# Sticky  How to help a dog with Separation Anxiety.



## sue&harvey

*Separation Anxiety in Dogs *

There has been loads of people asking for advice about this recently, so I thought I would try and put some information all in one place. Please feel free to add any further advice 

*Separation Anxiety Definition *:- The term separation anxiety is not exclusive to dogs or even to veterinary medicine. It is a psychological term to describe the stress and anxiousness in an individual brought on by the leaving (perceived or imagined) of another individual. In the case of a pet, it is usually an anxiety brought on by separation from the primary pet caretaker. In the case of humans, anxiety in a child from being separated from a parent.

What classifies as a "separation"? This varies greatly between animals: some must have "their person" within their line of sight, other pets are fine as long as the owner is within a comfortable distance (i.e. somewhere else in the house), and still others are fine until the owner leaves. Even finer distinctions would be animals that are fine for a certain period of time after their owner leaves, but then start to show signs of anxiousness some time later.

Just like the variance in what stresses out each individual, the signs of separation anxiety vary greatly as well.

*Which Dogs can be effected by Separation Anxiety:-* The answer to this is ANY! There are some breeds believed to be prone to SA. Some of these are German Shepherds, Airedales, Springer Spaniels, Australian Shepherds and Weimaraners, to name a few. This is not to say all of these dogs will not cope being left alone, as with all dogs it will vary greatly depending on the individual.

Plus a higher number of dogs that come from a shelter or rescue home, seem to develop dog separation anxiety easily. These dogs might have gone through some severe trauma, or abandonment before ending up in the shelter and once they are placed in a home with an owner they can trust, they will start relying on that owner a lot faster than dogs that haven't experienced any trauma in their life already.
Pups that leave their litter too early are also predisposed to SA.

*How to prevent your new puppy, or dog from being affected by Separation Anxiety *:- Owners need to help their dog, or puppy to find a happy medium between companionship and becoming sufficiently independent to tolerate being alone for periods of time. Dogs do not electively engage in anxious behaviours. They develop over a period of time, and becomes a panic response. People must condition their dogs to stay calm when left alone. To condition means to get the dog used to specific things, situations and events. That's why it's important to practice leaving and returning to the dog frequently, starting when you first bring the dog into your home and family.

Teach your dog from the start that your leaving the house is an ordinary, regular event. Help your dog build tolerance for your departures and absences. Calm departures and homecomings will help the dog to relax. When leaving do not have emotional goodbyes, this will not help the dog .

*Mummy* " _ahh poor baby, will you miss mummy?_" Kiss Kiss Kiss _"Don't worry mummy be back soon"_

*Puppy *Where's she going, why all this fuss, that thing they call a coat, she only puts that on when she goes outside… I wanna go! Don't want to stay on my own!!! *Panic Response Alert !!!*

The same applies for your return. Take your coat off unpack the shopping, open your mail, then when the dog is calm let them outside to toilet. (Still not spoken to him) When he had been to the loo, then you can give him praise and a little play session.

When you first bring home your bundle of fluff and needle sharp teeth, let them explore the outside area first ( get them used to going outside, it will help when toilet training, and big fuss for toileting outside.) Then take them inside letting them explore their new kingdom in stages.

Have the dog's bed and bowl of water ready in a safe, well-lighted, comfortable confined area with "family smells", such as a gated-off kitchen, family room or crate placed in a family area. (Do not confine in basements, garages, storage rooms, or other non-family areas). This nice "den" will be the place in which she will stay when you are not home to supervise. Take her to that place, tell her lie down (guide her if she has not yet learned that command). Then give her one or two safe chew toys and praise her. Couple a food treat with the verbal praise. In fact, it's helpful to keep a small bag of tiny tipbit treats on you at all times during the acclimation and training phases.

Next, close the door or gate to the room or crate, and step back. See if she is staying calm. Resist the urge to talk to the dog, since that will distract her from this desired, calm, relaxed behaviour. ( He should be shattered from his trip to his new home, and all that exploring)

If she stays reasonably calm when separated from you for a minute or two, let her stay there as long as she seems comfortable. (See thread "Cages" in Dog Chat) If the dog is good in her confined area, this is a very good sign. You can begin to add calm, quiet verbal praise and an occasional food treat to this acclimation routine as a reward for being good and calm in her confined area.

Over the next few days and weeks encourage your new pup or dog to sleep in his safe area. Slowly increase the amount of time they are left. A dog that is left regularly will become well adapted and sufficiently independent to cope with being alone.

Also install baby gates so you dog learns to accept he cannot access you when ever he wants. He can see you, but cannot always get to you.

_*Spend time training your dog to happily accept alone time will save you, your dog and you neighbours a lot of stress in the long run! *_


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## sue&harvey

*Punishment and adversaries will not work:*- Punishing, aversive training methods and coercion *will not work*! Please, Please, Please, do not employ the use of shock, spray, noise or any other foul collar. Shock pads are even worse. They are ridiculously expensive and you will end up compounding the dogs issues.

Ok so forget the dog for a second Think of something that makes you panic. Your worst fear. Got it ???

Right mine is Spiders I hate them, really give me the heebey geebies. Im a complete wimp and run screaming from the room! No person with any compassion would attempt to treat my fear by punishing me! (I would get the kitchen knife first)

But for the purpose of this lets say that is exactly what someone comes and does.

They lock me in a dark shed, fully of spiders webs, and loads of HUGE spiders. Then every time I screamed, tried to release my self, cried, killed one of the little blighters in an attempt to get them off me, my healer shocked me!!! This could go on for minutes, hours or days, they didnt tell me!!! I silently stand there, shaking and sobbing until I either faint, die of fright, go into clinical shock, or they let me out! :scared: :crying:

*Yeah right, I am really going to want to go NEAR a spider again.*

I think most would agree this would compound my fear, rather than heal it. Congratulations you have now taught me *learned helplessness*. And the next time you come near me, I will have that kitchen knife in my hand, another congratulations I am now *aggressive*.

This is exactly what these sorts of aversive methods do!!! Please, Please do not put your dog through this!!!!


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## sue&harvey

*Signs and symptoms of Separation Anxiety:-*
*Before you go! Introducing Velcro dog!
*

*Your dog or puppy needs to be with you:* If your dog has separation anxiety, you may find that they always need to be in the same room as you, or within eyesight. If you make a move to another room, they will immediately get up to follow you. They are calmest when they are right next to you, and you arent moving. Some people call this behaviour Velcro-ing because the dog is stuck to you. Clinically this is called hyper-attachment and is a major identifier of separation anxiety in dogs.

*Anxiety And Nervousness:* when you are getting ready to leave: Dogs are smart animals  your dog has probably figured out that you are going to leave by how you act before leaving the house. These leaving signals can trigger anxiety in your dog before you have even gone. For example, Scout used to run to the door when I picked up my keys and jingled them. He also knew that when I put on shoes or sandals, that I was getting ready to go. He would stand at the door and block me, to make sure I wasnt leaving without him. Dogs will also pace back in forth, nervous that you are about to leave.
*Chewing Items that smell like you:* Dogs like to chew on your underwear and socks because they smell like you. Make sure you pick up, and give the dogs other items to chew on.

*While you are absent! Introducing the devil incarnate!*
*Barking, Howling and Whining*: Your dog barking when you leave is a very common symptom of dog separation anxiety. Typically, your dog will show signs of anxiety, and begin whining or pacing before you leave. As the anxiety level increases, this may change to whining, then barking. *These are not normal barks * your dog is having an anxiety attack because they think that *you* are not coming back and need to be with you. This is a huge problem with Condo and apartment tenants. Many cases of dogs returning to shelters are because of Separation issues.

*Digging, Scratching, Chewing:* The next level of separation anxiety is when a dog moves beyond barking and starts get physical. This type of scratching chewing and digging is an attempt to escape from the confines of the room, house, or yard so that they can find you. Some dogs will be in such a panic that they will rub their noses and paws completely raw, break through glass, tear down walls, and otherwise injure you or your property to get to you.

*Destroying the House!* Your dog may also get downright destructive. I have seen many couches ruined, carpets pulled up, and cabinets destroyed. This is a symptom of separation anxiety when these behaviours happen only when you are not present. If you dont curb this behaviour quickly, the costs can become enormous.
If you have a puppy, they may be teething and need a better variety of safe treats to chew on. If your dog is also destructive while you are home, they probably need more exercise, and stronger training regime. You should also keep an eye on your dog so that you can correct the behaviour while it is happening.

*Peeing and Pooing around the House*: Some dogs will go to the toilet around the house when you leave. This is caused because they are so scared and anxious, that they lose control of their bowels and bladder. They are truly in a panic. Healthy adult dogs should be able to hold their bladder for at least 5 hours. Puppies typically can hold their bladder 1 hour for every month of age. You probably know your dogs routine, if this behaviour is outside of normal, they most likely have separation anxiety!

*When you return! Overjoyed dog in the middle of a war zone!*

*Over Excitement:* A common symptom of an anxious dog is that they when they see you again, they are excessively overjoyed. The greeting is not normal and calm, it is frantic and uncontrolled. Your dog thought you would never return, so they are not just saying Hello, they are expressing their relief at no longer being abandoned.
Not all dogs display these behaviours, some display mild symptoms such as whining, others will destroy a room that they are left in until you return. Separation anxiety is a serious condition and robs both you and your dog of a healthy relationship

_Please, where possible ask a GOOD behaviourist to diagnose Separation Anxiety, and assist with a behaviour modification plan, as each dog is different!
_


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## sue&harvey

*Ok, so we have Velcro-devil-destroyer dog, HELP!*

*This next part takes time, commitment and consistency. Sorry no quick fix!*

When we found out from six out of eleven neighbours Harvey was howling the house down the entire time we were out, I turned to this forum and received some fantastic advice. Due to where I live, I was unable to seek advice from a behaviourist. (Language barrier and disagreement in techniques used! Those shock collars again)

This next bit is bits of advice I received, and my own experience all compiled into one, hopefully helpful post!

*Calmatives *

Calmatives are not sedatives! Please dont use sedatives even if they worked in the book Marley and me!

Types of calmatives widely available either in the shops, on the net or from the vet are:-

DAP- Dog appeasing Pheromone collars and diffusers are widely available. 
_Taken from Nutrecare website _

DAP is a synthetic copy of a dog's naturally occurring appeasing pheromones from the lactating female. The DAP Diffuser works like a plug in air freshener, continuously releasing the odourless natural pheromone into the dogs environment, helping to make it feel safe and calm. The DAP Diffuser is a natural solution, there is no sedative effect and the dogs ability to interact and play is maintained.

A lot of people have dogs who are frightened of fireworks, and it is very distressing for owners to see their beloved friends cowering or shivering in a corner during this season, which seems to get longer each year. The only solution for many is sedatives. This is only a short term solution and is not good long term for the dog.

Plug DAP into an electric outlet in the room most frequented by the dog. The diffuser is reusable and vials may be replaced as needed. Each vial lasts approximately four weeks and covers up to 650-square-feet.

DAP Dog Appeasing Pheromone diffuser releases a pacifying pheromone which has been successfully used to treat chronic problems such as destruction, barking, whining, house soiling or excessive licking in adult dogs.

Overcome separation anxiety. 
One Dog Appeasing Pheromone diffuser will cover between 50 and 70 sqm; so please check the size of your house as you may need more than one diffuser.

*Bach Rescue Remedy.* A few drops in their water

Dr Edward Bach discovered 38 remedies which he split into seven different groups that can be combined to suit any individual. The flower remedies are made from wild plants, trees and bushes. They work by treating the individual rather than the disease or its symptoms and are a gentle way to manage your emotions and rediscover a positive side to yourself.
Each of the 38 Bach Original Flower Remedies is unique and helps treat a different emotion. Most people find it reasonably easy to select their own remedies. All you need to do is find the remedy (or remedies) that seem to reflect your situation, mood or personality best. All the states described are everyday human emotions that we feel from time to time. Even the most negative state has a corresponding positive quality that shows us what we can be when we are completely ourselves.
For more information about how to select your own Bach Original Flower Remedies and courses to learn more about the system of 38 remedies developed by Dr Bach visit our Bach Original Flower Remedies brand site.
(Always read the label.)

ZYLKENE

Zylkene is not a drug as such, it is a food supplement made from a protein found in milk. The active ingredient is a peptide (a simple sort of protein molecule) which is able to bind temporarily to certain receptors in the brain. This has a calming influence which is similar in some ways to tranquilliser drugs such as diazepam (Vallium), but without the side effects. It has been clinically proven to be effective in dogs and cats (as well as rats and humans). It is supplied in 3 different sizes of capsule, chosen according to the size of the animal to be treated. The capsules are opened and sprinkled on food once daily. The contents seem to taste delicious to most dogs and cats and are easy to give. It is possible to provide treatment for just a few days if it is to cover a particular stressful event, such as travelling away for the weekend. However it is perfectly safe in most situations to give for long periods if needed. Usually a course is given for 2  4 weeks then re-assessed. If in doubt ask your vet, or email us at VioVet for more information. Zylkene is available without prescription and is a safe, natural treatment worth trying for most dogs or cats suffering from stress. It should be used with caution in animals known to be sensitive or allergic to milk, though in fact it is very unlikely to cause trouble even to these animals.

With Harvey we chose Zylkene, as it was one of the few we could easily obtain. Personally I think it made a difference, but again each dog is different. 
There are plenty more calmatives, so have a good look and speak with your vet to find the best for your dog.


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## sue&harvey

*Crate Training.*

I dont want to go too much into crate training here, as there is a good sticky in Dog Chat about Cages. DO NOT USE A CRATE TO HELP EASE SEPARATION ANXIETY UNTIL THE DOG IS REALLY COMFORTABLE ABOUT BEINGIN THERE!

Provided a crate is introduced in a positive manner, made a nice place to be, and NEVER used as a punishment, then it could (and did become mine) your biggest ally with combating Separation Anxiety.

The dog has a safe place, or den where he can retreat to in stressful situations. Also you leave him in a safe environment where he cannot chew through your antique table or the live wire of your TV.

A friend of mine has a staffie cross who was slicing her paws on the carpet grips at all the doors in their 3 story house. The behaviourist suggested the dog feels it has to protect her domain when her owners were out. With so many doors to protect she would dash between each door tearing carpets and paws as she went. They introduced the crate and voila one door, relaxed dog!

To effectively manage the problem, you need to put the dog in a situation where he cannot make a mistake.

*Comforting sounds and smells.*

Leaving the TV or radio on can sooth the dog. Radio stations like BBC Radio 4 is great, lots of talking, or he may be partial to classic FM. Whatever works for him.

Also a well worn but not washed top of yours near to him but out of chewing distance can help here too.

*Desensitization!*

Hutch6 gave this fantastic piece of advice for getting your dog happy for you to be out of sight, and teaching that you always come back

http://www.petforums.co.uk/1666248-post8.html

Once you get to a stage where they are happy for you to be out of sight and are happy in their crate (or whichever area you want to leave them) then move on to the next step. Please do not rush, it takes time but will be really worth it in the end! If you think the dog has got it stay on the same step for a further 3 days! Really ingrained then.

The first step is to ensure the dog is sufficiently tired. Exercise, play, train. Hard. You want him to be ready for long sleep. For this first step a good play and training session should do the trick. You must be calm and relaxed or the dog will pick up on it.

1) Put the dog in his area, having made sure he is empty, and basic needs met. Then follow your normal leaving routine, grab your keys. Then sit down and read a magazine.

Repeat 10 times a day, until the dog no longer even bothers to lift an eyelid.

2) As above place the dog in his area, after meeting basic needs, introduce a stuffed Kong 10 minutes before you get ready. (something to keep him occupied) Go through your normal routine, go out the door, close it, then come straight back in.

Again repeat minimum 10 times a day, until he thinks you are simply mad, and doesnt bat an eye lid.

If you have a car, this could also be a trigger, so step 3 may be to open and close the car door, and go straight back. Then turn the engine on etc.

3) This is where you need to up the exercise, and stimulation to tire. Do all of stage 2, give the Kong etc. Very slowly begin to increase the time, 30 seconds, 1 minute, 2 minutes, 3 minutes, 5 minutes and so on. REMEMBER you are setting the dog up to succeed.

4) Once you can leave for 30 minutes, you can then build this into hours, again 1 hour, 1 hour 30 mins, 2 hours etc.

CONGRATULATIONS WITH HARD WORK, UNDERSTANDING, AND CONSISTANT TRAINING YOU HAVE A DOG THAT NO LONGER HOWLS, CHEWS AND SPENDS ALL HIS TIME WAITING DESPERATLY FOR YOU TO COME BACK.

If you havent then you really need to employ a behaviourist to assist you, if you havent already.

Once you successfully get to this stage, after about 6 months of happily being left alone, you can take steps to withdraw calmatives very slowly, and shorten the length of extra exercise. Dont do it too quickly and undo the hard work.

Harvey is getting there now. If I want to pop to the shops, I will give him a quick walk, and a Kong or chewy and he is happy. He now has no calmatives. Its been really hard work but well worth it.

If this helps only one person, then I will be pleased. I know how stressful SA is and the impact it can have


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## sue&harvey

Bump ....


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## Bearpaw

Wow Sue,thats a great thread,deserves to be a sticky!!! you worked really hard and hopefully itll help lots of people not to get in/or who are in that situation


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## sue&harvey

Bearpaw said:


> Wow Sue,thats a great thread,deserves to be a sticky!!! you worked really hard and hopefully itll help lots of people not to get in/or who are in that situation


Cheers BP  I know how horrible it is to deal with.


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## Amy&Ted

This is a FANTASTIC thread! Ted is displaying signs of SA... he has the classic signs of being a "velcro dog" He follows me everywhere and whines if i even dare to so much as go to the toilet.

I'm going to take my time and digest all you have written here and hopefully find a way to ease my little guy into a happy place when i'm out.

Thanks so much for taking the time to write this!
:thumbup:


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## sue&harvey

TedEBear said:


> This is a FANTASTIC thread! Ted is displaying signs of SA... he has the classic signs of being a "velcro dog" He follows me everywhere and whines if i even dare to so much as go to the toilet.
> 
> I'm going to take my time and digest all you have written here and hopefully find a way to ease my little guy into a happy place when i'm out.
> 
> Thanks so much for taking the time to write this!
> :thumbup:


Glad you found it helpful 

Thanks Tashi 

I have probably missed loads out, so please feel free to add


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## madonna

hi mine barks and howls , when i pop ot , and yhats even if someone is with him. .. i will try this but hes a weimaraner so its in his breed. thanks for the post .


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## WoodyGSP

Woody always scratches the books off the book shelf (in my hall, by the front door) when we go out.
I usually leave the lounge door shut and he has the hall and kitchen. But today the door was open when we got back and guess what, the books were where we left them:thumbup:
He had moved a few shoes, but no damage, so I'm going the leave the door open in future. I was always worried he'd chew the sofa or something, but I think he just feels better being able to look out the front window.


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## cpatel

Hi

This is a great topic, very interesting. Some very good points!

I wanted to say that we should not forget that separation related problems can have a number of different 'motivations' apart from anxiety and we generally tend to label most dogs who present with separation related problems with Sep Anx. forgetting to consider other possibilities such as frustration, conditioned (learn't) behaviours...

Have seen clients who have seen trainer and behaviourists who have "diagnosed" Sep Anx. and "treated" accordingly but with little or no success, on evaluating some of these cases, I don't believe that a lot of these dogs have anxiety based problems when left.

Chirag

Chirag Patel BSc (Hons), DipCABT, CPDT
San Francisco SPCA Certificates in Training & Behaviour and Dog Aggression
Member of the Association of Pet Dog Trainers #00923 (UK) #71093 (US)
Pets as Therapy Assessor

Dog Star Daily Blogger  Please check out Dog Star Daily for loads of free puppy & dog training articles, videos and blogs.

Telephone: 077 2531 0204
Email: [email protected]
Website: www.domesticatedmanners.com

(BSc (Hons) = Bachelor of Science in Veterinary Science from the Royal Veterinary College, London)
(DipCABT = Advanced Diploma in Practical Aspects of Companion Animal Behaviour & Training from the Centre of Applied Pet Ethology)
(CPDT = Certified Pet Dog Trainer with the Certification Council for Professional Dog Trainers)


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## madonna

hi i have a 5 monh old weimaraner boy , i can go out or as someone on here has said go o the loo or shut thre door on him, h wont wee in thr garden without a door open , i know this breed is known for it , does this mean i have a lifetiome of this or can it be a puppy thing , i see so many for homing and they all say cant be left, i have days out coming up and , feel i cant leave him , he barks so loud. im at home most days and hes only left for short times .i try leeving doors shut and stair gates to ty and get him usd to not being next to me ,my brother went to a doberman rescue show today and told someone i have a weim , and her reply was good luck! doesnt help. cant bear to think heed have to go as we love him and hes part of our family now , can this be conquered ,,,help ?


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## sue&harvey

madonna said:


> hi i have a 5 monh old weimaraner boy , i can go out or as someone on here has said go o the loo or shut thre door on him, h wont wee in thr garden without a door open , i know this breed is known for it , does this mean i have a lifetiome of this or can it be a puppy thing , i see so many for homing and they all say cant be left, i have days out coming up and , feel i cant leave him , he barks so loud. im at home most days and hes only left for short times .i try leeving doors shut and stair gates to ty and get him usd to not being next to me ,my brother went to a doberman rescue show today and told someone i have a weim , and her reply was good luck! doesnt help. cant bear to think heed have to go as we love him and hes part of our family now , can this be conquered ,,,help ?


The good news is that just because he is a Weimy does not mean he will, or indeed has SA. It's like saying all beagles will never be off lead, or all GSD will guard and become aggressive.

Although the breed seems prone to it, you and your Weimy can lead a normal life.

You need to be very consistant and strong. You need to leave them on a regular basis, so they learn being on their own is not a bad thing, and you alway come back. Not peeing in the garden without a door open, is not uncommon in dogs.

If you have pet insurance it may cover behaviourist costs. If you can get help to nip this in the bud now, it will be easier to combat. The longer it goes on, the more practised and learned the behaviour will become.

Have a chat with your vet, and ask for a behaviourist referal. PLEASE only use a behaviourist that uses NO ADVERSARIES!!!

Hope this helps, and good luck, let us know how it goes


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## madonna

hi sue and harvey, thanks for that , at 5 months how long should i leave him for, and is it normal for him to b stressed if he can still see me but is behind a stairgate? he cries and pants even if other people are their .


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## sue&harvey

madonna said:


> hi sue and harvey, thanks for that , at 5 months how long should i leave him for, and is it normal for him to b stressed if he can still see me but is behind a stairgate? he cries and pants even if other people are their .


He should be learning to be happy on his own. Have a look in the link where Hutch6 gave some great desensitization techniques


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## crosscairn

Thank you so much for this post Sue.

The bit about the dog slicing itself on carpet rails just screamed out to me, I made another post just a few minutes ago on my dog doing this. 

I noted your point about crating, I had asked on my other post re crating during the day. It would be three hours, then out over lunch then back for four hours. While I can see how thats on the extreme side and maybe viewed by some as too long, I am worried about my dog doing himself a serious injury. What are your views?

Thanks


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## sue&harvey

crosscairn said:


> Thank you so much for this post Sue.
> 
> The bit about the dog slicing itself on carpet rails just screamed out to me, I made another post just a few minutes ago on my dog doing this.
> 
> I noted your point about crating, I had asked on my other post re crating during the day. It would be three hours, then out over lunch then back for four hours. While I can see how thats on the extreme side and maybe viewed by some as too long, I am worried about my dog doing himself a serious injury. What are your views?
> 
> Thanks


Hi I am no expert, and my first suggestion would be to involve a good behaviourist. But ad far as crating goes, as a short term measure, as long as you exercise him properly then it is safer than him causing himself an injury. If it becomes long term I would say try and get someone in for an hour to brake the day up a bit for him.

Good luck, hope you manage to sort it soon


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## crosscairn

It definitely would be short term, 2-3 weeks max. The crate has helped a lot with his night time behaviour, I'm hopeful that it will do the same for this daytime madness! I'd adjust his morning exercise accordingly. I sit in work worried in case he's done himself an injury. The carpet I can replace, the little 'un I can't.


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## sue&harvey

crosscairn said:


> It definitely would be short term, 2-3 weeks max. The crate has helped a lot with his night time behaviour, I'm hopeful that it will do the same for this daytime madness! I'd adjust his morning exercise accordingly. I sit in work worried in case he's done himself an injury. The carpet I can replace, the little 'un I can't.


Good Luck, hope it helps. I hated leaving Harvey knowing he would howl, but loads better now. Just be consistant so he knows what is expected of him


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## crosscairn

The crate during the day really is a last resort. I'm currently getting quotes done to have a dog run built outside. He has a lot more to keep him amused outside, rather than staring at 4 walls all day long.

He can chase flies for hours on end!


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## Kollie

Thanks for a fantastic thread! I just picked my new dog up from the rescue centre a couple of days ago. He's obviously a bit stressed and confused from all the stuff going on around him, and has decided the safest thing to do is to constantly be within half an inch of me. Having read this thread I now have an idea of what to do in order to stop the situation developing and him turning into a velcro monster! Fingers crossed we get it right!

Kine


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## sue&harvey

Kollie said:


> Thanks for a fantastic thread! I just picked my new dog up from the rescue centre a couple of days ago. He's obviously a bit stressed and confused from all the stuff going on around him, and has decided the safest thing to do is to constantly be within half an inch of me. Having read this thread I now have an idea of what to do in order to stop the situation developing and him turning into a velcro monster! Fingers crossed we get it right!
> 
> Kine


Good luck with your new addition. Hope he settles in well


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## madonna

hi all ,tried the 5 minite theory , hes just not getting it.. will try calmatives next but not hopefull , i have spoke to both neighbours and been told its constant ,and he sounds really stressed ,its now getting me down , as i feel i cant go out at all, and i have a unhappy dog.... not sure how this will work out . hes a lovely dog , so really want this to work out .


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## snoopydo

Separation Anxiety in Dogs, My dog has Separation Anxiety


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## sue&harvey

snoopydo said:


> Separation Anxiety in Dogs, My dog has Separation Anxiety


It's a shame that all that is based on Dominance theory. Cross species domination is something I really do not believe in, and is very misunderstood, because people learn all about it from people like CM/DW. :nonod:

An example here. I am expecting Harvey's SA recovery to take a dent because we are inflicting big changes. He has to endure his home being packed into boxes, be crated for about 10 hours, Fly when he gets a bit travel sick, be separated from me during the check in process-Flight-Collection, allowed no medication to help with this, or toys as a boardem buster. Then meet many new people, stay in a strange house, meet 2 new dogs, sleep in a strange house. Then endure another 7 hours journey, (with breaks this time) arrive at another strange envrionment, meet new people, dogs, smells and experiences. Endure temperatures he has never known and weather he has never known.

I very much expect to take a few steps backward, Why? Because *I* moved him away from all things familiar. How can any of the above be knitted into the dominance theory. It's simple uncertainty, which will take time to iron out again. NOT because I am pack leader, I am a human who provides all he needs. I am not a dog, and I don't hunt for food, therefore I am not alpha male. He still respects me because I condition him to. You don't bite me coz it hurts, you don't pee in my house coz it stinks and so on.

Mutual Respect not Dominance 

I have just had time to read through the above link, an personally I would not advise ANYONE to heed. Dogs are not out to take over humans. Following that link is going to make pretty miserable dog ownership  
QUOTE from the above link
*During the time you are establishing your higher pack position, no hugs should be given to the dog by you, as a dominant dog may consider this a challenge of power.* 

Not the way I will choose to teach my dog I will always come back, and to feel safe and secure :nonod:


----------



## leashedForLife

madonna said:


> ...will try calmatives next but not hopeful,
> i have spoke to both neighbours and been told its constant, and he sounds really stressed,
> its now getting me down...


CALMATIVES for everyone... 4-foots + 2-foots, both. 
Pet Forums Community - View Single Post - dog body-language - and why it matters so much...

OVERALL dvm, re separating departure cues from exits - 
What is Behavior Modification? | k9aggression.com 
LOOK in the right-margin for the title

tethering for when U are home, to prevent shadowing U about - 
Tethered to Success 
an 18-inch free length between the clips on either end is plenty - 
many big-box DIY stores will cut them to length and crimp the spring-clips into a loop on either end. 
nylon-coated bike cable in a light weight is suggested. 
screw an eye-bolt right into the baseboard, OUT of traffic paths; if U put an eye-bolt in each room, the dog has a space of his own, no matter where U are, and cannot be stepping on Ur heels, lying on Ur feet, leaning on U, etc.

FROZEN STUFFED KONGS or other busywork, to keep the dog happily engaged - 
put half of brekkie in one Kong the night before, deliver it **just** before walking out the door.

safe chew-toys: 
solid rubber, solid nylon: flavored or scented bones of nylon, bumpy rubber balls to chew, rubber playing-jacks,... 
WASH all rubber items before offering them to the dog - many makers powder them with a foul-tasting fine, 
clingy powder to repel greasy dirt, which is disgusting stuff [don't ask...]

dog-soothing music *which is associated beforehand* with U being HOME, and is *regularly reinforced as a happy-association* with times when the dog is calm, all is copacetic, and the house is peaceful...


----------



## leashedForLife

pardon me, snoop - 
but let me be brutally frank - *this link leads to the biggest load of sloppy manure that i have ever seen, 
outside of a honey-wagon for spreading the stuff on fields before cultivating them.*


snoopydo said:


> Separation Anxiety in Dogs, My dog has Separation Anxiety


i mean LOOK at this tortured, twisted, complex rationalization - 


> *bold and underline added - *
> 
> _In a pack, *the leader is allowed to leave*.
> However, the *followers never leave the leader*.
> If your dog is instinctually *seeing you as their follower and you leave* them, *it causes so much mental anguish that a dog often takes it out on your house or themselves*. The dog sees themselves as the one who is *responsible for the pack* and when the pack has *left the house* they get in a *panic* because they are afraid that *something might happen to their pack members* for which _[EDIT: 'whom'] _*they are responsible* for. _[EDIT: 'for' is redundant]


how many twists + turns of logic, there!  i get dizzy just thinking about it - good heavens.

dogs who suffer GENUINE sep-anx are in a panic - because THEY, the dogs, are afraid to be alone - 
not because they have premonitions that U will be struck-down by a drunk driver, or killed in a falling elevator, 
or be mugged + die of a blunt-force head injury... *dogs do not subscribe to the SUN.*

"get another DOG" is often not only pointless, but makes it WORSE - 
the sep-anx sufferer does not miss k9-company, they want HUMANS around to feel safe + secure; the 2nd dog 
is often a fifth-wheel when the owners leave, and can in fact, 'catch' the anxiety or at least the destructive 
behaviors of the 1st-dog; the FIRST dog destroys doors, sills, floors at exits, carpet, lino, etc, in a frantic attempt 
to escape; the SECOND dog palely mimics the 1st, but focuses on more traditional targets - sofas, the remotes, 
books, soft-furnishings... 


> *bold added - *
> 
> _If you allow the *dog to pul*l in front, you are once again *re-enforcing to your dog that they are alpha*
> over you. Instinctually, *the pack leader goes first*. If you do not make your dog heel beside or behind you,
> the walk will not accomplish its intended goal. *When a dog walks with their mind focused on the owner,
> they are releasing both physical and mental energy.* [snip]...
> I suggest you save some money, buy some of *Cesar Millan DVDs and watch them*. The money you invest in these DVD's will be less than your dogs future destruction and anguish. _


just *watching them* will cure the separation anxiety!? WoW... 
i had no idea, they are mind-control for dogs! i watch the DVD, and *my dog's behavior CHANGES* - with no intervention, management, B-Mod, new training, nuthin - it just HAPPENS, *i am in awe... *  well, no i am not in awe... 
:lol: i am astounded that anyone would believe that, tho.

_first, last and always: 
to change the dog's behavior, We Humans Must Change Ours FIRST. 
thats the only way it works; change what WE do, changes what THEY do. 
if we keep doing what we are doing... we get what we are getting.  _



> To help you learn to do this, we strongly suggest *Cesar Millan DVDs* and or *Cesar Millan Books* to every dog owner, from Chihuahua to Pit Bull. An excellent guide to communicating with, understanding, and controlling your dog.
> Written by Dawn Littlefield, Littlefield Kennels
> Edited by Dog Breed Info Center®


*dominance * is not the root-cause of sep-anx; 
FEARS and ANXIETIES cause the dog severe distress, and in the worst cases, 
the dog will self-injure: break teeth on crate-doors or metal gates, rip open paw-pads tearing at metal sill plates, 
rip doors + embed painful splinters in paws and legs, jump thru closed windows, and more. 
a *panic disorder* is not soothed or scared away by yelling at it - more tension only means more tension, which is IMO not only useless, but exacerbating.

U cannot DOMINATE separation-anxiety - U can reduce or modify it, U can treat it thru a vet-behaviorist, 
U can ignore it and end by euthanizing the dog, or give the dog up to someone else to fix [unlikely], 
who will very possibly euthanize the dog themselves - TREATMENT is time-consuming and needs patience; 
in cases with self-injury, it needs *psychoactive meds from a vet-behaviorist and a treatment protocol written out by the DVM-Beh. *

for mild cases, B-mod, calmatives, DS/CC and patience help. 
see the booklet, _I'll be Home Soon..._ by *patricia McConnell*.

JMO + IME - happy B-Mod, 
--- terry


----------



## Maiisiku

Took me a while to read it all but this was a very interesting thread


----------



## sue&harvey

Lemmsy's link for a study on calmatives. Lots of information on how they work. Also at the bottom is a link to a survey, collecting information about people's experiences of calmatives. https://sites.google.com/site/lucysd...-domestic-dogs


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## Kaitlyn

A very interesting read :thumbup: Cassie has the past couple of weeks started whining constantly when she's in a different room to us and gets super duper excited as soon as i go in to her, follows me round like a lost sheep and wont leave my side. The only thing thats changed was OH being in hospital for a week and me being around the house constantly for 2 weeks around this time. 

Got rescue remedy in the house so shes got a couple of drops of that in her water and also looks like back to basics with regards to me leaving her.

I wouldn't mind but shes over 5 years old now :lol: Big kid bless her


----------



## Spaniel mad

Brooke one of my cockers has SA

If i go out of the room where she cannot follow she whines and whines and whines and whines.

If i go upstairs they cant follow as theres a dog gate stopping them and she will just whine

We found she was also doing this when we went out and the dogs were left in the dog room so we started leaving them with the run of the downstairs and no whining.

So it appears she only hates it if im in the house where she cant follow. Any tips???


----------



## sue&harvey

Spaniel mad said:


> Brooke one of my cockers has SA
> 
> If i go out of the room where she cannot follow she whines and whines and whines and whines.
> 
> If i go upstairs they cant follow as theres a dog gate stopping them and she will just whine
> 
> We found she was also doing this when we went out and the dogs were left in the dog room so we started leaving them with the run of the downstairs and no whining.
> 
> So it appears she only hates it if im in the house where she cant follow. Any tips???


Have a look in the link I put to Hutch6 post. Really good tips and makes perfect sense.


----------



## Spaniel mad

sue&harvey said:


> Have a look in the link I put to Hutch6 post. Really good tips and makes perfect sense.


Will do

Thanx


----------



## petcoach

This has always worked with separation anxiety: dogs know the signs of when you are about to leave - or go upstairs. They watch you do your hair, put on your make up, run around and find your mobile, etc. and they know that all this means you are about to run out of the door or go upstairs, and they get anxious.

So, what you do is follow your usual routine to the letter - and then, instead of running out of the door - you sit down and watch a bit of TV or read a book. Do that often enough and you will desensitise the dog because he will realise that your putting on your coat and picking up your bag or doing whatever you do before you go upstairs really does not necessarily mean you are going to disappear. You can also try your usual routine and go out, only to return immediately. Repeat this a lot and it could break the anxiety cycle

When you do go upstairs or go out, try to change your routine and don't say anything to your dog - just walk out of the door without looking back. If your dog senses you are anxious about what they will do, he will show his concern by howling or with distructive behaviour. 

All this applies if your dog is left downstairs and cries when he is left alone. Your dog is trying to train you - don't let it win! If the worst thing happens and it whines and you need to go down stairs, throw your keys or something similar down the stairs before you appear; the sudden sound will shock it into a temporary silence at which point you can appear and reward it immediately for being quiet! You can use anything that will distract it and keep it quiet long enough for you to come downstairs. 

And, don't forget the crucial rule is always walk your dog until it is really tired every morning and again in the evening. If that means engaging a dog walker, then that is what you must do. A tired dog is a happy dog that goes to sleep - most of the time!

All the best with this,

Sue
.


----------



## leashedForLife

see the Overall DVM page on Dissociating Departure Cues - 
HHS: Veterinary Medicine Community Client Instructions -- Protocol for Teaching Your Dog to Uncouple Departures and Departure Cues

also *Relaxation Protocol - *
Douglas Island Veterinary Service - Training

those are all fine ideas, very safe DS/CC which is done over time. 
however... 


petcoach said:


> *bold and underline added - *
> 
> ...if your dog is left downstairs and *cries when he is left alone. Your dog is trying to train you - don't let it win!*


the dog is not 'trying to train U' - there is no nefarious plot; the dog reacts with anxiety or protests 
being alone because they have emotions - whining, crying or barking is manifestation of emotions.

there is no *competition - * the dog is not winning, U are not losing; 
the dog feels emotions and displays their feelings in ways available to dogs; 
they don't write Letters to the Editor -  they bark, yelp or cry. 


petcoach said:


> *bold added - *
> 
> If the worst thing happens and it whines and you need to go down stairs, *throw your keys or something similar
> down the stairs before you appear*; the sudden sound will shock it into a temporary silence at which point
> you can appear and reward it immediately for being quiet! You can use anything that will distract it and keep it quiet long enough for you to come downstairs.


the *startling* effect is not one that i suggest - 
for dogs who are already for one reason or another, anxious, this is IMO + IME not very helpful.

the Q is not, _'does it work?'_ - yes, the dog shuts-up. 
the Q is, _'what are the likely longer-term effects of further stressing a dog who is already anxious?' _ 
the A in my opinion, is that the dog becomes more anxious - *suppressing the symptomatic behavior - * 
the whining, barking, yelping, etc - *is never as good as addressing the emotional issue: * the anxiety.

cranking the screw tighter on the thumb-screw, IOW, is not a solution.  reducing the tension is the solution. 
CALMATIVES can help - see this link 
Pet Forums Community - View Single Post - dog body-language - and why it matters so much... 
for What to give, When, How, etc.

cheers, 
- terry


----------



## sue&harvey

Petcoach, the dog is not try to train you at all, it is a *panic response*.

Maybe you should re-read why aversaries DO NOT WORK!

*Please peps do NOT throw your keys and scare the poor little mite, you wouldn't slap a child for being afraid of the dark!*


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## newfiesmum

I do wish I had seen this forum two years ago! When we only had Ferdie he used to sit beside the front door when I was out, no matter who else was in the house, pacing and crying. He was ok during the day, as I suppose after the initial two weeks I always spend at home with a new puppy, he got used to me being out most of the day, though my son was always there. It was if I went out in the evening, which I rarely do. Then I would perhaps go to collect my son from somewhere and I would have phone calls from whoever was with him, saying that this dog is going frantic! I thought he was just overly attached to me; didn't realise that this is what it was. It all stopped when we got Joshua, though.

Ferdie still won't go for a walk with anyone else though. If he sees I am not coming, he sits down and refuses to move.


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## leashedForLife

newfiesmum said:


> Ferdie still won't go for a walk with anyone else though.
> If he sees I am not coming, he sits down and refuses to move.


i'd work on that ASAP - what if U went to hospital after a car-accident for a week or more? 
the poor dog cannot be utterly dependent on One Person to walk on a leash - we are none of us untouchable, 
life happens; he needs to broaden his horizons.  have the other person hold the leash, and U simply walk; 
walk a half-block with them, fade back, and walk home; make SURE they keep up a good pace, not lollygagging, 
they should MOVE briskly from pause to sniff to next pause-to-sniff.

happy B-Mod, 
- terry


----------



## madonna

my weim is the same , but it s every time we go out , sitting at door crying barking and dribbling , hes 6 months now and its got worse since we got him 3 months ago , despite coming and going to try to desensitise him , my neighbour has told me its constant , and gets to her enough to want to go out , although she says she understands we are aware of him. we are now at a loss as what to do ... does another dog help ..although really not ht e awnser as we dont have a big house .


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## sue&harvey

madonna said:


> my weim is the same , but it s every time we go out , sitting at door crying barking and dribbling , hes 6 months now and its got worse since we got him 3 months ago , despite coming and going to try to desensitise him , my neighbour has told me its constant , and gets to her enough to want to go out , although she says she understands we are aware of him. we are now at a loss as what to do ... does another dog help ..although really not ht e awnser as we dont have a big house .


Hi there, sorry yu have had no improvement. 
Sadly getting another dog may double your problems, as they could learn the same behaviour.

I think you should go and chat to your vet and get them to refer you to a good behaviourist. Any suggestions of bark/e-collars/dominance then run.... fast... the other way.
Some insurance policies do cover behaviourist costs.

All the best
Sue


----------



## <3 Oliver

As I was reading through all the symptoms of SA all I could picture was my dog Oliver. I'm definitely going to t try not doing the over exciting greeting when coming back home, now that I know what it's all about. He used to be really bad when I left, now all he does is curl up on the bed and go to sleep...he doesn't even notice i'm leaving.

I'm not sure if this would constitue as a symptom of SA but any help or a point in the right forum direction would be great. 

When we first got Oliver he was scared of everything, he would run to either my boyfriend or I for protection. Because I am in school and home more than my boyfriend that works all day Oliver and I bonded. He would growl at my boyfriend if he came to close to me, not want anything to do with my boyfriend, run away scared if he came to close. Things have gotten better, there is no more skittish activity or growling, which is good. But when I'm gone Oliver will go to the bedroom and sulk around and rarely come out. When my boyfriend tries to get him to go to the bathroom he hides under the bed. He will only play with or have anything to do with my boyfriend when I'm around. 

We got Oliver when he was 6 months old, someone had just dumped him on the street not wanting him anymore and then we adopted him. At first we thought that maybe it had something to do with his previous owners and a fear of males or something. How do I help him to realize my boyfriend is ok, he's not going to hurt him or do anything. I want Oliver to feel as comfortable around my boyfriend as he does me.


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## sue&harvey

<3 Oliver said:


> As I was reading through all the symptoms of SA all I could picture was my dog Oliver. I'm definitely going to t try not doing the over exciting greeting when coming back home, now that I know what it's all about. He used to be really bad when I left, now all he does is curl up on the bed and go to sleep...he doesn't even notice i'm leaving.
> 
> I'm not sure if this would constitue as a symptom of SA but any help or a point in the right forum direction would be great.
> 
> When we first got Oliver he was scared of everything, he would run to either my boyfriend or I for protection. Because I am in school and home more than my boyfriend that works all day Oliver and I bonded. He would growl at my boyfriend if he came to close to me, not want anything to do with my boyfriend, run away scared if he came to close. Things have gotten better, there is no more skittish activity or growling, which is good. But when I'm gone Oliver will go to the bedroom and sulk around and rarely come out. When my boyfriend tries to get him to go to the bathroom he hides under the bed. He will only play with or have anything to do with my boyfriend when I'm around.
> 
> We got Oliver when he was 6 months old, someone had just dumped him on the street not wanting him anymore and then we adopted him. At first we thought that maybe it had something to do with his previous owners and a fear of males or something. How do I help him to realize my boyfriend is ok, he's not going to hurt him or do anything. I want Oliver to feel as comfortable around my boyfriend as he does me.


He needs to learn to trust and know your bf is not going to harm him. I would find a treat he really really likes and only your bf feed it to him. When he is sat on the sofa, then get your bf to throw him treats, but not really engage with him. Slowly over time throw the treats closer to his feet. Generally just let him find out that he is not a scary beast but a play mate. Almost the same thing you would do with a shy child.

Hope this helps


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## leashedForLife

<3 Oliver said:


> ...I am in school and home more than my boyfriend that works all day Oliver and I bonded.
> He would growl at my boyfriend if he came to close to me, not want anything to do with my boyfriend,
> run away scared if he came to close. Things have gotten better, there is no more skittish activity or growling, which is good. But *when I'm gone Oliver will go to the bedroom and sulk around and rarely come out. When my boyfriend tries to get him to go to the bathroom he hides under the bed. *He will only play with or have anything to do with my boyfriend when I'm around.


when U leave the house, FIRST make sure the dog is not in the bedroom, then close the bedroom door - 
no more hiding under the bed + being dragged out, that only digs the habit deeper and makes the dog more-afraid.

if there is a crate, put the crate out in the living area as a safe retreat for the dog; if need be, leave a drag-line on the dog with NO loop - BF can use the drag to gently encourage the dog out of the crate [with his BACK to the dog, not staring at the dog's face or standing in front of the open door of the crate]. 
turning his back, patting his leg, making kissy noises... whatever works to get him out to potty.

having BF walk him when U are at home, will give the dog more happy-associations - 
as will having BF feed the dog. 
good luck, 
- terry


----------



## JayneW

This is SUCH a good thread and thank you to everyone who has posted tips and ideas. My 5 month old Springer, Oscar, is very attached to both of us. We wonder if its because his mother abandoned her entire litter of 10 pups and he was hand reared? Anyway, we have twice come home now to find the carpet scrapped up off the floor near the front door. Its not the carpet we are worried about but the fact that Oscar felt anxious enough to do this. We are following the tip about not making a fuss when re-entering the house and leaving. I am the last to leave in the morning so always give him a rawhide stick to chew on and just pat him on the head and then quietly leave. OH is a taxi driver so is always in and out - not sure if that helps or hinders. We are practising the leaving the house and coming back in again immediately to see if that will help. Has anyone tried the bach rescue remedy or any other such "remedy", and has it helped?

Thanks.


----------



## sue&harvey

JayneW said:


> This is SUCH a good thread and thank you to everyone who has posted tips and ideas. My 5 month old Springer, Oscar, is very attached to both of us. We wonder if its because his mother abandoned her entire litter of 10 pups and he was hand reared? Anyway, we have twice come home now to find the carpet scrapped up off the floor near the front door. Its not the carpet we are worried about but the fact that Oscar felt anxious enough to do this. We are following the tip about not making a fuss when re-entering the house and leaving. I am the last to leave in the morning so always give him a rawhide stick to chew on and just pat him on the head and then quietly leave. OH is a taxi driver so is always in and out - not sure if that helps or hinders. We are practising the leaving the house and coming back in again immediately to see if that will help. Has anyone tried the bach rescue remedy or any other such "remedy", and has it helped?
> 
> Thanks.


Glad it's helped... one word of warning about rawhide though is that it can cause blockages, and chocking risk. My lad does have rawhide chews but only when he is being supervised though.

Rescue Remedy seems to help a lot of dogs and is fairly cheap, so always worth a try  
All the best


----------



## Superspudking

Sounds like our almost 10 week old lottie is feeling the same. Only had her 5 days and can already tell. Follows us around and as soon as we stand still she lays on our feet. Step out the room for one minute and she crys. We have been crate training her (for the last 3 days) and we get up in the night to let her out for the toilet. She then won't go back to sleep unless I lay with her by her crate for 10mins. Also she won't play with her toys on her own. We can be playing together then as she is chewing on her bear I get to get a drink and she stops playing and trys sleeping on my feet. Going to try the tips on this thread and see what happens


----------



## nfp20

madonna said:


> my weim is the same , but it s every time we go out , sitting at door crying barking and dribbling , hes 6 months now and its got worse since we got him 3 months ago , despite coming and going to try to desensitise him , my neighbour has told me its constant , and gets to her enough to want to go out , although she says she understands we are aware of him. we are now at a loss as what to do ... does another dog help ..although really not ht e awnser as we dont have a big house .


Definitely don't get another dog that will not help your particular situation.


----------



## Racheldee

Lots of really useful information, thank you. I'm working so hard with my rescue staffie as It would break my heart to have to return her, but my neighbours are complaining about barking and she destroys the house when left in my dining room. I've had to leave her in a crate today for her own safety, but she needs time to adjust and we just dont have it :-( today she bent part of the crate and somehow removed the tray... I have 3 days before I have to leave her again so i'm doing everything I can. I cant afford to get in a professional at the moment, times are hard...


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## leashedForLife

Racheldee said:


> I've had to leave her in a crate today for her own safety, but she needs time to adjust and we just dont have it :-( today she bent part of the crate and somehow removed the tray... I have 3 days before I have to leave her again so i'm doing everything I can.


straighten the bent-bar on the crate and return it, if possible; 
if not sell it to someone else or TRADE it for an *airline approved Shipping Crate*.

show-crates are pretty useless, IMO - as see this video: 
YouTube - Anubis shows his skills

they don't offer a solid ROOF [security, safety, enclosed, den-like] 
a solid FLOOR [leaks, tray shifts or is chewed or cracks or is kicked out or...], 
any refuge for shy or anxious dogs from the sight of strangers, the social *pressure* of glances + stares, etc.

get a KONG-toy - 
put half the dog's brekkie in it, freeze it overnight; give it to the dog to hang-out peaceably in the crate for an hour or two, as busywork.

use CALMATIVES to help the dog relax, 
Pet Forums Community - View Single Post - dog body-language - and why it matters so much...
and at night - to help the dog fall asleep.

*pump-spray botanical-lavender *
[i recommend Alteya - organic, Bulgaria, farmers-co-op] can be a terrific conditioned RELAX... cue for home-alone time; use it EVERY night before bed, 20-to 30-mins before U take the dog out for that last potty-trip, then come in + sack-out;

*at night* - 
i'd give DAP, Rescue-Remedy *and* lavender before bed;
i'd have the dog's crate in the bedroom, dog in it, with door latched; 
no food, no bedding, a safe rubber or nylon chew-toy for stress-chewing.

this may not be actual Sep-Anx, but just the sudden changes: 
new home after shelter/rescue, too much change, too short time. STRESS... 
hang in there, and happy training, 
- terry


----------



## Racheldee

Thank you so much for your advice. I was given the crate so i'll try and swap it. I dont think It will fit in my bedroom though, its enormous. Already introducing the kong. Will get some calmatives today. She does accept the crate as her day bed-she has her blankets, small water bowl, few small toys and I covered it with a blanket. She gets the best treats in the crate, kong etc. But prior to these neighbour complaints she slept in my room and had the run of the house all day. I have to keep her in my back room now as its more soundproofed until I can work on her barking. Then she became very destructive, hence the crate when i'm out. I read the advice on here and moved her bed to outside my door. Now its in the crate but she still wants to sleep outside my door. I dont think the crate will fit outside the door either... She's ok if I close the crate door for short periods, and I reckon in 6 months she'll be fine. Please can you clarify about what should and should not be in the crate, and should I make her sleep in it at night? I did try but she barked. Am I using it in the wrong way? I thought it should be her happy place and she will eventually accept that sometimes the door is closed, but that means its yummy treat time? Maybe i'm doing it wrong :-( I dont know if its SA, its too early to tell but she sure is velcro dog and she has the symptoms, which is what I need to manage urgently. Thank you :-D


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## madonna

i know excactly how you feel , ive had my weim pup for 4 months now and hes so lovely , but i too have had a letter from the council as a complaint was made about his barking, he just cant be left, hes not destructive just panicks and barks non stop,it would break my heart to have to give him up because of this , ive tried going and coming ignoring him etc , i cant offer advice as so far nothing has worked but try and go on as many forums as you can , send emails off etc, we too cant afford long term help its so frustrating . best wishes and i hope you get there . donna


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## sue&harvey

Racheldee said:


> Thank you so much for your advice. I was given the crate so i'll try and swap it. I dont think It will fit in my bedroom though, its enormous. Already introducing the kong. Will get some calmatives today. She does accept the crate as her day bed-she has her blankets, small water bowl, few small toys and I covered it with a blanket. She gets the best treats in the crate, kong etc. But prior to these neighbour complaints she slept in my room and had the run of the house all day. I have to keep her in my back room now as its more soundproofed until I can work on her barking. Then she became very destructive, hence the crate when i'm out. I read the advice on here and moved her bed to outside my door. Now its in the crate but she still wants to sleep outside my door. I dont think the crate will fit outside the door either... She's ok if I close the crate door for short periods, and I reckon in 6 months she'll be fine. Please can you clarify about what should and should not be in the crate, and should I make her sleep in it at night? I did try but she barked. Am I using it in the wrong way? I thought it should be her happy place and she will eventually accept that sometimes the door is closed, but that means its yummy treat time? Maybe i'm doing it wrong :-( I dont know if its SA, its too early to tell but she sure is velcro dog and she has the symptoms, which is what I need to manage urgently. Thank you :-D


As for the crate, I would pick a place that is accessable all the time. Start with putting her in at night. Lead her in with a few treats, shut the door... and leave. It's awful when they bark and cry, trust me I know, but you have to be strong, and ignore her. Yep the first night may be 1 hour, and you are thinking how mean and nasty you are. But if you are consistant the next night it could be 40 mins... as much as you will hate me for saying this... that is progress. The next night, and the night after you will see a decrease in the baking and whinging. I don't leave anything in Harveys crate at night, just his blanket. It's bed time so I don't want him playing.

Work on the crate in the day by throwing treats in her crate, and praise whn she goes in, also try doing some training, ie sit, down, stands while she is in there, reinforce it's a good place. Take it slow, be consistant and you will get there.

Just to add for Madonna, check your insurance policy if you have insurance, some cover behaviourist costs. Failing that it may cost £60 or so for a consultation but they can help you build a plan for your dogs needs 

Good luck to you both, when you eventually get through the other side it's a great feeling, so keep at it.

Rants are welcome here if you need it too


----------



## Racheldee

Thank you! Ok I think i'm getting the hang of this... Although I only need and want her to be in the crate while i'm at work, I have to make being in it with the door closed a normal daily thing, both when i'm home and when i'm out, in order that she'll accept it and be relaxed while i'm at work. I think. Sorry I dont mean to seem silly, but i'm not used to treating my dog in this way, and its not like training a puppy at all. Always had dogs but never had these barking issues or had to resort to leaving doggie in a crate. The thing is, will I ever be able to go back to leaving her free in the house or will she always have to be crated? How can I work on the initial problem, the barking, if she's always left in the crate? Hmmm


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## Racheldee

madonna said:


> i know excactly how you feel , ive had my weim pup for 4 months now and hes so lovely , but i too have had a letter from the council as a complaint was made about his barking, he just cant be left, hes not destructive just panicks and barks non stop,it would break my heart to have to give him up because of this , ive tried going and coming ignoring him etc , i cant offer advice as so far nothing has worked but try and go on as many forums as you can , send emails off etc, we too cant afford long term help its so frustrating . best wishes and i hope you get there . donna


Thank you, I hope you get it sorted out too, I know how stressful this is to manage. As much as I love my dog I'll be kicked out by my landlord so i'll have to return her if I cant make it work.
Can you leave him in a more soundproofed room? Or somehow make a room more soundproofed? I'd be very friendly with all your neighbours and tell them all you are doing everything you can but that you may have to re-home because of the complaint, let them meet him and get some sympathy and support. Good luck!


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## leashedForLife

calmatives, 
calmatives, 
calmatives - and FREEZE the stuffed-Kong with half of brekkie in it the night before.


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## leashedForLife

Racheldee said:


> ...I think i'm getting the hang of this...
> Although I only need and want her to be in the crate while i'm at work, I have to make being in it with the door
> closed a normal daily thing, both when i'm home and when i'm out, in order that she'll accept it and be relaxed
> while i'm at work. I think.


yup! :thumbup: give her a rubber or nylon chew-toy, a stuffed-Kong, 
or a compressed-DOMESTIC rawhide [chips mashed together in a mold, under heat + pressure, 
made in USA or Europe - not China, Brazil,, Argentina, etc - they use ARSENIC on hides].


Racheldee said:


> ...will I ever be able to go back to leaving her free in the house
> or will she always have to be crated? How can I work on the initial problem, the barking,
> if she's always left in the crate? Hmmm


ignore the barking - once she relaxes in the crate, the barking will stop. 
calmatives, busy-work, etc. 
usually - in weeks or months - most dogs are out in the house, altho possibly only one room, at first.

see OVERALL DVM for *"what is behavior modification"* - Google the phrase. 
there is a relaxation protocol, how to dissociate departure cues, etc, etc, etc...


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## Racheldee

Its getting better! I'm so grateful for all the advice, thank you. I've seen progress already... The advice works! :-D


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## sue&harvey

Racheldee said:


> Its getting better! I'm so grateful for all the advice, thank you. I've seen progress already... The advice works! :-D


:thumbup: Stick with it, and be consistant


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## madonna

my dog is now out of our room and sleeping at night on his own which is good, but still barking when i go out , so not seperation anxiety.... so why does he still bark,really trying to ignore him as been told, and shouting quiet if he barks , when i leave the house , he was quiet one day but has slipped back to barking non stop,ive been trying for 4 months now , really dont know what next to do as already had letter of complaint .where am i going wrong? glad to hear others are getting their .


----------



## sue&harvey

madonna said:


> my dog is now out of our room and sleeping at night on his own which is good, but still barking when i go out , so not seperation anxiety.... so why does he still bark,really trying to ignore him as been told, and shouting quiet if he barks , when i leave the house , he was quiet one day but has slipped back to barking non stop,ive been trying for 4 months now , really dont know what next to do as already had letter of complaint .where am i going wrong? glad to hear others are getting their .


Firstly shouting when he barks really wont help much. one you are rewarding the barking, and two it sounds to him like you are replying. 
If I was you I would seek the advice of a behaviourist. Even if it is just one session they can assess and evaluate, then give you an action plan.


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## madonna

hi,.i have been so upset as i dont want to scare him, just for him to be able to cope and be happy. i dont want to loose him but really dont know the next step. he went away for a few days with the trainer and was v calm on return was quiet the next day , but has gone back to barking, hes getting better indoors as im closing doors on him and not allowing him to follow me, i dont know what else to r=try


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## sue&harvey

madonna said:


> hi this is advice from a behaviourist ,a well known one ..i have been so upset as i dont want to scare him just for him to be able to cope and be happy. i dont want to loose him but really dont know the next step. he went away for a few days with the trainer and was v calm on return was quiet the next day , but has gone back to barking, hes getting better indoors as im closing doors on him and not allowing him to follow me, i dont know what else to r=try


Please remember I have been there too, and know what you are going through...so firstly a empathetic hug from me.

However most good behaviourists would not take the dog away from their home environment and also would want you there at all times, so you learn how to manage.

How did you find this behaviourist? Are they members of APBC or COAPE? 
I am left wondering about their methods.

The not letting him have access to you at all times, is ok. It's the manner in which you do it. You need him to be happy being away from you. To stop him from Barking alone is not enough. He could turn his panic into destructiveness. 
Where as, if you call him to a room, give him a nice chew of something then block his access, the whole thing is much more pleasent. If that makes sense. You may need to use a baby gate at the begining so he can see you, but not get too you then progress to doors.


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## sue&harvey

Put a lock at the top of the door where the dog cannot get to it. Not just for the dogs safety but your homes too! 

Any info in the post I put before?


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## madonna

hi i have a stairgate , hes getting better when i shut it on him, quiet for longer, he can sleepon his own at night , but when i go out he dribbles barks howls and scratches the door ,our other door is glass so he can see through into front room so hes not totally blocked off from me. ive tried for 4 months and dont know what to do we cannot afford a trainer .thankyou for taking time to reply .


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## leashedForLife

madonna said:


> ...when i go out he dribbles barks howls and scratches the door,
> our other door is glass so he can see... into front room... hes not totally blocked off from me.
> ive tried for 4 months and dont know what to do we cannot afford a trainer.


did U try CALMATIVES? see link above.

did U read the OVERALL-dvm wbsite advice? 
see link above.

did U read FEARFULDOGS.com - especially *triggers + thresholds*? 
see link above.

did U provide *busywork*? a stuff-frozen Kong with half of brekkie in it, 
chopped/compressed rawhide [from USA or Europe/UK] chews, 
food-puzzles, kibble in a Buster-Cube, etc, etc?

did U give *set-back from the door and from sound-stimulus*? 
no view of the front-door or yard, no view of a sidewalk, only a quiet 
garden without intrusive trespassing cats, no neighbors in the alley, 
etc? 
did U leave a quiet light-classical station playing on the radio, 
or if U get cable-Tv an all-music station? 
or a sleep-sounds generator, *which costs as little as $10* to play soft rain, 
ocean waves, babbling brook, etc?


----------



## Racheldee

I'm working on this like mad too but you have to follow the advice fully and stick to it. One thing that's been very helpful is the extra exercise-i'm up at 6am walking with her and I tire her out as much as possible so she sleeps when i'm out. What about the soundproof room? Thats a temporary solution to the complaint problem no? In my house its just my dining room but its at the back of the house and further away from my neighbours bedroom. I've not done anything to the room. Good luck, dont give up


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## just_an_illusion

Amy&Ted said:


> This is a FANTASTIC thread! Ted is displaying signs of SA... he has the classic signs of being a "velcro dog" He follows me everywhere and whines if i even dare to so much as go to the toilet.
> 
> I'm going to take my time and digest all you have written here and hopefully find a way to ease my little guy into a happy place when i'm out.
> 
> Thanks so much for taking the time to write this!
> :thumbup:


You think thats bad? Mine FOLLOWS me to the toilet and sometimes even has to come in with me. Dont get me started on fitting a lab in a public toilet cubical.


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## ghengis

i am glad i have found this thread was a brillany read i think i am going to try this out too as ghengis is not settling for his own company when needed even though i have tried my damndest to train him to be ok with his own company

fingers crossed i can knock it on the head


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## midget

sue&harvey said:


> Glad you found it helpful
> 
> Thanks Tashi
> 
> I have probably missed loads out, so please feel free to add


Hello my name is Claire

I have a 3 year old recue Beagle we were his third home in a year, we have had to do a lot of training with him because no one had spent any time with him.

We are having a real problem when we leave him, he will bark none stop until we come home, he will wee and pooh all over the place, we have tried a bark collar that sprays him, we have tried standing outside and when he barks come in and spray him with water, we have tried a sent thing from the vet but that make him aggressive, so the last thing we tried and are still doing it crate training him, other that this we dont no what else to do.

If anyone has any ideas then please let me know I am willing to try anything we dont want to get rid of him but I am scared that our neighbors will call the policy because of his barking.

Thank you
Claire

:


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## newfiesmum

Have you read all the posts on this thread? If not, then please take your time and read them all. Put yourself in this dog's place for a moment. He has had three different homes, he is very insecure, never knowing whether this home is going to disappear as well. He barks whenever you leave him because he is scared, terrified in fact that you will not come back. So what do you do? You get him a collar that does unpleasant things when he barks (barking is natural and he knows no other way to express himself). You come in and spray him with water - all this aversive treatment is making him even more scared and making the problem worse.

Read every bit of advice on here, please. The dog needs to be sure that you are not leaving him forever, so when you are home, practice leaving him for a few minutes to begin with, then gradually increase the time.

Other posters have greater advice than mine, as I have never had to deal with this problem, but please, please stop spraying him and punishing him for things he cannot help.


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## sue&harvey

Hi Claire as Newfies mum said, please read through especially about why dogs affected by SA behave the way they do. It is a panic response. Your poor dog has had 3 homes in one year. I think the poor mite has every reason to feel insecure. My advice... bin and scrap all the tecniques and devices you have tried so far, take a deep breath, make a coffee, give Beagle boy a big hug then read through from the begining.

Do you have pet insurance? Some of them cover behaviourist fees. If so I would get a vet to refer you to an APBC here The APBC | Association of Pet Behaviour Counsellors Or CAPBT coape trainer CAPBT - COAPE Association of Pet Behaviourists and Trainers Please Please do not employ anyone who speaks of dominance, shock collars, sprays or any other nasty.

The thing that really worked for us, and Harvey, was consistancy, kindness, and most of all understanding. It does work. Some it works with quickly, others take longer. If you are worried about the neighbours go and explain the situation to them. Hopefully they will display empathy and understanding, of the poor mite.

Good luck


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## madonna

i have been trying for 5 months now, and i have explained to my neighbours over and over , and still got aletter from the council .i tried bark collars which i wish i hadent , it was on someone elses advice, ive tried ignoring him , coming and going , making him sleep seperatly ,i give him toys treats , and chews but he doesnt touch them ,ive left radios on , tv etc , giving extra runs , but i think with this it depends oon the dog, no seperation anxiety can be cured ,i think if it works then your lucky , sorry if it sounds down heartning ,i not advising anyone just my personal experience , we were told to shout quiet at him and grab his collar ,but i know this was wrong but it was advice rom a trainer.. i am at hte stage wher im hoping he will just realise one day we do come home ,but really know this wont happen im glad some people have had succses just wished we had ,what saddens me is what happens to all the dogs this doesnt work for as its impossible to go out and live a normal life ..if my dog can sleep on his own ,why cant he be left ? i truly wish everyone who has this problem luck , but it is hard and it may work .but it also may not . good luck .best wishes .


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## sue&harvey

Madonna, sorry you are still having problems, and even more sorry, you have found a trainer that tells you to shout quiet and scruff the poor dog who is panicing.  

Have you tried a behaviourist under the two organisations mentioned above. I know money is tight for all at the moment, but if you could stretch for even one session, they would be able to support you and assess him. 

All the best


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## newfiesmum

sue&harvey said:


> Madonna, sorry you are still having problems, and even more sorry, you have found a trainer that tells you to shout quiet and scruff the poor dog who is panicing.
> 
> Have you tried a behaviourist under the two organisations mentioned above. I know money is tight for all at the moment, but if you could stretch for even one session, they would be able to support you and assess him.
> 
> All the best


I second that!! Please, please try one of the organisations before giving up. It must be heartbreaking for you, I can only imagine how you feel. Please find out how much it will cost and give it a try. These are qualified positive reward based behaviourists and will not tell you grab his collar, shout at him, or any other barbaric practices.

Shame you have such lousy neighbours. I think the ones where I used to live would have been like this, but here I have lovely neighbours who all have dogs and I doubt it would be a problem.


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## madonna

hi thankyou both,i have been given a name of a lady called jo winpenny , she has said with sep anxiety it caannot be gauranteed that she can help or change him , but as its not directed at just 1 person leaving mbe he can be helped , she does a visit then is always at the end of the phone or email , but has said we will have to totally ignore him no contact apart from basic care ,and in the 6 weeks or so we do it he cant be left ,which will be hard as im on my own in the day and have to take my son to nusery and dogs arent alloweded in the grounds , i live in harlow and have ben here a year ,i wished i hadent moved as i had lovely neighbours . ive been told casteration wont help as its not dominance etc. ..ive heard you can get fined 5000, for the noise, but as it is its once a t he wekend when we go shopping and for 10 mins when i do school run , makes me mad that someone would do this ,i do admit he has a loud bark and it is constant , but not all dfay and never at night ... oh to win the lottery and move away .thanks again for your advice .


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## newfiesmum

She isn't a Jan Fennell "dog listener", is she? I only ask because their philosophy is to ignore the dog. If she is, forget it. I hope I am wrong; have you looked at the two directories given? I don't want to put a dampener on things, but you really do need to be so careful or you could make matters worse.


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## madonna

oh i dont know , everyone ive spoke to says to ignore him , make him realise he can be on his own , we had him in our room in his bed but was told put him out so he sleepson the landing, but has started weeing in the night , and he never did when he wqas in our room , it is so hard ,you think your getting good advice ,im so confused as what to do .


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## newfiesmum

I tried googling the name but couldn't find anything. Don't take advice from just anybody; everyone you meet thinks they know everything about dogs, especially if it is a new addition. If he was happy in your bedroom and you were happy having him there, then why move him? 

Fennell Listeners charge in the region of £175 to come and talk to you for two hours, then lifetime email and telephone support. Their main philosophy seems to be to ignore the dog. Don't waste your money on someone like this, they are not qualified behaviourists. Have a look on the directories given, or try the ADTB website. They have a list of people who have done their course and know a thing or two.

The APBC is the first place to look, so see what they have.


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## newfiesmum

Forgot to say, have you tried any calmatives, like DAP or lavender spray? They might just calm him down enough if you are not out for very long. I can't believe your neighbours complaining like that when you are only gone for a little while. I hate people!


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## madonna

hi ,i was told to keep him away from us and make him more independant , he cried at first but happily sleeps their now , but hes ruining the floor from weeing so will probly take him back in , i really dont know which way to go now ,but will look up the sites thats on here ,although hes 8 months now and hes been like this since we got him at 11 weeks , what worries me is that their is no cure and everyone says you may still have a dog that cant be left ,maybe an hour if were lucky ..seems so many diffrent approaches and it will confuse him trying diffrent things ive always had dogs ,had the normal problems but never this . will read through all my info again but it gets confusing .


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## leashedForLife

madonna said:


> ...hes 8-MO now and he's been like this since we got him at 11 weeks...


sep-anx does * not * start at 11-WO; being mildly disturbed over being alone for short times is normal, 
for any pup - whining, barking, scratch or jump at doors, etc.

*true sep-anx includes panic, non-stop vocal distress, serious + exended attempts to escape, 
assaults on doors, windows, sills, the lino at entrances, self-injury from chewing at crate-wire... 
we are speaking of MILD = sep-distress Vs SEVERE = sep-anx.* 
sep-anx normally is not full-blown until 12 to 18-MO, altho it can be seeded by 9-MO.


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## madonna

hi we have filmed him , and this is what he does , he has scratched our front door down to thwe wood,he barks and howls non stop, i come home to dribble on the floor by the door ,he has actually let him self out ,my briother luckily was in and got him in , we now have a double lock on the door, he just consy=tantly runs back n forth to door jumps at the window and is genrally stressed, same if we close the stairgate on him indoors, if someone goes out but im still in he cries a bit but will settle ,he has recently started to wee when left, and he is so hyper when i get in ,he has a very loud bark and its non stop ,i can hear him at the end of my road ,so yes it is seperation anxiety ,he just goes into panick mode and does not stop till we come home , he always has a whit nose from rubbing the door and walls with his nose ,ive sat and wa=tched the tape when i come home nd their is no break in his barking .


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## leashedForLife

helpful link on B-Mod 
What is Behavior Modification? | k9aggression.com 
SEE "relaxation protocol" and "dissociating departure cues"

buy [or borrow a library-copy] of *I'll Be Home Soon...* 
I'll Be Home Soon-Dog Behavior Problem Solving Booklets at Patricia McConnell

but SOMEhow U have to avoid leaving him alone, WHILE U are working on B-mod - hire a pet-sitter, 
park him with the vet in a kennel for a few hours, dog-daycare? Something. 
*he cannot practice it while U are attempting to alter the panic.* that is the nub.


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## madonna

hi thankyou ,have found the book on ebay .


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## leashedForLife

American Veterinary Society of Animal Behavior - AVSAB - 2010 AVSAB Facebook/Twitter/YouTube Abstracts 
scroll DOWN to November - click the link.

this is a 7-page PDF-file from a peer-reviewed journal - 
it includes info on scrip-drugs as well as the needed B-Mod which is mandatory, medication is not a silver-bullet + does not work alone.

there is a key [short] segment that explains the success of treatment with DAP + B-Mod, and it also stresses that compliance and persistence is important in a good outcome; it lists *4-weeks of DAP in diffuser form as a minimum, with a month of B-Mod simultaneously, to show improvement* - IOW the dog's behavior is improved, but it is not RESOLVED as in "cured" - it is *better*.


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## madonna

hi thankyou , i clicked the link but it doesnt go to it, i spoke to my vets the other day about dap and tablets but she said tabs are only short term , they wont allow it to be consatnt , so will be trying the dap plug in and spray to put on a handkerchief round his collar, i need somthing to work as i cvame home a fter 40 mins the other day and he,d made his nails bleed from scratching ,hes so lovely and calm in every other way , i need a miracle i think . thanks to all x


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## Ginger Ninja

Hi All. Fairly new to the forum and been reading your advice since we got Molly just over two months ago.

Molly is a beagle and is 17 weeks old and we can see signs of SA developing, although not to the extremes that other forum members have posted with.

We're currently crate-training her, and she sleeps well in her crate, although will only ever go to it when either we put her there or she is absolutely shattered! Most other times, she prefers to kip on the couch (we don't mind this when we're around). We have a dog-walker who comes in twice a day as we're out between 8 and 5 who does an awesome job with Molly and gives us loads of feedback.

However, she really starts to get whiney and barks when we put her in the crate when we're in the house, and she tries to follow me out when leaving for work (I know this is probably quite normal) but what we find hardest is that she hates to be in a different room from us when we're in the house. We have a gate on our stairs and when we're both upstairs she gets really anxious. She bites at the gate, squeals, barks and tries to jump the gate. We try not to spend too much time upstairs (usually only when we get home from work and get changed) and when one of us is up there we keep popping our head around the door so she knows we're still there but that only keeps her quiet for a few seconds.

Does anyone have any further suggestions in addition to what has been posted that would help us in this specific situation?

Many thanks in advance.

Dene


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## JackRusselOwner

really great thread, a few hours ago i had no idea about SA, but now i feel much wiser!

I believe my 20 month old jack russel has a certain degree of SA as i very early in her life left on a businesstrip for almost 2 weeks. She never whines or barks when me, my girlfriend or her son leaves the house, so i never really thought she would have it at all. But she does follow us around the flat whenever we are here and when I come home(or wake up), she is acting overjoyed every single time. 

I never knew about crate-training either, but she adapted to her special place the first day we got her. 

The problem is that she clearly does get anxious, because she sometimes pisses or poops at home (especially when i go away for a few days on business).

I am going to try to adapt some of the ideas ive read in this thread, especially the hutch66 thread.

sue&harvey, would have you any additional advice for me? I have not read about this specific problem with SA when the dog doesnt bark or whine, but clearly does have it.


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## sue&harvey

JackRusselOwner said:


> really great thread, a few hours ago i had no idea about SA, but now i feel much wiser!
> 
> I believe my 20 month old jack russel has a certain degree of SA as i very early in her life left on a businesstrip for almost 2 weeks. She never whines or barks when me, my girlfriend or her son leaves the house, so i never really thought she would have it at all. But she does follow us around the flat whenever we are here and when I come home(or wake up), she is acting overjoyed every single time.
> 
> I never knew about crate-training either, but she adapted to her special place the first day we got her.
> 
> The problem is that she clearly does get anxious, because she sometimes pisses or poops at home (especially when i go away for a few days on business).
> 
> I am going to try to adapt some of the ideas ive read in this thread, especially the hutch66 thread.
> 
> sue&harvey, would have you any additional advice for me? I have not read about this specific problem with SA when the dog doesnt bark or whine, but clearly does have it.


Dogs can display reactions to SA in different ways. Some will be destructive, some will howl and others will urinate or defecate. When you say she does it when you go away, does her routine change or get left for a little longer?

If you can say no to both then I would find her trigger. Is it a certain bag, that she may associate with your absence? If you think it could be this, begin to randomly get the bag out, put it in the hall, or wherever you would leave it for 5 mins, ignore her completely, then put it away again.

Also begin to prevent her access to you when you are at home, for some of the time. Start for short periods, then build it up. Baby gates are cheap, and means she can see you, but not access you.

Buy a kong, fill with tasty's and only give when you go out, so she has something good to do.

Hope this helps


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## JackRusselOwner

The answer is defenitely no to both questions and i know that the dog gets anxious as soon as i take my suitcase out....

I will try your advice, thanks very much!! :thumbup:


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## chris123

Hello 
My dog goes nuts when we come in
My technique has been to ignore him until he clams down
Is this correct?


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## leashedForLife

chris123 said:


> My dog goes nuts when we come [home].
> [we] ignore him until he [calms] down.


yes, that's fine - but *everybody* has to do it, for this to help. 
giving the dog setback from the door - a baby-gate, a closed door, a crate - helps the dog 
to develop some self-control and be less frustrated, in the meanwhile.


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## Nina2010

Hi All,
I am new to this site and was searching for help on this very subject. We have 2 dogs now (got the newie last Thursday) our resident dog is fab, never have any trouble with him, the new girl is an ex breeder and was not well looked after at all, it appears that she has all the traits of the "velcro" dog, follows me absolutely everywhere and barks when left though not all the tme, she seems to sleep for most of the night and starts about 5am, we've got up to her and let them both out as we feel she may need the loo, only to go back to bed and her start barking again.
My husband works nights so sleeps during the day, there are other people about but not always in the same room as her, I got a call from hubby this morning as i'd popped out to get some rawhide bones! saying she barked non stop until he came down and let her in the living room with him. I couldn't even go to the loo this morning before I went out without her barking.
Unfortunately I feel the fosterer where she was firstly didn't tell us about this, but when I rang her this morning she told me yes she did have a problem and her answer to it was to let her sleep in the bedroom with us! a definate no i'm afraid!

My question is, should her being an abused ex breeder make any difference on how we start dealing with this?

I have a crate that we used for Jake so will get that out again, i'm thinking that maybe if she was used to a kennel she may well like the crate, I have the biggest rawhide bone I could find:eek6: this seems to stop her barking if she has one, and will try leaving the radio on.

Is there anything else you think we should be doing?

Thanks in advance


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## sue&harvey

Nina2010 said:


> Hi All,
> I am new to this site and was searching for help on this very subject. We have 2 dogs now (got the newie last Thursday) our resident dog is fab, never have any trouble with him, the new girl is an ex breeder and was not well looked after at all, it appears that she has all the traits of the "velcro" dog, follows me absolutely everywhere and barks when left though not all the tme, she seems to sleep for most of the night and starts about 5am, we've got up to her and let them both out as we feel she may need the loo, only to go back to bed and her start barking again.
> My husband works nights so sleeps during the day, there are other people about but not always in the same room as her, I got a call from hubby this morning as i'd popped out to get some rawhide bones! saying she barked non stop until he came down and let her in the living room with him. I couldn't even go to the loo this morning before I went out without her barking.
> Unfortunately I feel the fosterer where she was firstly didn't tell us about this, but when I rang her this morning she told me yes she did have a problem and her answer to it was to let her sleep in the bedroom with us! a definate no i'm afraid!
> 
> My question is, should her being an abused ex breeder make any difference on how we start dealing with this?
> 
> I have a crate that we used for Jake so will get that out again, i'm thinking that maybe if she was used to a kennel she may well like the crate, I have the biggest rawhide bone I could find:eek6: this seems to stop her barking if she has one, and will try leaving the radio on.
> 
> Is there anything else you think we should be doing?
> 
> Thanks in advance


Poor girl, sounds like she need some stability in her life. Her past shouldn't make a difference on how you treat this, but it may take a little more patience. I would say be careful about leaving her with rawhide. If she swallows large pieces it can swell and cause major problems. Mabey buy a kong and see how she goes with that.


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## Nina2010

sue&harvey said:


> Poor girl, sounds like she need some stability in her life. Her past shouldn't make a difference on how you treat this, but it may take a little more patience. I would say be careful about leaving her with rawhide. If she swallows large pieces it can swell and cause major problems. Mabey buy a kong and see how she goes with that.


Thanks for the reply, will definately invest in a kong, until then the rawhide will have to do, but when I say "huge" I mean huge it's definately going to take her a long while to get anywhere near swallowing any

I will update when we've tried some of these tips

A question, what do you do if your dog has been peacefully sleeping out in the kitchen whilst you've been in another room and it starts barking? would you go to it? would you tell it NO, obviously in the middle of the night i'd have to go to her or the neighbours will start to complain, but this happened half an hour ago. We had her shut in the kitchen before dinner very successfully, after dinner we came back to the living room, leaving both dogs asleep in the kitchen which again was going well, but she just suddenly started barking and I wasn't sure what to do then!!


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## leashedForLife

Nina2010 said:


> ...what do you do if your dog has been peacefully sleeping out in the kitchen whilst you've been in another room
> and [s/he] starts barking? would you go to [the dog]? would you tell [her/him] NO?...
> obviously in the middle of the night i'd have to go to her or the neighbours will start to complain, but this happened
> half an hour ago. We... shut [her] in the kitchen before dinner very successfully, after dinner we went
> into the living room, leaving both dogs asleep in the kitchen... but she just suddenly started barking and I wasn't sure what to do then!!


since neither we nor U know *why* she is barking, the only answer is to go find out.

U are assuming that *of course*, she is barking for the sheer H*** of it, and demanding attention. 
that's a pretty big assumption, given that dogs can hear thunder many miles from the lightning 
which made the sound; they can also hear bats' sonar, ultrasonic whistles, the infrasound of diesels. 
they can hear a normal human-conversation from over 75-feet away. [can U? 
at that distance, i'd be hard pressed to see lips move! :lol: ] 
*that we cannot hear anything does not mean that nothing is to be heard.*


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## Nina2010

A quick update on Tess, yesterday morning I was woken by her barking at 5am, she was busting for a wee so let both dogs out, but she then kept woofing until 6.10 when I finally got up. She barked on and off all day. However since reading all the great advice on here we've started trying many of the tips, yesterday evening I didn't let them in the living room for the whole of the time, every now and again I put them back in the dining room and shut the door and all was well. Last night I put them to bed, left the radio on and also left the dining room door open which accesses the stairs. She woke me at 4.30am again busting for a week, but I went downstairs and did not talk to either dogs, I opened the door let them out and in and walked straight back out again, she went back to sleep and I woke her at 6.10:thumbup: she has been as good as gold all day today, and seems a lot more settled in herself. I've also ordered a DAP so fingers crossed that will help her too.
Oh yes and we've also all started to ignore the "hyper" tail wagging etc and only talking to her when she's calm and that has worked a treat already!! 
such a clever girlie very early days I know but am very pleased so far


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## sonia123

hi all im new to this site and ive found the advice about seperation anxiety very useful.i have a 4 year old boxer cross husky who,s been left in a crate when im out since he was 4 weeks old and been great but ive recently moved house and now he,s showing sighs of seperation anxiety.ive recently had to buy him a new heavy duty crate because he broke out of his other one.i left him last night and when i came back he had some how managed to get my curtain from inside his crate and pulled py curtain rail down and now he has very sore feet of rubbing his claws up the bars so one of his feet is bandaged up


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## madonna

:hi again , im pleased to read that some people have m,ade progress , but for me and my boy its sad to say we have not.
i think it all depends on the dog , with us he was brought as a pup and this is his only home , so its not down to a bad start just part of being a weim i suppose, i really do love him hence me trying all this time , but i still come home to a soaked floor my front door is scratched down to the frame i find blood where i suppose hes scratching so hard with his nails , really dont knopw what more i can do ,its not somthing that in time he will accept im coming back to him .its really hard as hes such a handsome loving dog .


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## sue&harvey

madonna said:


> :hi again , im pleased to read that some people have m,ade progress , but for me and my boy its sad to say we have not.
> i think it all depends on the dog , with us he was brought as a pup and this is his only home , so its not down to a bad start just part of being a weim i suppose, i really do love him hence me trying all this time , but i still come home to a soaked floor my front door is scratched down to the frame i find blood where i suppose hes scratching so hard with his nails , really dont knopw what more i can do ,its not somthing that in time he will accept im coming back to him .its really hard as hes such a handsome loving dog .


Hi again sorry to hear he is still bad. Did you try crate training? I can't recall.


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## sue&harvey

Nina2010 said:


> A quick update on Tess, yesterday morning I was woken by her barking at 5am, she was busting for a wee so let both dogs out, but she then kept woofing until 6.10 when I finally got up. She barked on and off all day. However since reading all the great advice on here we've started trying many of the tips, yesterday evening I didn't let them in the living room for the whole of the time, every now and again I put them back in the dining room and shut the door and all was well. Last night I put them to bed, left the radio on and also left the dining room door open which accesses the stairs. She woke me at 4.30am again busting for a week, but I went downstairs and did not talk to either dogs, I opened the door let them out and in and walked straight back out again, she went back to sleep and I woke her at 6.10:thumbup: she has been as good as gold all day today, and seems a lot more settled in herself. I've also ordered a DAP so fingers crossed that will help her too.
> Oh yes and we've also all started to ignore the "hyper" tail wagging etc and only talking to her when she's calm and that has worked a treat already!!
> such a clever girlie very early days I know but am very pleased so far


Pleased to hear it's going well :thumbup: It is a long hard slog, and even now Harvey relapses a little on occassions, but if you keep going with it, it is so rewarding. I no longer have to walk him miles before leaving him, we don't use the calmatives but we do still use the crate. It can work 



sonia123 said:


> hi all im new to this site and ive found the advice about seperation anxiety very useful.i have a 4 year old boxer cross husky who,s been left in a crate when im out since he was 4 weeks old and been great but ive recently moved house and now he,s showing sighs of seperation anxiety.ive recently had to buy him a new heavy duty crate because he broke out of his other one.i left him last night and when i came back he had some how managed to get my curtain from inside his crate and pulled py curtain rail down and now he has very sore feet of rubbing his claws up the bars so one of his feet is bandaged up


I would try re-associating the crate with nice things. Feed him in there, treats and games centred around the crate etc. I know you have moved, but has the position of his crate changed dramatically. ie was in the lounge but now in the kitchen? I can't have Harvey's in the Kitchen as he has a direct view of the door, which upsets him.


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## littlekitty

Our dog has this also. We got him over 2 years ago as a rescue and he still follows me everywhere and can be a bit overpowering sometimes. I have tried all the above but it seems that it is something I will have to get used to. On saying that he used to bark everytime we came home, that is now (mainly) nonexistent. he will bark, sometimes, when OH comes in or when my son is home and we return, but nothing like the constant barking he used to do. So some progress there. We still ignore him etc when we get home as he is quiet excitable at times.


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## sonia123

no when i lived in my other house his crate was in me and my partners bedroom and its still in me and my partners bedroom.im wondering if its because when we lived in our old house it was just me and my partner but now you see were both living with my parents and he hasnt really been in his crate much since we moved in august where as when we lived in our old house he was in it for a couple of hours every day but now he isnt cos i we go out theres always my parents to watch him its very frustrating for us all seeing him hurt himself


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## madonna

sue&harvey said:


> Hi again sorry to hear he is still bad. Did you try crate training? I can't recall.


hi no we havent crated him , hes 10 months old now and i was told if hes as bad as he is then a crate wont work at his age , i think he would still bark and probly get more stressed , its hard to know what to do. you hope that maybe one day it will just click that we do come back. but deep down know that that would be a dream not reality, i think whoever reported me to the council will do it again should we start leaving him again.i do agree with another post on here that you do tend just to go along with it and hope that what your doing will help but it truly depends on the dog the breed and the owner .


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## sue&harvey

madonna said:


> hi no we havent crated him , hes 10 months old now and i was told if hes as bad as he is then a crate wont work at his age , i think he would still bark and probly get more stressed , its hard to know what to do. you hope that maybe one day it will just click that we do come back. but deep down know that that would be a dream not reality, i think whoever reported me to the council will do it again should we start leaving him again.i do agree with another post on here that you do tend just to go along with it and hope that what your doing will help but it truly depends on the dog the breed and the owner .


Adog is never too old to be crate trained. Harvey was 6mo and my friends was 4 when they crate trained. It really may be worth a try


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## cardaph

We have been battling with separation issues with our tibetan terier for over a year now. We consulted a behaviourist in June last year and have been trying to follow the programme given us since then. We have made very slow progress and up until the arctic conditions started were going out and standing in the drive for 5mins and got no reaction. Over the past few weeks it has become very obvious that her problem is more with me than my husband. Whilst I have been out of the house he has popped out a couple of times and there has been no barking on the recording. So I will now up the desensitising training for just me. Yesterday I went to the shops whilst she was out for her walk. Hubby came and picked me up and left her at home. I was pleased when I ran the recording back to find that most of the time she had been quiet, only 1 brief session of barking. 
So my advice to anyone in the same position is to never give up and keep trying. Desensitise slowly at the dog's own pace - if you get a negative reaction you are going too fast and need to go back a step or two.


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## madonna

hi cardaph . can i ask what you are doing with your dog, we too record him but it is pretty much constant from when we go to when we come back hes panting and out of breath when we get in ,then he goes asleep when were in .any tips would be great ,thankyou


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## cardaph

Hi Madonna, 
I will get the report out we have been working from tomorrow and list the important points. One thing to remember though is this programme was tailor made for our dog, however a lot could be applied to any dog I would think.
daph


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## cardaph

Hi Madonna here are some of the things we have been doing 

Leaving signals - write down all the things that alert the dog you are going out ie picking up keys putting coat and shoes on etc. During the day pick keys up or pretend to get ready to go out without actually doing so - be totally unpredictable 

We had to feed from a kong and each time make her sit and give a paw - any food not consumed within 20 minutes to be removed. 

Teach the dog to be alone in a room by itself while you are in another part of the house - start with leaving for 15-30 seconds and build up 

Provide plenty of mental stimulation by playing games.. Have a couple of toys which you keep and play with on your terms. Play for short sessions about 5 minutes and stop whilst the dog is still keen to play. Also take on busy walks and possibly enrol in a training or agility class. 

Re the leaving signals,we would walk up and down the hallway, then progressed to opening and shutting the door. When she was used to that we would go out and come straight back in around six times each session. Then we gradually built up the time we were out. This is still work in progress due to the bad weather. 

Hope some of this helps it's not easy and sometimes you think you are making no progress but then you see a slight improvement which gives you a real boost and the determination to carry on trying.


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## Nina2010

Guys,
I posted a little while back about our rescue girl who has separation issues. I think we are one of the lucky ones in that she is settling much quicker than we thought, we have purchased one of the DAPs, it's been in about 1.5 weeks, she is still chewing her rawhide bones when she gets stressed but not as much, and today I have bought them both a Kong  they love em! have tried them out today and they play with them for hours! as ours are labs theyhave the large ones, stuffed a markie in first and then stuffed in loads of the shape biscuits they have gone mad for them will let you know next week if they work when we most need them to!! I have to say god old fashioned exercise seems to be helping her too, she gets 2 long walks a day at least an hour in the evening and that has really helped to calm her.:thumbup:


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## susan_xx

Hi all, been referring to this thread for a while now but was wondering if anyone had any specific pearls of wisdom about my problem (and also need to share as its getting me down!)

My boyfriend and I got a miniature schnauzer from a rescue centre in November, he is 9 years old, was in the shelter for about 3 months and before that lived with an old lady who unfortunately lost her sight and couldn't care for him any more. Its also believed he lived with another dog here and they were rehomed seperately. 

He is a lovely, quiet little dog and besides a few bad manners is well behaved, he generally spends most of his day sleeping but is energetic enough when out walking.

Due to a combination of factors he wasn't really left alone in his new home much for the first week or so we had him, and we found when we did leave him he would bark and howl reallyloudly and constantly. 

We got him a DAP collar and put aside lots of time to train him as per the instructions and tips on here and elsewhere online, gradually building up from 10 seconds to about 3 hours, with few setbacks, but generally it went very well. I made the change at about the half hour mark to give him half his ration of food when we were leaving him after reading about how if he was focussed on food he wouldn't notice us leaving too much. He is crate trained, sleeps happily in it each night and we leave him in it when we leave. We recorded him on some sessions to make sure he was ok and from what we could hear he was calm.

However this week he appears to have gone back to square one, howling pretty much constantly from the 10 min mark onwards. The noise he makes is so sad! I feel terrible for him especially after hoping he was much more settled and accepting of being left alone. Not to mention the hassle it must be for our patient neighbours who have been putting up with it (we live in a flat).

The only factors I can imagine for this setback are
-change in DAP, removed his collar around the 2 hour mark as it was when it should have run out anyway, he seemed to get on fine without it, and to be honest I never noticed much change in him when he had it on anyway. However 2 days ago, after his setback, I got a plug in Dap thing which I have had in for a couple of days, it doesnt seem to be helping.

-he's had some kind of fright when we've been out. We recorded and listened to about 70% of his successful periods alone and he didn't seem to get any frights even with post being dropped through etc. He isn't particularly skittish anyway

-I've been cuddling him too much! as he has settled in i've been spending more time close with him, letting him nap on the couch lying next to me etc, wondering if I've been unknowingly encouraging more dependence on me?

these reasons are me clutching at straws really as I can't see a real reason why he would relapse so quickly and so dramatically. As i said I got the new DAP and a kong to leave him with, but he's still very anxious

When we did the training the first time i took time off work etc to make sure he wasn't left alone at all outside the training, but I'm not sure I can do that again if we need to start from scratch. Also I'm worried if I start from scratch I'll be reinforcing the howling behaviour with more treats for less time alone.

any advice or kind words would be much appreciated, I'm very down about it and feel terrible that he is so unhappy!

thanks
x


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## Tobyboy

I could also do with some advice....
I got a 9 month old rescue dog at christmas and due to recovering from surgery I have been in the majority of the time with him. He is reducing the need to be by my side 24/7.

My dilemma is that I am going back to work in 2 weeks and am concerned about leaving him. He has been left for 3/4 hours and has been fine, but we recently went to see some friends and ended up staying out longer than anticipated.... about 6/7 hours. When we returned he had chewed the wooden windowsill, the trim on the laminate floor and also a small area of the wallpaper. He is fine at night and sleeps on the landing with no issues. He is being left in the same area as he is at night. He is left with all his toys to play with.

Also we have been invited to a party and I am concerned about leaving him in the evening. He has plenty of toys to keep him amused which he enjoys playing with.

Any ideas....
Thanks


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## sue&harvey

Hi both, Firstly Susan I would go back a few steps if possible, you need to find his threshold, and go back to that stage. If you have been recording him, you should be able to pick out fairly easily, which is triggering him. My lad has a few episodes, even now, but if he howls when I leave then I do keep going. He is always settled when I get back. Have a look at Zylkene. It is similar to the dap and worked wonders with our lad. 

Tobyboy, it sounds as if your lad is happy for 4 hours but 6/7 hours is the max he should be left in a day tops. how long will you be out while at work? If you leave plenty of things to do and give him a good walk, and a little training before you go 4/5 hours he should be fine. 

Someone here before said you imagine sitting with no TV, noone to talk to, and no other stimulation, what would you do?

hope this helps you both


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## Tobyboy

sue&harvey said:


> Tobyboy, it sounds as if your lad is happy for 4 hours but 6/7 hours is the max he should be left in a day tops. how long will you be out while at work? If you leave plenty of things to do and give him a good walk, and a little training before you go 4/5 hours he should be fine.


HI
The house will be empty potentially at worst for about 8 hours... would it be better to leave him with some background music and lots and lots of toys. He gets a very long walk in the evening - over an hour long. Would it be better to take him out in the mrning as well, so as to tire him out a little??
Thanks for your help


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## sue&harvey

Tobyboy said:


> HI
> The house will be empty potentially at worst for about 8 hours... would it be better to leave him with some background music and lots and lots of toys. He gets a very long walk in the evening - over an hour long. Would it be better to take him out in the mrning as well, so as to tire him out a little??
> Thanks for your help


2 walks are better than one. 8 Hours is a long time. You may consider getting someone in to brak the day up for him.


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## shannons

Our family got a 12 week Lab almost a month ago and were told not to worry about signs of separation anxiety the first few days or the first week. But now time has passed and things don't seem to get better. She keeps whining and crying when left alone and even trying to run away from us. I don't know what to do.

I have searched the internet for help and came across a few ebooks on the subject, Separation Anxiety in Dogs - The Utimate Guide being perhaps the most appealing. What do you think, could it be any good? I'm not used to buying things online and don't know what to trust and what not to.

Anyone here who's ever tried this one or a similar product?


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## Cassia

sue&harvey said:


> *Separation Anxiety in Dogs *
> 
> There has been loads of people asking for advice about this recently, so I thought I would try and put some information all in one place. Please feel free to add any further advice
> 
> *Separation Anxiety Definition *:- The term separation anxiety is not exclusive to dogs or even to veterinary medicine. It is a psychological term to describe the stress and anxiousness in an individual brought on by the leaving (perceived or imagined) of another individual. In the case of a pet, it is usually an anxiety brought on by separation from the primary pet caretaker. In the case of humans, anxiety in a child from being separated from a parent.
> 
> What classifies as a "separation"? This varies greatly between animals: some must have "their person" within their line of sight, other pets are fine as long as the owner is within a comfortable distance (i.e. somewhere else in the house), and still others are fine until the owner leaves. Even finer distinctions would be animals that are fine for a certain period of time after their owner leaves, but then start to show signs of anxiousness some time later.
> 
> Just like the variance in what stresses out each individual, the signs of separation anxiety vary greatly as well.
> 
> *Which Dogs can be effected by Separation Anxiety:-* The answer to this is ANY! There are some breeds believed to be prone to SA. Some of these are German Shepherds, Airedales, Springer Spaniels, Australian Shepherds and Weimaraners, to name a few. This is not to say all of these dogs will not cope being left alone, as with all dogs it will vary greatly depending on the individual.
> 
> Plus a higher number of dogs that come from a shelter or rescue home, seem to develop dog separation anxiety easily. These dogs might have gone through some severe trauma, or abandonment before ending up in the shelter and once they are placed in a home with an owner they can trust, they will start relying on that owner a lot faster than dogs that haven't experienced any trauma in their life already.
> Pups that leave their litter too early are also predisposed to SA.
> 
> *How to prevent your new puppy, or dog from being affected by Separation Anxiety *:- Owners need to help their dog, or puppy to find a happy medium between companionship and becoming sufficiently independent to tolerate being alone for periods of time. Dogs do not electively engage in anxious behaviours. They develop over a period of time, and becomes a panic response. People must condition their dogs to stay calm when left alone. To condition means to get the dog used to specific things, situations and events. That's why it's important to practice leaving and returning to the dog frequently, starting when you first bring the dog into your home and family.
> 
> Teach your dog from the start that your leaving the house is an ordinary, regular event. Help your dog build tolerance for your departures and absences. Calm departures and homecomings will help the dog to relax. When leaving do not have emotional goodbyes, this will not help the dog .
> 
> *Mummy*  _ahh poor baby, will you miss mummy?_ Kiss Kiss Kiss _Dont worry mummy be back soon_
> 
> *Puppy *Wheres she going, why all this fuss, that thing they call a coat, she only puts that on when she goes outside I wanna go! Dont want to stay on my own!!! *Panic Response Alert !!!*
> 
> The same applies for your return. Take your coat off unpack the shopping, open your mail, then when the dog is calm let them outside to toilet. (Still not spoken to him) When he had been to the loo, then you can give him praise and a little play session.
> 
> When you first bring home your bundle of fluff and needle sharp teeth, let them explore the outside area first ( get them used to going outside, it will help when toilet training, and big fuss for toileting outside.) Then take them inside letting them explore their new kingdom in stages.
> 
> Have the dog's bed and bowl of water ready in a safe, well-lighted, comfortable confined area with "family smells", such as a gated-off kitchen, family room or crate placed in a family area. (Do not confine in basements, garages, storage rooms, or other non-family areas). This nice "den" will be the place in which she will stay when you are not home to supervise. Take her to that place, tell her lie down (guide her if she has not yet learned that command). Then give her one or two safe chew toys and praise her. Couple a food treat with the verbal praise. In fact, it's helpful to keep a small bag of tiny tipbit treats on you at all times during the acclimation and training phases.
> 
> Next, close the door or gate to the room or crate, and step back. See if she is staying calm. Resist the urge to talk to the dog, since that will distract her from this desired, calm, relaxed behaviour. ( He should be shattered from his trip to his new home, and all that exploring)
> 
> If she stays reasonably calm when separated from you for a minute or two, let her stay there as long as she seems comfortable. (See thread Cages in Dog Chat) If the dog is good in her confined area, this is a very good sign. You can begin to add calm, quiet verbal praise and an occasional food treat to this acclimation routine as a reward for being good and calm in her confined area.
> 
> Over the next few days and weeks encourage your new pup or dog to sleep in his safe area. Slowly increase the amount of time they are left. A dog that is left regularly will become well adapted and sufficiently independent to cope with being alone.
> 
> Also install baby gates so you dog learns to accept he cannot access you when ever he wants. He can see you, but cannot always get to you.
> 
> _*Spend time training your dog to happily accept alone time will save you, your dog and you neighbours a lot of stress in the long run! *_


Our 11 week old CC powder puff Dobby is showing signs of seperation anxiety.
We're considering wether to carry on crating him at night or when we're out. 
He makes these dreadfull howling/screeching noises when he's in there and we need to go out etc (it sounds like he's being seriously hurt). There are people telling us that it's very important to crate train and get him used to spending periods of time in the crate but on the other hand it seems to be causing him allot of distress etc. 
I don't think it's just down to the crate as whenever I leave a room he starts whining... but I can't not leave a room ever etc. 
I do allot of nipping out for 5/10 mins to try and get him used to me leaving and I had to go shopping today, he was crying when we left and when we came back we stood outside the front foor to see if he were still crying/howling and he was!
It's heart braking. 
Not entirely sure what to try to get him used to spending time alone because I have a part time job where I work a few hours every Tues, Thursday and Friday... it's horrid to think he's in a state whilst I'm away from him.


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## Bigones

Fantastic Thread really helpful going to try some of the things you suggested. Our dog seems to be fine through the day it's just on a night and I was wondering if its because my husband (his bestfriend!) puts him to bed, as he normally stops up after me. Might try me putting Henry (the dog) to bed when I go to bed!?


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## leashedForLife

Too Much Love? Soothing Separation Anxiety - Paw Nation


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## K.W.S

Numerology changes dog`s behaviour as well as human behaviour. If your dog has numbers in his life (too many of same kind) which indicate that he is depending on people too much and he cannot be alone without the anxiety, dog`s name needs to change.
New name balances dog`s behaviour. In separation anxiety cases, usually the dog has those "unwanted" numbers already in birth numbers or in his register name or in both. The name which you use on him on daily bases might add to his anxiety.
What ever you do, don`t punish your dog. He cannot change his number energies.


----------



## leashedForLife

response to a query re problem-behaviors [urinating, chewing] when home solo - 
Separation Anxiety Question for Dr. McConnell, Dog Training Tips at Patricia McConnell

there are hyperlinks within the text for more-specific info.

what sep-anx Is & Isn't, how to help prevent it, some ways to reduce it - 
Separation Anxiety in Dogs - PAWS Chicago  Chicago's largest No Kill humane and adoption organization


----------



## leashedForLife

Separation Anxiety - Scared to Be Home Alone, by Pat Miller

written by my colleague Pat of Peaceable Paws, with info from Overall, DVM, on symptoms; also several case-studies, 
including one misdiagnosis.  U can read it on-line, or download the PDF.


----------



## Tiger Brindle Poppy

Hi I'm a newbie to the site and just saw this post and thought its what im going through!

I have a 10 week old Boxer Puppy who i know is going to have S/A at this young age but she is to the extreme of if she is asleep when i leave the room she will wake to follow me! 

I am trying all of the suggested but she whines and barks for such a long time, is this common in the breed or is it down to her age? 

It is so bad my husband has to do the grocery shopping for me 

Also she is crate trained and loves it as her getaway, she happily sleeps all through the night in her crate but yet 2 mins on her own crate or no crate she' s a mess.

I currently take her to work with me, as she has only just had her 2nd booster, but i want to be able to leave her at home in a few weeks just for a day or 2 out of the week (obviously i will be taking her for long morning and evening walks on these days) but at the moment i don't see this as even been a possiblity!!


----------



## leashedForLife

Tiger Brindle Poppy said:


> I have a 10-WO Boxer Puppy...


it's *not* sep-anx; read the 3 articles in the 2 posts directly above Urs.

then read the whole thread for tips on preventing sep-anx & coping with *separation distress.*


----------



## lucylastic

I second the recommendation for the book "I'll be home soon" by Patricia McConnell. I really rate her practical advice.


----------



## leashedForLife

preventing sep-anx: 
YouTube - ‪How to train your dog to be left alone- clicker training‬‏ the ever-helpful KikoPup. :thumbup1:

YouTube - ‪Separation Anxiety 101 - Part 1‬‏

YouTube - ‪Separation Anxiety 101 - Part 2‬‏ 
be sure to check the LINKS under Katie's vids: she's very good about including resource references. :001_smile:


----------



## leashedForLife

Separation Anxiety The What's, Why's and How's


----------



## MarkSteve

In my opinion man engage your dog in different kind of running,playing and sport activities,I always found this better.Whenever i feel some change in my dog then i immediately take him to a training school where my dog had a special session of a week.I think it really works.


----------



## leashedForLife

MarkSteve said:


> In my opinion man engage your dog in different kind of running, playing and sport activities,
> I always found this better. Whenever i feel some change in my dog then i immediately take him to a training school
> where my dog had a special session of a week. I think it really works.


???? ... this is a wind-up, surely. :blink: exercise can help, of course - enrichment can help. 
but exercise will not 'cure' sep-anx. It's a panic-attack, & needs to be changed by changing the emotional response 
to being alone.


----------



## Guest

Hi everyone.

Myself and hubby have re-homed a one year old border collie. He's lovely, but has some sort of seperation anxiety. We've had to leave him alone a few times whilst we've gone out, and he does whine a lot as we leave etc (he seems to settle though as when we come back he's usually asleep!) We're putting that down to being in a new home, as we haven't had him long. Just to point out, the rescue centre didn't know anything about his background.

He does get incredibly upset and whines a lot when my husband leaves for work, and this usually lasts for a few hours. He'll wait by the door and practically howl. I've tried giving him lots of fuss and cuddles, which he does seem to love, but after he goes back to the whining/howling.

As I say he's a lovely dog overall, he seems very attached and loyal, just would like some tips on how to calm him down when my husband leaves for work.

Thanks


----------



## petlover84

this thread is really helpful in determining the symptoms of dog separation anxiety. unfortunately it seems that my dog is showing all this symptoms.


----------



## Callie

Great Thread..........only started looking as my 15month old retriever,who was home with her Mum when we are out yesterday was so worked up when we came in, it took her an hour and half to calm down and stop panting so heavily.

Don't think she was howling or anything but has started to show signs of SA by whining if I'm upstairs, following me in every room and just generally liking to know I am there.

I am ususally at home most days and if out it is only for a few hours at most but mostly it wee half hour stints...........when she is fine but as you say in your post she greets me as if I have been away forever.
At weekends however she is left for slightly longer and think this is getting to her a bit now.......even though Mum is there albiet separated by baby gate as when together pup would lick Mums ears so much they were getting really sore.


----------



## conoflex

We have a 2 year old GSD which we've had from 8weeks old and he is marvelous except for the seperation anxiety he only has it when my wife leaves the room or goes out.
We have tried everything that all the web sites suggest to get him out of it but if anything it's getting worse, he is crate trained and sleeps in it with no problem at all when we go to bed.
It's now not even line of sight if my goes to the washing line he can see her but conservatory door is shut he howls cries till she comes back in, if she goes to the toilet it's the same he has now started howling and crying when she's on the phone.
When we go shopping he goes in his crate with no problem but as soon as he realises we have gone out he starts the crying howling and barking untill we come back (as neighbours have told us) 2 hour trip to Tesco's and does it the whole time.
We are both home most of the time as i'm disabled and my wife is my carer but when we are out hostpital etc the neighbours are now complaining a bit about bit, we can't afford to get someone to try train him out of it (as this has been sugested from a trainer on another site)
It's coming to the point now that my wife has had enough and is starting to think that the best thing would be to re-home him, sorry for the lomg post.


----------



## leashedForLife

conoflex said:


> It's coming to the point now that my wife has had enough & is starting to think that the best thing would be
> to re-home him, sorry for the lomg post.


 - it took 2-years to get this bad; it *won't* disappear in a week or two.

- *read the thread - * there are links, books, & websites to help. 
no-one will type U an individual 'book of Ur own' for B-Mod; we can't re-write everything.

- OTC calmatives can help. For What, When, How, etc, see this post: 
Pet Forums Community - View Single Post - dog body-language - and why it matters so much...


----------



## leashedForLife

Barklett said:


> try Pet Remedy ....new plug in which diffuses a natural valerian based blend of essential oils...
> I had amazing results and would thoroughly recommend it!!!


please *be careful* - inhaling essential-oils can lead to serious problems if U or the dog have respiratory issues, 
like a brachy-breed [mashed face & short jaws = accordion sinuses & a down-hanging soft-palate - 
their airways are occluded].

i'd recommend a DAP plug-in AKA 'Comfort Zone for Dogs' - which is listed with the other calmatives, 
at the link i posted.  very safe, no perfumes or essential oils; it's a pheromone.


----------



## conoflex

leashedForLife said:


> - it took 2-years to get this bad; it *won't* disappear in a week or two.
> 
> - *read the thread - * there are links, books, & websites to help.
> no-one will type U an individual 'book of Ur own' for B-Mod; we can't re-write everything.
> 
> - OTC calmatives can help. For What, When, How, etc, see this post:
> Pet Forums Community - View Single Post - dog body-language - and why it matters so much...


I'm not expecting it to disappear in a week, I did read the thread and we have tried 99% of books and methods also tried various calmatives none of which worked.
Not asking for a miracle cure either just wanted another opinion to see if there was something new we missed and no need to be condescending either.


----------



## madonna

hi i really feel for you and the stress your under . i tried all the things ,diffusers training ignoring him ,making him sleep on his own which he did .neuturing him . and in the end it broke my heart but to give him the life he needed i gave him up to peole who knows what he needed .i was reported etc and recorded .like yours he barked for the whole time we were shoping max 2 hours .to the point where their was blood on the wall from his nails and the floor was wet with dribble .i couldnt se him like that .im crying now as i truly loved him and will never forgrt him .he was so good indoors ,im not saying give up please take all the advice you can all dogs are diffrent .and yes its hard as all advice is not good ,its scared me that much that i have not got another dog although itruly want one and trawl the rescue sites ,but i cant risk the chance another dog may do the same .it was the hardest thing to do and ill never forget him. i wish you the best of luck please talk to your vet he may have good advice .all the best


----------



## leashedForLife

madonna said:


> ...please *talk to your vet*, S/he may have good advice.


i'll say it again -

_unless they are veterinary-behaviorists, vets receive zero in-depth education 
on animal-behavior. Most never even learn good handling & restraint techniques, 
to keep themselves & the animal they are examining, diagnosing, or treating, *safe.* 
i would not consult a vet on behavior *unless* s/he was board-certified in that specialty.

many vets argue with clients who want a full thyroid-panel on their dogs, *because 
of the dog's behavior: irritability, snarking, distractible, tail-chasing, other OCD stuff.* 
they'll say the dog is too young, doesn't have greasy skin or hyperpigmentation, etc. 
they tell people to get ONE reading - of FIVE, & four of those are floor-&-ceiling numbers, 
both needed to determine the measurment *between* them.

don't get me wrong: a good vet is a blessing & a DoGsend - but they aren't behaviorists 
unless they have certification in that specialty._


----------



## madonna

my vet was a trained certificated behaviourist .


----------



## Shalize

Lots of sound advice


----------



## Archie11

I'm joining this thread which i've read in full. We've just rehomed a lovely dog from a rescue centre he's a 6 month Spaniel cross. Seems very loving dog and i know it's only been 4 days but i want to do what's best.... He follows me everywhere and if i'm out of sight whines, howls and barks, no matter if other people are in the house.
I've done the in and out of the house and it doesn't settle down only when i'm back. I don't talk to him and no eye contact on return. It was the same at night, and we had to put his crate in our bedroom for the last two nights and he sleeps well straight away. We couldn't let him howl all night as the neighbours have already complained....
I have to do the school run and normal errands and i'm already getting stressed about leaving him knowning how much noise he will make and stress he puts himself thru. 
I've got some Bach rescue remedy - comfort and reassure that i've started putting in his water...
any other advice please? he is our first family dog.


----------



## leashedForLife

Archie11 said:


> I'm joining this thread which i've read in full.


then U've seen the link to Dr Overall's page, which includes a massively detailed protocol for relaxation, 
another for desensitizing dogs to events AT THE DOOR, 
& a third for teaching the dog to defer to the owner / handler.

they are all found on her webpage, which can be found by googling "What is behavior modification" - 
What is Behavior Modification? | k9aggression.com

i'd suggest all 3 - and buying a copy of _"I'll be home soon"_ by Patricia McConnell, or borrowing 
that book from the library [probably via interlibrary loan] would also be a good idea.


----------



## simon44

Hi,

Harry seems OK left alone at home , I have tried it for 10 minutes or so now and then ,but I have a huge problem with him outside shops. If I tie him outside a shop even for literally a minute he barks his head off , I mean really howling almost. He used to bite the lead off in seconds so I used a chain for a bit but that has stopped now. He was never trained for this as a puppy , (he wasn't mine and there was no need) ..
I am reluctant to leave him for long at home incase the barking starts as I live in a flat with close neighbors.......

How can I calm him down and train him to wait outside shops for me ? I can afford a car for now and he waits happily in that , so I can avoid the situation by taking the car when I have to.But if it goes then I will need to be able to make him wait outside shops,GP's , all sorts ?


----------



## leashedForLife

simon44 said:


> How can I calm [Harry]... & train him to wait outside shops for me?


that's not separation anxiety.  i'd suggest begin a new thread, under *Training & Behavior*. 
it's lost here, & won't get much response; there, it will get individual attention.


----------



## vicky10

i have a dog with this and i was wondering that if i took the dog everywhere i went even on short car journeys, would this make her worse in the long term? really not sure what to do, as i was gone for half an hr this afternoon and she tor the stairs up again- please help as i dont like her behaving like this.


----------



## soosiesoo

hello, I am new to this site but very glad I found it! I have an 11 month old springer spaniel called Daisy. She's always been a really easy dog and gets lots of walks etc. Last week my husband was in hospital and our general routine went out the window a bit. He normally walks her in the evening and I struggled to find the time to walk her for quite as long due to kids, hospital visits etc but I made sure she did get one long walk a day - except for one day when she only had one short walk as I was at hospital most of the day (there is however always someone in the house as my mum lives with us and spends time with Daisy). My husband is now home but almost overnight Daisy is displaying some very strange behaviour. She whines even when I am in the house and a lot during the night (loudly), she goes round the house looking frantic as if she has lost something, she is scratching the carpets and she has started to carry a chew toy round in her mouth at all times as if it was a dummy. Things are back to pretty much normal now with her routine but her odd behaviour is continuing. I am guessing this is because of the change in last week with my husband not being around and me not being around as much (I'm quite shocked that this 1 week could result in such a change in her though). Do you think this is the cause and where do I start to help her??? Many thanks, Sue


----------



## leashedForLife

soosiesoo said:


> I have an 11-MO Springer Spaniel, Daisy. She's always been a really easy dog...
> Last week my husband was in hospital & our general routine went out the window a bit. He normally walks her [eves],
> I struggled to find the time to walk her for quite as long, due to kids, hospital visits etc but [she had]
> one long walk a day - except for one day [with] only... one short walk, as I was at hospital most of the day
> (there's... always someone in the house as my mum lives with us & spends time with Daisy).
> 
> My husband is now home, but almost overnight Daisy is displaying some very strange behaviour.
> *She whines even when I'm in the house & a lot during the night (loudly),
> she goes round the house looking frantic as if she's lost something,
> she is scratching... carpets, &... has started to carry a chew toy round in her mouth at all times
> as if it was a dummy. *
> Things are back to pretty much normal now with her routine, but *her odd behaviour is continuing*.


Sue, 
is Daisy *intact? *

if so, When was her last heat? 
i suspect she is entering pre-estrus, not suffering sep-anx [sep-anx's primary symptom is ESCAPE].

if she is intact, i'd also suggest she be spayed ASAP.


----------



## simon44

I doubt that would work outside a shop , which is the problem originally posted..............
there seems to be a limited amount of helpful suggestions , but plenty of additions to the problem? I have given up on this forum before as the questions/problems where never answered , or am I being to judgmental ? Perhaps it's simply that nobody knows what to do for training a dog to wait outside a shop?


----------



## leashedForLife

simon44 said:


> I doubt that would work outside a shop , which is the problem originally posted...


Simon, dear - 
the original topic is SEP-ANX, not "leaving dogs outside shops". 


simon44 said:


> I have given up on this forum before as the questions/problems where never answered,
> or am I being [too] judgmental ? Perhaps... nobody knows [how to train] a dog to wait outside a shop?


as i already suggested: *post #148 - *


> Originally Posted by simon44
> 
> How can I calm [Harry]... & train him to wait outside shops for me?


that's not separation anxiety. *i'd suggest begin a new thread, under Training & Behavior.* 
it's lost here, & won't get much response; *there, it will get individual attention.*


----------



## Cazz enigma

What a great thread, will definitely try these techniques with Fergus as he hates being in a different room to us, and being left, which up to now hasn't been on his own at all.


----------



## Popularfurball

What a fab thread... We have just got mister patch... He is barking solidly from 930pm-6am at the moment


----------



## Hertsgirl

What a brilliant thread, such a lot of great advice. I have a puppy and am at that 'crying/barking' with her when I go out stage so this is very helpful. Thanks


----------



## Teddy Red Lab

Hello!
I could really do with some advice about my 4 1/2 month old labrador puppy.
He is absolutely fantastic, really well behaved and learns really quickly, the only problem we have with him is that he whines alot of the time,especially when when I leave him in a room alone. 
He is crate trained and we can go out and leave him for 2 or 3 hours and he is absolutely fine and totally chilled (ive checked by sneaking up to the front door when he thinks Im 'out' and listening at the letterbox!!!) but when Im in the house and I leave him in a room he cries and cries until I come back (unless he is in his crate in which case hes fine!). It is really frustrating as when he is older I want to wean him off his crate as our kitchen is only small, however he clearly doesnt feel secure on his own unless he is shut in there. Does this count as separation anxiety? Hes fine being totally left but cant stand being left if he knows we are at home. Also he is very fussy and whinges alot of the time,if he doesnt get his own way-like not being allowed on the sofa or if hes not getting attention when he wants it- it is very irritating and is becoming a running joke with our.friends!!! He gets daily walks and lots of attention as he goes to work with my boyfriend every day so it not like hes neglected and has a horrid life! Weve obviously got into a bad habit somewhere along the line for this behaviour to have developed!
Any ideas or comments bout this would be really appreciated!


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## leashedForLife

Teddy Red Lab said:


> I['d like] some advice about my *4 1/2-month-old Labrador puppy*.
> ...he whines a lot of the time, especially when... in a room alone.


this is not 'separation anxiety', which has ESCAPE as its major symptom. 
18-WO pups have not had time to develop this chronic behavior, which generally develops 
past puberty at the very earliest [9-MO or older].

i'd suggest the 2 *free books* on DogStarDaily - go to the website, click on FREE DOWNLOADS, 
& read them on Ur computer - or print off single pages to carry along, or print the whole book.

the titles are _'Before U Get Ur Pup'_ & _'After U Get Ur Pup'_. 
they are chock-full of good tips for socializing, habituating, teaching a soft-mouth, & more.


----------



## Teddy Red Lab

Thanks so much, Ill have a look!
Steph


----------



## leashedForLife

Barklett said:


> Try Pet Remedy... See their website!!! amazing results ...
> there are lots of reviews and testimonials on the site


Hmmm.

methinks i smell a _SPAMMER... _ 
http://tinyurl.com/cctondf

7 posts, all unapologetic *advertisements for Pet Remedy, in some form.* :thumbdown: 
Go away, & peddle it elsewhere, please?... :skep: Thanks.


----------



## gazwelshguy

We have a gorgeous 3 year old British Bulldog stud where we are having problems with leaving him on his own.. Think we have started out in the wrong direction allowing him to sleep with us for the past 5 nights on our bed.. He stresses a lot in the kitchen when we go to work.. Door scratched to bits and accidents on the carpet. We are going to start leaving him in the kitchen at night again but not sure if to leave the door open with the baby gate shut or completely shut the door...


----------



## Nat28

Thanks for the advice. I have just gotten a nine week puppy and have given him a couple of days to get used to his surroundings. He is sticking by my side everywhere i go though. He gets the run of the living room and kitchen area but everytime i go to go into another room he cries and whimpers. Im going to start goin to another room for longer periods and not make a fuss when i come back. Im off work for a couple of weeks to help him settle but i want him to learn there will be times he has to be alone. My lovely bunch of fun is a jackapoo called malkie


----------



## retepwaker

lots of love is the answer


----------



## leashedForLife

retepwaker said:


> lots of love is the answer


???... :thumbdown: SEP-ANX isn't 'lack of love' - 
it's a panic-attack caused by humans departing.

it requires B-Mod, & severe cases can be life-threatening; such dogs may need psych-meds, 
so that the B-Mod can take effect.


----------



## hazel pritchard

3 months ago i homed a 13 month old rescue he had SA, we love him to bits so does our other dog,,, the foster mum he was with before he came to us told us he had SA,, im not surprised he has it ,, after the way he has been treated by his other homes, i gave him zylkene and it has really helped him,,,


----------



## sezra

When I got Daisy my Cockapoo I received fabulous advice on here for her seperation issues and this thread really helped. I am still training her and we still have lots of work to do but whilst we are at home night time is no longer an issue.

If anyone would like to read about Daisy I have written about her here:

Training Daisy


----------



## emmieferns

Thanks a lot for the information. I am to take a holiday off with my family but I can't bring my puppy with me due to some reasons. I don't have any idea how to manage her separation anxiety not until I have read your thread. :thumbup1:


----------



## Teddy Red Lab

Wow this has been really useful! Thank you so much... Ive taken lots of this advice on board and my dog is so much more chilled about being left alone!


----------



## topaza

puppy howling when left alone

Hi, I'm new to this, but I wondered if someone could tell me how to stop my 6mth old Rottie howling when we leave the house, She is put in her cage with all her toys and some treats, but I have been informed by my next door neighbour that she howls all the time we are out. Dont want to upset my lovely neighbour (and she really is lovely). I'm desperate now, we dont leave her for too long and we leave a radio on as well. I have had a rottie before and never had trouble like this. we got this one from someone else when she was 5 months old, so dont know if they left her howling or not, ot wether she was mis treated, But we have had her 6 weeks now and she seems to have issue with being left alone, even in doors she has to be every where you are.

THanks for this help, I will give this a try, beginning tomorrow.


----------



## choclabwoody

Hi All
My 12 month (well nearly - 2 days to go) old dog has a problem with separation anxiety and he has been like this since I bought him i.e. 4 weeks ago.

I have been staying in my Mum's during the Christmas period and we all went out today and he is now starting to show some of the same symptoms when either my mother or step father (Alf) leaves us or is out of sight.

I thought he would of been alright with me in the back of the car but he whined and was very restless at first. After getting to our destination he leapt out of the car once I unclipped his harness and he started to jump all over my mother and step father for attention or it might of been excitement.

I managed to walk him outside the shops but all he wanted to do was go and see were my mother had gone. Once he spotted Alf coming out of the shops he dragged me towards him and leaped forwards and jumped up at him.

I'm going to have to read this topic again and make some notes. Driving back home is going to be a nightmare and when I'm back at home I do need to go shopping and restock the fridge etc. so again a nightmare as he doesn't like to be left alone.

I have had some good days and bad days. Telling him off just makes him worse or he ends up with diarrhea or being sick. Most of the time, No 2's have always been runny so don't know if it is the food or the way he is i.e. emotional problems etc. He came with a bag of James WellBeloved and I thought the diarrhea was due to this, so gave him Harringtons and now Wagg Worker Complete.

I wanted to give up on day one...day two....and so on. Just doesn't seem to learn and sometimes my patience isn't that good.


----------



## leashedForLife

choclabwoody said:


> [his stools] have always been runny, so i don't know if it's the food or... emotional problems, etc.
> 
> He came with a bag of *James WellBeloved*, & I thought the diarrhea was due to this, so gave him *Harringtons*,
> & now *Wagg Worker Complete*.


_*#@%$&*!...*_

U've had the poor dog for a MONTH; he's had sloppy-stools the entire time - 
A - has he been to the VET? 
B - if not, Why not?

C - THREE dog-foods in FOUR weeks?! 
that alone can cause major diarrhea, gas / belly-cramps, & more. :mad5:

Take the dog to the vet; 
i'd ask the vet to test for parasites [worms, Giardia, etc], & look for gut-bacteria [E-coli, Shigella, etc]; 
i'd also ask the vet to LISTEN to his gut-sounds & see if he sounds normal.

IT TAKES A WEEK TO TEN DAYS to change food entirely from one product to another. 
Find a good, quality food, based on MEAT - the 1st 2 to 3 ingredients should be meat; 
no more than TWO carb-sources, & i'd avoid Wheat [in any form], Corn AKA Maize [ditto], & Soy [ditto] - 
modified-starch, corn-meal, TVP, wheat gluten, etc.

then feed him a meal of 1/4 volume X [new food] & 3/4 volume Y [prior food] for 2 to 3 days. 
then half-&-half for 2 to 3 days; then 3/4 new to 1/4 prior, 2 to 3 days... IF AT ANY TIME he has diarrhea, 
GO BACK ONE STEP & stay there till his stools are normal.

Good luck - to the dog, & U.


----------



## choclabwoody

Hi thanks for the advice.
This is my first dog so don't know what I'm doing. I have been reading around and know that changing his food might upset his stomach and cause diarrhea but I don't know if I got a dog with problems already.

The previous owners said he was toilet trained and didn't have any problems but I haven't seen any evidence of this. I take him out late at night for the toilet just before bed and sometimes during the night he still wees or poos. I've got him now though to go for a No. 1 by saying 'Wee' and he will go on command so there has been some progress but at times he will slope off and just do it without saying.

He seems to have had two previous owners since birth and I'm the 3rd. It makes you wonder what has happened in his short past. He knows some basic commands like 'sit', 'stay' and will even sit when you give him his food. He doesn't know what 'lie down' is or the idea of fetch, he will retrieve it but wont release or drop it.

I took him to the vets as I was concerned with a few things and one of them was about the diarrhea and the vet suggested worming tablets. He has had the worming tablets now and it doesn't seem to have sorted anything out.

I will see the vet with what you have recommended and hope we can get his problem sorted out.


----------



## leashedForLife

choclabwoody said:


> I took him to the vets as I was concerned... about the diarrhea & the vet suggested worming tablets.
> He's had the worming tablets now and it doesn't seem to have sorted anything out.


the vet did not do a fecal-float *before* 'suggesting' he be wormed? 
that's weird - & very-suspect behavior, IMO, for a vet.

normally, they LOOK FOR which species of worm, so that they know what to Rx. 
the vet doesn't just *assume* some sort of worms, & throw a generic pesticide into the dog. 
many worms are only killed by a single, very-specific drug - at a specific dosage, too.

 Is there another vet in the area?


----------



## choclabwoody

Hi
I was quite disappointed at the vets as well, £26 to see her and £3 for two tablets of Drontal Plus. He got weighed (23Kg) and I explained my concerns and because it was his first visit there she just inputted his details in her computer and that was all she was concerned about.

I could of done the same myself and saved the money as the previous owners didn't know the date they last wormed him. So really common sense should of been applied there I think.

I don't have the money to keep on taking him to the vet all the time and need sites like this one to point me in the right directions. The Practice I took him to has several others dotted about so don't know if there are any others. I'll check to see if there are any others, but I do know that there is one in a Pet Superstore called 'Pets at Home' and I think they charge £38 per visit. A bit steep for me at the moment.

Just had another wee/poo free night and got woke up at 7.30am so took him out and then gave him his breakfast. He's now happy and playing with his toys after a mad run around the house galloping like a race horse with his bone in his mouth. Long walk now to tire him out.

My main concern is his SA and need to try to sort his problems out.


----------



## RoxanneandRocco

Hello

I am really hoping that someone here might be able to help me!

An introduction, I have an 8 month old Miniature Dachshund named Rocco, I have had him since he was 8 weeks old and he is quite well trained in most areas...

He suffers from acute SA, I am now back working full time (was off for 4 months with him to train/look after him) and he barks constantly while alone in the house.

We have him in puppy day care during the day and due to his small size, the vet recommended 3 half days would be enough for him (8am - 12.30) and I would come home for 12.30 to walk him etc then leave him in the flat again at 1.30 on the other 2 days, so he was only alone for 4 hrs at a time. This didn't work as he barked constantly and the neighbours started to complain.

So we upped him to 5 days at day care from 8am - 4pm, he still barked constantly from being dropped off at 4pm till I got home at 5.30pm and the neighbours again were not happy.

As a last resort we kept him in day care until 5.30pm where i drove to pick him up myself after work, we did this for a week before the christmas break and it made Rocco really ill, a mixture of the cold and over exercise made him lose a lot of weight and he got a viral infection, so this is no longer an option.

We have tried everything I can think of, crate training, seperation training (leaving for 10 seonds coming back in, leaving for 1 minute coming back in etc), dap sprays and diffusers, calming pills, spray collar, leaving something with my scent, taking him with me to work (barked at my coworkers), taking him and leaving him in the car (barked all day), I am totally at a loss as to what to do now.

Its not an exercise thing as he can do 7 hours exercise at puppy day care a day and still bark the house down when he gets dropped back off.

We have been crate training him for months and he still does not accept it, he barks and cries the entire time he is in the crate everyday without fail.

Its not crunch time at the point where I am either going to have to give up my flat, give up my job, or give up my dog...

I hope someone can offer me some advice? I wanted to try getting an companion for him but my other half is refusing on getting another dog and I don't know anyone with a smaller dog who I could test it with.

Please help me, I don't know what else to do!


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## cornelius121

so sweet picture of dogs. i like it..


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## Ingrid25

i wish i read this before my archie ran away he ran away because of spearation anxiety while we were on holiday :sad: :cryin: :crying:


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## busterjo

I have a 6 month Shih tzu, Buster, :smile5: Whenever I leave him which is at the moment never longer then 3 hours ,he whines and barks, its so heart breaking! I have to leave him in my bathroom as I also have a cat who is learning to sharing the house with him. I would not want to let him have the run of the house because of dangers and cat! I have once set a tape recorder up to hear him and he does settle down after 10 15 minutes and sleep for an hour but whines again for 10 minutes then sleep. He seems to whine and pine more then bark.
Should I be worried about him or is this something he will grow out of?? I am hoping that when he is not a puppy and chewing etc will been gone he can then be in the house. I am worried he think I am horrid everytime I put him into the bathroom!
Thanks


----------



## Abe23

Hi guys, I am so glad I joined this community! I would like to thank you for this valuable thread.. I am currently into separation anxiety situation with my dog, since the day that we left him because I need to go to the hospital to give birth. I'm so glad I've read your posts. I'm still on the process of teaching him and introducing him our baby, because he tends to get jealous whenever he sees us holding our baby..


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## Nat28

Hey all, i know it sounds silly but im so glad to know im not the only one going through having a pup with sa. He is 5 month old. Iv got a dap collar and plug in and a thunder shirt. I also have started going outside ranging from 30 secs to a few minutes then coming back in and ignoring him until he calms down on his greeting me. He whines and howls when i leave my neighbour has mentioned it. Its got to the point i cant eve go to a dentist app without worrying and rushing back. I also have to work so he is left for 2 hours until my boyfriend comes home. Its getting me down  please help


----------



## DobermannZoe

Wow Very good read, My Dobermann Zeus whos 9 months has started to cry when I get my coat on so I will get practising! Thank you!


----------



## Ponge69

Hi all,

I have 2 10month old pups who are great but the bitch gets very upset when I go upstairs. She doesn't get whine or bark when we are at work and it is only my leaving to go upstairs that bothers her. Even if the whole family are in the room she still doesnt like me going.

I assume it is because she knows Im around but doesnt know where or maybe she's worried the bath might have got me, which is the only thing the dogs are allowed upstairs for.

Any ides's as its so distressing to see a normally happy dog get so upset just because I've left the room.

Thanks

Angie


----------



## CockersIndie

hi,

really excellent thread thank you so much! im just about to start on the very first stage- the magazine read! if she starts crying in the 2 minutes im reading for what should i do? ignore and return when she's quiet?


----------



## jennymurphy2001

I recently got a rescued 7 month old wheaten terrier. At first, she seemed to do very well when I had to leave the house for a short period of time. The foster family she stayed with for 2 weeks had got her crate trained, which was a huge benefit. Unfortunately, last night when I was out for a short period, I received a call that a family member had been taken to hospital and so my Maddy was left for longer than planned. When I got home, she was very distressed and had defecated in her crate. Today when I left for a short period, she was again distressed - I could hear her barking when I left and when I returned. She had urinated in her crate and had bout of diarrhoea. 

Having read through this thread, I have realised that I haven't continued the work started by the foster family in relation to crate training - she would whine/cry if I moved to another room when in her crate, but when out of crate was perfectly happy for me to go to another room or upstairs - didn't follow me or whine. And so I started doing some work on re-establishing the crate as her "safe place", and have seen great results in a short period of time - she remained calm and lying down when I moved into another room for a brief period. If I heard signs that she may be getting upset (increased movement, but before the crying started) I returned to the room she was in, ignored her while reading more posts on this thread until she was again calm and relaxed, and then praise, treat, praise! I was only able to go upstairs for a very short period (upstairs and straight back down again!), but still progress has been made! I was also able to go out the back door and back in the front - she was standing when I got back in, but again reinforced being calm. Thank you so much for putting together this information. I'm going to print out the first few posts and have them on my fridge for ease of access. 

Now, I do have a problem. I have to return to work tomorrow night and am very concerned that she is going to keep the neighbours awake all night. How can I continue to help her get used to being alone, while having to leave her to go to work? Won't leaving her for a long period reinforce her being upset? I can come home in the middle of my shift for about an hour, and am going to take her out for a walk. I am really worried about how she is going to manage, and how my neighbours are going to manage! She won't be locked in the crate for the period I am in work - she will have the run of the hallway with crate open. Any advice you can give will be greatly appreciated.


----------



## suespoon

I need some help too. I, too, have a velcro dog! My gorgeous pup, now aged 17 wks, got spooked one night when put in her crate and now sees it as the devil's hole! She simply will not settle in there. She comes to bed with me - beside, not in! - and sleeps all night, no problem. However, now I have the problem that whenever I try to leave her during the day, she screams the place down if put in her crate. She wee'd in it yesterday, so I think the trauma is increasing. Where would you start? I'd gladly leave her in the house and not in the crate if I could be sure she wouldn't chew or scream her way out! She is only a baby, so I don't want to set her up to fail. Help!!


----------



## a2d3i4

Hi, i think its pretty common when this happens and i have always believed in love and care which all do for sure. And another option if the dog is not ferocious is introduce him to the opposite sex or a pup. this was helpful when i adopted a dog back home.


----------



## little tally

Hi, I just joined this site to get some advice about separation anxiety and this was the first post I came across. The small part of it that I have read has given me a lot of information to take home and use with our pup, but I still intend to read it all!

We got our collie x pup, Frankie, two weeks ago. He is only 13 weeks old but already I am seeing some serious signs of SA which I'm worried about. At first I thought it was normal puppy behaviour, crying at night, getting used to a new home and being away from his litter mates. We got him from a rescue centre and he has been used to the constant companionship of other dogs, and usually a human around a lot of the time.

Since day one we have been using a crate on a night and when we leave the house. He has always been a little bit resistant to going in it but we had seen some improvements, less crying etc. Over the weekend things seem to have taken a turn for the worse... Absolutely point blank refuses to go in, and when he is in he cries and barks and howls and generally makes a huge racket! Last night was the worst so far. He went into the crate at 11.30, I was still awake at 12.30, again at 1.30, then he woke me again at 3am and then my partner got up around 6am this morning when he was howling the place down again.

Last night when I started the routine of getting ready to head up to bed, he was whimpering before I even went near the crate, and he urinated on the kitchen floor. I know that this is a sure fire sign of SA and I'm so concerned that we're going to create a very upset and anxious dog. We have his crate covered to try and make it a den, he has his favourite toys, also a hot water bottle for comfort and the radio playing. I try and reassue him by always saying "be back soon", and so far we have completely resisted going down in the middle of the night, as we refuse to be trained by him! It is getting harder though, and I find myself having anxiety whenever I put him to bed! I really thought we would have seen improvement but it's getting worse, I believe changing from some puppy behaviour to separation anxiety.

I'm willing to try anything to try and reassure our little pup, because I want him to be happy and comfortable and to feel safe in our home. We both work but he is never alone for more than a couple of hours, we have relatives who help out and in every other sense he is a fantastic puppy. Very obedient, barely chews other than his toys, his toilet training is coming along nicely, his social skills are brill and he is even starting to make friends with our two grumpy cats!

I will read through as many posts as I can to try and get some tips. We just really want to nip this in the bud whilst he is little and try to improve things for both his sake and our sanity! Do you think that his life to date in a rescue environment may have anything to do with it? Also, we don't want to encourage him upstairs but he has escaped up there a couple of times and we have found him snoozing under our bed, very chilled out and relaxed! Ideas about this? I was considering a baby gate at the bottom of the stairs and a bed in the hall way, so he isn't so far removed, but would he just howl at the bottom of the stairs all night???

So sorry for this enormous post, but I've been racking my brains for what to try next and any advice would be welcomed with open arms!

Thanks, tally xx


----------



## little tally

Hi, I just joined this site to get some advice about separation anxiety and this was the first post I came across. The small part of it that I have read has given me a lot of information to take home and use with our pup, but I still intend to read it all!

We got our collie x pup, Frankie, two weeks ago. He is only 13 weeks old but already I am seeing some serious signs of SA which I'm worried about. At first I thought it was normal puppy behaviour, crying at night, getting used to a new home and being away from his litter mates. We got him from a rescue centre and he has been used to the constant companionship of other dogs, and usually a human around a lot of the time.

Since day one we have been using a crate on a night and when we leave the house. He has always been a little bit resistant to going in it but we had seen some improvements, less crying etc. Over the weekend things seem to have taken a turn for the worse... Absolutely point blank refuses to go in, and when he is in he cries and barks and howls and generally makes a huge racket! Last night was the worst so far. He went into the crate at 11.30, I was still awake at 12.30, again at 1.30, then he woke me again at 3am and then my partner got up around 6am this morning when he was howling the place down again.

Last night when I started the routine of getting ready to head up to bed, he was whimpering before I even went near the crate, and he urinated on the kitchen floor. I know that this is a sure fire sign of SA and I'm so concerned that we're going to create a very upset and anxious dog. We have his crate covered to try and make it a den, he has his favourite toys, also a hot water bottle for comfort and the radio playing. I try and reassue him by always saying "be back soon", and so far we have completely resisted going down in the middle of the night, as we refuse to be trained by him! It is getting harder though, and I find myself having anxiety whenever I put him to bed! I really thought we would have seen improvement but it's getting worse, I believe changing from some puppy behaviour to separation anxiety.

I'm willing to try anything to try and reassure our little pup, because I want him to be happy and comfortable and to feel safe in our home. We both work but he is never alone for more than a couple of hours, we have relatives who help out and in every other sense he is a fantastic puppy. Very obedient, barely chews other than his toys, his toilet training is coming along nicely, his social skills are brill and he is even starting to make friends with our two grumpy cats!

I will read through as many posts as I can to try and get some tips. We just really want to nip this in the bud whilst he is little and try to improve things for both his sake and our sanity! Do you think that his life to date in a rescue environment may have anything to do with it? Also, we don't want to encourage him upstairs but he has escaped up there a couple of times and we have found him snoozing under our bed, very chilled out and relaxed! Ideas about this? I was considering a baby gate at the bottom of the stairs and a bed in the hall way, so he isn't so far removed, but would he just howl at the bottom of the stairs all night???

So sorry for this enormous post, but I've been racking my brains for what to try next and any advice would be welcomed with open arms!

Thanks, tally xx


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## Barkley Star

My two girls are 2.5 years old soon and have over the last 6 months or so become even more attached to eachother (for reasons that are fairly clear to us). They are fine if left alone together, but can't bear being left at home when the other one is away (like when I take one to dog club), even if one of us is there for company. 

We want to sort this out before it gets worse, but I'm not 100% sure how to go about it. I was thinking of starting with just taking one dog outside, then in and swap dogs, and do that for a couple of minutes at a time until they are fine with it. Then longer times apart, and where they can't see eachother (like around the house from front to back door or something. Perhaps we should take them out on separate walks but at the same time, me gokng in one direction and my partner in the other?


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## leashedForLife

Barkley Star said:


> My two girls are ... are fine if left alone together, but can't bear being left at home when the other one
> is away (like when I take one to dog club), even if one of us is there for company.


this is NOT sep-anx - 
please read threads before posting to them?  i'd start a new one, under _dog training & behavior,_

but titled, "our 2 dogs are over-attached", or "our sibling-dogs are over-attached", 
or some variation thereof. Good luck. :001_smile:


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## DHumph

Absolutely brilliant post, really helpful and with tips and advice I need to use.myself with my new puppy!


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## Barkley Star

leashedForLife said:


> this is NOT sep-anx -
> please read threads before posting to them?  i'd start a new one, under _dog training & behavior,_
> 
> but titled, "our 2 dogs are over-attached", or "our sibling-dogs are over-attached",
> or some variation thereof. Good luck. :001_smile:


I did read the previous posts, the whole thread in fact, before posting. What we experience also matches the first couple of posts on what SA is and how it is manifested, at least from the way I read it. The screaming, pacing and sock sucking for instance, as well as the being velcro dogs to eachother.

But if this doesn't count as SA, then maybe the first post should be very clear on what type of problems are "allowed" in the thread.


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## leashedForLife

Barkley Star said:


> I did read the previous posts, the whole thread in fact, before posting.


from page-4, ONE of many posts explaining what Sep-Anx is, & is not:



leashedForLife said:


> response to a query re problem-behaviors [urinating, chewing] when home solo -
> Separation Anxiety Question for Dr. McConnell, Dog Training Tips at Patricia McConnell
> 
> there are hyperlinks within the text for more-specific info.
> 
> what sep-anx Is & Isn't, how to help prevent it, some ways to reduce it -
> Separation Anxiety in Dogs - PAWS Chicago - Chicago's largest No Kill humane and adoption organization


SUGG: 
go to the *links & read the material.*


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## rubyblacklab

I have seen this in horses. I use Cool, Calm & Collected on my mare who was terrible! She is now a totally different horse! It's saved me a fortune as it costs pence! They also do a version for dogs! Check them out


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## Barkley Star

leashedForLife said:


> from page-4, ONE of many posts explaining what Sep-Anx is, & is not:
> SUGG:
> go to the *links & read the material.*


Right, I have looked over the posts and links again, and what we experience is still ticking many of the "Is SA" boxes and *none* of the "Isn't SA" boxes. So never mind and we'll just have a go at following the many of the posted advice on how to tackle SA anyway.


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## leashedForLife

rubyblacklab said:


> I have seen this in horses. I use Cool, Calm & Collected on my mare who was terrible!
> She is now a totally different horse! It's saved me a fortune as it costs pence!
> They also do a version for dogs! Check them out


SO FAR, R-B-L, U have recommended this for: 
- a fearful hound, 
- a Golden who was resource-guarding,
- & now, a dog whose owner claims has sep-anx.

U also claim that calcium-deficiency is the root of fearful behavior in many dogs, something that in over 
30-years in dogs, i have yet to hear from anyone else...

& that a calcium-supplement "cured" Ur 'terrible' mare --- of some unspecified but awful problem 
behavior. :glare: Color me skeptical. :skep: Does it also cure cancer & extend lifespan?

Do U sell "Cool, Calm & Collected"?


----------



## rubyblacklab

leashedForLife said:


> SO FAR, R-B-L, U have recommended this for:
> - a fearful hound,
> - a Golden who was resource-guarding,
> - & now, a dog whose owner claims has sep-anx.
> 
> U also claim that calcium-deficiency is the root of fearful behavior in many dogs, something that in over
> 30-years in dogs, i have yet to hear from anyone else...
> 
> & that a calcium-supplement "cured" Ur 'terrible' mare --- of some unspecified but awful problem
> behavior. :glare: Color me skeptical. :skep: Does it also cure cancer & extend lifespan?
> 
> Do U sell "Cool, Calm & Collected"?


This is a blog to share experiences and discover what has worked for other pet owners. I am simply sharing what has worked for me, my horse and dogs. Everyone has their opinion. I have simply discovered an alternative explanation and the science is very sound.

People can spend a fortune one "behaviourists", vets and training but I have happened to come across a very low cost method that has finally worked for me (I have tried a lot of calmers at great expense!).

If you wish to scientifically explain an alternative method, I am all ears. I feel its like saying children act up because they are just badly behaved (some of them are Im sure) but some act out because of what they eat (or more importantly, what they dont eat!). Hey, people said the earth was flat until we knew better. If people don't push the boundaries, we would never learn.

I hope what has worked for me could help others...


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## rosie 1994

thanks so much for posting this. kai is showing 3-4 signs of sa. i'll try following your advice and see if it helps  x


----------



## maximas dog

hi I'v been reading your post and not sure if Max is suffering SA. Since we got him he's never been allowed to the top two floors but has the run of the bottom two its a tall thin house with the back door in the cellar. But he has started winning if I go up stairs at all even when my OH or daughter are sat in the room with him. He is fine if anyone leaves through the front door but also wines if anyone goes out of the back door including the cat which causes a slight issue as her cat flap is in the back door as the front opens onto a busy road, we take him out the back for walks in the area for the same reason and garden time. But he does go out of the front if we are going anywhere in the car this being less frequent. We use the same tactics with him no matter which way I/we leave the room, he has his comforter (a blanket that we have had on the bed) and a small selection of toys and we don't make a fuss or say good bye just tell him to go to his bed and give him his Kong or chosen toy/s and usually leave a couple more toys/treats around the room/kitchen to prevent boredom. But this only seems to distract him when we go out the front. There's no real destruction unless we leave anything in reach that smells of food but I think most dogs are like that?! He just wines 

Any idea if it is SA and would the plug ins, stair gates and short burst of time help?


----------



## masueuk1

Hi all

Max is 11, a rescue labrador who we adopted when he was 7 and 1/2. Until last September Max lived happily with our old labrador Sam who was PTS aged 16 1/4 yrs. This is when we made the big mistake. We were in the process of moving so allowed Max to sleep in our bedroom. He did show signs of SA when we left him but by making a few changes, he has overcome his anxiety when we leave and is quite calm when we return. Now to the problem. We are hoping to get a new puppy, who is 3 weeks old tomorrow. So we have just over a month to sort out the problem. 

Max stayed with my sister overnight on Friday, he barked all night, despite being with her lab (2 yr old girl) in the kitchen. So we agreed that if he needs to stay over again, we will have to sort out this problem. Saturday night he was downstairs in our kitchen and barked solidly all night. At this point I hadnt found this site and believed that leaving him was the right thing to do. Sunday night he barked all night long. We put a stair gate in the kitchen door last night hoping that the lack of a closed door might help. Nope, he still barked all night. 

So, what to do. I have DAP plug in and spray and rescue remedy and will try them tonight. When I got my old lab as a puppy it was the days of leave them to whine and they will learn to be quiet, but now it seems that the advice is to keep pup in bedroom for first couple of nights and gradually move to kitchen. If I move pup in how can I hope to keep Max in the kitchen sleeping quietly. We are going to see the puppy on Friday after looking for one for several months. 

Max is insured so I could get a behaviourist but I am worried about timings etc. 

I have read through most of the posts but any help on this would be really helpful


----------



## Dylano

Hi I just recently got a 8 week gsd puppy. I purchased him 4 and a half days ago and I'm quite confused and struggling to decide what the problem is with him.
Since I have got him he has not been alone for more then 5 mins. When we are no around or when he has to sleep he is in an indoor run which has a puppy kong blanket and crate (always open but he doesn't use)
Issues are as follows
1) when ever I put him in the indoor run he cries and barks 
2) when ever I leave to room he sits outside the door I've jut excited 
3) follows me around the living room

When he is sleepy/not active he does not follow me when I leave the room. When he I asleep (deep sleep)and I go out the room and he sees me go out te room he will just go back to sleep 

What can I do to allow him to be okay when he's alone
Thanks


----------



## Lisaj

I have read every post on this over the last few days and wanted to thank everyone who contributed with things to do. i am dealing with this now on a rescue dog - it's working slowly. Fingers crossed!


----------



## Janey D

Hi, I have read this the whole way through and there is some really useful info so thank you. Our 2 yo rescue dog was abandoned and found roaming around in quite a poor way by a dog warden. After adopting him the Rescue Centre advised us not to leave him at home on his own for the first 2 weeks then build it up very slowly. We have had him a week and his is glued to me, although he is OK if I go out and leave him with my husband and settles well on a night.

I feel better prepared now if we do have any problems and will follow the advice on here. At the moment I am ignoring him if he follows me from room to room and trying to not give him any attention so that I dont encourage this.


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## russelgrane

sue&harvey said:


> *Separation Anxiety in Dogs *
> 
> There has been loads of people asking for advice about this recently, so I thought I would try and put some information all in one place. Please feel free to add any further advice
> 
> *Separation Anxiety Definition *:- The term separation anxiety is not exclusive to dogs or even to veterinary medicine. It is a psychological term to describe the stress and anxiousness in an individual brought on by the leaving (perceived or imagined) of another individual. In the case of a pet, it is usually an anxiety brought on by separation from the primary pet caretaker. In the case of humans, anxiety in a child from being separated from a parent.
> 
> What classifies as a "separation"? This varies greatly between animals: some must have "their person" within their line of sight, other pets are fine as long as the owner is within a comfortable distance (i.e. somewhere else in the house), and still others are fine until the owner leaves. Even finer distinctions would be animals that are fine for a certain period of time after their owner leaves, but then start to show signs of anxiousness some time later.
> 
> Just like the variance in what stresses out each individual, the signs of separation anxiety vary greatly as well.
> 
> *Which Dogs can be effected by Separation Anxiety:-* The answer to this is ANY! There are some breeds believed to be prone to SA. Some of these are German Shepherds, Airedales, Springer Spaniels, Australian Shepherds and Weimaraners, to name a few. This is not to say all of these dogs will not cope being left alone, as with all dogs it will vary greatly depending on the individual.
> 
> Plus a higher number of dogs that come from a shelter or rescue home, seem to develop dog separation anxiety easily. These dogs might have gone through some severe trauma, or abandonment before ending up in the shelter and once they are placed in a home with an owner they can trust, they will start relying on that owner a lot faster than dogs that haven't experienced any trauma in their life already.
> Pups that leave their litter too early are also predisposed to SA.
> 
> *How to prevent your new puppy, or dog from being affected by Separation Anxiety *:- Owners need to help their dog, or puppy to find a happy medium between companionship and becoming sufficiently independent to tolerate being alone for periods of time. Dogs do not electively engage in anxious behaviours. They develop over a period of time, and becomes a panic response. People must condition their dogs to stay calm when left alone. To condition means to get the dog used to specific things, situations and events. That's why it's important to practice leaving and returning to the dog frequently, starting when you first bring the dog into your home and family.
> 
> Teach your dog from the start that your leaving the house is an ordinary, regular event. Help your dog build tolerance for your departures and absences. Calm departures and homecomings will help the dog to relax. When leaving do not have emotional goodbyes, this will not help the dog .
> 
> *Mummy*  _ahh poor baby, will you miss mummy?_ Kiss Kiss Kiss _Dont worry mummy be back soon_
> 
> *Puppy *Wheres she going, why all this fuss, that thing they call a coat, she only puts that on when she goes outside I wanna go! Dont want to stay on my own!!! *Panic Response Alert !!!*
> 
> The same applies for your return. Take your coat off unpack the shopping, open your mail, then when the dog is calm let them outside to toilet. (Still not spoken to him) When he had been to the loo, then you can give him praise and a little play session.
> 
> When you first bring home your bundle of fluff and needle sharp teeth, let them explore the outside area first ( get them used to going outside, it will help when toilet training, and big fuss for toileting outside.) Then take them inside letting them explore their new kingdom in stages.
> 
> Have the dog's bed and bowl of water ready in a safe, well-lighted, comfortable confined area with "family smells", such as a gated-off kitchen, family room or crate placed in a family area. (Do not confine in basements, garages, storage rooms, or other non-family areas). This nice "den" will be the place in which she will stay when you are not home to supervise. Take her to that place, tell her lie down (guide her if she has not yet learned that command). Then give her one or two safe chew toys and praise her. Couple a food treat with the verbal praise. In fact, it's helpful to keep a small bag of tiny tipbit treats on you at all times during the acclimation and training phases.
> 
> Next, close the door or gate to the room or crate, and step back. See if she is staying calm. Resist the urge to talk to the dog, since that will distract her from this desired, calm, relaxed behaviour. ( He should be shattered from his trip to his new home, and all that exploring)
> 
> If she stays reasonably calm when separated from you for a minute or two, let her stay there as long as she seems comfortable. (See thread Cages in Dog Chat) If the dog is good in her confined area, this is a very good sign. You can begin to add calm, quiet verbal praise and an occasional food treat to this acclimation routine as a reward for being good and calm in her confined area.
> 
> Over the next few days and weeks encourage your new pup or dog to sleep in his safe area. Slowly increase the amount of time they are left. A dog that is left regularly will become well adapted and sufficiently independent to cope with being alone.
> 
> Also install baby gates so you dog learns to accept he cannot access you when ever he wants. He can see you, but cannot always get to you.
> 
> _*Spend time training your dog to happily accept alone time will save you, your dog and you neighbours a lot of stress in the long run! *_


Dog's are smart animals, your dog is to attached to you, not because of his anxiety, he likes to stay with you. To cure this kind of anxiety you try them to leave them alone.


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## Lisaj

I need to share that Bella our rescue dog with seperation anxiety has been great today. We have had her 4 1/2 weeks and been working with her every day. When we got her if she was in a crate / behind a gate or in a different room to us she would panic and cry and bark and freak out. Today I have left the house twice for 10 minutes each time (we have really built this up slowly) and both times she didn't bother at all. I have set up a camera / microphone in the hall that watches the door but records the sound from all of downstairs and she didn't even go to the door once or make 1 sound. I am very pleased - long may it continue. 4 weeks ago i couldn't even go to the loo without having a nervous wreck !!!


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## leashedForLife

russelgrane said:


> Dogs [no apostrophe on plurals] are smart animals[;] *your dog is [too] attached to you,
> not because of [her / his] anxiety*, [but because] *s/he likes to stay with you.
> 
> To cure this... anxiety, you... leave them alone.*


Russell, yer a twit. :nono: Dogs with genuine sep-anx suffer from panic attacks which are severely distressing, 
highly stressful, physically & emotionally exhausting, & can result in SELF-INJURY:

dogs with sep-anx have jumped thru closed upper-story windows, patio-doors, off decks or balconies, 
& died or been severely injured on impact; they break teeth struggling to escape crates or rooms, 
tear up doors & get splinters in paw-pads & palates!, rip-up floors [ditto], rip out the claws on forefeet... 
it's NOT advisable to just _"leave her / him alone, & let the dog get over it."_

they don't get BETTER when left alone to panic & become hysterical - *they get worse.*
sep-anx requires habituation over time, calmatives at the very least, sometimes scrip-meds, 
& always a PLAN - over TIME. It doesn't develop in days or weeks, & it won't go away in days or weeks, 
either.


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## smokeybear

A tip of the week from the Whole Dog Journal by Pat Miller re this subject

Understanding The Triggers of Canine Separation Anxiety
by Pat Miller 
Have you ever had the misfortune of walking into your house to find overturned furniture, inches-deep claw gouges on door frames, blood-stained tooth marks on window sills, and countless messages on your answering machine from neighbors complaining about your dog barking and howling for hours on end in your absence? If so, you're probably familiar with the term "separation anxiety" - a mild label for a devastating and destructive behavior.

Dogs are naturally inclined to become anxious when left alone. Many well-intentioned but misguided owners of new dogs inadvertently set the stage for SA by doing all the wrong things when they first bring their new dog home.

For example, lots of families adopt their new dog or puppy at the beginning of the summer, when the kids will be home to spend a lot of time with him. Other new-dog parents may take several days off from work, or at least arrange to bring the dog home on a Friday afternoon so they have the entire weekend to help the new kid settle in. On its face, this is a thoughtful approach to acclimating the dog to his new life. What better way to help him feel comfortable and welcome than to give him a couple of days of your loving company?

It's true that spending extra time with the newcomer can help smooth the transition for him, but unless you take some important precautions, you could be setting him up for a rude awakening on Monday morning when you go back to work, leaving him alone all day to wonder and worry the pack is ever coming back to rescue him from solitary confinement.

For more details and advice on ways to prevent and cure canine separation anxiety, purchase Whole Dog Journal's ebook, Separation Anxiety.

It's probably you not the dog!


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## gsddrake

Hi just joined and a very interesting thread,our main problem is only occurring when we are all out together and the dog is on the lead,I can leave him[alpha male perhaps, with no problem] but if my wife or 9yr old boy goes more than about 10 feet away we get a very high pitched un-gsd alarm bark -he does also do rapturous welcomes home, but save raiding the bin well behaved when we have to leave him home alone,any advice much welcomed as we're struggling to take him with us to any where that we would need to have him on a lead.


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## william04

My Pet Dog Showing abnormal behavior, not following instructions ,barks unusually. Any Solution?


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## leashedForLife

gsddrake said:


> ...I can leave him [*alpha male* perhaps] with no problem, but if my wife or 9yr old boy goes
> more than about 10 feet away...


Sugg: 
ditch the Alpha-male hooey. 


gsddrake said:


> ... save raiding the bin, [he is] well-behaved when we... leave him home alone...


then this isn't sep-anx, which is the thread topic. 

Sugg: 
start a new thread, in the *Behavior & Training* sub-forum.


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## trixx214

I had the same issue and found this, thought that it might become helpful to you as well: *3 Mistakes To Avoid in Dog Training*


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## leashedForLife

*3 Mistakes To Avoid in Dog Training* is not only a CRAP article, 
but it's *off the topic* of this thread - it has nothing whatever to do with sep-anx. :thumbdown:

i'd skip that link - badly-written & bad advice, too.


----------



## william04

leashedForLife said:


> *3 Mistakes To Avoid in Dog Training* is not only a CRAP article,
> but it's *off the topic* of this thread - it has nothing whatever to do with sep-anx. :thumbdown:
> 
> i'd skip that link - badly-written & bad advice, too.


Agree! I required Some specific Information's not general one.


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## kts

i use to have trouble with my dogs behavior all the time until i found this( cure dog anxiety.kmmakers.com)..some good info there really helped me. ne1 having problems with there pet should get this..


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## calol

iam having trouble with my two with separation issues and they tick all the boxes you have said. i really need help with this now. they are still only 9 months. they follow me everywhere in the house + yesterday got a phone call in work from next door neighbour to say my two in her garden!! they chewed through the fence an got through the hole. i my two dearly and want to help as much as poss.


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## smokeybear

http://www.apbc.org.uk/system/files/private/advice_sheet_6_home_alone.pdf

http://www.deesdogs.com/documents/separationanxiety.pdf

http://www.deesdogs.com/documents/teachingyourdogtostayhomealone.pdf

Separation Anxiety - Canine Style | Animal Behavior and Medicine Blog | Dr. Sophia Yin, DVM, MS

ClickerSolutions Training Articles -- Separation Anxiety

ACVC 2001 - Separation Anxiety in Dogs

http://www.clickertraining.com/node/1556

http://www.clickertraining.com/node/3291

http://www.apdt.co.uk/documents/Homealone_000.pdf

I'll Be Home Soon y by Patricial McConell
Don't Leave Me, by Nicola Wilde


----------



## leashedForLife

GeorgeP said:


> "Curing Dog Separation Anxiety" [link]
> 
> ...if we had... found this *site* earlier, it would have saved us a lot of wasted time
> trying so many different things. [snip]
> 
> George.


George, 
[bet that's not a real name!], that's not a SITE - it's a SALES PITCH for a book, not helpful things to do - 
which BTW this thread offers, free of charge. 

they also list these symptoms for sep-anx: 


> Does your dog whine or bark incessantly?
> Does your dog pace, chew furniture, destroy window coverings, rip up carpeting, eat through drywall, mutilate plants or scratch at windows and doors?
> Does your dog injure itself through its destructive behavior?
> Does your dog jump on you and your guests? This often leads to ruined and dirty clothes and can even result in scratched skin.
> Does your dog get jealous and growl or attack people near you... this can include small children... who love to pet "any" dog?


As anyone can clearly see, 80% of that isn't sep-anx at all! this is pure bunkum. 
Go away, SPAMMER. :thumbdown:


----------



## beetle22

I used to have a labrador that came to me with established anxiety seperation at 13 weeks, this is what I did with him to make being alone okay for him. I started by telling him to go on his bed for 10 minutes, and during this time I clicked him and gave him treats every 30 seconds. I did this whilst near him a few times throughout the day.

I then gradually progressed to telling him to stay on his bed whilst I walked out of the door way and returned every 30 secs to click and treat him. My lab was happy to stay on his bed as he knew rewards would follow. Each day I went further and further out of his sight and returned after 30 seconds, then 1 minute, 2 minutes, 5 minutes and clicked and treated him.

After many repetitions and extending the time between clicks and treats, It wasn't long before I was able to walk upstairs whilst he stayed downstairs on his bed. I could walk to the front door and he stayed put as he knew I would return.

By associating my coming and going with something tastey my labrador was content to be alone and had no idea how it happened. I also went out of the front door, then the back door and would stay out building up to 5 minutes, then 10 and so on.

When I went out with my family for the evening, I left him with a buster cube and other toys he could play with. I didn't stroke him or give him eye contact when I left the house as I had taught him, that me coming and going was no big deal.


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## beetle22

There isn't a quick fix for anxiety-separation, it takes time and consistency. I never thought my Labrador would change but he did after many repetitions of click and treat when I left the room and came back.


----------



## EC 06

Hi, I have a 14mth old cocker spaniel bitch who is suffering from SA.It started at about 5mths old when we thought she was teething, she first started chewing on the carpet in the hall then progressed to the walls on the upstairs landing and then the stair carpet, but this was not when we were out but did this in the early hours of the morning( from about 5am) while we were in bed !.
She is now put in a pen with our 5yr old Field spaniel at night or when we go out, she did chew anything in the pen with them i.e. toys bed or blanket but has now stopped the chewing but she has started to cry and/or howls and jumps up and down from about 6am until she is let out.We also have this behaviour when we return home if I have been out shopping, I do not work so in most of the day with them both. The vet suggested to ignore her until she stops the jumping and howling before letting her out which I have started but this can go on for quite a few minutes and think my neighbours maybe getting a bit fed up.!The next line we have talked about is using 'Nutricalm' has anyone else used this ?


----------



## laurahair

I adopted an ex-racer greyhound last week and she suffers with seperation anxiety, in fact she was returned from her previous home because of it.
However in the last 6 days we have seen huge improvements already, by being firm and consistent, not making a fuss of going out and not making a fuss coming back. The first night she whined and howled most of the night-last night she did a little howling on and off for about 10 mins at about 12ish 

Lots of great advice on this thread, much appreciated by me (and my beautiful hound Tess who will be much happier for this issue being sorted!).


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## leashedForLife

beetle22 said:


> I [had] a Lab [who] came to me with *established anxiety seperation* (sic) at 13-weeks [of age]...


Sep-anx doesn't occur in 13-WO pups; the earliest age of onset is at least 9-MO & it's very rare then, 
the average age of Dx is 15-MO to 3-YO.

Sep-anx is a panic attack when the humans leave; it takes repeated incidents to trigger a genuine panic, 
& altho young pups do show *separation distress* when solo [whining, distress calls, metronomic yaps, 
older-pups are unable to settle, or neonates crawl about sniffing for Mom & sibs, etc], it's not the same thing.

The primary symptom of sep-anx is ESCAPE! :yikes:, in order to find their person / a human. 
Dogs affected will dig at floor-surfaces, chew crate-doors, gnaw window sills like k9-beavers, etc.


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## Laursy4

I've got a 16 week old puppy who seems to becoming a little demon. He's always wanted to know where we are. Mum says its getting a little extreme now. The other day I left him for an hour and he had shredded his news paper. I'd left him for an hour, the next day I left him for 5 hours whilst I worked and he was fine. He generally likes to play with newspaper anyway. Last night mum had a bath to come down and find he had her iPhone in his mouth, been all over the sofa (he's not allowed on it) and had a wee in the kitchen on his newspaper after a dry day. Have we got a puppy developing signs of SA or just a puppy who is pushing our limits to see what he can get away with?


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## leashedForLife

Laursy4 said:


> I've got a *16 week old puppy who seems to becoming a little demon.*
> He's always wanted to know where we are. Mum says its getting a little extreme now.
> 
> The other day I left him for an hour, & he'd shredded his newspaper.


Since when is an un-supervised puppy getting into things U don't want them to get into, 
_"a little demon"?_ :devil: Sounds to me more like lousy management, 
rather than a "bad" puppy. :nono:

Was he properly confined? 
Did he have other apropos things to do? 
[food-stuffed frozen or welded Kong, solid-rubber or solid-nylon chew-toys, a food puzzle, 
very-solid edible chews such as bully-sticks AKA freeze-dried bull penis, ...]?

if he wasn't in a puppy-PROOF area with nothing he could chew, eat, scratch, dirty, or otherwise damage, 
& WITHOUT access to things he shouldn't mess with, yet =With!= things he should have as apropos 
pacifiers & time-sucking devices, the *humans* - not the 4-MO pup - screwed-up. 


Laursy4 said:


> ...the next day I left him for 5-hours [while at work], & he was fine.


And this proves ____ ?


Laursy4 said:


> He generally likes to play with newspaper anyway.
> 
> Last night mum had a bath, [then came] down [to] find *he had her iPhone in his mouth, been all over
> the sofa* (*he's not allowed on it*) *& *[*he'd pee'd] on his newspaper after [being] dry [all] day.*


 - he went on the newspaper - Whddaya want? 
he's 4-MO / 16-WO; a human infant would have EIGHTEEN MONTHS of diapers, still ahead. :mad5:

- WHy the H#!! did she leave her cell-phone where the pup could reach it?!
Better yet, why was it in the same SPACE as the puppy? 

- if he's "not allowed on the sofa", WHY is he in the room with the sofa, =alone=?
Use a baby-gate, a shipping-crate [airline-approved type preferred], a CLOSED door, etc.


Laursy4 said:


> *Have we got a puppy developing signs of SA *
> or *just a puppy who's pushing our limits to see what he can get away with?*


IMO?

Answer D - 
U have neither of the above. Ur pup is still 2-mos from puberty, at which time 
he'll be approx-equal to a 12-YO kid, so now, he might be the approx-equivalent of a 9-YO boy. 
HE'S NOT REBELLIOUS. He's unsupervised in an environment with more "forbidden objects" 
than it has puppy-apropos toys!

Q:
would U leave a 5-YO kid alone, in a roomful of incredibly-expensive electronics - 
Then bitch AT THE KID for "playing with" them, & inevitably breaking them or messing-up 
programs?

This is the precise analogy. :sosp:

Suggestions: 
buy a used airline-approved crate that will fit the pup as an adult.

Install baby-gates to keep him away from forbidden objects that can't be put in a closet
[the bed, the sofa, the stuffed bison, the Sunday roast out to thaw...].

STOP letting him have more 'freedom' than he can handle; More monitoring, less "blame the dog". :nono:

Yes, i'm being blunt: It's whoever's fault that left the pup at large. It's the HUMAN's fault - 
don't lay it on the dog, he's not the one who bought home an iPhone & left it on the coffee-table! :incazzato:

[/end-Rant] Whew! i feel better, now. :laugh:


----------



## laurahair

2 weeks on from my last post i thought i'd update as I am dealing with a 5 yr old bitch who has a history of SA, was returned to rescue because of repeated peeing in the house, howling, scratching at doors etc.

She still panics but nowhere near the same extent as before. Nights are now peaceful, we have had the odd bit of howling but as I have no curtain at my back door who knows what she saw in the garden? Not concerned about that at all.

When I go out on school runs, shopping etc she is always asleep when i return whether I have been out for 15 mins or an hour, and one day I unexpectedly found myself out for 4 hours and returned to an intact kitchen 
She still goes mad when I return, but calms down quicker. The ignoring on return has been difficult for us as the kids are genuinely excited to see her after a day at school, however her anxiety is aimed at me leaving her so I don't think it is setting us back too far.

She has improved so much within 4 weeks, much more than I would have expected. I feel so sad for her that previous owners couldn't achieve what I have, but equally very grateful to have such a lovely animal in my family!

I hope this gives hope for people dealing with SA in older rescue dogs-it can be overcome 

Oh and thus far the damage caused has been: bin destroying (my fault, shouldn't have left it in there with her), fridge raiding (ok that was annoying and a little bit expensive) and some scratches on the door. She is a relatively big greyhound so I think we have got off lightly


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## Savvy20

I'm glad I read this, my dog has SA and its really hard to cope with, will try some of the tips tho x


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## OESD owner

Definitely agree that keeping in mind that a dog suffering from SA is seriously unhappy is the right place from which to deal with the behavioural symptoms. Also that medication should be used as a last resort.


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## leashedForLife

OESD owner said:


> Definitely agree... that a dog suffering from SA is seriously unhappy, is the right place from which to deal
> with the behavioural symptoms.


:yesnod: Wholeheartedly agree.



OESD owner said:


> Also that medication should be used as a last resort.


Why? 
Doesn't that depend upon how serious the behavior is? 
Dogs who literally are at-risk of killing themselves may need scrip-meds immediately, & the sooner 
the better, IMO. :thumbsup: Doesn't mean i think drugs should be handed out like penny-candy!

I had one client who refused to use DAP pump-spray, referring to it as 'a drug'. 
 Hunh? It's a synthetic mimic of Mom's lactation-pheromone for young nursing-age pups, 
which helps them to _relax & nurse_ when Mom-dog is present, maximizing an opp to feed quietly, 
vs stress-out & miss a meal while she's in the nest. If that's a 'drug', so is the pheromone in humans 
responsible for the "dormitory effect" where all the fertile-age females get their menses synchronized 
with other women, when they share a living space.  Drug, me old Aunt-Mabel... sheesh.

Calmatives can be very helpful, & are often OTC [no Rx needed] plus extremely safe.
see post # 22 on the _"Dog Body-Language"_ sticky for specifics of What, Where, When, & How.


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## Walney Bill

Posted this somewhere else on the forum earlier but it probably should be on here.........

Newbie here......

Read with interest about seperation anxiety and take in and do most of what is noted about not making a big deal leaving or arriving, changing the way I leave, front door / back door etc but I have a problem which I haven't seen here so far.

Our dog is very very clingy to me, the velcro dog I have seen noted somewhere. The problem we have is I work in the oil and gas business and have in the last year returned to a 28 days on / 28 days off schedule. My wife and I find that after approx 2-3 weeks of me being away, the dog vomits quite a lot. Obviously he is taken to the vets and to date, they cannot find anything wrong with him. This has been going on since April 2012. Upon my return, he is fine again. No problems, no vomitting, sickness or anything.

I suspect its to do with my absence but I'm no expert. the vets can't find anything wrong and cannot explain this vomitting at almost the exact time after each of my departures.

Is it that after the set amount of time he finally thinks....hey, he's really not coming back and has the anxiety attacks?

Keen to hear views on this.

Thanks


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## Walney Bill

For such a popular forum, and having noticed at least a 1000 views to my post, find it a little strange nobody has any views or can offer advice on my post.

Are newbie questions / posts always left unanswered?


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## fluke13

Quick question. It's early days as we have only had our 8 week old pup 3 days but i was wondering if she has SA because at night she will go in her bed fine but it seems when she wakes in the night for a wee(usually every hour or so) she crys until i go to her put her back in her bed and is then ok until she wkes again. I can't ignore her crying as i have a 10 yr old daughter and this would disturb her sleep.Forgot to say she is in the kitchen with a baby gate preventing her for getting out.
Any help would be great.


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## leashedForLife

fluke13 said:


> ...we've only had our *8-WO pup* [for] 3 days but i [wonder] if she has SA...
> 
> at night she'll go [to] bed... but it seems when she wakes in the night for a wee (usually every hour or so)
> she cries until i *go to her, put her back in her bed, & she's then ok until she wakes again. *
> 
> [The pup] is in the kitchen, with a baby gate [to confine her].


 - she doesn't have Sep-Anx; if U'd read the thread, the average age of onset is 15 to 18-mos.

- she's an INFANT - take her into the bedroom, set up a shipping crate & put her in it without bedding, 
& set the alarm for 3-AM every night before U sleep.

Read the *housetraining sticky* for more suggestions - Good luck.


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## fluke13

leashedForLife said:


> - she doesn't have Sep-Anx; if U'd read the thread, the average age of onset is 15 to 18-mos.
> 
> - she's an INFANT - take her into the bedroom, set up a shipping crate & put her in it without bedding,
> & set the alarm for 3-AM every night before U sleep.
> 
> Read the *housetraining sticky* for more suggestions - Good luck.


Our bedroom is tiny and wouldn't fit a crate in it. She has a soft sided travel crate that she sleeps in with the door open so she can wee on the paper.
Thanks for the reply


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## leashedForLife

fluke13 said:


> Our bedroom is tiny and wouldn't fit a crate...


What breed is this 8-WO pup?

unless she's a giant, a 2-ft long crate, 12 to 15 inches wide, should fit her, 
easily - & it can be used as a bedside table for a lamp, a book, & her leash.

Once she's no longer on a 3-AM pee schedule [generally by 15-WO], she can be moved 
out of the bedroom & into a larger shipping-crate in the hall, then to the kitchen over a week or 10-days, 
moving her a bit each night. She can be fed in her crate - 2 meals a day eaten in it with the door shut 
builds a simple, happy association. She can nap in it, chew a chew-toy, un-stuff a frozen kong, etc.

A shipping-crate is a lifetime of handy use; it's the gold standard for transport safely. 
it's a familiar bedroom when U travel, visit relatives, or [God help us] must evacuate - floods happen, 
so do fires, long-term power outages, & other unplanned events.
:yesnod: cheers, 
- terry


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## fluke13

She's a Heinz 57 and believe me there is only enough room to walk round the bed but thanks for the advice.


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## leashedForLife

is there a closet with a sliding-door? 
Tuck the crate in there, put shoes on top of it to conserve space, if need be.

i had my Akita's 2-ft x 3-ft x 2-ft crate in my bedroom as a nightstand for years - 
then i moved from the 2-bedroom apt to a 1-bedroom apt, but the crate came along!


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## RobertSelbey

Like the post very much ,
I generally suggest to every person the thing that listen to your dog. Learn to become your dog. If your dog seems to be unpleasant conference another dog, creature or individual, do not require that he say hello. Hes informing you that he is not relaxed for a purpose, and you should regard that. Pushing the problem can often outcome in larger issues down the range.


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## Dexter2009

Hi

My dog is suffering from separation anxiety, I think. I have recently moved into my boyfriends house while my house is up for sale. I have been there for over 8 weeks now but the neighbours have complained saying my dog howls (he is a four year old beagle) from when we leave the house at 08.30 up until 11.00 every day. He never did this at my house according to my neighbour. I leave and return to my boyfriends house at the same time as if I was at my house. He is fed and goes out in the garden before we leave just like at home, he has is bed and all his toys just like at home, nothing in his routine has changed just the house. It has come to the point where I have had to move back into my house to give the neighbours a break but cannot do this for long as my house is up for sale. 


Please help.


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## Colliecross

Havent been able to read the whole of this thread as internet is at work but would be soooooo grateful for any help at all. I think my collie cross mongrel suffers from SA and general anxiety. Sometimes he can be fine for a few months when I go to work but other times he wrecks the house especially the doors. He is now crated, has a DAP plugin, has Zylkene and Stress Less tablets each morning but is still not settled at all. I have tried Rescue Remedy and many other calming remedies. He has the radio on when I go out. He was a rescue and I have had him for five years and battled with these issues the whole time. I come home each dinner time to break his day up, he is walked mornings and evenings and has two other dogs at home with him. He has tried tablets from the vets which work for a while and then dont. I live alone and have to work so can not do the desensitising thing because I can not take that much time off work. He never seems bothered when I get ready to go out but is happier than the other two when I get home or come back in from the bathroom or outside etc. Any advice would be appreciated.


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## ines020287

Hi guys,

I recently got a Shar Pei boy- he's 15 weeks now and since we took him I spent lot of time at home due to my health. I'm going to return to work in about 10 days but my little boy is still far too dependent on me.

I can leave him in his crate in the kitchen, go to the living room and he starts barking, crying and whining... Breaks my heart but being tough for his own good! I then re-enter the kitchen when he's quiet- usually 5-10mins- don't make any fuss of him and wait until he's calm to let him out. I quite often close the door behind me so he can't follow me everywhere- as that's what he does all the time. He still doesn't seem any more settled and independent.

Am I forgetting to do something else? How long should I wait before seeing improvement from him?


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## Babbo

Great advice one of my mini schnauzhers suffers from this from time t time, luckly for her and me im only out 4 hours a day!!

I find a long run off lead and a stuffed kong helps keep her tired and rested while i leave the house ;-)


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## leashedForLife

Colliecross said:


> Havent been able to read the whole of this thread as internet is at work but would be soooooo grateful for any help at all.
> 
> I think my collie-cross ... suffers from SA & general anxiety.


Collies as a group are often sensitive, emotionally & in other ways; they tend to be thin-skinned,
which means most any stimulus gets a reaction [visual, audible, odor, tactile...].

Doesn't mean they're nervous wrecks, by any means! Only that they both notice & respond to stuff 
that more-phlegmatic breeds / types / mixes might just ignore. :shrug:

so yes, it could be sep-anx; it could also be normal collie-reactivity to specific triggers or events, too.
Possibly it's even both - sep-anx under certain circs only [noises off, stormy days, _____ ],
& simply reactive to some event when U're not there at others. :blush2: Really, i'm not trying to be vague;
both can happen in the same dog, & each can be tripped as a response by different stimuli or circs.


Colliecross said:


> ....he can be fine for a few months [while i'm @ work], but other times he wrecks the house, *especially the doors*.


Good clue!

I'd *video-record* his activity, -with- sound, in case it's due to a salesnik or parcel-person 
who knocks at the door when he's home alone, the neighbors are having a row or a party, a car backfires, 
a fire-truck goes by... any of the million & one sounds that can surprise or worry a dog.


Colliecross said:


> He's now crated & has a DAP plug-in, with Zylkene & Stress-Less tabs each morning, but is still not settled...
> 
> I've tried Rescue Remedy and many other calming remedies.
> *He has the radio on when I [am gone].*


Is the radio on whenever U are at home? :huh:

if not, then it's actually a clue that U're gone [or about to leave him - one or t'other]. :nonod:

Sugg:
choose just ONE station that has reliable, low-key, pleasant chat, or happy rhythmic music - 
anything *not* heavy-metal, rap, acid-rock or similar harsh sounds: Swing, 1920s, R&B, light classics...
have it on when U're relaxed & pleasantly occupied, say reading or the telly's on, with the radio in another room.
Be sure it's a low volume, not intrusive, & no 'hate radio' or shock-jock hosts.

He will associate that station with relaxation over about a week or 10-days;
THEN, when it's really well-connected, turn it on before departing but while he's crated. Ignore him 
for the last 10 to 20-mins before actually leaving; Give him a Kong full of frozen goodies to work on, 
& WALK AWAY without any comment. [Skip any yearning good-byes, too.  Just go.]

I'll be back later - but let us know how he's getting on?
cheers, 
- t


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## ggordster

Hi I have a 6 month old American Bulldog and he suffers with SA but the only symptom he has is barking/howling when hes left alone. I have resorted to recording him with the webcam when we leave to monitor his behaviour as we have neighbours from hell that moan about everything and anything. Mostly he is fine for the first hour then after that he starts to whine and bark. I always walk him for 45min-an hour first then give him something good to keep him occupied like a bone/stuffed kong but hes still not happy being left.
I crate him when we go out leave the tv on the blind pulled down etc but nothing helps.
I have concidered getting another dog as a companion (an older dog) has anyone done this and seen results?
I do know my dog follows us around the house and will sit at the bottom of the stairs when we go upstairs. I wondered if i try to stop him following us as much as possible in the house and move his crate into the kitchen instead of the front room will this help boost his confidence and maybe help him cope when hes left?

I dont want to leave him for long in the day as im only out for 4-5 hours max but i am starting to make excuses not to visit family/friends to accomodate the dog and its getting me down.

Any advice would be great


----------



## Julia Leeds

Hi Sue, I have a lurcher terrier cross who we got from the dogs trust 12 years ago. She always used to go to work with my ex husband in the day and was occaisionally left on her own and was fine. I am not with my ex husband anymore but we share custody of her. I have her at weekends and she stays with my ex's girlfriend through the day as they have had a baby.When she does come to me I cant leave her for even 10 minutes as she starts crying and getting very anxious and distressed. She comes everywhere with me even to get my nails done!! The house I have got is a three storey house and she does like to look out of the window normally. My patio doors look onto the garden but I think she likes to see whats going on etc and cant see very much. If I go out at the weekend I leave her at my Mums and shes fine there even if they go out. Is it because shes not used to the house, or is having her at the weekend not a good thing???. I have spoken to my ex with a view of having her full time and will of course make sure shes with someone when I'm at work but what can I do to ease her anxiety when i need to pop out......she has to come everywhere with me. I dont want to leave her alone as the house is rented and the neighbours might not be accomodating....Please any help would be really appreciated, thank you


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## Babbo

I had a dog with this, it takes a lot of love and hard work but great advice ;-)


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## weeziex1

I have a 2 yr.,old Dorkie she is 1/2 Dachshund and 1/2 Yorkie, she has Sa really bad. I am Disabled and don't leave home very often . So whenever I start getting dressed she starts sitting up and whining and shaking like a leaf. I try and ignore her but she continues to cry, I feel so sorry for her. I've carried he to the and he prescribed meds., but it made her sleepy all day and that's not good for her either. I stopped giving it to her. I've decided to try a Thunder Shirt, they claim that they work we'll see, if it doesn't  help I have no idea what I'll do. When I return home and she's so excited to see me I ignore he hoping she'll get the idea that it's ok for me to I'm going to cime home so far no luck. Any ideas you could give would be greatly appreciated.


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## leashedForLife

weeziex1 said:


> Any ideas you could give would be greatly appreciated.


There are 244 posts in this thread.  At the max setting, with 40 posts per page, that's over 6 pages.
Within those 240-odd, *most* are suggestions for B-mod, including links to articles, videos, & books.

i'd start with those. :001_smile:


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## kazters

WOW what a great thread..

Pippin My littlest (springer Spaniel) has always been upset when left from day 1. her first night she howeled, her second she howled and scratched at the kitchen floor/door. but odly it was only at night (neighbours reported nothing during the day when asked) and if you left her in kitchen while you were say in the bath the would do the same thing. the scratching at the floor would go on at night for about 30-min to an hour and then she would settle and as soon as you walke up and start to move around she would start again untill you come down. 

by october, Pippin and WIillow were close enough that i felt happy leaving them together at night (still keep them appart during the day as they both deserve and need a break) and instantly the nighttime scratching and noises stoped. 

However! we are still stuck with as soon as pippin hears you moving around in the morning or going to the loo during the night she starts up again. She will stop (during the night) or if Willow barks at her. but would love a tip to stop this as she is now one (well just yesterday).


----------



## weeziex1

To kazters 
I know how you feel, I really don't have a idea except are you acknowleging pippin during the night. Maybe if you ignore her instead of trying to get her to stop all scratching during the nite, you know what they say any attention is better than none. I know with out thinking your half asleep and sometimes we make more noise than they do trying to quite them.
I know that's what my Dad used to tell my Mom . I hope this helps. Louise


----------



## kazters

weeziex1 said:


> To kazters
> I know how you feel, I really don't have a idea except are you acknowleging pippin during the night. Maybe if you ignore her instead of trying to get her to stop all scratching during the nite, you know what they say any attention is better than none. I know with out thinking your half asleep and sometimes we make more noise than they do trying to quite them.
> I know that's what my Dad used to tell my Mom . I hope this helps. Louise


Hello, thanks for your reply
we dont go down during the night. even when we got her at first and she was sleeping alone we didnt go down, she had to learn to settle herself. (wasnt being mean to her, willow wasnt ready to sleep with her for months, they are inseprable now though)

she only makes a noise if you get up to go to loo... and she usualy stops once you are settled back in bed. its when you wake up in the morning and get out of bed she starts, and there really is no way around going down as she and willow sleep in the kitchen.


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## Ljec88

This is a brilliant thread with lots really helpful information  
Looking forward to trying out the tips with my staff!


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## weeziex1

Hi ! Kazters sorry that i was no help. I have a GSD that sleeps with me and my better half. She scratches at our bedroom door like crazy to go outside to potty, she only does this if one of us gets up to go to the bathroom, and goes back to bed. Do you think when she hears yall moving around maybe she needs to get outside and is trying to hurry you up. Just a thought keep me informed. I forgot to mention I'm from Deep East Texas. Louise


----------



## kazters

weeziex1 said:


> Hi ! Kazters sorry that i was no help. I have a GSD that sleeps with me and my better half. She scratches at our bedroom door like crazy to go outside to potty, she only does this if one of us gets up to go to the bathroom, and goes back to bed. Do you think when she hears yall moving around maybe she needs to get outside and is trying to hurry you up. Just a thought keep me informed. I forgot to mention I'm from Deep East Texas. Louise


I don't think it's that. As I get up for work much earlier than everyone else, feed, walk the girls and go to work an hour or so later when everyone else gets up she does the same.  glad to know though other people have the problrm


----------



## maryandcisco

hi there, just wanted to write a wee message to say thank you! i found your thread very interesting and hopefully i can put it into practice with my big guy!!! although working full time its pretty hard i know it will take a bit longer.. any more tips to help with training for a rescued 1 and a half year old german shepherd x alaskan malamute would be greatly appreciated ! and thanks again put my mind at ease that im not the only one whose dog cant bare to be left home alone!!  x


----------



## Donut76

Hello

First off what a wonderful site this is - ive already learned so much on pet care & only been here a few days 

I have adopted a romanian rescue pup (im mentioning this as i feel this makes her issues understood) She is 6mths old & we have had her since last thursday evening

She spent the 4 weeks before we got her with a lovely foster mummy who had no small children & 3 other dogs 

I have 2 small children (well 8 1/2 & 9 1/2) 

She is crate trained to some extent

She sleeps in it in our bedroom at night
She doesnt whine after a few moments (once she realises she isnt alone) 
She goes all night without needing to get up (we keep quite late hours 11pmish) & get up quite early compared to foster mom (7amish)

She hates being left tho we have had some success with her getting settled in.

If me & hubby are both in the house she will follow me
If I am in the house on my own then we are at the point that she will stay in another room for a few moments or will come see me & then wander off happy
If Hubby is in on his own (when i work) she will pine for a short while & then be ok & will follow hubby about just like she does me (she doesnt follow hubby at all if i am in the house

If i go upstairs she will whine - she can now manage the stairs so will follow me - today we had another success - if she isnt interested she will go downstairs again (& then back & forth) 

i cannot leave her AT all & leave her on her own either in the crate or out i darent yet - when her foster mum tried she ripped her paws trying to get out of her crate

I cannot leave her roming the house ONLY because she has a weak back leg that has had sever break healed with NO help & i wouldnt want to make her so distressed that it got damaged again 

she has a large OPEN crate downstairs as well as the small one upstairs (this is going to be too small quite soon)

She will quite happily go into this crate of her own accord & either sleep or chill or play with her toys i dont need to send her to it or put her in it she isnt in the least bit bothered - i have only tried to close the gate once when i went into the kitchen for a moment & she whined & did that cry that was mentioned in a previous post BUT she didnt scatch or jump - tho i did talk (to myself haha) so she knew i was there

How do i carefully get her so that she can feel safe & left safe for a short time (im talking 30mins max during the day) as eventually she will have to sleep downstairs i cannot get a bigger crate upstairs no matter what i shuft about or move

OK hope that makes sence

I want to procede slowly as she is still so uncertain & has had so much loss in her little life - spent a lot of it either on the street, in pain (broken self healed leg) or in a rescue centre - her 4 weeks with her foster mom must have been wonderful & then more loss as she moved in with us  

THANKS


----------



## Sarah89

Having got a velcro dog myself this thread is fab! :thumbsup:


----------



## Skinnywhippet

Just want to extend a sympathetic hug to everyone else who arrives to read this! 

Even though separation issues clearly affect a lot of people, personally i've not met any of them and get sick to death of most people's lack of understanding on how badly it affects your life.

In the three months since we got our Whippet bitch, myself and my other half have spent maybe 3 hours out of the house together. I mostly work from home and have to pay a dogsitter any time I work away. I can't even go grocery shopping, or get a haircut, unless my other half (who works long hours) is around or I pay someone to mind her. 

One set of neighbours are petty-minded and mean at the best of times, and on the one time we left her for 35 mins in the middle of the day on a weekend, made sure they were waiting outside to tell us all about how they'd heard her when we returned. 

Family book us into gatherings at posh restaurants an hour's drive from our house, then look exasperated when we say that four hours out of the house isn't remotely an option. I've lost count of the number of people who say that their dog whined a bit too, but they just shut the door and let it get on with it and it got over it - I fell for that idea briefly after so many people banged on about it, and regretted it when she got much worse.

This is a fantastic thread and although i'd tried many of the ideas to some extent, have had to go back to square one - just getting her happy in the crate again - after a week of 30-60 minute "just go out and she'll get over it" trips. It's great to know that i'm not the only desperate, worried and housebound dog owner out there. I hope my girl will make progress, and quickly, because the mortgage has to be paid so this can't go on indefinitely


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## smec

Hi, I was wondering if you could offer me some help and advice. 
I have an 8year old springer and, as well as other behaviour issues, he has separation anxiety. I have come home from work to doors chewed and him having been to the loo in the house. It has got a lot better over the years, however, I now face a new problem. 
I am having to move home next month. I plan to move back to my parents to save money to eventually get on the property ladder. I am not able to bring my dog due to his behaviour when left alone. I had arranged for my ex husband to look after my dog during this time. This way, I could still take the dog for walks and spend time with him. However, he has now changed his mind. 
So, I'm left with a very difficult situation. The worst out come would be that I would have to re home my dog, but this would not only break my heart but my sons heart too. 
Could anyone suggest any thing I could do or anywhere I can seek advice.
Thanks


----------



## Donut76

my hubby has come across this as a relaxation aid & i wanted advice first

Things with Angel have come to a point i just cannot no matter how long (minutes) leave her as she today have ripped up my carpet she even goes mental in the porch while i just go TO the car (me & my neighbour share a front garden so cant let her into that really)

Herbal Medicine for Your Dog - Whole Dog Journal Article

I will turn my garden into a field of this stuff if it helps LOL

I think i need to work on her relaxation BEFORE we try again with leaving her


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## leashedForLife

Donut76 said:


> my hubby [found] this as a relaxation aid & i wanted advice first
> 
> ...i just cannot no matter how [short] (minutes) leave [Angel], as she today ...ripped up my carpet;
> she even goes mental in the porch while i just go TO the car (me & my neighbour share a front garden,
> so cant let her into that really)
> 
> [lemon balm article]
> 
> I will turn my garden into a field of this stuff, if it helps LOL


here is a whole list of OTC calmatives for dogs & humans; all are safe, don't interact, no dosage worries:
Pet Forums Community - View Single Post - dog body-language - and why it matters so much...

As noted in the post, use at least THREE for best results, 1 oral, 1 olfactory, & 1 tactile.



Donut76 said:


> I think i need to work on her relaxation BEFORE we try again with leaving her


Yes, if she has sep-anx, U do - as U must build-up to separation, beginning with not allowing her 
to follow U from room to room when U are at home, & gradually increase from there.


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## auxonian

I just read your detailed advice on separation anxiety and couldn't agree more. I was just thinking that you could write a book with that depth of knowledge - if you haven't already - as I have put much the same information in my first book Help! My Dog Won't Stop Barking. 

I included a section on separation anxiety as it relates to barking issues, but I have to confess that you have put it better than I did. Perhaps I will rewrite it for the second edition!


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## lazypony

Hi thank you for this info.
Im having on/off trouble with my dog and neighbours. He is a bit of a velcro dog but is happy to just chill on his own. He is a barker mostly at people at the front or back of the house when we are in or out of the house. The weather has been so hot we have been leaving the windows open upstairs and thats when we started to get complaints, the thing is he doesnt do it every time we go out so we are not sure what to do? He is a cocker spaniel.


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## Si2045

Fantastic post really needed to find out more about this as my rescue dog toby is displaying all the signs..think i have a long road ahead


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## sasha5b

my dogs got separation anxiety i have two dogs sonny is the one who has the anxiety what would be the first think to do as my neighbour is on night shift cant go out very much will try the 5minute out and come back in and dont look at him till i have finished what i am doing then talk to him is that right or what can i try


sasha5b said:


> was at vet to day and that what he said my dog has i have two dogs papillions one is 16 and sonny who is got the anxiety cant go out the house as he barks all the time he gave me some advice what to do just want to know if anyone on the forum has got a dog like this my neighbour who lives upstairs from me is on night shift so cant leave without ihim but vet said go out for five minutes and longer each time not looking at sonnny till i have got to dothings first like put message away and don t look at him till i have finished what i have done and then greet him and talk to him need advice thanks sasha5b


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## sasha5b

were do i start to help my dog sasha5b


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## Joolz63

I have moved my original post - I think I posted in the wrong place


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## nicl03

Hi just need some advice my 9 week puppy is great in the day but come night time he does nothing but cry,howl scratch doors etc how do we overcome this?


----------



## ashux

This is interesting thread and want to thank you for posting. I have some friends that could use the information so I'm passing this on to them.


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## thomas12

Thanks this information could be the answer for us. Got 12 WK mini dashund with severe separation anxiety. Here goes wish us luck.


----------



## leashedForLife

thomas12 said:


> Got 12 WK mini dashund with severe separation anxiety.
> Here goes - wish us luck.


12-WO puppies don't have sep-anx. Period.

Sep-anx is a panic attack caused by being left without human company.
It can be anything from mild to severe & life-threatening.
AVERAGE AGE of onset is 18-MO.

Puppies - ALL puppies - have separation distress when left solo. Tiny pups who should not be away 
from dam or litter yet, suffer it after the briefest of interruptions - a 14-DO pup who is lifted out of contact
with the warm littermates, & away from mum's smell, will whimper, whine, or begin to sniff avidly
within 5 to 8 seconds of leaving that olfactory balloon of security.

As pups age, they become more & more independent, tho they are still social all their lives.
A 12-WO pup needs to LEARN to be solo comfortably & happily, for a couple of hours - 
but that's not sep-anx. It's plain old ordinary anxiety, not a panic attack.
.
.


----------



## JasminRia

Whenever we left the house our dog would just chew the place up! The walls and anything he could possibly get his paws on. We tried leaving him toys to chew, and kongs full of peanut butter etc but he would completely discard them and get to destroying the house. Luckily he did not bark or anything so that wasnt an issue for us.

In the end we bought him a soft muzzle, with space in the bottom so he could still drink and lick. This has worked wonders for us! I was quite worried it would be deemed cruel but he really doesn't mind it. It has completely stopped the destruction to the house, and it means we don't have to shut him up and he can still have access to water. 

This may not be a solution to everyone but for similar issues it may work


----------



## JasminRia

nicl03 said:


> Hi just need some advice my 9 week puppy is great in the day but come night time he does nothing but cry,howl scratch doors etc how do we overcome this?


My dog did this for weeks as a pup and we tried everything! Crating him, giving him teddies, things of ours that smelt like us etc. We weren't having much sleep- especially since he is a beagle and his howl was quite annoying! In the end we saw Pets at home were selling a 'pheromone diffuser' which plugs into the wall and gives off pheromones similar to the puppies mother. The brand name we used is Adaptil, and it was fairly pricey at £30 for a months plug in but we had tried all else so thought it was worth a go! Luckily so as it really did work for us from the first night we got it, and our dog was calmer. We only had to buy the initial months worth as when it ran out he didnt need it anymore and was fine


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## leashedForLife

Free ON-LINE resources include Karen Overall, DVM - 
a vet-behaviorist & member of the American Veterinary Society of Animal Behaviorists.
HHS: Veterinary Medicine Community Client Instructions -- Protocol for Teaching Your Dog to Uncouple Departures and Departure Cues
Disassociating departure cues, etc

DS / CC for events that occur near the door:
HHS: Veterinary Medicine Community Client Instructions -- Protocol for Desensitization and Counterconditioning to Noises and Activities That Occur by the Door
.
.


----------



## fonc

I found this forum and it makes me feel better that we are not the only ones with this problem, however I am going to share our experience, it is going to be a long story but maybe I will get some sound help. 

We have a terrier cross that was found wandering near to where we lived in France. As he was going to be taken to the pound where they only get 24 hours before being put down and efforts had already been made to find his owners we took him home with us. 

Casper (as we called him) is a lovely dog, hes friendly with other dogs, great with the kids, the cats etc. When we are all at home he is a happy and independent little boy. 

All except for when we go out.He is an accomplished escape artist; we have collected him from all over France and more recently from the UK. He has eaten through plaster board walls, window frames, metal panels on doors and climbed fences and jumped out of upstairs windows. He also ate the interior of a 5 series BMW (his first offence). He regularly scavenges for food but that is another story. 

We have sought help and advice from vets and behavioural specialists and we have tried, and continue to try to follow all the advice. Crating is an absolute must to avoid the escaping, he has trashed every cage we have bought apart from an airline transit cage, although recently he did manage to very slightly move a bit of the grid and impale his chin on it. We do not make a fuss when we go in or out, we have tried DAP, Kongs, leaving him for short periods and lengthening them, and we even got him another dog. 

This behaviour has been going on for 6 years now and shows no sign of improving. He is not a velcro dog, any human will do although he does prefer the family. We really love Casper, I think you would have to to keep trying to help him as we do but things will be getting worse soon. We both work full time and one of our daughters goes to school fairly locally so she is able to get home pretty promptly, let him out of his cage and take him for a walk. However she is off to uni next year and Caspers length of time in his cage, which he hates, will get longer. 

We cannot afford doggy day care although that would be his preferred option, is there anything we have not tried? One vet who knew Casper well (he has seen several in his little life) did actually offer euthanasia although was visibly relieved when we said no. Does anyone have any advice not already given in this forum posting?


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## Silverfox25

Great thread and info. Its a condition I'm always interested in learning more about.


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## guinga

HI,
My 6 month Bernese mountain is showing signs of SA. He developped a big hot spot on his back two days ago and the vet said it could be due to stress.
We always let him sleep outside and he stays as close to the door as possible, under a balcony. When I go to work, 4 days a week, I leave him outside. I thought that our fenced garden would be a better option since he would have more space. Now, I've been reading articles stating that a dog is better off in a confined area... I could leave him in a room.
I have to leave him for 8 hours although I could come for 10-15 minutes on my lunch break (I have a 20m drive from work). Is it beneficial or too short to see him for only 15m ?
Would it be better if the room where he stays was left open or do you think the acces to the garden would mean "too much space" for him and make him anxious?
I appreciate your help.


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## heatherp6

Hi everyone, we,ve had our rescue dog,GSD for 4 years now, during the day she completely ignores me,she stays on her bed,or goes out into the garden,with our cat,but doesnt do any damage to the house,but when hubby gets in from work,hes not even taken his coat off,and shes at his feet,after reading this realise it is typical separation anxiety,even though I,m at home all day,
Now recently when we,ve both gone out,she damages door frames,manages to get into cupboards,( now cupboards all have kiddie locks on them,) but the most frustrating thing is the deliberately making herself sick,on her bed of all places,
Sometimes if our cat has come for a fuss,and we dont call her over for a fuss as well, she,ll go into the kitchen and make herself sick !!!!,,I mean really, why be sick where youre going to sleep !!
If shes done something naughty and we tell her off, she toddles off and makes herself sick on her bed again,
We,re going away for 4 days over new year,and could do with some help,We used to put her into kennels,but she just used to tip her bowls of water and food all over the kennel, so now she stays home,where at least she eats,
Our neighbour comes round and lets her out for an hour in the morning,and then the same at night, She has toys,we leave the radio on, our cat stays in,the whole time as well, so shes not completely on her own, we,ve had the cat 2 years,
What can we use almost immediately to make her more relaxed,for when we go away,in just over a week,it needs to be suitable for the entire time, can you leave a plug in,in place for the whole time,if not what we do,so our neighbour has to just do what he normally does, Shes been left at home while we go away for over 2 yeas now,so thats not a new thing,
But hubby is getting really frustrated now,more so about making herself sick,as its obviously not good for her, 
At the weekend she doesnt do it,just when we go out or if she gets told off,or we fuss the cat,but as he cant move without her tripping him up at the weekends and when he gets in from work, he has said hes seriously thinking about putting her up for rehoming,as when hes home he cant go pout the room,but she follows him,if hes cooking anything,he,ll turn round and trip over her,hes shouted at her a few times for that,as hes hurt his back falling over her,he has a problem with his spine,so falling over her is really not good for either of them,
Shes always been his dog,shes followed him everywhere since we got her,but more or less ignores me,!!obviously Im not important in her pack, cheeky madam, !!
So now we,re desperate for any advice,as we,re at our wits end with her,and dont understand why,its suddenly got so much worse in the last 4 months,so any help will be greatly appreciated,
thanks
Heather xx


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## Guest

I have to say I read your post heather and feel sick and anxious for your poor dog 

You go away and leave her alone in the house? :crying: 

I don't actually know what to write at the moment. I don't own a dog yet but the animal lover and pet owner in me knows her behaviour is showing her great distress at being neglected and shouted at when she attempts to get attention :crying:

Words fail me to be honest, all I can say is leaving a dog locked up for days is beyond cruel and you should not be dog owners


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## heatherp6

.How dare you !!!!!!!!
What are we meant to do when we go away on holidays,??and its not possible for her to come with us. leave her in the garden ?????
I,ve already explained we used to put her in kennels and that was even worse for her, at least at home ,shes in her normal enviroment,and eats and drinks at home,which she NEVER does in boarding kennels, We tried different boarding kennels ,incase she just didnt like the one she went to, but its always the same,
She tips her bowls up when shes given food and water,and would you say we shouldn,t go on holiday,lots of loving animal owners put their dogs in boarding kennels,
When left at home she eats and drinks,the radio is left on for her, she gets kongs, she has indoor and outdoor toys,and she has the run of the large kitchen,and the conservatory, a lot more room,than she,d have in kennels,the reason I came on here was to see what else we could do,and shes not crying when we leave her,where did I say shes crying,??
I didnt ask to be slated by someone who doesnt know us,or our dog,
I said my husband has shouted at her,when hes fell over and hurt his back,which would be normal for anyone with a serious back problem,she doesnt get shouted at ALL the time,just when shes hurt him,and hes shouting out in pain,
My post was about making her more comfortable, shes a VERY well fed,loved fully vacinated,animal( not neglected,)if she wasnt we,d have left her at boarding kennels when we go away,even though we know she doesnt eat or drink,at all, while shes there,
Or would you rather we put her in another strange enviroment,with people she doesnt know,knowing full well,shes even more unhappy there,and wont eat or drink,
If shes in kennels for a week,its always obvious she hadnt eaten,as shes lost weight,we asked why she,d lost weight,and thats when we found out what she does with her food and drink bowls,
Leaving her at home seemed to be the only other option,We,ve lived here for 14 years,so she knows the neighbour very well, that comes in, lets her out for an hour,morning and night,while he stays in our house,but most people we know, family and friends also have dogs,so her going to them isnt an option, She went to my in-laws once, who dont have animals,but she chewed their door frames as well,and they,re both retired,so at home all day and night with her,so obviously people aren,t going to want to look after her.when they know shes destructive,
So go on,if you think this isnt an option leaving her at home, doesnt eat at kennels,cant leave her at other peoples houses,what do you suggest ,??Leave her in the garden all the time, ???!!!!
If you read about seperation anxiety you,ll see her behaviour is not about her getting attention, its about wanting to see what we,re doing, it tells you very clearly,that when she follows my husband everywhere ,its about her being the Alpha,not her wanting to be petted,
maybe you should read ALL the information,before you start making assumptions,and when its possible for her to go with us she does,but its not ALWAYS possible,we normally go abroad to see friends of ours in September,for our wedding anniversary,but this year we didnt,because she,d been poorly a couple of months before,we actually went to a very wet n windy Cornwall,so we still went away,but she was able to go with us,So you really shouldn,t just make assumptions,


So I,ll ask again,is there anyone else,who IS a dog owner,whos gone through this,give us any advice of what else to try, We.re going to buy the adaptil collar today,so shes used to it before we go away,so that shes comfortable with it,would you recommend,the Bach remedy as well as the collar, or just the collar.
Thanks


----------



## BarkMark

We had this problem with our boston. He had quite bad separation anxiety and he used to bark and pee on my audio receiver. We got complaints from the neighbors and tried few different common solutions. We tried training with the method that we leave the house for a short time and then gradually grow the time - didn't work very well. We tried radio - didn't work at all. We tried that thing that is suppose to emit that certain hormone - didn't work.

What worked was a specific sound played when he barks.

I had an idea that because we had a laptop that was always home, a computer program could monitor if the dog barks and command him. Essentially making him feel like I'm there watching him. So I developed a quick and buggy first version with built-in sound me saying "NO". This worked magic. Our neighbors tells us that there's no more barking and haven't been for a long time. Also it seems, based on the program's "bark log", that the dog rarely barks anymore so I guess he has learned something. This experience is why I'm now running a service which is essentially what the software above but in your browser.

Some people say that those "ultrasonic bark deterrents" don't work but I think there's a huge difference between dog hearing an annoying high frequency sound and a command from his or her human.


----------



## leashedForLife

BarkMark said:


> We had this problem with our [Boston *Bull And* Terrier].
> He had quite bad separation anxiety...
> 
> I had an idea ... *a computer program could monitor if the dog barks and command him.
> ... I developed a ... version with ... me saying "NO". This worked magic.* Our neighbors [tell] us that there's
> no more barking and [hasn't] been for a long time.
> 
> Also... based on the program's "bark log", ...the dog rarely barks anymore so *I guess he has learned
> something.* ...I'm now running a service [selling] the software above... in your browser.
> 
> ...ppl say... "ultrasonic bark deterrents" don't work, but I think there's a huge difference between dog hearing
> an annoying... sound and *a command* from her or his human.


Yo, Mark!  
Nice to know U've found a niche market for a homemade program.

However, U obviously DON't know much about PF-uk - advertising has its own area, which isn't "here". :thumbdown:

Equally obviously, U don't know much about dogs, nor specifically about *separation anxiety.*

SepAnx is a PANIC ATTACK - tell me, if a coworker was having an asthma attack due to a severe emotional
upset, would shouting *"Stop!"* alleviate the emotional distress, & ease the asthma? [Clue: no.]

A *panic attack* isn't under conscious control - NO ONE CHOOSES TO BE IN SEVERE DISTRESS.
A dog with SepAnx CANNOT CONTROL THEIR EMOTIONAL REACTION - they are PANICKED.

Severe SepAnx is life-threatening: dogs have DIED by leaping out a closed window 2-stories up,
tried to CHEW THRU cheap interior hollow-core doors & gotten SPLINTERS in their palates, gums, & throats,
BROKEN TEETH & CLAWS desperately trying to escape a crate or fenced kennel, CHEWING fence-wire...
& so on.

so yeah - "just say *No!"* isn't gonna "cure" a dog of SepAnx.
But go right ahead & fleece ppl of their money, & leave the dogs still distressed, if anything a bit
more so, with a nagging voice responding every time they bark at the postie, a neighbor yelling at their kid,
a trash pick-up with the bang & thump of cans outside, etc. [Of course, in an ideal world, Ur software would
be able to discriminate between "distress bark / howl / yelp / cry" & "alarm-bark at a real sound".
But even if it could, nagging won't "cure" SepAnx.]

Nagging a dog is SO effective -  that's why yelling, _"Shut up!"_ at a barking dog, works every time. :

Suggestion, Mark:
*Read the thread.*

Not a couple of posts - read WHAT SepAnx is, WHY it may arise, & HOW to desensitize the dog.
Then maybe U'll understand why a software-genie to sternly say, *"No!"* won't do a dam* thing
to actually address the underlying issue, & simply adds more noise - & more stress.

Then erase that program - think of another money-maker, & advertise it somewhere... other than here.
 thanks.


----------



## BarkMark

leashedForLife said:


> Yo, Mark!
> Nice to know U've found a niche market for a homemade program.
> 
> However, U obviously DON't know much about PF-uk - advertising has its own area, which isn't "here". :thumbdown:


Well the point wasn't advertising, it was sharing what worked for our dog and maybe somebody else might try this way before using a shock collar or similar.

You know the concept really isn't that hard - give corrective feedback at the right time. You can do it yourself but the reason I wrote the software in the first place was that unfortunately I couldn't hang around the house all day waiting for the dog to bark.



> Equally obviously, U don't know much about dogs, nor specifically about *separation anxiety.*
> 
> SepAnx is a PANIC ATTACK - tell me, if a coworker was having an asthma attack due to a severe emotional
> upset, would shouting *"Stop!"* alleviate the emotional distress, & ease the asthma? [Clue: no.]
> 
> A *panic attack* isn't under conscious control - NO ONE CHOOSES TO BE IN SEVERE DISTRESS.
> A dog with SepAnx CANNOT CONTROL THEIR EMOTIONAL REACTION - they are PANICKED.
> 
> Severe SepAnx is life-threatening: dogs have DIED by leaping out a closed window 2-stories up,
> tried to CHEW THRU cheap interior hollow-core doors & gotten SPLINTERS in their palates, gums, & throats,
> BROKEN TEETH & CLAWS desperately trying to escape a crate or fenced kennel, CHEWING fence-wire...
> & so on.
> 
> so yeah - "just say *No!"* isn't gonna "cure" a dog of SepAnx.
> But go right ahead & fleece ppl of their money, & leave the dogs still distressed, if anything a bit
> more so, with a nagging voice responding every time they bark at the postie, a neighbor yelling at their kid,
> a trash pick-up with the bang & thump of cans outside, etc. [Of course, in an ideal world, Ur software would
> be able to discriminate between "distress bark / howl / yelp / cry" & "alarm-bark at a real sound".
> But even if it could, nagging won't "cure" SepAnx.]


I don't mean to sound rude but which part of the name bark silencer confused you about what the program does? If the dog is going berserk, of course it won't help. Nobody is saying that. I'm assuming the user understands that if your dog is destroying places, it won't help.

As an expert that you obvious are you must know that there's different levels of separation anxiety and obviously this isn't for those dogs who are jumping out of the window...

It's not a magic bullet that magically cures your dog. It's an app that plays a prerecorded sound when it detects noises. Before you use the app, you calibrate it so that it doesn't react to other that really loud noises like barks. If the app needs to "nag" meaning the sound is playing constantly, then the sound isn't obviously effective method for your dog. If this is the case, you can also forget other sound based bark deterrents (which I guess are also crap in your opinion?). This is why you can test the app for free so that you know if it works with your dog.

Is there some reason you are attacking me at the personal level?



> Nagging a dog is SO effective -  that's why yelling, _"Shut up!"_ at a barking dog, works every time. :
> 
> Suggestion, Mark:
> *Read the thread.*
> 
> Not a couple of posts - read WHAT SepAnx is, WHY it may arise, & HOW to desensitize the dog.
> Then maybe U'll understand why a software-genie to sternly say, *"No!"* won't do a dam* thing
> to actually address the underlying issue, & simply adds more noise - & more stress.


Trust me, I know what separation anxiety is. I read about it quite a bit when our dog had it. There's a difference between SHUT UP and NO. The first one is just screaming at the dog and the other one is a command. And the clarify, NO worked for our dog because that's what we have always used as a command for "stop doing whatever you are doing". Use what works with your dog.



> Then erase that program - think of another money-maker, & advertise it somewhere... other than here.
> thanks.


So you are advocating that I erase a program that people are finding helpful with their dog's barking? I suppose you have a suggestion what I should tell these people to do instead? Shock collars? Training that most people won't do because the don't have the time? Pills?


----------



## Sherpa

my dog has had separation anxiety today really bad because my husband was out all day. I have been with the dog all day doing the usual things that we do and I am the one that walks him, so why is he so anxious because my husband was not here. That I do not understand because I am with him. Walking playing as usual.????


----------



## leashedForLife

BarkMark said:


> ... If the dog is going berserk, of course it won't help. Nobody is saying that.
> 
> I [assume] the user understands... if your dog is destroying [the house], it won't help.


The primary presenting-symptom of *separation anxiety * is *escape:*
"Get out of here, so i can go find my human // any human!"

That's why ripping up the carpet BY THE DOOR strongly indicates sep-anx, whilst chewing on the carpet
on the stair-tread where a hole is worn in it, is much-more likely to be sheer boredom.

Digging the H*** out of the door at the sill is likely sep-anx; jumping-up on the door & nuisance-barking 
when the owner is at home, but shuts the dog out of the room, could be over-attachment, or a dog who 
is not well-behaved with visitors & an owner who can't / won't take the time to retrain or who isn't willing 
to manage the dog but just shuts the dog out, or an owner entertaining a visitor who hates dogs, & the owner 
doesn't want the dog to be a bone of contention with their visitor... or it could be a dozen other things.

ESCAPE is what Sep-Anx is about: to find, to rejoin, to seek one person or any person.
DESTRUCTION of a door, sill, window, carpet at the entry, lino by the door, etc, is a symptom.


BarkMark said:


> ... you can test the app for free, so that you know if it works with your dog.


The *test* is "free", the *app* is not - meaning it is & was an advertisement.



BarkMark said:


> ...you [advocate] that I erase a program that people [find] helpful with their dog's barking?


No.
I advocate that U *stop* advertising it as a B-Mod tool specifically for *separation anxiety*,
& i'd stipulate further that U advertise it in a the correct sub-forum - which isn't here.

This is a sub-forum for discussing behavior - the behavior native to dogs - & training: teaching dogs 
those behaviors that we humans want. Many of the wanted behaviors are not native to dogs; they are
artificial, or even counter to native behavior.

This isn't the classified-ads section; it's the Dear Abby column, the agony-aunt, the DIY department.


----------



## BarkMark

leashedForLife said:


> The primary presenting-symptom of *separation anxiety * is *escape:*
> "Get out of here, so i can go find my human // any human!"
> 
> That's why ripping up the carpet BY THE DOOR strongly indicates sep-anx, whilst chewing on the carpet
> on the stair-tread where a hole is worn in it, is much-more likely to be sheer boredom.
> 
> Digging the H*** out of the door at the sill is likely sep-anx; jumping-up on the door & nuisance-barking
> when the owner is at home, but shuts the dog out of the room, could be over-attachment, or a dog who
> is not well-behaved with visitors & an owner who can't / won't take the time to retrain or who isn't willing
> to manage the dog but just shuts the dog out, or an owner entertaining a visitor who hates dogs, & the owner
> doesn't want the dog to be a bone of contention with their visitor... or it could be a dozen other things.
> 
> ESCAPE is what Sep-Anx is about: to find, to rejoin, to seek one person or any person.
> DESTRUCTION of a door, sill, window, carpet at the entry, lino by the door, etc, is a symptom.



So obviously you don't understand all dogs don't suffer such high-level separation anxiety.

Before replying, please read Dog Separation Anxiety Symptoms, Causes, Medications and tell me again how separation anxiety is all about escaping and destruction.

Also before replying, please post your credentials that gives you the right to state it as a fact what separation anxiety is when sites like WebMD are not agreeing with you.



> The *test* is "free", the *app* is not - meaning it is & was an advertisement.


No, the app is free. Free version gives you 45 minutes of monitoring in one session. It has all the features but monitoring session is limited. However most people need more monitoring so they opt-in for unlimited monitoring. If you only need 45 mins of monitoring, all you need is the free version and that's cool with me.



> I advocate that U *stop* advertising it as a B-Mod tool specifically for *separation anxiety*,
> & i'd stipulate further that U advertise it in a the correct sub-forum - which isn't here.
> 
> This is a sub-forum for discussing behavior - the behavior native to dogs - & training: teaching dogs
> those behaviors that we humans want. Many of the wanted behaviors are not native to dogs; they are
> artificial, or even counter to native behavior.
> 
> This isn't the classified-ads section; it's the Dear Abby column, the agony-aunt, the DIY department.


Really? Where did I advertise it "specifically for separation anxiety"? Please provide a source or quote.

Please read my original post again and tell me where I advertise? In fact I provided a completely DIY method for you how I did it. Or do you count as me telling how I developed a software that monitors sound as advertising? But you are ok with a dog trainer saying he or she uses this and that method to help with dog's barking? I mean isn't that also advertising with your logic?


----------



## kateh8888

Great thread


----------



## Sherpa

Maybe a great thread but no one has answered my question which is even when either me or my husband is with our dog...he gets separation anxiety when only ONE of us leaves . My dog has been howling and barking because my husband has been out all day yesterday and won't be back until this evening. I am the walker, groomer,feeder,plaything but the dog is pineing for my husband. This I can't fathom out as I would have thought he would not be anxious as I am with him. Does anyone know why or has anyone got the same problem????? Everything I have read so far seems to be about separation anxiety when both owners leave.


----------



## leashedForLife

Sherpa said:


> my dog's *separation anxiety* today[was] really bad, because *my husband was out all day*.
> 
> I've been with the dog all day, doing the usual...& I'm the one that walks him, so why is he so anxious
> because my husband was not here[?]
> ...I don't understand because I'm with him, walking [him &] playing [with him] as usual.
> ????


Over-attachment isn't sep-anx, either.

Did he spend the day moping at the door, clawing the lino, howling, trying to escape?
Did he lack appetite, ignore his toys & ignore U, try to bolt every time the door opened?

I doubt it. I think he ate, drank, played, etc.
Precisely what were the symptoms of his "anxiety"?


----------



## Sherpa

leashedForLife said:


> Over-attachment isn't sep-anx, either.
> 
> Did he spend the day moping at the door, clawing the lino, howling, trying to escape?
> Did he lack appetite, ignore his toys & ignore U, try to bolt every time the door opened?
> 
> I doubt it. I think he ate, drank, played, etc.
> Precisely what were the symptoms of his "anxiety"?


He kept barking and howling. Also kept taking items of my husbands, socks, jumper shoes and bringing them into the living room. He was OK when we went out for a walk and ate his food OK that was not a problem. He did show some agrressive behaviour towards me, jumping up and nipping my hand when we were out and growling. When we got home he would run and jump at me and keep growling. Then after a while he would come up to me for a cuddle. I just don't understand this behaviour as I am his main carer. ? He doesn't like it when I go out and leave my husband with him, he barks and howls but not as much. It seems as though he doesn't like the pack split up for some reason.


----------



## leashedForLife

Sherpa said:


> He kept barking and howling.
> Also kept taking items of my husbands, socks, jumper, shoes, & bringing them into the living room.
> 
> He was OK when we went out for a walk and ate his food OK that was not a problem.
> 
> He did show some aggressive behaviour toward me, jumping up & nipping my hand when we were out,
> & growling. When we got home he'd run & jump at me, & keep growling. Then after a while,
> he'd come up to me for a cuddle.
> 
> I just don't understand this behaviour as I'm his main carer. He doesn't like it when I go out & leave my DH
> with him, he barks & howls, but not as much.
> *It seems as though he doesn't like the pack split up,* for some reason.


I haven't any idea why he'd do any of those things, & particularly ALL of those things, but it's not Sep-Anx.
That last comment is pure speculation, & also it's hogwash: domestic dogs don't form packs, even when
they are feral & living outside of human contact or care.

I'd suggest posting the entire description on Behavior & Training as its own topic, for more feedback.
I'd also suggest *videorecording the behaviors, both when U're gone & hubby's present, & when hubby's 
gone & U are present,* to see if there are observable differences.

Finally, i'd get an experienced APDT-uk member to come assess the dog, & perhaps design some B-Mod
to address whatever his issues are.

[Is there ANYthing that hubby does that U do not? With the dog, for the dog, to the dog?...
But that's a Q for the new thread; here, it's off-topic.]


----------



## Sherpa

leashedForLife said:


> I haven't any idea why he'd do any of those things, & particularly ALL of those things, but it's not Sep-Anx.
> That last comment is pure speculation, & also it's hogwash: domestic dogs don't form packs, even when
> they are feral & living outside of human contact or care.
> 
> I'd suggest posting the entire description on Behavior & Training as its own topic, for more feedback.
> I'd also suggest *videorecording the behaviors, both when U're gone & hubby's present, & when hubby's
> gone & U are present,* to see if there are observable differences.
> 
> Finally, i'd get an experienced APDT-uk member to come assess the dog, & perhaps design some B-Mod
> to address whatever his issues are.
> 
> [Is there ANYthing that hubby does that U do not? With the dog, for the dog, to the dog?...
> But that's a Q for the new thread; here, it's off-topic.]


OK...thank you very much. Video recording would be a good idea. I will monitor and post a new thread when it happens.


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## Georgie beau

Hello all,
My cocker spaniel does who some signs of separation anxiety if it's out of routine, when I go to work he is fine as this is routine, but if it's at a time I wouldn't normally go out I can tell he is getting anxious. Also he follows me around everywhere when indoors. I am trying something at the moment where I use a new bed and give him a kong with lots of treats in a slowly try to step away from him for longer periods of time, I'm hoping this will help.
Thanks,
Paul.


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## Lorri

I had watched a programme recently about this. The programme is called Dogs: Their secret lives. It's on very week on channel 4oD If you can not access to it I have linked it up with youtube.

This programme may be upsetting for some. But we all need to learn about our loving dogs.

Dogs: Their Secret Lives Series 1 Full Episode 1 PILOT - YouTube

You will see from the programme that 8 out of 10 dogs do suffer from this. It's such an alarming rate .


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## Joogle

Hi,
My Westie Billy is over 4 years old and has never had a problem with being left. However, in the last couple of months he has taken to barking for up to an hour each time I leave for work. He shows no signs of being unhappy as I'm leaving, and my neighbour has told me that he waits for about 10 mins after I've gone before barking. I expect that is the time that he takes to eat the contents of his kong, which I've always given him when leaving.
In the last year I've suffered ill health and been at home more than usual. However I've always gone to work mornings, so routine there hasn't changed. It's just meant that I've been home earlier some days, in fact during December I was home at lunch time every day.
Also, very strangely I'm told he doesn't do it if I go out at the weekend.
Does this sound like SA?


----------



## leashedForLife

Lorri said:


> Dogs: Their Secret Lives Series 1 Full Episode 1 PILOT - YouTube
> 
> You'll see from the programme that *8 of 10 dogs suffer from [Sep-Anx]*.
> It's such an alarming rate.


WHO CLAIMS that "80%" of all dogs have Sep-Anx?!... that's a ludicrous number. :thumbdown:

I can believe that 8 of 10 dogs BARK at some point in their lives, persistently-enuf to cause complaints - 
if not from the owner, from the neighbors. But there is NO WAY that 80% of all pet-dogs have Sep-Anx.
That's completely untrue.
.
.


----------



## RatsnCatnKids

We have a 5 month old puppy. She's been brilliant in her crate from the first night, when she was 10 weeks old. However, last night we all went out for the first time in the evening, from 7.15pm till 10.45pm, leaving her in her crate. We've left her loads of time during the day. When we got back I took her out to toilet her and let her have some free time inside before putting her in her crate for the night at about 11.30pm. In the end, I ignored her after about 1am and she eventually gave up at about 2am. I tried all sorts of things - took her out to toilet again, giving her some food, leaving a light on, leaving the TV on. I always waited till she was between barking bouts before going in. I hoped it was a one off but, although we've had a 'normal' evening tonight, she has been barking for the last hour. I have gone in about 3-4 times (waiting till she's quiet) just to let her know I'm around but she starts again the moment I leave the room.
I have 2 school age children and a husband who has to get up for work at 5am every day and I really want to stop this behaviour before it becomes a real problem. I'm assuming we unwittingly started SA when we left her alone last night.
I should be really grateful for advice on how to deal with this. Thank you!


----------



## Sarahliz100

RatsnCatnKids said:


> We have a 5 month old puppy. She's been brilliant in her crate from the first night, when she was 10 weeks old. However, last night we all went out for the first time in the evening, from 7.15pm till 10.45pm, leaving her in her crate. We've left her loads of time during the day. When we got back I took her out to toilet her and let her have some free time inside before putting her in her crate for the night at about 11.30pm. In the end, I ignored her after about 1am and she eventually gave up at about 2am. I tried all sorts of things - took her out to toilet again, giving her some food, leaving a light on, leaving the TV on. I always waited till she was between barking bouts before going in. I hoped it was a one off but, although we've had a 'normal' evening tonight, she has been barking for the last hour. I have gone in about 3-4 times (waiting till she's quiet) just to let her know I'm around but she starts again the moment I leave the room.
> I have 2 school age children and a husband who has to get up for work at 5am every day and I really want to stop this behaviour before it becomes a real problem. I'm assuming we unwittingly started SA when we left her alone last night.
> I should be really grateful for advice on how to deal with this. Thank you!


Firstly, it would be a good idea to start a new thread to discuss your puppies issues as it will get more attention and you'll have more knowledgeable people than me coming to the rescue. The "stickies" at the top of the page are there all the time and might get overlooked.

I wouldn't necessarily assume it's separation anxiety providing she is usually ok being left for that length of time, more likely a change in routine unsettling her. Unless she's not really used to being left for long, in which case I guess suddenly being left for 3.5 hours might have frightened her. If she isn't really used to being left, then you probably need to start by leaving her for very short periods and working up.

Our pup will sleep the entire time we are out, and at that age it meant if we had been out for over three hours in the evening he'd had a lovely long nap and going back to bed was certainly not on the agenda. We also found that if his routine was significantly messed with he wouldn't sleep well for a few days. I found the best way to get him back into a good sleeping habit was to REALLY tire him out (mentally and physically) for a few days so that he was tired enough to sleep through.

My pup didn't sleep that well around that age. He was ok in his crate when sleepy, but once awake he wanted out. Usually at about 4am. In the end we stopped using the crate (we primarily wanted it for toilet training so it had served it's purpose) and he slept loose in our dining room which is also our puppy proof room. He was immediately much happier. He likes to change position a lot and during the day will move from his bed - sofa - floor - other sofa etc and I think he just likes to have a bit more freedom. He's now 7 months and (fingers crossed I'm not cursing myself) will be settled from 9.30 to 7.30. We sometimes hear him moving about but he vary rarely barks.

I'm not necessarily suggesting you stop using the crate - they are really useful for lots of reasons - just telling you what we did. I think that because he was toilet trained and could be trusted in our puppy proofed dining room I was not putting him in the crate during the day so he was less used to it. Could this be the case with your pup? Do you need to do more work on making her comfortable in the crate so that even if she wakes up she's still happy to lie there and chew on a toy or something?

Oh and the barking...... I think the best thing is to completely ignore it providing you know she is safe, doesn't need the toilet etc. I found this difficult as I live in a terrace, and I'm sure it would be hard for you with your family. I used to go to him when he barked for fear if upsetting the neighbours and I'm sure it perpetuated the problem. Any chance of having the crate in the farthest part of the house, using ear plugs etc? Hopefully a few days will be enough to break the habit. You have to stick to your guns though - if you leave her to bark for an hour the first night then go to her she might bark for an hour and a half the next night as she knows you'll come in the end.......


----------



## RatsnCatnKids

Thank you for the helpful and reassuring reply! I'm glad it's not SA. She's fine normally and during the day and she's used to being on her own in the crate both when we're in the house and she is used to being keft up to 4 hours during the day. That was the first time after dark but I think you are right in that it is the messing with her sleep pattern that's probably messed things up. 
Your suggestion of really tiring her out before bedtime is a good one. I shall also ignore the barking, unless she sounds distressed. At least it's half-term week so the kids can catch up on their sleep!
If she doesn't settle in a couple of days I'll post it on the puppy thread.
Thanks again. Getting a reply, especially such a helpful one, has cheered me up!


----------



## El Jay 82

Fantastic thread,

thank you so much for taking the time to put all this information out for us to access. Our pup is only 8 weeks old and is very sociable with human beings however is highly stressed at night. We have tried crating her in our bedroom but she did not relent. Upon reading threads such as yours I think, before too much more time passes, we have to go back to basics and start very slowly from the beginning again.

Thanks

LJ


----------



## Oskysum

Hi guys, would appreciate some advice.
ive just adopted a rescue dog who has some issues to say the least but im willing to spend good time rehabilitating this dog te correct way.

At the moment she has a dog bed in living room which she stays in alot of the time. She doesnt follow me room to room but as soon as i approach the door she comes running to the door. If i leave te house whe starts crying after 30 seconds.
my question is where should i come back in and give reward?

Do i come back in as soon as she starts crying or before?

I dont quite understand the training.


----------



## leashedForLife

Oskysum said:


> Hi guys, I'd appreciate some advice.
> i've just adopted a rescue dog who has some issues...


i'm going to echo the previous post -

U'll get a lot more replies by posting on Behavior & Training.

Only folks who have previously-replied to this thread get an e-mail, & the final post
on a "theme" thread or topic is quickly buried by more-recent posts on other threads of new topics,
& lost.

Also, this does not sound like Sep-Anx, the critical symptom of which is ESCAPE.

I'd suggest start a new thread, include the dog's age, any known history, sex, repro-intact or S/N, etc,
& then describe the various issues. :001_smile:
.
.


----------



## Darkin

*Thank you* for that vital information for my granddaughter who is having these problems with her Husky puppy.


----------



## advocate for animals

Here's some information I hope will help - it is taken from an article I wrote. 

Don't leave the dog in the backyard and consider it exercise. Long walks and hikes, of at least 30 minutes, twice a day, training, tracking and agility are a few other ideas. Length, intensity, and frequency will depend on your dogs age and physical condition.

Tiring him out before you leave the house, can make him more relaxed about being left alone.

Most of us have a routine we follow each time were ready to leave the house, and that can set your dog panicking, so change it. For example, he knows that when you put your coat on, you leave the house. Why not put your coat on randomly during the day, then open the mail. Grab your keys, and put them in a different place. After a few weeks with no discernible pattern, his separation anxiety may be less evident as you walk out the door.

Never make a big deal out of coming or going, just leave and return that's it. 
Youll be doing him a big favour if you dont pay attention to him a few minutes before you leave, and for a few minutes after you get back.
This shows him your absence is temporary, and nothing to be concerned about.

Practice longer and longer absences by going side for a couple of minutes, than coming right back. Dont make a big deal out of it. If your dog suffers from severe anxiety, you may only be able to step outside for a second, before having to coming back in. If thats the case, than a second it will have to be. Once youre inside, go about your business for a few minutes, giving your dog a chance to relax. When you next go out, stay away bit longer. That might mean only 2 seconds, than 3 the next. Thats fine, just keep increasing. You can also vary the length of time you stay out. For instance  say youve worked up to 7 minutes, the next time leave for 4 minutes, then 8, than 5. Within a few weeks, your dogs anxiety should be significantly reduced.

The above suggestions take time to work, so for something more immediate until the other tips take effect, have some take him out during the day, speak to your vet about anti anxiety medication in the meantime, try one of those plug ins that help reduce anxiety. I've never tried it on a dog, but the one for cats worked wonders.


----------



## New territory

Hi all. This is all very foreign to me, it's the first time I've used a forum, well it's the first time I've needed advice. 
I'll start with a brief history; we have a Westie named Zak. We have had him since he was just 6 weeks old, he is now 14. As Westie's go, we are reliably informed by vets, groomers, kennels etc that he is very well natured. Overall he has been a real star, enduring the arrival of our 2 children and 4 house moves within his lifetime. He really is a top chap!!
Unfortunately over the last 12 months or so he has lost his hearing, but this generally doesn't seem to bother him at all - it's more of a challenge for us when we need his attention! He is also developing cataracts which are worsening rapidly and have rendered him unable to tackle stairs with any confidence. 
So that's Zak in a nutshell.
Our problem lies in that with our 4th house move (only 2 months ago) he has developed terrible separation anxiety. 
This is very new territory for us, he's never had any issues being left, in fact since day 1 we have both worked so he's always been comfortable being left. He has a comfortable kennel in the garden and has his best friend with him, our cat! Now, however, it would appear that a number of our neighbours are very disgruntled, expressing their concern for his well-being. 
Largely he is fine with the 'normal routine', if we are at work and the children at school, the neighbours have said they didnt even know he was in the garden. BUT sometimes he is totally stressed by it, especially if we leave the house at any other time, for instance to go shopping or maybe go for a meal at the weekend, he barks, cries, howls and paces for the whole time we are gone. When we return he is completely overwhelmed to see us but totally exhausted. I'm thinking of trying the Adaptil collar alongside some basic training techniques, but he's a smart old chap and knows all the tricks.
Any advice anyone can offer would be very much appreciated.
Rather worried about the dog and anxious not to upset our neighbours further and in very new territory


----------



## auxonian

I can echo what 'advocate for animals' has written here. I wrote something similar in my book and it definitely seems to work (otherwise I wouldn't have put it in the book)!


----------



## JessicaPenny

Hi all, 

I have read the thread and have got some good ideas but I thought I would tell write my situation down and see if any of you had any extra advice. 

I have a Jack Russell Crossed Whippet (we think she's part whippet we don't know that for sure) called Penny who is 10 years old. We rescued her when she was 8 months old.

Penny is a lovely affectionate girl who plays nicely, comes back when she is off the lead and walks nicely on the lead. She is well behaved when we are home. She is walked 2 - 3 times a day for 20 mins to 1 hour on week day and a few hours at weekends when we go to the big park or down by the river which she loves. 

The problem we have is that since my brother left home and I started working full time she is left longer and is normally quite disruptive. 
We haven't had any reports of her barking or whining but my neighbors are often out in the day too so may not hear her. 
Each day however we are not sure what we will come home too. She more often that not wee's but a lot of the time now she has either crewed something, scratched the door or pulled up/ripped the carpet. 

My mum is getting a quite a bit upset about coming home to her now and I'm still trying to work out what to do to help Penny and my Mum. 

My mum and I have tried a number of different things including Calmex tablets, Bach Rescue Remedy in her water, DAP Adaptil Diffuser and collar and some other tablets the Vets have given as.We have also tried leaving the tv and radio on, putting tops with our sent on it in her bed, taking her for longer walks in the morning, giving her treats or something else to crew before we leave which she often doesn't touch. 

I am going to try the points about getting ourselves ready and then sitting on the sofa and leaving her for a short time and then coming back in building the time up and see if that help. 

My mum think we maybe too late to try and re-train her but I am willing to try anything as I'm not sure how much more my mum can take and I hate that Penny is getting herself in a stress whenever we leave. 

Any advice or help will be much appreciated thank you.

Jess


----------



## Sabrina LD

We bought our JRT home at the beginning of the summer holidays and from day one he's been a very good little dog. All "naughty" behaviour manageable and understandable. He sleeps in his bed, can be left alone for a few hours at a time and is generally quite good in that time although he did lkke pulling my plant over and stealing coals from the fire (plant relocated, fire guard in place).
We bought a dog crate before getting him but as we didn't have any real problems with him initially we decided not to use it. I now feel that this was a big mistake! Having now returned to work after the summer holidays I need to leave him for about 4-5 hrs a day which I do not feel is excessive. And I was confident that after a good walk, a feed and a toilet opportunity he would be fine! Imagine my horror when I came home to find the carpet in front of my bedroom door partially destroyed! 
I have two questions: first, when I left the house he was sound asleep and I left the tv on for him. Is it possible that he woke alone and thought I was in my room (like at nighttime) and was trying to get to me? He did this once, but with no real damage when we shut him out to get dressed once. Should I have made him aware that I was going so he knew not to look for me? 
Second: we live in a rented flat, so I can't really afford for him to do anymore damage and with this happening on the first day back to work, I'm now very worried about leaving him loose in the flat. Am I too late to crate train him? He is now 14 weeks.
Any response greatly appreciated.


----------



## Nanaka

Hi everyone,
I've just discovered this forum and there is a lot more advice here than in the French ones. I'd like to tell you about my story because I can't take it anymore....
I took Kurtis 18 months ago in a shelter. We discovered after one or two days that he had a high anxiety separation (peeing everywhere, barking, destroying furniture...). We tried a behavior therapy for 6 months (ignore him before we leave and come back, give him toys full of food when we are away but he is so stressed he won't eat, etc..). We really tried everything even homeopathy. He even managed to escape twice, and the last time he was almost hit by a car. After having seen the behaviorist, he said that Kurtis had such a high anxiety separation that we should now start considering medication even though he is usually highly against it. We gave him 20 mg of clomipramine twice a day at first (and we have always kept going with the behavior therapy). It did improve but after 4 months, things went bad again. We increased the dosage to 30mg but it didn't work. We stopped the medication for a week in order to wean him (and he became especially out of control during that week) and then we introduced a new molecule, fluoxetine 20 mg. Things really improve, more than with the clomipramine but we recently moved in in another flat and the neighbors are always complaining about his barking and wailing. I know that a new flat is a really big deal for a dog. We filmed him and he is indeed barking no matter how long we are away and he keeps staring at the entrance door (even if we are away for 4 hours). But no more peeing or destroying though. We think we should now start considering increase the dosage after the advice of the behaviorist.
He is a mix between a beagle and a spaniel. He weights 19kg (42 pounds). 
He is two years old. We took him at the age of 5months where he stayed in a shelter for 3 months (he wasn't weaned for enough time, according to my vet and the behaviorist specialized in dog anxiety). We introduce clomipramine when he was 11months, stopped it when he was 16 and he is now under Prozac 20 mg for 6 months.
Except this high anxiety, he is the best dog ever, we walk him every day in a big park for 2 hours where he can meet all his dog friends, he has never showed any kind of aggression towards humans or dogs.
Can you please give me some advice to help me?
I don't know what to do, we tried everything but we can't put him back in a shelter, I would feel sad for the rest of my life.

Thank you in advance for reading me. And I'm sorry for my English as it is not my native language.

Kinds regards,
Catherine.


----------



## Theandrewsfamily

Hi

I'm new to this forum, and have read the thread on Dogs with Separation Anxiety, the causes and how to perform this at an early stage.

I/We have a GSD Boxer Cross puppy who is Seven Months old.
We had him from a Dog Shelter (where we was with Two of his brother's).
When he first arrived at our home, he explored his new place and felt at ease with his new setting.
We (my wife, my daughter & I) toilet trained 'Busta' using newspapers firstly and then puppy pads. Busta eventually went out the garden's (where he always goes). 
Unfortunately, he has always suffered with SA. I always take him out for a walk (on/off the lead) but once we put our coats on he begins whining (once left the house he barks and howls). We have had complient's from neighbours and I feel we may have to get rid of him? 
Can anyone give me advise on how we can go about curbing this for our lovely puppy/dog before it's too late?

Ps we always watch Ceaser Millan and Puppy SOS but our puppy has this serverly! 

Please help us.


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## waltergibbs

I had tremendous luck with youtube videos for dogs on my smart telly. I set the sleep timer to an hour and he watches videos of cows (he has odd taste). When I watched my dognanny cam video, he watches for a bit, does a door circle and eats his dry food before watching another fifteen minutes of cows in a field before drooping off to sleep. I don't know what keeps the separation anxiety from triggering again, but it seems to settle the initial bit of nerves he gets that spirals into full blown anxious destruction and such. Every animal is different so it usually takes a bit of tests to find something that fits and then you knock wood it stays. Makes for a much better homecoming after work for both of us


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## caz58

waltergibbs said:


> I had tremendous luck with youtube videos for dogs on my smart telly. I set the sleep timer to an hour and he watches videos of cows (he has odd taste). When I watched my dognanny cam video, he watches for a bit, does a door circle and eats his dry food before watching another fifteen minutes of cows in a field before drooping off to sleep. I don't know what keeps the separation anxiety from triggering again, but it seems to settle the initial bit of nerves he gets that spirals into full blown anxious destruction and such. Every animal is different so it usually takes a bit of tests to find something that fits and then you knock wood it stays. Makes for a much better homecoming after work for both of us


Wow that`s great! How did you discover that he liked to watch that???


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## waltergibbs

caz58 said:


> Wow that`s great! How did you discover that he liked to watch that???


I went through the usual pet videos of dogs for dogs, fish for cats, birds for dogs and cats, etc (eww sounds like porn) and then tried relaxation videos for humans. He likes the rain on leaves one but it is a no go as a plane and a garbage truck enter the audio at some point. I think I chose "pleasant fields" originally, which yielded horses (just riled him up) and then there was one with piebald cows he just watched. Like most other things internet, the rabbit hole is small but the tunnel is long and winding  Just glad he enjoys it. It also helps in the winter or when the rain is bad outside and we can't go out as easily. I would say just to start experimenting. I have a friend that ended up giving his cat his old smartphone to basically play video games while he was away. He also used it like a small telly, with a little stand in front of the cat's bed so it could watch birds eat seed iirc. Your results may vary but there are loads of vids on youtube to find the thing that they like. Try grilling steak or hamburger with cheese videos-if it doesn't excite them too much lol. Actually don't do that because I cannot to afford to buy you a new telly when they try to get the burger  Best of luck with your pet and its anxiety.


----------



## Kristalmaze

Hope someone can help! My 12 year old collie x Springer has developed possible separation anxiety which manifests itself mainly at night when he continually paces and pants, often for hours and nothing I can do will settle him! This doesn't happen every night and I have monitored for a pattern and there is none! 

He has always slept in the bedroom and has access still but I have also tried giving him the run of the house, shutting him in the bedroom, shutting him out the bedroom, shutting him in the small en suite where he goes when he's scared, you name it iv tried the combination and no change! He has a dog flap and when I'm out now he has started to spend time squeezed in a small gap at the top of the garden rather than indoors as he has always done before - nothing has changed at home for him at all. 

He has had a full vet check and all clear, although his eyes and hearing aren't as good as they used to be as I would expect. 98% of the time he is perfectly normal as he has been all his life but the no sleep factor is beginning to take its toll on me and I hate seeing him like that!!!

I have seen many suggestions for training for separation anxiety but these appear to be for puppies and not managing the changes in an older dog - does anyone have any tips??????


----------



## Nonnie

Kristalmaze said:


> Hope someone can help! My 12 year old collie x Springer has developed possible separation anxiety which manifests itself mainly at night when he continually paces and pants, often for hours and nothing I can do will settle him! This doesn't happen every night and I have monitored for a pattern and there is none!
> 
> He has always slept in the bedroom and has access still but I have also tried giving him the run of the house, shutting him in the bedroom, shutting him out the bedroom, shutting him in the small en suite where he goes when he's scared, you name it iv tried the combination and no change! He has a dog flap and when I'm out now he has started to spend time squeezed in a small gap at the top of the garden rather than indoors as he has always done before - nothing has changed at home for him at all.
> 
> He has had a full vet check and all clear, although his eyes and hearing aren't as good as they used to be as I would expect. 98% of the time he is perfectly normal as he has been all his life but the no sleep factor is beginning to take its toll on me and I hate seeing him like that!!!
> 
> I have seen many suggestions for training for separation anxiety but these appear to be for puppies and not managing the changes in an older dog - does anyone have any tips??????


Did your vet mention canine cognitive dysfunction at all?

Unsettled at night is a common symptom.


----------



## Kristalmaze

Nonnie said:


> Did your vet mention canine cognitive dysfunction at all?
> 
> Unsettled at night is a common symptom.


Hi yes he did but as he has no other symptoms of it at all they think it's unlikely to be that


----------



## Dedi

Hi, 
I'm new to this site and I'm finding it very useful. .....we have just rescued a Siberian Husky of 8 months who has had no training and I mean NO training what so ever.....he definitely has separation anxiety especially from my hubby who he has attached himself to. Cooper also has developed a guarding issue over a bone we bought him today and he got very snappy with both of us which actually was quite scary! As we haven't seen him display this until today. We know that Huskies are a very strong breed of dog and this isn't our first dog I have had dogs all my life but have never experienced this behaviour in such a young dog before any advice would be greatly appreciated as I'm beginning to wonder if we have bitten off more than we can handle! ! Pardon the pun.


----------



## Feyi

Hi there dedi, 
Sorry to hear your having trouble with your new husky, I'm also new to this site and I have just adopted an 18 month old male husky, he is very good and well trained at home , just not good with other dogs.
Huskies are very strong breeds and need a lot of excersise. Have you thought of getting a dog trainer Or take him to a puppy class? I'm looking into this for my Nhylus . Where are you based?


----------



## allyf

sue&harvey said:


> *Separation Anxiety in Dogs *
> 
> There has been loads of people asking for advice about this recently, so I thought I would try and put some information all in one place. Please feel free to add any further advice
> 
> *Separation Anxiety Definition *:- The term separation anxiety is not exclusive to dogs or even to veterinary medicine. It is a psychological term to describe the stress and anxiousness in an individual brought on by the leaving (perceived or imagined) of another individual. In the case of a pet, it is usually an anxiety brought on by separation from the primary pet caretaker. In the case of humans, anxiety in a child from being separated from a parent.
> 
> What classifies as a "separation"? This varies greatly between animals: some must have "their person" within their line of sight, other pets are fine as long as the owner is within a comfortable distance (i.e. somewhere else in the house), and still others are fine until the owner leaves. Even finer distinctions would be animals that are fine for a certain period of time after their owner leaves, but then start to show signs of anxiousness some time later.
> 
> Just like the variance in what stresses out each individual, the signs of separation anxiety vary greatly as well.
> 
> *Which Dogs can be effected by Separation Anxiety:-* The answer to this is ANY! There are some breeds believed to be prone to SA. Some of these are German Shepherds, Airedales, Springer Spaniels, Australian Shepherds and Weimaraners, to name a few. This is not to say all of these dogs will not cope being left alone, as with all dogs it will vary greatly depending on the individual.
> 
> Plus a higher number of dogs that come from a shelter or rescue home, seem to develop dog separation anxiety easily. These dogs might have gone through some severe trauma, or abandonment before ending up in the shelter and once they are placed in a home with an owner they can trust, they will start relying on that owner a lot faster than dogs that haven't experienced any trauma in their life already.
> Pups that leave their litter too early are also predisposed to SA.
> 
> *How to prevent your new puppy, or dog from being affected by Separation Anxiety *:- Owners need to help their dog, or puppy to find a happy medium between companionship and becoming sufficiently independent to tolerate being alone for periods of time. Dogs do not electively engage in anxious behaviours. They develop over a period of time, and becomes a panic response. People must condition their dogs to stay calm when left alone. To condition means to get the dog used to specific things, situations and events. That's why it's important to practice leaving and returning to the dog frequently, starting when you first bring the dog into your home and family.
> 
> Teach your dog from the start that your leaving the house is an ordinary, regular event. Help your dog build tolerance for your departures and absences. Calm departures and homecomings will help the dog to relax. When leaving do not have emotional goodbyes, this will not help the dog .
> 
> *Mummy* " _ahh poor baby, will you miss mummy?_" Kiss Kiss Kiss _"Don't worry mummy be back soon"_
> 
> *Puppy *Where's she going, why all this fuss, that thing they call a coat, she only puts that on when she goes outside… I wanna go! Don't want to stay on my own!!! *Panic Response Alert !!!*
> 
> The same applies for your return. Take your coat off unpack the shopping, open your mail, then when the dog is calm let them outside to toilet. (Still not spoken to him) When he had been to the loo, then you can give him praise and a little play session.
> 
> When you first bring home your bundle of fluff and needle sharp teeth, let them explore the outside area first ( get them used to going outside, it will help when toilet training, and big fuss for toileting outside.) Then take them inside letting them explore their new kingdom in stages.
> 
> Have the dog's bed and bowl of water ready in a safe, well-lighted, comfortable confined area with "family smells", such as a gated-off kitchen, family room or crate placed in a family area. (Do not confine in basements, garages, storage rooms, or other non-family areas). This nice "den" will be the place in which she will stay when you are not home to supervise. Take her to that place, tell her lie down (guide her if she has not yet learned that command). Then give her one or two safe chew toys and praise her. Couple a food treat with the verbal praise. In fact, it's helpful to keep a small bag of tiny tipbit treats on you at all times during the acclimation and training phases.
> 
> Next, close the door or gate to the room or crate, and step back. See if she is staying calm. Resist the urge to talk to the dog, since that will distract her from this desired, calm, relaxed behaviour. ( He should be shattered from his trip to his new home, and all that exploring)
> 
> If she stays reasonably calm when separated from you for a minute or two, let her stay there as long as she seems comfortable. (See thread "Cages" in Dog Chat) If the dog is good in her confined area, this is a very good sign. You can begin to add calm, quiet verbal praise and an occasional food treat to this acclimation routine as a reward for being good and calm in her confined area.
> 
> Over the next few days and weeks encourage your new pup or dog to sleep in his safe area. Slowly increase the amount of time they are left. A dog that is left regularly will become well adapted and sufficiently independent to cope with being alone.
> 
> Also install baby gates so you dog learns to accept he cannot access you when ever he wants. He can see you, but cannot always get to you.
> 
> _*Spend time training your dog to happily accept alone time will save you, your dog and you neighbours a lot of stress in the long run! *_


----------



## ggrw104

I've been trying the tips outlined in this article and I've got my 8 week old pug used to about three minutes in her pen. However, she is starting to soil her pen when I do this. This morning she peed next to her crate and this afternoon she pooped in her crate (having been taken outside to use the toilet). Does anyone have any advice on how to deal with this? i've been trying the '10 times a day minimum' of just leaving the room. We go back to work in two weeks so I just want to make it as smooth as possible for her.


----------



## AlpineHeros

This advice is golden, thanks so much!!!! I have 3 puppies who all have SA and two are brother and sister, and both used to have Tapeworm so there appetite is large. One is 4 months the other two are 3. If one starts whining or barking, it has a knock on affect with the other dogs so I either have to sit with them for an average of 10 minutes to calm them before leaving, or take them all out for a walk, sometimes at least 5 times a day or a couple of 2hr+ long walks, so almost all my time is dedicated to them and prempting there behaviour with attention, toilet walks or long walks.


----------



## AceOfSpades113

This thread is great! My Border Collie Ace has a nightmare case of Separation Anxiety, I would never even consider a shock collar or the likes for him. Sadly, he had a traumatic experience while at the vets getting neutered which included a blunt razor and a cut open stomach, and since that day he refuses to be without me. Say for example we walk to the shop as usual. I will tie him up outside where he will be able to see through the glass window to make sure I am there. He will make this howl/whining noise which the workers now call his song and just keep getting louder and louder until I return.
Inside the house if left alone, Ace's bladder wouldn't hold whatsoever, even if left for an hour we would come home to pee everywhere, the door scratching became so bad I actually showed him how to open my bedroom door! I know some people are going to say 'bad idea' but believe me, when I had the option of him scratching the entire wood or knowing he could open the door in a more clean matter then that was what I chose in a hurry, since by this stage the dreaded 'He's going to the pound if he doesn't' was beginning at this stage. Although the front and back door are beyond repair by this stage, three years later and he is still a bad sufferer, although has learnt that not everyone is bad and will remain calm providing someone else who is part of the family unit is there with him. During the night if he is left downstairs, in the hall, or anywhere else he will pee/poo, although that was solved quickly and effectively by letting him sleep in the room with me, more so than that he is not even happy on the ground and insists on being up cuddled with his head on the pillow! His separation anxiety gets especially bad when people try to stop him from getting to me, he turns downright violent. We managed to get our CD Obedience Award with Kennel Club and were only a few points from our next level when I pulled him out- the task was a simple one, but not for us. It involved him sitting still while a stranger stroked him and I walked away. We tried for four weeks, and he only became more aggressive everytime to the point when he seen anyone coming near he would already press himself into me and snarl at them. I may have to try the calmatives and see do they help at all next time I am gone for a long time!


----------



## Django987

I read the initial post with interest as having just moved home to live with my partner and his children, my dog is having to adapt to new surroundings as well as his seperation anxiety. What I am interested in knowing though is about who can be present when the training is taking place. If the children are around should they leave the house when I do (as I am the point of anxiety for him) or can they stay in the house? What do people think?


----------



## Barcello

sue&harvey said:


> *Separation Anxiety in Dogs *
> 
> There has been loads of people asking for advice about this recently, so I thought I would try and put some information all in one place. Please feel free to add any further advice
> 
> *Separation Anxiety Definition *:- The term separation anxiety is not exclusive to dogs or even to veterinary medicine. It is a psychological term to describe the stress and anxiousness in an individual brought on by the leaving (perceived or imagined) of another individual. In the case of a pet, it is usually an anxiety brought on by separation from the primary pet caretaker. In the case of humans, anxiety in a child from being separated from a parent.
> 
> What classifies as a "separation"? This varies greatly between animals: some must have "their person" within their line of sight, other pets are fine as long as the owner is within a comfortable distance (i.e. somewhere else in the house), and still others are fine until the owner leaves. Even finer distinctions would be animals that are fine for a certain period of time after their owner leaves, but then start to show signs of anxiousness some time later.
> 
> Just like the variance in what stresses out each individual, the signs of separation anxiety vary greatly as well.
> 
> *Which Dogs can be effected by Separation Anxiety:-* The answer to this is ANY! There are some breeds believed to be prone to SA. Some of these are German Shepherds, Airedales, Springer Spaniels, Australian Shepherds and Weimaraners, to name a few. This is not to say all of these dogs will not cope being left alone, as with all dogs it will vary greatly depending on the individual.
> 
> Plus a higher number of dogs that come from a shelter or rescue home, seem to develop dog separation anxiety easily. These dogs might have gone through some severe trauma, or abandonment before ending up in the shelter and once they are placed in a home with an owner they can trust, they will start relying on that owner a lot faster than dogs that haven't experienced any trauma in their life already.
> Pups that leave their litter too early are also predisposed to SA.
> 
> *How to prevent your new puppy, or dog from being affected by Separation Anxiety *:- Owners need to help their dog, or puppy to find a happy medium between companionship and becoming sufficiently independent to tolerate being alone for periods of time. Dogs do not electively engage in anxious behaviours. They develop over a period of time, and becomes a panic response. People must condition their dogs to stay calm when left alone. To condition means to get the dog used to specific things, situations and events. That's why it's important to practice leaving and returning to the dog frequently, starting when you first bring the dog into your home and family.
> 
> Teach your dog from the start that your leaving the house is an ordinary, regular event. Help your dog build tolerance for your departures and absences. Calm departures and homecomings will help the dog to relax. When leaving do not have emotional goodbyes, this will not help the dog .
> 
> *Mummy* " _ahh poor baby, will you miss mummy?_" Kiss Kiss Kiss _"Don't worry mummy be back soon"_
> 
> *Puppy *Where's she going, why all this fuss, that thing they call a coat, she only puts that on when she goes outside… I wanna go! Don't want to stay on my own!!! *Panic Response Alert !!!*
> 
> The same applies for your return. Take your coat off unpack the shopping, open your mail, then when the dog is calm let them outside to toilet. (Still not spoken to him) When he had been to the loo, then you can give him praise and a little play session.
> 
> When you first bring home your bundle of fluff and needle sharp teeth, let them explore the outside area first ( get them used to going outside, it will help when toilet training, and big fuss for toileting outside.) Then take them inside letting them explore their new kingdom in stages.
> 
> Have the dog's bed and bowl of water ready in a safe, well-lighted, comfortable confined area with "family smells", such as a gated-off kitchen, family room or crate placed in a family area. (Do not confine in basements, garages, storage rooms, or other non-family areas). This nice "den" will be the place in which she will stay when you are not home to supervise. Take her to that place, tell her lie down (guide her if she has not yet learned that command). Then give her one or two safe chew toys and praise her. Couple a food treat with the verbal praise. In fact, it's helpful to keep a small bag of tiny tipbit treats on you at all times during the acclimation and training phases.
> 
> Next, close the door or gate to the room or crate, and step back. See if she is staying calm. Resist the urge to talk to the dog, since that will distract her from this desired, calm, relaxed behaviour. ( He should be shattered from his trip to his new home, and all that exploring)
> 
> If she stays reasonably calm when separated from you for a minute or two, let her stay there as long as she seems comfortable. (See thread "Cages" in Dog Chat) If the dog is good in her confined area, this is a very good sign. You can begin to add calm, quiet verbal praise and an occasional food treat to this acclimation routine as a reward for being good and calm in her confined area.
> 
> Over the next few days and weeks encourage your new pup or dog to sleep in his safe area. Slowly increase the amount of time they are left. A dog that is left regularly will become well adapted and sufficiently independent to cope with being alone.
> 
> Also install baby gates so you dog learns to accept he cannot access you when ever he wants. He can see you, but cannot always get to you.
> 
> _*Spend time training your dog to happily accept alone time will save you, your dog and you neighbours a lot of stress in the long run! *_


Our problem is a little more confusing our 11 month old Finley our tibetan boy is fine when hubby goes out and Finley is left with me he is calm and settlef. But when I go out Finley becomes very distressed barking crying scratching our front door . He is best of pals with my hustand they play with toys and rolling around the floor when the 3 of us are together but when I go out Finley will not entertain going for a walk or playing as he is too anxious he's the same when I get put of the car and leave him with hubby but calm when he's left with me. The problem is getting worse and we don't know how to help him as we don't know why he's doing it.


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## Danielle Barber

Video of my Beagle, Toby  Loves a squeaky toy! He used to chew them up and eat them, luckily.. 5 years later, he now loves his toys and prefers to play with them rather than eat them! For other videos of Toby.. search on Youtube "TOBY Funny Beagle"

Beagle's are such lovely dogs, but are very puppy-like for a very long time.. (well, mine is!) Toby has only just started to mature and he is now 5.. However, I wouldn't change him! He has major separation anxieties, so its like having a baby 24/7! Anytime i need to go out, he has to sit in the car and wait for me or i have to get someone round to sit with him.. OR worse case, he spends the day/night in the kennels (which he appears to absolutely love) Strange boy!


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## Rob1878

This is an excellent thread and helping me out with our 4 month old mini dacshund. Thank you all.


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## kestrel

This is a hugely helpful post, I agree. My issue is I have a ten year old boy, who, with our Husky (..who is as laid back as they come) behaves 99% of the time. Problem is when he doesn't....

We rent accommodation and in our last house, when we had him crate trained, he chewed and bent the bars, got his head through, and chewed our banister, which has cost us £80 and he pulled the letterbox off of the door. Amazingly, they didn't notice that!! After this we decided to see how he was out of his crate, which he did ok with apart from quite a few pees and poos.

We have recently moved and apart from regular poo's when we came home (which was ok, as it is a change of environment) he was doing great. We came back a few nights ago and he had chewed and scratched a door frame quite badly (fortunately nothing a good wood filler won't fix). We had a horrendous day yesterday trying to decide what the best course of action is as we love him a great deal but we cannot leave ourselves in a position where he puts our tenancy at risk! Anyway we have decided he will go to my mother in law for a week or so until we can put a fix in place, and, sadly, this will HAVE to be a crate again. We really have no option.

What I want to know is what kind of crate might there be out there for us to buy that he CANT chew on. Does such a thing exist or will we just have to do our best and stick with him in a crate, regardless. I hate the idea of doing this but I do not see we have ANY other option, apart from him going to the shelter. Before us he had four home in four years and he has now been with us for six years. I worry sheltering him would be the final straw and he would end up being put down, which I don't think he deserves! I just need a plan in place. Pls help.


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## matty1878

I need help! I've posted somewere else today lol I've moved home been here a month and when I try leave my flat zack starts to bark and howl till I'm back. I've only been doing this for 5/ten mins a day to try get him used to it. Do I need to keep at it? I've got an adaptil collar on and a diffuser in. We sleep eat live together 24/7


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## lux.lisbon

Hi, I'm new to forums in general and a new puppy owner so I really, really need help from you, guys.
Last Friday I brought home a puppy, around one month old, someone threw him and his 6 other brothers and sisters out. A friend of mine found him and long story short, I have a puppy and I never had one before. I have another dog, but we adopted him when he was already an adult. 
This new puppy is a mix between labrador and golden retriever and I believe he's got separation anxiety, from what I found out on internet. First night he slept with me in my bed, but that's not what I want to train him to do, so my dad made him some kind of a crate, quite spacious, he has all his toys in there, food, water, bed, everything. But he hates to be on his own, even for a minute. He whines A LOT, until he falls asleep, and I'm kind of taking this too hard 
I keep thinking he's in pain or in need or in great stress. We don't leave him alone a lot, couple of hours during the day, and there's always someone home to take him out, feed him or play with him. My dad's method is just to ignore his whining, so I'm just wondering if we're doing this wrong? Is it okay to ignore a puppy while he cries? I know it's been only a couple of days, and it seems to me like he whines less than yesterday, but still... It's not really possible for us to keep him occupied all the time. Any experiences with such small puppies? He doesn't cry during the night.

P. S. Sorry if there are some grammar mistakes, English is not my native language.  
P. P. S. His name is Tesla.


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## Jomo80

lux.lisbon said:


> Hi, I'm new to forums in general and a new puppy owner so I really, really need help from you, guys.
> Last Friday I brought home a puppy, around one month old, someone threw him and his 6 other brothers and sisters out. A friend of mine found him and long story short, I have a puppy and I never had one before. I have another dog, but we adopted him when he was already an adult.
> This new puppy is a mix between labrador and golden retriever and I believe he's got separation anxiety, from what I found out on internet. First night he slept with me in my bed, but that's not what I want to train him to do, so my dad made him some kind of a crate, quite spacious, he has all his toys in there, food, water, bed, everything. But he hates to be on his own, even for a minute. He whines A LOT, until he falls asleep, and I'm kind of taking this too hard
> I keep thinking he's in pain or in need or in great stress. We don't leave him alone a lot, couple of hours during the day, and there's always someone home to take him out, feed him or play with him. My dad's method is just to ignore his whining, so I'm just wondering if we're doing this wrong? Is it okay to ignore a puppy while he cries? I know it's been only a couple of days, and it seems to me like he whines less than yesterday, but still... It's not really possible for us to keep him occupied all the time. Any experiences with such small puppies? He doesn't cry during the night.
> 
> P. S. Sorry if there are some grammar mistakes, English is not my native language.
> P. P. S. His name is Tesla.


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## Jomo80

Hi, if he's only 1 month old that's much too young to be away from Mum in ordinary circumstances so may be worth chatting to a vet. In the mean time you can buy soft puppy toys that can be heated to mimic their litter mates (think I've seen them at Pets at home??) That may be some help


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## Jomo80

Very useful thread! I rescued a lurcher a few years ago with massive separation anxiety problems, he would chew the carpets, destroy furniture and soil everywhere. On one occasion we were out for a couple hours and left a small window above the kitchen sink open a small way. When we returned home our neighbour told us he had him as he had ended up injuring his leg and face falling on to the concrete out side the kitchen window. Turned out he had pulled himself on to the sink and managed to get out of the window. I still can't get my head around that as he's huge and the window could only just fit a cat through. 
We worked really hard with a vet to help him. The thing I found made the biggest difference was tough love. We stopped allowing him on the bed and furniture and when he came over nudging our arm for attention (which he did continually) we gave him a pat on the head, said "Good boy, on your bed" but nothing more. It took ages and he still has a relapse every so often - ie I may come home to find he's destroyed my slippers, but he is so much better and come so far.


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## BaileyBeagle1986

Really hoping this helps my Bailey. Had him since Feb, he is a 3 year old rescue who is very overweight, his previous owner just didnt have the time for him. As a result he has formed an incredibly strong bond with the first person to show him attention...ME! He will come and wake me up, follows me round 90% of the time until my son (7) finds a rope or ball to play with, but he will check I am where he left me. even when I leave for work (two hours a day, and my partner works from home so hes not actually alone) he cries for me. We tried a crate, he wouldn't go anywhere near it (until I was collapsing it down, then of course it was great fun!), Stair gates are apparently evil and must be barked at, we couldn't even shut the gate and just walk into the next room so have decided its not worth the extra stress. what we have done (when hes completely alone) instead is shut all doors except for the family room. It has helped already, but he still struggles, also learnt the hard way that he can actually open doors...and then cupboards. Yes, my lil fatty got into the kitchen, and into the child locked cupboards to eat the entire contense!! 

We have got him some toys that he only gets when we are going out, such as his kong, cow horn and huge knot ball, does anyone know if its a good idea to continue with keeping those as special toys or is that making matter worse?


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## Darkangelwitch

I have the same thing with Shona, she follows me everywhere, toilet, shower etc. Luckily she has two other dogs to keep her company when we do have to go out and the Patterdale Karnie play fights teasing her until she plays with him.

I think it's a good idea to keep special toys for when you have to leave him - if he had them all the time he would get bored with them.

Give him time, it took Shona nearly a year to cuddle with my OH and you have only had him a couple of months. Patience, kindness, love and discipline are key to rehabilitation.

I am sure there will be some people on here who can give some ideas to help.

Good luck with him, he looks lovely


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## 2Retrievers

Hi. I have a 13 year old retriever who is great when at home, no accidents etc even when we go out for a few hours. When we went away recently we left her with a dog sitter and she urinated in the dog sittershouse - which she doesn't do at home. She even did this after being outside for hours. Can anyone help explain this please? and how we might be able to solve the problem? Thanks very much for any advice.


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## hemodv

thank you so helpful


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## Hattiesan

Helpful, thank you


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## Hattiesan

Helpful, thank you


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## Amanda22

petcoach said:


> This has always worked with separation anxiety: dogs know the signs of when you are about to leave - or go upstairs. They watch you do your hair, put on your make up, run around and find your mobile, etc. and they know that all this means you are about to run out of the door or go upstairs, and they get anxious.
> 
> So, what you do is follow your usual routine to the letter - and then, instead of running out of the door - you sit down and watch a bit of TV or read a book. Do that often enough and you will desensitise the dog because he will realise that your putting on your coat and picking up your bag or doing whatever you do before you go upstairs really does not necessarily mean you are going to disappear. You can also try your usual routine and go out, only to return immediately. Repeat this a lot and it could break the anxiety cycle
> 
> When you do go upstairs or go out, try to change your routine and don't say anything to your dog - just walk out of the door without looking back. If your dog senses you are anxious about what they will do, he will show his concern by howling or with distructive behaviour.
> 
> All this applies if your dog is left downstairs and cries when he is left alone. Your dog is trying to train you - don't let it win! If the worst thing happens and it whines and you need to go down stairs, throw your keys or something similar down the stairs before you appear; the sudden sound will shock it into a temporary silence at which point you can appear and reward it immediately for being quiet! You can use anything that will distract it and keep it quiet long enough for you to come downstairs.
> 
> And, don't forget the crucial rule is always walk your dog until it is really tired every morning and again in the evening. If that means engaging a dog walker, then that is what you must do. A tired dog is a happy dog that goes to sleep - most of the time!
> 
> All the best with this,
> 
> Sue
> .


Please could you explain, got a 16 week old beagle a couple of weeks ago, Bailey he's absolutely adorable but whines and howls when left alone. Going to try these suggestions but do I try them initially with him free to roam or in his crate with the door closed.


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## LoopyL

Thought I'd add this article which I thought very good http://malenademartini.com/the-exasperating-truth-why-separation-anxiety-gets-a-bad-rap/


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## Petra McCandless

I always tell my pulpy owner to use massage and use lavender oil *specifically* made for dogs. This will help the dog to relax by the lavender and feel safe by having the owner close by. This is also the best way to create bonds between the owner and the puppy or dog. Please just make sure you do not use the lavender oil we people use, it is to strong for the dogs.


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## Aromaticmist

matty1878 said:


> I need help! I've posted somewere else today lol I've moved home been here a month and when I try leave my flat zack starts to bark and howl till I'm back. I've only been doing this for 5/ten mins a day to try get him used to it. Do I need to keep at it? I've got an adaptil collar on and a diffuser in. We sleep eat live together 24/7


Did you ever get sorted, I'm going through something now very similar?


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## Lennor Magill

sue&harvey said:


> *Signs and symptoms of Separation Anxiety:-
> Before you go! Introducing Velcro dog!
> *
> 
> *Your dog or puppy needs to be with you:* If your dog has separation anxiety, you may find that they always need to be in the same room as you, or within eyesight. If you make a move to another room, they will immediately get up to follow you. They are calmest when they are right next to you, and you arent moving. Some people call this behaviour Velcro-ing because the dog is stuck to you. Clinically this is called hyper-attachment and is a major identifier of separation anxiety in dogs.
> 
> *Anxiety And Nervousness:* when you are getting ready to leave: Dogs are smart animals  your dog has probably figured out that you are going to leave by how you act before leaving the house. These leaving signals can trigger anxiety in your dog before you have even gone. For example, Scout used to run to the door when I picked up my keys and jingled them. He also knew that when I put on shoes or sandals, that I was getting ready to go. He would stand at the door and block me, to make sure I wasnt leaving without him. Dogs will also pace back in forth, nervous that you are about to leave.
> *Chewing Items that smell like you:* Dogs like to chew on your underwear and socks because they smell like you. Make sure you pick up, and give the dogs other items to chew on.
> 
> *While you are absent! Introducing the devil incarnate!*
> *Barking, Howling and Whining*: Your dog barking when you leave is a very common symptom of dog separation anxiety. Typically, your dog will show signs of anxiety, and begin whining or pacing before you leave. As the anxiety level increases, this may change to whining, then barking. *These are not normal barks * your dog is having an anxiety attack because they think that *you* are not coming back and need to be with you. This is a huge problem with Condo and apartment tenants. Many cases of dogs returning to shelters are because of Separation issues.
> 
> *Digging, Scratching, Chewing:* The next level of separation anxiety is when a dog moves beyond barking and starts get physical. This type of scratching chewing and digging is an attempt to escape from the confines of the room, house, or yard so that they can find you. Some dogs will be in such a panic that they will rub their noses and paws completely raw, break through glass, tear down walls, and otherwise injure you or your property to get to you.
> 
> *Destroying the House!* Your dog may also get downright destructive. I have seen many couches ruined, carpets pulled up, and cabinets destroyed. This is a symptom of separation anxiety when these behaviours happen only when you are not present. If you dont curb this behaviour quickly, the costs can become enormous.
> If you have a puppy, they may be teething and need a better variety of safe treats to chew on. If your dog is also destructive while you are home, they probably need more exercise, and stronger training regime. You should also keep an eye on your dog so that you can correct the behaviour while it is happening.
> 
> *Peeing and Pooing around the House*: Some dogs will go to the toilet around the house when you leave. This is caused because they are so scared and anxious, that they lose control of their bowels and bladder. They are truly in a panic. Healthy adult dogs should be able to hold their bladder for at least 5 hours. Puppies typically can hold their bladder 1 hour for every month of age. You probably know your dogs routine, if this behaviour is outside of normal, they most likely have separation anxiety!
> 
> *When you return! Overjoyed dog in the middle of a war zone!*
> 
> *Over Excitement:* A common symptom of an anxious dog is that they when they see you again, they are excessively overjoyed. The greeting is not normal and calm, it is frantic and uncontrolled. Your dog thought you would never return, so they are not just saying Hello, they are expressing their relief at no longer being abandoned.
> Not all dogs display these behaviours, some display mild symptoms such as whining, others will destroy a room that they are left in until you return. Separation anxiety is a serious condition and robs both you and your dog of a healthy relationship
> 
> _Please, where possible ask a GOOD behaviourist to diagnose Separation Anxiety, and assist with a behaviour modification plan, as each dog is different!_


I have a greyhound puppy who is almost 6months old who i believe is suffering from SA.
He follows my son and i everywhere. We have a baby gate to know Jim out of the kitchen and he will stand there and watch me,or sit outside the bathroom door waiting. He cannot decide at times who he misses most,my son or I. He cried for and hour for the first-time a few days ago when my son left for work ,he was right next to me. We've had him now for four months. He was one of a little of 11 and was brought to us when he was 8weeks old
Yesterday i left him in the living room and went next door,I couldn't heard him on return and looked through the window to see him calmly lying on the sofa.( He's not allowed there) It's the only time he hasn't jumped all over me on my return. It seems it's one of the ways forward,but i don't want Morgan sitting on the sofas or armchairs.
I am almost at my wits end with his SA. I love him dearly and maybe we are to blame as we lost another greyhound puppy who was deliberately run over by a hit and run driver. We tended to be overly protective when we 1st got him.
We've now got very over anxious pup. Any suggestions you can offer?


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## MaryAnn

Great post....I'm not sure...I've heard that letting a dog that is a velcro dog sleep with you doesn't help with SA. I have tried to make my dog sleep in her bed but I feel so bad, like she thinks she did something wrong. I think it's harder on me than it is on her. She will do it if I make her but she loves to snuggle.


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## Ellieaness

We have a similar issue MaryAnn, our dog can't sleep downstairs as he whines and barks, and we can't keep the door open as the cats try to come in, and they aren't friends yet. We encourage him into his bed in our bedroom when we go to bed, but he always sneak on the bed in the night. he is definitely a velcro dog.


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## Ellieaness

By the way, has anyone tried a Thundershirt for separation anxiety?


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## Lennor Magill

MaryAnn said:


> Great post....I'm not sure...I've heard that letting a dog that is a velcro dog sleep with you doesn't help with SA. I have tried to make my dog sleep in her bed but I feel so bad, like she thinks she did something wrong. I think it's harder on me than it is on her. She will do it if I make her but she loves to snuggle.





Ellieaness said:


> By the way, has anyone tried a Thundershirt for separation anxiety?


Thank you for your response, Morgan sneeks into our beads during the night. 1st to my son's then back to my bedroom where he sleeps on the floor at the foot of my bed but come morning he jumps into my bed . 
I have been told that greyhounds need the company of other dogs as they suffer from anxiety and separation. They are so loving that you can't help loving them.My dog is a great mischievous character and in spite of the fact of me being unable to leave him alone, I simply cannot be without him.


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## Lennor Magill

MaryAnn said:


> Great post....I'm not sure...I've heard that letting a dog that is a velcro dog sleep with you doesn't help with SA. I have tried to make my dog sleep in her bed but I feel so bad, like she thinks she did something wrong. I think it's harder on me than it is on her. She will do it if I make her but she loves to snuggle.


Don't worry about your dog getting into your bed, I'm a widow an love my doggy cuddles. Morgan loves lying with his head across my lap. He loves doing that


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## MaryN

I think that it is very important to give your dog give your dog something to do while you are away


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## Lennor Magill

sue&harvey said:


> *Separation Anxiety in Dogs *
> 
> There has been loads of people asking for advice about this recently, so I thought I would try and put some information all in one place. Please feel free to add any further advice
> 
> *Separation Anxiety Definition *:- The term separation anxiety is not exclusive to dogs or even to veterinary medicine. It is a psychological term to describe the stress and anxiousness in an individual brought on by the leaving (perceived or imagined) of another individual. In the case of a pet, it is usually an anxiety brought on by separation from the primary pet caretaker. In the case of humans, anxiety in a child from being separated from a parent.
> 
> What classifies as a "separation"? This varies greatly between animals: some must have "their person" within their line of sight, other pets are fine as long as the owner is within a comfortable distance (i.e. somewhere else in the house), and still others are fine until the owner leaves. Even finer distinctions would be animals that are fine for a certain period of time after their owner leaves, but then start to show signs of anxiousness some time later.
> 
> Just like the variance in what stresses out each individual, the signs of separation anxiety vary greatly as well.
> 
> *Which Dogs can be effected by Separation Anxiety:-* The answer to this is ANY! There are some breeds believed to be prone to SA. Some of these are German Shepherds, Airedales, Springer Spaniels, Australian Shepherds and Weimaraners, to name a few. This is not to say all of these dogs will not cope being left alone, as with all dogs it will vary greatly depending on the individual.
> 
> Plus a higher number of dogs that come from a shelter or rescue home, seem to develop dog separation anxiety easily. These dogs might have gone through some severe trauma, or abandonment before ending up in the shelter and once they are placed in a home with an owner they can trust, they will start relying on that owner a lot faster than dogs that haven't experienced any trauma in their life already.
> Pups that leave their litter too early are also predisposed to SA.
> 
> *How to prevent your new puppy, or dog from being affected by Separation Anxiety *:- Owners need to help their dog, or puppy to find a happy medium between companionship and becoming sufficiently independent to tolerate being alone for periods of time. Dogs do not electively engage in anxious behaviours. They develop over a period of time, and becomes a panic response. People must condition their dogs to stay calm when left alone. To condition means to get the dog used to specific things, situations and events. That's why it's important to practice leaving and returning to the dog frequently, starting when you first bring the dog into your home and family.
> 
> Teach your dog from the start that your leaving the house is an ordinary, regular event. Help your dog build tolerance for your departures and absences. Calm departures and homecomings will help the dog to relax. When leaving do not have emotional goodbyes, this will not help the dog .
> 
> *Mummy* " _ahh poor baby, will you miss mummy?_" Kiss Kiss Kiss _"Don't worry mummy be back soon"_
> 
> *Puppy *Where's she going, why all this fuss, that thing they call a coat, she only puts that on when she goes outside… I wanna go! Don't want to stay on my own!!! *Panic Response Alert !!!*
> 
> The same applies for your return. Take your coat off unpack the shopping, open your mail, then when the dog is calm let them outside to toilet. (Still not spoken to him) When he had been to the loo, then you can give him praise and a little play session.
> 
> When you first bring home your bundle of fluff and needle sharp teeth, let them explore the outside area first ( get them used to going outside, it will help when toilet training, and big fuss for toileting outside.) Then take them inside letting them explore their new kingdom in stages.
> 
> Have the dog's bed and bowl of water ready in a safe, well-lighted, comfortable confined area with "family smells", such as a gated-off kitchen, family room or crate placed in a family area. (Do not confine in basements, garages, storage rooms, or other non-family areas). This nice "den" will be the place in which she will stay when you are not home to supervise. Take her to that place, tell her lie down (guide her if she has not yet learned that command). Then give her one or two safe chew toys and praise her. Couple a food treat with the verbal praise. In fact, it's helpful to keep a small bag of tiny tipbit treats on you at all times during the acclimation and training phases.
> 
> Next, close the door or gate to the room or crate, and step back. See if she is staying calm. Resist the urge to talk to the dog, since that will distract her from this desired, calm, relaxed behaviour. ( He should be shattered from his trip to his new home, and all that exploring)
> 
> If she stays reasonably calm when separated from you for a minute or two, let her stay there as long as she seems comfortable. (See thread "Cages" in Dog Chat) If the dog is good in her confined area, this is a very good sign. You can begin to add calm, quiet verbal praise and an occasional food treat to this acclimation routine as a reward for being good and calm in her confined area.
> 
> Over the next few days and weeks encourage your new pup or dog to sleep in his safe area. Slowly increase the amount of time they are left. A dog that is left regularly will become well adapted and sufficiently independent to cope with being alone.
> 
> Also install baby gates so you dog learns to accept he cannot access you when ever he wants. He can see you, but cannot always get to you.
> 
> _*Spend time training your dog to happily accept alone time will save you, your dog and you neighbours a lot of stress in the long run! *_


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## Lennor Magill

My dog must have us within sight nearly always. He goes out in the garden and is fine,or he sometimes goes out of slight to his bed no problem. Most of the time he must be very very near,almost under foot . I sometimes leave him to go shopping for 1/2 an hour and return to find him sitting calmly at the top of the stairs other times he howls. I don't make a fuss when leaving,i just go.
I practice most of the tips you give sometimes it's successful others not.I am told greyhounds are very difficult to train,but i think he's worth the time patience and effort. I use threats and a clicker for training,he always responds to food. Morgan is a lovely affection dog just stubborn. He's now 8mths old and is slowly getting there.
THANKS SO MUCH for taking the time to post very helpful information.


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## Keith Hammond

MaryAnn said:


> Great post....I'm not sure...I've heard that letting a dog that is a velcro dog sleep with you doesn't help with SA. I have tried to make my dog sleep in her bed but I feel so bad, like she thinks she did something wrong. I think it's harder on me than it is on her. She will do it if I make her but she loves to snuggle.


I am new to all this … both a dog owner and this online stuff. But I have read some really helpful posts on this thread. I have a ten month old Cocker Spaniel - Charlie. I got him at nine weeks old and he had already had a tough time. He had first gone to a home where there were two mature Staffies and the owners went out to work each day, leaving Charlie to deal with the two Staffies. So when I got him I made every mistake in the book and now at ten months he follows me like my shadow. Not surprising really. Now however I want him to be free of SA and charging around like the independent character he is raring to be …

First, I am moving about my tiny flat more, knowing he is on my tail. I am not giving any attention that welcomes him when he starts snuggling up whilst I am putting up book shelves and things. Next week I start going out again without making a fuss about going and coming for very short times. He will bark like Caruso but what the hell. Me and this fella have to get this SA sorted … Any help from this forum?

All best KH


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## Julianhoney

sue&harvey said:


> *Ok, so we have Velcro-devil-destroyer dog, HELP!*
> 
> *This next part takes time, commitment and consistency. Sorry no quick fix!*
> 
> When we found out from six out of eleven neighbours Harvey was howling the house down the entire time we were out, I turned to this forum and received some fantastic advice. Due to where I live, I was unable to seek advice from a behaviourist. (Language barrier and disagreement in techniques used! Those shock collars again)
> 
> This next bit is bits of advice I received, and my own experience all compiled into one, hopefully helpful post!
> 
> *Calmatives *
> 
> Calmatives are not sedatives! Please dont use sedatives even if they worked in the book Marley and me!
> 
> Types of calmatives widely available either in the shops, on the net or from the vet are:-
> 
> DAP- Dog appeasing Pheromone collars and diffusers are widely available.
> _Taken from Nutrecare website _
> 
> DAP is a synthetic copy of a dog's naturally occurring appeasing pheromones from the lactating female. The DAP Diffuser works like a plug in air freshener, continuously releasing the odourless natural pheromone into the dogs environment, helping to make it feel safe and calm. The DAP Diffuser is a natural solution, there is no sedative effect and the dogs ability to interact and play is maintained.
> 
> A lot of people have dogs who are frightened of fireworks, and it is very distressing for owners to see their beloved friends cowering or shivering in a corner during this season, which seems to get longer each year. The only solution for many is sedatives. This is only a short term solution and is not good long term for the dog.
> 
> Plug DAP into an electric outlet in the room most frequented by the dog. The diffuser is reusable and vials may be replaced as needed. Each vial lasts approximately four weeks and covers up to 650-square-feet.
> 
> DAP Dog Appeasing Pheromone diffuser releases a pacifying pheromone which has been successfully used to treat chronic problems such as destruction, barking, whining, house soiling or excessive licking in adult dogs.
> 
> Overcome separation anxiety.
> One Dog Appeasing Pheromone diffuser will cover between 50 and 70 sqm; so please check the size of your house as you may need more than one diffuser.
> 
> *Bach Rescue Remedy.* A few drops in their water
> 
> Dr Edward Bach discovered 38 remedies which he split into seven different groups that can be combined to suit any individual. The flower remedies are made from wild plants, trees and bushes. They work by treating the individual rather than the disease or its symptoms and are a gentle way to manage your emotions and rediscover a positive side to yourself.
> Each of the 38 Bach Original Flower Remedies is unique and helps treat a different emotion. Most people find it reasonably easy to select their own remedies. All you need to do is find the remedy (or remedies) that seem to reflect your situation, mood or personality best. All the states described are everyday human emotions that we feel from time to time. Even the most negative state has a corresponding positive quality that shows us what we can be when we are completely ourselves.
> For more information about how to select your own Bach Original Flower Remedies and courses to learn more about the system of 38 remedies developed by Dr Bach visit our Bach Original Flower Remedies brand site.
> (Always read the label.)
> 
> ZYLKENE
> 
> Zylkene is not a drug as such, it is a food supplement made from a protein found in milk. The active ingredient is a peptide (a simple sort of protein molecule) which is able to bind temporarily to certain receptors in the brain. This has a calming influence which is similar in some ways to tranquilliser drugs such as diazepam (Vallium), but without the side effects. It has been clinically proven to be effective in dogs and cats (as well as rats and humans). It is supplied in 3 different sizes of capsule, chosen according to the size of the animal to be treated. The capsules are opened and sprinkled on food once daily. The contents seem to taste delicious to most dogs and cats and are easy to give. It is possible to provide treatment for just a few days if it is to cover a particular stressful event, such as travelling away for the weekend. However it is perfectly safe in most situations to give for long periods if needed. Usually a course is given for 2  4 weeks then re-assessed. If in doubt ask your vet, or email us at VioVet for more information. Zylkene is available without prescription and is a safe, natural treatment worth trying for most dogs or cats suffering from stress. It should be used with caution in animals known to be sensitive or allergic to milk, though in fact it is very unlikely to cause trouble even to these animals.
> 
> With Harvey we chose Zylkene, as it was one of the few we could easily obtain. Personally I think it made a difference, but again each dog is different.
> There are plenty more calmatives, so have a good look and speak with your vet to find the best for your dog.


----------



## joelmarks

Separation anxiety in puppies and dogs isn’t always preventable, despite your best efforts. But with patience and a positive attitude, you may be able to reduce your puppy's suffering. It can be a complicated process, so consider working with a Certified Applied Animal Behaviorist or a veterinary behaviorist.


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## Marino Tilatti

One of the most common phrases used by owners to describe a dog that appears stressed when the owner leaves home-or just leaves the room-is separation anxiety in dogs.

*Simulated vs. true dog separation anxiety *

There is true separation anxiety, and there is simulated separation anxiety, in which the dog behavior appears to be separation anxiety but it is, in fact, a learned behavior.

*Causes of dog separation anxiety *

Dog separation anxiety is often unknowingly encouraged by dog owners. We make a big fuss when we leave or come home, and in doing so we reward the dog's concern with our absence, provoking in him even more stress every time we leave.

*The importance of obedience training and discipline 
*
I believe much of the cure for separation anxiety comes from obedience training and discipline. This approach lets your dog know what is expected of him, helping his good behavior to become a habit. He feels wrong showing an unwanted behavior even without you indicating it. Take advantage of that.

*Crate training to avoid dog separation anxiety *

When you are home, have your dog familiar with being in the crate. Start with short periods and then increase the time he spends in it. Feed him in the crate, let him have his favorite bone to be used as a stress reliever while he is in there.

*Change your routine *

It is possible for your dog to recognize a series of actions, you have to be clever. Changing your dog's habits often means changing your own and that can be difficult-we are creatures of habit-but you'll have to change your routine.


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## Aln

Hi can anybody help me I have just rescued a dachshund from a dachshund rescue he is 6 years old and he has become really attached to me to the point where he will follow me everywhere including toilet he is a nervous dog in general and the trouble we are having is that because he has become so attached to me he barks constantly even when he is left with the hubby and when left alone he is a woman sitting dog and isn't very sure on males so we are working on getting his trust in my husband but can anyone give me advice on how to work with his separation anxiety from me with the constant barking after me plz


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## John Parker

Hi everyone.
I have read pages and pages of this thread (and pages on other websites) and tried 99.9% of it all.
We have 4 dogs (Dachshund X's), Mum and Dad and 2 puppies.
To cut a long story short, "Dad", who is approaching 2 years old, screams and screams and screams through the night. He is not a puppy anymore and we have tried everything.
Admittedly we have created this monster as when he/they were younger we used to let them sleep in our bed. He now has the entire run of downstairs at night.
We will not go down until he has stopped screaming, but this is becoming quite hard as he will literally scream for 3 hours straight (it's now nearly 7 and he's been doing it since circa 3am).
We thought he'd pack this in after a week or 2, but it's been months now.
What makes it worse is we have a baby on the way (our first) and my partner is getting little to no sleep because of it... I'm obviously also worried as he'll keep the baby up at night too and ultimately I can't let that happen.
We really need some help. As much as I love him, I fear we can't put up with this lack of sleep much longer.
Oh and we 110% will not be letting him back upstairs just in case anyone suggests it.


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## Darkangelwitch

John Parker said:


> Hi everyone.
> I have read pages and pages of this thread (and pages on other websites) and tried 99.9% of it all.
> We have 4 dogs (Dachshund X's), Mum and Dad and 2 puppies.
> To cut a long story short, "Dad", who is approaching 2 years old, screams and screams and screams through the night. He is not a puppy anymore and we have tried everything.
> Admittedly we have created this monster as when he/they were younger we used to let them sleep in our bed. He now has the entire run of downstairs at night.
> We will not go down until he has stopped screaming, but this is becoming quite hard as he will literally scream for 3 hours straight (it's now nearly 7 and he's been doing it since circa 3am).
> We thought he'd pack this in after a week or 2, but it's been months now.
> What makes it worse is we have a baby on the way (our first) and my partner is getting little to no sleep because of it... I'm obviously also worried as he'll keep the baby up at night too and ultimately I can't let that happen.
> We really need some help. As much as I love him, I fear we can't put up with this lack of sleep much longer.
> Oh and we 110% will not be letting him back upstairs just in case anyone suggests it.


Might be worth putting this on a new thread so it is easily seen


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## John Parker

Darkangelwitch said:


> Might be worth putting this on a new thread so it is easily seen


Thanks for your advice. Re-posted as suggested and getting some good advice  .


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## SweetJo

Our 19 week old 'velcro puppy' isn't getting any better at being apart from us. We have installed extra baby gates so we are currently leaving him for 30 seconds or so.

Sometimes he sits quietly and waits for us. Other times he starts whining after 5 seconds. Advice says return to him before he gets distressed. But he is so inconsistent with his whining we never know when he's going to start.

He will happily have a kong etc on his own but as soon as he's finished he's at the gate crying for us. He won't play with any toys without us there. He just waits by the gate.

When he is really sleepy at night we can leave him when he's in his crate. But during the day he's not having any of it.

I feel like crying. The one thing I was worried about when getting a dog was SA and it looks like we're heading down that road.

How do I get past 30 seconds?! It seems like we're stuck there. Help!!!!


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## HJC

sue&harvey said:


> *Crate Training.*
> 
> I dont want to go too much into crate training here, as there is a good sticky in Dog Chat about Cages. DO NOT USE A CRATE TO HELP EASE SEPARATION ANXIETY UNTIL THE DOG IS REALLY COMFORTABLE ABOUT BEINGIN THERE!
> 
> Provided a crate is introduced in a positive manner, made a nice place to be, and NEVER used as a punishment, then it could (and did become mine) your biggest ally with combating Separation Anxiety.
> 
> The dog has a safe place, or den where he can retreat to in stressful situations. Also you leave him in a safe environment where he cannot chew through your antique table or the live wire of your TV.
> 
> A friend of mine has a staffie cross who was slicing her paws on the carpet grips at all the doors in their 3 story house. The behaviourist suggested the dog feels it has to protect her domain when her owners were out. With so many doors to protect she would dash between each door tearing carpets and paws as she went. They introduced the crate and voila one door, relaxed dog!
> 
> To effectively manage the problem, you need to put the dog in a situation where he cannot make a mistake.
> 
> *Comforting sounds and smells.*
> 
> Leaving the TV or radio on can sooth the dog. Radio stations like BBC Radio 4 is great, lots of talking, or he may be partial to classic FM. Whatever works for him.
> 
> Also a well worn but not washed top of yours near to him but out of chewing distance can help here too.
> 
> *Desensitization!*
> 
> Hutch6 gave this fantastic piece of advice for getting your dog happy for you to be out of sight, and teaching that you always come back
> 
> http://www.petforums.co.uk/1666248-post8.html
> 
> Once you get to a stage where they are happy for you to be out of sight and are happy in their crate (or whichever area you want to leave them) then move on to the next step. Please do not rush, it takes time but will be really worth it in the end! If you think the dog has got it stay on the same step for a further 3 days! Really ingrained then.
> 
> The first step is to ensure the dog is sufficiently tired. Exercise, play, train. Hard. You want him to be ready for long sleep. For this first step a good play and training session should do the trick. You must be calm and relaxed or the dog will pick up on it.
> 
> 1) Put the dog in his area, having made sure he is empty, and basic needs met. Then follow your normal leaving routine, grab your keys. Then sit down and read a magazine.
> 
> Repeat 10 times a day, until the dog no longer even bothers to lift an eyelid.
> 
> 2) As above place the dog in his area, after meeting basic needs, introduce a stuffed Kong 10 minutes before you get ready. (something to keep him occupied) Go through your normal routine, go out the door, close it, then come straight back in.
> 
> Again repeat minimum 10 times a day, until he thinks you are simply mad, and doesnt bat an eye lid.
> 
> If you have a car, this could also be a trigger, so step 3 may be to open and close the car door, and go straight back. Then turn the engine on etc.
> 
> 3) This is where you need to up the exercise, and stimulation to tire. Do all of stage 2, give the Kong etc. Very slowly begin to increase the time, 30 seconds, 1 minute, 2 minutes, 3 minutes, 5 minutes and so on. REMEMBER you are setting the dog up to succeed.
> 
> 4) Once you can leave for 30 minutes, you can then build this into hours, again 1 hour, 1 hour 30 mins, 2 hours etc.
> 
> CONGRATULATIONS WITH HARD WORK, UNDERSTANDING, AND CONSISTANT TRAINING YOU HAVE A DOG THAT NO LONGER HOWLS, CHEWS AND SPENDS ALL HIS TIME WAITING DESPERATLY FOR YOU TO COME BACK.
> 
> If you havent then you really need to employ a behaviourist to assist you, if you havent already.
> 
> Once you successfully get to this stage, after about 6 months of happily being left alone, you can take steps to withdraw calmatives very slowly, and shorten the length of extra exercise. Dont do it too quickly and undo the hard work.
> 
> Harvey is getting there now. If I want to pop to the shops, I will give him a quick walk, and a Kong or chewy and he is happy. He now has no calmatives. Its been really hard work but well worth it.
> 
> If this helps only one person, then I will be pleased. I know how stressful SA is and the impact it can have


This is so helpful thanks. 
Can I ask, in step one, do I sit in sight of him, and how long do I leave it before I go in? Until he starts showing signed of stress? What do I do once we are done? Give him free reign of the house until we are ready to give it a go again or should I encourage him to play in that area too? 
Thanks,
Hannah


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## ChiweenieMummy

This thread has been a great help. When we first got Darby he would scream the place down if we were out of sight and our normal human reaction was "Oh my goodness what could be wrong" obviously this very quickly taught him that if he yelps loud enough someone will come for him. 
We've started the training spending longer and longer out of sight and lots of positive reinforcement when he is quiet in his crate and not fussing and he's doing so much better. Now he sleeps in his crate in the kitchen away from us. We admittedly felt awful when first crate training, but it's his little safe den and he loves it. Often grabs a toy or chew and disappears inside there himself. 
I think for any first time dog owner this is one of the toughest things to deal with. Hearing your furbaby crying can break your heart.


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## Warhurs90

I have a 6 month beagle puppy! And really struggling with separation anxiety with our pup! He will howl when I leave he room and go upstairs, there is a baby gate to stop him from getting up! 
During the day I go out to work for a few hours and then back he is only on his own for 3 hours max and goes into his crate happily after 1 hours walk/exercise in the morning, he never gets stressed when he’s in his crate and we are leaving to go out and when we arrive back he is always calm and again didn’t get overly stressed out!
I make sure I put all my bags down first etc and don’t acknowledge him until I have sorted myself out, then I let him out for a wee and then say hello!
Really getting to be a struggle though I can’t even go upstairs for a minute without him howling/baying!
Any advice would be great thanks!


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## zneve08

We had a problem with our cavoodle and she still has a bit of anxiety being left alone but shes getting MUCH better. When we leave we make it a point to not make a big deal about it. We come and go as we please and she's getting used to it in small increments. When we come back we do not address her until she calms down. Once she calms down, she's rewarded with cuddles etc. but only when she is clam, so we are rewarding being calm in situations that might cause her to by hyper active. She's getting more calm, and much more independent and only at 5 months old.


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## Jbop33

Omg! This is helping so much!! 
I’ve an 11 week german shepherd pup and she has howled the house down 2 nights in a row. (She was great the first 4 nights as we had a family dog staying for her holidays lol) but ofcourse now she’s gone she feels like she’s been abandoned twice. 
The crate has deff helped and stopped her attacking the door. But I couldn’t leave the room without whining. Now I can after just a few try’s. 
Will build up to the rest. Currently working on a different room and the timer is at 4 mins no noise and I heard her happily lie down 30 seconds in


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## Emmachi

I have a solution to all your dogs problems.you can check my signature for the link


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## Kirsty251

sue&harvey said:


> *Separation Anxiety in Dogs *
> 
> There has been loads of people asking for advice about this recently, so I thought I would try and put some information all in one place. Please feel free to add any further advice
> 
> *Separation Anxiety Definition *:- The term separation anxiety is not exclusive to dogs or even to veterinary medicine. It is a psychological term to describe the stress and anxiousness in an individual brought on by the leaving (perceived or imagined) of another individual. In the case of a pet, it is usually an anxiety brought on by separation from the primary pet caretaker. In the case of humans, anxiety in a child from being separated from a parent.
> 
> What classifies as a "separation"? This varies greatly between animals: some must have "their person" within their line of sight, other pets are fine as long as the owner is within a comfortable distance (i.e. somewhere else in the house), and still others are fine until the owner leaves. Even finer distinctions would be animals that are fine for a certain period of time after their owner leaves, but then start to show signs of anxiousness some time later.
> 
> Just like the variance in what stresses out each individual, the signs of separation anxiety vary greatly as well.
> 
> *Which Dogs can be effected by Separation Anxiety:-* The answer to this is ANY! There are some breeds believed to be prone to SA. Some of these are German Shepherds, Airedales, Springer Spaniels, Australian Shepherds and Weimaraners, to name a few. This is not to say all of these dogs will not cope being left alone, as with all dogs it will vary greatly depending on the individual.
> 
> Plus a higher number of dogs that come from a shelter or rescue home, seem to develop dog separation anxiety easily. These dogs might have gone through some severe trauma, or abandonment before ending up in the shelter and once they are placed in a home with an owner they can trust, they will start relying on that owner a lot faster than dogs that haven't experienced any trauma in their life already.
> Pups that leave their litter too early are also predisposed to SA.
> 
> *How to prevent your new puppy, or dog from being affected by Separation Anxiety *:- Owners need to help their dog, or puppy to find a happy medium between companionship and becoming sufficiently independent to tolerate being alone for periods of time. Dogs do not electively engage in anxious behaviours. They develop over a period of time, and becomes a panic response. People must condition their dogs to stay calm when left alone. To condition means to get the dog used to specific things, situations and events. That's why it's important to practice leaving and returning to the dog frequently, starting when you first bring the dog into your home and family.
> 
> Teach your dog from the start that your leaving the house is an ordinary, regular event. Help your dog build tolerance for your departures and absences. Calm departures and homecomings will help the dog to relax. When leaving do not have emotional goodbyes, this will not help the dog .
> 
> *Mummy* " _ahh poor baby, will you miss mummy?_" Kiss Kiss Kiss _"Don't worry mummy be back soon"_
> 
> *Puppy *Where's she going, why all this fuss, that thing they call a coat, she only puts that on when she goes outside… I wanna go! Don't want to stay on my own!!! *Panic Response Alert !!!*
> 
> The same applies for your return. Take your coat off unpack the shopping, open your mail, then when the dog is calm let them outside to toilet. (Still not spoken to him) When he had been to the loo, then you can give him praise and a little play session.
> 
> When you first bring home your bundle of fluff and needle sharp teeth, let them explore the outside area first ( get them used to going outside, it will help when toilet training, and big fuss for toileting outside.) Then take them inside letting them explore their new kingdom in stages.
> 
> Have the dog's bed and bowl of water ready in a safe, well-lighted, comfortable confined area with "family smells", such as a gated-off kitchen, family room or crate placed in a family area. (Do not confine in basements, garages, storage rooms, or other non-family areas). This nice "den" will be the place in which she will stay when you are not home to supervise. Take her to that place, tell her lie down (guide her if she has not yet learned that command). Then give her one or two safe chew toys and praise her. Couple a food treat with the verbal praise. In fact, it's helpful to keep a small bag of tiny tipbit treats on you at all times during the acclimation and training phases.
> 
> Next, close the door or gate to the room or crate, and step back. See if she is staying calm. Resist the urge to talk to the dog, since that will distract her from this desired, calm, relaxed behaviour. ( He should be shattered from his trip to his new home, and all that exploring)
> 
> If she stays reasonably calm when separated from you for a minute or two, let her stay there as long as she seems comfortable. (See thread "Cages" in Dog Chat) If the dog is good in her confined area, this is a very good sign. You can begin to add calm, quiet verbal praise and an occasional food treat to this acclimation routine as a reward for being good and calm in her confined area.
> 
> Over the next few days and weeks encourage your new pup or dog to sleep in his safe area. Slowly increase the amount of time they are left. A dog that is left regularly will become well adapted and sufficiently independent to cope with being alone.
> 
> Also install baby gates so you dog learns to accept he cannot access you when ever he wants. He can see you, but cannot always get to you.
> 
> _*Spend time training your dog to happily accept alone time will save you, your dog and you neighbours a lot of stress in the long run! *_


My dog is showing all these signs. I have a week off work now, so I am going to work on all these points. I am going to look at calmatives. Thanks Sue.


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## Katie Yates

My 10 week old springer spaniel is showing all of the signs. I feel like I am having a mental breakdown with her. She follows me around the house and won’t settle in her crate, the only time she settles is when she is with me on the sofa. I have only left her a few times in the house for around 30mins and when I come home she has done her business on the kitchen floor. I really don’t know what to do with her. Please someone help


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## roberto19993

I wanted to share thishttps://bit.ly/2sRyqdi that helped me a lot when teaching my pet is excellent, besides that they teach very well


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## AB123

This is great, it really captures information that all owners need to know about their dogs. I've never really thought to try and put myself in their shoes as you discussed with the spiders, and it makes me so thankful that I had already read up on leaving your dog at home alone before - as I can't imagine putting anyone through that.

I also think it is so important you talked about the effect of negative crate training and experiences for a dog - as this is something that not many people are clued up on at all, and it is so sad. I would also like to repeat your sentiments on the correct way to crate 'train' a dog. When done right, it benefits both yourself and your dog and can be a great way of reducing the stress and anxiety of your dog - giving them an area to retreat to whenever they feel stressed at all. I know personally one of my dogs uses it as an escape from particularly noisy or handsy guests - and I just have to tell people to leave him be when he's there, and I know it helps.


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## XeniaStarkov

Thank you for this post! I have the same problem with my 3-year-old Dachshund. I've thought about using a crate, but now I know it can make things worse!


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## Guest

I need to read through this tonight when I can concentrate! In the week since having Finn, I've been to the toilet THREE TIMES by myself in private. It's like overly-attached dog: bathmat edition


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## lullabydream

AsahiGo said:


> I need to read through this tonight when I can concentrate! In the week since having Finn, I've been to the toilet THREE TIMES by myself in private. It's like overly-attached dog: bathmat edition


That's just normal dog behaviour!


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## Maxgoh77

It seems like a new topic to me. I've seen the related articles before. Meaning of similar cases happened and it started to draw attention from some dog training experts. They came out with some useful research on this matter.


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## SusieRainbow

Maxgoh77 said:


> It seems like a new topic to me. I've seen the related articles before. Meaning of similar cases happened and it started to draw attention from some dog training experts. They came out with some useful research on this matter.


Seperation anxiety is not by any means a new topic . Can you tell us about the research and maybe tel us about the dog in your avatar ?


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## kezzavee

Hi I’m
In need of advice, I have 10 week old gs huskie cross, and he won’t leave my side. I can’t leave him at all without him
Screaming even if I go upstairs. I have been trying to crate train him, he goes in thier happily, and will go to sleep but as soon as wakes up he’s crying again and I have resorted to sleeping on the sofa  I feel like my life is on hold, my partner and I are taking it in turns to be in the house, with him. I have 2 other dogs but they don’t get on, he wants to play, but they don’t. He has been to a puppy socialisation class and they said he is playing like he should be.
I am distracting him with toys constantly to divert his attention from my other dogs and from biting me, and he is responding, he also focuses well when I try and train him.
I fee that the separation thing is getting me down and tiredness due to spending over 9 nights with lack of sleep!


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## GSD Advice

There are some great blog posts about this topic, a quick search in google might help for any info your looking for


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## Sairy

kezzavee said:


> Hi I'm
> In need of advice, I have 10 week old gs huskie cross, and he won't leave my side. I can't leave him at all without him
> Screaming even if I go upstairs. I have been trying to crate train him, he goes in thier happily, and will go to sleep but as soon as wakes up he's crying again and I have resorted to sleeping on the sofa  I feel like my life is on hold, my partner and I are taking it in turns to be in the house, with him. I have 2 other dogs but they don't get on, he wants to play, but they don't. He has been to a puppy socialisation class and they said he is playing like he should be.
> I am distracting him with toys constantly to divert his attention from my other dogs and from biting me, and he is responding, he also focuses well when I try and train him.
> I fee that the separation thing is getting me down and tiredness due to spending over 9 nights with lack of sleep!


Hi there. He is just a baby who has recently been separated from his siblings so it's only natural that he wants to be in company. However, it is important to teach him independence. As he currently does not like you even leaving the room I would start by teaching him to be independent with you still in view. Get him to go into his crate and settle with a chew or stuffed Kong. Stay in sight, but just ignore him whilst he gets on with it. Once he's finished you can see if he settles for a bit and then let him back out again. Work on this first and once he is happy with this you can try leaving the room for short periods, but always return BEFORE he starts to feel stressed.


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## Touikii moha

Okay, repeat after me: "_It doesn't have to do with the dog. It doesn't have to do with the dog. it doesn't have to do with the dog_!"

Good, now start looking at what you've projected onto the dog…_your security and worth_.

Next question: How could you have learned such a thing? By being deprived when you were at critical developmental stages in your life.

As children we all need safety and security as a basic need. When it is not timely or functional, especially from assigned caregivers, we get anxious. We as therapists, always find physical or emotional abandonment underneath anxious people. They then tend to fixate on something to try and alleviate the stress of anxiety. They get stuck emotionally in childhood as their self-soothing was not enough to override the bleak-scary-alone sensation experienced.

Animal dependency, and dogs in particular with their devotion, seem to substitute for the unconditional love we didn't get properly as a child. They then become the focus of our security and value. They are our friends.

Only they really aren't. It's our own mental process from being deprived that projects it onto them. They are a dynamic Rorschach for our mind, comforting us like an addict, which we are at that point. The withdrawal is traumatizing. That's why most of the suggestions are just substitutes until the real drug can be accessed again. Substitutes really don't work for long. Nor do CNS (central nervous system) blockers like alcohol and drugs. They all are temporary.

To really fix this or cure it, you have to stop working on symptoms and get to the source. That core system was supposed to be experiential wich is why people can't be talked to about it and have it fix. In addition, because it was supposed to be part of the Blessing package when being an early infant and child, even the original caregivers can't access the protected vault and change out the source codes now.

That has to be done therapeutically using guided imagery to recreate and recode the Blessing so love and security flows from the inside out, rather than depending on it flowing from the outside in like we did when children. Again, anxious people are stuck there. We commonly say, they are _not mature_, meaning they did not grow up emotionally and are stuck at that emotionally developmental state.

It generally takes a trusted therapist to assist them accessing the vault and then to reframe the belief system with a higher-power/deity/spirit-guide parental substitute, in order to reformat the belief system. That then allows the animals to be seen appropriately for what they are and everyone can be healthy in their role. As Cesar Millan says on the dog whisperer: "The human is supposed to be the _pack leader_ and provide the security, not the other way around.


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## lullabydream

Touikii moha said:


> As Cesar Millan says on the dog whisperer: "The human is supposed to be the _pack leader_ and provide the security, not the other way around.


Oh dear oh dear oh dear...

Maybe before you posted here you should have read posts on how Caesar Milan is viewed. He's really not the greatest person at understanding dog behaviour at all.

Maybe you should take some time reading the threads you are actually posting on. The actual good resources available and get to know the ethos of this forum


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## Alexliu

1. Say goodbye to your dog extended before you leave
Having difficulty exercising “no touch, no talk, no eye contact”? Take the opportunity to share affection and tell your pet which you will overlook him way prior to deciding to actually keep. Take into account that this show is for you, not your dog! Your dog won’t have his emotions hurt in the event you didn’t say farewell.

2. Stay relaxed and assertive
When you are ready to go to function, leave those responsible, nervous, and worried feelings powering. Rather, allow your puppy realize that every thing is going to be fine by projecting the assured energy of any load up head. A calm and assertive innovator can simplicity splitting up anxiousness in dogs.

3. Start out small by leaving behind your puppy alone for only five minutes.
Depart your pet alone for 5 minutes, then expand time to 20 mins, then an hour. Carry on and increase the time you may spend away up until you can leave to get a total eight hrs without any a lot more pet problems!


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## Mitchell Perry

I hope to see a raising in awareness for separation anxiety in dogs. My mom has 2 dogs from the Staffy Rescue Centre and now she can't leave the house for very long due to them becoming destructive and barking in the house. Her previous dogs have never been like this so it has something to do with the way they are raised from a puppy. I am keen to find out if there is a way of helping them become less anxious when left alone. I know this thread is old, but if anyone out there can help with any methods to solve this please message me. She has tried tonnes of things and i will show her the information in this post.... thats if she hasn't already read it. Thanks


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## Messi_1984

Hi, Ive never had a dog with any kind of anxiety, well any that showed any signs. But last week I became the owner of a dogue de bordeaux, 18month old, showing signs of anxiety, pacing crying and panting when leaving the room etc. But after only 2 days getting him used to his new home, we had an accident where a car hit him and broke a leg. So to add to it all he had to spend 4 days in a vet and has had an operation etc, so after all this when I put him to bed, the crying and banging the door starts but he has started to chew at the door frame. I have started to leave him alone for 5 or 10 mins at a time to get him used to being alone but at night time i cant do it so any advice to help him settle at night? ive tried putting in a treat in a kong so it keeps him busy for a while, and with his blankets etc so he has fimilar smell. but really want to fix the anxiety and have a happy confident dog. Thank you for any advice


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## Amaash47

I've had my Springer for 6 years, he's over 10 years old and we think he was mistreated in his early years ☹
Since getting him, he's been so good. He became very attached to me, and has always been a bit like velcro, but has never caused any issues, I've been able to go out for hours and although I got the sad face, there were no apparent issues. 
Over the last couple of months, due to the Corona situation, there has been someone in the house with him most of the time. Now that my son is working again, and I am not working from home as much, he is being left in the kitchen area like he used to be, and he has started to scratch and wreck the floor by the kitchen door, whenever we go out, and seems to start doing it as soon as we leave


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## Harry Cooper

Messi_1984 said:


> Hi, Ive never had a dog with any kind of anxiety, well any that showed any signs. But last week I became the owner of a dogue de bordeaux, 18month old, showing signs of anxiety, pacing crying and panting when leaving the room etc. But after only 2 days getting him used to his new home, we had an accident where a car hit him and broke a leg. So to add to it all he had to spend 4 days in a vet and has had an operation etc, so after all this when I put him to bed, the crying and banging the door starts but he has started to chew at the door frame. I have started to leave him alone for 5 or 10 mins at a time to get him used to being alone but at night time i cant do it so any advice to help him settle at night? ive tried putting in a treat in a kong so it keeps him busy for a while, and with his blankets etc so he has fimilar smell. but really want to fix the anxiety and have a happy confident dog. Thank you for any advice


Have you tried having him sleep in his bed, placing it closer to your bed? Eventually you can start creating more distance? Or it may even be helpful to start crate training him, so that the crate can become a place where he feels safe and comfortable. Though this would have to start in the day time when you are around. I'd keep the vet updated, if they have any suggestions though. Hope this helps? Let me know if you have any questions  All the best


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## sarahjim

I don't know there is a specific 'best way' bit here is what if did for one of my dogs that had separation anxiety. It worked much of the time but not every time.

The trick is to distract them while you are leaving and for a while after you are gone. A good way to do that is to get a "Kong" toy which is a hard rubber toy that looks somewhat like a beehive with holes at either end. Put a dog biscuit in the hole (you may need to squeeze the Kong a little to insert the biscuit) and maybe add a little peanut butter the inside. Do this right before you leave and give the Kong with a treat to your dog before you leave. Your dog will keep themselves occupied trying to get at the treat for some time and won't be focused on you being gone.
Good Luck!


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## sarahjim

Anxiety can be extremely hard, and there is little out there to help dogs dealing with it. That is why CBD oil for dogs with anxiety is a fantastic option for owners in these times of stress. With CBD oil treats, I reward my pet in the morning with a calming treat before leaving for work, which will help my dog not suffer as much from separation anxiety during the day. CBD oils are in the best interest of my little fur baby and me, but like with all things, always make sure it is ok for a pup.


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## kattypears

Last year when I went overseas for a few months, my mother gave my unwashed clothes to my dogs for them to sniff. It worked well for a short period of time. Try it!


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## puppuccino

Anything with a smell is good for dogs to help calm them and remember you by.

A blanket in particular because they can sleep in/on it.


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## Kim and Stan

Seems a few people are suffering at the moment since covid. My pup had just got into a routine of being left for 4 hours and now everything has gone to pot.

When we leave he paces from window to window and howls and barks. 

Currently using an adaptil plug in which doesn't seem to do much - although im confused when you're suppose to turn this on?

Stuffing and freezing a kong will keep him occupied for 30 mins or so but then it's just howling again.

Hes started to get very attached to me as I've been home so much - even when i leave the house and he's not alone he whines!

Such a horrible situation


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## Niedermayer

Our new GSD puppy that we've had for soon 2 weeks now is doing fairly good alone. He doesn't always feel the need to be close to us, he can go and take a nap or just bring his toy and chew on it where ever he pleases for the moment, he can even be left outdoors on the porch and take a nap there then gently bark a little when he wants to go inside again. (We've puppy proofed well since we've just moved in to our new and so far very empty house).

But,

When the both of us need to leave we put him in our bedroom where he sleeps at night. He barks and sometimes scratches for a minute, then he goes right to his bed and he remains there calm for 30-50 minutes that we've had to leave him the longest for. (We've set up a camera in there to see what he does when we're away).

My question is if it's bad to 'allow' him to panic a little? We just take him to his bed, give him a safe toy and leave without making a big deal out of it for him. When we come back he's always a sleep and we just open the door and wait for him to wake up and come to us.


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## Sairy

Ideally you don't want him to bark at all when you leave, however as he is soon settling down and is asleep when you return I wouldn't be concerned. I suspect eventually he will go straight to settling down. If he was panicked then he would not settle so quickly. In fact, many dogs with seperation anxiety will bark/whine/howl/pace continuously for several hours.


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## m0t

My cockapoo is 16 weeks old and seems to have developed severe separation anxiety :Arghh

If one of us goes upstairs he will sit at the bottom and whine and cry until we come back down (even if one of us is still with him).

When we go behind the baby gate in the kitchen he will charge at it.

He's also getting very upset at night now as well. He will take himself into his crate in the day for naps if you are in the same room and will go to sleep at night but once he wakes up (at 3am for a wee) he will sit and cry in there and start destroying his bed until he gets let out. He then falls asleep at your feet because he's still tired.

During the day he will go in the garden by himself and play so he's comfortable being alone sometimes.

We have managed to leave him alone in his crate a few times with a chew but this week we had to go out for 40 minutes. We gave him his favourite beef pizzle and he started chewing it. We got back home and after we left he had stopped chewing the pizzle and spent the entire time barking and whining in his crate and destroying his bed.

We've been working on the stuff in the post and he has adaptil plug ins and calming treats but we seem to be going backwards. He's teething at the moment (lost 2 teeth on Thursday) which might be part of the problem.

We've got to go out for two hours this week and can't take him with us a few weeks ago this didn't seem like a huge issue but now I'm not sure how we will manage :Bawling


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## Willsteak

sue&harvey said:


> *Separation Anxiety in Dogs *
> 
> There has been loads of people asking for advice about this recently, so I thought I would try and put some information all in one place. Please feel free to add any further advice
> 
> *Separation Anxiety Definition *:- The term separation anxiety is not exclusive to dogs or even to veterinary medicine. It is a psychological term to describe the stress and anxiousness in an individual brought on by the leaving (perceived or imagined) of another individual. In the case of a pet, it is usually an anxiety brought on by separation from the primary pet caretaker. In the case of humans, anxiety in a child from being separated from a parent.
> 
> What classifies as a "separation"? This varies greatly between animals: some must have "their person" within their line of sight, other pets are fine as long as the owner is within a comfortable distance (i.e. somewhere else in the house), and still others are fine until the owner leaves. Even finer distinctions would be animals that are fine for a certain period of time after their owner leaves, but then start to show signs of anxiousness some time later.
> 
> Just like the variance in what stresses out each individual, the signs of separation anxiety vary greatly as well.
> 
> *Which Dogs can be effected by Separation Anxiety:-* The answer to this is ANY! There are some breeds believed to be prone to SA. Some of these are German Shepherds, Airedales, Springer Spaniels, Australian Shepherds and Weimaraners, to name a few. This is not to say all of these dogs will not cope being left alone, as with all dogs it will vary greatly depending on the individual.
> 
> Plus a higher number of dogs that come from a shelter or rescue home, seem to develop dog separation anxiety easily. These dogs might have gone through some severe trauma, or abandonment before ending up in the shelter and once they are placed in a home with an owner they can trust, they will start relying on that owner a lot faster than dogs that haven't experienced any trauma in their life already.
> Pups that leave their litter too early are also predisposed to SA.
> 
> *How to prevent your new puppy, or dog from being affected by Separation Anxiety *:- Owners need to help their dog, or puppy to find a happy medium between companionship and becoming sufficiently independent to tolerate being alone for periods of time. Dogs do not electively engage in anxious behaviours. They develop over a period of time, and becomes a panic response. People must condition their dogs to stay calm when left alone. To condition means to get the dog used to specific things, situations and events. That's why it's important to practice leaving and returning to the dog frequently, starting when you first bring the dog into your home and family.
> 
> Teach your dog from the start that your leaving the house is an ordinary, regular event. Help your dog build tolerance for your departures and absences. Calm departures and homecomings will help the dog to relax. When leaving do not have emotional goodbyes, this will not help the dog .
> 
> *Mummy* " _ahh poor baby, will you miss mummy?_" Kiss Kiss Kiss _"Don't worry mummy be back soon"_
> 
> *Puppy *Where's she going, why all this fuss, that thing they call a coat, she only puts that on when she goes outside… I wanna go! Don't want to stay on my own!!! *Panic Response Alert !!!*
> 
> The same applies for your return. Take your coat off unpack the shopping, open your mail, then when the dog is calm let them outside to toilet. (Still not spoken to him) When he had been to the loo, then you can give him praise and a little play session.
> 
> When you first bring home your bundle of fluff and needle sharp teeth, let them explore the outside area first ( get them used to going outside, it will help when toilet training, and big fuss for toileting outside.) Then take them inside letting them explore their new kingdom in stages.
> 
> Have the dog's bed and bowl of water ready in a safe, well-lighted, comfortable confined area with "family smells", such as a gated-off kitchen, family room or crate placed in a family area. (Do not confine in basements, garages, storage rooms, or other non-family areas). This nice "den" will be the place in which she will stay when you are not home to supervise. Take her to that place, tell her lie down (guide her if she has not yet learned that command). Then give her one or two safe chew toys and praise her. Couple a food treat with the verbal praise. In fact, it's helpful to keep a small bag of tiny tipbit treats on you at all times during the acclimation and training phases.
> 
> Next, close the door or gate to the room or crate, and step back. See if she is staying calm. Resist the urge to talk to the dog, since that will distract her from this desired, calm, relaxed behaviour. ( He should be shattered from his trip to his new home, and all that exploring)
> 
> If she stays reasonably calm when separated from you for a minute or two, let her stay there as long as she seems comfortable. (See thread "Cages" in Dog Chat) If the dog is good in her confined area, this is a very good sign. You can begin to add calm, quiet verbal praise and an occasional food treat to this acclimation routine as a reward for being good and calm in her confined area.
> 
> Over the next few days and weeks encourage your new pup or dog to sleep in his safe area. Slowly increase the amount of time they are left. A dog that is left regularly will become well adapted and sufficiently independent to cope with being alone.
> 
> Also install baby gates so you dog learns to accept he cannot access you when ever he wants. He can see you, but cannot always get to you.
> 
> _*Spend time training your dog to happily accept alone time will save you, your dog and you neighbours a lot of stress in the long run! *_


Both my rescue dogs suffer from separation anxiety one was tied up and abandoned and one was locked in a cage for years so really hard to train out of them because they have Past trauma. It made it a lot better for them Being together as I got them years apart. Our routine started working great but since lockdown I'm worried working from home will make them anxious again when we return to work.


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## Raisy

kattypears said:


> Last year when I went overseas for a few months, my mother gave my unwashed clothes to my dogs for them to sniff. It worked well for a short period of time. Try it!


This is genius!


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## Lurcherlad

Willsteak said:


> Both my rescue dogs suffer from separation anxiety one was tied up and abandoned and one was locked in a cage for years so really hard to train out of them because they have Past trauma. It made it a lot better for them Being together as I got them years apart. Our routine started working great but since lockdown I'm worried working from home will make them anxious again when we return to work.


All you can do is make sure you actually do go out of the house every day for some time so they continue to be used to being left.


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