# Elderberry syrup



## Etienne (Dec 8, 2010)

Yesterday when walking one of the dogs we met a lady and told her that our other dog has kennel cough and told her she was on AB`s at the moment. She informed us that when her dogs caught it she prefers herbal medications and suggested we try elderberry syrup, she swears by it. We have never seen this lady before so I don't know if I should believe her or not. What are your thoughts please guys


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

ABs are there to CURE infection, the syrup will just make the throat less sore, you can achieve this by giving a tsp of manuka honey.

The question is do you trust your vet or not and if not, then why go to him?


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## Etienne (Dec 8, 2010)

smokeybear said:


> ABs are there to CURE infection, the syrup will just make the throat less sore, you can achieve this by giving a tsp of manuka honey.
> 
> The question is do you trust your vet or not and if not, then why go to him?


HEY BACK OFF

Off course we trust our vet and we would never go against there recommendations.
This was just someone we meet over the park and she told us what she does with her dogs and I wondered if anyone had heard of it before.
I had NO intention of trying it and when I said taking AB`s at the moment, that was until the course of tablets were finished and she was fine afterwards :


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## sallygunes (Aug 5, 2011)

my nan used to give us all elderberry syrup/elderberry rob as she called it when we had coughs and i have to say it eased it off brilliantly it wouldn't hurt to give alongside the medication But it should be home made not shop bought .


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

Etienne said:


> HEY BACK OFF
> 
> Off course we trust our vet and we would never go against there recommendations.
> This was just someone we meet over the park and she told us what she does with her dogs and I wondered if anyone had heard of it before.
> I had NO intention of trying it and when I said taking AB`s at the moment, that was until the course of tablets were finished and she was fine afterwards :


*There are people who sit in pyramids surrounded by crystals and who chant too............................. * :cornut:


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## victoria171168 (Apr 8, 2013)

I give homemade blackberry syrup which also includes certain extras such as cinnamon and ginger in it whenever any of our dogs get kennel cough. 
They also have antibiotics as well .

the syrup helps definitely.


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## Mumtomaddog (Sep 17, 2013)

I tend to use a lot of Herbal or alternative treatments, old wives tales, the lot, and perhaps i have been known to surround myself in crystals and chant, i also meditate daily.  It keeps me sane (ish) and many do help physically too.

Of course any responsible person will also take the advice of a qualified medical practitioner, BUT if alternative treatments can be used alongside... why not?
I would definitely try the elderberry syrup, just to try and soothe the irritation, poor thing. Also as Smokeybear suggested, the honey wont hurt either.. although i paid a fortune for my boys honey last night!! was shocked at the price for the good stuff but thought what the heck, may as well get him the best. 
I couldnt bring my doggy home from DT until his kennel cough had cleared up, it was so painful to watch him coughing and hacking. 
Hope your wee doggy feels better soon, Etienne.


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## Etienne (Dec 8, 2010)

Mumtomaddog said:


> I tend to use a lot of Herbal or alternative treatments, old wives tales, the lot, and perhaps i have been known to surround myself in crystals and chant, i also meditate daily.  It keeps me sane (ish) and many do help physically too.
> 
> Of course any responsible person will also take the advice of a qualified medical practitioner, BUT if alternative treatments can be used alongside... why not?
> I would definitely try the elderberry syrup, just to try and soothe the irritation, poor thing. Also as Smokeybear suggested, the honey wont hurt either.. although i paid a fortune for my boys honey last night!! was shocked at the price for the good stuff but thought what the heck, may as well get him the best.
> ...


The thing is she is so happy and playful all the time and until she starts coughing which isn`t all the time


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## Etienne (Dec 8, 2010)

smokeybear said:


> *There are people who sit in pyramids surrounded by crystals and who chant too............................. * :cornut:


Smokeybear, may I apologise to you, after sleeping on it I think I may have been OTT. I believe your primary concern was for our girl and that is how it should be. Thank you


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## Etienne (Dec 8, 2010)

Thank you all for your comments


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## 3DogKnight (Jul 11, 2014)

Elderberry extract is being studied for its effectiveness in treating many things. But studies have already shown it to be highly effective in treating swine flu and bird fluas effective, or even more effective than Tamiflu. There are many scholarly articles available online. But for the layman:

Elderberry Fights Flu Symptoms

While raw elderberries are harmful to dogs, many people use the extract (cooked and rendered harmless) to treat (yes, *treat*) infections, as it's often more effective than antibiotics, but without the harmful side effects. Antibiotics (anti=against; biotic=living organism) are broad-spectrum and indiscriminately kill good bacteria along with the bad.

Do yourself a favour & don't bother to engage with mockers & scoffers. They offer no evidence aside from their own ignorant mockery, committing logical fallacies (in this case ad hominem; appeal to ridicule; judgemental language; loaded question; personal incredulity) and a serious error in judgement, all in one fell, unintelligent swoop.


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## dbyers (Dec 14, 2014)

smokeybear said:


> *There are people who sit in pyramids surrounded by crystals and who chant too............................. * :cornut:


Smokeybear - you're an idiot!


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## dbyers (Dec 14, 2014)

In case I didn't do that right...Smokeybear, you are an idiot!


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## Mum2Heidi (Feb 17, 2010)

A v wise member here who unfortunately we don't see these days, shared a recipe she swore by for kennel cough.
No substitute for AB's but in lots of cases of Kennel Cough they aren't necessary.

I know a lot of folk here have used it

Tried and tested many many times over.

One good dollop of honey (buy the best you can afford, Manuka is the best)
One good dollop of blackcurrant jam
Mix with a little cooled boiled water
Add 1-2 drops of teatree essential oil or eucalyptus essential oil
Give a dessert spoon size to dog as a dose
Dose as often as necessary, there is nothing to 'overdose' on.

Count a dessert spoon size dose as for an adult dog ranging from collie size to giant breed size. Reduce dose if dog is smaller.

Coughing will either cease in 3 -4 days or will not appear at all.


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## Old Shep (Oct 17, 2010)

It has been proven, irrefutably, that cough mixtures are totally ineffective. This is why they are not recommended any more.


But, you may feel you are in control by going to a chemist (or slaving over a mixing bowl), paying money and giving it to your child/dog. That may make you feel better and influence your view of your dogs condition.

In other words, it's called "the placebo effect" and it's real.


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

Old Shep said:


> It has been proven, irrefutably, that cough mixtures are totally ineffective. This is why they are not recommended any more.
> 
> But, you may feel you are in control by going to a chemist (or slaving over a mixing bowl), paying money and giving it to your child/dog. That may make you feel better and influence your view of your dogs condition.
> 
> In other words, it's called "the placebo effect" and it's real.


Lets have the links to studies you claim 'prove, irrefutably' that cough mixtures are totally ineffective.


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## Old Shep (Oct 17, 2010)

I could. But no one bothers to read them or respond.


They are not hard to find. There was a recent meta analysis of OTC cough medicines showing them to be basically ineffective.

Cough medicines are no longer allowed to be marketed at children as they are, at best, ineffective or, at worst, actually cause harm. I'd be surprised is anyone didn't know this already.


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## Old Shep (Oct 17, 2010)

....oh go on then.

Safety warnings and messages for medicines : MHRA

From MHRA, the regulation authority for medicines.

Effect of Dextromethorphan, Diphenhydramine, and Placebo on Nocturnal Cough and Sleep Quality for Coughing Children and Their Parents

Interestingly, there is some evidence to show plain old honey works better than either OTC cough syrup or placebo. Takes much nicer, too!


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## Old Shep (Oct 17, 2010)

That is absolutely the last time I post links to peer reviewed research paper in response to criticism.

No one ever reads them!

I'm away now to feed the unicorn at the bottom of the garden with some stardust and moonbeams.


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## DirtyGertie (Mar 12, 2011)

Old Shep said:


> That is absolutely the last time I post links to peer reviewed research paper in response to criticism.
> 
> *No one ever reads them!*
> 
> I'm away now to feed the unicorn at the bottom of the garden with some stardust and moonbeams.


Just curious but how do you know no-one ever reads them .

I've read the first link. I didn't know that new advice is that OTC medicines shouldn't be used for children under 6, presumably that it is just that - advice - and that if a parent insisted they could still purchase them . I will pass the advice on to my son although his youngest is 11 so would come under the next age group where the pharmacist would advise. My grandson has a 5 month old baby so I imagine that they would go to the doctor with anything like that at this age.

I gave up with the other link,it hadn't loaded after 5 minutes, just got a blank page.


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## Old Shep (Oct 17, 2010)

DirtyGertie said:


> Just curious but how do you know no-one ever reads them .
> 
> I've read the first link. I didn't know that new advice is that OTC medicines shouldn't be used for children under 6, presumably that it is just that - advice - and that if a parent insisted they could still purchase them . I will pass the advice on to my son although his youngest is 11 so would come under the next age group where the pharmacist would advise. My grandson has a 5 month old baby so I imagine that they would go to the doctor with anything like that at this age.
> 
> I gave up with the other link,it hadn't loaded after 5 minutes, just got a blank page.


I checked the other link and it was fine for me.

The reason I suspect they are not read is because they are all ignored. No one responds. Well, wait, no. I did get a response once. The poster said "I don't believe in facts"


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

Old Shep said:


> ....oh go on then.
> 
> Safety warnings and messages for medicines : MHRA
> 
> ...


The first link says nothing whatever about cough remedies being 'totally ineffective' as you claimed. It's the dosage for small children that's the issue. And this is a dog forum, not about small children. Many vets do still recommend cough syrups for kennel cough. The OP's question was about elderberry extracts, not over-the-counter cough remedies anyway.

The second study does indicate that 2 ingredients are no better than a placebo, but the sample size is not one I'd draw meaningful conclusions from.


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## Old Shep (Oct 17, 2010)

The active ingredient in cough medicine is codeine

Codeine and cough: an ineffective gold standard

Most other ingredients are inert.

Yes, this is a dog forum, but the conversation was about cough remedies, and as far as I am aware, there are no cough remedies specific to dogs- people use OTC cough remedies for humans.

I was discussing OTC remedies because, clearly, your doctor cannot write a prescription for your dog.

There's lots more evidence of the I effectiveness of OTC cough remedies, but I'm not willing to post anymore.


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