# Pancreatitis in cats



## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

My Nfc has been diagnosed with Pancreatitis, not sure if its chronic or acute though. He has the runs and has been sick a few times. At the moment he is eating ID dry as it is the only thing that is helping him, but after a couple of weeks he has had the runs a couple of times. Not sure what to give him, the vet says low cholestreal and high protein. Anyone have any ideas, will be seeing the vet tomorrow for a Vit B shot. JJ is 11 years old


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## Treaclesmum (Sep 26, 2011)

Hi sorry to hear this. Have you tried Digestive enzymes for cats?


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

What is that Treaclesmum?


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## Treaclesmum (Sep 26, 2011)

jenny armour said:


> What is that Treaclesmum?


I've just bought a product called Maxxidigest cat enzymes from Amazon and started my cat Pudding on it. She is only on day 2 but already showing a big improvement in her bowel movements.

Have you tried your cat on grain free food as Hills ID doesn't sound very good to me, it contains maize.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

So far I have tried Almo nature sensitive, C|arney, Fine catz, Bozita. he has either not liked it or it hasnt agreed with him. I will speak to the vet tomorrow about the digestive enzymes



Treaclesmum said:


> I've just bought a product called Maxxidigest cat enzymes from Amazon and started my cat Pudding on it. She is only on day 2 but already showing a big improvement in her bowel movements.
> 
> Have you tried your cat on grain free food as Hills ID doesn't sound very good to me, it contains maize.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> My Nfc has been diagnosed with Pancreatitis, not sure if its chronic or acute though. He has the runs and has been sick a few times. At the moment he is eating ID dry as it is the only thing that is helping him, but after a couple of weeks he has had the runs a couple of times. Not sure what to give him, the vet says low cholestreal and high protein. Anyone have any ideas, will be seeing the vet tomorrow for a Vit B shot. JJ is 11 years old


Hi Jenny, poor JJ, it's not a nice condition. I had a cat with it & you might want to consider joining the Feline Pancreatic Group. The B12 injections were very good for my cat, but then they couldn't get them and instead gave her Cobalaplex tablets. She had a low dose of steroids too for years and they helped enormously. I think your vet may have said a low fat diet? My cat tried many cat foods and you must introduce the foods very gradually, very slowly, so expect to waste some of the food initially. It's useful to keep a food and healthy diary. The food my cat did best on was Animonda Vom Feinsten for neutered cats, pure turkey flavour. She also did well on the same make, chicken livers flavour and also the turkey and salmon flavour. She did well on Macs sensitive turkey flavour and Macs turkey and veal, all from Zooplus... there are other suppliers, but are more expensive. The AVF is low in fat, grain free, around 57% meat, 12% protein etc... see attachment for exact info. She was ok on Miamor Ragout Royale in jelly (turkey, veal, not the fish). The right food helped reduce vomiting and it helped too to feed many small meals, as apposed to two or three large meals, including at least one meal over night... think at least one meal every 5 hrs. If she had a bout of diarrhoea, an oz of roast chicken or roast turkey would help, or mackerel fillets, or (initially) white fish. Lots of water should be made available and multiple litter trays and as little stress as possible. I've heard of many cats with this condition having pain killers and anti nausea medication, but my vet's & my specialist vet seemed against this. Ask your vet? My cat got worse once given antibiotics to clear up a bacterial infection, leaving her with liquid diarrhoea, but I presume it helps many other cats, or they wouldn't prescribe it(?!). I hope your cat finds a good wet diet.
P.S did you know the Arabic word for chicken is JJ!!
https://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats/canned_cat_food_pouches/animonda/trays/523945


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Hi Jenny, poor JJ, it's not a nice condition. I had a cat with it & you might want to consider joining the Feline Pancreatic Group. The B12 injections were very good for my cat, but then they couldn't get them and instead gave her Cobalaplex tablets. She had a low dose of steroids too for years and they helped enormously. I think your vet may have said a low fat diet? My cat tried many cat foods and you must introduce the foods very gradually, very slowly, so expect to waste some of the food initially. It's useful to keep a food and healthy diary. The food my cat did best on was Animonda Vom Feinsten for neutered cats, pure turkey flavour. She also did well on the same make, chicken livers flavour and also the turkey and salmon flavour. She did well on Macs sensitive turkey flavour and Macs turkey and veal, all from Zooplus... there are other suppliers, but are more expensive. The AVF is low in fat, grain free, around 57% meat, 12% protein etc... see attachment for exact info. She was ok on Miamor Ragout Royale in jelly (turkey, veal, not the fish). The right food helped reduce vomiting and it helped too to feed many small meals, as apposed to two or three large meals, including at least one meal over night... think at least one meal every 5 hrs. If she had a bou.t of diarrhoea, an oz of roast chicken or roast turkey would help, or mackerel fillets, or (initially) white fish. Lots of water should be made available and multiple litter trays and as little stress as possible. I've heard of many cats with this condition having pain killers and anti nausea medication, but my vet's & my specialist vet seemed against this. Ask your vet? My cat got worse once given antibiotics to clear up a bacterial infection, leaving her with liquid diarrhoea, but I presume it helps many other cats, or they wouldn't prescribe it(?!). I hope your cat finds a good wet diet.
> P.S did you know the Arabic word for chicken is JJ!!
> https://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats/canned_cat_food_pouches/animonda/trays/523945


Thank you for your info TRiTri. I do have plenty of water around as I have six indoor cats and two dogs, so they are given fresh water everyday. Talking about antibiotics, JJ was prescribed Metrobactin but it made him worse regarding diarrhoea and I had trouble giving him the tablets as they tasted awful and he wouldnt swallow them. I will speak to the vet tomorrow when he goes for his jab. Funnily enough I two more cats with IBS and an intestinal problem, one is a raggie Oliver and the other is another Nfc Nellie, (she is also on Cobalaplex) but they both have different food, although the raggie can eat the Nfcs wet food but not the other way round. I did try one of the MIamor food but JJ didnt like it. I have an account with Zooplus (I must be one of their best customers) so that isnt a problem. There is a few litter trays around but I noticed that since this problem JJ sometimes uses my bathroom floor maybe because the others are using them . As for stress I also noticed that he goes under my bed some of the time probably to get away from the others. Also I have been giving him furball paste as he suffers from alot of furballs. I am hoping if this is successful as he is losing weight, three years ago he was 7 kgs he is now 4.5. 
P.S. I will have to start calling JJ, chicken then lol


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Thank you for your info TRiTri. I do have plenty of water around as I have six indoor cats and two dogs, so they are given fresh water everyday. Talking about antibiotics, JJ was prescribed Metrobactin but it made him worse regarding diarrhoea and I had trouble giving him the tablets as they tasted awful and he wouldnt swallow them. I will speak to the vet tomorrow when he goes for his jab. Funnily enough I two more cats with IBS and an intestinal problem, one is a raggie Oliver and the other is another Nfc Nellie, (she is also on Cobalaplex) but they both have different food, although the raggie can eat the Nfcs wet food but not the other way round. I did try one of the MIamor food but JJ didnt like it. I have an account with Zooplus (I must be one of their best customers) so that isnt a problem. There is a few litter trays around but I noticed that since this problem JJ sometimes uses my bathroom floor maybe because the others are using them . As for stress I also noticed that he goes under my bed some of the time probably to get away from the others. Also I have been giving him furball paste as he suffers from alot of furballs. I am hoping if this is successful as he is losing weight, three years ago he was 7 kgs he is now 4.5.
> P.S. I will have to start calling JJ, chicken then lol


How lovely, I use to have 5 cats at once.
On the litter tray front, as there are problems, I highly recommend a large (or was it extra large?) Catit hooded litter tray, but take the hood off! It's huge, so everything stays in the tray and it's large, so if he needs to use it multiple times (e.g in quick succession, or before you have time to clean it out), there's plenty of room in it. I use to put puppy pads under the litter trays too. Put it where no cats or people are passing, somewhere "private."
What's a raggie? (My sister's getting a puppy called Nellie this week!). I think the different Miamor foods vary depending on the name, but the other food makes mine had, had more meat content anyway. To get my dear cat to take meds, I hid them in either Easypill cat putty (from Viovet.. online) or in Greenies pill pockets, best price from a chap on EBay. She thought they were treats. I had a pill popper for backup and as long as I did it quickly, she barely didn't notice me doing it, but I felt the putty type things were kinder to give her.

IMO from what I have seen and read, I think stress and IBD are related. Peace and quiet, with her own private get away space, lots of tlc and a good diet, should go a long way. As your dear cat has lost so much weight, you might want to refer him to a specialist? Could he have a bacterial infection? Has he been tested for EPI? It might be worth checking. Has he had any ultrasound? Please let me know how he gets on. Good luck and best wishes to you all.
Edit: by the way, I think the fur-ball thing is a red herring and a vomiting problem caused by food intolerances. There may well be fur in the vomit, but I suspect there's a bit more to it than that. Check with your vet. Chillminx could advise you on dealing with food intolerances, if it's that.


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

@jenny armour -

When the pancreas becomes inflamed, the flow of enzymes into the digestive tract can become disrupted, forcing the enzymes out of the pancreas and into the abdominal area. When this happens the digestive enzymes start breaking down the fat and proteins in other organs, as well as in the pancreas. In effect, the body begins to digest itself.

Digestive enzymes aren't recommended for treating pancreatitis. (They are often used for treating EPI (Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency).

Inflammation of the pancreas is not due to nutritional causes in cats. Treatment for pancreatitis is mainly supportive -- fluid therapy, pain relief, medicine to control nausea and vomiting, + possibly antibiotics. Because of the link between intestinal inflammation and pancreatitis, a short course of steroids may be prescribed.

Keeping the patient hydrated is vital. Pancreatitis in cats is not related to the fat content in their food, so patients do not need to eat low-fat foods. Cats that stop eating are at risk of liver lipidosis, so it is vital your cat keeps eating, any type of of healthy wet food your cat will eat, and even high fat foods are OK.

The Animonda Vom Feinsten for neutered cats Pure Turkey that TriTri suggested is a good idea, as it is light and palatable and if your cat has any inflammation in her intestines it will be easy for her to digest. And lots of small meals as TriTri also said. 

If she likes home cooked food consider some meats (pot-roasted in the oven to conserve nutrients) such as chicken or turkey. And poached white fish. Serve plenty of the cooking juices with the meats to ensure she is kept hydrated.

I hope this is helpful Jenny


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Ragdoll!! Finally worked it out :Hilarious.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Hi Jenny, poor JJ, it's not a nice condition. I had a cat with it & you might want to consider joining the Feline Pancreatic Group. The B12 injections were very good for my cat, but then they couldn't get them and instead gave her Cobalaplex tablets. She had a low dose of steroids too for years and they helped enormously. I think your vet may have said a low fat diet? My cat tried many cat foods and you must introduce the foods very gradually, very slowly, so expect to waste some of the food initially. It's useful to keep a food and healthy diary. The food my cat did best on was Animonda Vom Feinsten for neutered cats, pure turkey flavour. She also did well on the same make, chicken livers flavour and also the turkey and salmon flavour. She did well on Macs sensitive turkey flavour and Macs turkey and veal, all from Zooplus... there are other suppliers, but are more expensive. The AVF is low in fat, grain free, around 57% meat, 12% protein etc... see attachment for exact info. She was ok on Miamor Ragout Royale in jelly (turkey, veal, not the fish). The right food helped reduce vomiting and it helped too to feed many small meals, as apposed to two or three large meals, including at least one meal over night... think at least one meal every 5 hrs. If she had a bout of diarrhoea, an oz of roast chicken or roast turkey would help, or mackerel fillets, or (initially) white fish. Lots of water should be made available and multiple litter trays and as little stress as possible. I've heard of many cats with this condition having pain killers and anti nausea medication, but my vet's & my specialist vet seemed against this. Ask your vet? My cat got worse once given antibiotics to clear up a bacterial infection, leaving her with liquid diarrhoea, but I presume it helps many other cats, or they wouldn't prescribe it(?!). I hope your cat finds a good wet diet.
> P.S did you know the Arabic word for chicken is JJ!!
> https://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats/canned_cat_food_pouches/animonda/trays/523945


Hi TriTri cant find the Macs chicken livers. JJ was blood tested for just Pancreatitis not EPI, he didnt need that. The vet also recommended Crave sensitive but I didnt like the look of that. He had diarrhoea again this morning so must get some food that will agree with him. What about Carney or Finecatz, have some in the cupboard at the moment>


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Ragdoll!! Finally worked it out :Hilarious.


Sorry forgot to tell you, have ordered a few of the Animonda Von Feinsten Tuekey hope he likes it and it works xx


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Sorry forgot to tell you, have ordered a few of the Animonda Von Feinsten Tuekey hope he likes it and it works xx


I do too! It's one my cat Max has also liked and done well on, as well as Tessy. It's good to find a food that they don't get bored of and they do well on. Fingers crossed.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

will let you know


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## Treaclesmum (Sep 26, 2011)

I wish my cats liked AVF but sadly they don't 

The Animonda Integra Intestinal turkey flavour looks lovely, it is a coarse pate with jelly, but Pudding only had a very small amount then rejected the rest. Its so hard to find something good for them.


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

jenny armour said:


> JJ was blood tested for just Pancreatitis not EPI, he didnt need that.


Yes, the symptoms of EPI are different to those of pancreatitis - different treatment


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Hi TriTri cant find the Macs chicken livers. JJ was blood tested for just Pancreatitis not EPI, he didnt need that.  The vet also recommended Crave sensitive but I didnt like the look of that. He had diarrhoea again this morning so must get some food that will agree with him. What about Carney or Finecatz, have some in the cupboard at the moment>


That's good. The Animonda Vom Feinsten do the chicken livers flavour, but Zooplus don't always sell it on its own, without other ones. The turkey hearts is ok to feed occasionally, the poultry and veal I think from memory, too. My cats tried several dozen of the flavours and we ended up with half a dozen they were ok with, and definitely not the senior ones! Macs would be mono sensitive in turkey (or lamb) or Macs turkey & veal... they do a large tin of the turkey and veal for just over a pound, ideal for a multi cat household. I've never bought the Carney, sos. Not sure about the Finecatz. Bozita beef was ok for a while, that's another jelly one. Fresh 5% fat beef mince or turkey mince were good too.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Dont worry I have plenty of food that four of my cats will eat it if they like it, as long as I can find one that not only JJ like but will help him x


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Treaclesmum said:


> I wish my cats liked AVF but sadly they don't
> 
> The Animonda Integra Intestinal turkey flavour looks lovely, it is a coarse pate with jelly, but Pudding only had a very small amount then rejected the rest. Its so hard to find something good for them.


Which one is AVF? Does Pudding have pancreatitis as well?


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

I had a boy with chronic pancreatitis. I kept him stable for years with B12 injections at the beginning, then a low dose of steroids, anti-nausea meds and sub-cut fluids twice a week. He did not have diarrhoea but my vet was always warning me of the danger of triaditis which is a combination of pancreas, liver and small intestine inflammation. Has your boy had any other investigations apart from the fpl blood test?

I did not have to change my boy's food. He carried on having home-cooked meat and fish always available especially at night with extra treat foods after his meds.

Some friends have a boy with chronic pancreatitis and he does not have B12 injections but he does have daily cobalaplex and Omeprazole. Again, he does not have special food but one of his owners sometimes gets up twice in the night to ensure he eats regularly. He is 15 now and is doing well.


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## Treaclesmum (Sep 26, 2011)

jenny armour said:


> Which one is AVF? Does Pudding have pancreatitis as well?


I hope not, but she seems to have IBD. I will find out more at her vet check on Friday. AVF is the Animonda for neuteted cats.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

QOTN said:


> I had a boy with chronic pancreatitis. I kept him stable for years with B12 injections at the beginning, then a low dose of steroids, anti-nausea meds and sub-cut fluids twice a week. He did not have diarrhoea but my vet was always warning me of the danger of triaditis which is a combination of pancreas, liver and small intestine inflammation. Has your boy had any other investigations apart from the fpl blood test?
> 
> I did not have to change my boy's food. He carried on having home-cooked meat and fish always available especially at night with extra treat foods after his meds.
> 
> Some friends have a boy with chronic pancreatitis and he does not have B12 injections but he does have daily cobalaplex and Omeprazole. Again, he does not have special food but one of his owners sometimes gets up twice in the night to ensure he eats regularly. He is 15 now and is doing well.


The only other initial blood test was for kidneys, liver, thyroid etc, which came back clear which lead onto the pancreatitis and intestine test. JJ cannot now tolerate sensitive now, but could initially. There is still a suggestion of having a body scan to make sure there is nothing else there like tumours and that it is faeces. He has put a little weight back on since last Friday.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Thank you I realised afterwards what AVF was


Treaclesmum said:


> I hope not, but she seems to have IBD. I will find out more at her vet check on Friday. AVF is the Animonda for neuteted cats.


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

jenny armour said:


> The only other initial blood test was for kidneys, liver, thyroid etc, which came back clear which lead onto the pancreatitis and intestine test. JJ cannot now tolerate sensitive now, but could initially. There is still a suggestion of having a body scan to make sure there is nothing else there like tumours and that it is faeces. He has put a little weight back on since last Friday.


Sorry, I have missed mention of the intestine test. What was discovered?


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Nothing was mentioned about the intestines, only the pancreas


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

jenny armour said:


> will let you know


Update on JJ, AVF arrived from Zooplus this morning along with the Macs (which I havent tried yet). The AVF I gave him a third of a third of a tray, which went down very well. JJ says thank you very much, hope it lasts lol. Will give him a little more later on this evening


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Update on JJ, AVF arrived from Zooplus this morning along with the Macs (which I havent tried yet). The AVF I gave him a third of a third of a tray, which went down very well. JJ says thank you very much, hope it lasts lol. Will give him a little more later on this evening


Wonderful news. Stick with it "JJ Chicken." I can't recommend it highly enough. Leave the Macs for a while. The slower the change overs are, the better.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

I'm going to start clucking at him next lol. He's waiting patiently for his next meal x


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Is JJ still eating the Animonda Vom Feinsten @jenny armour ?


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Is JJ still eating the Animonda Vom Feinsten @jenny armour ?


Hi TriTri. He is and loves it, but I made the mistake on Saturday of giving him just that, instead of mixing it with his normal food. So Sunday, I started again. He loves it but I'm not sure how its effecting his stomach,as he covers his poo when he is outside (they have a spot in their pen for poo). I'm not giving him much, he is only on the second tray since Saturday. He is due his second B12 injection on Wednesday


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Hi TriTri. He is and loves it, but I made the mistake on Saturday of giving him just that, instead of mixing it with his normal food. So Sunday, I started again. He loves it but I'm not sure how its effecting his stomach,as he covers his poo when he is outside (they have a spot in their pen for poo). I'm not giving him much, he is only on the second tray since Saturday. He is due his second B12 injection on Wednesday


Hi, that sounds promising. Weekly B12 shots to start with, is it? Good. When you've time, it's worth dissecting things in "that area of the pen" to see how JJ's really doing :Vomit :Woot.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

A quick update on JJ. He currently is not eating the AVF so am having to wean him onto Macs. Hope this isnt going to be often, could run out of things to give him. Has anyone tried Krave for cats?


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> A quick update on JJ. He currently is not eating the AVF so am having to wean him onto Macs. Hope this isnt going to be often, could run out of things to give him. Has anyone tried Krave for cats?


What a shame. Sorry, I don't know anyone who's tried Krave. Good luck with the Macs turkey. Maybe you could try cooking some roast chicken in water for broth, or roast turkey or cook some white fish? Maybe you've already tried them? Let us know how JJ gets on please.


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

@jenny armour - do you mean "Crave" pouches of wet food?

If so I tried it for one of my cats about a year ago. She loved it but I took her off it because she was gaining weight rapidly. It is quite high in fat [8%] for a wet food and I put the weight gain down to the addition of Crave to her regular diet. Certainly she lost the extra weight she had gained when I took Crave out of her diet.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Hi, that sounds promising. Weekly B12 shots to start with, is it? Good. When you've time, it's worth dissecting things in "that area of the pen" to see how JJ's really doing :Vomit :Woot.





TriTri said:


> What a shame. Sorry, I don't know anyone who's tried Krave. Good luck with the Macs turkey. Maybe you could try cooking some roast chicken in water for broth, or roast turkey or cook some white fish? Maybe you've already tried them? Let us know how JJ gets on please.


Havent tried the chicken or turkey yet, the vet said I should boil the chicken, when I mentioned it? not sure



chillminx said:


> @jenny armour - do you mean "Crave" pouches of wet food?
> 
> If so I tried it for one of my cats about a year ago. She loved it but I took her off it because she was gaining weight rapidly. It is quite high in fat [8%] for a wet food and I put the weight gain down to the addition of Crave to her regular diet. Certainly she lost the extra weight she had gained when I took Crave out of her diet.


Yes Chillminx I meant Crave lol, the vet suggested it to try the sensitive version, although I cant see it on Zooplus, so not sure which one to try. JJ hasnt gained much weight since being on his diet, but maybe its early days (4.5kg to 4.67). The weaning from AVF to Macs is still ongoing


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Something I forgot to mention also about JJ is he also has muscle wastage in his back legs, maybe that is why he isnt putting on the weight. I did have him on Yumove for about 3 months but took him off of them when he was on antibiotics. That makes him look thinner as well


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Another update, JJ had his last B12 injection today. He has gone back down to 4.5 kgs. I woke up last Saturday early morning to him being sick, although only fur. After that he was sick for the next four mornings. I had to put him onto Macs last Thursday, because he stopped eating AVF ( he was weaned from one to the other). The vet reckons the sickness was because of the change of food. This morning he had a sloppy poo, so I am now keeping him on the Macs sensitive, and hope he doesnt go off that food as well


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Sorry to hear this Jenny. Poor JJ. x

Is it the Macs Sensitive Lamb or the Turkey? The Turkey recipe contains a small amount of milk thistle, a liver cleanser which can cause loose stools,


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

chillminx said:


> Sorry to hear this Jenny. Poor JJ. x
> 
> Is it the Macs Sensitive Lamb or the Turkey? The Turkey recipe contains a small amount of milk thistle, a liver cleanser which can cause loose stools,


The turkey Chillminx, I thought the lamb would be too fatty


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

jenny armour said:


> The turkey Chillminx, I thought the lamb would be too fatty


Yes, the Macs Sensitive Lamb is quite fatty, and if JJ is not keen on fatty foods then best not to give him it. Though the pancreatitis doesn't require a low fat diet. If his stools are OK when he eats the Macs Turkey it will be fine


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

This morning his stool was sloppy, but I had changed it from Macs Turkey and veal to Turkey, dont know if that is what did it, but besides AVF I currently only have the Macs Turkey. will see what happens. He is having a body scan on Friday, as the vet wants to make sure nothing else is causing the pancreatitis



chillminx said:


> Yes, the Macs Sensitive Lamb is quite fatty, and if JJ is not keen on fatty foods then best not to give him it. Though the pancreatitis doesn't require a low fat diet. If his stools are OK when he eats the Macs Turkey it will be fine


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> This morning his stool was sloppy, but I had changed it from Macs Turkey and veal to Turkey, dont know if that is what did it, but besides AVF I currently only have the Macs Turkey. will see what happens. He is having a body scan on Friday, as the vet wants to make sure nothing else is causing the pancreatitis


What a shame JJ didn't want to stick with the AVF. Feeding cats can be a minefield
into getting it right.

I hope all goes well on Friday and the vet gets some plan of action together for JJ. Please let us know how it goes.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

I will do TriTri x


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Just a thought, has anyone tried Royal Canin Veterinary diet cat - Intestinal Moderate Calorie. It was one of the best for Pancreatitis for cats apparently?


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

Blue had the intestinal diet but the high calorie food for a while wheb she was poorly. On paper it’s a terrible food to feed cats but it does seem to be easily digestible. 

Vet suggested RC instant diet to help her weight and the pickiness, and oralade to keep her fluid intake up when they thought she had pancreatitis. She had mirtazapine as an appetite stimulant and mild anti-sickness and cerenia for anti-sickness and pain relief plus famotidine for acid. Her FPLi came back negative. 
Have you got an appetite stimulant for JJ?


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

lill
ytheunicorn said:


> Blue had the intestinal diet but the high calorie food for a while wheb she was poorly. On paper it's a terrible food to feed cats but it does seem to be easily digestible.
> 
> Vet suggested RC instant diet to help her weight and the pickiness, and oralade to keep her fluid intake up when they thought she had pancreatitis. She had mirtazapine as an appetite stimulant and mild anti-sickness and cerenia for anti-sickness and pain relief plus famotidine for acid. Her FPLi came back negative.
> Have you got an appetite stimulant for JJ?


I dont know of these two foods, will have a look. It seems what is good for one cat isnt always good for another. Macs Turkey definitely doesnt agree with MJJ, altho he seemed ok with Macs Turkey and Veal

I do have Mirtazpine in the house but it isnt prescribed for JJ but one of my other cats with renal when he wasnt eating. JJ doesnt appear to have problems eating only the ones I want him to eat..The vet may put him on Omeprazole as he has been sick for a few times, but she thinks its because of his change of diet.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Another update. JJ is now down the vets for the scan. Just had a call from the vets, saying everything seems clear, but she saw a shadow on his abdomen which the scan is bouncing off of. She asked me if she could sedate him, as he wasnt sedated for the scan, just to make sure it is only faeces. Keep fingers crossed, I am now getting worried



TriTri said:


> What a shame JJ didn't want to stick with the AVF. Feeding cats can be a minefield
> into getting it right.
> 
> I hope all goes well on Friday and the vet gets some plan of action together for JJ. Please let us know how it goes.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Another update. JJ is now down the vets for the scan. Just had a call from the vets, saying everything seems clear, but she saw a shadow on his abdomen which the scan is bouncing off of. She asked me if she could sedate him, as he wasnt sedated for the scan, just to make sure it is only faeces. Keep fingers crossed, I am now getting worried


Fingers crossed here that all is fine. Please let us know. Good luck little JJ chicken Xx


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Wwe go from here, but havent heard anything. I know the practice is very busy as they only have one vet on plus nurse plus receptionist. Unfortunately I had to give him what disagrees with him plus a little AVF 2 small meals and now has one with him in the kitchen but is turning his nose up, although hungry. Was reading about a food called Kiwi peak lamb for pancreatitis supposed to be one of the best. Will see what the vet says when I speak to her. The thing is the vet will want him on a diet for 4-6 weeks to see if it is working, and JJ isnt helping.
This is the culprit by the way


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

not sure where the first half of the message went lol


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

Handsome boy! 

Mine love Ziwi Peak lamb it’s very expensive and smells strongly of iron but the cats love it. I feed the kittens it once a week as it was good for weight gain. 

Any food is better than no food with pancreatitis.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Where do you get it from Lillytheunicorn. I'd like to try it on JJ before I get a batch in? JJ has currently lost weight, so am trying to put weight on him


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

jenny armour said:


> Where do you get it from Lillytheunicorn. I'd like to try it on JJ before I get a batch in? JJ has currently lost weight, so am trying to put weight on him


I buy it from Amazon when it is cheap, I have a price watch on it. I am not sure where you can buy individual tins. The RC instant diet is the highest calories food that I could find, your vet may have it in stock and can sell you a sachet to try. I use it to put weight back on cats post pregnancy and it kept Blue going whilst she was so ill whilst pregnant and lactating. I get it from here https://www.vetuk.co.uk/royal-canin...cence-instant-sachets-for-dogs-and-cats-p-254


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

lillytheunicorn said:


> I buy it from Amazon when it is cheap, I have a price watch on it. I am not sure where you can buy individual tins. The RC instant diet is the highest calories food that I could find, your vet may have it in stock and can sell you a sachet to try. I use it to put weight back on cats post pregnancy and it kept Blue going whilst she was so ill whilst pregnant and lactating. I get it from here https://www.vetuk.co.uk/royal-canin...cence-instant-sachets-for-dogs-and-cats-p-254


Yes, my cat was put on the liquid version of this after she was fitted with a feeding tube, in hope of her putting on weight. I too think it would be a good choice to try JJ on the pouch version.

@jenny armour He looks a lovely cat. Is he holding his back legs ok? I've heard of people's cats being prescribed Gabapentin as a pain killer to help with the back legs I think and if they get worse (due to loss of muscle), it may be worth asking your vet about? My cat was also very fussy indeed, so I feel your pain. I wish I had the hundreds of left over foods to send you to try, but they went to the local cat rescue. I've got a few dozen left of AVF meat cocktail & a few odd other foods, (Applaws and others) but worry they could make JJ worse? Tessy did well on and also liked (for a while) Cannigan pouched food from the pet shop and it looked and smelt of a good quality.


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Where do you get it from Lillytheunicorn. I'd like to try it on JJ before I get a batch in? JJ has currently lost weight, so am trying to put weight on him


I've seen Ziwipeak on some online firms but none of them sell individual tins unfortunately.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Yes fetch do it but it singly I would have to pay delivery. The vet suggested RC EN with forty flora on it, also RC Veterinary diet cat - Intestinal moderate . She wants him to stay on one diet for about 4-6 weeks to see how he goes, but JJ has other ideas. This morning he had some AVF because he was hungry but he wasnt weaned onto it so dont know how he will react. TriTri is that the liquid version of RC instant diet?
His back legs are standing him up well, he was on Yumove but took him off of them when he was antibiotics. I dont think Applawes will help him, but thank you anyway.sh

Cannigan pouch havent heard of that one. I have ordered a few pouches of Crave from Ebay which should be due anytime now. I have to laugh when the vet wants to stick to one think, when JJ doesnt. Also she has suggested a couple of things anyway lol


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Yes fetch do it but it singly I would have to pay delivery. The vet suggested RC EN with forty flora on it, also RC Veterinary diet cat - Intestinal moderate . She wants him to stay on one diet for about 4-6 weeks to see how he goes, but JJ has other ideas. This morning he had some AVF because he was hungry but he wasnt weaned onto it so dont know how he will react. TriTri is that the liquid version of RC instant diet?
> His back legs are standing him up well, he was on Yumove but took him off of them when he was antibiotics. I dont think Applawes will help him, but thank you anyway.sh
> 
> Cannigan pouch havent heard of that one. I have ordered a few pouches of Crave from Ebay which should be due anytime now. I have to laugh when the vet wants to stick to one think, when JJ doesnt. Also she has suggested a couple of things anyway lol


Yes, the vet's advise you what to do... in a perfect situation, where your cat is a robot and will go along with anything Ha! They mean well and these things rarely go to plan and require ever changing plans/ reviews. There must be some cats that accept the foods they suggest, so you can only try.
It took me a very long time to find a replacement for Whiskas cat food, it was expensive trying out many foods and mentally draining, but also rewarding once better quality cat foods were accepted. I think with all the unwanted foods, it's no more expensive to go down the route of including decent quality meat and fish as part of the diet, if they are preferred, but always with plenty of broth & water and depending on the amounts, with a completer supplement. At the end of the day you will have to be guided by JJ.

I've just double checked and this is what Tessy was put on by the vet's to help her gain weight, though her problems spiralled out of control..... I believe it wouldn't have been suitable for her long term & she was much sicker than JJ. I'm pleased JJ's legs are holding up ok now. It looks the same one as in the link above provided by Lilytheunicorn.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Hi @jenny armour 
How is JJ? Is he been prescribed anti-nausea drugs? I've just received this information on Pancreatitis from Feline Friends Academy & thought you may find it useful?

http://www.feline-friends.org.uk/topics/pancreatitis/


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Hi @jenny armour
> How is JJ? Is he been prescribed anti-nausea drugs? I've just received this information on Pancreatitis from Feline Friends Academy & thought you may find it useful?
> 
> http://www.feline-friends.org.uk/topics/pancreatitis/


Hi TriTri quite an interesting bit of info, although alot of it is confusing. I find with pancreatitis some of the symptoms are what JJ has and some not.

The vet last week mentioned giving him omeprezole. As far as I know I have only seen him be sick once, that was yesterday morning, its all water with a bit of fur in it.

On the good side, for the time being, he has gone back on the AVF, and eating a fair amount of it, not sure how long that will be for. He eats it with Harry who has CRF with medication of Pronefra. I have also received the food that the vet suggested this morning, so when he does get fed up with it, I will try that.


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

@TriTri thats an really interesting article. Blue had raised lipase and clinically had pancreatitis. Lethargy, Abdominal pain, teeth grinding (sign of pain), nausea and anorexia. However her fPLI was within normal limits. However reading that article it could have been mild chronic pancreatitis; our vet felt sure she had pancreatitis. On pain relief, cerenia (anti-nausea +pain relief) and mirtazapine (appetite stimulant) she eventually started eating, initially only gourmet mon petit but after a couple of weeks of steroids as well she was back to normal.

@jenny armour the only reason I knew Blue was nauseous as she was walking up to her bowl, like she was hungry and then walk off. Previously when she was very poorly, (not pancreatitis) she started off doing that, with a bit of lip licking like she had just eaten but she hadn't. The vet gave her cerenia for nausea and the behaviours stopped really quickly. A couple of months later she started doing the same, and I took her in to the vets as she was very quiet and not eating even treats , she was dehydrated and I said to the vet I think she is nauseous and the locum vet disagreed and just put her on IV fluids. She deteriorated overnight to the point she was struggling to move about. We saw a different vet and I said I thought she was nauseous and could she have some cerenia. She didn't think she was but agreed she could have some as it wasn't going to do her any harm whilst we waited for her bloods results to decide to PTS or not. Anyway within about 20 minutes of IV cerenia she was a little brighter and more comfortable and vet agreed that she was probably feeling very nauseous.


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## Magic Waves (Jun 7, 2020)

jenny armour said:


> My Nfc has been diagnosed with Pancreatitis, not sure if its chronic or acute though. He has the runs and has been sick a few times. At the moment he is eating ID dry as it is the only thing that is helping him, but after a couple of weeks he has had the runs a couple of times. Not sure what to give him, the vet says low cholestreal and high protein. Anyone have any ideas, will be seeing the vet tomorrow for a Vit B shot. JJ is 11 years old


Sorry to hear this but this link may help as it covers all issues.
https://www.pethealthnetwork.com/ca..., and cats with pancreatitis are no exception.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Hi TriTri quite an interesting bit of info, although alot of it is confusing. I find with pancreatitis some of the symptoms are what JJ has and some not.
> 
> The vet last week mentioned giving him omeprezole. As far as I know I have only seen him be sick once, that was yesterday morning, its all water with a bit of fur in it.
> 
> On the good side, for the time being, he has gone back on the AVF, and eating a fair amount of it, not sure how long that will be for. He eats it with Harry who has CRF with medication of Pronefra. I have also received the food that the vet suggested this morning, so when he does get fed up with it, I will try that.


Yes, Animonda Vom Feinsten pure turkey for neutered cats was my go to cat food for Tessy and still is now for Max. Good luck with the new food x


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Yes, Animonda Vom Feinsten pure turkey for neutered cats was my go to cat food for Tessy and still is now for Max. Good luck with the new food x


TriTri have you had two cats with pancreatitis?
sin
Somebody suggested in a quote that teeth grinding could be a symptom, but JJ has been doing that since he was young, didnt realise that was a symptom.
He's still eating the AVF so far touch wood x


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> TriTri have you had two cats with pancreatitis?
> sin
> Somebody suggested in a quote that teeth grinding could be a symptom, but JJ has been doing that since he was young, didnt realise that was a symptom.
> He's still eating the AVF so far touch wood x


No just one cat, Tessy and then later, Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency (EPI) & then probable triaditis. She was dumped outside with sickness and diarrhoea when I found her, 6 years earlier. Max doesn't have it that I know of.

Another rescue cat of mine Elmo (RIP) use to grind his teeth when he ate when he was 18-19 yrs of age, but he did not have pancreatitis. He was very ill that year with all-sorts of medical issues and I put it down to a problem in his mouth, but in-spite of regular vet visits, the vet's never gave a reason. I've read if cats are dehydrated they do this too. I think if had Elmo been well enough, a dental may have resolved this.
Does JJ do this when he is eating, or in general? Much? I would try upping his water intake if at all possible and also mention it to your vet. It may be dehydration. The vet's could also check in his mouth?
I'd recommend you join the Feline Pancreatic Group, as they have absolutely lots of experience with this. You don't have to post anything on there if you don't want to, but you'll get to read everyone else's posts, who are in a similar situation to you. I sent a link earlier I think, or I can send you it? It's best to use a separate email address for this.

Sorry, predictive text kept changing my spelling, so I had to keep editing this!


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

P.S I'd be happy to make all your cats some catnip mice (free obviously) if you'd like any? If so PM me, if not, no problem.

Here's the link to getting AVF chicken livers. Tessy did ok on 3 of these, but went off the others. If you do try them and JJ likes the meat cocktail too, I can send you lots of them, but again, changing to new foods must be done at a snails pace, or I found so. 
https://www.zooplus.co.uk/shop/cats/canned_cat_food_pouches/animonda/adult/14020


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> P.S I'd be happy to make all your cats some catnip mice (free obviously) if you'd like any? If so PM me, if not, no problem.
> 
> Thank you TriTri all my cats love catnip toys, will Pm you x
> 
> ...


I did make a note of the FEline Pancreatic Group, isnt under Tanya's, which I also read about when Harry was first diagnosed with CRF.

I am trying to mix water with JJ's (and Harry's) food just in case he wasnt getting enough to drink I will mention to the vet and yes he grinds when eating. He also likes to lick plastic bags, thats something else he has done since he was young. Incidentally while looking for something else for JJ to eat, she suggested some Forty Flora to put on his food, if he will eat it


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Havent done this for a while, cant remember to PM you lol


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

Blue was teeth grinding when she wasn’t eating, which the vet said was pain. She was doing it whilst the vet was cuddling her. Some of mine grind teeth occasionally when eating especially when they have a meat to chew.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

JJ's poo has gone sloppy again on the AVF, wonder whether to wean onto the Rc Gastrointestinal Moderate


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Have now ordered the Forty Flora


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

jenny armour said:


> JJ's poo has gone sloppy again on the AVF, wonder whether to wean onto the Rc Gastrointestinal Moderate


Has JJ had his stool tested? Just I case he has a bug too



jenny armour said:


> Have now ordered the Forty Flora


Fortuflora can make cats have diarrhoea so just use a sprinkle


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

No, no stool test


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

I thought fortiflora was to help with diarrhoea


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

jenny armour said:


> I thought fortiflora was to help with diarrhoea


It does have probiotics in it but for some reason it seems to give some cats diarrhoea. However it is super tasty and appealing to cats and is often used by PF'ers to encourage cats to eat food.

I give mine pro-kaolin which has pectin and kaolin to absorb excess fluid from the intestine which stops diarrhoea except when we had campy which was resistant to it.

@chillminx is the most knowledgeable on food


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

jenny armour said:


> Have now ordered the Forty Flora


Probiotics repopulate the bowel flora with healthy bacteria which can be useful after a course of antibiotics or a bowel infection. They do not always cure diarrhoea but may help, depending on the cause of the diarrhoea.

Fortiflora is not IME helpful for stopping diarrhoea because, as lilytheunicorn said, it can in fact cause diarrhoea in some cats. My 2 boys with IBD could not tolerate even a small pinch of Fortiflora on their food without it upsetting their bowels. As Fortilfora is strong smelling it can encourage inappetant cats to eat, as LTU also said.

One of the best probiotics for cats is Bioglans (buy from Amazon) but do start with a tiny amount and increase very slowly over a couple of months to a max of half a capsule a day. It would be best to have some stool samples tested to rule out possible causes of the diarrhoea such as bowel infection or parasites.


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

I use Bioglan is the one that seems to agree with all the NFC. I start with a sprinkle and build up to 1/2 capsule twice a day for my forests. 

Just tried Maxidigest, agreed with some cats but gave Baby diarrhoea unfortunately and she has a strong constitution. 

I just wonder if giving a paste with kaolin or montrilmorte clay in would be worth a try to break the cycle of diarrhoea.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

lillytheunicorn said:


> It does have probiotics in it but for some reason it seems to give some cats diarrhoea. However it is super tasty and appealing to cats and is often used by PF'ers to encourage cats to eat food.
> 
> I give mine pro-kaolin which has pectin and kaolin to absorb excess fluid from the intestine which stops diarrhoea except when we had campy which was resistant to it.
> 
> @chillminx is the most knowledgeable on food


I do actually keep prokolin in as another of my Nfcs has for someime had intestinal problems, so she has it every day. I have alreadh ordered the Fortiflora on the advice of the vet, but will not give it to him unless he has a bout and will try it. I will also take into consideration what Chillminx has suggested, just in case


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Havent done this for a while, cant remember to PM you lol


Press the envelope at the top, press show all, then press start a new conversation and add my name. Or I can PM you and you could press reply, if you should want any catnip mice? How's JJ?


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Press the envelope at the top, press show all, then press start a new conversation and add my name. Or I can PM you and you could press reply, if you should want any catnip mice? How's JJ?


All I was getting was a 'Contact us' window, perhaps you could pm me and hopefully I can find the reply button lol x


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> All I was getting was a 'Contact us' window, perhaps you could pm me and hopefully I can find the reply button lol x


You did it, well done! I have replied back.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

lillytheunicorn said:


> @TriTri thats an really interesting article. Blue had raised lipase and clinically had pancreatitis. Lethargy, Abdominal pain, teeth grinding (sign of pain), nausea and anorexia. However her fPLI was within normal limits. However reading that article it could have been mild chronic pancreatitis; our vet felt sure she had pancreatitis. On pain relief, cerenia (anti-nausea +pain relief) and mirtazapine (appetite stimulant) she eventually started eating, initially only gourmet mon petit but after a couple of weeks of steroids as well she was back to normal.
> 
> @jenny armour the only reason I knew Blue was nauseous as she was walking up to her bowl, like she was hungry and then walk off. Previously when she was very poorly, (not pancreatitis) she started off doing that, with a bit of lip licking like she had just eaten but she hadn't. The vet gave her cerenia for nausea and the behaviours stopped really quickly. A couple of months later she started doing the same, and I took her in to the vets as she was very quiet and not eating even treats , she was dehydrated and I said to the vet I think she is nauseous and the locum vet disagreed and just put her on IV fluids. She deteriorated overnight to the point she was struggling to move about. We saw a different vet and I said I thought she was nauseous and could she have some cerenia. She didn't think she was but agreed she could have some as it wasn't going to do her any harm whilst we waited for her bloods results to decide to PTS or not. Anyway within about 20 minutes of IV cerenia she was a little brighter and more comfortable and vet agreed that she was probably feeling very nauseous.


Well done @lillytheunicorn, it just shows how well you knew Blue and good that you spoke up for Blue in her hour of need.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

JJ was down the vet again today to have another B12 injection. He is eating well but his faeces is a combination of lots of fluid with a few poos in with it. I saw another vet but she is loathe to complicate things by suggesting anything else. Beth my normal ivet t seems has a plan so will go with her. It was suggested that if the B12 isnt working that maybe a steroid injection. He has lost a little more weight and he is still on the AVF Turkey


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Am worried about JJ, as not eating as much, will speak to my vet tomorrow


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

jenny armour said:


> Am worried about JJ, as not eating as much, will speak to my vet tomorrow


Do you have any pain relief or appetite stimulant for him?


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

jenny armour said:


> Am worried about JJ, as not eating as much, will speak to my vet tomorrow


Since he is losing so much fluid, it might be an idea to ask your vet whether they recommend sub-cut fluids. I mentioned before that I gave them to my boy for years. I was very reluctant at first but my vet was very insistent that it was the best way to keep these cats well.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

lillytheunicorn said:


> Do you have any pain relief or appetite stimulant for him?


I do have stimulants which was prescribed for Harry when he has a day of not eating, but not for JJ



QOTN said:


> Since he is losing so much fluid, it might be an idea to ask your vet whether they recommend sub-cut fluids. I mentioned before that I gave them to my boy for years. I was very reluctant at first but my vet was very insistent that it was the best way to keep these cats well.


I tried the sub cut fluids with Harry when he was not drinking enough, I'm afraid I couldnt do it, I did try with Harry but got an air lock in it and it put me off. I ended up at the time taking Harry down to the vets and the nurses did it for me, mind you I probably cant do that with a lockdown on. I do still have the fluids though. I gave JJ a tiny bit of chicken this evening which he loved and he is eating better for the moment, but I am still going to phone the vet to see what she plans next. The vet I saw yesterday examined him and said his bowel (I assume) felt thickened , although he did have a scan last month and it was clear,
only faeces


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

I think what is worse is his weight is now 4.4kg down from 5.0 in May in his prime 7.2kg, but his belly being shaved for the scan makes him look thinner. I so wish I could get some weight on him


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> I think what is worse is his weight is now 4.4kg down from 5.0 in May in his prime 7.2kg, but his belly being shaved for the scan makes him look thinner. I so wish I could get some weight on him


Come on JJ, time to chub up a bit. Fingers crossed here @jenny armour that JJ has picked up since Sunday.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

[="TriTri, post: 1065694899, member: 1463400"]Come on JJ, time to chub up a bit. Fingers crossed here @jenny armour that JJ has picked up since Sunday.[/QUOTE]

Trish what would I do without you. I have decided to wean JJ off the AVF as it was giving him the slops. A couple of nights ago I gradually put him onto RC Gastrointestinal Moderate with the AVF. He had his first solid poo in a couple of weeks, last night IN THE TRAY I know this may only last a little while before the soft poos come back. I will try rain water, never thought of that. The outdoor cats obviously get rain water too. In this part of the country the water is very soft.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> [="TriTri, post: 1065694899, member: 1463400"]Come on JJ, time to chub up a bit. Fingers crossed here @jenny armour that JJ has picked up since Sunday.


Trish what would I do without you. I have decided to wean JJ off the AVF as it was giving him the slops. A couple of nights ago I gradually put him onto RC Gastrointestinal Moderate with the AVF. He had his first solid poo in a couple of weeks, last night IN THE TRAY I know this may only last a little while before the soft poos come back. I will try rain water, never thought of that. The outdoor cats obviously get rain water too. In this part of the country the water is very soft.[/QUOTE]
Well done JJ :Chicken. Well done RC Gastrointestinal Moderate too. Keep up the good work @jenny armour, all your efforts should be rewarded, all be it in the form a big .... :Woot:Hilarious:Hilarious. No photos necessary, as we'll believe you :Hilarious.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Another couple of things I meant to ask about JJ.

1. His poo smells awful, I first noticed it when I first put him on the AVF and now he is on the RC. It may seem when his poo is firmer
2. He sleeps alot, like when he finishes his food he will fall asleep on the kitchen table beside the empty dish and sometimes when he is just sitting on the arm of the chair he will sit and close his eyes like when he was in the vets last Saturday he closed his eyes and had a little zzzz. Could it be the legarthy?


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

JJ went onto the RC too quick, hence the runs. Back onto AVF. He wouldnt eat the AVF when put with the RC, so start again


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Fed up with trying to tell you what is happening with JJ as this laptop keeps deleting it, but the vet isnt happy with JJ and think the pancreatitis could be secondary and not primary


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## Whompingwillow (Feb 21, 2018)

jenny armour said:


> Fed up with trying to tell you what is happening with JJ as this laptop keeps deleting it, but the vet isnt happy with JJ and think the pancreatitis could be secondary and not primary


Iv been following your thread, sending thoughts to you and JJ. Sorry I haven't got much advice but wanted to respond. Some of this sounds similar to what I went through with one of my cats who also had pancreatitis. Sorry to hear the vet isn't happy with how jj is :-/ I hope they find some answers for you Xx


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Whompingwillow said:


> Iv been following your thread, sending thoughts to you and JJ. Sorry I haven't got much advice but wanted to respond. Some of this sounds similar to what I went through with one of my cats who also had pancreatitis. Sorry to hear the vet isn't happy with how jj is :-/ I hope they find some answers for you Xx


Thank you Whompingwillow. The vet wants to either try omeprazole and steroids or go straight for the tube down the throat to see if they can take a sample. Seems to me like omeprazole and steroids wouldnt work, but to do the tube down the throat means I would have to take him over to the main branch which is 10 miles and I dont drive


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Fed up with trying to tell you what is happening with JJ as this laptop keeps deleting it, but the vet isnt happy with JJ and think the pancreatitis could be secondary and not primary


I think computers do that sometimes, like another force is trying to stop you. I had that when I tried to contact the Feline Pancreatic Support Group... stopping us from interfering with a destiny? It might sound bonkers to some, but when it happens repeatedly....?

That does sound about right, or that there's something else going on. When my cat was sleeping all the time, I pushed for more tests and that's when they found she also had a bacterial infection (Clostridium Perfringens), which has to be specifically tested for. I think it's rare, but what about an under active thyroid? It's probably not that, but it sounds like something else is making him sleep more than usual, maybe a bacterial infection? Come on JJ:Chicken, perk up please.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Wmaking him sleep more thanual, maybe a bacterial infection? Come on JJ:Chicken, perk up please.[/QUOTE]

Wouldnt under active make him put on weight? He had a blood test in August, I think the vet was thinking of doing it again. I was expecting to hear from her today but she didnt phone. JJ was eating about 8 trays of AVF in the last couple of days, he is very gassy, because he is losing weight he looks like he's pregnant.

What worries me is when he had the scan last month, the vet 
said the scan didnt work as well as the one at the main branch. Now I am worried that they missed something. I have decided if they do this camera and they find something sinister that I will let him go. He cant go on like this


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> JJ went onto the RC too quick, hence the runs. Back onto AVF. He wouldnt eat the AVF when put with the RC, so start again





jenny armour said:


> Wmaking him sleep more thanual, maybe a bacterial infection? Come on JJ:Chicken, perk up please.


Wouldnt under active make him put on weight? He had a blood test in August, I think the vet was thinking of doing it again. I was expecting to hear from her today but she didnt phone. JJ was eating about 8 trays of AVF in the last couple of days, he is very gassy, because he is losing weight he looks like he's pregnant.

What worries me is when he had the scan last month, the vet
said the scan didnt work as well as the one at the main branch. Now I am worried that they missed something. I have decided if they do this camera and they find something sinister that I will let him go. He cant go on like this[/QUOTE]
Oh yes, good point, he would have put weight on if had an under active thyroid, or if it were fluid. It doesn't sound like an infection either. It sounds pretty urgent. Can you ask if they take him on to the main branch? Maybe one of the vet's will be traveling from your branch to the main branch in the week? Some vet's do & there's no harm in asking.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Oh yes, good point, he would have put weight on if had an under active thyroid, or if it were fluid. It doesn't sound like an infection either. It sounds pretty urgent. Can you ask if they take him on to the main branch? Maybe one of the vet's will be traveling from your branch to the main branch in the week? Some vet's do & there's no harm in asking.[/QUOTE]

They used to do that for me, take him to and from the other vets, now they are saying, it seems, they are not covered for the insurance, in case anything happens to the animal in transit. This vet has recently been taken over by the larger practice, and I am wondering if that is why.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Oh yes, good point, he would have put weight on if had an under active thyroid, or if it were fluid. It doesn't sound like an infection either. It sounds pretty urgent. Can you ask if they take him on to the main branch? Maybe one of the vet's will be traveling from your branch to the main branch in the week? Some vet's do & there's no harm in asking.


They used to do that for me, take him to and from the other vets, now they are saying, it seems, they are not covered for the insurance, in case anything happens to the animal in transit. This vet has recently been taken over by the larger practice, and I am wondering if that is why.[/QUOTE]

That's a shame. It sounds like a specific exclusion on their motor insurance policy.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

This thread has got all our posts mixed up, yours in my name, mine in your name... ?!


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Oh dear how can we change that? Perhaps I wont quote yours


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Oh dear how can we change that? Perhaps I wont quote yours


Probably not worth bothering the mods with.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Another update JJ havng another scan and possible scope tomorrow, still being and the runs altho he is taking omeprezole if this doesnt work will considerate second opinion, at my wits end now


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

jenny armour said:


> Another update JJ havng another scan and possible scope tomorrow, still being and the runs altho he is taking omeprezole if this doesnt work will considerate second opinion, at my wits end now


So sorry to hear that, hopefully you get some answers.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Another update JJ havng another scan and possible scope tomorrow, still being and the runs altho he is taking omeprezole if this doesnt work will considerate second opinion, at my wits end now


I hope they get to the bottom of things for you both and turn this around. I know how it feels, just horrible, unbearable. Keep your chin up @jenny armour & please let us know how JJ gets on xx


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Thank you ladies, the vet who is in charge has phoned this morning, to say instead of the probe, if they have to, they are going to do a camera into his colon, as the probe will probably only show the same as the scan. I gave them a 3 day poo sample which came back clear


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

He is being opened up as the scan showed a shadow, hopefully will hear something today


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

jenny armour said:


> He is being opened up as the scan showed a shadow, hopefully will hear something today


So sorry to hear that but hopefully they can get to the bottom of his problems poor boy. Big hugs


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> He is being opened up as the scan showed a shadow, hopefully will hear something today


Very sorry to hear this. Sending best wishes to you and your boy. I hope they can sort it out. Xx


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

lillytheunicorn said:


> So sorry to hear that but hopefully they can get to the bottom of his problems poor boy. Big hugs





SbanR said:


> Very sorry to hear this. Sending best wishes to you and your boy. I hope they can sort it out. Xx


5 samples of his pancreas and other parts of his inners have gone off for analysis, as there is thickening. Meanwhile when he comes home tomorrow I have got to try another food to see if it agrees with his system. Keep your fingers crossed


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> 5 samples of his pancreas and other parts of his inners have gone off for analysis, as there is thickening. Meanwhile when he comes home tomorrow I have got to try another food to see if it agrees with his system. Keep your fingers crossed


I do hope you manage to find a food that agrees and that he will eat! Such a relief when that happens.
Good luck.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Thank you SbanR. I have some RC En to try which the vet Okayed, so will see, I so hope so as he has lost alot of weight, but considering the problem he hasnt as yet lost his appetite


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## Whompingwillow (Feb 21, 2018)

All crossed @jenny armour , thinking of you both and hope you get some answers soon and find some foods he can tolerate. Have you tried cooked mince and meats with a supplement (Fellini complete for example)? I gave that to saffi for a long time after being left with only one food she tolerated and she did well on it for a long time and it gave her more variety, I found the thought of the task daunting but it was really ok to do in the end, I cooked it in a slow cooker, sending all our thoughts to you both and hope things pick up a bit x


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Thank you for your thought. JJ's weight is now down to 3.85 more or less half his weight in his prime now


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Whompingwillow said:


> All crossed @jenny armour , thinking of you both and hope you get some answers soon and find some foods he can tolerate. Have you tried cooked mince and meats with a supplement (Fellini complete for example)? I gave that to saffi for a long time after being left with only one food she tolerated and she did well on it for a long time and it gave her more variety, I found the thought of the task daunting but it was really ok to do in the end, I cooked it in a slow cooker, sending all our thoughts to you both and hope things pick up a bit x


Is cooked mince meat ok for tums to tolerate ?


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

Yes we feed that to Blue when she was poorly.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Is cooked mince meat ok for tums to tolerate ?


Yes, they were very good for Tessy. Fingers crossed here too xx


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> 5 samples of his pancreas and other parts of his inners have gone off for analysis, as there is thickening. Meanwhile when he comes home tomorrow I have got to try another food to see if it agrees with his system. Keep your fingers crossed


Hi @jenny armour 
When do you hope to hear the results? Thinking of you & JJ.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Hi @jenny armour
> When do you hope to hear the results? Thinking of you & JJ.


Hi TRish hopefully before Christmas. I could have had it done quicker but they wanted another £30-40. I know it sounds tight, but I spent £850 yesterday, He now weighs 3.85 kgs almost half his original weight. He is on RC EN but so far not making any difference. He has a check up tomorrow at my branch. He still wants his food, which is a good thing. He is disappearing before my eyes.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

The vet said low protein, low fat??


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

If I defrost a low fat mince for him now will he be ok for the time being, without the nutrients, until I can get him some?


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

jenny armour said:


> If I defrost a low fat mince for him now will he be ok for the time being, without the nutrients, until I can get him some?


Your main concern with muscle meat is the lack of calcium. I can remember many years ago when a friend went to the Animal Health Trust for her cats' allergies she was told they would be alright without supplements for the eight weeks they were on the prescribed elimination diet. Obviously you would need to get a supplement as soon as possible but there is no reason to panic. If you use turkey thigh mince or 5% fat pork mince you will be getting the correct levels of taurine which is another concern. Do make sure you cook it as short a time as possible and keep the pan covered all the time.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

QOTN said:


> Your main concern with muscle meat is the lack of calcium. I can remember many years ago when a friend went to the Animal Health Trust for her cats' allergies she was told they would be alright without supplements for the eight weeks they were on the prescribed elimination diet. Obviously you would need to get a supplement as soon as possible but there is no reason to panic. If you use turkey thigh mince or 5% fat pork mince you will be getting the correct levels of taurine which is another concern. Do make sure you cook it as short a time as possible and keep the pan covered all the time.


I have just got this message and have just back from a big shop and I bought more mince beef, if only I have known before I went out. I will have to try the butcher tomorrow


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

jenny armour said:


> I have just got this message and have just back from a big shop and I bought more mince beef, if only I have known before I went out. I will have to try the butcher tomorrow


Beef has taurine but I don't know how low in fat his food needs to be. I don't feed beef to my cats so I don't know if low fat versions are available.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

QOTN said:


> Beef has taurine but I don't know how low in fat his food needs to be. I don't feed beef to my cats so I don't know if low fat versions are available.


It says 5 pct, if I can try just today and get to the butchers tomorrow ?


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Have ordered Felini from Zooplus


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

jenny armour said:


> It says 5 pct, if I can try just today and get to the butchers tomorrow ?


5% is as low as any meat I have seen. I would probably not feed him beef in large quantities if he were mine but it will be fine to start. You really need to try different things to see if you can give him a variety of what he likes. I am not clear how you can feed low protein and low fat. I fed my Gam meat all the time but he was on meds from the time he was diagnosed. The vet never mentioned his diet.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

I will check with the vet tomorrow, not sure if he does have Pancreatitis or if it is secondary, will probably know more when the results come back, hopefully next week


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> I will check with the vet tomorrow, not sure if he does have Pancreatitis or if it is secondary, will probably know more when the results come back, hopefully next week


Hi @jenny armour
I'm gutted I didn't read this earlier, as could have sent you some Felini. Tessy was only 3.5 kilos when I found her and went down to 1.9/2 kilos, then up a little. I feel your pain, horrible. I got Tessy the 5% fat lean minced beef and 5% fat lean minced turkey from Sainsburys and it helped. Originally I fried it in oil, then found it better to use goose fat and eventually found it better just in a drop of water, in a tiny frying pan. I wished I'd tried it in the slow cooker, but the water was the best option for me at that time. I timed it, 3-4 minutes. That, AVF turkey and roast turkey were her favourites, that she did "ok" on... compared to most other foods. They were things she "wanted" to eat. Roast turkey legs are nicer when cooked in water in the oven, with foil over the top, then I take the broth out and foil out, for the last (or rather an extra) 5 minutes.
Like you, I often wonder what else could be going on, so at least they are trying to eliminate things. It's great that JJ's eating, the little fighter ❤.

Edit: less than 3 mins i think from memory (?) for the mince, it's liver I fry for 3-4 mins, sos.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Hi @jenny armour
> I'm gutted I didn't read this earlier, as could have sent you some Felini. Tessy was only 3.5 kilos when I found her and went down to 1.9/2 kilos, then up a little. I feel your pain, horrible. I got Tessy the 5% fat lean minced beef and 5% fat lean minced turkey from Sainsburys and it helped. Originally I fried it in oil, then found it better to use goose fat and eventually found it better just in a drop of water, in a tiny frying pan. I wished I'd tried it in the slow cooker, but the water was the best option for me at that time. I timed it, 3-4 minutes. That, AVF turkey and roast turkey were her favourites, that she did "ok" on... compared to most other foods. They were things she "wanted" to eat. Roast turkey legs are nicer when cooked in water in the oven, with foil over the top, then I take the broth out and foil out, for the last (or rather an extra) 5 minutes.
> Like you, I often wonder what else could be going on, so at least they are trying to eliminate things. It's great that JJ's eating, the little fighter ❤.





TriTri said:


> Hi @jenny armour
> I'm gutted I didn't read this earlier, as could have sent you some Felini. Tessy was only 3.5 kilos when I found her and went down to 1.9/2 kilos, then up a little. I feel your pain, horrible. I got Tessy the 5% fat lean minced, they beef and 5% fat lean minced turkey from Sainsburys and it helped. Originally I fried it in oil, then found it better to use goose fat and eventually found it better just in a drop of water, in a tiny frying pan. I wished I'd tried it in the slow cooker, but the water was the best option for me at that time. I timed it, 3-4 minutes. That, AVF turkey and roast turkey were her favourites, that she did "ok" on... compared to most other foods. They were things she "wanted" to eat. Roast turkey legs are nicer when cooked in water in the oven, with foil over the top, then I take the broth out and foil out, for the last (or rather an extra) 5 minutes.
> Like you, I often wonder what else could be going on, so at least they are trying to eliminate things. It's great that JJ's eating, the little fighter ❤.


Pity I didnt think to get some turkey legs from Morrisons today, I only bought some more beef mince. JJ is enjoying it tho, he hasnt been to the toilet since this morning when it was sloppy, so dont know how his poo will be. I had had him on the RC En but he didnt like it. Now I will get some turkey legs (hope nobody wanted their turkeys with legs, cause I will have them all lol). I was reading on Zooplus the menus on the Felini post. Hope this helps poor JJ and his problem. Do you know I get more knowledge on here than from the vets, they know nothing about nutrition, so still confused about how much protein and how much fat.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Pity I didnt think to get some turkey legs from Morrisons today, I only bought some more beef mince. JJ is enjoying it tho, he hasnt been to the toilet since this morning when it was sloppy, so dont know how his poo will be. I had had him on the RC En but he didnt like it. Now I will get some turkey legs (hope nobody wanted their turkeys with legs, cause I will have them all lol). I was reading on Zooplus the menus on the Felini post. Hope this helps poor JJ and his problem. Do you know I get more knowledge on here than from the vets, they know nothing about nutrition, so still confused about how much protein and how much fat.


I know! They try to teach them about all animals I suppose, where as if they specialised in cats only )) they'd have more time to spend on cat nutrition.
Don't worry about buying up all the turkey legs as last night on tv they said when they take the legs off to sell the turkey crown only, then then bizarrely put the cost of the turkey up by £5!! (You can't have em all 'cause Max needs two a week!) Sainsbury sell fresh turkey drumsticks but at Christmas they swap them for much nicer turkey legs; a big difference and really nice. Tesco's are ok and Asda's seem much cheaper, like the average drumstick, & no idea about Morrison! JJ can let us know. The longer before he goes after diarrhoea is usually the better, as I'm sure you know. Fingers crossed. Bless him. I'd try and feed some wet food also after a day and a half, if and when things firm up.
Was it JJ or another of your cats that had diarrhoea following taking antibiotics? If so, I heard they then need a probiotic, something I don't think my vet's prescribed after this happened to my cat and I think it would have been worth trying on my cat. I did ask them. I may be getting mixed up with another of your cats, but if not, may be worth trying if you haven't already?


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> I know! They try to teach them about all animals I suppose, where as if they specialised in cats only )) they'd have more time to spend on cat nutrition.
> Don't worry about buying up all the turkey legs as last night on tv they said when they take the legs off to sell the turkey crown only, then then bizarrely put the cost of the turkey up by £5!! (You can't have em all 'cause Max needs two a week!) Sainsbury sell fresh turkey drumsticks but at Christmas they swap them for much nicer turkey legs; a big difference and really nice. Tesco's are ok and Asda's seem much cheaper, like the average drumstick, & no idea about Morrison! JJ can let us know. The longer before he goes after diarrhoea is usually the better, as I'm sure you know. Fingers crossed. Bless him. I'd try and feed some wet food also after a day and a half, if and when things firm up.
> Was it JJ or another of your cats that had diarrhoea following taking antibiotics? If so, I heard they then need a probiotic, something I don't think my vet's prescribed after this happened to my cat and I think it would have been worth trying on my cat. I did ask them. I may be getting mixed up with another of your cats, but if not, may be worth trying if you haven't already?


Yes my vet is initially a large animal practice, if you phone on an emergency about April time, the vet is always out lambing or calving, but where I take Nellie seems to be better regarding cats, I may move him over to there if I dont get anywhere with this vet.

JJ just had a sloppy poo, but he hadnt been since (Ithink) this morning. What wet food do you suggest Trish? It was JJ who had diarrhoea after antibiotics and probiotics well forty flora didnt help and prokolin I cant get down his throat and he closes it off, devil. Last night and this morning I had to give him pain relief by spraying his gums and he did the same then


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Tried the prokolin he dribbled it everywhere, so I gave him a little bit of mince beef so he might lick it off?


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Tried the prokolin he dribbled it everywhere, so I gave him a little bit of mince beef so he might lick it off?


He might! Good luck. 
My vet wouldn't give it to my cat after antibiotics left her with runny diarrhoea, but several people on here have recommended using it when antibiotics strip out the good bacteria in the gut. When I first found Tessy they gave her Prokolin (not sure of the spelling). Later SbanR kindly sent me some Bio Gaia. You could read this where there was a discussion about it and a link to buying it. I don't know if it would help and it might be worth running it by your vet, but then they may well not of heard of it, Chillminx often recommends it and did here: 
https://www.petforums.co.uk/threads/fussy-little-madams.528155/
Meat or fish (depending on which your cat normally likes & does well on, seem to calm things down quicker than cat foods in my experience and from what I have read. Try the mince and the turkey? Maybe a slither of liver, that's something sick cats will often eat, when it's still nice and warm. It's the warm temperature that seems to appeal to them most I think. Come on JJ!


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> He might! Good luck.
> My vet wouldn't give it to my cat after antibiotics left her with runny diarrhoea, but several people on here have recommended using it when antibiotics strip out the good bacteria in the gut. When I first found Tessy they gave her Prokolin (not sure of the spelling). Later SbanR kindly sent me some Bio Gaia. You could read this where there was a discussion about it and a link to buying it. I don't know if it would help and it might be worth running it by your vet, but then they may well not of heard of it, Chillminx often recommends it and did here:
> https://www.petforums.co.uk/threads/fussy-little-madams.528155/
> Meat or fish (depending on which your cat normally likes & does well on, seem to calm things down quicker than cat foods in my experience and from what I have read. Try the mince and the turkey? Maybe a slither of liver, that's something sick cats will often eat, when it's still nice and warm. It's the warm temperature that seems to appeal to them most I think. Come on JJ!


also

JJ still had a bit of sloppy poo during the night, after the Prokolin, but at least it was in the tray. Cant, so far, get hold of any turkey legs, tried two butchers in the town and the co op who only sells the whole turkey, but they wont be in until tomorrow. Came back with some chicken thighs, altho I know this wont be as good. Have got to go to the vet again this afternoon, so I will go to Morrisons tomorrow. JJ doesnt seem to like fish, I cooked some for the dogs the other day, and I tried the juices on him for rehydration but he wasnt interested. JJ has a ravenous appetite just cant keep the food in. He is also still on the omeprazole twice a day now, I think the vet got the wrong dose last time, as he was still being sick. She said he can only have it for 6 weeks


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

What about turkey thigh mince?


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

jenny armour said:


> What about turkey thigh mince?


I mean turkey mince


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> What about turkey thigh mince?





jenny armour said:


> I mean turkey mince


You can get turkey mince in breast or thigh meat.
The paler, more expensive per kilo is the breast mince and will be lower in fat.
If you're worried about lack of taurine I have a bag and can send you some if you PM your address.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

SbanR said:


> You can get turkey mince in breast or thigh meat.
> The paler, more expensive per kilo is the breast mince and will be lower in fat.
> If you're worried about lack of taurine I have a bag and can send you some if you PM your address.


Thank you SbanR, not good at Pm ing but will try. Do I have to give much taurine to JJ?
Couldnt get any Turkey mince from where I live, but Morrisons does . Got some chickiten thighs for the moment until tomorrow
Poor JJ, I took him down the vet for a checkup. Because of the social distancing I had to wait outside for about 20 minutes but they did take JJ in as it was raining. He would have been sitting in his stroller for about 15 minutes of that time, and had had terrible runs and had been sitting in it. Having terrible trouble trying to clean him up, its all down his back end. I cooked the thighs in water, so hopefully him having a drink of the cooked water, will help him to clean himself up. I hope I'm doing the right thing giving him this food. Cant do anything else until these results come back.


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

If he's also eating commercial food you needn't worry too much as it should have taurine in.

A search of taurine should bring up more info.
I first heard about the importance of taurine in a cat's diet on CC.
I only give mine a little, dissolved in warm water.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> also
> 
> JJ still had a bit of sloppy poo during the night, after the Prokolin, but at least it was in the tray. Cant, so far, get hold of any turkey legs, tried two butchers in the town and the co op who only sells the whole turkey, but they wont be in until tomorrow. Came back with some chicken thighs, altho I know this wont be as good. Have got to go to the vet again this afternoon, so I will go to Morrisons tomorrow. JJ doesnt seem to like fish, I cooked some for the dogs the other day, and I tried the juices on him for rehydration but he wasnt interested. JJ has a ravenous appetite just cant keep the food in. He is also still on the omeprazole twice a day now, I think the vet got the wrong dose last time, as he was still being sick. She said he can only have it for 6 weeks


Max was recently put on omeprazole when he vomited every day after a Credelio flea tablet and the vomiting stopped as soon as he went on the omeprazole, 5mg in the morning and 5mg in the evening. He's being weened off it now & is ok so far, touch wood. I was told earlier this week by the vet that omeprazole is only effective for 7 weeks and then it stops working, which ties in near enough with what your vet has said. This week Max is on 2.5 mg x twice daily and next week half that. They've given me a 20 mg tablet to cut into eighths! Crumbs! I get crumbs! They said they couldn't get a smaller dose. I believe I recently read Chillminx recommending Famatodine (?) as a preferred alternative. I keep a food/health diary for my cats and believe Tessy's vomiting was purely down to food intolerances. She didn't vomit once the month before her peg tube was fitted, being just fed turkey (& veal I think). I suppose JJ's could be food related, or other. What did your vet say? I'd ask a nurse to clean the box out if I couldn't do it myself, but I always have a bag of cleaning stuff & spare puppy pads etc for vet trips, just in-case! I'm surprised JJ was just left in it! On occasion I've just taken a cat out their soiled carrier in the car and put them straight into a clean carrier. Someone on here said she wrote down every single ingredient in each of her cats foods & identified the culprit ingredient that way- great idea if it's food related & I think she mentioned rosemary oil as the culprit? I haven't seen that on any foods I've bought and you must have your hands full with all your pets, but maybe someone could give that a go for you, if your vet or if you think an edible ingredient could possibly be the cause?


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

I dont know how long JJ was sitting in it, but I am sure he was ok when he was with me, after all the odour he gives out atm I would have noticed. He would have been in the vets on his own for about 15 minutes

Had an email from Zoolplus to say my order for the Felini could be held up due to high volume of orders, hopefully it wont be too long

After a few cock ups with JJ's Omeprazole, the vets actually got it right and he is also on 2 x 5ml and yes they are small. Fancy having to leave it to you to do the breaking up of the tablet. I think the vet is waiting for the results of the biopsies to come back and take it from there, regarding food, although I am still going to find something that will help him

Why did Tessy have a peg tube fitted, what was wrong with her?

On top of all this, I have had a personal re-occurring problem happening to me for a while and was sent for a blood test yesterday. Although I havent spoken to the doctor as yet, it seems I am being put on medication for diabetes, so hopefully I get to speak to the doctor on Monday. I have alot of problems sleeping and dont go to bed to at least 1am, and then cant sleep, like now, I should be in bed, maybe should start reading again when I do go to bed


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> I dont know how long JJ was sitting in it, but I am sure he was ok when he was with me, after all the odour he gives out atm I would have noticed. He would have been in the vets on his own for about 15 minutes
> 
> Had an email from Zoolplus to say my order for the Felini could be held up due to high volume of orders, hopefully it wont be too long
> 
> ...


Zooplus said that with my Tuesday order and my order arrived today. I could post you half of my Felini on Monday, if need be?
The 20 mg omeprazole are huge, but not suited to being cut into 8 pieces, let alone 8 equal pieces, but he has to be weened off them slowly.

Tessy was eating fine, but refused her pancreatic enzymes & began losing weight faster than she had already been losing weight, probably due to the liquid diarrhoea brought on by the antibiotics, but the specialist said it was due to her not having her pancreatic enzymes & her kidneys suddenly deteriorated. At 1.9/2 kilos she would have probably only lasted a couple of weeks, so I went for the feeding tube. The enzymes (and liquid food and water) were easy to administer through the tube, but the enzymes didn't make enough difference. Long story, I best not put online.

Any part of a turkey, I would think would help JJ, doesn't have to be a leg. Hopefully the mince will help.

Sorry to hear you're having sleeping problems and are now diabetic. I sleep late because of my thyroid, but don't have a problem nodding off and can sleep in late if need be. I'm just trying out the sleep app on my phone "sleep cycle." It monitors your sleep and tells you if you cough, talk etc and when and knows how long you sleep for, when you wake up, how much deep sleep etc you get and the times, it shows you your chart each morning! My sister had the app and snores and was able to play me the recordings of her snoring!

Bye for now.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

I've taken JJ off the fresh meat untiI I get the felini through. During the night he had two lots of runs very watery I think he was also sick as it looked like chicken, and I am still cleaning him up from yesterday. 

When my Harry was on the appetite stimulant Mirtazapine 15mg, the vet I saw at the time had these tablets cut into 8 pcs, he even warned me not to shake the bottle because they would turn to dust, surely if they cant break them up, how are you expected to? I just hope if its not tumours that they find then I can find something that will agree with him, dont feel confident at the moment.

Trish you sound too young to have Thyroid problems. I have to phone the doctor on Monday as they tried phoning me on my mobile and it was in another room so I didnt hear it (they, for some reason cant get through on my landline) so I have to phone the doctors on Monday. I think I'm missing out on all these new mobile phones, I just have an idiotproof one

Have you had an email fro Zooplus about Brexit and that they may stop some of the products? I hope that doesnt include Hills id Chicken and Stew thats why Nellie and Oliver have, I did have trouble getting it last month because they were (and other companies) were out of stock.
Any part of a turkey, I would think would help JJ, doesn’t have to be a leg. Hopefully the mince will help.


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## Whompingwillow (Feb 21, 2018)

jenny armour said:


> Is cooked mince meat ok for tums to tolerate ?


Yes, it really was the best thing in the end


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Whompingwillow said:


> Yes, it really was the best thing in the end


i hope so I am thinking nothing will work for my JJ, everything I give him just goes straight through him and he is so hungry, tried RC Gastrointestinal EN again this morning, I know it wont make any difference but until I get this Felini I am stuck. Will get the turkey mine hopefully tomorrow in case the Felini comes this week and the results from the biopsies


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> i hope so I am thinking nothing will work for my JJ, everything I give him just goes straight through him and he is so hungry, tried RC Gastrointestinal EN again this morning, I know it wont make any difference but until I get this Felini I am stuck. Will get the turkey mine hopefully tomorrow in case the Felini comes this week and the results from the biopsies


It shouldn't hurt him to have meat without Felini for a few days.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

SbanR said:


> It shouldn't hurt him to have meat without Felini for a few days.


In the last couple of days he has had both beef mince and chicken and both gave him extreme runs, so I hope Felini does work


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

jenny armour said:


> In the last couple of days he has had both beef mince and chicken and both gave him extreme runs, so I hope Felini does work


Felini won't stop his diarrhoea. It is only a vitamin and mineral supplement. It might be better to try a different meat. As @SbanR says a few days without the supplement will not harm him.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

QOTN said:


> Felini won't stop his diarrhoea. It is only a vitamin and mineral supplement. It might be better to try a different meat. As @SbanR[/UNQUOTE
> 
> I will try the turkey mince with it but I am not confident anymore, dont know what the vet will suggest, he's disappearing before my eyes


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

Not sure if it’s okay as JJ has pancreatitis best check with your vets but when nothing stayed in Blue for very long as she was having liquid diarrhoea and vomiting multiple times a day. Our vet advised us to feed her hills a/d mixed with oralade or RC convalescent instant diet mixed with oralade, due to the high energy density anything that was able to be absorbed as it speed its way through her gut was going to at least give her as much energy as possible. Alongside lots of fluid to replace the fluid loss through the diarrhoea and vomiting. Blue was on and off IV fluids due to the dehydration she was experiencing.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

lillytheunicorn said:


> Not sure if it's okay as JJ has pancreatitis best check with your vets but when nothing stayed in Blue for very long as she was having liquid diarrhoea and vomiting multiple times a day. Our vet advised us to feed her hills a/d mixed with oralade or RC convalescent instant diet mixed with oralade, due to the high energy density anything that was able to be absorbed as it speed its way through her gut was going to at least give her as much energy as possible. Alongside lots of fluid to replace the fluid loss through the diarrhoea and vomiting. Blue was on and off IV fluids due to the dehydration she was experiencing.


Although he was originally diagnosed with Pancreatitis, because the food (AVF) didnt seem to work, there was a mention of it being secondary. This was I reckon why the vet for the exploratory last week, to see if there was anything else ie anything sinister. I know a/d helps to put on weight, at least that was what they did for Harry (a nother of my Nfcs)when he was first diagnosed with CRF and he was losing weight. I could mention it when I see or hear from the vet. I'm just shoving anything down him even though its coming out the other end. All I need now is that he losses his appetite. He is on omeprezole for the sickness. I was, last week, when they were going to open him up, to say if they found anything wrong to just let him go


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Another update:


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Another update: JJ has been diagnosed with an lymphoma of his intestines. They are going to put him onto steroids on Thursday


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

SbanR said:


> If you're worried about lack of taurine I have a bag and can send you some if you PM your address.


Thank you received today x


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Thank you received today x


Start off with a tiny amount as it does have a distinct taste and might put your cat off it.
You can gradually build up to more.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Another update: JJ has been diagnosed with an lymphoma of his intestines. They are going to put him onto steroids on Thursday


Hi @jenny armour
Sorry I've not had a chance to get on here and reply until now. I'm not surprised JJ has been diagnosed with lymphoma, I'm sorry to hear that & I suspect that's what Tessy really had. Steroids did work wonders for Tessy and I suspect had the vet's upped them a little at times, she would have done a bit better. We always worry that they can cause diabetes, but for some cats, it can seem like the only option. What about probiotics after all the good bacteria got stripped out? Might be worth asking about at some point? Maybe ask the vet about some RC convalescent support or similar liquid food... if JJ is drinking a fair bit, is he? How is JJ in himself?


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> I've taken JJ off the fresh meat untiI I get the felini through. During the night he had two lots of runs very watery I think he was also sick as it looked like chicken, and I am still cleaning him up from yesterday.
> 
> When my Harry was on the appetite stimulant Mirtazapine 15mg, the vet I saw at the time had these tablets cut into 8 pcs, he even warned me not to shake the bottle because they would turn to dust, surely if they cant break them up, how are you expected to? I just hope if its not tumours that they find then I can find something that will agree with him, dont feel confident at the moment.
> 
> ...


I just heard that Zooplus may have delays, unless I've missed a message? Maybe it will be a temporary blip not getting those foods? Do Nellie & Oli eat anything else? Probably worth trying them on something else, for back up. Are there any other similar foods? What about meat or fish? Hopefully they'll do better on meat, than JJ just has done.


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## Whompingwillow (Feb 21, 2018)

jenny armour said:


> Another update: JJ has been diagnosed with an lymphoma of his intestines. They are going to put him onto steroids on Thursday


So sorry to hear this @jenny armour, hope the steroids help and having a diagnosis is somewhat settling just to know, sending all our thoughts xx


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Hi @jenny armour
> Sorry I've not had a chance to get on here and reply until now. I'm not surprised JJ has been diagnosed with lymphoma, I'm sorry to hear that & I suspect that's what Tessy really had. Steroids did work wonders for Tessy and I suspect had the vet's upped them a little at times, she would have done a bit better. We always worry that they can cause diabetes, but for some cats, it can seem like the only option. What about probiotics after all the good bacteria got stripped out? Might be worth asking about at some point? Maybe ask the vet about some RC convalescent support or similar liquid food... if JJ is drinking a fair bit, is he? How is JJ in himself?


I hope the steroids help with his weight and dries up the diarrhoea he was also sick this morning. JJ still very hungry but lethargic in between. Turkey also gave him diarrhoea and altho it may not help I am giving him a combination of Crave and RC EN, but only have 16 pouches to last til I can order again



TriTri said:


> I just heard that Zooplus may have delays, unless I've missed a message? Maybe it will be a temporary blip not getting those foods? Do Nellie & Oli eat anything else? Probably worth trying them on something else, for back up. Are there any other similar foods? What about meat or fish? Hopefully they'll do better on meat, than JJ just has done.


Nellie and Oliver eat Hills id chicken and stew and altho I do have some, I did order some more but thats held up. Got an email from them saying they are going to drop some of the products after Brexit, not sure what tho. They did eat Biome (Hills) but I dont think they are stocking that now



Whompingwillow said:


> So sorry to hear this @jenny armour, hope the steroids help and having a diagnosis is somewhat settling just to know, sending all our thoughts xx


Thank You Whompingwillow for your thoughts xx

On top of everything else, I have been told I have diabetes after a blood test last week, and another one tomorrow, waiting for tablets from Pharmacy2you and thats taking its time been waiting a week


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> I hope the steroids help with his weight and dries up the diarrhoea he was also sick this morning. JJ still very hungry but lethargic in between. Turkey also gave him diarrhoea and altho it may not help I am giving him a combination of Crave and RC EN, but only have 16 pouches to last til I can order again
> 
> Nellie and Oliver eat Hills id chicken and stew and altho I do have some, I did order some more but thats held up. Got an email from them saying they are going to drop some of the products after Brexit, not sure what tho. They did eat Biome (Hills) but I dont think they are stocking that now
> 
> ...


I've not heard of any of those foods. Brexit is just a few days away. Your to-do list must be long. I hope you get your meds soon. Can you ask on CC if anyone has any of those foods left and spare?


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> I've not heard of any of those foods. Brexit is just a few days away. Your to-do list must be long. I hope you get your meds soon. Can you ask on CC if anyone has any of those foods left and spare?


CC? x
Nellie had Hills Boeme and now Hills ID chicken and stew (Oliver also eats it)
JJ was recommended Crave and RC Gastrointestinal EN by his vet for his Pancreatitis

To be crude if I never see a sloppy poo again, it wont be a day too soon lol x


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> CC? x
> Nellie had Hills Boeme and now Hills ID chicken and stew (Oliver also eats it)
> JJ was recommended Crave and RC Gastrointestinal EN by his vet for his Pancreatitis
> 
> To be crude if I never see a sloppy poo again, it wont be a day too soon lol x


Sorry, CC= Cat Chat.
I'd had 6 years of them up until August, (not my own ), but I would put up with it again if I had to (prefer not to mind you). One of the two RC cat foods for dodgy tummies, says in the small print, not for cats with pancreatitis, but don't remember off hand which one. It's on the zooplus info though under contraindications.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Sorry, CC= Cat Chat.
> I'd had 6 years of them up until August, (not my own ), but I would put up with it again if I had to (prefer not to mind you). One of the two RC cat foods for dodgy tummies, says in the small print, not for cats with pancreatitis, but don't remember off hand which one. It's on the zooplus info though under contraindications.


Will have a look but I am sure this RC is for pancreatitis. JJ not looking too happy as vet gave him steroid injection and start the tablets tomorrow. Vet prescribed Hills AD to help build him up. He loved it but not sure about the AD liking him, he isnt interested in food and its Christmas and I cant get to a vet until Tuesday. Do you think he will be better once the steroids start to work, he lost a bit more weight today. Apparently he has a soft cell lymphoma


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

The steroids will reduce inflammation in his intestines as they are a powerful anti-inflammatory, this will allow his intestines to absorb more of the nutrients. Steroids also have the side effect of increasing appetite, which is wanted in JJ’s case is wanted. They should also hopefully make him feel brighter. Dependent on what steroid injection he had will depend on how quick it gets to work. Blue had steroids and the short acting one would make her feel better very quickly within hours but would wear off by the next day. There are medium and longer term steroids last longer but take longer to work, the injection will tide JJ over until the tablets take effect which is usually a day to a day and a half and a little longer to properly reduce the inflammation. I presume it’s prednisilone that he is one.


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

If he is being particularly fussy about the a/d you can stir it up into liquid and mix it in with a preferred food. I had to finger dip feed Blue at times to get her to eat. You can also syringe feeed a/d relatively easy.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

lillytheunicorn said:


> The steroids will reduce inflammation in his intestines as they are a powerful anti-inflammatory, this will allow his intestines to absorb more of the nutrients. Steroids also have the side effect of increasing appetite, which is wanted in JJ's case is wanted. They should also hopefully make him feel brighter. Dependent on what steroid injection he had will depend on how quick it gets to work. Blue had steroids and the short acting one would make her feel better very quickly within hours but would wear off by the next day. There are medium and longer term steroids last longer but take longer to work, the injection will tide JJ over until the tablets take effect which is usually a day to a day and a half and a little longer to properly reduce the inflammation. I presume it's prednisilone that he is one.


His appetite doesnt seem so good as earlier on or any other day. When I opened the first tin (a/d), he fell on it, but although his diarrhoea doesnt seem much different he is getting it all down the back of him, which must make him feel lousy. Dont know what injection he had but it is prednisilone tablets. I did try mixing it in other food but he either licked around it or ignored it altogether. He has had about another 1/4 tin tonight. Syringe feeding is definitely out, he just closes his throat off, so it dribbles out the side of his mouth. Thank you for being so patient, I think being on my own makes it harder, as not having anyone to talk to x



lillytheunicorn said:


> If he is being particularly fussy about the a/d you can stir it up into liquid and mix it in with a preferred food. I had to finger dip feed Blue at times to get her to eat. You can also syringe feeed a/d relatively easy.


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

Try dipping your finger in it and letting him lick it off your finger. If he is eating other food, try not to worry too much he may associate the a/d with feeling ill. Miss May adored RC convalescent diet and had it as an occasional treat as a kitten. She was fed it at the vets and when she came home after being poorly, for a long time she wouldn’t touch it as she associated it with being unwell. 

Fingers crossed his diarrhoea starts to improve, also having NFC I know the pain of poopy knickerbockers.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

lillytheunicorn said:


> Try dipping your finger in it and letting him lick it off your finger. If he is eating other food, try not to worry too much he may associate the a/d with feeling ill. Miss May adored RC convalescent diet and had it as an occasional treat as a kitten. She was fed it at the vets and when she came home after being poorly, for a long time she wouldn't touch it as she associated it with being unwell.
> 
> Fingers crossed his diarrhoea starts to improve, also having NFC I know the pain of poopy knickerbockers.


Couldnt sleep this morning, so got up at 5am, and JJ was waiting and meowing for food. He finished off the AD (3/4 tin) had a good amount of RC Gastrointestinal Moderat dry and some AVF. That was between 5-6 this morning, He has just gone out into the pen, I think for a poo, although I havent had a look to see what its like, so he's kept it down or up for about 6-7 hours. Obviously the diarrhoea makes him tired and he sleeps next to the dish until the next time.

I assume your profile is of your wegie, I have wegie called Troy who looks a little like him x


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

That’s really good news, hopefully the steroids are starting to take effect. 

Yep that’s the original Forest cat Loki in my profile picture. The cat who made me fall in love with the breed.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

lillytheunicorn said:


> That's really good news, hopefully the steroids are starting to take effect.
> 
> Yep that's the original Forest cat Loki in my profile picture. The cat who made me fall in love with the breed.


Lovely breed, except for the poopy bums. I have five of them, do you breed?


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

jenny armour said:


> Lovely breed, except for the poopy bums. I have five of them, do you breed?


Yes we breed Norwegians though that's on a bit of a hiatus at the moment with COVID as I couldn't guarantee to be able to have time off when kittens were born.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Just for a change, JJ seems to be eating well touch wood and now Nellie who is 15 in May is up the emergency vet as she hasnt eaten in two days a friend has taken her in for me, will know later what is happening


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

jenny armour said:


> Just for a change, JJ seems to be eating well touch wood and now Nellie who is 15 in May is up the emergency vet as she hasnt eaten in two days a friend has taken her in for me, will know later what is happening


Oh dear, you are having a rubbish time, hopefully Nellie is easily sorted. Pleased JJ is eating well.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

I hope so, have you heard Nfcs having intestinal problems, four out of five of my wegies are from the same line?



lillytheunicorn said:


> Oh dear, you are having a rubbish time, hopefully Nellie is easily sorted. Pleased JJ is eating well.


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

jenny armour said:


> I hope so, have you heard Nfcs having intestinal problems, four out of five of my wegies are from the same line?


Not really and apart from ours getting campylobacter at stud we haven't had any issues. They did really suffer from the campy, Blue was so ill, I thought I was going to loose her, she was pregnant when it got brought home and the cat who picked it up ended up having a biopsy done as the vet found a mass which went away when they were treated for the campy. The others who are related weren't affected, only the pregnant ones.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

I hope my two youngest stay healthy, they are 9 now. Both JJ and Nellie got this intestinal problem when they were both 11. although they both have different symptoms. Have never heard of Campylobacter sounds really nasty. STill waiting to hear from the vet, I am assuming they will keep Nellie in on a drip. I have a friend who is waiting to go and pick her up but its not fair to expect her to go and pick her up if it is late


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Nellie came out this morning but she isnt eating as yet. She had diarrhoea but I think that was from the drip. JJ still has diarrhoea, wonder if thats the AD being too rich. Vet appointment for him on Thursday


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

jenny armour said:


> Nellie came out this morning but she isnt eating as yet. She had diarrhoea but I think that was from the drip. JJ still has diarrhoea, wonder if thats the AD being too rich. Vet appointment for him on Thursday


The drip shouldn't give her diarrhoea, it will just be fluids possibly with electrolytes. Have you had any faecal testing done? I just wonder if you could have a bug with the fact you have 2 with diarrhoea and JJ's isn't clearing up on steroids (on top of JJ's lymphoma) 
The a/d can give diarrhoea especially if he is eating huge amounts in one sitting, maybe try and pace his eating.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

lillytheunicorn said:


> The drip shouldn't give her diarrhoea, it will just be fluids possibly with electrolytes. Have you had any faecal testing done? I just wonder if you could have a bug with the fact you have 2 with diarrhoea and JJ's isn't clearing up on steroids (on top of JJ's lymphoma)
> The a/d can give diarrhoea especially if he is eating huge amounts in one sitting, maybe try and pace his eating.


The vet warned me she had diarrhoea and that it should clear up. She's been twice and it had a funny smell to it thats why I thought it was from the drip they also took her bloods, which has come back fine and a steroid injection too. She still hasnt eaten yet but seems alot brighter this evening. I have been spreading out JJ's food today and he actually been leaving a bit of it. His poo is what I call one sausage in thick gravey well two sausages tonight, hope you dont like sausages


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> The vet warned me she had diarrhoea and that it should clear up. She's been twice and it had a funny smell to it thats why I thought it was from the drip they also took her bloods, which has come back fine and a steroid injection too. She still hasnt eaten yet but seems alot brighter this evening. I have been spreading out JJ's food today and he actually been leaving a bit of it. His poo is what I call one sausage in thick gravey well two sausages tonight, hope you dont like sausages


Hi @jenny armour, wow, sounds like JJ is making some progress on the steroids. That's good (something).
How's Nellie doing? I'm pleased a friend helped with her trips to the vet. I hope she offers again!
Blood tests for bacterial infections etc don't cover all possible infections with one test, some require specific tests. If Nellie's diarrhoea continues, they might need to do more (specific) tests. I hope she makes a speedy recovery.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Hi @jenny armour, wow, sounds like JJ is making some progress on the steroids. That's good (something).
> How's Nellie doing? I'm pleased a friend helped with her trips to the vet. I hope she offers again!
> Blood tests for bacterial infections etc don't cover all possible infections with one test, some require specific tests. If Nellie's diarrhoea continues, they might need to do more (specific) tests. I hope she makes a speedy recovery.


JJ's poos has gone runny again and is going on the carpet in my bedroom, as if he cant make the tray, unfortunately I have taken up my rugs and shut the bedrooms off for the time being until we get it sorted. I have made an appointment at the vets this afternoon, and I think he is pretty dehydrated, as he keep grating his teeth

Nellie wasnt eating so I gave her some cooked turkey mince which she loved. She started eating her own food this morning, after three days and back on her B12 capsules. My fiend had to help me back in April with Harry too when he wasnt well


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

How did JJ get on at the vets, we have our paws crossed for you.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

lillytheunicorn said:


> How did JJ get on at the vets, we have our paws crossed for you.


Not good I'm afraid. JJ has lost more weight, he is now 3.633 more or less his original body weight. The vet said, we are now clutching at straws, but he gave him an antibiotic, but thats about it. He is still on HIlls AD and eating it like its going out of fashion. I know his days or maybe weeks are numbered but I wont let him suffer. I think at the moment he is still a little bit of life in him, but I wlil keep an eye on him


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

@jenny armour I am sorry to hear that, did he get any pain relief? Blue would grind her teeth in pain, might be worth asking them for some pain relief. Pleased to hear his appetite is good.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

This was taken of him and Harry last month, I can see the difference in him since then


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

jenny armour said:


> View attachment 458959
> This was taken of him and Harry last month, I can see the difference in him since then
> View attachment 458959


Who is who? I just adore black cat!


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Not good I'm afraid. JJ has lost more weight, he is now 3.633 more or less his original body weight. The vet said, we are now clutching at straws, but he gave him an antibiotic, but thats about it. He is still on HIlls AD and eating it like its going out of fashion. I know his days or maybe weeks are numbered but I wont let him suffer. I think at the moment he is still a little bit of life in him, but I wlil keep an eye on him


Sorry it wasn't better news @jenny armour
You know what's best for JJ. At least he is eating and Nellie is too now. What a rollercoaster life is with cats. Bless him. I hope the antibiotics help JJ. Is the Hills A/D the tinned food that's like rubber, that you need to add hot water to, to make it more palatable?

Would any carpets roll up, temporarily? When my sweet Pickles lost proper use of her bladder, I had to cover the carpets in bed sheets. A thin polythene slip-coat over the carpets could help, if it's not a tripping hazard? Or restricting his area, as you are doing now, will obviously save your carpets.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

lillytheunicorn said:


> Who is who? I just adore black cat![/QUOTE
> 
> The black cat is JJ with Harry he's red silver and white (he has renal problems) I got Troy and Torre B/w and blue and white who are brothers and a little bigger and then Nellie who is coming up for 15 in May
> 
> I will do that with the AD TRish, JJ has the run of the conservatory, although he doesnt go out there much, kitchen, hall and lounge, all wooden flooring and tiling..Two of my bedrooms are sort of open plan to the stairs. He can also get out into the cat pen, which he does, but I have put a cat bed on top of the kitchen table so he can lay in there, which he seems to like


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

JJ taken in November


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Nellie in her prime before she lost her weight


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Troy


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

This was taken a few years ago. L-R Torre, Oliver, Troy and JJ, happy times


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

.... I didnt see her on the end, hiding, but thats Pixie who I rescued with her son 9 years ago.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

I feel that time is getting close for JJ, he was sick last night and not eating so much today. This is where I become a coward and have got to be brave for JJ. I also have the doctor phoning because my sugar levels were so high that they are worried, although I feel ok in myself.


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## lillytheunicorn (Nov 17, 2012)

JJ is absolutely stunning, I love black NFC and black smoke NFC. I am so sorry to hear that but you will know when is best. 

Please also look after yourself, you can’t look after the cats if you are not well. 

my thoughts are with you. Xx


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

lillytheunicorn said:


> JJ is absolutely stunning, I love black NFC and black smoke NFC. I am so sorry to hear that but you will know when is best.
> 
> Please also look after yourself, you can't look after the cats if you are not well.
> 
> my thoughts are with you. Xx


Thank you I will try. I am already starting to cut down, but seeing the nurse on Monday

The story of JJ is when I phoned the breeder about him as a kitten, I was told he was going cheaper because he was black, but he is down as a black and white because he has a small white mark between two of his back toes, he was such character, my Asbo baby. Just the one winter he did go black smoke, but never again after that


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> I feel that time is getting close for JJ, he was sick last night and not eating so much today. This is where I become a coward and have got to be brave for JJ. I also have the doctor phoning because my sugar levels were so high that they are worried, although I feel ok in myself.


Hi @jenny armour, I didn't get the updates and have only just seen this. How are things? Manageable I hope? What a lovely photo of 5 of your cats.... as you say "Happy Days." Troy looks like my "Mr Tizzy" who was originally called Jerry Lee Lewis by his original family.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Hi @jenny armour, I didn't get the updates and have only just seen this. How are things? Manageable I hope? What a lovely photo of 5 of your cats.... as you say "Happy Days." Troy looks like my "Mr Tizzy" who was originally called Jerry Lee Lewis by his original family.


Hi Trish and thank you, yes my Troy is a real love and so laid back, mind you he can bully his brother Torre and Nellie though. JJ is still with me although nothing has changed. I took JJ to the vet last week and told him that the steroids werent working, He more or less shrugged and said I was clutching at straws. I'm not silly I know it can be anytime. He doesnt seem to be in any pain and so far is still eating. Sometimes he just lays in his bed and looks like he is in a trance. He obviously does alot of sleeping, but in the morning when I come downstairs he runs around yelling for his food does a good scratch on the post and he still has a good wash when he finishes eating.

Because he is on HIlls AD I ordered some from Zooplus, but I had run out so for the time being I got a tray of 24 from the vets. Couldnt believe the price £75.17!!!! Zooplus £43.99, I know its expensive but not that dear, I mix it with his AVF, he seems to life it.

How's your baby ?


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Hi Trish and thank you, yes my Troy is a real love and so laid back, mind you he can bully his brother Torre and Nellie though. JJ is still with me although nothing has changed. I took JJ to the vet last week and told him that the steroids werent working, He more or less shrugged and said I was clutching at straws. I'm not silly I know it can be anytime. He doesnt seem to be in any pain and so far is still eating. Sometimes he just lays in his bed and looks like he is in a trance. He obviously does alot of sleeping, but in the morning when I come downstairs he runs around yelling for his food does a good scratch on the post and he still has a good wash when he finishes eating.
> 
> Because he is on HIlls AD I ordered some from Zooplus, but I had run out so for the time being I got a tray of 24 from the vets. Couldnt believe the price £75.17!!!! Zooplus £43.99, I know its expensive but not that dear, I mix it with his AVF, he seems to life it.
> 
> How's your baby ?


Your Troy sounds lovely, with Mr Tizzy's same naughty streak.
Well it sounds like JJ isn't doing too bad, considering his diagnosis.
Yes, Zooplus can be a lot cheaper than other suppliers, but sent me the wrong cat food a week ago & I'm still awaiting the replacement. Other suppliers are sold out..

My Max isn't doing too well at the moment and I'm not really getting anywhere fast with the vet's. He's been off since Tessy passed away in August, then 2 or 3 unexpected cat fights in September & the weather changing and then after a Credelio flea tablet he kept vomiting. He's got intermittent pain in his mouth and the whites of his eyes are a bit red. He had full set of blood tests, then SDMA blood test, all pretty normal, omeprazole for nearly two months, which held off the vomiting _until yesterday_ and eye drops for his left eye. His right eye is red tonight in the white parts (difficult to spot unless you lift his eyelids up). He also started snoring & sounding wheezy (no comments by the vet's about this). He hates car trips & not sure what to do, but think I'll have to give the vet's another try tomorrow or Tuesday. Any ideas? I took a screenshot of his mouth from a video and wondered if he has a loose tooth dangling sideways, can you see in this photo? Any suggestions? He stays in more, but still goes out too, scratches his posts, eats turkey foods only etc. He's 10 years old. 
Edit: @chillminx would you have any ideas? The vet supposed to have given him a good check over a couple of weeks back and thought he seemed great, especially as he had regained a little weight, but him, his eyes/mouth/vomiting suggest otherwise.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Your Troy sounds lovely, with Mr Tizzy's same naughty streak.
> Well it sounds like JJ isn't doing too bad, considering his diagnosis.
> Yes, Zooplus can be a lot cheaper than other suppliers, but sent me the wrong cat food a week ago & I'm still awaiting the replacement. Other suppliers are sold out..
> 
> ...


Cant see too clearly Max's mouth, do you think its a loose tooth? What was wrong with Max originally? Would a second opinion help do you think?
These animals are a real worry arent they? This year, I have seen the the vet twice with Harry, twice with Oliver, a few times with Nellie what with steroids and overnight stay on Boxing night, and countless times with JJ. Maggie my rough collie started being sick on Thusday but she seems fine and has eaten her first two meals today. Oliver has had not so much diarrhoea but my bathroom floor was more or less covered with his faeces this morning, they are like small slugs size. The vet wants him back on his Hills ZD which he hates. He has been eating Nellie's ID chicken and vegetable until now for about the past year. His weight since March has gone from 4.3 to 3.6, he's nearly 14 now. If the steroids dont work we could be going the same road as JJ ie scans


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Cant see too clearly Max's mouth, do you think its a loose tooth? What was wrong with Max originally? Would a second opinion help do you think?
> These animals are a real worry arent they? This year, I have seen the the vet twice with Harry, twice with Oliver, a few times with Nellie what with steroids and overnight stay on Boxing night, and countless times with JJ. Maggie my rough collie started being sick on Thusday but she seems fine and has eaten her first two meals today. Oliver has had not so much diarrhoea but my bathroom floor was more or less covered with his faeces this morning, they are like small slugs size. The vet wants him back on his Hills ZD which he hates. He has been eating Nellie's ID chicken and vegetable until now for about the past year. His weight since March has gone from 4.3 to 3.6, he's nearly 14 now. If the steroids dont work we could be going the same road as JJ ie scans


Hi, aww poor Olli.
Yes, I think Max has a loose tooth, at minimum & he's booked in to go back to the vet tomorrow morning. He was vomiting and nauseous originally. I can't travel far with Max, as he gets very upset in the car. My vet is a 5 minute drive away, roughly... that's each way, so 10 minutes of torture for him (& me).

I think a lot of your cats are 11-14 aren't they? When they are of a similar age, and get to about that age (& especially older), it can be a lot of trips to the vet. I thought I'd get a few more years out of Max yet, before he'd have to have lots of trips to/from the vet's, but that was wishful thinking. If only they could talk our language.

I hope your little (or big, rather) fur family all pick up soon. Hopefully Maggie has just had a blip and is now back to feeling well again. I wonder most days how JJ's doing & hope things don't ever get worse. He sounds a little fighter. You certainly have had a lot to deal with lately, well done, keep going. That's a lovely photo of them together.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Hi, aww poor Olli.
> Yes, I think Max has a loose tooth, at minimum & he's booked in to go back to the vet tomorrow morning. He was vomiting and nauseous originally. I can't travel far with Max, as he gets very upset in the car. My vet is a 5 minute drive away, roughly... that's each way, so 10 minutes of torture for him (& me).
> 
> I think a lot of your cats are 11-14 aren't they? When they are of a similar age, and get to about that age (& especially older), it can be a lot of trips to the vet. I thought I'd get a few more years out of Max yet, before he'd have to have lots of trips to/from the vet's, but that was wishful thinking. If only they could talk our language.
> ...


6 out of 8 of my cats are in that age gap including my outdoor cats, but so far those two are pretty hardy, lets hope it stays that way. Brothers Troy and Torre are 9 now.

Oliver had a steroid injection and anti sickness, but he had a 'squirt' of diarrohea tonight and he is staying on the ZD, mind you I think he stole a couple of dry bits from a bowl that I hadnt got rid of. Got to let the vet know how he is doing. I dread that they might mention scanning him. she did say that he is very inflamed inside.

JJ does alot of sleeping, in fact he had been asleep since late morning today and just sat up this evening. I thought he wanted to eat, but next thing he was back in his bed asleep again. This I am happy about as obviously doesnt want to go to the toilet so much.

How is Max today?


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> 6 out of 8 of my cats are in that age gap including my outdoor cats, but so far those two are pretty hardy, lets hope it stays that way. Brothers Troy and Torre are 9 now.
> 
> Oliver had a steroid injection and anti sickness, but he had a 'squirt' of diarrohea tonight and he is staying on the ZD, mind you I think he stole a couple of dry bits from a bowl that I hadnt got rid of. Got to let the vet know how he is doing. I dread that they might mention scanning him. she did say that he is very inflamed inside.
> 
> ...


Hi @jenny armour
Poor Ollie, what a shame. 6 in that age gap, wow! How lovely to have brother cats too. Little JJ, big kiss to him please, from me.

Max saw a new vet yesterday. She has put him back on omeprazole as it stopped him vomiting before. She says they can stay on it longer than the 7 weeks the previous vet suggested. (I asked about Famatodine otherwise). Vet didnt say why he may be vomiting. She thinks he has conjunctivitis (though no wet eye discharge), the whites of his eyes are red, so this time put on antibiotic steroid eye drops, as opposed to just antibiotic drops. Max needs a chest X-ray to find out why he's snoring/wheezing now and mouth was sensitive to her touch & she says he needs a dental anyway, with mouth X-rays and full bloods first and can do the chest X-ray then too. 'Will leave him for 1-2 weeks first, for his eye problem to heal, as she said the anaesthetic would otherwise make his eyes very dry (& sore? I think she said). She said mouth pain can make them nauseous. My previous cats usually needed a dental around the age of 7-8 + and then again at the age of 13-14 ish and maybe another one too in later years, and I suppose cats must vary, but Max is ten, so I'm surprised he needs yet another dental. I need to check his records, but I think this is his third, since he's lived with me. I can't clean his teeth I'm afraid, might lose my fingers, & I worry about using the dental powder in food, as it has kelp in it, which is not good for the thyroid I believe. I hope people luck enough to have kittens, brush their cats teeth from a young age to get use to it. If I'd had Max from a kitten, I'd have got him use to the car from kitten hood... he does not like my driving and becomes very vocal & sometimes hangs upside down in the carrier from the the bars, like a bat!


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Hi @jenny armour
> Poor Ollie, what a shame. 6 in that age gap, wow! How lovely to have brother cats too. Little JJ, big kiss to him please, from me.
> 
> Max saw a new vet yesterday. She has put him back on omeprazole as it stopped him vomiting before. She says they can stay on it longer than the 7 weeks the previous vet suggested. (I asked about Famatodine otherwise). Vet didnt say why he may be vomiting. She thinks he has conjunctivitis (though no wet eye discharge), the whites of his eyes are red, so this time put on antibiotic steroid eye drops, as opposed to just antibiotic drops. Max needs a chest X-ray to find out why he's snoring/wheezing now and mouth was sensitive to her touch & she says he needs a dental anyway, with mouth X-rays and full bloods first and can do the chest X-ray then too. 'Will leave him for 1-2 weeks first, for his eye problem to heal, as she said the anaesthetic would otherwise make his eyes very dry (& sore? I think she said). She said mouth pain can make them nauseous. My previous cats usually needed a dental around the age of 7-8 + and then again at the age of 13-14 ish and maybe another one too in later years, and I suppose cats must vary, but Max is ten, so I'm surprised he needs yet another dental. I need to check his records, but I think this is his third, since he's lived with me. I can't clean his teeth I'm afraid, might lose my fingers, & I worry about using the dental powder in food, as it has kelp in it, which is not good for the thyroid I believe. I hope people luck enough to have kittens, brush their cats teeth from a young age to get use to it. If I'd had Max from a kitten, I'd have got him use to the car from kitten hood... he does not like my driving and becomes very vocal & sometimes hangs upside down in the carrier from the the bars, like a bat!


Oh TRish, I think black and black and white cats are such characters. This vet seems to make sense in what she says, interesting about the Omeprazole. Perhaps you can see her more in future, just shows you how vets all have their own ideas.

Oliver is on antibiotics and steroid tablets to help to clear up this diarrhoea, otherwise next is guess........a scan, his tummy is very inflamed and there is alot of thickening. He has had possible IBS/IBD since 2016 and in that time his weight has almost halved. He is not happy about the ZD but I have got to give it a chance. Great fun organising where and when my cats feed, from the conservatory (Nellie), kitchen, (JJ) hall (Troy and Torre) and then (Oliver)and lounge (Harry and Pixie), Freddie on the doorstep. The dogs (Maggie and Tullis) are a little easier lol.

JJ seems to be sleeping more and more these days, and I am having wake him up to feed him, as I said before, he gives the impression he is hungry and the next thing I know he's asleep again. I suppose this is how its going to be with him sleeping more and more.

I hope the vet helps Mx out x


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

Just an update on JJ. He had diarrhoea overnight and again this morning, he cant quite make the tray so was on the floor both times. He has just been sick and brought up all his breakfast from this morning, doesnt look very happy. I am seeing how he is overnight, but if he cant keep anything inside him........ The trouble is getting him in, as it is always a squeeze nowadays.

Didnt wait until tomorrow as there wasnt a spare appointment, so took him in tonight. I really thought I was going to say goodbye to him, but the vet had a look at him and said that he didnt think any different from last time which was the week after Christmas. He has given him an antisickness injection one that apparently they use on dogs and has good results on cats, and an antibiotic injection. If he is still being sick tomorrow then to take him back. One bit of good news is has put on about 0.3 kilo which is better than nothing.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Just an update on JJ. He had diarrhoea overnight and again this morning, he cant quite make the tray so was on the floor both times. He has just been sick and brought up all his breakfast from this morning, doesnt look very happy. I am seeing how he is overnight, but if he cant keep anything inside him........ The trouble is getting him in, as it is always a squeeze nowadays.
> 
> Didnt wait until tomorrow as there wasnt a spare appointment, so took him in tonight. I really thought I was going to say goodbye to him, but the vet had a look at him and said that he didnt think any different from last time which was the week after Christmas. He has given him an antisickness injection one that apparently they use on dogs and has good results on cats, and an antibiotic injection. If he is still being sick tomorrow then to take him back. One bit of good news is has put on about 0.3 kilo which is better than nothing.


Thanks for the update @jenny armour.
That was lucky getting JJ seen today & any weight gain is always encouraging. Was he dehydrated? I hope the sickness and diarrhoea stops soon. You must be watching him like a hawk. And poor Ollie too, let's hope the ZD helps. I'm trying to imagine them all when they are eating. I was bought a waste disposal unit for Christmas, for leftover smelly cat food! Apparently this one grinds waste into nothing! I just need to get it fitted now. I currently stick leftover cat food into nappy sacks, before binning.

Come on cats, get better please....


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Thanks for the update @jenny armour.
> That was lucky getting JJ seen today & any weight gain is always encouraging. Was he dehydrated? I hope the sickness and diarrhoea stops soon. You must be watching him like a hawk. And poor Ollie too, let's hope the ZD helps. I'm trying to imagine them all when they are eating. I was bought a waste disposal unit for Christmas, for leftover smelly cat food! Apparently this one grinds waste into nothing! I just need to get it fitted now. I currently stick leftover cat food into nappy sacks, before binning.
> 
> Come on cats, get better please....


Vet phoned this morning regarding Oliver, his poo isnt so bad and he isnt spreading around the bathroom floor like he was on Monday. Still on the steroids and Ab's. Why is it when cats have these sort of problems that they rarely use the trays, or is it just mine? (my cats that is lol)

You would laugh if you saw the routine regarding eating, I have to feed Nellie in the conservatory, JJ in the kitchen, Troy and Torre (dry food in morning) in hall, Freddie and Pixie on doorstep and Harry in lounge, then when Troy and Torre finish, Oliver gets to eat his. JJ and Nellie eats little and often, so by the time I have finished that, I start again and again with JJ and Nellie. Knackering. Oh in between that my poor dogs get to eat theirs, then I take them out for their walk. Medication is fun atm as JJ and Oliver are both on the steriods but different dosages

Be interesting to see how your waste disposal bins work. My dogs are my waste disposals bins, but not much left after my cats finish


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

jenny armour said:


> Vet phoned this morning regarding Oliver, his poo isnt so bad and he isnt spreading around the bathroom floor like he was on Monday. Still on the steroids and Ab's. Why is it when cats have these sort of problems that they rarely use the trays, or is it just mine? (my cats that is lol)
> 
> You would laugh if you saw the routine regarding eating, I have to feed Nellie in the conservatory, JJ in the kitchen, Troy and Torre (dry food in morning) in hall, Freddie and Pixie on doorstep and Harry in lounge, then when Troy and Torre finish, Oliver gets to eat his. JJ and Nellie eats little and often, so by the time I have finished that, I start again and again with JJ and Nellie. Knackering. Oh in between that my poor dogs get to eat theirs, then I take them out for their walk. Medication is fun atm as JJ and Oliver are both on the steriods but different dosages
> 
> Be interesting to see how your waste disposal bins work. My dogs are my waste disposals bins, but not much left after my cats finish


Oh doggy waste bins, how handy.
I think the average litter tray is too small for a cat needing to get comfy passing diarrhoea, thats why I mentioned the Catit hooded extra large litter trays, but without the lid. Tessy was very good with her tray, she had several normal trays plus this one, by far her favourite. I can't remember the exact size, but think this may be the one...
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Catit-Jumbo-Hooded-Cat-Grey/dp/B003RQVGKC


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

TriTri said:


> Oh doggy waste bins, how handy.
> I think the average litter tray is too small for a cat needing to get comfy passing diarrhoea, thats why I mentioned the Catit hooded extra large litter trays, but without the lid. Tessy was very good with her tray, she had several normal trays plus this one, by far her favourite. I can't remember the exact size, but think this may be the one...
> https://www.amazon.co.uk/Catit-Jumbo-Hooded-Cat-Grey/dp/B003RQVGKC


I have jumbo bins but I dont think they are as big as that. I have had them over 20 years as I used to have a raggie (Raffles) who was rather large (9.6Kgs) he couldnt fit in a ordinary large tray with hood. I deliberately bought smaller ones as I was using so much litter in the larger. In fact I got one from the Cats Protection charity shop that I used to work in, but I took it back, wish I'd kept it now that was ginormous Nellie I fear has always been a not very litter trained cat. For ten years she would, given the chance, wee in the rooms, so I had to keep her in the conservatory, now its her poo.

Dont know if its a coincidence and I am not going to hold my breath, but I noticed JJ hadnt had a 'moussy' poo since Thursday, and tonight I had a shower and he couldnt get into the bathroom where one of the litter trays are, so he pooed outside the door and it was firm! I wonder if it was anything to do with the injection he had on Thursday evening. The trouble is the vet told me at the time what it was called, but I didnt take any noticed of what he said, as I was more concerned if I could still give JJ his omeprezole, but it was for the sickness. He said at the time it was normally given to dogs but it worked on cats.


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