# Fear of Fire!



## sainty43 (Dec 5, 2012)

Hi,

Please help!

I have a 2 year old Border Terrier, who is terrified of the fireplace in our lounge when lit. Naturally as the wood burns it occasionally crackles and spits, and it is this noise that seems to terrify him. It sounds just like a dry twig snapping when it spits. He absolutely loved the fire until last winter and would spend the evening laying in front of it.

At the moment we have all the internal doors in the house open, so immediately upon me lighting the fire he runs off to get as far away from it as possible. He will spend all evening shivering in a cold room rather than be in the same room as a fire. I have no idea what suddenly caused this, but I don't believe he has been hit by a stray spark, as we use a spark guard.

We really need to remedy this as we are heading into winter, and we want him in the lounge with us.

Last winter when it started, we have tried to shut him in with us, and tried completely ignoring him when he showed fear, and praising him when he sat or lay down, even for just a second, but after 2 months this didn't change anything. He would simply spend all evening pacing up and down basically panicking.

This year we have put his cage in the lounge with us when the fire is lit and put him in to it when he shows fear, hoping it would calm him down. All it seems to do is work him up more as he grabs the bars with his teeth and franticly try's to rip the bars out. He gets so worked up and overheated, and I'm worried he is going to rip his teeth out on the bars of the cage.

We're out of ideas and I would greatly appreciate anyone's help on the matter.

Thanks for reading.


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## koolchick (Apr 5, 2011)

I'd leave doors open and encourage him to come to you in the room. Start by trying to encourage him to the door way and reward with what ever he likes best a treat some meat or a toy you play with him with. I'd say forcing him near something he's scared of would be the worst thing you can do. Just think how you would feel being trapped in a room with something you are scared of. Would it make you less or more scared of it? I'd guess it would make you more scared as from what you say it has made your dog more scared.


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## sainty43 (Dec 5, 2012)

koolchick said:


> I'd leave doors open and encourage him to come to you in the room. Start by trying to encourage him to the door way and reward with what ever he likes best a treat some meat or a toy you play with him with. I'd say forcing him near something he's scared of would be the worst thing you can do. Just think how you would feel being trapped in a room with something you are scared of. Would it make you less or more scared of it? I'd guess it would make you more scared as from what you say it has made your dog more scared.


Thanks so much for your reply. We have spent weeks and weeks last winter leaving doors open so he can come and go, but he simply chose to go. We encouraged him back to the room with treats of liver & cheese, both his favourite but he simply came in had the treat and then ran off again. It didn't seem to help him or re-assure him at all. In fact most of the time he would rather go without his favourite treat and simply curl up in a cold room. We done this for perhaps 3-4 weeks, trying to play with him, talk in an upbeat mood when he was in the room, smile and treats, but it seemed to make no difference. I would have thought we would have made a bit of progress in 3-4 weeks but nothing at all.

Would anyone recommend using desensitization for this? I was reading through similar posts on this forum regarding fireworks noise and people seem to report success. I wonder if I played a CD of a crackling fireplace, starting low volume? Or is this likely to make matters worse?


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## sainty43 (Dec 5, 2012)

Seems everyone's a bit stumped with this one. I was hoping it would be a fairly simple issue to work on :mad2:

Anyone at all used desensitization to help their dog over fears of sounds. Any advice or tips?


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## Old Shep (Oct 17, 2010)

My old collie used to be be terrified of the fire- and like your dog, he would bolt from the room and lie in the hall in preference to sharing a room with the spitting dragon!

I wouldn't try to "lure" him. I don't think it would work.

Why not just accept he doesn't trike the fire and prefers the hall?

Move a nice comfy bed into the hall- or wherever he prefers- and let him choose his sleeping spot. He won't come to any harm and will be cozy in his furry coat!

Although you would prefer him to lie by the fire, he doesn't want to and it won't do him any harm at all not to!

I wouldn't sweat about it.


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## sainty43 (Dec 5, 2012)

Old Shep said:


> My old collie used to be be terrified of the fire- and like your dog, he would bolt from the room and lie in the hall in preference to sharing a room with the spitting dragon!
> 
> I wouldn't try to "lure" him. I don't think it would work.
> 
> ...


Hi,

Thanks for your response. It seems they are very thin on the ground regarding this subject.

It is not that I want him in front of the fire, I simply want him in the same room as me and my partner of an evening. He gets walked and a fuss at lunch time, and another walk in the evening, but the majority of the working day he is on his own, so it would be nice if he was with us in the evening, otherwise he is going to be on his own for the vast majority of Winter.

Also he isn't sleeping in the cold room he goes to, he mainly sits their feeling sorry for himself. He's not happy and content in the cold room, just in his mind it is the lesser of 2 evils. He sits in this cold room ears pricked up listening for the fire monster as it spits and crackles.

Their seems to be a lot of knowledgeable people on this section of forum, however it seems to have everyone stumped!


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## Jamesgoeswalkies (May 8, 2014)

To be honest I've never seen this board stumped for ideas. There is always someone with a suggestion or two. I didn't see this post before so maybe it just slipped by peoples notice.

To be honest i just accept that some of mine (and some of those that pass through my home) are not keen on open fires. We have a fire in the winter ...full log fire with the hisses and crackles that fires entail ... and some lie too close (if we'd let them) and some prefer the hall.

Unfortunately I suspect that forcing your dog (however well meant) to stay in the room with the hot crackling monster may have exacerbated his fear and so that it is now more about phobia than fear. Not being able to escape (flight) can cause a dog to become highly anxious.

You could certainly try slowly desensitising your dog to the sound and sights of the fire. I would suggest maybe a small fire (paper only for example .. or a couple of lumps of coal) for a short period during the day (not evening) and start by interacting with your dog in the *other *room (training or play time with treats) whist the fire burns. After a couple of days with the fire lit for an hour but not being encouraged to enter the room, gradually move the game playing/training time into the same room as the lit fire. Stay as far away from the fire as you can. If he leaves the room do not try to call him back but try playing in the doorway.

As you achieve a level with the low level fire so the next day add some twigs.

You can also feed your dog in that room.

Systematic desensitisation means building up very, very slowly thus reducing the fearful reaction and therefore in turn increasing your dogs ability to cope.

You could try a sound tape. However I suspect that this alone will not be enough as fires are more than just sounds.

J


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## sainty43 (Dec 5, 2012)

Thanks Jamesgoeswalkies for the reply. Much appreciated.

The past couple of evenings we tried the playing in a different room, and even offered his favourite treats but he is not in any way interested. We even tried some new treats and a new toy, but no interest whatsoever. He simply paces about, or sits in the corner shaking.

We'll carry it on, but I cant imagine he will change with this however thanks for the suggestion.

Would anyone recommend calming tablets, the type used around firework night? I don't want to make the situation any worse, however I wondered if we tried the tablets and left him in the cold room with the door open and gradually introduced him into the room with the fire? Any suggestions?


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## Jamesgoeswalkies (May 8, 2014)

Calming tablets are fine and can offer some help ... though they are best used alongside any de-sensitisation programme rather than simply on their own.

Remember, systematic de-sensitisation is a (very) s-l-o-w process which is why it is always best to start small (hardly any fire), at a different time of day and as far away as possible. (Try the garden). The chances are also he is anxious before you even light the fire as his anxiety will be triggered by the routine (time of day/setting the fire/collecting the logs etc) and these triggers usually have to be dealt with first. (Which is why i suggested working on this at different times of the day).

If it continues and you don't make any headway then maybe consulting a behaviourist who can observe and talk you through it, may help.

Good luck.

J


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## sainty43 (Dec 5, 2012)

Thanks again for your reply, you've been a great help.

I think I will try as you suggest - Small fires at different times of days, with different materials, and having him in different parts of the house and garden. This seems the best bet for him. The way he is at the moment, I know it's going to be a long road ahead, and I just wish I had known what caused it in the first place.

Thank you once again


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

Coal burns much more quietly than wood, so you could try that (despite the greater cost both in cash and to the environment). Or those peat briquette things. With any luck, a quieter fire might be more acceptable. And a Thundershirt should help.

You could go further and install a closed woodburner or multifuel stove; much more efficient at heating the house, and very quiet so the dog shouldn't be scared of it.


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## Hopeattheendofthetunnel (Jun 26, 2013)

I second the coals.

Some dogs are seemingly more sensitive to certain noises than others. Only one of mine had issues with the wood crackling in an open fire. I think it is a maturity issue as well since he'd happily chew a chew close to the fire until he was about 3.

After that it was a "get out of the room, you fools - the room is on fire!". He'd bark and clearly tried his best to make us understand that the room wasn't safe. Since I could sort of see his point - open flames in the living room are bound to make an intelligent dog twitchy ! - we largely ignored it. 

What made me laugh is that he carefully "rescued" all toys and chews from that room BEFORE he proceeded to "rescue" us.

Frankly, I couldn't see the merit in either forcing or coaxing him to stay in the room given that he clearly didn't dig the romantic ambiance of the open fire. Since nothing we tried made any difference ( music, alluring treats) we left him to it. If he'd rather be in the bedrooms, kitchen or anywhere else ....why not?

Coals, with the much calmer non- crackly flame, were a compromise. They didn't alarm him like logs did, but given that he was a longhaired dog with a thick coat, I guess the room simply got too hot and stuffy for him. Meaning he still prefered the cool bedroom or dining room .


My advice: don't make an issue out of it as the harder you try to convince him, the more he'll balk. And use coals.


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

The time to have worked on this was when you did not have a fire, you would have had plenty of months to use desensitisation and counter conditioning with the use of tapes.

Unfortunately you have now waited nearly a year since the problem first arose and have not sought professional help until the dog has to choose between being with you (and the fire) or not.

The problem is that unless you have another means of heating your room/house then one of you (at least) will be forced to be cold. 

Where do you live perhaps we can recommend a trainer?


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## sainty43 (Dec 5, 2012)

smokeybear said:


> The time to have worked on this was when you did not have a fire, you would have had plenty of months to use desensitisation and counter conditioning with the use of tapes.
> 
> Unfortunately you have now waited nearly a year since the problem first arose and have not sought professional help until the dog has to choose between being with you (and the fire) or not.
> 
> ...


We naively thought that the problem may have disappeared as it has been almost a year.

To be fair though, I am thinking that tapes wont work, as mentioned in a previous message they only replicate the sounds of a fire, not the sight, warmth and smell of a real fire. I have found a crackly fire video on YouTube, played it on my phone full volume and placed my phone in the fireplace (not lit of course ) but he simply ignored it and was quite happy. Obviosuley not real enough for him.

I appreciate the advice on using coal, this is certainly something we will try. We did use coal last year, but the occasional lump of coal does still crack when heated up, and all it seems to take is 1 cracking sound and he's off. It might help though if not to bad, and certainly worth a try.


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

sainty43 said:


> We naively thought that the problem may have disappeared as it has been almost a year.
> 
> To be fair though, I am thinking that tapes wont work, as mentioned in a previous message they only replicate the sounds of a fire, not the sight, warmth and smell of a real fire. I have found a crackly fire video on YouTube, played it on my phone full volume and placed my phone in the fireplace (not lit of course ) but he simply ignored it and was quite happy. Obviosuley not real enough for him.
> 
> I appreciate the advice on using coal, this is certainly something we will try. We did use coal last year, but *the occasional lump of coal does still crack when heated up, and all it seems to take is 1 cracking sound and he's off*. It might help though if not to bad, and certainly worth a try.


There's a solid fuel you can get, Homefire it's called, sort of hexagonal brick shaped; doesn't crack and burns to fine powdery ash. Not cheap but burns for longer than coal so shouldn't work out too much more costly.

I've never found any of these tapes to be worth bothering with. Like you said, dogs are reacting to much more than just a sound.


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## Hopeattheendofthetunnel (Jun 26, 2013)

Maybe I misunderstood your post, sainty43.

Are you saying that the open fire is your ONLY source of heating in the living room? That you'd have to sit in a freezing room all winter without it?

I had assumed that it was an occasional extra. Which also explains why the dog is not habituated to it, because most people with other heat sources - aka radiators - don't light an open fire every single day. Just when it is extra chilly or for a cozy ambiance.

If it IS your only source of warmth in the living room all winter long....I'd consider replacing it with a wood burner. More energy efficient and the dog won't freak from crackling behind the glass.


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## sainty43 (Dec 5, 2012)

Burrowzig said:


> There's a solid fuel you can get, Homefire it's called, sort of hexagonal brick shaped; doesn't crack and burns to fine powdery ash. Not cheap but burns for longer than coal so shouldn't work out too much more costly.
> 
> I've never found any of these tapes to be worth bothering with. Like you said, dogs are reacting to much more than just a sound.


That's a brilliant idea, thank you! I have heard of Homefire and some people rave about it, but didn't realise it burnt so quietly. I'm off to get a bag or 2 this weekend to give it a try. The main problem is the noise, so this should go a long way towards getting him over this, thanks :thumbup:


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## sainty43 (Dec 5, 2012)

Hopeattheendofthetunnel said:


> Maybe I misunderstood your post, sainty43.
> 
> Are you saying that the open fire is your ONLY source of heating in the living room? That you'd have to sit in a freezing room all winter without it?
> 
> ...


We do have central heating, but we don't really use it during the week, as we are normally only in 1 or 2 rooms in the evening so we light a fire. I get a lot of free wood locally so it works out a lot cheaper than putting the heating on.

We have thought about the idea of a wood burner, but I am sure the wood will still spit and crackle behind the glass, albeit muffled, which I'm sure will still send the dog running. Also when you open the door of a wood burner he will hear the crackling and run. I want to try and address the fear issue and make some progress before spending a lot of money on a wood burner. Thanks for the suggestion though


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