# im going to breed from my bitch but cant decide whicth stud to use!!



## clairedax (Jun 12, 2010)

hi i have a beautiful, and very loyal mix breed, mum is ridgeback x rotti and dad is lab x staffy, we would like to breed from her as she is so good and only had min training until a few weeks ago when we took her to agilty classes she loved it. and some many people wanted to know when she was having pups. my choices are another lab or whipett/greyhound. my other half wants to breed with boxer but im un sure on that one. please help peeps.


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## Lucy1012 (May 23, 2010)

wow you dog is a mixture..

Some people do not beleive it is right to breed cross breeds in this way, but I am not in the habit of telling people what they should and shouldn't do, but what I can offer you advice is on Boxers. 

Boxers are loyal, loving dogs but do not calm down and grow up until about the age of 4 or 5. They can be quite hard to train as they have short attention spans, and not handled correctly can come a little too big for their boots. They also have quite a few health problems, including cancerous lumps and bumps, epilepsy, under/over shot jaws but to name a few. 

The only word of caution I would give you is that whelping a litter is a costly business, and the cost would be the same whether a cross breed or pedigree. Your bitch is a medium to large breed and I would expect she is capable of having at least 6 to 8 pups. My Ridgeback's litter has cost me £2k so far, and the work involved really is not for the faint hearted.


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## clairedax (Jun 12, 2010)

thank you for your reply ill show my other half, i used to have a boxer few years ago now befor i met my other half and he was a very good boy but that was prob because i used to take him to work (with horse) so by the time i got home he was quiet and tired.
thank you for info tho.


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## deb53 (Jun 4, 2009)

Hun,

Why on earth do you want to breed her?

Is it so you can have another pup? There are many many great dogs/puppies in rescue that are in dire need of a great home.

You will be breeding mongrels that will come from untested health lines and that combined with the risk this could put on your girl it really is not worth the heartache and risk.

Have a look around all the rescue sites and see all the gorgeous dogs/puppies that are waiting for homes....there will definatly be one for you.

That way you can enjoy your girl and the activities you do and also give a loving home to a dog and save it from living its life in rescue kennels.

There are far too many untested mongrel puppies being born and do you really want to add to this?


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## flufffluff39 (May 25, 2009)

deb53 said:


> Hun,
> 
> Why on earth do you want to breed her?
> 
> ...


I'm not having a go at you for telling them to rescue but my Aunty and Uncle have hit so many brick walls while rescuing that they are danted. They wanted to rescue a greyhound but they walk to much and to far and most of the other kennels did'nt want them to have a dog because they work all day. They finally found a kennels that would let them adopt but unfortunately they lost the old girl to cancer recently and are looking again for a friend for the other dog. Unfortunately the kennels that would let them adopt has closed!!! So where can they go now???They may work all week but they go on holidays every working holiday and will walk all day. Also they go away every weekend and walk miles. What a nice life for a doggie


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## deb53 (Jun 4, 2009)

flufffluff39 said:


> I'm not having a go at you for telling them to rescue but my Aunty and Uncle have hit so many brick walls while rescuing that they are danted. They wanted to rescue a greyhound but they walk to much and to far and most of the other kennels did'nt want them to have a dog because they work all day. They finally found a kennels that would let them adopt but unfortunately they lost the old girl to cancer recently and are looking again for a friend for the other dog. Unfortunately the kennels that would let them adopt has closed!!! So where can they go now???They may work all week but they go on holidays every working holiday and will walk all day. Also they go away every weekend and walk miles. What a nice life for a doggie


So lets breed some more untested heritaged mongrel puppies!!! 

Dropping out of this thread...just hope OP sees sense


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## flufffluff39 (May 25, 2009)

deb53 said:


> So lets breed some more untested heritaged mongrel puppies!!!
> 
> Dropping out of this thread...just hope OP sees sense


You took offence when there was none given!!! I don't agree with her breeding her bitch or with the fact that you can just rescue. People keep telling people go rescue!! Its not easy and thats just as heart breaking as bringing a litter into the world that may be unwanted and ill for the rest of their lives or could end up in a rescue kennels Can you see where I'm coming from?? No its so easy to jump off and not hear what you don't want to!!!


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## alaun (Jul 21, 2009)

clairedax said:


> hi i have a beautiful, and very loyal mix breed, mum is ridgeback x rotti and dad is lab x staffy, we would like to breed from her as she is so good and only had min training until a few weeks ago when we took her to agilty classes she loved it. and some many people wanted to know when she was having pups. my choices are another lab or whipett/greyhound. my other half wants to breed with boxer but im un sure on that one. please help peeps.


Will you have homes set up for them all? Make sure you have double the people on your waiting list than the expected number of pups. The credit crunch has had a major impact on puppy buyers and rescues are at crisis point. Unless you are 100% sure of lifelong homes and have the space and money to keep the entire litter, should things go wrong, then I strongly urge you to reconsider breeding her at this moment in time.

I'm sorry it's not what you asked for - but re the stud - check your market. What would the people on your list want?


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## clairedax (Jun 12, 2010)

well didnt mean to start arguments, but as for going round rescue centers already did and had my heart set on a few dogs and got nowhere so i decided to get a pup and she is beaut, i would love to give and to a stray but finding the right one is so hard as i have ducks chickens rabbits and horses and children visit very often. but the pups are not for me i have about 16 people wanting and waiting pups off my mia all are friens and family most of whitch are family. so ill ask againe for advice on what i should breed my bitch with a boxer or lab.


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

why not ask the people interested in the puppies?


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

DKDREAM said:


> why not ask the people interested in the puppies?


great idea, you have so many homes lined for the pups let the potential new owners choose. rep point your way DD x


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

16 people waiting for a puppy when they don't even know what breed the stud dog might be, thats better than most breeders breeding from champion dogs can do.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> People keep telling people go rescue!! Its not easy


No it's not always easy to get a rescue, and nor should it be, but then it's not easy to get a puppy from a decent breeder either. I'm sure there are rescues that would allow your aunt and uncle to adopt, but it will probably require a little searching. In addition to the general, well known rescues there are smaller rescues and breed rescues (quite honestly, hundreds of them) and I'd be surprised if they didn't find something somewhere.

Are they online - if so, I would get them to have a look at dogpages.org.uk


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## SEVEN_PETS (Aug 11, 2009)

Firstly, I would say get her tested for the common health problems, such as hips, elbows and eyes. As your bitch is such a mixture, it would be difficult to do specific health tests for all the breeds she has.

If she was tested clear, I would then think about what you want the pups to do. Are most of the prospective owners looking for agility dogs or solely family pets? I would be inclined to go for a purebred lab if they are going to be family pets. For agility, you may want to use a more slimmer build of breed or maybe even a working type lab. Make sure the stud is health tested fully for its breed.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> so ill ask againe for advice on what i should breed my bitch with a boxer or lab.


Now herein lies one of the problems with breeding crossbreeds (or heinz 57 in your case). Apart from the thousands of rescues looking for homes, the majority of which are crossbreeds (and you do get puppies in rescues too, you know), you have nothing to aim for. You are simply producing mixed breed puppies. I'm not have a go at mixed breed dogs either, but what I guess I'm trying to say is... does it matter what you breed it with.... you won't have any way of knowing how the puppies turn out, it will be a lottery, so all you are producing is mixed breed puppies  You could probably toss a coin to decide and it will have the same outcome.


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

SEVEN_PETS said:


> Firstly, I would say get her tested for the common health problems, such as hips, elbows and eyes. As your bitch is such a mixture, it would be difficult to do specific health tests for all the breeds she has.
> 
> If she was tested clear, I would then think about what you want the pups to do. Are most of the prospective owners looking for agility dogs or solely family pets? I would be inclined to go for a purebred lab if they are going to be family pets. For agility, you may want to use a more slimmer build of breed or maybe even a working type lab. Make sure the stud is health tested fully for its breed.


i dont think people health test cross breeds, I think they are just going to be pets.


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## SEVEN_PETS (Aug 11, 2009)

DKDREAM said:


> i dont think people health test cross breeds, I think they are just going to be pets.


even if they are going to be solely pets, they should be health tested for the basics.


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

rocco33 said:


> Now herein lies one of the problems with breeding crossbreeds (or heinz 57 in your case). Apart from the thousands of rescues looking for homes, the majority of which are crossbreeds (and you do get puppies in rescues too, you know), you have nothing to aim for. You are simply producing mixed breed puppies. I'm not have a go at mixed breed dogs either, but what I guess I'm trying to say is... does it matter what you breed it with.... you won't have any way of knowing how the puppies turn out, it will be a lottery, so all you are producing is mixed breed puppies  You could probably toss a coin to decide and it will have the same outcome.


i think the best bet would be get all potential owners to meet both of the boys and choose between themselves. They arte the ones that are going to look after the pups.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> i dont think people health test cross breeds, I think they are just going to be pets.


No most don't tend to bother, but that's no reason not to - cross breeds suffer from these problems too. The worst case of HD I've personally come across was a collie/gsd cross!


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

SEVEN_PETS said:


> even if they are going to be solely pets, they should be health tested for the basics.


In a perfect world yes. Their is pedigree dogs out their not health tested so doubt people will bother with a cross.


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## SEVEN_PETS (Aug 11, 2009)

DKDREAM said:


> In a perfect world yes. Their is pedigree dogs out their not health tested so doubt people will bother with a cross.


they should be bothered. there's no point saying to the OP, don't bother with health tests cos no-one else does. we should at least encourage the OP to do the basic health tests, then at least we know the pups will be covered for some conditions.


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

rocco33 said:


> No most don't tend to bother, but that's no reason not to - cross breeds suffer from these problems too. The worst case of HD I've personally come across was a collie/gsd cross!


I understand what your saying but theis is healthy un tested crosses too, its luck of the draw


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

SEVEN_PETS said:


> they should be bothered. there's no point saying to the OP, don't bother with health tests cos no-one else does. we should at least encourage the OP to do the basic health tests, then at least we know the pups will be covered for some conditions.


since when did anyone say that? SP you really need to read posts. The thread is about... witch male should i use... not health tests.


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

SEVEN_PETS said:


> they should be bothered. there's no point saying to the OP, don't bother with health tests cos no-one else does. we should at least encourage the OP to do the basic health tests, then at least we know the pups will be covered for some conditions.


in an ideal world yes , but it aint gonna happened is it?  I'd love to get on my soap box and get people to get ALL litters screened but as said not all pedigree litters are tested so you ain;t gonna get cross bred litters done are you?

BUt thats not what OP asked us to comment on is it?


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## SEVEN_PETS (Aug 11, 2009)

DKDREAM said:


> since when did anyone say that? SP you really need to read posts. The thread is about... witch male should i use... not health tests.


i'm advising her on breeding. she's planning on breeding a mixed breed dog and she needs to know the ins and outs of breeding and what needs to be done and thought about before breeding. health testing is one of those and is very important. would you rather we didn't mention it at all, and the pups suffered as a result, cos no-one told the OP about health testing?

i do read posts, but I also think about the dog's and the pups welfare and will write things that aren't asked for by the OP for the sake of those pups.


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## SEVEN_PETS (Aug 11, 2009)

dexter said:


> in an ideal world yes , but it aint gonna happened is it? I'd love to get on my soap box and get people to get ALL litters screened but as said not all pedigree litters are tested so you ain;t gonna get cross bred litters done are you?


for goodness sake, I'm just saying to the OP to get her bitch health screened for the basics. I'm not saying that I want all litters screened. read my original post, I was just advising the OP on health screening her bitch, nothing about any other litters out there.


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## Natik (Mar 9, 2008)

DKDREAM said:


> since when did anyone say that? SP you really need to read posts. The thread is about... witch male should i use... not health tests.


its not about health tests no, but the mating didnt take place yet, so its only responsible of members to mention health testing and encourage the OP to carry them out before its too late.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> i think the best bet would be get all potential owners to meet both of the boys and choose between themselves. They arte the ones that are going to look after the pups.


Hopefully - you'd be surprised how many friends and family say they want a pup only to change their minds when the pups appear 



> Their is pedigree dogs out their not health tested so doubt people will bother with a cross


Well if they don't bother, then they will be breeding irresponsibly - I thought this forum was supposed to support responsible breeding.


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

Natik said:


> its not about health tests no, but the mating didnt take place yet, so its only responsible of members to mention health testing and encourage the OP to carry them out before its too late.


I can understand that, by all means mention them, I know what your getting at, but I think that my suggest was best, in the fact the potentail puppy buyers should be involved.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> but the pups are not for me


If you are not going to keep one, then quite frankly, I wouldn't bother. It can cost £1000's and it is putting your bitch through a stressful and risky pregnancy. While many pregancies do go ok, many do not. Loss of pups, c-sections (costing £1000+), even loss of bitch, not to mention all the expense of raising a litter properly will make you out of pocket.

Enjoy her for what she is.


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## mummyxofx2 (Jun 12, 2010)

i myself have ust mated a cross breed dog with a pure dog cross breed is a rotti x GSD and the pure is a rotti i took all precautions and got mummy health tested and the father had already been health tested not long before the mating occured i think its in the best interest for the pups for the parents to be health tested my puppies are not born yet but already have homes lined up for them all even the veternarian wants one 

but back to the uestion you are better off going for lab as there is already the blood lines there do not go any of the other breeds cause then u have 5 breed puppies which will come with alot of health problems i reakon


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

rocco33 said:


> Hopefully - you'd be surprised how many friends and family say they want a pup only to change their minds when the pups appear
> 
> Well if they don't bother, then they will be breeding irresponsibly -.


thats your opinion. in that case most cross breeds are bred irresponsibly and some pedigrees just because of health tests, their is alot more you do other then health tests. I am backing out of this thread as its Off topic.


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## Natik (Mar 9, 2008)

DKDREAM said:


> i think the best bet would be get all potential owners to meet both of the boys and choose between themselves. They arte the ones that are going to look after the pups.


But if they will not be able to keep the pup for whatever reason might arise then its the breeder who is going to be taking them back and looking after them, or the rescue obviously.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> in that case most cross breeds are bred irresponsibly and some pedigrees just because of health tests


Yes, that's right.



> their is alot more you do other then health tests


I know - I never said there wasn't


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

Natik said:


> But if they will not be able to keep the pup for whatever reason might arise then its the breeder who is going to be taking them back and looking after them, or the rescue obviously.


this is that to consider too but i was just commenting on what the thread was about.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> i myself have ust mated a cross breed dog with a pure dog cross breed is a rotti x GSD and the pure is a rotti i took all precautions and got mummy health tested and the father had already been health tested not long before the mating occured


Well done, I'm heartened to hear that.


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

rocco33 said:


> Yes, that's right.
> 
> I know - I never said there wasn't


to me health testing isnt so important the health of the mother is throughout pregnancy etc, Health tests can only minimize risks, not wipe them out, if only breeding was that easy


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## Natik (Mar 9, 2008)

DKDREAM said:


> this is that to consider too but i was just commenting on what the thread was about.


i know, but if she breeds them with a stud which might not be suitable for her situation and then she might will have to take pups or older dogs in future back then she will be in a difficult situation stuck with maybe one or several dogs unsuitable for her lifestyle and situation.

So she should be breeding what she needs and not what others need really, but she doeant want to keep any pups anyway but she might be in a situation where she might not have a choice.


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

mummyxofx2 said:


> i myself have ust mated a cross breed dog with a pure dog cross breed is a rotti x GSD and the pure is a rotti i took all precautions and got mummy health tested and the father had already been health tested not long before the mating occured i think its in the best interest for the pups for the parents to be health tested my puppies are not born yet but already have homes lined up for them all even the veternarian wants one
> 
> but back to the uestion you are better off going for lab as there is already the blood lines there do not go any of the other breeds cause then u have 5 breed puppies which will come with alot of health problems i reakon


But if you use a Lab you increase the risk of Lab health problems by 250%


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

Natik said:


> i know, but if she breeds them with a stud which might not be suitable for her situation and then she might will have to take pups or older dogs in future back then she will be in a difficult situation stuck with maybe one or several dogs unsuitable for her lifestyle and situation.
> 
> So she should be breeding what she needs and not what others need really, but she doeant want to keep any pups anyway but she might be in a situation where she might not have a choice.


yeah but you have to consider the potential homes, some people may find a boxer for example too strong and bouncy. I personally would involve everyone, as then they know what they would be taking on before the mating.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> to me health testing isnt so important the health of the mother is throughout pregnancy etc, Health tests can only minimize risks, not wipe them out, if only breeding was that easy


It depends on the health test - some minimize risks others eliminate it.

So I guess you are saying that it's not important to minimize risks?



> Discuss all topics related to responsible dog breeding


Just taken from the top of this forum!

There are many aspects to breeding and doing all you can to minimize the health risks to future puppies is part of responsible breeding. If everyone took your stance, we would most likely end up with a lot of blind cripples.


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## Natik (Mar 9, 2008)

DKDREAM said:


> yeah but you have to consider the potential homes, some people may find a boxer for example too strong and bouncy. I personally would involve everyone, as then they know what they would be taking on before the mating.


then those potentional homes should be looking elsewhere for a pup or are simply not suitable for this breeder as its the breeder who is responsible for the pups entire life really by beimg there to take them back any time.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> as then they know what they would be taking on before the mating.


With so many breeds in the mix no one knows what they are taking on - it will be a lottery. It's not like cooking a dish.... a bit of this to give you that, and a bit of this will give some of that flavour!


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

rocco33 said:


> It depends on the health test - some minimize risks others eliminate it.
> 
> So I guess you are saying that it's not important to minimize risks?
> 
> ...


im not saying its not important but its less important bthen making sure you have money set aside for a C section, to me the mother is more important then puppies. This thread its self is not on about health testing. Please dont judge me as i am not judging anyone,.


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

rocco33 said:


> With so many breeds in the mix no one knows what they are taking on - it will be a lottery. It's not like cooking a dish.... a bit of this to give you that, and a bit of this will give some of that flavour!


i know that but its the same for health tests too, they wouldnt know every test they should do.


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

Natik said:


> then those potentional homes should be looking elsewhere for a pup or are simply not suitable for this breeder as its the breeder who is responsible for the pups entire life really by beimg there to take them back any time.


if they wont be keeping a puppy do you think they would take all puppies back? I do understand what your saying,


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## Natik (Mar 9, 2008)

DKDREAM said:


> if they wont be keeping a puppy do you think they would take all puppies back? I do understand what your saying,


if not then they shouldnt be encouraged breeding at all ....


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

Natik said:


> if not then they shouldnt be encouraged breeding at all ....


i agree but sadly these things happen, no matter what we say will change a persons choice


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> im not saying its not important but its less important bthen making sure you have money set aside for a C section,


No, it's AS important.



> to me the mother is more important then puppies


Really  I can't get my head round this. As a breeder you have a responsiblity not only for your bitch, but also the lives that you bring into this world. It is the breeder and the breeder alone that has made the decision to have puppies - bitches don't need puppies (or feel the need to have them). It is the breeder who wants them and is responsible for bringing them into the world. They are, therefore, also responsible for ensuring they do all they can to bring health puppies into the world, for the sake of both the puppies and the future puppies owners.


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## Natik (Mar 9, 2008)

DKDREAM said:


> i agree but sadly these things happen, no matter what we say will change a persons choice


by advising ur encouraging, so i guess u have some sort of influence if it makes the OP think.


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

*Now i wonder if the OP will bother to come back.
Why the hell can't people stay on topic?:mad2:*


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

rocco33 said:


> No, it's AS important.
> 
> Really  I can't get my head round this. As a breeder you have a responsiblity not only for your bitch, but also the lives that you bring into this world. It is the breeder and the breeder alone that has made the decision to have puppies - bitches don't need puppies (or feel the need to have them). It is the breeder who wants them and is responsible for bringing them into the world. They are, therefore, also responsible for ensuring they do all they can to bring health puppies into the world, for the sake of both the puppies and the future puppies owners.


Im not going to argue about it and when i do breed eventually I will be health testing and be responsible. I just have trouble wording posts. I know what your saying about the health tests but with such a mix is it possible to know what tests are needed.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> I know what your saying about the health tests but with such a mix is it possible to know what tests are needed.


Yes, I can only advise on the tests for labradors, cos they are my breed, but others may know the tests for the other breeds involved, or breed clubs will be able to give the info.


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

Just because the mother is a crossbreed doesn't mean the health tests are all suddenly meaningless.

All dogs have hips, elbows, eyes, hearts, kidneys, liver etc. they can all therefore suffer from problems. Suggesting that a caring person get those basic general tests done before breeding is not so far fetched.

If the pups are being given/sold to family members and close friends then the last thing anyone would want is to jeopardise that friendship by providing them with an unhealthy pup, especially if is has a disease that on hindsight could have been tested for and prevented.

Breeders selling to the public tend to have refund/replacement strategies in place for sickly pups and some will jettison any responsibility too.

However the OP will have to confront that head on with relatives or friends as every time she visits them the subject could be brought up especially if little Buster or Betty the pups that *she/he* bred has just cost them another few hundred pounds in vet bills, or has had to be put down due to a genetic illness. People have seriously fallen out over less.

Rocco also makes a good point. Potentially sacrificing the health or perhaps the life of your own dog just so others can have a pup, doesn't make a lot of sense. You are inexperienced and that in itself could be problematic for the good and safe outcome for your dog and her pups. Many think that breeding is a easy and that the bitch basically does it all herself, that is so often a complete myth.
Tell your friends and relatives to go buy a pup, or rescue one instead would be my advice to anyone in a similar situation whether the dog be a cross breed or a pedigree.


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## moboyd (Sep 29, 2009)

lauren001 said:


> Just because the mother is a crossbreed doesn't mean the health tests are all suddenly meaningless.
> 
> All dogs have hips, elbows, eyes, hearts, kidneys, liver etc. they can all therefore suffer from problems. Suggesting that a caring person get those basic general tests done before breeding is not so far fetched.
> 
> ...


Very well thought out sensible post, I totally agree.

Mo


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> Quote:
> Originally Posted by lauren001
> Just because the mother is a crossbreed doesn't mean the health tests are all suddenly meaningless.
> 
> ...


I totally agree too - much better put than I did.


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## Guest (Jun 12, 2010)

lauren001 said:


> Just because the mother is a crossbreed doesn't mean the health tests are all suddenly meaningless.
> 
> All dogs have hips, elbows, eyes, hearts, kidneys, liver etc. they can all therefore suffer from problems. Suggesting that a caring person get those basic general tests done before breeding is not so far fetched.
> 
> ...


i also agree!

ive worked in rescue and ive know of quite a few bitches actually die from whelping complications and ive lost count of the number of bitches who have needed emergency ceasarians, sorry but i really dont undertand anyone risking the life of their bitch for other people


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

Thanks guys.


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## poppydog1 (Mar 26, 2010)

Hi i was going to breed form my ESS bitch but after coming on this site i decided against it, i did not want anything to happen to her also when you add up all the costs it was too much peopkle used to say she would be a good mum and have lovely pups but i have decided against it and she will be spayed later this month. If you really want to breed from your bitch then really do consider everything long and hard.Please keep us posted and i hope whatever you do goes well.


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## dee o gee (May 21, 2010)

clairedax said:


> we would like to breed from her as she is so good and only had min training until a few weeks ago when we took her to agilty classes she loved it.


There is absolutely no guarantee that the pups will be the same temperment wise, especially as they will have such a mix of breeds in them. If this is the only reason that your friends and family want a pup from her, then they could be in for a big shock if they get a pup and realise that it requires more training than your bitch did. 
It sounds like you are very lucky to have a dog with such a great temperment and ease of training, but there is no guarantee that this will pass on into the pups.


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## haeveymolly (Mar 7, 2009)

JANICE199 said:


> *Now i wonder if the OP will bother to come back.
> Why the hell can't people stay on topic?:mad2:*


I was just thinking when is someone going to advice on which breed to use my god if i hadnt seen the actual thread title i would have thought it was another health test thread, and ime sooooo bored of them.

It amazes me how many variations of saying the same thing "always health test" there is.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> I was just thinking when is someone going to advice on which breed to use


There have been several replies, including my own, however, the best advice has come in the other posts and that is not to breed.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> Now i wonder if the OP will bother to come back


Well, that depends, hopefully they will. But most people don't come back because they don't like the advice given and will do what they want anyway.


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## davehyde (Jul 13, 2009)

what stud should i use???????

answer - a press stud, shut firmly over the back end of your dog so no other dog can mate with it.

nuff sed!!!!!!


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## haeveymolly (Mar 7, 2009)

Most dont come back because they are bombarded with comments that arnt related to what has been originally asked, ime all for making people aware of health testing but the problem is it goes on and on and on.


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## moboyd (Sep 29, 2009)

sorry, but if someone needs advice from strangers of what breed to use on their girl, then IMO they shouldnt even be contemplating breeding at all, 

Mo


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## Guest (Jun 12, 2010)

haeveymolly said:


> Most dont come back because they are bombarded with comments that arnt related to what has been originally asked, ime all for making people aware of health testing but the problem is it goes on and on and on.


well maybe potential breeders will understand just how important health testing is when 'it goes on and on'!


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> Most dont come back because they are bombarded with comments that arnt related to what has been originally asked


Well, we will have to agree to disagree - IMO most come back because they don't get the answers they *want* to hear. Anyone who wants to breed responsibly and ethically would have no problem about hearing these posts, in fact, they would probably expect them, they may well have already tested and if so, would happily post to that effect. If they didn't know about it they would welcome the information. People who don't want to know or don't care either act defensively or don't return.


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## haeveymolly (Mar 7, 2009)

Shamen said:


> well maybe potential breeders will understand just how important health testing is when 'it goes on and on'!


I think after the first few all saying more or less the same thing they get the message then switch off, dont get me wrong ime not against health testing or "for" none health testing but i have to say it does get a little tiring


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## haeveymolly (Mar 7, 2009)

rocco33 said:


> Well, we will have to agree to disagree - IMO most come back because they don't get the answers they *want* to hear. Anyone who wants to breed responsibly and ethically would have no problem about hearing these posts, in fact, they would probably expect them, they may well have already tested and if so, would happily post to that effect. If they didn't know about it they would welcome the information. People who don't want to know or don't care either act defensively or don't return.


I have to agree to a point that they go away after not hearing what they want to hear, but ime sure it just gets annoying to the ones that get the message to keep having it rammed down their throats over and over again and frustrating when their original question isnt addressed. There is a limit to how many times you want to hear the same old same old.


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## davehyde (Jul 13, 2009)

yeah but these ppl come on no intros and expect to be told how fkn great they are cos the malapoodoodlecock they got is gonna get pregnant by the jackadoriopugalicker down the road.

they need telling how stupid they are, if they gotta come on here and ask they got no business even thinking about breeding.

makes my blood boil.

good job you dont get a council house cos you got dogs aint it.


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## moboyd (Sep 29, 2009)

haeveymolly said:


> I have to agree to a point that they go away after not hearing what they want to hear, but ime sure it just gets annoying to the ones that get the message to keep having it rammed down their throats over and over again and frustrating when their original question isnt addressed. There is a limit to how many times you want to hear the same old same old.


It may be something you as a regular hears over and over and again, but it may be the first time a new person has heard it, you would be surprised how many people dont even know there are health tests that can be done before breeding, and if just one posts giving the information, gets just one bitch/dog tested then its been worth it.

Mo


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## davehyde (Jul 13, 2009)

but if she can be deterred from even doing it in the first place even better.

wtf reasons as she got that are valid or sensible????


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## Guest (Jun 12, 2010)

haeveymolly said:


> I think after the first few all saying more or less the same thing they get the message then switch off, dont get me wrong ime not against health testing or "for" none health testing but i have to say it does get a little tiring


maybe it is tiring to you but what about new members? anyway i feel so strongly about health testing that i'll never stop trying to get the message across, i get so fed up and depressed seeing the amount of puppies churned out unethically, breeding should be a massive responsiblility but to some people it just aint!


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> There is a limit to how many times you want to hear the same old same old.


I agree with Mo, it's not the same old same old to a new poster, it's the existing members that follow the threads and complain (and seldom contribute to them anyway) that hear it over and over, not the op.


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

rocco33 said:


> Well, that depends, hopefully they will. But most people don't come back because they don't like the advice given and will do what they want anyway.


*Thats a very sweeping statement.My 1st thought would be they wouldn't come back because they didn't want to be bombarded with questions and given the 3rd degree.*


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> My 1st thought would be they wouldn't come back because they didn't want to be bombarded with questions and given the 3rd degree.


Well, you're entitled to it.... My 1st thought is that they will either be realise that there is a lot more to breeding than simply choosing what breed sire to use and it will give them a lot to think about before they go ahead, if they go ahead, or they are not going to like the comments that they get and go and do what they want anyway.


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

rocco33 said:


> Well, you're entitled to it.... My 1st thought is that they will either be realise that there is a lot more to breeding than simply choosing what breed sire to use and it will give them a lot to think about before they go ahead, if they go ahead, or they are not going to like the comments that they get and go and do what they want anyway.


*This forum is for all differnt people with various views i can't see it being fair to ram down someones throat something they didn't even ask about.
Fine for those that believe health testing is the right way of doing things then do it.But remember not everyone shares those views.*


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## luvmydogs (Dec 30, 2009)

davehyde said:


> yeah but these ppl come on no intros and expect to be told how fkn great they are cos the malapoodoodlecock they got is gonna get pregnant by the jackadoriopugalicker down the road.


:lol::lol::lol: That made me really laugh out loud! :lol::lol::lol:


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## haeveymolly (Mar 7, 2009)

moboyd said:


> It may be something you as a regular hears over and over and again, but it may be the first time a new person has heard it, you would be surprised how many people dont even know there are health tests that can be done before breeding, and if just one posts giving the information, gets just one bitch/dog tested then its been worth it.
> 
> Mo


I understand that, i for one didnt know about health tests until i came on here and i had 2 dogs then so i do understand the importance of it its the telling post after post on the same thread that gets waring and i do know it scares people away, theres telling theirs ramming it down throats i dont think it does any more for educating than telling them maybe a few times then leaving it because after all it is the same thing each person is saying.


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## Fuzzbugs!x (Jan 18, 2010)

clairedax said:


> hi i have a beautiful, and very loyal mix breed, mum is ridgeback x rotti and dad is lab x staffy, we would like to breed from her as she is so good and only had min training until a few weeks ago when we took her to agilty classes she loved it. and some many people wanted to know when she was having pups. my choices are another lab or whipett/greyhound. my other half wants to breed with boxer but im un sure on that one. please help peeps.


I think you should ask yourself some very important questions before you even contemplate breeding - apologies if you have already thought this through.

1. Is your bitch at least 18 months?
2. Have you had her scince she was a puppy?
3. Has she been health tested - hips and eyes at least - or will she be?
4. Do you have experience in breeding/have someone on hand who does?
5. Did you meet both parents of your girl?
6. Is she good with kids, other dogs, ect?
7. Do you have a couple of thousand ££ spare in case something goes wrong with the birth?
8. Will you have the time to watch the puppies and mother constantly in the beginning?
9. If puppies have to be hand reared as such will you have the time to do so?
10 . Will you be willing to take back any unwanted puppies at a later date?

Just a few questions you should ask yourself before you begin planning a litte imo - if you can't honestly say yes to any of those questions i would rethink breeding from your girlie. If however you can say yes to them then i would start further researching into breeding ect. As for a choice of stud dog i don't really see why you would choose a greyhound or a boxer for that matter? I think you'll find it hard to find a suitable health tested stud whos owner is willing to breed to such a cross. Also these puppies being ridgeback x labrador x rottweiler x staff x ??? - should only be going to people with experience in large powerful dogs. x


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## SEVEN_PETS (Aug 11, 2009)

Fuzzbugs!x said:


> I think you should ask yourself some very important questions before you even contemplate breeding - apologies if you have already thought this through.
> 
> 1. Is your bitch at least 18 months?
> 2. Have you had her scince she was a puppy?
> ...


totally agree with this post. great questions to ask the OP. :thumbup: the mixture that the pups will be will need to go to experienced owners who have had large powerful breeds.


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## Mum2Alfie (Jan 4, 2010)

"what dog shall I use to mate with my bitch"........Simple answer.......

What ever you believe, suggest health testing and the reasons for and as Fuzzbugs has posted, some questions to help the OP out with so that she can make a descision.

This was not a thread for people to rant on about health testing and cross breeds yet again!!! Do you not think there has been plenty of threads already about it? Yes health testing is the best thing if you are going to breed for the sake of the puppys, however you can only advise people. Better to advise rather than lecture! People wont listen if they get bombarded!


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## davehyde (Jul 13, 2009)

when HH just posted, in the latest threads bit it read...............

i am going to breed from my harryhamster

looked real funny.

sorry to digress.


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## haeveymolly (Mar 7, 2009)

rocco33 said:


> I agree with Mo, it's not the same old same old to a new poster, it's the existing members that follow the threads and complain (and seldom contribute to them anyway) that hear it over and over, not the op.


When i say the same old, i dont mean over time different threads i mean on the same post someone highlights the need for health testing the 2nd,3rd, 4th post and more all saying the same thing.

I very seldom post on health test threads the reason being i have 2 and have had 3 un-health tested dogs 2 was before i knew about health testing i feel it is important to health test and i have said ive had no problems with mine, ok my first died young but not due to not been health tested. So i dont feel i can contribute too much having healthy un-h tested dogs then commenting on the fact that people are irresponsible for buying these dogs.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> When i say the same old, i dont mean over time different threads i mean on the same post someone highlights the need for health testing the 2nd,3rd, 4th post and more all saying the same thing.


Well, I've just reread the posts and nothing was advised re health testing till post #14. I was followed by others including a post about cross breeds not being health tested. In fact, from what I have read through (albeit briefly) the next posts were actually not to the op but the poster who said cross breeds aren't health tested. Amongst those posts was some more advice for OP. Then we get to post # 51 saying



> Now i wonder if the OP will bother to come back.
> Why the hell can't people stay on topic?


which apart from a couple of very good posts full of good advice, the following 30+ posts have been about whether or not people should mention health tests to people who ask about various breeding matters.

Go figure....

This forum supports responsible breeding according to what is written describin the dog breeding section.


> *Dog Breeding* Discuss all topics related to responsible dog breeding.


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

Can this be kept vaguely on topic please, and not a discussion about what people can and can not post. All that does is lead a thread even further from the original post, and doesnt help the OP at all.


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## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

Can I ask why you want to breed her? what do you want to get out of it?

Are you hoping for a little 'mini-me'? because the likelihood of getting this with a pedigree dog are slim to none - getting them with a 'heinz 57' which is what she is, and the pups moreso, is even less likely.

You have no idea of knowing what traits from which breed are going to come through, temperament and behavioural issues can skip generations - and must be much more difficult to trace back when you have four breeds to consider rather than one. 

Waiting lists for pups from health tested KC registered parents come with a health warning - I've had people laugh at me for saying this, they've not been laughing when they've been left with pups at 12 weeks + - without being disrespectful, people who want a cross-breed pup will invariably stumble across another litter or rescue before your pups are even created, never mind born - then you could be stuck with potentially 8 puppies + and no homes  

=================

I am not going to harp on about health tests because it's clearly already been done and one way traffic to some people - however, I will say this.

If you have so many people lined up for your pups, I would hazard a guess these people are predominantly friends and family - think about how you would feel if one or more of these pups became ill in the first 12 months with genetic related / environmental exacerbated health problems which may cause the need for surgery or PTS - how would you feel about this? what would it do to friendships?

It's hard enough when you have pups under 12 months on the ground, and know you've done everything in your power to prevent problems - it must be doubly so if something happens and you know you could have taken steps which MIGHT have prevented it.

There are hundreds / probably thousands of cross breed and pedigree dogs and pups in rescue - each one with their own personalities and needs - you would be more likely to get another one like your girl by taking your time and regular visiting until you find the right match as opposed to breeding from your girl.

You also have the issue that the large majority of responsible stud dog owners certainly in my own breed, are highly unlikely to allow their dog to cover your bitch - you are then into the pet market - which also brings with it risks, because you are bringing two probably maiden dogs together by two novice owners.

I've supported matings between big strong dogs that know what they are doing and got the bruises to prove it - I've mated small dogs of a similar ilk and got the bites to prove it.

I've got a fully health tested pedigree male here and even as an experienced breeder / bitch owner, I would need to get help on board if / when he is used at stud.

Any litter carries risks of losing mum and the babies - you really would be better placed trying to find a pup or slightly older pup with a similar nature and temperament to your girl, and enjoy them for what they are, beloved family pets.

I know it's not the answer you want and I've no doubt I will be pulled to pieces by some for my response - but why put your girl at risk when the chances of getting what I suspect you want are low to zero?


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

I don't really think this thread has been a rant, apart from some coming on and the only contribution they have made to the thread is saying it is a rant.

Many good and valid points have been made, one of those has been health, which to many pet owners is the most important aspect. No-one wants huge vet bills or dogs dying young, especially if it could have been avoided. 

We are not in the realms here, of being worried about ear shape or tail carriage, so the actual breed or dog to use is immaterial. Most breeds are friendly, manageable and make good pet dogs, given the mix that is already present then no matter which breed is used there will probably be all sorts of traits coming to the fore in the pups anyway. 

No-one can advise really on the breed as we could all agree and advise on a Labrador for instance and the pups end up sickly, or bad tempered or as thick as mince, just like their dad, as the OP may inadvertently choose the thickest, sickest, angriest Lab around. 
It is really the quality of the individual stud dog chosen not necessarily the breed in this case.


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

> I know it's not the answer you want and I've no doubt I will be pulled to pieces by some for my response


I do not think you have said anything that hasn't been already said on this thread already so i wouldn't worry about being pulled to pieces.


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

HarryHamster2 said:


> "what dog shall I use to mate with my bitch"........Simple answer.......
> 
> What ever you believe, suggest health testing and the reasons for and as Fuzzbugs has posted, some questions to help the OP out with so that she can make a descision.
> 
> This was not a thread for people to rant on about health testing and cross breeds yet again!!! Do you not think there has been plenty of threads already about it? Yes health testing is the best thing if you are going to breed for the sake of the puppys, however you can only advise people. Better to advise rather than lecture! People wont listen if they get bombarded!


thats a brilliant post. this thread is not about wot others would do the op asked a question and suddenly as usual its kicked off. Yes i DO health test but the threads not about me !!!!!!!!!!

Janice i doubt they will come back as many have'nt before.


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## BigBearsRule (Jun 24, 2009)

swarthy said:


> Can I ask why you want to breed her? what do you want to get out of it?
> 
> Are you hoping for a little 'mini-me'? because the likelihood of getting this with a pedigree dog are slim to none - getting them with a 'heinz 57' which is what she is, and the pups moreso, is even less likely.
> 
> ...


I agree with you. I do not think you should be pulled to pieces. You have given very interesting points and provoked much thought at this end.


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## Natik (Mar 9, 2008)

Nonnie said:


> Can this be kept vaguely on topic please, and not a discussion about what people can and can not post. All that does is lead a thread even further from the original post, and doesnt help the OP at all.


Exactly my thought...

Most threads like this are being given often great advice and then taken totally out of topic from people having the need to tell others what they should or shouldnt post and what _they _are fed up reading about or not so those threads then start to come across unfriendly and very argumentative rather than what its really about... breeding.


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

Any further off topic posts will be deleted.


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## the melster (Mar 20, 2010)

I would personally go for a lab as I don't particularly like the boxer squashed snout. Sorry that wasn't very technical.


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## Sleeping_Lion (Mar 19, 2009)

Personally, I'd have to say whatever stud dog you find, it will be second best, as (I would hope) any reputable stud dog owner, wouldn't entertain allowing their dog to be used with your bitch. That's not to say she isn't a lovely bitch, and has a lot going for her, but with such a mix, you cannot be sure of anything, either health or temperament wise. As such, I think you will find it hard to find a good pedigree stud dog to use with her, and if you do find someone willing to allow you to use their stud dog, you have to question why?

I would count your blessings you have such a lovely girl, and wouldn't put her through the rigours of health testing or whelping.


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## poppydog1 (Mar 26, 2010)

Well said Sleeping Lion that is very true.


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## ClaireLouise (Oct 11, 2009)

I think DD idea was the best so far....... ask the potiential puppy owners for input :thumbup: :thumbup:


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## Acacia86 (Dec 30, 2008)

clairedax said:


> hi i have a beautiful, and very loyal mix breed, mum is ridgeback x rotti and dad is lab x staffy, we would like to breed from her as she is so good and only had min training until a few weeks ago when we took her to agilty classes she loved it. and some many people wanted to know when she was having pups. my choices are another lab or whipett/greyhound. my other half wants to breed with boxer but im un sure on that one. please help peeps.


Hi Claire, i have no idea what has already been posted on here. But this is my opinion:

You NEED to have a good reason to breed your bitch. Not just that she is ''good, loyal, great personality, gorgeous etc'' also the people who ask you if she is having puppies may not still be there when the time comes to collect the pups! Many many people say they want a pup and then decide against last minute! It is highly frustrating but it happens.

You need to be in a postion, home size wise, money wise, time wise etc to be able to safely see the bitch through mating, pregnancy, whelping and the pups raising. A c-section for a bitch can be £1000 minimum.

Believe it or not, out of the thousands and thousands of people/breeders who have pups each year MANY do not have the safe and easy mating ,pregnancy and whelping they lead you to believe! Breeding and whelping in dogs is not always what it seems. If i put the ratio it is actually quite scary!

In mating, pregnancy, birth, and raising pups there can be serious injuries/ill health and also its NOT cheap!!!

I am not trying to scare you, far from it actually. If you do wish to mate your bitch, then thats your decision, but PLEASE make sure BOTH dogs are health tested. For hips, and eyes especially. Your vet might well say that they are ''healthy'' but this is based on an external examination..........not a proper health test. Hips need x-rays for example.

Also in taking the plunge and deciding to have puppies you MUST make sure you do every single thing you possibly can for the bitch/dog and pups. This also means doing everything you can for the welfare when they are with and after.

You must also be in a postion to take back any pup you bred no matter how old, if the owner could not keep him/her. This is where it can get expensive also! If 2 or 3 people could not keep their pups even as adults you should be able to take them back. You bought these animals into the world so its your responsibilty they have the best care throughout their lives and NEVER end up in a rescue shelter.

This is all i will say! As i could go on and on.

But please read this, and think about it all. Breeding dogs is NOT for the faint hearted. It should be done by people who know what they doing, through research and experience. It shouldn't matter if someone you know has done it safely and the pups have been fine..............some people do not have it so easy. It could be you who has it hard, and you NEED ot know what you are doing.

Good luck.


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## clairedax (Jun 12, 2010)

thank you to every one, i have asked everyone who would like a pup what they would like stud to be and they said a lab so its sorted thank you xx


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## kazschow (Oct 23, 2008)

Sorry havent read all this thread...but just thought I'd mention, if your friends are wanting a dog like yours, breeding her isn't going to do that, the only way to get a dog with any hope of being similar to yours is to go back to the original breeding and repeating it.

There's a huge element of unpredictabiliy in breeding a bitch, with such a diverse heritage.


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## CarolineH (Aug 4, 2009)

I never realised that the rescue shelters were that short of mongrels now that people had to breed them deliberately? Other than that, words fail me.:frown2:


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## JSR (Jan 2, 2009)

Great more mutts, woo hooo can't wait to see the puppies, and I just bet they all come out as perfect clones of their wonderful mummy cos that's what happens when you breed mutts! 

I really really do give up the level of sense, caring and moral duty that is displayed on this forum.

On average *27* dogs will be euthenised today in England alone due to lack of home's yet we continue to get thread's like this.

Last word I have is SHAMEFUL.


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## tashi (Dec 5, 2007)

I am now going to close this thread you all gave your opinions and they werent taken. No good argueing amongst ourselves


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