# Questions re show judging!



## allison6564 (Aug 20, 2009)

Hi all
as some of you know I am new to showing and attended my first official gccf show on sat. I am still getting confused to the BOB and BIS judging.

1) BOB I notice that Ollie got 1st in his open class (there were two silver mc's) and then another kitten got BOB who wasn't in the same class as she was a female in a class of her own. So would they of added all the cats in the whole MC section together to pick the BOB? Just looked on cat planet and this can't eb the case as there are a few BOB??? I'm confused:confused5:

BIS now do they choose one cat or kitten from each pedigree i.e 1 persian, 1 pet, 1 MC etc???? When I went to my first show (pet south ribble show) there was a BIS kitten, junior and adult whcih was ncie and clear but at yesterday's show there was one kitten (kiliper's eyptian mau and gorgous!) and then all the others were adults but differant breeds. At a point in the day a certain lady came up to me and said that it hadn't been annoounced yet but my Stan had got BIS kitten but then when the time came another cat was choosen (and went on to win though!) Now how do they choose the BIS cats, does each judge choose their won and the results added together? Confused here too?:confused5:

Now last quick question is about all the champion status things, haven't got a clue at all about these so any advice at all would be very useful.

Sorry to bother everyone again but it is all so confusing!!
Thanks
Allison


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## allison6564 (Aug 20, 2009)

Just checked on cat planet again and Stanley got BOC, now who was that up against? He was the only kitten and there was 4 juniors or was it in the SH group????


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## messyhearts (Feb 6, 2009)

What they do is in Ollie's class there would be a separation for male & female. So one female & one male could get a 1st. They then compete for BOB. So you get a BOB for each class available in the opens. All the BOBs in each section (like neuter or kitten) compete for Best of Variety Kitten/Neuter/Adult & then there is a best overall that gets taken to a new pen for BIS judging.

Often it is possible to have one cat entered in a class (like silver tabby series Maine Coon) & have nothing to compete against in the other gender.

If you look at a schedule it will state the judges at the start of the varieties & also for the overall best. They will usually decide on BOV during the day & once decided at the end they put them in the pens & have the show manager on a mic telling everyone what is going on & who won etc. Did you not see this?


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

Welcome to the Governing Council of the Cat Fancy read the show section it covers everything you've asked and more. :thumbup1:


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## allison6564 (Aug 20, 2009)

Hi
yes right at the end I saw all the BIS cats up front but I missed the announcements etc as they were so quiet! So I can understand in Ollies pedigree classes but in the non pedigree do they have a best of class for each also? Stan was the only SH kitten and so got his 1st open but when this lady (judge) came up to me during the afternoon she did say that she had awarded him somethign and that he had beaten all the other cats in! So really confused. Could it be the case that she gave it to him but other judges didn't agree maybe. At the end of the I only do the shows for fun and not upset about it and I'm so pleased with what they have both won but with the lady coming up to me and saying that I just don't understand what she meant. I'm sure she said he had been given the BIS for non pedigree.

Anyway suppose I'll never know but next time (whcih won't be till march for me now) I will ensure I know how it all works before going.

On a final note, it must of been BIS that she said she had given him as he was in a class of his own and so wouldn't of beaten any other cats if she had been talking about BOC. They do come and get the cats when they announce the BIS don't they and not just announce it and then it is up to the exhibitor to take the cat,?


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## Kalipha (Jul 15, 2009)

He might've got BIS non-pedigree *kitten*. And then they pick from BIS non-ped kitten and neuter and they picked the neuter for overall BIS non-ped. No small achievement still 

Edit: Did he get a small purple rosette that said "Nominated Best of Variety Kitten"?


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## dharma66 (Oct 25, 2009)

I've seen a few posts like this, and posted one or two myself, and someone always posts a link to the GCCF, saying that it explains everything. However, I've been through that website as much as I can manage, and I've never actually managed to find anything that comes close to making things clear.

If someone can provide a link to the actual page that explains things, or tell me what links to follow from the home[age, then that would be great.


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## messyhearts (Feb 6, 2009)

allison6564 said:


> Hi
> yes right at the end I saw all the BIS cats up front but I missed the announcements etc as they were so quiet! So I can understand in Ollies pedigree classes but in the non pedigree do they have a best of class for each also? Stan was the only SH kitten and so got his 1st open but when this lady (judge) came up to me during the afternoon she did say that she had awarded him somethign and that he had beaten all the other cats in! So really confused. Could it be the case that she gave it to him but other judges didn't agree maybe. At the end of the I only do the shows for fun and not upset about it and I'm so pleased with what they have both won but with the lady coming up to me and saying that I just don't understand what she meant. I'm sure she said he had been given the BIS for non pedigree.
> 
> Anyway suppose I'll never know but next time (whcih won't be till march for me now) I will ensure I know how it all works before going.
> ...


All open classes are split into genders. Each one that comes first in each gender within that class is eligible for BOB/BOC along with others that have opted in (like a cat in a Grand Premier/Champion/Master class). Each BOB in a section (kitten, neuter, adult) competes for BOV & then the three compete for BOV overall to be up for the BIS.

Do you know who this woman was? TBH I wouldn't take anything someone says until you see it as fact on the results boards or with a rosette on your pen. She could have said he was BOV non-ped kitten. They still need to choose the best overall non-ped out of all of them for BOV. Someone comes & gets the cat & puts it in the BOV pen for BIS then. Though if you didn't get that little purple rosette then I am not sure what you were told was truthful.

He would have been against any other kitten that had BOC. So I am looking at the results at the moment on Cat Planet there were three with BOC for ped kittens & four in the non-ped. So he would have had competition for BOV kitten.


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## allison6564 (Aug 20, 2009)

Hi
thanks for everyone trying to explain all of this but I'm still unclear!! Sorry I must be thick but just don't get it all. I've always thought I'm an intelligent woman, have my own business, trained accountant but god this all baffles me !!! LOL
Stan was the only kitten in the pet section and so won his open as he was the only one, don't get me wrong his side classes had more cats in and he got a 1st and 2nd up against other cats and so I'm so proud of him! 

Think I just need to forget about this lady who came up to me and move on.

Saying all that if he was up against BOC kittens in the pedigree section then the little Eygptian Mau that got that was so stunning and very much deserved it! Stan i so sweet and lovely but that little girl was another league!! lol

Anyway I'm really not that bothered and so very very happy with my boys and enjoyed the whole day so much can't wait until March!

I just wanted to try and get my head round it all but will keep trying:confused5:
Thanks all


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## messyhearts (Feb 6, 2009)

According to Cat Planet, there were 7 kittens in the pet section that got BOCs. It is those he would have been against. Stan wouldn't have been up against an Egyptian Mau.

If you look at this page:
Cheshire Area Cat Club Show 2009 - Non Pedigree | Cheshire Area Cat Club Show - 14/11/09

It shows you who was entered & what they got.

Stan would have been competing against Millie & Lucy at least.


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## Kalipha (Jul 15, 2009)

messyhearts said:


> Stan would have been competing against Millie & Lucy at least.


Maybe I'm reading it wrong, but I looked for Millie and Lucy and both of their classes said 'cat' not 'kitten'.


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## messyhearts (Feb 6, 2009)

Kalipha said:


> Maybe I'm reading it wrong, but I looked for Millie and Lucy and both of their classes said 'cat' not 'kitten'.


I think I have read that page wrong.

Perhaps that isn't clear but Stan certainly would not have been competing against cats that were outside of this list if he did not get BOV overall. If he was the best kitten then he would compete against the best adult & it was an adult that was in the pen for BIS.


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## allison6564 (Aug 20, 2009)

He was the only kitten in the pet section and MC Alfred who won it was a stunning boy and deserved it, I was just confused with this lady coming up to me and she definatly said that he had beaten all the other cats, like you say though until it is in black and white need to take any comments etc with a pinch of salt.

Never mind like I said I was and am so thrilled with them both it really doesn't matter I'm was just trying to understand it all for next time!! LOL:confused5:
Thanks for all your advice and explanations
Allison


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## carolmanycats (May 18, 2009)

Looking at the results and cats there it seems that Stanley was the only non ped/pet ped kitten there so I would say that he was awarded BIS HP Kitten. What happens usually is that the shows ask the judges to pick a BIS Non-Ped Adult, a BIS Non-Ped Kitten, a BIS Pet-Ped Adult and, a BIS Pet-Ped Kitten, then to choose ONE Overall BIS from the 4 (if all 4 are present). OR they just pick an overall BIS Adult from both sections and BIS Kitten from both sections then an Overall BIS from the two, some, like the Yorkshire have all 4 BIS awards then an Overall Non-Ped and an Overall Pet-Ped rather than the 2 competing."Our" South Ribble show, where we had Adult, Kitten & Junior in both sections is different as we are a solely non-ped show so can go the extra mile 

I suspect that on Saturday either Alfred was the Non-Ped Adult, there was no Non-Ped Kitten, one of the Pet-Ped Adults was BIS Pet-Ped Adult and Stanley was BIS Pet-Ped Kitten then Alfred was BIS Overall or else they just picked one of each Adult & Kitten, Alfred was BIS Non/Pet-Ped Adult and Stanley was BIS Non/Pet-Ped Kitten. Either way, Alfred got the Overall BIS and, as usually happens, no further mention is made of any of the others - again, unlike "our" show where they all get a "posh pen"!

As for going up against the pedigrees, no, there are 2 distinct and seperate BIS, one each for the pedigree and non/pet pedigree sections and ne'er the twain shall meet!!! (Well, they did once, several years ago, and a judge made history - and got everyone into a lot of bother ;-) - by picking the HP as the Overall BIS!!! Actually, that was Alfred too LOL).

Carol


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## allison6564 (Aug 20, 2009)

HI CArol
many thanks for the info and now it is all clear and what a funny story about Alfred!!! LOL

I think I met a friend of yours there on sat who was Teddy Boy's owner, sorry don't have my schedule here at work to know her name but sure you'll know who I mean. She was really nice and even let me give Teddy a cuddle, he is absolutely gorgous!!! I could of taken him home (husband would kill me if I got any more cats though)!!LOL

Stan done me so proud and the next show we'll be at is the Shropshire now on 6th Feb, said I wouldn't travel any more than 1 hour but getting the bug!!!

The cats in the pet section were all loveley and it was horrible to hear some of the horror stories about them being rescued. There are very evil people out there.:shocked:

Thanks again and good luck with your cats in any up coming shows, are you ate the supreme?
Take Care
Allison


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## carolmanycats (May 18, 2009)

No probs, Allison 

Yes, pauline is lovely, as is Teddy Boy, what a huge soppy boy he is!!

Will see you at the Shropshire then, it's actually not too far, certainly takes me well under 2 hours from here.

Yes, got all the curly boys and girl at the Supreme plus another couple of HPs too )

Carol


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## Kalipha (Jul 15, 2009)

I'll hopefully be at that one with Liz  When the tiny Mau will be less tiny! God she looked miniscule in the BOV pens next to that massive British and Persian.


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## messyhearts (Feb 6, 2009)

Kalipha said:


> I'll hopefully be at that one with Liz  When the tiny Mau will be less tiny! God she looked miniscule in the BOV pens next to that massive British and Persian.


I thought that British was going to get BIS. He was HUGE!


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## allison6564 (Aug 20, 2009)

FINALLY I GET IT!!! LOL
just checked my schedule and Stan would of got BOC out of all the pet pedigree's (not non pet pedigree's) and there was 7 including him so "well Stan the Man"!! When the lady said he had beaten the other cats she would of meant the other pet pedigree's so all makes sense at last!
Look forward to seeing you all st the Shropshire show.


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## allison6564 (Aug 20, 2009)

Just want to send a HUGE GOOD LUCK Carol for the supreme!


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## carolmanycats (May 18, 2009)

Thanks Allison!


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## allison6564 (Aug 20, 2009)

God I am so THICK!!! Was admiring Stan's rossettes this morning and what was there? A BOB one!!! so he won the BOb for the pet pedigree's soa ll makes sense now. I wonder if I am going do lally sometimes!!!! lol


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