# desperate for help please



## lu39 (Jun 30, 2014)

Hi all i really need some advice, i purchased a persian kitten on the 20th of dec about 6pm when he was just coming up for 13 weeks old. When we got him home he had a bit of a dicky belly the next day but i excepted this as stress for moving to the new house, anyway on the 23rd of dec i woke up early and did the litter tray and was horrified to find bloody diarrhoea, he was plastered in it so i quickly cleaned him up and the litter tray and rang the vets who wanted to see him straight away. He was treated by the vets with 
DEXADRESON INJECTION 
SYNULOX TABLETS 
MILBEMAX 
this seemed to settle the tummy for about 24 hours after that runny tummy again but no blood i continued to give him the antibiotics as instructed but rang the vets again because of the dicky belly he said to stop the antibiotics which i did. 
We went back to the vets again on the 30th of dec to get him checked over his stools were very soft but not runny, during the week before the 2nd vet visit i had noticed he didnt seem to respond to any noise so i looked in his ears and was horrified to find them jammed and i mean jammed with rock hard black wax. So i used EPI OTIC ear cleaner daily to free it all up on the second visit i got the vet to look in his ears and he said there was still a lot of dirt in them and to keep doing what I was doing. The upside to this is the poor little kitten can now hear for probably the 1st time in a long long time. He has also had on the 30th ADVOCATE. 
Anyway today just a short while ago the diahorrea is back no blood thankfully and we are back to the vets this afternoon.

What I need is advice on where i stand with these mounting vet bills i have had him just under 2 weeks and so far the visits are costing upwards of £55 a trip so with todays it will put it in the region of £165. I should mention that i have been trying to contact the breeder since the 23rd of dec without any joy. Much as I love this kitten I cannot afford these vet bills. I dont want her having him back either as she is obviously a bad breeder/owner. What do I do and is she responsible /liable to reimburse me. Please help,


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## The Wild Bunch (Jul 16, 2014)

Hi and welcome to the cat forum.
It sounds like you have had an awful time with your poorly kitten. Really, if the breeder was aware that the kitten was unwell then he shouldn't have been allowed to leave for his new home. Some breeders will be along to help with your predicament soon I'm sure but it doesn't look promising for you getting hold of this 'breeder' I fear that you may have to 'suck up' the costs and once he is fit and well, get him insured


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

Sadly it seems you have fallen foul of a backyard breeder  The majority of pedigree kittens will come with at least 4 weeks free insurance cover which would have been a help in your case.
I can only suggest that you take out insurance now - though it won't cover you for the current treatment or for any related problem in the future. You could just set aside a sum of money weekly in a special account for veterinary treatment otherwise.
When you collected your kitten did his breeder give you a registration certificate and pedigree? If so I would urge you to contact the registering body (GCCF is the most common but it will say on the certificate) and tell them you have been sold a sick kitten, giving them the breeder's details. 
I think you will be lucky to get any recompense from the breeder


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## lu39 (Jun 30, 2014)

Hi thank you for your quick response, I forgot to mention there was 4 weeks free insurance with the kitten but having spoken to them they would be unwilling to pay as it was in their opinion an exsisting condition would she would have been aware of before selling the kitten. And becuse of the stomach issue they dont know if it is a genetic, hereditary or going to be a permanent problem, so if i continue the policy with them they wouldnt cover this or any other stomach problems and because i would have to declare this to any insurance company they will all exclude stomach conditions. 
At the moment i am fighting the urge to drive to her house and sort this out. I find this terrible behaviour on her part, i expected a healthy kitten.


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## The Wild Bunch (Jul 16, 2014)

lu39 said:


> Hi thank you for your quick response, I forgot to mention there was 4 weeks free insurance with the kitten but having spoken to them they would be unwilling to pay as it was in their opinion an exsisting condition would she would have been aware of before selling the kitten. And becuse of the stomach issue they dont know if it is a genetic, hereditary or going to be a permanent problem, so if i continue the policy with them they wouldnt cover this or any other stomach problems and because i would have to declare this to any insurance company they will all exclude stomach conditions.
> At the moment i am fighting the urge to drive to her house and sort this out. I find this terrible behaviour on her part, i expected a healthy kitten.


I completely understand where you are coming from, do you have pedigree papers for your boy? If so, the breeders prefix should be on the paperwork and you can contact GCCF or whoever the pedigree registering body is and discuss the issue with them


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## Sparkle22 (Oct 26, 2013)

I really feel for you, I have been in a position before facing vet bills I can't pay as well, it's an awful feeling.

I don't know if the following will be of help but I believe that pets, in the eyes of the law, are considered goods and if the insurance company believes she knew the kitten was suffering before sale, then technically, she has sold you faulty goods. 
I would get in contact with a solicitor and see if you can force her to reimburse you the bills. 
Don't mention anything to the 'breeder', just make sure you have her correct address and save any papers she gave you.

If he does have papers, make sure you get in contact with GCCF and complain about her, she might be on a suspension list which would put her in even deeper trouble.


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

It is indeed poor behaviour - try to contact the breeder again and if you have no luck then do get in touch with the registering body.


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## lu39 (Jun 30, 2014)

The thing that makes this all unbareable for me is i lost my old cat on the 8th of January last year at the ripe old age of 18 he would have been 19 on the 20th of feb, i felt i couldn't replace him ( with another cat not in our hearts that is impossible ) but he left such a big hole in my life and after nearly a year i was ready to share my home with another cat so i started searching for the right one, i saw several moggie litters but felt that they weren't right so i didnt get one then i met this handsome boy and he is gorgeous i knew i was right not to have rushed into the 1st cat i saw and in less than two weeks he has stolen my heart i still miss my old boy. But this little one has made him not been here that bit easier. I so wanted this to be perfect but after racking up £4500 in bills from my old boy ( because i stupidly had an annual policy never again ) he had diabetes,  dementia and finally it was a brain tumour that took him from us. I cant go through all of this again not so soon after my last one. I probably sound like a daft old sod but i am terrified everything is going wrong i dont expect this from a baby.


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## lu39 (Jun 30, 2014)

I have been on the GCCF website they are not open again until Monday I will be on the phone to them 1st thing. I am also considering the RSPCA purely because if a baby is in this state what are the adults like. She knew all about my old boy and seemed genuinely sorry for my loss guess all she saw was pound signs. No matter what happens with this little boy I am making it my mission to make sure she is accountable for what she has done unfortunately for her my new daughter in law is a litigation solicitor and when they get back off honeymoon i will let her deal with it because my son and her brought the cat for me. I dont want to trouble them now i want to try and sort this before they get back on Wednesday.


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

Personally I feel your kitten may have Giardia and needs a 10 day course Panacur Paste.

The insurance will not pay out, the loop hole as you now know is the condition may be from the breeder, so you now need to pay vets bills.

I do however feel the breeder may have known about this issue and therefore do think you should continue to contact the breeder regarding these problems.

Regarding Gccf, they may see this as sale of a sick kitten, you are able to complain if the breeder is registered with this registering body, this will cost you £15 to make your complaint.

Not sure which area you are in, but if you need help getting your kitten better I am happy to help you.

Did you see the mother of the kitten?


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## Worzel (Jan 21, 2014)

It's quite possible for Giardia to be symptom-free, so a kitten could be sold with it unknown to a breeder. It could have been vet checked and wormed and still have Giardia. Seems a bit tight of the insurance co. since it could be as simple to cure as Panacur & Metronizanol. One of my cats had Giardia and my vet also went round the houses with steroid/antibiotic injections and talk of scans, instead of treating for Giardia. When he got the meds, he was fine.


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## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

It could be Giardia, but it could also be a myriad of other things. As the kitten has recently had Milbemax, I'd wait a little while before beginning Panacur. He needs fecal screening at the vets, and you need to request that the screen includes TF. You need to take in a 3 day sample.

Is your breeder registered with GCCF or TICA? If you let me have the name I might be able to help you. I'm also a Persian breeder.


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## lu39 (Jun 30, 2014)

Thanks again for all the replies. The latest is I have gone back to see her, I showed her the vet bills and explained what was going on and how I had been trying to get hold of her since before Christmas apparently her home phone has stopped working, the long and short of it is she tried to say it wasn't her kitten she was selling it on behalf of someone and they had moved so she couldnt get the money back, i pointed out this was not disclosed to me at time of purchase she said she was the breeder and the details all came back to her address then she said it was her kitten originally but she sold it and then it was returned. This all started to sound very very strange she constantly contradicted herself then she said she couldnt give me my moneyback as she had spent it and couldnt give me the vet bill money because she didnt have it. So I ended it with her by saying just so we are clear you refuse to give me a refund and reimburse my vet bills even though you admit his ears were probably blocked and he had diahorrea when he left you. To which she responded yes thats right. I then informed her she left me with no choice but to go to small claims court to claim it back. She replied it wasnt her responsibility i couldnt prove it. 
I have now my obilgations by trying to return him so its all on her now.

my youngest sons had the idea to record the conversation on my phone i am so glad i did, it is probably going to help me win my case. She also admitted that the cats are all registered with the gccf so i will be emailing them a copy of the conversation to go with my complaint.

On the plus side with the gorgeous boy my vet doesnt think it is gardia he has put him on a probiotic to calm his belly and we are switching him over to hills instead of the crap she was feeding him on. We didnt want to do this before while his belly was dicky but now we have nothing to loose his tummy feels bad so going to start the switch over tomorrow. Fingers crossed this works and the poor little love starts to feel better soon. If this doesnt work he wants to start running tests i think he is hoping that he just has a very sensitive belly and a good food will help him get back on track. 
His ears are getting there i have to update the vet again Mon. Sounds daft but i am glad in a way she wouldnt take him back because i dont think i would sleep knowing he was with her. He is staying with me now and we will do the best we can for him regardless.


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## AlbertRoss (Feb 16, 2009)

Which insurance company was the 4 weeks free with? Was it Agria? Because that's the one the GCCF have as their own brand.


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## jaycee05 (Sep 24, 2012)

Consumer protection will also give you good advice as even though an animal it still comes under the goods for sale act


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## moggie14 (Sep 11, 2013)

Oh my, sorry you are going through such an awful situation! 
You definitely need to report this breeder to the GCCF. This is soo wrong on every level and I'm sure they would want to hear from you.
Also from a legal point of view it's worth following up.
I hope your little kitten feels much better soon bless him. Good luck - please keep us posted xx


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## lu39 (Jun 30, 2014)

I think she is in for a shock really I was hoping to have resolved this before my eldest got back from honeymoon, but she was uncooperative and fairly hostile my daughter in law is going to have a field day with this especially since listening to the recording of the conversation she clearly admits he was ill when we got him I have just got a dominos for my youngest son for been smart enough to think of recording the conversation. 

I will be going sending her a recorded letter formally asking for a refund and reimbursement of vet fees as i am sure she will ignore it. It is written here now ready for the post office tomorrow, and i am off up the courts after speaking to the gccf Monday to get the claim form which i will leave for my daughter in law to fill out. 

I will post again Mon after speaking to the vets but i am hoping he is going to be fine. I have been reading old posts on here and i am sad to see this is not an one off. I thought i was getting a healthy kitten from a good breeder it is a shame not a pedigree backyard breeder. 

I only hope i can do better by him than she has with such a poor start he deserves the best i only hope i am good enough for him.


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## Ceiling Kitty (Mar 7, 2010)

TBH, I've seen plenty of bloody diarrhoea in previously perfectly healthy kittens, simply because they've moved home and changed environment. So I never immediately jump to the conclusion that it's definitely down to the breeder - in most cases it isn't. 

That said, the communications you've been having with the breeder do appear less than satisfactory.

Meanwhile, diagnosing diarrhoea over the internet is not a wise thing to attempt; there are so many things that it could be. A pooled faecal sample, collected over three days for submission to the lab, would be a sensible course of action.

Were ear mites present, given the build-up of brown stuff?


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## jaycee05 (Sep 24, 2012)

Did you see any of the other kittens and mum and dad, just wondewring what condition they were in, poor little things, you would think she would have noticed the ears ,even without actually checking them [which she should have done anyway] if they were caked in black stuff


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## lostbear (May 29, 2013)

lu39 said:


> I think she is in for a shock really I was hoping to have resolved this before my eldest got back from honeymoon, but she was uncooperative and fairly hostile my daughter in law is going to have a field day with this especially since* listening to the recording of the conversation she clearly admits he was ill when we got him* I have just got a dominos for my youngest son for been smart enough to think of recording the conversation.
> 
> I will be going sending her a recorded letter formally asking for a refund and reimbursement of vet fees as i am sure she will ignore it. It is written here now ready for the post office tomorrow, and i am off up the courts after speaking to the gccf Monday to get the claim form which i will leave for my daughter in law to fill out.
> 
> ...


Well done you for recording the conversation! Your son is a little star.

Take her to the small claims court and claim for everything regarding the vet's fees. If you claim for a reimbursement of the cost of the kitten, you will have to be prepared to hand him back, so you may want to think about that before you put that as part of your claim - obviously it's up to you, but personally I wouldn't want her getting her hands on any cat I had grown fond of. It may be though that you can claim for ongoing vet's fees until the condition is fully cleared.

Claim for expenses, too - e.g. if you have to take time off work to go to court, the cost of serving papers - everything. It will teach her a lesson this time, and might stop her pulling the same trick again with someone else.

Best of luck.


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## Jiskefet (May 15, 2011)

If the poor mite continues to have runny stools, do have him tested for giardia, just to be on the safe side. Giardia testing needs to be done on stools from three consecutive days, as the cysts are excreted intermittently, so a single test may result in a false negative.


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## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

jaycee05 said:


> you would think she would have noticed the ears ,even without actually checking them [which she should have done anyway] if they were caked in black stuff


Would have thought the vet would notice as well on the first visit, surely checking the ears is part of a routine health check, not waiting until the second visit to look.


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## Charity (Apr 17, 2013)

I think you need to be careful asking for a full refund as I believe legally you can't expect to have both your money and the kitten, which, under the Sale of Goods Act is seen as a product just like if you had bought a TV and it would be awful if the woman, therefore, changed her mind at some point and wanted the kitten back. If the kitten gets well, you can certainly demand the vets fees and other expenses and might be awarded costs. Bear in mind though, if she doesn't have the money to pay then you will have even more of a struggle on your hands as the courts don't enforce their ruling and it's up to you to take more legal action.


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## lu39 (Jun 30, 2014)

Thanks for all the answers 
Going to try and answer everything everyone has asked sorry if I miss any. 
He was the only kitten left so I didnt see any others, mum and dad were pointed out to me but they were at the top of the stairs and I couldn't see them clearly. There were 5 or 6 adult cats in the house all of which were upstairs, she has dogs as well that she had shut in the kitchen when we arrived.

I am going to get him tested for gardia using a company I found recommend on another post on these forums PALS vetlab. If it comes back as positive I will at least have saved a bit using them allowing me to maybe treat my dogs as a precaution if it is advised. 
I have been using my steam cleaner daily on the litter box and the floor around it, because of the runny tummy i am have to wash his back end several times a day 
This morning I have put the clippers on his back end and trimmed the fur he looks strange but if it helps with hygiene the fur will grow back. This is all advice I found on other threads with animals that had dicky bellies.

Please dont think I am trying to diagnose him over the internet he is receiving vet care I just want ideas from owners with probably more experience than the vet when it comes to cats.

As for the vets not checking him over on the 1st visit my little boy was very poorly and the priority was the bloody diarrhoea my vet knows me well enough to know that as he improved I would tell him everything I observed and his the fact he couldnt hear wasn't important on the 1st visit I knew it was something we would investigate when he was feeling better. And if he was deaf that would have been fine my old dog is blind. The vet seemed sure it was mites he scratched his ear and took the scrapping out the back and when he came back in he told me my dogs weren't at risk because I use advocate and to start him on it also the cleaner he gave me he liked because it drowned the mites and didn't leave he fur greasy.

As for asking for the refund she has made it very clear she isn't going to do it so I feel very safe sending the letter which I have to do as part of the small claims process (so I have been told by a friend who has done a small claim before ) when we get to court I will make it very clear that he is not going back to her and I am prepared to assume the responsibility of potentially future episodes of this stomach issue all I will be claiming is the vet bills for this 1st instance to make the kitten healthy as he should have been at the point of sale.

If she can't afford to pay the cost on the court ruling (if it goes in my favour ) it may at least make her think twice about breeding again if she cant afford it if things go wrong.

I dont want to name and shame her until after the court case and I am still trying to talk to the insurance about putting a claim in as I also read on here not all representative know what they are talking about.


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

> under the Sale of Goods Act is seen as a product just like if you had bought a TV


Well yes and no. It's a private sale so you have the same rights as you would buying a second hand TV from a private individual. These are not as comprehensive as your rights buying from a commercial trader.

Your position is however stronger than most involved in a private transaction because of the subsequent claims made as to the origin of the kitten. Even in a private sale the seller must not misrepresent the goods eg they must not state a TV is two years old if it's ten years old. If the paperwork you were given gives the impression the kitten was bred by the seller and you then have a recording of that seller saying she didn't actually breed it then you have clear evidence of misrepresentation. It may even point towards her trading which would put you in an even stronger position and your particulars of claim would therefore be different. Who is given as the breeder on the registration certificate?

And adding - do not send your LBA by recorded mail as she'll just refuse to sign for it. Send it normal mail but post it over the counter at a Post Office and ask for a certificate of posting which is free. If you have proof of posting it will be accepted as served when you get to court.


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## lu39 (Jun 30, 2014)

Hi all thanks for all your comments and advice it has been a bit of a roller coaster ride, heres the latest.

Gccf are doing an investigation and this is the shocker, ( please bear in mind I have never owned a pedigree so dont judge me to harshly please ) When we collected him I filled out on a form my details in the new owner boxes she said she would send it off to get him transferred to me well when I spoke to them in the course of the conversation they were checking his pedigree from the hand written version she provided me with until the real one turned up. He doesn't exsist while yes she is a registered breeder he is not registered nor can he be because one name and cssr number is non exsistant and the other number is correct but to a different cat. Very much a nightmare well now I have really had enough I paid for a pedigree and got well he is persian but not as I was told at purchase.

Any way I decided enough was enough so once again we treked to her house and I some how managed to remain calm called her out on the pedigree and said this would be added to the growing court case against her.

Long and short of it is she has refunded me half of my money and gave me the vet bills up to date. I was gob smacked she back down and handed over the cash. 

So as far as I am concerned he is better off with me the partial refund will be used for any further vet bills seems as I was planning on paying that out on him anyway.

I am a little disappointed he doesn't have papers and possibly if I had known before getting him I wouldn't have got him but the fact is he is here now settled in, and well on the road to recovery and we all love him. 

So once again thank you all.


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

I wish I could say I was surprised but this one had a bad smell about it. I have a nasty feeling the GCCF can't react to a complaint about the kitten because it isn't registered with them but hopefully there is something more general they can get the breeder on. Well done on getting what you did from the breeder, I don't think you'd have got more and kept the kitten even if you had gone to court.

This won't be an isolated incidence, there are presumably other buyers who have been duped just as you were. You've seen how easy it is to be conned and none of us would judge you harshly for it.


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## lu39 (Jun 30, 2014)

If I decide in the future and I am not saying I will when he is a couple of years old in total good health and been snipped that he needs company other than the dogs ( he is going to be a house cat never had a house cat before )I will be on here asking for good breeders near to me. Right now my priority is him and making sure he grows into a big healthy boy. 

Thank you again to everyone for the advice the pack for testing his poop should be here soon so will be able to tell the vet if there is anything from those results. Fingers crossed he is clear.


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

Thank goodness you at least managed to get some of your money back - I am amazed that you did to be honest.
I hope your little boy gets better and better and grows up to be the gorgeous, loving cat you deserve. He may not be exactly what you paid for but you clearly love him :blush:


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