# some advice needed



## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

hi all 
i have a dog who is 56 days pregnant from mating when we took her for a scan vet said she was 7 days behind mating dates 
i am just wondering should i go by her mating dates or scan dates


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## claire & the gang (Nov 18, 2010)

pcs969804 said:


> hi all
> i have a dog who is 56 days pregnant from mating when we took her for a scan vet said she was 7 days behind mating dates
> i am just wondering should i go by her mating dates or scan dates


if you are going off mating dates rather then ovulation dates your vets scan could be more accurate. The semen could be retained in the bitch for a week until ovulation which might account for the pups being smaller for dates.

I`m sure someone will correct me if i`m wrong  I`d just keep an eye on her for now & when she gets to the dates 63 from mating you can always ask your vet to reaccess her to see if she looks near to delivering


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## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

Go by mating, not scans..... scans are inaccurate at counting, never mind at getting the dates.... after all.... most go on size.... every breed is different, each puppy is different size, yet they were all conceived within a few hours of each other.


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> hi all
> i have a dog who is 56 days pregnant from mating when we took her for a scan vet said she was 7 days behind mating dates
> i am just wondering should i go by her mating dates or scan dates


Good luck  i would go with the mating date

My girl is on day 57 did think it was all go last night but she was having me on, just a waiting game now


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

thanks for all ur replies 

i will go by mating dates and see how we go if worried i will take her to my vets 

dont think it will be long thou as she got milk in teats which is leakin now and again and also her vulva is lookin soft and swollen and shes had some discharge


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Aww bless her, are you taking her temp? what breed is she?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

no not takin her temp as she wont let me 
she is a staffie


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> no not takin her temp as she wont let me
> she is a staffie


Aww my bitch was not happy with me taking at first  but she's got used to it now bless her

Did you see lots of puppies on the scan?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

she is like a beached whale lol
she has trouble walkin upstairs as her stomach touches each step 
when went went for 1st scan vet saw 4 pups on 2nd scan he saw 6 pups but said he thinks she might still be hidin some 
so we know she havin at least 6 


i have attached a pic of her when she had 9 days 2 go


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Bless her she's soooo big... think it will be this weekend she's has them

and i think she will have 7 or 8


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## shazalhasa (Jul 21, 2009)

bloody hell, I can't get over the size on her boobies  hope the pups have got big mouths lol


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## Guest (Jan 6, 2011)

Bloody hell....she's huge.

What breed is she? Her nipples are massive.


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## claire & the gang (Nov 18, 2010)

shazalhasa said:


> bloody hell, I can't get over the size on her boobies  hope the pups have got big mouths lol


lol i`m just glad to see another preggie dog with huge boobies too...i thought my Diz was a freak of nature with hers...either that or she was gonna audition for page 3 hehe

Your staffies tum looks sooo big bless her...bet she will be relieved to have them out


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## cav (May 23, 2008)

as she had pups before cus those teats are huge!!


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

lol yeah those boobs are like organ stops!!is this her first litter?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

she is a staffie 
yes her boobies r huge as well as her stomach she sure got a belly full this time we know shes havin at least 6 pups 
no its not her 1st litter it will be her 3rd and final litter


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## Guest (Jan 6, 2011)

How old is she?

When was her last litter?

Sorry for all the questions just I have never seen a dog with nipples that big.:lol:


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## cav (May 23, 2008)

that explains the size off the teats nothing more to say on this thread


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

flippin heck shes big! how old is she?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

she will be 5 in april 
and her last litter was a yr ago on 26th jan


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> she will be 5 in april
> and her last litter was a yr ago on 26th jan


is she & the stud L2 hga and HC tested?

my uncle/cousins owns 9 of these crazy beasts lol! and bull terrriers, although they have never bred.


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

hi all 
ive tryed again with takin her temp 
with some luck this time its come up at 37.6 is this a good sign she be whelpin soon


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## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> hi all
> ive tryed again with takin her temp
> with some luck this time its come up at 37.6 is this a good sign she be whelpin soon


You have to build a pattern of temperatures.... the temperature itself is pretty much irrelevant.... the relevant bit is the drop. Some bitches have a core temp lower than others, and most thermometers have a degree of inaccuracy and can be as much as 0.5 degree out.

Take the temperature at regular intervals per day (from day 60 I take it 6 times per day, including the night) day 62 it is taken 8 times per day.... once the temperature is seen to decrease it is taken every hour until "the drop" is seen..... you expect a drop of about 0.8 degree or more


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

ok then thanks for the info

do u know what sort of temp it should drop 2 before whelpin would start


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## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

expect a drop of bout 0.8 degree or more from her average body temperature


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

thanks i will keep an eye on her temp now i know 

ive notice last couple days shes had a stringy discharge very time she goes wee 

and shes not eaten her breakfast so far today

and shes just been sick twice


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## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

Labour sounds imminent then.


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> thanks i will keep an eye on her temp now i know
> 
> ive notice last couple days shes had a stringy discharge very time she goes wee
> 
> ...


Hows she doing now?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

hi archielee

shes slept most of the day and has just eaten some of her food

not showing any other signs at the mo


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> hi archielee
> 
> shes slept most of the day and has just eaten some of her food
> 
> not showing any other signs at the mo


Aww bit like my girl them  what day she on now its it 58?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

yh she day 58 by mating dates 

but by vets scan shes a wk less they said she was a wk less when she had her 2nd litter but still whelped on day 63 

just a waiting game i think shes gonna keep me guessing shes so huge bless her think she be glad once shes had them all 

we know shes having at least 6 but vet thinks she was still hidin some when we had scan


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

well still no sign shes gonna have them yet lol

shes loss some discharge again today 

her milk is startin 2 come in 

temp 37.6

her vulva is starting to swell so hopefully it wont be much longer before she has them


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## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

Are you doing the temperature regularly?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

hi tanya 

yh doin them reguarly stayin at bout 37.6 to 37.8 no lower


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## shazalhasa (Jul 21, 2009)

I don't rate vets scans after the fiasco with our litter. The first scan they wouldn't confirm a pregnancy, just said that they saw a couple of blobs but not sure if there was anything in them, then 2 weeks later they told us to expect a few but not even a rough number. Even the scan was pretty rubbish, they took a photo of a spine... wow !


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## claire & the gang (Nov 18, 2010)

shazalhasa said:


> I don't rate vets scans after the fiasco with our litter. The first scan they wouldn't confirm a pregnancy, just said that they saw a couple of blobs but not sure if there was anything in them, then 2 weeks later they told us to expect a few but not even a rough number. Even the scan was pretty rubbish, they took a photo of a spine... wow !


Similar to our scan...although they confirmed pregnancy with the first scan, the second two weeks later, she was unable to give any further idea of numbers. She also said pups looked to be a week bigger than dates, questioned if i was sure of mating dates. There is absolutely no chance of her being a week more as i know that dates she was mated & although i do have an intact dog here my house was like a prison with all the security gates & i always kept them a 2 gate distance apart.

I don`t think many vets probably do scans frequently enough or on a variety of breeds the be experts in this.


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

temp so far today is 37.1 
managed 2 just take it as she would let me early has been a bit restless as well cant seem 2 get comfy


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> temp so far today is 37.1
> managed 2 just take it as she would let me early has been a bit restless as well cant seem 2 get comfy


Has her temp dropped a little ?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

yh it has a little before went to bed last night it was 37.8


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Yeah my girl is doing the same

All this waiting is hard work :lol:


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

yh it is hard work lol

hate this part of the pregnancy 

shes so big thou bless her i be glad when shes had them so she can breath normally lol and not be used as a football pitch with all the pups inside her at mo


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

temp last night 37.8

temp now 36.8

but not showin any signs


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## cav (May 23, 2008)

did you keep back from your other litters?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

not from the 1st litter i didnt but i kept a bitch from the 2nd litter 

wasnt goin 2 but she took a likin 2 me and followed me everywhere i tried 2 keep distance but i feel in love with her shes so good shes not a dog dog thou shes a peoples dog 

but dont get me wrong when i say shes not a dog dog shes not aggressive 2 other dogs shes just not interested in them


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## cav (May 23, 2008)

do you own the sire

i have a staffie she is a great dog but she is spayed and pet only.


what about this litter are you keeping any and have you got homes lined up hope you dont mind the questions but there are so many unwanted staffies that need a good home.


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> temp last night 37.8
> 
> temp now 36.8
> 
> but not showin any signs


Oooo temp going down


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

yes i have homes lined up for them 

yes temp goin down and shes loss some more discharge today as well 

gonna take temp in hr again


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> yes i have homes lined up for them
> 
> yes temp goin down and shes loss some more discharge today as well
> 
> gonna take temp in hr again


is she & the stud L2 hga and HC tested? and kc reg?

my uncle/cousins owns 9 of these crazy beasts lol! and bull terrriers, although they have never bred


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> yes i have homes lined up for them
> 
> yes temp goin down and shes loss some more discharge today as well
> 
> gonna take temp in hr again


Whats her temp doing?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

hi archielee

just took her temp again and its 36.9

gone up .01 but still low


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> hi archielee
> 
> just took her temp again and its 36.9
> 
> gone up .01 but still low


Yeah my girl was doing the same, up a bit then down a bit


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

archielee said:


> Yeah my girl was doing the same, up a bit then down a bit


how is she doing now

is she still digging about


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> how is she doing now
> 
> is she still digging about


Yes some digging then back to sleep


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Whats her temp doing now?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

archielee said:


> Whats her temp doing now?


just taken it 37.0 now


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Has it done back up more?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

archielee said:


> Has it done back up more?


yh archielee

its gone up .2 degrees


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> yh archielee
> 
> its gone up .2 degrees


oh she will have to hold on to them for a bit longer then


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

archielee said:


> oh she will have to hold on to them for a bit longer then


yh looks that way

but not so bad as shes only day 61


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## vizzy24 (Aug 31, 2008)

Good luck I hope all goes well for you


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## Starlite (Sep 9, 2009)

Darn you lady get those pups out lol!


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## vizzy24 (Aug 31, 2008)

morning how is she this morning?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

congrats on ur 3 pups archielee

rosie had her pups today as well shes had 8 pups so far x


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

wow 8 puppies thats going to be hard work 

anymore yet?


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## claire & the gang (Nov 18, 2010)

pcs969804 said:


> rosie had her pups today as well shes had 8 pups so far x


aww congratz to you & Rosie...no wonder she looked ready to burst with all those

is that her finished at 8 or are you expecting anymore?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

rosie had just the 8 pups in end 

5 boys and 3 girls


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## vizzy24 (Aug 31, 2008)

Congratulations we had a litter of 8 they were great fun:thumbup:


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## Pointermum (Jul 2, 2010)

Taylorbaby said:


> is she & the stud L2 hga and HC tested? and kc reg?
> 
> my uncle/cousins owns 9 of these crazy beasts lol! and bull terrriers, although they have never bred


I guessing thats a no seen as you've asked it twice and been ignored twice  

OP do you show staffies and are these KC reg health tested pups??

OR just yet more Staffies to end up in a home to be PTS in a years time


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## SpringerHusky (Nov 6, 2008)

Awww bless, you'll have to get pics up :thumbup:


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

Pointermum said:


> I guessing thats a no seen as you've asked it twice and been ignored twice
> 
> OP do you show staffies and are these KC reg health tested pups??
> 
> OR just yet more Staffies to end up in a home to be PTS in a years time


head and brick wall? Nail on the head? and all that! Disgusing thought this forum was meant to PROMOTE responsible breeding  I cant believe people would congratulate the arrival of more staffies so 8 new pups - whats that about 100 plus that will have been pts around the country to day !!


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

the dog r health tested for ur information and all pups have got homes already


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

Funny that you didnt ask the first times it was asked! If their tested I take it you wont have a problem saying what their tested for, where they were tested & the costs  After all it only the sort of questions potentail owners will ask.


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## CheekoAndCo (Jun 17, 2009)

Devil-Dogz said:


> Funny that you didnt ask the first times it was asked! If their tested I take it you wont have a problem saying what their tested for, where they were tested & the costs  After all it only the sort of questions potentail owners will ask.


And the KC names of both parents too? I'm guessing they are KC reg..!


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## noushka05 (Mar 28, 2008)

pcs969804 said:


> the dog r health tested for ur information and all pups have got homes already


i really hope so, because the staffy rescue crisis is heartbreaking


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

God, what is it with jumping down peoples throats!  

She hasnt said she has or hasnt, your all just presuming! 

Dont you think having pups is stressful enough without adding to it. :frown:


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

kiara said:


> God, what is it with jumping down peoples throats!
> 
> She hasnt said she has or hasnt, your all just presuming!
> 
> Dont you think having pups is stressful enough without adding to it. :frown:


Its fine she can clear it up then cant she and I for one will say sorry! 

Do you think picking up the bits from these types of breeders is non stressful?? Believe me its not, if you dont like my posts dont read them I for one will NOT clap my hands a someone who is breeding for no vaild reason from dogs that should be neatured. I wanna know what a bitch has to offer the breed thats so good to have 3 litters, who doesnt show or compete in any way with her dog thats bad enough!  I stand proud not supporting the unethical - shame most others on this thread cant!


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## CheekoAndCo (Jun 17, 2009)

Devil-Dogz said:


> Its fine she can clear it up then cant she and I for one will say sorry!
> 
> Do you think picking up the bits from these types of breeders is non stressful?? Believe me its not, if you dont like my posts dont read them I for one will NOT clap my hands a someone who is breeding for no vaild reason from dogs that should be neatured. I wanna know what a bitch has to offer the breed thats so good to have 3 litters, who doesnt show or compete in any way with her dog thats bad enough!  I stand proud not supporting the unethical - shame most others on this thread cant!


As soon as people see pups any ethical breeding thoughts seem to go from their head!


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

CheekoAndCo said:


> As soon as people see pups any ethical breeding thoughts seem to go from their head!


or they just dont care like they seem to claim - next time I see someone one moaning about bad breeders I will have a right mind to point them to threads where they have supported EXACTLY what their moaning about!


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## cav (May 23, 2008)

nothing wrong with staffies guys:thumbup:


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

if anybody has read any of my threads then they will know im passionate about this breed and do not condone irresponsible breeding but I just don't think its fair to be commenting without the facts.


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## Pointermum (Jul 2, 2010)

noushka05 said:


> i really hope so, because the staffy rescue crisis is heartbreaking


so do i 



kiara said:


> God, what is it with jumping down peoples throats!
> 
> She hasn't said she has or hasn't, your all just presuming!
> 
> Dint you think having pups is stressful enough without adding to it. :frown:


It's the dogs 3rd litter so i think she should understand what the work involved should be. She's ignored health questions several times, which i can only guess means there not health tested. With staffies at crisis point and she's has 3 litters unless it's some top show champion with full health test there is *NO REASON ON EARTH IMHO WHY SHE SHOULD BREED HER*


Devil-Dogz said:


> Its fine she can clear it up then cant she and I for one will say sorry!
> 
> Do you think picking up the bits from these types of breeders is non stressful?? Believe me its not, if you dint like my posts don't read them I for one will NOT clap my hands a someone who is breeding for no vaild reason from dogs that should be neatured. I wanna know what a bitch has to offer the breed thats so good to have 3 litters, who doesnt show or compete in any way with her dog thats bad enough!  I stand proud not supporting the unethical - shame most others on this thread cant!


once again i fully agree 


Devil-Dogz said:


> or they just dont care like they seem to claim - next time I see someone one moaning about bad breeders I will have a right mind to point them to threads where they have supported EXACTLY what their moaning about!


I can't believe people who moan have supported this litter


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## cav (May 23, 2008)

I dont think she as had much support in this thread


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## Pointermum (Jul 2, 2010)

cav said:


> nothing wrong with staffies guys:thumbup:


we never said there was (my mum has one) just with 100's being PTS weekly why breed more when there's not enough homes for the ones already alive, there just added to the problem.


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

cav said:


> I dont think she as had much support in this thread


anyone congratulating on new puppies is supporting them in my eyes.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> if anybody has read any of my threads then they will know im passionate about this breed and do not condone irresponsible breeding but I just don't think its fair to be commenting without the facts.


No one can know the 'facts'. People lie on forums all the time - say all sorts of things that aren't true - it's happened before and it'll happen again. I find people posts and omissions usually tell more about them than what they actually say and claim 



> Disgusing thought this forum was meant to PROMOTE responsible breeding I cant believe people would congratulate the arrival of more staffies so 8 new pups


Couldn't agree more, especially when it's from people who are breeders themselves 

So much for responsible breeding


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## cav (May 23, 2008)

Pointermum said:


> we never said there was (my mum has one) just with 100's being PTS weekly why breed more when there's not enough homes for the ones already alive, there just added to the problem.


I agree and i dont as for me if they were not bred ....where do i get one from a rescue- not a option for me with young children.

It is the breeders that a churning poor standard,no health tests,no kc i have a problem with.


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## cav (May 23, 2008)

Devil-Dogz said:


> anyone congratulating on new puppies is supporting them in my eyes.


year but there is only 4 posts not that many when you look how many come in this section im not saying i agree with this either.


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## vizzy24 (Aug 31, 2008)

Most people that bother to stay on this forum care very deeply about ethical breeding. The puppies are here and whether they are health tested or not will not change the fact they are born. IF they are not health tested then surely it is more important to educate people to the facts about breeding and health testing so that hopefully they will decide to either cease breeding their dog or health test the litters parents in the future. If we slam everyone on here then all they will do is stop coming on the forum. This wont stop the breeding the only thing that will stop that is educating people. So you may think that being aggresive towards them and telling them whats what will help, all it will do is drive people away before you can educate them in an adult manner.Driving people away from a source of eduacting them will not help this countries problem with overbreeding. Yes people should know, but fact is they dont. Are you more likely to listen to advice from a freind or from someone who is telling you what a bad thing you are doing? Have your opinion by all means but at least make sure they apply to this person first.This is speculation you have asked if they are health tested and then once given your reply you have almost accused them of not telling the truth. If someone is not telling the truth it will come out eventually and then say your piece.


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

Completely agree with vizzy - the pups are on the planet and that's that! If the breeder now needs help - for the sake of the pups - then she should be given as much as possible and not treated like a naughty school girl. 

By all means comment on health testing and rescue but she hasn't done anything illegal, she's not a criminal who's broken the law. Health tests are not mandatory even though desirable and the KC will still continue to take litter registration money without health tests or from breeds that are flooding rescues - a fact Dogs Today commented about in their "Staffies In Crisis" article November edition! 

If the OP now has problems with the pups where can she turn? She won't come here as she's already been put "in her place" by the high and mighty!

Why not complain to the KC for registering non health tested dogs and earning a fortune for doing so, they are not completely blameless you know - bloody money making machine!

Dog lovers eh? - hmm I wonder!!!


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## Pointermum (Jul 2, 2010)

vizzy24 said:


> Most people that bother to stay on this forum care very deeply about ethical breeding. The puppies are here and whether they are health tested or not will not change the fact they are born. IF they are not health tested then surely it is more important to educate people to the facts about breeding and health testing so that hopefully they will decide to either cease breeding their dog or health test the litters parents in the future. If we slam everyone on here then all they will do is stop coming on the forum. This wont stop the breeding the only thing that will stop that is educating people. So you may think that being aggresive towards them and telling them whats what will help, all it will do is drive people away before you can educate them in an adult manner.Driving people away from a source of eduacting them will not help this countries problem with overbreeding. Yes people should know, but fact is they dont. Are you more likely to listen to advice from a freind or from someone who is telling you what a bad thing you are doing? Have your opinion by all means but at least make sure they apply to this person first.This is speculation you have asked if they are health tested and then once given your reply you have almost accused them of not telling the truth. If someone is not telling the truth it will come out eventually and then say your piece.


She was asked the question a few times and chose to ignore it, which speaks volumes in my eyes. If no one challenges her over this litter and is all well done congratulations , then she will continue to think it's ok. She's already said she's never planned to keep a pup from any litters , then why she breeding?


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

Who is anyone on here to challenge her - who exactly do you think you are????


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## Pointermum (Jul 2, 2010)

Malmum said:


> Who is anyone on here to challenge her - who exactly do you think you are????


I'm someone on a PUBLIC forum with freedom of speech


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> Most people that bother to stay on this forum care very deeply about ethical breeding.


Mmmm........ are we talking about the same forum 



> The puppies are here and whether they are health tested or not will not change the fact they are born


And the OP got polite advice - but I don't think bringing in yet more staffies when there is a crisis in rescue is worth congratulations.



> IF they are not health tested then surely it is more important to educate people to the facts about breeding and health testing so that hopefully they will decide to either cease breeding their dog or health test the litters parents in the future.


There is plenty of info easily available however, if someone is really ignorant about then yes, education can help, but I think it is naive to think that everyone wants educating - most really don't care or think they know best or will take the risk. Just a look at the CC thread will show you how 'educated' people want to become. Most don't because the lure of puppies, whether for love, the 'experience' or the money is too tempting.


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## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

Heartbreaking to see more Staffies being born when so many are being killed everyday. 

I just hope that the OP is keeping the mum and not gonna abandon her to rescue now that she has had 3 litters out of her.


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

Pointermum response -Someone who declines to help a potential bitch or pup in need because things haven't been done the way you see fit, as you have obviously been faultless your entire life with dogs you may have owned!

I can say I haven't and have learned by my mistakes, as a human being I do make mistakes and i'm never to old to learn.

What I find really sickening is how a breeder I know - who wanted to use my Flynn at one year old, no health tests and far too young, has so many friends in the breeding and show world - why? because she's in "the loop", doesn't health test but it's who she knows! Yet anyone else would be a BYB - not her for some reason!

Hyporcrites that *do* know better where as some on here don't.

Freedom of speech is one thing, slagging someone off and belittling them on a public forum is quite something else and shameful when it may be in the interest of a dog (any dog) to offer advice!


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

I have kept tight lipped on this thread.

After she said that this was the dogs 3rd litter I vannished out of the thread.

Its unlikely that this dog is a champ or has something to offer the breed. Its unlikely that the stud or the bitch is health tested and its just as unlikely that they are KC reg.

However the deed has been done...lets hope the OP keeps her word and this is the dogs final litter.


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

Malmum said:


> Who is anyone on here to challenge her - who exactly do you think you are????


LOL - another one that doesnt mind sitting back watching BYBers! Great it gets better and better. Me I am a dog lover, who will only ever support decent breeders and stand up for the dogs that find their selfs in the wrong hands!"


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

Devil-Dogz said:


> LOL - another one that doesnt mind sitting back watching BYBers! Great it gets better and better. Me I am a dog lover, who will only ever support decent breeders and stand up for the dogs that find their selfs in the wrong hands!"


Twaddle!!!


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

ohhh and btw I have helped many breeders on here who I havent agreed with for the sake of the bitch as anyone that was around when I first was


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

Malmum said:


> Twaddle!!!


what ever- you think I care what you think? I stick by my love for animals and the responsible owning and breeding of them. You think I care about someone that supports the irresponsible or their opinion of me.. pfft never!


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

Devil-Dogz said:


> what ever- you think I care what you think? I stick by my love for animals and the responsible owning and breeding of them. You think I care about someone that supports the irresponsible or their opinion of me.. pfft never!


Don't exactly know how you rowed yourself into this - my post was NOT directed at you. Get over yourself!


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

Considering you quoted me and said twaddle that would be where I got it from !!! I dont need to get over my self - certainly not when told to by someone that supports BYBers


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## Pointermum (Jul 2, 2010)

Slagging her off? i merely questioned her as to why would she breed her staffie when it's a breed in crisis. Most over responses have been directed at what other people have posted. I wanted to comment on this thread days ago but didn't it only got to me when she continued to ignore the health question and then people congratulating her on her 3rd litter of over bred staffies


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## topseyturvey (Feb 1, 2010)

So lets get this straight then,
The only decent breeders out there are those that breed for the show ring, and of course no decent breeders pups would end up going through rescue would they.

I'm not stupid enough to believe that,infact I know first hand of a family that brought a pup from a breeder who was on the breed clubs commitee,the dog needed to be rehomed,no fault of the families,went back to the breeder,didn't want to know,a fully health tested dog from good show lines ended up in a rescue!


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

Pointermum said:


> Slagging her off? i merely questioned her as to why would she breed her staffie when it's a breed in crisis. Most over responses have been directed at what other people have posted. I wanted to comment on this thread days ago but didn't it only got to me when she continued to ignore the health question and then people congratulating her on her 3rd litter of over bred staffies


Dont you feel you need to explain your self. Jeez your the good guy here - whos trying to help promote responsible breeding, and not the dodgy under hand style.  Cant believe you have been made to feel you should explain your self.
I also wonder how many of these people that think this breeder should be laid some slack works in rescue and sees the amount of staffs something in


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

topseyturvey said:


> So lets get this straight then,
> The only decent breeders out there are those that breed for the show ring, and of course no decent breeders pups would end up going through rescue would they.
> 
> I'm not stupid enough to believe that,infact I know first hand of a family that brought a pup from a breeder who was on the breed clubs commitee,the dog needed to be rehomed,no fault of the families,went back to the breeder,didn't want to know,a fully health tested dog from good show lines ended up in a rescue!


Reputation of the breeder doesnt always count for something. I dont know who your post is direct at and where its come from? no one has said anything near the above?
There is no need to produce litter after litter of staffs, from non tested dogs - are you aware of the breed health issues, and what pain and discomfort affected dogs many feel? Doubt that!

Breeders should be aiming for something to produce working, show ect ect pups from the best dogs they can find with good results - not shoving two dogs together nilly willy.

Did you also know that as the breed requires health tests - if a pup went on to be affected because the breeder failed to test both parents the new owner could take said breeder to court and most likely WIN the case. 

Its also rather rare for a show dog to end up in rescue, thats talking from experience - anyways why arent breeders microchipping puppies and putting them selves down as second contact? That way their puppies are less likely to ever remain in rescue if found strayed or dumped!


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

topseyturvey said:


> So lets get this straight then,
> The only decent breeders out there are those that breed for the show ring, and of course no decent breeders pups would end up going through rescue would they.
> 
> I'm not stupid enough to believe that,infact I know first hand of a family that brought a pup from a breeder who was on the breed clubs commitee,the dog needed to be rehomed,no fault of the families,went back to the breeder,didn't want to know,a fully health tested dog from good show lines ended up in a rescue!


No one's saying that health tested dogs dont end up in rescues but I am a firm believer that NO over bred dogs should be being bred at the moment unless from health tested parents and from good lines.

You cant go and pick up a staff from a flat in the center of Manchester (for example) and a year later breed it and for a second think that your pups are going to be as healthy as those breeders who know the linage and health test and spend years researching the breed before breeding.

Good breeders will accept a dog back.

Good breeders will also vet new homes so that when the pups are ready they go to the best homes possible.

BYB's put adds up and as soon as someone calls say "come collect it on ____date" thats it....

The club breeder you are on about was obviously not a good breeder.


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## topseyturvey (Feb 1, 2010)

My post was aimed at no one,I do get sick of hearing about BYB's and about how many of there pups will end up in rescue,well bred dogs also end up in rescue,kc reg dogs the list goes on and on.

I saw a post on this thread about how these pups may end up in rescue in a years time,yes some of them may,they may not,no one knows for sure even *good breeders do not know* if the puppy they have bred and sold will have a home for life.


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## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

topseyturvey said:


> So lets get this straight then,
> The only decent breeders out there are those that breed for the show ring, and of course no decent breeders pups would end up going through rescue would they.
> 
> I'm not stupid enough to believe that,infact I know first hand of a family that brought a pup from a breeder who was on the breed clubs commitee,the dog needed to be rehomed,no fault of the families,went back to the breeder,didn't want to know,a fully health tested dog from good show lines ended up in a rescue!


No one is saying that are they?
What angers me is the fact that it's Staffies that she is breeding and that it is the dogs 3rd litter, when there is a huge problem with abandoned and unwanted Staffies in particular. 
There really is no need to be breeding them in such an irresponsible way when there are perfectly healthy dogs being put to sleep every day because there are not enough rescue spaces for them.


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

topseyturvey said:


> My post was aimed at no one,I do get sick of hearing about BYB's and about how many of there pups will end up in rescue,well bred dogs also end up in rescue,kc reg dogs the list goes on and on.
> 
> I saw a post on this thread about how these pups may end up in rescue in a years time,yes some of them may,they may not,no one knows for sure even *good breeders do not know* if the puppy they have bred and sold will have a home for life.


Good breeders keep in regular contact with new owners to prevent that.
Granted some owners dont give a crap....same goes for some breeders.

I know for a fact that I would pay the full amount that the new owner paid me to get my dog back if it was going to be put into a rescue.....

There is also a certain chipping service some breeders use (I will be using this) were you as the breeder can put your details ont he chip too.

In america they tattoo the pups in the breeders name then chip in the owners name so if the dog goes missing the tattoo can have the breeders traced.


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

I give up - I actually give up. This isnt just about dogs ending up in resacue, I couldnt care less if they were KC reg'ed or not. DOGS FROM UN TESTED PARENTS CAN GO ON TO HAVE HEALTH ISSUES EVEN MORE SO IN A BREED LIKE THIS. I WILL NOT STAND BY AND WATCH SOMEONE PRODUCING PUPPIES THAT MAY HAVE A LIFE FULL OF PAIN AND UNHAPPINESS BECAUSE A BREEDER FAILED TO HEALTH TEST - WITH OWNERS THAT PAY VET FEE AFTER VET FEE, AND THEN WATCH THEIR FAMILY MEMBER SLIP AWAY. end of!


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## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

topseyturvey said:


> My post was aimed at no one,I do get sick of hearing about BYB's and about how many of there pups will end up in rescue,well bred dogs also end up in rescue,kc reg dogs the list goes on and on.
> 
> I saw a post on this thread about how these pups may end up in rescue in a years time,yes some of them may,they may not,no one knows for sure even *good breeders do not know* if the puppy they have bred and sold will have a home for life.


Do you work/volunteer in rescue?


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Devil-Dogz said:


> I also wonder how many of these people that think this breeder should be laid some slack works in rescue and sees the amount of staffs something in


I actually do.


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

kiara said:


> I actually do.


and you think its ok for this breeder to produce puppies in such a way


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Devil-Dogz said:


> I give up - I actually give up. This isnt just about dogs ending up in resacue, I couldnt care less if they were KC reg'ed or not. DOGS FROM UN TESTED PARENTS CAN GO ON TO HAVE HEALTH ISSUES EVEN MORE SO IN A BREED LIKE THIS. I WILL NOT STAND BY AND WATCH SOMEONE PRODUCING PUPPIES THAT MAY HAVE A LIFE FULL OF PAIN AND UNHAPPINESS BECAUSE A BREEDER FAILED TO HEALTH TEST - WITH OWNERS THAT PAY VET FEE AFTER VET FEE, AND THEN WATCH THEIR FAMILY MEMBER SLIP AWAY. end of!


But she has said they are tested!


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## topseyturvey (Feb 1, 2010)

Nina_82 said:


> No one is saying that are they?
> What angers me is the fact that it's Staffies that she is breeding and that it is the dogs 3rd litter, when there is a huge problem with abandoned and unwanted Staffies in particular.
> There really is no need to be breeding them in such an irresponsible way when there are perfectly healthy dogs being put to sleep every day because there are not enough rescue spaces for them.


Are they not ?
That's the impression I get from this thread,the pups are here now,no going back,educate by all means but do it in a constructive polite manner,then maybe potential breeders will start to listen,instead of going ahead anyway and never coming back to the forum.

I know there is a huge huge problem with Staffies,staffie rescue is one of the rescue's we support along with the PDSA.
I have a crossbreed from a rescue,there is a crisis full stop,I was told the registration figures for staffies have fell by a fair bit over the last few years and have also been told by a good friend of mine that people within that breed are trying to get the KC to refuse registrations of un tested dogs.


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

topseyturvey said:


> *good breeders do not know* if the puppy they have bred and sold will have a home for life.


when you work with breed resuces and others yes you do


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Devil-Dogz said:


> and you think its ok for this breeder to produce puppies in such a way


What way??? You are presuming they are not tested etc!


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

kiara said:


> But she has said they are tested!


Then she has no problem providing the proof does she or even the dogs names. I will then apolagise however - I dont believe it, she has been asked more than once or more than one thread. why ignore it, surely you want to shout it from the roof top?


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

kiara said:


> What way??? You are presuming they are not tested etc!


forget the health tests a second then!

She is bring from her staff, infact 3 litters it had - you tell me what she is offering the breed? NO one should be breeding unless they feel they have something offer let alone a breed like the staff!


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## topseyturvey (Feb 1, 2010)

Devil-Dogz said:


> when you work with breed resuces and others yes you do


And how many good breeders work with rescues and welfare ?
And what if the dogs owners move and you loose contact ?
Then what ?


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## Pointermum (Jul 2, 2010)

kiara said:


> But she has said they are tested!


On the 3rd or 4th time of asking and a very short reply. Breeders i know who health test will be more than happy to tell you their results, as they spent a lot of time effort and money getting them.


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

topseyturvey said:


> And how many good breeders work with rescues and welfare ?
> And what if the dogs owners move and you loose contact ?
> Then what ?


MANY that I know! we have NEVER lost contact with our puppies - theres such things as emails, phone calls & facebook to see updates. I dont see how them moving would affect a pup going into rescue. Like us many breeders microchip their puppies so that if the dog ever strays or is dumped by the owner and took to resce we will come up as the breeder/second owner and be contacted - there are good breeders, and ways around most things to ensure your puppies have a life long happy home.


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

Devil-Dogz said:


> forget the health tests a second then!
> 
> She is bring from her staff, infact 3 litters it had - you tell me what she is offering the breed? NO one should be breeding unless they feel they have something offer let alone a breed like the staff!


Dont get me wrong I do completely understand where your coming from, but all I am saying is let the breeder have her say and answer your questions before presuming that everything has been done in an irresponsible way. I find it fine that her bitch has had 3 litters in a space of 5 years, this is not uncommon, she may show/work her dog! We do not know that.


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## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

topseyturvey said:


> Are they not ?
> That's the impression I get from this thread,the pups are here now,no going back,educate by all means but do it in a constructive polite manner,then maybe potential breeders will start to listen,instead of going ahead anyway and never coming back to the forum.
> 
> I know there is a huge huge problem with Staffies,staffie rescue is one of the rescue's we support along with the PDSA.
> I have a crossbreed from a rescue,there is a crisis full stop,I was told the registration figures for staffies have fell by a fair bit over the last few years and have also been told by a good friend of mine that people within that breed are trying to get the KC to refuse registrations of un tested dogs.


But people don't listen where money is concerned do they!
This 'breeder' is not doing it for the love of the breed, and it certainly is not out of love for her dog either. If she loved the breed she would know that there is an overbreeding issue with staffies.
As a previous poster said there is the health testing issue as well which the OP skirted round everytime the question was asked. Yes, she says they are health tested but I think she probably knew more people would stop supporting her if she said they weren't!


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> And how many good breeders work with rescues and welfare


And who do you think started breed rescues? It was predominantly show breeders  All the show breeders I know are or have been very active in breed rescue.


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## topseyturvey (Feb 1, 2010)

I can see your point but I am also saying that it is a *Fact *that dogs from good breeders can and do also find themselves in rescue,not all rescue dogs come from BYB's and puppy farms.


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

topseyturvey said:


> I can see your point but I am also saying that it is a *Fact *that dogs from good breeders can and do also find themselves in rescue,not all rescue dogs come from BYB's and puppy farms.


and what do GOOD breeders do? If notified take them back with out a second thought - or their not good breeders


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## topseyturvey (Feb 1, 2010)

Nina_82 said:


> But people don't listen where money is concerned do they!
> This 'breeder' is not doing it for the love of the breed, and it certainly is not out of love for her dog either. If she loved the breed she would know that there is an overbreeding issue with staffies.
> As a previous poster said there is the health testing issue as well which the OP skirted round everytime the question was asked. Yes, she says they are health tested but I think she probably knew more people would stop supporting her if she said they weren't!


But you don't know this you are assuming,you don't know this breeder,you don't know if the bitch is or has been shown,show breeders know there is an issue with unwanted dogs but still keep breeding,is this acceptable then ?

And next you will tell me show breeders don't breed for money,if that's the case why don't they make back what they have outlaid on a litter and reduce there prices then ?


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

topseyturvey said:


> And next you will tell me show breeders don't breed for money,if that's the case why don't they make back what they have outlaid on a litter and reduce there prices then ?


Does that also mean then when they make a great loss they should up the price - it doesnt work like that, there are set prices dependant on alot of factors. what they make or lose has nothing to do with it or we wouldnt have just made a loss of £950 on our latest litter!


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

Nina_82 said:


> Heartbreaking to see more Staffies being born when so many are being killed everyday.
> 
> I just hope that the OP is keeping the mum and not gonna abandon her to rescue now that she has had 3 litters out of her.


NO im not just gonna abandoned her now as u put it had 3 litters out of her 
i have only bred her when ive had people asking for her pups im NOT breeding her 2 make money out of her

and like someone else on here has said u cant rescue a staffie unless ur children r of a certain age over 12 sometimes 14 or even 16


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> NO im not just gonna abandoned her now as u put it had 3 litters out of her
> *i have only bred her when ive had people asking for her pups im breeding her 2 make money out of her *
> and like someone else on here has said u cant rescue a staffie unless ur children r of a certain age over 12 sometimes 14 or even 16


So you admitt you are breeding for money - I rest my case! as for the health tests?
ohh and thats total crap regarding age limits, of course for SOME dogs not the breed altogether!


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## Pointermum (Jul 2, 2010)

pcs969804 said:


> NO im not just gonna abandoned her now as u put it had 3 litters out of her
> i have only bred her when ive had people asking for her pups im breeding her 2 make money out of her
> 
> and like someone else on here has said u cant rescue a staffie unless ur children r of a certain age over 12 sometimes 14 or even 16


I rest my case *THANK YOU *

:mad2: :mad5: :mad2: :mad5: :mad2: :mad5:


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

pcs969804 said:


> NO im not just gonna abandoned her now as u put it had 3 litters out of her
> i have only bred her when ive had people asking for her pups im breeding her 2 make money out of her
> 
> and like someone else on here has said u cant rescue a staffie unless ur children r of a certain age over 12 sometimes 14 or even 16


Please please answer these questions.

Is she health tested?
Is the stud health tested?
Are they KC registered?


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## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

topseyturvey said:


> But you don't know this you are assuming,you don't know this breeder,you don't know if the bitch is or has been shown,show breeders know there is an issue with unwanted dogs but still keep breeding,is this acceptable then ?
> 
> And next you will tell me show breeders don't breed for money,if that's the case why don't they make back what they have outlaid on a litter and reduce there prices then ?


No, it is not acceptable to breed any dog that has been overbred in my opinion. I am making an informed guess - based on the information given and the attitude of the OP - that these dogs have not been health tested.

I'm not saying they don't breed for money but a *good* breeder carries out the proper checks on health, parentage etc. I'm sure there are many bad show breeders and I have the same opinion on them as I do on people like the OP.


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## noushka05 (Mar 28, 2008)

pcs969804 said:


> i have only bred her when ive had people asking for her pups im breeding her 2 make money out of her


Holy smoke just catching up but did not expect to see this!

Jeezus


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## topseyturvey (Feb 1, 2010)

Nina_82 said:


> No, it is not acceptable to breed any dog that has been overbred in my opinion. I am making an informed guess - based on the information given and the attitude of the OP - that these dogs have not been health tested.
> 
> I'm not saying they don't breed for money but a *good* breeder carries out the proper checks on health, parentage etc. I'm sure there are *many bad show breeders *and I have the same opinion on them as I do on people like the OP.


And I am sure you are correct.....


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## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

pcs969804 said:


> NO im not just gonna abandoned her now as u put it had 3 litters out of her
> i have only bred her when ive had people asking for her pups im breeding her 2 make money out of her
> 
> and like someone else on here has said u cant rescue a staffie unless ur children r of a certain age over 12 sometimes 14 or even 16


You're breeding her to make money out of her?? How nice of you.

That bit about not being able to rescue is false. I have a rescue Boxer x Staff and my kids are 4yrs and 2 yrs.

If people are willing to look around, travel anywhere and wait for the right rescue dog to come up then they will find one.


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## vizzy24 (Aug 31, 2008)

Pointermum said:


> She was asked the question a few times and chose to ignore it, which speaks volumes in my eyes. If no one challenges her over this litter and is all well done congratulations , then she will continue to think it's ok. She's already said she's never planned to keep a pup from any litters , then why she breeding?


I didn't say don't challenge I just said not to do it in a aggressive way. I never kept a pup from my litter as I would not produce 8 pups just so I could have 1. I did however wait until I had a full list of owners of puppies before she went to stud. All I was saying is educate don't alienate

I would like to add any breeding done for money is not acceptable in my book


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> I never kept a pup from my litter as I would not produce 8 pups just so I could have 1.


But you breed 8 pups just to sell them all? Why did you breed then? Just cos you wanted the experience?



> I would like to add any breeding done for money is not acceptable in my book


So you'll take back your congratulations will you? and your earlier posts complaining about those who saw the reality of the situation.


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## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> NO im not just gonna abandoned her now as u put it had 3 litters out of her
> i have only bred her when ive had people asking for her pups im breeding her 2 make money out of her
> 
> and like someone else on here has said u cant rescue a staffie unless ur children r of a certain age over 12 sometimes 14 or even 16


Oh no


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## Pointermum (Jul 2, 2010)

vizzy24 said:


> I didn't say don't challenge I just said not to do it in a aggressive way. I never kept a pup from my litter as I would not produce 8 pups just so I could have 1. I did however wait until I had a full list of owners of puppies before she went to stud. All I was saying is educate don't alienate
> 
> I would like to add any breeding done for money is not acceptable in my book


I asked why had she ignored the question twice and if they was infact health tested, which i would call a challage where have i been agressive? i've only responed to other posts. I've not quoted the OP say she's a stupid ****** of any thing like that have i


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

when i just wrote that last mess i missed a word out (NOT)
im not breeding her for money i have only bred her when people have asked for a pup 
i dont just breed her for the sake of it


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

pcs969804 said:


> when i just wrote that last mess i missed a word out (NOT)
> im not breeding her for money i have only bred her when people have asked for a pup
> i dont just breed her for the sake of it


Can you answer those questions please?

Is your bitch and teh stud KC reg?
Are htey both health tested? If so what results?


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## noushka05 (Mar 28, 2008)

pcs969804 said:


> when i just wrote that last mess i missed a word out (NOT)
> im not breeding her for money i have only bred her when people have asked for a pup
> i dont just breed her for the sake of it


so you put your dog through 3 pregnancys just for other people!!


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## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

pcs969804 said:


> when i just wrote that last mess i missed a word out (NOT)
> im not breeding her for money i have only bred her when people have asked for a pup
> i dont just breed her for the sake of it


So you give them away for free do you?

In my opinion you are breeding for the sake of it when this breed is particularly overbred.


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

I still dont understand why people breed because others ask them to! we breed for ourselves, we then let people know of our plans and will start a waiting list or add more to it from previous list! People would have had to put information about to get a list full of names? You dont just one day wake with 5/6 pepple asking you to breed - you must have planned to before adding people to lists!


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> so you put your dog through 3 pregnancys just for other people!!


Exactly  and not just once - three times - poor bitch


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

noushka05 said:


> so you put your dog through 3 pregnancys just for other people!!


what and u lot who have the KC reg dogs and all the health tests

dont just breed for other people YES u all do u all have a waiting list and breed when u got enough enquires

so y is it when i have said that i didnt breed her till i had a waiting list for pups that it is wrong when i do it but not when u all do it

And i dont have 2 tell u the health tests that either of the dogs have had done or what they KC name is as its none of ur business


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## tashi (Dec 5, 2007)

OK peeps think you have got your point across can we now just help out this girlie and see these pups into the world - job is done now too late to go back OP has obviously never heard of health testing etc so too late for all that now but these pups and their mum should now be our concern. 

OP I guess that out of the money from these pups you will be paying to get your girlie spayed


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

Not all breeders breed to keep a pup - just looking at the BRS would show you that they'd be inundated with dogs if they did, so that's a lame excuse!

Not all pet keepers are "in it for the money" as any breeder should know - there is no money left if you do things properly.
I had a litter and divorced my OH after 33years of marriage for not telling me about the mating, which happened while I was in hospital. However, I vetted all homes, refused many, health tested my dogs - all be it late - spayed the only bitch before homing and remaining males at six months, not something I actually agree with but due to higher than average hip score on dads part thought it necessary, plus contracts for remaing boys to be neutered. Puppy pack with extensive info on breed, feeding, history of the Mal, bloat, hot spots, socialisation and definite return should a re home become necessary. I, as a sort of BYB did everything I could for my babies and keep in regular contact. Took one boy back at 2 years old who now lives with another Mal and have contact through icebaymals forum, where he is just begining to learn to work.
Would I have asked for advice on here? not in a million years, thankfully I didn't need any!

I mocrochipped the pups and found that if the new owner wanted to remove my details from the chip they could, so didn't add myself, just keep in regular contact. Apparently once the new owner has purchased the pup it's entirely up to them if they want anyone else on the microchip details - so nothing's flawless!

As of now all the pups are healthy, three are workers and the only one to have suffered health problems is Flynn, who I kept - karma eh? I know it's early days and so do all of the owners but we are hopeful.

How regular breeders can guarantee the pup will remain in his forever home is beyond me, a move can change things overnight - surely! With only six pups to keep in contact with (two in the same home) it's fairly easy for me, also I have visited them and they me at my home.

I think in present climes *no one* should be breeding for a while, every breed has a rescue - just google any breed. My point was if an owner needs advice - whether things have been done right or wrong, it's in the *dogs* interest to offer it, regardless of pedigree, health tests, show potential. it's not the dogs fault it was born and as i've seen on here, even dogs that are health tested can still have problems.

That's why I get so angry that everyone is tarred with the same brush and called BYB's when breeders - according to Dogs Today - are also adding to the rescue problem - it's just that they don't always know - how could they?


----------



## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

rocco33 said:


> Exactly  and not just once - three times - poor bitch


And whats wrong with breeding her 3 times theres nothing wrong with it

u lot breed ur dog probably a dame sight more than i have bred my bitch


----------



## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

pcs969804 said:


> what and u lot who have the KC reg dogs and all the health tests
> 
> dont just breed for other people YES u all do u all have a waiting list and breed when u got enough enquires
> 
> ...


If you are a good breeder who health tests and has kc reg dogs why wouldnt you be shouting those results off roof tops? I know I do.

No, I breed for ME. I am breeding when I want a pup from my bitch.
I wouldnt care if anyone had one of my pups, I would be happy to keep them all.

You are adding to the staffy problem in this country. Surely if you love the breed so you wouldnt wish to see if suffer?


----------



## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> And i dont have 2 tell u the health tests that either of the dogs have had done or what they KC name is as its none of ur business


  I would say I hope new owners dont take you to court and squeeze every last penny out of you when your puppies become affected of inherited disease - that YOU could have PREVENTED. Required tests arent there for a laugh, its serious. Thing is to say that I would be lying, I hope every single one takes you - then you will see what you have done is so wrong! poor poor puppies.

and them that when on to shoot some of the members down for 'picking' on the OP just remember the dogs are the victims.


----------



## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

pcs969804 said:


> what and u lot who have the KC reg dogs and all the health tests
> 
> dont just breed for other people YES u all do u all have a waiting list and breed when u got enough enquires


I thought you said *your* dog was KC reg and health tested?? "You lot"???

I think you just answered everyone's question.


----------



## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> And whats wrong with breeding her 3 times theres nothing wrong with it
> 
> u lot breed ur dog probably a dame sight more than i have bred my bitch


No I haven't. I have a hard enough time deciding to put my bitches through pregnancy and all the risk and work it is for them, in order to keep a pup myself, much less for other people. And my dogs are fully health tested, proven and at the top of their game.


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## vizzy24 (Aug 31, 2008)

Pointermum said:


> I asked why had she ignored the question twice and if they was infact health tested, which i would call a challage where have i been agressive? i've only responed to other posts. I've not quoted the OP say she's a stupid ****** of any thing like that have i


No sorry I didn't mean you specifically but some posters were being aggressive in their posts and I was just responding to you saying that you should challenge people that's all .


----------



## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> I thought you said your dog was KC reg and health tested?? "You lot"???
> 
> I think you just answered everyone's question.


Didn't really need it answering. No surprise to me, sadly.


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

They can't take you to court - this is England not Sweden, we don't have such laws......yet!!!


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

Malmum said:


> They can't take you to court - this is England not Sweden, we don't have such laws......yet!!!


ermm yes they can.. seen it happen


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

Nina_82 said:


> I thought you said *your* dog was KC reg and health tested?? "You lot"???
> 
> I think you just answered everyone's question.


actually i think u find i never said whether they were KC reg and i did answer about health tests

i just dont have 2 tell u all what they had done just 2 prove a point 2 u all as its none of ur business


----------



## noushka05 (Mar 28, 2008)

pcs969804 said:


> what and u lot who have the KC reg dogs and all the health tests
> 
> dont just breed for other people YES u all do u all have a waiting list and breed when u got enough enquires
> 
> ...


im only answering this question Tashi then i'm leaving the thread

no youve got it all wrong! reputable breeders only breed when they want a puppy/puppies for themself , ive bred 1 litter in 10 yrs and i kept 3 of the 4 puppies....i would never put a bitch of mine through pregnancy for someone else.


----------



## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

pcs969804 said:


> actually i think u find i never said whether they were KC reg and i did answer about health tests
> 
> i just dont have 2 tell u all what they had done just 2 prove a point 2 u all as its none of ur business


So she's not kc reg? You dont even know her line.:frown::frown:

And why lie about health tests?



pcs969804 said:


> the dog r health tested for ur information and all pups have got homes already


My bitch was hip scored in October....I came on here shouting it from the stars that she has good hips and clear eyes!

Not hiding it away....so clearly no tests have been done.

If shes not KC reg how do you know shes a full staff? And not a mix that looks like a staff? My GSD cross looks like a GSD.


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## tashi (Dec 5, 2007)

noushka05 said:


> im only answering this question Tashi then i'm leaving the thread
> 
> no youve got it all wrong! reputable breeders only breed when they want a puppy/puppies for themself , ive bred 1 litter in 10 yrs and i kept 3 of the 4 puppies....i would never put a bitch of mine through pregnancy for someone else.


Yes I am with you on that  we have a litter to keep the line but not all have the same values


----------



## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> My point was if an owner needs advice - whether things have been done right or wrong, it's in the dogs interest to offer it, regardless of pedigree, health tests, show potential. it's not the dogs fault it was born and as i've seen on here, even dogs that are health tested can still have problems.


The advice was given and given politely. I think what I found uncomfortable was later in the thread when members (and supposed 'responsible breeders' were congratulating an irresponsible breeder and I suspect others did too.


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## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

pcs969804 said:


> actually i think u find i never said whether they were KC reg and i did answer about health tests
> 
> i just dont have 2 tell u all what they had done just 2 prove a point 2 u all as its none of ur business


Well I'm sure we all have our opinions on whether to believe you or not. I personally do not.

If you are happy with what you are doing then I'm sure no one on here is going to change your mind on the fact that it is pointless and irresponsible behaviour. Maybe if you go and visit a dog pound where there are dogs like yours being KILLED everyday because there are not enough homes for them then you will reconsider and maybe regret what you are doing.

Are you going to answer the question about having your poor dog spayed?


----------



## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

tashi said:


> Yes I am with you on that  we have a litter to keep the line but not all have the same values


I must admit I would be happy keeping all of Alaska's pups (when we have them) even spoke about this with my OH as its common for shelties to have small litters.

A very good friend of mine....she has top show dogs and health tested till the cows come home. She is getting on a bit now.

Last time she bred a litter was 3 years ago and it was 2 pups in that litter.
She has bred again this year because her top boy passed away and she wants to have a boy again.

Then there are other breeders who pump out litter after litter....I know who I have respect for.


----------



## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

noushka05 said:


> im only answering this question Tashi then i'm leaving the thread
> 
> no youve got it all wrong! reputable breeders only breed when they want a puppy/puppies for themself , ive bred 1 litter in 10 yrs and i kept 3 of the 4 puppies....i would never put a bitch of mine through pregnancy for someone else.


Then you are a good breeder but we can see on this forum that some sell the whole litter - nothing wrong with that but then say good breeders only breed to keep one - why lie? the BRS doesn't and you can see how many are actually kept by breeders there and i'm not talking about BYB's - there are some big names in there too - too often in fact! :


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

shetlandlover said:


> So she's not kc reg? You dont even know her line.:frown::frown:
> 
> And why lie about health tests?
> 
> ...


she is a full staff as u put it her mum and dad were KC reg but they didnt reg the pups 
how can u all assume no tests were done u cant its only the fact ur sayin it because i wont disclose they results

and i do check all the homes before pups go and keep in contact with all the owners 
as from the previous litter 4 of the pups went to very good friends of mine so i see them every if not most days


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

I wouldnt say to be a good breeder you have to keep from all litters - but you should certainly being AIMING to do so!


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

pcs969804 said:


> she is a full staff as u put it her mum and dad were KC reg but they didnt reg the pups
> how can u all assume no tests were done u cant its only the fact ur sayin it because i wont disclose they results
> 
> and i do check all the homes before pups go and keep in contact with all the owners
> as from the previous litter 4 of the pups went to very good friends of mine so i see them every if not most days


Why was she not registered then?

And why would you buy a none-kc reg dog to breed from?

Okay....

Where did oyu get her DNA test done? As I am getting my bitch done soon and would love your reccomendations.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> Then you are a good breeder but we can see on this forum that some sell the whole litter - nothing wrong with that but then say good breeders only breed to keep one - why lie? the BRS doesn't and you can see how many are actually kept by breeders there and i'm not talking about BYB's - there are some big names in there too - too often in fact!


I wouldn't put a bitch through pregnancy unless I was sure her genes were worth keeping and I wanted a pup either, but I do think there's a big difference between someone who is at the top of their game, hugely knowledgeable about the breed from excellent dogs and not keeping a pup and someone putting their pet bitch through it just to sell the pups.


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## hazel pritchard (Jun 28, 2009)

I many yrs ago was owned by a corgi :lol: she was bred by a byb , we got her from corgi rescue,she was 18mnths old and we were her 5th owner !!!!! we took her to be spayed, where during the op she nearly bled to death, only a very good vet (in my opion) saved her life, after many tests it was found she had Vonwillibrands (her blood would not clot properly) the vet wanted to know where she came from so to find out if any other puppies from her litter had it,it scares me to think how many puppies went on to have this from the dogs they were bred from , as she was a rescue we could not find out who bred her nor could could the rescue as she was handed over to first owner in a motorway petrol station, the reason im writing this is please please get dogs that are going to be bred from, health tested, we had to be careful where we walked our dog incase she got a cut etc, im glad to say she had a long happy life with us she passed away when she was 16yrs old,


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

Having worked in Staff rescue many years ago and owned four Staffs, I love this breed and it saddens me that any are being bred at all now to be honest. Even the president of the SBT club UK hasn't had a litter in three years because of their plight. The way they have become so disposable, the chavs who sometimes own them and the dog fighting rings they could end up in when not wanted, would be reason enough for me not to breed them. 

My hope is that the OP will ensure as best as possible to home them with forever families who will not one day get fed up with them. That is the main thing I would say at this point. Vet the homes thoroughly, keep in contact - even if you appear a bore and take back ANY that are not wanted - as many times as it takes. Staffs are far too special to be suffering the way they now are - a more loyal, devoted dog to it's family I have yet to find. Love them as I do my Mals don't match up to my past Staffs.


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

shetlandlover said:


> Why was she not registered then?
> 
> And why would you buy a none-kc reg dog to breed from?
> 
> ...


they werent registered as they had both dogs and the male accidently got hold of the female before she was 2yrs old and u cant reg pups if female is under 2yrs old 
both her parents were health tested and all was fine

i downloaded the forms and went to my local vet to have the blood tests done

i dont care whether she was reg or not u dont have 2 have a good breed dog to have it reg 
where i took her for stud there dog is KC reg and i sent them pics and met them in person with her before mating her with their dog

i also got my bitch a full health check up before mating her and got the all clear from my vets 
she is also wormed with PANACUR 10% liquid from day 40 of preg until 2 days post whelping then the pups r wormed using panacur at 2 wks and 5 wks then again at 8 wks before goin to there new homes 
they r also all microchipped before they go be it in my name or the new owners name 
and given a full health check before they go as well


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

Her last litter was 6 pups and this ones 8 pups.....


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

i have also owned staffies for the past 17 yrs


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> they werent registered as they had both dogs and the male accidently got hold of the female before she was 2yrs old and u cant reg pups if female is under 2yrs old


Do you know anything about breeding?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

shetlandlover said:


> Her last litter was 6 pups and this ones 8 pups.....


yes her last litter was 6 pups and this time she had 8

she had 2 scans durin pregnany and 1st scan vet saw 4 pups then when we went back he saw 6 pups

but as u know scans arent accurate


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

Unfortunately the KC states the bitch must be over *1 year old* - another reason I hold them partly responsible for bad breeding practices!


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

pcs969804 said:


> they werent registered as they had both dogs and the male accidently got hold of the female before she was 2yrs old and u cant reg pups if female is under 2yrs old
> both her parents were health tested and all was fine
> 
> i downloaded the forms and went to my local vet to have the blood tests done
> ...


What did she get on her DNA results?
Where did you send the blood off to? I ma having some problems with that as I missed the clinic.

btw health checks dont mean anything, my cavalier passed a health check even though his hearts a mess.


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## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

Don't shoot me down in flames but....

Lets keep this friendly guys. I know a lot of us on here are very passionate about breeding ethics (me being one). We can't change what is done now and the OP sees how we all feel, but lets keep thing civil in case (heaven forbid) the OP has problems with the pups and needs to ask for advice.

Our priorities should now be to the puppies and the bitch.


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

Malmum said:


> Unfortunately the KC states the bitch must be over *1 year old* - another reason I hold them partly responsible for bad breeding practices! [/QUOTE
> 
> really then y was it when my step dad brought a new springer as his KC reg died after 13 yrs
> he went 2 buy a KC 1 but they couldnt reg litter as mum was under 2yrs old and this was only 2 yrs ago
> and he phoned the KC and they said that a bitch had 2 be 2yrs


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> u cant reg pups if female is under 2yrs old


Yes you can. The age limit for registering pups is *1* year old.



> i also got my bitch a full health check up before mating her and got the all clear from my vets


That is not what doing health tests entails. Your vet (unless an opthalmic specialist and there are very few that are) cannot do an eye test. There are other DNA tests that need to be done that your vet cannot do - they need to be sent away for testing.

Sorry, but what you have done is irresponsible breeding and not just one, but *three* times. Not only that, but in a breed that has a crisis in rescue.


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

pcs969804 said:


> Malmum said:
> 
> 
> > Unfortunately the KC states the bitch must be over *1 year old* - another reason I hold them partly responsible for bad breeding practices! [/QUOTE
> ...


----------



## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

Tanya1989 said:


> Don't shoot me down in flames but....
> 
> Lets keep this friendly guys. I know a lot of us on here are very passionate about breeding ethics (me being one). We can't change what is done now and the OP sees how we all feel, but lets keep thing civil in case (heaven forbid) the OP has problems with the pups and needs to ask for advice.
> 
> Our priorities should now be to the puppies and the bitch.


TRUST ME

after hearing all the stufff ive heard on hear

i wont be askin any of u for advice anymore

i would go directly 2 my vet now no matter what time of day it was or how much it would cost me


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## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

All I can say is for every one of those pups just born another one has been killed today.

Are you going to get the dog spayed or not?

Maybe you should hold on in case you find some more friends who want to use your dog as a breeding machine.


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

rocco33 said:


> Yes you can. The age limit for registering pups is *1* year old.
> 
> That is not what doing health tests entails. Your vet (unless an opthalmic specialist and there are very few that are) cannot do an eye test. There are other DNA tests that need to be done that your vet cannot do - they need to be sent away for testing.
> 
> Sorry, but what you have done is irresponsible breeding and not just one, but *three* times. Not only that, but in a breed that has a crisis in rescue.


i never said she only had health checks from the vets if u read my posts properly 
i actually said i also got her a health check from my vets before mating her each time

and i said i downloaded a form to which the vets did the blood tests and sent them off


----------



## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

pcs969804 said:


> i never said she only had health checks from the vets if u read my posts properly
> i actually said i also got her a health check from my vets before mating her each time


Where did you send off the DNA to? What where the results? Which company did oyu use?

I have herd of 3 want to know which one you used as my bitch is due hers in March.

Also why would you want to breed again after having so many in the last litter?

Do you have your girls dam and sire names?


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## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

pcs969804 said:


> TRUST ME
> 
> after hearing all the stufff ive heard on hear
> 
> ...


Did you expect people to agree with your irresponsible breeding then?

This thread started off with people giving advice and then it became clear what you had done.

GO AND VISIT A DOG POUND AND SEE DOGS BEING KILLED BECAUSE OF PEOPLE LIKE YOU OVER BREEDING AND THEN MAYBE YOU WILL SEE WHY YOU HAVE GOT PEOPLES BACKS UP.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> i never said she only had health checks from the vets if u read my posts properly
> i actually said i also got her a health check from my vets before mating her each time


DNA tests only need to be done once   DNA does not change over a dogs life!

I would forget trying to explain as it is pretty clear from your posts the level of knowledge you have. It doesn't need explaining.

I'm glad this is your poor girl's last litter and would suggest if you ever breed again, you do a lot more research into it before embarking on breeding.


----------



## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

Nina_82 said:


> Did you expect people to agree with your irresponsible breeding then?
> 
> This thread started off with people giving advice and then it became clear what you had done.
> 
> GO AND VISIT A DOG POUND AND SEE DOGS BEING KILLED BECAUSE OF PEOPLE LIKE YOU OVER BREEDING AND THEN MAYBE YOU WILL SEE WHY YOU HAVE GOT PEOPLES BACKS UP.


What gets my back up is that she has done this for money...purely and simply.

Her bitch isnt offering the breed anything and I am guessing hte stud dog is her own dog? As I dont know a breeder worth his salt that would breed to a unhealth tested dog.

I lost a very good friend of mine because she wanted to use her dog to Alaska......she refused to health test so I said no. (he wasnt right for my bitch either). Have not seen her since..... 

But my bitch is worth more than that...


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

Nina_82 said:


> Did you expect people to agree with your irresponsible breeding then?
> 
> This thread started off with people giving advice and then it became clear what you had done.
> 
> GO AND VISIT A DOG POUND AND SEE DOGS BEING KILLED BECAUSE OF PEOPLE LIKE YOU OVER BREEDING AND THEN MAYBE YOU WILL SEE WHY YOU HAVE GOT PEOPLES BACKS UP.


for ur information i worked in a dog santuary for 3yrs

to be honest i dont really care what u like think

from most of the posts ive had u all think ur better then everyone else

BUT I WOULD LIKE TO THANK ALL THOSE THAT HAVE GIVEN ME ADVICE AND NOT JUST HAD AGO

and just cos i dont share the health tests doesnt mean shes not had them 
just means i dont like to brag about her tests and how she did


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

pcs969804 said:


> And whats wrong with breeding her 3 times theres nothing wrong with it
> 
> u lot breed ur dog probably a dame sight more than i have bred my bitch


er actually NO! . have you heatlth tested ?? as you have ignored this question i quess the answer is no.


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

pcs969804 said:


> i wont be askin any of u for advice anymore


Truth hurts and you lady are a BYB - using your poor dogs for self gain. MONEY. How do you sleep at night knowing you may well have produced puppies that are suffering horrid disases - I so hope the money was worth it 
Its people like you that give breeders a bad name!


----------



## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

rocco33 said:


> DNA tests only need to be done once   DNA does not change over a dogs life!
> 
> I would forget trying to explain as it is pretty clear from your posts the level of knowledge you have. It doesn't need explaining.
> 
> ...


i never said DNA tests change 
i said ive had her tested for the necessary tests but i all ways got her check all before matin 2 make sure she was fit enough 2 carry a litter

2 be honest u all make me laugh u dont actually read posts probably u just jump 2 all kinds of conclusions


----------



## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

shetlandlover said:


> What gets my back up is that she has done this for money...purely and simply.
> 
> Her bitch isnt offering the breed anything and I am guessing hte stud dog is her own dog? As I dont know a breeder worth his salt that would breed to a unhealth tested dog.
> 
> ...


Totally agree. I just can't imagine why people would want to do this. She clearly does not understand what health testing means either. A quick vet check up is obviously enough for her! 

You losing a friend over it just goes to show how important health testing is to decent breeders/owners etc.


----------



## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

pcs969804 said:


> for ur information i worked in a dog santuary for 3yrs
> 
> to be honest i dont really care what u like think
> 
> ...


Why wouldnt you want to brag about your healthy dog?.....

Which is clear since you cant tell me what company you used she has never had them done. Sad sad situation.

I honestly dont know how you can willingly bring into the world a litter of pups on the cheap because people have asked you to breed, you should have told them to go to the local pound and get a dog from there.

I am guessing you sell them? At least £100 per pup I am guessing so £800 for a litter that will feed you and your family for months but you dont want to pay a bit of money to ensure these pups have the best 10-15 years of their lives?

I do honestly hope the pups find good homes were they will be loved and not bred from and with owners that are willing to pay £1000's to fix any health probelms your breeding has caused.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> and just cos i dont share the health tests doesnt mean shes not had them
> just means i dont like to brag about her tests and how she did


There's no bragging about them - what's to brag about  what a sad attitude to take regarding bringing lives into this world.



> to be honest i dont really care what u like think


Well that's pretty obvious, and tbh unimportant, what's should have been important that you cared about the puppies you have produced in breed that is in crisis through irresponsible overbreeding.



> from most of the posts ive had u all think ur better then everyone else


No, not better than everyone else, just a bit better prepared, have done more research, have more knoweldge and experience and don't simply produce puppies because they have a bitch and they can.

I'm bowing out of this thread now.
I know this sort of irresponsible breeding goes on but it's too depressing to keep reading about it.


----------



## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

pcs969804 said:


> i never said DNA tests change
> i said ive had her tested for the necessary tests but i all ways got her check all before matin 2 make sure she was fit enough 2 carry a litter
> 
> 2 be honest u all make me laugh u dont actually read posts probably u just jump 2 all kinds of conclusions


Wait.....are you breeding her again?


----------



## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

pcs969804 said:


> for ur information i worked in a dog santuary for 3yrs
> 
> to be honest i dont really care what u like think
> 
> ...


Poor dogs is all i have to say on that one. Not that I believe you for a second to be honest. I volunteer in dog rescue and I can assure you everyone I know who is involved in rescue would think that you are very irresponsible.

I know you don't care what I think, people like you don't care what anyone thinks as long as you are getting cash in your hand for your poor dog's puppies


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## tashi (Dec 5, 2007)

This thread is only going round in circles 

Dont think you are going to get the answers you are looking for from the OP, can we please now think of the bitch and her pups if the OP is going to stay with us, think that is all we can do


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

Devil-Dogz said:


> Truth hurts and you lady are a BYB - using your poor dogs for self gain. MONEY. How do you sleep at night knowing you may well have produced puppies that are suffering horrid disases - I so hope the money was worth it
> Its people like you that give breeders a bad name!


who actually says im makin money from it

i never said im makin money from breeding her

like i stated in 1 of my previous posts 4 of my very good friends have a pup each from her last litter

i never actually said they gave me any money for them


----------



## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

shetlandlover said:


> Wait.....are you breeding her again?


Where did she say that?


----------



## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

kiara said:


> Where did she say that?


thanks kiara

exactly when did i say i was gonna breed her again

my point exactualy jumping 2 conclusions


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## topseyturvey (Feb 1, 2010)

ShetlandLover,
I have just spoke to my friend on the phone,it is correct how the OP has described,the vet takes blood this is then sent off by the vet to be tested.
The results are back within 6 weeks.


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

topseyturvey said:


> ShetlandLover,
> I have just spoke to my friend on the phone,it is correct how the OP has described,the vet takes blood this is then sent off by the vet to be tested.
> The results are back within 6 weeks.


thanks topseyturvey

and u all just assumed i was lying


----------



## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

topseyturvey said:


> ShetlandLover,
> I have just spoke to my friend on the phone,it is correct how the OP has described,the vet takes blood this is then sent off by the vet to be tested.
> The results are back within 6 weeks.


I already know...except the OP didnt say about blood I did.

Nor did she tell me what company she used.



And to everyone asking.



> i never said DNA tests change
> i said ive had her tested for the necessary tests but i all ways got her check all before matin 2 make sure she was fit enough 2 carry a litter


Does it not say she is getting her checked before mating? Or am I misreading (could well be me misreading it as my eyes are playing up today)


----------



## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

pcs969804 said:


> thanks topseyturvey
> 
> and u all just assumed i was lying


You tell me where you told me you had blood sent off?
You told me about a form....not blood. I mentioned blood.

Which company did you use then? 
And what results did you get?


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## tashi (Dec 5, 2007)

tashi said:


> This thread is only going round in circles
> 
> Dont think you are going to get the answers you are looking for from the OP, can we please now think of the bitch and her pups if the OP is going to stay with us, think that is all we can do


once again folks - think OP has now got the message


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

shetlandlover said:


> I already know...except the OP didnt say about blood I did.
> 
> Nor did she tell me what company she used.
> 
> ...


actually i think if u go back 2 post #188
i actually wrote this

i never said she only had health checks from the vets if u read my posts properly 
i actually said i also got her a health check from my vets before mating her each time

and i said i downloaded a form to which the vets did the blood tests and sent them off


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

pcs969804 said:


> actually i think if u go back 2 post #188
> i actually wrote this
> 
> i never said she only had health checks from the vets if u read my posts properly
> ...


Right okay....so which company did you use? And what results did you get?

See....is easy to answer.


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## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

pcs969804 said:


> thanks topseyturvey
> 
> and u all just assumed i was lying


Yeah so we are all going to believe you now are we?

You have admitted yourself that it was not a proper Health test that was carried out, merely a quick once over by the vet.

You have bred non-health tested Staffie puppies which, like it or not, is irresponsible due to the risk of health problems and the over breeding issue.

You can sit there all smug because you have a few posts in your favour but if you seriously think about it surely you can see you are in the wrong? If you can't see that then I feel so sorry for your dog and her pups. I hope to god that you are going to get the poor girl spayed now.

I will say no more on the matter, you won't listen to anyone anyway.

I'm off to netmums, I don't get so angry with people on there


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2011)

Actually rocco quoted the end of that post #188 and it didnt contain the "blood and vet bit" and the post was edited at 9:30 which is when I am guessing she added that bit in?


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

shetlandlover said:


> Right okay....so which company did you use? And what results did you get?
> 
> See....is easy to answer.


like i stated before i dont have 2 give u the results of her tests

i downloaded the forms and vet sent them off

TO the AHT animal health trust is where as far as i know the vet sent it all


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## pcs969804 (Jan 6, 2011)

nina_82 said:


> yeah so we are all going to believe you now are we?
> 
> You have admitted yourself that it was not a proper health test that was carried out, merely a quick once over by the vet.
> 
> ...


how many times do i have to state to some of u the only health test she had doner at the vets was to make sure she was healthly 2 carry a litter 
she had a blood tests down for her other health tests to which the vet sent off


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## kiara (Jun 2, 2009)

have you had time to get any pics of the babies?
id love to see some, staffie pups are just the cutest.


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## Nina_82 (Sep 26, 2010)

pcs969804 said:


> how many times do i have to state to some of u the only health test she had doner at the vets was to make sure she was healthly 2 carry a litter
> she had a blood tests down for her other health tests to which the vet sent off


Yawn.

You are going round in circles. You are probably googling info as we speak to try to back yourself up.

You won't listen, I'm bored of trying to make you see that you have been irresponsible. Get on with it. All the rescues will be here to pick up the pieces when the pups have pups, get abandoned etc. Don't you worry, just carry on in your little bubble.


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## tashi (Dec 5, 2007)

Now closing this thread see the pups have been born safe and sound too late now to worry about health testing and the like - cannot push them back  hopefully this is this girls final litter and she will be spayed


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> TO the AHT animal health trust is where as far as i know the vet sent it all


LOL - keep digging the hole you are in. 

It will be on the certificate that you received with the results. As the owner of the bitch YOUR name and address would have been on the form and the results would have been sent to you.

Ok - I really am going to bow out now.


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