# Finding an unspayed tom?



## Sera (Jan 11, 2010)

Dear all,

Apologies if this is an inappropriate topic or if I sound wildly inexperienced - I am completely unaware as to whether what I am asking advice for is even a possibility!

I own two lovely little cats of approximately 6 months, brother and sister. They are only domestic shorthairs (ginger and black torty respectively) though there is some suggestion (by the vet) of a possible bengal/burmese mix somewhere down the line due to their looks, though I'm not convinced. 

The boy has been spayed, however the female is currently unspayed. We had hoped to allow her to mate with a friends cat before being spayed. We had/have homes for any kittens produced, otherwise we would not consider it. Tragically, our friends beautiful tom suffered a sudden and rare leak in his bladder and had to had emergency surgery, which unfortunately he did not survive. Our little girl is now on heat every couple of weeks and the poor thing is very (unsurprisingly) frustrated. There are clearly no toms in the local vicinity as she goes out for periods of time in the day and is still very much on heat (and has been intermittently for the last few weeks).

I am wondering whether there is any scope for finding a tom to mate with our girl (how I would go about doing this without buying another cat, whether there are people with unspayed toms willing to do so, and so on), or whether I should put the poor thing out of her (seemingly torturous) heat, and have her spayed asap. 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

Sera


----------



## Nicky10 (Jan 11, 2010)

I would have her spayed tbh. You put her with some random tom she could catch a serious illness, there's the risk of pregnancy complications and even death for your girl. She might need a c-section and you may have to handrear the kittens. All of this is a lot of money, time and unecessary stress on your precious cat. Then there's the hundreds of cats in rescues even pedigree breeders are finding it hard to find homes for the kittens let alone crossbreeds. You can't guarantee the homes you have lined up will actually want the kittens once they're born meaning you could end up with quite a few cats or they could end up in a rescue. I don't think its fair for you to breed her just book her in for a spay


----------



## VampiricLust (Mar 3, 2008)

1000's of cats are PTS every year as there are just not enough homes for them all.

The RSPCA, if called to any strays, will simply PTS without looking at any other options.

For every kitten she could have, you are taking a home away from a potential rescue cat. Rescue cats that could have been waiting years for a new loving home.

She is also at risk of catching some nasty illnesses if randomnly mated with the local tom, not to mention Feline Aids (Which if tested positive, most vets will PTS).

Put the poor girl out of her frustration and spay her.


----------



## Kalipha (Jul 15, 2009)

Just for future reference, males are neutered or castrated, only females are spayed 

To second what others have said, if you have homes lined up, tell them it's marvelous they're happy to take on another cat and point them at one of the many bursting rescue centres, and get your girl spayed without putting her through kittening.

Now, this is all gonna sound really hypocritical coming from registered breeders, which a lot of posters on here are. The main difference is that moggies and pedigrees are different 'markets' - someone looking for a pedigree ragdoll is unlikely to find what they're looking for in a rescue, so will seek out a breeder. Your pretty moggie is unlikely to give kittens any different to the thousands of domestic shorthairs in rescures waiting for homes.


----------



## fluffosaur (Dec 10, 2009)

If there are homes lined up you should point them in the direction of a cat shelter. There are thousands of kittens going through the doors of those places every year and a small but significant number end up being PTS because they are unable to find suitable homes for them.

PLEASE PLEASE have your cat spayed. Breeding off a domestic shorthair would be a terribly selfish thing to do. You risk your cats life and the lives of the kittens she may or may not produce. Even if you manage to find a stud cat there is no guarantee your girl will be able to handle the pregnancy or that it would be uncomplicated.

Please have her spayed.


----------



## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

Kalipha said:


> Just for future reference, males are neutered or castrated, only females are spayed


In the US the term is used for both, at least colloquially - I wonder if the OP is in the US?

The short answer is let her out, that is almost certainly what will end up happening anyway. But why bother? Promised homes often evaporate as soon as real kittens are there and last year certainly there seem to have been too many moggies bred for the available homes.

It is just possible that you might find a stud cat owner willing to allow your cat to use a pedigree stud in exchange for a kitten, if there is a beneficial outcross to be had (beneficial to the stud's breed I mean). Or there are some people who advertise on preloved in particular who are willing to let moggies use unregistered pedigree studs. If you want any such breeders to contact you, you need to say where you are!

Liz


----------



## amberpearl66 (Jan 11, 2010)

i have an entire shorthaired rex male


----------



## Saikou (Apr 2, 2008)

Do you have the facilities for accepting outside girls into your boy? If you just have him running round the house, it would very unwise to have a strange cat into your house, even if you confined them to one room, as you have no way of controlling the spread of any viruses brought in. A shut door won't do that. Even more unwise if you think your girl could be pregnant, and you may either have a pregnant girl or young kittens in the house.


----------



## Clare Ferris (Nov 26, 2009)

I would get her spayed, what are your reasond for wanting to mate her? because people want a kitten there are plenty of non pedigree kittens needing homes in rescue. As a breeder yes it does sound hypocritical of me but as someone else has said they are two completely different markets. It is not as straight forward as putting your girl to a boy and hoping for the best. There are sexually transmitted diseases which are rife in local wandering toms. Risks of birth difficulties and lack of milk produced by mum which will mean hand rearing which would be every two hours to start with. Extra food, litter, time etc The homes may not be definate ones. For the sake of having a litter before spay its not worth it. If you want to get into breeding properly then that is fine as long as you know what you are doing as there is alot of research involved to be able to rear kittens properly.


----------



## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

Sera said:


> Dear all,
> 
> Apologies if this is an inappropriate topic or if I sound wildly inexperienced - I am completely unaware as to whether what I am asking advice for is even a possibility!
> 
> ...


have her spayed :smile5:
if your friends etc are looking for kittens there's always plenty in rescues needing new homes.


----------



## CarolineH (Aug 4, 2009)

Do the responsible thing. Get her speyed. There is no need for yet more randomly bred kittens into a world already overflowing with unwanted cats and kittens. She does not need to have babies and she won't miss not having them.


----------



## happysaz133 (Jun 5, 2008)

Yes I would agree with others to have her spayed. Thousands of kittens are being put to sleep, older cats too, for lack of a home. Kittens are cute, but so much can go wrong, including females dying during birth. If you love your cat, why take the risk? Enjoy her as a pet


----------



## alal332 (Jan 13, 2010)

Ive just newly joined this site and have to say I was absolutely shocked when reading this. This forum (cat breeding) is (what I thought) a place to ask others in same situation for some help and advice. I have to agree that it would be very careless to let the poor kitty mate with any stray as she could catch a disease, but I am appauled by everyones response to the question which was "get her spayed". Maybe the owner...as she has stated, doesnt want that, and wants to give her kitty a chance to breed...dont critisize theres many of you here who have bred your cat. Maybe she is going about it the wrong way, but it sickens me that the only narrow minded answer that was given was to spay her! IF she is ready to take responsibility for the litter incase they dont find homes then I dont see why she cant find a suitable tom cat ( as long as you know the owner and its had all its shots)..


----------



## SEVEN_PETS (Aug 11, 2009)

alal332 said:


> Ive just newly joined this site and have to say I was absolutely shocked when reading this. This forum (cat breeding) is (what I thought) a place to ask others in same situation for some help and advice. I have to agree that it would be very careless to let the poor kitty mate with any stray as she could catch a disease, but I am appauled by everyones response to the question which was "get her spayed". Maybe the owner...as she has stated, doesnt want that, and wants to give her kitty a chance to breed...dont critisize theres many of you here who have bred your cat. Maybe she is going about it the wrong way, but it sickens me that the only narrow minded answer that was given was to spay her! IF she is ready to take responsibility for the litter incase they dont find homes then I dont see why she cant find a suitable tom cat ( as long as you know the owner and its had all its shots)..


if everyone gave their cat "a chance to breed" we would be living in a world full of stray cats and the rescues would be more overflowing than they are at present. I agree with everyone else, get her spayed and allow her to live a normal life.


----------



## alal332 (Jan 13, 2010)

We arent talking everyone though are we? there are 90 house in my street...and only 2 of them own a cat, my friend funnily enough is wanting to adopt a kitten..and there arent any available even at the shelter, all Im saying is, we have no right to tell another owner what to do with her cat.


----------



## SEVEN_PETS (Aug 11, 2009)

alal332 said:


> We arent talking everyone though are we? there are 90 house in my street...and only 2 of them own a cat, my friend funnily enough is wanting to adopt a kitten..and there arent any available even at the shelter, all Im saying is, we have no right to tell another owner what to do with her cat.


everyone who owns a cat


----------



## messyhearts (Feb 6, 2009)

I think the point was that the only way to get a moggie pregnant would be to let her roam & that by doing that it was unwise. IF there was someone with a male tom that wasn't going around spreading his seed & collecting STDs as he went then that would be the answer but it isn't so spaying is the answer unless OP wants a queen that has STDs AND kittens.


----------



## alal332 (Jan 13, 2010)

Well there are toms that dont go around spreading their seed and in returning retrieving stds...I for one have a tom, who is an indoor cat, and he is a very pleasent one at that too. This is turning into a battle, and I have no wish for that. I just thought it very rude for everyone to throw the words "GET IT SPAYED" at this person.


----------



## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

Perhaps you should offer her the use of your boy then? 

Liz


----------



## alal332 (Jan 13, 2010)

Perhaps thats a personal decision? although if the person asking was living near to myself I wouldnt actually mind.


----------



## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

Well since neither of you have said where you live ....


----------



## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

I agree that no one should tell someone what to do with their cat, unless the cat is in danger.
However there is a crisis here, with loads of cats and kittens being put down, through little fault of their own.
To breed more kittens in that climate is selfish and not really caring about cats in general, in my opinion.


----------



## alal332 (Jan 13, 2010)

lizward....its very unlikely that I would post where I live on here isnt it...IF I were to tell her Id message her...And however..what does that have to do with you? :S I have an indoor tom...Im sure plenty of people do...I was giving you an example incase you did not notice.


----------



## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

alal332 said:


> lizward....its very unlikely that I would post where I live on here isnt it...IF I were to tell her Id message her...And however..what does that have to do with you? :S I have an indoor tom...Im sure plenty of people do...I was giving you an example incase you did not notice.


if you have a look LOADS of people have their general whereabout on the right hand side of thier posts - where the rep and post numbers are etc. Personally, I think it is wierd when people ask for a stud (not this thread in particualr cos I think this lass actually approached the subject perfectly and asked for advice as well, seemed sensible etc) but don't say where they are - how can anyone help if they don't know where that person is?

Anyway, we are all entitled to our opinons but we should all also be nice to each other and try not to write our threads so they can be construed as appearing rude. Play nice now.


----------



## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

alal332 said:


> lizward....its very unlikely that I would post where I live on here isnt it...IF I were to tell her Id message her...And however..what does that have to do with you? :S I have an indoor tom...Im sure plenty of people do...I was giving you an example incase you did not notice.


Not at all unlikely, you don't seriously think that if you put you live in Devon, someone is going to track you down and do soemthing nasty to you, do you? If the OP lived in Aberdeen and the only willing stud owner lived in Kent, they would not be very likely to get together, but if they happened to live within a reasonable distance of one another, they might be able to come up with some mutually acceptable arrangement.

If someone comes on here wanting to know where they can find a stud or a kitten and doesn't give any idea of where they live, it is rather hard to give them much assistance!

Liz


----------



## alal332 (Jan 13, 2010)

lizward said:


> Not at all unlikely, you don't seriously think that if you put you live in Devon, someone is going to track you down and do soemthing nasty to you, do you? If the OP lived in Aberdeen and the only willing stud owner lived in Kent, they would not be very likely to get together, but if they happened to live within a reasonable distance of one another, they might be able to come up with some mutually acceptable arrangement.
> 
> If someone comes on here wanting to know where they can find a stud or a kitten and doesn't give any idea of where they live, it is rather hard to give them much assistance!
> 
> Liz


No, I do not believe that anyone would track me down...this is getting silly. However I think its a personal choice once again, perhaps I do not want to declare to the forum where I live? Perhaps the OP doesn't and will do it through message if anyone does declare they have a stud?

I think we are drifting off topic a little here. The fact is...the OP got attacked for asking advice...she was bombarded with the only 3 main words "get her spayed" and that is what caused my fury. People come here for help and advice, not to be told what to do with their cats.

By any chance, are you a breeder?


----------



## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

I think you are shouting at the wrong person - Lizward is the only one who DIDN'T say - get her spayed - she actually gave reasonable advice on how a stud could or couldn't be obtained - and asked 'why bother?' - nothing about being spayed!

And yes I am a breeder, I have one breeding queen (Birman) and 1 cross girlie, who ( even though she is absolutley beautiful) I would never breed from as the two markets are completely different.


----------



## PinkPaws (Jan 4, 2010)

I totally agree with what everyone else said. Get her spayed. I wanted to mate my kitten when she was old enough but I realised it's the wrong thing to do. I can't really say much because the person I'm getting my kitten off is kind of a BYB but there aren't kittens in our rescue shelters and at least I'm getting her spayed rather than someone else buying from a BYB and then breeding her to make more kittens.

Like people said, there are thousands of cats and kitten PTS because they can't find homes. If your cat has 6 kittens and 6 people buy them instead of going to a shelter then you've made 6 kittens have less chance of getting a home and more chance of being PTS.

You're right we can't tell you what to do with you cat and NOBODY is condemning you. We are trying to get you to see reason, think of all those poor homeless kitties in the shelter, they need a home too. 

I know that seeing your cat give birth and having a litter of little kittens may seem great but there's so much more to it than that, I realised this and honestly it's just not worth it  Plus the health risks you're taking, please get her spayed. I'm not telling you what to do, I'm asking you.

If you want to breed pedigrees and you have the time and money then get yourself a pedigree queen and then you can still see kittens and not add to the problem we have with overpopulation.

Please remember, nobody is being mean or telling you what to do. We all just are very passionate about animals and are upset by how many get euthanized because they can't find a home. It's just not fair


----------



## alal332 (Jan 13, 2010)

This is my last post, and probably the last on this site after seeing the poor OP getting ripped apart for asking advice.

But just to clear things up, I wasn't shouting (not that you could hear me). 

And sera I hope you figure out the right thing to do.


----------



## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

alal332 said:


> No, I do not believe that anyone would track me down...this is getting silly. However I think its a personal choice once again, perhaps I do not want to declare to the forum where I live? Perhaps the OP doesn't and will do it through message if anyone does declare they have a stud?


Possibly, but it's unlikely that anyone who has a stud they would be willing to let such a person use, would say so here - the reaction from most would be rather negative!



> By any chance, are you a breeder?


I am indeed a breeder. Why?

Liz


----------



## Acacia86 (Dec 30, 2008)

If you are certain of mating her then please please find a tom that someone owns and is very healthy with some tests done and cleared.

Please don't just let her out, she could get serious and sometimes fatal diseases which will cost you a lot of money every month for treatment, she has a higher chance of being hit by car due to queens travelling very far to find a mate. She could be injured in fight etc etc

I would reccommend getting her spayed, but no-one on here can force you, so getting the right tom is of absolute importance.

Also please please do all the research about breeding cats, make sure you know exactly what is involved with every part. 

There can be problems with kittening, some needing vet treatment (out of hours....ceasers = a lot of cash) kittens dying, mum dying in birth, mum rejecting kittens etc etc etc 

So all of this needs to researched and taken in........BEFORE she gets pregnant.


----------



## ellie8024 (May 4, 2009)

i would also recommend spaying as the more she calls the more danger you are putting her in. Just a note to the people who think we are trying to tell the OP what to do.. she actually asked in her post whether she should just get her cat spayed


----------



## Acacia86 (Dec 30, 2008)

Oh and good breeders will also send their kittens to their new homes, fully flead, wormed, with at least their first vaccination done (some breeders do both Vaccs as they don't allow the kittens to go before 13 weeks old), a vet certificate to prove they have been checked and are healthy, a kitten pack etc

So all in all its a very costly ''experience''


----------



## Acacia86 (Dec 30, 2008)

ellie8024 said:


> i would also recommend spaying as the more she calls the more danger you are putting her in. Just a note to the people who think we are trying to tell the OP what to do.. she actually asked in her post whether she should just get her cat spayed


I agree, queens who left unspayed and unmated will drive themsleves crazy and it is very unhealthy to allow this to happen.

Some will get aggressive due to stress, some will stop eating, some will get depressed the list in endless.

It is much kinder and more ethical to get a pet cat spayed/neutered.


----------



## PinkPaws (Jan 4, 2010)

alal332 said:


> This is my last post, and probably the last on this site after seeing the poor OP getting ripped apart for asking advice.
> 
> But just to clear things up, I wasn't shouting (not that you could hear me).
> 
> And sera I hope you figure out the right thing to do.


Please, this is getting ridiculous now. You are way over reacting, the OP did not get ripped apart. She got advice.. the advice was don't breed your cat, get her spayed, she even got reasons why we gave her that advice. I did not feel that anyone was forceful or aggressive, you don't even know if the OP feels that way either. All this fuss for nothing.


----------



## Clare Ferris (Nov 26, 2009)

alal332 said:


> Ive just newly joined this site and have to say I was absolutely shocked when reading this. This forum (cat breeding) is (what I thought) a place to ask others in same situation for some help and advice. I have to agree that it would be very careless to let the poor kitty mate with any stray as she could catch a disease, but I am appauled by everyones response to the question which was "get her spayed". Maybe the owner...as she has stated, doesnt want that, and wants to give her kitty a chance to breed...dont critisize theres many of you here who have bred your cat. Maybe she is going about it the wrong way, but it sickens me that the only narrow minded answer that was given was to spay her! IF she is ready to take responsibility for the litter incase they dont find homes then I dont see why she cant find a suitable tom cat ( as long as you know the owner and its had all its shots)..


The replys are what people feel is best for the cat. Most of the people on here are breeders who have atleast some knowledge and I would like to think breed respectably with their cats having the necessary tests and being free from disease. They also know what to do when the cat gives birth and how to rear kittens correctly from having done alot of research I would assume. There is a big difference in someone choosing to breed cats (pedigree) as a hobby and doing things properly than a pet owner wanting their cat to have a litter before being spayed who has no experience or knowledge on the subject. It is not something we can teach her over night on a forum. Maybe she did not realise the potential implications to her cats health, which are not good if she allows the cat out to mate which I think she is already allowing the cat outside unspayed???
What she does is upto her but no one is going to tell her to go ahead and mate her theres enough homeless cats out there already. If people want a kitten there are plenty in rescue, maybe they are just hoping for a freebie hence why they are all so keen?? until the novelty wares of and then it gets dumbed in a rescue later ending up being put to sleep as does happen if a home is not found. Its not worth the risk in my opinion but if she wants to mate her cat then she will find it very difficult as most caring cat owners have their cats altered and if they dont then I seriously doubt they care enough to test for infectious disease, vaccinate, health check the cat. Her only hope really would be finding a stud owner of a pedigree but again she would be very lucky.
It is her choice at the end of the day but she will struggle to find a nice, healthy cat free from disease who has not already been castrated .


----------



## Clare Ferris (Nov 26, 2009)

alal332 said:


> We arent talking everyone though are we? there are 90 house in my street...and only 2 of them own a cat, my friend funnily enough is wanting to adopt a kitten..and there arent any available even at the shelter, all Im saying is, we have no right to tell another owner what to do with her cat.


Because its the wrong time of year for kittens to be available. Would she not like a young adult or maybe she could wait till summer.


----------



## doogpoh (Jan 8, 2010)

i don't want to get caught up in the disagrement on this thread, but no one seemed to mention the fact this cat is just a kitten and only 6 months old!!!, [if they have then sorry i must have missed it]. that's reason enought not to breed from her isn't it?


----------



## Clare Ferris (Nov 26, 2009)

doogpoh said:


> i don't want to get caught up in the disagrement on this thread, but no one seemed to mention the fact this cat is just a kitten and only 6 months old!!!, [if they have then sorry i must have missed it]. that's reason enought not to breed from her isn't it?


Most definately...I missed that I think??? Well that is the problem with most pet owners wanting to have a litter they think once they start calling it is ok to mate them when its not


----------



## Cat Lover Chris (Jan 11, 2009)

Children, this is all getting out of hand.
Toys are getting thrown out of prams.

Now everyone, calm down. The person asked for advice; various of you have offered an opinion; leave it at that.
If he/she wants to take that advice great; if they don't, then let's hope the kitties that end up being born do get good homes.
Think positive; glass half full, not half empty !!!!


----------



## doogpoh (Jan 8, 2010)

She said the cats were roughly 6 months in the original thread. And only mentioned this as no one else had, and is not meant to be abusive in anyway, just pointing it out as it can cause alot of problems for a kitten to have kittens, and will more than likely stunt her growth, not know how to care for the kittens and may have problems delivering and sure there be other problems related to her age aswell. Maybe the lady is unaware it's to young?. was just trying to help!


----------



## Acacia86 (Dec 30, 2008)

doogpoh said:


> She said the cats were roughly 6 months in the original thread. And only mentioned this as no one else had, and is not meant to be abusive in anyway, just pointing it out as it can cause alot of problems for a kitten to have kittens, and will more than likely stunt her growth, not know how to care for the kittens and may have problems delivering and sure there be other problems related to her age aswell. Maybe the lady is unaware it's to young?. was just trying to help!


Indeed! I am shocked at myself and the others that failed to pick this up 

I guess we were so caught up in ''don't breed'' that we failed to comment on the age of the queen :blush:

And i do very much agree that 6 months is way way to young. She is a kitten herself.


----------



## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

I was assuming that she didn't mean "right now".

Liz


----------



## fluffosaur (Dec 10, 2009)

I think it's clear the OP is never coming back. They only made 1 post.


----------



## westie~ma (Mar 16, 2009)

I'll close this thread now.


----------

