# 8month old border terrier scent marking in houses?



## Fi :-) (Feb 1, 2011)

Hi All

Just a quickie (I think). Mum's 8 month old border terrier, Hamish, who is housetrained, has recently discovered the joys of being a little boy and has cocked his leg and peed 3 times in other people's houses. Not big pees, just a little bit which is why I thought scent marking, also all these houses had other male dogs. 

He is fine in our house, and has been in another house where there are no other dogs and hasn't peed there. 

He is so quick with it, but last time he did it I did put him outside straight away because I couldnt think of what else to do! 

I haven't scolded him or anything because I don't agree with that, but the first time that he did it (I wasn't there) the owners of the house shouted at him and grabbed him and roughly chucked him outside by the scruff of his little neck 

Any advice?


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## Fi :-) (Feb 1, 2011)

This may be asking the impossible but Hamish has also just unfortunately had his first chase when he found a baby blackbird in the garden and chased the poor little thing around until it flew into the back door, completely ignoring my 'leave it' commands.

Thankfully I managed to grab him before he did any more damage and the chick managed to get back into the tree after a few minutes of recovery. 

Is there any way to desensitize a dog into not chasing animals and birds or is that going against instinct and asking way too much? 

PS - at the moment, he ignores rabbits and was scared of the guinea pig that I introduced him to last week!


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

Fi :-) said:


> Mum's 8-MO Border Terrier, Hamish, who is housetrained, has recently discovered the joys of being
> a little boy & has cocked his leg and peed 3 times in other people's houses. Not big pees... which is why
> I thought [it's] scent marking, also... these houses had other male dogs.
> He's fine in our house, &... in another house where there are no other dogs, [he] hasn't peed there.
> ...


* is he neutered? IF NOT i would suggest desex ASAP - like, yesterday. 

he's less than 4-mos from adulthood, he's a toy-breed & there are no 'joint-issue' red-herrings to delay 
his neutering; *getting it done immediately* avoids the even-higher testosterone peak at 9-to-10-MO, 
when he secretes more male-juices than any adult-dog of his size. *that peak exacerbates 
any problematic male-pattern behavior - like M:M posturing displays, aggro, hump, flirt, etcetera.* 
if he's not going to be bred, the sooner, the better. *if he is going to be bred, U need to step up Ur 
behavioral management & training so that he continues to be a well-behaved, polite, welcome guest - 
& neighbor, whether indoors or out.* :yesnod:

* prevention is key - the more times he does it, the faster & more habitual his marking.

since he's so small, even having him ON LEASH does not guarantee that his minder could catch him *before* 
he leg-lifts, while he's still thinking about it, & pre-empt the pee by interrupting him; also, interruptions 
such as tugging him away from that door-jamb, table-leg, sofa-corner, etc, can simply result in him peeing 
where he stands - which is exceedingly difficult for the HANDLER to see, altho the householder may see it instantly 
& be immediately upset. :nonod:

for an immediate solution - 
* carry him at all times in other dog-homes; he is either in Ur arms, or on Ur lap; no exceptions.

for future prevention - 
* buy 2 belly-bands [all cotton, fully-enclosed elastic] - one to wash & one to wear. 
anytime he's in a potentially-tempting indoor setting, or even at the local fair, have him wear one. 
carry 2 spare peel-N-press panty-liners, No perfume/deodorant, & the spare belly-band, if U like. 
he's only "nude" when he's in a place where he can mark without worry - no postcard-carousels, 
display-tables, strangers' trousers, sofas, etc.

the panty-liners are changed whenever they're damp [check them when he is taking a potty-break] 
or at minimum, once every 24-hours, to limit bacteria growth. :001_smile:


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

Fi :-) said:


> ...Hamish has also just unfortunately had his first chase when he found a baby blackbird in the garden
> and chased the poor little thing around until it flew into the back door, completely ignoring my 'leave it' commands.
> [SNIP]
> Is there any way to desensitize a dog into not chasing animals & birds or is that going against instinct & asking way too much?


how good is his Leave-it under other circs - like something not moving, a bit of hotdog on the floor, 
a ball sitting on the grass, etc? How well-proofed is it? he's only 8-MO, & i would bet this is not a fluent, 
well-proofed behavior. Yelling a cue that is not well-proofed while the dog is under intense distraction 
is pretty-much a hopeless endeavor - even a well-proofed cue can crumble under heavy stress.

* he's a TERRIERRRRIST - he reacts to movement & sound, he is varminty.

it is possible to TRAIN a dog to leave potential-prey, but first the dog cannot be allowed to practice chasing. 
that means he has to be leashed in the yard until U **know** that there are no potential victims: 
police the yard before turning him out, OR leash him & police the yard for stray targets with him.

don't count on his puppyish _'i'm scared'_ to save future Guinea-pigs from assault, & bunnies are not 
going to stay on his ignore-list for long, IMO.


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## Fi :-) (Feb 1, 2011)

He isn't neutered and he isn't going to be used for breeding. He's my mum's dog so I will suggest neutering to her - she does intend to have him done but was waiting until he was mature because we had heard stories about neutering too early causing problems with growth and causing dogs to retain puppy-like characteristics etc.

His leave it command is generally very good with food, tissues and the like but we've never before had the need to use it around animals and you are right that we haven't proofed it well enough around distractions. 

I have a pet cockatiel which he is not particularly interested in - not that I ever let her out of her cage if he is around. I guess the temptation of this little chick was just too much for him. 

I'm just not sure that I can ever offer anything as a reward which is of a high enough value that will keep him from chasing small furry or feathery things.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

Fi :-) said:


> I'm just not sure that I can ever offer anything as a reward which is of a high enough value that will keep him
> from chasing small furry or feathery things.


offer alternative activities - especially Premack. One sample: 
YouTube - ‪CU: Snap demos relaxing on mat and off-switch game‬‏

this is a typical-terrierrrist being rewarded for lying calmly on a mat; NOTICE she gets extremely picky, 
going not just for 'all 4 on the mat', or 'lie over on one hip, not in Sphinx-pose', but soft blinky-eyes, 
a STILL tail, etc - details do matter.  _Control Unleashed_ is an excellent book which explains this & other 
training techniques at length; the local library may have it, or if not, can BORROW it from another library - 
it does not get much cheaper. :001_smile:

his reward is to chase & catch a fake-foxtail on a flirt-pole. Similarly, it is easy to develop a manic devotion 
to a tug-toy, like a ball-on-a-rope, which can be seen from a distance & whipped out as a competitor 
for his attention, BEFORE he starts chasing. A long-line is Ur best friend until he is well & thoroughly trained, 
& then well-proofed under distraction.

remember: distractions MULTIPLY, they do not add. 
2 distractions [park + squirrel] = *4 times* as hard as at-home with no squirrel.

also, according to Terry's mathematical law of behavior: 
_the likelihood of the dog complying is the square of the distance between handler & dog._
the closer the dog is to U, the more likely U are to get compliant behavior.  feel free to credit me.


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## Fi :-) (Feb 1, 2011)

That is a brilliant clip! I haven't done much Premack training, but I've been reading up on it and it does sound excellent. I'll definitely give this a good shot and I'll get a furry toy that he can play with if he is calm. 

Thank you!


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