# Don't know what to say/how to put it.



## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

I have a big problem and getting nowhere. I dunno, I guess there are dog people and people people. Put myself into a situation that is now shit, but don't know if it is me? 
I think there should always be give and take in relationships.


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## LoopyL (Jun 16, 2015)

Praps if you outline problem we can help or provide support at least? A trouble shared...


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## Lexiedhb (Jun 9, 2011)

You might wanna actually tell us whats going on if you want some help/advise!!


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## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

Sorry you are having problems, it can be very hard if the people you love/family/friends don't share you love of animals resulting in conflict. Hope its nothing too serious.


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

Maybe we could help with more information if you can share


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## MontyMaude (Feb 23, 2012)

Is this issues with your Husband/partner and Muttley ? Sorry if I'm wrong, it's just I remember you posting about wanting to let Muttley in the bedroom and your oh saying no.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Crap, I kind of posted it and had to do some work, then was going to edit when thought about how to say. 

I slept in the lounge with Muttly again. He was scratching, like mad at the door of the kitchen, when I got down he was panting very heavily and clearly distressed. I said I am not leaving him like this, my OH won't let him in the bedroom or even give him the chance to have the run of the house and choose where he sleeps. Then hates me for leaving him to go to Muttly's aid.
Saying if this don't change, Muttly is gone. (that won't happen btw, and he knows it).

Says I have zero tolerance for humans, but patience of a saint for animals and I should live on my own with a pack of dogs. :Shifty


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## MontyMaude (Feb 23, 2012)

Oof it's a tough one, my husband isn't as keen on the dogs as I am but he knows what they mean to me so sucks it up and gets on with it, although he was the one to encourage them onto the bed to get a full nights sleep when I was against them being on the bed, so it's all compromise really, and I don't do well with edicts, I likes little give and take, I'm not sure what to suggest really apart from giving him a virtual clout round the head to try and knock some sense into him.


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

From what you say it sounds like he does not like dogs at all Does he say why he wont let him have the run of the house ?
To say if this continues the poor dog is gone is very unfair when he is not even giving him a chance Does he do anything with the dog at all feed him or walk him or play with him


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

shirleystarr said:


> From what you say it sounds like he does not like dogs at all Does he say why he wont let him have the run of the house ?
> To say if this continues the poor dog is gone is very unfair when he is not even giving him a chance Does he do anything with the dog at all feed him or walk him or play with him


Plays with him several nights a week. Fusses him now and then.
I feed him, but OH will give him treats while I'm at work.
He just says "from day one I said he is sleeping in the kitchen, so that's that"
Can't talk any sense into him.

Says if he has the run of the house, next he will be in our room, then on our bed.
But I don't want him on the bed either, not to sleep anyway, fine in the morning when we wake up type thing. 
Reckons Muttly is out for world domination I think....


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

I feel your pain really I do. I was in a similar situation with my wife going back a few months ago. She liked Alfie but he was doing her head in at night and I was sleeping down stairs with him.

Also as I go to work early I used to drop Alfie off in the bedroom when I left which meant the wife ended up not getting enough sleep.

I resolved this by re arranging my leaving time to allow me to take Alfie for a long work at 5am so when I did leave at 6:30 he was happy and contented and it was the time my wife gets up for work as well so that made things easier for her.

The night time problem was resolved, I have to admit, by letting him sleep in the bedroom with us. This was not my suggestion but actually my wife's as she thought it would be good to get him used to sleeping with us when we went on holiday in the caravan for two weeks.

Now he happily comes to bed when we go up and curls up on a blanket next to the bed and sleeps through until I get up in the morning. I think all he wanted was to be in the same room as us. This has been the routine for the last month and a half and he's only twice come up onto the bed, once he was asleep laid out next to my wife and once I woke to find him cuddled up between the head board and my pillow. But mostly he just goes to sleep on the floor next to the bed and is quite happy there.

I was surprised my wife actually suggested it as she has never allowed the cat to sleep in the bedroom but for some reason she was fine with Alfie. Its also made her more relaxed around him and he's picked up on this and he does a lot more for her when she gives him an instruction.

Reading back through this I doubt if this is very helpful but see it as an example that there is a solution for every problem if you both work as a team to make it work


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## penguin (Jan 2, 2013)

You could try crate training him. So that when he goes to bed he knows he's in a safe place?


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

penguin said:


> You could try crate training him. So that when he goes to bed he knows he's in a safe place?


 Are you suggesting that for Muttly or the OH


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## penguin (Jan 2, 2013)

Haha. Deffo OH


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## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

Why do you think Muttley was panting heavily and distressed? is the kitchen too hot for him? or do you think its because he doesn't like being separated from you or just that he wants to sleep elsewhere? or did he need a toilet visit?

In your shoes I would try and have a nice calm discussion with your OH where you tell him you want to reach a compromise. However before you do that you need to have a pretty good idea of how Muttley will react - so for instance if you negotiate him having access to the lounge will he then starting playing up to come upstairs? If you made the kitchen cooler would that help? Show your OH that you are working on resolving the issue but won't leave Muttley distressed in the meantime.

We did have a similar situation with Indie, we stopped her coming upstairs after her first operation at 13 months and had been sticking to that even though she is fully recovered as we didn't really want her doing stairs. On the odd occasion she would whine at the bottom of the stairs when we were all upstairs (boys sleep upstairs so she was on her own) and I'd persuade OH to let her up but she would cause chaos jumping on and off the beds, roaming from room to room and upsetting the boys so OH would send her back downstairs, a few times I went down with her and slept on the sofa as I couldn't listen to her whining and upset. Recently she got used to sleeping on the bed with me when we are in Devon as we have a bungalow but when we came back home she would whine to come up stairs and be all unsettled again. I persuaded OH to try again but picked a long weekend when he didn't have to be up for work so wasn't too touchy about being woken up and we did have a few unsettled nights with her but I think she just didn't know where her place to sleep was, we stuck with it and now she comes up every night and gets on my bed while I'm reading then when OH comes to bed she jumps off and goes in with Arthur, who accepts sharing his double bed with her now :Joyful:Joyful


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

penguin said:


> Haha. Deffo OH


That made me laugh


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## LoopyL (Jun 16, 2015)

I would tell OH you just don't like hearing your dog distressed at being seperated from you
Praps he could be persuaded to let Muttly sleep outside your _open_ bedroom door with a baby gate
preventing him from coming in? That way he'd hear you breathing & hopefully settle quietly on his bed so you
could all have a peaceful night. I was reading a Derek Tangye book recently & he (DT) was brought up to think cats were 2nd class
citizens & when his wife got a kitten insisted it should remain in the kitchen! However Monty the cat
soon educated him into the ways of cat  & he wrote a whole series of books featuring cats lol!


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## IncaThePup (May 30, 2011)

Muttly said:


> Plays with him several nights a week. Fusses him now and then.
> I feed him, but OH will give him treats while I'm at work.
> He just says "from day one I said he is sleeping in the kitchen, so that's that"
> Can't talk any sense into him.
> ...


whose house is it, his or yours?


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

Oh dear, sounds more like a marriage problem than a dog problem. Husband might have a genuine reason for not wanting him in the bedroom ( he doesn't want him on the bed, and you're already saying it would be ok first thing in the morning...), but giving you an ultimatum is completely the wrong thing to do. If mine gives me an ultimatum I say "OK, fine", I don't mind being asked but won't be ordered around. Can Muttly sleep in your bedroom in a crate or basket if he can't be separated from you at night, then you are near him but it's not the beginning of the slippery slope. Is your husband so dictatorial on many things, or does he just not want dog slobber on the sheets? I love dogs, have 4 plus loads ( and I mean loads) of cats, but watching Beethoven just makes me shudder, for me face licking is a no - no.


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## tabulahrasa (Nov 4, 2012)

My OH isn't a pet person, he's fond of them, but left to his own devices he'd have none.

Brock and one of the cats have chronic health problems which impact hugely on our finances and daily life...he's never threatened to get rid of them because he agreed I could have them and he knows how important to me they are.

Your issue isn't that he isn't a dog person, your issue is about you and him IMO.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Can't remember what you said about crating Muttly in your room, or even outside in the hallway. But to me that would be the compromise here.


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## Lexiedhb (Jun 9, 2011)

God they train us so blumming well dont they. Dexter paced round the room (that i was blumming well in) whining all night for 4 days when i first had him at my new place, until the OH said "oh for god sake just let the whinging thing on the bed if it means we all get to sleep"....... I swear I saw dexter giving a sly grin, and a "I knew I'd break them" look as he jumped up, and promptly passed out snoring. I dont think it is totally unacceptable for someone not to want to share their bedroom with a dog, but you will continue to make the situation worse by going to him when he creates - as hard as it is to ignore the little manipulative sods!!

I think I would try and get to the route of the problem of his distress, I mean he hasnt always been uncomfortable sleeping alone. Have you tried rescue remedy and adaptil plug ins? Made sure he cant see/ hear anything outside? Made sure hes not to hot/ cold? Set a firm routine for bed time? Tried a stair gate at the bottom of the stairs but Muttley can sleep in the lounge/hall etc Failing that then compromise is key........


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## Dimwit (Nov 10, 2011)

Is it worth talking calmly with your OH and seeing if you could get a behaviourist in to discuss the issues?
Logically, if rehoming the dog is not an option then something clearly needs to be done to try to resolve the situation and you may find that your OH will listen to a professional more readily than he will listen to you.


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## Magyarmum (Apr 27, 2015)

There's always they possibility that even if Muttly had the option of sleeping on your bed, he wouldn't want to! My dogs have the run of the house and are allowed to choose where they want to sleep. Both M'boi and Chloe, my previous two chose to sleep on my bed but with the two I have now, Georgina prefers to sleep on her mattress beside my bed, and only a couple of times in the nearly two years I've had her, has she slept on my bed. Gwylim likes to sleep either on the carpet or on the sofa in the living room and it's only sometimes in winter that I find he's climbed onto my bed in the middle of the night.


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

Your husband needs to apologise for his dictatorial behaviour, he had no right to threaten to get rid of your dog. If he could apologise nicely, but explain exactly what his problem is with dogs in bedrooms ( and many people don't like dogs in bedrooms or on the bed, but they don't all fall back on threatening to get rid of the dog), then you could reach a compromise. But you need to do it because you love him ( your husband) and want to please him, not because he said so. Slight but *very important* difference*. *Of course if you don't love him that's a different thing, and you need to make some decisions, but make sure it's not just a rough patch you could weather with some work. Have you been very unhappy for a long time, or is it just a blip? Those are questions to answer in your own head, not on here by the way, I'm not being nosey! If you're generally happy but annoyed with the way he's handled it you could toss it back to him : " I'm really worried about Muttly, but I know you don't want him in the bedroom. It's not good for our relationship sleeping apart, what do you think we should try?". Along the lines of " well you make a better suggestion then", but put with a lot more tact!


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## Zaros (Nov 24, 2009)

Muttly said:


> *Says I have zero tolerance for humans, but patience of a saint for animals* and I should live on my own with a pack of dogs. :Shifty


Well, you're not alone there Muttles. Me and MrsZee have little to no tolerance of other people either, particularly the stupid and the ignorant, but we have all the time in the world for Zara and Oscar. 
One day when I stop being ignorant and MrsZee stops being stupid we'll all be able spend time in the same room together.

Remember, Life's a trade off - you know - give a little here take a little there - favours for favours and all that dastardly trickery - and I suspect imposing sanctions in the bedroom just might get you both singing from the same sheet.

Even if one of you is slightly out of key


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## lisa0307 (Aug 25, 2009)

My OH wouldn't have our dog sleep anywhere else but our bed...TBH I think it's because they both do smelly farts and he can blame it on the dog.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

The kitchen/diner is the coolest place in the house. He slept in it fine for the first 4 months we had him. Then decided he wants to be with us. It is definatly he just wants to be near us.
When I went down last night, he asked to come up on the sofa with me and I said 'no, stay down' he slept on the floor brilliantly.
10 mins after I went down he was calm and stopped panting (but he did stop and listen every time my OH was moving upstairs). I think he was stressed because OH had shouted at him half hour before that.

When we go away he always sleeps in our room and stays on the floor, so I don't see the issue. 

I'll have a talk later, or try. 
I had 4 hours sleep last night and then to work, so not in the best mind state.

I left him this morning with the run of the house, as I do every day and he slept on the sofa. OH said he did come up into the bedroom while OH was asleep, but he just slept around my side of the bed on the floor.

Inca - It's a rented house, that we both pay for.


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## Meezey (Jan 29, 2013)

I don't think Goldie is the issue  I am very lucky to have who loves the critters as much if not more than I do, but he does put his foot down when I let my heart rule my head ( sometimes). I'm wondering if OH is feeling a bit neglected and unloved? Feeling that someone has replaced him in your affections? 

I'd try and have a calm chat with him about it, find out why he's so against it, i think the not sleeping in the bed might be a bit of a front  Have a chat


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Zaros said:


> Well, you're not alone there Muttles. Me and MrsZee have little to no tolerance of other people either, particularly the stupid and the ignorant, but we have all the time in the world for Zara and Oscar.
> One day when I stop being ignorant and MrsZee stops being stupid we'll all be able spend time in the same room together.
> 
> Remember, Life's a trade off - you know - give a little here take a little there - favours for favours and all that dastardly trickery - and I suspect imposing sanctions in the bedroom just might get you both singing from the same sheet.
> ...


I wish we were both that way tbh, and I thought we were until we got Muttly and I saw that we weren't.


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## ellenlouisepascoe (Jul 12, 2013)

My husband is a total pain in the backside however I am lucky that the dogs and their impact on our lives is a joint decision. ( which I often get blamed for from friends family ) but my husband will quite willingly hold his hands up and say " Well actually keeping Shelby / Blue was my idea "

We do however have an agreement that the dogs have limits, I would say a good 80% of my time at home is spent on the dogs so we mutually agreed that they are not allowed upstairs to sleep with us and must stay downstairs.

1) I don't want that amount of dog hair all over my bedroom 
2) I'm 27 and only been married 3 years 
3) I think it is important ( especially for us) that we spend time with each other as couple without the dogs clambering all over.

Please do not take this the wrong way but I feel your worrying over the situation isn't helping Muttly, thousands of dogs sleep alone downstairs all over the UK and are completely fine. I would be looking into resolving the issues with him sleeping on his own, rather than trying to find a way to pacify him, You never know what situations could occur in the future where he may not be able to sleep in your bedroom / loose and it would be beneficial to get him used to that.

I absolutely adore my dogs and they are ""spoiled"" however I expect a certain behaviour from them ( ie sleeping downstairs overnight so I can get a bit of peace ) and I will work on them till they are able to do so. Shelby *SCREAMED *my house down from 11pm - 6am every single night for the first three months we took her on, now I have to physically force her out of her bed on a morning.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Thanks for all your help guys, I have a lot to think about.


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## Twiggy (Jun 24, 2010)

Muttly said:


> Crap, I kind of posted it and had to do some work, then was going to edit when thought about how to say.
> 
> I slept in the lounge with Muttly again. He was scratching, like mad at the door of the kitchen, when I got down he was panting very heavily and clearly distressed. I said I am not leaving him like this, my OH won't let him in the bedroom or even give him the chance to have the run of the house and choose where he sleeps. Then hates me for leaving him to go to Muttly's aid.
> Saying if this don't change, Muttly is gone. (that won't happen btw, and he knows it).
> ...


Do you think it's a bit of jealousy on the part of your OH, especially if you're having to get up in the night?

Mine definitely got the green eyed look about him when I started owning dogs and beginning to train and show them.

I always ask if he minds when I get another puppy and these days he's beyond caring but way back then he would point blank refuse to even discuss it. I do remember on one occasion telling him I would give up going to shows and training the dogs and indulge in a new passion instead - clubbing every night.....!! Naughty me......


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## ellenlouisepascoe (Jul 12, 2013)

However if my husband threatened to rehome the dogs, I'd be sending him packing to his mothers  
It's a little bit of give, a little bit of take


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Getting Muttly was my OH's idea funnily enough, he thought it would be good for his kid and knows how much I missed having a dog since leaving home.


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## Rott lover (Jan 2, 2015)

Dont feel like the only one.I like my dogs more than i like most people.Luckily i have someone who feels the same.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Rott lover said:


> Dont feel like the only one.I like my dogs more than i like most people.Luckily i have someone who feels the same.


You are very lucky.

I think the problem is Muttly is not just my dog, but also my way of relaxing and my hobby. I love walking him and teaching him things but OH never really wants to come on a walk, so I go on my own, then I'm spending too much time with Muttly. I don't bloody know, I just can't sodding win.


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## Meezey (Jan 29, 2013)

I generally like my dogs more than most people, but also lucky to have an amazing OH, KT is his girl, love him only has eyes for him, I love the fact she is like that with him, BUT I can understand someone maybe feeling little bit put out if they think the dog comes before them  I have no doubt KT comes first lol lol


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

It's quite a big interest not to share really I think.
I'm severely pissed about the things he has said though.Sleeping in the garden, getting rid of him etc..

We have totally different opinions on training/dog ownership, which doesn't help.
My parents bug him because they are very dog-orientated too. I wish I would have know this before we had Muttly though.


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## Lexiedhb (Jun 9, 2011)

Can you involve him more?


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## ellenlouisepascoe (Jul 12, 2013)

Meezey said:


> I generally like my dogs more than most people, but also lucky to have an amazing OH, KT is his girl, love him only has eyes for him, I love the fact she is like that with him, BUT I can understand someone maybe feeling little bit put out if they think the dog comes before them  I have no doubt KT comes first lol lol


I know that Skyla comes before me in my husbands world, she's his babygirl!

Agreed however you do need to share a common interest in your pets, but also have to compromise in some areas. When my husband works away I admit I do take all 5 dogs up to bed with me ( some sleep on the bed, others on the floor ) but bed time when he is home is a chance for us to have "us" time , away from the delinquents lol


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

Sounds to me he is jealous of the time you spend with Muttly to me


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Lexiedhb said:


> Can you involve him more?


I have tried, he's not interested.


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## Blitz (Feb 12, 2009)

I think it is fairly common for one partner not to be so interested in the dogs. 

I would never have a hairy dog in the bedroom and I still can't believe we gave in to Candy when the old dog died when she was 6 months and she reacted so badly we had to take her everywhere with us. It wore off but she was committed to the bedroom by then!

I can really see his point of view over it and I think you have to forget about the bedroom being the ultimate answer and find a way for Muttly to sleep downstairs happily. You sleeping with him instead of with your OH is an even worse answer than allowing him in the bedroom.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

shirleystarr said:


> Sounds to me he is jealous of the time you spend with Muttly to me


But I don't have anymore time to give. I work full time, look after the house, cook etc. I still have to fit in showers, shopping and maybe I might get some time to relax before bed. Yes Muttly will come for a cuddle when I finally sit down for a bit at 8pm, he's not there all the time, he gets up and lies on the floor, I get up and have a shower or do whatever, then go to bed at half 10/11.
So really I don't have much time with either of them, which I hate.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Blitz said:


> I think it is fairly common for one partner not to be so interested in the dogs.
> 
> I would never have a hairy dog in the bedroom and I still can't believe we gave in to Candy when the old dog died when she was 6 months and she reacted so badly we had to take her everywhere with us. It wore off but she was committed to the bedroom by then!
> 
> I can really see his point of view over it and I think you have to forget about the bedroom being the ultimate answer and find a way for Muttly to sleep downstairs happily. *You sleeping with him instead of with your OH is an even worse answer than allowing him in the bedroom*.


Agreed, but at 1am I had no other option, I couldn't leave him how he was, and OH wouldn't allow him upstairs.


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## ellenlouisepascoe (Jul 12, 2013)

Muttly said:


> Agreed, but at 1am I had no other option, I couldn't leave him how he was, and OH wouldn't allow him upstairs.


Afraid to say I would have ignored , he is learning that if he behaves like that you will go down and keep him company.

Skyla did similar a few months ago, started pawing at the pipes in the kitchen which echoed round the house and made me get up. It took me about 3 days of being woke up at 4am before I resorted to ear plugs and she soon got out of it.


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## Rott lover (Jan 2, 2015)

I have always had dogs in my life but when i got older i decided against having dogs in the bed.When i was younger i had dogs in the bed and hated the fur always being in the bed and being itchy all the time.The OH wanted the dogs in the bed.I told her my reasons why i didn't and also told her that the dog can have the run of the house but the bed is a fur free zone.From there we just figured out where the dogs wanted to sleep and went from there.I absolutely see no reason for dogs to not be in the bedroom with you.Oliver used to lay at the foot of the bed or next to the bed.Boz used to sleep on the couch.A little bit of give and take.


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

I really don't understand the argument that fully grown, adult men feel jealous and left out when a baby or dog comes along 

They need to grow up IMO.

I can understand some people don't want a dog on the bed because of hairs and dirt, etc. but if the dog stays on the floor and everyone get's a good nights sleep, does it really matter?

I would be inclined to get a bed for Muttly and put in on the floor, on your side of the room, train the dog to sleep in it and just let OH get over it!

If the dog sleeps in your room if you go away, without issue, what's the difference?

And as for being given an ultimatum, my OH wouldn't even try


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

I wouldnt ignore him if he is distressed, but i would discuss a compromise with your OH.

How about moving him into your room on a temporary basis in his crate, then gradually move him further and further away until he is happy to be back in the room you wish him to be in.

No way would i ever ignore an obviously distressed animal. He won't just cry it out and get over it, he needs some work put in.


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## ellenlouisepascoe (Jul 12, 2013)

Just to add the only reason I have said to ignore as I've previously read he used to sleep down there alone with no problems. It sounds as if he's done it once and realised you will come down to him, you've pacified it for a while and now he is expecting it.

We used the crate in the doorway with Shelby and slowly moved her down the landing, to the bottom of the stairs , into the living room then into the kitchen and when she was comfortable removed the crate. It took about 3 months but she would scream even at the door of our bedroom. It just "clicked" one day and I went to put her in her crate for bed, but she ran to Skyla's bed and curled up in there with her.


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

Muttly said:


> But I don't have anymore time to give. I work full time, look after the house, cook etc. I still have to fit in showers, shopping and maybe I might get some time to relax before bed. Yes Muttly will come for a cuddle when I finally sit down for a bit at 8pm, he's not there all the time, he gets up and lies on the floor, I get up and have a shower or do whatever, then go to bed at half 10/11.
> So really I don't have much time with either of them, which I hate.


 I have the same problem both my wife and I work, I go to work at 6:30am and finish at 4:30pm in time to collect my daughter from after school club. I then get tea ready for the two of us, feed the cat, rabbit and dog. sit down and help my daughter do her homework and reading then make my wife tea ready for her to come in at 7:30pm.

My daughter goes to bed at 9 and I take the dog out for his walk at that time. I'm back in about 10 and settle down for an hour with Alfie laying in the fire place while we catch up on the days activities and watch TV.

11 we go to bed and am up again at 5 in the morning to sort out school uniform, pack lunches, breakfast and take dog for walk.

So I fully understand that spending time with the OH is important but limited and there's always pressure from my daughter and the dog to spend time with them.

To compensate a little for this we always have a family day on Saturdays, We all take Alfie for a long walk in the morning then do something nice in the afternoon just the three of us. Last Saturday we went to Marwell zoo.

Sunday is a full family day where we go out with the dog for the day and take a picnic with us if the weather is good.

This way we all get to spend quality time together. Its hard but getting into a routine was very important for it to work smoothly. Now we operate like a well oiled machine 

By the way the OH does all the cleaning and washing when she gets in (with my daughters help) I don't want it to sound like I do everything 

Perhaps if you set up times where you and your OH go out as a couple in the day time leaving Muttly at home for a few hours would do wonders for your relationship and state of mind. Perhaps then your OH would feel more appreciated as you are consciously making time for him without your little fella being around. Just and idea


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## Mum2Heidi (Feb 17, 2010)

"I left him this morning with the run of the house, as I do every day and he slept on the sofa. OH said he did come up into the bedroom while OH was asleep, but he just slept around my side of the bed on the floor"

If Muttly chose to sleep on the floor at your side of the bed, it's the perfect compromise. See if you can win your OH round with it. Perhaps suggest it in the short term to solve the immediate problem with the aim of very slowly working Muttly bed to the door and onto the landing - as far as you can agree is acceptable.

I remember my OH (bless him) didn't want us to have Heidi and wasn't pleased when I brought her home. I reminded him I had a dog when we first got together and that's the person I am. He replied "fair comment" and that was it.
(That's the short version - there was a few more ad lib's ) but there wasn't a day go by that he didn't adore her and she gave him lots of pleasure


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

Maybe ask him if the little dog can just have the run of the house but not the bedroom would that work


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

Can I ask? when you took Muttly to the beach (as you showed in one of your other threads) did your OH go with you? if he did did he enjoy it?

If he didn't why didn't he? if he were to spend more fun time with Muttly he might be more relaxed around him and then let you try settling him down in the bedroom in a crate or a basket by the side of you.


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## catz4m8z (Aug 27, 2008)

Sounds like a tricky situation, I hope you can convince Mutley that downstairs is an ok place to be!
Not surprised its causing issues though, attitudes towards pets are kinda fundamental to our personalities (like attitudes towards kids or religion!). Im not sure how a 'just a dog' person ever sees eye to eye with a 'furry family member' person!


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

ellenlouisepascoe said:


> Afraid to say I would have ignored , he is learning that if he behaves like that you will go down and keep him company.
> 
> Skyla did similar a few months ago, started pawing at the pipes in the kitchen which echoed round the house and made me get up. It took me about 3 days of being woke up at 4am before I resorted to ear plugs and she soon got out of it.


Ellen, he was so distressed when I got down there, there was saliva all over the floor from getting worked up and panting. I would of hate to have seen the state of him in the morning if I ignored.
He was scratching a little the last couple of weeks, I ignored and he stopped after half hour to an hour.

But he was like a dog possessed last night, it was truly awful.


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## ellenlouisepascoe (Jul 12, 2013)

Muttly said:


> Ellen, he was so distressed when I got down there, there was saliva all over the floor from getting worked up and panting. I would of hate to have seen the state of him in the morning if I ignored.
> He was scratching a little the last couple of weeks, I ignored and he stopped after half hour to an hour.
> 
> But he was like a dog possessed last night, it was truly awful.


Are you using the rescue remedy on him or any other way of calming?


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## SarahBugz (Mar 14, 2011)

Could something have spooked him?

What about also maybe trying an Adaptil diffuser? Seems to be working for Tom.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

jamat said:


> I have the same problem both my wife and I work, I go to work at 6:30am and finish at 4:30pm in time to collect my daughter from after school club. I then get tea ready for the two of us, feed the cat, rabbit and dog. sit down and help my daughter do her homework and reading then make my wife tea ready for her to come in at 7:30pm.
> 
> My daughter goes to bed at 9 and I take the dog out for his walk at that time. I'm back in about 10 and settle down for an hour with Alfie laying in the fire place while we catch up on the days activities and watch TV.
> 
> ...


Problem being, we can't have any time on our own because if I'm not at work, it's the weekend and the kid is here.
your set up sounds great, but ours is just kinda falling apart and noone puts in any effort


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

jamat said:


> Can I ask? when you took Muttly to the beach (as you showed in one of your other threads) did your OH go with you? if he did did he enjoy it?
> 
> If he didn't why didn't he? if he were to spend more fun time with Muttly he might be more relaxed around him and then let you try settling him down in the bedroom in a crate or a basket by the side of you.


All the pics I'm on my own.
OH did come out one day last week when I had time off work and I think he enjoyed it, but that's a one-off.


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## Lexiedhb (Jun 9, 2011)

Muttly said:


> Problem being, we can't have any time on our own because if I'm not at work, it's the weekend and the kid is here.
> your set up sounds great, but ours is just kinda falling apart and noone puts in any effort


Have you considered relationship counselling? Has just worked wonders for 2 friends of mine


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

catz4m8z said:


> Sounds like a tricky situation, I hope you can convince Mutley that downstairs is an ok place to be!
> Not surprised its causing issues though, attitudes towards pets are kinda fundamental to our personalities (like attitudes towards kids or religion!). Im not sure how a 'just a dog' person ever sees eye to eye with a 'furry family member' person!


I'm beginning to wonder that too......
The comment of 'he should sleep in the garden tonight (last night) so he can see how spoilt he really is' I just can't get my head round.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

ellenlouisepascoe said:


> Are you using the rescue remedy on him or any other way of calming?


I haven't yet, because after you suggested it, he went ok again. So I didn't get any for just in case as it's expensive and have to watch what I spend on him....
But I thought about it last night, I need to try it.
After last time, he seemed ok with the radio on, but now that doesn't help either.


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## karmacookie (Nov 9, 2014)

Sounds like a difficult situation. I just want to say that in my opinion little dogs especially shouldn't sleep on beds. that's how my little one broke his leg, by rolling off 

Can't see a problem with having his bed on the floor at your side though. Can't see why your oh could object to that, but then my oh loves the animals as much as I do. I think when we met he fell in love with my dog before me lol 

Hope you can work it out x


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## Rott lover (Jan 2, 2015)

I dont get the jealous aspect at all from anyone.What would he be jealous of?HE made the choice not to be involved in any of this.See in my opinion spending time together takes some give and take as well.I hate clothes shopping.I do it because i get to spend time with my OH.My OH hates going to sears looking at tools.She does it because she gets to spend time with me.Your OH chooses not to engage in walking with you and going out or whatever.I am no counselor but that makes this his problem not yours.He wants to give you an ultimatum of the dog is gone or?Then ask him how he thinks he will feel if you go right along with the dog?I guess thats where i am lucky.We both understand that the animals come before each other.The dogs are just as much a part of us as we are them and each other.


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

Muttly said:


> P
> your set up sounds great, but ours is just kinda falling apart and noone puts in any effort


We still have our moments. My brother lives in Oz and he sent me a text message late last night our time, when I was in bed. I usually have my phone muted but forgot last night the sound spooked Alfie and he spent 5 minutes barking his head off until I picked him up and took him down to the lounge and slept there, him on one sofa me on the other.

So the best laid plans still hits bumps now and then. 

Can Muttly see the garden from where he is in the kitchen? If he can do you know if there are any new cats in the street that might come exploring up to your back door? this could be spooking him.

In the day time we have a gate on the door between the conservatory and the kitchen where Alfie stays in the day time when we are out but we hang a blanket over the gate to stop him being able to see into the garden as if he sees a cat he barks his head off.

sometimes he can have a barking fit if he gets startled by his own reflection in the kitchen door at night too. Perhaps if you were some how able to blank out the windows / door at night he'd settle better.


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## ellenlouisepascoe (Jul 12, 2013)

Muttly said:


> I haven't yet, because after you suggested it, he went ok again. So I didn't get any for just in case as it's expensive and have to watch what I spend on him....
> But I thought about it last night, I need to try it.
> After last time, he seemed ok with the radio on, but now that doesn't help either.


Definitely look into it, it sounds as if he needs it and if it brings back unity to your household it will be worth it x


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## Gemmaa (Jul 19, 2009)

I think I'd be considering leaving. I know that's a cliche dog owner opinion, but if my fiance couldn't accept that the dogs are a large part of my life and they're going to be inconvenient at times, I couldn't be with him because we'd all be miserable.

It's not fair on you or Muttly to have someone giving you ultimatums, it'll just cause resentment and a horrible atmosphere, which probably won't help the dogs problems.

Recent events have made me realise that life is far too short to be around people who make you miserable.


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

Muttly said:


> Problem being, we can't have any time on our own because if I'm not at work, it's the weekend and the kid is here.
> your set up sounds great, but ours is just kinda falling apart and noone puts in any effort


Does the kid love muttly? do they spend time with him when they are with you at the weekend?

Where does the kid sleep when they are with you? if the kid loves the dog would it be possible to have mutely share their room at weekends? then over time he would see that room as his in the week and sleep happily in there because it smells of the kid....

Don't know if this would ever work but thought I'd chuck it in as a possibility


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

jamat said:


> Does the kid love muttly? do they spend time with him when they are with you at the weekend?
> 
> Where does the kid sleep when they are with you? if the kid loves the dog would it be possible to have mutely share their room at weekends? then over time he would see that room as his in the week and sleep happily in there because it smells of the kid....
> 
> Don't know if this would ever work but thought I'd chuck it in as a possibility


Oh sorry no, said child lives with us. She's not overly bothered about Muttly tbh. Sometimes they play well, but it's not for that long. 
Thank you though


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

Don't mean to be rude to anyone as everyone here is giving good advice but I honestly don't think we are in a position to advise on people relationships thats something for the two of them to work out between them. 

Perhaps we should just try to keep things to the practical issue of helping mutely settle somewhere at night that isn't the bedroom


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

jamat said:


> Don't mean to be rude to anyone as everyone here is giving good advice but I honestly don't think we are in a position to advise on people relationships thats something for the two of them to work out between them.
> 
> Perhaps we should just try to keep things to the practical issue of helping mutely settle somewhere at night that isn't the bedroom


Thanks Jamat.

Tempted to go out and get a stair gate later and put it at the bottom of the stairs so he can have the run of downstairs. No idea if it will work though.
Every night when it's bed time, he goes to the bottom of the stairs and is ever hopeful that it might be the day we say 'upstairs then boy'
Which says, he wants to be upstairs. But perhaps like has been said if he can hear us without closed doors, he may be ok.


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

Muttly said:


> Oh sorry no, said child lives with us. She's not overly bothered about Muttly tbh. Sometimes they play well, but it's not for that long.
> Thank you though


Oh got you 

One of the other reasons we sorted out the routine we have is because of my daughter, she'd be happy to have Alfie sleep with her but that is a no no with me as I believe she needs her sleep more than me and the wife so Alfie comes to bed with us and I close the door so he can't go walk about at night.

yes I know I just suggested mutely sleep with your's but I was looking at desperate measures to solve the problem


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

Muttly said:


> Thanks Jamat.
> 
> Tempted to go out and get a stair gate later and put it at the bottom of the stairs so he can have the run of downstairs. No idea if it will work though.
> Every night when it's bed time, he goes to the bottom of the stairs and is ever hopeful that it might be the day we say 'upstairs then boy'
> Which says, he wants to be upstairs. But perhaps like has been said if he can hear us without closed doors, he may be ok.


before you do that do you know anyone with kids that might still have a stair gate stored away somewhere that you could borrow rather than paying for one and it not working as you mentioned you have to think about where you spend your money


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## Sarahliz100 (Jan 5, 2014)

No wise advice on getting him to sleep downstairs. My OH and I are weak and eventually caved after months of rubbish sleep and dog now sleeps on bedroom floor and we all have a blissful nights sleep.

All I can suggest is a frank discussion with your OH and explore what the issues are, what compromises you're each willing to make. At the end of the day how things are is not working so between you you need to come up with a solution. If he shoots down every suggestion you make then ask him for some. Make it clear that rehoming is simply not an option for you.

Is getting a trainer/behaviourist round an option? I know it's not the biggest behavioural problem in the world but it sounds like it's causing you a fair amount of bother just now! Plus Muttly has some reactivity issues doesn't he? Maybe he's just generally quite stressed and that's feeding in to his inability to settle at night. Getting a professional in might allow you to get a handle on both issues. If you can get your OH to engage you can hopefully come up with a solution that suits all of you.

Adaptil or similar sounds like a very sensible suggestion.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Thanks Sarah. I will be having a chat tonight.


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

Oh gosh, I'm going to put my foot in it but here goes... he wanted a dog but doesn't want the responsibility or the pleasure of ownership. His child lives with you both, and he thought getting a dog would be a good way of keeping the child happy? He needs to be a good father to his child _*himself*,_ not get a dog to " be good for his kid". Now he's giving ultimatums to *you. *I referred to him as "husband" earlier, if he's not yet then I would think very carefully before taking the next step with him. What has he got to offer you, your future children? How kind and considerate is he in most things - everyone has their bad points, of course they do. How he is with his child, it should give you a good idea of your future with him once the romance has died down a bit. Is he caring, enjoys spending family time, or a bit of a loner? Will you feel comfortable having kids round to play, making a mess of the house...?Do you look forward to him coming home, or just hope there won't be another row? Sounds like you do the housework, provide a home for him and his child from his previous relationship, and he tells you how it's going to work. Not good!


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Maybe we are too different. I don't like children much and he seemingly doesn't like animals much. Difference is, I was honest about it.
It feels like there is a large divide in the house.


Could it be that because the stress levels in the house have been slowly rising over the last few months, this has made Muttly start this behaviour?
I remember once Muttly had been non reactive for a while and I had a big argument with OH and went out for a walk and Muttly was very reactive.

I think I'm piecing together what others have said, sorry about the slow brain.


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## MontyMaude (Feb 23, 2012)

Muttley is your house quite old could there be mice under the floorboards possibly as I know with my previous dog Beastie, she always slept in the kitchen and we moved and again she slept in the kitchen and was fine for a week or two and then she began whining at night and wouldn't settle, turns out we had the equililent of a mouse super highway going on under the kitchen floor and the noise was scaring her night, so we then allowed her access to the hallway overnight and she slept there without a peep away from the scuttling and scurrying of the mice.

As for you OH I think you need to sit down and have a proper talk with him as I wouldn't put up with his behaviour and attitude towards the dog especially seeing as it was him that wanted the dog in the first place.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Perhaps Monty. It's a 50's house. The kitchen is just concrete under the lino though. I know one thing, I'm not shutting him in there tonight as I have nothing new to help him yet.


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## PawsOnMe (Nov 1, 2012)

I can see where your husband is coming from. He obviously doesn't want Muttly in the bedroom (I can't stand dogs in my bed, I can't sprawl out as I like to and they leave all gritty dirt and hair in my bed so Jasper's in my mum's room on her bed and Izzy sleeps in her bed in my room) , maybe you need to both compromise and set him up somewhere other than the kitchen but not the bedroom, maybe the landing outside your room or make him up a cosy crate somewhere he likes. Do like you would a puppy first settling in and start afresh and make it a positive place for him to sleep.


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## MontyMaude (Feb 23, 2012)

Is there any way to barricade the stairs temporarily just for tonight and give him the run of downstairs to see if that helps and if so then get a baby gate or put a baby gate at your bedroom door so he can still be near you and see and hear you but not actually in the bedroom.


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## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

Have a long hard think before you go into battle though. Ask yourself do you want to compromise on what would be your ideal outcome or do you feel this is all a symptom of a general relationship breakdown? I'm sure Muttley is picking up on the stress and it sounds like you and him have quite a close bond so perhaps he feels he needs to be near you rather than the other way around.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

If Muttly is feeling he needs to be with me, nothing is going to help but being with me. 
I just want him to be settled and happy tbh, wherever that is.


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## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

Good luck - hope things don't get too heated.


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## Leanne77 (Oct 18, 2011)

ellenlouisepascoe said:


> My husband is a total pain in the backside however I am lucky that the dogs and their impact on our lives is a joint decision. ( which I often get blamed for from friends family ) but my husband will quite willingly hold his hands up and say " Well actually keeping Shelby / Blue was my idea "
> 
> We do however have an agreement that the dogs have limits, I would say a good 80% of my time at home is spent on the dogs so we mutually agreed that they are not allowed upstairs to sleep with us and must stay downstairs.
> 
> ...


I am in agreement with Ellen. My dogs dont get the run of the house and they certainly dont have access to my bedroom. If I was in a relationship I would definitely be the one putting my foot down about that so I can see where your OH is coming from. I personally think it's healthy to have time away from your pets and for them to be able to be alone without issues, and I like to have places in the house where the dogs dont have access and the bedroom is most definitely one of those places. I spent a couple of nights in a hotel room with my dogs and despite their pleas I refused them access to the bed but my God, what a sleepless night I had what with the dogs constantly moving about, swapping beds, scratching etc, drove me insane!


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

I'm an awkward so and so at times, so just thinking out loud here, but seen as your OH is so firm on laying down the rules, could you not override him and simply tell him that you're crating Muttly in the landing/bedroom and that's that? Or is that likely to cause more heated arguments? If you explain he won't have access to the actual bed then I'm not seeing his issue to be honest.


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## Leanne77 (Oct 18, 2011)

Could the issue simply not be that he doesnt want Muttly in the bedroom?

Trying to find somebody who accepts my 3 dogs as well as myself and also me accepting a partner that has their own pets that I may take issue with is part of the reason i'm single. Me and my ex used to fall out regularly over his dog and the way she behaved, and also his cruel treatment of her so I do think it's a difficult thing to balance unless both of you feel exactly the same way, or one of you is too laid back to care.


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

I really think you should sit him down and talk to him in a calm way either suggest the little dog stays in a crate in your bedroom so he cant get on the bed but can see you if he is against that then suggest giving the little lad the run of the house downstairs either shut the bedroom door or get a baby gate at the bottom of the stairs one this is for sure you cant go on like this your husband needs to understand how much it is not only stressing you but the poor dog too


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## tabulahrasa (Nov 4, 2012)

Muttly said:


> If Muttly is feeling he needs to be with me, nothing is going to help but being with me.
> I just want him to be settled and happy tbh, wherever that is.


I do think it's fair enough to say no to a dog in the bedroom tbh, it's the ultimatum of getting rid of him and the threats of putting him in the garden that are making me say it's less of a dog issue than a relationship one.


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## Gemmaa (Jul 19, 2009)

Freddie started howling at 4am every single morning without fail, after sleeping happily in the kitchen his entire life. 
I put a bed for him in my room and he stopped howling and sleeps right through the night. He doesn't come on my bed. I had tried to avoid having a dog in my room after Pip, but Freddie has a lot of issues and it's just easier this way. 
It's really worked for him, he just likes company and he's happy now which is all I care about.

Also, I hope my other comment didn't upset you. It's just that Freddie has been such hard work over the years, I know that I would really struggle if people were negative about him and I didn't feel like I had any support.


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

tabulahrasa said:


> I do think it's fair enough to say no to a dog in the bedroom tbh, it's the ultimatum of getting rid of him and the threats of putting him in the garden that are making me say it's less of a dog issue than a relationship one.


Sorry to say but I do agree with this


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

Selena Scott was on telly the other day and said that both her dogs would not settle in the kitchen of her very old house - turns out she has a ghost!


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## MontyMaude (Feb 23, 2012)

Lurcherlad said:


> Selena Scott was on telly the other day and said that both her dogs would not settle in the kitchen of her very old house - turns out she has a ghost!


Woooooooh :Bag < closest ghost like looking smilie


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## Westie Mum (Feb 5, 2015)

I think sometimes in life we just have to stand up for ourselves and this sounds like one of those moments, a kind of "you'll be gone long before my dog goes anywhere" moment.

You both need to sit and talk so you can explain how much Muttly means to you.

I am a step parent myself (all 3 moved in!) so if you can talk about your understanding of how much his child means to him and how sometimes things happen/money gets spent/time is devoted solely for the child, that doesn't always make you happy but you understand because it's his child, then maybe - just maybe, he will have some understanding when you're explaining how much you care for the dog. The dog is your child so to speak. 

We sometimes have to break things down and explain properly to men 

My boy dog will not sleep alone and I refuse to see him distressed. All 3 of our dogs have their own beds in our room and they go straight to them and stay there, unless Oscar gets spooked and then he climbs on the bed but that is better than sleeping apart, or being woken up when you have work in the morning.

Edited to add: It also sounds like you would all benefit from spending more time on days off as a family, with the kid and dog. Pub lunches outside, walks through the park - anything to get him to bond with the dog. The same effort I am sure you made to bond with his child


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## Leanne77 (Oct 18, 2011)

Muttly said:


> If Muttly is feeling he needs to be with me, nothing is going to help but being with me.
> I just want him to be settled and happy tbh, wherever that is.


Just picking up on this, and sorry to be very blunt and possibly harsh, but giving in to him is not your only option. I'm pretty sure that for most of us, our dogs feel some need to be with us all the time but thats generally not practical, such as when we go to work etc, and we teach our dogs to cope with being alone in these circumstances. Muttly being alone in the kitchen whilst everybody is sleeping is just another one of those things that can be taught.

It's just the same when I had my dogs from puppies. From day 1 they slept in the kitchen and they protested to that but thats the way it was going to be and their only choice was to get used to it.


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

Silly question but how long have you had Muttly now and how do you react when your OH throws these comments at you?


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

Awh I'm sorry to hear this @Muttly, I've not been on PF all day so I've missed this.

When we first got Molls she was downstairs and the OH was very firm about this. Then we both had separate hospital trips and she ended up sleeping in the spare room with whomever was the patient at the time. If I'm honest I regret that Molly is allowed in our bedroom sometimes and having to backtrack on her routine so that she is now on the landing in her own bed with a baby gate at our door so we can hear here but we get some bed space as she's a rather long legged creature.

It's far from me to suggest anything about your relationship. But I did notice a similarity in how you described your relationship between Muttly and your OH and my OH and Molly when we first had her, up to about a year ago. So what follows is about us not you and your OH but I hope helpful as I think much of what Molly's 'rules' were in the view of my husband were due to a general disparity about having a dog. I always wanted a dog, kept on about it all the time especially after IVF and even my GP thought it might be a good idea as a dog man himself. So Molly arrived because of me. Then the first four months of their life, my OH was very ill after a bike accident with a head injury. So they missed the early bonding and only saw a loopy young dog that took all his strength to deal with. I found our lovely trainer friend and took the courses and held the clicker. Pretty much I dealt with Molly and then abandoned her each day to my OH when I went to work as he is retired.

When I got made redundant we walked Molly a lot together and we did some training together. I gradually began to trust him even though he rarely uses the clicker but really it's down to Molly that she has also engaged with him because I took a step back. And that's the key for us, me engaging less.

I just wonder, and I hope I am not overstepping any boundaries and don't want to offend, but I wonder if your OH is just trying to get a bit of you back if you are engaging so much with Muttly (as I did with Molls) and can you take a step back to allow him to build a bond with Muttly? Maybe that's worth exploring with the view that you can reach a compromise that will suit you all. I think that the landing and a baby gate could be a good idea and agree on perhaps starting at the weekend or a time when you can afford a disrupted sleep.

Take care and huge hugs, it's crap isn't it? But I think you both have valid worries if that's of any value.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Leanne77 said:


> Just picking up on this, and sorry to be very blunt and possibly harsh, but giving in to him is not your only option. I'm pretty sure that for most of us, our dogs feel some need to be with us all the time but thats generally not practical, such as when we go to work etc, and we teach our dogs to cope with being alone in these circumstances. Muttly being alone in the kitchen whilst everybody is sleeping is just another one of those things that can be taught.
> 
> It's just the same when I had my dogs from puppies. From day 1 they slept in the kitchen and they protested to that but thats the way it was going to be and their only choice was to get used to it.


Depends on whether you have close neighbours though. No way could I leave any of mine to 'protest' at being left alone, whining, scratching up the laminate floor/doors etc and not expect to receive complaints from my sleeping neighbours. So yes, while the advise to leave them to it is all well and good, it's not always practical. Besides which, I think from what @Muttly has said here and elsewhere before, he's getting himself worked up into a right frenzy and becoming very stressed.

To be honest if that's the case and there really is no budging from the OH, I can only see professional help as the next best step.


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## Amelia66 (Feb 15, 2011)

Muttly said:


> *If Muttly is feeling he needs to be with me, nothing is going to help but being with me. *
> I just want him to be settled and happy tbh, wherever that is.


Might be harsh but i really think this is the wrong attitude. There will be times when he cant be with you for whatever reasons and you need to train him that thats ok. Because going down and sleeping downstairs every time he makes a fuss is likely to make him worse. The night you mention he does sound like he worked himself into a state and it was worth going down, but settling him back down and then going back to bed would have been my course of action or he knows when he cries you comedown and stay with him.

I also dont think its unreasonable to not want dogs in the bedroom, and there are some real dangers with small dogs especially. For example one of our dogs used to sleep on the bed with us, until one night my Oh woke to a funny sound and quickly realised he had gone to roll over and squashed her and she was gasping. He was absolutely distraught [she was fine] and he felt awful about it for ages as if he hadn't of woken then she probably wouldn't have been able to breathe. Needless to say shes back to sleeping in her crate which she is fine with.

Being in the bedroom is not the be all and end all or something that will fix all your issues as being with you 24/7 could lead to separation anxiety and imagine how you are are going to feel going to work when hes working himself into a state and there is nothing you can do as you have to have a job. its good for him to have time on his own and learn that its ok. You say he was ok before,is there anything new in or outside the house that could be bothering him? new things in the kitchen that may make noise? neighbours leaving or coming home? dog in season in the area? has he been vet checked? as you say this didn't happen before.

I think the stair gate is a great idea and a good compromise. I do also think a chat with the OH is a good idea is it could be something else entirely bothering him and hes just deflecting that onto the dog. You just need to have a calm honest discussion telling him your feelings and how you are trying to solve things.


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## StrawberryBlonde (May 27, 2015)

Im having a similar issue but with my parents. I have moved back in with them with my 2 dogs & they are just so strict with them. In our house they were allowed everywhere they wanted, here they're confined to 2 rooms & get shouted at if they bark, lick themselves, itch etc. So I'm looking to move back to the house/situation I came from. Bottomline, they're just not dog/animal people!


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## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

In fairness though Mrs Muttley does work full time so its not a case of the dog not being able to be apart from her. She mentioned earlier that Muttley is perfectly happy with the run of the house during the day and just sleeps on the sofa so its possible he would do the same at night and is just objecting to the kitchen, perhaps there is a noise in there he doesn't like. When we had the slightly similar situation going on with Indie I did sleep downstairs with her some nights because no way would I leave her downstairs distressed and crying, that didn't mean she did the same thing the next night or the one after but just some nights. I guess we all have different tolerances for listening to our dogs in distress, mine is pretty low I must admit, we've all got different relationships with our spouses/OH's too and for peace to reign we have to find a compromise/give and take a little but that should include some give on Mr Muttley's part too.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Another thing to consider maybe @Muttly is whether he's scared of anything in the kitchen? Missy developed an anxiety around the fridge, washing machine and dishwasher to the point she'd stand at the kitchen door and cry until we got up to go in with her for a drink. Just leaving her wasn't fair IMO as she was obviously worried and unable to go any further. But things he may be ok with during the day can seem different at night in the dark. For example the sound of the fridge coming on can spook some dogs ( and is what triggered Missy's anxiety which then transferred to the other appliances ). Him getting worked up could indicate it's something he's finding unsettling in the kitchen itself, especially as you say he's fine left alone elsewhere. I wouldn't be able to leave Missy alone in the kitchen and expect a content dog on my return. She may put up with being in there, but she'd be anxious the entire time.


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## Hanlou (Oct 29, 2012)

Dogloverlou said:


> Another thing to consider maybe @Muttly is whether he's scared of anything in the kitchen? Missy developed an anxiety around the fridge, washing machine and dishwasher to the point she'd stand at the kitchen door and cry until we got up to go in with her for a drink. Just leaving her wasn't fair IMO as she was obviously worried and unable to go any further. But things he may be ok with during the day can seem different at night in the dark. For example the sound of the fridge coming on can spook some dogs ( and is what triggered Missy's anxiety which then transferred to the other appliances ). Him getting worked up could indicate it's something he's finding unsettling in the kitchen itself, especially as you say he's fine left alone elsewhere.


This is a good point. This is why we ended up caving in and letting Whisper come upstairs - she was really scared of the kitchen. Even now she sometimes won't walk through it without lots of encouragement! I wanted to feed her in there but that was never going to work - she eats in the hallway which she's happy with and her water dish is also in there as she is so uncomfortable in the kitchen.

I stopped her from jumping on the bed though - she's too big and hairy!! She sleeps on her own bed in our room. Teddy does sleep on the bed (well, he often jumps off at this time of year as he gets too hot) but being small it's not a problem.

I do feel very blessed with my OH - he's so supportive with everything I do. We did have lots of discussions about things before we went to see Whisper though - it was important to me it was a joint decision as he's retired and I work so if he wasn't on board with everything it would be much harder! He walks them when I'm at work, often feeds them and cleans out the rabbits etc. Even made dinner today as I was doing a load of ironing!

Really hope you get things sorted xxx


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## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

Both dogs sleep in our room, OH is fine with it otherwise they'd be barking at every passer-by,human or animal. Tango sleeps in a puppy pen at the end of the bed, it's a cosy little den for her, and Reena in a soft crate - she was crate trained when we got her. The only time they've ever woken us is if they've been unwell and needed to go out.


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

None of my dogs would settle in the kitchen at night as they spent their days in the lounge the kitchen was only for access to the garden and for feeding.
Once I moved their crates to the lounge they settled immediately - I don't think you crate Muttley? but the principle would be the same, leave him snoozing the night away on the sofa if that is where he is most comfortable (just remember to put away/out of reach anything he could get up to mischief in the night with), maybe your OH would be happy to try this?
Personally we don't have dogs in the bedroom unless they are new to us or sick and need monitoring through the night - I wouldn't mind them crated in our room but Hubby doesn't like the idea so I don't ask.
I hope you can find a solution soon


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## Rott lover (Jan 2, 2015)

jamat said:


> Don't mean to be rude to anyone as everyone here is giving good advice but I honestly don't think we are in a position to advise on people relationships thats something for the two of them to work out between them.
> 
> Perhaps we should just try to keep things to the practical issue of helping mutely settle somewhere at night that isn't the bedroom


If the problem stems from that then we are giving opinions.Or at least i am.And that is really all we have.If ou want to go there then there is only a few select people on here that are vets and so forth that should be posting at all.


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## Westie Mum (Feb 5, 2015)

rottiepointerhouse said:


> In fairness though Mrs Muttley does work full time so its not a case of the dog not being able to be apart from her. She mentioned earlier that Muttley is perfectly happy with the run of the house during the day and just sleeps on the sofa


I know from my own boy dog, he is perfectly fine while I'm at work (I've asked the neighbours and our grown up children who are often here during the day with various shift patters) and perfectly fine if I'm not here and OH is here.

But as soon as I am here, he has to be with me and will not settle otherwise, I often joke the last time I went for a wee without being watched was the day before we picked Oscar up from the breeders.

But it is what it is .... I can't watch/listen to him bring distressed so allowances have to be made. Maybe if we stuck it out he would eventually settle away from me, but I have neighbours and would never put them through no sleep.

I've replied now as fell asleep on sofa hours ago. OH and the 2 girl dogs went to bed. Boy dog stays by my side even though he had free access to upstairs with the others.


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## 2Hounds (Jun 24, 2009)

I used to leave my dogs in the kitchen, but found they didn't settle very well in there, i think because when home we'd all be in the living room and we spend very little time in the kitchen and it can be colder in there too. When we got home first thing hector would do was drag his bed from the kitchen to the living room. Hector also used to be fine when we left the house but be noisy when he knew we were upstairs away from him, Actually with him it took tough love of me leaving to whine & bark while at my dads detached house (ours has attached neighbours) but he wasn't really distressed he'd just trained us to come when he was noisy. I think with Muttley i'd try to offer somewhere he'll feel more relaxed and comfortable to start.

I do agree with Ellen though as i've created dogs that have become used to being in same room as us at night because it made our lives easier & we liked it, but they aren't as reliably quiet when left downstairs. Although the worst offender is Throp who has spent more time sleeping downstairs in his lifetime than the rest.

I think its ok to not want dogs in the bedroom, but Muttley is a joint responsibility and I can see why you feel like you can do no right by OH, he's annoyed at the noise & annoyed when you go downstairs so Muttley is quiet and you can both sleep, won't offer up any compromises or help finding a solution, removing Muttley from home as least amount of effort involved.We can all be grouchy when lacking sleep & say things don't actually mean, but sounds like the OH has actually lost interest with the realities of dog ownership.


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## Little P (Jun 10, 2014)

My OH has been very accommodating of my dog. He's not an easy dog at all, but they've eventually formed a good relationship and my OH has even admitted that he quite likes him  buuuut my OH is under no illusion how much the dog means to me - I've had him half my life and he's been my dog throughout that time, not a family pet that I have taken with me. He's been with me through school, college, university and now as an adult.

When we moved in together nearly 2 years ago, naturally the dog was coming too! Moving gave the dog a whole new set of issues including full blown separation anxiety, and he went from previously sleeping downstairs on the sofa for the previous 11 years, to being completely unable to be left alone despite all the preventative measures under the sun (gradual positive introduction to the new house, every calmative product on the market). I couldn't even go upstairs without the dog sitting at the bottom (with a stair gate) and getting very distressed. The only option I had for the sake of the neighbours, was to have the dog in the bedroom, which my OH didn't want. We compromised, and the dog was put in a bed on the floor over my side of the bedroom - it was supposed to be a temporary measure while his separation anxiety was addressed.....and he's slept soundly there ever since. Once he's in bed, you wouldn't even know he's in the bedroom (apart from the snoring, but to be honest, the OH is worse!).

Anyway, I'm rambling.

You need to compromise with your partner, it's a shared house so there's shared feelings to consider, even if they are different to your own. If he really doesn't want the dog in the bedroom, he needs to understand that it's not going to be an overnight transformation into a dog that is happy sleeping in the kitchen overnight. My first question - why the kitchen? I wouldn't want to sleep in the kitchen. How old is your dog? Is there any possibility that there could be a medical reason for his sudden change of behaviour? (Mine went through a spell of not sleeping through the night, getting up multiple times - he's on medication for senility and he's much better now). If he's medically checked out fine, I'd get a behaviour referral from your vet (any good behaviourist will insist on a vet health check first) - one that will come out to the house and talk to the whole family and help you address the problems that you're having.

Good luck


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## Lexiedhb (Jun 9, 2011)

Muttly said:


> If Muttly is feeling he needs to be with me, nothing is going to help but being with me.
> I just want him to be settled and happy tbh, wherever that is.


Please dont think like this, you are fuelling his anxiety. He can be trained into not needing to be with you one way or another, which he needs to be for the sake of your relationship.


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

Rott lover said:


> If the problem stems from that then we are giving opinions.Or at least i am.And that is really all we have.If ou want to go there then there is only a few select people on here that are vets and so forth that should be posting at all.


 All I was trying to say was if it was marriage guidance Mrs muttly was looking for she'd have gone to a relationship forum, from her original post she was asking for advice on how to settle her dog not her husband / partner.

Yes some people have suggested this might be deeper routed than just the dog issue but there have been one or two posts that have basically indicated to put the dog before her partner and to show him the door if he didn't like it.... this helps no one and would imagine comments like that would upset her. Thats why I suggested keeping it to dog related suggestions and allow her to reflect on her relationship privately not to have it aired on this forum.

I'm not trying to pick a fight by the way but I do think we need to respect Mrs Muttly's privacy


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Right, thanks guys for all your replies and experiences, they have all really helped.

Muttly slept in the kitchen when we brought him home last August (9 months old), he slept soundly for about 3 months, during which time the relationship and bond between us grew. We gave him a treat and he was eating it while we shut the door and went to bed.
In December he started refusing the treat, ears and tail down, looking sad.
A couple of months ago he started scratching in addition to the sad looks, first time was so out of the blue, I went to see if he was ok (obviously) and put him back to bed, then a few weeks, he did it again and I ended up on the sofa with him. Then he will go for weeks with perhaps a little scratch and we ignore and he settles. But some nights like the last 2 he is going mental, so much that I cannot ignore him as he is literally banging the door with what I can only imagine is his nose!
OH thinks that having the run of the kitchen was great at first to what he had in his previous home (crated alone). Then he decided that he wants more and more and more and because I let him on the sofa in the evening, he doesn't then like being shut in the kitchen away from me.

He has no separation anxiety during the day if I leave him with the run of the house, he sits on the sofa. When I leave at lunchtime, my OH is there and he is at all bothered that I leave.
If I shut him in the kitchen when I leave for work in the morning, he doesn't like it. In fact this morning, he really didn't want to stay and I'm pretty sure when I go home at lunch today OH will tell me he scratched and had to be let out. (I'll report back).

OH said to put him back in the kitchen in the mornings, which I didn't want to because the way I think is yes it's healthy that they can self settle alone, but OH wants him in the kitchen 10pm-6:30am, then 8am - 12pm. I think it is just too much. That's why I started giving him the run of house in the morning, he has a walk, settles on the sofa and stays there when I leave for work, he doesn't get up and try and follow me out the door, he is happy.

Had a chat with OH, he was somewhat understanding, but after a chat and going to bed at 1am, I had to respond again to Muttly scratching like a mad thing when he was put in kitchen.
So I was on sofa.
I took him for an evening walk, to see if that would make him more tired and he would settle, but no.
He spends the evenings lately (cos if the heat) either sitting in the garden watching the birds, or on the floor, so he is not on my lap much.
I suggested getting the big crate out and putting it on the landing outside our door, but he didn't agree that would work, he said "Yet another victory for him, then he insist he is in the room, then the bed" "Muttly has a pet human and you have made a rod for your own back"
Yeah that helps .....I suggested the calms drops and he said they won't work, because he is just trying to control me and be my boss. So I was like "well we have to try something ffs!"

The other night when he scratched and went mental, we both went down and sat with him in the lounge for 20 mins, then tried him again and he was worse.

But anyway it is all my fault because I wanted to love my dog and give him a happy safe home that he had never had, I'm clueless and brought all this on myself. Seriously shit owner.
I am supposed to go to work for 8 hours then not give him much attention when I get home, then shut him away again all night.
Can't do this :Arghh

I did mention that because there has been increased stress at home that it may be making him act out, as lil un is acting up more lately too.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

StormyThai said:


> Silly question but how long have you had Muttly now and how do you react when your OH throws these comments at you?


Have had Muttly nearly 11 months. When OH says this stuff, I don't shout,I ask what he suggests. He's far too "I told you so" and if he goes on and on about how it's my fault and Muttly owns me, then he gets a rolled eyes look. Because that is not constructive and not helping.


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

My wife wasn't as hard nosed as your OH when we had problems with Alfie and was sure there was no solution other than rehoming but I placed a list of 10 things we could try in different combinations in front of her and asked for a month to work through them and see which ones worked.

A month later we were all having a good nights sleep (admittedly Alfie was in our bedroom)

Some didn't work or made the situation worse but we found a compromise that worked and yes we still have a few hoc ups now and then but for the majority of the time we now have a less stressed house hold ..... 

What I'm trying to say is if you work out a plan of action, taking into account some of the good advice given here and then approach your OH and ask him to help you work through them to see what will work for you all hopefully he will see that you are trying to take all his concerns on board and he might, just might support you in it.

Oh and make sure "muttly sleeping in your room" isn't one of them. This is the biggest issue with your OH and if he thinks it is a possibility he won't be supportive of your endeavours


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## karmacookie (Nov 9, 2014)

instead of a stairgate we bought one of these

http://www.petplanet.co.uk/product....m_CiL8v_emsqk6XBetdXArCKeNkvmbCqn6xoCpvrw_wcB

it has been so handy. we use it at the back door when we don't want the dogs out barking but want the door open. Use it to keep the dogs in one place when hoovering etc. was really handy when we took the dogs on holiday.

May be worth getting then you could experiment with keeping Mutley confined in different places and see where he settles the best?


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

karmacookie said:


> instead of a stairgate we bought one of these
> 
> http://www.petplanet.co.uk/product....m_CiL8v_emsqk6XBetdXArCKeNkvmbCqn6xoCpvrw_wcB
> 
> ...


 thats great I might nick that idea and get one for when we go off to the caravan 

its cheaper than the one I was looking at in Argos


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

karmacookie said:


> instead of a stairgate we bought one of these
> 
> http://www.petplanet.co.uk/product....m_CiL8v_emsqk6XBetdXArCKeNkvmbCqn6xoCpvrw_wcB
> 
> ...


Thank you for that! That would be a good idea. Do the feet easily slide along the floor?


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## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

Just wanted to say you are absolutely not a crap owner who has brought the situation on yourself, you are a caring owner trying to reach a compromise that makes both your OH and your dog happy. Muttly is one lucky little dog having you fight his corner so please don't feel down about yourself


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

rottiepointerhouse said:


> Just wanted to say you are absolutely not a crap owner who has brought the situation on yourself, you are a caring owner trying to reach a compromise that makes both your OH and your dog happy. Muttly is one lucky little dog having you fight his corner so please don't feel down about yourself


Thank you :Shy I love my lil Muttly to bits and I want the best for him, he's such a lovely dog.


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## Pupcakes (Jun 20, 2011)

Just to second what RPH has said, you're not a crap owner - you're a caring owner! 

I too have been crying/stressing all this week as I have been very poorly and havent been able to take The Terrors for their usual adventures, so they have been sleeping all day with me and my OH does little walks in between (thats another thread...). I kept thinking what a crap owner I am, how awful I am and even bought the buggers steaks to have raw for dinner to ease my guilt! (During a 5:10am shopping trip dressed like a mad woman, but thats another story!)

The point is, what I've learnt this week and over the years I've had my 2, is the reason we are so hard on ourselves is because we care so much. If you didnt care, you would lock him away and let him cry and be upset and I know plenty who do that and dont come back for hours on end, I'm talking 12 hours.

Muttly is clearly very loved!xxx


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## karmacookie (Nov 9, 2014)

I'm not entirely sure what you mean 

If you mean is it easy for us to move then yes it's lightweight and portable.

If you mean could Mutley move it, possible (it certainly wouldn't work for a large boisterous dog) However, you position the feet yourself so I made sure the feet were going to fit in the doorways and the gate part just out a bit either side against the door frame so that if it was jumped at or shoved there was less likelyhood of it falling over. The young Cairn has never escaped from it, my older dog has managed to move it somehow and get round the side of it a couple of times.

When on the stairs I put it on the first step, it probably wouldn't work well at the top of the stairs though


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

I was umm-ing and ahh-ing whether or not to post on here as it's about pretty personal stuff, not just dog stuff but one thing that's stood out from everything else is when you said Muttly slept next to your bed once you'd gone to work and OH was in bed.. could you not use this as a foundation to build on?  As in 'remember how well behaved/how well he slept when I'd gone to work and he was next to the bed..' kinda convo then maybe ask him to trial a new situation for a night or 2 to see how well you guys get to sleep? Whether it be an on the landing situation or muttly in his own bed in your room? 
Here, it was me who didn't want the dog in the bedroom and all along before we got willow we had planned for the front room downstairs to be 'her room'... she melted my heart and her bed got moved to our bedroom lol & it was OH who allowed her on the bed... despite me saying no... I just gave up in the end lol but she usually always had to go in her own bed to sleep  the same rules now stand for the other two... when me and OH are in bed, no dogs are allowed on the bed. Eventually you come up with ways to deal with any 'alone time' you need as a couple and make sure the dogs are out of the way. 

I think once you both start getting a proper decent night sleep you can work everything else out and decide if there really is any relationship issues or whether your both just super tired right now  I'm such a cow when I'm tired!


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Thanks Jen, I'm a cow when tired too!
I really need an early night tonight, I'm so tired, 2 nights of 4 hours sleep kills me. I'm leaning towards the baby gate at the bottom of the stairs tbh. I would need to go and get one after work if Argos have any.
I would prefer the gate over our bedroom if I'm honest, but lil un has to sleep with her door open lately, and Muttly would jump all over her if he has access.
Either that or the crate on the landing, if it fits, our house is very small.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Good luck  there's nothing worse than having words when your both tired.


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## Amelia66 (Feb 15, 2011)

Can you not put the crate in the living room? might also solve the issues if you OH is so against the bedroom [which to be honest would not be something i would be pushing, sometimes you just have to respect the other persons decision] I think the baby gate will give you some idea of whats going on as if he still cries while access to the front room its most likely just for attention. Why not say to your OH to try it for one night, if it works continue it if not back to the drawing board. Im sure he would like you back in the bed and more sleep himself so he should be open to ideas.plus one night isn't going to hurt.


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

Muttly said:


> Thanks Jen, I'm a cow when tired too!
> I really need an early night tonight, I'm so tired, 2 nights of 4 hours sleep kills me. I'm leaning towards the baby gate at the bottom of the stairs tbh. I would need to go and get one after work if Argos have any.
> I would prefer the gate over our bedroom if I'm honest, but lil un has to sleep with her door open lately, and Muttly would jump all over her if he has access.
> Either that or the crate on the landing, if it fits, our house is very small.


Not dog related, but is the little girl frightened of nightmares? A teddy bear nightlight could be a comfort to her, and a promise you'll check on her and tuck her in again when you go to bed yourself. I can still remember being scared of the dark when I was little - don't really like it now if I'm honest, but when you're a farmer in lambing time you just have to get on with it, and once you're in the shed or field with a ewe in front of you there's no time for anything else.


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

We have two gates one on the kitchen door and one on the conservatory door to kind of pen Alfie into the kitchen in the day time.

We thought of putting one on my daughter's bedroom door so Alfie could then have the run of our room, the lounge and the hall / landing but decided against it due to my daughter needing to go to the toilet at night, we've just had new sofas in the lounge and don't want them chewed and Alfie now loves running up and down stairs so giving access to the hall and landing wouldn't be the best idea.


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

10pm-6:30am, then 8am - 12pm.He wants the dog in the kitchen for those times what the heck for no wonder the poor thing does not like the kitchen he spends too much time on his own in there maybe that's the problem
Not criticizing in any way by saying this at all but why wont your OH allow him to be in the lounge where he may be happier I get he does not want him in the bedroom fair enough but to put him in the kitchen when he gets stressed and anxious to the point where you have to go down is just not working 
Your OH will be unhappy you are not sleeping in bed with him don't know what else to suggest really


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Muttly, you're far from a crap owner! It's your OH who's got it all back to front with his talk of Muttly 'dominating' you etc  It sounds as if he's truly experiencing anxiety in the kitchen. If your OH is being such an arse about him coming upstairs, will he agree to allowing him the run of the downstairs? Or even just the living room? Blimey, you can't compromise more than that! If not, I'd make it known in no uncertain terms that the only other option you're left with is seeking professional help to help Muttly with his anxiety and that you'll be expecting him to pay for it


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Thanks guys...again :Shy You lot are great!!

I got home at lunch and OH said he hadn't heard Muttly scratching at all. From this I am wondering if he is scratching for me? Since he knew I had gone to work, then he didn't scratch. But then when he has the run of the house in the mornings, he doesn't need me. Hmmmm, I dunno.
Or perhaps he just doesn't want to scratch for OH as he shouted at him last time? OH would say, "then you need to shout at him" 
It's all guesswork and I'm not happy shouting at my dog when I'm not 100% sure on this.

@shirleystarr - That's my point yeah, I think it's too long on his own, in a place he isn't happy. I wonder if because we did this from day one, he got to the point where he just really disliked it.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Dogloverlou said:


> Muttly, you're far from a crap owner! It's your OH who's got it all back to front with his talk of Muttly 'dominating' you etc  It sounds as if he's truly experiencing anxiety in the kitchen. If your OH is being such an arse about him coming upstairs, will he agree to allowing him the run of the downstairs? Or even just the living room? Blimey, you can't compromise more than that! If not, I'd make it known in no uncertain terms that the only other option you're left with is seeking professional help to help Muttly with his anxiety and that you'll be expecting him to pay for it


Thank you  I keep saying to OH, "If he thinks he owns me and is the boss, then why would he still listen to me when I tell him not to do something, or with all his training I have done"
I have taught him his 'lie down' now in a couple of days and then back up into a 'sit' (I know it's basic, just never needed a lie down before, so didn't teach it ) I want to teach him lots of things and have got a couple of books recommended on here too.

I think the baby gate at the bottom of the stairs next, so he has kitchen/diner, lounge, hallway.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Catharinem said:


> Not dog related, but is the little girl frightened of nightmares? A teddy bear nightlight could be a comfort to her, and a promise you'll check on her and tuck her in again when you go to bed yourself. I can still remember being scared of the dark when I was little - don't really like it now if I'm honest, but when you're a farmer in lambing time you just have to get on with it, and once you're in the shed or field with a ewe in front of you there's no time for anything else.


It's strange when we got her when she was 2, she had a night light and she would get out of bed and turn it off, every night lol. So she was in the pitch black. Then a year ago (when she was 5) she decided she was scared in the dark, so we let her have her door open, she can hear us in the lounge so I think that comforts her and she goes to sleep. Luckily once she is asleep, she sleeps very deep. 
I think getting another nightlight might be worth it yeah, or knowing her she has prob got used to hearing us and likes to go to sleep that way now..


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Amelia66 said:


> Can you not put the crate in the living room? might also solve the issues if you OH is so against the bedroom [which to be honest would not be something i would be pushing, sometimes you just have to respect the other persons decision] I think the baby gate will give you some idea of whats going on as if he still cries while access to the front room its most likely just for attention. Why not say to your OH to try it for one night, if it works continue it if not back to the drawing board. Im sure he would like you back in the bed and more sleep himself so he should be open to ideas.plus one night isn't going to hurt.


Not sure if relevant, but Muttly has never ever cried vocally. He only scratches or noses the door. But yeah I'm not going to push for the bedroom, I will try the baby gate downstairs and see how it goes. 
What may ruin it, we are going to my parents end of the month and he will sleep in our room for 2 nights.


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

He is not trying to dominate you as your OH suggested that's an out of date theory dogs don't dominate at all Shouting at him will make him even more stressed and anxious sounds like your OH has some very old fashioned ideas about dogs Your OH says he did not hear scratching when you were at work this morning does that mean he was shut in the kitchen on his own while you were working


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## Lexiedhb (Jun 9, 2011)

Muttly said:


> Thanks guys...again :Shy You lot are great!!
> 
> I got home at lunch and OH said he hadn't heard Muttly scratching at all. From this I am wondering if he is scratching for me? Since he knew I had gone to work, then he didn't scratch. But then when he has the run of the house in the mornings, he doesn't need me. Hmmmm, I dunno.
> Or perhaps he just doesn't want to scratch for OH as he shouted at him last time? OH would say, "then you need to shout at him"
> ...


Of course he is scratching for you- you go to him when he does it!!! - you give him exactly what it is he wants, and so it continues. (I am not saying you can just leave him scratching and distressed at all BTW) Your OH doesn't. Dexter wouldnt dream of bothering my OH to take him out for a walk, as he never once has, me on the other hand, well thats a different story.

Your not a pants owner, we all pander to our dogs one way or another (mine likes breakfast at 5.30am...... not a minute later - cheers Dex), you just need to find a solution that really works for all involved, and both the hoomins need to be open to compromise.

If hes so quick to catch on, look up and teach him a "settle"......... may help.


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

When Alfie first started coming in the front room with us i taught him the settle command as we didn't want him up on the sofas. It too a few weeks but he has it down pat now. All we have to say is Alfie settle and he goes off into one of the corners or onto the fire half and settles himself down for the evening. 

Its well worth teaching him as I use it when we are out and sitting outside a pub or the like


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

Muttly said:


> It's strange when we got her when she was 2, she had a night light and she would get out of bed and turn it off, every night lol. So she was in the pitch black. Then a year ago (when she was 5) she decided she was scared in the dark, so we let her have her door open, she can hear us in the lounge so I think that comforts her and she goes to sleep. Luckily once she is asleep, she sleeps very deep.
> I think getting another nightlight might be worth it yeah, or knowing her she has prob got used to hearing us and likes to go to sleep that way now..


Poor baby, probably got the idea of being scared of the dark from other children when she started school. Do try a nice big teddy bear light. She's probably feeling quite insecure as she's not with her mum, maybe started wondering why her mum doesn't want her or if she'll be left again. Not saying that for a moment, but children worry, and often won't say what's really bothering them for us to reassure them. Modern relationships are so difficult, no longer mum, dad and 2.4 children.


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## Rott lover (Jan 2, 2015)

I am sorry and this is going to sound horrible but if he expects her to be locked up in the kitchen for 12.5 hours a day i would be putting my foot up an arse.I know that sounds harsh and this is just my opinion but no dog should be locked away for that many hours a day.I would looking at the OH and telling him he cant come out of the bedroom or office or what ever for 12.5 hours a day and see how he likes it.It is no wonder muttly goes nuts.I sure as hell know i would in that situation.


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## MyAnimals (Aug 14, 2014)

I understand it's not the same, but when my dogs cry at night I let them straight outside, then straight back in their crate, no fuss, night night, back up to bed. They don't do it often, but I think they learnt that crying at night doesn't get attention, it gets them booted out in the cold for a min. Sounds mean, but I didn't want them getting nice attention in the middle of the night for no reason then doing it every night. It'll be tough at first, but you are giving him what he wants and he won't learn to sleep at night by himself. Go down, let him out for a pee, or say "bedtime" and go straight back up. He'll get the idea. Also, could he be scared of the dark? Maybe a little night light might help. Sounds daft, but worth a try. I'd also move him to the living room, they're much cosier than kitchens.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Muttly said:


> Thanks guys...again :Shy You lot are great!!
> 
> I got home at lunch and OH said he hadn't heard Muttly scratching at all. From this I am wondering if he is scratching for me? Since he knew I had gone to work, then he didn't scratch. But then when he has the run of the house in the mornings, he doesn't need me. Hmmmm, I dunno.
> Or perhaps he just doesn't want to scratch for OH as he shouted at him last time? OH would say, "then you need to shout at him"
> ...


Just wondering, but is it possible your OH is just saying he hasn't made any noise etc so as to make it more evident 'you're' the problem? Sounds quite horrible I know, but if he's so strict about the rules etc then he's hardly going to say 'yeah, he was awful' so as to reinforce your point.

For example, my Ty has SA and I know for a fact he whines when I'm not around...even being left with my mum & sister he whines and gets on their nerves lol. However my dad always says he's 'fine' when he's been left with him and hasn't cried at all! I don't believe this for a minute based on past experience, but my dad is one of those types who tries to always look better than you. So by saying Ty is good with him is just another way of trying to look good and point score


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## Leanne77 (Oct 18, 2011)

shirleystarr said:


> 10pm-6:30am, then 8am - 12pm.He wants the dog in the kitchen for those times what the heck for no wonder the poor thing does not like the kitchen he spends too much time on his own in there maybe that's the problem
> Not criticizing in any way by saying this at all but why wont your OH allow him to be in the lounge where he may be happier I get he does not want him in the bedroom fair enough but to put him in the kitchen when he gets stressed and anxious to the point where you have to go down is just not working
> Your OH will be unhappy you are not sleeping in bed with him don't know what else to suggest really


Well, I must be a really, really sh1tty owner then because my dogs are in the kitchen 24/7 except when they have access to the garden. During the summer that is most of the day but during winter there is no free access to outside. My dogs only get to spend time with me on walks, training classes or when I sit outside with them or on their beds with them. I dont think anybody can accuse my dogs of being miserable or unhappy or accuse me of not caring or having their best interests at heart.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Leanne77 said:


> Well, I must be a really, really sh1tty owner then because my dogs are in the kitchen 24/7 except when they have access to the garden. During the summer that is most of the day but during winter there is no free access to outside. My dogs only get to spend time with me on walks, training classes or when I sit outside with them or on their beds with them. I dont think anybody can accuse my dogs of being miserable or unhappy or accuse me of not caring or having their best interests at heart.


As long as your dogs are happy, which I'm sure they are, then great! Mine isn't, that's the problem.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Leanne77 said:


> Well, I must be a really, really sh1tty owner then because my dogs are in the kitchen 24/7 except when they have access to the garden. During the summer that is most of the day but during winter there is no free access to outside. My dogs only get to spend time with me on walks, training classes or when I sit outside with them or on their beds with them. I dont think anybody can accuse my dogs of being miserable or unhappy or accuse me of not caring or having their best interests at heart.


I wouldn't take it the wrong way Leanne  & I seriously doubt anyone on here would accuse you of such things either. From what I gather your dogs have each other for company and that's their routine which they have always had and they are really happy with it? Where as muttly is on his own and gets run of the house normally, being locked in the kitchen isn't a normal thing for him apart from at bedtime and now he's decided hje's not happy.. if he wasn't playing up it wouldn't be an issue but obviously muttly is making a little issue out of it now for some reason


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

Rott lover said:


> I am sorry and this is going to sound horrible but if he expects her to be locked up in the kitchen for 12.5 hours a day i would be putting my foot up an arse.I know that sounds harsh and this is just my opinion but no dog should be locked away for that many hours a day.I would looking at the OH and telling him he cant come out of the bedroom or office or what ever for 12.5 hours a day and see how he likes it.It is no wonder muttly goes nuts.I sure as hell know i would in that situation.


Totally agree with this. What's the point of having a dog if it's going to be shut away from the family for the majority of the time? I'm not surprised that Muttly is unhappy at being shut in the kitchen at night.

The dog is not trying to dominate anyone - but there is definitely someone in the house who is 

Personally, I'd just say "the dog has the run of the house during the day, and can sleep on the sofa at night" - everyone gets a good night's sleep. Get over it. End of.

My dog has got it made - he was left sleeping on our bed last evening whilst we, ahem, had a cuddle, downstairs - so as not to disturb the dog! We even squeezed into the bed later on making sure we didn't disturb him! No biggy


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## Ownedbymany (Nov 16, 2014)

Yikes, I don't want to go into who is right and who is wrong or blame anyone for anything but this whole situation seems like a whole lot of drama over nothing. That drama isn't making anyone happy though, you, your partner or muttley!

I get why your partner doesn't want muttley in the bedroom.
I get why you don't want to ignore an upset doggy too. 
I get why muttley is upset too but there must be some darn compromise to restore the peace! 

Anyway in your situation I would just accept that the way things are isn't working for anyone. I would ask my partner if he thought the situation was working for anyone. If he said "yes the dog" I would then explain why it isn't working for him. 

I can't explain why muttley is getting distressed for seemingly no real reason but he is. If he was mine I would set a whole new bedtime routine. I would probably buy a crate (folding one if space is an issue) or a new bed with a puppy pen round it or something and train him to be happy there.
I would change the location of his bed if only slightly.
I would possibly change his daytime routine by doing training, walking and feeding at different times so he is ready for a good sleep overnight. 
perhaps change your bedtime by half an hour or something if you have a set routine.
if you need to make a good fuss of him to say goodnight then you don't have to stop, just do it earlier and make the going upstairs part more simple so he can't pick up on any anxiety you might have about leaving him.

(Please don't take all my thoughts completely on board as I am not a trainer and I can't see the situation with him either. My thinking is if he has got a little set in his ways because his current routine gets more time with you then it could be simple to set a new routine. On the other hand if he is genuinely getting anxious you don't want to risk making things worse so I would get professional advice in that case)

I do think something needs to change. You have to think that this might get worse if it is anxiety and he really does need to learn to accept his own company at times- for his sake as well as you and your partners sanity. 

I can understand why your partner might think your slowly working up to letting him in the bedroom but I think you really need to make it clear that is not your intention (even if it is what you want) and that you are trying to compromise because all 3 of you have to live together and you all have to be happy. 

I do feel for you all and hope you can resolve things.


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## Hanlou (Oct 29, 2012)

Just popping on to the thread to say you're most definitely not a rubbish owner!! These dogs and what they put us through eh?! Hope you can get things sorted out xx


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## Leanne77 (Oct 18, 2011)

Muttly said:


> As long as your dogs are happy, which I'm sure they are, then great! Mine isn't, that's the problem.





JenSteWillow said:


> I wouldn't take it the wrong way Leanne  & I seriously doubt anyone on here would accuse you of such things either. From what I gather your dogs have each other for company and that's their routine which they have always had and they are really happy with it? Where as muttly is on his own and gets run of the house normally, being locked in the kitchen isn't a normal thing for him apart from at bedtime and now he's decided hje's not happy.. if he wasn't playing up it wouldn't be an issue but obviously muttly is making a little issue out of it now for some reason


I wasnt comparing my dogs to Muttly. I know they have each other and they have lived that way all their lives so it's normal for them. My ex's dog used to sleep in an unheated kitchen with minimal bedding completely alone as she wasnt allowed anywhere else in his house either. And when she wasnt alone in a cold kitchen she was alone in a cage in a cold van whilst he was at work. Now, that really is a sh1tty life.

But anyway, hope you can come to a compromise over Muttly, there has to be some middle ground somewhere.


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

Hope you reached some sort of agreement and that you all had a more peaceful night last night


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Had another chat and OH put a plan to me:

Because I seriously need some sleep he said
Stay downstairs with him for a few nights, then try him back in the kitchen Fri, then if he scratches, Sat we will go get a stair gate and put it at the bottom of stairs.

So I had a bit more sleep last night, except at 3am I woke up boiling hot and Muttly was panting too, the lounge aint ideal, but chucked off the covers and both had a drink and he settled back down on the floor.

Then I overslept this morning  ffs


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

Glad to hear you have a basic plan to work to and that it was the OH that came up with it to  I'll keep my fingers crossed it works out


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

Glad to hear he has come up with a plan too a stair gate would be great it would mean the little dog could have the run of the house downstairs


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## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

Thats a big step in the right direction and shows he is prepared to compromise.


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## silvi (Jul 31, 2014)

Sounds like real progress all round.... even if you did oversleep!


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Yup, think we are getting somewhere and I also made a discovery!
I turned off the light last night to sleep (in the lounge with him again, I usually leave the light on low in the lounge so I can see to get up but I prefer the dark) and he started looking around, and panting! I turned it back on and he put his head down and went to sleep.
Muttly is afraid of the dark, bless him  But a step towards understanding him! 

Will sleep down with him again tonight so I can sleep properly (plus we are due violent thunder storms tonight), then fri night try him in kitchen with the light on 
Fingers crossed!!!


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

aww bless him I wonder what has made him scared of the dark


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

shirleystarr said:


> aww bless him I wonder what has made him scared of the dark


Really don't know, he was fine before. Racking my brains trying to think what has changed?


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

Muttly said:


> Really don't know, he was fine before. Racking my brains trying to think what has changed?


Poor boy! If he's ok with the light on low in the lounge, maybe get a small pug in night light for the kitchen (I guess no dimmer switch in there, and you can't leave door open or he'll be out?). That way he gets enough light to be ok, but doesn't get too much light, and he has a definite day/night cue.


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## Catharinem (Dec 17, 2014)

_*Plug - in*_ night light, not _*pug in*_ night light! Curse sending before proofreading!


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

Catharinem said:


> _*Plug - in*_ night light, not _*pug in*_ night light! Curse sending before proofreading!


Just had an image of a little sad big eyed flat face pressed against the glass of a lightbulb when I read that


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

jamat said:


> Just had an image of a little sad big eyed flat face pressed against the glass of a lightbulb when I read that


:Hilarious


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

jamat said:


> Just had an image of a little sad big eyed flat face pressed against the glass of a lightbulb when I read that


That's just had me laughing too funny


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Glad to hear things are looking more positive @Muttly 

The plug in night light idea is a good one if you think his anxiety is related to the dark. Have you considered a DAP diffuser too?


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Dogloverlou said:


> Glad to hear things are looking more positive @Muttly
> 
> The plug in night light idea is a good one if you think his anxiety is related to the dark. Have you considered a DAP diffuser too?


Yup thinking of getting one, not sure where I can get one physically. As don't need to order anything from zooplus or anywhere.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Muttly said:


> Yup thinking of getting one, not sure where I can get one physically. As don't need to order anything from zooplus or anywhere.


I got one years ago from the vet. Might be worth asking yours


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## SarahBugz (Mar 14, 2011)

I got my DAP diffuser from Pets at Home. I think my vets sells them too. Most pet shops seem to stock them. My dog also had one of the DAP collars.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Ah thanks guys, I might pop to [email protected] on saturday, handy as it's near Argos too for the stair gate I may need.


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## Rott lover (Jan 2, 2015)

I think i like the PUG in light idea better than the PLUG in light:Hilarious


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## steveshanks (Feb 19, 2015)

Do you have a local hardware store, or a cheapy shop like poundland or something, you can get the basic ones for about 3 quid, we have loads for our birds to prevent them having night frights.......If your going to Argos
http://www.argos.co.uk/static/Product/partNumber/1221417.htm
Steve


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

I am glad you're getting some answers @Muttly


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## lemmsy (May 12, 2008)

Glad to hear things are better!

I would add that, in my opinion, for what it is worth, you are doing a good job of not anthropomorphising (humanising basically) his behaviour. Dogs don't do things to "gain victories" over us or "just because", they do them because either:

1. They are reinforced for doing so

or... most likely in this case (behaviours which aren't subject to operant conditioning)

2. They feel they have to (i.e. they don't feel safe, they are distressed).

If you think his anxiety might be prompted by the dark and finding a nightlight might be hard could you invest in a plug in lamp, which can be placed safely, out of reach somewhere?


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

lemmsy said:


> Glad to hear things are better!
> 
> I would add that, in my opinion, for what it is worth, you are doing a good job of not anthropomorphising (humanising basically) his behaviour. Dogs don't do things to "gain victories" over us or "just because", they do them because either:
> 
> ...


Thanks Lemmsy. That means a lot.

In the diner end of the kitchen, there is a less bright energy saving bulb, so I'm thinking of just keeping that on for him ?(it lights up the whole room inc kitchen, but dim. Which is fine tbh, our house is bloody Blackpool Illuminations at night. We have lights on in the toilet (for lil un in the night) the hallway, her room (dimmer on low), now the diner lol


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

OH has suggested I don't let him come up on my lap as he pleases, that he must sit and wait to asked. (We did this when I first got him, but I let it slip).
So I started doing this last night, when he jumped up, I said down. But.... He put his tail down and went under my sofa foot rest and stayed there the whole evening. He isn't asking because he doesn't know he has too, not sure how to make him realise he has to ask. He may just think I don't want him  Quite upsetting tbh.

I slept down with him again and when I came back down from getting ready for bed, he was on the sofa, my bed. I walked in and he got on the floor straight away. Then he wouldn't come back.
I went to sleep then woke up in the night, and I called him up 
I really don't want him to think I'm rejecting him now.


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

Alfie does the same straight up on the bed or if we are in the lounge, the sofa. I point to the floor and say down and he gets off and sits on the floor watching me. 

Once I've settles in bed to on sofa I say come and he jumps up and I sat settle and he curls up at the bottom between my legs and goes to sleep. 

Over time he's realise dI get in first and he is then allowed to get on after  it just takes time. try a treat when you ask him to get off the sofa / your lap then he will know you are not rejecting him


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

jamat said:


> Alfie does the same straight up on the bed or if we are in the lounge, the sofa. I point to the floor and say down and he gets off and sits on the floor watching me.
> 
> Once I've settles in bed to on sofa I say come and he jumps up and I sat settle and he curls up at the bottom between my legs and goes to sleep.
> 
> Over time he's realise dI get in first and he is then allowed to get on after  it just takes time. *try a treat when you ask him to get off the sofa / your lap then he will know you are not rejecting him*


Ah great! thanks. Will try this.

OH wants to try him in the kitchen tonight, think I know how that will go.....
Off to Argos and P&H Saturday me thinks.


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

Muttly said:


> Ah great! thanks. Will try this.
> 
> OH wants to try him in the kitchen tonight, think I know how that will go.....
> Off to Argos and P&H Saturday me thinks.


Hope the light solves the problem and he is happy to settle in the kitchen tonight.

If not, then I'd be inclined to let him sleep on the sofa (again, with a light in the room) and hope he settles there. Seems a fair compromise.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

I do think that it will be a stair gate on the bottom of stairs and he will be having the run of down stairs by Sat night. With the dimmer low in the lounge.


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## Mum2Heidi (Feb 17, 2010)

They are all different so it may not work for you but if that was Heidi responded like Muttly, I would wait a couple of mins and then call her out from under the chair and ask her up. A little while later, ask her to get down again, get up myself and do something, come back, sit down and invite her up again. Do this a few times rather than asking her up and down regimentally.

Hope that makes sense/helps in some way.


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## lemmsy (May 12, 2008)

Muttly said:


> OH has suggested I don't let him come up on my lap as he pleases, that he must sit and wait to asked. (We did this when I first got him, but I let it slip).
> So I started doing this last night, when he jumped up, I said down. But.... He put his tail down and went under my sofa foot rest and stayed there the whole evening. He isn't asking because he doesn't know he has too, not sure how to make him realise he has to ask. He may just think I don't want him  Quite upsetting tbh.
> 
> I slept down with him again and when I came back down from getting ready for bed, he was on the sofa, my bed. I walked in and he got on the floor straight away. Then he wouldn't come back.
> ...


Does he jump up uninvited?
And if he does, does it bother you?
I don't wish to put my two-pennies-worth in where it's not warranted, but could it be that it bothers your OH (and does Muttly do the same to him) or that he views it as the dog "gaining a victory". If that is the case, I think your OH really does misunderstand the dog. The dog isn't trying to take over the world.
Also, and I hope you won't think this is out of turn, you say your partner "suggested" it (as a means of improving Muttly's behaviour perhaps), but don't you take care of most of the dog stuff/responsibilities and work with the dog more, I'd be tempted to be more confident in your assessment of these situations. You are the dog's main caregiver, you understand him. You don't have to listen to or follow everyone's suggestions. Sometimes people have good ones, sometimes bad ones.

Sometimes my dogs jump onto a sofa next to people (their people) or on their laps (partly- they aren't Muttly size so don't fit fully on one lap ). That's fine, I don't feel the need to control their every move. I want dogs that enjoy interacting with their people. If there isn't room or for whatever reason, I want them to jump off, I ask them to and they do and they get some fuss, or a "good lad/girly" and a stroke for doing so. No problem.

Again, I do get the impression that OH sees normal aspects of the dog's behaviour now, as attempting to control, where he is just being a normal dog.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

lemmsy said:


> Does he jump up uninvited?
> And if he does, does it bother you?
> I don't wish to put my two-pennies-worth in where it's not warranted, but could it be that it bothers your OH (and does Muttly do the same to him) or that he views it as the dog "gaining a victory". If that is the case, I think your OH really does misunderstand the dog. The dog isn't trying to take over the world.
> Also, and I hope you won't think this is out of turn, you say your partner "suggested" it (as a means of improving Muttly's behaviour perhaps), but don't you take care of most of the dog stuff/responsibilities and work with the dog more, I'd be tempted to be more confident in your assessment of these situations. You are the dog's main caregiver, you understand him. You don't have to listen to or follow everyone's suggestions. Sometimes people have good ones, sometimes bad ones.
> ...


Oh Lemmsy, you hit the nail right on the head.
Yes I am Muttly's owner 100%.

A lot of the time Muttly does come up uninvited yes. But I do actually take this as him being in a routine, and he knows I am happy with his actions, for example when I come home at lunch and have faffed about, I go and sit on the sofa he will then come on my lap for cuddles, also after putting lil un to bed, the same.
It's routine, he knows that I am happy to sit down for a while and have him up.
After dinner, he doesn't get on my lap, and this is because he knows it's not cuddle time. Although I'm sitting down, I'm doing things and then when I do get up he waits for me to say 'play time' and we have a game.
Maybe to other people (OH) this is perceived differently.

If he comes up and I need my lap free, I tell him to sit beside me on the sofa instead. This is the thing, he does do as I ask, he doesn't control me.

Muttly never jumps up on OH, as in the past , yes he tried sometimes and was told to get down every time. OH calls him up sometimes and gives him a fuss for a min, but it's rarely on his lap. In fact since we have had him he's prob been on his lap about 5 times. He doesn't like it, that's fine, no problem.
But I do, tbh I really missed my Muttly cuddles yesterday evening, I had a great walk with him, did some training and then brushed him, then what would of been nice is a cuddle on the sofa for half hour.
But OH said to do this, so I ended up feeling like crap, so I think did Muttly.

I am really worried, this is damaging our great bond we have. :Sorry

I am happy for my dog to make his own decisions sometimes, I'm here to guide him if his decisions are not suitable. I don't think dogs lives should be by a textbook and everything so 'expected'


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

I personally would allow Muttly to come on your lap when he wants to your happy with it the dog is happy but you OH thinks the dog is controlling you or dominating you what a lot of twaddle that is Poor dog did not understand last night why you told him to get down and obviously he was upset seems to me that your OH is being the dominating one not the dog My OH would never dream of behaving like this he knows better


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

What you need to do is make it positive as I suggested earlier if you tell him to go on the floor when he does make a fuss of him maybe give him a treat and call him a good boy.

We have a sofa in the conservatory which he's allowed on anytime. when I sit there he knows he's allowed to come up even climb all over me and give me licks though he knows when I say settle he has to lay down next to me and rest.

In the lounge he will only jump up if you have food with you ... though he doesn't go for the food in your hand he will sit right next to you dripping all over the leather until you give him a little something then we say settle and off he goes into a corner or the fire half to lay down.

My wife likes him laying next to her but not all over her so she tends to tell him to settle most hen he's on the sofa and he just lays there next to her.

My daughter loves to lay down and give him cuddles which he just lays there and takes tail wagging all the time.

When my daughter has gone to bed that when he has to stay on the floor as both my wife and I like to relax and watch telly not having a hot fluffy ball of fun jumping or laying all over us.

From my past posts some of you will know that at the beginning we had a lot of tension in the house between my wife and me and the dog. It even got to the stage where rehoming him was a possibility but we set up routines and training programs and slowly over the last 3 months its all started to fall into place.... The biggest thing, and the biggest eye opener, for me is that dogs don't come with a manual, there is no mute switch or off button its like having a TV without a control box and every dog is different and the instructions you write for one might not work for another..... its a lot of trail and error involved and time and dedication.

AND

Commitment from all parties


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Mum2Heidi said:


> They are all different so it may not work for you but if that was Heidi responded like Muttly, I would wait a couple of mins and then call her out from under the chair and ask her up. A little while later, ask her to get down again, get up myself and do something, come back, sit down and invite her up again. Do this a few times rather than asking her up and down regimentally.
> 
> Hope that makes sense/helps in some way.


I did try and call him up a couple of mins after, but he ignored me almost like he was sulking 

I will try this though, but perhaps with less of a pause


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

I actually listed some of Muttly's positives yesterday to my OH  just because I feel he is focusing on the negatives only.

He lies down without being asked when we sit down to dinner.
He is 'quiet' when told to be and doesn't bark much.
He is incredibly gentle when taking things from a human.
He is extremely loving and friendly.
He knows his border lines with lil un - Big one I think.


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## jamat (Jun 3, 2015)

Muttly said:


> I actually listed some of Muttly's positives yesterday to my OH  just because I feel he is focusing on the negatives only.
> 
> He lies down without being asked when we sit down to dinner.
> He is 'quiet' when told to be and doesn't bark much.
> ...


and don't forget

He's cute and fluffy


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## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

Muttly said:


> I did try and call him up a couple of mins after, but he ignored me almost like he was sulking
> 
> I will try this though, but perhaps with less of a pause


I don't think he was sulking, more confused by the sound of things because he was expecting to come up for a cuddle. We've all got different ideas about what our dogs should be allowed to do. My house is a bit of a free for all I have to admit, the only restrictions I have in place is a baby gate across the stairs which I shut during the day once we are all downstairs and thats only because I don't want them chasing each other up and down the stairs. Otherwise they go where they like when they like and despite that my 3 big dogs are not trying to rule me or take over. I'd love your OH to meet Indie so he can see that dogs can still be well trained and well behaved and friendly despite having the run of the house and furniture


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Yeah I have said to him that Muttly is confused at the mo, as lots of things are changing and he doesn't know where he is! I try not to put human emotions onto dogs, which is why I said almost seemed like he was sulking 

Went home at lunch, did my faffing, then called him up for a big fuss  
Apparently my OH said that he had called him up for a fuss too when he got up, so think he is trying more with Muttly too, which is great.

He also said that another thing has improved, we have been trying to teach him to leave the post as he decided it was good to chew 
I started by going to the door with him and getting him to sit and stay on the first stairs step, then give him a treat and pick up the post. Well that was great, but I'm not always home before the post. OH said he told Muttly to 'leave it'....'leave it'...'leave it'...and he did, just sat and looked at it, then had a good sniff and OH picked it up, he then fussed him lots. So great!!! (because that's another thing that has been really pissing my OH off).

Thing is, as I keep saying, I cannot make him a great, well trained dog alone, when I am at work full time! I need help from the family too, now he has done this with the post, perhaps he will do more training too


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

jamat said:


> and don't forget
> 
> He's cute and fluffy


He sure is  
I keep looking at my avatar and feeling a bit sad, because he is so happy there and this is him on his walks, just us. Such a happy little boy.


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

I have a mesh cage on the letter box so they cant get the post


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## silvi (Jul 31, 2014)

You see, I'm different with dogs. I'm not a 'touchy feely' person and I like my space. If a dog jumps up on my lap when I don't want them to, I won't say anything to them; I just put them back down on the floor and get on with what I was doing when they jumped up, whether that is talking, working, or just watching the TV.
So there's no feeling of a reprimand for what they have done, just a bit of a reminder that 'now is not a good time'. If that makes sense?

All our dogs have known that I say when they can come and sit on my lap (or beside me depending upon size), and they have seemed quite happy with that.
But I don't think that's about 'control', either by me or by the dogs - just respecting each others space and learning a routine that suits all of us.

But having said that, it seems to me that you have set a routine that Muttly knows - when you enjoy cuddles with him and when it is not the time for cuddles, so now he is confused (not sulking - confused ).

In my experience, most dogs settle well into routines, as long as they know what they are, so perhaps just putting him back on the floor when you are not ready to have him on your lap, but not saying a word, would not confuse him quite as much?
And as long as you then set up the new routine when there is no confusion (or disagreement between you and your OH) about when he comes up for cuddles, I think that Muttly will be absolutely fine


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

shirleystarr said:


> I have a mesh cage on the letter box so they cant get the post


That was going to be the next step, but I was sure I could train him not to chew it. Mainly because he used to just pick it up and bring it to us.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

silvi said:


> You see, I'm different with dogs. I'm not a 'touchy feely' person and I like my space. If a dog jumps up on my lap when I don't want them to, I won't say anything to them; I just put them back down on the floor and get on with what I was doing when they jumped up, whether that is talking, working, or just watching the TV.
> So there's no feeling of a reprimand for what they have done, just a bit of a reminder that 'now is not a good time'. If that makes sense?
> 
> All our dogs have known that I say when they can come and sit on my lap (or beside me depending upon size), and they have seemed quite happy with that.
> ...


I think so too 

I was explaining to OH last night about me and dogs, and how when I lived at home, I would often be found on the floor cuddling the dogs, or with one of their heads on my lap (Golden Retrievers so didn't fit on laps lol). I just love a dog cuddle


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## Elles (Aug 15, 2011)

I didn't reply to your initial concerns, because my answer would have been to tell OH to get stuffed, which wouldn't have been helpful.  I am pleased you're both working it out though. 

In our house I'm like Silvi. We have two sofas, one is mine and one is Elles'. She will suffer laying on hubby's lap if he deigns to sit on her sofa, but she only comes to mine for a cuddle if she's worried about something, like fireworks or a thunderstorm and then she asks, she doesn't just jump up. I was the one who slept downstairs with her when we first got her though and she sleeps on her bed next to my side upstairs not his and goes to bed when I do. It's entirely his fault the second sofa is hers. He encouraged her to jump up when she was small, I didn't. As it's a 2 seater, it's his own fault he sits on the floor when she's stretched out asleep on his sofa. I'd ask her to go on her own bed, I don't always want a hairy dog sat on me and I'm not sitting on the floor. 

Muttly sounds like a lovely little dog, I'm glad you're managing to work it out together with hubby.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Is your OH open to perhaps reading an article on two about the 'dominance' theory being debunked? He sounds very set in his ways and beliefs, but he needs to understand Muttly is not out for world domination. Or, as said already, just tell him where to go and continue doing what you're doing as YOU know you're doing things right. But it perhaps sounds like you're beginning to doubt yourself in some ways?

You're doing a great job and Muttly sounds like a well behaved little guy


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

Muttly said:


> Yeah I have said to him that Muttly is confused at the mo, as lots of things are changing and he doesn't know where he is! I try not to put human emotions onto dogs, which is why I said almost seemed like he was sulking
> 
> Went home at lunch, did my faffing, then called him up for a big fuss
> Apparently my OH said that he had called him up for a fuss too when he got up, so think he is trying more with Muttly too, which is great.
> ...


Fantastic that things seem to be improving now


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## SurfCFC (Dec 16, 2014)

Just read through these posts, I'm sorry to hear you've been going through this Muttly 

I don't really have much advice as what everyone has said is absolutely spot on - plus I have very few boundaries with Cooper - he sits/sleeps where he wants   so I very much doubt I'd be of any help!!

It does look as though you have made progress though - both with Muttly and your OH! - and I just wanted to say good luck and hope it all works out


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## Rott lover (Jan 2, 2015)

rottiepointerhouse said:


> I don't think he was sulking, more confused by the sound of things because he was expecting to come up for a cuddle. We've all got different ideas about what our dogs should be allowed to do. My house is a bit of a free for all I have to admit, the only restrictions I have in place is a baby gate across the stairs which I shut during the day once we are all downstairs and thats only because I don't want them chasing each other up and down the stairs. Otherwise they go where they like when they like and despite that my 3 big dogs are not trying to rule me or take over. I'd love your OH to meet Indie so he can see that dogs can still be well trained and well behaved and friendly despite having the run of the house and furniture


That is the way it is in our house with any animal we have had.The only place that is off limits is the bed.Oliver loved being on the couch but also knew it was our spot as well.As soon as we wen to sit on the couch he would hop down and wait until we were settled and told him it was ok.Even then a lot of the time he would stay on the floor.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Dogloverlou said:


> Is your OH open to perhaps reading an article on two about the 'dominance' theory being debunked? He sounds very set in his ways and beliefs, but he needs to understand Muttly is not out for world domination. Or, as said already, just tell him where to go and continue doing what you're doing as YOU know you're doing things right. But it perhaps sounds like you're beginning to doubt yourself in some ways?
> 
> You're doing a great job and Muttly sounds like a well behaved little guy


It will need chipping away at over time tbh, I think he is starting to open his mind a little.
The things I'm doubting are what to do next. Tonight OH said to go back to normal but give Muttly a light on the kitchen, then if he scratches too badly to be ignored again, I'll have to go down on sofa again. Then get the stair gate Sat.
Muttly is anxious from about 10pm, so not really fair, I also said I am anxious too because I know he won't settle and I can't stand knowing he is distressed! 
I can't see him settling at all tonight, I want to really stop that and go in with a new option for him, so he may feel some relief of not being shut away.


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

If he starts scratching in the kitchen I don't think you could ignore him at least I couldn't maybe the light will work


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

shirleystarr said:


> If he starts scratching in the kitchen I don't think you could ignore him at least I couldn't maybe the light will work


No I can't, but in the past he has scratched lightly a couple of times, then stopped. So I haven't gone down.


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## Leanne77 (Oct 18, 2011)

Muttly said:


> It will need chipping away at over time tbh, I think he is starting to open his mind a little.
> The things I'm doubting are what to do next. Tonight OH said to go back to normal but give Muttly a light on the kitchen, then if he scratches too badly to be ignored again, I'll have to go down on sofa again. Then get the stair gate Sat.
> *Muttly is anxious from about 10pm, so not really fair, I also said I am anxious too because I know he won't settle and I can't stand knowing he is distressed! *
> I can't see him settling at all tonight, I want to really stop that and go in with a new option for him, so he may feel some relief of not being shut away.


I think this is one of your problems. Muttly is anxious, you are anxious, Muttly gets even more anxious and it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy and just goes round and round. Perhaps you need to look at your routine before bed, the signals that you will be giving that you are soon going to put Muttly in the kitchen and leave him which make him become worried about the situation.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Muttly said:


> It will need chipping away at over time tbh, I think he is starting to open his mind a little.
> The things I'm doubting are what to do next. Tonight OH said to go back to normal but give Muttly a light on the kitchen, then if he scratches too badly to be ignored again, I'll have to go down on sofa again. Then get the stair gate Sat.
> Muttly is anxious from about 10pm, so not really fair, I also said I am anxious too because I know he won't settle and I can't stand knowing he is distressed!
> I can't see him settling at all tonight, I want to really stop that and go in with a new option for him, so he may feel some relief of not being shut away.


Well that's a start so I'd give it a go and see how you go. You may find that a night light and maybe using a DAP diffuser is all you need to do. Fingers crossed for him tonight.

Do you leave him with a Kong or long lasting chews or anything?


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Dogloverlou said:


> Well that's a start so I'd give it a go and see how you go. You may find that a night light and maybe using a DAP diffuser is all you need to do. Fingers crossed for him tonight.
> 
> Do you leave him with a Kong or long lasting chews or anything?


Used too, but he just refuses to eat when he is put in there (another symptom I have tried explaining is fear/stress). I tried a gravy bone yesterday morning when I went to work. OH said he ate it when he got up. I give him his breakfast in his kong at half 7 ish and he eats it up before I go to work.

I will be getting the plug too yeah, when I get the stair gate.

Thanks, yup have my fingers crossed too.


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## silvi (Jul 31, 2014)

Hope everything has been going well over this weekend with Muttly.


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

How did it go last night update us when you can


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Thanks for your concern guys 
Fri night, I said I was going to stay down with him as I really didn't think even trying and putting him back in that stressful situation was going to help him one bit.
Saturday, I went and got a great stair gate that my OH found, it's one that the whole thing is a 2 way door, so you don't just have this tiny door to get through, when it's open you don't know it's there 
So we have put that at the bottom of the stairs, basically (should of taken a pic lol) You walk in our front door, the stairs are on the right, the lounge on the left and kitchen straight on. So the gate goes from the banister to the just before the lounge door. So, it also stops him from getting to the post!
The hallway light is always left on and it lights up the lounge and most of the kitchen.

He settled really well Saturday and last night. We continued talking at normal volume upstairs as I said to OH I think he will be happy if he can just hear us. He was, I peeked through the gap in the banister a few times and I couldn't see him, so he wasn't waiting at the gate at all  By the looks of the sofa cushions, he slept on them on the sofa (they were all scuffed up lol, where he digs them to make a bed).
He doesn't go as mad with his greeting to me in the mornings when I come down to him either, which shows he is not as bothered being left doesn't it?
I didn't get the plug in, as I went to Jolly's and they were very very expensive, so wanted to try this first and if this had failed, I would of got one.

So anyway we have a happy Muttly and a happy Muttly Mum and Dad 

Just want to thank all you guys for your great advice, help and support, especially @silvi and @jamat for your messages


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## Geolgrad (Mar 17, 2013)

Brilliant news! Well done Muttly.
We've found that allowing Hera and Nyx the hallway, stairs and kitchen when we're out of the house has helped hugely with Nyx's SA. They have two blankets and a cushion each that is only used for when we're out. They now know that when they are put down in the kitchen its time to settle down for a few hours and have a snooze until we come home. Just wondering if you can do this on your sofa (save the poor cushions). Hes probably sleeping on there as that is what smells the most like you.


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## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

I am so pleased for you I had an idea that letting him sleep where he wanted downstairs may work glad it did seems he just hated being shut away in the kitchen wonderful news for you both and for Muttly


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

What I also did, was I brought his bed into the lounge next to my side of the sofa and put an old pillow in it (I have been using this pillow all week when sleeping down with him, so smelt of me lots) and he is actually using his bed again, even in the day when I have asked him to get down while I eat or something.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Geolgrad said:


> Brilliant news! Well done Muttly.
> We've found that allowing Hera and Nyx the hallway, stairs and kitchen when we're out of the house has helped hugely with Nyx's SA. They have two blankets and a cushion each that is only used for when we're out. They now know that when they are put down in the kitchen its time to settle down for a few hours and have a snooze until we come home. Just wondering if you can do this on your sofa (save the poor cushions). Hes probably sleeping on there as that is what smells the most like you.


He's always loved those cushions, they are a bit old and crap tbh and chewed on each edge  so I'm happy for him to sleep on them.


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## Westie Mum (Feb 5, 2015)

Thats great news ! Long may it continue  

Hopefully if he now feels like he isn't shut in somewhere then life will get back to normal for you and OH.


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## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

So pleased you have been able to reach a compromise that sounds like it is suiting all of you.


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

I haven't read all the replies towards the end, but will say your OH should consider himself lucky that you are willing to go through all of this because of his issues...

If he was mine he would have been told to put up and shut up...I can understand not wanting Muttly on the bed (Thai isn't allowed whilst we are asleep either) but personally I think he is being a bit of a spoilt child about everything else and you have gone above and beyond to help appease the situation.

It has taken my OH a few years to work out that the fluffs come first (to a point of course) and he knows that if he doesn't like it then the door is that way! Now if he has valid concerns then of course they will be considered...Thai was allowed on the bed at the beginning but the OH was getting kicked out so wasn't sleeping well, so Thai was evicted to his bed in the room so peace has been restored...but beyond that, he knows I am an animal person, I was an animal person before he met me so take me as I am, or not at all 


Sorry that isn't much help


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## lostbear (May 29, 2013)

Zaros said:


> Well, you're not alone there Muttles. Me and MrsZee have little to no tolerance of other people either, particularly the stupid and the ignorant, but we have all the time in the world for Zara and Oscar.
> One day when I stop being ignorant and MrsZee stops being stupid we'll all be able spend time in the same room together.
> 
> Remember, Life's a trade off - you know - give a little here take a little there - favours for favours and all that dastardly trickery - and I suspect imposing sanctions in the bedroom just might get you both singing from the same sheet.
> ...


You do make me laugh, Zed!

If Mrs Zee decides to re-home you, can I have first refusal? (BTW - you are neutered aren't you? I couldn't be bothered with all that posturing and leg-lifting all over the place.)


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## lostbear (May 29, 2013)

ellenlouisepascoe said:


> My husband is a total pain in the backside however I am lucky that the dogs and their impact on our lives is a joint decision. ( which I often get blamed for from friends family ) but my husband will quite willingly hold his hands up and say " Well actually keeping Shelby / Blue was my idea "
> 
> We do however have an agreement that the dogs have limits, I would say a good 80% of my time at home is spent on the dogs so we mutually agreed that they are not allowed upstairs to sleep with us and must stay downstairs.
> 
> ...


Agree with you about the "*You never know what situations could occur in the future where he may not be able to sleep in your bedroom / loose and it would be beneficial to get him used to that." *bit. Our dogs always slept on the bed, but when we had a couple who were very old (and - er, LEAKY) it was a real faff making sure that they were on incontinence blankets and washing them every day etc. I know we would have had to wash the bedding daily anyway, but we wouldn't have been sleeping in a urinal. I wished I'd never started the bed-sharing thing off.


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## lostbear (May 29, 2013)

lisa0307 said:


> My OH wouldn't have our dog sleep anywhere else but our bed...TBH I think it's because they both do smelly farts and he can blame it on the dog.


Do you sleep with a nose clip, like a synchronised swimmer? :Yuck


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## lostbear (May 29, 2013)

jamat said:


> before you do that do you know anyone with kids that might still have a stair gate stored away somewhere that you could borrow rather than paying for one and it not working as you mentioned you have to think about where you spend your money


Good advice - and if you do decide to get one, check the charity shops first. Barnardo's often has loads of stuff like that.


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## silvi (Jul 31, 2014)

Fantastic news @Muttly!
So glad that things seem to be working out and that you are all happier now....especially Muttly


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## Rott lover (Jan 2, 2015)

Happy dog happy life.I am glad to hear things are better.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

silvi said:


> Fantastic news @Muttly!
> So glad that things seem to be working out and that you are all happier now....especially Muttly


I feel so much better knowing that he is happy and ok now  Massive weight off my mind.


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

Rott lover said:


> Happy dog happy life.I am glad to hear things are better.


And, happy wife - happy life! 

My OH learned that a LONG time ago!


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## Rott lover (Jan 2, 2015)

Lurcherlad said:


> And, happy wife - happy life!
> 
> My OH learned that a LONG time ago!


I wasn't going to quote that since i thought everyone already knew that.


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

@Muttly so pleased to read your update and to know that you are all getting a good night's sleep.

It is so hard coping with different values when it comes to dogs, I utterly appreciate that as frankly I'd have Molly as my sleeping partner all the time, she snores an awful lot less than the OH 

Take care lovely


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

MollySmith said:


> @Muttly so pleased to read your update and to know that you are all getting a good night's sleep.
> 
> It is so hard coping with different values when it comes to dogs, I utterly appreciate that as frankly I'd have Molly as my sleeping partner all the time, she snores an awful lot less than the OH
> 
> Take care lovely


He he I'm a terrible snorer my OH has to tell me to stop, but Muttly doesn't mind as he sleep growls lol


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## Zaros (Nov 24, 2009)

lostbear said:


> You do make me laugh, Zed!
> 
> If Mrs Zee decides to re-home you, can I have first refusal? (BTW - you are neutered aren't you? I couldn't be bothered with all that posturing and leg-lifting all over the place.)


For the record;

Everything downstairs in the basement is in perfectly good working order  It may not be bargain basement to some but it's all there 

However, upstairs in the attic I'm afraid it's all a bit of a shambles and there aren't many who are brave enough to go there except, perhaps, a Priest or two.

'The power of Christ compels you!'

Who are they kidding? No one pulls that Big Brother room 101 malarky on me twice!


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