# Is he to old?



## Staffiez (Aug 30, 2011)

Hi All

I offered my male Staffie to stud her bitch as they both have such nice and gentle personalities.Shes just a little over 3 and he's heading to being 7. 
However, when i take him round they have a quick play then he tries mounting her. But she's a bit taller than him, so he has about 10 seconds trying then just stops and gets off.
We've put cushions around to help him and the bitch bends her back legs a bit but he still has a quick go and stops.

Is it her height or is my baby past it


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## Doolally (Oct 12, 2010)

Past it. Completely. As are all the staffies being put to sleep daily because they're being horrendously overbred


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## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

Please please don't offer your dog for stud, quite aside from the issue of him being an older dog there are _too many_ staffies, rescues are full of them & people are having immense trouble rehoming them. It would be irresponsible & unfair to bring any more staffies into the world


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## Staffiez (Aug 30, 2011)

You will find rescues aren't full of Staffies, in fact if you counted each breed in a rescue center Staffies are reasonably low in the list. It's because of a Staffies 'reputation' they are highlighted more!


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## Nataliee (Jul 25, 2011)

68 Staffies a DAY killed in the UK because people still keeping breeding.
68 x 7 = 476 a WEEK.
476 x 52 = 24,572 DEAD STAFFIE AND STAFFIE CROSSES A YEAR.


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## Doolally (Oct 12, 2010)

I beg to differ...I'm a veterinary nurse and we do all the vet work for a local very large charity. 90% of the dogs they have are bull breeds, mostly made up of staff/staff crosses. The charity I deal with has a no kill policy unless the dog is severely aggressive, but unfortunately that also means some of the staffs have been then for well over a year. And when you've held a sweet 6month old puppy for it to be put to sleep because its a staff cross that has been 'identified' as being a pit cross, then come and tell me there's not an issue with over breeding bull breeds


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

Past it. I've heard of bigger height differences than than overcome by tiny dogs, so lankier of the same breed ain't an excuse for him, bless'im!
If a dog isn't bred by a certain age, then many just havnt a clue what they are doing.
But I've got to add, the fact that he wasn't doesnt have the drive now is likely the reason for his excessive loveliness now. SBT is a terrier just like the yorkie, so I'll assume they are similar in this respect; many, many breeders of YTs will say that once you breed your boy, your left with a stud; they don't ever completely revert back to the cuddly bundle of love they were- not 100%
~ I don't know personally, I was too afraid to keep an intact male away from my girls twice a year, so I just hire them an escort for the weekend instead!


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## SixStar (Dec 8, 2009)

Staffiez said:


> You will find rescues aren't full of Staffies, in fact if you counted each breed in a rescue center Staffies are reasonably low in the list. It's because of a Staffies 'reputation' they are highlighted more!


A load of crap. Like it or not, rescues ARE absolutely bursting with Staffies. Hundreds put to sleep each week.

We're a forum of dog lovers - we take no note of the bad reputation Staffies wrongly have, yet we still try and highlight just how bad the Staffie rescue crisis is at the moment, because, simply.. it's awful.

Please don't stud your dog - the last thing needed at the moment is more Staffie pups


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## Guest (Aug 30, 2011)

Argh...this is whats wrong with the world.


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## AlexArt (Apr 25, 2010)

Oh dear another backyard breeder - poor dogs!!
Have you actually looked on all the freeads, preloved etc there are simply TONS of staffies that no-one wants or can sell, where do you think they all end up?!! - I think you'll find if you actually go to a rescue centre and ask which are the hardest dogs to find homes for and which are the most commonly put to sleep dogs and you'll find they are staffies and staffy crosses!! 

Has your dog had any health tests, has it won any shows - likewise the bitch too - as that may increase the chances of selling at least one or two puppies, or are you purely breeding to make a fast buck and the bitch owner wants some ever so cuuute puppieeeees to play with!! - I hope your friend can keep 6+ puppies and can afford to spay/neuter/vaccinate/chip all those that don't sell, as all breeders should or they should not breed!

And yes at 7 your dogs fertility will be lower than it was at say 3, and there is a higher chance of having puppies with birth defects. Does your dog even suit the bitches conformation? - what are you aiming to improve on her? - have you given ANY thought at all to this other than they are nice pets???? - sigh!!!


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## Staffiez (Aug 30, 2011)

Doolally said:


> I beg to differ...I'm a veterinary nurse and we do all the vet work for a local very large charity. 90% of the dogs they have are bull breeds, mostly made up of staff/staff crosses. The charity I deal with has a no kill policy unless the dog is severely aggressive, but unfortunately that also means some of the staffs have been then for well over a year. And when you've held a sweet 6month old puppy for it to be put to sleep because its a staff cross that has been 'identified' as being a pit cross, then come and tell me there's not an issue with over breeding bull breeds


Now you are bringing Pits in to it. A Pit Bull is a banned dog that has NOTHING to do with Staffies.

The person who has the bitch has 4 people waiting for a pup (although shes more likely to have 1 or2), her brother, 2 of her sons and her best friend, so its not a irresponsible breed, they will all get a excellent home, and knows none will ever end up in a center.
Would you find it better if i was breeding these crossed dogs like Labadoodles where you are mixing breeds giving the pups problems with the heart,breathing or whatever else they end up with. Then when the pups 'look wrong' they are cast aside!


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## Nataliee (Jul 25, 2011)

Staffiez said:


> Now you are bringing Pits in to it. A Pit Bull is a banned dog that has NOTHING to do with Staffies.
> 
> The person who has the bitch has 4 people waiting for a pup (although shes more likely to have 1 or2), her brother, 2 of her sons and her best friend, so its not a irresponsible breed, they will all get a excellent home, and knows none will ever end up in a center.
> Would you find it better if i was breeding these crossed dogs like Labadoodles where you are mixing breeds giving the pups problems with the heart,breathing or whatever else they end up with. Then when the pups 'look wrong' they are cast aside!


Why can't her brother, 2 of her sons and her best friend go and choose some nice staffie pups from a rescue, there's plenty to choose from


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## Staffiez (Aug 30, 2011)

Nataliee said:


> Why can't her brother, 2 of her sons and her best friend go and choose some nice staffie pups from a rescue, there's plenty to choose from


Because they can't find any!!!


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## Dally Banjo (Oct 22, 2009)

:idea: Google staffy rescues uk


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## Guest (Aug 30, 2011)

Staffiez said:


> You will find rescues aren't full of Staffies, in fact if you counted each breed in a rescue center Staffies are reasonably low in the list. It's because of a Staffies 'reputation' they are highlighted more!


rescues are full of staffies and their crosses , take a look in the rescue section of this very forum!!



Staffiez said:


> Because they can't find any!!!


you must be walking round with your eyes closed then


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

at 7 no he shouldnt be to old, assuming he is a healthy dog. - I would re think studding him out, rescues are full of staffs, and there crosses. Dogs are PTS daily. 
- You havent mentioned health tests, or your male being proven as a good example of the breed with something to offer a line, and the over all breed - therefore I fail to see there being a need to stud him out. 

Breeding is far to easy, and people seem to be jumping on the band wagon. not having a clue, and no reason.


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## Guest (Aug 30, 2011)

please have a read of this link.
Save the Staffies - Staffordshire Bull Terriers, Rescue dogs, staffies, staffy


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## Zayna (Apr 19, 2009)

Staffiez said:


> Because they can't find any!!!


sorry but thats bullcrap, when oh were looking for a rescue dog every centre we rang were FULL to the brim with staffies, they were literally begging us to take them!

Please please ask those people who want staffs to contact a rescue, they have stafs of all colours ages sizes etc, they will have so many to choose from!


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## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

Staffiez said:


> Because they can't find any!!!


Tell them to try harder, last week there was a lovely staffy boy on death row due to the lack of demand for the breed, it took several people on several forums (including this one) until this dog found a rescue place, he was due to die yesterday & he is one of the lucky ones, do your homework & your blinkered eyes will be opened, dogs and puppies are _dying_ daily, due to people like you thinking one litter will not make a difference, believe me, it really does
Please, just forget any idea of breeding him & just enjoy him as your friend & companion


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## AlexArt (Apr 25, 2010)

***Shakes head in disbelief**** - I don't think you get it!! - if you have 4 people wanting puppies - and by the way people will say they want a pup as they like the idea then pull out at the last minute when they realise how big a commitment it is to have a dog and how much it costs to keep one - they always do!!! But that aside there are soooo many in rescues that the sensible, cheaper and more responsible thing for those people to do is rescue a puppy who has already been bred by an idiot like yourself and your friend with exactly the same idea and belief they are being responsible, thought they could make a quick buck and use their pet as a cash machine, and give a poor animal that is already in the world and not wanted a good home - imagine how good that would feel if you stopped thinking of yourself and do a good deed for another living thing - probably an alien concept to you and I'm sure this is falling on thick ears but worth a try for the animals sake!!?????!!!!! - I wish they would bring in a pet license so numpties like this don't get their greedy selfish mits on animals - no wonder we have too many dogs in this country!

And by the way crossbreeding doesn't mean the dogs have health problems unless the parents are not health tested for hereditary problems - which applies to pedigree dogs with no health tests too - a pedigree only proves the dogs breeding NOT wether the dog has any hereditary defects which is why people get the tests done - you are doing EXACTLY what someone breeding 2 random un-health tested mongrels is doing, there is no difference except a piece of paper!!


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## bassetsandbeyond (Jun 21, 2009)

7 isn't too old, my nan studded out her sheltie till it was 10 i believe


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## Nataliee (Jul 25, 2011)

Staffiez said:


> Because they can't find any!!!


SUGAR - Details - rspca.org.uk
LOUIS - Details - rspca.org.uk
ELLIOTT - Details - rspca.org.uk
ICE - Details - rspca.org.uk
MISSY - Details - rspca.org.uk
MINNIE - Details - rspca.org.uk

And thats just the RSPCA, who i'd imagine are quite particular about which staffies they take on. When i spoke to dogs trust they told me they only take on 7 staffies in each centre at a time because they are so hard to rehome, and to be one of those lucky 7 they have to pass a very hard test


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

Staffiez said:


> Because they can't find any!!!


well they ain't looking in the right places because almost all rescues are inundated with staffs or staff types.


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## Zayna (Apr 19, 2009)

puppies are cute, people like puppies, i think i might just breed some for fun:mad2:


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## Guest (Aug 30, 2011)

bassetsandbeyond said:


> 7 isn't too old, my nan studded out her sheltie till it was 10 i believe


oh god please , don`t give them any idea`s


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

Staffiez said:


> Because they can't find any!!!


my motto. what he hasn't had he won't miss . forget using him at stud.


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## bassetsandbeyond (Jun 21, 2009)

diablo said:


> oh god please , don`t give them any idea`s


sorry  just being truthful


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## Doolally (Oct 12, 2010)

Staffiez said:


> Now you are bringing Pits in to it. A Pit Bull is a banned dog that has NOTHING to do with Staffies.
> 
> !


If you cared to read my post I didn't mention it was a Pit Bull. I'm saying that MANY staffie crosses are wrongly 'typed' as being 'Pit Bull Type' as they are typed completely on looks.

IF I worked for a charity that did kill SBTs then my post would have been me saying I cuddle SBTs whilst they are put to sleep. But no, them 'lucky' ones that get to 'my' rescue are left to sit in kennels for months or even years. What I was saying in my post is 90% of the dogs we see through the charity are Bull Breeds crosses, and the wrongly typed SBT crosses are the ones I have to hold whilst they are put to sleep.

It's a ridiculous situation...made worse all the time by people still churning out SBTs because they are 'lovely dogs' - which I don't doubt they are!! But there's 1000s more lovely ones sitting in rescue!


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## Guest (Aug 30, 2011)

bassetsandbeyond said:


> sorry  just being truthful


yar , comments like that hardly help when most know thousands of staffs are needlessly dying in rescues everyday , your grans dog was probably an entirely different ball game , great pedigree , current health tests , had loads to offer the gene pool.


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## Guest (Aug 30, 2011)

nice wind up ya got them all going


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## bassetsandbeyond (Jun 21, 2009)

diablo said:


> yar , comments like that hardly help when most know thousands of staffs are needlessly dying in rescues everyday , your grans dog was probably an entirely different ball game , great pedigree , current health tests , had loads to offer the gene pool.


yes he was, all the health tests under the Sheltie sun! lol

I now and again look on the ads of the internet....chocker block of Staffie's and staffie mutts. No reason for surfing the net in the local areas/counties


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## Marley boy (Sep 6, 2010)

Staffiez said:


> Because they can't find any!!!


my local rescue only has staffies in at the moment bar one or two other terrier mixes. Unless you live on mars you will be able to find staff puppies for rehoming


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

Staffiez said:


> Hi All
> 
> I offered my male Staffie to stud her bitch as they both have such nice and gentle personalities.Shes just a little over 3 and he's heading to being 7.
> However, when i take him round they have a quick play then he tries mounting her. But she's a bit taller than him, so he has about 10 seconds trying then just stops and gets off.
> ...


Personally cannot for the life of me see why anyone would want to breed a litter of staffies in the current environment!
You may have the best dog in the world there!! but there are to many in rescue at the moment!
And every pup that is sold is a *guaranteed* death warrant for an unwanted staffie! If you love your breed you would *NOT* put another dog through that!
DT


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## Guest (Aug 30, 2011)

My local stray center;
Hyndburn Stray Dogs In Need

What do you see? 5 of the 6 dogs are staff/staff cross.


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## emsky (Jul 26, 2011)

Its a huge responsibilty and weight on your shoulders, would you know that every pup you breed will have a good and loving forever home? Its a fact that Staffs and Staff crosses out number every other breed put together in rescue centres. Its heartbreaking to think that a pup/dog you brought into this world would end up unloved, abandoned and worse pts due to irresponsible breeding. Unless you're completely heartless/greedy don't do it.


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## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> Its a huge responsibilty and weight on your shoulders, would you know that every pup you breed will have a good and loving forever home?


As much as I share your sentiments - these kind of breeders/stud owners don't know the meaning of 'responsibility'.!


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## Cassia (May 28, 2011)

I'm deeply saddend by the original post.
But I don't have the energy at the moment to explain why.
I'm sure most of you know why anyway, you probably feel the same.


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## Emmy333 (Oct 25, 2010)

staffordshire bull terriers - United Kingdom - Classifieds

A quick Gumtree search; over nine pages

Find staffordshire bull terrier Freeads | Find All Free Ads Classifieds for sale in the UK

A quick Freeads search; over 22 pages

Preloved | Pets and Livestock free ads UK and Ireland

A quick Preloved search; 20 pages

Are you genuinely saying, hand on heart, that you can't find a staffy pup? Seriously? :cursing:


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## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

Staffiez said:


> Now you are bringing Pits in to it. A Pit Bull is a banned dog that has NOTHING to do with Staffies.
> 
> The person who has the bitch has 4 people waiting for a pup (although shes more likely to have 1 or2), her brother, 2 of her sons and her best friend, so its not a irresponsible breed, they will all get a excellent home, and knows none will ever end up in a center.
> Would you find it better if i was breeding these crossed dogs like Labadoodles where you are mixing breeds giving the pups problems with the heart,breathing or whatever else they end up with. Then when the pups 'look wrong' they are cast aside!


Why is she using your dog at 7 years old when he's never been used at stud? What has he got that all the other staffy stud dogs haven't?

Why has he got to 7 without being used? is that because you have been busy campaigning him in the showring to get his stud book number / titles before you allowed him to stand at stud?

Why did you have to 'offer' your boy? Bitch owners have the pick of stud dogs from loving family pets to SH Ch and full champions and beyond - even pet bitch owners can pretty much take their pick of stud dogs. I talked to about 50 stud dog owners before I decided who I was going to use on my girl, and chose the dog who I felt could add most to my bitch to improve the conformation of her offspring while at least maintaining and hopefully improving overall health and maintaining the even steady temperament of my girl.

The fact you had to offer and she has pups waiting would suggest to me that the bitch owner has had problems finding a stud dog - there must be a reason for that - is convenience being offset against using the best dog?

I assume your dog and the bitch have had all the required health-tests for the breed and that you are able to advise the bitch owner on keeping an in whelp bitch and how to raise a litter and be in a position to help find suitable homes for the pups.

As you are inexperienced - I assume you have a competent experienced mentor to guide and advise you?



DT said:


> Personally cannot for the life of me see why anyone would want to breed a litter of staffies in the current environment


TBH - it's quite daunting breeding in the current economic climate for many, even in popular breeds such as my own - never mind a breed where there is quite clearly a very real problem


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## shamykebab (Jul 15, 2009)

Just to add some more to that list:

Roger
Baggins
Hettie


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

I hadn't even wanted to get started on the whole shelter staffie issue- but I originally assumed the 'breeder' just happened to ask you to stud your dog for the 1st time, but since I reread that You offered, then yea, I agree that you should really open your wyes and look at the whole picture. 
At one time, one of our very few no kill shelters had about 25 or so staffs, and a huge list of staffs in foster and on pounds death rows just hoping for a space to come up, but for most it never did.
Two people I know had fantastic SBT bp's, but they were having issues with feeling ok about bringing more pups into the overpopulated world, so stopped breeding. But if we can get rid of all the bybs (by not buying from them or studding to them) then suddenly more of the better breeders will start up their programes again and be more likely to mentor those newer and dedicated breeders who deserve it! And those who are not willing to save up and buy from a reputable breeder will just have to adopt an older dog or lost pup, or if the shelters are Actually empty, then they would just have to wait for a dog to become available!


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## Cockerpoo lover (Oct 15, 2009)

If the bitches owner has family and friends waiting for pups rather than breed her, it would be easier and kinder and more responsible to go to a number of rescues throughout the UK and look into adopting a rescue.

With so many staffies PTS at present I think it would be such a nice thing for the 4 people concerned to do


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## Zayna (Apr 19, 2009)

OP hasnt been back, this is prob a wind up


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

Zayna said:


> OP hasnt been back, this is prob a wind up


or they realised breeding like this is a terrible idea and didn't want to read the replies they're getting haha


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## casandra (Aug 1, 2008)

7 Pups for 7 People:

Seven Pups For Seven People 1/3 - YouTube

Seven Pups For Seven People 2/3 - YouTube

Seven Pups for Seven People 3/3

Even those breeding fully health tested, show quality Staffordshire Bull Terriers and other well-bred pedigree breeds are having issues finding the right homes for their dogs. Unless you are doing it for the right reasons (to further a line with a purpose, ie to show or work,) and you have the right experience, know-how, and resources, you shouldn't be doing it at all. The majority of people after Staffords and other status dog breeds shouldn't own a pet rock let alone a dog.


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## jo5 (Jun 22, 2011)

Nico0laGouldsmith said:


> or they realised breeding like this is a terrible idea and didn't want to read the replies they're getting haha


There have been some honest posts here explaining why this is such a bad idea, but lots of offensive posts too, you may feel strongly about this situation I think we all do, and its exasperating that someone seems ignorant of the current Staffie crisis  But due to the offensive nature of some of the posts I doubt the OP will be back I know I wouldn't but I would have left thinking you were a lot of well won't say what , because when you are rude thats how it comes across, its harder but so much more fruitful to calmly inform someone of the facts , they are so much more likely to listen and if they don't want to listen at least you have done your best you can do no more. So to those who have been rude and offensive, Congratulations, you have achieved absolutely nothing ....again


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## jo5 (Jun 22, 2011)

If the OP does come back on to read any more posts, I would like to say that regardless of what you want to believe, there* is* a massive Staffie rescue crisis at the moment, which is such a shame as they are indeed lovely dogs, my sister had a rescue Staffie, she was very sweet. It really is a bad a idea to produce any more pups for a huge amount of reasons, you have been given sound advice by some, read it and take it in they do know what they are talking about. Also have a look at some rescue centres online, its so sad to see any type of dog there but unfortunbately its the Staffies that end up as the long term residents and as kind as the rescue centre staff are its no substitute for a family of their own. If your friends family want a Pup rather than an adult that shouldn't be a problem as there are usually litters in as nobody wants them
Think things through I am sure you don't want to be responsible for yet more dogs ending up in rescue, or with a breed related condition as they havent been health tested.


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

jo5 said:


> There have been some honest posts here explaining why this is such a bad idea, but lots of offensive posts too, you may feel strongly about this situation I think we all do, and its exasperating that someone seems ignorant of the current Staffie crisis  But due to the offensive nature of some of the posts I doubt the OP will be back I know I wouldn't but I would have left thinking you were a lot of well won't say what , because when you are rude thats how it comes across, its harder but so much more fruitful to calmly inform someone of the facts , they are so much more likely to listen and if they don't want to listen at least you have done your best you can do no more. So to those who have been rude and offensive, Congratulations, you have achieved absolutely nothing ....again


Not really seen anything that is ultra offensive!
Certainly not by pf past experiences I havn't!
OK one person may dress up what they say- make it kinda pink and fluffy!
Me personally- i'd sooner folk spell it out! Certainly where the SBT is concerned!


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## jo5 (Jun 22, 2011)

DT said:


> Not really seen anything that is ultra offensive!
> Certainly not by pf past experiences I havn't!
> OK one person may dress up what they say- make it kinda pink and fluffy!
> Me personally- i'd sooner folk spell it out! Certainly where the SBT is concerned!


There have been offensive posts, do they have to be 'ultra offensive 'now to count  No one suggested making anything Pink and Fluffy but by being offensive you achieve absolutely nothing, apart from relieving your own frustrations which may benefit you but achieves nothing else. 
You can spell things out without being offensive, would you be more likely to listen if someone laid down the facts for you or simply insulted you


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

jo5 said:


> There have been offensive posts, do they have to be 'ultra offensive 'now to count  No one suggested making anything Pink and Fluffy but by being offensive you achieve absolutely nothing, apart from relieving your own frustrations which may benefit you but achieves nothing else.
> You can spell things out without being offensive, would you be more likely to listen if someone laid down the facts for you or simply insulted you


but sadly, where the SBT is concerned, people obviously have not listened, nor have they done their homework! It is after all the breed most in crisis, not a day goes by without us reading of poordogseither being put to sleep or being stuck in rescue for years on end
(look atsome of ninja's posts )
Personally! and this is speakly purely of myself, whenever I see such posts as these I think on of two things.

One! either its a wind up!
Two! whatever anyone says NOTHING will stop them going ahead

Sadly! again speaking for myself I cannot find a civil tongue for anyone considering such irresponsible breeding- and if that is viewed with giving me relief from my frustrations then all I can say is Guess I can live with that!


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## Freyja (Jun 28, 2008)

As the owner of the stud you would be just as responsible as the bitch owner for finding homes for the pups. Do you have room to keep a whole litter of pups for the rest of their lives if homes cannot be found for them?

Saying you have homes for them does not always work I had a litter of whippets earlier this year and although I had a full waiting list of homes for the pups when they were born people dropped out why? because the pups were not the colour of dad. Out of 8 pups 2 have stayed with me as future show dogs and 1 has been given to the bitches breeder. Of the others 2 have only just gone to their new homes at nearly 7 months old. Whippets are not like staffies they are usually easy to find homes for.

I have also had at least 3 people contact me recently about using my dogs as studs all have been put off. I dare say they have gone else were to find a stud but there is no wat I am encouraging anyone to breed at the moment even in my own breed and breeding of a bitch that is a pet and not been proved in any way.


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## ClaireandDaisy (Jul 4, 2010)

I think this is yet another wind-up merchant. The best response is a dignified silence. 
Either that or it`s a bloke who gets his jollies talking about dogs bonking possibly? In which case a swift exit is best. I mean... euw!


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## Staffiez (Aug 30, 2011)

And thats just the RSPCA, who i'd imagine are quite particular about which staffies they take on. When i spoke to dogs trust they told me they only take on 7 staffies in each centre at a time because they are so hard to rehome, and to be one of those lucky 7 they have to pass a very hard test[/QUOTE]

7?? 7?? Rimming with Staffies i think u, Staffie haters are trying to say!!

This whole thing is about getting a rescue dog and not breeding as (i quote) rescue centers are over run with Staffies, well you could only find 7. Does that mean rescue centers only keep 10 dogs per center? I think not!!
So i guess that means you all speak crap and have no idea. 
No rescue center turns any dog away no matter what breed it is. If you can give me a name and address of a center that does then i'll show you an unfit shelter. People like that do not selective rescue, they might find alternative housing if they are full, but never do they refuse to take an animal!!

Who do u all think u r slagging me down like ur doing, calling me an idiot/irresponsible and whatever else you see fit. Yet it people like you lot that hate Staffies and saying no1 wants them blah blah blah that's putting people off them so they are giving them up!!

I've never heard from so many narrow minded, jumped up load of morons in my life!!
I asked a perfectly reasonable question, that i would of expected a perfectly reasonable answer. but no!!
Because i mentioned the 'S' word you put me in a set category that you stupidly believe own Staffies.

To whoever said cross breeding doesn't add problems to a 'breed' what planet do u live on? 
These are 'fashion' dogs. What do you think happens to these when a Labadoodle grows up without a curly coat or a Yorkiepoo looks like a normal yorkie?? they get thrown out idiot!

Has anyone asked what where and where4s? no!! You've all just jumped on the ban wagon cuz u hate Staffies, you sad SAD bunch of simpletons!!!


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## Staffiez (Aug 30, 2011)

ClaireandDaisy said:


> I think this is yet another wind-up merchant. The best response is a dignified silence.
> Either that or it`s a bloke who gets his jollies talking about dogs bonking possibly? In which case a swift exit is best. I mean... euw!


OMG you sick individual !!!


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## jo5 (Jun 22, 2011)

DT said:


> but sadly, where the SBT is concerned, people obviously have not listened, nor have they done their homework! It is after all the breed most in crisis, not a day goes by without us reading of poordogseither being put to sleep or being stuck in rescue for years on end
> (look atsome of ninja's posts )
> Personally! and this is speakly purely of myself, whenever I see such posts as these I think on of two things.
> 
> ...


I am not arguing there is a terrible rescue crisis at the moment especially as far as staffies are concerned but I think you have summed it all up in your post all the things that illustrate my point nicely. You immediately think that the post is a wind up, you clearly have a high opinion of the dog owning general public then as to a lot of pet owning people, breeding their dog is seen as nothing more than natural., their parents had litters whats the problem etc etc So why would they think asking a question would wind people up?? Secondly you have already assumed that they will go ahead regardless, thats probably correct in the majority of cases but what about those few who will listen, your attitude would condemn those would be puppies, I am glad you can live with that, I for one couldn't 
You see unless you are a member of a forum such as this or a breed club or do activities with your dog etc etc, you won't come accross breeding issues, rescue centres overflowing with dogs that will never be homed. I think you also wrongly assume that everyone has the same knowledge as you, the truth is they don't. They live in their bubble with their 'nice' pet who would make a lovely mum, they don't see that as being wrong, so to come onto a forum with what seems to them to be a perfectly acceptable question and be blown away with abuse is a bit of a shock  and they will scurry away not with much needed info but stinging ears and are then likely to carry on regardless as they have no respect for 'advice' like that.I have lost count of the amount of times someone down the School or a friend of a friend has bought a pup from non ethical breeders or have said They didn't know their bitch was pregnant, or indeed offered me the use of their Dog on my Bitch. These are not yobs or uneducated people, they are just not knowledgable in the ways of Ethical breeding etc. Surely we shouldn't judge but educate them so that they do know better, So 4 out of 5 people still go away and produce a litter but 1 listens , now I can live with that 
Oh and you never know , perhaps without the abuse another 1 will stick around long enough to get some good 'advice' and there could be 1 less litter again, now isn't that better


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

jo5 said:


> There have been some honest posts here explaining why this is such a bad idea, but lots of offensive posts too, you may feel strongly about this situation I think we all do, and its exasperating that someone seems ignorant of the current Staffie crisis  But due to the offensive nature of some of the posts I doubt the OP will be back I know I wouldn't but I would have left thinking you were a lot of well won't say what , because when you are rude thats how it comes across, its harder but so much more fruitful to calmly inform someone of the facts , they are so much more likely to listen and if they don't want to listen at least you have done your best you can do no more. So to those who have been rude and offensive, Congratulations, you have achieved absolutely nothing ....again


yeah I agree some have been offensive and I'm normally the one that doesn't make comments on posts such as this because of the offensive posts . . .it gives the wrong impression buuuuuuuuut sometimes people just need it pointing out how unrealistic they are being. . . imagine if everyone was like "yeah that's not a very good idea. . . there's lots of staffies in rescues so maybe you shouldn't do that please" the person would just think it didn't affect their life that there are all these staffies in rescues but if the people on here show them how passionate they are about this issue the person might think twice

I completely agree with you with a lot of things . . . but then sometimes people come here for advice and because they don't get the answers they want they argue back and then just go off and do it anyway

but maybe this person wasn't really aware of the issues around the dogs in rescues and needed it very bluntly putting to them


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## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

> Staffiez said:
> 
> 
> > And thats just the RSPCA, who i'd imagine are quite particular about which staffies they take on. When i spoke to dogs trust they told me they only take on 7 staffies in each centre at a time because they are so hard to rehome, and to be one of those lucky 7 they have to pass a very hard test
> ...


Actually, you're very wrong, you are obviously not getting the answer you want & therefore have resorted to personal insults at people who genuinely care about all dogs, including your apparently 'hated' staffies. I am currently looking into fostering some of the unfortunate dogs that nobody wants, after last week spent worrying about that unwanted Staffie in the pound who was due to be PTS. Due to the sheer number of Staffords people are throwing out like rubbish, you can bet your bottom dollar that one of the dogs we take in for foster will be a Staffie or Staffie cross
People like you really need a reality check


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## Guest (Aug 31, 2011)

Staffiez said:


> And thats just the RSPCA, who i'd imagine are quite particular about which staffies they take on. When i spoke to dogs trust they told me they only take on 7 staffies in each centre at a time because they are so hard to rehome, and to be one of those lucky 7 they have to pass a very hard test
> 
> 7?? 7?? Rimming with Staffies i think u, Staffie haters are trying to say!!
> 
> ...


aye what you have to remember is , the dog world is a relatively small one it`s widely publicised that the staffie problem is a huge one , even people who are not in the breed , know this. so when ya have problems possibly assisting a bitch in labour , or the two dogs get hurt during the breeding process , it`s this bunch of simpleton morons who you will probably come back to looking for advice just a word to the wise , don`t alienate yeself


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## jo5 (Jun 22, 2011)

Staffiez said:


> And thats just the RSPCA, who i'd imagine are quite particular about which staffies they take on. When i spoke to dogs trust they told me they only take on 7 staffies in each centre at a time because they are so hard to rehome, and to be one of those lucky 7 they have to pass a very hard test


7?? 7?? Rimming with Staffies i think u, Staffie haters are trying to say!!

This whole thing is about getting a rescue dog and not breeding as (i quote) rescue centers are over run with Staffies, well you could only find 7. Does that mean rescue centers only keep 10 dogs per center? I think not!!
So i guess that means you all speak crap and have no idea. 
No rescue center turns any dog away no matter what breed it is. If you can give me a name and address of a center that does then i'll show you an unfit shelter. People like that do not selective rescue, they might find alternative housing if they are full, but never do they refuse to take an animal!!

Who do u all think u r slagging me down like ur doing, calling me an idiot/irresponsible and whatever else you see fit. Yet it people like you lot that hate Staffies and saying no1 wants them blah blah blah that's putting people off them so they are giving them up!!

I've never heard from so many narrow minded, jumped up load of morons in my life!!
I asked a perfectly reasonable question, that i would of expected a perfectly reasonable answer. but no!!
Because i mentioned the 'S' word you put me in a set category that you stupidly believe own Staffies.

To whoever said cross breeding doesn't add problems to a 'breed' what planet do u live on? 
These are 'fashion' dogs. What do you think happens to these when a Labadoodle grows up without a curly coat or a Yorkiepoo looks like a normal yorkie?? they get thrown out idiot!

Has anyone asked what where and where4s? no!! You've all just jumped on the ban wagon cuz u hate Staffies, you sad SAD bunch of simpletons!!![/QUOTE]
*Iunderstand you are feeling attacked at the moment see my previous posts. However you have had valid information regarding the rescue crisis at the moment which is indeed correct It really is not the best time to be breeding Staffies at the moment and its not that posters here don't like the breed quite the opposite, its because they care sooo much that they get a little 'heated'. 
Please read through some more of the more 'helpful' posts as they reiterate what I have said. The thing is you have come here to ask for help with regards to producing another litter of SBT unfortunately due to the huge overpopulation crisis no one here can condone or encourage such a litter.*


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## jo5 (Jun 22, 2011)

Nico0laGouldsmith said:


> yeah I agree some have been offensive and I'm normally the one that doesn't make comments on posts such as this because of the offensive posts . . .it gives the wrong impression buuuuuuuuut sometimes people just need it pointing out how unrealistic they are being. . . imagine if everyone was like "yeah that's not a very good idea. . . there's lots of staffies in rescues so maybe you shouldn't do that please" the person would just think it didn't affect their life that there are all these staffies in rescues but if the people on here show them how passionate they are about this issue the person might think twice
> 
> I completely agree with you with a lot of things . . . but then sometimes people come here for advice and because they don't get the answers they want they argue back and then just go off and do it anyway
> 
> but maybe this person wasn't really aware of the issues around the dogs in rescues and needed it very bluntly putting to them


Thanks and I totally agree that some when told what they don't want to hear will trade insults back, but then you wouldn't just take it would you
I don't suggest that pussyfooting around is the answer, the cold hard facts are enough, posters should be able to get their point accross without having to reduce themselves to personal insults. 
Otherwise it ends up in a slanging match and nothing is gained


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## francesandjon (Jun 3, 2009)

Staffiez - you have clearly misread peoples intentions with all the above posts......it is the LOVE of staffies and dogs in general that makes people upset/angry when others come here asking for advice about breeding their lovely, well tempered, beautiful pet staffie.

I don't quite know how you can deny that there is a MASSIVE rescue crisis with staffies at the moment......I thought it was a well known and publisied fact.

Why get so angry and defensive about the comments that have been made? If you truely are a dog and staffie lover then take a step back, check out all the links provided and make a wise choice......please don't add to this growing problem!


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## Guest (Aug 31, 2011)

please google `rescue crisis staffordshire bull terrier`
the amount of web pages this brings up is unbelievable , here`s a few.
About staffies | Staffie Support
Endangered Dogs Defence & Rescue - Staffycross News 2005
Staffy Campaign


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## Staffiez (Aug 30, 2011)

jo5 said:


> I am not arguing there is a terrible rescue crisis at the moment especially as far as staffies are concerned but I think you have summed it all up in your post all the things that illustrate my point nicely. You immediately think that the post is a wind up, you clearly have a high opinion of the dog owning general public then as to a lot of pet owning people, breeding their dog is seen as nothing more than natural., their parents had litters whats the problem etc etc So why would they think asking a question would wind people up?? Secondly you have already assumed that they will go ahead regardless, thats probably correct in the majority of cases but what about those few who will listen, your attitude would condemn those would be puppies, I am glad you can live with that, I for one couldn't
> You see unless you are a member of a forum such as this or a breed club or do activities with your dog etc etc, you won't come accross breeding issues, rescue centres overflowing with dogs that will never be homed. I think you also wrongly assume that everyone has the same knowledge as you, the truth is they don't. They live in their bubble with their 'nice' pet who would make a lovely mum, they don't see that as being wrong, so to come onto a forum with what seems to them to be a perfectly acceptable question and be blown away with abuse is a bit of a shock  and they will scurry away not with much needed info but stinging ears and are then likely to carry on regardless as they have no respect for 'advice' like that.I have lost count of the amount of times someone down the School or a friend of a friend has bought a pup from non ethical breeders or have said They didn't know their bitch was pregnant, or indeed offered me the use of their Dog on my Bitch. These are not yobs or uneducated people, they are just not knowledgable in the ways of Ethical breeding etc. Surely we shouldn't judge but educate them so that they do know better, So 4 out of 5 people still go away and produce a litter but 1 listens , now I can live with that
> Oh and you never know , perhaps without the abuse another 1 will stick around long enough to get some good 'advice' and there could be 1 less litter again, now isn't that better


Thank you Jo5, this has been the problem all the way through narrow-minded people assuming things about me and using what i have said or the way i have said things to their own advantage to slate me down.
I went last night due to 2 things 1, i had some where to go 2, because i could feel myself getting drawn in and i'd end up lowering myself to their standards.

I'm so disappointed, no disgusted with the immature yet venomous replies i received.
I'm sure if this had been someone else asking then they would of held two fingers up to you all and gone ahead as all this abuse would of made them more determined than they were before!!!

I feel sorry that people on here deem fit to insult and verbal attack not only someone with a genuine question but 1 of the newest members (soon to be ex member) of this group.

If you lot are what this site is all about then I want nothing to do with it.

Oh and you lot are more irresponsible breeders for what you have written in the last 6 pages than I'll ever be. Not including Jo5 as they are the ONLY one to reply with a mature attitude!!


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## Staffiez (Aug 30, 2011)

francesandjon said:


> Staffiez - you have clearly misread peoples intentions with all the above posts......it is the LOVE of staffies and dogs in general that makes people upset/angry when others come here asking for advice about breeding their lovely, well tempered, beautiful pet staffie.
> 
> I don't quite know how you can deny that there is a MASSIVE rescue crisis with staffies at the moment......I thought it was a well known and publisied fact.
> 
> Why get so angry and defensive about the comments that have been made? If you truely are a dog and staffie lover then take a step back, check out all the links provided and make a wise choice......please don't add to this growing problem!


*CLEARLY MISREAD????? I BEG YOUR PARDON? DON'T MAKE ME LAUGH!
HOW CAN YOU MISREAD PEOPLES PATHETIC ABUSE AS ANYTHING AS THAT!!!*

Goodbye low lifes!!


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## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

Staffiez said:


> Thank you Jo5, this has been the problem all the way through narrow-minded people assuming things about me and using what i have said or the way i have said things to their own advantage to slate me down.
> I went last night due to 2 things 1, i had some where to go 2, because i could feel myself getting drawn in and i'd end up lowering myself to their standards.
> 
> I'm so disappointed, no disgusted with the immature yet venomous replies i received.
> ...


Have you reconsidered putting your boy to stud then? I think a lot of people come across as blunt, but thats because they are concerned, there are also a lot of trolls who will just post something controversial to get a reaction. There's a lot more to breeding than just letting your dog mate with a bitch, I hope you have decided against it


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## Snoringbear (Sep 26, 2008)

Staffiez said:


> And thats just the RSPCA, who i'd imagine are quite particular about which staffies they take on. When i spoke to dogs trust they told me they only take on 7 staffies in each centre at a time because they are so hard to rehome, and to be one of those lucky 7 they have to pass a very hard test


7?? 7?? Rimming with Staffies i think u, Staffie haters are trying to say!!

This whole thing is about getting a rescue dog and not breeding as (i quote) rescue centers are over run with Staffies, well you could only find 7. Does that mean rescue centers only keep 10 dogs per center? I think not!!
So i guess that means you all speak crap and have no idea. 
No rescue center turns any dog away no matter what breed it is. *If you can give me a name and address of a center that does then i'll show you an unfit shelter. People like that do not selective rescue, they might find alternative housing if they are full, but never do they refuse to take an animal!!*
Who do u all think u r slagging me down like ur doing, calling me an idiot/irresponsible and whatever else you see fit. Yet it people like you lot that hate Staffies and saying no1 wants them blah blah blah that's putting people off them so they are giving them up!!

I've never heard from so many narrow minded, jumped up load of morons in my life!!
I asked a perfectly reasonable question, that i would of expected a perfectly reasonable answer. but no!!
Because i mentioned the 'S' word you put me in a set category that you stupidly believe own Staffies.

To whoever said cross breeding doesn't add problems to a 'breed' what planet do u live on? 
These are 'fashion' dogs. What do you think happens to these when a Labadoodle grows up without a curly coat or a Yorkiepoo looks like a normal yorkie?? they get thrown out idiot!

Has anyone asked what where and where4s? no!! You've all just jumped on the ban wagon cuz u hate Staffies, you sad SAD bunch of simpletons!!![/QUOTE]

The Bluecross, which are a national network of rescues currently have to turn 9 out of 10 staffies away.

Blue Cross - Animal charity forced to turn away nine out of ten unwanted Staffie-type dogs


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## francesandjon (Jun 3, 2009)

Staffiez said:


> *CLEARLY MISREAD????? I BEG YOUR PARDON? DON'T MAKE ME LAUGH!
> HOW CAN YOU MISREAD PEOPLES PATHETIC ABUSE AS ANYTHING AS THAT!!!*
> 
> Goodbye low lifes!!


Maybe 'misread' was the wrong word.....mis-taken, misunderstood - they might be better.

I was trying to be nice and diplomatic....but clearly you are not interested in replying with the same level of respect.

If the truth hurts then may I suggest you don't come back to read any more of it!


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## Guest (Aug 31, 2011)

Staffiez said:


> *CLEARLY MISREAD????? I BEG YOUR PARDON? DON'T MAKE ME LAUGH!
> HOW CAN YOU MISREAD PEOPLES PATHETIC ABUSE AS ANYTHING AS THAT!!!*
> 
> Goodbye low lifes!!


now your just going out of ya way to upset people , have you read any of the links , or ya just covered your eyes to skip the worse partshonestly i dispair sometimes some of the most respected people in the breed right now have put their plans on hold , what does that say to you ? anything ?


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## Freyja (Jun 28, 2008)

I meant to put on my previous post that even out local greyhound rescue Greyhound Gap has a staffie bitch in their kennels. She is a bleautifull blie bitch who was due to be PTS at the pound. She came to the Gap in march suffering from servere skin problems and is still there. Gap is a sight hound rescue but just couldn't see this lovely girl PTS.

Gap will not give up on her she will be found a new forever home.

The reason I have put about Storm is to show the staffies are in such a crisis that now the pound will PTS staffies and staffie crosses as they no longer have room for them.


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## Sleeping_Lion (Mar 19, 2009)

Please rethink trying to use your boy at stud with any bitch, I'm sure you won't have had health tests done of which there are a few for staffs, one of which is for a condition which is quite debilitating, even fatal for pups. Mating dogs isn't always easy, and can end up in injury for dogs and humans, so if you're not experienced then really, please don't try. Also, if the bitch hasn't been checked out, how would you know that she didn't have something internally that may cause problems, I've known strictures and tumours be picked up by experienced stud dog owners who've gone on to do an internal examination of the bitch when they are signalling they're ready, but are then reluctant to mate. 

Honestly, there's a lot more to handling a stud dog than just allowing them to mate with a bitch, it's an incredibly responsible position, and if anything goes wrong, the blame usually lands at your door, it was your dog, so obviously it's your fault. 

Please, enjoy your dog for the companion he is, tell your friend to get her bitch spayed, and apply to rescue(s) for young staffy pups/dogs for their friends and family. Apart from anything, how would you feel if you produced pups that had hereditary conditions because you hadn't done the health tests for the breed  

PS I've got good friends who work in staffy rescue, the problem is just overwhelming at the moment because people are just putting their pet dogs together to produce pups, and not thinking about the wider issue. My brother has rescue staffs, and in the future, I'd like to take on an oldie staff when I have the time and opportunity, there are no staffy haters on this forum


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## Cassia (May 28, 2011)

We're lowlifes? oh yeah ofc we are... as we are the ones considering adding to the Staffie crisis and obviously not putting much thought into what breeding actually entails etc. 

We are definately the lowlifes.
God damn us all for caring about the SBT breed. God damn us. We are all going to hell.


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## koekemakranka (Aug 2, 2010)

Perhaps there should be a standard template for this type of thread:

Delete as appropriate:
I have a lovely male/female .....................(name of breed or cross) who has a lovely temperament and my boss/mother-in-law/postie/Tesco cashier/"people" have said he/she is a perfect example of the breed. I would dearly love just one litter before I neuter/spay. Does anyone have advice/a stud/a breeding bitch.

Proviso:

I would appreciate only the following advice (choose whichever is applicable):
1. Fantastic. Go for it.
2. Fantastic. Show us the pics.
3. Fantastic. ........ (name of breed) are wonderful dogs

Other responses need not apply.


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

Cassia said:


> God damn us all for caring about the SBT breed. God damn us. We are all going to hell.


you can share my taxi if ya like!


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

Staffiez said:


> *CLEARLY MISREAD????? I BEG YOUR PARDON? DON'T MAKE ME LAUGH!
> HOW CAN YOU MISREAD PEOPLES PATHETIC ABUSE AS ANYTHING AS THAT!!!*
> 
> Goodbye low lifes!!


Scuze me! your cap lock seems to be stuck on bit of WD40 should fix it!


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

QUEEN - ANOTHER ONE BITES THE DUST (LIVE ON FIRE AT THE BOWL) - YouTube


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## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

I don't know why you bother - let these people get over-run with puppies they can't manage and can't sell - let their dogs risk death while being mated and unable to give bitch owners advice and help which could save the life of a bitch in trouble.

Let them risk changing the temperaments of unproven unhealth-tested veteran dogs to un-health-tested bitches who appear to be unable to find a suitable stud with proven assets.

If that makes us horrible irresponsible low-lifes, then I for one am damn proud of the fact - that I won't be adding to the rescue problem or bringing pups from unhealth-tested parents into the world - - as we know, some people ask and when they don't get the response they want - resort to abuse because it makes them feel better - it's a bl**dy sad world we live in 

Just let them get on with it - if they want to risk their beloved family pets lives and those of any pups they produce - it says more about them than the people who have responded on this thread - it's a sad sad day for the dog world in general, and for lovely staffies who, through no fault of their own and an ignorant over-zealous media, find themselves living in rescue kennels and often, after spending half their lives being pushed from pillar to post, facing a premature death  

I've no doubt these people will sleep soundly in their beds at night, while responsible breeders tear themselves apart deciding whether to breed or not in the current economic climate, and when they do, spend a long time researching, caring, and putting their lives and souls into any pups they do produce, and always conscious of the things that can go wrong both prior to, during whelping and wearning and after the pups go to their new homes


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## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

DT said:


> you can share my taxi if ya like!


I got a couple of spaces in my handcart


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

simplysardonic said:


> I got a couple of spaces in my handcart


best reserve me one then!


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## Guest (Aug 31, 2011)

ClaireandDaisy said:


> I think this is yet another wind-up merchant. The best response is a dignified silence.
> Either that or it`s a bloke who gets his jollies talking about dogs bonking possibly? In which case a swift exit is best. I mean... euw!


spot on


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## fluffybunny2001 (Feb 8, 2008)

Staffiez said:


> You will find rescues aren't full of Staffies, in fact if you counted each breed in a rescue center Staffies are reasonably low in the list. It's because of a Staffies 'reputation' they are highlighted more!


i beg to differ,i work in rescue we currently have over 90% staffies and over 50 staffies on the waitining list to come in!!!!
battersea is overun with them as well!!


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## GillyR (Nov 2, 2009)

troll alert......dont feed them


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## emsky (Jul 26, 2011)

Staffiez said:


> I'm so disappointed, no disgusted with the immature yet venomous replies i received.
> I'm sure if this had been someone else asking then they would of held two fingers up to you all and gone ahead as all this abuse would of made them more determined than they were before!!!
> 
> I feel sorry that people on here deem fit to insult and verbal attack not only someone with a genuine question but 1 of the newest members (soon to be ex member) of this group.
> ...


Did you even read half the posts? Just because people are trying to point out the responsibilties that breeding yet more Staffies can have/very probably will have horrible consequences and most definately will add to an out of control crisis doesn't mean they are verbally attacking you. This is an advice forum, people are advising you to what is morally right. I also love the fact that you label everyone immature and venemous just because they have a different opinion :cursing: like i said you should read through again with a less defensive attitude.


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## 1290423 (Aug 11, 2011)

GillyR said:


> troll alert......dont feed them


but we have to get rid of the bakers somehow!


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## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

DT said:


> but we have to get rid of the bakers somehow!


NNNNNNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!
All the additives makes 'em hyper


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## pogo (Jul 25, 2011)

I'm sorry your talking absolute bulls*** rescues are full of staffies and crosses, i'm in the process of adopting a rescue and guess what he's a staffy/american bulldog cross, but while we were there we looked round and there were 20 other dogs 12 were staffs/crosses!

I also work in a different rescue which has roughly 20 dogs again but about 17 of them are staffs etc.


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## mysticmel (Jun 27, 2011)

some people are beyond help or reason, the OP has a 7 year old dog and friend a 3 year old bitch, if they were responsible both dogs would have been neutered a long time ago, 
any comments (positive or negative) won't stop these people from breeding. they only want help in a getting it done
maybe a zimmer frame and some viagra for the poor boy


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## Dogless (Feb 26, 2010)

mysticmel said:


> some people are beyond help or reason, the OP has a 7 year old dog and friend a 3 year old bitch, if they were responsible both dogs would have been neutered a long time ago,
> any comments (positive or negative) won't stop these people from breeding. they only want help in a getting it done
> maybe a zimmer frame and some viagra for the poor boy


I must say I'm getting a little fed up of all the comments on here at present suggesting that it is irresponsible not to neuter your dog. I don't agree with the OP in any shape or form BUT do not think that part of being a responsible owner is the blanket neutering of dogs.


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## Guest (Aug 31, 2011)

GillyR said:


> troll alert......dont feed them


but they do keep feeding the troll


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## catlove844 (Feb 15, 2011)

Nataliee said:


> 68 Staffies a DAY killed in the UK because people still keeping breeding.
> 68 x 7 = 476 a WEEK.
> 476 x 52 = 24,572 DEAD STAFFIE AND STAFFIE CROSSES A YEAR.


that is so sad, please dont breed anymore  :crying: :crying:


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## Tigerneko (Jan 2, 2009)

Its just some loser trying to wind us all up 

Just out of interest Staffiez - can you please pick out some quotes where people have said they hate staffies? Personally I didn't get that impression so would like to see where I appear to have gone wrong? 

thanks


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## Zayna (Apr 19, 2009)

another happy customer! *sniggers*

if they decide against breeding though then its worth it!


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

As the saying goes - "There's none so blind as those who will not see" Unfortunately our poor old Staffy's are the ones paying for this "blindness"! 

Disgraceful to say the least, not to worry though cos the op seems to know more than the dogs trust, dogs today mag and even the president of the Staffordshire Bull Terrier Club of Great Britain who hasn't bred a litter in over three years due to the rescue crisis. Best get on the blower and tell the pres she's got it all wrong!


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## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

Malmum said:


> As the saying goes - "There's none so blind as those who will not see" Unfortunately our poor old Staffy's are the ones paying for this "blindness"!
> 
> Disgraceful to say the least, not to worry though cos the op seems to know more than the dogs trust, dogs today mag and even the president of the Staffordshire Bull Terrier Club of Great Britain who hasn't bred a litter in over three years due to the rescue crisis. Best get on the blower and tell the pres she's got it all wrong!


It's interesting you should say that - we noticed at the show on BH Monday (a show where we always follow staffies into the ring) that entries for the breed had diminished massively - normally we are looking at about an hour + for judging just one breed - this time there was just 5 dogs entered across all the classes 4 were puppies - suggesting there has been a decrease in breeding numbers as there were no dogs coming through for the later classes.


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## Malmum (Aug 1, 2010)

What a shame that the well bred Staffs are not being bred now while others are being churned out left right and centre Swarthy  The breed is allready looking shabby with some of the poor examples we see around, long legs, narrow bodies, small heads and don't think i've seen a pump handle tail round here in years.

Such a terrible injustice to such a magnificent breed!


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## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

Malmum said:


> What a shame that the well bred Staffs are not being bred now while others are being churned out left right and centre Swarthy  The breed is allready looking shabby with some of the poor examples we see around, long legs, narrow bodies, small heads and don't think i've seen a pump handle tail round here in years.
> 
> Such a terrible injustice to such a magnificent breed!


Yes - and the fact that this has been emphasised by so many so many times on this forum - responsible breeders pull back from breeding (it's not just staffies, although I haven't seen the up to date figures, Labrador registrations have dropped enormously by all accounts) - people don't stop buying pups, they buy poorly bred dogs from BYB and PF because often they don't want to wait - or don't do their research.

Anyone who thinks any moratorium on responsible breeding would benefit rescue - it wouldn't - it could quite easily make them worse to the detriment of many breeds - if people want puppies, they want pups, and despite much cajoling - if they don't want a rescue dog, very little will make them change their minds 

The increased breeding and sale of poorly bred and irresponsibly homed dogs will inevitably see an even greater impact on rescue - and this is what happens when good breeders pull back the reigns and breed less.


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## BreShiE (Sep 2, 2011)

Excuse me? Oh come on this is absolutely ridiculous! Is this how you treat every fellow breeder?

The OP came to the forum asking a simple question, and instead you slate him / her. You mention about back door breeders, but with the way you lot are acting, it is just like pathetic low lives who have nothing better to do but sit on the INTERNET and feed on the downfall of others.

I understand what you're saying about 'Overcrowded Kennels' but rather than saying it in the despicable amount of abuse as you did, just explain it in a nice way 

He / She is probably a better breeder than most in this forum, yet you slate him / her over one post where the OP only asked a question? That is pathetic, and don't bother trying to reply to this saying I'm trying to hurt people here, because that would be hypercritical!

As I said above I understand the reason why you could possibly be angry, but there's no reason to go about it the way you have done so.


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

BreShiE said:


> He / She is probably a better breeder than most in this forum


hahahahahaha! OMG you should be awarded the award for the funniest first post! :lol:

a better breeder, flipping heck theres so many reasons why the OPer (who quite possibly is you!) is not a better breeder - some on here are just as bad, a small handful are ten times more ....


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## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

BreShiE said:


> Excuse me? Oh come on this is absolutely ridiculous! Is this how you treat every fellow breeder?
> 
> The OP came to the forum asking a simple question, and instead you slate him / her. You mention about back door breeders, but with the way you lot are acting, it is just like pathetic low lives who have nothing better to do but sit on the INTERNET and feed on the downfall of others.
> 
> ...


Hmmm, rather rambunctious first post there


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## BreShiE (Sep 2, 2011)

Devil-Dogz said:


> hahahahahaha! OMG you should be awarded the award for the funniest first post! :lol:
> 
> a better breeder, flipping heck theres so many reasons why the OPer (who quite possibly is you!) is not a better breeder - some on here are just as bad, a small handful are ten times more ....


Actually no, I'm not the OP. Check over the OP's previous post and compare that level of grammar to mine, I'm sure you will see it's not me.

He / She may not be the best breeder, but the OP only asked a simple question, so why does everyone have to jump on and slate the OP for that?


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## Guest (Sep 2, 2011)

simplysardonic said:


> Hmmm, rather rambunctious first post there


thay just popped in for a coffee


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

BreShiE said:


> so why does everyone have to jump on and slate the OP for that?


The same reason people jump on the bandwagon to breed such an over bred breed. where high numbers are PTS daily.


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## XxZoexX (Sep 8, 2010)

Or some popcorn :lol: :lol:


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## BreShiE (Sep 2, 2011)

I don't get why everyone is thinking this is a fake post aswell? It's more than a fair enough question, so why not answer it in a nice why?


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## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

BreShiE said:


> Actually no, I'm not the OP. Check over the OP's previous post and compare that level of grammar to mine, I'm sure you will see it's not me.
> 
> He / She may not be the best breeder, but the OP only asked a simple question, so why does everyone have to jump on and slate the OP for that?


I don't think 'everyone' has jumped on & slated the OP, far from it, plenty of people posted informatively & without resorting to personal insults, sadly the OP didn't hear what they wanted to hear & consequently was less than overjoyed at the responses


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## paddyjulie (May 9, 2009)

XxZoexX said:


> Or some popcorn :lol: :lol:


yes please...after all it is the weekend and the night is yet young..so we may need plenty


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## BreShiE (Sep 2, 2011)

Devil-Dogz said:


> The same reason people jump on the bandwagon to breed such an over bred breed. where high numbers are PTS daily.


I understand this, and I agree. I just don't agree with the way people are saying it though, why can't they act in a professional manner rather than acting like children?


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## Devil-Dogz (Oct 4, 2009)

BreShiE said:


> I understand this, and I agree. I just don't agree with the way people are saying it though, why can't they act in a professional manner rather than acting like children?


I guess them that replied to this thread are fed up of repeating themselves to uneducated folk that will do as they please, rather than whats right and responsible - Hence I stayed out after my orginal post.


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## BreShiE (Sep 2, 2011)

simplysardonic said:


> I don't think 'everyone' has jumped on & slated the OP, far from it, plenty of people posted informatively & without resorting to personal insults, sadly the OP didn't hear what they wanted to hear & consequently was less than overjoyed at the responses


I know, I've read every post, but the majority of the posts are just pure abuse, and is no need for it, do you see what I mean?


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## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

BreShiE said:


> I know, I've read every post, but the majority of the posts are just pure abuse, and is no need for it, do you see what I mean?


Granted, some posts are more curt than others, the written word is open to interpretation, some people are very blunt in their repiles, other people are so weary of the many threads started on this subject that they either think it's a troll or their patience has worn thin


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

there are many many staffies that get put to sleep day after day, why does the op want to breed? just because they have nice personalities? why not rescue a staffie pup and give it a 2nd chance. The only way id ever support anyone breeding at this time is if they are willing to keep ALL IN THE LITTER as far to many staffies end up in rescues or PTS. Id say the same for anyother breed too only breed if your willing to keep all pups until suitable homes are found.


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

BreShiE said:


> I don't get why everyone is thinking this is a fake post aswell? It's more than a fair enough question, so why not answer it in a nice why?


odd....... a newbie and you've made your 5 posts all in this thread?


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## BreShiE (Sep 2, 2011)

simplysardonic said:


> Granted, some posts are more curt than others, the written word is open to interpretation, some people are very blunt in their repiles, other people are so weary of the many threads started on this subject that they either think it's a troll or their patience has worn thin


So you're telling me that adults can't control their feelings and instead result to abusing other people? That is just pathetic, I'm not usually like this, I hate abusing people but the way users are acting is just downright child-like.


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## BreShiE (Sep 2, 2011)

```

```



dexter said:


> odd....... a newbie and you've made your 5 posts all in this thread?


Wow, you're very observant aren't you? What's your point?


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

BreShiE said:


> ```
> 
> ```
> Wow, you're very observant aren't you? What's your point?


I guess the point is you join a forum and usually introduce yourself, not get in on a debate, It makes it look like your just here to cause trouble. Not enjoy the forum and contribute


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

BreShiE said:


> ```
> 
> ```
> Wow, you're very observant aren't you? What's your point?


most newbies introduce their selves in the intro thread before replying to threads. me i'm always on the ball...............


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## BreShiE (Sep 2, 2011)

DKDREAM said:


> I guess the point is you join a forum and usually introduce yourself, not get in on a debate, It makes it look like your just here to cause trouble. Not enjoy the forum and contribute


I'm here to stand up it what I believe in, why would I want to contribute to a community of which that attacks users for a question that they ask?


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## Guest (Sep 2, 2011)

many of us could have chosen to give out advice , don`t know about anyone else , certainly goes against my own ethics. for starters , the dog is too old for a first litter , many may disagree , i for one think it`s way too old. then there was the issue of health tests , non were mentioned , no mention of whether the dogs were of good pedigrees / lines , nothing. that`s not even mentioning the crisis this breed is in right now , i for one don`t want to help anyone add to those statistics


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

BreShiE said:


> I'm here to stand up it what I believe in, why would I want to contribute to a community of which that attacks users for a question that they ask?


Okay that I understand, maybe its because people on this site care about animals? after all it is a pet forum. Why would anyone want to encourage someone to breed a litter of Staffies when there are loads and loads sat in rescue centres.


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## BreShiE (Sep 2, 2011)

diablo said:


> many of us could have chosen to give out advice , don`t know about anyone else , certainly goes against my own ethics. for starters , the dog is too old for a first litter , many may disagree , i for one think it`s way too old. then there was the issue of health tests , non were mentioned , no mention of whether the dogs were of good pedigrees / lines , nothing. that`s not even mentioning the crisis this breed is in right now , i for one don`t want to help anyone add to those statistics


How do you know it would of been the dogs first litter? It may not of been.

To OP: If you read this, is this the dogs first litter?

EDIT: Also you mentioned you don't want anyone to add to the statistics, that's fair enough. But did you people have to go about it the way you have? If you have children, would you allow them to talk to people the way you lot have? I'm sure I wouldn't, so why should it be alright for you to do so?


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

BreShiE said:


> I'm here to stand up it what I believe in, why would I want to contribute to a community of which that attacks users for a question that they ask?


which is what exactly? hundreds of staffys or staffy types are put to sleep each day surely everyone knows that , why the need to add to the problem, which i believe if you read the replies 99% of people agree on.


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## Guest (Sep 2, 2011)

BreShiE said:


> How do you know it would of been the dogs first litter? It may not of been.
> 
> To OP: If you read this, is this the dogs first litter?


it certainly sounded like he was at stud for the first time


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## BreShiE (Sep 2, 2011)

DKDREAM said:


> Okay that I understand, maybe its because people on this site care about animals? after all it is a pet forum. Why would anyone want to encourage someone to breed a litter of Staffies when there are loads and loads sat in rescue centres.


As I said before I agree with that, I just don't agree with the way you went about saying it.

Also what if people don't want to get staffies from rescue centers but instead want to get a well bread one?


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## Guest (Sep 2, 2011)

i think even most would struggle right now to get a well bred one , many putting their plans on the back burner in the hope of getting the staffie rescue crisis sorted out


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## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

BreShiE said:


> So you're telling me that adults can't control their feelings and instead result to abusing other people? That is just pathetic, I'm not usually like this, I hate abusing people but the way users are acting is just downright child-like.


Can't speak for other people but it's forum life, can't censor every post that may offend someone, if something offends me, which isn't often as I have skin like a rhino, I just reach for the 'off' button & go & do something less liable to get me stressed


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

BreShiE said:


> As I said before I agree with that, I just don't agree with the way you went about saying it.
> 
> Also what if people don't want to get staffies from rescue centers but instead want to get a well bread one?


Firstly i have just started commenting on this thread so never went about anyway saying anything.

Well ok I understand rescues are not everyone's choice but in that case why not go to a reputable breeder and buy a single puppy rather then bring a whole litter into the world.


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## BreShiE (Sep 2, 2011)

DKDREAM said:


> Firstly i have just started commenting on this thread so never went about anyway saying anything.
> 
> Well ok I understand rescues are not everyone's choice but in that case why not go to a reputable breeder and buy a single puppy rather then bring a whole litter into the world.


You're trying to say the OP is wanting to sell the whole litter? What if he / she wants to keep one?

I myself own a rescued staff, she's one of the best dogs I've had, just thought I'd at that in incase you thought I'm just someone here looking for an argument


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

BreShiE said:


> You're trying to say the OP is wanting to sell the whole litter? What if he / she wants to keep one?
> 
> I myself own a rescued staff, she's one of the best dogs I've had, just thought I'd at that in incase you thought I'm just someone here looking for an argument


I was not implying the OP wants to sell all - I actually said this basically if she wants another staffy then go and buy one rather then BRING A WHOLE LITTER OF STAFFIES in to the world

ETA : It will also work out a heck of a lot cheaper, what if the mother needed a C section? for all involved it would be far better the OP just bought another Staffie that's the best advice i can give.


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## BreShiE (Sep 2, 2011)

DKDREAM said:


> I was not implying the OP wants to sell all - I actually said this basically if she wants another staffy then go and buy one rather then BRING A WHOLE LITTER OF STAFFIES in to the world


If the OP wants to do that, then let him / her do so. He / she may be a good breeder, not one of those idiots who gets staffies to look 'hard'.


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

BreShiE said:


> If the OP wants to do that, then let him / her do so. He / she may be a good breeder, not one of those idiots who gets staffies to look 'hard'.


but WHY................ some people on this forum care about where dogs end up not just cute puppies.


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## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

BreShiE said:


> If the OP wants to do that, then let him / her do so. He / she may be a good breeder, not one of those idiots who gets staffies to look 'hard'.


a good breeder would know if their dog was too old to use at stud not come on a public forum to ask


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## GillyR (Nov 2, 2009)

borderer said:


> but they do keep feeding the troll


Aye bordie....


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## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

BreShiE said:


> If the OP wants to do that, then let him / her do so. He / she may be a good breeder, not one of those idiots who gets staffies to look 'hard'.


The OP's dog is 7 years old - a veteran - and never been used at stud - there's no mention of health tests or being a responsible breeder.

If they showed the dogs then they would have an insight into the breeding world - the basic questions being asked, and the ignorance of the OP to what is a very serious crisis with Staffies speaks volumes.

I've been showing for around 6.5 years now, and never seen such low entry figures for Staffies - a very popular breed in my area - this in itself speaks volumes and gives some insight in the size of the problem.

If the OP was a responsible / experienced breeder, they wouldn't need to be asking the questions they are on a public pet forum as they would already have the answers.

There would be few reasons why a dog would get to that age without being used if he was such a good example of the breed - stud owners don't offer their dogs to bitches, bitch owners ask stud owners if they can use their dogs - in this instance, the OP offered the dog to the bitch owner - who is they were knowledgeable would know that with a reasonable health tested bitch, they would have the pick of stud dogs.


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## GillyR (Nov 2, 2009)

One word ....

Morphed 

Go figure hmy:


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## Sleeping_Lion (Mar 19, 2009)

BreShiE said:


> If the OP wants to do that, then let him / her do so. He / she may be a good breeder, not one of those idiots who gets staffies to look 'hard'.


You have a rescue staffy, you're more aware of the rescue situation than the OP, and you think they should breed?? Wow, well you can't get a better endorsement than that OP, why not go for it, after all, responsible breeders aren't, so there's a gap in the market!


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## EmCHammer (Dec 28, 2009)

If it apperars that rescues don't have many staffies it's probably because they canchoose their intake. Pounds who have no choice are destroying staffies weekly. We are innundated at our small pound dog rescue.
Someone likebattetsea admits that staffies overwhelm all the other breeds put together and they put thousands down a year and they are one of the only rescues aka pounds brave enough to publically admit this... It's not their fault they are mopping up this huge problem

We have been contacted again this week by a pound to take 8 bull breeds due to be put to sleep. That's one weeks dogs from one town the uk. A couple have been usedfor breeding and dumped in a terrible state. Others the owners don't want one is 8 months old. Next week he will die si
ple as. We can't help them we are 500 in the red so it's a struggle to keep going and keep thestaffies we saved from being destroyed two weeks ago safe.

Everyone is in the same situation. Pounds are putting so many staffies down week it's unbiavable... No one wants it public knowledge because of back lash but I am fed up of seeing pictures of gorgeous dogs that no one can help who end updead week after week.

Others in the rescueworld will know what I mean. Look at forums that help pound dogs it's crazy


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## Sleeping_Lion (Mar 19, 2009)

EmCHammer said:


> If it apperars that rescues don't have many staffies it's probably because they canchoose their intake. Pounds who have no choice are destroying staffies weekly. We are innundated at our small pound dog rescue.
> Someone likebattetsea admits that staffies overwhelm all the other breeds put together and they put thousands down a year and they are one of the only rescues aka pounds brave enough to publically admit this... It's not their fault they are mopping up this huge problem
> 
> We have been contacted again this week by a pound to take 8 bull breeds due to be put to sleep. That's one weeks dogs from one town the uk. A couple have been usedfor breeding and dumped in a terrible state. Others the owners don't want one is 8 months old. Next week he will die si
> ...


TBH, I think it should be shoved under the nose of Joe Public just as they sit down to eat their evening meal. People need to see the truth, I get fed up of people who didn't realise the problem was so bad 

We are slowly but surely insulating ourselves from reality in every aspect relating to life that we can!


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## EmCHammer (Dec 28, 2009)

I know we have to respect the pounds wishes . I know when my local pound had to put 17 staffies down and it became public knowledge they recieved awful grief .. They were devasted themselves and at least people cared to get so enraged but the anger was funnelled in the wrong place because they didn't know.


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## Sleeping_Lion (Mar 19, 2009)

EmCHammer said:


> I know we have to respect the pounds wishes . I know when my local pound had to put 17 staffies down and it became public knowledge they recieved awful grief .. They were devasted themselves and at least people cared to get so enraged but the anger was funnelled in the wrong place because they didn't know.


I wonder how many of those homes who were prepared to give grief to those having to make a difficult decision, would have made room for a staff if they could?

I give grief where appropriate, I can't rehome a staffy myself right now because of my personal circumstances, but my next rescue is going to be an oldie (as previously) and preferrably a staffy.

What pee's me off, is people get angry about it, then the next second it's forgotten, and the rest of their lives support animal cruelty, but shove something under their nose and they're enraged for a whole five seconds flat. The whole system is wrong, people don't *care* genuinely, they just have fluffy moments where they think they might care and then they get distracted by something else on the tele.


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## haeveymolly (Mar 7, 2009)

BreShiE said:


> So you're telling me that adults can't control their feelings and instead result to abusing other people? That is just pathetic, I'm not usually like this, I hate abusing people but the way users are acting is just downright child-like.


are you his mother by any chance  calm down.


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## EmCHammer (Dec 28, 2009)

Evenif you could take one there so many then next weekand the week the people who care can only help so much . Change has to cometo work at the root cause and I don't know how

it's not helped by the other issue ... People don't want staffies they think they willturn and savage their kids etc


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## Sleeping_Lion (Mar 19, 2009)

EmCHammer said:


> Evenif you could take one there so many then next weekand the week the people who care can only help so much . *Change has to cometo work at the root cause and I don't know how*
> 
> it's not helped by the other issue ... People don't want staffies they think they willturn and savage their kids etc


Hopefully by people reading threads like this, and hearing it as it is 

I love pups, I love the smell of pups, they are brilliant little characters, but all those pups grow up into dogs, and in the case of staffies, they grow up into unwanted dogs, ones that are pts because people just don't want them any more, for whatever reason. Unfortunately people don't bear that in mind when they see their smiley staff and think it'd be a great idea to breed, the fall out usually lands on someone elses doorstep


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