# one of my relatives just brought a Dogo Argentino!!!



## harmeetjohal

I am a little upset to find out that one of my relatives has just brought a Dogo Argentino pup, not cause i view them as a danger, but cause they are illgal...
does anyone know why this breed is banned also the Tosa?


----------



## Nicky09

Dogo's are a very hard breed to keep very powerful with very strong protective instincts and can be aggressive in the wrong hands. They really need a very experienced firm owner not cruel but they can't be allowed to get away with any bad behaviour. I'd assume this is why they're banned. Tosas I don't know why they were banned because as far as I know they were bred to be wrestlers not fighters and dog aggression was actively discouraged I could be wrong though.


----------



## cassie01

to behonest i think its the same as the pit bull, the dogs were misused by idiots and then banned. gets me really angry, doesnt take long to breed in/out any traits so its not as if any problems with the breed cant be sorted out, its just because a few stupid humans think its clever to breed them badly and then misuse them, spoils it for the rest of us!!!
i bet it will be a really nice dog too.


----------



## Natik

harmeetjohal said:


> I am a little upset to find out that one of my relatives has just brought a Dogo Argentino pup, not cause i view them as a danger, but cause they are illgal...
> does anyone know why this breed is banned also the Tosa?


because this type of dog is classed as danger to the public under the DDA


----------



## harmeetjohal

im sure i had read that the Dogo Argentino and tosa werent even in the UK when they were banned....
ppl miss use staffs, rotti, and DDB and they not banned... its sad how ppl can spoil a breed


----------



## RowanWolf

It makes me quite angry.
So many staffies around at the moment because they are the in thing for young people to have to try and fight other people. What the f**k.
I had words with one staff owner the other week in a park.


----------



## Nicky09

I think it was the Dogo and Filia that weren't in the country. In the right hands I sure these are great dogs but even people that love the breed say they're not easy to own. I would love a pitbull though stupid NZ has the same rules as the UK I've just have to content myself with a staffie instead.


----------



## james1

harmeetjohal said:


> I am a little upset to find out that one of my relatives has just brought a Dogo Argentino pup, not cause i view them as a danger, but cause they are illgal...
> does anyone know why this breed is banned also the Tosa?


how can you be sure its a dogo? have you got any pics?


----------



## Guest

harmeetjohal said:


> im sure i had read that the Dogo Argentino and tosa werent even in the UK when they were banned....
> ppl miss use staffs, rotti, and DDB and they not banned... its sad how ppl can spoil a breed


i read that they were not even in the country when the DDA was made


----------



## harmeetjohal

pic's as attached....


----------



## harmeetjohal

thats a pic of the dad and the pups....


----------



## Nicky09

Certainly does look like a Dogo. Handsome boy and the puppies are adorable.


----------



## RowanWolf

I didn't recognize the name but I recognize the photos!
As any breed, especially so called 'more dangerous or danger dogs' they need the right experienced hand. I bet they can be big sops


----------



## cassie01

awwwwww. how cute are are they, they look like softies to me. id have one!!! 

also you are allowed to keep them in this country provided the authorities know, you get a licence and they are kept onlead and muzzled in public. unless they have changed this and no one told me!


----------



## Guest

I'm going to put my neck out here and say that it probably isn't a Dogo, I don't think it is I'd say it's more than likely a Scott or Hines bred American Bulldog.


----------



## kayz

They are really cute!!

But if they are illegal isn't your relative worried about someone who knows their dogs and reporting him?


----------



## harmeetjohal

would you guys ever own a banned breed


----------



## kayz

This is a pic I have googled. Certainly look the same breed.


----------



## RowanWolf

I would if I was saving it yes. In the right circumstances, if I knew I could give it what it needed I'd own a banned breed.


----------



## kayz

harmeetjohal said:


> would you guys ever own a banned breed


I'm not sure. I have read stories of banned dogs being taken away and PTS by wardens despite the owners having a licence. Wouldn't want to risk it.


----------



## LostGirl

gorgeous dogs 

were they advertised as dogo's?


----------



## Nicky09

I wouldn't because I couldn't bear the thought of my beloved pet being taken away and euthanised purely because of something it can't control. Given the choice though I would take a pitbull in a heartbeat or maybe a tosa with more research into the breed of course if they weren't illegal.


----------



## cassie01

harmeetjohal said:


> would you guys ever own a banned breed


id own anything that turned up. i find that most pets i heve just kind of happen so yes if i had the opertunity i would, id never turn anything away and i dont believe for one minuite any of these dogs should have been banned. just the dipsh*ts that have ruined them.


----------



## Guest

White American Bulldogs can look pretty much the same









I'm trying to find better photo's.

I'd also like to know why the dogs ears are being held like that in the first pic?


----------



## Guest

It looks like an American Bulldog to me or An American bulldog cross. There are lots of them and their crosses in my area


----------



## harmeetjohal

think he brought it of Pizco i think....


----------



## Nicky09

Could be an American Bulldog I blame Homeward Bound but I've wanted one of those since I was a kid.
Probably a stupid question but say you had a staffie pure bred KC papers and everything and the police seized it as a pitbull could you use those papers to get it off? Or would it not matter.


----------



## Acacia86

Nicci said:


> White American Bulldogs can look pretty much the same
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm trying to find better photo's.
> 
> I'd also like to know why the dogs ears are being held like that in the first pic?


I thought the same! I have a couple of pics:


----------



## Guest

harmeetjohal said:


> think he brought it of Pizco i think....


I'm laying my life on the line and telling you it more than likely isn't a dogo, it is more than likely a white performance bred (Hines, Scott, Painter) American Bulldog.


----------



## Acacia86

Nicci said:


> I'm laying my life on the line and telling you it more than likely isn't a dogo, it is more than likely a white performance bred (Hines, Scott, Painter) American Bulldog.


I agree. I would say A.Bulldog, too!


----------



## Natik

i would never own a banned breed because if the dog is going to be exposed its going to be pts and i would be risking being sentenced in some way too.... not fair on the dog at all....


----------



## Guest

Those puppies I'm afraid to say do look like American Bulldogs, Dogo's are white, they don't come in any other colour.


----------



## harmeetjohal

Wikipedia says they could normally white (sometimes spotted)


----------



## Acacia86

COAT: Completely white. Any spot of color should be disqualified as an atavistic characteristic. The small spots on the head are not cause for disqualification, but among two similar animals, the completely white one is preferable. In contrast, any spot on the body is cause for disqualification.



DISQUALIFYING FACTORS: Bluish-grey eyes, Unilateral or Bilateral Deafness, spots on the body, long hair, white nose or very spotted with white, prognatism (whether overshot or undershot), very pendulous mouth, a greyhound head, bitches less that 23.5 inches tall, dogs less than 24.5 inches tall, more than one spot on the face, any physical disproportion. The aberrant toe (Dewclaw) loses points, but does not disqualify the animal.

This is part of the breed standard (Dogo Argentino club of America)

I am afraid to say that he is 99.9% likely to be An American Bulldog. Or a cross.

Still stunning though! 
xx


----------



## Nonnie

Nicci said:


> I'd also like to know why the dogs ears are being held like that in the first pic?


Maybe its because they are traditionally cropped, and he's trying to make it appear more dogo like. Maybe the owners just a bit odd.

Gorgeous dogs, but like many have stated, i doubt they are dogo's. They certainly arent a breed that most people would recognise, as everyone seems to concentrate on the pitbull.

If i was owning one, id tell people they were an American Bulldog. Would be silly to boast and promote that you were owning a potentially illegal breed.

If it IS a dogo, wish your friend luck, someone i know (not in the UK) has them and says they arent a pet breed. He uses his for hunting.


----------



## Johnderondon

Looks like a Am. Bull to me.

Dogos were included in the banned list because their low numbers made them a politically safe breed to ban.



Nicky09 said:


> Probably a stupid question but say you had a staffie pure bred KC papers and everything and the police seized it as a pitbull could you use those papers to get it off? Or would it not matter.


Wouldn't matter. The dog is 'type' or not depending on whether it shares substantial number of characterisitics with an out of date breed standard from the American Breeders Assoc. Parentage is not relevent.


----------



## harmeetjohal

so you guys are guessing its an AM Bully... thats intresting..... i will speak to him.... im sure he will be happy...lol


----------



## Nonnie

Johnderondon said:


> Looks like a Am. Bull to me.
> 
> Dogos were included in the banned list because their low numbers made them a politically safe breed to ban.
> 
> Wouldn't matter. The dog is 'type' or not depending on whether it shares substantial number of characterisitics with an out of date breed standard from the American Breeders Assoc. Parentage is not relevent.


Are you sure about that? As far as im aware, if you can prove your dog is NOT a pitbull, and is infact a SBT, a legal breed, then the police can't seize the dog, unless it was a danger/aggressive.

What has the American Breeders Assoc got to do with anything?


----------



## Guest

harmeetjohal said:


> so you guys are guessing its an AM Bully... thats intresting..... i will speak to him.... im sure he will be happy...lol


Yes, I'd lay money on the fact the dog is a White performance type American Bulldog, my American Bulldogs Dam looked very identical to the dog you have posted photos of, she was white (although my AB wasn't she did however look a lot like the dog in the photo in the face, very similar build too).

My husband knows nothing much about dogs unless you show him Lurchers and even he's just said the dog is a White American Bull.


----------



## Guest

Nonnie said:


> What has the American Breeders Assoc got to do with anything?


I don't think you read the post correctly,
The dog is 'type' or not depending on whether it shares substantial number of characterisitics with an out of date breed standard from the American Breeders Assoc.

So implying the American Breeders Assoc had written the standard.


----------



## Nonnie

sallyanne said:


> I don't think you read the post correctly,
> The dog is 'type' or not depending on whether it shares substantial number of characterisitics with an out of date breed standard from the American Breeders Assoc.
> 
> So implying the American Breeders Assoc had written the standard.


The breed standard for the pitbull?

Surely though a KC registered SBT cannot be seized merely for sharing characteristics? Otherwise they'd all be at risk.

I may be being a retard here, its been a long day.


----------



## harmeetjohal

the breeder traveled all the way from Ireland to london....


----------



## Snoringbear

The puppies are definitely Am Bull. There's something about the dog that's off for a Dogo, can't put my finger on it though. Maybe it's the structure of the head and length of muzzle. 

The ears are probably held as they are usually cropped in countries they are legal in. They have been used for pit fighting but bred as a much smaller version to the regular hunting one.


----------



## Guest

Nonnie said:


> The breed standard for the pitbull?
> 
> Surely though a KC registered SBT cannot be seized merely for sharing characteristics? Otherwise they'd all be at risk.
> 
> I may be being a retard here, its been a long day.


I think that was what was been referred to and KC reg Staffords have been caught up in this poor legislation before.


----------



## Nicky09

It doesn't really matter your relative gets a great dog in an am bull without the legal issues of owning a Dogo. Besides they're so handsome.
I thought a KC reg SBT wouldn't be destroyed but you never know. I know there have been a lot of perfectly legal SBTs destroyed before sadly.


----------



## Guest

Snoringbear said:


> The puppies are definitely Am Bull. There's something about the dog that's off for a Dogo, can't put my finger on it though. Maybe it's the structure of the head and length of muzzle.
> 
> The ears are probably held as they are usually cropped in countries they are legal in. They have been used for pit fighting but bred as a much smaller version to the regular hunting one.


Hit it there, the muzzle is too broad almost appearing 'snoutish' on one of the pics shape of head isn't right it all screams definately AmBull. My own dogs Dam was near identical to the dog in the photo pure white Am Bull, lovely she was too


----------



## harmeetjohal

Google Image Result for http://breederinfocenter.com/images2/20070508200623_150642_1.gif

this dogo also has a patch....


----------



## Nonnie

sallyanne said:


> I think that was what was been referred to and KC reg Staffords have been caught up in this poor legislation before.


Well thats just stupid.

The DDA has far too many holes in it. Pity that new report/law/whatever it was didnt even see the light of day.


----------



## Guest

The breed is predominantly white, those puppies have patches on their backs, they are American Bulldog pups, I've seen loads and I'm definately not mistaken.


----------



## Guest

Nonnie said:


> Well thats just stupid.
> 
> The DDA has far too many holes in it. Pity that new report/law/whatever it was didnt even see the light of day.


I think it has possibly been the worse piece of legislation ever passed.


----------



## Nicky09

Yes and then there's the idiots that still honestly believe it is the best thing ever and keeping people safe from dog attacks. Even when they haven't gone down since it was brought in.


----------



## Nonnie

Nicky09 said:


> Yes and then there's the idiots that still honestly believe it is the best thing ever and keeping people safe from dog attacks. Even when they haven't gone down since it was brought in.


Isnt there more pitbull types around now, than there was before the ban?

Yes, a wonderfully fantastic piece of legislation


----------



## Nicky09

Probably or maybe they're getting stricter about what is a "Pitbull" just a fantastic law where great dane mixes are seized as pits....


----------



## Acacia86

harmeetjohal said:


> Google Image Result for http://breederinfocenter.com/images2/20070508200623_150642_1.gif
> 
> this dogo also has a patch....


He has a patch on his face. That is allowed in the breed standard but a pure white would get chosen out of the 2 if them.


----------



## Guest

Nonnie said:


> Isnt there more pitbull types around now, than there was before the ban?
> 
> Yes, a wonderfully fantastic piece of legislation


They have never gone away,there are probably more now than before the ban,unless people just tend to notice them more nowadays - I don't know.


----------



## davehyde

in the dda there is a provision for any dog over a certain size to be classed as dangerous. this would include golden retrievers, labs, gsd's etc.

if i can find it again i will post it up.

local councils have immense powers under the act but they dont seem to understand or comprehend the rules at all and many mistakes will be made if they try to use them.

re the apbt. they used the akc standard as they were the ruling body on pits at the time.

re staffs: a dog can be siezed IF it appears to resemble and has some of the characteristics of................
pretty unfair and stupid.

tosas were bred to fight silently, different from non aggression, if a tosa made a noise it was disqualified. i'd put a tosa against any other dog and it would probably win. not that i do or condone, just an opinion.

while i mostly agree it is the deed not the breed, some dog breeds have no business being pets at all. they were and are bred to be so guarding and aggressive they are a strictly working dog imho.

as handsome as they are they are to be given a large dose of respect and fear.


----------



## Guest

davehyde said:


> while i mostly agree it is the deed not the breed, some dog breeds have no business being pets at all. they were and are bred to be so guarding and aggressive they are a strictly working dog imho.
> 
> as handsome as they are they are to be given a large dose of respect and fear.


Which breeds are you referring to ?


----------



## Acacia86

sallyanne said:


> Which breeds are you referring to ?


Thats what i was thinking 

That statement is quite harsh. I would assume a Doberman is in your 'list' deemed not to be suitable? As they were purposely breed to guard.

But my friend had one 'Chester' and i will tell you now i have never seen a nicer, all round family dog. The biggest softie you could imagine. So i would love you to try and tell her that he ''shouldn't be owned''

And if you include GSD's you'd be half wrong.........they were bred for herding purposes.

And Staffies??? Again wrong. In the wrong hands they were made to be fighting dogs. But the still continue to top the ''best family dogs'' charts. They are great family dogs, very loving, patient, great with children etc


----------



## RowanWolf

I do not believe there is any breed that cannot be a pet, it just takes the correct, experienced person to bring it up.


----------



## Acacia86

RowanWolf said:


> I do not believe there is any breed that cannot be a pet, it just takes the correct, experienced person to bring it up.


Exactly. Understanding, training, knowledge and plenty patientce and any dog of any breed could be an amazing addition to a household.


----------



## davehyde

will get back to ya on that i have a file on disc somewhere.
but there are a couple of breeds that are so not recommended as pets.

not talking dobies and rotts and stuff. i cant remember the breeds off the top of my head but i remember coming across it a year or so ago.

i had to back up all my lappy hence it is on a disc somewhere.

they were a moloser type dog if i remember rightly. very territorial and very high guarding instinct. 

typically woulndt even allow a person to approach. scared the be jesus outa me and i never ever seen or heard of them lol.


----------



## Nicky09

I would be inclined to agree with Dave actually I think there are some that either need a really experienced specalist handler and a lot of work or should not be in a pet home.


----------



## davehyde

btw ya'll love to jump down peoples throats dont ya.

i do actually have a bit of dog experience and am not known for making rash statements.

i like all dogs that doesnt mean to say that all dogs are nice.

ya'll need to lighten up and realise there are many breeds out there you do not know.

i research things i am interested, and not just dogs, and some of the things i find are quite interesting. i wont bother sharing anymore.


----------



## RowanWolf

It is the experienced person that is key, any breed can be a pet. Maybe not a pet for anyone and everyone, but still a pet in the right hands.


----------



## Nicky09

Yes but your average pet home some breeds would be a disaster.


----------



## Guest

davehyde said:


> btw ya'll love to jump down peoples throats dont ya.


I wasn't just curious as to which breeds you were referring to 

It's amazing how many people actually slate breeds without knowing anything about them.


----------



## davehyde

ok english grammar.

where in the statement "some dog breeds are so not recommended as pets"

am i slating any dog?

if i said a ford escort is so not recommended for formula 1 you'd agree.

same difference.


----------



## Acacia86

davehyde said:


> in the dda there is a provision for any dog over a certain size to be classed as dangerous. this would include golden retrievers, labs, gsd's etc.
> 
> if i can find it again i will post it up.
> 
> local councils have immense powers under the act but they dont seem to understand or comprehend the rules at all and many mistakes will be made if they try to use them.
> 
> re the apbt. they used the akc standard as they were the ruling body on pits at the time.
> 
> re staffs: a dog can be siezed IF it appears to resemble and has some of the characteristics of................
> pretty unfair and stupid.
> 
> tosas were bred to fight silently, different from non aggression, if a tosa made a noise it was disqualified. i'd put a tosa against any other dog and it would probably win. not that i do or condone, just an opinion.
> 
> while i mostly agree it is the deed not the breed, some dog breeds have no business being pets at all. they were and are bred to be so guarding and aggressive they are a strictly working dog imho.
> 
> as handsome as they are they are to be given a large dose of respect and fear.


That pretty much did it! Not word for word but taken in the same context.


----------



## Guest

davehyde said:


> ok english grammar.
> 
> where in the statement "some dog breeds are so not recommended as pets"
> 
> am i slating any dog?
> 
> if i said a ford escort is so not recommended for formula 1 you'd agree.
> 
> same difference.


LOL,
I didn't aim that at anyone or you,

I said "It's amazing how many people actually slate breeds without knowing anything about them" it wasn't aimed at anyone,I have enough experience owning the breed I do, to know that people often slate breeds they have no knowledge or experience of :001_tt2: :smilewinkgrin:


----------



## davehyde

Acacia86 said:


> That pretty much did it! Not word for word but taken in the same context.


not at all, you took 1 half of a sentence out of a whole qualifying paragraph.

the sentence was rationalised by what came after it.

geez gordon brown aint got spin docotrs like you lot lol.


----------



## Guest

Davehyde, I have a feeling you could probably be refering to the Bully Kutta?

http://www.bullykutta.com/


----------



## davehyde

that rings a bell, i think it was one of the afghan/ kurdish dogs they use for use for fighting too.

to be sure i'll have to dig that disc out but i have 4ooo to look through.

i never label the things lol.


----------



## Guest

davehyde said:


> that rings a bell, i think it was one of the afghan/ kurdish dogs they use for use for fighting too.
> 
> to be sure i'll have to dig that disc out but i have 4ooo to look through.
> 
> i never label the things lol.


The Kutta isn't a pet dog, I think I know which dogs you are refering to but I put Kabul (which is the place these dogs are fought in Afghanistan).

I'll get some information in a moment.


----------



## MissG

Regardless of what breed this dog is, it's quite clearly being bred for the wrong reasons and it's in the wrong hands.

Would anyone else on here put your dogs ears so they looked cropped? I am guessing no. The reason it's done is to make the dog look more aggressive.... Why would anyone in the right mind want that from a dog who could potentially be an illegal breed?


----------



## Acacia86

davehyde said:


> not at all, you took 1 half of a sentence out of a whole qualifying paragraph.
> 
> the sentence was rationalised by what came after it.
> 
> geez gordon brown aint got spin docotrs like you lot lol.


I did read the whole post. And i took it all in. But you stated about the fact that some dogs were bred to guard and be aggressive. And siad they had n o business being pets. Now, there have been many breeds for this!! As i have already put the Doberman being one! Louis Dobermann created this breed for this purpose, so while you may not have actually meant this breed, this was how it was taken.
I do not 'jump' down peoples throats. I reply to what i see..............


----------



## sequeena

Nicci said:


> Davehyde, I have a feeling you could probably be refering to the Bully Kutta?
> 
> Bullykutta.com


That is one massive dog


----------



## Guest

sequeena said:


> That is one massive dog


Wouldn't want one in my house tho!  Nice looking animals, but not pets.


----------



## davehyde

a gull dong was another one i think, not to be trusted.

also a cordoba fighting dog,but i think these are no now more. good job too.

alunga mastiff and indian mastiff are more aggressive than the bully katta apparently.


----------



## Acacia86

sequeena said:


> That is one massive dog


I thought so too, but i then googled it in images and it doesn't seem as big as some breeds  in some it certainly doesn't look 32+ inches!


----------



## sequeena

Nicci said:


> Wouldn't want one in my house tho!  Nice looking animals, but not pets.


http://webzoom.freewebs.com/bullykutta/che1.jpg

:yikes:


----------



## sequeena

Acacia86 said:


> I thought so too, but i then googled it in images and it doesn't seem as big as some breeds  in some it certainly doesn't look 32+ inches!


Take a look at the link I just posted, a dog that has a lead/rope that thick must be huge :yikes:


----------



## Guest

sequeena said:


> http://webzoom.freewebs.com/bullykutta/che1.jpg
> 
> :yikes:





Acacia86 said:


> I thought so too, but i then googled it in images and it doesn't seem as big as some breeds  in some it certainly doesn't look 32+ inches!


They are massive dogs, the guy in the link you posted Sequeena actually attends shows ever so occasionally with his dogs and has been photographed with them at shows many times, few years back there were disputes that his dogs were not Kutta's but it is common knowledge now, as he has a few of them and they are the real deal


----------



## sequeena

Nicci said:


> They are massive dogs, the guy in the link you posted Sequeena actually attends shows ever so occasionally with his dogs and has been photographed with them at shows many times, few years back there were disputes that his dogs were not Kutta's but it is common knowledge now, as he has a few of them and they are the real deal


Very big dogs, not for the faint hearted!

Bet he has some big muscles lol!


----------



## RowanWolf

He is a beauty!


----------



## davehyde

omg what size.hmy:


----------



## Guest

sequeena said:


> Very big dogs, not for the faint hearted!
> 
> Bet he has some big muscles lol!


LOL I think we would all have handling dogs like that on an everyday basis


----------



## Acacia86

Ooooh should i add to my list of ''my next dog'' 

I have been looking for giant breed for a while  seems he fits the bill......................lol!!!!


----------



## Johnderondon

Nonnie said:


> Are you sure about that? As far as im aware, if you can prove your dog is NOT a pitbull, and is infact a SBT, a legal breed, then the police can't seize the dog, unless it was a danger/aggressive.


No, I'm afraid not. Sallyanne's got it right. The law doesn't prohibit pit bulls, it prohibits pit bull 'types'. That word 'type' is crucial. It means that a dog doesn't need to have any pit bull in it at all, it only needs to be physically similar to be considered 'type'.



> What has the American Breeders Assoc got to do with anything?


When the first case came before the court in the UK the judge pointed out that, if type is to be determined, there must be a standard to refer to. The KC didn't have a standard because the pit bull is not recognised in the UK as a breed. So the court sent off to the American Breeders Association and obtained their 1988 breed standard for the American Pit Bull Terrier. That standard has since been revised but the UK courts still use the '88 one.



Nonnie said:


> Isnt there more pitbull types around now, than there was before the ban?


There are more prosecutions at the moment but that's not the same thing. It is difficult to be definitive about numbers but the RSPCA estimates that there are more 'type' dogs today than in '91.



davehyde said:


> re the apbt. they used the akc standard as they were the ruling body on pits at the time.


No. They use the American Breeders Association's standard because the American Pit Bull Terrier is not recognised by the AKC either.


----------



## davehyde

the akc i believe calls it the american staffordshire terrier.
the same dog cam be registered with both the bodies as a pb and an amstaff i think.

i dunno why they do that tho.

yeah i got it wrong re the akc i couldnt remember the other name off my head.


----------



## james1

In my eyes that is no way an American Bull or a long legged staff, there's so many obvious facial characteristics between them.
Without doubt to me its a Dogo but having never ever ever seen one i dont think any of us can say for sure....... there are one or two Americans that wander on here every now and again.
Where did they pic it up from? - What part of the country, and why would they buy something that is so obviously suspect?


----------



## Ty-bo

james1 said:


> In my eyes that is no way an American Bull or a long legged staff, there's so many obvious facial characteristics between them.
> Without doubt to me its a Dogo but having never ever ever seen one i dont think any of us can say for sure....... there are one or two Americans that wander on here every now and again.
> Where did they pic it up from? - What part of the country, and why would they buy something that is so obviously suspect?


Sorry to interupt this thread but thats what I was thinking too.

WHY would this person buy a dog that is a banned breed???? (if it is indeed a Dogo)


----------



## sequeena

Ty-bo said:


> Sorry to interupt this thread but thats what I was thinking too.
> 
> WHY would this person buy a dog that is a banned breed???? (if it is indeed a Dogo)


I think the breeder is in Ireland, not sure if dog is banned there (seeing as it's not part of the UK) :yesnod:


----------



## Johnderondon

Ty-bo said:


> WHY would this person buy a dog that is a banned breed???? (if it is indeed a Dogo)


Because people will look and say "Gosh! That man has a fearsome dog. He must have extrordinarily large genitalia"

Same reason I bought a sports car, really.


----------



## Dingle

Johnderondon said:


> Because people will look and say "Gosh! That man has a fearsome dog. He must have extrordinarily large genitalia"
> 
> Same reason I bought a sports car, really.


lmao.........


----------



## harmeetjohal

Johnderondon said:


> Because people will look and say "Gosh! That man has a fearsome dog. He must have extrordinarily large genitalia"
> 
> Same reason I bought a sports car, really.


hahahaha im sure its not far from the truth
he already has a female neo mastiff, and from what i heard he brought two of these 'dogo' types from this irish breeder...


----------



## Guest

james1 said:


> In my eyes that is no way an American Bull or a long legged staff, there's so many obvious facial characteristics between them.
> Without doubt to me its a Dogo but having never ever ever seen one i dont think any of us can say for sure....... there are one or two Americans that wander on here every now and again.
> Where did they pic it up from? - What part of the country, and why would they buy something that is so obviously suspect?


I went offline early last night and got in touch with a close friend in the USA that shows Dogo Argentino's directed them to the photo's here and they were in no doubt that the dog isn't a dogo. They said the dog is more than likely an American Bulldog or a Presa cross type of dog in their opinion.

We compared many photos to different Dogo's including their own dogs and we couldn't find anything that looked vaguely similar around the head and muzzle when comparing photos of the dogs and the photo posted on here. They did go on to point out *IF* the dog is infact proved to be a Dogo it's a very bad example of one.

It's very easy to mislead the unsuspecting public into making them believe that you have something that is illegal in this country some folks like to have these 'type' of breeds as they are seen as something different that no-one should own, so these dogs are almost certainly someones status symbol, but I believe in this case it's 'caveat emtor' - buyer beware! People that buy these "Dogos" and I'll use that term loosely are hardly going to want to take the breeders to court to prove in court that the dog they have purchased is or isn't a Dogo as that would mean the dog being siezed either way.

There are perfectly legal breeds in the UK that are capable of doing what someone would want a Dogo examples have been posted above to do but of course people engaging in illegal activities including engaging the sale of illegal breeds obviously don't want the legal breeds because the price of offspring does not command a high enough price.


----------



## Ty-bo

Johnderondon said:


> Because people will look and say "Gosh! That man has a fearsome dog. He must have extrordinarily large genitalia"
> 
> Same reason I bought a sports car, really.


Lol too true!!!!


----------



## Ty-bo

harmeetjohal said:


> hahahaha im sure its not far from the truth
> he already has a female neo mastiff, and from what i heard he brought two of these 'dogo' types from this irish breeder...


Does he plan on breeding then?????


----------



## Dingle

harmeetjohal said:


> pic's as attached....


Below is a dogo taken from google images


----------



## harmeetjohal

Nicci said:


> I went offline early last night and got in touch with a close friend in the USA that shows Dogo Argentino's directed them to the photo's here and they were in no doubt that the dog isn't a dogo. They said the dog is more than likely an American Bulldog or a Presa cross type of dog in their opinion.
> 
> We compared many photos to different Dogo's including their own dogs and we couldn't find anything that looked vaguely similar around the head and muzzle when comparing photos of the dogs and the photo posted on here. They did go on to point out *IF* the dog is infact proved to be a Dogo it's a very bad example of one.
> 
> It's very easy to mislead the unsuspecting public into making them believe that you have something that is illegal in this country some folks like to have these 'type' of breeds as they are seen as something different that no-one should own, so these dogs are almost certainly someones status symbol, but I believe in this case it's 'caveat emtor' - buyer beware! People that buy these "Dogos" and I'll use that term loosely are hardly going to want to take the breeders to court to prove in court that the dog they have purchased is or isn't a Dogo as that would mean the dog being siezed either way.
> 
> There are perfectly legal breeds in the UK that are capable of doing what someone would want a Dogo examples have been posted above to do but of course people engaging in illegal activities including engaging the sale of illegal breeds obviously don't want the legal breeds because the price of offspring does not command a high enough price.


thanks for that....
he brought two males.....


----------



## davehyde

Johnderondon said:


> Because people will look and say "Gosh! That man has a fearsome dog. He must have extrordinarily large genitalia"
> 
> Same reason I bought a sports car, really.


omg, i got a golden, what does that say about me as a man???:001_tt2:


----------



## james1

it says you would probably run away from a dogo and lick the nearest small child


----------



## james1

Dingle said:


> Below is a dogo taken from google images


just to say - the similarity to me is striking


----------



## Happy Paws2

I have not read all the posts so if I'm repeating something I'm sorry.

Banned dogs in the UK are

Pit Bull Terrier
Dog Argentino
Japanese Tosa
Fila Brasileiro

*Type dogs*

If you own, breed or sell one of these breeds you can be fined £5.000 or/and be imprisoned for 6 months.

If your relatives are in the UK I hope they know what they are doing, but there again they didn't or they would not have been as silly as to have one.


----------



## sequeena

While we're on the subject I am very confused. I have read that you can own a pit bull you just need a licence and it must be muzzled when outside


----------



## davehyde

i think that chance has gone now. not too sure without referring to it agin.

i think they ended the "amnesty" some time ago.


----------



## Nonnie

Nicci said:


> Davehyde, I have a feeling you could probably be refering to the Bully Kutta?
> 
> Bullykutta.com





> When not fed properly they have been known to prey on their owners.


Id be shovelling food down its throat.

I wonder how such aggression can be bred into an animal. Ive always like to think that the way a dog is raised, influences its actions and temperament, but its obvious that this isnt always the case.

Beautiful dogs, but not one id own. But then im not one to choose an animal merely for how it looks.


----------



## Snoringbear

Caucasian Ovcharka probably wouldn't make a good pet

Caucasian Shepherd Dog - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


----------



## Snoringbear

Protection work

http://bpg.sytes.net/nagazi/images/Image/Archive/Caucasian_Ovcharka_Attacking.jpg

"Small" teeth


----------



## Guest

Snoringbear said:


> Caucasian Ovcharka probably wouldn't make a good pet
> 
> Caucasian Shepherd Dog - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


I know a few people with these who have all said they are pretty good dogs providing you give lots of consistent training from day one, thing is though it never stops you have to keep reinforcing what you have taught them to get a stable mannered dog.


----------



## Snoringbear

Seems very hard for the average and inexperienced. I'd read that when working they were basically just left with the herd 24/7 and were pretty unreliable with anyone other than the primary owner.


----------



## Guest

Gary Sicard the webmaster of Molosserdogs owns them, his are real beauties


----------



## Nicky09

They're gorgeous dogs but they really need a good experienced owner and a lot of work I guess.


----------



## Miss.PuddyCat

Snoringbear said:


> Caucasian Ovcharka probably wouldn't make a good pet
> 
> Caucasian Shepherd Dog - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


It looks like a bear!!


----------



## Acacia86

Miss.PuddyCat said:


> It looks like a bear!!


It does!! But i like.........

x


----------



## staceydawlz

they look the same but if you google dgos it looks very like them...as for them thy r stunnin id love one and id love a pitbull!! i think hey r stunin dogs!! i saw a puppy pit a few weeks back she was like cream brindle really light brindle she was stunin never seen one like her b4!!! i wanted to steel her lol!!!! xx


----------



## Johnderondon

sequeena said:


> While we're on the subject I am very confused. I have read that you can own a pit bull you just need a licence and it must be muzzled when outside


That's not quite true.

It is illegal to own, breed or import a type dog. However if you are discovered and convicted you may still ask that the court spare the dog's life by placing it on the Index of Exempted Dogs. If the court agrees that the dog is of good nature and represents no danger then they will neuter and tattoo the dog and return it to the owner under several very strict conditions which include leashing and muzzling at all times in public.

The exemption register is a life-line for type dogs but it can also be a death sentence in itself. One owner was walking their dog when it began to vomit. Fearing that the dog would choke the owner removed the muzzle and, at just that moment, a police officer observed them. Breach of conditions = the dog died.

Another strict condition of the Index is that ownership of the dog cannot be transfered. It cannot be sold or gifted. That means that if the owner loses their accomodation and moves into non-dog friendly housing then the dog dies. Or if the owner is hospitalised for a lengthy period then the dog dies. Or if the owner dies then the dog dies.

The numbers of dogs currently on the Index do not stack up. Given how many dogs are added year by year there should be a lot more dogs on the register than there actually are. Nobody knows why there isn't or what has befallen those missing dogs but the factors above may explain some of the shortfall.


----------



## Johnderondon

davehyde said:


> i think that chance has gone now. not too sure without referring to it agin.


That chance did come and go but then came again when the Act was amended in '97.



> i think they ended the "amnesty" some time ago.


Small point and I'm being picky but that word 'amnesty' really jumps out at me. Dog amnesties have been held at several times and places throughout the UK.

It's no amnesty for the dogs. When the police have a gun amnesty or a knife amnesty they are effectively saying "hand over your gun/knife for us to destroy and you wont face charges". It's the same deal with dog amnesties. It should be called a cull or a massacre but, you know, amnesty sounds more cuddly and nice.


----------



## sequeena

Johnderondon said:


> That's not quite true.
> 
> It is illegal to own, breed or import a type dog. However if you are discovered and convicted you may still ask that the court spare the dog's life by placing it on the Index of Exempted Dogs. If the court agrees that the dog is of good nature and represents no danger then they will neuter and tattoo the dog and return it to the owner under several very strict conditions which include leashing and muzzling at all times in public.
> 
> The exemption register is a life-line for type dogs but it can also be a death sentence in itself. One owner was walking their dog when it began to vomit. Fearing that the dog would choke the owner removed the muzzle and, at just that moment, a police officer observed them. Breach of conditions = the dog died.
> 
> Another strict condition of the Index is that ownership of the dog cannot be transfered. It cannot be sold or gifted. That means that if the owner loses their accomodation and moves into non-dog friendly housing then the dog dies. Or if the owner is hospitalised for a lengthy period then the dog dies. Or if the owner dies then the dog dies.
> 
> The numbers of dogs currently on the Index do not stack up. Given how many dogs are added year by year there should be a lot more dogs on the register than there actually are. Nobody knows why there isn't or what has befallen those missing dogs but the factors above may explain some of the shortfall.


Thanks for that!  I was only confused because me and the OH were watching road wars (hahaha) and there was a pitbull on there. They said it was possible to own it with a licence which I found very confusing ut:


----------



## Johnderondon

sequeena said:


> Thanks for that!  I was only confused because me and the OH were watching road wars (hahaha) and there was a pitbull on there. They said it was possible to own it with a licence which I found very confusing ut:


You are not alone. The Dangerous Dogs Act '91 is not well understood.

Another point worth making, I think, is that an owner who thinks that their dog may be of type cannot ask for their dog to be placed on the Index. Only a court can make that order so such an owner would have to wait until the dog is seized by police, taken to a secret location (where it may *not *be well cared for), wait months for a court date and then persuade the court to exempt the dog.

Some owners - some _loving_ owners - have destroyed their own dog rather than allow that to happen. I don't think I could really imagine what that must feel like but this story gives an impression.



> In Cassie's Name | Print |
> Tuesday, 20 February 2007
> We all have our own favourite breed of dog, however, my soft spot was reserved for Bull breeds. I know each breed has their own quirks, and that's what makes them special to each of us, but for me, there's no smile like a staffie smile. My wife and I didn't have pets, just two children, but when I heard about a litter of pups that were being homed, I managed to convince my wife to let us go and see them, not to take one home obviously as she was adamant that we weren't going to have a dog, but we could just go and see them. However, changes were afoot, and by the time we arrived to see the pups she had gone from the adamant "no" to a "maybe we can get a girl?" When we walked in, we only had eyes for one tiny pup, which nestled in the palm of my hand. It was love at first sight, and it was obvious that Cassie would be coming with us to share our home and be part of our family.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We brought Cassie home on 15th May 2005 and she became my dog. That evening she slept on my chest and for the rest of her life Cassie would creep towards you to sneak on your lap put her * Arms * around you to give you a kiss. She loved nothing more than being with us and we loved having her here. We took her to the vets and she had all her vaccinations and was chipped. That's what responsible owners do. Cassie was easy to train. She adored us and if it made us happy she would have climbed mountains so toilet training was easy. Cassie used to love eating ice cubes and to watch her chasing after bits she had dropped had us in tears of laughter. I'm sure she did it more because she saw it made us laugh. We took her on caravan holidays with us, which she loved as everyone was around all day. It was her idea of heaven, her and her family.
> 
> If you had had a bad day at work, Cassie made you smile when you came home. When we woke up she said "good morning" with a wagging tail and a kiss. She loved our children and seemed to know they were "little people" and was so gentle around them. Our son would sit crossed legged on the floor and Cassie would creep up and push her head through his arm before creeping a bit further to sleep with her head on his lap. They would spend hours just sat there: One boy and his dog. Cassie used to come to work with me every day until one day; Cassie was stolen from my van. We were distraught. We searched everywhere, called everyone but no one had found her. We filed reports with the police and contacted Doglost, an organisation that help people find their missing pets. The days turned into weeks and the weeks into months. It was awful; we didn't know where she was, whether she was ok or even if she was still alive. When you're missing your dog you think you see them around every corner, everyone else has a dog just like yours only when you look closer, its not your dog and your heart breaks a bit more. I can't describe how raw that feels.
> 
> At the end of September, three months after Cassie was stolen we had a call from a nearby dog warden. They said they had our dog. After thinking so many dogs could be our dog I was sure this was another mistake but then they said, "we have scanned her. She's chipped to you!" They told me I would need to pick her up from a nearby rescue that take the strays and would need to pay a fine. I yelled down the phone "I don't care how much, I'll pay it, I'm on my way!" The traffic was horrendous but I made it in less than an hour. I paid the money and there was my girl, my Cassie! She remembered me and ran towards me to give me her famous kiss and cuddle like she had never been away. I took her out to the van and as soon as she saw it she got in and wet herself. For two weeks afterwards the van upset her…it was where she had been stolen. We have no idea what happened to her while she was missing but it clearly upset her. She had been too young to be neutered before she was stolen but three days after we got her back she was spayed. We never wanted to breed her anyway she was a pet dog and that's what responsible owners do.
> 
> For the next year and a half we were a family again. Husband and wife, one son one daughter and Cassie. We were just like you, a normal family with a dog enjoying life. The kids only worried about what to watch on the T.V while we worried about all the things parents worry about. I worked hard to provide for my family and life was good. Cassie didn't seem to worry about anything; she thought life was just perfect.
> 
> Then our world turned upside down. On 6-2-07 i heard via the local media that Merseyside police were to hold a seven day amnesty for people to hand in so called "dangerous dogs". They mentioned many different breeds as common names for "pit bull types" which seemed to cover every bull breed and many crosses. The report said you had to call the police for information. I couldn't believe what I had heard. I was sure they had it wrong. My dog was most defiantly not a "dangerous dog" She was Cassie, a soppy friendly dog who loved nothing more than a cuddle! I was sure this was wrong but called the police. That's what you do isn't it? You are responsible law abiding people and you call when the police tell you to. I just wanted information.
> 
> I rang the number given and was told that there were exemptions if my dog was micro chipped, spayed and tattooed but that they would take my name & number and someone would get in touch with me to assess Cassie. I assumed they meant they would come and see she was friendly and well trained and everything would be ok. She was chipped and spayed so I didn't worry. 24 hours passed by and I had a phone call from someone at police headquarters saying that an officer would have to come and assess Cassie. I asked what they do during the assessment; I was curious and wasn't worried anymore. They would see she wasn't dangerous so I had nothing to worry about. They told me they would look at her to see if they thought she looked like a pit bull type according to a set of vague guidelines. If they thought she did then they would take her away.
> 
> I reeled. This wasn't what I had thought happened. How could they take her away? She was my dog; surely they couldn't just take my dog? They told me if I refused to sign her over to be killed they would seize her and put her in kennels while they took me to court. It didn't matter whether Cassie was a fantastic family dog who had never hurt anyone. If she looked * wrong * and I didn't sign her over for them to kill her, then they would take her from me. Still unable to comprehend how this was possible I said, "you are welcome to look but you will not be taking my dog" I told this person that I was going to a family party that evening so they would have to come on Friday. He said he couldn't say when would be there but someone would ring me.
> 
> Whilst I was at the family meal a police dog section van turned up at my address with another unmarked white van. An officer from the dog section then phoned me on my mobile saying he was outside my house to assess Cassie. I told him that I was at a family party and that he would have to come back at another time. He then proceeded to tell me that he intended to seize my dog. They hadn't even seen my dog! How could they deem her to be anything without seeing her? She wasn't dangerous! I couldn't understand what was happening, it was like a bad dream this couldn't really be happening. I told him again, that he would not take my dog at anytime and he said he would be back the next day and Cassie "would be gone".
> 
> Overnight my wife and I discussed the situation. We both felt that we could not bear her being taken by the police. We had lost her once and we couldn't do it again. The thought of her alone in kennels, us not knowing what was happening to her, her thinking we had abandoned her, just broke our hearts. The threat of a possible jail sentence taking me from my family, stopping me being able to provide for them, be there for them. Fines, criminal records. We are normal people with a pet dog but the way we understood it we didn't have any choice.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> We decided to put Cassie to sleep on our terms with the people who loved her. On Friday 9th February 2007 i took my much-loved Cassie to the vets and we let her go to sleep without knowing any more fear. Cassie died in my arms…. the same arms that cuddled her on my chest when she was a baby, the same arms that held her when we were reunited, the same arms that hugged her when she crept up to give out her kisses. . The tears rolled down every ones faces from the vet, nurse, my wife and myself.
> 
> Cassie was gone.
> 
> I picked her up, holding her for the last time we stayed with her lifeless body for about twenty minutes afterwards before returning home. We took Cassie's Death Certificate to our local police station to tell them not to attend my home that evening and went home to grieve. They had the nerve to ring me Sunday morning to see if they could come and have a look at Cassie. I couldn't believe they had paid so little attention to Cassie's death. I yelled down the phone "don't you talk to each other" They asked us to come down again and show us the paperwork. By now there was nothing left in me to fight. Cassie had gone; I just wanted them to leave us alone. My wife took the paperwork down and we haven't heard from them again.
> 
> Our children don't understand. They are 5 and 7. It's hard enough at that age explaining why anything dies but to try and tell a child the law discriminates against a look? They don't understand and to be honest, I don't think I do either. I know what the law says now, I've spoken to those at Deed Not Breed but it doesn't make sense. Not to any logical minded person. Deed Not Breed tell me that the register of exempt dogs can only be added to by a court. There isn't any option for your dog to stay with you while waiting for court and you cant register your dog yourself. I don't understand why. I don't understand why this law exists at all. Cassie had never hurt anyone and had never shown any aggression. The Kennel Club had suggested that instead of following a law which is thought to be one of the worst pieces of canine legislation, that Merseyside police allowed owners to register their dogs while keeping them at home. This may have saved our Cassie. I've cried more tears then I ever thought possible. I cry for Cassie, for us, for everyone hiding their dogs in fear, for the dogs already seized and waiting and for those already killed under this "amnesty".
> 
> I can't change what has happened. But I can fight to make sure that Cassie is remembered and try and show why the law MUST be changed. Dogs are not born dangerous; they are a product of what you teach them and how you treat them. We taught Cassie what it is to be loved and she taught us that dogs could love you back. It is the owners who should be targeted not a dog based solely on its appearance and we need legislation that reflects that.
> 
> Please, Say no to Breed Specific legislation, In Cassie's name.
> 
> As told to Deed Not Breed by Cassie's Owners


----------



## LostGirl

ive read that before its such a sad story poor cassie. There owners did the best for her but it must have hurt like hell to do it


----------



## sequeena

So sad  I can't imagine their pain


----------



## Nicky09

Thats an awful story poor Cassie and her poor owners. She's such a beautiful dog too.


----------



## dobermummy

The post about Cassie had me in tears. It goes to show how wrong the law is.


----------



## ozzy007

Nicci said:


> Those puppies I'm afraid to say do look like American Bulldogs, Dogo's are white, they don't come in any other colour.


you are wrong

the dogo they come to some blacks on head even on the body.


----------



## Bijou

breed specific legislation is wrong on so many counts - there is no rhyme or reason for the way that some breeds are chosen to be the flavour of the month for the 'ard innit' scum that have single handedly destroyed the Staffy breed - I tell you - there but for the grace of god goes your, mine and any other breed that takes their fancy - a dog is not dangerous because of the way it looks but because of the irresponsible 'b*****ds that own and breed it !!


----------



## Burrowzig

Acacia86 said:


> COAT: Completely white. Any spot of color should be disqualified as an atavistic characteristic. The small spots on the head are not cause for disqualification, but among two similar animals, the completely white one is preferable. In contrast, any spot on the body is cause for disqualification.
> 
> DISQUALIFYING FACTORS: Bluish-grey eyes, Unilateral or Bilateral Deafness, spots on the body, long hair, white nose or very spotted with white, prognatism (whether overshot or undershot), very pendulous mouth, a greyhound head, bitches less that 23.5 inches tall, dogs less than 24.5 inches tall, more than one spot on the face, any physical disproportion. The aberrant toe (Dewclaw) loses points, but does not disqualify the animal.
> 
> This is part of the breed standard (Dogo Argentino club of America)
> 
> I am afraid to say that he is 99.9% likely to be An American Bulldog. Or a cross.
> 
> Still stunning though!
> xx


To quote a breed standard to say whether or not a dog is a particular breed just doesn't wash. Lots of dogs of some breeds don't comply with the breed standard - for instance long-haired, black or white GSDs. They still exist, just don't make the show bench.


----------



## sequeena

Burrowzig said:


> To quote a breed standard to say whether or not a dog is a particular breed just doesn't wash. Lots of dogs of some breeds don't comply with the breed standard - for instance long-haired, black or white GSDs. They still exist, just don't make the show bench.


Are you jipping my girl? :lol: 
I thought blacks were shown  good thing I'm not involved with showing isn't it. :lol:


----------



## unimatrix1

New rule for pitbulls, was on the news it is now law you have to have them mussled and on a lead when taking them into a public place.


----------



## Taylorbaby

unimatrix1 said:


> New rule for pitbulls, was on the news it is now law you have to have them mussled and on a lead when taking them into a public place.


how have people got them if they have been illgel for like 10years? (i dont knwo how long it is)


----------



## Taylorbaby

sequeena said:


> Are you jipping my girl? :lol:
> I thought blacks were shown  good thing I'm not involved with showing isn't it. :lol:


yes they are shown at long coat shows, just not at crufts where b&t bannanas seem to get picks over healthy straight back long coats beautys!


----------



## Johnderondon

Taylorbaby said:


> how have people got them if they have been illgel for like 10years? (i dont knwo how long it is)


Twenty years next summer.


----------



## Taylorbaby

Johnderondon said:


> Twenty years next summer.


flippin heck really? blimey thats a long old time and people still breeding selling buying them! that worked a real treat banning them!


----------



## lifeizsweet

Taylorbaby said:


> flippin heck really? blimey thats a long old time and people still breeding selling buying them! that worked a real treat banning them!


I think, if you have a license you can keep them.

Atleast - if you have a dangerous animals license you can keep tigers and lions...would be silly if you could do that, but couldn't get a license to keep a pit bull.


----------



## Freyja

Taylorbaby said:


> yes they are shown at long coat shows, just not at crufts where b&t bannanas seem to get picks over healthy straight back long coats beautys!


Black GSD'S can and are shown. I have a friend who qualified her black or Crufts and showed him there about 6/7 years ago. She doesn't show him any more as she shows mals but he definitley went to crufts at least once.


----------



## unimatrix1

Taylorbaby said:


> how have people got them if they have been illgel for like 10years? (i dont knwo how long it is)


Yes people still breed them, why take such a nice dog out of the doggy world just because of the stupid abusers? we aint all like that.

I see them selling on Gumtree as blue staffies..
Some people get them registered at the RSPCA as staffies when they are pups.


----------



## Snoringbear

unimatrix1 said:


> Yes people still breed them, why take such a nice dog out of the doggy world just because of the stupid abusers? we aint all like that.
> 
> I see them selling on Gumtree as blue staffies..
> Some people get them registered at the RSPCA as staffies when they are pups.


RSPCA don't register dogs.


----------



## unimatrix1

PDSA then maybe...? The one at Salford.

I had a pitbull and they are not as bad as people make out, they are loving family dogs i even had 2 children growing up with the dog so cant be all that aggressive. At the end of the day its people that "Teach" them to do bad things that should be punished not the others nor the dog for that matter.


----------



## Johnderondon

lifeizsweet said:


> I think, if you have a license you can keep them.
> 
> Atleast - if you have a dangerous animals license you can keep tigers and lions...would be silly if you could do that, but couldn't get a license to keep a pit bull.


No license but post #117 on this thread may explain better



unimatrix1 said:


> PDSA then maybe...?


They don't register dogs either and even if a dog is registered (say, with the Kennel Club) it still offers no protection. The courts don't care if a dog is a staffie or whatever. They _only_ care about whether it has a pitbull-ish shape.

Incidentally muzzling and leashing in a public place has been a requirement for dogs registered on the Index of Exempted Dogs since the DDA amendment in '97.


----------



## unimatrix1

Our old pitbull was registered on paper at the PDSA as a staffie, so police would pull over look at the dog ask what type and if they didnt believe me i had the papers to prove it.

I was bringing the mussle and leash into account because it was on the BBC News not so long ago middle of last month that these types of dogs do need to be mussled and on a leash in a public place, which i couldnt agree more with as people "hiding" these types of dogs or "scared" to take them out in a public place and just letting them in their back garden each day is no good for the dog as it is not getting regular exercise that is needed for the health of the dog, besides from the dogs point of view its no good seeing the same ol back garden.


----------



## Johnderondon

unimatrix1 said:


> Our old pitbull was registered on paper at the PDSA as a staffie, so police would pull over look at the dog ask what type and if they didnt believe me i had the papers to prove it.


I don't know what paperwork you had but it would not have been considered proof in court had the police chosen to take the matter further. The law does not ban pit bulls as a breed but as a 'type'. That's important. KC registered staffies that can demonstrate their heritage for generations can be, and have been, found as 'type'. It all swings on how much the dog resembles the 1988 ADBA breed standard for APBT. It doesn't matter if the dog is a pureblood staffie - if it looks "substantially" like a pit bull that is enough.

Prior to the death of Ellie Lawrenson the police weren't really interested in seizing type dogs and the numbers seized annually by police forces were usually in single figures. Since then it has become big public issue and police now have dedicated units and budgets. Seizures by the Met. police alone are running at circa 1,000 dogs per year.



> I was bringing the mussle and leash into account because it was on the BBC News not so long ago middle of last month that these types of dogs do need to be mussled and on a leash in a public place.


The only dogs that require muzzling and leashing are those subject to a court order. A pit bull type dog that has not appeared before a court is illegal whether muzzled or not.

Some good infromation here:

dangerousdogsact.co.uk | Welcome to DDAWatch - Supporting Fair & Effective Dog Laws


----------



## unimatrix1

They are cruel to such dogs by taking them from innocent owners that do not condone any type of dog violence and killing them off with the injections.. This is no way of any nature to treat animals like that.

Killing a dog in any shape or form is cruel to animals.
Killing animals with injections that are healthy and nothing wrong with them is again cruel to animals.


----------



## cutekiaro1

unimatrix1 said:


> They are cruel to such dogs by taking them from innocent owners that do not condone any type of dog violence and killing them off with the injections.. This is no way of any nature to treat animals like that.
> 
> Killing a dog in any shape or form is cruel to animals.
> Killing animals with injections that are healthy and nothing wrong with them is again cruel to animals.


they wouldnt be killed if people didnt breed and buy an illegal dog.

I have no sympathy for people who deliberatly go and buy these dogs knowing they are illegal.

I do however have sympathy for people whose dogs are deemed type when in actual fact they are not.

There are two on dogsblog atm who look to me like American Bulldogs but who were taken at a few months old and kenneled for 18months then let go but the owner couldnt have them back for various reasons.


----------



## unimatrix1

To me an animal is an animal how can such things be "illegal" when they come from nature.


----------



## cutekiaro1

unimatrix1 said:


> To me an animal is an animal how can such things be "illegal" when they come from nature.


because the human race are d**ks and make these animals dangerous for their own sick gain, regardless of morals the fact is these dogs are banned and the ban should be adhered to...... if you refuse to accept it and buy one anyway ..... on your head be it!

I guess you could compare it to drugs. They are banned and people are well aware of the fact but yet people still buy them and then wonder why they they get arrested .......... because of course they arent harming anyone by doing it


----------



## unimatrix1

cutekiaro1 said:


> I guess you could compare it to drugs. They are banned and people are well aware of the fact but yet people still buy them and then wonder why they they get arrested .......... because of course they arent harming anyone by doing it


Yes but nobody is getting hurt by such banned dogs?,Drugs are a total different thing if people tend to use drugs then so be it they only hurting themselves which i dont care, they choose to do such things.

It is people that always target certain animals to give them bad press and always look for things bad in the press to put a comment on, i get sick and tired of hearing it all the time a dog is as friendly as you make it.


----------



## cutekiaro1

unimatrix1 said:


> Yes but nobody is getting hurt by such banned dogs?,Drugs are a total different thing if people tend to use drugs then so be it they only hurting themselves which i dont care, they choose to do such things.
> 
> It is people that always target certain animals to give them bad press and always look for things bad in the press to put a comment on, i get sick and tired of hearing it all the time a dog is as friendly as you make it.


I think you are missing the point. People who buy drugs are not just hurting themselves they are hurting lots of people, same as the people who sell them.

Its the same with the pitbull, they are deemed a dangerous dog no matter what way it is fluffied up. They can had have been dangerous and some still are because of the silly chavs that keep them.

My point is people will always go against the law regardless of what it is in relation to..... if they choose to do this knowing full well what they are doing is illegal then im sorry but they have nobody to blame but themselves and they deserve all the punishment they get.

Yes I feel sorry for the dogs.... no its not their fault and I know they can be great dogs but they are still illegal....... its the people that breed them and the stupid lowlife that buy them that are the issue. We wouldnt have dogs taken and pts if people adhered to the law regardless of weather they agree to it or not.

Nobody is above the law


----------



## cutekiaro1

unimatrix1 said:


> Yes but nobody is getting hurt by such banned dogs?,Drugs are a total different thing if people tend to use drugs then so be it they only hurting themselves which i dont care, they choose to do such things.
> 
> It is people that always target certain animals to give them bad press and always look for things bad in the press to put a comment on, i get sick and tired of hearing it all the time a dog is as friendly as you make it.


sorry just saw this and yes you are quite right in that a dog is what you make it


----------



## Cleo38

cutekiaro1 said:


> they wouldnt be killed if people didnt breed and buy an illegal dog.
> 
> I have no sympathy for people who deliberatly go and buy these dogs knowing they are illegal.
> 
> I do however have sympathy for people whose dogs are deemed type when in actual fact they are not.
> 
> There are two on dogsblog atm who look to me like American Bulldogs but who were taken at a few months old and kenneled for 18months then let go but the owner couldnt have them back for various reasons.


Completely agree with you. Why breed dogs that you know are illegal & if found out will be pts


----------



## Johnderondon

cutekiaro1 said:


> We wouldnt have dogs taken and pts if people adhered to the law regardless of weather they agree to it or not.


Whilst I concur with the spirit of your post I would point out that, because of the way our law is drafted, we will _*always*_ have dogs seized as pit bull type.

Owners can find themselves outside of the law despite having behaved in a perfectly legal manner.


----------



## cutekiaro1

Johnderondon said:


> Whilst I concur with the spirit of your post I would point out that, because of the way our law is drafted, we will _*always*_ have dogs seized as pit bull type.
> 
> Owners can find themselves outside of the law despite having behaved in a perfectly legal manner.


Yep totally agree with you which is why I posted about the two that are on dogsblog who were taken for 18months then released but poor poor owners could no longer have them 

It sure would give us a head start though if people stopped breeding and buying pits


----------



## unimatrix1

They are not bad dogs and never will be why a long long time ago the Pitbull originated in England and Ireland Police was also using them in England as Police Dogs. Cant all be that bad like i keep saying its people that have negativity towards these kind of dogs because of some strange reason they have to give the dog a bad name not fair on the dogs..and for one i wouldnt ever think of giving dogs a bad name because of its actions however i would give the owner a bad name for the upbringing of the dog.


----------



## mitch4

Nicci said:


> Davehyde, I have a feeling you could probably be refering to the Bully Kutta?
> 
> Bullykutta.com


That is one huge dog :scared:


----------



## Taylorbaby

mitch4 said:


> That is one huge dog :scared:


sound like the perfect family pet to me!!!! 

Due to the nature of the work these dogs are bred to perform, _*they are known to be human aggressive and difficult to handle*_. *When not fed properly they have been known to prey on their owners.* This breed is not the type of dog to own in a family with children. Bully Kutta's are not recommended for first time dog owners, or timid dog owners. With their size and great strength, it is best that the owner is experienced in the type of training that these dogs need. [


----------



## unimatrix1

Lol you not seen that documentary channel where the man tames a lion takes it in as his own then lets it back into the wild somewhere in africa just goes to show you can tame anything if you have the knowledge what it takes.

Kevin Richardson thats him.

YouTube - African Lions Accept Man As One of Their Own


----------



## RetroLemons

What a load of rubbish! I dont class an animal that could easily turn tame! If he got too annoying, or they got bored bam, end of. Just think of all the stories in the news where so called tame animals who work with humans have turned and killed their trainers etc...


----------



## cutekiaro1

RetroLemons said:


> What a load of rubbish! I dont class an animal that could easily turn tame! If he got too annoying, or they got bored bam, end of. Just think of all the stories in the news where so called tame animals who work with humans have turned and killed their trainers etc...


One very good reason why wild animals should not be tampered with..... they are wild for a reason and IMO it should be kept that way.

I dont really like going to zoo's either unless they are captive breeding programs because they get these majestic wild animals and put them on display for the joy of man and make money from them when they should be in their own environment


----------



## lala_martinelo

Seems that many people are missing the point here.

Before buying any dog, first thing to do is to get information about the type of breeds that are out there and choose one that is suitable for you and for your family.

If your ancle got a dangerous dog and does not know about its law and does not know the breed, that is very irresponsable.

To own a dangerous dog you need a special licence, apart of having the dog neutered, tatooed, microchiped etc. On top of that, dangerous dogs can only be out in the street with muzzle and on a leash.

If your ancle does not follow the law, he may get to prison and the dog will be put to sleep.

Breeding these dogs is also ilegall. Therefore, supporting illegal breaders is also very irresponsable.

Speak to your ancle after getting all the information and consider what is best for the dog.

If after reading the below document you are not sure what to do, I would sugest you speak to the government or to the RSPCA directly.

Dogs that are banned in the UK : Directgov - Home and community

Take care and all the best with it.

Lala (A charity dog volunteer)


----------



## Presa2011

Well all i see is narrow minded idiots commenting on this breed when they have no experience with this breed nor have they every seen one!!!
ppl who make comments about something they no f88k all about give these stupid dda laws longer standing!! please take a look at the SaveLennox.co.uk

we all know the dda laws is garbage and needs serious overhaul, any dog has potential to be a dangrous creature in the wrong hands. all breeds should be allowed yet the owner found to be abusing the animal or being trained in a dangrous manner should be banned from owning dog period....

i have seen seen a few dogo's grow into fab pets who live around babies and young children and other animals.

labs are not a banned dog and the number 1 pet dog in the uk!! so its ok that owners can train these large dogs easily train to attack, its ok its not illeagal........


----------



## Cassia

cassie01 said:


> awwwwww. how cute are are they, they look like softies to me. id have one!!!
> 
> also you are allowed to keep them in this country provided the authorities know, you get a licence and they are kept onlead and muzzled in public. unless they have changed this and no one told me!


If your in the UK, they're banned I'm afraid


----------



## leashedForLife

Presa2011 said:


> Well all i see is narrow minded idiots commenting on this breed when they have no experience
> with this breed nor have they [ever?] seen one!!!
> ppl who make comments about something they [know] f88k-all about give these stupid [DDA-]laws [more?] standing!!
> please take a look at the SaveLennox.co.uk


Lennox is quite a complex case - 
* the owners BOUGHT A PUP knowing he would resemble 'type' as an adult.

* when the dog-wardens came to their home [wrong address], rather than be polite & reasonable, 
*they bragged & threatened that he - Lennox! - would 'eat them alive' or some such &$%#@. * 
either the dog IS A FRIENDLY PET - or he's Not. They portrayed him as Not.

* the dog, predictably, was taken. Suddenly they are shouting from the rooftops how unfair this is!  
if they had said, _'he's a dear sweet dog & we've never had a moment's worry with him, the neighbors 
think he's wonderful & he has his KC-Gold thru the training-club...'_, the event might have been 
a NON-event; their own pugnacious, rude behavior condemned their own dog.

* Lennox was *offered sanctuary in the south - & they said, No, thanks.* 
if their only concern was their darling dog's safety, why would they not say _Yes! Please!... _ :huh:

* then suddenly Lennox is a 'therapy dog' for their [12-YO? i think] daughter. 
i swear, his dog has more careers than most people; he was a loving pet, then a homicidal maniac, 
then a loving pet languishing in kennels torn from his family , & now he's a miracle-worker 
who is the prop & support of a child... Funny, how they never mentioned this when they said, _he'll kill ya'..._

* they're collecting $$$$$$... for what? who oversees the disbursement? 
*up-front collections for charity are holding-accounts for vet-fees, or a trust which is run 
by trustees with accounting that is transparent & public - Who are the trustees? What is the sum for? 
Where has it been spent, so far? If it's legal fees, where is the accounting? *


Presa2011 said:


> we all know the [DDA] is garbage and needs serious overhaul, any dog has potential
> to be a dangrous creature in the wrong hands. all breeds should be allowed yet the owner found to be abusing
> the animal or being trained in a dangrous manner should be banned from owning [a] dog[,] period.


yes, i agree that banning problematic owners from owning or training or even caring for dogs in future, 
once they've shown their irresponsible behavior with one or more dogs, would be good.

banning those convicted of cruelty from *living with* or sharing their home with pets would also 
IMO be good & proactive - but it's rare to get such a ruling in the USA. 
even people who've set dogs afire or tortured them, are not banned from owning pets, in most cases. 


Presa2011 said:


> i have seen seen a few [Dogos] grow into fab pets who live around babies and young children and other animals.


i've met quite a few - i would not recommend them to novice owners, nor to the average pet-dog owner 
with young kids, cats, pocket-pets, bunnies, etc - NOR to an elderly or unfit or disabled wannabe-owner.

Dogos are often predatory, tend to be stranger-aggro, need firm, kind training & LOADS of socialization thru 
their 2nd-year, just like any other guarding-breed - then continued maintenance of that socialization. 
most pet-dog owners aren't interested in meeting those standards. 


Presa2011 said:


> [Labradors] are not a banned dog & [are] the number-1 pet [dog-breed] in the UK!!
> so [it's OK] that owners can train these large dogs easily... to attack, its OK it's not [illegal]...


as a trainer, i can say with assurance that i could get a reliable biting performance from a JRT, 
MinPin or Chihuahua, a Doxie or many working-bred BCs, rather than from a Labrador - Labs are prone to mouth, 
not *bite with force sufficient to break skin* unless provoked. Most Labs are not aggro dogs - there are some, 
of course, but they are pretty rare, & often it's other dogs they have an attitude about, not people.

i'd go thru a large number of candidate-Labs to find one that would reliably bite WITHOUT good reason.

conversely, it would not be hard to find a biting-Dogo, or a biting-GSD, or a biting-Akita, IME.

any large breed *can be* a dangerous animal to an adult-human; any dog can be dangerous to an infant, 
whatever the size; the critical thing is *not* _*'can this dog bite?...'*_* as all dogs CAN bite; 
it is, 'what would cause this dog to bite with force?'* 
how easily a dog is provoked to bite with force & by whom, under any set of circs, is the critical info.


----------



## Rednosepitbull

hi ,on studying the pictures you have posted i just thought i should mention that the sire (father) does look like a full breed dogo although i did notice there was a few dark patches around the mouth which does suggest that it maybe a cross an not actually a full breed, and the puppy's are definatly not full breed , you can tell this by the black patches of fur on ears and around the eye's , All True Breed dogo Argentina's are Pure white, thats one of the crucial things when looking at these dogs,not to say there is anything wrong with them, personalty i think there adorable, But defanatly a cross and not a full breed , hope i may have enlightened you all abit, thanks for reading this, if there is anything else you would liike to know feel free to ask


----------



## Rednosepitbull

harmeetjohal said:


> pic's as attached....


hi ,on studying the pictures you have posted i just thought i should mention that the sire (father) does look like a full breed dogo although i did notice there was a few dark patches around the mouth which does suggest that it maybe a cross an not actually a full breed, and the puppy's are definatly not full breed , you can tell this by the black patches of fur on ears and around the eye's , All True Breed dogo Argentina's are Pure white, thats one of the crucial things when looking at these dogs,not to say there is anything wrong with them, personalty i think there adorable, But defanatly a cross and not a full breed , hope i may have enlightened you all abit, thanks for reading this, if there is anything else you would liike to know feel free to ask


----------



## thug4life

harmeetjohal said:


> I am a little upset to find out that one of my relatives has just brought a Dogo Argentino pup, not cause i view them as a danger, but cause they are illgal...
> does anyone know why this breed is banned also the Tosa?


Hi the dogo dogs are and can be quite dangerous but i am intresseted in the dog
if you are selling the dog


----------



## newfiesmum

thug4life said:


> Hi the dogo dogs are and can be quite dangerous but i am intresseted in the dog
> if you are selling the dog


This thread is over a year old, but I would point out that we do not engage in buying and selling illegal dogs on this forum.

For your information the Dogo Argentino is no more dangerous than any other breed of dog and is described in the US programme Dogs 101 as a great family dog. It is only the UK government who have become paranoid about the way a dog looks.


----------



## simplysardonic

thug4life said:


> Hi the dogo dogs are and can be quite dangerous but i am intresseted in the dog
> if you are selling the dog


Interesting choice of username....................


----------



## pogo

I have to say from the photos i'm not convinced the dog(s) are full dogo's or even partial crosses. 

I will say dogo's are an amazing breed and can make brilliant family pets if in the right hands. Yes i know there illegal here though.


----------



## Luz

What I can't understand (I know this thread is a year old...Thanks to Newfie Mum - Doh I might not have wasted the last hour reading it if I'd realised!) is how you could import it into the country from Ireland. Or was it slipped over the border into the North? Also you can't insure them can you? 
Incidentally there is a lovely film about a Dogo Argentino called Bombón El Perro! (Spanish with subtitles)


----------



## tashax

thug4life said:


> Hi the dogo dogs are and can be quite dangerous but i am intresseted in the dog
> if you are selling the dog


You sound delightful


----------



## Luz

thug4life said:


> Hi the dogo dogs are and can be quite dangerous but i am intresseted in the dog
> if you are selling the dog


Methinks this is someone making a joke or perhaps being deleiberately inflammatory.


----------



## newfiesmum

Obviously someone trying to wind people up I should think, dragging up a really old thread as well. A very childlike username to choose I think as well. But while we are on the subject, the Dogo Argentino is no more dangerous than any other breed of that type but people like this user who has dragged this up again, are just the type who have given him a bad name.


----------



## Zaros

newfiesmum said:


> *Obviously someone trying to wind people up I should think, dragging up a really old thread. *
> 
> *A very childlike username* to choose I think as well. But while we are on the subject, the Dogo Argentino is no more dangerous than any other breed of that type but people like this user who has dragged this up again, are just the type who have given him a bad name.


Clockwork threads NM they're there so folks can wind them up!


----------

