# help - my fishes have ich! :(



## avons82 (Mar 23, 2010)

Hi,

Its me again! Now I have another problem with my tank - 60l biorb with one black moor, one other very small fantail and 5 tiny ones (like coldwater neons - sorry I dont know what theyre called).

I introduced my new small fantail two weeks ago and both goldfish are now lethargic and sitting at the bottom of the tank, and have little white spots, like a salt dusting on them - this looks like ich.

Did a water change a week ago and the testing kit reads all ok on except on the second ph level which is a bit high (goes a bit pink on the stick instead of white).

How do I treat this? Ive googled this and cant seem to find a straight forward solution to help them - is there one?

Any help or advice would be great! Ive had endless problems with this tank and just want my fish to be well!

thanks, Amey


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## Guest (Jun 28, 2010)

When you mention the second pH level, are you using the test reagent for high pH levels? Master test kits usually come with two types of pH test reagent, one for acidic/neutral conditions (usually between pH 5.0-7.5) and one for more alkaline conditions (pH 7.5-9.5).

It's important that you don't confuse Whitespot (_Ichthyophthirius multifilis_) with Velvet disease (_Oödinium pilularis_ or _Oödinium limneticum_ in freshwater species). Both diseases produce relatively similar symptoms, however the spots caused by Velvet are noticeably smaller than those produced by Whitespot, with Velvet spots resulting in a 'clouded' effect on the affected fishes skin.

A slightly more detailed description of the symptoms would be very useful, as would be a photo. Are the fish showing any other unusual symptoms, such as rubbing, flicking or heavy breathing?

In either case, both diseases are extremely contagious and treatment must be initiated quickly to ensure success.


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## Fishyfins (Feb 28, 2009)

hmmmmm, what you describe could certainly be ich. ich is usually seen as small sugar sized specks on he fishes body, along with lethargy and flicking. 

now, when you say you tested the water, what exactly did you test for? if you could tell us what you got for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate, it would help us to figure out whats going on, and help solve the problem. dont worry about PH, unless your keeping difficult to keep fish such as discus, then it isnt really necissary test for it, and goldfish will live happily in all but the extremes of acidity and alkalinity, so that wont matter.

one problem i will point out now though, from the information you have given, is that your tank is already pretty heavily overstocked. fancy goldfish require about 50L per fish (and thats not just when they get big), so with you having 2, the goldfish alone will require about 100L of space, and on top of that you have what im assuming to be white cloud mountain minnows (which, as another point, the goldfish will eventualy eat).
these problems are multiplied by the fact they are in a biorb, which are far from ideal aquariums, having limited surface area for oxygen diffusion, and a very basic filter system. if kept in a biorb, you probably need to double the space the fish need, to compensate for these limitations in the tanks design.

it is highly likely given the information above that the water conditions in the tank are sub-par (too many fish producing too much waste, being cleaned by too small a filter), weakening the fishes immune system, and causing disease to spread. it would be best for the health of the fish if the goldfish were removed from the system. indeed there is very little you can do to ensure the health of the fish unless you do. in the meantime, treatment with a simple white spot medication will help, but you would essentially be treating a symptom, not the cause.


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## avons82 (Mar 23, 2010)

hi,

I did a partial eater change on sunday night and added some salt to help until I could get to the shop for more testing kits and some of the advised " Protozin" solution. Both fantails are looking terrible now, sitting at the bottom, dusted in white spots, fins retracted and the blackmoor looks to have blood around the gills!  - see uploaded pics.

Im going to the aquatic shop tonight... so is Protozin still the most advised? Someone else mentioned treating with a white spot medication - is this the same thing?

thanks so much..

amey


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## Guest (Jun 30, 2010)

It's whitespot alright, no mistake. I would suggest quarantining any affected fish into their own quarters, for the time being. I also wouldn't suggest adding salt, with the exception of aquarium pharmaceutical salts. Saline conditions are the last thing a freshwater fish needs when suffering from a disease.

Waterlife Protozin is formulated for treatment against whitespot, fungal infections, NTD, velvet, Costiasis and Trichodiniasis. It does work, however I've had far better success with eSHA labs Exit, simply due to its potency.

The blood around the gills that you describe will be inflammation, which suggests that the disease has become well established. Gradually raising the water temperature with a heater will speed up the cyst lifecycle, aiding treatment. However, warmer water can hold less dissolved oxygen, so add an airstone if you have one.


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## Fishyfins (Feb 28, 2009)

I agree with Chill there. salt is often advised as a treatment for parasites, as they dont like it, but it can be dangerous to use, as freshwater fish hate it as well (burns them), and can put the fish under even more stress. in my opinion, whilst the science behind it works, the dangers outweigh the benefits, and there are better treatments out there, far better!


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