# Nightmare at Vets



## Barcode (Mar 7, 2011)

More of a lurker than a poster, though thought I'd sound out honest opinions since I'm still somewhat shaken by what occurred yesterday.

Scrabble, our B.T, can be reactive. This is not a new thing, and we've made strides. I've certainly got her under control on walks, and she passes most dogs fine. What she does not like are strange dogs in her face, and that's all very manageable.

So, off we went to the vets yesterday for her kennel cough. She doesn't like it too much in there after a massive dog lunged at her before so I scan the room before entering. One dog on someone's lap, in we go. She's sitting next to it, they had a sniff, S sits by me fine. Two Yorkies enter, S looks at me for a treat, continues doing nothing. I'm happy that we seem to have improved in that situation (3 dogs is a lot for her!).

Then a Cane Corso entered and all hell broke loose.

We were in the corner (nowhere else to go). The dog sniffs her face, and she lunged doing a fairly good impression of a Tasmanian Devil. As I pull her off, there is a scrape on the other dog's nose. It stopped bleeding within seconds. And whilst I wish she hadn't reacted like that (more on this soon), the owner then proceeded to yell at me that my dog has bit her dog's face. I apologised. She said she was now going to get my details since we were all in the vets.

The vet pops his head round and says "We don't work like that."

Yorkie woman pops up from her chair and says: "I'll be a witness if you want to report it!"

The receptionist points out that it sometimes happens between dogs in small spaces and that it's nothing extreme.

The vet then points out it had stopped bleeding and there is nothing significant. 

I've burst into tears. The woman is shouting at me, demanding I muzzle S. Yorkie woman picks up her dogs under each arm "incase they get bitten too!" I keep apologising, explaining that, if there were any damage, I would pay there and then without question. She kept demanding my details. I got annoyed, pointing out that it was a scrape that stopped bleeding instantly. S then goes into the vet who says that it was nothing major, and she's calm now.

Just awful. The woman was in the right, but did a good job of making me feel about three inches tall with some out of control beast. As a result of this, we're going to get a soft muzzle for the vets. I can see exactly why it happened (dog ten times size of her backed her into a corner) but don't know if that is a good reason.

Now, I'm worried she may do worse. Have we gone back to square one? Was it normal in that particular situation? Do we need a behaviourist? (The answer to this is I think: Yes, it would be beneficial and they are not for the worst of the worst because clearly, we are missing subtle signals sometimes). 

Prior to entering the vets we'd had a good walk. She recalled from all dogs and tolerated the one that approached her (she sniffs and moves on unless it approaches her head-on like a maniac). We were happy. And then it all went wrong.

Completely shaken up. Possibly overthinking. She goes into kennels next week whilst we go to Crufts, and she has always had rave reviews there - they usually pair her with a male dog (if she likes a dog it's almost always a male) and has never had to be put on lead, playing and so forth. Now I'm half-afraid to put her there!

Help!


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## Poundingpaws (Nov 28, 2012)

Your poor dog was trapped on a lead, in a corner, feeling vulnerable and lashed out. Big deal over nothing it strikes me.

Just ensure that you don't let dogs sniff her face when she has no escape.


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## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

what a nightmare , my dogs would have reacted just the same ! The bigger dog clearly wasn't controlled properly if it could get yours into a corner. I'm sure it's knocked your confidence but it sounds as though you did nothing wrong , nor did Scrabble, surely she's entitled to defend herself ??!!
Try and put it behind you. No harm done.


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## Dimwit (Nov 10, 2011)

I would try not to panic too much. Vets waiting rooms are never a good place to have a collection of dogs, which is why I never take mine in there if I can help it.
I think it is s good idea to get your dog used to wearing a muzzle and, TBH, I would ring the vets and ask for a referral to a behaviourist who can properly assess the dog and advise you on how best to manage these situations.
I agree that the other owner should not have let her dog approach yours but I always assume that other people will not be considerate and make sure they don't have access to my dog in these situations.

It is probably also worth chatting to the staff at the kennels to explain what happened and make sure they keep a close eye on your dog (I am also very surprised that they would take a dog who has kennel cough, let alone pair her with another dog).


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## Sparkle22 (Oct 26, 2013)

Im not surprised it happened but I am surprised you let them sniff each other's faces, I would have stood in the way and pushed the other dog back if I knew mine was reactive. 
I think a muzzle is wise.


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## Barcode (Mar 7, 2011)

Ah no, sorry was not clear: She's just had the vaccine to keep her updated so she can go. Will reply to the other points in a bit more detail soon (seeing my students right now).


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## mylesaminute (Jan 11, 2015)

Tbh I wouldn't worry about the Cane Corso or the owner. Who lets their animal come into contact with another animal at the vets, where sick animals tend to go...The blame falls on the Cane Corso owner more so than on you I think, you were stuck in a corner and the woman came over to you and let her dog get in Scrabble's face. 

I would consult a behaviourist just to find out where the reactivity stems from, but really wouldn't worry myself over the incident at the vets. Cane Corso owner might have learned some manners from the incident. I think a muzzle is a good idea for vet visits, I have a muzzle for my new dog and am getting her used to it. It means the vet doesn't have to worry about getting bitten and prevents incidents in the waiting room.

Your dog is a small dog, in future I'd step in front of Scrabble when other dogs come over to you. It adds a barrier between your dog and theirs and gives you a chance to tell the owner your dog doesn't like others getting in her face.

Brush off the incident at the vets, no singular person is to blame and I really wouldn't worry about the other woman taking matters further.


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## Barcode (Mar 7, 2011)

Sparkle22 said:


> Im not surprised it happened but I am surprised you let them sniff each other's faces, I would have stood in the way and pushed the other dog back if I knew mine was reactive.
> I think a muzzle is wise.


I was perhaps over-confident, and take responsibility. Though bear in mind it's a small room and about five paces between corner (where we were) and door. There was really nowhere to go. I know from experience that picking her up makes her worse (but perhaps better in that instant). All I can say is it happened so quickly, I didn't respond as quickly as I should have (I've got it down easily when we're in open spaces and haven't had any incidents for a long while).


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

Barcode said:


> More of a lurker than a poster, though thought I'd sound out honest opinions since I'm still somewhat shaken by what occurred yesterday.
> 
> Scrabble, our B.T, can be reactive. This is not a new thing, and we've made strides. I've certainly got her under control on walks, and she passes most dogs fine. What she does not like are strange dogs in her face, and that's all very manageable.
> 
> ...


Personally I think its more a wrong place and wrong time situation more then anything else.

A lot of dogs get stressed and anxious in the vets anyway, when a dogs stressed and anxious to start with the more the likelihood that they may react if they continue to be challenged with more things that might make them finally snap when they cant cope any longer.

Sounds like you were doing a good job with her, and even though it wasn't her favourite place to be by far, so was likely a little stressed, she was coping very well up to then with all the other dogs.

She was also in a confined area, literally cornered by the sound of it, on lead,
a large dog comes in, straight up to her and makes direct contact. She cant operate any sort of flight to get away from the situation, she hasn't got the time to weigh up if the dog is a real threat, (probably the size and the way it approached and made direct in her face contact was enough to be deemed a threat anyway) and she didn't have the time to exhibit any kind of body language herself. So sounds like what she did is the only other option available and most dogs will do in the same situation, growl, show teeth, lunge in defence and protect herself and it got a nip on the nose in the process, sounds like she probably more air snapped in warning, it was a big to close she miscued a bit, and it got a scrape with an incisor. Of course didn't see it, but based on what you have said and what the majority of dogs seem to do behavioural wise in the same situation that would be my guess.

I wouldn't stress about it and treat it as a one off in the particular situation to be honest. Get her out as much as you can, and carry on with what you were doing before, making any sighting and meetings with dogs as positive as you can and see how it goes.

Depending how she is between now and the kennels, and she could be absolutely fine and back to normal, just mention it to the Kennels that she had a bad experience in the vets when she was cornered and stressed and in case its had any lasting effects or has made her that bit more wary just be a bit more careful with any introductions, and make sure she is happy relaxed and comfortable with any dogs, before letting them interact freely.

I wouldn't worry about the corso owner, they can be selective what dogs they like and don't anyway. In fact she probably should have more control over it and not have let it get up close straight away in another dogs face. As for the other woman ignore her too. You heard the vets and vet nurses professional opinion on the subject, I would bet it happens quite a bit from time to time, with nervous dogs packed in a waiting room.

The more you worry about it and stress the more the likelihood that she will pick up on it too.


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## Sarahliz100 (Jan 5, 2014)

Our vets waiting room is similarly small and I hate it too. A couple of times I've had to ask people not to let their dogs amble across to mine on an unlocked flexi. You don't have to be an expert on dog behaviour to see my quivering dog is terrified (although of the vet rather than the other dogs but the other owners don't know that). Last time I had to repeatedly bodily push a dog away that was determined to get at mine. I wish the vet staff would put up signs asking people to have their dogs on a short leash or politely ask people to do so.

Anyway it does sound like your dog was in a situation that lots wouldn't cope with well either so I wouldn't loose heart too much.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

Forgot to say if you are thinking of getting a muzzle for the vets. Personally I would get one on the box or Baskerville muzzles. These do the job but let them pant and breathe freely. The cloth soft muzzles don't allow them to pant and breathe properly especially if they may be in them for a good time.

You would need to introduce and habituate her to wearing one too on a regular basis, so that she is relaxed about it and comfortable in one.


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## lorilu (Sep 6, 2009)

mylesaminute said:


> Tbh I wouldn't worry about the Cane Corso or the owner. Who lets their animal come into contact with another animal at the vets, where sick animals tend to go...The blame falls on the Cane Corso owner more so than on you I think, you were stuck in a corner and the woman came over to you and let her dog get in Scrabble's face.
> 
> <snip>


Agree with this absolutely. YOU had nothing to apologize for. The other dog owner was in the wrong, no matter how it is looked at. I love the support you got from your vet. xx


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## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

Gosh don't some people like making others feel bad and make a mountain out of a mole hill. Whilst I'm sure she was shocked and upset that her dog had a bleeding nose once you see its just a scrape and has stopped bleeding and the owner apologies why can't people just let things be 

Anyway back to your situation, given how small your vets waiting room is would it not be possible to leave your dog in the car until the vet is ready for you then bring him straight through? My last rottie was a total mare at the vets both with other dogs and with the vet so to avoid getting her unnecessarily wound up before seeing the vet we always left her in the car then brought her in when the vet was ready.


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## Sarah1983 (Nov 2, 2011)

So she's in a small, crowded space in what is in general an already stressful situation for her, other dogs are close by, one large dog is allowed to get in her face? No wonder she reacted as she did! And imo the other owner made a mountain out of a molehill. She failed to keep control of her dog and as a result her dog got a scratch to its nose. I've been in that situation (although not at the vets) and imo it was MY fault.

I hated vets waiting rooms with Rupert. There was always that one dog allowed to get up in his face that I had to fend off before he did. He was muzzled in public anyway but if he hadn't been I'd have muzzled him at the vets, purely to ensure he couldn't bite. He'd have done a lot more than scrape the dogs nose though.

If picking her up makes her worse could you perhaps teach her to go under the chair? That way you could block other dogs with your legs so they can't get to her. I would certainly be preventing other dogs from sniffing her at the vets one way or another whether you muzzle her or not. Which can be easier said than done I know


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## Rott lover (Jan 2, 2015)

Honestly Oliver is very excitable around other animal big or small.To him it is playtime.However other owners don't see a 120 lb rott barking and growling as playful.When i go to the vets office i leave Oliver in the car and go check in and when the vet is ready they come and get me.


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## lorilu (Sep 6, 2009)

Rott lover said:


> Honestly Oliver is very excitable around other animal big or small.To him it is playtime.However other owners don't see a 120 lb rott barking and growling as playful.When i go to the vets office i leave Oliver in the car and go check in and when the vet is ready they come and get me.


That is the rule in the vet clinic I use.


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## Sarah1983 (Nov 2, 2011)

Leaving my dog in the car was never an option for me as I can't drive. And even now that my husband takes me the nearest parking spot is a 5 minute walk away. And I'd still have had to walk the length of the waiting room to get to the exam room anyway, still have had those dogs in Ruperts face. I waited outside if it were busy in there but even then any dog going in or out or past had pass us.

If people just stopped treating the vets waiting room like a social event it would solve a lot of problems imo.


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## Rott lover (Jan 2, 2015)

Sarah1983 said:


> Leaving my dog in the car was never an option for me as I can't drive. And even now that my husband takes me the nearest parking spot is a 5 minute walk away. And I'd still have had to walk the length of the waiting room to get to the exam room anyway, still have had those dogs in Ruperts face. I waited outside if it were busy in there but even then any dog going in or out or past had pass us.
> 
> If people just stopped treating the vets waiting room like a social event it would solve a lot of problems imo.


absolutely correct.I have sat in the vets office with oliver a few times and i make him sit and not move.When people come in or go out they alwas ask can i pet him or let my dog meet him or anything like that.I always get dirty looks since i say no at all times.


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## lilythepink (Jul 24, 2013)

mylesaminute said:


> Tbh I wouldn't worry about the Cane Corso or the owner. Who lets their animal come into contact with another animal at the vets, where sick animals tend to go...The blame falls on the Cane Corso owner more so than on you I think, you were stuck in a corner and the woman came over to you and let her dog get in Scrabble's face.
> 
> I would consult a behaviourist just to find out where the reactivity stems from, but really wouldn't worry myself over the incident at the vets. Cane Corso owner might have learned some manners from the incident. I think a muzzle is a good idea for vet visits, I have a muzzle for my new dog and am getting her used to it. It means the vet doesn't have to worry about getting bitten and prevents incidents in the waiting room.
> 
> ...


I agree with this too. I have a bullmastiff...not reactive to anything at all but if my dog shoved her nose and backed another dog into the corner and got bitten for her troubles I would consider it my fault. and I would be the one to apologise for my stupidity....for allowing my dog to get close enough to get bitten.

Dogs get stressed at the vets and you never know what a dog is there for...I never let my dogs mix with other dogs or people when I am at the vets.....other people are fine when we are out though. just not in the vets.

I wouldn't dream of taking things further. but I would be extra careful next time I was at the vets.


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## bingolitle (Dec 6, 2014)

The one I have a problem with is the yorkie owner  Witness indeed! To what? One dog telling another dog to get of its space. Good grief!


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## Barcode (Mar 7, 2011)

bingolitle said:


> The one I have a problem with is the yorkie owner  Witness indeed! To what? One dog telling another dog to get of its space. Good grief!


I did feel like saying "And you can pipe down too!". It was also the whole picking them up incase they got bitten which upset me. After all the work we've done with Scrabble, I felt like everything had come undone. After I got upset (completely involuntarily), the CC owner kept telling me "You need to calm down", but it wasn't me shouting in the first place.

I can see that it appeared nasty and that other owners might not realize that, despite appearances, it is all hot air. What I'm wondering is: Is there a 'scale' of dog bites in relation to dogs biting other dogs? Scrabble has never gotten her teeth into another dog and I keep worrying it will escalate. Really appreciate everyone here for helping me put it into perspective.


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## Barcode (Mar 7, 2011)

Sled dog hotel said:


> So sounds like what she did is the only other option available and most dogs will do in the same situation, growl, show teeth, lunge in defence and protect herself and it got a nip on the nose in the process, sounds like she probably more air snapped in warning


Thankyou so much. When I explained what happened to my OH, she said: "You know what Scrabble is like, and I'm not surprised. She was probably scared by a massive thing towering over her where she couldn't escape." And I'm pretty certain I'd react the same way too!

I'm certainly going to mention it to kennels. It's not they actively pair her up. More, if she gets along with one dog, she's allowed to play relatively freely. Everytime she's been nothing has happened. They say she's happy (and I've seen her when she doesn't know I've been watching, so this is true) and hasn't had to be leashed and kept away from other dogs. I find this very surprising, and it reinforces my suspicion that I am inadvertently doing things sometimes to trigger her - it's a blimmin' steep learning curve!


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## Rott lover (Jan 2, 2015)

bingolitle said:


> The one I have a problem with is the yorkie owner  Witness indeed! To what? One dog telling another dog to get of its space. Good grief!


Exactly.I think the wrong person was doing all the apologizing here.If that happened to Oliver i would look at the other owner and give my apologies and then look at Oliver and make sure all is good and then curse myself for being an idiot.


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## Barcode (Mar 7, 2011)

rottiepointerhouse said:


> Anyway back to your situation, given how small your vets waiting room is would it not be possible to leave your dog in the car until the vet is ready for you then bring him straight through? My last rottie was a total mare at the vets both with other dogs and with the vet so to avoid getting her unnecessarily wound up before seeing the vet we always left her in the car then brought her in when the vet was ready.


We do this. Park across the road, and I look in the window before we go in! Yesterday, vet was running late, and three more entered leaving us no escape. It's really badly designed! Once other dogs enter there is no room to move without passing very very close to them.


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## Barcode (Mar 7, 2011)

Rott lover said:


> Exactly.I think the wrong person was doing all the apologizing here.If that happened to Oliver i would look at the other owner and give my apologies and then look at Oliver and make sure all is good and then curse myself for being an idiot.


I did wonder if it's someone who has never encountered a dog doing that before, or someone who mistakes a lot of noise for something uncontrollable (it does look unpleasant, I admit!). From her perspective, my dog 'bit its face' without no warning whatsoever. But I say she had nowhere to go.

We've just returned from a walk and had to pass seven dogs (why do people walk so many at once, what is going on around here ?!?!). Was o.k, but def. a bit fearful. Kept looking at them, looking at me, pressing herself close. My nerves are still frazzled.

For those who keep their dog away from others: Does this make things worse? Obv., I don't let her run freely up to others, but do worry that little interaction apart from Matilda who she lives with could be making it worse.


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## Rott lover (Jan 2, 2015)

Barcode said:


> I did wonder if it's someone who has never encountered a dog doing that before, or someone who mistakes a lot of noise for something uncontrollable (it does look unpleasant, I admit!). From her perspective, my dog 'bit its face' without no warning whatsoever. But I say she had nowhere to go.
> 
> We've just returned from a walk and had to pass seven dogs (why do people walk so many at once, what is going on around here ?!?!). Was o.k, but def. a bit fearful. Kept looking at them, looking at me, pressing herself close. My nerves are still frazzled.
> 
> For those who keep their dog away from others: Does this make things worse? Obv., I don't let her run freely up to others, but do worry that little interaction apart from Matilda who she lives with could be making it worse.


When Oliver gets to playing with any other dog he is insane.He has never caused any harm to another dog but to watch him is scary.He barks and growls and grumps and is not at all ashamed to be boisterous at top volume.I did have a lady yell at me telling me i should keep my dog contained if he is going to fight with other dogs.The dog he was "fighting "with was my best friends dog and we both started laughing.I apologized for laughing and told he lady that they were playing and that the other dog was my friends which i pointed to right next to me.The lady said they looked vicious while playing.

For this reason while out walking i do not allow him any contact with other dogs while out walking.I will take him to the side and make him sit until others have passed.The other thing is to learn to stay calm in yourself then the dog will also stay calmer.


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

Don't worry about it. The Cane Corso's owner was an idiot letting her dog corner a much smaller one and go right in it's face. Your dog reacted as any sentient dog would under the circumstances. 

You could have stepped in and made it back off, and you'll know to do that next time.


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## Buzzard (Aug 10, 2012)

Sorry you experienced this. My last dog freaked out in the vets waiting room, so we used to check in and wait outside and they would come out and call us in. Might be worth considering for the future to try and reduce the stress levels for your dog and help avoid anything similar happening again.


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## Guest (Feb 27, 2015)

I wouldn't worry about fault. Just live and learn. Vets waiting rooms are not the place for dogs to come in to contact with each other for any reason.
Learn to block your dog and other dogs from coming in contact with yours. If she is small enough, pop her in a crate and keep her crated and behind you, or under a chair while in the waiting room.

If you know she will resort to teeth, a muzzle is a good option, but please don't use a fabric muzzle. Dogs get stressy at the vet and need to pant, fabric muzzles prevent them being able to do that. She could easily overheat and add to her discomfort. 
You need a well fitted basket muzzle that you introduce to her as a happy thing


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## Little P (Jun 10, 2014)

Sounds like everyone has said everything that I would in terms of the situation that happened. 

In terms of practicalities, muzzle training has been discussed, as has the "leaving in car" strategy. 

Other things that we do for dog reactive dogs are get them in for pre-planned appointments at quiet times of day - either first thing in the morning, immediately after lunch or at the end of the day, or we will block out the appointments either side of the reactive dogs appointment for cats/non-dog species appointments, rather than appointments for other dogs. You could ask if there's a slot between two non-dog appointments that you could take. 

Depending on how large your surgery is, you could also ask if there's a spare room you could wait in if leaving her in the car isn't an option. If our nurses room is free, people with very unhappy dogs are welcome to wait in there until the vet is ready for them too.


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## Jamesgoeswalkies (May 8, 2014)

I'm another one who hates the vets waiting room .... so you have my sympathy.

The Vets were right though, a quick growl/snap and no lasting damage is quite common in such a crowded environment.

I don't wait in the waiting room if I can help it with any of my dogs ....not if the room is crowed ... my big dog would have reacted if a dog had come into her face like that ...and she isn't a reactive dog. All dogs are stressed and on edge in the vets so their threshold is much lower.

Mostly people are respectful of space in our vets but you do get a few who just don't get it. I suspect they are the same individuals who let their off lead dogs bound rudely up to other dogs (even if they are on the lead) and then when asked to control their dogs reply 'he's only being friendly' 

J


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

Barcode said:


> More of a lurker than a poster, though thought I'd sound out honest opinions since I'm still somewhat shaken by what occurred yesterday.
> 
> Scrabble, our B.T, can be reactive. This is not a new thing, and we've made strides. I've certainly got her under control on walks, and she passes most dogs fine. What she does not like are strange dogs in her face, and that's all very manageable.
> 
> ...


Not read the whole thread however I do not take my dogs in to the vets until the last moment. I leave them in the car until they call my name and then I go in, this reduces the exposure to potential problems.

Of course I am lucky I have a vet with a large car park where I can leave the dog in the car (shock horror) so that it can remain as relaxed as possible for as long as possible.

I also do not permit my dogs to socialise with others in the vet and vice versa.

You might want to consider the same.


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## Dogless (Feb 26, 2010)

Barcode said:


> For those who keep their dog away from others: Does this make things worse? Obv., I don't let her run freely up to others, but do worry that little interaction apart from Matilda who she lives with could be making it worse.


No; far, far better. Brings the stress levels right down. Removing the expectation of a greeting means Roo behaves on his lead and Kilo is much less stressed. When I have a day with Kilo when we have seen lots of dogs or encountered stressful situations I make sure to go somewhere quiet with him for the next few days so that his stress levels can come right down. If I do not do that he is much more on the ceiling for a few walks after the busy one.


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## Barcode (Mar 7, 2011)

I think we'll wait outside now until called in. I hadn't allowed them so socialize, rather, the dog strolled across to us. Though, I should have been quicker to react. 

She's just returned from agility and OH said she was fine, walking past other dogs with no lunging. Plenty of treats, and she's returned a happy dog. It does seem to be mostly about the environment rather than simply having an intrinsically aggressive streak in her that manifests towards all and sundry.

We'll carry on as we are, mention it to kennels, and think about the behaviourist when we return from Crufts. I swing between thinking there is something that needs to be done and thinking that, to a large extent, this is simply her disposition.


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## cheekymonkey68 (Nov 18, 2012)

Please dont feel bad. The CC owner was so wrong to let her large dog near S. Even worse that she actually tried to tell you off!! I know how quickly it all happens, if that CC had come near my dogs face he would have done the same as S, but would probably have latched onto the dogs face....consequently I have become skilled in managing other peoples dogs for them. I dont care if they are offended, I look at it as protecting their pooch. If they were doing an efficient job I wont have to say anything.... It sounds like dear Scrabble just needs space around the face, its not too much to ask for


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## Canine K9 (Feb 22, 2013)

I hope you both recover soon. I don't drive so I have to bring Bailey in. He becomes HA at the vets (as he gets frightened and stressed) so he wears a basket muzzle there- I wouldn't use a fabric one as they can't pant.
Hope you're both ok


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## hazel pritchard (Jun 28, 2009)

1 of my dogs can be a bit reactive when other dogs are in his face , or at his other end !!!! , as i know hes like that and that some owners often say"oh my dog is only being friendly"!!!! i make sure me dog is never put in the situation where he could get so stressed so he lunges or has a go,, when at the vets waiting room if it gets busy i either take him outside and get receptionist to call when its his turn, or if another dog comes towards him i tell the owner that hes not keen on other dogs up close, 
with a reactive dog you must always be 1 step ahead at all times


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## Old Shep (Oct 17, 2010)

It's a pity vets don't give too much thought to the layout of their waiting rooms.

A "bus" style seating arrangement would prevent any face to face meetings. 

I've never seen a vet surgery laid out like that: they seems designed to cause dogs more stress!


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

Old Shep said:


> It's a pity vets don't give too much thought to the layout of their waiting rooms.
> 
> A "bus" style seating arrangement would prevent any face to face meetings.
> 
> I've never seen a vet surgery laid out like that: they seems designed to cause dogs more stress!


My vet's waiting area has a section for dogs and another for cats and other animals, though cat owners have to go through the dog section to get into the consulting rooms . The seats are side by side in rows - at least you have good all round visibility . With a bus style arrangement, you might not be able to see another dog creeping under the chairs to get to your dog's bum - at least not a face to face meeting.

It's something that does need more care and thought though.


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## Barcode (Mar 7, 2011)

Yes, r.e., the layout. A space to escape if necessary would be good, as to reach the door, you have to pass whatever animals are waiting.

We've just returned from a lovely walk. Lots of off-lead zooming, and no reaction beyond a GRRRR when a puppy flew across the field and landed on her head. How I hate this sort of stuff, but at least she was reasonably tolerant and the owners apologetic. All other dogs passed fine. I've noticed that, when a dog ignores her, she also turns her head away and passes normally. The problems begin when dogs approach uninvited.

We're thinking about something that says I NEED SPACE or the yellow dog thing. Has anyone had success with that?


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

Barcode said:


> Yes, r.e., the layout. A space to escape if necessary would be good, as to reach the door, you have to pass whatever animals are waiting.
> 
> We've just returned from a lovely walk. Lots of off-lead zooming, and no reaction beyond a GRRRR when a puppy flew across the field and landed on her head. How I hate this sort of stuff, but at least she was reasonably tolerant and the owners apologetic. All other dogs passed fine. I've noticed that, when a dog ignores her, she also turns her head away and passes normally. The problems begin when dogs approach uninvited.
> 
> We're thinking about something that says I NEED SPACE or the yellow dog thing. Has anyone had success with that?


I wouldn't worry about a verbal Grrr reprimand to a pup who had no manners and jumped on her head. The majority of dogs will tell an ill mannered dog off verbally.

There is actually a website called DINOs Dogs in need of Space. It might be helpful.

Dogs in Need of Space


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## Firedog (Oct 19, 2011)

These Borders are little sods aren't they. Last week when I opened my side door at that very moment my neighbours walked past with their American Bulldog and Presa Canero x, Luna shot past me before I even realised and was outside giving it loads. I was chasing her up and down, forget every command I had ever been taught at dog training, the AB turned around very quickly and the chap started falling over, luckily I caught him ,up righted him and carried on trying to get my dog under control while the chap used a few choice swear words and I don't blame him.

I was absolutely mortified and my heart rate went through the roof. I couldn't believe it, two large bull breeds outside my house and the only devil dog was my Border Terrier. Horrified to say the least. She won't be leaving the house ever again without a muzzle.

It sounds like poor Scrabble wasn't at fault.


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## Gemmaa (Jul 19, 2009)

I always end up waiting outside until the person in front leaves. Our vets waiting room is TINY  I also try to get an appointment for as soon as they're open at 8am .

Hope you're feeling calmer now .


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## Barcode (Mar 7, 2011)

Firedog said:


> These Borders are little sods aren't they.


I fear I'll be a raving alcoholic soon to deal with the stress!

Is Luna DA? How do you manage passing other dogs?

Nah. A GRRR was deserved. I was just thankful it was that! She tends to tolerate puppies much more than ill-mannered adult dogs. All normal, I think. In Border Terrier terms, I suspect she is quite typical of the breed, i.e., a headache for her poor stressed out owners at times!


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## Firedog (Oct 19, 2011)

Barcode said:


> I fear I'll be a raving alcoholic soon to deal with the stress!
> 
> Is Luna DA? How do you manage passing other dogs?
> 
> Nah. A GRRR was deserved. I was just thankful it was that! She tends to tolerate puppies much more than ill-mannered adult dogs. All normal, I think. In Border Terrier terms, I suspect she is quite typical of the breed, i.e., a headache for her poor stressed out owners at times!


Not so much DA but she seems to really not like big dogs or hairy dogs. She would rather mouth off and ask questions later.

She had seen those two dogs the day before and had a bark but I just took off up the road so perhaps she thought she would sort things out her own way as soon as she had the chance. I dread to think if my neighbours hadn't been in control of their dogs they could have got hold of Luna and pulled her in two like a Christmas cracker.

She seems to have got worse since Precious died. I just have to keep walking if she starts.


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## MollySmith (May 7, 2012)

Molly would have been the same or either peed herself as she's done before the waiting room was too crowded to get her out after an appointment (I now check the route is clear) and it's a tiny waiting area.

I leave Molly in the car and get the vet to call us in. Vets aren't the place to practice any training for her reactivity and I just avoid the situation completely by using the car as the safe space. I've had holier than thou owners say she's violent before now.

Poor Scrabble, poor you. Hope you're feeling calmer.


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## lemmsy (May 12, 2008)

Your dog was not unreasonable really. Shoving your head in someones face is rather rude, in dog terms. 

I'm glad your vet stood up for you. 

Echoing what others say about lingering outside or plodding around the carpark until it's your turn to see the vet. My vets allow me to do this with my dog-fearful one. Either the receptionist or the vet herself pops her head around the door when she is ready for us. They are also lovely about making sure that dogs don't sit by the door when she comes in, so my dog has room to walk through without others getting in her face or trying to talk to her.


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## Rafa (Jun 18, 2012)

I have a six year old Jack Russell Bitch and she would have reacted exactly the same way.

Your dog wasn't to blame. If the owner of the other dog is silly enough to allow it to get nose to nose with strange dogs, then she takes the risk that some dogs may not react well.

Fortunately, my vets waiting room is huge, but I make Rosie sit in front of me on a short lead. If anyone tries to allow their dog to wander over on a Flexi lead, I always say "Mine isn't friendly, she may snap". 

Rosie has been this way for about four years now. She will ignore other dogs but, if one barges into 'her space', she will warn it off. Even though she does this, her behaviour hasn't escalated into anything worse.

I wouldn't worry about it at all. It was six of one and half a dozen of the other but, in future, don't be afraid to speak up and ask people not to let their dogs come over to yours.


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