# Cat just won't behave



## Micky78 (Mar 19, 2011)

Hi people.

We have had Pickle since he was a kitten. He is now 2 years and 3 months old.
Unfortunately, he was taken from his mother too early, the 'breeder' claimed he was 12 weeks old and our vet said he was no more than 6 weeks old, our mistake for being gullible first-time kitten owners.

We had a lot of behavioural difficulties with him for months, but with plenty of love, affection and play-time, he has calmed down a lot... but not calmed down enough.

He will often attack my fiance, biting and clawing her for no reason whatsoever, all she has to do is walk past him and he will swipe. He also goes for me on occasions and I'm worried he will hurt a young visitor.

We have tried yelping when he attacks, ignoring him, isolating him from us for an hour or so. Just nothing works.

My fiance has had enough of him and is talking of taking him to the RSPCA, personally I don't want him to go. He lives in a pretty big house with a big garden and pretty much sleeps where he likes, he's always fed three meals a day and as I mentioned, not short of love and attention.

Is there any advice at all? Or do cats like this never learn?


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Hi Micky,

Before taking the irrevocable step of handing him to a Shelter for rehoming, I recommend you consult an animal behaviourist specialising with cats. Your vet will be able to recommend someone good. Make sure it is the kind who comes to your home and observes your cat in its own environment. You may only need a couple of visits, and although not cheap, it will be worth the money. If you have pet insurance, you are probably covered for this.

Please bear in mind if you hand him over to the RSPCA and tell them he attacks people, there is a fair chance they will euthanise him as being too difficult to re-home. Therefore I urge you, if it comes to the point where you feel you must give up on him, please hand him to a shelter that won't euthanise him. Many smaller independent Rescues operate a "no-kill" policy, and will do their best to find him a sympathetic, experienced new owner. If they can't, they will keep him at the shelter.

You say your cat attacks for "no reason whatsoever", by which I assume you mean for no *apparent* reason, as there will always be a cause for his behaviour. Either he wants to play when he swipes at your fiance, or he is annoyed about something that has happened, or he is frustrated by something within his environment, such as e.g. another cat, or maybe he is even hungry. Without seeing him in action I cannot tell you the cause.

I don't see any reason in theory why he could not be trained to behave with more decorum, regarding use of claws and teeth, but it will take a lot of patience on your and your fiance's part, as his behaviour by now has become habitual, and he needs retraining.

But the fact is, he may possibly be one of those cats who will always have a bit of a short fuse, who gets over-excited easily, and seems unable to cope with too much interaction with humans. When over-excited such cats can lash out and hurt.

The best way to manage such a cat is never to *initiate* displays of physical affection with him, or intrude in any way into his personal space if he is snoozing or sleeping. Allow the cat to come to you if he wants to, when 
he decides he needs attention, strokes, cuddles etc, rather than you go to him.

I have had 2 short-fused cats in the past years, and I learnt never to pick them up, (except to put them in a carrier for vet visits), and never to stroke them unless they approached me in a friendly manner. Over several years their tempers gradually improved a lot, as they learnt to trust that I would always, always, always respect their need to decide for themselves what level of interaction they wanted with me. Humans do tend to take it for granted that our cats are happy to be stroked any time we feel like doing it, but with some cats this is not the case.

Interaction through play, using arms length toys such as fishing rod toys, laser lights etc, is fine. You are safer from *assault*, and the cat feels more comfortable in his own space.

I would also review his diet. Some cats can be irritable or tetchy on a diet that includes a lot of carbs, i.e. cereals. Cats do not need carbs, can't digest them, and it gives them surges in blood sugar which can cause erratic behaviour. So ensure you are feeding him a diet high in meat protein, preferably free of cereals. This means ruling out most supermarket cat foods. Though Hilife Natures Essentials is one that is OK (sold by [email protected])

Definitely do not feed him any dry food as most makes are full of carbs. A diet high in meat protein will be digested slowly, as best suits the cat's metabolism, and will keep his mood more even.

If you can give any more detail about the kind of things that often lead up to your cat being aggressive with your fiance I can comment further.


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## Jiskefet (May 15, 2011)

Have you ever tested his sight and hearing?
Swiping at people for no reason may mean he was taken by surprise and got spooked, which would be quite understandable if he was shortsighted or hard of hearing.

I once had a deaf cat, who would swipe at us, or the other cats, if we walked too close and she didn't notice us coming. She would get a fright and defend herself.
the cats soon learned to walk by her in a way that would not disturb her, and we made sure to make the floor vibrate or to touch the chair or bed she was sleeping on to announce our presence.

He may also feel insecure for some reason (maybe because he was taken from his mother too young), and punishing him will only increase his fear and insecurity. If it is insecurity, you'd need to build up his confidence instead.
But you need a cat behaviourist to assess his behaviour on site.


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## Jiskefet (May 15, 2011)

If he senses fear or animosity, that could trigger aggressive or defensive behaviour, too.
for I am not at all convinced he is aggressive, I rather expect him to be defensive. He may percieve your fiancees presence as a threat to his position and become insecure as a result.


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## muffin789 (Jan 28, 2013)

You've got some great advice and hopefully it'll help you get to the bottom of Pickle's peculiarities 

But please don't label him as not behaving - he's just not behaving as you would like him to. He was taken from his mum far too young, so missed out on a lot of the socialising that mothers normally teach their young, and bless him he doesn't know any better.

In my experience "time out" doesn't work with cats as we have no way of verbally communicating to them why they're being isolated. Ignoring, yes, it's something that can be used for short periods of time, but time out has no concept to them.

Does your fiancee have much "pleasant" interaction with Pickle? Such as being the one to give food, treats etc? I found that with a (now ex) partner that I wanted my cats at the time to accept, things got far easier when I made him the one to do the majority of the care-giving and took a step back - I think it helps build trust and rapport.

A behaviourist is definitely the way to go, particularly as you're obviously keen to keep the little guy. If he's not learnt how to behave socially, that's not really something that's his fault but it is something you can all work on together, rather than just giving up.

Fingers crossed things work out for you all!! xxxx


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## Micky78 (Mar 19, 2011)

Many thanks for the replies, plenty of information to go on.

Pickle sometimes has had forced affection, previous cats didn't seem to mind this, but with Pickle he is probably too young to stand for it. In recent weeks he has had no forced affection and the only time he has been picked up is when he has been on tables or work-spaces. There doesn't seem to be any other way to get him down, I don't agree with clapping or shouting like some owners do.

He will sit and glare at you, then pounce for no apparent reason, you don't actually have to move your hands or feet for this to happen. We do allow him on the bed and the sofa and this is when he is more likely to attack as well as when you pass him.
He will often lock his teeth and his claws around your arm or ankle, usually drawing blood.

His diet has always been wet food upto a few weeks ago where we have given him half wet and half dry. It was a ploy to make sure he was getting enough meat content and maybe stop him bringing us gifts.
We do the right thing with the gifts, say thanks and calmly dispose when he isn't around, but the amount of dead rats, mice and birds is getting a little OTT.

My fiance is the main feeder and he is of course very affectionate with her when he is hungry and she is the recipient to the many gifts. But most of the time he is just likes to attack her.

There are no cat behaviour specialists that are local, so looks like we will have to train him one way or another.

Again, thanks for the replies.


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## Jiskefet (May 15, 2011)

By the way, has he been neutered, and at what age?
Unneutered toms have a habit of defending their territory, and if he is entire, he may consider some places in the house, or even the place where he happens to be sitting at that moment, his personal space, and be offended and feel challenged if you come too close.
If he hsn't been neutered, that should be the first step, though you must allow about 2 months post neutering for his hormones to settle. So he may still behave like a true tom for some weeks to come.

By the way, the early separation from his mother may be the cause for his inability to accept being taken down from a worktop, too. My Xena does exactly the same if she doesn't like to be picked up, she will glare, growl and swipe at us, even though she loves up very much and will be extremely cuddly when SHE chooses to.


But her mother simply wasn't around long enough to teach her to accept being told off.... She was dumped at a campsite at 6 weeks.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Agree that if you take the cat to a main-stream rescue he might well be pts, and the difficulty with the completely no-kill ones is that they rarely have room for another cat though some might do home-to-home - they match up, do home checks, then the prospective homer visits you at your home to see the cat. And right now all shelters are full of kittens, so adults almost always get overlooked. 

Agree also that forced affection is NOT the way to go - with any cat, including your cat. People don't like it either.

You might find reading some books written by a well-known behaviourist useful - she describes how they dealt with a number of cats with similar problems. In essense it was a mixture of making life more interesting for the cat, and wearing protection for a while so that the owners genuinely could ignore the cat's attacks, and the cat didn't get it's usual hit of fun from attacking them. And since she can often spot when he is about to attack, diversion with a toy might help.

You cat would well be bored despite the large garden and the most exciting thing that happens is when he attacks.


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Micky, here is a link to the COAPE Association of Animal Behaviourists in case you want to search for a Behaviourist near you. Their training is excellent and thorough.

Bear in mind they may be prepared to travel a reasonable distance from their home, though would make a small additional charge for travel time & petrol.

CAPBT - COAPE Association of Pet Behaviourists and Trainers

The big advantage of bringing in a behaviourist is that as well as their experience they bring a fresh perspective with which to make an independent assessment of the dynamics of the situation. This would be really helpful to you as the problem with Pickle has been going on for a while. A behaviourist would work out a clear plan of action for you and your fiance.

Also sometimes having fresh input from an independent source can take a lot of *heat* out of the situation and can help dissipate any feelings of annoyance, resentment etc.

I also really like Oriental Slave's suggestion of reading a book or two about cat behaviour. Claire Bessant is one of the best -- so I would recommend this one:

The Cat Whisperer: Amazon.co.uk: Claire Bessant: Books

Roger Tabor is another good one:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Understandi...&qid=1372503856&sr=1-5&keywords=cat+behaviour

(Would you recommend other authors OrientalSlave?)

In Pickle's case I would disagree with your method of removing him from work tops by picking him up. It seems possible he is a cat who only wants to be handled on his own terms, so I would avoid initiating touch where possible.

Instead you could try pointing at the floor with your finger and saying "down" in a firm voice, whilst at the same time tapping him very lightly with a wand toy at the backs of his legs (near his feet). I am not saying he will like this, but as a method it is less intrusive into his personal space, and he can make the decision himself to jump down. I have found it works.

Just a thought, if he keeps getting on worktops, is he looking for food? None of my cats over the years have ever been interested in worktops after they learnt food is never left there when I am out of the room. I must say they all like sitting on tables though, but I always tolerate that as long as we are not eating at the table at the time. A quick wipe down of the table suffices before we sit down to eat.

I am also curious he is hunting quite so vigorously if he is not hungry. Though I know there are some cats that are really intrepid hunters, in spite of what they get fed at home.

It could actually be the case Pickle is telling you he would like his food raw. 
Have you considered feeding him some raw meat? Maybe some nice fresh raw chunks of beef or lamb? Or perhaps a raw chicken wing (good for his teeth to chew the bone)

If you wanted to put him on a completely raw diet it would need to be properly balanced, with the right proportion of muscle meat, offal, and bone. But as just a part of his diet it would be OK to feed just some chunks to see if he likes them.

Cats hunt mostly at twilight, i.e. dawn and dusk, so if you can keep him shut indoors at those times you will certainly cut down on the number of *gifts* he brings indoors. Also, I hope you keep him shut indoors overnight as that is the time when most injuries happen to cats, either from fighting with other cats, or from being hit by vehicles.


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## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

I know it's a TV show but see if you can find the recent series of My Cat from Hell with Jackson Galaxy as there have been a couple of these issues on there. You may get some ideas before seeking the help of a behaviourist.


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## Velcro (May 20, 2013)

my Velcro has abit of an attitude as well, took about a year for her to decide she liked my bloke. and now, annoyingly, she seems to favour him over me 

he just stayed out of her way and interacted with her on her terms. he would feed her and after watching some of those my cats from hells on youtube, we invested in a long stick with feathers on, way better than the shorter little fishing pole ones you get from the pet shops

she gives him kisses and allsorts now and totally ignores me these days ):

she doesn't like anyone else mind. but all I say to anyone if she is around is to just stay away from the cat lol. 

im sure you can work on him, don't give up!!


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Vicki Halls has written some good books as well.


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## Jiskefet (May 15, 2011)

One of the things Jackson Galaxy (My Cat From Hell) always stresses is that owners have to learn to look at their house through the eyes of the cat. The house needs to be habitable and comfortable, not just for the humans, but for the cat as well.

Does the cat have enough safe places snd privacy to sit and sleep? 
does he have enough privacy when using his litter box?
Is the type of litterbox and litter right for him?
Is his food and water in a place where he can eat in peace?
does he have scratching posts in various places he can use to mark his territory by scratching them?
Does he have enough places to climb onto and view his kingdom from a high vantage point?
Does he feel threatened or challenged by any neighbouring cats entering his territory (patrolling his garden or even entering the garage or shed)?
Does he have enough interactive play to tire him out and channel his energy?


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## Micky78 (Mar 19, 2011)

Jiskefet said:


> By the way, has he been neutered, and at what age?
> Unneutered toms have a habit of defending their territory, and if he is entire, he may consider some places in the house, or even the place where he happens to be sitting at that moment, his personal space, and be offended and feel challenged if you come too close.
> If he hsn't been neutered, that should be the first step, though you must allow about 2 months post neutering for his hormones to settle. So he may still behave like a true tom for some weeks to come.
> 
> ...


He was neutered at 6 months.
Pickle loves to be in high places, many times we do wonder how he gets up on the cupboards and he loves to climb the high trees we have in the garden (often crying because he can't figure how to get back down lol).
I know what you mean about the mothers not being around too long, at the time we were told of ways to deal with this, but I don't think there is any substitution for nature.


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## Lunabuma (Dec 12, 2011)

I have a very similar story about my Mitzi when she was around. She did calm down but it was more like 3 years before she did. The main thing I did was shoo her away / shut her out of the room every time she was out of the blue agressive / hurty playful. 

There has been lots of good advice already been given. You have taken on responsibility of Pickles, there are lots of safeguards that you can put in place if you fear visitors / youngsters are at risk of an attack rather than writing him off.


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## Micky78 (Mar 19, 2011)

chillminx said:


> Micky, here is a link to the COAPE Association of Animal Behaviourists in case you want to search for a Behaviourist near you. Their training is excellent and thorough.
> 
> Bear in mind they may be prepared to travel a reasonable distance from their home, though would make a small additional charge for travel time & petrol.
> 
> ...


Pickle has had the freedom to go out when he pleases since he was about 7 months old, the litter tray went at the same time. There are a number of cats that come in to our garden day and night so I'm guessing he gets in a number of scrapes, but never seems to have any lumps or scratches.

I think he just loves to hunt, he has the oppotunites very close to home with the amount of bird-houses, bushes and trees surrounding us.
He generally seems to be happy with what he is fed and is fed three times a day.

Yes he does look for food, good idea with wiping the surfaces down, we usually just leave the kitchen to eat and up he goes, often licking pans (dirty little munter). We will order him down in future, he knows he's not allowed up there, but when he has his head in a pan he is often very ignorant.

I will definitely order one or both of those books, I don't think either of us are cat experts and there is a lot to learn about them. I'm determined to teach Pickle what is right and wrong instead of giving him away.

Thanks for the advice.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

How about not leaving pans out with stuff in for him to lick?

As to teaching him, that's tricky with a cat. Have you heard that dogs have owners and cats have staff? He isn't a dog, your language 'teach him what is right and wrong' and 'not giving way' sounds like a dog owners language, not like that of a cat's slave.


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## Micky78 (Mar 19, 2011)

Jiskefet said:


> One of the things Jackson Galaxy (My Cat From Hell) always stresses is that owners have to learn to look at their house through the eyes of the cat. The house needs to be habitable and comfortable, not just for the humans, but for the cat as well.
> 
> Does the cat have enough safe places snd privacy to sit and sleep?
> does he have enough privacy when using his litter box?
> ...


Yes Pickle has the run of the house, in total he has seven rooms where he has somewhere nice and comfy to sleep and more often than not he would rather be in a room where someone usually is, so if one of us is watching TV, he will sit next to you and fall asleep rather than sit in the next room.
We don't use a litterbox anymore, he has a cat-flap open 24/7.
Yes he eats in the utility room, so we feed him and leave him.
He has three scratching posts, all located near sofas and the bed.
There are very high trees in the garden that he climbs and the walls are high.
Very very possibly, I can count at least six cats that come in to our garden, on one occasion at least, one of them has come through the cat-flap. They all seem to congregate in our garden.
I think we could actually play with him a little bit more, he loves (or hates) the laser-pointer and that seems to knacker him out, but he doesn't seem to want to play as much now.


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## Micky78 (Mar 19, 2011)

OrientalSlave said:


> How about not leaving pans out with stuff in for him to lick?
> 
> As to teaching him, that's tricky with a cat. Have you heard that dogs have owners and cats have staff? He isn't a dog, your language 'teach him what is right and wrong' and 'not giving way' sounds like a dog owners language, not like that of a cat's slave.


I did actually say 'Giving him away' as in giving him to a shelter.
Ok maybe I worded it wrong, but if I was a cat expert, I wouldn't be on here asking for advice.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Indeed you did, but my point that it's a dog owners sort of view still holds I think. Cats don't have the social structures that dogs do, Kipling wrote about the 'cat that walked alone' fairly accurately.

Just So Stories, Rudyard Kipling


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Micky, I think dogs are more inclined to want to please humans, which is why it is possible to train them. 

Cats on the other hand have a strong will, it is a natural part of their character, (and one reason I admire them so much). To get a cat to behave the way you want, even in small ways, needs affection, persuasion, bribery, praise, and .........compromise.  

Best of luck


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