# a little concerned about tabitha's unborn kittens



## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

back on the 24/7 i took tabitha to the vets for a check as she was coughing a lot. the vet said she was full of worms. i thought she may be pregnant as explained in this thread:
http://www.petforums.co.uk/cat-breeding/250681-advice-needed.html
well, the vet said she wasn't pregnant and wormed and flead her and her kitten. as time passed it became obvious that she most definitely is pregnant.
i am concerned now as to the health of the kittens. she had milbemax and stronghold. does anyone know if these treatments can cause any problems for the unborn kittens. i think she must have been about 4 - 5 weeks pregnant at the time of having them as i don't think she will go much further now. i can feel all sorts of lumps that i imagine must be heads and bodies and they feel quite big. you can visibly see these large lumps sticking out from her rather 'fat' tummy now. any ideas as to how long she may have left?


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

I believe the Milbemax is safe but not sure about Stronhold.
If you can feel the kittens moving she should have about two weeks left from the time you could first feel or see them move.


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## Ang2 (Jun 15, 2012)

I would phone the vet and ask his advice, especially as he was the one who recommended you using these products.


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

I can't find any evidence on line to say that these two treatments aren't safe in pregnancy. 

She is probably due in a week or so by your dates.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

lymorelynn said:


> I believe the Milbemax is safe but not sure about Stronhold.
> If you can feel the kittens moving she should have about two weeks left from the time you could first feel or see them move.


i've just checked back on my other threads and the first time i felt the lumps was on 9/8 so 10 days ago. she is going into her nesting box very regularly now. doesn't look like i have long to wait


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Ang2 said:


> I would phone the vet and ask his advice, especially as he was the one who recommended you using these products.


i think i'll do that in the morning. it's too late mind you now if there are any risks to the kittens. i was just wondering what i could be letting myself in for - and what the little ones might have wrong if anything


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## Deb1 (Jun 10, 2012)

Stronghold was considered safe to give Ruby when she was still feeding the kittens and they were only a few weeks old.

Edit - I've just googled 'stonghold and pregnant cats' and found a couple of sites including the 'Stonghold date sheet' that say it's fine.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Deb1 said:


> Stronghold was considered safe to give Ruby when she was still feeding the kittens and they were only a few weeks old.
> 
> Edit - I've just googled 'stonghold and pregnant cats' and found a couple of sites including the 'Stonghold date sheet' that say it's fine.


that's great thanks. that puts my mind at rest. i shall try to stop worrying now


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

Here's the important bit from the datasheet
_Fleas (pregnant and lactating queens and bitches to prevent flea infestations in kittens and puppies)
Through a reduction in the flea population, monthly treatment of pregnant and lactating queens and bitches will aid prevention of infestations in the litter up to seven weeks of age._

The vet saw you coming though. Stronghold treats roundworms so selling you the Milbemax as well was a touch naughty.


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

milbemax is a multi wormer so this treats all worms...not sure why you would then need stronghold.
from the first time you see kittens move its normally 2 weeks, so probably a week left to go now.
is there any milk on the teats yet?


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> milbemax is a multi wormer so this treats all worms...not sure why you would then need stronghold.
> from the first time you see kittens move its normally 2 weeks, so probably a week left to go now.
> is there any milk on the teats yet?


i can't see any milk yet although there is a lump just slightly above the one teat which i presume is milk. not sure if i'm correct on that though. he gave them both stronghold as they were both covered in fleas.


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## Alaskacat (Aug 2, 2010)

Look out for quilting, when they look all dimpled down the front, though some queens don't have this and birth can be 1 to 3 days (in my experience) from this occuring.

Also look out for frequent small trips to the litter box the day before. She might shout and try to round up your younger cats a few hours before birth as she is an experienced queen.

Really don't worry, keep your Vets number on hand, but most second time Mums know what they are doing. 

You will be needed to count the placentas and reassure her. You will be needed to ensure that she doesn't actively try and birth a kitten for more than an hour. You may be needed to tear the umbilical cords and dispose of placentas. You may be needed to keep the already born kittens safe and warm whilst she is delivering the rest of the litter. Please don't worry, you are doing the best you can.

Keep us updated :


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

> She might shout and try to round up your younger cats a few hours before birth


This made me giggle, only because it's true. I always know when one of mine is about to give birth as she starts 'collecting kittens' - socks, sponges, toys etc.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Alaskacat said:


> Look out for quilting, when they look all dimpled down the front, though some queens don't have this and birth can be 1 to 3 days (in my experience) from this occuring.
> 
> can i just ask what you mean by 'quilting'. have you any pictures that will show what you mean? do you mean 'dimpled' on the stomach area?


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

dont worry, you will be fine. as she has had a litter before i expect she will have everything all done before you wake up one morning.
my experience is the dried white milk on the teats but others have other experiences aswell. when you see dried milk i would say 3 days to go. you may even see the mucus plug come away if you are lucky.
a warm damp flannel would be great incase you need to wipe the kittens nose and faces but only if mum doesnt do this....most cats know what to do and i cant wait to hear how many babies you have.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> dont worry, you will be fine. as she has had a litter before i expect she will have everything all done before you wake up one morning.
> my experience is the dried white milk on the teats but others have other experiences aswell. when you see dried milk i would say 3 days to go. you may even see the mucus plug come away if you are lucky.
> a warm damp flannel would be great incase you need to wipe the kittens nose and faces but only if mum doesnt do this....most cats know what to do and i cant wait to hear how many babies you have.


i'm praying she doesn't have too many kittens. my uncle will take one of them, possibly a neighbour, i've had a freinds daughter ask but there is no way she is having one. she's been letting her 16 week old kitten out and he's gone missing!! no way is she having one of these. if she only has say 4 i could re-home 2 and maybe keep the other 2. i have some serious creeping to do with my oh. mind you i think he'll struggle to let them go once they are here
i'll keep you all informed and thanks so much for all the advice and support. you've all been great:thumbup:


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

just thought i'd update. tabitha must be getting close now. i have 2 nesting boxes for her to choose from. this morning i noticed that in the one box she had rearranged the bedding into a big heap. just a few minutes ago she has gone into the other box and done the same in there too. not too much longer now i don't think


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## Alaskacat (Aug 2, 2010)

> can i just ask what you mean by 'quilting'. have you any pictures that will show what you mean? do you mean 'dimpled' on the stomach area?


I do have a photo that sort of shows it, hope it is attached. (I'll give 10 PF points to te first person to spot the Bengal!!) If she was facing you head on you would see proper quilting down the front. If Tabitha does it you will see it clearly, but some deliver without it happening so don't worry.



> This made me giggle, only because it's true. I always know when one of mine is about to give birth as she starts 'collecting kittens' - socks, sponges, toys etc.


Oh blimey, I've never had them gather household items!! It's the look on the 7 month old kit's face when they are dragged into the birthing bed. I'm sure the kit was saying "someone help me, she's proper lost it this time!!"

It does sound like she is nesting, I'll be internet stalking the breeding forum waiting for news now.

The girl in the photo gave birth to 5 kits about 40 hours after the photo was taken. She wouldn't settle in the bedroom so had them in broad daylight in the conservatory. Obviously I was there with her and the other cats were kept away. She is now happy in the bedroom wardrobe with them.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Alaskacat said:


> I do have a photo that sort of shows it, hope it is attached. (I'll give 10 PF points to te first person to spot the Bengal!!) If she was facing you head on you would see proper quilting down the front. If Tabitha does it you will see it clearly, but some deliver without it happening so don't worry.
> 
> Oh blimey, I've never had them gather household items!! It's the look on the 7 month old kit's face when they are dragged into the birthing bed. I'm sure the kit was saying "someone help me, she's proper lost it this time!!"
> 
> ...


thanks for the photo. not sure i can see anything on tabitha though. your girl is beautiful by the way. i spotted the bengal at the bottom of the stairs and is there another cat lying there too?


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

bengal easy to spot but then im a breeder, so give the points to somebody else whos not a breeder. :thumbup:


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## Alaskacat (Aug 2, 2010)

Thank you, Alaska is a Snowshoe. Yes, there is a subtly hidden British Shorthair colourpoint and white pretending to be invisible, sharp eyes!!

Don't worry if you don't see anything, it doesn't always happen. By your dates we are guessing she is due in 3 or 4 days or so, so she could drop any day or might still be a week away I guess. Even knowing the due date breeders are left guessing at this point.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Alaskacat said:


> Thank you, Alaska is a Snowshoe. Yes, there is a subtly hidden British Shorthair colourpoint and white pretending to be invisible, sharp eyes!!
> 
> Don't worry if you don't see anything, it doesn't always happen. By your dates we are guessing she is due in 3 or 4 days or so, so she could drop any day or might still be a week away I guess. Even knowing the due date breeders are left guessing at this point.


i thought i could see someone lying there. i'll keep updating about tabs and her kittens. i can't wait now. it's worse than waiting for my own kids to be born


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

this is tabitha this morning. she is not happy if you go anywhere near her stomach now. she is happy though to laze around on top of the dog cage all day long. her nesting box is inside the cage along with another nesting box for her to hopefully choose from.


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## Alaskacat (Aug 2, 2010)

She is so beautiful and looks in super condition. Not too many kits in there hopefully, 3 to 5 would be perfect.

I can't wait to hear some news. 

:


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Alaskacat said:


> She is so beautiful and looks in super condition. Not too many kits in there hopefully, 3 to 5 would be perfect.
> 
> I can't wait to hear some news.
> 
> :


thankyou. she has some really strong markings on her fur. she is so trusting considering she was dumped. i don't suppose she was bothered with that much before either if they could easily get rid of her how they did.
i can't wait either - i can't wait to see what colours they will be. her litter that she was dumped with were all black with a small amount of white


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

she is very beautiful...kittens are going to be stunners. bet you keepp them all. you wont need to ask OH as the kittens will win him over easily.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> she is very beautiful...kittens are going to be stunners. bet you keepp them all. you wont need to ask OH as the kittens will win him over easily.


he is a big softy where the cats are concerned. it's strange though because my 3 kids all have different learning/behavioural problems. adhd, aspergers, dyslexia, dyspraxia etc and my oh has adhd. somehow the animals have calming effects on them. this fish tank used to be the best for my little boy, while the cats are great for my oh. i know when he sees them he will just melt


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Alaskacat said:


> Also look out for frequent small trips to the litter box the day before. She might shout and try to round up your younger cats a few hours before birth as she is an experienced queen.
> 
> Keep us updated :


right today i have noticed tabitha trying to get our other rescue kitten (about 15 weeks old) into her nesting box this was quite funny to watch actually. mittens (the kitten) has always been nervous of her and hisses quite often. so when tabs went running to her quietly meowing mittens hissed and backed away a few steps. tabitha kept 'calling' her to the box but she was having none of it. poor mittens took off out of the room while tabitha stood looking rather bewildered. it was like watching a sheep dog trying to round the sheep up but not very successfully. she's lay down again now and given up - for now she is also using her litter tray quite a lot too. i think we are getting closer:thumbup:


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

I'll be very surprised if you don't have kittens today. In my experience dragging a kitten to the nest is almost 100% indication that birth is imminent. I say almost because I recently had a girl who started this behaviour several days before her ktitens arrived but that has only happened once in 20 years of breeding, normally birth starts within the hour.

Liz


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## colliemerles (Nov 2, 2007)

_shes beautiful, and looks very happy and content, good luck, looks like it could be soon. xxxxxx_


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

just thought i'd let you know that tabitha is still holding on to her kittens. she's been very quiet today - slept most of it. let's see what tomorrow brings


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

kittens i hope, im still waiting to hear how many. xx


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## MCWillow (Aug 26, 2011)

Any news on Tabitha yet?


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

MCWillow said:


> Any news on Tabitha yet?


nothing at all. i think she wants to keep them to herself. she's still sitting here getting fatter each day


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

tabitha has been sick tonight. she has now had quite loose poo in her tray and has been pacing up and down. i thought maybe things were starting to happen but she's now gone off to sleep again. maybe they will be here by morning.....


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## Durhamchance (Aug 2, 2012)

The waiting must be killing you!


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Durhamchance said:


> The waiting must be killing you!


it most definitely is. i'm excited, anxious, worried - every emotion is going on inside me. i keep thinking something must be wrong but i shouldn't really as i simply do not know when she is due. i've had her 6 weeks on monday coming - so the most she has left is 3 weeks but surely she can't go on that long. i just know that she will have them when i have to go out - it will by my oh who will be here not me


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

cats galore said:


> tabitha has been sick tonight. she has now had quite loose poo in her tray and has been pacing up and down. i thought maybe things were starting to happen but she's now gone off to sleep again. maybe they will be here by morning.....


my girl is always sick 3 days before she has babies.
wont be long now.


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## Alaskacat (Aug 2, 2010)

I don't think it'll be long either. A couple of days at most. They don't give much warning when the time has come, so don't give up hope just because she's gone to sleep.

:001_cool:


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

Alaskacat said:


> I don't think it'll be long either. A couple of days at most. They don't give much warning when the time has come, so don't give up hope just because she's gone to sleep.
> 
> :001_cool:


i fell for this. had been up 3 nights with my queen then once she was asleep i thought great i can get some sleep now...result i missed it all and woke an hour later to a litter of kittens. thought i was dreaming.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

i've been checking on tabitha on and off all night and she has been sick a few times. it's just bile now. but i have just walked in the room and there is a puddle of pinky coloured liquid. would this be the plug that you talk about or her waters breaking do you think? i'm not going anywhere today now as i think we may have lift off


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## Alaskacat (Aug 2, 2010)

Hi the pink liquid is not the plug or waters, most likely sick after drinking water on an inflammed stomach in my opinion. Waters don't break like humans do, as each kitten has it's own sack so whilst there is a lot of moisture in a whole birth, each kitten only has a small amount. The mucus plug is sticky but she may clean it up herself.

hope it's soon,

:001_smile:


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Alaskacat said:


> Hi the pink liquid is not the plug or waters, most likely sick after drinking water on an inflammed stomach in my opinion. Waters don't break like humans do, as each kitten has it's own sack so whilst there is a lot of moisture in a whole birth, each kitten only has a small amount. The mucus plug is sticky but she may clean it up herself.
> 
> hope it's soon,
> 
> :001_smile:


thanks for that. i have just put another thread on as she now has had diarreah. is this normal for her do you know


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## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

Alaskacat said:


> Waters don't break like humans do, as each kitten has it's own sack so whilst there is a lot of moisture in a whole birth, each kitten only has a small amount.


My girls are always very wet when their waters break which is before the first kitten is born, same with every breeder I know......


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## Alaskacat (Aug 2, 2010)

I don't think that more water appears before the first kitten is born than before the last kitten is born, though I agree there is water loss before the first kitten. Must be a scale thing, it doesn't seem the same as waters breaking in a human, just the water surrounding each kitten as they are born, so a lot of water overall, but not as much up front as in a human birth, proportionally of course. I've certainly never seen a pool of water prior to a cat birth, but I accept others have had more experiences of cat birth than me - and it is nearly always dark so hard to see how much fluid is lost. 

It would seem odd that all the kittens waters break before the birth as I have seen water gushing out of later kitten's sacks also. Every day is a school day


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

cats waters dont break... when the first kitten is born its the sac that breaks which is where you see the water.
her mucus plug will look a light blood colour with white....pretty much like runny scrambled egg, you cant miss it.
if mum doesnt break the sac you need to wipe with a warm damp flannel over the mouth and head to clear the airways but mum will probably do this anyway. also if mum does do the cords dont leave the kittens attached for more than an hour. i had a litter of 5 and they was all tangled together, took awhile to cut them all but got there in the end. if you have to do the cords tie in the middle with either dental floss or cotton then cut the placenta side, please be careful you dont pull on the cord as this gives the kittens a hernia.
you will be fine, mum will do it all as shes not a first time queen.
must say im pretty fed up waiting for the new arrivals now so please please can we have babies this weekend, ive been patiently waiting for ages.:thumbup:


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## we love bsh's (Mar 28, 2011)

my last girl didnt do the cords and were also all tangled up due to this i also had to cut cords.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> you will be fine, mum will do it all as shes not a first time queen.
> must say im pretty fed up waiting for the new arrivals now so please please can we have babies this weekend, ive been patiently waiting for ages.:thumbup:


i have to agree. it's driving me mad she is still sitting here getting fatter and eating well again. i just think she wants them all to herself - how spiteful is that after i took her in when she was dumped come on tabs i'm desperate to see your babies. this picture was taken this morning after breakfast - she actually doesn't look very big on it but she is really - it's just the angle the picture was taken at


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## Alaskacat (Aug 2, 2010)

She is lovely. Mind you isn't this the cat that the Vet said wasn't pregnant? Would be a little bit funny if she was just very very fat!

Only joking, come on Tabitha, we've been patient and now we want to see babies!!


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Alaskacat said:


> She is lovely. Mind you isn't this the cat that the Vet said wasn't pregnant? Would be a little bit funny if she was just very very fat!
> 
> Only joking, come on Tabitha, we've been patient and now we want to see babies!!


yes she is. i keep getting paranoid thinking she is just fat but she definitely is pregnant. i can feel the kittens easily now i've had her 6 weeks on monday and she obviously got pregnant before i had her so i would think that she was just at the stage where they couldn't feel anything apart from the worms that she was full of. that must by why nothing showed up on the scan too. this is worse than waiting for my own kids to be born! i get up every 2 hours in the night ro check on her. you watch, the first night i sleep all night she will have them


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## Alaskacat (Aug 2, 2010)

Yes that will be just what happens. I spent three nights and most of the day laying on the floor beside one girl in her birthing box. In the end I gave up and crawled into bed at 2am on the fourth day and resigned myself to taking her to the Vet in the morning as she was 3 days past her due day, was a first time Mum and I was convinced she only had one kitten and that that meant there weren't enough hormones to stimulate labour to start. I woke up two hours later to baby kit squeaks under the bed and felt awful I had missed the first (and second) being born. She had three and i'm sure she was just waiting for me to leave her blooming alone! All were fine and happy and one of them looks like this now


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

just to let you know im still waiting for your babies to arrive.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> just to let you know im still waiting for your babies to arrive.


i've give up on them ever coming. if she doesn't have them soon i'm sure she'll burst - maybe it's an alien instead
i had a kitten here yesterday that had been found dumped (yet another one) and he looked very similar to her. she took one look at him and run to give him a love. he was only downstairs for a couple of minutes but she followed him around wherever he went. she really took to him. i think she's quite happy to look after others and keep her own to herself
i have actually found him a fantastic home and he went there last night. i would have loved to keep him - he was so loving. he wasn't bothered in the slightest by any of my other cats - no hissing, backing away, nothing. he would have fit in perfectly but a line has to be drawn somewhere - and if tabitha ever has her kittens i will be FORCED to keep ''some'' of them (by myself)


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

just a quick question about tabitha. her teats are very dry - is this ok or do i need to do something to help her. at first i wondered if it was the colostrum but it is definitely dry flaky skin.


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

i replied to your other thread but will put it here aswell incase you miss it.
do not put anything on or around the teats as when kittens are born they wont suckle from mum. all is fine just relax.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> i replied to your other thread but will put it here aswell incase you miss it.
> do not put anything on or around the teats as when kittens are born they wont suckle from mum. all is fine just relax.


ok thanks, wasn't sure whether she would be sore or not. told you i am a novice at this


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

dont worry, even the most experienced breeder learns something new with kittening. my queen fools me every time.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

just a quick update: i'm still waiting - tabitha is getting fatter as i write. i don't think they are ever going to arrive.
i have a medical appointment on thursday that i cannot change and i just know she will have them then. selfish little pussy cat


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## Durhamchance (Aug 2, 2012)

Oh! I thought this was going to be an update to say they were here!!


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Durhamchance said:


> Oh! I thought this was going to be an update to say they were here!!


no such luck. i can't wait to get a decent nights sleep. i keep waking up to check on her. on the first night i manage to stay asleep she will probably have them - if it's not on thursday when i have my appointment


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## MCWillow (Aug 26, 2011)

Give her a curry for dinner and mix a bit of castor oil in it - then take her for a bumpy car ride :yesnod:

Mind you none of that worked for me, and I ended up being three week late 

PS: Obviously I am only joking, for people that dont know me or my sense of humour


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

MCWillow said:


> Give her a curry for dinner and mix a bit of castor oil in it - then take her for a bumpy car ride :yesnod:
> 
> Mind you none of that worked for me, and I ended up being three week late
> 
> PS: Obviously I am only joking, for people that dont know me or my sense of humour


maybe she had a curry before i had her and now she has wind that would explain her fat stomach
as you might have guessed though - STILL NO BABIES!!!!


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

I have liked this post - but actually I don't cos it isn't an update telling me that you have KITTENS!!!! Come on Tabitha!!!


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## Durhamchance (Aug 2, 2012)

I can't believe Tabitha is still hanging onto these kittens!! She needs inducing...


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

she is huge now. she spent yesterday and so far today looking around the house. she was going in the nesting box that i had put ready for but hasn't been near it for about 5 days now. she can't possibly go on much longer


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

I clicked on this thinking, if this is news of kittens I'm not looking  I think she has been holding on to them for long enough now!


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## Misi (Jul 13, 2009)

Good grief! Still no kittens? But how long has she been pregnant? It seems like a year ago last January! Are you sure she's not really a heffalump?


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Misi said:


> Good grief! Still no kittens? But how long has she been pregnant? It seems like a year ago last January! Are you sure she's not really a heffalump?


i have had her 7 weeks on monday coming. so the very most she has left is another 2 weeks approx. she was already pregnant when i took her in after she had been dumped. it does seem like forever and you know - maybe she is a heffalump!! she certainly weighs enough


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## Durhamchance (Aug 2, 2012)

Bless her! They're bulging out of her sides!  

C'mon Tabitha, you can't keep them in there forever!


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Durhamchance said:


> Bless her! They're bulging out of her sides!
> 
> C'mon Tabitha, you can't keep them in there forever!


sometimes when i look at her you can see lumps coming out of lumps. she actually looks small on the photo but believe me, she isn't!!


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## Misi (Jul 13, 2009)

Love her . I can't wait to see what colours they'll be!


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Misi said:


> Love her . I can't wait to see what colours they'll be!


her last litter that she was dumped with were all black with a little bit of white on them. i wonder if she'll have any tabby's this time?


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

looking at the photo her belly hasnt dropped yet, i think you still have a good 5 days left to wait. would love to be proved wrong.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> looking at the photo her belly hasnt dropped yet, i think you still have a good 5 days left to wait. would love to be proved wrong.


that would answer why the vet didn't know she was pregnant. it would have been too soon for him to palpate them and of course too early for them to show up on the scan.


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

the earliest a vet can tell is when the cat is over 28 days pregnant. scans are normally done much later after the kittens have developed.
my vet once told me to expect 3 so when she only had one i was worried, now its just easier to stay away from the vet and count them being born. im guessing no milk on the teats yet.


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## Alaskacat (Aug 2, 2010)

That is clearly a cat that has swallowed something, please check your home to see if a rugby ball may be missing!! 

Come on Tabitha, I am bored of waiting. Human's do nine months, cats do nine weeks, now crack on with it!!


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> the earliest a vet can tell is when the cat is over 28 days pregnant. scans are normally done much later after the kittens have developed.
> my vet once told me to expect 3 so when she only had one i was worried, now its just easier to stay away from the vet and count them being born. im guessing no milk on the teats yet.


i can't see any milk but then again i don't get much chance to check. as soon as you go anywhere near her stomach she tries to 'eat' your hand


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## Lisac27 (Jun 8, 2012)

Cats galore shall we have a race. My girl is due on Sunday but like your girl the rugby ball is still present, so no sign of babies dropping and no sign of milk. These naughty girls are keeping us waiting


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Lisac27 said:


> Cats galore shall we have a race. My girl is due on Sunday but like your girl the rugby ball is still present, so no sign of babies dropping and no sign of milk. These naughty girls are keeping us waiting


i have a rescue guinea pig who is ready to 'pop' at anytime too. i think they all want to keep their babies to themselves. mind you i'm very concerned for angel (the guinea pig). she is in a back to back pregnancy - her babies that came with her were only a couple of weeks old and she must have got pregnant immediately after birth. not good for any animal but really bad for guinea pigs


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## Lisac27 (Jun 8, 2012)

Aww poor thing, you sound like you are a guardian angel to so many pets in need. Here's hoping all 3 girls have healthy pregnancies, easy births and happy healthy babies


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## Treaclesmum (Sep 26, 2011)

Aww, she looks like Treacle's sister... Hope the babies come soon x


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

well another day and we are still waiting. tabitha is searching everywhere at the moment. she seems really huge today. she has markings on her sides that are like circles. this is where we have seen the 'lumps'. it is as though they are framed in the markings. today though, she seems bigger underneath now. she is just simply round - everywhere she's rummaging in my saucepan cupboard when i put the washing up away. she's searching on the worktops!! she's mooching everywhere. surely she has got to have these babies soon
if only cats could talk...


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

has her belly dropped now.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> has her belly dropped now.


i don't know - it's all so new to me and i can't tell. she just seems bigger all over!! will the 'lumps' at her sides disappear when her belly drops? the lumps are still visible but she seems bigger if that makes sense


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

when her belly drops the kittens will still be seen but lower down in her belly. when you cant see the kittens they are then already in the position to be born. i find its easier to tell from looking at the front of the girl, if kittens are up near her back then they havent dropped. maybe try taking a photo. normally my queen refuses her nesting box until she is in labour. also look at her teats there should be dried white milk on the ends.


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

does she look round like this. this photo was taken 4 days before my girl had 8 kittens.


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## Treaclesmum (Sep 26, 2011)

Sounds like the kittens are growing well! If she's searching everywhere, she could be looking for a nesting spot


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> when her belly drops the kittens will still be seen but lower down in her belly. when you cant see the kittens they are then already in the position to be born. i find its easier to tell from looking at the front of the girl, if kittens are up near her back then they havent dropped. maybe try taking a photo. normally my queen refuses her nesting box until she is in labour. also look at her teats there should be dried white milk on the ends.


i can still see the kittens but i think they are slightly lower than before. i wouldn't say they are really low though. these are a couple of photos taken this morning - not that you can see a lot but it's nice to share them the first photo shows the markings that i spoke about. the 'circle' is where we have seen the 'lumps' for a while now but she does seem bigger below it now.
her teats are white and dry looking but i'm not sure if it is just dry skin. she doesn't like us going near her belly so it's hard to get close enough to tell properly.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Treaclesmum said:


> Sounds like the kittens are growing well! If she's searching everywhere, she could be looking for a nesting spot


they do seem to like the worst place possible to nest don't they she just simply cannot have them on the worktop!!


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## sharonbee (Aug 3, 2011)

Only just seen this thread, sounds all exciting now, any news? hope the birth goes well and all the kittens fit and healthy.:thumbup:

Look forward to seeing pics of babies.


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## Lisac27 (Jun 8, 2012)

I am still there with you at this waiting lark, cats galore. I can't tell if kitties have dropped either, they seem to be at the sides and kicking underneath. My girl isn't nesting anymore, she looks thoroughly fed up and can't be bothered to move today, poor thing 
I hope your girlie is fine, and I am waiting for my kitties and yours :thumbup:


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

looking at your photo today and mine taken afew weeks ago, her belly has dropped. cant tell from the pic about the teats. im guessing wednesday but could be earlier. will be watching this post very carefully now.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> looking at your photo today and mine taken afew weeks ago, her belly has dropped. cant tell from the pic about the teats. im guessing wednesday but could be earlier. will be watching this post very carefully now.


i have a friend who reckons wednesday and 6 kittens!! i should have started a wager and took bets everyone here is taking a guess - but it is purely guessing because none of us have a clue


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

well wednesday is here - still no kittens!! tabitha's tummy has dropped, she has been searching every nook and cranny for a nest (i presume that's what she's doing) but still no other signs. i can't believe she's still hanging on. i'm getting quite worried now about her - although i do not know when she is due. i had a rescue guinea pig need an emergency c-section on monday as the baby was too big for her to deliver. sadly it was stillborn. she was in a back to back pregnancy the same as tabitha. i know with guinea pigs any birth can be really bad especially back to back and i would imagine it wouldn't be quite so bad for a cat but it really has made me worry now. on saying that though, tabitha is eating well and seems perfectly healthy so i really need to ignore my thoughts but it is hard after such a stressful time with angel (the guinea pig). anyway i'll keep popping back and letting you all know when things progress


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## Alaskacat (Aug 2, 2010)

Morning. Another day and still no good news. I have a girl due Monday but I did think Tabitha would be due when my other girl had hers 14th August!! 

Just keep an eye on her, but I wouldn't go to the Vet yet (unless it is to check her species, because if she is a horse not a cat there will be a bit longer wait probably). 

Sorry to hear about the piggy. Cats cope better with birth than guinea pigs do I think and you have done your best to provide good nutrition to combat the tole on her body from the closeness of her pregnancies. You will have to pile food into her once she has had them, but at least this will be her last pregnancy.

Keep us updated.


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## we love bsh's (Mar 28, 2011)

ok im going to say i think its going to be today/night once they start the search for a suitable place to nest it wont be long thats what i havefound with my girls.


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## Lisac27 (Jun 8, 2012)

I still think today's the day. Right before Tilly started with contractions she went on a mad nesting spree, just like Tabitha. She was following me everywhere and when I went into a room she tried to find a nest in that room, by digging in wardrobes etc. 
Right before contractions, I put her in her box ( for the millionth time) but this time she stayed and started purring really loudly. 
No doubt you will have kittens by this time tomorrow ( come on Tabitha), I'm guessing 6 as well xx


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Lisac27 said:


> I still think today's the day. Right before Tilly started with contractions she went on a mad nesting spree, just like Tabitha. She was following me everywhere and when I went into a room she tried to find a nest in that room, by digging in wardrobes etc.
> Right before contractions, I put her in her box ( for the millionth time) but this time she stayed and started purring really loudly.
> No doubt you will have kittens by this time tomorrow ( come on Tabitha), I'm guessing 6 as well xx


this is what's really confusing though because she's been searching the house for several days now. she's being extremely mean to me


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

could she be holding on if she doesn't feel comfortable with where she is. she has always slept in the kitchen since the day she came here with her kitten. she mooches around the house but always goes back to the kitchen. we had to put her in my bedroom the on day just for 30 mins and she was not happy at all. she wanted to go back to the kitchen. i'm wondering if because we are in and out of there and also i have 10 other cats around the house, could it be that she isn't happy having them with it being busy rather than really quiet?


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## Lisac27 (Jun 8, 2012)

I'm not an expert but I do think it's best if they are in an area that they find comfortable and safe, away from other cats. Tilly has always slept in the dining room (she fights with my other 2 so they have to be separated at night). A week before she was due I moved her into the front room so i could sleep with her, nesting box in the corner and kept the other cats out. 
I do think Tabitha needs a space where there are no other cats, with her nesting box and litter. You will probably need somewhere to sit comfortably in there too xx


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Lisac27 said:


> I'm not an expert but I do think it's best if they are in an area that they find comfortable and safe, away from other cats. Tilly has always slept in the dining room (she fights with my other 2 so they have to be separated at night). A week before she was due I moved her into the front room so i could sleep with her, nesting box in the corner and kept the other cats out.
> I do think Tabitha needs a space where there are no other cats, with her nesting box and litter. You will probably need somewhere to sit comfortably in there too xx


i've been trying to work out what room to put her in. it's really difficult as she doesn't like being shut in for one thing. she went crazy when she had to go in our bedroom the other day. i don't want to stress her out. she seems to want to be in the kitchen where she has always been. we haven't made her stay there, it's been her choice. i'm going to try and get her to go in the living room later but the dogs normally stay in there if i have to go out so i hope they will settle too. i wish i had a bigger house but i already have a 4 bedroomed one and don't think i could afford anything bigger i'll have to kick the kids out


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

i wouldnt worry. my queen has free run of the house but once labour started she went into her nesting box in my bedroom away from the others and settled fine. you will find once her labour has started she will want the quiet space for her kittens. aslong as you have a nesting box somewhere way from the other cats she will sort herself out.
you are only worrying as you dont know the exact dates but she could be 63 days. i think tonight she will start labour, i wouldnt stress her with the vet unless she has been pushing for an hour and a kitten is obviously stuck, doesnt make any difference to cats having back to back litters.
sorry to hear about the guinea pig. you just need to relax all will be fine you will see.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> i wouldnt worry. my queen has free run of the house but once labour started she went into her nesting box in my bedroom away from the others and settled fine. you will find once her labour has started she will want the quiet space for her kittens. aslong as you have a nesting box somewhere way from the other cats she will sort herself out.
> you are only worrying as you dont know the exact dates but she could be 63 days. i think tonight she will start labour, i wouldnt stress her with the vet unless she has been pushing for an hour and a kitten is obviously stuck, doesnt make any difference to cats having back to back litters.
> sorry to hear about the guinea pig. you just need to relax all will be fine you will see.


thanks for that. i'll leave her where she is then. she is happier to be in the kitchen and i have set up two nesting boxes in there for her. hopefully she will choose one of them. she did try to get in the washing machine which obviously is not good i wasn't sure how cats coped with back to back pregnancies - i know that it is very bad for g/pigs - in fact any normal birth can be bad for g/pigs. that's a relief to here cats do better. hopefully i'll be starting a new thread soon telling you all about her kittens


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## Lisac27 (Jun 8, 2012)

I agree with catcoonz, Tilly also had free run until labour started (except at night due to scrapping cats). I don't have a quiet room either, or quiet house with 4 kids lol. But as catcoonz said, her box should be away from other animals. I'm sure when she's ready she will let you know by sticking to you like glue. I also noticed Tilly was restless, not doing her usual sleep all day routine. 
Don't worry, this isn't Tabithas first litter so she will know what to do xx


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

i was in a panic with my very first litter as my queen started nesting in the tumble dryer so i know how you are feeling.
the quietest part of the home is ideal so have a nesting box where suits you and where you wont disturb her too much. i find my bedroom is ideal then i can be kept awake if needed and its also quiet. she will once labour starts have her kittens where you want her to be as she will be otherwise occupied and wont even notice. then she will settle down with her kittens safe and warm. dont worry about her for now she knows what shes doing.
sorry i have no idea about guinea pigs only cats, im not that much good with foaling either but have seen some being born and i can tell you cats are much easier than horses.


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## Lisac27 (Jun 8, 2012)

Cats galore, I was wondering if you have some nutridrops. I bought these not really thinking I would need them, but they have been a life saver. I gave mum some straight after birth as she was very tired and sell shocked. Plus 2 of my kitties were quite small, after giving them nutridrops yesterday, they have both gained over 10 grams in less than a day. I think it gives them some vitamins and energy x


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Lisac27 said:


> Cats galore, I was wondering if you have some nutridrops. I bought these not really thinking I would need them, but they have been a life saver. I gave mum some straight after birth as she was very tired and sell shocked. Plus 2 of my kitties were quite small, after giving them nutridrops yesterday, they have both gained over 10 grams in less than a day. I think it gives them some vitamins and energy x


i haven't actually. can you get them in such as pets at home or did you get them online.


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

i use nutri-um from pets at home but you cant give kittens younger than 6 weeks this.
the vet will be able to get some nutridrops for you, not sure if you can get this on line as ive only just started using it myself. did perk my queen up quickly and kittens at 6 weeks old love it. sorry this isnt much help is it, was hoping to read your girl was in labour.


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## Lisac27 (Jun 8, 2012)

You can get them online from amazon or eBay, I got mine from an online pharmacy called hyperdrug and they send them within a day or so. You can get them just for cats, or for cats, dogs and other small animals x


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

i think we might have lift off soon!!
tabitha is very fussy this morning - she has had a touch of 'the runs' and also been a little sick. maybe she's getting ready at long last


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## Lisac27 (Jun 8, 2012)

How exciting 
I can't wait to hear all about it and see pics.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

she seems quite restless today. i haven't seen the plug come away or any wetness so don't know if she is getting ready. only time will tell i suppose


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

sounds promising, as soon as the plug comes away kittens will be born very soon. my queen had a poorly tummy and sickness then the next day she went into labour.


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## we love bsh's (Mar 28, 2011)

Sounds promising sounds close.


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

Blooming Nora cat - hurry up!:scared:


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## Savvy20 (Jul 18, 2012)

Hope today is the day


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

she's very quiet again now. she hasn't eaten anything all day. nothing else has happened so i'm back to waiting and wondering


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## Lisac27 (Jun 8, 2012)

I think the not eating is a big clue, Tilly hardly ate the night before, and only grazed the morning she went into labour. I think you are going to have kitties today/ tonight. So excited:thumbup:


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## MCWillow (Aug 26, 2011)

About 2am I reckon she will start


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## Durhamchance (Aug 2, 2012)

Labour watch!! C'mon Tabitha!


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

Ooooh - fingers crossed :thumbup:


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## egyptianreggae (May 26, 2012)

Jeezo, I like to procrastinate but this little kitty is taking it too far. Come on Tabitha, drop those kittens!


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## Alaskacat (Aug 2, 2010)

People this is clearly a troll post, 13 pages and still no kitten pictures!! 

Joking (obviously), but I have wasted hours checking back in on this thread and really think that I should be allowed to name a kitten when they do finally grace us with their present!!! 

Come on Tabitha, I'm human and have had shorter pregancies than this!!

Hope all goes well tonight - 1st kitten 11.37pm if we are having a sweepstake. 

Will log on first thing tomorrow expecting news!!


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

can i ask a quick question? last night i clearly saw movement on the sides of tabitha's tummy but low down. then there was this 'mad' movement and suddenly all the movement is underneath her now. i can really feel and see movements now more than i have ever done throughout the whole pregnancy. would i still be able to feel movement if she is close to labour - i'm sure it's the kittens i can feel not contractions. she still hasn't lost the mucus plug as far as i am aware either. i have had her 8 weeks on monday coming and she was already pregnant so i know she can't go much longer


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

It's hard to tell a cat is pregnant by looking at her until about 3 weeks when she pinks up. Average pregnancy is 9 weeks, so if she was 3 weeks when you got her that would make her 2 weeks overdue which is seriously overdue...

I think I'd be ringing my vet with this timetable.


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## egyptianreggae (May 26, 2012)

cats galore said:


> can i ask a quick question? last night i clearly saw movement on the sides of tabitha's tummy but low down. then there was this 'mad' movement and suddenly all the movement is underneath her now. i can really feel and see movements now more than i have ever done throughout the whole pregnancy. would i still be able to feel movement if she is close to labour - i'm sure it's the kittens i can feel not contractions. she still hasn't lost the mucus plug as far as i am aware either. i have had her 8 weeks on monday coming and she was already pregnant so i know she can't go much longer


I don't think I can go on for much longer either, the suspense is killing me! I'm going for 1st kitten 3.10am in sweepstake!


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

BTW I've lost track through all the threads. She hasn't been out for 8 weeks? Not even for 5 minutes?


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

dont worry about movement its just the kittens moving into the birthing position. its good you can see them move as then they are ok and alive, must say i dont think kittens will be born tonight though, maybe another 2/3 days. she could have only just got pregnant right before you had her. some cats go 63 days others ive had go 68 days so she will have them when shes good and ready, normally once you get fedup waiting she will surprise you.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

OrientalSlave said:


> BTW I've lost track through all the threads. She hasn't been out for 8 weeks? Not even for 5 minutes?


no she hasn't been out. none of my cats can get outside. they have their catservatory that they go into to get fresh air but cannot get out of there. my 2 toms are neutered too so she has had no access to un neutered toms since living here.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> dont worry about movement its just the kittens moving into the birthing position. its good you can see them move as then they are ok and alive, must say i dont think kittens will be born tonight though, maybe another 2/3 days. she could have only just got pregnant right before you had her. some cats go 63 days others ive had go 68 days so she will have them when shes good and ready, normally once you get fedup waiting she will surprise you.


i thought maybe they were moving into the birthing position with how the movement moved from one area to another - and it is a relief to see them move especially after the stillborn piggy i had on monday. i was also thinking maybe another day or two as she is eating again now like she was before. she had sickness and stopped eating for a day a few weeks ago. she really knows how to confuse me and she certainly likes to keep us all wondering


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## MCWillow (Aug 26, 2011)

I am going for 2.22am :yesnod:

I also reserve the right to name a kitten - I think kitten number 2 :thumbup:

And can you tell Tabitha I was 3 weeks late with my Jake - and she has definitely been pregnant longer that I was :scared:


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## Alaskacat (Aug 2, 2010)

Don't worry about the movement, sometimes you can feel it, sometimes you can't. If there is a huge litter I haven't felt them move close to the date, but other litters I have felt move close to, before and during the birth.

I think Tabitha had a worm burden and was feeding her kits when OP got her, so I wouldn't be too concerned about the date today. Probably the OP thought she was pregnant when it couldn't be seen, but she coincidentally happened to be right. The Vet said she wasn't pregnant earlier I think, so unlikely the Op could tell but not a Vet unless she was very early pregnant. (no offence OP).

Got to be soon though I'm bored waiting.



> I was 3 weeks late with my Jake


Three weeks late is unbearable, I lost my sense of humour completly 12 days late.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

Alaskacat said:


> Don't worry about the movement, sometimes you can feel it, sometimes you can't. If there is a huge litter I haven't felt them move close to the date, but other litters I have felt move close to, before and during the birth.
> 
> I think Tabitha had a worm burden and was feeding her kits when OP got her, so I wouldn't be too concerned about the date today. Probably the OP thought she was pregnant when it couldn't be seen, but she coincidentally happened to be right. The Vet said she wasn't pregnant earlier I think, so unlikely the Op could tell but not a Vet unless she was very early pregnant. (no offence OP).
> 
> ...


that's right. when we took tabitha in the vet said she was full of worms which explained her large tummy (she did look about 5 weeks pregnant). she had pink teats but was still feeding an 8 week old kitten so we assumed she wasn't pregnant as the vet couldn't feel anything. also she had a scan and of course nothing showed up. i still had a gut feeling that she was though. it turns out that she must have got caught just before we had her. like i said earlier we will have had her 8 weeks on monday coming so she must have got caught somewhere around a week before we had her.


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

cats galore said:


> no she hasn't been out. none of my cats can get outside. they have their catservatory that they go into to get fresh air but cannot get out of there. my 2 toms are neutered too so she has had no access to un neutered toms since living here.


at least this gives you some idea of dates if your girl did go too far over with her pregnancy.


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

if we are doing a betting service now i bet saturday around 11pm her contractions will start, betting on 6 beautiful babies born.


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## egyptianreggae (May 26, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> if we are doing a betting service now i bet saturday around 11pm her contractions will start, betting on 6 beautiful babies born.


Six? That's a high estimate! I'm going for four.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

just to say she has not had them yet. still time to place your bets
i need her to have just a couple so that there is more chance of my OH letting me keep them. i personally think she will have more than a few though


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## Durhamchance (Aug 2, 2012)

Right Tabitha, I go on holiday Sunday night and need to see kittens before then!! 

My guess is 4.12am Saturday morning and there will be 5 kits


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

i'm sitting here fed up with nothing to do - well actually i have plenty to do but cannot be bothered so i thought i'd add a new post just to get you all excited thinking tabitha had gone into labour. sadly, we are still sitting here waiting.... COME ON TABS THIS IS DOING MY HEAD IN
i have to go to the vets tomorrow morning with my guinea pig who had the c-section (for a check up) - you watch , she'll start then just because i'm the only one that drives and i have no choice but to go out!! my OH will find it so funny if i miss everything after all this waiting


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

well you have 3 hours before you knock me out of the betting.
come on tabitha what are you waiting for. then we need 6 babies otherwise i will look a complete idiot and being a breeder this isnt good for my reputation.


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

catcoonz said:


> well you have 3 hours before you knock me out of the betting.
> come on tabitha what are you waiting for. then we need 6 babies otherwise i will look a complete idiot and being a breeder this isnt good for my reputation.


you know she looks as fed up as we all feel. she is just lying in her bed doing nothing. she has only had 2 wees today - normally she's on the tray constantly. she's not eating much either again. she just looks really depressed
this is her just a few moments ago - poor girl. the second picture was earlier today - she looks quite small actually in this second picture for some reason


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

bless her she does look tired. guessing my bet was wrong as its past 11pm and no contractions. my girl looked like this and had kittens the next day so hopefully this weekend you will have your kittens. still think she will have 6 though but hope its just 2 for your sake and mine otherwise i will be wanting one.


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## MCWillow (Aug 26, 2011)

Oh bless - all I can do is sympathise with her *hugs*

I really hope its soon, for her sake - I _so_ know what she is going though - all the other cats saying 'havent you had them yet?' and she is thinking 'does it f*cking look like it...' but being too polite to say so ...... :blush:


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## Guest (Sep 8, 2012)

MCWillow said:


> Oh bless - all I can do is sympathise with her *hugs*
> 
> I really hope its soon, for her sake - I _so_ know what she is going though - all the other cats saying 'havent you had them yet?' and she is thinking 'does it f*cking look like it...' but being too polite to say so ...... :blush:


Arf!!! Made me really chuckle!


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

well she's still her looking very fat. maybe later today...


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## Durhamchance (Aug 2, 2012)

Thats me out of the running then!


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

11 pm tonight  
She had better be in labour by then


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## sharonbee (Aug 3, 2011)

I'm guessing she will start tomorrow afternoon, hope she has them soon and hope all goes smoothly.


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## kelzcats (Aug 1, 2011)

I have been following this thread.....any news yet? I'm waiting too my girl is 65days.:mad2:


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## catcoonz (Aug 4, 2012)

hoping you are a very busy midwife today.


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## sharonbee (Aug 3, 2011)

Any news yet?


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## cats galore (Jul 17, 2012)

nothing to report yet. tabitha is still fat and sleeping all the time. she looks so fed up and depressed. she hasn't been eating too much the last few days but is drinking more than normal. she has episodes of restlessness than hours and hours of sleeping. the waiting continues i'm afraid


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

Poor girl - she must be really fed up by now


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