# Ragdoll Pregnancy dates



## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

I agree with you - due date from a mating on the 12th Feb - kit due 18th April. 

However, I just put the dates in to the Purrinlot calendar and it came up with the 17th April too - I think you must have put the dates in wrong.

Good luck for the 16/17/18th ish!


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Oh yes, I did again.. So I think she is most likely to be on day 58 if I am reading it correctly.

Thanks very much.

Do you think I should be setting my alarm for every 3 hours from perhaps day 60?


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Sorry me again, perhaps I should move her box to upstairs beside the bed? Or do you think she may have them under the bed if I did this?

the room she is in just now, she has been sleeping in there at night since she was a baby?

thanks again.


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

the rest I'm not good on - my lass isa maiden and only 4 week gone - so I think you should just do what you feel is best. All I can say is when (30 odd) years ago our moggy gave birth it just happened. Possibly the less fuss the better then mum doesn't get stressed. I'm sure other can tell you more. But i'd just relax and enjoy it i'm sure she will let you know what is needed nearer the time.


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## ChinaBlue (Feb 3, 2008)

Okay based on my breed club gestation chart (basing on a 65 gestation period) if she was mated on the 12th February then she would be due on the 18th April give or take a couple of days either way. Did your MIL not witness the first mating taking place and able to tell you the first day they actually did mate? It is just a little more helpful when calculating your dates.

Put her kittening pen/box in a quiet out of the way place if possible and keep showing it to her so she knows where it is. You will notice a change in her behaviour when she is due to give birth - my Raggies get very restless and I know the birth is imminent.


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## ChinaBlue (Feb 3, 2008)

Just a thought - the breeder of your cat would probably be happy to help and advise too if you contact her - I take it your girl is registered as active?

Everyone here will be more than happy to offer advice should you need it so don't hesitate to ask - even if you feel a question may sound a bit daft!


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## deedeedee (Apr 2, 2008)

You sound like you are doing just fine - my girl is 4 weeks gone so I cannot advise you on reality, but like you I have read/bought everything I can in preparation and find myself asking people questions I already know the answers to.. 'just in case' 

I am going to keep my girl in my bedroom nearer the time but I have breeder friends with cats wont give birth until everyone is asleep. 

See how she goes, she will probably let you know where she wants to be

D xx


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## ChinaBlue (Feb 3, 2008)

Our Raggies have free run of the house all the time though about two days before I think she is due I will sleep with the mum to be in the spare room and my OH and I take turns in sleeping in there for the first week after the kits are born.

Make sure you have a list of useful telephone numbers with you i.e. vet and/or breeder/mentor if you have one. Our first litter started arriving at 11.00 p.m. and no.2 and no.3 were breech births...luckily we were able to phone an experienced breeder friend who was able to talk us through it!


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

Cant add more to what has been said but good luck with the babies, cant wait for piccis Love ragdolls :aureola: 

I wouldnt breed her twice a year just because of her being on heat though as if you have her spayed none of that would even be a problem.....Make sure that she is on 'active' not just reg'd & that you look at her faults & positves and research stud lines which will enhance what she has to create gorgeous babies! :thumbup:


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

I think I may move her up to the bedroom with us, in her box. She likes the box. I have been studying her lines and all seems good. I have been trying to think of a flaw, she had an icky tummy when young and has one mis-matched foot, these are her flaws but she is *SO AFFECTIONATE*.

I need to look closer dads lines though.

I had thought about buying a stud male...I will have to see how this goes as I am a tad stresses about it so perhaps it takes a certain type of person to breed.  A non-worrier I would think....

We also plan to build a run out back for Misty, we have a huge garden so she could have quite a bit of space.

My mother also has a ragdoll. I have created a bit of Ragdoll mania in the family tbh! Anyway, she is affectionate and nice but I think mine is more so.... although that could just be the pregnancy thing.

She likes nothing better than lying on my chest sucking my chain and padding away!

I forgot to say Misty is mitted (seal) and Male cat is blue-bicolour (High White i believe) any ideas on colours?

I am very very excited!


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

In order to register kittens both parents need to be registered on the Active and the boy needs a Certificate of Entirety which will be impossible to do now, did he have one prior to his neutering?


> I think I may move her up to the bedroom with us, in her box. She likes the box.


That sounds good, she may however go under the bed to have the kittens, I would just make sure it is clean and safe.

Good luck


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

mellowma said:


> I think I may move her up to the bedroom with us, in her box. She likes the box. I have been studying her lines and all seems good. I have been trying to think of a flaw, she had an icky tummy when young and has one mis-matched foot, these are her flaws but she is *SO AFFECTIONATE*.
> 
> I need to look closer dads lines though.
> 
> ...


There is a colour predictor on the ragdoll website I just tried to use it...but I have no idea lol! 

personally I have gone to use outside studs to build up my lines, going to do this for a while until I breed my own stud!


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Yes she has this for Harvey (dad) Not for Morgan. (he is little cross-eyed but very cute). 

Misty is most definately on the active register and her owner knew from the off-set that I would plan to have at least 1 litter with her, she was the chunkiest little girl in the litter but she is still smaller than my mother in laws males. Smaller features etc.

I shall have to work out how to upload pictures for the big day/night and of course for those 13 weeks after!!!!

I will be very sad to see them go. I may have questions about that closer to the time. Will mum be upset though? Do we have a worried emoticon?


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

It will depend on what they carry, all will be bi-colour though.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

To be honest as long as they are healthy I will quite happy whatever the colour!

I like the look of the tabbies and also liliac cats. I think I may end up with one of each colour.

I need to read more about lines. I need to find good breeder willto give me advice. Mistys owner went awol as soon as money exchanged hands. 

I could go to her house though. I even sent her pictures via mobile but she never answered. the phone is now cut off. Although for her to doing this it makes me wonder if her advice would be good.

I will use between now and Thu/Fri/Sat/Sun........please no.....to read as much as I can. 

i do know how to pull kitten out (should it be stuck) I know how to resusitate and keep warm. (must buy more hot water bottles).

Anyway only 5/6 days to go!!!!!!


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Strangely enough when I visted a prediction site it said 1/4 mitted, 1/4 bicolour/ 1/4 white bi-colour and a 1/4 mitted high bi-colour.

Wow that is confusing.

http://www.ragdollcats.biz/patterns.


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

Sorry, I was taking it literally, in that mitted is also two colours ie a bicolour.
Not the Ragdoll meaning.
With white in other words.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Yes she is mitted, Mitts on front feet and more like socks on back feet (slight flaw on left leg)

Very cute though!


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

I love mitts.


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## ChinaBlue (Feb 3, 2008)

Does your girl carry blue? In theory you could have half blue; half seal - half mitted and half mid high whites. I would add that my first litter was a blue bicolour to seal mitted mating and I got two bicolours and two mitteds (all seal) http://www.petforums.co.uk/cat-photo-galleries/36100-how-they-look-now-our-first-litter.html (Pix of my first litter 4 years on!).

Have you joined any of the breed clubs? It is worth your while doing so if you haven't as they run seminars to help new breeders. There are three main breed clubs. The British Ragdoll Cat Club, The Traditionalist Ragdoll Cat Society and The Progressive Ragdoll Breed Cat Club.

Also it would be worth you going to some cat shows to get to know some of the breeder/exhibitors. If you get chatting to some you may find one happy to help you and maybe let you in to use their stud. I would perhaps wait a little while before getting a stud boy - it is a huge commitment and it may be worth gaining a little experience and going to a couple of the seminars before taking on the boy - that way you would know what to look for in a boy, what paperwork is needed and how to meet his needs etc. In theory you should have three entire girls for one stud boy.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Thanks again


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

ChinaBlue - Misty is a seal mitted ragdoll she looks just like your kitten Spook - Now living in devon.


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

the pink slips aren't very good quality, quite small and can certainly look copied (I was quite disappointed when I saw what it was - and was like 'is that it?') - and £500 seems about right to me - my lass was £425 (Birman) - have you re-registered in your name or had she already done that. One way to check would be to ring GCCF and ask - read them out the info on the slip and they will be able to tell you if it is right. I think it might be hard to forge a pink slip.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

I will call them Tuesday, they may be closed easter Monday.


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## ChinaBlue (Feb 3, 2008)

Hi

I do not think your slip is correct. I do not see that Porche (Nineeleven) could have sired your Misty as he has been neutered for nearly two years I am _fairly_ certain. I will check up on this for you and get back to you. £500 is not too far off for a breeding girl as this can vary from area to area - average is though perhaps more around £600 give or take.

Last year we had to rush Rio in for a C Section and spay (we always intended that to be her last litter anyway) out of hours - it cost us £505! Again this will vary from vet to vet and area to area.


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

Oh how sad, Who are the people that you bought her off of? 

I think that £500-£600 is the active price for Raggs so doesnt sound too bad!


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

mellowma said:


> This is in her name. It has numbers under each cat pre-fix ie: Hollygram Blue Topaz - Dam CSSR 523 731 66a
> 
> Sire Emerisle Ninelevens - Cssr 405 615 6631A - very confusing.
> 
> ...


Hmmm, not sure about the 'hounors obtained' bit - pulls out own pink slip to see - nope nothing like that on mine.

It should have - in order

At the top - 'transfer certificate'
then says 'GCCF (funny eye looking symbol) This is to certify that the undermentioned cat has been transferred as follows' next to that a box with her registration number and the transfer date in it.

Then next section, your cat's name
then
breed no, colour (in words), date of birth and sex 
next section , sire's name and detials, breed no, colour owner and registration number
next section - dams details
next section - new owners (that's you) details and next to that a blank space - if she on active it's empty, if she not it says non-active or something like that on it. 
then previous owner and the transfer number

On the back are all the abbreviations explained the address of the GCCF and show rules etc. Does this sound like yours?

No-where does it says on my cert Active. I asked my stud owners about this and they said that's how it is done.


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

Just been on 'a' Hollygram ragdoll website - they don't have a Bluetopaz at the moment - they are in Scotland - does any of this ring true?

tamischaba ragdolls have a Hollygram Blue topaz though - they keep all their cats in runs unless they are pregnant - they are in Scotland too.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

I still love her to bits though.  I just cannot understand why someone would do this.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

I suppose I can still give the prospective buyers "kitten packs" I have been buying bits and pieces here and there.

I also feel if they are not registered then maybe I cannot vet the homes they will go to as much as I would like.

Oh dear!

I am going to log off for a while and stop thinking about it. 

I have looked out my camera so shall get some batteries and hopefully tomorrow I can show you some heavily pregnant cat pics, I think I have the dad on this camera too.


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

I know this has been a huge shock for you - and my heart goes out to you. These things happen and you had no reason to suspect anything. WHo did you buy Misty from - I assume it wasn't tamischaba? I have birman friends wqho live in Schotts (were they are based) would you like mwe to ask a few questions? 

CHin up though, you can still sell the kittens and you can still vet as much as you want as they are still your kittens. Yes hand out kitten packs too. This will make you a responsible person. 

Stay with us on here, lets us help and supprt you, you will feel better about it soon.

As for recompense - I'd contact Citizens Advice - this is a type of fraud and you might be able to go through the small claims court -I have no idea if the police would be interested or not.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

No it wasn't from tamischaba. Sadly.

Another of your members is very kindly looking into Mistys background and I think but any information from Tamischaba would be welcome. Even to know if Hollygram was sold as active would give me more of an idea, although I think I have resign myself to the fact the I have been lied to.

I have not said on here but when Misty came to me she was 8 weeks (vet thought more 6 weeks) and I know now and found out after reading up more on ragdolls that they should be with their mum until at least 13/14 weeks.

She was quite unwell, I had to feed her KMR and changed her whiskas diet to dry Royal Canin (digestive sensitive) this should also have rang alarm bells. I also have a semi-feral cat (she sleeps in the shed and comes in for food/flea & worm treatment) and she also became unwell when Misty arrived. (runny tummy).

Misty being sold as "active" at 8 weeks should also have sounded alarm bells, she was the chunkiest out of the litter but her colours are so different. I guess I was so excited to have her.

I feel very naive.

I will still give out kitten packs (have been buying little food bowls, fluffy pet blankets, toys and packets of Royal Canin kitten Dry food).

Anyway, I am attempting to keep my chin up, she is still very lovely and we shall still have kittens for a few months to enjoy.

I will have her spayed after she stops feeding the kittens though and when/if I am ready buy from a reputable breeder in the mean time I think I shall visit some cats shows.  and work out all this GCCF paperwork etc.


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## ChinaBlue (Feb 3, 2008)

You are not the first to be taken in like this so don't feel too bad about it - these people are very plausible and unless you have done some real research it is so easy to get taken in by them. 

There are a lot of people on here who will give you a lot of help and advice and hopefully get you back on track! As the end of the day you have given a loving home to Misty and you get as much back from her as you have put in. Enjoy the kittens. There is no reason why you shouldn't vet the kitten owners any differently if you cannot register the kits than if you can...if you get my drift!


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## shortbackandsides (Aug 28, 2008)

I cant understand some people,sorry you were taken in you can still be picky and careful when rehoming your babies my raggies arent registered,and i still have no problems finding good homesive heard of people forging pedigrees before,but never pink slips!! its a way of getting more money im afraid,and it tars us all with the same brush i just dont see the point in doing any of it! good luck with the new arrivals:thumbup:


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

mellowma said:


> I suppose I can still give the prospective buyers "kitten packs" I have been buying bits and pieces here and there.
> 
> I also feel if they are not registered then maybe I cannot vet the homes they will go to as much as I would like.
> 
> ...


Why cant you vet them? You can do whatever you like! Just because they arent reg'd doesnt mean you cant be as choosy as if they were!!

With the kitten packs you can still do petplan insurance 4 weeks free, jsut sign up at there website, kitten packs infact everything you would do if they were reg'd 



mellowma said:


> No it wasn't from tamischaba. Sadly.
> 
> Another of your members is very kindly looking into Mistys background and I think but any information from Tamischaba would be welcome. Even to know if Hollygram was sold as active would give me more of an idea, although I think I have resign myself to the fact the I have been lied to.
> 
> ...


Ive since learnt that some people do sell at 8 weeks so you wasnt to know, espically if you were given papers


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## ChinaBlue (Feb 3, 2008)

"Originally Posted by mellowma 
_This is in her name. It has numbers under each cat pre-fix ie: Hollygram Blue Topaz - Dam CSSR 523 731 66a
Sire Emerisle Ninelevens - Cssr 405 615 6631A - very confusing_"

Oh dear - I have just realised - these cannot be your girls parents not least because a blue colourpoint (66a) mated with a blue bicolour (6631a) cannot produce a seal mitted - only colourpoints or bicolours. So the pedigree does appear to be a work of fiction. I am so very sorry.

I wonder if this so called breeder has lifted cats names from other people's websites?


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

I had thought this may be the case. Never-mind. I will one day have a registered "Active" female.

Funnily enough I wondered the same thing (taking names from websites) the lady also told us her mum breeded Ragdolls and this is where she had her first Breeding Female from but I have never seen her mother advertising them.

I did see that the lady is advertising them again. Not registered this time though, so I guess this is okay.

Anyway, back to *Misty*. We are now on day 62 and she seems the same as ever. Very loving. Lying in the middle of the rug with the sun coming in through the wondow onto her.

I will still give out kitten packs as otherwise my/their kittens would end up with sore tummys if their new owners changed their foods.

The idea was to have all kittens have a turn sleeping on these covers little fleece covers I bought for them so that when the kittens do go to their new homes they still have the scent of brothers and sisters and mum.

I will go to Pet-plan today too see about their insurance. Whilst I was at Pets at Home they informed me I could advertise in their shop, which would be good. She also said there seems to be a shortage of kittens at the moment....well they will have a good 13 week wait anyway!!!

I am still excited as ever over our impending birth. I wil move Misty upstairs tonight i think.

Thanks again for all your support.


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## Eiserblew (Apr 13, 2009)

Hi all,

I just thought I'd pop on, after being contacted by ChinaBlue about my dear old Porscha.

I am/was the owner of Porscha - Grand Champion Emerisle Porscha Nineleven, who unfortunately passed away on the 9th February 2009 due to kidney failure (he had Chronic Renal Failure for about a year and on medication, but one day he 'crashed', and we had to have him pts). Porscha has lived with me since the 13th September 2003. I purchased him from Hollygram Ragdolls, and brought him back 'down south'. We were based in Southampton, right on the south coast, but are now in Basingstoke - which is just south of London. Porscha was neutered in September 2007 (can't remember the exact date!), and was enjoying his retirement as a much loved indoor pet.

ChinaBlue is correct, in that if he was mated to a Colourpointed girl he would not be able to produce a Mitted offspring, as he was a 'true Bicolour' and could only produce Bicolours and Colourpointeds when mated to a Colourpointed cat.

Here's a picture of a pink slip - so you know what one looks like for the future. It happens to be Porschas pink slip! If you buy a kitten which is on the 'active register', in the box near the bottom right hand corner (the one above the box with 'transfer number' in it) will be blank. If the cat is not to be bred from it will have a note saying something to the effect of 'no progeny to be registered'.










Here's a photo of my magnificent boy. I miss him every day and still keep expecting to find him asleep on the sofa when I walk in the room. It broke my heart to lose him.










I would be very interested to see what paperwork you did get with my boys name on, as obviously I may need to get in touch with the GCCF depending on what you were given. Would it be possible for you to scan it and email it to me? I am very concerned that people are scamming innocent people and using my cats name to do so!


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

I knew it was possible to scam folk with pedigree certificates made up on a computer but I didn't really think they would go as far as forging the pink slips too.
Scary.

Porscha was a absolutely beautiful cat. Sorry for your loss.

Lauren


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## raggs (Aug 3, 2008)

ChinaBlue said:


> "Originally Posted by mellowma
> _This is in her name. It has numbers under each cat pre-fix ie: Hollygram Blue Topaz - Dam CSSR 523 731 66a
> Sire Emerisle Ninelevens - Cssr 405 615 6631A - very confusing_"
> 
> ...


I've been following this post with intrest and must say i have to agree with Chinablue here, it seems as if this so called breeder has browsed through some websites and pulled out a couple of names to use, but they clearly have no knowledge or very little knowledge of Ragdoll cats as Chinablue is spot on in what she says about colour predictions. I would do everything i possibly could to find this so called breeder they need to be "named and shamed". Its BYB's like this that have no place in the cat world.i do hope you can sort the problem out and still treat everything the way you would have if they had been registered, it makes you a better person than the scum bag that ripped you off, good luck..............CHRIS.


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## purrlover (Mar 27, 2009)

oh my gosh!! ive been following this thread and im stunned to say the least , how do these people sleep at night :frown: i cant think of anythink else to write im so in shock


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

First of all thank you very much for taking the time to come and show me this Eiserblew. I am so sorry for your loss. He certainly was beautiful. I am not at work for a few weeks, I work 2 days per week but am on "pet-ternal" leave! I can however scan this to you when I return on 30th April.

Since this last night/this morning I seen the same lady advertising kittens on pre-loved for £280.00.

I contacted her to ask her as to why I had paid £500 for a cat who was:
1. Not registered
2. Not the cat she had given me the pedigree paper for
etc etc

I just received an email from her saying the following:

"You came to me and made it very plain from the start you were looking for a Ragdoll girl to eventually breed from. You had the pick of 6 kittens and that is why you were charged £500. Had you not taken that kitten I would have kept her for myself as I knew from the on-set she was breeding material!

I do know about ragdolls and I do know that they are _supposed _to stay with their mums until 14 weeks but after speaking to my vet he said that the only reason breeders do this is so they can see if the cat is show quality and will not sell you it if it is,and it actually makes it harder for the mum if you keepthe kitten for 14 weeks.

The pink bit of paper I gave you was her Pedigree papers and you would have send that to GCCF yourself to get her registered.

If you are saying that Hollygram Blue Topaz & Emerisle Ninelevens is what is on the Pedigree then I must have gave you the wrong one.

The parents of the cat I gave you are Adtrello Ysaline and Kingsmeadow Caspian Dusk."

 :mad2:


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

I have googled the names Adtrello Ysaline & Kingsmeadow Caspian Dusk and there is nothing.


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

I'd ask her for the correct paperwork and tell her you are sending it to the GCCF for confirmation, IF everything turns out okay then you won't be chasing her for a refund of some of the money.


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## ChinaBlue (Feb 3, 2008)

Just like she gave the other lady the "wrong one" as the parents on that one didn't match the unsuspecting owner's cat's pattern/breeding...ggrrrrrr:mad2::mad2: She obviously doesn't know anything about breeding, genetics or how to register the kittens. It is down to the breeder to register the kitten - not you!

She is obviously trying to cover up the fact that she has been rumbled. She has obviously gotten Hollygram Bluetopaz and Porcha's name from somewhere so......and it would seem now that Bluetopaz's owners should be advised too.

I am so sorry that you are faced with all this at the moment but don't let it take the shine off this very exciting time for you and your Misty.


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

oh blimey?! 

Just looked up her advert, both parents are un'reg but they have their pedigrees? 

I know that people can forge things but to go this far..........She must kow that you can take her to court over this? 

Hopefully something will come good & hopefully the new names come up with something


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## Eiserblew (Apr 13, 2009)

I wonder if this 'woman' owns a kitten out of Blue Haze and Porscha (that mating may have been done before I got Porscha), and if she is just copying the pedigree for every kitten she sells. I am contacting the owners of Hollygram Blue Topaz to see if they know anything. 

To register any kitten, you would actually need a mating certificate (downloadable from the GCCF website), and both the parents would have to have been registered as 'active' with the GCCF. I think you need to ask her for a mating certificate and see what she says. She needs to watch out - she has totally mis-sold you that girl. 

Just going to try and find her ad now.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Oh good I was just in the process of contacting Hollygrams parents to see if she knew this lady at all. It would bet better to come from a reputable bredder though so I shall let you contact her.

Thanks ever so much.


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## raggs (Aug 3, 2008)

SHE IS AVIN A LAFF.........LOL
Its so sad how far some BYB's will go to make a few pounds, she has done this to you so how many other innocent buyers has she robbed....:nono::nono::nono:


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## Eiserblew (Apr 13, 2009)

Looks like a typical byb. There are a lot of adverts. If you google their username off of preloved you get to this site:

HIB334LIFE • MingleVille

and you can see two raggies in the background. I am trying to find a contact email address for Kingsmeadow. We might be able to find out if that Kingsmeadow cat was sold as a pet or for breeding...


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Yes, that's him. Very easy to trace I see. Glad I am not on any of these twitter, myspace etc. 

It would be good to see if she had actually owned any of the cats on this pedigree paper.


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## Eiserblew (Apr 13, 2009)

I've been able to talk to the breeder of Adtrello Ysaline. She was not sold as a breeding cat, just as a pet... in fact, the lady who brought this girl as a kitten doesn't even have her pink registration papers - these are still held by the breeder. 

Unfortunately, this means that if your girl is the daughter of Ysaline, she is not registered at all, and is certainly not on the 'active' register. I have been asked by the breeder of Ysaline if I could forward her a copy of the pedigree when you have a chance to get it to me (after your kit-ternity leave! lol!), as she may well be seeing if she can take any action too. I think this might be a case where a few of us have to get together to take action against this woman.


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## CharleyRogan (Feb 20, 2009)

This is shameful what this woman has done! Hope you do get some money back and I hope she is dealt with for the crime she has committed!

Char
xxx


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

if you do take action this website is really good:
https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/

She doesnt sound like a very truthful person really does she! Dont know how she lives with herself


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

I can now say I am not surprised at all that Adtrello Ysaline was not bought for breeding. Poor girl.

I had another email from Mistys owner advising that she *does sell registered *cats but has a very long waiting list for them. 

Surpringly, just with week I answered an advert for GCCF registered kittens and contacted the owner asking her to keep me in mind should she have any females in future who she feels have the breeding criteria but they must be over 13/14 weeks and GCCF Registered.

This lady contacted me today and it is Hollygram Blue Topaz owner. She explained she was in contact with someone from down South regarding Hollgram and I have explained I am the lady who bought the 8 week old cat.etc (The Ragdoll world seems very small)!!

It would be great to see Mistys mums papers, registered or unregistered just to see her (real & correct) background.

She slept with me last night, not in her box, or her padded bed, on me  I was woken at 4am to litter tray smells and Misty kissing me on the face! Oh the delights!!!

She is keeping herself to herself this morning and not eating a great amount. She actually looked as though she was walking funny at one point but I think that may have been a kitten sitting in a strange position in her tummy.

Thanks again for all you help.


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

Well, the person in that link lists his occupation as "selling dodgy gear on ebay" - "buyer beware" springs to mind!

Can someone provide a link to the advert for the kittens please? I've only just caught up with this thread and I am curious.

Liz


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

[[http://www.preloved.co.uk/fuseaction-adverts.showadvert/index-1031732030/0b2e9040.html]]


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## CharleyRogan (Feb 20, 2009)

That link doesn't work!

Char
xxx


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## Eiserblew (Apr 13, 2009)

Try this one:

Preloved | ragdoll kittens for sale in Edinburgh, East Lothian, UK


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## ChinaBlue (Feb 3, 2008)

I cannot believe she is charging £280 for unregistered kits - I also note "another litter" - makes you wonder how often she is breeding her girls?


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## Eiserblew (Apr 13, 2009)

Hi ChinaBlue,

I was speaking to another breeder in Scotland last night. She was telling me that she knows of this woman, as she was contacted a few days ago by a lady who bought 2 kittens off this 'woman' (I'd prefer to call her an animal, but no animal would behave the way this 'woman' does). One of the pair of kittens was already dead, and the other was seriously ill at the vets. I don't know the details of why the kittens are ill, but the kittens are 10 months old. The mother? The same girl - Adtrelo Ysaline. 4 months between litters. The vet that saw those kittens said they weren't the 8 or 9 weeks she'd been told they were, they were more like 5 to 6 weeks old. Sounds like that poor girl has her babies ripped away from her prematurely, gets a 2 week break and is mated straight back up again. I'm sorry, but I really hope someone somewhere can find a way of doing something about this woman. It's been playing on my mind all night.


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

That is horrid poor cat! I do hope something can be done.


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## Lotti (Aug 21, 2008)

I don't think some people relise what there doing! Has she ever had children?! How would she like it if she was made pregnant everytime she'd finished giving birth she'd be almost dead! :mad5:


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

This is terrible. I am contacting SSPCA today will full address and details. I have also gave Adtrello Ysalines *real [*B]owner[/B] this girls address.

I will let you know how I get on with SSPCA.


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## Lotti (Aug 21, 2008)

wow thats fantastic good on you! I hope to hear she gets caught and dealt with!


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

mellowma said:


> This is terrible. I am contacting SSPCA today will full address and details. I have also gave Adtrello Ysalines *real [*B]owner[/B] this girls address.
> 
> I will let you know how I get on with SSPCA.


So she doesn't even own the second cat she said was the mum! It just gets worse! This is fraud!


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Sorry I worded that last post wrongly she does own Adtrello but the lady who gave her to her still has the pink slip as she did not have her neutered. i.e. she is still breeding from her, when she bought cat as pet only.

When I bought my Ragdoll from her my vet thought she too was only 6/7 weeks. [sad] She was also very unwell. Lots better now though!

I am very careful about what I say on the internet with so many people looking on but not actually posting. I also stay quite close to this person and worry, a lot about the come-back.

She at times with up to 16 kittens. They were actually quite proud of it!

For someone to take this away from them, they will be angry and that is something which worries me.

I have to say even though I am slightly on edge with Mistys impending birth this whole situation has made me feel quite sick. I have hardly slept at all thinking it all through.

I have done as I said I would do in my last post and this is going to be acted upon, they are sending someone round to check. I gave details of how my kitten was when I got her, I gave details of the conditions they are being dragged up in, 

*I only hope it is enough for someone to make them stop.*


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

Ah, I see. She is still commiting fraud but I understand your anxiety. My thoughts are with you.


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

lizward said:


> Well, the person in that link lists *his occupation as "selling dodgy gear on ebay"* - "buyer beware" springs to mind!
> 
> Can someone provide a link to the advert for the kittens please? I've only just caught up with this thread and I am curious.
> 
> Liz


WOW! Top bloke........


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Hello again, I would just like to say that I realise how *stupid/naive/idiotic about this whole thing. I guess I would just like you to know that I know this.*

Thanks for all your help and especially to ChinaBlue & Eiserblew and those few other who messaged me but with all this on my mind I seem to have forgotten your names....{sorry}


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

You're not an idiot. The person selling the cats is, well, stronger than idiot! Just glad your girl is well and looked after by you.


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

I would certainly think very badly of any breeder who held this against you and I doubt if any will. In fact, if I were the breeder of your cat's mother, I'd be trying to work out whether there was any way I could help you out - and that breeder could, if she really wanted to, by transferring that cat to the active register. That way, if you have a mating certificate and the father is on the active register, you could register the kittens - and since the pink slip has been withheld, it isn't going to make any difference to the breeder of your cat. But obviously the breeder of your cat's mother is under no obligation to do that.

There is another option - you could register your cat, I think, or certainly at least the kittens (assuming Dad is on the active register and has the entirety certificate, it doesn't matter if he is neutered now as long as the vet will say he was entire before that). You would register her as semi-longhair and the kittens would be reference register, but at least they would be registered. 

Liz


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## Indie (Nov 6, 2007)

This is awfull i really feel for you good luck with the kittens. So could someone tell me is £280 to much to pay for an unregistered Ragdoll wanted only as a pet?


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

This is not you being idiotic or stupid. Maybe a little naive but aren't we all at times. You were scammed NONE OF THIS IS YOUR FAULT. I am sure that there are plenty of Ragdoll breeders out there that would sell to you. I'd sell to you but I have Birmans due (want one?) Those people that are reading this thread and thinking bad stuff about you and what happened need to go and boil their heads! Those people aren't worth thinking about. 

Chin up, PM me if you like - I'm in Scotland too - you sound down and like you are beating yourself up and it really isn't your fault.


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

Indie said:


> This is awfull i really feel for you good luck with the kittens. So could someone tell me is £280 to much to pay for an unregistered Ragdoll wanted only as a pet?


personally I'd pay the extra £70 and get the real deal. There is no guarentee with unregistered that the mum and dad are full peds.


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## Eiserblew (Apr 13, 2009)

Now then girl, don't beat yourself up! This 'woman' was obviously very convincing - plus she intentionally misled you about this kitten. She must know about breeding and so-on if she reckons she does have some litters that she registers, so she would know fully well that she cannot register any of the kittens from your girls mother. She even tried to deceive you by giving you a 'pink slip' with 'active' printed on it! You have been conned - and a con artist is very good at convincing people. That is not your fault. If everyone could spot a con, then there would be no con artists. 

Do not think that no-one will help you - that is not the case at all. I just wish I wasn't at the opposite end of the country, or I would offer to mentor you and sell you a breeding girl if you agreed to breed under my mentoring for the first couple of years. When you've had and raised this litter, if you do still want to consider breeding, then I am more than happy to help you. I can put you in touch with a few breeders, and even try to find you a mentor, who will be there to help you learn about the breed. 

One idea in the meantime is to ask a reputable breeder for a show neuter, and to start showing a cat first. You get to learn all about the breed, plus you get to meet other Ragdoll people and start to network properly. This is a great way of meeting new friends and learning as much as you can about the breed. It's how I started, and to be honest I am glad that I did it that way.

To answer the question about £280 being too much for an unregistered Raggie, the answer is yes. 

Working on 'south' prices, the vaccinations are around £60, registration £9, worming £2, insurance (free for us to give, but 1 month is worth a few £)... that's £351 straight off before you factor in the cost to the breeder of feeding those kittens for the extra weeks (and incidental costs - damaged curtains/vase, extra washing of bedding etc.)... then you have to consider the back yard breeder kittens are usually poorly and need vets treatment - add more money for that (and you don't have the insurance to claim back from!)... no comeback if anything goes wrong.... All of a sudden that £280 kitten doesn't seem like such a bargain, does it!


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## ChinaBlue (Feb 3, 2008)

I echo Eiserblew's post. You were conned - you are not the first and won't be last. There will be breeders who will sell to you as you have proved that you are genuine by being honest and upfront and shown your caring nature so don't despair. I am sure both Eiserblew and I will help all we can - and I understand you have been in touch with someone else who is willing to perhaps help you and who lives in Scotland. Showing is a great way to start - you learn so much and make a lot of friends etc.

In the meantime if you have any questions or need any advice we are all here for you.


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Wow, you people are very nice. 

I think I am just having a bit of a day today. 

I have to say though I have met more nice people this week than I have in years! 

Thanks again


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

> One idea in the meantime is to ask a reputable breeder for a show neuter, and to start showing a cat first. You get to learn all about the breed, plus you get to meet other Ragdoll people and start to network properly. This is a great way of meeting new friends and learning as much as you can about the breed. It's how I started, and to be honest I am glad that I did it that way.


This is a great idea, this way you gain an insight into the workings of the breed as well. Who has nice cats at the moment, who doesn't, who is trustworthy, who isn't, I know there is a lot of show gossip but this way you meet people face to face and you can work out for yourself who you can trust as well as finding out great tips about the breed. You also find out where the breed is going, which cats are doing well at shows which colours or pedigrees are particularly sought after etc. etc. 
Loads of breeders started this way.

Lauren


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