOUS feet in northern-temperate zones to spread their weight on snow & help prevent break-thru,
> have larger backskulls, longer forefaces, & bigger premolars & molars than dogs.
> 
> ...


ohh ok..well anyway the thing that makes me think he has some kinda husky somewhere in him is the fact that he has these bursts where he just runs up and down the garden extremely fast till he gets himself tired, he also "talks" alot...its not a bark more a deep groany grunt mixed with a kinda deep howl lol


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

5rivers79 said:


> ...he has... bursts where he just runs up & down the garden extremely fast till he gets himself tired,
> he also "talks" a lot... not a bark, more a deep groany grunt mixed with a kinda deep howl lol


Akitas are not big on endurance at speed - so that's a very typical pattern, pup-zoomies & then crash. 

Siberians can trot or canter for miles on end; Akitas can trot enduringly IF it's not too hot - i always knew 
if i wanted titles in agility, we'd have to compete with snow down, no way she'd run in July! :lol:

woo-woos are common in Akitas - talk to Michealasi http://tinyurl.com/5wdd6m6 
she has 2 gorgeous rescue-Akitas, & has posted videos of them both on the Forum - check her past posts. :thumbsup:


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## pinklady (Feb 6, 2010)

I think your Akita looks lovely but i wouldnt say he isnt an Inu, i could be wrong though, Akitas Inu's are alot smaller in build than the Japanese Akita. He is still a baby and you will be surprised how much they change, has he just had his first blow? that will make him look slimmer than normal? I think he looks perfect they way he is. My male Akita was the same when he was younger but he soon filled out!!!!!


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

pinklady said:


> I think your Akita looks lovely but i wouldnt say he isnt an Inu, i could be wrong though, Akitas Inu's are alot smaller in build than the Japanese Akita. He is still a baby and you will be surprised how much they change, has he just had his first blow? that will make him look slimmer than normal? I think he looks perfect they way he is. My male Akita was the same when he was younger but he soon filled out!!!!!


Hi, Samson thanks you for the compliment :smile:

He just shed most of his coat so normally does look more fluffy. Thing is..iv read they usually blow their coat for about 2 weeks but he hasn't stopped and its been over a month now..its not coming out in clumps anymore but it is still coming out more than it was before he started shedding.

May i ask you what you feed your akita's? Mine gets bored of food very quickly so have changed from Arden grange Puppy to Burns.

He started to get bored of the Burns chicken too so i got the Burns Lamb which he was hesitant towards and now since the other day iv started adding in half a boneless chicken breast fillet to it and he loves it all.

So all in all he is getting 400g of Burns per day and 150g of raw chicken fillet plus a few treats here and there. Is that enough food for a growing pup and is it ok to give the raw boneless fillet?


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## pinklady (Feb 6, 2010)

My Big Akita gets a dodgy tummy very easily so i have to be careful what he eats, the only food i find that doesnt disagree with him is WAGG but he has fresh chicken and liver once a week and also fresh fish. He loves it and it doesnt go through him like a steam train!!!!! My little one (well 8 months) will eat anything but we give her the same as Mitch was the same at her age. As for blowing, it's supposed to happen every 6 months but Mitch seems to mault all year!!!!! but you know when the blow because their back legs which usually have lovely soft fur turn to strange cotton wool fur!!! its not great when both of mine are blowing!!! its like tumble weed lol :blink: hope this helps x


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## SpringerHusky (Nov 6, 2008)

It could just be in his summer coat that confuses everyone, my malamute is the same

Summer coat









Winter coat









He's a very nice lad


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

Wow what a difference in size. Your malamute looks so cuddly 

Is there any particular kinda fish thats good for em? What about bones in the fish?


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## mamf (Jun 26, 2011)

I feed my akita inu shar pei and shiba tinned pilchards (rinsed of any brine if i cant get the stuff in spring water) unsmoked mackrel or occaisonally salmon! He is a beaut it could be that your breeder has veered from the standard as theres urajiro markings on cheeks and above eyes but the body type is a little different than a typical inu, but a gorgeous boy none the less!


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

Is that boneless fish? I'm weary of giving him anything with bones in it


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## mamf (Jun 26, 2011)

They all have bones but they're easy to pick out if present at all in tinned food, just give it a good mush with a fork if you are worried and the bones tend to pop up, we have fed fish for years without problem though. 

The way it goes down there could be breezeblocks in it and they wouldnt notice


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## pinklady (Feb 6, 2010)

we feed ours Pilchards, tuna or salmon always goes down well


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

5rivers79 said:


> He just shed most of his coat so normally does look more fluffy. Thing is... i've read they usually blow their coat
> for about 2 weeks, but he hasn't stopped... its been over a month now... its not coming out in clumps anymore
> but it is still coming out more than it was before he started shedding.


actually, 3-weeks to a month each spring & fall is about right. BITCHES blow coat again in estrus - 
they shed in anticipation of possible pregnancy, leaving less hair on the milk-bar.

my Akita was tight for coat year-round, *except* for spring & fall - i bathed her regularly, as she did 
therapy-visits, & if i saw more than 6 to 12 hairs in the tub, it was RaRE. :001_smile:



5rivers79 said:


> ...Mine gets bored of food very quickly... changed from Arden grange Puppy to Burns.
> He started to get bored of the Burns chicken too...
> [SNIP]
> Is that enough food for a growing pup and *is it ok to give the raw boneless fillet*?


do U mean he gets BORED - or that the heat means he eats less?

my Akita-bitch went down 8 to 10# every year, during the heat - she ran less, ate less, etc. 
feeding early-AM & late evening [8-ish], when temps are down, can help.

i know zip about Burns, Arden etc - but re the raw-chicken, i always FREEZE any raw meat first, & thaw in the frig, 
not at room-temp - which means overnight: get it out before bed, put it in the frig, feed next day.  
it kills bacteria - BUT freezing will not eliminate any bacterial-Toxins, so get it from a trusted source.

also - RESERVE some proteins!  prime-time for developing food allergies is 2 to 3-YO; 
U don't want to feed him EVERYTHING & have no commonly available, novel protein left, as back-up.

otherwise U can get stuck explaining why he has to have duck-N-Sweet-Potato, or Reindeer-N-Millet, etc, 
 as he ages into adulthood. Keep something OFF the menu; find a food that suits him, & stick to it as his 
primary diet - treats should be less than 10% of his diet, & even those BE AWARE of what's in them.

Canada has a recall on for freeze-dried chicken tenders, & China is IMO not a trusted source for ANY foodstuff, 
human or animal, period.


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

You can feed raw fish and the bones are quite safe but when cooked they become spiky and brittle as opposed to bendy like they are when raw. I feed a barf diet and all bones are quite safe unless they are cooked, chicken bones are no exception. Cooking makes bones brittle and more likely to splinter and puncture the gut/intestine, when raw they are more flexible and digest easily.


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

I dont think the heat has had any effect on his eating because since i started adding raw chicken fillets he has been eating it all within minutes lol

Also when he did get bored of the Arden Grange and Burns Chicken it was during winter and then spring so i think iv been blessed with a picky akita lol


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## venus (Feb 16, 2009)

i'm pretty sure that both his parents are what are known as tweenies in the akita world (a mix of japanese and american lines). he looks a nice boy, but alot of his features are definatly not japanese akita inu but more akita. his ear shape, size and placement are all wrong to be a japanese akita inu as are the shape of his eyes. he as a much leggier than i would expect to see on an american as well even at this age. if you look at the picture of my 8 month old inu bitch you can see the shape of her face is much more trianglar than your boys and her coat texture is very different. 
















he doesn't look under weight but due to his breeding you may never get a big bear. i own a bitch that is a tweenie and she is only just starting to fill out at 7 years old. she is the best dog i have ever owned and if your boy as a temperment half as good as she does then you'll have one pretty amazing dog.


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

Your inu is very cute indeed! can you believe this is a fighting/bear hunting breed lol

I dont mind if he doesnt grow massive as he is already overwhelmingly strong lol However his mum and dad were huge!

I have contacted the breeder to ask the sire's kc name but the **** hasnt replied to my emails for a while!


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

5rivers79 said:


> I have contacted the breeder to ask the sire's kc name...


didn't U get a KC-registry [name, etc] & pedigree for the sire when U got the pup?

if not, the breeder IMO is a real slimeball. No excuses.

were both his dogs, sire & dam, health-screened? At minimum:
* hips & KNEES for dysplasia &/or patellar-luxation 
* 3 skin-punches from different areas for Sebaceous-adenitis 
* 5-way thyroid panel read by Michigan State-Univ vet-lab for breed-specific normal range 
* EYE certificates, signed by a canine-opthalmologist [not a general-DVM] 
indicating both sire & dam are free of heritable eye-problems & *no more than 12-mos old*


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## venus (Feb 16, 2009)

to be honest leashed for life the breeder used a bitch that wasn't kc registered so is unlikely to have done any health testing. the only recommended health tests over here in the uk is hip scoring and eye test (although i really do believe that both the test for sa and thyroid should be done myself).


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

venus said:


> to be honest leashed for life the breeder used a bitch that wasn't kc registered so is unlikely to have done any health testing. the only recommended health tests over here in the uk is hip scoring and eye test (although i really do believe that both the test for sa and thyroid should be done myself).


I didnt know Thyroid was a problem in the Akita too! Its a terrible problem in Sibes and Mals too. I have mine routinely tested every so often. Ive now had 3 sibes who had the idiopathic version came on about 10ish and my youngest
sibe/Mal mix has the auto immune thyroiditis symptoms appeared at 2yrs.
she was seriously low started having seizures which alerted me to the possible problem. So far my Mals Ok his tests have been fine.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

5rivers79 said:


> Your inu is very cute indeed! can you believe this is a fighting/bear hunting breed lol
> 
> I dont mind if he doesnt grow massive as he is already overwhelmingly strong lol However his mum and dad were huge!
> 
> I have contacted the breeder to ask the sire's kc name but the **** hasnt replied to my emails for a while!


Just noticed you have added a pic to your avatar, hes got a cracking face, lovely looking boy.


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

leashedForLife said:


> didn't U get a KC-registry [name, etc] & pedigree for the sire when U got the pup?
> 
> if not, the breeder IMO is a real slimeball. No excuses.
> 
> ...


I saw the sire's kc certificate, it was a damn long thing so i didnt think to note any of it down at the time and to be honest this was the first time iv purchased a dog so didnt really know what i was doing.

As for the tests on the sire and dam i didnt see any of those either but the pups were vet checked, given the injections and microchipped..he also sent the pups off with food and a months insurance.

The breeder himself was a nurse at the pet vaccination clinic so im not sure if he would have tried to screw me over as i knew where he worked and where he lived. He only included the first set of injections at first but quickly included the 2nd set too after i asked him nicely.

Maybe i should have been a little weary and walked away but when i saw how the sire looked and how cute the puppies were i just could not walk away..there was no other akita that looked like the Sire when i was looking lol


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## venus (Feb 16, 2009)

i've not really heard of many american akitas with it tbh, but then i have spent the last 5 years more involve with the japanese akita inu, but as both breeds have very close ties i would assume that it does show up. i do know that there have been cases of it amongst the japanese akita inu, my friend recently lost her bitch to complications that arose from the hypothyroid issue she had. she started the same way as your sibe/mal mix with seizures.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

venus said:


> i've not really heard of many american akitas with it tbh, but then i have spent the last 5 years more involve with the japanese akita inu, but as both breeds have very close ties i would assume that it does show up. i do know that there have been cases of it amongst the japanese akita inu, my friend recently lost her bitch to complications that arose from the hypothyroid issue she had. she started the same way as your sibe/mal mix with seizures.


There were very subtle not quite right things that bothered me, As a pup, she always looked sad, where the others used to veg on the sofas, or beds they didnt stay there long and would get too hot where she would stay put and curled up, She was a very quiet and biddable pup (way strange for her mix sibe/mal), she always got upset tums in hot weather. I was actually going to get her thyroid routine tested anyway when her next titres were due a month or two later, but when she had a couple of seizures, knowing the link to seizures and that the auto immune thyroid makes an appearance before 3 (she was just coming up 2yrs) I insisted it was done, and it was way too low. Been on the Meds now for almost 6mths and no more seizures.

I am so sorry to hear about your friends girl. Thyroid problems seem to be missed in the Uk a lot, and even after diagnosis getting the right treatment can be a problem.

Apologies for taking your thread off topic OP, but as Venus said if thyroid is a problem in Akitas as it is in my breeds, the information may be useful to you in general too, just in case you spot anything in the future.


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

You guys have been very helpful. My pup has had an annoying skin condition on his tummy and the vet thinks he has some kinda allergy. Hopefully the blood test will tell what it is.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

5rivers79 said:


> ...the sire's kc certificate... was a damn long thing, so i didnt think to note any of it down
> at the time, &TBH [it's] the first time i've purchased a dog, so didnt really know what i was doing.


don't feel bad, but U should have been given a *photocopy* by the breeder - that is extremely cheap, 
& there is zero excuse for anyone selling a pup & *not* providing a 5-generation pedigree on any registered 
parent - it's not costly, & it is ethically inexcusable to not share that info.


5rivers79 said:


> As for... tests on the sire & dam, i didnt see any of those... the pups were vet checked,
> [vaxed] and microchipped... he also sent the pups off with food and a months insurance.


that's nice - but genetic screening is IMO not an option, but a requirement.  


5rivers79 said:


> Maybe i should have been a little [wary] & walked away, but *when i saw... the sire... & how cute the puppies were,
> i just could not walk away... * ...no other Akita... looked like the sire when i was looking, :lol:


breeders *depend on that reflex - * all pups are adorable. :nonod: that's why deciding before U see 
or touch a puppy is so important - if the breeder has not tested sire & dam, i would not even view the litter. 
it protects U from puppy-delirium,  which turns brains to mush. :001_tt2:


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

venus said:


> ...the breeder used a bitch that wasn't kc registered so is unlikely to have done any health testing.


sorry, IMO even unregistered mutts who are bred should be tested - if not, don't breed them. 
mutts get hip-dysplasia, dermoid sinus, PRA, & all the rest, too. No excuses.


venus said:


> the only recommended health tests... in the UK [are] hip scoring & [eye-exam by a k9-opthalmologist,
> with a certificate] - although IMO both the test for SA & thyroid should be done...


see this link for suggestions; breeds are listed alphabetically in Section-A, possible conditions are in Section-B.

Dodds DVM, W Jean ; Hall DVM, Susan; Inks, Kay: 
Guide To Congenital and Heritable Disorders In Dogs (March, 2006). 
http://www.avar.org/pdf/publication/brochure/dog_disease_guide.pdf

AVAR is no longer on the web, & this incredibly-valuable resource is disappearing from the web - 
i am going to copy it [*again*] on the breeding forum.

this is their list for Akitas 


> _ Akita:
> 9, 10, 11, 27, 31, 43, 65, 71, 103, 114, 115, 131, 135, 137,
> 140, 146, 152, 156, 166, 172, 178a, 192, 193a, 199, 206, 221, 221a,
> 239, 256, 258a, 270, 273a, 291, 311a, 312, 318, 329, 330 _


each number is a specific problem. 
see Powered by Google Docs for the list as a Google-document, & look them up.


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

leashedForLife said:


> don't feel bad, but U should have been given a *photocopy* by the breeder - that is extremely cheap,
> & there is zero excuse for anyone selling a pup & *not* providing a 5-generation pedigree on any registered
> parent - it's not costly, & it is ethically inexcusable to not share that info.
> 
> ...


He turns my brains to mush on a daily basis lol :w00t:


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

this pearl beyond price is vanishing from the web, as folks update their purebred websites & delete 'old' links.

Dodds DVM, W Jean ; Hall DVM, Susan; Inks, Kay: 
Guide To Congenital and Heritable Disorders In Dogs (March, 2006). 
http://www.avar.org/pdf/publication/...ease_guide.pdf

AVAR is no longer on the web; i copied the Guide [again] on the *sticky* _Necessary health tests before breeding._

this is their list for Akitas 


> _ Akita:
> 9, 10, 11, 27, 31, 43, 65, 71, 103, 114, 115, 131, 135, 137,
> 140, 146, 152, 156, 166, 172, 178a, 192, 193a, 199, 206, 221, 221a,
> 239, 256, 258a, 270, 273a, 291, 311a, 312, 318, 329, 330_


see the sticky for the explanations.


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

Sorry to be a numpty but where is this sticky? Do have a link for it? Thanks


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

5rivers79 said:


> Sorry to be a numpty but where is this sticky? Do have a link for it? Thanks


oops! wrong Forum  it's on Breeding forum.

Necessary health tests before breeding - Pet Forums Community


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## venus (Feb 16, 2009)

leashedForLife said:


> sorry, IMO even unregistered mutts who are bred should be tested - if not, don't breed them.
> mutts get hip-dysplasia, dermoid sinus, PRA, & all the rest, too. No excuses.


i wasn't suggesting other wise, i personally don't believe in breeding from un-registered dogs let alone untested and also feel that a dog should have proved itself to be a good example of its breed either through working or showing. 
i was suggesting that its more than likely that this breeder didn't bother to test his dogs because its more than likely he bred for profit not the good of the breed.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

venus said:


> i wasn't suggesting otherwise, i personally don't believe in breeding from un-registered dogs, let alone untested,
> and also feel that a dog should have proved itself to be a good example of its breed, either through working or showing.


 i'm *very* sorry, i did not think for a moment that U approved his actions at all - i apologize, that was poor 
communication on my part. 


venus said:


> ...its more than likely that this breeder didn't bother to test his dogs... likely he bred for profit, not the good of the breed.


& i'm sure he did - he got no breed-club or KC permission to add this bitch to the studbook. :nonod:


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

I dont think he bred for profit, i mean how much would you charge to make profit out of pup? Sammy was relatively cheap compared to other Akitas when i was looking around. People were charging over a grand for pups because they were KC reg'd.


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## venus (Feb 16, 2009)

even though his puppies probably where a lot cheaper than a puppy from a more reputable breeder the chances are he as made more profit. his cost will have been far less than say mine would be if i breed from my girl. she is shown to prove that she is a good example of her breed so there are those costs to be added in (its not a cheap hobby) then the costs of health testing, my girl will more than likely been taken abroad to be mated so pet passporting, transport to the stud plus stud fee's. so far i'm looking at been around 3 grand (not including the cost of showing) out of pocket before i even produce a litter. that doesn't include whelping kit extra food, shots and microchips for puppies and everything else that comes from producing a litter. average litter size for an inu is around 5-6 puppies. i might break even if i'm lucky. 

the breeder of your boy can't show his girl, more than likely hasn't spend anything on health testing other than maybe a vet check and used his own stud so no fee there. he as the basics to pay for. which is why he can charge much less than i could and still make profit.


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## 5rivers79 (Mar 28, 2011)

venus said:


> even though his puppies probably where a lot cheaper than a puppy from a more reputable breeder the chances are he as made more profit. his cost will have been far less than say mine would be if i breed from my girl. she is shown to prove that she is a good example of her breed so there are those costs to be added in (its not a cheap hobby) then the costs of health testing, my girl will more than likely been taken abroad to be mated so pet passporting, transport to the stud plus stud fee's. so far i'm looking at been around 3 grand (not including the cost of showing) out of pocket before i even produce a litter. that doesn't include whelping kit extra food, shots and microchips for puppies and everything else that comes from producing a litter. average litter size for an inu is around 5-6 puppies. i might break even if i'm lucky.
> 
> the breeder of your boy can't show his girl, more than likely hasn't spend anything on health testing other than maybe a vet check and used his own stud so no fee there. he as the basics to pay for. which is why he can charge much less than i could and still make profit.


Yeh thats true, his stud did have full paper work though i just didnt think to look at it thoroughly 

He did pay for the initial vet check, a months insurance with petplan, micro chipping, both sets of injections and a few weeks worth of food ( Arden Grange) i dont know how much all that would cost but he charged me £500 for Sammy.

Im not sure if i remember correctly but im sure in the original advert on epupz stated that they were *Adacar Akitas* or something  im not even sure if it was spelt like that as i cant find anything online with that name.


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