# advice needed on my young female already calling



## julie2508 (Sep 9, 2009)

Hi, I have kept ragdolls for a few years now and started to breed last year. I have 2 queens and the stud(who lives about 95% of the time in the house with us) and recently bought another girl to breed from. The problem is that she is calling already at just 4 months old. I know that she needs to be "fully grown" before breeding, but also to keep her calling for months on end would be bad for her. Any advice?
Thanks in advance,
Julie


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## Treaclesmum (Sep 26, 2011)

Surely she won't be calling for months on end?? She will go off heat and then come back on a few months later I would think


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## lisa306 (Oct 3, 2010)

Hi Julie, i have the same trouble as you, my boy comes in the house alot, but i've had to keep him out, just bring him in my bedroom at night 
Because my girl is now 7 months old, and just had her 3rd season, every 2 weeks...
The breeder i got her from, told me if she carries on like this, then breed her at 10 months, but only if she has grown to a good size.
There is something the vet can give, can't remember the name but my breeder did not recommend it because of the side affects.
Hopefully she may not have another for a few months.


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

Treaclesmum said:


> Surely she won't be calling for months on end?? She will go off heat and then come back on a few months later I would think


roughly every 3 weeks for a week ad infinitum


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

You may find that she doesn't call again for a while - 4 months is very young  Rosie started at 6 -7 months and I thought that was young  I was advised by her breeder to mate her on her fifth call or by the time she was a year old, whichever came first.
Treaclesmum cats come into call roughly once a month for about a week and sometimes sooner if not mated


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

You may find if the boys indoors that could be why, or are you sure that its a 'real' call? If she does keep calling its best to neuter her if its every 3weeks, heating aswell keeps them warm.

What lines are your boy/girl from?? what colours? do you have a website? :laugh:


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## julie2508 (Sep 9, 2009)

Thanks for all the advice so far. I've tried to link a photo of her to show how young she is. She's a seal tabby/lynx ragdoll. She is definately in full heat, crying out, walking with belly on floor and bottom up, rolling over and over, weeing everywhere and generally trying to throw herself at the boy. I will keep them apart and hope that there are long enough gaps between heats to allow her to grow up. Also as someone mentioned that drugs can be given to stop cats coming into heat, I've used it before on my other two girls and one has changed totally in her personality, like permanent pms. I wouldn't want to use it again and I know the vet wouldn't allow it for a young cat anyway. 
I have found that by stroking her over and over on my knee she does calm down for quite a while. 
Julie


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

She is pretty :001_wub:
Keeping her in a cool room might help as well as keeping your boy out of the way. I wouldn't give 'the pill' to a young maiden queen either.


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## MCWillow (Aug 26, 2011)

I know nothing about breeding, calling etc. just wanted to say what a beautiful girl, will be a shame if you end up having to neuter her - she is gorgeous.


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## lisa306 (Oct 3, 2010)

Arrr she is lovely, i like the lyxn markings.
I also wouldn't give any pills.


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## julie2508 (Sep 9, 2009)

thank you everyone. 
We got her at 13 weeks 7 weeks ago, so she is just 20 weeks old. She absolutely adores the boy cat and has spent the last weeks sleeping cuddled to him and chasing/playing with him. So she is also missing him.


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## jo-pop (May 27, 2011)

What does your breeder/mentor suggest? Do you have somebody who is advising you? I hope you find a good way forward. Breeding is a very complex thing isn't it.


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

she is stunning, what lines is she from?(I breed ragdolls to! I have a blue lynx stud boy, but I REALLY want to keep a seal lynx back as they are really different to the others a bit more naughty :laugh: :w00t: and I just love the colour/pattern  

Yes keep her away 100% and min age for mating has to be 10 months, But I do know of some breeders who have mated earlier due to queens calling so much, they never looked after the kittens and were hand reared as they didnt want to lose the lines and neuter the cats, but thats a different breed.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Cats can be very sneaky about mating when you don't want them to, if you have a stud pen I'd put the boy out there until she has finished calling. I agree that living with entire males in the house might also bring her into call more, and that warmth and light can as well.

Also, her breeder should be a good source of information - have you spoken to him or her?


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## colliemerles (Nov 2, 2007)

_wow, shes stunning, a very pretty girl.:001_tt1:,_


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## julie2508 (Sep 9, 2009)

We are at the moment making alterations to the outside pen so that she/ he can alternatly spend more time out there. Also despite having heating it is colder out there so that may help.
I will reply about her breeding lines when I get a chance to look at her papers.
thanks again
Julie


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## tellingtails (Jul 28, 2010)

Hi Julie,

I totally sympathise with you, having a queen in heat is difficult at the best of times, but combine that with a Queen who is way to young to breed, and you have a bit of a nightmare, There are some that may be reading the breeding section who have never had an un-neutered Cat or never breed and wonder what all the fuss is about. So thought I would write a small note to explain to those that might not breed or do not have an un-neutered Queen, so have not experienced a Queen in call.

Cats are referred to as Polyestrus, which means that they naturally come in and out of heat/season periodically throughout the year. These heat/seasons may start as early as the fourth or fifth month of a kitten's life, they can potentially continue until the Queen is either bred or spayed. Heat/seasons in cats can last anything from several days to two weeks or in some cases even longer, they can also repeat every two to three weeks. So to some owners it can seem that their Queen may always be in heat.

No one can say with any accuracy that heat cycles are painful to cats, however from the constant calling and other symptoms they exhibit, it would appear that they are very uncomfortable.

However regardless whether they feel pain or they do not,it can be very detrimental to the Queens well being and health to allow her to be constanty in Season.

Believe me when I say a Cat in Call is not for the faint hearted they can seriously try the patience of a saint, when breeders say they have become vocal it is often a vast understatement. This vocalisation can be extremely loud it is designed for her to attract a mate and it is said to be able to be heard by a mate over 5 Miles away. This constant yowling and meowing can be relentless day and night.Other symptoms of call can also include,

The Queen licking her vulval area more than usual, making it inflamed and swollen.

The Queen can also be restless and may pace back and forth constanly, roll constantly around on the floor or furniture.

The Queen may have a loss of appetite or refuse to eat, this loss in appetite often leads to a general decline in the Queens overall condition.

Many owners become increasingly stressed with repeated escape attempts, with Queens scratching at doors, windows and carpets in an attempt to get outdoors. Queens bolting for open doors, Not to mention owners overwhelmed by the over affectionation of their queen constantly rubbing up against them.

In addition to all this it can potentially be extremely dangerous and potentially fatal to allow a Queen to constantly come in and out of season without being mated or spayed.

Pyometra is a disease mainly associated with middle-aged female cats that have not been spayed.However it can happen in Cats at any age.But the older a Cat gets the higher the risk is.Pyometra is a hormonal abnormality, and a secondary bacterial infection may or may not be present. Pyometra follows a heat cycle in which fertilization does not occur.

The two main hormones produced by the ovaries are estrogen and progestrogen. An excessive quantity of progesterone, or the uterus becoming oversensitive to it, causes Pyometra, Cysts form in the lining of the uterus. At this point, the condition is called endometrial hyperplasia, and believe it or not the cat can show signs of disease. Typically, within two to four months after the cycle, the female starts showing signs of the disease and takes owners by surprise.

As these cysts containing numerous secretory cells grow, large quantities of fluids are produced and released into the interior of the uterus. Bacteria commonly colonize the uterus by entering through the cervix. This produces an even greater response by the body, as it showers additional fluid and white blood cells into the affected organ. The condition is then called Pyometra.

PYO = meaning Pus /Infection METRA = meaning Womb/Uterus

Because of this Breeders are constantly torn between doing right for their Queen, they have to allow their Queen to come to an adequate age for breeding, and as you can see from Julie&#8217;s Queen who has come into season early this can be a great concern. In addition to this breeders like myself also have to allow our Queens adequate rest and recovery time between litters,
The alternatives are obviously spaying for the Pet owner, however not an option for someone who is intending to breed from their Queen, so the majority of breeders closely monitor calls and dates to minimise the risk to their Queens.

The Question of contraception has also been raised, there is contraception for Cats the main one used is Depo-Provera which is a registered trademark. Its key component is : Medroxyprogesterone Acetate which is a synthetic progesterone, it is commonly used by us as a form of birth control, but may also be used in Pets when prescribed by a Vet to supress heat cycles.

Progesterone is a sex hormone found naturally in Pets. At high doses synthetic progesterone can prevent the ovaries from producing eggs and also prevents the Cat coming into heat. However the effects can take several months to go back to normal, which again is not beneficial to the Cat or the Breeder. And with any medication there is also a secondary risk of side effects related to any medication.

So anyone who has no intention of breeding their Queen, spay her it really is for the best, Which is why most breeders retire their Queens very young and spay straight away before rehoming retired Queens.


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## Shrap (Nov 22, 2010)

tellingtails said:


> Hi Julie,
> 
> I totally sympathise with you, having a queen in heat is difficult at the best of times, but combine that with a Queen who is way to young to breed, and you have a bit of a nightmare, There are some that may be reading the breeding section who have never had an un-neutered Cat or never breed and wonder what all the fuss is about. So thought I would write a small note to explain to those that might not breed or do not have an un-neutered Queen, so have not experienced a Queen in call.
> 
> ...


Great post!


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## Catmaverick (Feb 26, 2012)

Hello,

How is Depo-Provera, or Medroxyprogesterone Acetate administered to cats to supress heat cycles? Thanks!

~Louise

The Question of contraception has also been raised, there is contraception for Cats the main one used is Depo-Provera which is a registered trademark. Its key component is : Medroxyprogesterone Acetate which is a synthetic progesterone, it is commonly used by us as a form of birth control, but may also be used in Pets when prescribed by a Vet to supress heat cycles.


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

I use Ovarid when necessary and have never had a problem with it but I know plenty of breeders who are dead set against it. It comes in tablet form and the dosage stated by the manufacturers is way too high for most cats. I *think* they suggest a full 5mg tablet every 3 weeks. I give a quarter of a tablet as soon as a cat shows the first signs of coming into call. This knocks many cats off call within 24 hours but if not then I'd give another quarter tablet.

This regime works for up to six weeks in my cats and I wouldn't give another dose until the queen showed signs of coming into call again. I find it a brilliant solution for keeping cats who call almost continually in decent condition but I only use it on those who need it. Like many I was wary of it and am still very circumspect in my use of it which could be why I haven't had a problem with it. I still wouldn't use it on a maiden queen.

There is the option of an injectable contraceptive for cats. I wouldn't go down this route as I'd have no control over dosage.


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## Ingrid25 (Oct 1, 2011)

whats your name and do you have a website? i would love to have a look at it!


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