# Buying from Petshops



## SEVEN_PETS

Is buying from petshops ever good?

I hate people buying from pet shops and usually when someone new comes onto the forum, they've already got the animal from the petshop so there's nothing you can do. I do get angry that people don't think about where these animals have come from. They haven't come from a nice, fluffy place. They have come from a place where no-one cares for the individual animals or the animals that they produce, they just care about profit and the huge amount of animals they produce. 

IMO there is no excuse not to research thoroughly before getting a pet. it only takes 2 seconds to type into google your chosen animal and it will come up with information sites. It's not difficult. It just shows how little people actually care about the animal they are bringing into their lives if they do not research properly before getting it. 

Before I get a new pet, I spend months on research, finding out everything from housing, to food, to any illnesses or health problems it may have. But most people usually buy the animal, buy some housing which is far too small for the animal to live in, and then come on a forum and ask questions. 

I know that people can get taken in by the animals in the pet shops and especially if there is a ill one there and it doesn't seem to receive any veterinary care from the staff. However, unless we ALL stop buying from pet shops, we will never get rid of this terrible business and we can not stop animals suffering from the hands of the breeders who supply the petshops.


----------



## Guest

My views exactly :thumbup:


----------



## niki87

Well put! :thumbup:


----------



## purple_x

I agree with all that you've said.

People who buy an animal and then do the research bug me a little, every animal I have ever had has been researched before I have got it/them.
I researched mice and got some and although I still ask some questions I know most of what I need to know.

It also makes me sooooo mad that pet shops are allowed to sell cages and hutches that are far too small, I wish we could somehow put a stop to this.


----------



## simplysardonic

I've bought animals from pet shops in the past, before I knew better, I would never do it now & I do my best to discourage anyone else from doing it


----------



## Jesss

Although I would never buy from a pet shop, I can see why people do. Some people do not know the true horrors of where their pets came from. Also it is really difficult to find some pets, such as I have been searching for a few pet mice for aaages now. Still no such luck. Thats where pet shops get there buyers from, its quick and easy, I just wish it wasn't.


----------



## DKDREAM

It depends on the petshop you buy from, Some petshops (very few i agree) only get animals from responsible caring breeders.


----------



## newfiesmum

The fact is that people think they are getting a bargain. When I first had Ferdie this woman I knew came back from Australia (of all places) and told me I had been had because she saw newfoundlands in a pet shop over there for only 350 Australian Dollars. I tried, but I could not get it through to her that there is a reason why I paid £1000, and they were only 350 dollars. And the very idea of keeping puppies in a pet shop window makes me shudder.

And since Harrods sell them, of course you have the snob element who think that everything that comes from Harrods is somehow upper class.

The [email protected] nearest me does not sell puppies and kittens, but they do sell reptiles, fish and small furries. I know nothing about the reptiles but the small furries all look healthy and are well kept in huge runs. So they are not all bad after all. But, as you say, we have no idea where they came from.


----------



## miniloo

i do buy from one petshop but only cos i know the owner and a few of her breeders i have visited a few of them and her knowledge of not only the breeders but the aniamls that she sells is really great, she vets you before she sells and wont sell u anything if she thinks that you might have not got your set up right, don't have enough information on that animal, and will go out of her way to give you info or sites to find info from. 

so yes there are some good petshops out there.


----------



## hayleypope

you know its only big chains that are the big probs most petshop retailers grow up with animals and work with animals cos is it there passion some of which breed there own live stock, also petshop owners should have an obligation eg selling a kitten if a problem should occur the shop is obligated to help, buy it from tom dick who dont have a clue kitties have major worms,earmites fleas an unsuspecting private purchaser may not be able to recognise th e first signs of disease; but if course a private purchase they have no governing licensing people so often or not will tell you to get stuffed.
so really you are spouting that people go to random places and buy animals under false pretences and breeders dont get me started interbreeding, i tell you once they got your money they really dont care yes they may take back the pet but yeah you want a refund you must be joking. i have seen it!


----------



## hayleypope

i own a petshop and yes it disgusts me i refuse to sell an animal in a cage not suitable but i tell you the amount of people that will go to the big stores and buy something smaller to fit in there designated space is disgusting, and then wonder why i wont let them have an animal


----------



## Guest

hayleypope said:


> you know its only big chains that are the big probs most petshop retailers grow up with animals and work with animals cos is it there passion some of which breed there own live stock, also petshop owners should have an obligation eg selling a kitten if a problem should occur the shop is obligated to help, buy it from tom dick who dont have a clue kitties have major worms,earmites fleas an unsuspecting private purchaser may not be able to recognise th e first signs of disease; but if course a private purchase they have no governing licensing people so often or not will tell you to get stuffed.
> so really you are spouting that people go to random places and buy animals under false pretences and breeders dont get me started interbreeding, i tell you once they got your money they really dont care yes they may take back the pet but yeah you want a refund you must be joking. i have seen it!


Errr no we are not spouting that people should go to random places.
Good ethical breeders and rescue is where you need to go, any ethical breeder will vet the person buying from them and they will also home check to make sure their babies are going to the best home possible. Ethical breeders will also have a contact in place that states if the new owners can't keep the animal for any reason they must be returned to the breeder.
Ethical breeders will also be able to spot the first signs of any problems so will be able to treat it of not put the animal up for sale.
Rescues home check and the animal will always belong to the rescue so again if the owners circumstances change the animal is to be returned to the rescue.

NO petshop can say they offer the same, they sell for profit simple as. Myself and others on this forum will be very, very glad when petshops are stopped from selling livestock


----------



## simplysardonic

hayleypope said:


> *you know its only big chains that are the big probs* most petshop retailers grow up with animals and work with animals cos is it there passion some of which breed there own live stock, also petshop owners should have an obligation eg selling a kitten if a problem should occur the shop is obligated to help, buy it from tom dick who dont have a clue kitties have major worms,earmites fleas an unsuspecting private purchaser may not be able to recognise th e first signs of disease; but if course a private purchase they have no governing licensing people so often or not will tell you to get stuffed.
> so really you are spouting that people go to random places and buy animals under false pretences and breeders dont get me started interbreeding, i tell you once they got your money they really dont care yes they may take back the pet but yeah you want a refund you must be joking. i have seen it!


Sorry but I disagree, I made the mistake of going into an awful 'family run' pet shop just 2 weeks ago, totally inappropriate cages, dwarf hamsters in those little plastic tanks with no enrichment, rabbits & guinea pigs housed in the same small cage with very little hay & horrible food that was bright green & bright orange, it was dreadful. I personally think that pet shops should not sell animals, regardless of how much they may care about the welfare, as it's just too easy for people to impuse buy a pet. If people decide they want a pet then hopefully the fact that they would have to do some research to find a good breeder (such as online on a forum or through a club or rescue) would mean they're exposed to info about that animal as well
As for the last comment, inbreeding isn't always bad & your comment is a bit of a sweeping statement about breeders, as there are ethical ones out there


----------



## Clare7435

DKDREAM said:


> It depends on the petshop you buy from, Some petshops (very few i agree) only get animals from responsible caring breeders.


I couldn't agree more, with both the op's concerns and your thoughts, some et shops are rubbish and i think a lot more research should be done ,though the pet shop i use either re homes or gets from a very good breeder. My first rabbit Loui came from there and never cost me a penny in ill health in his entire 9+ years, poor dolly came from a very reputable very expensive breeder and has cost me a fortune, the first illness came from when she was with her mother she had Encephalitozoon cuniculi and the vet said she'd had it in there for some time, and since then she's been prone to re infection, all the research on this breeder pointed to how good he was , his housing was clean and all the buns looked healthy so despite my research i didnt and couldn't see this coming, yet there was little loui come from our pet shop out living loads of other bunnys with a problem free life, same with the other buns i've had from there, i think if you're going to use a pet shop that's perfectly ok as long as you can see where the animals come from and as the op said....research. I love my local pet shop


----------



## Clare7435

Also with the life expectancy of a giant rabbit like dolly, had I have gone to a rescue I would risk only enjoying her for a sort while, maybe i sound selfish but i don't want to bond with a rabbit just to lose them a few short months later. I most certainly research though because i do agree that some shop owners are crap


----------



## Guest

Clare7435 said:


> I couldn't agree more, with both the op's concerns and your thoughts, some et shops are rubbish and i think a lot more research should be done ,though the pet shop i use either re homes or gets from a very good breeder. My first rabbit Loui came from there and never cost me a penny in ill health in his entire 9+ years, poor dolly came from a very reputable very expensive breeder and has cost me a fortune, the first illness came from when she was with her mother she had Encephalitozoon cuniculi and the vet said she'd had it in there for some time, and since then she's been prone to re infection, all the research on this breeder pointed to how good he was , his housing was clean and all the buns looked healthy so despite my research i didnt and couldn't see this coming, yet there was little loui come from our pet shop out living loads of other bunnys with a problem free life, same with the other buns i've had from there, i think if you're going to use a pet shop that's perfectly ok as long as you can see where the animals come from and as the op said....research. I love my local pet shop


80% of rabbits carry EC it just depends if they are carriers or it is active. The only way to stop EC is by Panacuring for 28 days (bleaching on days 21 and 28) 2 or 3 times a year. If she caught EC from her mother it would have been obvious when you picked her up


----------



## Clare7435

B3rnie said:


> 80% of rabbits carry EC it just depends if they are carriers or it is active. The only way to stop EC is by Panacuring for 28 days (bleaching on days 21 and 28) 2 or 3 times a year. If she caught EC from her mother it would have been obvious when you picked her up


she was 12 weeks old when i picked her up and 18 weeks hen she got her first bout, the vet said that can lay active inside them for some time then can flare up suddenly like with dolly, in all honesty i'd never had a rabbit with it till Dolly because I treat all mine regularly, in fact Dolly had her treatment just 2 days before she me down with it so god knows how come she got so ill...never seen a bun with paralysis like that and hope i never will again, what bothers me is that my cousin took her rabbit to the blue cross with exactly he same symptoms about a year before and they put the bun down saying it couldn't be treated, they didn't even find out if it was the same thing just put the poor thing to sleep.


----------



## Guest

Yeah the bacteria can lay dormant until the immune system is compromised or they are put under stress  
She was probably a carrier then so unless the breeder had a bun from those lines exhibit the illness they would have never known, did you contact the breeder to let them know what happened?

And yes unfortunately alot of vets will say PTS when they see EC symptoms not many vets know a lot about it so unless they are rabbit savvy they will opt PTS


----------



## OctodonDegus

I agree, but I also fear for the animals. If no one is buying them, what is their fate? they are still lives which need to be taken into account.


----------



## WelshYorkieLover

SEVEN_PETS said:


> It just shows how little people actually care about the animal they are bringing into their lives if they do not research properly before getting it. QUOTE]
> 
> That is not true at all! That is just your opinion! Just because someone buys a pet from a pet shop it doesn't mean they dont care about the animal. All my hamsters and my budgie when I was younger came from petshops.
> 
> What do you think happens to the animals if nobody buys them? Think about it! They deserve a home as much as any animal in the rescue!


----------



## WelshYorkieLover

OctodonDegus said:


> I agree, but I also fear for the animals. If no one is buying them, what is their fate? they are still lives which need to be taken into account.


Exactly!!!!! That just goes to show that you care about animals and that people who just refuse to get pets from a pet shop just out of principle obvously cant care that much!! Principles doesnt home pet shop pets!!


----------



## Guest

WelshYorkieLover said:


> SEVEN_PETS said:
> 
> 
> 
> It just shows how little people actually care about the animal they are bringing into their lives if they do not research properly before getting it. QUOTE]
> 
> That is not true at all! That is just your opinion! Just because someone buys a pet from a pet shop it doesn't mean they dont care about the animal. All my hamsters and my budgie when I was younger came from petshops.
> 
> What do you think happens to the animals if nobody buys them? Think about it! They deserve a home as much as any animal in the rescue!
> 
> 
> 
> SP was talking about not researching the pet, the fact that the people not researching can just pop to the shops to get the next fluffy critter. She didn't mean that everyone that buys from a petshop is uncaring.
> Just that it encourages these sort of people.
> 
> And to answer your question if people stopped buying from petshops it would no longer be profitable for them to sell animals so they will stop  At the end of the day anyone that owns a shop is in it for the money they can make, they wouldn't do it if they didn't make money
> 
> I hope that makes sense
Click to expand...


----------



## Guest

WelshYorkieLover said:


> Exactly!!!!! That just goes to show that you care about animals and that people who just refuse to get pets from a pet shop just out of principle obvously cant care that much!! Principles doesnt home pet shop pets!!


Err no I look at the bigger picture 

I think my rescue animals will tell you I am very caring....


----------



## Clare7435

B3rnie said:


> Yeah the bacteria can lay dormant until the immune system is compromised or they are put under stress
> She was probably a carrier then so unless the breeder had a bun from those lines exhibit the illness they would have never known, did you contact the breeder to let them know what happened?
> 
> And yes unfortunately alot of vets will say PTS when they see EC symptoms not many vets know a lot about it so unless they are rabbit savvy they will opt PTS


Yeh it was the first thing i did after getting in from the vets, poor bloke was gutted but unless he had x ray vision which I'm pretty sure he hadn't I don't suppose he'd have known until the symptoms presented, he was really good though, even offered me another rabbit should the worst come to the worst which i really was trying not to think about at the time and luckily didn't have to as my vet thankfully is fantastic and had her turned around and walking again within 2 weeks, tbh the hardest part was keeping her back end clean, i ended up shaving off the fur round her bottom and putting a nappy on her to save her laying in her wee in her sleep with her being temp paralysed. She was one wonderful bunny though as it didn't affect her using her litter tray at all she went straight back to it as soon as she could walk again:biggrin:


----------



## WelshYorkieLover

Sorry Bernie I wasn't directing anything at you! It just got to me when the op said that people who buy from pet shops dont care about the animals!


----------



## Guest

WelshYorkieLover said:


> Sorry Bernie I wasn't directing anything at you! It just got to me when the op said that people who buy from pet shops dont care about the animals!


Sorry you hit a nerve 
It's not the first time that has been said to me


----------



## WelshYorkieLover

I honestly did mean anything. I just feel for the animals that noone will buy because they're in a petshop. I haven't bought from a pet shop in years as you know my hamster and rats are taken in from homes who no longer wanted them but I just feel sorry for them if they're not being given a good home!


----------



## Guest

WelshYorkieLover said:


> I honestly did mean anything. I just feel for the animals that noone will buy because they're in a petshop. I haven't bought from a pet shop in years as you know my hamster and rats are taken in from homes who no longer wanted them but I just feel sorry for them if they're not being given a good home!


I too feel for them, I had to walk away from a very, very cute English lop cross today 
I went to check out a new petshop in the area to see what they were like, and I spotted him in the corner  I had to be strong because if I bought him there would have been another litter produced to fill the gap


----------



## OctodonDegus

It' a difficult situation, I can see 2 sides of it. On the one hand if the pet shops are over run and no one is buying they may stop, but on the other hand there are lives who may be "gotten rid off" in a not so nice way, lives which may never be loved, and lives which are going to waste. 

I think it just needs a different approach, of course I'm not suggesting we shouldn't do anything, I just think there needs to be a change in law, some awareness and some way these practices can be stopped and regulated. 

No, it wont be easy, I don't know exactly how to approach it, but I think that's better than possibly risking the happiness of other animals. I want them all to win in the end.

This is not aimed at anyone, its just my opinion, I feel sad for both the animals in the farms and the ones who may never get homes...its just very difficult.


----------



## SEVEN_PETS

why are my old threads being brought up? and WelshYorkieLover, I don't mean that people who buy from pet shops are uncaring, I just meant that if you don't research and buy the animals on a whim, then that isn't caring. For example, like getting a rabbit and a hutch from the pet shop and the hutch is 3ft long because the owner didn't research how large the accommodation needed to be. 

I have had pet shop animals in the past, I wouldn't buy them in the future, but I would buy animals from the adoption centres in Pets At Home and other pet shops that have this system. There's one bunny that is in [email protected] right now that I want (but don't have the space for so won't get her). She's a large REW bunny who's been in the store the whole of her 7 month life and no-one wants her because of her appearance. If I had the space, I'd have her.


----------



## Leanne77

I'd always bought my pets from the pet shop until very recently, because I now know better. My last batch of mice came from the RSPCA. I had trouble locating some at the time but was determined I wouldnt get them from a shop, even though they were readily available and much nicer colours than the ones I ended up having.
Around a year ago my Mum added a cockatiel to the family, this came from a rescue place too.
I would never, ever buy rabbits from a pets shop as there are so many in rescue.


----------



## newfiesmum

When I was growing up you could always see puppies and kittens in small pet shops, usually in the window. That is where the old song "How much is that doggie in the window" came from. I really thought it had been outlawed as it is not something I have seen for years.

Our local pet shop used to sell rabbits and guinea pigs, hamsters and the like, but not any more. He also used to keep monkeys and a parrot in there, but they were his own, not for sale. The monkeys had a sort of cage which took up the whole ceiling in the shop. I think lots of people asked to buy them but he would never sell.

The parrot was always out in the shop so I used to tap on the window and he would come outside to serve me. I am terrified of birds and flatly refused to go in there!


----------



## MrRustyRead

i do object to the how they are bred, but my maisie and bobz came from a pet shop and i dont see why they dont deserve a good home just because they came from a pet shop, they still deserve happy lives, at least they are with me and not some bratty little child that will get bored of them after a week.


----------



## Ingrid25

IMO there is no excuse not to research thoroughly before getting a pet. it only takes 2 seconds to type into google your chosen animal and it will come up with information sites. It's not difficult. It just shows how little people actually care about the animal they are bringing into their lives if they do not research properly before getting it. 

Before I get a new pet, I spend months on research, finding out everything from housing, to food, to any illnesses or health problems it may have. But most people usually buy the animal, buy some housing which is far too small for the animal to live in, and then come on a forum and ask questions. 
QUOTE]

that was so me when i got my first guinea pigs and my kitten! hours and hours and hours of research!
we have 1 pet shop animal, thats all. the rest have been bred or bought from a breeder!


----------



## hayleypope

if for any reason any of my animals are poorly i take them to a vet immediately, that is my own animals and any i sell. I ALSO GIVE A TWO WEEK PERIOD so if an animal was to become ill i would seek vetinary treatment. how many reputable breeders as you call them showing at crufts interbreed causing damaging effects to poor puppies for perfection and so high up are they they are seen as reputable and you pay through the nose and why do breeders breed animals when there are so many rescue animals omg where are the animals going to come from if no one breeds them? and i think you will find kennels or catteries who breed dogs and cats do it for an income.
yes i do earn an income from my shop the animals are an attraction and they make our work more enjoyable but no shop makes money out of the animals themselves its the cages and accessories and food toys that provide us with a living for example if i am charged eight pound for a guineapig say i have it for a couple of weeks it costs say 6 pound before i sell it to look after then you sell say 20 pounds 20 per cent is vat so where is the greed?and mountains of profit


----------



## Guest

hayleypope said:


> if for any reason any of my animals are poorly i take them to a vet immediately, that is my own animals and any i sell. I ALSO GIVE A TWO WEEK PERIOD so if an animal was to become ill i would seek vetinary treatment. how many reputable breeders as you call them showing at crufts interbreed causing damaging effects to poor puppies for perfection and so high up are they they are seen as reputable and you pay through the nose and why do breeders breed animals when there are so many rescue animals omg where are the animals going to come from if no one breeds them? and i think you will find kennels or catteries who breed dogs and cats do it for an income.
> yes i do earn an income from my shop the animals are an attraction and they make our work more enjoyable but no shop makes money out of the animals themselves its the cages and accessories and food toys that provide us with a living for example if i am charged eight pound for a guineapig say i have it for a couple of weeks it costs say 6 pound before i sell it to look after then you sell say 20 pounds 20 per cent is vat so where is the greed?and mountains of profit


I suggest you do a bit of research on what a GOOD breeder is, what you have described is bad breeding  
Also your comment on where are the animals going to come from? GOOD breeders

Unfortunately rescues will probably never run out of animals, we live in too much of a disposable society :frown2:

I repeat no GOOD breeder will sell to or through a pet shop as they can not guarantee/or care about the types of homes they sell too :mad5:


----------



## MrRustyRead

Been owning rabbits for 10 years now, got mine from a pet shop as all the ones in rescue were prebonded and I needed a single one, don't love Maisie any less as she is from a pet shop, she is such a beautiful girl. Can't wait for bobz to meet her


----------



## Guest

jimbo_28_02 said:


> Been owning rabbits for 10 years now, got mine from a pet shop as all the ones in rescue were prebonded and I needed a single one, don't love Maisie any less as she is from a pet shop, she is such a beautiful girl. Can't wait for bobz to meet her


Not being funny but that is pretty irrelevant to the convo, no one suggested you should love your pet shop bought animals any less 

And there are plenty of single rabbits in rescue, just sometimes you have to be patient.


----------



## MrRustyRead

Sorry just sometimes feel like my bunnies are looked down on as they are from pet shops,I looked round all rescues and they all bond and rehome together and said bobz was to old for a friend from them.


----------



## Guest

jimbo_28_02 said:


> Sorry just sometimes feel like my bunnies are looked down on as they are from pet shops,I looked round all rescues and they all bond and rehome together and said bobz was to old for a friend from them.


Then you should have tried a different rescue center  but no matter now as you have Maisey.

No one looks down on the animals because of where they come from, this is about the bad ethics of the majority of petshops.


----------



## simplysardonic

Pet shops also seem to be notoriously bad at dispensing decent advice, so many people come on here with their shop bought small furries & they've bought unsuitable cages or are feeding an unsuitable diet, which makes it look like they've done no research before getting their animal
On a positive note I was glad to hear that a local pet shop has lost their license to sell animals again, they'd only recently got it back as well. It will be a good day indeed when none of them sell animals IMO


----------



## MrRustyRead

B3rnie said:


> Then you should have tried a different rescue center  but no matter now as you have Maisey.
> 
> No one looks down on the animals because of where they come from, this is about the bad ethics of the majority of petshops.


I searched every rescue in my local area Bernie. If their would of been one I would of taken one. I was more shocked at the size of the cages in harrods! They were so tiny! And the puppies! They were charging £2,500 for!



simplysardonic said:


> Pet shops also seem to be notoriously bad at dispensing decent advice, so many people come on here with their shop bought small furries & they've bought unsuitable cages or are feeding an unsuitable diet, which makes it look like they've done no research before getting their animal
> On a positive note I was glad to hear that a local pet shop has lost their license to sell animals again, they'd only recently got it back as well. It will be a good day indeed when none of them sell animals IMO


Who do you ring to report them to virge, really wanna report the place I told you about today.


----------



## Guest

jimbo_28_02 said:


> I searched every rescue in my local area Bernie. If their would of been one I would of taken one. I was more shocked at the size of the cages in harrods! They were so tiny! And the puppies! They were charging £2,500 for!
> 
> Who do you ring to report them to virge, really wanna report the place I told you about today.


Many rescues rehome nationally and will organise a run to get the animal to you, I did tell you this over pm a while ago  But as I said it doesn't matter now as you have Maisey.

For reporting petshops you need to phone your local council as they control the licences for selling livestock.


----------



## simplysardonic

yep, as B3rnie says, report them to the council, I'll do it as well if you give me the details


----------



## MrRustyRead

Trust me, my next one will be a rescue.

I'll ring them tomorrow as the rabbits in there are pretty much lifeless they just lye there and don't move! It's terrible!


----------



## Snippet

Would you buy a puppy from a puppy mill? Because buying any animal from a pet shop is supporting the same ethics. The breeding animals are used untill they aren't capable of reproducing, then they are disposed of. The babies are sold to any idiot with enough money in their pocket at the time. There is a serious lack of information on any of the pets you can buy. Any responsible breeder would not put their animals in that situation because 1) they like to know their animals are well looked after and 2) Breeders require information on the health of their lines, which they can't get is those animals are sold with no way of knowing where they went.

The above it in no way directed at anyone that has posted on this thread. This is just the way I look at it



hayleypope said:


> so really you are spouting that people go to random places and buy animals under false pretences and breeders dont get me started interbreeding, i tell you once they got your money they really dont care yes they may take back the pet but yeah you want a refund you must be joking. i have seen it!


No. People need to research their breeder to ensure they agree with their ethics. For example, I wouldn't go to a breeder that took more then 2 litters from one rat.

In breeding is a tool, and it is not a bad thing when done correctly. In breeding will show you what genes are lurking about in your lines because it brings any recessive genes to the front. This will allow you to see the health of your lines within 1 or 2 generations. This is much better then allowing in to remain in the background and become to bred into a line that it is impossible to breed it out.

A good breeder will have a contract in place that states if you can't keep your pet for any reason then you must return it to them. I don't think you should expect a refund.


----------



## MrRustyRead

It is scary how you can get around them, I've seen it done many of times, how do they know for sure how many you have at home? You could say 1 but really it could be 30 or something stupid like that


----------



## Cassia

I've had furries from P&H before... including my two rattie girls Lillian & Maisey. My rats are the only animals I've bought from there myself and that was nearly two years ago. I won't be purchasing any more animals from there even though they are well looked after within P&H. I've come to learn that they probably don't get their animals from the right places and buy purchasing animals from P&H I might be funding unethical breeding. 

I want to eventually get Guinea pigs, I grew up with Guinea pigs and love them so much! They are awesome little animals with HUGE personalities!
I shall be purchasing mine from a reliable, ethical breeder... and would love it if people could point me in the right direction? breeder wise.


----------



## Guest

Cassia said:


> I've had furries from P&H before... including my two rattie girls Lillian & Maisey. My rats are the only animals I've bought from there myself and that was nearly two years ago. I won't be purchasing any more animals from there even though they are well looked after within P&H. I've come to learn that they probably don't get their animals from the right places and buy purchasing animals from P&H I might be funding unethical breeding.
> 
> I want to eventually get Guinea pigs, I grew up with Guinea pigs and love them so much! They are awesome little animals with HUGE personalities!
> I shall be purchasing mine from a reliable, ethical breeder... and would love it if people could point me in the right direction? breeder wise.


Go have a look on this forum Guinea Pigs - Rodents with Attitude Forums - Powered by vBulletin there are a few good breeders and many rescues on there, if there isn't one near you they can point you in the right direction


----------



## Cassia

B3rnie said:


> Go have a look on this forum Guinea Pigs - Rodents with Attitude Forums - Powered by vBulletin there are a few good breeders and many rescues on there, if there isn't one near you they can point you in the right direction


Thankyou very muchly B3rnie!  
xxx


----------



## swatton42

Personally I wouldn't buy from a pet shop, although i still can't resist looking in all the cages if i do go in a shop with livestock.

All my guinea pigs and the cat have come from rescue, i find it rewarding giving a animal a second chance at a happy home.


----------



## swatton42

Also meant to say i thought pet shops weren't allowed to stock dogs and cats unless they had a specialist license, as there is not enough space to house them suitably without affect their welfare.

I was taught this at college so is that wrong or am i just not remembering my facts correctly?


----------



## retepwaker

Yes and you can also get info from books ext


----------



## MrRustyRead

swatton42 said:


> Also meant to say i thought pet shops weren't allowed to stock dogs and cats unless they had a specialist license, as there is not enough space to house them suitably without affect their welfare.
> 
> I was taught this at college so is that wrong or am i just not remembering my facts correctly?


Only place I have seen puppies is harrods, never seen them in shops in the uk. A lot of USA ones do.


----------



## swatton42

Yea i know some countries do like the USA and New Zealand but i didn't think it was allowed here


----------



## lexiloo

A couple weeks ago I decided to go in a locally owned pet shop in my town because the people who work in my local chain pet shop are snobs. 

This was a big mistake. I could not believe that this shop is legally allowed to sell ANYTHING, let alone live animals. Their product selection was awful. Everything was covered with sawdust for some reason and just really unorganized. They had a very large selection in birds, but their conditions were absolutely awful. Ten times worse than any chain pet store I have every been in. Then I made the mistake of going to look at the small animal section. I was absolutely heartbroken. I can't even put into words how bad the conditions were. The rats, mice, degus, hamsters, and gerbils are all kept in ten gallon aquariums, which is the same for most pet stores. But there were at least 15 animals in each tank, some with probably up to 25 or 30. It was obvious that there were multiple litters in the same tank, of various ages. Some looked less than a week old, some were of breeding age. So there's no doubt going to be surprise litters there. There was also random cages just sitting on the floor that had chinchillas. Seeing the rats' conditions was especially heartbreaking for me, as I own three myself who are completely spoiled. There was also reptiles kept in comparable conditions.

Now, I know pet store conditions are not the best by any means. I have been in my fair share of Petsmarts, Petcos, and other chain stores. But compared to this store, the chains are perfect conditions. I am still absolutely disgusted with this pet store and I will never be going back. I am blown away that this store can even be allowed to sell live pets. Are there regulations for pet stores as far as the conditions for animals? I feel like there is no way this can be acceptable. It just makes me so mad that the owners claim to be pet lovers but are basically abusing hundreds of animals everyday.


----------



## MrRustyRead

When someone told me about harrods I thought they were joking, as I thought they weren't allowed to as well. But then I went in and saw them and was shocked


----------



## Guest

lexiloo said:


> A couple weeks ago I decided to go in a locally owned pet shop in my town because the people who work in my local chain pet shop are snobs.
> 
> This was a big mistake. I could not believe that this shop is legally allowed to sell ANYTHING, let alone live animals. Their product selection was awful. Everything was covered with sawdust for some reason and just really unorganized. They had a very large selection in birds, but their conditions were absolutely awful. Ten times worse than any chain pet store I have every been in. Then I made the mistake of going to look at the small animal section. I was absolutely heartbroken. I can't even put into words how bad the conditions were. The rats, mice, degus, hamsters, and gerbils are all kept in ten gallon aquariums, which is the same for most pet stores. But there were at least 15 animals in each tank, some with probably up to 25 or 30. It was obvious that there were multiple litters in the same tank, of various ages. Some looked less than a week old, some were of breeding age. So there's no doubt going to be surprise litters there. There was also random cages just sitting on the floor that had chinchillas. Seeing the rats' conditions was especially heartbreaking for me, as I own three myself who are completely spoiled. There was also reptiles kept in comparable conditions.
> 
> Now, I know pet store conditions are not the best by any means. I have been in my fair share of Petsmarts, Petcos, and other chain stores. But compared to this store, the chains are perfect conditions. I am still absolutely disgusted with this pet store and I will never be going back. I am blown away that this store can even be allowed to sell live pets. Are there regulations for pet stores as far as the conditions for animals? I feel like there is no way this can be acceptable. It just makes me so mad that the owners claim to be pet lovers but are basically abusing hundreds of animals everyday.


I would contact your local council to complain as that isn't right at all


----------



## hawksport

swatton42 said:


> Also meant to say i thought pet shops weren't allowed to stock dogs and cats unless they had a specialist license, as there is not enough space to house them suitably without affect their welfare.
> 
> I was taught this at college so is that wrong or am i just not remembering my facts correctly?


You are remembering wrong, the only extra conditions for puppies is
If they are kept longer than 5 days they should have somewhere to exercise.
A sales register has to be kept
Pupies from different litters shouldnt be mixed


----------



## swatton42

Ok. Thanks for clearing that up for me :thumbup1:


----------



## LostGirl

Please report pet shops who arent Looking after animals correctly this will cut down on the number of live stock selling ones 

We reported one who kept snakes the owner knew nothing, didnt know the diffence in the snakes, feeding was rubbish we got our make boa who was meant to be 2yrs old who couldnt feed, was the size of a 8-9month old one max and was just a very poorly bred snake he died after years of trying to get him to eat in a good pattern and he never really grew. They were cut down about 6months afteR

I have brought from pet shops 2 boys and 2 girl rats both the girls came from the same one and i must admit its like they have the requivilent to AHDH i swear they hardly sleep, constantly up and about and its like seeing a 2yr old on coffee and e numbers!

the boys i only got because I was scared of what would happen to them, one had a respiratory infection and was scarred from it. I knew not many people would be able to cope the treatmet e.t.c i didnt pay alot only £6 for both i think when the normal price is £8 each


----------



## hayleypope

you know i really do agree with some of the comments you say i got in argument with one of the cages wholesalers the other day as he was trying to say his small cages were fine for a canary and we are all entitled to our own opinion and it was like mate the poor things gotta spend most of its life in there so its unsuitable, and i also agree some petshops shouldnt have licences. Hamsters shouldnt be kept in tanks or glass vivariums its not good for them as condensation builds up causing probs like wet tail. i really wish guide lines were alot better and making small cages illegle to sell would be amazing. but not all bad breeders sell to pet shops our hamster lady has been in evry day to handle her babies and my friend breeds guineapigs in amzing conditions as she has massive runs and toys, tunnels galore. my rabbits are kept in six foot hutches. Environmental health is a joke the people governing the licenses dont even have to have an animal care certificate its disgusting but from a petshop personnal view i love my animals and if i dont think someone is suitable or hasnt thought seriously about the animal i will not let them purchase one; i am sad to say yes there are people who dont obviously care about their livestock but i do! i wish rules were tighter and standards higher but not all of us are bad


----------



## GerbilNik

DKDREAM said:


> It depends on the petshop you buy from, Some petshops (very few i agree) only get animals from responsible caring breeders.


I'm not sure what has been posted as I haven't read every single reply, but I disagree with this. I think if a breeder brings an animal into the world it is their own responsibility to either keep the offspring, or find suitable homes for their animals THEMSELVES. In my eyes no "responsible" breeder would give their animals to a pet shop knowing no homechecks are done and that they could end up with anyone and even used for breeding themselves by anyone. I know it's an easy option to "get rid" of excess or less than perfect animals.

Most of the time it's commercial breeders who supply the pet shops and I know at least from a Gerbil point of view that it appears that NONE of these bring up their Gerbils in the correct breeding environment. This results in abnormal stereotypical behaviours which are seen so often that many people see them as NORMAL behaviour!


----------



## MrRustyRead

This is why I couldn't be a breeder because my home checks would be so so strict that no one would be good enough ha


----------



## GerbilNik

Awww that's so sweet lol :thumbup1:


----------



## DKDREAM

GerbilNik said:


> I'm not sure what has been posted as I haven't read every single reply, but I disagree with this. I think if a breeder brings an animal into the world it is their own responsibility to either keep the offspring, or find suitable homes for their animals THEMSELVES. In my eyes no "responsible" breeder would give their animals to a pet shop knowing no homechecks are done and that they could end up with anyone and even used for breeding themselves by anyone. I know it's an easy option to "get rid" of excess or less than perfect animals.
> 
> Most of the time it's commercial breeders who supply the pet shops and I know at least from a Gerbil point of view that it appears that NONE of these bring up their Gerbils in the correct breeding environment. This results in abnormal stereotypical behaviours which are seen so often that many people see them as NORMAL behaviour!


I dont understand why you disagree as my local petshop does the above, I guess what I am trying to say is don't tar all petshops with the same brush. I did say very few, but some do exist.


----------



## GerbilNik

DKDREAM said:


> I dont understand why you disagree as my local petshop does the above, I guess what I am trying to say is don't tar all petshops with the same brush. I did say very few, but some do exist.


Sorry I'm not sure what you mean by "my local petshop does the above". Which part are you referring to ?


----------



## DKDREAM

GerbilNik said:


> Sorry I'm not sure what you mean by "my local petshop does the above". Which part are you referring to ?


they only source animals from caring breeders and they only stock few animals.


----------



## GerbilNik

DKDREAM said:


> they only source animals from caring breeders and they only stock few animals.


Right ok. Well the point I made above was that the breeders obviously aren't that caring because they allow the Pet Shop to sell the animals they have bred and no homechecks or follow-ups are done. Once they give/sell their offspring to the shops, they have no say or control over where they might end up.


----------



## DKDREAM

GerbilNik said:


> Right ok. Well the point I made above was that the breeders obviously aren't that caring because they allow the Pet Shop to sell the animals they have bred and no homechecks or follow-ups are done. Once they give/sell their offspring to the shops, they have no say or control over where they might end up.


but how do you know that the petshop doesn't ask questions? and where do you draw the line? unless you physically go to each home and vet them you really have no idea where the animal is or how it is kept, how do people know the said animal will always live in the home it was placed? the end of the day we are talking about a pet shop not the RSPCA here, such practice is never carried out via a petshop, but what I will say in favour of mine is they go and see animals they are going to buy babies from,how they are kept and everything.

and on that note we adopted Mia from the RSPCA they never ever came to see her/homecheck


----------



## GerbilNik

DKDREAM said:


> but how do you know that the petshop doesn't ask questions? and where do you draw the line? *unless you physically go to each home and vet them you really have no idea where the animal is or how it is kept, how do people know the said animal will always live in the home it was placed? * the end of the day we are talking about a pet shop not the RSPCA here, such practice is never carried out via a petshop, but what I will say in favour of mine is they go and see animals they are going to buy babies from,how they are kept and everything.
> 
> and on that note we adopted Mia from the RSPCA they never ever came to see her/homecheck


If you read my replies you will see that I didn't say anywhere that the petshop doesn't ask questions.

The part in bold is exactly the point I am making! That's why I said I don't feel it's responsible of a breeder to give their animals to a pet shop, which is what this thread is about - Petshops - what the RSPCA do in terms of homechecking isn't under discussion and doesn't mean its right either.


----------



## DKDREAM

GerbilNik said:


> If you read my replies you will see that I didn't say anywhere that the petshop doesn't ask questions.
> 
> The part in bold is exactly the point I am making! That's why I said I don't feel it's responsible of a breeder to give their animals to a pet shop, which is what this thread is about - Petshops - what the RSPCA do in terms of homechecking isn't under discussion and doesn't mean its right either.


well i know where i would rather buy animals from small pet shops who care as much as they can. rather that then support rodent farms. I just think what your saying is unrealistic, in an ideal world that would happen what you say but its just not like that. we will agree to disagree im done.


----------



## GerbilNik

DKDREAM said:


> well i know where i would rather buy animals from small pet shops who care as much as they can. rather that then support rodent farms. I just think what your saying is unrealistic, in an ideal world that would happen what you say but its just not like that. we will agree to disagree im done.


It's only unrealistic because you're taking my point out of context. I don't expect pet shops to do homechecks etc as I know it wont ever happen. My point is you were talking about responsible breeders which is the point I was addressing, saying that they aren't that responsible as they hand over their animals to petshops, who in turn do not homecheck, that was all - not how good small pet shops are in comparison to larger ones. I am aware that not all petshops are as bad as others but I still stand by the fact they are not good places to purchase animals from.


----------



## hayleypope

A good petshops will take the name and address of both breeder and customer, in case of any health issues also they should provide the correct information about the animals and importance of environmental stimulation,it is important people to not buy on a wimb but go away and think about the needs of the animal. You forums go on about the petshops and breeders being bad but people need to be educated and taught to respect animals when selling or rehomeing an animal in any sphere trust is put into the people homing the animal surely the petshops can only be a bad place if the right education is not given out. Information false on the internet can also be blamed misleading controversale information often wrong causing unessasary suffering when the problem could have been avoided.


----------



## GerbilNik

hayleypope said:


> A good petshops will take the name and address of both breeder and customer, in case of any health issues also they should provide the correct information about the animals and importance of environmental stimulation,it is important people to not buy on a wimb but go away and think about the needs of the animal. You forums go on about the petshops and breeders being bad but people need to be educated and taught to respect animals when selling or rehomeing an animal in any sphere trust is put into the people homing the animal surely the petshops can only be a bad place if the right education is not given out. Information false on the internet can also be blamed misleading controversale information often wrong causing unessasary suffering when the problem could have been avoided.


They might take the name of the breeder and customer but what good does that do? It's just to keep in with the law. I agree with you that it's very important that people don't buy on a whim, which is why i do not like petshops as they make it very easy to do just that and I'm sure a lot of ther sales are due to just that. Someone might go in for some supplies and come out with a rabbit or a hamster or any other animal of choice. They won't have thought about it but instead the "Awwwwww" factor would have won them over. This in turn means that these same animals are sold on, given away or handed into rescues for someone else to foot the bill and look after them.
Yes there is a lot of misleading information on the internet, which is why it's even more important for people to take the time and do their research before committing to buy. At the end of the day petshops make it far too easy for animals to be bought and in turn are partly respnsible for the amount of unwanted animals out there in the world today.


----------



## Guest

hayleypope said:


> A good petshops will take the name and address of both breeder and customer, in case of any health issues also they should provide the correct information about the animals and importance of environmental stimulation,it is important people to not buy on a wimb but go away and think about the needs of the animal. You forums go on about the petshops and breeders being bad but people need to be educated and taught to respect animals when selling or rehomeing an animal in any sphere trust is put into the people homing the animal surely the petshops can only be a bad place if the right education is not given out. Information false on the internet can also be blamed misleading controversale information often wrong causing unessasary suffering when the problem could have been avoided.


Your replies just make me laugh now :lol: Nothing you say will convince myself that petshops (ANY petshops) should sell livestock. I will repeat ANY breeder that sells to a petshop is NOT a responsible or ethical one so having the name of said unethical breeder is a pointless exercise


----------



## hayleypope

Very few sales in a petshops are on a wimb people go into a pet shop because they want a certain animal just like they do when going to a breeder or rescue centre your accusations and ideas are unjust.


----------



## Crittery

hayleypope said:


> Very few sales in a petshops are on a wimb people go into a pet shop because they want a certain animal


I'm afraid a lot of people buy animals on a whim, I've heard quite a few just on my visits in there to buy food and spoken to colleagues about it - a breeder or rescue requires a lot more forethought, planning and *should* require some kind of vetting procedure. Intentions also change, I've heard people go in to buy a hamster for instance and come out with degu...just a bit different there....!

To make a sale I've seen plenty of times petshop staff sell a "starter" cage to someone and saying 'oh you'll need to buy one when it is bigger' but I suspect a lot of people don't bother. Spend a little while trawling preloved or gumtree and you'll see the spontaneous pet shop purchases being sold a few months later in a cage 'that needs upgrading but I never had time to do it'.


----------



## MrRustyRead

i remember not to long back seeing this little pet shop and it said on a big sign, buy a hamster cage, get a free hamster! i thought that was completely out of order!


----------



## Guest

hayleypope said:


> Very few sales in a petshops are on a wimb people go into a pet shop because they want a certain animal just like they do when going to a breeder or rescue centre your accusations and ideas are unjust.


Utter rubbish


----------



## Grace_Lily

All I can add is my own personal experience of buying from pet shops has only ever been positive, unlike my experience of buying from a breeder.

An example, Smokey my rabbit was from notcutts and is the softest rabbit I've ever met. His temperament is second to none and he's a healthy boy. 

I bought Amber as a friend for Smokey from a supposedly reputable breeder. Amber has a neurological health problem and has a nervous disposition. 

I'm not naive enough to think my experience is the rule but I can only make judgements based on what I know.


----------



## Horse and Hound

I got my first ever guinea pigs from a Garden Centre. They lived for 9 years. My second lot of guineas was a rescue pair. They died after 3 years. My third lot of guineas is/was from the adoption bit in [email protected]. Their owner had returned them after their little girl had died... 

I've had them about 18 months. one died last week, Milo is still happy and munching away.

One of my dogs was bought from a breeder, the other is a rescue.

I also bought both my beardies from a "Pet Shop", owned by a man that has 30 years experience of owning every reptile under the sun. He started with 2 bearded dragons and went from there.

He breeds most of his stock on site. He also takes in rescues and works with the police when people are found illegaly smuggling in exotic pets. His animals are fantastic and he is ALWAYS at the end of the phone for advice and often pops in for a brew on his rounds delivering food.

The shop is tiny, isn't as well stocked or as fancy as some big chains, but I wouldn't go anywhere else for any of my pet equipment now to be fair. He sells it all, but the only livestock he sells are reptiles.


----------



## hayleypope

i am so angry today yet again a poor rabbit farmed from pets at home has died its gross neglegence they have vets on site this should not happen the second i have heard of in the last month when will people start not supporting these big chains if you going to use a pet shop use ones where the animals are sourced locally and people actually care:mad5:


----------



## Blue Moon

As a child, my siblings and I always had several pets at any given time.
My beloved mother, would bring home stray cats,dogs infact, any animal she saw needed help she brought them home. Fortunately I followed suit.

All the pets that we have had over the years has been from rescue centres, friends or strays, never a pet shop

I was 8 years old when I got my first pet, which was a gerbil and that was 40 years ago.

In my days we did not have the internet to research our pets before purchase, it was trail and error.

Your first port of call should always be the rescue centres as these animals throught no fault of their own have ended up at the centres due to neglect etc.
Please consider giving these universal creatures a second chance PLEASE.

Universal Blessings 

Blue Moon


----------



## Louiseandfriends

Okay, I've bought one animal from a pet shop. 
The rest of my animals come from recuse centres and charities.


----------



## vet-2-b

When I was little and me and my family didn't know better we got all are animals from this one pet shop they all died quite young 2 of cancer and 2 of strokes we just thought it was bad look but since getting older and learning more I havnt bought a an animal from a pet shop (except a hamster from [email protected] adoption bit) and have only got animals from breeders and rescues who have all been healther and happyer then the petshop animals which in opion is down to the animals breeding or care that is of a lack of in most petshop animals but in a ideal world all people would be aware of this and all animals would give proper care.


----------



## Waterlily

My cats are from petshop, infact so were some of my rats. I dont buy from certain ones only if I know the owner and this one I do, she only has the shop cos her hubby bought it so she wouldnt keep bringing pets home lol. All are cuddled and she never sells to parents with rowdy kids in her shop etc she tells them that ones on hold etc.


----------



## sammieanne111

After reading this long thread and everyone's mixed views I wanted to add my piece only because of a recent experience.... Me personally have always tried to look after rescue animals large or small I have had my fair share.
Just before Christmas a friend phoned to tell me that a lone baby rat was going to get put down at the end of the day to make room for another lot arriving!!

So if your anti pet shops which I am!! what do you do stick by your guns and ignore what your friend say or do you go to that pet shop and buy the lone baby Rat?

This happened to me and being a lover of all animals I went and got the Rat, 
I think that pet shops should not be allowed to sell animals but I am not sure If I could of slept that night knowing what I knew at the time.........

You might have issues with pet shops but these creatures did not ask to be born and stuck in a pet shop.
samx


----------



## simplysardonic

sammieanne111 said:


> After reading this long thread and everyone's mixed views I wanted to add my piece only because of a recent experience.... Me personally have always tried to look after rescue animals large or small I have had my fair share.
> Just before Christmas a friend phoned to tell me that a lone baby rat was going to get put down at the end of the day to make room for another lot arriving!!
> 
> So if your anti pet shops which I am!! what do you do stick by your guns and ignore what your friend say or do you go to that pet shop and buy the lone baby Rat?
> 
> This happened to me and being a lover of all animals I went and got the Rat,
> I think that pet shops should not be allowed to sell animals but I am not sure If I could of slept that night knowing what I knew at the time.........
> 
> You might have issues with pet shops but these creatures did not ask to be born and stuck in a pet shop.
> samx


I can see your point in that it is very upsetting to hear of things like that & very difficult not to want to help, but every time someone hands over money for a pet shop animal out of pity it has a knock on effect in that it makes that pet shop money, which in turn makes them order more animals from unethical breeders & rodent farms to make more money from. So even more animals suffer as a consequence. The more people who _don't_ buy from pet shops the better, as it will affect their profits & make them reconsider selling live animals. At the end of the day they are a business & supply will cease if the demand isn't there.


----------



## Waterlily

sammieanne111 said:


> After reading this long thread and everyone's mixed views I wanted to add my piece only because of a recent experience.... Me personally have always tried to look after rescue animals large or small I have had my fair share.
> Just before Christmas a friend phoned to tell me that a lone baby rat was going to get put down at the end of the day to make room for another lot arriving!!
> 
> So if your anti pet shops which I am!! what do you do stick by your guns and ignore what your friend say or do you go to that pet shop and buy the lone baby Rat?
> 
> This happened to me and being a lover of all animals I went and got the Rat,
> I think that pet shops should not be allowed to sell animals but I am not sure If I could of slept that night knowing what I knew at the time.........
> 
> You might have issues with pet shops but these creatures did not ask to be born and stuck in a pet shop.
> samx


But if you rescue that one baby, the next lot will have one left over as well and so on etc, I know of one store here I will never enter without a rifle, cos she puts all them in a bucket and finishes them if not sold, a friend of mines daughter did work there and was traumatised, but nothing can be done about it, without proof.


----------



## sammieanne111

Waterlily said:


> But if you rescue that one baby, the next lot will have one left over as well and so on etc, I know of one store here I will never enter without a rifle, cos she puts all them in a bucket and finishes them if not sold, a friend of mines daughter did work there and was traumatised, but nothing can be done about it, without proof.


It's a never-ending story really. I am totally against pet shops selling animals the shop I got the rat from was really horrible there were so many kittens, puppy's and every kind of small animal you can imagine all in awful conditions........


----------



## simplysardonic

sammieanne111 said:


> It's a never-ending story really. I am totally against pet shops selling animals the shop I got the rat from was really horrible there were so many kittens, puppy's and every kind of small animal you can imagine all in awful conditions........


If they're really bad report them to the local authority, they can revoke their license to sell animals


----------



## Obzocky

Hot topic eh!

I'm one of those awful individuals who will purchase from a pet shop where I *know* the animals are bred by the owners/staff, and done so in a manner I find acceptable. I also make a habit of not buying from shops where staff exhibit absolutely no passion for the animals they stock, i'm not expecting experts in every species, but at least an active interest in small furries, or a love for birds, obsession with fish, something, anything, other than some of the lack luster creatures who refuse to handle the poor creatures!

I remember some photos were taken by a rat breeder of a large commercial business that sold small furries to pet shops, and as appalling as those photos were it simply made me determined to find those few, far flung shops which were basically using the shop as a front for their hobby breeding. Perhaps not individuals who exhibit their animals, but ones who keep records, who care, the ones who are truly horrified whenever you dare insinuate that they keep their rats in the sort of systems found in large scale feeder breeders. As strange as it may seem I have been to shops where contracts similar to those drawn up in the rat fancy exist, and when faced with having to come back, show pictures of the cage (including measurements) and discuss how they intend to keep the rats (or any small furry...) many exit. True, they usually go to one of the plentiful first come, first serve shops, but people like that will always exist.

Anyway.

In recent years, as i've aged and realised i'm far more interested in companionship that show/breeding potential and found myself perfectly happy to cuddle up to the lumpy, bumpy, not-quite perfect rescue fuzzbum i've drifted away from breeders and pet shops all together. I'd rather go to a rescue/re-home privately than purchase them. I have no reason to do so and until I find myself unable to cope with the potential health problems of a rescue then that's the way it's going to be.

I'll never completely say "no, pet shops bad!" only ever "do your research, really investigate the shop, check out their animals". Even if they were banned from keeping animals you'd then have to consider the number of appalling breeders around who are just as, if not worse, than the pet shops. The pet shops simply buy in their small furries for profit. The bad breeders are the ones keeping their animals in such an appalling state.

Basically I take the same view of pet shops as I do with those who breed and sell privately. I do my research, I ask around, I ask if i'm able to see breeding facilities and ask questions. Rescues too. There are some *awful* people calling themselves rescues, people who mean well but find themselves unable to cope, people who seem to be using the term "rescue" to acquire free animals from which they can make a profit (and I mean profit given the lack of veterinary care).

Wherever an animal is from, it's important to question, background check and make sure you can view everywhere that is reasonable to ensure you are not having wool pulled over your eyes.


----------

