# My Rough collie has bitten my son ,



## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

please please can anyone give me some advise , we are considering having him uthanised , we got him from a proper breeder and i rang her to tell her and she wasnt really interested please help ..


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## DoodlesRule (Jul 7, 2011)

How hold is the dog, how old is the son what was going on when he was bitten


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## thedogsmother (Aug 28, 2008)

Welcome to the forums, Im sorry its under such circumstances though . Has your dog ever bitten or shown aggression before?
Have you had a vet check him over to see if hes hiding signs of pain?


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## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

hello everyone. my name is valerie samantha. i have a collie and a westie, can anyone help me how this forum works, i need to find someone who can advise me. our rough collie has bitten my son hes 25 but it was fairly bad and im wondering wot anyone else would now do , please help x


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## AmberNero (Jun 6, 2010)

Hi, sorry to hear this, the important thing is not to panic, head over to dog chat for the best advice and opinions- outline exactly what happened with the dog and your son. A lot of factors can affect this, the dogs health, the way your son may have moved- if he startled the dog by accident, for instance. Welcome to PF, sorry your first few posts here are about something less positive


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## canuckjill (Jun 25, 2008)

I read on another thread her son is 25. What was happening at the time? Does your dog know your son? If you can give us more info it will help immensly how old is the dog etc...


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

Things to consider are: What precipitated the bite? How old is the dog? First consider whether perhaps the dog has something medically wrong that could be causing him pain, so get him checked out by a vet.

He could be getting old and going a little senile, so we would need more information on that. Don't worry, it could be a one off, but there is always a reason when a dog bites, even if it is not an obvious reason.


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

I have replied to the other thread

http://www.petforums.co.uk/dog-chat/272244-my-dog-has-bitten-my-son.html


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

chelseabond said:


> please please can anyone give me some advise , we are considering having him uthanised , we got him from a proper breeder and i rang her to tell her and she wasnt really interested please help ..


Please read my reply on your other thread. Do I take it then that this is a young dog, perhaps even a puppy? I cannot believe that you are thinking of having a young dog pts because of one incident, so please come back and give more details.


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## canuckjill (Jun 25, 2008)

My Collie nipped a young girl in my back yard, turned out totally innocent the dog was actually trying to pull her away from something and nipped through her shirt. So a full description of what was happening can make all the difference in the world. I never even got mad at my dog as she was trying to prevent an accident in the making...


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

canuckjill said:


> My Collie nipped a young girl in my back yard, turned out totally innocent the dog was actually trying to pull her away from something and nipped through her shirt. So a full description of what was happening can make all the difference in the world. I never even got mad at my dog as she was trying to prevent an accident in the making...


Exactly. Dogs always have a reason, even though it might turn out to not be a logical one. That is the first thing to discover.


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## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

hy there ty so much all of you for showing interest im at my wits end.i got my collie from a breeder in kent and she does come on this forum.
we paid her £600 for him and i have loved him from the 6 weeks when we got him, hes called marley, 
he is 4 years old , is groomed by a groomer every 6-8 weeks to kp his coat beautiful and i brush him every 2-3 days inbetween that. he lives with me , my partner al, and our little 13 year old westie.
from the time he was 1 year old or even before that he was showing his teeth, he likes a lot of fuss and from that he will suddenly show his teeth so we stop. we have learnt to recognise the signs. in the last 3 years he has nipped quite a few of freinds n family nothing severe, but none the less hes dun it.
sometimes the person went to stroke him or bent dwon to him or was just sitting in a chair stroking his head.
my son danny came to live with us for a few months and this was about 2-3 months ago so its not like afew days ago.
we have been living in our caravan for the last 7 years so this has always been marleys home. he is let out lots and has a big garden.
and is loved dearly.
last nyt we all heard some shouting outside our van so we went into my bedroom to listen, (being nosey) then we came bac into front room, i sat down on the sofa one end and danny on the other, marley came up to danny and he leaned over to pat him then marley sunk his teeth into dannys hand, danny tried to pull away but marley wudnt let go until we jumped up to stop him.
the bite was quite bad, so now . we are all very upset i have cried most of today, we have an appointment at our vets in the morning for advice but are terrified he will say he shud be put down. this will break my heart . i hope my info has helped some of you to help me. i did ring the breeder this morning and sed it mite be something in the genes of the collies u are breeding but she wasnt really interested ....


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

chelseabond said:


> hy there ty so much all of you for showing interest im at my wits end.i got my collie from a breeder in kent and she does come on this forum.
> we paid her £600 for him and i have loved him from the 6 weeks when we got him, hes called marley,
> he is 4 years old , is groomed by a groomer every 6-8 weeks to kp his coat beautiful and i brush him every 2-3 days inbetween that. he lives with me , my partner al, and our little 13 year old westie.
> from the time he was 1 year old or even before that he was showing his teeth, he likes a lot of fuss and from that he will suddenly show his teeth so we stop. we have learnt to recognise the signs. in the last 3 years he has nipped quite a few of freinds n family nothing severe, but none the less hes dun it.
> ...


If you have never had him professionally assesed by a behaviourist and dealt with the problems when they first started, it could be purely behavioural without the appropriate behaviour modification and training problems especially when they first start to become an issue they can and do exacerbate. So you may find he does have purely a temperament/behavioural problem.

On a check on collie health some lines apparently can be known for poor temperament particularly apparently excessive shyness, anxiety problems can lead to what appears to be agressive reactive behaviour.

There is also several health problems known in the rough collie, also though like epilepsy which is a neurological problem, also hypo thyroidism that also is on the list and can cause behavioural problems and aggression, and as its mentioned under Rough collie health it cant be that unusual or rare. Also Heart problems, and we did actually have a thread once where another breed suddenly bit a member of the family and he turned out to have heart problems.
Other problems like liver issues can also cause changes in behaviour too.

First off I would get him a through check up including an orthopaedic exam, as pain and discomfort can make dogs reactive and aggressive. I would personally also have hemotology and biochemistry blood tests to make sure there are no underlying health problems, and as hypo thyroid is mentioned on collie health have a full thyroid test panel done, to rule that out as well. Which is a separate specific blood test.

If he gets a clear bill of health and there are no underlying physical diseases/problems that are causing it then next step would be to get in a behaviourist for a full temperament assessment and behaviour modification programme to deal with the problems if it is behavioural. If the behaviourist after assessment does say though that its fixable the whole family will have to follow the programe to the letter as it wont work to modify his behaviour problems otherwise.

CAPBT - COAPE Association of Pet Behaviourists and Trainers will find a behaviourist in your area, best thing is to speak to a few first. Otherwise vets can usually put you in touch with reccomended behaviourists.


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## Netpon (Feb 21, 2012)

I wuldn't rush in to anything. Get your vet to rule out any medical reason and then ask for a referral to a behaviorist.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

Forgot to add the link on collie health
Learn About Collies | Herbal-remedy-for-hypothyroidism-in-rough-collie

Although I would ignore the mention of herbal stuff to help with hypothyroid if he did have it, the only way is thyroid hormone replacement therapy in the form of tablets to replace it and solve the problem.


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## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

thank you so much for your replies can u keep them coming, the only thing i will say at the moment is that i rang some behaviourists a couple of years ago after another issue, and we was told it wud be about £600 just to i dont think the insurance will cover tests for to do with behaivousee him, then more for further visits, and im afraid we dont habve that kind of money, and all these tests at the vets will cost hundreds, he is fully insured by the way, and has been castrated. i dont think the insurance will cover tests for behaviour problems


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

chelseabond said:


> thank you so much for your replies can u keep them coming, the only thing i will say at the moment is that i rang some behaviourists a couple of years ago after another issue, and we was told it wud be about £600 just to i dont think the insurance will cover tests for to do with behaivousee him, then more for further visits, and im afraid we dont habve that kind of money, and all these tests at the vets will cost hundreds, he is fully insured by the way, and has been castrated. i dont think the insurance will cover tests for behaviour problems


Firstly, it shouldn't cost anywhere near that much money. Secondly if your vet refers you to a behaviourist (and a proper one may not see him without a vet referral) the insurance may well cover it.

But you need to be very careful as at the moment, any idiot can call themselves a behaviourist so you need someone with the right qualifications. Start with the vet and see what he has to say.

I think myself that your dog has been allowed to get away with whatever he likes, he has been subjected to some row outside and possibly associated that with your son. Collies can be temperamental, but you need to be sure it is not medical to start with.


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

chelseabond said:


> thank you so much for your replies can u keep them coming, the only thing i will say at the moment is that i rang some behaviourists a couple of years ago after another issue, and we was told it wud be about £600 just to i dont think the insurance will cover tests for to do with behaivousee him, then more for further visits, and im afraid we dont habve that kind of money, and all these tests at the vets will cost hundreds, he is fully insured by the way, and has been castrated. i dont think the insurance will cover tests for behaviour problems


It won't hurt anything to take your dog to the vet initially, it should only cost a consultation fee ... with some vets this may even be free to do.

Then you will get a better idea what you're looking at.

It's a difficult situation you're in. You say the breeder posts on the forums, if you know their username why not try PMing them via the forums and alerting them to this thread? They might be more helpful this way.


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## Hanlou (Oct 29, 2012)

I would also advise ringing the  (( Rough Collie Rescue )) for advice or if you decide to rehome.

Our Rough' has never ever come close to biting us despite having been mistreated before we adopted her but she is protective and has barked at my husband in the past if she thought he was doing something to hurt me (he wasn't, he was just messing about!).

I fully agree with getting him checked out thoroughly health-wise and take it from there.


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## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

thanks for the l;ast reply, im afraid my cursor must have jumped about and jumbled my writing up a little. im glad u cud decifer it. i had marley on my own for the first year of his life, then my partner came to live with me and not long after he was sittin on the sofa and he just went to pat his head then all of a sudden marley had jumped up at him showing his teeth , he didnt bite him but he shwoed aggression,and now my son danny has come to live here for a wile, (hes been here 2-3 months tho already) hes had a go at him the first time it was nipping , but now this time its far more. butttt hes never attacked me ...


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## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

hy aurelia, yes the breeder does post on here but i dont think shes too bothered i have told her i think something is wrong along he rbreeding line maybe but i dont know this, and i spoke to her on the fone this morning but she didnt seem interested, i got very upset and sed to her i love my boy and cant bear the thought of losing him in any way, all she sed then was im going this is upsetting me, but i dont think she was interested . we are takin him to the vets in the morning to have a chat initially....


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## Knightofalbion (Jul 3, 2012)

Rough Collies are intelligent animals. They need stimulation. And as they're essentially working dogs, they need plenty of exercise too. If they don't get one or both, they can get a bit cranky.

And as with every dog it needs to grow up in a loving environment, BUT it needs to know the ground rules and its place in the pecking order. In a wild state, a dog would readily nip and bite other pack members that it saw as subordinate or rival to it.

There is also the possibility that the dog may have an ailment i.e. ear infection or bad tooth, that is causing him pain and hence the reaction.

Hanlou gave very good advice. Contact Rough Collie Rescue. They can give you wise counsel on getting on top of your dog's behaviour. Or rehome it if you think the dog has gone too far. I certainly wouldn't like to see the dog put down.


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## hutch6 (May 9, 2008)

So he's nipped Danny before, was it for a similar interaction?

What is the dog like when outside of the home?

What is the dog like when you're not around?

Can you do what Danny did without the dog reacting in anyway at all?

When he shows his teeth or growls etc. does it matter which side the person is on i.e his left or his right, in front or to the side?


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

chelseabond said:


> thanks for the l;ast reply, im afraid my cursor must have jumped about and jumbled my writing up a little. im glad u cud decifer it. i had marley on my own for the first year of his life, then my partner came to live with me and not long after he was sittin on the sofa and he just went to pat his head then all of a sudden marley had jumped up at him showing his teeth , he didnt bite him but he shwoed aggression,and now my son danny has come to live here for a wile, (hes been here 2-3 months tho already) hes had a go at him the first time it was nipping , but now this time its far more. butttt hes never attacked me ...


It seems to me that this dog has bitten people who have patted him on the head, if I have read this correctly. It could be that he is in some pain on his head or his ears, or it could be that this movement is frightening him. It is never a good idea to put your hand over a dog's head unless you know that dog very well, but you know your dog is likely to snap so not a good idea at all.



chelseabond said:


> hy aurelia, yes the breeder does post on here but i dont think shes too bothered i have told her i think something is wrong along he rbreeding line maybe but i dont know this, and i spoke to her on the fone this morning but she didnt seem interested, i got very upset and sed to her i love my boy and cant bear the thought of losing him in any way, all she sed then was im going this is upsetting me, but i dont think she was interested . we are takin him to the vets in the morning to have a chat initially....


Whether the breeder posts on here or not is irrelevant really. It would be libellous to name them, and I am not really sure what you expect her to do anyway, except maybe take the dog back. Possibly you have enlightened her to a fault in her lines, which is why she is upset, but please don't assume anything.

Let us know what the vet had to say.


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## Ang2 (Jun 15, 2012)

Now my friend has a collie that can be temperamental - sweet, loving and obedient - but can show his teeth when he doesnt get his way. She has handled this remarkably well. She always stands up to reprimand him in a very stern voice and he backs down. 

I dont really know what you expect from the breeder. They cant be responible for the whole life of the dog. He is, after all, four years old now. 

My friend takes her collie out twice a day for 2 hour walks and has him running and chasing balls and sticks the whole time. It really helps tire him out and he is definitely more sombre.


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## Netpon (Feb 21, 2012)

Some insurance companies wioll pay for behaviourists if referred by a vet. I have consulted behaviourists in the past and it didn't cost anything like £600, I think I paid £100-£150


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

To be clear I am encouraging the poster to get the breeder more involved because of the fact it might shed some light on a fault in their lines that they don't know about, or they could have had past experience with something similar and be able to offer help getting the matter resolved. Not for some witch hunt or to even take the dog back (which I'm almost sure the poster dosn't want anyway).

I do think though that the most important thing to do first is get the dog to a vet for a consultation. It may also be that the dog has a problem with its neck. Collies are often walked on chokechains, which we all know is not really wise especially if they pull.


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## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

hy
marley is very very obedient,i am the one i wud say that is in charge of him, when we are out walkin he is fine he doesnt snap at people, but if people approach him i do say cud u leave him as he gets a bit funny, so i dont have a problem there.
as for the breeder i wud never disclose who they are, and i know theres nothin she can do now, she did offer a couple of years ago she even offered to come and take him back, but we feared she may have got him put to sleep and we decided to carry on as we do lovel our boy.
but i have done this last call to her todayand to make sure she knows this has come about in a dog she has bred, its a bit weird really cos right from the day we bought marley home he has been of plastic bags we only have to move or rattle one and he is terrified,and hes also scared to go out for a walk or run or even to the toiled when its windy.
i must also say, we were away on hol a few weeks ago on a narrowboat.
and me and my al were lettin the 2 dogs off the boat late at nyt before we all went to bed , we were away with family...anyway id got off the boat to let marley toilet al was waitin on the boat a few feet away from me, i sed to al marleys been for a wee ill swap them over now, all of a sudden these guys were comin over a bridge and shouting zak come back then this rottweiler came at me he jumped up at me, and marley jumped at him it was awful my family came running over off the boat and they managed to get the dog away, by this time id seen the dog go for marleys neck and i jumped myslef on top of marley i got him underneath me , it ended with the 2 dogs ok and id smashed my knee, the moral of this story is, marley was protecting me and i ended up doing the same for him ....


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

chelseabond said:


> thank you so much for your replies can u keep them coming, the only thing i will say at the moment is that i rang some behaviourists a couple of years ago after another issue, and we was told it wud be about £600 just to i dont think the insurance will cover tests for to do with behaivousee him, then more for further visits, and im afraid we dont habve that kind of money, and all these tests at the vets will cost hundreds, he is fully insured by the way, and has been castrated. i dont think the insurance will cover tests for behaviour problems


All I can advise if that you check your insurance as regards to it covering a behaviourist for behavioural problems, some I believe in fact do and it should tell you in your full paper work and terms and conditions.

As regards to doing tests, again speak to your vet, and see what he thinks, you can also usually get whats called pre-authorisation from your insurance companies you submit a pre authorisation form, similar to a claims form prior to having the treatment done and they will confirm if they will accept the claim or not prior to having it done so you will know for sure.

A lot of canine behaviourists often request that prior to assessment the dog has a vet check to rule out any medical problems first. So if your policy does cover behavioural then you may find that you would be covered for the vets side and the behaviourist if needed.

The behaviourist you got a quote from does seem quite excessive, I had one admittedly about 5 years ago, that was CAPBT plus other organisations approved and that was about £120 for 3 individual one to ones , in fact my sister used the same one only a couple of years ago cant be uch more and that hadnt gone up that much for the same thing, if I remember rightly it was around about £140.


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## Hanlou (Oct 29, 2012)

chelseabond said:


> but i have done this last call to her todayand to make sure she knows this has come about in a dog she has bred, its a bit weird really cos right from the day we bought marley home he has been of plastic bags we only have to move or rattle one and he is terrified,and hes also scared to go out for a walk or run or even to the toiled when its windy.


I wouldn't say that noise sensitivity is unsusual in collies. Whisper is our first dog so I'm not experienced but she is *very* reactive to noises. She also hates wind, reflective surfaces etc! Sudden noises scare her and if we raise our voices (even just getting enthusiastic, not necessarily argumentative!) she will get upset.



chelseabond said:


> i must also say, we were away on hol a few weeks ago on a narrowboat.
> and me and my al were lettin the 2 dogs off the boat late at nyt before we all went to bed , we were away with family...anyway id got off the boat to let marley toilet al was waitin on the boat a few feet away from me, i sed to al marleys been for a wee ill swap them over now, all of a sudden these guys were comin over a bridge and shouting zak come back then this rottweiler came at me he jumped up at me, and marley jumped at him it was awful my family came running over off the boat and they managed to get the dog away, by this time id seen the dog go for marleys neck and i jumped myslef on top of marley i got him underneath me , it ended with the 2 dogs ok and id smashed my knee, the moral of this story is, marley was protecting me and i ended up doing the same for him ....


Has Marley been thoroughly vet checked since this incident?? This dog could easily have done damage that wouldn't be obvious due to the thick fur on his neck - but damage could still have been done and should be checked out. It isn't easy to see a Rough collies' actual skin due to the thickness of their fur but a Rottweiler is a big strong dog and could have hurt him somewhere, which could explain his reactivity.

ETA: This is especially so as you say he goes to a groomers - I brush Whisper myself so I can examine her but if he goes to a groomers you may not have noticed an injury. When Whisper first came to us she was obsessive about licking a certain part of her body near her hindlegs - I managed to find a teeny tiny cut there which was bothering her. It healed fine but it just showed me how easily they could have an injury that you wouldn't see because of their thick fur.


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## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

well we are att the vets at 10.15 tomorrow and im also going to look into the rough collie rescue . thanks all im very grateful for all your input any more ? kp em coming thanks again...


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## Hanlou (Oct 29, 2012)

chelseabond said:


> well we are att the vets at 10.15 tomorrow and im also going to look into the rough collie rescue . thanks all im very grateful for all your input any more ? kp em coming thanks again...


Do keep us updated! I have to say we have fallen for Rough Collies in a big way so I'm a bit biased when it comes to this lovely breed.

Really hope you can find some answers for your boy. I would mention the incident with the Rottie to the vet so they can check it out as well as other things that have been mentioned.


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

chelseabond said:


> hy
> marley is very very obedient,i am the one i wud say that is in charge of him, when we are out walkin he is fine he doesnt snap at people, but if people approach him i do say cud u leave him as he gets a bit funny, so i dont have a problem there.
> as for the breeder i wud never disclose who they are, and i know theres nothin she can do now, she did offer a couple of years ago she even offered to come and take him back, but we feared she may have got him put to sleep and we decided to carry on as we do lovel our boy.
> but i have done this last call to her todayand to make sure she knows this has come about in a dog she has bred, its a bit weird really cos right from the day we bought marley home he has been of plastic bags we only have to move or rattle one and he is terrified,and hes also scared to go out for a walk or run or even to the toiled when its windy.
> ...


And did it occur to you that Marley might just have been injured during this debacle and that is why he is afraid of anyone touching his head, which is why he snaps? He could easily have a neck injury or anything.

He should perhaps have been checked by the vet straight away.


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

None of us can assess your dog over the ether or determine the whys and wherefores of his behaviour.

We can only give you what is considered "_best practice_"

Ie you need to get your dog to a vet to have a full examination to determine if your dog is in pain or has an underlying medical condition. You may even wish to ask for a full thyroid panel.

If and when any of the above or more have been ruled out, the vet can refer you to a reputable behaviourist, who will not see a client WITHOUT a vet referral.

These will usually, not always belong to one or more professional bodies:

APBC
CABPT
UKRCB

It is possible that subtle changes can be missed by a GP vet, and so a paraprofessional may be indicated such as a chiropracter, osteopath, bowen therapist, physiotherapist who may detect changes in the musculo skeletal system that can be adjusted and thereby remove pain.

So please go to your vet first and look at what may be the immediate causes and you may need to look further and the underlying ones.


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## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

newfies he was taken to a vet and checked out then for his head, and was fine and the snapping and biting stated way before this, and he is going to see our vet in the morning, im going to do all i can for my boy


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## Bobbie (May 3, 2008)

Do hope the vet can come up with some answers for you I too own a rough and he has a very sound temperment but it must be very hard for you to know which way to turn.


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## Sarah1983 (Nov 2, 2011)

chelseabond said:


> thank you so much for your replies can u keep them coming, the only thing i will say at the moment is that i rang some behaviourists a couple of years ago after another issue, and we was told it wud be about £600 just to i dont think the insurance will cover tests for to do with behaivousee him, then more for further visits, and im afraid we dont habve that kind of money, and all these tests at the vets will cost hundreds, he is fully insured by the way, and has been castrated. i dont think the insurance will cover tests for behaviour problems


Check your insurance. Mine covers behavioural problems as well as medical as do quite a few others.


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## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

hello all
the update is. the vet doesnt seem to think marley is a vicous dog, but cannot rule that out he did a heart check , took his temp that was normal, he checked his legs all fine , hes taken a blood test and we r now waitin for the results... i have done much thinking today as has my partner al. our main concern is that as marley has bitten my son danny. my grave concern is when my 6 ur old grandaughter comes on school hols . marley is now we feel unpredictable and this is of much concernt to me. we will await the results first then decide what to do next. this is all breaking my heart as we love our boy so much from valerie xx


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## Owned By A Yellow Lab (May 16, 2012)

If the blood tests come back clear then I would urge you to get a referral to a behaviourist, as others have suggested. It sounds as though the problem has been going on for a while and of course you all need help with it.

My first dog was a Rough Collie, they are lovely, intelligent, usually gentle dogs, can be sensitive, and if healthy they need a lot of exercise. A good behaviourist could really help you if it turns out not to be a medical issue.

Please do keep us posted 

edited to add:

You mentioned that Marley goes to a groomer? Is there any chance that something is going on there that has affected Marley...? Are you there when the grooming happens?

Personally I would from now on stay and watch very closely when the grooming takes place, just in case....


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## Bobbie (May 3, 2008)

Maybe when your grandchild comes to stay you could kennel the dog that way no accidents will happen and you will be stress free. So will the dog. I kennel Bracken when our grandson comes as Harrison is such a live wire I am sure my dog would be so stressed out.


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## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

hy bobbi
just to let you know i have sent a request to add u on here as im tryin to get to know people more and as u have rough collie like mine we have a lot in coomon lol, im postin an update on my marley in a mo , from valsam x


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## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

hy hanlou and bobbi i hope u both dont mind but i have clicked on add u as freinds im not usure this works on here but i hpe u dont mind as u both seem to know about rough collies like mine too.
ok my update is.
marley has has blood tests of various kinds and xryas and ears and mouith checked and medically he has nothing wrong with him at all. as he bit my son and we cant explain why i was reall wary and we had the fone in our hand to ring vet to have him put to sleep.... but i cudnt do it i love him to much.
we have spent hudreds of pounds on him recently with no way of recouping it from the vets via our insurance , as it doent cover behaviour problems.

we have decided not to go dwon the behavourist route as he really dosnt need it, hes very well behaved , we have come to the conclusion that something must have frightened him that night, it wont excuse wot he did to my son. but we are moving on from that.

and are much more aware of things. at the moment we aare living in our caravan and very soon we are going home to our house to live again,(it been rented out)and marley will have a great big garden and lots of space so until we go were just being more vigilant and biding our time.

obviously if he bit me my partner or my son again we wud certainly have to consider things then. but hopefully things well be ok.

i love him very very much and cant bear to be parted from him. ty all of you for ur adivce im very grateful from valsam xx


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## Bobbie (May 3, 2008)

Hi I have put you in my friends list. These roughs just make you love them. Hope things go ok for you with yours.


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## Hanlou (Oct 29, 2012)

Bobbie said:


> Hi I have put you in my friends list. These roughs just make you love them. Hope things go ok for you with yours.


Ditto xx

Feel free to pm anytime if you just want to 'talk' things through. Am no expert but am more than willing to listen and help as much as I can.


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

chelseabond said:


> hy aurelia, yes the breeder does post on here but i dont think shes too bothered i have told her i think something is wrong along he rbreeding line maybe but i dont know this, and i spoke to her on the fone this morning but she didnt seem interested, i got very upset and sed to her i love my boy and cant bear the thought of losing him in any way, all she sed then was im going this is upsetting me, but i dont think she was interested . We are takin him to the vets in the morning to have a chat initially....


iam appalled that you have slagged me off on here.. I have just caught up with this. I am the breeder of this dog who was the most loving puppy when he left my house.since marley was i year old you told me he had issues and each time i said i would come and get him back.. Each time you rang the next day and said no we are going to try with him., i've given you behavioursist nos. For 2 years you haven't rung and then suddenly the morning i'm going for chemo you ring and tell me he has bitten your adult son and you are going to have him pts. You then tried to tell me its in his genes , which i deny with a vengence, breeding a dog with a bad temperment would never be considered ever. . I have his 2 brothers here , mother grandma and mother all fabulous temperments. I suggested to you he may have a brain issue and to get him checked out. I then said to you i am going as i'm getting upset by your call.nice to know that he hasn't been pts thanks for letting me know.


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

anyone want to comment???


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## hazel pritchard (Jun 28, 2009)

Please please if your dog has already bitten someone, when your g/child or any child comes to your place , put a muzzle on your dog, the size of your dog if it bit a young child it would do alot of harm.


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## Moobli (Feb 20, 2012)

Collies are a sensitive breed.

It is impossible to give any sort of behaviour advice, or to second guess why your dog bit your son, without knowing the whole circumstances and meeting the dog. However, from the information you have given, it does sound as though you have had an issue with Marley from a young age showing aggression to various people. Is he a fearful dog?

I do think a behaviourist would be your best option as, to me, it does not sound like a one off and isolated incident. However, as you say you do not wish to go down the behaviourist route, I would just give a word of caution to try not to put your dog/son/other people in a situation where this could happen again. You need to find a way to manage Marley's behaviour so he cannot bite again. 

Also, I wanted to say it is nice to get both sides of the story.


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## Guest (Nov 17, 2012)

Sorry, but I don't understand how you can state that your dog doesn't need a behaviourist/trainer, given the problems you have outlined...?

The breeder of your dog has posted and stated that you have repeatedly described serious problems with this dog. She has offered to take him back, which is what a good breeder does.

If you love your dog, and it sounds as though you do, then you need to get the proper help and if it's not a medical issue, then you should consult a good behaviourist. If your dog does bite someone you could lose him if the victim makes an official complaint.


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## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

Hy all thanks for all your comments, we have not had any problems with marley, my son isnt living here anymore, hes got a nice flat, so all is well at the mo,


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## canuckjill (Jun 25, 2008)

I must say, when one of my collies got tempermental I never even thought of turning it to the breeder I instead tried to think of any changes we had done in the last several months. Please remember there were probably subtle changes for awhile before this happened...Turned out my dog had a pancreatis (sp) attack. Change of diet and time and she is back to normal. A bite is usually the last resort so think back to subtle changes, I also stay right on top of her behaviour even the little stuff at least until she was totally back to normal..


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

glad you have decided against pts- a bit rash in my opinion.
when you first mentioned that the breeder was on here i did think ad, 'dexter' but then even from the little i know and have read, there is not really a chance it would be a genetic cause- she has always seemed 110% commited to temperment.
it's easy to blame the breeder, but often (unless a poorly bred dog) it is environmental factors that cause issues like marleys, nnot genes- and to outright blame a breeder for this with no basis is, if nothing else, arrogant and rude.


my gran had a rough collie when i was little, and when i stayed at hers he was always kept to the back of the house (but that didnt stop me sneeking down at night for fluffer cuddles!) because he was so big and clumsy and did have a habit of mouthing things- and did at one time get carried away and broke skin on my dads arm. but then again, be shouldn't have had his arm in the dogs mouth, and said that himself!

it sounds very clear you need a behaviourist, what is making you think otherwise?
with my poppet, she will shy away when most people try to touch her head- she just doesnt like it, but would never tell anyone that! its just the same as i dont like people touching my sides, or grabbing my arm if i dont know them well- even if they are being friendly and nice... case in point- the other day my friend poked me in the side when i wasnt expecting it; the poor guy has a bruised rib becvause my automatic reaction was a jab of the elbow  
i'm not proud of it, but that is My automatic reaction to being spooked. 


if marley is used to only you and your partner, is it possible your sons tone of voice is unknown to marley- i know my Dexx is scared of 'booming mens voices' and my bamb doesnt like black haired people much as none of our family have dark hair...


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## ElvieMogs (Mar 22, 2012)

chelseabond said:


> Hy all thanks for all your comments, we have not had any problems with marley, my son isnt living here anymore, hes got a nice flat, so all is well at the mo,


But only 4 days ago you told his breeder you were going to pts. She sounds sensible and caring and, unlike you - stable. You can't say you have problems and are going to pts one day then deny any issues the next. Get a grip and take some responsibility!


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## Linden_Tree (Jan 6, 2011)

dexter said:


> iam appalled that you have slagged me off on here.. I have just caught up with this. I am the breeder of this dog who was the most loving puppy when he left my house.since marley was i year old you told me he had issues and each time i said i would come and get him back.. Each time you rang the next day and said no we are going to try with him., i've given you behavioursist nos. For 2 years you haven't rung and then suddenly the morning i'm going for chemo you ring and tell me he has bitten your adult son and you are going to have him pts. You then tried to tell me its in his genes , which i deny with a vengence, breeding a dog with a bad temperment would never be considered ever. . I have his 2 brothers here , mother grandma and mother all fabulous temperments. I suggested to you he may have a brain issue and to get him checked out. I then said to you i am going as i'm getting upset by your call.nice to know that he hasn't been pts thanks for letting me know.


I'm afraid this is part and parcel of being a breeder sometimes.

People will always want to place the blame elsewhere, than admit they have mucked up and caused the issue themselves.

Sad that they have felt the need to lie, but a thick skin needs to be grown at times.

Also, there is always legal action.


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## Buzzard (Aug 10, 2012)

Our trainer/behaviourist charges £20 for a one to one hour session, so if I were you I would look up reputable dog trainers/behaviourists in your area who follow the positive re-enforcement methods to assess your dog and advise. Don't panic at this stage, find out what the professionals think first. Good luck.


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## chelseabond (Nov 7, 2012)

we have now consulted a behavourist, and i need to just say i only came on the forum becos i wanted advice i was worried, i didnt mention my breeder, i only they post on here i never even mentioned marley had a pedigree, so i could have ment a breeder that was a registered breeder, it was never my intention to upset anyone especially had i known they were going for chemo, i have had 2 major operations myself so i know its terrible when we get health problems and things . i apologise for any upset i have caused and from now on i guess ill not continue with my posts about my marley. i wud never upset anyone intentionally. my freinds would all say that about me.

i will continue to love and look after my boy for as long as i am able to or get too old.


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

chelseabond said:


> we have now consulted a behavourist, and i need to just say i only came on the forum becos i wanted advice i was worried, i will continue to love and look after my boy for as long as i am able to or get too old.


i did suggest a behaviourist 2 years ago  however feel free to carry on posting as i for one want to know what is happening to him.


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## Owned By A Yellow Lab (May 16, 2012)

chelseabond said:


> we have now consulted a behavourist, and i need to just say i only came on the forum becos i wanted advice i was worried, i didnt mention my breeder, i only they post on here i never even mentioned marley had a pedigree, so i could have ment a breeder that was a registered breeder, it was never my intention to upset anyone especially had i known they were going for chemo, i have had 2 major operations myself so i know its terrible when we get health problems and things . i apologise for any upset i have caused and from now on i guess ill not continue with my posts about my marley. i wud never upset anyone intentionally. my freinds would all say that about me.
> 
> i will continue to love and look after my boy for as long as i am able to or get too old.


PLEASE PLEASE continue to post!

It's clear your breeder really wants to know how you are all getting on and you obviously love your dog. There is SO MUCH HELP available to you on this site - do stay on and find the support and advice that is on offer here


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

Owned By A Yellow Lab said:


> PLEASE PLEASE continue to post!
> 
> It's clear your breeder really wants to know how you are all getting on and you obviously love your dog. There is SO MUCH HELP available to you on this site - do stay on and find the support and advice that is on offer here


absolutely. besides i don't want a call every 1- 2 years to say he's being pts and that i've offered to 2 times to go and get him back. that option was omitted on the first post


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## terrytt (Nov 7, 2020)

i had rough collie.he did bite my friend.cause my friend aggressive to him.i had him 14 yrs he never bite nobody else. and me.


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## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

terrytt said:


> i had rough collie.he did bite my friend.cause my friend aggressive to him.i had him 14 yrs he never bite nobody else. and me.


This thread is 8 years old and no longer active. 
However you make a good point in saying that dogs may retaliate wth agression when treated agressively.


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