# Buying A Dog From Europuppy?



## AceOfSpades113 (Dec 1, 2015)

Hello!
I am curious, has anyone here ever used Europuppy? And if not, would you trust it? What are your thoughts on its ten year satisfaction guarantee?
For those of you who don't know how it works, basically you pick the breed, find a puppy you want/like, then sent europuppy an email. You will never talk to the breeder personally, and there really isn't much information on the parents of the pup. All it tells you is the parents weight and occasionally height, yet sometimes neither which means many of the pups on it have NO information about their parents or breeders. When you do email them, if you ask for Heath Test results they tell you they don't have them as they are only the middle person basically.. I see its an advantage for worldwide trading of puppies to assist bloodlines and such, and erases the language barriers, but I just think it is far too easy to abuse, a relationship with a breeder is something I find important though, which is maybe what turns me off. It was how I was originally planning on getting my Komondor pup, but wasn't at all happy with the lack of information they were willing to tell me or of course the no contact with breeder, way I seen it I would rather pay the extra to know exactly who bred my pup and the health status of the parents. I would love to use this service in the late future but I just want to know what other peoples opinions are on it, the bits I like are getting around language barriers, and how it is easier with them doing all the arrangements, but the lack of information on the parents just bothers me, it makes me feel like something isn't right. Even when I am talking to a private breeder, if they are obviously withholding information or telling me 'the sire and dam of our bitch both passed their health tests, so we didn't see a need' It just turns me away, but that is a whole other topic. Puppies get a health certificate from 'their own private vet' and, over half of the puppies don't come with their papers. Oh, meant to add there is a Champion Bloodline: part which either has a tick or an x in it. There are also references of others who have gotten via the site which seem positive enough, and they funny enough have a Scam page to assure people that all pups are added by them. The standards of the site seems to have dropped, though. As they claim all dogs come with papers, yet if you actually search a dog breed often times it is listed as won't come with papers, so confusing 
So what do you think? Effective, or too easy to be abused? Well done to the people who gathered all those puppies information and such, a little more on the parents would make a world of difference! Very interested to see if anyone has got their pup this way and if so how they thought the process went.


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## kittih (Jan 19, 2014)

From your description it sounds like a middleman operation for puppy farms. :-0 perhaps I am misunderstanding but surely having contact with the breeder and getting info re health tests results directly from them is preferable even if a language barrier needs to be overcome ?


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

No, wouldn't get a dog or puppy unless I could view first and ask ad many questions as possible, whether from breeder, private rehome or rescue. Sounds almost like a dating agency for owners and dogs, and you know how many people who meet throughdating sites actually go on to get married.
I once had a call from Harrods pet dept, asking If had Siamese kitten for " a VIP customer". I said I did, but would want to see them to establish if they were the right sort of home for one of my kittens. They seemed surprised I was even asking, wouldn't give me even the name of my supposed new owner. I asked them to feelfree to pass only details, and if telephone interview went well they could visit in person. They were very busy people,,important job, blah blah... I said no problem, just tell them to contact me and Icouldbe flexible with time, and I halfpenny of space for them to land their helicopter if that made travel easier for them. Never did hear any more, I assume the "VIP" got Harrods to source from a breeder who didn't care who got their babies. 
From a customer point of view I'd want to meet parents,(and siblings and grandparents if possible), see their temperament at home, and discuss diet, training already started, health problems and tests for the breed etc. As breeder I wouldn't want my babies to go to just anyone, so for that reason I'd be suspicious of a breeder who would sell through an agency,,which is really an online petshop.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

AceOfSpades113 said:


> Hello!
> I am curious, has anyone here ever used Europuppy? And if not, would you trust it? What are your thoughts on its ten year satisfaction guarantee?
> For those of you who don't know how it works, basically you pick the breed, find a puppy you want/like, then sent europuppy an email. You will never talk to the breeder personally, and there really isn't much information on the parents of the pup. All it tells you is the parents weight and occasionally height, yet sometimes neither which means many of the pups on it have NO information about their parents or breeders. When you do email them, if you ask for Heath Test results they tell you they don't have them as they are only the middle person basically.. I see its an advantage for worldwide trading of puppies to assist bloodlines and such, and erases the language barriers, but I just think it is far too easy to abuse, a relationship with a breeder is something I find important though, which is maybe what turns me off. It was how I was originally planning on getting my Komondor pup, but wasn't at all happy with the lack of information they were willing to tell me or of course the no contact with breeder, way I seen it I would rather pay the extra to know exactly who bred my pup and the health status of the parents. I would love to use this service in the late future but I just want to know what other peoples opinions are on it, the bits I like are getting around language barriers, and how it is easier with them doing all the arrangements, but the lack of information on the parents just bothers me, it makes me feel like something isn't right. Even when I am talking to a private breeder, if they are obviously withholding information or telling me 'the sire and dam of our bitch both passed their health tests, so we didn't see a need' It just turns me away, but that is a whole other topic. Puppies get a health certificate from 'their own private vet' and, over half of the puppies don't come with their papers. Oh, meant to add there is a Champion Bloodline: part which either has a tick or an x in it. There are also references of others who have gotten via the site which seem positive enough, and they funny enough have a Scam page to assure people that all pups are added by them. The standards of the site seems to have dropped, though. As they claim all dogs come with papers, yet if you actually search a dog breed often times it is listed as won't come with papers, so confusing
> So what do you think? Effective, or too easy to be abused? Well done to the people who gathered all those puppies information and such, a little more on the parents would make a world of difference! Very interested to see if anyone has got their pup this way and if so how they thought the process went.


Seriously anyone who would even contemplate getting a puppy or any dog from somewhere like this should be sectioned.

The guarantee isn't even worth the paper its written on.

*
What is not covered

*
1. *Coccidia, giardia, kennel cough, cold, pneumonia *and *other bacterial diseases *are not covered.

2. *Diseases which are not life threatening *and do not adversely affect the health of the animal are not covered

by this guarantee. Such diseases are *localized demodectic mange, grade 1-2 heart murmur, grade 1-2*

*luxating patellas, cherry eye, localized mange, bladder stones, inverted eyelids, inverted tails, testicle

problems *(pre-departure vet check will insure both testicles have descended). The guarantee does not cover

what in the Bulldog breed is considered normal: *cherry eye, entropion, loose hips, demodectic mange*

(generalized and localized)*, *and *skin allergies*.

3. Euro Puppy cannot be held responsible for *veterinarian fees *or costs. As a dog owner, you are aware that

owning a puppy means visits to the veterinarian and understand that you will be responsible for all payments.

Therefore, we strongly recommend that you buy pet insurance for your dog to cover unexpected veterinarian

fees. Veterinarian care including vaccines, de-worming and heartworm treatment plus regular checkups are all part

of owning a puppy and small problems should be treated before escalating into bigger ones. The guarantee will

not cover neglect or improper care by the owner!

If you don't know where the puppies are coming from and many don't have pedigrees of copies of the parents health testing (which could be faked anyway)
The puppies could be coming from anywhere and it could easily be a front for puppy farms.

The dogs trust warned last year of the great puppy scandal and illegally imported puppies.

https://www.dogstrust.org.uk/whats-...aigns/puppy-smuggling/puppy-smuggling-scandal

Why on earth would anyone in their right mind buy a pup through such a source not knowing the origin or anything about the lines the pups come from and if they had been health tested or not.

I also cant imagine any decent ethical breeder selling their puppies through an organisation like this one, unless they are in it for pure commercial profit and really don't care about they pups they breed.

Would add too its goes against every single thing that you are advised about doing and not doing when looking for a good breeder and buying a puppy.

https://www.dogstrust.org.uk/help-advice/advice-for-owners/buying-a-dog/buying-a-dog


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## AceOfSpades113 (Dec 1, 2015)

See, that's my line of thinking. If I was the breeder of a puppy, there would not be a hope I would sell it online through a middleman where nevermind meeting the potential owners, but never even speaking to them? Not even an email? I'd spend the rest of my life panicking about the poor pup 
I know in the arrangements of my Komondor who is coming from Hungary, viewing was an option other than for the distance we would have to travel, but with a sickly family member it quickly knocked it on the head for me. Yet the breeder has sent me photo updates since the pup was born, including him with mum and siblings, and of course dad. They asked plenty of questions and allowed me to as well, not to mention the pup is being delivered to our door so someone can do a home check  To me, that is the way to import a dog. It may be a lot more hassle, but I know I am getting a well bred, healthy puppy. I also find that the time you have to wait on a reservations list adds to the excitement, and of course allows you to be sure you are ready to make the commitment, europuppy would literally allow me to have a Komondor on my door on Friday if I asked. Its a shame it isn't better thought out/doesn't give you the ability to contact the breeders personally, it was likely made with good intentions in mind without the creators even realising they had literally just opened an online puppy farm.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

If you look in the FAQs section

It says that their puppies are registered with the Hungarian kennel club hence they come with a Hungarian pedigree

It also mentions usual age for shipping of puppies is 12/17 weeks depending where you live but if you are able to come/go to hungary you can collect them from 1o weeks of age.

Under the where are you located is says Budapest hungary.

https://www.europuppy.com/dog/faq.html

From the dogs trust
Shocking investigative footage reveals criminal breeders, vets and transporters in Hungary and Lithuania abusing the Pet Travel Scheme* with a lack of adequate enforcement and protocol by the relevant authorities. European vets have been caught on camera creating false pet passports and fake rabies vaccination records; the charity reveals underage puppies slipping through the net undeclared and lack of checks at ferry ports and borders, simplifying the smuggling process. With breeders making upwards of £100,000 a year** from the sale of smuggled puppies, the trade is spiralling out of control with no deterrent.

https://www.dogstrust.org.uk/help-advice/advice-for-owners/buying-a-dog/buying-a-dog

I might just be a big fat sceptic but I really don't think its a case of.

Its a shame it isn't better thought out/doesn't give you the ability to contact the breeders personally, it was likely made with good intentions in mind without the creators even realising they had literally just opened an online puppy farm. 

Personally I think it may be the intentions are very well thought out and not necessarily good ones, or there would be or at least I would have thought a hell of a lot more transparency.


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Nope, never. As mentioned it looks like a puppy farm with bells on.

But then I probably wouldn't import a dog full stop, as my dogs are pets, and I see no need for it unless you are involved in breeding or with rarer breeds. It is not as if there is not an adequate choice of breeds or decent breeders available in this country.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

An online FB group I'm apart of was having a discussion about this and we were all in agreement that it's nothing but a money making ploy with more than likely puppy farmed puppies. What's more, the prices charged are excessive for what are pups with no pedigrees, health tests or family history. For some of the breeds listed a lack of health info could be a disaster waiting to happen. The info Sled dog hotel quoted from their 'guarantee' regarding Bulldogs should NOT be considered normal within the breed and its sad that sick and unhealthy pups can be sold on in this way with the general public being conned into believing those ailments are acceptable.

When finding my own pups breeder I found them via Eurobreeder, but the breeders are only listed with them and you have direct access to their websites from there. I then made personal contact with my breeder and spoke to them for the best part of 2 Years.


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

I'm afraid no decent breeder would use europuppy. Most breeders in Europe have their own websites so they get plenty of interest from buyers in other countries. There's also Facebook groups for selling puppies or enquiring about buying a puppy from another country.


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

It looks very unethical for all the reasons that have been mentioned, @AceOfSpades113 I think you might be wise to remove the link in the post in case some idiot lurking around would be tempted to use them.


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## Blitz (Feb 12, 2009)

Gosh, I thought it was a joke or at least a total scam with no dogs involved. What a very odd idea and I am amazed that anyone would even consider buying a pup from them. what sort of breeder would sell to them as well. A giant disaster I think.


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

I was watching something on TV last night on the One Show, about people buying assistance puppies from a company. The pups were supposed to be trained up and then returned to the owners to help with the disabled person. It was a company that went bust anyway and also was somewhat on the scammy side especially as no one was able to train the pups properly. I'm sure they said the pups were being bought by a company called Europuppy, or something very similar to that name and it was a front for an Irish puppy farm


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## Magyarmum (Apr 27, 2015)

Dogloverlou said:


> .
> 
> When finding my own pups breeder I found them via Eurobreeder, but the breeders are only listed with them and you have direct access to their websites from there. I then made personal contact with my breeder and spoke to them for the best part of 2 Years.


I also used Eurobreeder to find Georgina, my Shar-Pei who's Hungarian born and bred as is Gwylim my Miniature Schnauzer. As I live in Hungary I collected them both from their breeders, but apart from that I went through exactly the same process of being questioned and questioning that I would expect if I was buying from a breeder in the UK.

Because Georgina's breeder lives the other side of Hungary to me I didn't see her until I collected her at 9 weeks old, when I was introduced to her parents and siblings, two of whom were waiting to be sent to the UK. I was able to trace her bloodline before I committed myself to buying her as it was shown on the breeders website. Her medical papers and FCI/MEOE (Hungarian Kennel Club) were sent direct to my vet so he was able to check them to verify the were in order.

Gwylim was slightly different because he was 9 months old when I bought him. His breeder lives 50 miles away and only sells on recommendation, which in my case was by our trainer who owns two of his dogs. For about 2 months before he agreed to sell me Gwylim we were in almost daily communications. He met Georgina to make sure she'd be a good "big sister", did a home visit and even asked me to show him how I got the dogs in and out of the car and walked them! We often see him and his family and he's been a very good friend to me and the dogs.



Sled dog hotel said:


> If you look in the FAQs section
> 
> It says that their puppies are registered with the Hungarian kennel club hence they come with a Hungarian pedigree
> 
> ...


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

I'd never import a dog and no I wouldn't not use this site and any other person shouldn't either.


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

Wouldn't touch them, not with a hundred foot, sterilised barge pole.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

Magyarmum said:


> I also used Eurobreeder to find Georgina, my Shar-Pei who's Hungarian born and bred as is Gwylim my Miniature Schnauzer. As I live in Hungary I collected them both from their breeders, but apart from that I went through exactly the same process of being questioned and questioning that I would expect if I was buying from a breeder in the UK.
> 
> Because Georgina's breeder lives the other side of Hungary to me I didn't see her until I collected her at 9 weeks old, when I was introduced to her parents and siblings, two of whom were waiting to be sent to the UK. I was able to trace her bloodline before I committed myself to buying her as it was shown on the breeders website. Her medical papers and FCI/MEOE (Hungarian Kennel Club) were sent direct to my vet so he was able to check them to verify the were in order.
> 
> Gwylim was slightly different because he was 9 months old when I bought him. His breeder lives 50 miles away and only sells on recommendation, which in my case was by our trainer who owns two of his dogs. For about 2 months before he agreed to sell me Gwylim we were in almost daily communications. He met Georgina to make sure she'd be a good "big sister", did a home visit and even asked me to show him how I got the dogs in and out of the car and walked them! We often see him and his family and he's been a very good friend to me and the dogs.


If you actually went to see the breeder her other dogs and how and where the puppy was raised and have all the correct paperwork in order and therefore no different to buying a puppy as you should then that sounds entirely fine as you researched and checked them out.

However, on the website it says
*Can you help me locate a breeder? *
Unfortunately not. There are many other sites doing that. Our policy is to visit each breeder we work with in person to assure that the puppies are coming from good homes. This is only possible for us here in Hungary or in the neighboring countries.

No mention of health testing parents either on health all they say is
Are your puppies Healthy?
All our puppies are healthy and checked by our veterinarian before departure.
A normal vet check isn't a substitute for health testing the parents.

Also the prices shown do not include shipping either or doesn't seem too.

As said different if you were put in touch and were able to go and check out the breeder and the premises and do all
the right things when buying a puppy. If though it is as its sounds and you will know nothing about the breeder, the health
testing, where they puppies are raised, or where they puppies actually come from at all then it seems a downright dangerous way to buy a pup.
Also if you want a puppy why would you also want to put a pup through the stress of shipping etc. I certainly wouldn't.
Even if you were a breeder and wanted to introduce new blood lines from abroad then any breeder breeding correctly, would want to know exactly what they are putting into their breeding lines, you would want to check out the breeder and her dogs you are buying from. Unless of course you just want to breed commercially for profit
and are not bothered.

*
A typical additional charge is a $75 (€75) fee for the export pedigree in your name if you request one (a standard pedigree is included in the price but not so useful if transferal to your kennel club is needed).*


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## Shikoku (Dec 16, 2013)

That site is awful, how can people even consider buying a puppy like grocery shopping online  A dog that would hopefully be a member of your family for at least 10 years.

A good breeder wouldn't use that site. They want to talk to new owners to make sure they can offer the right home for one of their puppies... when you've put years of effort into training, health testing, showing or taking part in dog sports and raising a dog with good character, then spent months planning a litter- finding and travelling to a suitable stud that complements the female and her lines well and actually putting the time in to socialise and raise a litter... Good breeders want to know where the pups are going, they like to keep in touch and see how they develop with character and health issues, they are always available for help and advice if needed or even to take the dog back and they often have a very good support network in place. Many good breeders often have a waiting list even before a mating takes place.
Good breeders can be an invaluable source of information, they should be able to tell you all about the breed- including the bad points, the lines they are working with- both good and bad points, any known health issues within the lines which can't be tested for.

I have tried to import twice because the breed I like isn't recognised by the KC and the few 'breeders' here seem to mix them with anything for a bit of cash :Greedy
First attempt the puppy was sadly bitten by an Adder and heartbreakingly had to be put to sleep a little while later after complications from the bite 
Second attempt the breeder decided to keep the puppy after getting too attached, she told me this the day I was meant to go and collect the pup! A week later the breeder said she didn't have the time to raise a puppy so I could have the puppy but the breeder wanted even more money, nearly doubling the price agreed for the pup and gave me a week to get the money however after a couple of days I discovered she had sold the puppy to someone else without even telling me 

I went through national breed clubs, breeder's I trust personal recommendations and breed databases to find these breeders, also to check out the health results, show titles, working titles, bonitation results and lines they worked with for myself. I asked 101 questions, tried my very best to do things the right way but nothing is really guaranteed until you have the puppy in your hands at 15 weeks old travelling back to the UK, you have to completely trust these breeders on their word, trust them to socialise the pup well, complete the microchip, vaccines, worming and paperwork correctly but accidents can sadly happen or breeders can go back on their word.

After two devastating knocks, I have so many times thought about and been very tempted to just go to a backyard breeder, at least I would finally get my pup after over 3 years waiting and research without the whole asking questions process but after learning on here I am so determined not to encourage such breeding.

My advice, just be really careful. Importing can and does work out extremely well, Dogloverlou and shadowmare have both imported beautiful dogs


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## Meezey (Jan 29, 2013)

I don't understand why anyone would use this or even consider using it.

I am sorry to say if you import a puppy I don't think it should be any different to buying a pup in the UK! I wouldn't import but if I did I would make sure to visit mother and pups, I'd personally want to meet the breeder and see how their dogs are kept and judge their dogs myself rather than their or anyone else heresay! If I couldn't afford at least 2 trips, one to visit one to pick up pup I wouldn't do it. Importing should be no different than buying from UK. We flew and met Cian at 6 weeks, then drove to get him, Belfast to Scotland, then from Scotland to Birmingham, then back to Scotland. KT to London met her before, both breeders I've known for 15 plus years and know their dogs, but still wouldn't have taken either without meeting them first, OH drove 12 hour round trip to meet Eric and again to pick him up..


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

AceOfSpades113 said:


> Hello!
> I am curious, has anyone here ever used Europuppy? And if not, would you trust it? What are your thoughts on its ten year satisfaction guarantee?
> For those of you who don't know how it works, basically you pick the breed, find a puppy you want/like, then sent europuppy an email. You will never talk to the breeder personally, and there really isn't much information on the parents of the pup. All it tells you is the parents weight and occasionally height, yet sometimes neither which means many of the pups on it have NO information about their parents or breeders. When you do email them, if you ask for Heath Test results they tell you they don't have them as they are only the middle person basically.. I see its an advantage for worldwide trading of puppies to assist bloodlines and such, and erases the language barriers, but I just think it is far too easy to abuse, a relationship with a breeder is something I find important though, which is maybe what turns me off. It was how I was originally planning on getting my Komondor pup, but wasn't at all happy with the lack of information they were willing to tell me or of course the no contact with breeder, way I seen it I would rather pay the extra to know exactly who bred my pup and the health status of the parents. I would love to use this service in the late future but I just want to know what other peoples opinions are on it, the bits I like are getting around language barriers, and how it is easier with them doing all the arrangements, but the lack of information on the parents just bothers me, it makes me feel like something isn't right. Even when I am talking to a private breeder, if they are obviously withholding information or telling me 'the sire and dam of our bitch both passed their health tests, so we didn't see a need' It just turns me away, but that is a whole other topic. Puppies get a health certificate from 'their own private vet' and, over half of the puppies don't come with their papers. Oh, meant to add there is a Champion Bloodline: part which either has a tick or an x in it. There are also references of others who have gotten via the site which seem positive enough, and they funny enough have a Scam page to assure people that all pups are added by them. The standards of the site seems to have dropped, though. As they claim all dogs come with papers, yet if you actually search a dog breed often times it is listed as won't come with papers, so confusing
> So what do you think? Effective, or too easy to be abused? Well done to the people who gathered all those puppies information and such, a little more on the parents would make a world of difference! Very interested to see if anyone has got their pup this way and if so how they thought the process went.


If this isn't a major puppy farm it is a scam. Help with bloodlines? You''re having a laugh aren't you? These people couldn't care less about blood lines. No health tests, no kc registration, probably interbreeding and overbreeding. This is animal cruelty, pure and simple, and anyone who supports them by buying from them should be ashamed of themselves.

I have removed your link as we do not want to provide advertising for such an organisation.


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

newfiesmum said:


> If this isn't a major puppy farm it is a scam. Help with bloodlines? You''re having a laugh aren't you? These people couldn't care less about blood lines. No health tests, no kc registration, probably interbreeding and overbreeding. This is animal cruelty, pure and simple, and anyone who supports them by buying from them should be ashamed of themselves.
> 
> I have removed your link as we do not want to provide advertising for such an organisation.


Hello  There are other links on the thread too in other replies just FYI, and thank you for the edit.


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## Phoolf (Jun 13, 2012)

Sled dog hotel said:


> If you look in the FAQs section
> 
> It says that their puppies are registered with the Hungarian kennel club hence they come with a Hungarian pedigree
> 
> ...


How can they ship puppies at 12 weeks and collect at 10 when they won't have all the necessary shots and paperwork to obtain a fully legal pet passport? This is why I have to wait 4 months for Tornjak puppies to come over from Croatia so that all vaccinations required are completed and effective. Some people have criticised and asked questions about why the pups are so 'old' when they come over, but my understanding is that it's legislation that prevents them coming over earlier otherwise I'd have preferred to socialise myself (although the breeders there do a fab job anyway).

As for the website, just a back alley way to sell puppies imo. I've had no issues getting reputable puppies from Europe for myself as well as other people, despite any supposed language barrier. The majority of folk will speak a lot of English, or will have a wife, friend or family member to translate as I have found with various breeders in Croatia/Bosnia etc. I can't even imagine why anyone would even remotely consider using a website like Europuppy.


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## Magyarmum (Apr 27, 2015)

Phoolf said:


> How can they ship puppies at 12 weeks and collect at 10 when they won't have all the necessary shots and paperwork to obtain a fully legal pet passport? This is why I have to wait 4 months for Tornjak puppies to come over from Croatia so that all vaccinations required are completed and effective. Some people have criticised and asked questions about why the pups are so 'old' when they come over, but my understanding is that it's legislation that prevents them coming over earlier otherwise I'd have preferred to socialise myself (although the breeders there do a fab job anyway).
> 
> As for the website, just a back alley way to sell puppies imo. I've had no issues getting reputable puppies from Europe for myself as well as other people, despite any supposed language barrier. The majority of folk will speak a lot of English, or will have a wife, friend or family member to translate as I have found with various breeders in Croatia/Bosnia etc. I can't even imagine why anyone would even remotely consider using a website like Europuppy.


Unfortunately part of my reply somehow got deleted but this what I said....

I know of several Hungarian breeders who sell their puppies to overseas buyers and none of them ship the puppy before the age of 16 weeks. As for collecting a pup at 10 weeks old to transport to the UK for example, no respectable breeder or vet would allow it. By law all dogs have be vaccinated for Rabies by the age of 16 weeks and yearly thereafter. My own vet considers 16 weeks is too young, but having to comply with the law he vaccinates for Rabies a few days before the 16 week rule. NO dog can travel to another EU country until 21 days AFTER having the Rabies vac which can only be done AFTER the dog has been microchipped and AFTER having received all other necessary vaccinations This would mean that to leave the country at 10 weeks old the puppy would have had to had all its vaccinations, including the one for Rabies by the age of 7 weeks which IMO could/would put the puppy's health at risk.

I live in Hungary and what makes me see red about websites like this is the disservice it does not only to the country but also its people and more particularly the many ethical breeders who are dedicated to improving their chosen breed and the quality and health of the puppies they produce. Unfortunately, whilst ever there are gullible ill informed buyers its inevitable that scams like this one will keep on appearing! .


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## Laboosh1 (Jul 5, 2017)

shadowmare said:


> I'm afraid no decent breeder would use europuppy. Most breeders in Europe have their own websites so they get plenty of interest from buyers in other countries. There's also Facebook groups for selling puppies or enquiring about buying a puppy from another country.


This is where I am confused. My mum has done a lot of homework on a puppy/young dog. She put me in touch with a lady who comes highly recommend by the breed. However she is on europuppy. I wouldn't touch europuppy with a barge pole. Very confused now.


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## Phoolf (Jun 13, 2012)

Laboosh1 said:


> This is where I am confused. My mum has done a lot of homework on a puppy/young dog. She put me in touch with a lady who comes highly recommend by the breed. However she is on europuppy. I wouldn't touch europuppy with a barge pole. Very confused now.


Does she also have her own website, transparent kennel history and details, show/work her dogs and tick other features of an ethical breeder (proven health TESTS not checks for example)?


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## Laboosh1 (Jul 5, 2017)

Thank you for getting back to me. No website. Yes fb page. She is on Champdogs too. She is getting rid of a 2yr old. I don't have to have a puppy. But she was passed to us by the breed association. That is what I find most strange.


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

That site has 'don't touch with a bardge pole' written all over it to me.


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## Laboosh1 (Jul 5, 2017)

Animallover26 said:


> That site has 'don't touch with a bardge pole' written all over it to me.


I don't see how you can be part of the champ dog community and Europuppy. Plus be recommended by the breed association. Perhaps I should mention it to them.


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

Laboosh1 said:


> I don't see how you can be part of the champ dog community and Europuppy. Plus be recommended by the breed association. Perhaps I should mention it to them.


No, sorry, wasn't talking about your post. I just saw the OP and responded without reading the other replies.


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## lullabydream (Jun 25, 2013)

Have you found the breeder on the KC site too...not that it ways means a lot but is she an assured breeder? Some cases it's a step in the right direction others don't agree with the whole 'assured breeder'.

Not all on champ dogs are great breeders, have seen some terrible chihuahua breeders there myself but it's quite a good place to start.. 

The breed club though...am kind of with you on that one...


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## Phoolf (Jun 13, 2012)

Laboosh1 said:


> Thank you for getting back to me. No website. Yes fb page. She is on Champdogs too. She is getting rid of a 2yr old. I don't have to have a puppy. But she was passed to us by the breed association. That is what I find most strange.


Do you know why she's rehoming? I assume the dog is not show worthy or going to be bred from?

So long as the breeder ticks all relevant breed tests etc. then I don't see any issue with it. I imagine some people join Europuppy so they have a presence to a wider audience.


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## dorrit (Sep 13, 2011)

After all the Tv and media coverage of the horrors of puppy farms does anyone seriously think this is a good idea ? It goes against all sensible advice.

Id say anyone using such an organisation need A to have their head examined and B Not to be left in charge of anything more complicated or valuable than a shopping trolley


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## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

As far as I'm considered, there are only two places to buy a puppies/dogs, that's from a breeder where you can see the puppies with there Mother and Siblings or from a rescue/breed rescue. On-line is just crazy.

Well that's just what I think.


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

Happy Paws said:


> As far as I'm considered, there are only two places to buy a puppies/dogs, that's from a breeder where you can see the puppies with there Mother and Siblings or from a rescue/breed rescue. On-line is just crazy.
> 
> Well that's just what I think.


I agree.

I knew someone who paid hundreds of pounds on line for a King Charles Cavalier and was surprised when they waited at the motorway services, as arranged, but the dog never turned up - and the website vanished! 

Caveat Emptor!


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## JoanneF (Feb 1, 2016)

Lurcherlad said:


> I agree.
> 
> I knew someone who paid hundreds of pounds on line for a King Charles Cavalier and was surprised when they waited at the motorway services, as arranged, but the dog never turned up - and the website vanished!
> 
> Caveat Emptor!


The only 'good' thing about this is that the dog probably never existed in the first place.


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## Trickster (Nov 13, 2017)

You don't know it's a scam or anything else. If you actually look at whatever breed, it shows you get health certificate, microchip, shipping crate, 10 year guarantee, and FCI pedigree. And for why they are so expensive it's because everything that I've named are included with them which cost money. So before you judge something do your homework. Just because they have breeders from Europe doesn't mean their bad ones, that their scams or anything


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

Health certificate for what? Something that says the vet has seen the dog and declares it's alright or are these health tests on the parents of the puppy?


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## Rafa (Jun 18, 2012)

Trickster said:


> You don't know it's a scam or anything else. If you actually look at whatever breed, it shows you get health certificate, microchip, shipping crate, 10 year guarantee, and FCI pedigree. And for why they are so expensive it's because everything that I've named are included with them which cost money. So before you judge something do your homework. Just because they have breeders from Europe doesn't mean their bad ones, that their scams or anything


A ten year guarantee?

Guarantee of what?


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## Guest (Nov 13, 2017)

of fraud.


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## JoanneF (Feb 1, 2016)

What an odd first post.


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

JoanneF said:


> What an odd first post.


It is isnt it. I wonder hidden agenda the op has


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## Trickster (Nov 13, 2017)

Siskin said:


> Health certificate for what? Something that says the vet has seen the dog and declares it's alright or are these health tests on the parents of the puppy?


for the puppy


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## Trickster (Nov 13, 2017)

Sweety said:


> A ten year guarantee?
> 
> Guarantee of what?


their health


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## JoanneF (Feb 1, 2016)

Siskin said:


> It is isnt it. I wonder hidden agenda the op has


I meant the new posts ...


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

Trickster said:


> their health


So the puppy gets ill, then what happens? Is it taken away and replaced with a healthy puppy?

I would far rather have health test certificates showing that the puppies parents have been tested and do not have the various congenital problems present in the breed then a piece of paper from a vet saying that on the day he saw the puppy it was alive and well


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

JoanneF said:


> I meant the new posts ...


Sorry, so did I


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## JoanneF (Feb 1, 2016)

Trickster said:


> their health


And how does that work? Suppose the dog contracts, say, kennel cough at the age of 9?


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## Rafa (Jun 18, 2012)

Trickster said:


> their health


What rubbish.

Absolutely impossible to guarantee perfect health for any animal for ten years.

That's a fraudulent claim to begin with.

Who are you anyway?


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## ladybattenburg (Oct 24, 2017)

Horrific.

I will have nightmares about puppies ordered online like shoes and delivered with the post.... Not only would I never trust them, I'd happily support a movement to get that kind of dog-f*****y shut down.


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

Sweety said:


> Absolutely impossible to guarantee perfect health for any animal for ten years.


When you read through the list of exclusions, nearly every ailment imaginable is excluded from the 'guarantee'!


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## Diana Grossman (Feb 13, 2020)

AceOfSpades113 said:


> Hello!
> I am curious, has anyone here ever used Europuppy? And if not, would you trust it? What are your thoughts on its ten year satisfaction guarantee?
> For those of you who don't know how it works, basically you pick the breed, find a puppy you want/like, then sent europuppy an email. You will never talk to the breeder personally, and there really isn't much information on the parents of the pup. All it tells you is the parents weight and occasionally height, yet sometimes neither which means many of the pups on it have NO information about their parents or breeders. When you do email them, if you ask for Heath Test results they tell you they don't have them as they are only the middle person basically.. I see its an advantage for worldwide trading of puppies to assist bloodlines and such, and erases the language barriers, but I just think it is far too easy to abuse, a relationship with a breeder is something I find important though, which is maybe what turns me off. It was how I was originally planning on getting my Komondor pup, but wasn't at all happy with the lack of information they were willing to tell me or of course the no contact with breeder, way I seen it I would rather pay the extra to know exactly who bred my pup and the health status of the parents. I would love to use this service in the late future but I just want to know what other peoples opinions are on it, the bits I like are getting around language barriers, and how it is easier with them doing all the arrangements, but the lack of information on the parents just bothers me, it makes me feel like something isn't right. Even when I am talking to a private breeder, if they are obviously withholding information or telling me 'the sire and dam of our bitch both passed their health tests, so we didn't see a need' It just turns me away, but that is a whole other topic. Puppies get a health certificate from 'their own private vet' and, over half of the puppies don't come with their papers. Oh, meant to add there is a Champion Bloodline: part which either has a tick or an x in it. There are also references of others who have gotten via the site which seem positive enough, and they funny enough have a Scam page to assure people that all pups are added by them. The standards of the site seems to have dropped, though. As they claim all dogs come with papers, yet if you actually search a dog breed often times it is listed as won't come with papers, so confusing
> So what do you think? Effective, or too easy to be abused? Well done to the people who gathered all those puppies information and such, a little more on the parents would make a world of difference! Very interested to see if anyone has got their pup this way and if so how they thought the process went.


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## Diana Grossman (Feb 13, 2020)

I realize you posted this a few years ago but I found your board this evening and I just uploaded a review I wrote on trust pilot regarding a very depressing experience I had purchasing a very sick ovtcharka puppy who died 5 years later of incurable bone marrow cancer.
Here's what I wrote on trustpilot this evening regarding my experience with Europuppy.

I need to warn everyone here that a beautiful 4.5 month old caucasian mountain dog came to me shipped by euro puppy already quite sick and traumatized by his long distance flight from Hungary to Chicago in 2005. I used europuppy and they are animal brokers not breeders. I met my beautiful puppy at the airport and unfortunately he was deeply traumatized from his long journey. I'm safely assuming that because he always had digestive issues he may have already had genetic problems because at the age of only five years old my young ovtcharka Troika was diagnosed with an incurable form of bone marrow cancer. I believe I paid $1600 or more for my dog which included travel expenses from Hungary. When I shared this event with Europuppy they were completely insensitive and unapologetic stating that after one year they are no longer responsible and they will not send me a healthy puppy or issue me a credit to purchase another puppy because I didn't purchase certain paperwork guaranteeing health. I do not recommend this particular animal broker. I suggest everyone reading this review that it's better to purchase a puppy from a reputable breeder not a third party animal broker like europuppy.

Europuppy are animal brokers and honestly I'm assuming they deal with puppy mills.
Please note I was not offered sympathy or the offer of a new puppy.


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## Blitz (Feb 12, 2009)

Diana Grossman said:


> I realize you posted this a few years ago but I found your board this evening and I just uploaded a review I wrote on trust pilot regarding a very depressing experience I had purchasing a very sick ovtcharka puppy who died 5 years later of incurable bone marrow cancer.
> Here's what I wrote on trustpilot this evening regarding my experience with Europuppy.
> 
> I need to warn everyone here that a beautiful 4.5 month old caucasian mountain dog came to me shipped by euro puppy already quite sick and traumatized by his long distance flight from Hungary to Chicago in 2005. I used europuppy and they are animal brokers not breeders. I met my beautiful puppy at the airport and unfortunately he was deeply traumatized from his long journey. I'm safely assuming that because he always had digestive issues he may have already had genetic problems because at the age of only five years old my young ovtcharka Troika was diagnosed with an incurable form of bone marrow cancer. I believe I paid $1600 or more for my dog which included travel expenses from Hungary. When I shared this event with Europuppy they were completely insensitive and unapologetic stating that after one year they are no longer responsible and they will not send me a healthy puppy or issue me a credit to purchase another puppy because I didn't purchase certain paperwork guaranteeing health. I do not recommend this particular animal broker. I suggest everyone reading this review that it's better to purchase a puppy from a reputable breeder not a third party animal broker like europuppy.
> ...


I agree that the whole thing is disgusting but why on earth would you expect a replacement puppy after 5 years. That would be ridiculous. It does not sound as though you paid over the odds either if that included transport. I would not have thought it was a cheap breed to buy and I would not expect them to have long lives either. I know someone who had a rescue ovcharka that died of cancer quite young, I wonder if they are prone to it. Very sorry that you have lost your dog but you cannot blame anyone for it, it was just one of those things.


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## Diana Grossman (Feb 13, 2020)

I believe memories have failed me. I think I paid $1600 for my puppy which included a 1 year health warranty for my new puppy's health. 
Back then I did not realize that Europuppy was am outfit of brokers that buy these dogs from puppy mill sources in Europe. 
My first ovtcharka lived to be 9 years of age and I purchased her from a breeder in upstate New York here in the United States. She had to be put down in my home because of hip dysplasia. She had arthritis at an early age and was diagnosed with arthritis at 6 months.
The breeder in new York was sorrowful and offered me a healthy ovtcharka from a different litter but I had grown deeply attached to Mishka and didn't need two giant dogs.
My third baby was purchased in Illinois and she cost me 1500. 
As I recall europuppy sold me troika for 1600 and then the additional travel fees. 
My 3rd ovtcharka is disease free, cancer free and she's 11 years old.
You seem not to understand that my purpose here is to be honest and dissuade potential buyers from using animal brokers.
You are absolutely wrong regarding caucasian mountain dogs and a propensity to have cancer and or incurable illnesses.
Yes any dog can have cancer but inbreeding and over breeding tends to cause these genetic illnesses and not the breed.
Since age 30 I've owned three different caucasian mountain dogs and only my 2nd from Europuppy had extreme problems digesting food. He would vomit or have diarrhea throughout his life. I fed him high quality dog food and my own cooking but he couldn't seem to gain enough weight like my two other caucasian mountain dogs did.
Please don't argue with me on this forum .
Europuppy's treatment of me was callous and definitely defensive. 
My only concern here is that the general public understands what they are potentially getting into. I can't bring Troika back to life but I need to be honest here and warn others.
Ovtcharka in general are a HEALTHY, HARDY,LOYAL BREED. ANY reputable breeder tests for hip dysplasia and genetic cancer and temperament.
Europuppy is a third party and they aren't breeders nor do they check for your future puppy's genetic bloodline or health. 
You can buy a warranty but that might be limited to one year of purchase. 
I will not argue online here nor was that my purpose. I want to share my truthful story.


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## moomoowawa (May 19, 2019)

Diana Grossman said:


> I believe memories have failed me. I think I paid $1600 for my puppy which included a 1 year health warranty for my new puppy's health.
> Back then I did not realize that Europuppy was am outfit of brokers that buy these dogs from puppy mill sources in Europe.
> My first ovtcharka lived to be 9 years of age and I purchased her from a breeder in upstate New York here in the United States. She had to be put down in my home because of hip dysplasia. She had arthritis at an early age and was diagnosed with arthritis at 6 months.
> The breeder in new York was sorrowful and offered me a healthy ovtcharka from a different litter but I had grown deeply attached to Mishka and didn't need two giant dogs.
> ...


How about you stop treating animals like designer goods you order and click and have shipped halfway across the world? Irrespective of anything else, unless it's a rescue situation, why would you ever think shipping a baby animal from Europe to the States would be a restful or pleasant experience for the puppy? How did you justify that to yourself?

You are part of the problem.


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## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

I know it's an old thread. I just want to say, if you are going to buy a puppy go onto the breed forums, read what they say about the breed, then look at the list of members who breed, find one you like, then go and see them and only buy a puppy if you see it with it's Mother and Siblings. Never buy a puppy that you don't see with it's Mother.


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

moomoowawa said:


> How about you stop treating animals like designer goods you order and click and have shipped halfway across the world? Irrespective of anything else, unless it's a rescue situation, why would you ever think shipping a baby animal from Europe to the States would be a restful or pleasant experience for the puppy? How did you justify that to yourself?
> 
> You are part of the problem.


That's very harshly put, but I really can't disagree.


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## Magyarmum (Apr 27, 2015)

Diana Grossman said:


> I realize you posted this a few years ago but I found your board this evening and I just uploaded a review I wrote on trust pilot regarding a very depressing experience I had purchasing a very sick ovtcharka puppy who died 5 years later of incurable bone marrow cancer.
> Here's what I wrote on trustpilot this evening regarding my experience with Europuppy.
> 
> I need to warn everyone here that a beautiful 4.5 month old caucasian mountain dog came to me shipped by euro puppy already quite sick and traumatized by his long distance flight from Hungary to Chicago in 2005. I used europuppy and they are animal brokers not breeders. I met my beautiful puppy at the airport and unfortunately he was deeply traumatized from his long journey. I'm safely assuming that because he always had digestive issues he may have already had genetic problems because at the age of only five years old my young ovtcharka Troika was diagnosed with an incurable form of bone marrow cancer. I believe I paid $1600 or more for my dog which included travel expenses from Hungary. When I shared this event with Europuppy they were completely insensitive and unapologetic stating that after one year they are no longer responsible and they will not send me a healthy puppy or issue me a credit to purchase another puppy because I didn't purchase certain paperwork guaranteeing health. I do not recommend this particular animal broker. I suggest everyone reading this review that it's better to purchase a puppy from a reputable breeder not a third party animal broker like europuppy.
> ...


Can I ask why it's taken you 15 years to write to Trust Pilot complaining about Europuppy?

As you profess a good knowledge of the breed, did you not ask what health tests had been performed before you agreed to the purchase?

If the puppy was sick when he arrived in the US surely you took him to the vet immediately and reported the results of the vet's assessment straight back to Europuppy? And when the dog suffered ongoing health problems were Europuppy kept informed?

Presumably being a pure bred the dog would be FCI registered and you would have been sent a copy of his pedigree which would have given the name and address of his breeder with whom you could have contacted directly?

Just asking out of curiosity!


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## Woah (Dec 24, 2018)

Who is their right mind would seek a dog by these means? Should be illegal.


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## Nursefurlife (Sep 6, 2020)

Hi, I unfortunately I spent over $6000 for a dog that 6 months later I have yet to receive from Europuppy. 6 months in and going back and forth with these people, they have yet to produce a dog. They keep giving excuses and in the open contract/terms and conditions it mentions in section 8 &9 that if they don't ship the dog on time, (at 4 months old) of course for any unforeseen reason you have breached the contract and they don't have to give you the cost of the dog, just the shipping cost will be refunded to you. They even asked for an additional $1200 to ship the dog in 2 weeks guaranteed because they needed a bigger cage and someone to drive the dog to Ukraine where they could get a flight. So 1 this happens often and 2 you could potentially be getting a dog a year old at a premium puppy price. I have asked them to ship to any of the 50 states and I would be there to pick it up. NOT 1 flight to any of the 50 states they could fly that puppy to? So anyone thinking of buying from them. I have seen similar reviews as well. Think twice. I am now going to my credit card company to attempt to recoup some money back. And I'm currently looking for a reputable breeder. Lesson learned!


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## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

Lesson learnt the hard way. 
I'm sorry this has happen to you, but you should NEVER buy a puppy without seeing it with it's Mother and Siblings and check the breeder and make sure it had all the Health Tests for the breed.


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