# Breeding hamsters



## lucy93

Hi, I want to breed my hamsters, I am yet to get a girlie hamster but have a 7 month old male, I know you shouldnt breed the girlies untill they are about 4 months but by then my male hamster will be 11 months, will he be ok to mate still. I am a first time breeder as you may have guessed, Tips and advice will be very much appreciated. 

Thankyou

Lucy93

Oh and they are syrian hamsters just to let you know


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## Guest

Hi, I dont know nothing about breeding hamsters but im sure someone on here does and can help you when they see your thread.


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## lucy93

Thanks, im sure there is a few people that know about it, ive read a lot online and I just want to be so careful because my mums lilac hamster got an infection in her womb and had to be put to sleep because of it after she had babies but she was about a year old i think


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## Petitepuppet

lucy93 said:


> Hi, I want to breed my hamsters, I am yet to get a girlie hamster but have a 7 month old male, I know you shouldnt breed the girlies untill they are about 4 months but by then my male hamster will be 11 months, will he be ok to mate still. I am a first time breeder as you may have guessed, Tips and advice will be very much appreciated.
> 
> Thankyou
> 
> Lucy93
> 
> Oh and they are syrian hamsters just to let you know


Can I ask why you want to breed your hamster? Are these pet shop hamsters or did you get them from a breeder?


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## lucy93

Petitepuppet said:


> Can I ask why you want to breed your hamster? Are these pet shop hamsters or did you get them from a breeder?


I got my hamster from a pet shop. And i want to breed them because I love hamsters, I want to become a hamster breeder for a hobby and plus il get a lil cash too but mainly its because I love hamsters


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## Petitepuppet

lucy93 said:


> I got my hamster from a pet shop. And i want to breed them because I love hamsters, I want to become a hamster breeder for a hobby and plus il get a lil cash too but mainly its because I love hamsters


Not sure that there would be much money to be made from breeding hamsters. I would suggest finding a reputable breeder and discussing it with them and then source some well bred, healthy hammys. I would not breed a pet shop animal.


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## lucy93

Petitepuppet said:


> Not sure that there would be much money to be made from breeding hamsters. I would suggest finding a reputable breeder and discussing it with them and then source some well bred, healthy hammys. I would not breed a pet shop animal.


Its ok ive read up on it all anyways and I dont really want to do it for cash, I dont exactly need the cash, just a hobby and I love hamsters, plus I know people who have bred pet shop hamsters, and i am going to give the hamsters my full attention and care plus ive had my hamster and will have my girl hamster checked out at the vets before I breed them so I do know what I am doing, just want people who have experinced it and what its like to breed hamsters


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## Petitepuppet

I suggest you read the part about why pet shop hamsters shouldnt be bred from.

Syrian hamster breeder


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## noushka05

lucy93 said:


> I got my hamster from a pet shop. And i want to breed them because I love hamsters, I want to become a hamster breeder for a hobby and plus il get a lil cash too but mainly its because I love hamsters


sorry to say this but its really irresponsible to be breeding from petshop hams, they mostly come from awful rodent farms many of which will be interbred...and you have no idea of their ancestry..., ive just rescued 4 unwanted hammies because they are being churned out by all and sundry to make a bit of money its so sad....if you are serious about breeding why not contact reputable breeder and do it properly with quality animals,...you really do have to be careful you should never just stick one ham together with another without knowing their background, the white bellied gene is lethal, breeding satin to satin also a lethal gene theres probably other big No No's i dont know enough about it.

also breeding carries big risks for both mother and babies as your Mum found out so why not just enjoy your little hammy as a pet


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## CheekoAndCo

I've just had a litter of hammies 2 weeks ago (not me personaly but you know lol ) and you will make hardly any money if any. In general I don't agree with breeding unless you know the history of the hamsters but I was able to find out mine including age grandparents etc lived to so I was happy enough to go ahead. 

I'm keeping 2 of the babies because 1 is the runt and has something wrong with her back leg and the other I was going to keep anyway. I've spent so much on them because I bought the best of everything while Phoebe was pregnant such as chicken, cheese, porridge, baby foods, some veggies so that she would have the best chance possible. Then I changed my usual bedding to something more expensive that is dust free so they weren't breathing in anything horrible. Of course mum will eat alot more too so hard food is alot more expensive than usual. Before they all go to their new homes they are all going to the vet to get a check over. I know alot of people probaly wouldn't do that but I want them to have the best start in life. That will easily be £15 so once you add it all up there is hardly anything to be made. And that's with a litter of 11!

You will also need atleast another 2 spare cages for the babies to go in once they are old enough to be seperated. It's best to have more incase of squabbles since syrians don't live together. Will you beable to keep them all if you can't get homes either? 

Phoebe had a big litter so of course it's taken it out of her so I've been helping her by syringing the babies milk (she trusts me enough to hold them once they were 10 days old) so that she can get a break. Would you be prepared for having to do the likes of that?

It's also not as simple as sticking 2 hamsters together because they can easily turn on eachother and if not supervised can lead to death. They may be a small animal but I thought of it the same way I would if I was to breed a dog because it's still a living thing.


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## Guest

I have bred hamsters since the 1990's and over 30 litters of hamsters from Syrians to winter whites...its not worth it trust me.

With the Syrians I ended up keeping over half the litter until they where 5 months old before owners came up.

Winter whites have really small litters sometimes one...or two. 

Its not worth it. It cost me £160 for my hamster at the vets after a nipple infection and a blocked milk duct she nearly ripped her own nipple off.

I have seen 4 litters eaten by mother and you have to have cages ready for however many dont sell....they cant be homed together!!! 

I ended up with some 15 cages while I found right homes for them. (one for each hamster and one for mother and father seperate as well as the cages I already had for rats and ferrets)

In the end I stopped having litters because it wasnt fair on the babies.
There are already too many hamsters around and that need homes. Just go to your local pet shop to see that...breeders become over run with none-seller and end up giving them away for free or even giving them to pet shops.

And to think they make money HAHAHAHAHA. Sorry.
You would sell them for £7 each max!
So for the however long they are with you, you have to:
-Buy cages for any left over.
-Feed a litter of 15 hamsters.
-Vet treatment for any.
-Bedding, sawdust and so on for them.

So its not making money....its losing money.


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## BattleKat

I agree with everything already said. 

I'm not against breeding hamsters because there aren't always enough in rescues and it's gives potential owners a better option than buying from a pet shop, but it needs to be done properly. 

You need to know the history of your hamsters so you'd need to a healthy breeding pair from an existing breeder.
You should also try and make sure you have homes ready for an average sized litter before you breed and have spare cages in case they're needed.

You need to be prepared to keep any that are born with birth defects (and, for that matter, any that you don't find homes for) and have enough money saved to deal with any vets bills that may arise.

I'd also do a lot of research in to breeding because I know some types of hamsters just can not be bred with each other. 

If you're doing it for your love of hamsters then it will cost you more than you make because you'll be properly caring for them. 

I'd also suggest joining a hamster breeding forum to get some real advice, and when you breed your aim should be to get a litter of healthy hamsters with good temperaments. Don't just breed willy nilly.


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## Daisymoo

shetlandlover said:


> I have bred hamsters since the 1990's and over 30 litters of hamsters from Syrians to winter whites...its not worth it trust me.
> 
> With the Syrians I ended up keeping over half the litter until they where 5 months old before owners came up.
> 
> Winter whites have really small litters sometimes one...or two.
> 
> Its not worth it. It cost me £160 for my hamster at the vets after a nipple infection and a blocked milk duct she nearly ripped her own nipple off.
> 
> I have seen 4 litters eaten by mother and you have to have cages ready for however many dont sell....they cant be homed together!!!
> 
> I ended up with some 15 cages while I found right homes for them. (one for each hamster and one for mother and father seperate as well as the cages I already had for rats and ferrets)
> 
> In the end I stopped having litters because it wasnt fair on the babies.
> There are already too many hamsters around and that need homes. Just go to your local pet shop to see that...breeders become over run with none-seller and end up giving them away for free or even giving them to pet shops.
> 
> And to think they make money HAHAHAHAHA. Sorry.
> You would sell them for £7 each max!
> So for the however long they are with you, you have to:
> -Buy cages for any left over.
> -Feed a litter of 15 hamsters.
> -Vet treatment for any.
> -Bedding, sawdust and so on for them.
> 
> So its not making money....its losing money.


I am just a bit puzzled as to why you did it for so long if it was as bad as that???  You must have enjoyed watching the babies grow and develop surely?


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## Guest

Daisymoo said:


> I am just a bit puzzled as to why you did it for so long if it was as bad as that???  You must have enjoyed watching the babies grow and develop surely?


Yeah, 
I enjoyed watch them grow and I also enjoyed (when they did sell) watching kids faces as they picked which they wanted.


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## momentofmadness

You only have to look on the rescue bit of rodents to realise no more babies need breeding at present..


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## Jazzy

momentofmadness said:


> You only have to look on the rescue bit of rodents to realise no more babies need breeding at present..


Agree entirely, there are enough animals in the world without homes without breeding any more.


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## noushka05

breeding any animal just because its enjoyable watching the babies developing is a really selfish reason to breed.... as has already been said theres far too many rodents being bred so many are ending up in rescues or worse....even babies get dumped ive rescued a 9wk old and a 12 wk old


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## CheekoAndCo

noushka05 said:


> breeding any animal just because its enjoyable watching the babies developing is a really selfish reason to breed.... as has already been said theres far too many rodents being bred so many are ending up in rescues or worse....even babies get dumped ive rescued a 9wk old and a 12 wk old


I was looking last night on free ads etc and there was loads of adverts for 9-14 week old hamsters looking for homes because kids had got bored  With my hammies the new owners will have to agree to contact me first if they can no longer keep it for whatever reason, be it 3 months old or 3 years old. I know it won't guarentee they will do it but atleast I know I'll have done the best for them. I had tears in my eyes last night thinking about the fact they will be off to new homes soon


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## noushka05

CheekoAndCo said:


> I was looking last night on free ads etc and there was loads of adverts for 9-14 week old hamsters looking for homes because kids had got bored  With my hammies the new owners will have to agree to contact me first if they can no longer keep it for whatever reason, be it 3 months old or 3 years old. I know it won't guarentee they will do it but atleast I know I'll have done the best for them. I had tears in my eyes last night thinking about the fact they will be off to new homes soon


omg i know ive seen loads of similar ads in our local [email protected] adoption center aswell

aww well it sounds as tho youre doing your utmost to protect your baby hammies x


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## RetroLemons

As has already been pointed out small animals overrun rescues because there are so many, so unless you have true aims to help hamsters as a domesticated species then dont do it.

If you want a litter just for the enjoyment of raising baby hamsters, as lets face it babies are dead cute! Then you could look into fostering a pregnant hamster and raising said litter :thumbup:


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## CheekoAndCo

RetroLemons said:


> As has already been pointed out small animals overrun rescues because there are so many, so unless you have true aims to help hamsters as a domesticated species then dont do it.
> 
> If you want a litter just for the enjoyment of raising baby hamsters, as lets face it babies are dead cute! Then you could look into fostering a pregnant hamster and raising said litter :thumbup:


There isn't much raising to do anyway if you are totaly honest. I did have to bottlefeed some of mine because there was that many and Phoebe was exhausted but apart from that mummy hammy does all the work. All you need to do is give her food and water


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## Blitzgreen

CheekoAndCo said:


> *I've just had a litter of hammies* 2 weeks ago (not me personaly but you know lol ) and you will make hardly any money if any. In general I don't agree with breeding unless you know the history of the hamsters but I was able to find out mine including age grandparents etc lived to so I was happy enough to go ahead.
> 
> I'm keeping 2 of the babies *because 1 is the runt and has something wrong with her back leg* and the other I was going to keep anyway. I've spent so much on them because I bought the best of everything while Phoebe was pregnant such as chicken, cheese, porridge, baby foods, some veggies so that she would have the best chance possible. Then I changed my usual bedding to something more expensive that is dust free so they weren't breathing in anything horrible. Of course mum will eat alot more too so hard food is alot more expensive than usual. Before they all go to their new homes they are all going to the vet to get a check over. I know alot of people probaly wouldn't do that but I want them to have the best start in life. That will easily be ?15 so once you add it all up there is hardly anything to be made. And that's with a litter of 11!
> 
> You will also need atleast another 2 spare cages for the babies to go in once they are old enough to be seperated. It's best to have more incase of squabbles since syrians don't live together. Will you beable to keep them all if you can't get homes either?
> 
> Phoebe had a big litter so of course it's taken it out of her so I've been helping her by syringing the babies milk (she trusts me enough to hold them once they were 10 days old) so that she can get a break. Would you be prepared for having to do the likes of that?
> 
> It's also not as simple as sticking 2 hamsters together because they can easily turn on eachother and if not supervised can lead to death. They may be a small animal but I thought of it the same way I would if I was to breed a dog because it's still a living thing.


So you said dont breed any two hamsters together and you didnt and have still had problems? hmmm.... whats wrong with this? oh yeah either way you *could* have problems. I know for a fact if you never breed a female she will not live as long .i believe it is wrong not to breed a female hamster at least once in her life.

its very clear the person wanting to breed hamsters cares enough to ask for help so least goes wrong as possible. The person has made their mind up the best thing to do is help not say oh well all these bad things are going to happen you havent help at all and should be angry at yourselves.

heres basicly what you need to know

Give extra bedding and extra food for the hamster to make a nest where she will put the babies and store food for later and will eat more
The average time of pregnancy is 16 days
Feed the mother low fat milk soaked bread which will help the milk produce
Close to giving birth she will breathe faster and will be restless
After birth giving food high in protein to the mother will help her recover quicker
Do not disturb the nest the mother has made she will panick and eat the babies
Do not move the cage while birthing or till 14 days after birth
It is the most important not to touch or place your hand anywhere near the babies after birth for a minimum of 14 days for this may make the mother eat the babies.
The mother will eat the babies if she fears for their lives touching the babies may leave your scent on them and confuse the mother into thinking there from another.
Seperate babies before 6 weeks to make sure no breeding or fighting happens

And thats pretty much it.
________


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## Petitepuppet

Blitzgreen said:


> .i believe it is wrong not to breed a female hamster at least once in her life.


Well I feel very sorry for any hammies you own!


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## Guest

Blitzgreen said:


> I know for a fact if you never breed a female she will not live as long .i believe it is wrong not to breed a female hamster at least once in her life.


Can you show me these facts please? Like a official website or statistics please?

I have had females that I never bred live till 3 years old and females I bred live to 1....so I guess your facts are not for all?

Are you one of these that believes that any female dog should at least have 1 litter before spaying too?


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## Nicky10

My female syrian hamster lived to 3 and a half never bred from never even met a male. As far as I know they only live to 4 or so right? I'd like to see the stats on that too

You shouldn't breed any animal you don't know the history of for at least 5 generations and know and any health problems within those lines, what age the parents died at etc. Pet shop animals are inbred and are sick a lot of the time I would never breed from one. If I wanted to breed hamsters I would go to good breeders who breed for health and temperment and get some.


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## CheekoAndCo

A health problem that has now fixed itself due to her growing. Vet doesn't really know what the problem was but it seems to have fixed itself. Wonder how many people would pay bills for a 3 week old hamster at the vet rather than kill it  All her brothers and sisters are healthy as I get updates and pictures of them.

Imagine if I bred from Runty then also her 5 sisters were bred from, then the girls from all those litters and so on  I've been asked if I'm breeding Phoebe again or Runty as people really liked the babies but the answer is no. I'd never put Phoebe through that again, one is more than enough because she was so skinny and had an infected nipple after it all. Not that I'm suprised with 11 babies! And I'd never breed Runty as she was born with a problem. Do you think I should go breeding a hamster that was born with a leg problem since all females should be bred from!?!

You can breed from dogs that have been fully health tested and one of the pups could later end up with some awful health problem but it's a fact of life you can't test and know everything so there is always a risk of a problem when breeding! But atleast those who are responsible when it comes to breeding try and eliminate any problem that could happen with what they are breeding by researching and not just sticking 2 together.

Forgot to say if you seperated them at 6 weeks there would already be babies on the way for both mothers and the baby hamsters. 4 weeks maximum is the age they should be seperated at. My boys were seperated from mum at 3 and a half weeks and the girls 4 because the girls needed a bit more time with mum. Also feeding food high in protien before she gives birth is best as it seems doing this makes mum less likely to turn on the babies. Phoebe was fed cheese and chicken before I mated her to build her up and she had 11 happy, healthy babies.


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## Blitzgreen

Nicky10 said:


> My female syrian hamster lived to 3 and a half never bred from never even met a male. As far as I know they only live to 4 or so right? *I'd like to see the stats on that too*
> 
> *You shouldn't breed any animal you don't know the history of for at least 5 generations and know and any health problems within those lines*, what age the parents died at etc. Pet shop animals are inbred and are sick a lot of the time I would never breed from one. If I wanted to breed hamsters I would go to good breeders who breed for health and temperment and get some.


When did i even mention any stats? Do you even know every health status of your own family history and even if you did and did have illnesses in your family i bet you would still have children and hope for the best.
________
]


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## Nicky10

If there was a genetic illness in my family I would get tested for it if I had it I wouldn't have kids. 

You said a female had to have a litter but I've never seen any proof of that beyond the Victorians thinking wombs migrated and women went crazy if they didn't have a baby.


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## Jazzy

Blitzgreen said:


> So you said dont breed any two hamsters together and you didnt and have still had problems? hmmm.... whats wrong with this? oh yeah either way you *could* have problems. _I know for a fact if you never breed a female she will not live as long .i believe it is wrong not to breed a female hamster at least once in her life._
> 
> its very clear the person wanting to breed hamsters cares enough to ask for help so least goes wrong as possible. The person has made their mind up the best thing to do is help not say oh well all these bad things are going to happen you havent help at all and should be angry at yourselves.
> 
> heres basicly what you need to know
> 
> Give extra bedding and extra food for the hamster to make a nest where she will put the babies and store food for later and will eat more
> The average time of pregnancy is 16 days
> Feed the mother low fat milk soaked bread which will help the milk produce
> Close to giving birth she will breathe faster and will be restless
> After birth giving food high in protein to the mother will help her recover quicker
> Do not disturb the nest the mother has made she will panick and eat the babies
> Do not move the cage while birthing or till 14 days after birth
> It is the most important not to touch or place your hand anywhere near the babies after birth for a minimum of 14 days for this may make the mother eat the babies.
> The mother will eat the babies if she fears for their lives touching the babies may leave your scent on them and confuse the mother into thinking there from another.
> Seperate babies before 6 weeks to make sure no breeding or fighting happens
> 
> And thats pretty much it.


Well I don't know where you get your facts from because I've had hamsters for over 35 years now and they have all lived their normal life span and even longer in some cases and I have never bred a hamster in my life and would never do so.


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## Guest

Blitzgreen said:


> Have you got a few spare years and hamsters or are you a retard?


Arent you nice.......not.

We want to see the REAL proof because you posted this...



> I know for a fact if you never breed a female she will not live as long


So if you know for a fact then well....I would like to see this fact based proof.

And dont go all keyboard warrior on me, retard isnt a nice name and tbh I know many people who take offence to such a word.


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## CheekoAndCo

So you don't want to 'correct' me and tell me I'm wrong about leaving babies until 6 weeks old? 

And also would you breed from Runty who was born with a problem?

I can't find anything saying they live longer. I know in other rodents it can shorten their life so I can't see how this would be any different for hamsters. One of my guinea pigs that was bred from before I got her is so frail yet my other 3 girls who are the same age are big and chunky yet never had a litter in their life..!


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## Guest

CheekoAndCo said:


> So you don't want to 'correct' me and tell me I'm wrong about leaving babies until 6 weeks old?
> 
> And also would you breed from Runty who was born with a problem?
> 
> I can't find anything saying they live longer. I know in other rodents it can shorten their life so I can't see how this would be any different for hamsters. One of my guinea pigs that was bred from before I got her is so frail yet my other 3 girls who are the same age are big and chunky yet never had a litter in their life..!


If you disagree with him or ask questions he cant answer...YOUR A RETARD.
:lol::lol::lol::lol:


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## CheekoAndCo

shetlandlover said:


> If you disagree with him or ask questions he cant answer...YOUR A RETARD.
> :lol::lol::lol::lol:


Atleast I can give links saying they should removed well before 6 weeks etc :thumbup:


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## Blitzgreen

Jazzy said:


> Well I don't know where you get your facts from because I've had hamsters for over 35 years now and they have all lived their normal life span and even longer in some cases and *I have never bred a hamster in my life* and would never do so.


Read what you have written you have never breed a hamster so how would you know if it affects their life span. sorry if you think im harsh when i said retard but read what your putting its like english isnt even your first language
________


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## Blitzgreen

CheekoAndCo said:


> So you don't want to 'correct' me and tell me I'm wrong about leaving babies until 6 weeks old?
> 
> And also would you breed from Runty who was born with a problem?
> 
> I can't find anything saying they live longer. I know in other rodents it can shorten their life so I can't see how this would be any different for hamsters. One of my guinea pigs that was bred from before I got her is so frail yet my other 3 girls who are the same age are big and chunky yet never had a litter in their life..!


Technically hamsters can breed at 3 weeks of age and the longer you leave both sexes together the more likely they will breed so thats why i believe its better at 4 weeks but im not the law or god its only my advice.

Someone could say one thing others say another but the bottom line is this is a forum where people give thier opinions *GET IT?*
________


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## Starlite

Blitzgreen said:


> .i believe it is wrong not to breed a female hamster at least once in her life.


ive had hamsters since a small child and have to Russians (male and female in seperate cages), so thats a span of about 20yrs and i have never bred from them.

Where do you get this crap from? Do you think every bitch should have a litter too?
I dont think you can make such a sweeping statement without any facts and then wonder why people question you!


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## Amethyst

Some posts make for depressing reading ...

I really hope you don't go ahead and breed, for most all the reasons given. You have been given some wonderful advice form knowledgeable people, yet refuse to listen


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## CheekoAndCo

Blitzgreen said:


> Technically hamsters can breed at 3 weeks of age and the longer you leave both sexes together the more likely they will breed so thats why i believe its better at 4 weeks but im not the law or god its only my advice.
> 
> Someone could say one thing others say another but the bottom line is this is a forum where people give thier opinions *GET IT?*


Please answer my other question..

*Would you breed from a hamster like Runty who was born with a problem?*

Not long ago you said keep them together for 6 weeks now you are saying 4 

I'm not blind so there was no need for putting it in capitals. When it comes to breeding you should be giving facts not just what you think is right like every hamster should be bred from or keeping together for 6 weeks.

I don't think I'd want 11 babies sucking at me for 6 weeks


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## canuckjill

I'm sure that we know enough words not to name call. I don't have time to stay on and read the thread. So please keep the nasty names in your head and off the forum...Thank you


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## SophieCyde

I would really like to know where some people get their facts from on here 

For one thing theres big chance your hamster will die before or during mating , through pregnancy and having babies takes an awful lot out of them ...


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## zany_toon

Blitzgreen said:


> Read what you have written you have never breed a hamster so how would you know if it affects their life span. sorry if you think im harsh when i said retard but read what your putting its like english isnt even your first language


If you have always bred your hamsters, how do you know that *not* breeding affects their lifespan? I have a friend who had a hamster who lived to be 5 years old and she was never bred from. The age that a hamster lives to, like every other animal, is down to a range of factors including heritage, genetics, food, environment, care etc. I would also have thought that breeding every female hamster you have would lead to both an excessive number of babies to find homes for (as well as space for the numbers you cannot get homes for) and issues in having enough unrelated males to father the litter. That in turn, if the fathers are related to the mother, can in itself lead to health issues as inbreeding will cause multiple recessive traits to show.

Pregnancy also can cause numerous health problems. Many hamsters are lucky but there are always going to be ones who become seriously ill as a result of being pregnant - like the op's mother's hammie who developed a wonb infection. Proof in itself that pregnancy isn't something that should be taken on without a great deal of consideration, and motivation to "make a little cash" isn't something that should be used as the reason to breed. I understand that the OP said that this was one of her reasons for doing it, then changed her mind. If you are breeding the reasons for doing so should be perfectly clear in your head - e.g. for health, to improve a line, for better size. I will be very honest and admit that I bred my pet mice (I know, more than a few differences to hamsters :lol but I researched this for months and months before deciding to do so and my reason for doing so was to keep my original mouse sized family going and in part because it had taken me almost 2 years to find mice in my area. The mothers to both my litters lived to be the same age as the girls I didn't breed from (actually the ones who weren't bred from were older.) And breeding isn't something that I am likely to do again. I loved the experience, I love my mice, but the health issues that are showing (and I know the history of my mice back three generations up to the age they were bred from) are not ones that showed in the mice until much older - and they are inherited issues. My mice didn't develop these inherited tumours until around 18 months of age, which is well past the age they should have been bred from. Breeding any animal even knowing the history can lead to risks that you didn't know of. I wouldn't change what I did in breeding my beautiful boy and girls, but I wouldn't in all consciousness breed again knowing that their family has these health issues - and I wouldn't have know that they were inherited health issues if I hadn't kept all the babies from both litters. So that is something that needs to be considered as well.

I believe that plenty of information has been given to answer all the OPs original questions, and there are also plenty of accurate websites and acknowledged resources online (such as the hamster clubs and forums) that will provide her all the information she needs. If she does decide to breed, good luck. But I would certainly say that no one should ever consider breeding without having done months of research and consideration first to look at all the issues, benefits and costs.


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## CheekoAndCo

SophieCyde said:


> I would really like to know where some people get their facts from on here
> 
> For one thing theres big chance your hamster will die before or during mating , through pregnancy and having babies takes an awful lot out of them ...


As soon as the mating was over mine were trying to hurt eachother but because I knew what I was doing nothing happened between them.

Breeding doesn't expand the life if the animals dies during the pregnancy or birth. Does the total opposite so it's not something that should be taken on with little thought.


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## squeaker

Syrian hamsters are all descendents of a mother and 3 offspring, captured from the wild in the 1930's. I'd be interested to hear how, since then, they could become any more inbred than they already are?


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## RetroLemons

squeaker said:


> Syrian hamsters are all descendents of a mother and 3 offspring, captured from the wild in the 1930's. I'd be interested to hear how, since then, they could become any more inbred than they already are?


Interested to know where this information was found  Sorry since doing science I have referencing packed in my brain so i need to know


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## squeaker

Well, it's a widely known fact. I found this interesting page for you to read though and it does seem that there were possibly two later captures but with no apparent evidence of the fate of the descendents.

Welcome to the British Hamster Association Web Site


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## Blitzgreen

squeaker said:


> Syrian hamsters are all descendents of a mother and 3 offspring, captured from the wild in the 1930's. I'd be interested to hear how, since then, they could become any more inbred than they already are?


Whoa even i find that hard to believe im not saying your wrong because all the christains(i have no religion) that may be on here i mean there was only adam and eve and were not inbred surely:lol:
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## squeaker

HUH? what?


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## Nicky10

Don't feed the troll. 

I've heard that about syrians too thought it was common knowledge. Even going by science all Europeans are descended from 6 women based of mitochondrial DNA


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## Blitzgreen

squeaker said:


> HUH? what?


if inbredding causes genetic problems then that cant be true simple
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## Guest

Blitzgreen said:


> . sorry if you think im harsh when i said retard but read what your putting its like english isnt even your first language


Um, It was me you called a retard...and I have ALWAYS had hamsters and have kept some as pets and some to be bred. English is my first language though so dont worry about that.


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## Tanya1989

This poster seems to have a knack for creating trouble... been watching one or two posts today.


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## squeaker

I'm finding it difficult to work out what you are trying to say. 

Are you re-writing history?


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## Nicky10

Hence the don't feed the troll. It's just not worth it


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## Daisymoo

CheekoAndCo said:


> I don't think I'd want 11 babies sucking at me for 6 weeks


and yet you were quite happy for your hamster to have 11 babies sucking at her!!

The person who started this thread has already made the decision to breed her hamsters she is not asking for permission, no-one has the right to tell her she should or shouldn't breed her hamsters if she wants to, she is asking for advice from people who have already bred their hamsters.

For people to come on here and tell her she shouldn't breed when they have bred their own hamsters is just hypocritical!!!


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## squeaker

What do trolls eat lol. Our words it seems. Try to have a decent discussion... 

Hamsters are brilliant, i love them, they rock. Opinions are like arses. Every one has one !


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## Blitzgreen

Daisymoo said:


> and yet you were quite happy for your hamster to have 11 babies sucking at her!!
> 
> The person who started this thread has already made the decision to breed her hamsters she is not asking for permission, no-one has the right to tell her she should or shouldn't breed her hamsters if she wants to, she is asking for advice from people who have already bred their hamsters.
> 
> For people to come on here and tell her she shouldn't breed when they have bred their own hamsters is just hypocritical!!!


Daisymoo thats what i put. not in the same words but now im a bad guy because some people cant handle the true about them selfs
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## Daisymoo

I think this thread should be stopped now its getting way off the subject!!!


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## Guest

Daisymoo said:


> For people to come on here and tell her she shouldn't breed when they have bred their own hamsters is just hypocritical!!!


I think its more we are asking her not to because of the experiences we have been through by breeding.

There are already more than enough un-wanted hamsters in the world...its pretty hard to "sell" them too because every pet shop sells them.

Most people buy on impulse and the pet shop not only sells hamsters but cages and food....

If you see were I am going with this.

No one is telling her what to do but giving advice and their opinion.


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## Blitzgreen

Daisymoo said:


> I think this thread should be stopped now its getting way off the subject!!!


This is no longer about the subject its about flamming me which i have reported to a mod
________


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## squeaker

If someone wants to breed they are not breaking the law. Information about types which shouldn't be bred together for health reasons is great advice. Apart from that it is freedom of choice. Nobody has the monopoly on breeding surely.

I guess i hope that common sense prevails.


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## Daisymoo

Blitzgreen said:


> This is no longer about the subject its about flamming me which i have reported to a mod


Good for you !! Too many people on here like to dictate and then say they are only giving advice !!! saying things like "You should not breed" is not advice its telling them what to do!!


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## squeaker

I have bred hamsters and sold them. My experience is that people wold prefer a home bred hamster to a pet shop hamster, which has been handled well and will go to its new home a friendly, well adjusted pet.


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## Jazzy

Blitzgreen said:


> Read what you have written you have never breed a hamster so how would you know if it affects their life span. sorry if you think im harsh when i said retard but read what your putting its like english isnt even your first language


You really are pathetic aren't you. 

I never mentioned anything about you calling anybody a retard, I just took it you was a very ignorant being and chose to ignore it.
A Syrian hamsters lifespan is meant to be 2 - 2 1/2 years and sometimes they do actually get to 3 or 4 but they are old and don't have a great quality of life after 2 or 3 years. Breeding them will not make any difference at all except to add to the every increasing numbers of animals in rescue and if that's what you are happy to do then so be it, your not worth even bothering answering to be honest.


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## Jazzy

Blitzgreen said:


> This is no longer about the subject its about flamming me which i have reported to a mod


From what you put on my post you deserve everything you get - report me too if you want.


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## Guest

Blitzgreen - The only flaming on this thread was you calling me a retard which was reported to a mod and has since been dealt with by the post being removed.
I don't see any other flaming going on...

Daisymoo - I have not said "don't breed" I don't know if anyone else has but I have not my advice was that it wasn't worth it. Regardless of what is posted on here the OP will do what she thinks is right or what she wants to do and will learn for herself if its worth continuing once she has had a first litter.


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## Nicky10

I'd assume I got reported oh well.


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## Jazzy

shetlandlover said:


> Blitzgreen - The only flaming on this thread was you calling me a retard which was reported to a mod and has since been dealt with by the post being removed.
> I don't see any other flaming going on...
> 
> Daisymoo - I have not said "don't breed" I don't know if anyone else has but I have not my advice was that it wasn't worth it. Regardless of what is posted on here the OP will do what she thinks is right or what she wants to do and will learn for herself if its worth continuing once she has had a first litter.


Well apparently I'm a 'retard' too now and I've reported it.


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## Guest

Jazzy said:


> Well apparently I'm a 'retard' too now and I've reported it.


He/She originally quoted me when I asked for stats and called me a retard.

I thought this thread was rather calm and polite until then....:confused1:


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## Daisymoo

shetlandlover said:


> Blitzgreen - The only flaming on this thread was you calling me a retard which was reported to a mod and has since been dealt with by the post being removed.
> I don't see any other flaming going on...
> 
> Daisymoo - I have not said "don't breed" I don't know if anyone else has but I have not my advice was that it wasn't worth it. Regardless of what is posted on here the OP will do what she thinks is right or what she wants to do and will learn for herself if its worth continuing once she has had a first litter.


I didn't say you in particular had said "don't breed" but other people have they have said things like this quote for example

"I really hope you don't go ahead and breed, for most all the reasons given. You have been given some wonderful advice form knowledgeable people, yet refuse to listen"

Telling someone that "they refuse to listen" is in my opinion dictating!!!


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## squeaker

Can i just ask? And this is a serious question. I am afterall a very welfare conscious person.

If nobody bred hamsters ever again, the problem with unwanted hamsters would certainly end. But would hamster owners be happy that this species likely became extinct as a pet and never owned one again?

It surely cannot be that just because you breed, you are contributing to the unwanted population of hamsters. Unless it can be proved that your particular hamster/s were the ones that ended up in rescue?

As it so often does, it seems to be that the probable answer lies in responsible ownership rather than not breeding the hamsters in the first instance.


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## Jazzy

shetlandlover said:


> He/She originally quoted me when I asked for stats and called me a retard.
> 
> I thought this thread was rather calm and polite until then....:confused1:


Yes it was but this person thinks if we don't agree that breeding hamsters is the way to go them we are retarded.


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## Nicky10

I don't have a problem with ethical breeding of hamsters. Same as dogs if we stopped breeding dogs you'd end up with very few dogs around


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## Guest

Daisymoo said:


> I didn't say you in particular had said "don't breed" but other people have they have said things like this quote for example
> 
> "I really hope you don't go ahead and breed, for most all the reasons given. You have been given some wonderful advice form knowledgeable people, yet refuse to listen"
> 
> Telling someone that "they refuse to listen" is in my opinion dictating!!!


Possibly yes but thats the thing with open forums...you will get everyones opinions. I know I have many times mistyped something and it has been taken wrong....

Regardless of what anyone puts on here the OP will decide what she wants to do. All we can do is voice our opinion and advice.

If you get what I mean.


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## Daisymoo

squeaker said:


> I have bred hamsters and sold them. My experience is that people wold prefer a home bred hamster to a pet shop hamster, which has been handled well and will go to its new home a friendly, well adjusted pet.


I totally agree :thumbup:


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## noushka05

squeaker said:


> Can i just ask? And this is a serious question. I am afterall a very welfare conscious person.
> 
> If nobody bred hamsters ever again, the problem with unwanted hamsters would certainly end. But would hamster owners be happy that this species likely became extinct as a pet and never owned one again?
> 
> It surely cannot be that just because you breed, you are contributing to the unwanted population of hamsters. Unless it can be proved that your particular hamster/s were the ones that ended up in rescue?
> 
> As it so often does, it seems to be that the probable answer lies in responsible ownership rather than not breeding the hamsters in the first instance.


I dont think anyone has said that no one should breed hamsters, just that if you do then do it as ethically and responsibly as possible, reputable breeders wont breed from petshop hammies or soley to supply an already oversaturated pet market, people should also be aware that their pets could lose their life! ...pregnancy can be very dangerous and ive seen on the hamster forum i go one quite a few incidence where the female has died...so is it really worth taking the risk :confused1: ,.also some coat types and coat colours carry lethal genes you shouldnt breed any animal if you dont know its ancestry.


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## noushka05

squeaker said:


> I have bred hamsters and sold them. My experience is that people wold prefer a home bred hamster to a pet shop hamster, which has been handled well and will go to its new home a friendly, well adjusted pet.


i wouldnt recommend buying from a petshop either nor from anyone who dosent know the background of their hamsters, people can find reputable breeders on the regional links on the the hamster council website

Home - National Hamster Council


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## Guest

noushka05 said:


> I dont think anyone has said that no one should breed hamsters, just that if you do then do it as ethically and responsibly as possible, reputable breeders wont breed from petshop hammies or soley to suppy an already oversaturated pet market, people should also be aware that their pets could lose their life! ...pregnancy can be very dangerous and ive seen on the hamster forum i go one quite a few incidence where the female has died...so is it really worth taking the risk :confused1: ,.also some coat types and coat colours carry lethal genes you shouldnt breed any animal if you dont know its ancestry.


Wise advice! Tinkerbelle is 4 years old in February, Princess unfortunately was only 2, Honey was 4, Willow was 3 and none of them had a litter. I wouldn't consider putting my girls at risk for anything...it's not worth it 

If I wanted another hammy I'd get one from the local pet store...a breeder would have to be very good if I am going to get a hammy! I agree with above posts it's just not worth it. But if the op is determined to do it anyway I'd advise buying a book and using google


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## CheekoAndCo

Whoever said I was happy to have 11 babies sucking at her. I didn't know how many she was going to have and if you know about hamster breeding then you would know you can't remove them from mum until they are older. That's why from the day she would let me I started hand feeding them to give her a break!

Anyone who got a baby from me did so because they didn't trust pet shops. They wanted a home bred hamster who had been handled daily so were much less likely to bite. I also told them they must contact me first if they are unable to keep a hamster.

I simply told the OP my experiance and costs involved. Yes she's probaly went away and bred the litter because she wants to breed but you can't stop someone from doing it. I just hope her hamsters aren't white bellied otherwises she could end up with lethals.

The troll still hasn't answered my question funnily enough!!


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## BattleKat

Buster's Mummy said:


> If I wanted another hammy I'd get one from the local pet store...a breeder would have to be very good if I am going to get a hammy!


can I just ask why you'd buy from a pet store?
Surely a breeder is better than pet stores which usually source from rodent farms?


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## squeaker

Rodent farms is an interesting term to use. One which is used rather loosely i feel. 

Has anyone any evidence of a rodent farm in THIS country either treating their animals badly OR not being genetically aware? Where is this evidence coming from. And i don't want to see anymore pictures of the place in the Netherlands thanks. In this country, who has the proof of this irresponsible breeding?

Oh and just for the record, i hate the way pets are bred in such volume for pet shops. I just feel that i would like to see some evidence of the accusations made.


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## Amethyst

BattleKat said:


> Surely a breeder is better than pet stores which usually source from rodent farms?


My thoughts too, I would much rather buy from someone who breeds and belongs to one of the hamster clubs than a pet shop. Buy from a pet shop and it's like buying from a puppy mill. Simply replace the word puppy with rodent 

Better still, take the rescue option if you can :thumbup:


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## BattleKat

squeaker said:


> Rodent farms is an interesting term to use. One which is used rather loosely i feel.
> 
> Has anyone any evidence of a rodent farm in THIS country either treating their animals badly OR not being genetically aware? Where is this evidence coming from. And i don't want to see anymore pictures of the place in the Netherlands thanks. In this country, who has the proof of this irresponsible breeding?
> 
> Oh and just for the record, i hate the way pets are bred in such volume for pet shops. I just feel that i would like to see some evidence of the accusations made.


I can't show you but my brother works in an animal feed centre and they can buy animals if they like. 
He showed me the brochures they sent him and while it wasn't as bad as some of the things I'd seen online the cages were still horrendously small with no enrichment and they only mentioned genetics when it came to the pygmy jerboas which indicates there is no concern for genetics with the other animals.

either way, my point was more that I'd like to see where my animals came from and be happy with it than to buy from a pet store and have no real idea. Just surprised me that someone would rather buy from a pet shop is all.


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## squeaker

Oh,i appreciate what you are saying and i agree. Just that a lot of people appear to quite loosely make reference to rodent farms that imply a level of cruelty. And, although i don't agree with this method of supplying any pets, i haven't seen any evidence that proves anything other than it's not to everyones' taste.

One problem as i have previously stated, is that these places do not have to be licensed as they are not selling pets, they are selling products and until the authorities recognise that they are one and the same, they remain unregulated as a business. They do though, have to adhere to general welfare legislation.

Absolutely every time, i know that a rodent, bred by someone who is going to care affectionately and handle said offspring, is going to be a more relaxed, content, handleable pet when sold or homed, which in turn may well have a marked impact on its health status. A stressed pet can very easily become a sick pet. Hence, so many pet shop sold Syrian Hamsters succumbing to Wet Tail.

Any pet shop hamsters i have ever bought have bounced off the walls (figure of speech) when brought home and although i tamed them, its off puting for anyone having bought one and stressful for the pet concerned.

It's a vicious circle unfortunately. One which could be improved in time.
Pet vending guidelines are to be updated in the near future.


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## happysaz133

The only thing about hamster breeders is they can be few and far between. I have never found a proper hamster breeder in the Highlands, so all mine had to come from pet shops.


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## CheekoAndCo

happysaz133 said:


> The only thing about hamster breeders is they can be few and far between. I have never found a proper hamster breeder in the Highlands, so all mine had to come from pet shops.


I think thats true for alot of small animals. Other than PAH or possibly on a rare occasion a rescue I wouldn't know where to get degus when I decide to get them because I've not came across any breeders. Not that I've really looked because I'm not getting them just now.

With the guinea pigs from now on mine will most likely always be from the free ads because after Ginger I want to help others like him but my friends sister shows guinea pigs so if I wanted a certain type I'd go to her.


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## BattleKat

happysaz133 said:


> The only thing about hamster breeders is they can be few and far between. I have never found a proper hamster breeder in the Highlands, so all mine had to come from pet shops.


I think it's fair enough if you've tried to find a breeder and couldn't.

I keep mice and it's unusual to find them full stop so if it was a choice of pet shop where I didn't know the history or no mice I'd go for pet shop too. I always try free ads and rescues then breeders then pet shops as a last resort though.


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## squeaker

It is incredible how things change. You mention not finding mice easily. Its true. Not many pet shops stock them now and if they do its often hairless mice i've seen.

The traditional pets we all grew up with are still around but we have seen a massive increase in more exotic species, even the mammals. Rabbits, guinea pigs, hamsters.... all still there.... but now people are shopping for accessories for Pygmy Hedgehogs, Sugar Gliders and Meerkats for example.

I love the Syrian Hamster and it would be very sad to see few of them around.


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## thatspicegirl

I bred my hamsters once years ago and it was a very successful breed. Rooney was the mama (Robbie was the father), and she took great care of her babies - had 10 (I couldn't believe 10 little babies were all smooshed inside that small belly of hers!), and all 10 survived and grew up nicely. We separated the boys from girls a few weeks later, and found homes for them of people we knew personally. We were very happy how it all turned out.

So I suppose if you wanna breed your hammies, make sure you know where they're going to end up and that you can guarantee good homes for them.


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## squeaker

One of mine had 15 babies!!! Spider Momma she was called. Cos she was a real climber like spiderman. All over the place. 15 !!!


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## thatspicegirl

^It's amazing they can fit 15 of those little things in their tiny bellies!


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