# ill kitten



## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi our kitten lilly seems very ill,we have had her for 8 days and when we got her we were told she was 7 weeks old now we have found out she was about 4 or 5 weeks old ,she seems very weak and only eating small amounts of food and she is always on our lap ,we took her to the vets on friday and she siad she was a healthy kitten but looking at her i dont think so,she is very thin and sleeps all the time ,she was perkie this morning but now she is the same as yesterday.any help please


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## tordis (Nov 10, 2009)

Small kittens sleep a lot, so the fact that she does that is not something you should be very worried about. Any other signs of her not being well?


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## katiefranke (Oct 6, 2008)

kittens are funny little things, they tend to be full of life one minute and then zonked out completely the next second, especially when young and tired through all the upheaval of going to a new home etc.

as tordis said, are there any other signs of the kitty being unwell? is she eating and toileting ok? does she seem alert when she is awake?

kittens are very tiny and soon get much bigger, its amazing how quickly they grow!

did the vet confirm that the kitten is much younger than you thought? or did you just think she might be younger due to her being so small?


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## jill3 (Feb 18, 2009)

I agree with the other two. Little kittens do sleep a lot especially if only 4 or 5 weeks old.
They also like to be fed small amounts about 4 or 5 times a day. They only have tiny tummies so little and often.
Just keep a check when she goes to the loo that she has not got an up set tum. It's quite common in kittens.
Also when you she goes to bed she might like a small soft toy to snuggle up to. She might be missing her siblings and also a soft toy will keep her warm.
That's nice that she sits on your lap for a cuddle. After all you are her mum now!


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi thanks for your advice,she's not very alert and the vet thought when we got her she was about 4 or 5 weeks old ,she goes to the loo ok but she does'nt groom herself and when she does go to bed she goes very close to the radiator then goes in her bed,sge is eating a little at a time we are feeding her white fish a tuna ,is this ok ?.when we first got her we were feeding her complete kitten food.


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## HoneyFern (Aug 27, 2009)

Tuna has a very high salt content so it's not great for kittens.

Where did you get her from? Didn't you realise she was small for '7 weeks'. Cats that age still rely on their mother's milk, she's missed out on vital nurishment and also socialisation. Is she on her own? You'll probably find as she gets older she'll be quite grabby and won't know when to stop playing - they learn limits from their parents and siblings.


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## Matrix/Logan (May 7, 2009)

To be honest the white fish and tuna diet could be the cause of her lethergy, they are both very bland and lacking in much energy providing nutrients.

I would try and get her onto a complete kitten food as soon as possible and you should hopefully see her energy levels increase. Also as other people have said kittens spend a lot of time asleep at this age, like 20 hours a day!!!

As for sleeping next to the radiator, she may be feeling the cold for a couple of reasons, one .... she is lacking fat in her diet, fat produces energy, energy produces warmth! And two.......... if she was still with mum and the other kittens she would be snuggled in the middle of a 'kitty ball' (LOL) so try puting a warm hot water bottle and some cuddly toys in a snuggly kitten bed and you should find her happily using that instead.

Hope she gets on ok.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

we did'nt know she was that young ,the person we got her from did'nt tell us the truth and we have another kitten of 8 weeks old and a kitten of 4mouths.


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

being as she is only 4-5 weeks old she obviously was taken away from her mum far too young. the not being able to groom herself must be an indication of this.


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## katiefranke (Oct 6, 2008)

oh poor little thing - I am afraid I dont know much about caring for kittens at this young an age as I have always got them from 8 weeks onwards...but as the others said she will be seeking warmth from her mum and siblings...get her onto the kitten food as soon as pos and yes she might not be able to groom or look after herself properly yet.

I think your best bet would be to get some advice from the people in the breeding section perhaps and explain the situation and ask them how to care for a kitten of this age who has left its mother way to early... or maybe on the cat chat bit and ask if anyone has had to hand rear a kitty?

good luck with her - at least she will have your other kitties to play with etc and she grows a little.


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## tordis (Nov 10, 2009)

I agree with what's been said about food: try and get her onto complete kitten food, you may want to give her some kitten milk, too. At such a young age, it's normal that she eats little and often. Unfortunately, I don't know what could help her start grooming, but perhaps your vet would know?
Cats like warm places, so sleeping next to the radiator is nothing out of the ordinary. The fact that she's not very alert may be a bad sign, though. Does she play with your other cats or is she always lethargic and sleepy?


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

she does'nt play with the other kitten and she's not very active


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## tordis (Nov 10, 2009)

You might want to take her to the vet again, then - possibly a different one, to get a second opinion. Even kittens taken away from their mothers too early should have bursts of activity from time to time.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

yeah she is going to the vets today at 3.30pm will keep you all posted ,she is a great little kitten and i hope she will be ok.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

I am sure she will be but there are a few things to change as others have suggested.

Get her onto a good quality wet (not dry) food, something with a minimum of 45% meat. The white fish whilst ok for a day or two to settle a tummy is not a complete diet, and will cause problems if fed as a long term diet. Tuna should only ever be fed as a treat and not to such a young baby.

Give her a heat pad, wrapped hot water bottle, microwave teddy to sleep with, kittens of this age struggle to adequatly maintain their temperature.

I would also be tryin to supplement her diet with some kitten milk replacement formula. At 4 weeks you would begin weaning, but its not ideal to be totally mum milk free. If she will lap it from a saucer then brilliant, if not an eye dropper works well.

Good luck at the vets, i hope she is ok.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

we had to leave lilly at the vets and he has said it does'nt look very good ,we have to ring him tomorrow around 10.30 am ,we all hwvw our fingers crossed and the house is very quite now,i know we only had her for 9 days but there are tears in my eyes.


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## Daisyandchlo (Feb 27, 2010)

Bless her. Fingers tightly crossed for her, here :smile5:


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

will keep everything crossed. Has he given you any indication as to what he thinks is wrong?


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

we we were told from the person we got her from that she was 8 weeks old but we have found out she was 5 weeks old and we are not vey happy about it we shall be speaking to the this person,but in the end we could of walked away,and thanks you all for your support.the vet said she was to young to leave her mother ,we are very mad with ourselves .we shall not make the same mistake again.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

has the vet given a diagnosis?


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

Poor little paws  hope she's ok everything crossed here for her x


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Why is the vetting keeping her in? Just to rehydrate her or what? Am I the only one thinking a kitten this young needs feeding every few hours (if necessary force feeding with a syringe). Does this vets practice have someone on site 24-7 ? 

Please keep us posted. 

All the best for you and your kitten.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

Tje said:


> Why is the vetting keeping her in? Just to rehydrate her or what? Am I the only one thinking a kitten this young needs feeding every few hours (if necessary force feeding with a syringe). Does this vets practice have someone on site 24-7 ?
> 
> Please keep us posted.
> 
> All the best for you and your kitten.


no your not alone.

I am expecting that the vet is keeping her in to rehydrate on a drip and syringe feed, but as the op hasnt given us the diagnosis yet we cant know for sure.

Early weaning at 4-5 weeks can be done. Its not ideal but sometimes its necessary. However, early weaning at this age doesnt mean they go without formula, it just means they are without mum.

A high quality wet food coupled with formula when she comes home should see her right. She also would need the solid food a minimum of 5 times a day and the milk as often in between.


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## Baby British (Jan 24, 2010)

Hope kitty is ok. Thinking of you x


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

billyboysmammy said:


> no your not alone.


What worries me… (had a few "touch and go" kittens around the 4, 5 and 6 week mark, but generally never heavier than about 350g) and I have found the best way to feed them is literally every 2 hours. I always try to syringe in 10ml Hill A.D and 5ml kitten milk every 2-3 hours, more if they'll take it. I just wonder (worry) if this kitten will get round the clock feeding at a vet's practice. 

To the OP…. do ask what they are doing at the vets, what the diagnosis is, and do they have 24 hour cover.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

its funny how we do things differently! I always alternated the feeds , and tbh i have never used hills AD (well not for a long long long time since i was at the vets!), but still its the same principle. 

I often find you dont have to syringe/finger feed the food after the first couple of days, and some kittens will take the milk from a saucer (again more after the first few days). But to start its offering the food on finger (or liquidising to syringe) and formula milk in a dropper/bottle/syringe. 

Most vets now do have 24 hour cover when they have inpatients, so fingers crossed. The nurses will be doing everything they can, of that i am sure!


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

billyboysmammy said:


> Most vets now do have 24 hour cover when they have inpatients, so fingers crossed. The nurses will be doing everything they can, of that i am sure!


Oh great to hear that most vets have 24 hr coverage, that was really worrying me.

You know, Ive never even thought of alternating solids and milk something works and you just stick to it and never think further than that. I will definitely try it next time I have a touch-and-go weaning age kitten. (I have never had any proper training though, and the places we have lived many/most of them dont even have proper shelters to coach or mentor you, so I just kind of muddle along on my own, but now we're back in the civilised world I hope I can learn better ways)

Hills AD has been a lifesaver for me (well for the rescues obviously). I just find it so easy to get it on to them. I think next time I am just going to try my new (high meat content) wet foods and give them a quick blast in the liquidizer. That AD is so expensive.

Thanks for the tips any more you have are ALWAYS welcome.

To the OP... my apologies for the sidetrack. Hope your kittens is doing okay.


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## tordis (Nov 10, 2009)

Poor little girl, I really hope she gets better. Did the vet tell you what was wrong? I'm just wondering why did he not notice it on your previous visit...


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi all ,lilly is still with us we called the vet today and they are feeding her by sringe and keeping her in today we have to call the vet tomorrow, so once again fingers crossed.The vet we saw yesterday was a differant to the one we saw on friday .


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

menszone said:


> hi all ,lilly is still with us we called the vet today and they are feeding her by sringe and keeping her in today we have to call the vet tomorrow, so once again fingers crossed.The vet we saw yesterday was a differant to the one we saw on friday .


I think thats encouraging news. I tend to think if they make it through the first 24 hrs of force-feeding they have a great chance to pull though. Once she gets rehydrated and starts to feel a nice full stomach Im sure shell start eating for herself, or with a little help and encouragement from you. I take it the vet hasnt found anything else wrong with her apart from hunger and dehydration due to being separated too young from the mother?

It could have been that on Frday she was okay and over the weekend developed the starvation symptoms (not implying you were starving her, sure you know what I mean). Kittens grow like weeds when they're doing well, but they can go downhill VERY quickly when they're ill or not eating.

All the best for Lilly.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

well we hope she will be ok and no the vet has'nt found anything else wrong with her and we do know what you mean about starvation,but she was eating ,anyway we will post an update tomorrow.thanks guys and please keep everthing crossed for lilly and hopfully if she does pull though we will post a photo of her on here.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi everyone just to let you know lilly is now taking kitten meat mixed with milk but the vet is still going to keep her in ,she is using the litter tray and also lapping milk ,we are going to see her today ,will let you know more news later .


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## Baby British (Jan 24, 2010)

So pleased that things are looking up for this little one. WTG Lilly  xxx


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## tina clarke (Jan 23, 2009)

I have bengals and they can be hard to get them onto to food at weaning age,as for not grooming you may try rubbing some kitten milk or meat on her foot,she will lick it of and that may help her to start grooming.xx


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## katiefranke (Oct 6, 2008)

menszone said:


> hi everyone just to let you know lilly is now taking kitten meat mixed with milk but the vet is still going to keep her in ,she is using the litter tray and also lapping milk ,we are going to see her today ,will let you know more news later .


oh brilliant news!!


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

menszone said:


> hi everyone just to let you know lilly is now taking kitten meat mixed with milk but the vet is still going to keep her in ,she is using the litter tray and also lapping milk ,we are going to see her today ,will let you know more news later .


Brilliant news.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

excellent news really pleased for you!


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## Daisyandchlo (Feb 27, 2010)

Really pleased to hear there's been some improvement


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

we went to see lilly today and she is eating and drinking milk and as soon as we went to her cage she stood up and meowed ,she is a fighter and could be home very soon ,my wife wonts her home asap but told the vet keep her till she is ready to come home and is eating more food,because she is so smalee everyone at the vet says she is staying there lol,i will keep you posted .


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

Oh brilliant news made my day


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## Cazzer (Feb 1, 2010)

thats good news


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## tordis (Nov 10, 2009)

That's great news, Lilly's in good hands and your wife shouldn't worry, the kitten will be with you in no time and, hopefully, in better condition than before.


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## Matrix/Logan (May 7, 2009)

menszone said:


> we went to see lilly today and she is eating and drinking milk and as soon as we went to her cage she stood up and meowed ,she is a fighter and could be home very soon ,my wife wonts her home asap but told the vet keep her till she is ready to come home and is eating more food,because she is so smalee everyone at the vet says she is staying there lol,i will keep you posted .


Aww i am so happy for you, she certainly is a little fighter. Hope she is home with you all soon. X X


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

seen lilly agian today and she looks even better ,we told the vet to keep her till he thinks she is ready to come home , guys i am 49 yrs old male and when we went yesterday to see her there was a tear in my eyes well to be honest a few tears , she is 1 great little kitten .we have now found out she came into this world 2 weeks early so i think we got her at a very young age and my wife is feeling very guilty about getting her at such a young age ,will keep you all posted on lilly and will put a photo of her on here sometime today.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

no kitten would survive being 14 days premature hun, but perhaps a few days yes, however its VERY VERY touch and go.

So so so pleased she is doing so well for you! xxx


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## Baby British (Jan 24, 2010)

I'm made up that Lilly is making such good progress and I can't wait to see the piccies


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

menszone said:


> we went to see lilly today and she is eating and drinking milk and as soon as we went to her cage she stood up and meowed ,she is a fighter and could be home very soon ,my wife wonts her home asap but told the vet keep her till she is ready to come home and is eating more food,because she is so smalee everyone at the vet says she is staying there lol,i will keep you posted .


Thats great news. She will home soon and running about mad!


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi guys well we have our lilly home now and got to say its fantastic and now we all are spoiling her and we like it ,she is a little fighter,you can see the happiness in her eyes .


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## Baby British (Jan 24, 2010)

menszone said:


> hi guys well we have our lilly home now and got to say its fantastic and now we all are spoiling her and we like it ,she is a little fighter,you can see the happiness in her eyes .


She's stunning :001_tt1: :001_tt1: !!!

I'm so glad that this tiny girl can finally start enjoying her new life with you. Congratulations on being able to bring your strong healthy baby home xxxx


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## Matrix/Logan (May 7, 2009)

Oh My Gosh she is gorgeous!! You can see the fight in her little eyes! (or should i say big eyes!! LOL) 

You should be very thankful that you had her or she may not be here now.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi thanks and lilly says thanks here are some photos of dexter ths tabby and pepsi ,lilly has done nothing but purr since she has been home .


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

Awwwwwwwwwwwwww how cute is she :001_wub: I bet in a couple of months all this will be a distant memory & she will be wearing you ragged  so pleased she is home x


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## Daisyandchlo (Feb 27, 2010)

Oh how cute is she? :001_wub:

Really pleased to hear she's back home and doing well


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

awwwww what a dinky lil poppet!


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## tordis (Nov 10, 2009)

Really happy to hear she's with you now and feeling much better 
And may I just say, I love ALL your cats :001_tt1:


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

awww she is a lovely little thing. The photo actually looks like she has a big grin on her face. So glad she is home and happy and healthy!


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

well just to let you guys know little lilly is now being a playful little kitten and is up to allsorts of trouble .as i am tnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn=h./= thats lilly typing lol she is being trouble and still she has not stopped purring ,we are all happy now.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi,well little lilly has taken a backward step and is not eating much at all and not growing ,she is still alert but sleeps most of the day,she has put on 35gms since last week.we have taken her to the vets today and he does'nt what is wrong because she has only put on a seventh of her body weight and he whats to see her in two weeks,she is still purring and chasing things for a short time ,we are worried that she is not growing and we dont want her to suffer,anyone got any advice.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

how much is she eating?

what is she eating?

when is she eating?

is she pooping and peeing ok?


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

she is eating a few mouthfuls at a time,we are feeding her on whiskers kitten food (wet) and she is eating mostly in the day and she is peeing ok and pooing ok


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

pouches? 

how many pouches in a day? 0.5 , 1, 2, 3 etc

she is what 9 weeks now?


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

menszone said:


> hi,well little lilly has taken a backward step and is not eating much at all and not growing ,she is still alert but sleeps most of the day,she has put on 35gms since last week.we have taken her to the vets today and he does'nt what is wrong because she has only put on a seventh of her body weight and he whats to see her in two weeks,she is still purring and chasing things for a short time ,we are worried that she is not growing and we dont want her to suffer,anyone got any advice.


How does she act after she has chased things for a short time & did the vet take her temp?


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

hehe db what are we like... all these questions.

Seriously though in order to help we kinda need to know the recent history and her current eating habits and patterns.
xxx


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

billyboysmammy said:


> hehe db what are we like... all these questions.
> 
> Seriously though in order to help we kinda need to know the recent history and her current eating habits and patterns.
> xxx


 yes sorry totally agree just a bit concerned when she was doing so well & now not putting on weight


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi,she is on tinned meat and was eating about 3 quarters of a tin every 2 days but now she is eating less,she does chase things about the after about 2/3 mins then she she stops,i will ask my wife about her temp,when she does eat you can tell she has had something to eat but her backend is boney


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

Has she had her 1st jab  sometimes that stops kittens growth. What brand of food is she on?


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

ok she needs about 2/3 a tin a day hun not every two days.

Assuming the vet has checked for the obvious (infection, flu, worms, FIP etc) there are a few things already you can change.

1 - change her food brand, whiskas is full of [email protected], i would move her onto another high quality wet. It doesnt mean more expensive just better quality. Will do you a list of brands at the end. Forget the thing about kitten meat and adult meat, its the quality of the food that matters. Whiskas is 4% meat. Cats as complete carnivores, they do not need nor require any cereals, grains, carbohydrates etc. Those brands such as whiskas are full of these sort of fillers.

2 - supplement her food with kitten milk, even the stuff bought in the shops will be better than none. So the felix or whiskas kitten milk will do. Try to get her to have about 1 bottle of that a day. Pour it into a saucer (and if need be warm it), for her to lap.

3 - little and often. Feed her at least every 2 hours, day and night. Her lack of weight gain at her age is serious. You will lose her if you cant get her eating more.

4 - if necessary tempt her to eat from eating on your fingers, or boiling chicken or white fish.


ok the list of foods

feline feyre - asda
asda select (made by feline feyre) - asda
tescos finest - tescos
highlife - tescos asda and sainsburys
encore - sainsburys (not a complete diet but good to supplement)
natures menu - most pet shops
almo nature - most pet shops (not complete but good to supplement with)
bozita - zooplus online
cosmo - zooplus online


there are loads of others, just look for a minimum meat content of 40% or higher.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

we do keep on putting her near her food ,she goes on top of our sky box where it is warm and it seems to us that when we give her some fresh whiskers that has the smell she does eat abit more ,the vet wants to see her in 2 weeks time ,he said she is to small to take blood from.and she has not had her jabs yets.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

move away from the whiskas hun and follow my advice, you really need to get her gaining more weight.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi,thanks for the advice,are these adult food?,can we put her on it straight away or give her alittle at a time ?


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

lol ok

at the moment she is on a food that is only 4% meat. She needs a much higher quality food.

There is a myth regards to kitten adult senior foods, no cat on a raw diet would geta kitten variety 

I would start to slowly move her food over, take it slowly but keep upping the quantity ASAP. At the moment you dont wanna give her an upset tummy but she desperatly needs some better nutrients, so its the sooner the better without upsetting her. Start slowly and build up. 

As for the boiled chicken(or white fish), and the kitten milk i would start that right away xxxx


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

Just a thought ontop of all the good advise given already, you could also feed her royal canin kitten food it has L-lysine in which will help boost her imune system, I feed the dry version as Louie dosent like the wet but he also gets any wet food that the fussy lot are curently eating, I think it comes in a small bag just incase she dosent like it, I get ours from pets at home


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

Dally Banjo said:


> Just a thought ontop of all the good advise given already, you could also feed her royal canin kitten food it has L-lysine in which will help boost her imune system, I feed the dry version as Louie dosent like the wet but he also gets any wet food that the fussy lot are curently eating, I think it comes in a small bag just incase she dosent like it, I get ours from pets at home


the l lysine is great but with her not eating well at the moment i wouldnt go for either. the wet is also full of fillers :frown:, and the dry will make her feel full which wont help to increase her appetite and eating. Good suggestion though 

just a quick edit for more info... L-Lysine is an amino acid, part of proteins which are found in good quantities in any meat. RC add it to their diets because their foods arent high enough in the meat content to satisfy a cats dietry needs. If they upped the meat content then they wouldnt have to put artificial lysine in. Guess which is cheaper! .

Lysine is essential to any mammals diet, it is found in all protein rich foods, such as meat, fish, and high protein pulses (beans lentils etc). It is important for calsium uptake, and for bone growth, so its very important a kitten has enough in its food. Feeding a high meat content food will ensure your kitten has enough lysine naturally.

hope that helps x sorry for the long edit!


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

the vet does not know whats wrong with her,he seems to think there is an underlieing problem,wish he knew what it was ,she is a great kitten,are the foods you advise on wet or dry


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

wet wet wet wet wet... i cannot stress this enough.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

i am on asda site now,would you get the pouches or tins and any flavour yeah


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

Thats very interesting about the L-lysine & RC food, I wont be buying anymore when he's finished this bag anyway, I am going to feed him the RC adult MC food though that has been recommended by a few peeps, but his big teeth are still comeing through so not yet. He loves the purley wet food which has a good meat content

Sorry menszone just hyjacked your post a bit but its good to learn things when they save money


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

menszone said:


> i am on asda site now,would you get the pouches or tins and any flavour yeah


lol any!

get one of each and try them all. The fishy ones are fairly stronly flavoured so they may tempt her more. The only thing i would say though is to watch out for too many pilchards... it can cause a bit of a runny tum


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

Dally Banjo said:


> Thats very interesting about the L-lysine & RC food, I wont be buying anymore when he's finished this bag anyway, I am going to feed him the RC adult MC food though that has been recommended by a few peeps, but his big teeth are still comeing through so not yet. He loves the purley wet food which has a good meat content
> 
> Sorry menszone just hyjacked your post a bit but its good to learn things when they save money


oooh a coonie owner! :thumbup: I shall be the proud owner of my first showgirl (with any luck) in about 10 weeks time! :thumbup: :thumbup:. All my other cats are rescues, and failed fosters (i just couldnt give em up). I fostered pregnant cats and their offspring until very very recently, when i decided to go for a slight change in direction.

i feed raw , as does my coonies breeder so at least i wont have any food change issues!


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

ok cheers ,would you start her on them tonight or a fews days on chicken,she does not have the runs her poo is fairly solid


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

thats entirely up to you. 

The boiled chicken/fish and kitten milk along with her whiskas tonight and tomorrow would be my advice, then slowly start to offer some of the new diet along with her whiskas meals over the next week. 

If she gets the runs, then move back half a step.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

ok thanks for all your advice and will that you know how she gets on


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

please do hun!

were are you based out of interest?


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Can I just add two things to the great advice BBsMammy has given already. (totally agree about high quality wet food and 2 hourly feeding this is key!) 

you say when you give her some fresh whiskas that she seems to prefer it? Well when she stops eating cover her bowl and put it back in the fridge but warm it up for 10 seconds in the microwave before giving it to her next time. It shoudln;t be hot, but it should be luke warm. I dont know what it is with cats and warmed up food I think the heat makes it smell more appealing to them. 

Weigh her every day. Try and do it at the same time of day each day. Not to the minute, but dont weigh on day 1 in the morning, then day 2 in the evening, try and keep the weighing to (roughly) 24 hour intervals. Try your very best to aim for 20grams weight gain per day. Anything under 10 is worrisome. Any weight loss at all would be very worrisome. 

Have you tried feeding her from your fingers? Gently forcing the food in (in as voluntary manner as possible). 

35 grams in a week is really bad. I cant believe your vet isnt being a lot more pro-active with this kitten. To be honest with a kitten with an already severely stunted growth I just dont understand it. 35 grams in a day would be more what I would be looking for in a kitten like this. But 100 grams weight gain per week really is minimal (as she already has a lot of growth to make up). Has your vet even suggested getting her on to Hills AD? (thats a prescription diet vet food given by vets to recuperating cats, its also used for syringe force-feeding, but for some reason many cats who have no appetite for other normal foods adore Hills AD, it;s also high calorie so great for right now. It is pricey, but if you can just get her eating something, switching back over is always possible once she is on the right path. 

Has your vet even suggested force feeding (through a syringe in her mouth)? Did the vet give you any kitten milk to bring home with you? (I mean mother milk replacement, not the whiskas stuff  although even that would be great right now).


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

menszone said:


> hi,well little lilly has taken a backward step and is not eating much at all and not growing ,she is still alert but sleeps most of the day,she has put on 35gms since last week.we have taken her to the vets today and he does'nt what is wrong because she has only put on a seventh of her body weight and he whats to see her in two weeks,she is still purring and chasing things for a short time ,we are worried that she is not growing and we dont want her to suffer,anyone got any advice.


can I just clarify something here....?

what does Lilly weigh right now and how old is she exactly right now?

It's just that you mention her only gaining a 7th of her body weight as being 35 grams... I know my maths sucks, but that says to me she is somewhere around 300 grams. I hope I am wrong.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

Tje said:


> Can I just add two things to the great advice BBsMammy has given already. (totally agree about high quality wet food and 2 hourly feeding this is key!)
> 
> you say when you give her some fresh whiskas that she seems to prefer it? Well when she stops eating cover her bowl and put it back in the fridge but warm it up for 10 seconds in the microwave before giving it to her next time. It shoudln;t be hot, but it should be luke warm. I dont know what it is with cats and warmed up food I think the heat makes it smell more appealing to them.
> 
> ...


i was sooo hoping you would be on!

Doh i completely forgot about the weighing 

If you cant get AD, and if she isnt eating, then you can blitz her other food in the food processor ,with a litle bit of cooled boiled water to create a liquid consistency.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

Tje said:


> can I just clarify something here....?
> 
> what does Lilly weigh right now and how old is she exactly right now?
> 
> It's just that you mention her only gaining a 7th of her body weight as being 35 grams... I know my maths sucks, but that says to me she is somewhere around 300 grams. I hope I am wrong.


almost it would make her about 250g 

At 9 weeks old she should be weighing around 800g -1.5kg ish. Depending on build and breed.

As she has been so ill, i would still want her to be weighing a minimum of 600g and even then i would be alarmed and worried.


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

I genuinely dont panic with kittens, and I have sat on my fingers for the last half hour and debated whether or not to say this, as I really dont want to panic you unduly. 

This cat was already very ill and weak 2 weeks ago or so. Once she started eating and was sent home from the vets she should have been making up for lost time and eating like a horse. Normal weight gain for a normal average kitten is about 100 grams a week (so she should be around 900 grams right now), but with a kitten with already stunted growth she really should be gaining (easily) 200 grams a week at this point, to make up for lost time in the last month. 35 grams in a week is way too low. I dont know your vet, so I obviously cant judge him apart from what youve written here. But I really do not think he or she is taking this kittens problems seriously enough. This kittens needs to eat, she will keep getting weaker and eating less and gaining less and then she will start losing weight at 35 grams in this last week she is very near this point already (going into the negative). Your vet has to assist you and help you and show you how to get that weight on. This situation cant go on very long any more, simply because she will die. Force feeding is a last resort, but if ever I read a post that screams force feeding at me, its this one. 

I can understand that your vet cant do too much testing for underlying causes on her right now, she simply is too small and weak to withstand much but she needs to eat. And that is not rocket science and frankly I am quite shocked that the excellent advice you are receiving here from BBM and others hasnt already been given to you by your vet. I mean your vet knows your feeding whiskas kitten pouches (and I dont expect you to know better) but he should have told you weeks ago to get this kitten on a far higher protein diet until her weight balances out. And he should have told you to weigh daily. And he should have given you kitten replacement milk to feed at home, and he should have shown you how to take her temps. And he should have told you to be feeding her 2 hourly, day and night. 

Sorry, with this best intentions from my side, I dont rate your vet. And I am not getting at you personally Menzone, you cant be expected to know all this, but your vet should! 

Please keep us posted and please get back to us with age and weight .  all the best.


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

How's Lilly today any joy with her new menu?  x


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

she is 8/9 weeks old and her weight is 335 gms not good we know ,she does eat but not alot the food is there for her to eat all the time and we are staring on her new food tonight .


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

blinkin heck my new kitten is 425g at 16 days old!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

where abouts are you? perhaps someone is close by who can come and gve you a hand


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

we are in grimsby n.e.lincolnshire


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Menzone, its not that food is not available to her, I know it is . Its more, she isnt eating enough. I am not blaming you (but I am seriously doubting your vet, he/she should be telling you this). It could be (probably is) she is just too weak to eat the food you put in front of her. It could also be that she doesnt quite know *how* to eat, and eating is tiring for her. In my experience its usually a combination of these two factors. We get hungry we eat, these tiny wee kittens dont. They get hungry, they get weak, they are less likely to eat. They need feeding. The weaker they get the less they eat themselves. And that's when we have to intervene.

One thing is sure, she isnt gaining anywhere near enough weight. If she was 750 grams I would find her small... but she is HALF of that. She needs a kickstart in some way. Personally with a cat this small (and she is at least two thirds under what she should weight) I would start off with high quality wet food, on my finger and try to coax her that way, but it has to be every 2 hours and she has to get a fair amount in at each sitting (say 20 grams minimum every couple of hours day and night and she needs to gain at least 20 grams in a 24 hour period). 

If that didnt work I would be force feeding her with a syringe. Its not as drastic as it sounds (and it is messy but not highly skilled, you only have to make sure she doesnt choke, your vet can show you how to do this) usually after the first 24 hours I can force feed a kitten in a very voluntary manner, I dont need to hold their heads or open their mouths. They just need enough food in them to realize theyre starving, then they will be begging for the syringe. When you get to that stage spout the food from the syringe on to a plate (or your finger) and slowly but surely she should start eating normally. But you have to keep weighing and intervene if and when her daily weight gain slips under the 20 grams per day. 

If you look at it over a 7 day period, I would imagine that day 1 you are doing all the work. You are forcing her to eat day 2 she is a bit stronger and she eats a bit from your finger with coaxing, the rest you force in. And over the period of the next few days (weighing continually) the balance slowly changes and the majority of her she is eating herself. Usually by day 7 I would expect her to have gained (at the very minimum) around 150 grams, but preferably 250-300grams or more, and she should be fine on her own (with a high protein wet food, kitten milk and daily weighing just to make sure she doesnt slip back). 

I really think she needs more hands on help than just a better diet she needs to get MUCH more inside her. 

All the very best. Let us know how it goes.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

she is eating but only very small amounts,i have put some on my finger and put some on her lips and then she did start to eat.when she came back from the vets she was eating alot then she started to eat less and less can you tell me why,lilly is part of our family and we dont wont to lose her .


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

so we are ok feeding adult wet food ?


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

Is there another vet you could take her to or see a different one at the practice she has been to?


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

menszone said:


> so we are ok feeding adult wet food ?


Yes she needs to eat but if she wont or cant take her back to a vet asap


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## The Twins (Oct 11, 2009)

She wont eat as she has no energy - its a viscious circle, the less they eat the less they'll want... as they have no energy to eat. I think you need to feed by syringe every 2 hours - as per the other posts. Yes its ok to feed her adult food - any wet food at this stage is ok!! You MUST get food and kitten milk into her asap. I'd mix some wet food into the kitten milk to make a paste and then syringe feed it to her every two hours from now til she starts eating on her own - and by that i mean that she should be eating a decent sized portion at least 4 times a day... until then i'd feed her every 2hrs. Am sorry to sound a bit blunt, but everyone has given you masses of help and advice as to what to do but you dont seem to be doing it so I am a bit confused as to what else we can all tell you to do... I fear you may loose her - she will become very weak very very easily and it is so easy to loose them before 16wks of age as they are so vunerable. 

Start the syringing with wet food and kitten milk mixed in asap - 2hrly for next couple of days. 

Please try this asap! Please.


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

menszone said:


> she is eating but only very small amounts,i have put some on my finger and put some on her lips and then she did start to eat.when she came back from the vets she was eating alot then she started to eat less and less can you tell me why,lilly is part of our family and we dont wont to lose her .


I can't tell you why, but i can say all the weak (underweight) kittens I come across are the same. It's like the weaker they are... the less they eat. Maybe it tires her out to eat? I'm not really sure of the why, I just know it reverses the more food you get into her.... but seeing as weight gain is averaging 7 grams a day, you really need to get a LOT more into her, and I am afraid letting her lick of your finger is just too voluntary for this wee girl, I think she really needs a week of force-feeding every 2 hours.

yes you can feed her adult cat food as long as it's a very high protein variety. I think BBsMammy named a few earlier.

I want to stress this again, I don;t think you have much time left to just try new foods with this kitten, she needs quite drastic help and quite quickly.

With a cat this small I would not at all be surprised if she didn't make it overnight. In fact in all my years of fostering kittens I have only ever came across one case similar to this that went on to live. But that kittens weight had only been static for 3 weeks... you cat has been static for around 6 weeks. I

I really think she needs a vet and 24 hour force feeding for the next week or so. You can do this at home, in fact I would much prefer to do it at home, not just that a vets stay costs loads of money, but it's better for the kitten to be in familiar surrounding with her trusted family. It's inexpensive and fairly easy to force feed, just very time consuming. Your vet can show you exactly what to do. You basically only start with 2x a 5ml syringes every 2 hours. If more will go in great, but that's basically it. I would use Hills AD food which the vet can give you (it's high protein, high calorie, appetising and best of all it is ever so easy to suck up into a syringe). A tin will last you roughly two days and you probably won't need more than 2 or 3 tins and she will start eating (normal high protein cat food) herself.

I also agree that I think you need to see another vet who will take a far more pro-active approach.

best of luck.

I don't live in the UK so no way can I pop over to help you... but if you need me to talk you through anything on the phone, just leave your phone number in a private message for me and I'll call you. I can call the Uk for free so that's no big deal.

I wish I was nearer and could offer some hands-on help... but I can't.

I do promise you though (apart from getting up twice in the night for 5 minutes)... it's not that much work... and she will start to thrive when she starts getting substantial amounts of food inside her. She just needs loads of feeding up.

Well you already know there may be underlying causes... but before those can be investigated she needs to grow.

One quick question... is her stomach distended? Does it look fatter than it should? Does it feel firm to the touch? Like a balloon filled with water? How does her stomach feel compared to your other kittens?

All the very best... my best wishes are with you.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

I cant echo more than what TJE has said except maybe sometimes the hard truth is needed.


Your kitten is dying.

If you or your vet do not get some good nutrition into her then she will die.

Your vet may well be right that there is an underlying cause but without giving you any ideas then all you can do is fight for your baby. Now is the time to fight, not later, not toniht, not tomorrow, fight now. 

Feed every 2 hours and if she doesnt finish her portion within 5min then force feed it.
Feed kitten milk at every feed.

Your kitten weighs approximatly what a 2 week old should weigh, not what a 9 week old should weigh. She will die if you dont do something now, or find a vet who will.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

yes her stomach feels like a balloon full of water


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

ok she needs to see another more competent vet and now.


I have a feeling about this, but it would be irresponsible of me or anyone to give an online diagnosis. She needs to be seen urgently by another vet. today. you need to explain all the history.

1 - early weaned
2 - needed hospitalisation due to malnutrition and dehydration
3 - progressive loss of appetite
4 - progressive lethargy
5 - stomach like a balloon


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

what could be wrong


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

billyboysmammy said:


> I cant echo more than what TJE has said except maybe sometimes the hard truth is needed.
> 
> Your kitten is dying.
> 
> ...


That really needed saying! I totally agree with this and danced around it without coming straight out and saying it. I agree totally, your cat is dying, she is suffering from slow starvation  now way can that be pleasant. Its not something you can take a passive approach with. Either get her medical help now or get your vet to put her to sleep. You have to take some form of action NOW.


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

menszone said:


> what could be wrong


geez, how can I say this and not sound rude.... what *could* be wrong is at this moment in time totally unimportant.

What *will* be wrong if you donlt take action is she will be dead very soon.

When a person is suffering from malnutrition we don't start testing them for other things... we treat the immediate danger fisrt... STARVATION.

Your kitten is in immediate danger.

It is your duty to treat that immediuate danger NOW.... other possible problems can be dealt with later.

Right now she is dying of starvation.

And I am losing my patience.


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## The Twins (Oct 11, 2009)

menszone said:


> what could be wrong


OMG, we cant say what it could be - we're not vets! But we could guess and be wrong - i hope so, as i have a feeling what it might but but get on the phone to your vet NOW!! Sorry to shout but your kitten could be in severe danger and may very well need medical intervention NOW.


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

billyboysmammy said:


> *ok she needs to see another more competent vet and now.*
> 
> I have a feeling about this, but it would be irresponsible of me or anyone to give an online diagnosis. * She needs to be seen urgently by another vet. today. *. you need to explain all the history.
> 
> ...


I agree ... highlighted the most important words ... please take action now.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

ok guys lily at the vets tonight


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

menszone said:


> ok guys lily at the vets tonight


wise move. Please keep us posted.

All the best for you both and Lilly.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hope its not to late


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

You should be phoning Vets right now as you may not get one near you with 24 hour service. Keep posting.


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## The Twins (Oct 11, 2009)

menszone said:


> hope its not to late


Me too... I really hope its not been left to late and she picks up or is treatable...


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## The Twins (Oct 11, 2009)

mellowma said:


> You should be phoning Vets right now as you may not get one near you with 24 hour service. Keep posting.


Ditto - you should really be taking her in as an emergency now, you dont need an appointment to turn up with an emergency, just go and they should treat you asap.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

any news? how did you get on at the vets?


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

vet has kept her in overnight ,he feed her some adult pilchard food around about 30gm and she eat like there is no tomorrow and to be honest guys it brought a tear to my eyes,wish i could of stayed with her ,once she finished the food the look on her face said more please sir and then she started to purr.we will give you all an update tomorrow .


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

feline feyre?or similar? nice smelly tempting for a kitty. However she needs much more than 30g, will someone be there overnight to keep feeding her?

What did he say about her temperature, swollen belly, lethargy etc?


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

temp was ok ,belly not a prob and she will be getting food every 2/3 hours he said around 30gms


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Menzone, good to know she is getting the treatment she needs. I will keep everything crossed for wee Lilly. (went to bed last night thinking about her and woke up this morning thinking of her).

Some practical advice that might be of help. 

because this kitten went downhill after the last time she was discharged from her stay at the vets, can I suggest that before you bring this kitten home that you make sure:

- the vet shows you how to syringe feed (so you can act immediately should she not be eating enough)
- that you have a supply of food like Hills AD that can be sucked up into a syringe (or a very good liquidizer to blend regular high protein cat food for this purpose). 
- some syringes (I use 2.5m and 5ml size, and I find it easier to use 4 syringes already filled  instead of stopping to refill during feeding)
- that you have get some kitten milk powder from the vet
- that you have a supply of good qulaity high protein cat food in the house 

and possibly (though I am not sure how vets feel about this?) . if this was my kitten Id want to monitor her temp, so I would ask the vet if it is recommended that you take her temperature at home (should she stop eating again). And if he agrees then youd need to get the vet to show you how. Shes such a tiny wee thing, taking her temperature can be a bit tricky. In my experience its not unusual with such tiny kittens that when theyre not eating for prolonged periods, they also become hypothermic. And although I am no vet, I can assume that a very small weak kitten with the added symptom of hypothermia would be less likely to want to eat, so her low body temp would perpetuate the vicious cycle of not eating/not gaining weight/eating even less/losing weight. 

And dont just assume if she thrives at the vet and is discharged that shell thrive at home, the chances are she will slip as she did last time. In my experience she will need at least one week (maybe 2 weeks) of constant help and coaching, very regular 2 hourly feeding of small portions, and daily weighing (and immediate intervention with force feeding if and when she slips, however slight that slip is). I would only let my guard down slightly with this kitten if she was 2 weeks further with a 400 gram gain in body weight. 

If you buy some tins of Hills AD and kitten milk powder from your vet, and it turns out you dont need it (as she is eating her regular cat food on her own) you can return it to the vet and get a full refund (providing of course you havent opened the packaging). I strongly recommend you have this stuff at hand for at least 2 weeks (and 400grams weight gain) after she is discharged. 

All the best.


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

Im not sure but I think you can get a thermometer which you place on the ear not sure but would easier for you, the vet should know. 

Paws & claws crossed for her here  x


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Dally Banjo said:


> Im not sure but I think you can get a thermometer which you place on the ear not sure but would easier for you, the vet should know.
> 
> Paws & claws crossed for her here  x


yes, you can get them and they are GREAT things, best invention since sliced bread :thumbup:. I am not sure if anywhere in the UK sells them (I don't live in the UK), I couldn't find them on e-bay UK. I got mine from e-bay in the states. They are quite pricey but they are soooo easy to use. You get an accurate reading in under 1 second, and the cat hardly notices it. Which I can't say is the same for an anal thermometer, lol.

Billyboy'sMummy, with all your many fosters, this would be a massive time-saver for you too... if you want pics of it or any other details... let me know. I promise I am not on commission for the ear-thermometer company


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

:lol: for once I aint been dreaming :lol:

Pet-Tempâ¢ Ear Thermometer for Pets bit pricey though


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## The Twins (Oct 11, 2009)

Menzone - what is the update today on your little one???


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi guys called vets and lilly is doing well


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

:thumbup: great news  x


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## Daisyandchlo (Feb 27, 2010)

Sorry to hear about Lily not eating well, again. Sounds like she's doing ok at the vet's though, so hopefully she's on her way to a full recovery, bless her.

Sending our best wishes and keeping her in our thoughts


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

been to see lily and she looks better and vet says she is eating feline feyre adult cat food,she is eating every 2 /3 hours and about 15/20 grm which he says is better then nothing,but she looks good,could we keep her on the adult food when she comes home from the vet?


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

I would think so but Tje or BBM will know better Im sure they will be along soon & let you know  they are much better qualified than me 

Now if she was a fussy pensioner then Ive lots of experience with them :lol:

So glad she is still doing well  x


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## The Twins (Oct 11, 2009)

Yes - feed her whatever she will/can eat as at this stage she is severely underweight so any food is good - plus kitten food is a con (imo) so i'd feed adult food anyway. I'd also ask your vet for some kitten milk powder and syringes just in case. I'd give her the kitten milk AND the food she is eating at the vets...


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

we are going to the vets tonight to see lilly and will that you all know how she is ,looks like a trip to asda for adult food and pets at home for power milk


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## The Twins (Oct 11, 2009)

Yes definitely stock up - try get some syringes too and also your vets should have some powdered kitten milk which will be better for her.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

If the vet cant give you the syringes (obviously without needles!), then any pharmacy will sell 5ml medicine syringes, which are just the same.

Yes keep her on the high quality high protein adult food.

20g/3 hours is a little low but better than she obviously has been having. When she does come home be prepared to force feed this via syringe if she doesnt take her whole meal. 

Either liquidise the normal food OR as tje suggested get some hills AD liquid food for the syringe.

You need her to keep increasing her appetite and gaining a minimum of 20g per day. 

What did she weigh today?

Good luck with your visit tonight will keep everything crossed.


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

how's Lilly today? What was her weight gain at the vets in the first 24hr period? Any idea when she's allowed home?


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi,vet was not happy with her weight gain and he did say there maybe an underlieing problem but she needs to gain weight before any tests can be done,he is keeping her in for at least a week.i think thats the best thing for her ,we are all very sad but lilly is a little fighter,going to see her tonight again.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

hiya

sorry to hear about the weight gain. Are they syringe feeding her?

Have they given any clue as to what the underlying problem might be?


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

they are syringe feeding her and untill she puts on more weight they cant do any tests,the vet did say that when they put a high smelling food in front of her she will eat it off the plate ,well we are in the hands of the vet and we will have to wait and see,thanks for all your advice.i really do hope he does'nt say we have to put her to sleep


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

Poor little paws  will keep everthing crossed for you all x


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

thanks,got to say last night the vet put her on the floor and she was chasing some toys about which made us all lol at her and they she just sat there as if to say whats the problem.we love her to bits


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

Awwwwwww bless her  x


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

aww thanks for keeping us updated.

Have the vets got no idea then what could be causing the problem?


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

no the vet has not said what it could be ,this is the second vet we have taken her to.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

no worries hun, i'm just frustrated! If i'm frustrated god only knows what you are going through! xxx


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

well your are right ,it is getting me down but i will not give up on lilly she is part of our family and we will explore every aveune to get her right and if we cant get her right ,then we can say we tried for lilly and we think she knows we are trying to get her up and running


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

menszone said:


> well your are right ,it is getting me down but i will not give up on lilly she is part of our family and we will explore every aveune to get her right and if we cant get her right ,then we can say we tried for lilly and we think she knows we are trying to get her up and running


she's got this far, which IMHO is in its self amazing.... I'm keeping everything crossed for her. She's in the best place receiving the best possible care and attention.

and just to let you know that my husband's firs words when he walked through the door right now were "hows the wee kitten in England doing"... with all of us gunning for her (and you both) she has to make it.

All the best.


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## tordis (Nov 10, 2009)

Hi Menszone, any news on Lilly? How is she doing? Any progress?


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi,just to let you know that lilly is still with us and she is still at the vets,she is now feeding by herself but the vet says she is a fussy eater and will only eat small amounts at a time.we went to see her last night and she came running to us with her tail in the air and purring when we picked her up,even the vet says shea a little fighter so please fingers crossed still.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

menszone said:


> hi,just to let you know that lilly is still with us and she is still at the vets,she is now feeding by herself but the vet says she is a fussy eater and will only eat small amounts at a time.we went to see her last night and she came running to us with her tail in the air and purring when we picked her up,even the vet says shea a little fighter so please fingers crossed still.


hiya menzone thanks so much for keeping us updated! how is her weight gain going?

all the very best, been thinking of you and lilly xxxx


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

Great news


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

the says her weight gain is not what he wonted but she is eating ,sometime they have to put her in front of her food but mostly she lets them know when she is ready to eat


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Menzone, am I understanding this correctly?

Lilly is not gaining that much (not as much as the vet wanted), but they are not force feeding her? They are just putting a bowl in front of her? 

What is her actual weight gain? Do they actually tell you how many grams she has gained each day? 

Is this the same vet practice where she was admitted to the first time?


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Menzone, another thing I wanted to ask. I find it quite unusual that a vet would admit such a young, small kitten for such a long period of time. They usually dont like doing this in cases with malnourished kittens because the young kittens get so isolated/stressed in cages and miss their human family at home, and this stress could add to the not-eating problem. In my experience (for the reasons just listed) they usually just send the kitten home with some Hills AD, some syringes and a feeding & weighing schedule for the owners. 

I really dont understand why your kitten has been admitted and how it is possible she is not gaining enough when she is in a vets practice and should be getting force fed. 

It doesnt add up.

Have you asked your vet these questions? 

It sounds to me like it is voluntary whether she eats or not (they put her food bowl in front of her) if thats the case you can do that at home, so why are they keeping her as an in-patient? 

I was at the shelter vet yesterday and they had one kitten who hadn't been responding to syringe feeding (or rather the kitten was doing its damndest not to eat what was coming out of the syringe, so the vet resorted to a tube down it's throat and syringing the food directly into it's stomach via this tube). That's why I find this very passive, almost voluntary approach that your vet is taking quite .... ? well, I would REALLY be questioning this vet's approach. It's highly unusual! The vet yesterday told me that with an already severly malnourished kitten she would be looking for syringe feeding for 3-4 days with a weight gain in those days of around 100grams, and if she didn't see that weight gain, the kitten would be tube fed. She was really quite black and white with her opinion, no grey area. 

And just for the record, the tube fed kitten I am refering to is LESS malnourished than Lilly... this one is 6 weeks old and weighs 350gram. Lilly is (was) a similar weight but she was 9 weeks old. So this shelter kitten is about 250g underweight, and Lilly is (was) about 550g underweight. 

Please give us some detailed feedback menzone, something isn't right here.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

we have lilly at home now and she is eating ,i do sometimes have to put some food on my finger and put it to her mouth then she eats ,last night every 2 hours i gave her some food and she ate it all and then more .he weight now is 500gm and right now she is eating again and acting like a little kitten and she is up to allsorts of trouble.


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

Thats great news keep up the good work  did the vet suggest an ultra sound I think they can do that without sedating her assuming she isnt a wrigler 

Any more pics it would be lovely to see her again


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

menszone said:


> we have lilly at home now and she is eating ,i do sometimes have to put some food on my finger and put it to her mouth then she eats ,last night every 2 hours i gave her some food and she ate it all and then more .he weight now is 500gm and right now she is eating again and acting like a little kitten and she is up to allsorts of trouble.


did the vet give you syringes, Hills AD and a weighing and feeding schedule for each day? (and obviously a crash-course in force-feeding too?). Great to hear she's doing better... but don't slack up on weighing and, if her weight is not up considerably in each 24hr period then you should intervene immediately.

oh and forgot to ask, when does he want to see her back for testing for the underlying reasons... and like DallyBanjo... we'd love soem pics fo her


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

any update on little Lilly ?


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

lilly seems to be ok ,she can be a lazy eater and i do sometimes have to put her back to her food and she is being trouble play fighting with the other cats we have


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## The Twins (Oct 11, 2009)

menszone said:


> lilly seems to be ok ,she can be a lazy eater and i do sometimes have to put her back to her food and she is being trouble play fighting with the other cats we have


How much is she eating each day and how much weight is she putting on each day? What is her current weight???


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

she is eating a full pouch aday


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## The Twins (Oct 11, 2009)

menszone said:


> she is eating a full pouch aday


She's eating 85g a day of food? How much did the vet recommend she eat in a day?


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

well each day she is eating more and she looks better then she ever has and the who is the second vet she has seen is happy with her eating more and more each day ,she is back at the vets today for a check up.


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Menzone

*what kind of food is she eating* (youd need 3 times as much whiskas as you would a more protein rich food, so knowing the brand and protein content is very important to know if she is eating enough)

and more importantly, *how much weight is she gaining each day*.

I am looking at a pouch of Royal Canin Kitten Instintive and an 8 wk old kitten should be eating 2 to 3 85gram pouches per day, and thats for a healthy kitten without malnutrition.

I am no vet and I have no real details of what Lilly is eating, but 85 grams sounds way too little to me.

can you try and be a lot more specific and detailed with your answers, please? A lot of us are more than willing to help you, but we need specific and detailed information to be able to help.

Let us know how she gets on at the vets today... all the best.


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

well she is eating feline feyre which as you know is 60% meat as i have just called home and she has eat 2 pouchs today so far and she looks stuffed lol.


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## The Twins (Oct 11, 2009)

menszone said:


> well she is eating feline feyre which as you know is 60% meat as i have just called home and she has eat 2 pouchs today so far and she looks stuffed lol.


It is great she is eating - 2 pouches is good, be careful to not feed her too much too quickly tho, small regular portions is what is needed as she will have a tiny stomach. But great news! What is her weight now?? You still havent mentioned this...


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

i will get my wife to weigh her,i will be honest i still think there is another problem but as the vet said lets get her eating 1st then do other test when she is at a good size,all i can she she looks and acts like a new kitten she is still small but she is happy and she is getting into trouble with our older cat lol


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Sounds like you are doing a great job looking after her  I hope she continues to do well and there are no underlying issues, poor little mite has been through the mill.


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

excellent news menzone. 

thanks for keeping us updated and getting the weights for us tonight


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

billyboysmammy said:


> excellent news menzone.
> 
> thanks for keeping us updated and getting the weights for us tonight


I know, I keep refreshing this page, hoping menzone is back from the vet with Lily and can give us the grand total for the weeks' weight gain. We should ask the mods to make Lilly a sticky at the top of the page, lol.


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## yorkshireblonde (Feb 8, 2010)

Morning to you Menzone. How are things? I have been reading this thread keeping everything crossed for you and your kitty. I hope all is going well and she is growing well now. Please keep us updated. I know I haven't posted on this before, but I'm sure there are lots of us who have been reading and thinking of you at this stressful time.
Good luck!


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## fifibelle (Jan 7, 2010)

yorkshireblonde said:


> Morning to you Menzone. How are things? I have been reading this thread keeping everything crossed for you and your kitty. I hope all is going well and she is growing well now. Please keep us updated. I know I haven't posted on this before, but I'm sure there are lots of us who have been reading and thinking of you at this stressful time.
> Good luck!


I like yorkshireblonde have been silently following this thread, how is she doing today Menzone? Any news, weights or Photos? Hope everything is ok!


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi well lilly seems to be ok and is eating well , we have tried to weigh her but with lilly being lilly we have to catch her 1st lol, at the last weigh in she was around 700gms and she is back at the vet next week she still keeping our fingers crossed.


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## Matrix/Logan (May 7, 2009)

menszone said:


> hi well lilly seems to be ok and is eating well , we have tried to weigh her but with lilly being lilly we have to catch her 1st lol, at the last weigh in she was around 700gms and she is back at the vet next week she still keeping our fingers crossed.


Great news, glad she is still doing well. X


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

thanks for all your support,we dont think lilly is out of the woods yet but as we have said before she is a fighter and we will fight to get her right,all the familt are keeping there fingers crossed for her


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

menszone said:


> thanks for all your support,we dont think lilly is out of the woods yet but as we have said before she is a fighter and we will fight to get her right,all the familt are keeping there fingers crossed for her





menszone said:


> hi well lilly seems to be ok and is eating well , we have tried to weigh her but with lilly being lilly we have to catch her 1st lol, at the last weigh in she was around 700gms and she is back at the vet next week she still keeping our fingers crossed.


Hey 350 grams in 10 days is GREAT!

before taking her to the vet last week she had gained 35 grams in a week, only 5 grams per day

in the last 10 days shes gained 350grams, thats 35 grams in a day
thats 7 times more than she had been gaining

and although she doesnt yet weight what she should weigh, if she keeps this rate of growth up for a month or so shell be back to target weight in no time.

Keep us updated and post some new pics please. :thumbup:


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

well we are keeping our fingers crossed


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## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

any news???????????


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## menszone (Mar 7, 2010)

hi guys,sorry for not getting back to you all .we have been very busy with work.i have some news on lilly well she is still with us and she is ok and is always in trouble,she is not as big as other cats but to be honest she is our lilly and she is great .we will post some pics on here soon.


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

:thumbup: Great to have an update


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## Amy-manycats (Jun 15, 2009)

Glad to hear it too. :thumbup:


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