# Chewie no longer responding



## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Chewies prednisone has been put up to 10 mg and just had her haematology today and she's not responding at all. Her white cells are at an all-time low.

We are trying an additional drug which I pick up tomorrow and they advised me of the cost of this drug is £109. 

I forgot what it's called I'll know better tomorrow. 

They said it's getting complicated again and she may need to be hospitalised. 

I've already spent close to £6,000 - insurance has expired I've sold things I've hit credit cards hard. 

I'm heartbroken because hospitalisation again just isn't economically viable.


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

Sorry to hear this


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Lurcherlad said:


> Sorry to hear this


Thankyou

She's got no quality of life anymore. Just sits in the bedroom staring into space


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

Karl43 said:


> Thankyou
> 
> She's got no quality of life anymore. Just sits in the bedroom staring into space


Very sad … maybe it's time to let her go?


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Lurcherlad said:


> Very sad … maybe it's time to let her go?


I'm trying this last medication, blood test two weeks after that, and if no response, I think that's going to be the course of action.


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## kimthecat (Aug 11, 2009)

Im sorry to hear this. Its heartbreaking.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> I'm trying this last medication, blood test two weeks after that, and if no response, I think that's going to be the course of action.


If she is really not herself and no longer happy, it's sadly clearly something you have to consider. I am sorry to hear this. What is she taking the Pred for?


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

kimthecat said:


> Im sorry to hear this. Its heartbreaking.


Thank you. I'm going to ask the vet if it's a reasonable course of action for these circumstances. Asked alot of my friends too.

I was walking around asda in tears. I got down the pet food aisle and that was that.


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## Hi_ (8 mo ago)

I'm sorry about this but is a go fund me possible it may help but I'm sorry once again


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> If she is really not herself and no longer happy, it's sadly clearly something you have to consider. I am sorry to hear this. What is she taking the Pred for?


She has primary immune mediated neutropenia with anemia. Rare in cats.

Her immune system attacks her body.

The red blood cells got sorted out but the white cells just not responding.

They are concerned in case she gets any sort of secondary infection.

All she does is eat and sleep. It's good that she eats of course, but she is 2 years old and she literally doesn't do anything. She won't play she won't really engage in anything, just sits staring or goes to sleep.

It's too complicated for local vets to deal with which is why they said if she doesn't respond to the new medication she would have to be hospitalised yet again.

My concern is it will just be a cycle of being hospitalised with no real results for chewie and just an endless money pit for me.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Hi_ said:


> I'm sorry about this but is a go fund me possible it may help but I'm sorry once again


I've already got a gofundme set up from the beginning but I'm not a fan of Facebook so don't have many Facebook friends and I'm a bit of a lone wolf in Life too, so it was largely unsuccessful. I think there is about £85 in there which won't even cover 1 months medication.

Even if I had all the money in the world no one can guarantee chewie a normal life


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

I’m so sorry to read this Karl, I really feel for you.


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## Miss Mayzee (9 mo ago)

That’s heartbreaking when Chewie is so young. I hope her new medication works


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## lullabydream (Jun 25, 2013)

So sorry to be reading this, love to you xxxx


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

Very sorry Karl


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## Charity (Apr 17, 2013)

I'm so sorry, at such a young age its very sad.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

I'm so sorry to hear this @Karl43. I feel devastated for you both. Let's hope the increase in steroids, along with the new drug help turn her little life around. You can only try.

I remember the before and after pictures you had of Chewie on here recently and she looked so much better. It sounds a terrible medical condition to have and so unfair with her only being two.

I've just been reading up on the condition, in desperation. Are they putting her on antibiotics? It mentions a blood cleansing therapy, specialist therapeutic plasma exchange…. (If all else fails). You certainly have done your best for your dear, sweet, pretty girl.

Please keep us updated. I don't do Facebook, but happy to donate if they can come up with some solution. Take care.


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## Mrs Funkin (Mar 12, 2018)

Oh Karl  I'm so sorry to read your latest update about your little lady. It's so awful for you to be going through this - I shall hope that the new drug helps her and she is able to have a better quality of life and stay with you for longer. Sending positive thoughts to you both xx


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## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Oh no  so sorry to read this


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

I have no advice to offer, but I just wanted to let you know that I'm thinking about you both. Hugs!


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TriTri said:


> I'm so sorry to hear this @Karl43. I feel devastated for you both. Let's hope the increase in steroids, along with the new drug help turn her little life around. You can only try.
> 
> I remember the before and after pictures you had of Chewie on here recently and she looked so much better. It sounds a terrible medical condition to have and so unfair with her only being two.
> 
> ...


I read up alot myself. It accounts for most of my browsing history I think!

She's been on antibiotics at one point.

I've not heard about thetherapeutic plasma exchange, but if it's anything like a transfusion I feel it would just be a temporary fix before her immune system starts destroying everything again. I'll certainly ask about it,thank you.

And thank you for the kind offer of donation I'll certainly discuss all options with the vet but I really am depleted in funds.

I am one of those people that always says if you can't afford a pet don't have one, but I've been brought up my entire life around cats and usually everything goes quite smoothly with cats, not that much really goes wrong, and I certainly didn't account for a two year old indoor cat to be so seriously ill with such a rare disease.


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

You can't anticipate or plan for anything like this, it just happens and you have to deal with it as best you can.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Karl43 said:


> I read up alot myself. It accounts for most of my browsing history I think!
> 
> She's been on antibiotics at one point.
> 
> ...


You couldn't have known, like you said, especially to such a young cat, and you've done so much…. It's a shame the insurers cap claims.

If it's a temporary fix, I agree, there's no point, but I don't know what it is exactly or how it works and what can be gained from it, but please do ask if you want to, incase it can turn things around for a long time. Maybe if they thought it was appropriate they would have mentioned it already.

Is there a special forum for cats with this medical condition (like there are for Feline CKD and Feline Pancreatitis etc)? They can be super helpful.


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## Bettybobbins (Nov 29, 2021)

I think you are being sensible; try the medication and if she isn’t responding or deteriorating then you are putting her best interests at heart, even though it is soul destroying for yourself. If she were a much older cat in her twilight years it is easier to accept her just lazing the days away but for a young girl in her prime to have no quality of life has to factored in.

whatever path you end up on your girl is very loved and receiving the best of care, we will all stand by you at whichever destination you arrive.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> I really am depleted in funds


I'd be happy to donate, too, if it would offer some hope. I am so sorry to hear this - just seen her lovely pictures on another thread and she looks so adorable. It's quite shocking where the money goes with vets. My Beauregard was at the Queen Mother Hospital for Animals - literally £1000 a day (and that was about ten years ago) until the money ran out. They never ever found out what his problem was and I wished afterwards that he had been PTS and not admitted there; he spent his last five days away from home and in a pen being poked and prodded, all seemingly for nothing and I had no chance to say goodbye to him. Deep down, I knew he would not be coming home the day he was admitted. But you do it in the hope of some sort of miracle - especially if they are so young. I wish you well. XX
@TriTri Agree, I joined a forum for cats with HT and one for CKD and have found them amazingly helpful - and you get first-hand experience from people who have been through the same.


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## BlessedbyJack (Feb 23, 2011)

I'm so sorry to hear this and just wanted to offer support please remember you are doing your very best for your furbaby and I really feel for what you are going through.
Sending love to you both and cuddles to chewie. I hope the medication will help.
Bless you both x


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Bettybobbins said:


> I think you are being sensible; try the medication and if she isn't responding or deteriorating then you are putting her best interests at heart, even though it is soul destroying for yourself. If she were a much older cat in her twilight years it is easier to accept her just lazing the days away but for a young girl in her prime to have no quality of life has to factored in.
> 
> whatever path you end up on your girl is very loved and receiving the best of care, we will all stand by you at whichever destination you arrive.


Thank you that's kind of you. I'm certainly in a dark place, as is chewie no doubt.

As you say if she was older this would be far more acceptable when she is so young it's difficult to watch. I remember when she was leaping all over the place


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> I'd be happy to donate, too, if it would offer some hope. I am so sorry to hear this - just seen her lovely pictures on another thread and she looks so adorable. It's quite shocking where the money goes with vets. My Beauregard was at the Queen Mother Hospital for Animals - literally £1000 a day (and that was about ten years ago) until the money ran out. They never ever found out what his problem was and I wished afterwards that he had been PTS and not admitted there; he spent his last five days away from home and in a pen being poked and prodded, all seemingly for nothing and I had no chance to say goodbye to him. Deep down, I knew he would not be coming home the day he was admitted. But you do it in the hope of some sort of miracle - especially if they are so young. I wish you well. XX
> @TriTri Agree, I joined a forum for cats with HT and one for CKD and have found them amazingly helpful - and you get first-hand experience from people who have been through the same.


Thankyou. I'm sorry to hear you went through similar. The expense can be mortifying and with little to no results. 

I told my friend last night they may want to hospitalise her again and she just looked at me perplexed and said "well what are they going to do?!"

I can drop a link for the page but I don't know if it goes against forum rules, so please someone delete or move if it does


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> Thankyou. I'm sorry to hear you went through similar. The expense can be mortifying and with little to no results.
> 
> I told my friend last night they may want to hospitalise her again and she just looked at me perplexed and said "well what are they going to do?!"
> 
> I can drop a link for the page but I don't know if it goes against forum rules, so please someone delete or move if it does


Cool - have donated and saved the link.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> Cool - have donated and saved the link.


Thankyou 

I ordered some photo prints a while ago in anticipation of what's happening, they arrived today so I am going to get a photo album done


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## Arny (Jul 29, 2017)

I'm so sorry for you and Chewie, like everyone's said no one expects this of a young cat and it certainly makes it harder.
You've really fought to get her this far and no doubt you'll make the right decision for her, even if its heart breaking.


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

I've bookmarked the Web page and I'll be able to donate over the weekend, although it may not be much.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Deguslave said:


> I've bookmarked the Web page and I'll be able to donate over the weekend, although it may not be much.


Thank you very much and it does not matter it all helps


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

I’ve just donated. So sorry you are both having to go through this. Keep us updated please.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TriTri said:


> I've just donated. So sorry you are both having to go through this. Keep us updated please.


You are so kind thank you so so much.

I will definitely keep everybody updated and I usually put updates on the donation page as well:Cat


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> The expense can be mortifying


I always recoil at the bills I get from the garage - but nothing compares to vet bills! I know several people, who, like you, thought they were A-OK because they were insured, but suddenly realised that it was still ongoing and the money had gone. Then you start to try to make sense of the situation and say, ''If I cough up, say, another £2000 myself, will that be the end of it - will that get results or . . . ''? 
How is Chewie today?


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

I'm really sorry but I have removed the link for the funding page because it is against forum rules.


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## LinznMilly (Jun 24, 2011)

@Karl43 so sorry to hear you're in this situation. Especially when Chewie is so young. 

Would your friend be able to share your GoFundMe page with their own friends list? Any other family and friends who could donate and then share?


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Small donation as promised. I'm sorry it couldn't be more.


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## lorilu (Sep 6, 2009)

I am so sorry to see this thread. XX


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

lorilu said:


> I am so sorry to see this thread. XX


Thank you. Its devastating 


StormyThai said:


> I'm really sorry but I have removed the link for the funding page because it is against forum rules.


No problem



Deguslave said:


> Small donation as promised. I'm sorry it couldn't be more.


Thank you so much


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

LinznMilly said:


> @Karl43 so sorry to hear you're in this situation. Especially when Chewie is so young.
> 
> Would your friend be able to share your GoFundMe page with their own friends list? Any other family and friends who could donate and then share?


Ironically the most generous people have been the people here who I don't even know.

I can try but I don't have many Facebook friends not a big Facebook fan


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

I'm sorry to read this but glad that you have at least one last option to try.

I have been in your position, insured but only up to 4k, and it took me a long while to pay it off even with help from my parents.

What I will say is that 2 weeks on the higher dose is a small amount of time in the scheme of things and that there is still hope that chewy will respond. I sincerely hope so xx


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

GingerNinja said:


> I'm sorry to read this but glad that you have at least one last option to try.
> 
> I have been in your position, insured but only up to 4k, and it took me a long while to pay it off even with help from my parents.
> 
> What I will say is that 2 weeks on the higher dose is a small amount of time in the scheme of things and that there is still hope that chewy will respond. I sincerely hope so xx


Thank you, I actually thought that myself. The vet catastrophized the situation and I did think well she's only been on the higher dose of pred for just over two weeks, give her a chance.

He also said it's not looking good that she is so lethargic and again I thought while she's on a massive dose of prednisone wouldn't she inevitably be lethargic?

I'm certainly trying the new drug. Having listened to the voicemail again, I'm pretty sure it's cyclosporine, it's a syrup. They didn't have it on Friday because they mixed the order up with somebody else's, so she doesn't even start it until Monday and continues with the 10 mg of prednisone

Thank you for your kind words, you have always been kind and maintained positive, probably more positive than myself x


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

Karl43 said:


> He also said it's not looking good that she is so lethargic and again I thought while she's on a massive dose of prednisone wouldn't she inevitably be lethargic?
> QUOTE]
> 
> I agree with you wholeheartedly. After six months I decided to reduce the pred without knowing if Luna's blood count had increased because she was struggling/so lethargic that I did not think it was fair to keep her going. I spoke to the vet first and they said it was my decision. I was willing to take the responsibility that it was potentially the end by that point but luckily it was the right move.
> ...


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

Sorry my response has appeared in your quote!


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

GingerNinja said:


> Sorry my response has appeared in your quote!


I keep telling her to fight. I was cuddling her yesterday and I was saying come on baby you need to just fight I'm doing all I can, please just fight.

Amongst all of the doom and gloom she does show me little glimpses of hope.

I went to bed last night and she always uses the litter tray when I get in bed, but then I could hear her constantly meowing. I thought something was wrong so jumped out of bed and she was sat in the doorway of the bedroom and as soon as she saw me started purring really loudly. I said what's the matter? Up went her tail into the air, she led me into the kitchen and basically just wanted a treat before I fell asleep:Cat

It is a struggle watching them on the prednisone isn't it? it really knocks the air out of the sails. It's difficult when a once playful active cat just kind of sleeps


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## LinznMilly (Jun 24, 2011)

Karl43 said:


> Thank you, I actually thought that myself. The vet catastrophized the situation and I did think well she's only been on the higher dose of pred for just over two weeks, give her a chance.
> 
> He also said it's not looking good that she is so lethargic and again I thought while she's on a massive dose of prednisone wouldn't she inevitably be lethargic?
> 
> ...


I can't speak for cats, and I don't know exactly what Chewie's condition is, but I have been on both pred (short courses for asthma, but worked for eczema too) and cyclosporine (much longer course) for eczema myself.

It's good stuff. It gave me about 18 months' relief from my skin irritation. In humans, it's recommended for a maximum of 2 years because it hits the liver and kidneys, but reading up in it for cats, they can (and usually are) on it for the rest of their lives. It seems it can reduce the immune system in cats as well as humans. Just something to be aware of. But if it worked for me, when nothing else did, hopefully it'll work for Chewie too.

Fingers crossed for you both.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

LinznMilly said:


> I can't speak for cats, and I don't know exactly what Chewie's condition is, but I have been on both pred (short courses for asthma, but worked for eczema too) and cyclosporine (much longer course) for eczema myself.
> 
> It's good stuff. It gave me about 18 months' relief from my skin irritation. In humans, it's recommended for a maximum of 2 years because it hits the liver and kidneys, but reading up in it for cats, they can (and usually are) on it for the rest of their lives. It seems it can reduce the immune system in cats as well as humans. Just something to be aware of. But if it worked for me, when nothing else did, hopefully it'll work for Chewie too.
> 
> Fingers crossed for you both.


Hi she takes the drugs with the sole intention of reducing her immune system.

She has primary immune mediated anaemia and neutropenia. (Autoimmune disease)

Her immune system is far to overactive and basically plays Space Invaders with her red blood cells and white cells instead of just taking out the bad stuff.

The prednisone has raised the red blood cells to acceptable levels which is really good because she was critical from anaemia, but it had no effect on the white cells recently, I think they are called neutrophils, which is a concern because she could get secondary infection and she has no immune system to fight it at the moment.

The prednisone worked brilliantly at first, she was on 10 mg, it got reduced to 7.5 and it stopped working for the neutrophils, so it was put back up to 10 and now it's still not working for the neutrophils.

I'm glad it works for your conditions and thank you for your kind comments


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

I had a degu (Dixie) on pred for just short of a year due to rhinitis. We started off with a high dose and then reduced it when we could. It was periodically increased and reduced again if he had a flare up. He had good days and bad days on it and all I had to do was tell the vet when I was increasing the dose for a few days and if I needed a further prescription. It was very much a team effort with me and his very experienced vets.

After a while frusol was added as he was retaining fluid which was causing further breathing problems. It gave me an extra year with him which I wouldn't have had without it. He had just turned 10 when I had to have him PTS because there was nothing more we could do and the frusol was no longer working and his condition deteriorated, but 10 is a very good age for a degu (seven to seven and a half is average)

I understand completely what you're going through and its a nightmare rollercoaster to be on.


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## Nealh (12 mo ago)

Contributed, chin up Chewie.


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## £54etgfb6 (Dec 25, 2020)

.


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

I've sent you the link.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Deguslave said:


> I had a degu (Dixie) on pred for just short of a year due to rhinitis. We started off with a high dose and then reduced it when we could. It was periodically increased and reduced again if he had a flare up. He had good days and bad days on it and all I had to do was tell the vet when I was increasing the dose for a few days and if I needed a further prescription. It was very much a team effort with me and his very experienced vets.
> 
> After a while frusol was added as he was retaining fluid which was causing further breathing problems. It gave me an extra year with him which I wouldn't have had without it. He had just turned 10 when I had to have him PTS because there was nothing more we could do and the frusol was no longer working and his condition deteriorated, but 10 is a very good age for a degu (seven to seven and a half is average)
> 
> I understand completely what you're going through and its a nightmare rollercoaster to be on.


Awwww it sounds like Dixie did really well and was a real fighter:Happy definitely a roller coaster, somebody on here pre warned me,but nothing could prepare me. So emotionally exhausting



Nealh said:


> Contributed, chin up Chewie.


Thank you so much I really appreciate it that's so kind of you:Cat



bmr10 said:


> I really, really wish the best for you both @Karl43. I am so sorry you're going through this and my heart goes out to her. I cannot find the link to donate please could someone send me it if possible? I would appreciate it a lot.


Hello unfortunately the link went against forum rules and was deleted.

Thank you so much it's an emotional rollercoaster at the moment, I don't know whether I am coming or going


Deguslave said:


> I've sent you the link.


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## £54etgfb6 (Dec 25, 2020)

.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Everybody meet chewie. She's quite bright today


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> Everybody meet chewie. She's quite bright today


She is gorgeous, and looking at her, you would not guess that there was a problem. To be honest, she's being far more active than any one of mine today - they are all zonked out on any sunny spot they can find on the floor near a window!


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> She is gorgeous, and looking at her, you would not guess that there was a problem. To be honest, she's being far more active than any one of mine today - they are all zonked out on any sunny spot they can find on the floor near a window!


And that's what makes it so difficult. Only 3 days ago the vet was saying, this is not looking good, she may need to be hospitalised and then fast forward and she has a really good day like today day where she is completely bright, interested in her surroundings, good appetite and I think to myself, what are they talking about.


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

That's exactly what its like. You will have days when you think its their last, then the next morning they're like nothings wrong. Its physically, mentally and emotionally exhausting.


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

I hope Chewie does well on her new medication @Karl43 She is a lovely girl.
It's fine for you to share the funding link by PM if anyone asks


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Deguslave said:


> That's exactly what its like. You will have days when you think its their last, then the next morning they're like nothings wrong. Its physically, mentally and emotionally exhausting.


It really drains you, I know - and you feel on edge every day, and your heart sinks if you look and they haven't cleared their bowl.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> It really drains you, I know - and you feel on edge every day, and your heart sinks if you look and they haven't cleared their bowl.


 you understand exactly. I'm so on edge that I rarely go to bed anymore. I just fall to sleep on the sofa usually in an emotionally drained heap.

If she starts crunching on her dry food in the night it wakes me without fail and I will lie there listening to the crunching until it stops and then I will drift off back to sleep. I check the bowl in the morning and when I get home from work and if it's empty there is a huge sense of relief, but sometimes it's untouched and the frustration and upset overwhelms me.

I've even taken to counting how many times she goes to the toilet and checking the poops not got anything nasty in it.
If she goes off into the bedroom, I'm checking if she's actually hiding under the bed and when I see her on the windowsill checking out the birds, again a huge sigh of relief.

It's just constant monitoring of everything.

Fetching the cyclosporine today


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

lymorelynn said:


> I hope Chewie does well on her new medication @Karl43 She is a lovely girl.
> It's fine for you to share the funding link by PM if anyone asks


:Cat thank you

Edit : just started the cyclosporine today so fingers crossed I will keep you all updated. Thank you to the people that have donated


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## Mrs Funkin (Mar 12, 2018)

Oh Karl  

Almost the first thing I say every morning is, "Has Oscar eaten anything". If he hasn't I'm so disappointed. Husband sends me updates at work of what he's eaten, it's ridiculous. If he hadn't have started on steroids, he'd have no longer been of the earthly plain now, as he just wouldn't eat. 

I share your pain at how stressful it is caring for a cat with long term issues. When Oscar was eventually diagnosed with the first condition (the liver), he had lost nearly 700g of weight in 16 days. However, he was heavier then than he is now but I seem more accepting of it. 

I won't say I don't stress about him every day, I do. His issues all "kicked off" in late Summer of 2019, but in the 2.5 years + since he was diagnosed with it all, it's become more of an "every day" stress, rather than a "totally overwhelming" stress. Does that make sense? It doesn't mean I don't worry, I obviously do, but I just think you learn to live with it. Annette the Vet said we should aim for 80-90% good days with the chronic conditions he has (liver and heart, amongst other bits), we currently have that. Absolutely we do. He will have thyroid bloods done again soon, see if we have that to contend with as well. Quite honestly, I reckon I can deal with most things now for him. 

You will get to a point where Chewie's issue just are filed in the back of your mind, not the only thing you think about. It takes time, it took me ages if you read Oscar's thread. 

Glad she's having a good day xx


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Karl43 said:


> you understand exactly. I'm so on edge that I rarely go to bed anymore. I just fall to sleep on the sofa usually in an emotionally drained heap.
> 
> If she starts crunching on her dry food in the night it wakes me without fail and I will lie there listening to the crunching until it stops and then I will drift off back to sleep. I check the bowl in the morning and when I get home from work and if it's empty there is a huge sense of relief, but sometimes it's untouched and the frustration and upset overwhelms me.
> 
> ...


Hi @Karl43 
Wow, I was surprised at how well Chewie seemed in Sunday's video and I hope she has managed to stay the same. It's always a good sign to see them cleaning themselves and she looked so alert, 'wonderful, thank you for sharing the videos.

Unfortunately I know just what you mean when you talk about how draining it can be. It does get overwhelming at times.

I was just reading up on her new meds and it says they can make them vomit, or can reduce their appetite, but these are short lived, so if you didn't already know this and it happens, don't panic! If it did continue they would reduce or stop the meds, with other meds available as an option, but with a bit of luck it won't come to that. I don't know how much the vets tell you. The best thing you can do for Chewie is to look after yourself and ensure you get enough sleep.

I hope you get more donations, as you could do without financial stress added in to the mix.

Please give Chewie our best wishes and Petforums healing vibes.


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## Cully (May 16, 2018)

Just topping up the healing vibes for Chewie.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TriTri said:


> Hi @Karl43
> Wow, I was surprised at how well Chewie seemed in Sunday's video and I hope she has managed to stay the same. It's always a good sign to see them cleaning themselves and she looked so alert, 'wonderful, thank you for sharing the videos.
> 
> Unfortunately I know just what you mean when you talk about how draining it can be. It does get overwhelming at times.
> ...


Thank-you

At this point im quickly slipping into depression.

My work vehicle is out of commission (self employed ,no earnings)

It was supposed to be sorted today but now it's not.

I have tried every single method in the book to administer the cyclosporine, but she's not having any of it. She can even taste it in the food.

Also despite the good day she had the other day she is back to being completely lethargic

I'm withdrawing from friends, withdrawing from life.....

Edit* one of my friends just text and said you have to be a bit forceful and directly use the syringe into the mouth. i've done that and she dribbled a bit but i suppose it's better than nothing . Also to be honest she's tired, I don't want to keep grabbing her forcing her mouth open and squirting nasty liquid into her mouth.

I really have got to the point in my head where I think quality of life takes precedence over quantity at the moment


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

This was her on Monday. Today she's not really moving


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

It does sound like she’s had enough 

It’s the hardest decision but the greatest act of love if it saves their suffering.

Sorry you’re having to go through this.

Do keep offloading on the forum … we all understand your pain.

Do reach out to friends too though … I’m sure they would want to support you through tough times.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Today , far more typical of what she does


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

@Karl43: Is Chewie still eating quite well?


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> @Karl43: Is Chewie still eating quite well?


Yes and if it wasn't for that fact I don't think she'd still be with us.


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## teddylion (Oct 16, 2019)

So sorry to see her looking sad and listless, poor Chewie.

Don't know if this will help, but when I administer with a syringe I insert it into the side of my cat's mouth and do it in two quick squirts so he has time to swallow the first one before the second. It goes straight to his throat and there is no dribbling or wastage. I know they don't enjoy it, but mine got used to it fairly quickly. I gently push him onto his side before I do it as it's too difficult when he's standing up.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

teddylion said:


> So sorry to see her looking sad and listless, poor Chewie.
> 
> Don't know if this will help, but when I administer with a syringe I insert it into the side of my cat's mouth and do it in two quick squirts so he has time to swallow the first one before the second. It goes straight to his throat and there is no dribbling or wastage. I know they don't enjoy it, but mine got used to it fairly quickly. I gently push him onto his side before I do it as it's too difficult when he's standing up.


Thank you very much . One of the mistakes I am making is trying to administer the syringe at the front of the mouth.

It was very difficult this morning she is a very very feisty cat when she wants to be. She didn't bite me and I don't think she would but there was a lot of struggling flattened ears and lots of growling.

She forgave me in about 15 seconds:Cat


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

In a way, its good that she's fighting you over the meds.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Karl43 said:


> Thank-you
> 
> At this point im quickly slipping into depression.
> 
> ...


Oh no! So sorry to read this. Stay positive.

Your friend is right, though you hate doing it, it really should just take a split second to gently tilt her head back and syringe into the side of her mouth. It may seem like you are being cruel, but it's being cruel to be kind and it could make all the difference. Try not to overthink it… gently tilt head back with left hand if you are right handed and with the syringe prepared in your right hand, a swift entry! Hold her head back or mouth closed until gone. Try to be confident. If a cat is very sick then they don't _usually_ fight you. Then try to forget about it until the next lot is due. Out of a 24 hour day, it's a very short time of Chewie possibly feeling mishandled, and in the grand scheme of things it's the best thing imo. I'd forget trying to put it in food or hide it in something, just syringe it it. If you chose to, let us know how you get on. It's a shame we don't live nearby and could just come and do it for you, to relieve you from the stress. You don't need to feel guilty about doing it as it's in her very best interest.

She clearly isn't well, but the second from last video and third from last video, along with eating, she seems a lot better than I was expecting and much more alert than sick cats I've had in their last days or weeks or months.

It sounds like you are burnt out, which could cloud your judgement. It happens to many of us when our cats are I'll and not getting better. Don't be afraid to ask people for help if you need it. Hopefully you'll get more donations on your funding page, to help with the days your car is off the road. Have you got your car sorted yet? If not, and it's off the road for a few days, just accept it and use your time wisely to work on how you can feel better and cope. It gives you time to take short breaks from home, for fresh air and walks to clear your head. If her moments of appearing very ill get longer and longer and you feel she has had enough, and the vet agrees, then maybe it's time…


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

My post took so long to type, you’ve had more replies and said she’s feisty with the syringing. If you can do it without her seeing you approach, like coming up from behind and to the side of her and gently stroking her head as to let her know you’re there (without her seeing you) and not frighten her, then a quick syringe…hopefully.


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## Bettybobbins (Nov 29, 2021)

Realistically the drug hasn’t had a chance to work
Yet so don’t give up the hope right now. My son is epileptic (amongst other stuff) and I’ve found setting myself a plan at the start works well so for example trialling a new drug I set myself 6 weeks or 3 months depending on the drug before I make judgement as to it’s success. Obviously major issues need addressing right away.

it’s a vicious cycle if your MH is low then having a complex needs cat is draining and also the complex needs makes the MH worse too. Lots of us understand that. You and chewie will get through this, even if it doesn’t go how we all want, she will still guide you.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TriTri said:


> Oh no! So sorry to read this. Stay positive.
> 
> Your friend is right, though you hate doing it, it really should just take a split second to gently tilt her head back and syringe into the side of her mouth. It may seem like you are being cruel, but it's being cruel to be kind and it could make all the difference. Try not to overthink it… gently tilt head back with left hand if you are right handed and with the syringe prepared in your right hand, a swift entry! Hold her head back or mouth closed until gone. Try to be confident. If a cat is very sick then they don't _usually_ fight you. Then try to forget about it until the next lot is due. Out of a 24 hour day, it's a very short time of Chewie possibly feeling mishandled, and in the grand scheme of things it's the best thing imo. I'd forget trying to put it in food or hide it in something, just syringe it it. If you chose to, let us know how you get on. It's a shame we don't live nearby and could just come and do it for you, to relieve you from the stress. You don't need to feel guilty about doing it as it's in her very best interest.
> 
> ...


The way she acts doesn't always coincide with the reality of what's happening. I remember my very first point of contact was over a video call with a vet on an app called joii....

They said she looked absolutely great and would be very surprised if anything serious was going on but take her to a Vet because eating litter is symptomatic of anaemia

That very same day when she was seen by an actual vet practice ,they said she might need a blood transfusion and/or might need putting to sleep because she is that ill.

All the way through her treatment she was still very feisty and needed heavy sedation just to be scanned and she was still kicking about lol

I've got to do syringing twice a day. The next one will be around 10 or 11 tonight, so I'll go in the side of the mouth and see if that works better. Apparently the cyclosporine tastes absolutely foul to them.

I think you are right ,iv completely burnt out. At least being out at work and socialising kept me busy ,however I'm still not back on the road....

Might be looking at early next week now.

i found this old video before she was ill. hard to believe now


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

@Karl43. Those meds cost you so much you can't risk wasting it by putting it in food which she then rejects (she leaves the food, she leaves the meds). Also, it might put her off her food, the last thing you want. My Maggie has HT and CKD so each day she has two tablets and I also give her two supplements twice a day, a phosphate binder and a kidney support. The tablets are bitter so I use a pill plunger and the four lots of supplement I use a syringe. So each morning three doses and each pm. I find the main problem is her being as sly as a fox and doing a disappearing act when she knows they are due! Once she's had them she knows that she's ''safe'' for another 12 hours. I know they don't like it, but if it is going to help her, you just have to get it over with as quickly as possible. I have to restrain her by holding her head still and doing all three in quick succession. I know for a fact that two out of three, in food, would be a waste of time and money. As @Deguslave pointed out, as frustrating as it is, it is probably a good sign that she is giving you a hard time - my HCM boy got to the point he was like a rag doll (although, bless him, he had always been very obliging about taking all his meds, poor guy. I used to buy him Jersey milk (his fave)as a reward).


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Karl43 said:


> The way she acts doesn't always coincide with the reality of what's happening. I remember my very first point of contact was over a video call with a vet on an app called joii....
> 
> They said she looked absolutely great and would be very surprised if anything serious was going on but take her to a Vet because eating litter is symptomatic of anaemia
> 
> ...


Oh wow, bless her. Is that a bouncy ball she was playing with? So cute. And yes, there are some that still manage to be feisty even at the very end. A favourite treat as suggested, straight after the meds can make them soon forget about the ordeal and help take the nasty taste away. Poor Chewey. Topping up the healing vibes xx


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TriTri said:


> Oh wow, bless her. Is that a bouncy ball she was playing with? So cute. And yes, there are some that still manage to be feisty even at the very end. A favourite treat as suggested, straight after the meds can make them soon forget about the ordeal and help take the nasty taste away. Poor Chewey. Topping up the healing vibes xx


Yes that was a long time ago before she got sick ,she used to fly about all over the place.

I rewarded her with treats this morning after the medication. I think treats are the way to chewies heart :Cat


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## teddylion (Oct 16, 2019)

I had a little cry watching Chewie so spritely in the other video, silly as it sounds. We've all been there and understand how hard it is to watch an animal previously so full of life become a shadow of who they were.

Fingers crossed the medication starts to kick into action soon - there is still hope!


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

teddylion said:


> I had a little cry watching Chewie so spritely in the other video, silly as it sounds. We've all been there and understand how hard it is to watch an animal previously so full of life become a shadow of who they were.
> 
> Fingers crossed the medication starts to kick into action soon - there is still hope!


It doesn't sound silly to me, just means you've got a heart 

That's probably one of the most difficult things, because she was such a playful active cat. I was always refreshing her toys because she needed a lot of stimulation and just before she got ill I was about to get her a second very large cat tree for the bedroom, but I don't think there's any need at the moment now. She doesn't get bored because her needs are pretty simple now.

I have a memory card with about 1500 photos and videos right from when she was a kitten so they are a nice keepsake.

I gave her the medication tonight, didn't go quite deep enough with the syringe as she started foaming at the mouth, so I think she caught a taste. I'll get better at it. Practice makes perfect.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> It doesn't sound silly to me, just means you've got a heart
> 
> That's probably one of the most difficult things, because she was such a playful active cat. I was always refreshing her toys because she needed a lot of stimulation and just before she got ill I was about to get her a second very large cat tree for the bedroom, but I don't think there's any need at the moment now. She doesn't get bored because her needs are pretty simple now.
> 
> ...


 I put the syringe in at an angle so it's facing the back part of her mouth. It makes it less likely to be spat out and Maggie doesn't seem to taste it as much as if it's on her tongue; she hardly reacts now and seems to have worked out that she will be fed afterwards (the supplements supposedly to be given mixed with food (er, no) or accompanying food) The things we do for them! 
But it's a relief for you that she is enjoying her food - so depressing when the plate stays full. One of mine used to run to the plate, obviously hungry, and then just turn his face away as if the thought of it made him feel nauseous.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> I put the syringe in at an angle so it's facing the back part of her mouth. It makes it less likely to be spat out and Maggie doesn't seem to taste it as much as if it's on her tongue; she hardly reacts now and seems to have worked out that she will be fed afterwards (the supplements supposedly to be given mixed with food (er, no) or accompanying food) The things we do for them!
> But it's a relief for you that she is enjoying her food - so depressing when the plate stays full. One of mine used to run to the plate, obviously hungry, and then just turn his face away as if the thought of it made him feel nauseous.


Im trying ,she really fights me . She's always OK afterward ,but makes such a song and dance while i'm doing it.

I always feed her afterwards ,bombard her with treats as a reward. I don't know what the reward is for ,because she is not exactly well behaved:Banghead I'm just trying to at least make some sort of positive association.

I don't want to jinx it but she seems very bright again the last 24 hours or so.

Regarding the food ,she seems to be ever so slightly off it today, but I'm trying to look on the bright side and conclude the cyclosporine is getting in her system, because it it reduces appetite and causes nausea


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## Cully (May 16, 2018)

Come on Chewie, just perk up a bit more every day for us


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Cully said:


> Come on Chewie, just perk up a bit more every day for us
> View attachment 490551


Just now 

She's very chill lately


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

@Karl43 I know it's hard but Chewie will be less active on the high steroid dose. She's relatively comfortable and eating (which is a huge indicator).
And she is in the same room as you, not hiding away.
It may not seem like it but these are really good signs.
You are doing great, give yourself space and give Chewie time. Take each day as it comes and vent on here!
Xxx


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

GingerNinja said:


> @Karl43 I know it's hard but Chewie will be less active on the high steroid dose. She's relatively comfortable and eating (which is a huge indicator).
> And she is in the same room as you, not hiding away.
> It may not seem like it but these are really good signs.
> You are doing great, give yourself space and give Chewie time. Take each day as it comes and vent on here!
> Xxx


Thank you. I keep thinking I'm venting a little bit too much on here but it's one of the few places where people understand the grief and turmoil.

There are so many positives like you say. She still jumps on my head in the morning trilling and making biscuits in an attempt to get me up 

She is relatively chilled out, uses the litter tray normally, never vomited ,she actually appears rather normal apart from the lethargy and as you say the steroids do this anyway.

We seem to get on fine and then she has the blood test and the vet just in my opinion goes completely over the top. I know I'm not medically trained in animals, but he really does seem to catastrophize everything based on one blood test ,which then absolutely devastates me. I wish he was a little more level-headed when choosing his words.


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

Karl43 said:


> Thank you. I keep thinking I'm venting a little bit too much on here but it's one of the few places where people understand the grief and turmoil.
> 
> There are so many positives like you say. She still jumps on my head in the morning trilling and making biscuits in an attempt to get me up
> 
> ...


Well I'm not medically trained either but she is a lot better than Luna was (behaviour wise) and my little girl is still here, fully recovered albeit a bit weird .

Obviously you have to be guided by the medical results but I don't think the time has come for difficult decisions just yet x


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

GingerNinja said:


> Well I'm not medically trained either but she is a lot better than Luna was (behaviour wise) and my little girl is still here, fully recovered albeit a bit weird .
> 
> Obviously you have to be guided by the medical results but I don't think the time has come for difficult decisions just yet x


Yes I was thinking of difficult decisions recently, but now not really so much.

I mean his exact words were:-

" this is starting to get complicated again, try the new medication and then she needs a blood test in 2 weeks (two? On my initial hospital letter it always stated 4-6 weeks to see if a response from medications)

If the blood test is not very good after two weeks, she will need to be hospitalised. I'm just so terribly sorry and if she's so lethargic this just isn't looking good"

Well as you could imagine, the tears started as I was walking down the street coming back from the veterinary practice. Utter devastation.

Very very pessimistic vet :Bag

I do understand if the neutrophils are very very low ,which they are , I don't know the actual number ,but apparently they are shockingly low ,and she did pick up some sort of infection or something, then that would not be a very good thing, but she's an indoor cat and I would like to believe it would be a little more difficult for her to actually get any sort of infections in the first place.

I'm so glad your Luna does so well ,such a wonderful success story really. Really does make me smile to know she's fought for all these years :Catcats are a little bit weird anyway ,so a little bit more weirdness won't go amiss


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## teddylion (Oct 16, 2019)

Do you think it might be an idea to try a different vet? One of the reasons I love my vet is he's so reassuringly calm about everything; I think bedside manner is important in situations like this. 

I would definitely query your vet about the discrepancy between the two week wait and the 4 -6 week wait stated by the hospital.


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

I have to agree with @teddylion, its one of the reasons I travel almost 20miles to get to my vet. You have to have complete trust in them.

And if you need to vent, then we'll listen.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

teddylion said:


> Do you think it might be an idea to try a different vet? One of the reasons I love my vet is he's so reassuringly calm about everything; I think bedside manner is important in situations like this.
> 
> I would definitely query your vet about the discrepancy between the two week wait and the 4 -6 week wait stated by the hospital.


This particular vet I really liked him at first, but I'm just getting a bit of a bad feeling. He always seems to be the bearer of bad news and goes for the most harsh and expensive options.

I'm going to switch practices altogether I think



Deguslave said:


> I have to agree with @teddylion, its one of the reasons I travel almost 20miles to get to my vet. You have to have complete trust in them.
> 
> And if you need to vent, then we'll listen.


Thank you and yes I agree .I can't honestly say at this point I have complete trust. I think I'm definitely going to be switching veterinary practices. Something just feels off


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> and then she needs a blood test in 2 weeks (two? On my initial hospital letter it always stated 4-6


I know with the HT meds, my vet has always tested after three weeks with every cat I've had - not as early as two . . . but maybe different vets have a different take on things. How long a supply of the cyclosporine were you given? 
Do you manage to get the steroids into her OK?


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> I know with the HT meds, my vet has always tested after three weeks with every cat I've had - not as early as two . . . but maybe different vets have a different take on things. How long a supply of the cyclosporine were you given?
> Do you manage to get the steroids into her OK?


I think I've been told it can take a couple of weeks to even kick in properly so I'm not really comfortable with a blood test after 2 weeks, unless of course I noticed some sort of significant change in her. The specialist at the hospital always maintained 4-6 weeks so I might just heed that advice.

This is the bottle I've got, I figure it should last over a month










I put the prednisone in Royal Canin pill assist treats and they work brilliantly.















I'm getting better at the syringing


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## teddylion (Oct 16, 2019)

It's great that you're both starting to manage the syringe better.

I can't understand why they would do a blood test before the medicine has had the recommended time to kick in. If it were me I would definitely go by the hospital's recommendation, and in the meantime, find a better vet to give it time for all Chewie's medical history to be transferred over (unless you ask for a different vet at the same practise). I found mine by researching online reviews.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

teddylion said:


> It's great that you're both starting to manage the syringe better.
> 
> I can't understand why they would do a blood test before the medicine has had the recommended time to kick in. If it were me I would definitely go by the hospital's recommendation, and in the meantime, find a better vet to give it time for all Chewie's medical history to be transferred over (unless you ask for a different vet at the same practise). I found mine by researching online reviews.


I don't like to be cynical and I try to keep an open mind and see everything, including people,positively ,but I'm starting to think he's preying on the strong love i have for Chewie and my willingness to flash my credit card. I really hope this is not true.

I contacted a completely different practice on the recommendation of a friend and based on mostly positive reviews. Just waiting for them to get back to me.

I've noticed the practice I use ,they've even disabled reviews on Facebook because they were getting so many bad ones.

Chewie seems really really bright at the moment, but not everything can be perfect, because strangely her brightness has coincided with her appetite going down the chute.

I'm just trying to be positive and think well maybe she's bright because the medication is starting to kick in a little bit and maybe she's not eating because the medication decreases appetite. When I say not eating, she still goes crazy for treats, but won't eat her main kibble. She's still licking the gravy off the whiskas.

In fact she was so crazy for treats she jumped on my head at 3am this morning, I think it was, repeatedly and meowing until it drove me crazy. All she wanted was a treat lol


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Its possible that she's not eating much because the weather is warm.

I've encountered some vets over the years who see pound signs before they see the pet. They are out there. I had one quote me £270 for an operation on one of my degus and they tried to get me to agree to operating the next day. I had the op done through my now usual vet a few weeks later, and the bill came to £89, very big difference.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Deguslave said:


> Its possible that she's not eating much because the weather is warm.
> 
> I've encountered some vets over the years who see pound signs before they see the pet. They are out there. I had one quote me £270 for an operation on one of my degus and they tried to get me to agree to operating the next day. I had the op done through my now usual vet a few weeks later, and the bill came to £89, very big difference.


Ah yes you make a very good point regarding the weather it is very warm lately. She was the same last summer.

That is a very big difference that's awful 

I'm glad you found a different vet

Edit:- I moved the kibble into the shade .she's eating it .


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Poor girl is wearing fur in this heat, she's got to be feeling a little warm.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

I really think today she's had the best day she's had in a long long time. So here's chewie looking brighter and can I take this opportunity to thank everybody that has financially helped. Those donations have funded potentially lifesaving medication at a time when I'm in a bit of a rut so I can't thank you enough

Please forgive my baby talk :Bag


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## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Hi @Karl43 please can you PM me your fundraiser link?


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## Bettybobbins (Nov 29, 2021)

Doesn’t she look happy!! If your vet pushes the two week bloods you could Jsut play the covid card and declare yourself self isolating as you feel it morally the right thing to do and then ring up once “clear” to book which should get yoj to 5-6 weeks ish if you time it well. 

I fed 3 cats and 1 kitten who were all supposedly starving for breakfast and they all walked away, I think they where just too hot and couldn’t be bothered. They did eat later on, the warmer weather messes them
Up a bit


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> I've noticed the practice I use ,they've even disabled reviews on Facebook because they were getting so many bad ones.


That would not be encouraging. I saw a review, just by chance, about one of the vets I use. A dog owner apparently went in to get wormers or flea treatment for her dog whom the vet had seen recently, so no need for the dog to be seen by the vet, although he was with her as she was going home after his walk and she was known to the receptionist. She realised that she did not have her card with her, but had cash for the full amount *less 1p*. The girl told her they ''were not a charity'' and that was that; so she went home and bought them online - and changed vets.
Maybe just try something different food-wise too - if she 's anything like my lot they change their minds with monotonous regularity. They do seem to get bored with the same menu each day (at least if you have five, there's normally one who will scoff the lot). Try a couple of little cans of Gourmet mousse maybe. Lethargy and lack of appetite unfortunately are common side effects of this stuff apparently, so I guess it's a case of tempting her with something she finds irresistible.

Look at all her toys!! :Cat:Cat


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> That would not be encouraging. I saw a review, just by chance, about one of the vets I use. A dog owner apparently went in to get wormers or flea treatment for her dog whom the vet had seen recently, so no need for the dog to be seen by the vet, although he was with her as she was going home after his walk and she was known to the receptionist. She realised that she did not have her card with her, but had cash for the full amount *less 1p*. The girl told her they ''were not a charity'' and that was that; so she went home and bought them online - and changed vets.
> Maybe just try something different food-wise too - if she 's anything like my lot they change their minds with monotonous regularity. They do seem to get bored with the same menu each day (at least if you have five, there's normally one who will scoff the lot). Try a couple of little cans of Gourmet mousse maybe. Lethargy and lack of appetite unfortunately are common side effects of this stuff apparently, so I guess it's a case of tempting her with something she finds irresistible.
> 
> Look at all her toys!! :Cat:Cat


That's absolutely ridiculous all for the sake of a penny. I know first and foremost they are running a business but love of animals and care should be at the forefront of their minds to be honest not pound signs.

One of the reviews on facebook and they left it on when they did allow review's so I imagine it could have been true ,though I can't imagine anything more horrifying.

A young girl apparently wanted her cat to be spayed so they carried out the spay regardless of the cat being actually pregnant. They then apparently turned around and said I thought you wanted the kittens aborting.

I don't know maybe it can be taken with a pinch of salt but it's quite a bizarre story.

I may switch the food. She used to eat iams for about a year and a half and decided she she couldn't care less for it all of a sudden lol

She used to have many many more toys. It used to look like absolute carnage but I have gathered a lot of them up and put them out of the way because she doesn't really want them.

Visitors usually comment how many toys she has. She's an indoor cat so she needs stimulation especially when she was a kitten. I couldn't eat my dinner or even watch a movie in peace when she was a baby she just used to jump all over me and ambush me:Cat


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## teddylion (Oct 16, 2019)

Shortchanged by 1p?!

My vet in Edinburgh who owns the practice is lovely, and I think that ethos can affect the rest of the staff. A colleague sadly had her dog euthanised and cremated and said 'Oh that reminds me, I haven't paid them yet!' He has advised me on how to get cheaper prescriptions online, and several times I've taken injured pigeons in and the receptionist actually thanked me for doing it. 

But in any practice, some vets can be better than others, so it's good to see if there are any specific names mentioned in reviews and then request that vet, that's what I did.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

teddylion said:


> Shortchanged by 1p?!
> 
> My vet in Edinburgh who owns the practice is lovely, and I think that ethos can affect the rest of the staff. A colleague sadly had her dog euthanised and cremated and said 'Oh that reminds me, I haven't paid them yet!' He has advised me on how to get cheaper prescriptions online, and several times I've taken injured pigeons in and the receptionist actually thanked me for doing it.
> 
> But in any practice, some vets can be better than others, so it's good to see if there are any specific names mentioned in reviews and then request that vet, that's what I did.


In this case, the vet himself responded to the review by saying that the receptionist in question was wonderful and a great asset to the practice (having just lost them a patient!).


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

My vet owns the practice and it does make a difference. I've often found that franchise vets have a financial target they have to meet in order to keep the practice name. I know all vets have to make a profit, but the inflated prices can be ridiculous.

In relation to the blood test after 2 weeks instead of the recommended 4-6, ask yourself one question; whose going to be paying for this unnecessary blood test, because its not going to be the vet.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Deguslave said:


> 2 weeks instead of the recommended 4-6,


There's quite a discrepancy - I could understand if one said 2/3 weeks and one said 3/4 and I'd go for three (being a simple soul).



Deguslave said:


> whose going to be paying for this unnecessary blood test


Take a guess!!:Cat


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

On the subject of blood tests, the last one we had done ,afterwards the receptionist was waiting for the fee to come through to her


I said it's usually 96 pounds


She said it's cheaper for you today it's only £52

I asked why this was and if they did a full haematology.

She said oh it's because the nurse just took her in the back and did the blood test usually there is vet consultation charge

What!! I never asked for a consultation just do the blood test!

There's no way she is having a blood test after 2-weeks, good people have donated me money it's not going to waste


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Its not just the money @Karl43, its putting Chewie through an unnecessary procedure. Its not fair to keep sticking needles in her for no reason.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Deguslave said:


> Its not just the money @Karl43, its putting Chewie through an unnecessary procedure. Its not fair to keep sticking needles in her for no reason.


That is one of the contributing factors as to why she's not going in hospital again. I saw what it did to her last time. She was traumatised for weeks and weeks. Every time I left the house for work she would run under the bed.

When I carry her to the local vets it's just a short walk ,she just sits in the carrier looking around and on the way back as soon as we get on the street, she seems to realise she's nearly home as she starts biting at the bars and being vocal.

I'm not putting her through unnecessary invasive "treatments".


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> What!! I never asked for a consultation just do the blood test!


Crikey - as if you haven't spent enough, £6000 and rising! Now, even mine (the one whose receptionist refused the treatments for the sake of a penny) does not charge a consult if it's just for blood. I was quite puzzled when the bill was so low and asked the girl at the desk how come and the vet was in the waiting room and he said ''We don't charge a consult for a blood test'' as if he thought I should know that. (I didn't.) And in Maggie's case it was the vet who had done the blood on both occasions. £96 is just about double the £52, ie another blood test. You really have to be proactive when dealing with people these days. I was actually quite happy during lockdown: I used to write down everything I wanted/didn't want and hand it in with the cat!


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

That’s a lovely video clip of your adorable Chewie . I’ve just signed in especially to see how she is . 

‘Just a thought, don’t forget to not wait until you’ve nearly run out of Chewie’s new meds before going in or phoning for more, in-case they need to order these specific meds in for you, which could take several days or a week or so. Have you worked out from the amount shown on the bottle and what you are using, how long they should last? I think you mentioned three or four weeks. (I’ve been caught out a few times with only giving a few days notice for repeat meds). 

Topping up with more get well vibes for your princess.


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## Cully (May 16, 2018)

Karl43 said:


> This particular vet I really liked him at first, but I'm just getting a bit of a bad feeling. He always seems to be the bearer of bad news and goes for the most harsh and expensive options.
> 
> I'm going to switch practices altogether I think
> 
> Thank you and yes I agree .I can't honestly say at this point I have complete trust. I think I'm definitely going to be switching veterinary practices. Something just feels off


I think you should look for a more sensitive vet. I know some medics think it's important to present a worse case scenario so that anything better is positive. But it's not always helpful, especially when you're already so stressed.
I've had some brilliant doctors but their bedside manner was awful.
She looks so happy, so her meds seem to be working. Maybe you both need a vet who isn't so gloomy.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

@Karl43
How long does it take for cyclosporine to work in cats?

May take *4-6 weeks* to see if the drug is working

I'm not an expert, but this is from Google ^^^^ Also says that vomiting is one of the side effects (or can be).
How is she today?


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TriTri said:


> That's a lovely video clip of your adorable Chewie . I've just signed in especially to see how she is .
> 
> 'Just a thought, don't forget to not wait until you've nearly run out of Chewie's new meds before going in or phoning for more, in-case they need to order these specific meds in for you, which could take several days or a week or so. Have you worked out from the amount shown on the bottle and what you are using, how long they should last? I think you mentioned three or four weeks. (I've been caught out a few times with only giving a few days notice for repeat meds).
> 
> Topping up with more get well vibes for your princess.


Oh that's really thoughtful of you 

She had a bit of a quiet day yesterday after a good run of positive days, but maybe she's wore herself out. I'm noticing a pattern if she gets good days she crashes afterwards for a while.

Thank you for that, I didn't think, the prednisone seems to be readily available, but the cyclosporine I remember the receptionist sort of pulled a face and said " oh Iv never heard of this one before" , so yes it may need to be specially ordered in 

I'm guessing one bottle will provide about 1 months supply



Cully said:


> I think you should look for a more sensitive vet. I know some medics think it's important to present a worse case scenario so that anything better is positive. But it's not always helpful, especially when you're already so stressed.
> I've had some brilliant doctors but their bedside manner was awful.
> She looks so happy, so her meds seem to be working. Maybe you both need a vet who isn't so gloomy.


I completely agree with you you. Me and chewie get on reasonably fine at home, she's eating ,she wakes me up purring, she's still very much interested in the world, albeit sometimes very lethargic, like yesterday, and then I talk to that vet and he throws the spanner in the works with his gloomy outlooks

I remember when I first went to the vet and they did the blood test and she was anaemic. Not the worst case of anaemia in the world I think it was about 14%,still bad ,but not as bad as it could have been and the vet rang me up (and this is a different one at the same practice), her very first words out of her mouth were "if you didn't have insurance it would have been better to put her to sleep"

I remember thinking, well I do have insurance so why even bring it up? 



Calvine said:


> @Karl43
> How long does it take for cyclosporine to work in cats?
> 
> May take *4-6 weeks* to see if the drug is working
> ...


It seems what you found on Google coincides with what the specialist at the hospital said.

In fact I've been looking at the timeline from day one and I think the whole thing has been rushed. I'll copy and paste in a minute because I write everything down and keep records

There's no vomiting, in fact she has never vomited once since the day I've had her, which I guess is quite strange for a cat. She must have a strong stomach:Cat

She was very lethargic yesterday and today so far she's a bit withdrawn again


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> I'm guessing one bottle will provide about 1 months supply


Depending on how long the bottle lasts: if you need more, it may be worth looking online for a cheaper source. Depending on how much the vet charges for a prescription, there are places you can get the same stuff online
Sporimune Oral Solution for Cats and Dogs (animeddirect.co.uk)
Fifty ml here is about what you paid for 25ml. My vet charges £12 for a prescription (is actually cheaper than most, I think) - and if you spend £29+, it's free postage. I get Maggie's meds from VetUk and save £500 a year (pays for some of her minced turkey and cans of sardines). It is well worth it in my case, as Maggie will be on her meds long-term. For short course ABs or such, it's hardly worth it. But in Maggie's case, vet quoted me £1.12 per tablet (two tablets a day for the rest of her life) and VetUk did them for 40p each. Think they have gone up to about 45, but then the vet is probably charging upwards of £1.12 per tablet now.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> Depending on how long the bottle lasts: if you need more, it may be worth looking online for a cheaper source. Depending on how much the vet charges for a prescription, there are places you can get the same stuff online
> Sporimune Oral Solution for Cats and Dogs (animeddirect.co.uk)
> Fifty ml here is about what you paid for 25ml. My vet charges £12 for a prescription (is actually cheaper than most, I think) - and if you spend £29+, it's free postage. I get Maggie's meds from VetUk and save £500 a year (pays for some of her minced turkey and cans of sardines). It is well worth it in my case, as Maggie will be on her meds long-term. For short course ABs or such, it's hardly worth it. But in Maggie's case, vet quoted me £1.12 per tablet (two tablets a day for the rest of her life) and VetUk did them for 40p each. Think they have gone up to about 45, but then the vet is probably charging upwards of £1.12 per tablet now.


I'll immediately look into that Thank-you 

These are the notes I keep . Just seems rushed

24th Feb :- starting meds: prednisone 10mg

24th March :- Haematology -Red Cells fine neutrophils slightly low- no real concerns (vet Rachel)

25th March :- reduced dose prednisone to 7.5mg until......

12th April :- Haematology -red cells fine, neutrophils far to low (vet juan)

13th April :-back to 10mg prednisone

2nd of May :- not peeing properly pooping fine ,consistency fine, extreme lethargy ,appetite fine.

5th may :- Haematology- unresponsive to medication starts cyclosporine on top of prednisone (vet juan)

Peeing" issue" resolved


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## NordicKay (8 mo ago)

Karl43 said:


> Chewies prednisone has been put up to 10 mg and just had her haematology today and she's not responding at all. Her white cells are at an all-time low.
> 
> We are trying an additional drug which I pick up tomorrow and they advised me of the cost of this drug is £109.
> 
> ...


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## NordicKay (8 mo ago)

So so sorry.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Well this just might be the final straw I asked for a prescription and they said do you want two prescriptions one for the sporimune and one for the cyclosporine.

I let them down gently and explained they are the same drug


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

NordicKay said:


> So so sorry.


Thank you. it's insanely difficult but what can you do. She's crashed again today:Bag

We've now changed vets.

It's another Vets4Pets practice but one in the next town which has got a fantastic reputation unlike the one in my town


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> I let them down gently and explained they are the same drug


Nothing surprises. I told one vet that I did not think my insurance would cough up for any treatment related to Gatsby's kidneys as ''all parts of the urinary tract'' had been excluded since he had a PU two years before (which they had in fact paid £4000 for). The vet swore blind that kidneys were in no way part of the urinary tract and that I should ring them - looked at me as if I was thick. It worried me that I, who did not even do 'O' level biology, knew something so basic that she didn't after six (??) years training. 
Sorry she's down again; it's such a worry for you. Has she eaten at least?


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> Nothing surprises. I told one vet that I did not think my insurance would cough up for any treatment related to Gatsby's kidneys as ''all parts of the urinary tract'' had been excluded since he had a PU two years before (which they had in fact paid £4000 for). The vet swore blind that kidneys were in no way part of the urinary tract and that I should ring them - looked at me as if I was thick. It worried me that I, who did not even do 'O' level biology, knew something so basic that she didn't after six (??) years training.
> Sorry she's down again; it's such a worry for you. Has she eaten at least?


Kidney not part of the urinary tract? Yes that's the first iv heard lol

Doesn't really instill confidence does it

She is eating enough for me to not be concerned in that respect.

She's just withdrawn and lethargic again. It seems to be a never-ending pattern


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## Cully (May 16, 2018)

I can totally believe this ignorance as I experienced a similar thing about myself.
The physio I was sent to for a neck problem said I didn't need an x-ray as you _don't have any bones in your neck,,!!!_ Three years later an x-ray showed degenerative arthritis in my neck made worse by _delayed diagnosis!!_
:Banghead:Banghead
Animals and humans, it does happen.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Cully said:


> I can totally believe this ignorance as I experienced a similar thing about myself.
> The physio I was sent to for a neck problem said I didn't need an x-ray as you _don't have any bones in your neck,,!!!_ Three years later an x-ray showed degenerative arthritis in my neck made worse by _delayed diagnosis!!_
> :Banghead:Banghead
> Animals and humans, it does happen.


Wouldn't we all be dead if there were no bones in the neck? that's where the brainstem connects to the spine isn't it?


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> Doesn't really instill confidence does it


Then you hand over the card for a bill of £100+ and later ask yourself why you paid for advice/information which was clearly suspect to say the least! She was a middle-aged vet of, I would say, 20 years' experience, not a young, newly qualified girl. And no, of course the insurance co. would not entertain the idea - she kept bullying me to ring them. Is Chewie any better today?


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Cully said:


> I can totally believe this ignorance as I experienced a similar thing about myself.
> The physio I was sent to for a neck problem said I didn't need an x-ray as you _don't have any bones in your neck,,!!!_ Three years later an x-ray showed degenerative arthritis in my neck made worse by _delayed diagnosis!!_
> :Banghead:Banghead
> Animals and humans, it does happen.


I had just such an enlightening experience with a nurse a few years ago, she asked me if the 22in scar around my left side was where I'd had my appendix removed. I told her that if it was, they took the scenic route, lol.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> Is Chewie any better today?


I'm sorry , really gone downhill again


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## Cully (May 16, 2018)

Hopefully it's just a bad day and she'll perk up by tomorrow.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Cully said:


> Hopefully it's just a bad day and she'll perk up by tomorrow.


She has wised up to the medications schedule and as soon as I got out of bed she shot under the bed.

I don't believe in dragging them out forcefully so I had to gently coax her out, meanwhile standing up my friends who I had arranged to meet.

Giving the meds today she struggled quite violently ,she's getting really sick of it.

Hardly eaten anything and no energy and vacant .

This is usually the way of it so hopefully like you say just a bad day ...or two


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

@Karl43 I remember reading quite a few years back that many vets were of the opinion that pets were being over-vaccinated which was causing bad reactions in some. One of the reactions I remember was auto-immune conditions. Have any of your vets suggested what could have caused her problem? I hope she's soon feeling better.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> @Karl43 I remember reading quite a few years back that many vets were of the opinion that pets were being over-vaccinated which was causing bad reactions in some. One of the reactions I remember was auto-immune conditions. Have any of your vets suggested what could have caused her problem? I hope she's soon feeling better.


No-one mentioned it ,but iv researched and thought it. I am anti vax to be honest regarding indoor cats but I was persuaded. Incidentally she was seemingly fine until her vaccinations


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> No-one mentioned it


No, I don't imagine they would. I have stopped having mine done, but they still bombard me with ''reminders''. There's nothing to stop an owner taking them in for an annual health check to get their teeth looked at, for example. But in your case, I would not have any jabs done on Chewie again.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> No, I don't imagine they would. I have stopped having mine done, but they still bombard me with ''reminders''. There's nothing to stop an owner taking them in for an annual health check to get their teeth looked at, for example. But in your case, I would not have any jabs done on Chewie again.


I guess by even bringing it up , it's , in a way, accepting potential liability and they aren't about to do that.

When I booked her for a health check ,they hard selled the vaccinations over the phone.

Its something I'll never give Chewie again ( anything that provokes an immune response has got to be bad for her ) and likely no other cats I have in the future.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

How is Chewie @Karl43? Are you managing to get the med's into her, or is she making you feel too guilty for trying? I believe I read that the med's can make them feel lethargic, so maybe it's to be expected and so concentrate on the end goal here? I can imagine it's quite torturous having to see her on her bad days, but I'm hoping for the med's to turn her little life around, when the good days outnumber the bad. I thought I read (on various websites) that they would normally prescribe antibiotics with this drug and wonder why they haven't(?). Come on Chewie, get well soon and pleeeeease accept the medication xxx

How are you feeling Karl? Are you feeling hopeful? Did you get your car sorted and have you got back to work now? Have you caught up with your friends that you had to cancel?


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TriTri said:


> How is Chewie @Karl43? Are you managing to get the med's into her, or is she making you feel too guilty for trying? I believe I read that the med's can make them feel lethargic, so maybe it's to be expected and so concentrate on the end goal here? I can imagine it's quite torturous having to see her on her bad days, but I'm hoping for the med's to turn her little life around, when the good days outnumber the bad. I thought I read (on various websites) that they would normally prescribe antibiotics with this drug and wonder why they haven't(?). Come on Chewie, get well soon and pleeeeease accept the medication xxx
> 
> How are you feeling Karl? Are you feeling hopeful? Did you get your car sorted and have you got back to work now? Have you caught up with your friends that you had to cancel?


Hi I'm definitely still doing the medication. I absolutely cannot stand doing it because it upsets her so much and yes it makes me feel guilty ,but I'm getting better at it and sticking to it because I keep telling myself this could actually save her life so there's no question. She's going to have to put up with it unfortunately.

I have changed veterinary surgeon now so she has a blood test on the 1st of June.

I'm not sure why she hasn't ever been offered antibiotics. She was on them intravenously while she was hospitalised, but never since

Allow me to clarify, when I said vehicle it's just a very expensive electric bike not a car lol

I lost my job during lockdown ,my background is actually retail management, so started just doing deliveries on an ebike to keep food on the table, but the money is so obscenely good, I've just carried on doing it ,regardless of the fact it's completely unglamorous!

I should have it back tomorrow. I'm not hopeful ,I'm a mess and if the bloods come back bad again I don't know what options are left. Iv been out with one of my friends today .

This is my friends cat George sat with me


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Karl43 said:


> Hi I'm definitely still doing the medication. I absolutely cannot stand doing it because it upsets her so much and yes it makes me feel guilty ,but I'm getting better at it and sticking to it because I keep telling myself this could actually save her life so there's no question. She's going to have to put up with it unfortunately.
> 
> I have changed veterinary surgeon now so she has a blood test on the 1st of June.
> 
> ...


Hi and thank you for replying. That's a good date to go to the vet, the day before the long bank holiday. My last sick cat usually got booked in the vets for either just before or straight after a bank holiday (or both), bring a frequent flyer :Hilarious. My original vet use to open Sunday mornings (as well as all day Mon-Sat), which was handy as one of my 5 cats was all white and allergic to so many things back then. You never really know what to expect out of hours… so nice to have an appointment then.

My cat Max nearly left home when he had to have eyedrops twice daily, a month ago… it's so horrid upsetting them and worrying about losing their trust, when you just want to get them better .

Sorry to hear you lost your previous job, but it seems every cloud has a silver lining . I don't know why I thought you had a car :Hilarious.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TriTri said:


> Hi and thank you for replying. That's a good date to go to the vet, the day before the long bank holiday. My last sick cat usually got booked in the vets for either just before or straight after a bank holiday (or both), bring a frequent flyer :Hilarious. My original vet use to open Sunday mornings (as well as all day Mon-Sat), which was handy as one of my 5 cats was all white and allergic to so many things back then. You never really know what to expect out of hours… so nice to have an appointment then.
> 
> My cat Max nearly left home when he had to have eyedrops twice daily, a month ago… it's so horrid upsetting them and worrying about losing their trust, when you just want to get them better .
> 
> Sorry to hear you lost your previous job, but it seems every cloud has a silver lining . I don't know why I thought you had a car :Hilarious.


Oh of course, I forgot all about that to be honest. Isn't it the Jubilee weekend ? I don't know whether work will be ridiculously busy that weekend or dead as a door nail .

Very nice opening hours. I think all of the vets in this area are Monday to Friday. If you want to go to out of hours here ,it's about 9 miles away. It's a vets now . I like them to be honest . They charged me less for an overnight stay than vets4pets did for a 5 hour stay  . Much more professional too. :Cat

Oh that must be so confusing for a cat to have eye drops. I don't even like having eyedrops and I know what they are and why i'm having them ,if I ever do need them.

From a cat's point of view, I guess we are just throwing nasty liquid in their eyes:Bag

Poor Max, hopefully he's forgiven you now:Cat

The dynamic of the relationship with chewie has definitely changed, because when I wake up in the morning, she is now either under the bed or behind the sofa, because she knows what's coming 

She is a little less aware of the evening dose for some reason ,but she is still very unsettled and tends to stay in the bedroom, but funnily enough as soon as I give her the dose in the evening ,she jumps on top of her cat tree and seems really chilled out ,almost as if to say thank goodness that's all over for the day.

I think I referred to the ebike as a work vehicle and from then on you referred to it as a car and i've never clarified until now


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## £54etgfb6 (Dec 25, 2020)

.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Karl43 said:


> Oh of course, I forgot all about that to be honest. Isn't it the Jubilee weekend ? I don't know whether work will be ridiculously busy that weekend or dead as a door nail .
> 
> Very nice opening hours. I think all of the vets in this area are Monday to Friday. If you want to go to out of hours here ,it's about 9 miles away. It's a vets now . I like them to be honest . They charged me less for an overnight stay than vets4pets did for a 5 hour stay  . Much more professional too. :Cat
> 
> ...


Yes, it's the Jubilee Bank Holiday weekend. Wow, Monday-Friday only? I was disappointed my new(ish) vets are open Mon-Fri and Sat a.m only, so I best count myself lucky. As for the doom and gloom vet you had, how about this; I had Max in as an emergency when he some sort of episode last October. He had bloods taken, X-ray, ultrasound, put on a drip etc and the 2 vets thought it was cancer and offered to put him to sleep there and then. I was horrified and not convinced and I was offered a third opinion (once vet no 3 back from her hols), for vet no 3 to then diagnose feline asthma! That was last October and I'm very pleased to say Max is still alive and kicking :Cat.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TriTri said:


> Yes, it's the Jubilee Bank Holiday weekend. Wow, Monday-Friday only? I was disappointed my new(ish) vets are open Mon-Fri and Sat a.m only, so I best count myself lucky. As for the doom and gloom vet you had, how about this; I had Max in as an emergency when he some sort of episode last October. He had bloods taken, X-ray, ultrasound, put on a drip etc and the 2 vets thought it was cancer and offered to put him to sleep there and then. I was horrified and not convinced and I was offered a third opinion (once vet no 3 back from her hols), for vet no 3 to then diagnose feline asthma! That was last October and I'm very pleased to say Max is still alive and kicking :Cat.


I'm kind of looking forward to it. I'm not a royalist by any means, but I think it will be quite an eventful weekend with lots of things going on 

That is absolutely horrendous. Admittedly, that would really anger me to be honest. How on earth can they conclude cancer and even suggest putting to sleep? That's absolutely crazy.

Surely cancer has to be firmly diagnosed not just guessed.

I'm so so glad you waited for an opinion from vet number three.

This is exactly why I've changed veterinary practice .My gut feeling has been screaming at me for a long time now


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

bmr10 said:


> Apologies to interrupt but you never know if she's sleeping near you while you sleep and just recognises you rousing from sleep and hightails it. If you show her love outwith her medication routine (which you obviously do) then she won't fear you, just the medication. Still not nice to experience though and it is heartbreaking when you wish you could explain _why_ you need to do something.


Interrupt away 

Yes I do think that's what's happening ,to clarify she's not literally already under the bed she is usually close by and then as you say I start sort of rousing and off she pops.

I know she still loves me, but she is very cautious in case I ambush her with syringe in hand:Bag

When I'm administering the medication she does not scratch me or bite me she doesn't growl or hiss, she just wines/cries.

That's the lovely connection we do have. I know she would never bite me or scratch me, but she will certainly bite and scratch other people
I remember when one of my friends came round a long time ago. She was meeting my cat whilst I was making us a coffee, so I had my back turned.

All of a sudden all hell broke loose I heard this crazy growling and hissing and commotion.

I turned around and chewie is on the floor low to the ground ears back hissing like mad

I said what happened there and my friend said ,I tried to pick her up and she really went for me :Facepalm

I said, oh yes sorry only I can do that:Cat it did tickle me a bit

Actually hunted down a moth tonight and also stalked my hand with a full on bottom wiggle and pounce! Not done that for as long as I can remember


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> Wouldn't we all be dead if there were no bones in the neck?


Certainly, if not dead, your head would be wobbling around like a punch bag.



Karl43 said:


> almost as if to say thank goodness that's all over for the day.


Yes, it does get better in that respect. Maggie has been on meds since January 2020 and she knows that after the second batch there is a ''cease fire'' until morning. They become slyer with age - she's 19 next birthday and she is as sly as an old fox. My place is big and she has hiding places I didn't know existed. Sometimes I just don't find her and I seriously wonder if she moves mid-search and is following me round so she's always behind me in a place I've already searched! I try to keep doors closed to limit the number of hiding places she can avail herself of. Do you find that you tiptoe up while her back is turned? I do - I have a pill popper and two syringes with ''deadly poison'' in my hand and I walk stealthily up behind her, deadly weapons in one hand and spare hand poised to grab her by any part of her body I can get get hold of (she is a bit deaf, so that's a plus); when my son was here he watched this manoeuvre and said, ''FFS, Mum, you look like a serial killer''.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

TriTri said:


> Yes, it's the Jubilee Bank Holiday weekend. Wow, Monday-Friday only? I was disappointed my new(ish) vets are open Mon-Fri and Sat a.m only, so I best count myself lucky. As for the doom and gloom vet you had, how about this; I had Max in as an emergency when he some sort of episode last October. He had bloods taken, X-ray, ultrasound, put on a drip etc and the 2 vets thought it was cancer and offered to put him to sleep there and then. I was horrified and not convinced and I was offered a third opinion (once vet no 3 back from her hols), for vet no 3 to then diagnose feline asthma! That was last October and I'm very pleased to say Max is still alive and kicking :Cat.


How scary is that. But the really awful thing is, if you had thought ''Well two vets can't be wrong'' and let them euthanise, you would never have even seen the third one, and Max would no longer be around. I had something similar, but not as potentially final, with Maggie after she was spayed years back. She got a huge great lump which: vet 1 said was a massive infection; vet 2 said was a hernia which would need surgery or all her guts were going to spill out and on to the table and then along came vet 3, a Romanian girl whose English was somewhat limited, but fluent enough to say, ''Take that stitch out, she's allergic to it''. Removed the stitch herself and handed Maggie back with profuse apologies. But if the Romanian girl had not been there, I wonder what exactly the treatment would have been (and what size the bill? . . . don't ask ). Glad your guy is still fit and well.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> Certainly, if not dead, your head would be wobbling around like a punch bag.
> 
> Yes, it does get better in that respect. Maggie has been on meds since January 2020 and she knows that after the second batch there is a ''cease fire'' until morning. They become slyer with age - she's 19 next birthday and she is as sly as an old fox. My place is big and she has hiding places I didn't know existed. Sometimes I just don't find her and I seriously wonder if she moves mid-search and is following me round so she's always behind me in a place I've already searched! I try to keep doors closed to limit the number of hiding places she can avail herself of. Do you find that you tiptoe up while her back is turned? I do - I have a pill popper and two syringes with ''deadly poison'' in my hand and I walk stealthily up behind her, deadly weapons in one hand and spare hand poised to grab her by any part of her body I can get get hold of (she is a bit deaf, so that's a plus); when my son was here he watched this manoeuvre and said, ''FFS, Mum, you look like a serial killer''.


Maggie is 19 ? isn't she doing well.

She will know all the best hiding places and every trick in the book at that age lol luckily my place is small, so hiding places are limited and I usually know where she is pretty quickly.

I like to do the medication in the same location every time, that way she doesn't associate every inch of the home as an assassination spot .I just casually pick her up talk to her calmly, the syringe is sat waiting, because I prepare it 10 minutes earlier, I get her down between my knees hold her top jaw and boom.

The last 5 times I've done it there's been little evidence of any saliva or spillage. I'm getting the syringe right to the back of the throat. It's definitely easier and less stressful the more I do it.

You made me giggle to myself with all the terminology. Deadly poison, deadly weapons, serial killer:Woot lol!

I don't want to jinx it, but apart from the blip the other day she seems to be having more good days than bad now and that's a first. She's just much more sociable.


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

When my cat, the one in my avatar, was a kitten, she developed a skin problem. Her fur fell out, the skin beneath was flaky, and she was beginning to look like a newly hatched chick. She was only about 4 months old at the time.

Took her to the vet, who diagnosed autoimmune disease and advised me to have her put to sleep. I refused and insisted on treatment. Six months of steroids and her fur started to grow back, only to fall out again a few weeks later. I changed vets. The second vet took one look and exclaimed 'its ringworm!' One injection and within a couple of weeks she was back to normal.

The first vet wanted to euthanise at 4 months old, she lived a very happy and a very full life until she died just before her 20th birthday.

Always, always, trust your gut and never be afraid to ask for a 2nd opinion.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Deguslave said:


> When my cat, the one in my avatar, was a kitten, she developed a skin problem. Her fur fell out, the skin beneath was flaky, and she was beginning to look like a newly hatched chick. She was only about 4 months old at the time.
> 
> Took her to the vet, who diagnosed autoimmune disease and advised me to have her put to sleep. I refused and insisted on treatment. Six months of steroids and her fur started to grow back, only to fall out again a few weeks later. I changed vets. The second vet took one look and exclaimed 'its ringworm!' One injection and within a couple of weeks she was back to normal.
> 
> ...


You really do have to stand your ground . . . no reason not to as you, the owner, is the one who knows their own cat best.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> Maggie is 19 ? isn't she doing well.


With age comes an increase in slyness, indeed, never a truer word. Even when she is fast asleep I swear she has one eye open so she can check up on me. She's the fat tabby on my avatar.


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## £54etgfb6 (Dec 25, 2020)

.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> With age comes an increase in slyness, indeed, never a truer word. Even when she is fast asleep I swear she has one eye open so she can check up on me. She's the fat tabby on my avatar.


Aww what a cutey ! 



bmr10 said:


> My Miri does the same when I wipe her bum or brush her teeth, and then she runs off to hunch over against the wall glaring at me. Sometimes I feel upset that she doesn't understand why I'm doing things to her but then I remember animals don't hold grudges and it's just a temporary unpleasantness.
> 
> I think this proves that deep in her heart, even if she doesn't understand _why_ the syringe has to happen she knows you would never intentionally hurt her. It's so nice to hear that you have a bond together


I think it is just the nature of cats ,they generally just don't like being restrained.

I think they just get in a bit of a mood at us, just like a human can with another human. They don't actually stop loving us.

When she was spayed the vet said to chewie, " I think your dad can look at your wound to check on it ,because when I did it you sank your teeth into me didn't you" :Cat:Bag

I have to mention to everybody ,this might be music to everybody's ears ,there is definitely a noted change in chewie, in fact today you could almost forget anything was wrong with her , she almost seems back to her old self, but without all of the insane playing of course. Something positive is happening. I don't know what and maybe she will crash tomorrow, but things seem good!

The bloodworks will of course tell the real story

But yes , all good in chewie land


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## £54etgfb6 (Dec 25, 2020)

.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

@Karl43: great that she is having a good day; must be such a relief to you - I was so pleased to read that. So next blood test is 1 June - how long is that since the previous one? Have you already told present vets that she is going elsewhere and arranged to have her medical history transferred - or will the new vet have done this? It's just that on one occasion in my case, notes had not been sent over as we requested and we had a wasted consultation, and a wasted fee too, naturally. Also, before you go there (with credit card screaming and fighting to get out of your wallet and pay them) do make a note of anything that you think is relevant - anything the previous vet has said, any meds she has had that you want to ask questions about. You have time to do it if it's ten days and glad you have found a vet you have heard is on the ball.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> @Karl43: great that she is having a good day; must be such a relief to you - I was so pleased to read that. So next blood test is 1 June - how long is that since the previous one? Have you already told present vets that she is going elsewhere and arranged to have her medical history transferred - or will the new vet have done this? It's just that on one occasion in my case, notes had not been sent over as we requested and we had a wasted consultation, and a wasted fee too, naturally. Also, before you go there (with credit card screaming and fighting to get out of your wallet and pay them) do make a note of anything that you think is relevant - anything the previous vet has said, any meds she has had that you want to ask questions about. You have time to do it if it's ten days and glad you have found a vet you have heard is on the ball.


The previous blood test was May 5th ,so around 27 days between.

I have told the current vets and they are prying into why, which is typical of them.


















I just sent this response today


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## 1507601 (Jun 26, 2020)

That's really rude of them. I've never been asked about stuff like that.


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

I've been asked for written permission to transfer notes before, but never for a reason why I'm changing vets.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Lucy2020 said:


> That's really rude of them. I've never been asked about stuff like that.


This sums them up and I bet they still have not done it . That is the same person that rang me 4 times a day emailed me another 4 times a day chasing for payment and the one time I asked her something because they were supposed to chase up something with the hospital, she said to me ,do not use this email ,if you want to speak to a vet, make an appointment.

They are a dreadful dreadful practice. I'm not putting her job position down, but she's a receptionist and I'm pretty sure it's nothing to do with her why I want to change practice


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

I'd be soooo tempted to tell them to read the review you're going to leave online, it should tell them everything they need to know.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Deguslave said:


> I'd be soooo tempted to tell them to read the review you're going to leave online, it should tell them everything they need to know.


They have disabled reviews on Facebook because they got so many bad ones but I'm quite sure I'll be able to leave a review elsewhere maybe on Google or something. Depending on their next response I may actually say what you suggested

What gets me is they said they will deactivate chewie, but then say I can still pick up the prescription .How can they take payment and process the distribution of a prescription if chewie is deactivated from the system?

just want to squeeze the last few Pennies from me I think


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Go for it! Lol. Google and Yell are pretty good for reviews, there is also a rate my vet uk website.

They'll probably either deactivate Chewie after the prescription has been issued and paid for, or hope that you'll change your mind.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

@Karl43
All you need to tell them, if anything, is that you want a second opinion.


Karl43 said:


> rang me 4 times a day emailed me another 4 times a day chasing for payment


This is reminiscent of the client who was a penny short for the wormers! No, probably not her fault, ''just obeying orders'' I guess. I remember when I transferred ownership and microchip details, they insisted on a _handwritten _signature, so maybe put a note through their door too - just in case. 
Is Chewie eating OK again?


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> I'll be able to leave a review elsewhere


Trust Pilot? I just left a review there for a great Italian restaurant . . . it works both ways. All their reviews were excellent.
I think they said the prescription was already done and awaiting collection before her deactivation..


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> @Karl43
> All you need to tell them, if anything, is that you want a second opinion.
> 
> This is reminiscent of the client who was a penny short for the wormers! No, probably not her fault, ''just obeying orders'' I guess. I remember when I transferred ownership and microchip details, they insisted on a _handwritten _signature, so maybe put a note through their door too - just in case.
> Is Chewie eating OK again?


I found out for sure they definitely have not transferred the notes. I asked the new vets and unbeknown to me they do open on Saturdays (which is great) and they contacted me this morning.

I still can't get over the penny lol

I was in retail management and customers occasionally were a couple of pence short and I would always let them off. Sometimes at the end of the shift I just used to throw 5 or 10 pence of my own money into the till to make up any losses. Its no big deal at all.



Calvine said:


> Trust Pilot? I just left a review there for a great Italian restaurant . . . it works both ways. All their reviews were excellent.
> I think they said the prescription was already done and awaiting collection before her deactivation..


I'm going to leave a few reviews on several different platforms.

Chewie had a remarkable day yesterday. I forgot she was ill for a moment ,she was even playing ,but I'm not going to hold my breath. Quietly positive. Oh and yes she's eating reasonably ok


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

If you need a reason to smile today and struggling to find one this might help.

First real interest in play and looking normal yesterday and today since February!! I shed tears of happiness .Even if it's not long lasting, moments like this need to be treasured


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Karl43 said:


> If you need a reason to smile today and struggling to find one this might help.
> 
> First real interest in play and looking normal yesterday and today since February!! I shed tears of happiness .Even if it's not long lasting, moments like this need to be treasured


Awww❤❤❤❤, bless her little Chewie socks ❤❤, thank you for sharing that.

On Chewie's medical notes front, you can also ask for a copy of her up to date notes to be emailed to you too. Or at least I did every few months with my previous veterinary surgery. They were happy to oblige. Perhaps email your request? :Woot:Hilarious.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Calvine said:


> How scary is that. But the really awful thing is, if you had thought ''Well two vets can't be wrong'' and let them euthanise, you would never have even seen the third one, and Max would no longer be around. I had something similar, but not as potentially final, with Maggie after she was spayed years back. She got a huge great lump which: vet 1 said was a massive infection; vet 2 said was a hernia which would need surgery or all her guts were going to spill out and on to the table and then along came vet 3, a Romanian girl whose English was somewhat limited, but fluent enough to say, ''Take that stitch out, she's allergic to it''. Removed the stitch herself and handed Maggie back with profuse apologies. But if the Romanian girl had not been there, I wonder what exactly the treatment would have been (and what size the bill? . . . don't ask ). Glad your guy is still fit and well.


Thank you!

'Funny you should mention that about the stitch as one of my cats had a problem which was caused by a stitch which needed to come out.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Karl43 said:


> Hi I'm definitely still doing the medication. I absolutely cannot stand doing it because it upsets her so much and yes it makes me feel guilty ,but I'm getting better at it and sticking to it because I keep telling myself this could actually save her life so there's no question. She's going to have to put up with it unfortunately.
> 
> I have changed veterinary surgeon now so she has a blood test on the 1st of June.
> 
> ...


Aww George is a sweetie ❤.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

@Karl43 Out of interest. Is the prescription for one bottle? Just thinking, the prescription that VetUk has for Maggie's tablets lasts six months from the date on it, and I request them 120 at a time until the prescription expires which may mean in your case that when the bottle is nearly empty you will be able to get a second on the same prescription - which obviously would save you a few quid more. On the prescriptions I get, the vet fills in a certain number of ''repeats'': there's a section at the bottom (near the vet's signature) which says ''this prescription may be repeated xx times'' and the vet fills in how many times it can be used.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

I'm sorry to reignite this thread but I had to share , another good day. I don't have any explanation ,surely this has to be the cyclosporine??


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## lullabydream (Jun 25, 2013)

Awww Chewie you are so adorable

Am hoping the medication is working for her and you @Karl43


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

lullabydream said:


> Awww Chewie you are so adorable
> 
> Am hoping the medication is working for her and you @Karl43


I haven't seen this level of activity since diagnosis. I can only conclude its the new drug , that or a wild coincidence. Its surreal to see her like this again, especially after the bleak outlook only weeks ago :Cat

Also ,I have been corresponding with the new veterinary practice and instantly getting good vibes. My old practice finally sent the medical history across, but never responded to my last email. I found out from the new vets.

They were very helpful. I asked about a prescription (never even picked one up from the old practice, I'm just so finished with them) they said they do need to see her first, but they can bump the appointment up if that would help, so now we go this Wednesday.


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## ScrapCat (8 mo ago)

Karl43 said:


> I'm sorry to reignite this thread but I had to share , another good day. I don't have any explanation ,surely this has to be the cyclosporine??


Oh wow! Look at her go! :Woot So glad to see the new medication working, and fingers crossed for many more good days. :Cat


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## Bettybobbins (Nov 29, 2021)

Please do update how she does on Wednesday. Im sure many of us are past the point of no return with following chewies story so like the updates.


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## lullabydream (Jun 25, 2013)

Glad the new vets sound positive to me @Karl43 hope it all goes well for Wednesday


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## teddylion (Oct 16, 2019)

Chewie looks great, and the new vet sounds much better. It's normal to need an appointment to get a prescription - my vet charges £20 for a prescription, which can be used twice before I need to see him again for a new one.


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

Fantastic update! Looking forward to more good news later in the week but if it's not as good as you hope for, don't forget these precious moments because it means she is fighting whatever the results say


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Really glad to see she's having a good spell Karl, long may it continue!

Molly sends pawsitive vibes! Well, she said 'waoooow!' but I'm sure that's what she meant!


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## Charity (Apr 17, 2013)

Lovely to see her looking so lively. Hopefully the new vets will be a lot better.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

ScrapCat said:


> Oh wow! Look at her go! :Woot So glad to see the new medication working, and fingers crossed for many more good days. :Cat


I know I thought these days were over .I'v been used to her just being pretty much catatonic (excuse the "pun") for the past 3 months. 
2 weeks into the new meds I think and boom this reaction

Either that or she's just decided she's sick of sitting around lol



Bettybobbins said:


> Please do update how she does on Wednesday. Im sure many of us are past the point of no return with following chewies story so like the updates.


I just don't want to be a forum hog, but I just had to share today. Also I don't want to leave everyone hanging and wondering 
I will be straight on here Wednesday whether it's good or bad news :Cat


lullabydream said:


> Glad the new vets sound positive to me @Karl43 hope it all goes well for Wednesday


Definitely getting good vibes from them and thank you



teddylion said:


> Chewie looks great, and the new vet sounds much better. It's normal to need an appointment to get a prescription - my vet charges £20 for a prescription, which can be used twice before I need to see him again for a new one.


I did think they may need to see her first .It would seem a little unorthodox to start handing out prescriptions to a patient they haven't even seen. :Bag

They do it a little differently they explained. In order to obtain the meds, you have to order the medication from the website ,get the order number and then they electronically send the prescription to the dispensary company with the order number. They don't issue paper scripts.



GingerNinja said:


> Fantastic update! Looking forward to more good news later in the week but if it's not as good as you hope for, don't forget these precious moments because it means she is fighting whatever the results say


Hello good to see you ,hope everything is ok?
Oh she is certainly a fighter. I remember when I first contacted a vet on a video call they said this :










And then a few hours later this happened :










:Bag



Tony Gussin said:


> Really glad to see she's having a good spell Karl, long may it continue!
> 
> Molly sends pawsitive vibes! Well, she said 'waoooow!' but I'm sure that's what she meant!
> 
> View attachment 491501


Awww Molly is lovely ( my hamster was a molly ,good name)

Thank you, I hope she remains this way for as long as possible. It's lovely for her and myself , including respite for me from the chronic emotional stress 

Chewie says thank you (mmeawwaaah) for the vibes:Cat


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Oh wow! I am loving these updates. The videos are heart warming. Chewie is doing so well and I think it has to be down to the new meds and of course all the tlc she clearly receives. ‘Expect the higher dose of steroids are helping too. I’ve forgotten what she’s been given for the anaemia? What was/is it? Maybe she’s no longer anaemic too? Well done Chewie, I knew your post title was just a temporary blip. She’s one of the prettiest cats I’ve ever seen, mind you I’m biased, as she reminds me so much of my Mr Tizzy, especially the little black marking on her right nostril ❤. Long may her energetic antics continue. Have you tried a laser torch toy for her? Or a Paul Dinning YouTube video? I’m so pleased you’ve managed to get the new meds into her. She is so adorable. The more updates, the better .


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TriTri said:


> Oh wow! I am loving these updates. The videos are heart warming. Chewie is doing so well and I think it has to be down to the new meds and of course all the tlc she clearly receives. 'Expect the higher dose of steroids are helping too. I've forgotten what she's been given for the anaemia? What was/is it? Maybe she's no longer anaemic too? Well done Chewie, I knew your post title was just a temporary blip. She's one of the prettiest cats I've ever seen, mind you I'm biased, as she reminds me so much of my Mr Tizzy, especially the little black marking on her right nostril ❤. Long may her energetic antics continue. Have you tried a laser torch toy for her? Or a Paul Dinning YouTube video? I'm so pleased you've managed to get the new meds into her. She is so adorable. The more updates, the better .


I'm pretty sure the little bugalugs dribbled out a lot of the medication tonight.:Banghead

Could have just been drool, but it was very runny. Tough love, she's getting her mouth held closed tomorrow and a chin tickle :Hilarious

The anaemia was all linked to the autoimmune disease, her immune system was attacking everything including neutrophils and red blood cells ,the latter causing the anaemia ,so I would assume the immunosuppressive drugs combated that.

When she was first presented I believe her red blood cells were at 14%. Anything under 25% is anaemic .I think 14% is pretty severe

She underwent intensive treatment and I think it raised to 16% .Just before she was let home the veterinary surgeon at the hospital said they had just had a cat come in that was at 8% ,so I don't know what became of them.

It is a regenerative anaemia (thankfully) as were the findings of the bone marrow biopsy.

The prednisolone immediately raised the red blood cells and red blood cells have never been an issue since treatment, or not enough of an issue to be concerned with.

The persistent issue at the moment is with the neutrophils,which are consistently low in number.

I've got a laser torch somewhere. I might dig It out. I'd forgotten I even had one

Have you got any pictures of Mr Tizzy?
I think she is very very pretty too, but then I'm biased as well for obvious reasons:Hilarious

Never heard of Paul Dinning , that's peaked my interest, I'll go and have a look


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Karl43 said:


> I'm pretty sure the little bugalugs dribbled out a lot of the medication tonight.:Banghead
> 
> Could have just been drool, but it was very runny. Tough love, she's getting her mouth held closed tomorrow and a chin tickle :Hilarious
> 
> ...


Oh yes, don't forget the chin tickle :Hilarious. 
Of course I have a photo of Mr Tizzy . Sorry it's showing sideways! Tizzy had more black as you can see here, same lovely furry coat, black dot on the same nostril.

And Max with a Paul Dinning clip..


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

And Tessy with her lazer pen, every night before bed and every morning too…


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> I'm pretty sure the little bugalugs dribbled out a lot of the medication tonight


I try to get it between the teeth and her cheek, pointing backwards, trying to miss the sides and front of the tongue. I think if it goes in there, there's less taste (and some of these meds do taste vile).


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> I try to get it between the teeth and her cheek, pointing backwards, trying to miss the sides and front of the tongue. I think if it goes in there, there's less taste (and some of these meds do taste vile).


Thanks for the tip I'll try that tonight.


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## Willsee (Nov 7, 2020)

Lovely video of Chewie , I’m so pleased she’s looking better. The new vets sound much nicer too xxxx


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

Was the appointment today? How did you get on @Karl43 ?


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

So sorry everyone iv been so busy had to sort my e bike out . They didn't even order the part, so I got really vocal with them. Lying through their back teeth ,so they dismantled another bike and I got £450 worth of parts for cheap :Hilarious

I can finally go back to work!

Right the good bit :

Chewie is in complete remission , clinically normal !!!! Red Cells fine ,neutrophils fine just like a regular cat .

Also the new vets were absolutely out of this world, unbelievably amazing.

Completely blew my mind and exceeded expectation.

So so thorough and so knowledgeable and so caring.

The vet said she would contact Derby to give them the results and discuss medication with them and then she said she is going to completely take over this case for me and be the designated vet.

As well as doing the bloods, they did a thourough examination ,listened to her heart for a very long time and and was feeling around her spleen as she said it's naturally enlarged. Looked in her ears mouth eyes asked a ton of questions. They were so good the friend I was with registered all three of her cats right there and then lol

They weighed chewie and she's the most she's ever weighed at 4.5 kg .At first presentation she was 3.5.

I can't even articulate how good they were.

She even said to me when the neutrophils were rock bottom, why was I not given antibiotics for chewie? I think afew of you guys on here mentioned antibiotics?

They said the most likely outcome would be to keep her on the cyclosporine and try to reduce the prednisolone in due course.

We are just so happy :Cat

3-4 months of hell and chronic stress just washed out of me in an instant

Thank you everyone for the amazing support including donations 

I know this isn't the end and it will be a rollercoaster ,but for now I'm on top of the world 

Chewie on the bus to the vets


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Amazing news! I'm so pleased. A good vet is worth their weight in gold.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Karl43 said:


> So sorry everyone iv been so busy had to sort my e bike out . They didn't even order the part, so I got really vocal with them. Lying through their back teeth ,so they dismantled another bike and I got £450 worth of parts for cheap :Hilarious
> 
> I can finally go back to work!
> 
> ...


Omg I am so pleased for you both. I knew she/ you could do it . Yes, it may well be a rollercoaster ride, but a worthy one. Hip hip, hooray :Cat:Cat. Yay!


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## Bettybobbins (Nov 29, 2021)

Yipeeeeee!!! Big happy dance


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## ScrapCat (8 mo ago)

Woooooooo!!! That's such wonderful news! :Woot And a huzzah for the new vets being so amazing, as well! So happy for both you and Chewie! :Shamefullyembarrased :Cat


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

And a gorgeous photo of Chewie too .


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## Willsee (Nov 7, 2020)

What a fantastic update  I’m grinning like a Cheshire Cat . I’m so pleased for you and Chewie, I know it’ll still be a bit of a rollercoaster for you both but with such a supportive vet I know you will be guided now in the best possible way. Love the pic on the bus too xxxxxx


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Karl43 said:


> So sorry everyone iv been so busy had to sort my e bike out . They didn't even order the part, so I got really vocal with them. Lying through their back teeth ,so they dismantled another bike and I got £450 worth of parts for cheap :Hilarious
> 
> I can finally go back to work!
> 
> ...


Great news Karl! A decent vet makes all the difference.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> So sorry everyone iv been so busy had to sort my e bike out . They didn't even order the part, so I got really vocal with them. Lying through their back teeth ,so they dismantled another bike and I got £450 worth of parts for cheap :Hilarious
> 
> I can finally go back to work!
> 
> ...


What great news; you must be so relieved! And a whole kg weight increase (must be the cheese on toast). Glad you have more confidence in this vet.


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

So happy to read your latest news @Karl43 . I can imagine the relief you feel. Such a weight off your shoulders.


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## Nealh (12 mo ago)

Very pleased for your well being and more importantly for Chewie, that she can be more of her self again.


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

What fantastic news! 

I'm so pleased for both of you and hope that she continues to do well. There's every hope now that the new meds are working xx


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## lullabydream (Jun 25, 2013)

Just catching up with this.

I am so happy for you @Karl43 and Chewie this has really lightened my day reading she's in remission


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## SnowyMittens (Oct 31, 2012)

Sorry to hear this, I didn’t want to read and run, sending love and positive thoughts xxx


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

How's she doing now?


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

SnowyMittens said:


> Sorry to hear this, I didn't want to read and run, sending love and positive thoughts xxx


Thankyou ,however she's in remission now



Deguslave said:


> How's she doing now?


We are reducing the pred soon


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## Charity (Apr 17, 2013)

So glad to read she is much better after all the worry and you have such a good vet now. It makes all the difference.


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## SnowyMittens (Oct 31, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> Thankyou ,however she's in remission now
> 
> We are reducing the pred soon


yay!!! So glad to hear it!


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

@Karl43: Re your battle to get tablets into Chewie. This is what I use to get the tablets into Maggie, hand round the back of the head. After a while she just seemed to accept that it's part of her daily routine (also two syringes of supplements for the kidneys). How long will she be having the steroids for - has the vet given any indication?


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Hi Karl, is it not possible to crush the tablets into food? 
We’ve had this issue with previous cats and when I’ve asked the vet that question, the initial response has been no, then they go away and look into it and decide it would be okay.

Whether the cat will eat them is another matter but I had some success by crushing them very fine between two spoons, then mixing very well into something like Lik e Lix.

Obviously I’d speak to your vet first though.

Also, worth asking if the med comes in liquid form, sometimes they do but the vets always seem to give out pills first.
You’d think by now savvy pharmaceutical companies would have produced something palatable in a liquid form for cats…


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

Tony Gussin said:


> Hi Karl, is it not possible to crush the tablets into food?
> We've had this issue with previous cats and when I've asked the vet that question, the initial response has been no, then they go away and look into it and decide it would be okay.
> 
> Whether the cat will eat them is another matter but I had some success by crushing them very fine between two spoons, then mixing very well into something like Lik e Lix.
> ...


There is a company that does bespoke liquid pet medications. @QOTN I'm sure you know the firm I'm thinking of. Obviously very much more expensive and Karl would still have to struggle to syringe it into Chewie


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

SbanR said:


> There is a company that does bespoke liquid pet medications. @QOTN I'm sure you know the firm I'm thinking of. Obviously very much more expensive and Karl would still have to struggle to syringe it into Chewie


Yes, unless it's something syrupy and sweet like Metacam/?Rheumocam, which they seem to lap up then there is often some resistance. . But some tablets really are quite vile. If you accidentally lick a finger after handling the Thiafeline, it really tastes like poison, so you can't blame them for complaining.


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

Calvine said:


> Yes, unless it's something syrupy and sweet like Metacam/?Rheumocam, which they seem to lap up then there is often some resistance. . But some tablets really are quite vile. If you accidentally lick a finger after handling the Thiafeline, it really tastes like poison, so you can't blame them for complaining.


From the name, a pet specific med. Makes you wonder why it's not enteric coated if it tastes so vile


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

SbanR said:


> From the name, a pet specific med. Makes you wonder why it's not enteric coated if it tastes so vile


Yes, it's coated with something as the outside is orange, but even with that it's quite awful if you even just touch it.


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

SbanR said:


> There is a company that does bespoke liquid pet medications. @QOTN I'm sure you know the firm I'm thinking of. Obviously very much more expensive and Karl would still have to struggle to syringe it into Chewie


I expect you mean Summit Veterinary. My Abs had Methimazole transdermal gel made up by them. They only supply vets. https://www.svprx.co.uk/our-products.html


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

SbanR said:


> There is a company that does bespoke liquid pet medications. @QOTN I'm sure you know the firm I'm thinking of. Obviously very much more expensive and Karl would still have to struggle to syringe it into Chewie


Some liquid meds aren't necessarily vile tasting though?
We usually got them into our cats mixed with a Felix soup or Lik e Lix etc, something strong tasting


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> @Karl43: Re your battle to get tablets into Chewie. This is what I use to get the tablets into Maggie, hand round the back of the head. After a while she just seemed to accept that it's part of her daily routine (also two syringes of supplements for the kidneys). How long will she be having the steroids for - has the vet given any indication?


Oh like a pill plunger . I might get one. It saves her sharp teeth catching me ! Lol

Luckily today just like that she ate the pill pocket with the steroids, so that saved alot of anguish.

I still syringe the liquid cyclosporine . That's become second nature now .

There is a bit less steroid to give now as starting today is the second reduction attempt . One and a half pill 7.5mg pred and maintaining 0.8 mg a day cyclosporine .

We are trying to get her off the steroid , but if she needs it then it will be given indefinitely.



Tony Gussin said:


> Hi Karl, is it not possible to crush the tablets into food?
> We've had this issue with previous cats and when I've asked the vet that question, the initial response has been no, then they go away and look into it and decide it would be okay.
> 
> Whether the cat will eat them is another matter but I had some success by crushing them very fine between two spoons, then mixing very well into something like Lik e Lix.
> ...


She's wise to preds in food now, plus she leaves bits so wouldn't necessarily be getting full dose.

For some reason she lapped up the pill pocket today . Maybe she thought well that's better than being force fed pills ! Lol

Cyclosporine is apparently absolutely vile and she can smell that a mile off so I have no choice but to syringe that, but I'm ok with doing that now . Second nature


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

I bought her this scratcher today . She just sat on it to proclaim ownership lol










And now she's asleep


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

She's looking well!

I know when I had a degu on pred he got used to taking it, I'd only have to say 'meds' and he'd come to the bars for it. I've found that they do get to know that the meds are doing them good, its usually just a point of principle that they fight against them when they are taking them long term.


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Karl43 said:


> Oh like a pill plunger . I might get one. It saves her sharp teeth catching me ! Lol
> 
> Luckily today just like that she ate the pill pocket with the steroids, so that saved alot of anguish.
> 
> ...


The trick I found was just to use a small amount of something they really liked, such as soup or Lik e Lix.
It wasn't a perfect art but usually the full amount went.
Putting anything in ordinary wet food never seemed to really work because as you say, they leave bits.

Glad to hear it went okay tonight though


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## Nealh (12 mo ago)

It's great to hear things are still looking up.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

A recent Chewie photo…... Yay! 

Thank you. She’s looking fab .


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> I bought her this scratcher today . She just sat on it to proclaim ownership lol
> 
> View attachment 494391
> 
> ...


She's a very pretty girl and she looks well and happy. :Cat


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TriTri said:


> A recent Chewie photo…... Yay!
> 
> Thank you. She's looking fab .


Iv not been very active on here ,but started back at work, then iv been bogged down with a rotten cold ,plus really not much to report chewie wise .

She is now on day two of a reduced prednisone dose and back at the vets in 4 weeks for bloods.

Also like people have said on here it is all now becoming a "new normal " .


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Karl43 said:


> Iv not been very active on here ,but started back at work, then iv been bogged down with a rotten cold ,plus really not much to report chewie wise .
> 
> She is now on day two of a reduced prednisone dose and back at the vets in 4 weeks for bloods.
> 
> Also like people have said on here it is all now becoming a "new normal " .


Oh, poor you, 'hope you feel better soon and I hope Chewie manages well on the reduced steroids.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Helping me make the bed last night. Cute stalk


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Last two days she's been withdrawn. 

Hope she's not relapsing 

Been on reduced steroid now for 9 days


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## ScrapCat (8 mo ago)

Sending all the positive vibes, and fingers crossed that she perks up soon. 🤞


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Karl43 said:


> Last two days she's been withdrawn.
> 
> Hope she's not relapsing
> 
> Been on reduced steroid now for 9 days


Ah, sorry to hear that Karl, I hope she picks up soon.


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Maybe she needs a slight increase in the steroids for a couple of days, I'd speak to your vet and see what they say. But it could also be this topsy-turvy weather we're having at the moment.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Deguslave said:


> Maybe she needs a slight increase in the steroids for a couple of days, I'd speak to your vet and see what they say. But it could also be this topsy-turvy weather we're having at the moment.


She's pretty much been on the maximum allowable dose since February. It really would be good progress if she could maintain responsive on a reduced dose, but just doesn't look good. The last time we tried to put her on the reduced dose she shot downhill and it's looking a bit wonky again this time.

Though as you say the weather has also been very topsy-turvy, it's been like a sauna in the house.

She greets me with Enthusiasm when I come home from work and then she basically spends the entire evening in the bedroom. It is a lot cooler in the bedroom

She's not even getting on the bed she just sits on the floor.

It's nothing new, she does exhibit some very very up and down bizarre behaviour


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

We (my vet and I) agreed to an increase just for a week when Dixie showed signs of not coping with the reduced dose. It was enough to give his system a boost.

I remember my cats always being a bit lethargic if there was a thunder storm brewing, I read somewhere that the increased air pressure can give some cats a headache, but I'm not sure how accurate that was.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

I'm not sure if she's responding to the reduction with a psychosis of some sort. (Its not unheard of)

Day 3 or is it 4 of just sat in the bedroom almost on guard , not relaxed.

This morning she attempted to go on her cat tree in the living room window and she SHOT behind the sofa ,yet nothing happened. Nothing was there!

I'm wondering if she's been spooked at the window at some point. 

Its so weird

She's gone from almost overly content to terrified in a day


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

She sits in that spot like that for 24 hours a day. 

This is off the back of complete contentment and happiness . I'm baffled


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Karl43 said:


> I'm not sure if she's responding to the reduction with a psychosis of some sort. (Its not unheard of)
> 
> Day 3 or is it 4 of just sat in the bedroom almost on guard , not relaxed.
> 
> ...


Might just be a temporary effect from withdrawal of the meds or something?

Not that I’ve got any medical knowledge whatsoever, just a thought, as you say


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Karl43 said:


> She sits in that spot like that for 24 hours a day.
> 
> This is off the back of complete contentment and happiness . I'm baffled
> 
> View attachment 573685


I guess see what the vets think?


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TonyG said:


> I guess see what the vets think?


And then behold she snaps out of it tonight and even plays  

The thing is and I know this might sound terrible to some people ,but it is what it is . I can't run to the vets everytime she has a bad day or few days, regardless of how much it worries me to death.

It costs almost £200 a month in regular maintenance and for her condition (rising energy costs eat your heart out) lol on top of the £5000 I've already spent  



















finally got on top of the cat tree


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Karl43 said:


> And then behold she snaps out of it tonight and even plays
> 
> The thing is and I know this might sound terrible to some people ,but it is what it is . I can't run to the vets everytime she has a bad day or few days, regardless of how much it worries me to death.
> 
> ...


That’s good news! Just a blip maybe?

I get what you’re saying. Have sadly now managed a few cats with long term illnesses and you could be on the phone to the vet every other day if you weren’t careful. As you say, you just have to kind of roll with the ups and downs.

Great to see she’s more herself again anyway. Perhaps as you said she saw something outside that freaked her out for a bit?


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Glad she's doing better.

I still think this could be weather related. And I know exactly what you mean about the vet.


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

You understand your cat and you're doing the best you can. Xx


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

SbanR said:


> You understand your cat and you're doing the best you can. Xx


I don't think I do understand her half of the time

Thank you


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Karl43 said:


> I don't think I do understand her half of the time
> 
> Thank you


She's a cat, you're not meant to understand her, lol.


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

I’m glad she seems ok again. I do think steroids have quite a big effect on mood. I’ve had to give Huck two courses recently and the first one he became very withdrawn on them, I really didn’t like it. The second he wasn’t too bad but he’s definitely a different cat off them. I do know you have to reduce or withdraw dosage very carefully so it may have had something to do with it. To wean Huck off I had to do it gradually over about 2 weeks.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

huckybuck said:


> I’m glad she seems ok again. I do think steroids have quite a big effect on mood. I’ve had to give Huck two courses recently and the first one he became very withdrawn on them, I really didn’t like it. The second he wasn’t too bad but he’s definitely a different cat off them. I do know you have to reduce or withdraw dosage very carefully so it may have had something to do with it. To wean Huck off I had to do it gradually over about 2 weeks.


This is the second time since February we are trying to wean her down to a smaller dose. The first time was unsuccessful.

We've put her back down to 7.5 mg from 10.

The idea is to wean her off them completely, but due to her condition ,that process would take around 4 months and that's providing everything went perfectly.

She is all over the place, a proper Jekyll and Hyde.

Hoping your huck is ok now


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

Huck is much better now. He does have to have an inhaler for his steroids now but it doesn’t have the same side effects thank goodness. When I was told I’d have to give him an inhaler I was horrified! Never thought I’d be able to do that with him as he’s a grumpy old man 😂

But a bit of perseverance and knowing he HAS to have it made me get on with it. I always try to rationalise how long in minutes/seconds it’s unpleasant for out of the number of minutes/seconds in their whole day. It does put things more in perspective.

He does have to have the inhaler on for around 10 seconds and yes he hates it and sometimes struggles but we have associated it with his fav treat of butter. I also do a song so he knows how long he has to go lol!

I can actually get the butter and the inhaler out at the same time and he will come over to me. You can see him weighing up - I want that/I don’t want THAT! But he tolerates it.

You could always try crushing Chewies in a tiny bit butter if she likes that?

I’m so glad she responded to the meds in the end (and you changed vets) I’ve just read the whole of your thread.

The one thing I wondered is do you think she still has the odd episode where she goes slightly anaemic. One of mine was found to have Pryuvate Kinase Deficiency which can lead to anaemia (he’s absolutely fine) but some of the signs of an episode are fatigue and withdrawal. Most of the episodes pass and thankfully he’s never had a bad one but he is def more lethargic than the other cats. I just keep an eye on him in case.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

huckybuck said:


> Huck is much better now. He does have to have an inhaler for his steroids now but it doesn’t have the same side effects thank goodness. When I was told I’d have to give him an inhaler I was horrified! Never thought I’d be able to do that with him as he’s a grumpy old man 😂
> 
> But a bit of perseverance and knowing he HAS to have it made me get on with it. I always try to rationalise how long in minutes/seconds it’s unpleasant for out of the number of minutes/seconds in their whole day. It does put things more in perspective.
> 
> ...


I do apologise for the late reply. I did have you in mind but been a bit busy with work and wanted to reply properly.

I'm so glad huck is doing better and I had no idea cats could have inhalers! Learn something new everyday. I think I would be horrified as well, because in a sense it seems worse than giving a cat a pill, because you have to hold the inhaler there for so long ,but sounds like you're really great with it. 


I'm ok with chewies tablets for now. I had to switch from Royal Canin pill assist to one called greenies. I believe they are an American company. She seems to like them very much and I can even cram one and a half pill into one treat.

I tried one from Animed, pill putty or something, and she ate the first few and then decided ,no way!

The other medication cyclosporine is a liquid and I just syringe that directly into the mouth. She still wriggles and moans, but I think I'm used to doing it now, a lot more than she is!

Regarding the anaemia ,I really don't think so, but I can't be sure. Every blood test since February, and she's had quite a few, have never shown any signs of anaemia and I do check her gums and nose, also her respiration rate, because it was the anaemia that nearly killed her back in February. I'm glad your other cat is ok. It is good to keep a close eye if you know its present, because if it gets to the point where they need a blood transfusion ,it can start getting very complex. 

As I say though I cannot be 100% sure because it could dip in between blood tests without me knowing and then go back up again, I don't know how it works.

The thing we can't seem to get on top of with any consistency is the neutrophil count.

Last time it was normal, but that was with a lot of heavy medication .I just fear now the prednisone has been reduced, the neutrophil count will drop yet again and I do believe that can cause severe lethargy.

Chewie tonight helping me with the bedding again lol


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Are these gums normal enough ? I'm getting beside myself with worry. I'm stressed about afew things so I worry more. But concerned about her strange behaviour and I'm thinking oh god is she anemic again  

Afew gum shows towards the end of video.


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

It’s really hard to see. I have a feeling it’s more tricky because she’s got a white mouth as well. I know that fur colour affects the skin colour in the mouth. 

I think you may just have to go on her behaviour - if she’s eating ok, going to the loo ok, cleaning and showing interest in stuff then I prob wouldn’t worry too much.


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

And just to throw a random thought out there…recently I’ve had all four of my cats do a blood test for one reason or another. Would you believe that every single one has had low nutraphils. When one came back we thought it was a strange anomaly (literally everything else was fine). Then the next did and the next…we have concluded it has to be either the vets machine or the fact they are indoors (no idea of the relevance here) or it’s a weird MC trait. None are related though. 

Not sure whether this helps or hinders tbh but I would be taking the whole of her bloods into account and not just the neutraphils on their own.


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## bluesunbeam (Oct 21, 2021)

huckybuck said:


> And just to throw a random thought out there…recently I’ve had all four of my cats do a blood test for one reason or another. Would you believe that every single one has had low nutraphils.


Smudge has been poorly for the last 12 days and i got a complete blood panel done just to be on the safe side.The only abnormality was a slightly low neutraphil level (not for the first time) and the vet explained that even a very short duration of exposure to acute stress situations like having blood taken, can drop the neutraphil levels enough to show up in the result as a low reading. He said unless there were other reasons to suspect problems either from the other blood results or physical or behavioural manifestations of abnormalities they would discount there being any significance in the low neutraphil count because it is a well documented phenomena. I thought it all sounded a bit unlikely and found it difficult to believe that a short exposure to stress could produce such a quick response in the immune system but have found several articles about this same effect in humans.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

huckybuck said:


> And just to throw a random thought out there…recently I’ve had all four of my cats do a blood test for one reason or another. Would you believe that every single one has had low nutraphils. When one came back we thought it was a strange anomaly (literally everything else was fine). Then the next did and the next…we have concluded it has to be either the vets machine or the fact they are indoors (no idea of the relevance here) or it’s a weird MC trait. None are related though.
> 
> Not sure whether this helps or hinders tbh but I would be taking the whole of her bloods into account and not just the neutraphils on their own.


In this instance she has actually been diagnosed with a condition (pimn) and it might be worth clarifying when I refer to her having low neutrophils she literally doesn't have any. It's not just low but shockingly low.

I always know the outcome of her blood tests before I even see results as she presents very ill whenever her neutrophils are low.

Interestingly she's an indoor.

My vet did note machines can be way off in the practices

At the moment I don't know if her illness is playing up or she's just reacting to the steroid reduction (withdrawal)

It all gets very confusing


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

I think as long as they are eating normally, going to the loo normally 1 and 2, grooming and not shying away from stuff (basically their routine is the same) but they seem more tired then I wouldn’t worry too much. However if one of those other things are out of kilter then I’d take note.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

huckybuck said:


> I think as long as they are eating normally, going to the loo normally 1 and 2, grooming and not shying away from stuff (basically their routine is the same) but they seem more tired then I wouldn’t worry too much. However if one of those other things are out of kilter then I’d take note.


Id agree but Chewie isn't ticking those boxes 

Low appetite ,rarely grooms and sits in another room


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)




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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Sometimes you just have to trust your instincts.

I'm glad this vet is being more proactive than the last one.

Keep on fighting Chewie.


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

That’s sad that it’s caused her anaemia again but good that she’s regenerating. Glad you got her checked and upped the pred as it seems to have been the right thing to do. I hope she perks up now.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)




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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Well done Chewie, you’re getting there, all be it slowly, but you will get there. Slow but sure eh @Karl43? She’s such a pretty cat and she sure is a little fighter 😀. I’m pleased you bought your appointment forward, so you know where you are with it all. Keep those piccies coming please.


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Your instincts were right Karl. I hope she picks up now she’s back on the right dose


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TriTri said:


> Well done Chewie, you’re getting there, all be it slowly, but you will get there. Slow but sure eh @Karl43? She’s such a pretty cat and she sure is a little fighter 😀. I’m pleased you bought your appointment forward, so you know where you are with it all. Keep those piccies coming please.


I never thought of it like that. It actually is progress. 7.5 MG she was on and the only thing wrong with her was mild anaemia so yes that is progress!

She is back on 10mg just to be safe but the good news is she's becoming more sociable and her gums are turning pink already


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> My vet did note machines can be way off in the practices


That is very useful!


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> That is very useful!


I know ,life-threatening illness and the machines can be way off.

To be fair my new vet prefers to send the samples off.

I think she is doing well again after I put the prednisolone back up. She does not accept pill pocket treats anymore at all ,so I do have to manually pill her but I find it relatively straightforward.


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

Glad to hear she seems a bit better now you have upped the dose. 

I’ve just tried to cut Huck’s steroid inhaler down to once a day as he seemed to be doing so well. But straight away we had a coughing fit in the night again so poor sod is going to have to have it twice!!! Not too much of a hardship for him as it means two lots of butter as well lol!


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

huckybuck said:


> Glad to hear she seems a bit better now you have upped the dose.
> 
> I’ve just tried to cut Huck’s steroid inhaler down to once a day as he seemed to be doing so well. But straight away we had a coughing fit in the night again so poor sod is going to have to have it twice!!! Not too much of a hardship for him as it means two lots of butter as well lol!


 I spoke to my vet because I couldn't understand how she was running around completely well and then I reduce the steroids by 2.5 mg and she goes anaemic.

She explained some ,not all cats, can be extremely sensitive to steroid dosage.

Looks like chewie and huck could both be pretty sensitive to change.

Has huck improved again now? Food and treats are definitely the way to a cat's heart


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

I should know tonight once I’ve given him his second dose again. Hopefully he won’t wake up and cough at 4am. 

At least I know he can’t go any lower than two doses a day now.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

huckybuck said:


> I should know tonight once I’ve given him his second dose again. Hopefully he won’t wake up and cough at 4am.
> 
> At least I know he can’t go any lower than two doses a day now.



All good now I hope? 

Just got back from the vets and they have finally conceded it might be best to just leave chewie on 10 mg of prednisolone for the rest of her life.


Reason being ,every single time we try to reduce it, she takes ill. 

Also I have to take her for blood tests all the time and I think the vet recognises this as quite a hardship.

She did have liver tests due to the high dose of prednisolone and she said her liver is surprisingly absolutely fine and she's quite the little Marvel.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Vets just rang. Very bad news. Anaemia is now pretty bad 18% ,neutrophils plummeting too. Prednisolone has actually now got to go to 15mg a day . 

Talk of possible intensive care , medicinal drips..


All going to hell again


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Oh no!


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Deguslave said:


> Oh no!


I know. Not what I expected


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## 1507601 (Jun 26, 2020)

Oh gosh I'm sorry


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Karl43 said:


> Vets just rang. Very bad news. Anaemia is now pretty bad 18% ,neutrophils plummeting too. Prednisolone has actually now got to go to 15mg a day .
> 
> Talk of possible intensive care , medicinal drips..
> 
> ...


Oh no, so sorry to hear that Karl ☹


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## Mrs Funkin (Mar 12, 2018)

I’m sorry to read this latest Chewie update, Karl. Long term conditions are so hard to manage - not least because cats are researched so much less than dogs.

Is she home with you currently? I hope so and I hope the 15mg helps her enough to enable you to get your head around things and time to process what to do and what exactly is going on.

Sending Chewie lots of love xx


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## Charity (Apr 17, 2013)

Oh no, that's not the news we wanted. So sorry Karl . Is this the lowest level she's been?


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

I'm so sorry @Karl43 

I know I've mentioned it before but would it be worth just having a conversation with your vet about chlorambucil? I have no idea if it would be appropriate in Chewie's case but i think it is worth having the conversation to see what they think.

Hopefully you can reduce back down to 10mg in a couple of weeks xxx


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

That's very sad to hear; so sorry to hear this. It's so depressing when you are doing the best you can and seeing no improvement.


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

Oh I am so sorry to hear this. I know you will do what you can to stabilise her again. Everything crossed this can be done quickly and she responds well.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

huckybuck said:


> Oh I am so sorry to hear this. I know you will do what you can to stabilise her again. Everything crossed this can be done quickly and she responds well.


Thank you. I'm really not happy she's been put on 15 mg. I didn't really like her being on 10 , but if it helps. 


TonyG said:


> Oh no, so sorry to hear that Karl ☹


Thanks Tony. I was beside myself last night. Copious amounts of alcohol and tears in equal measure.


Mrs Funkin said:


> I’m sorry to read this latest Chewie update, Karl. Long term conditions are so hard to manage - not least because cats are researched so much less than dogs.
> 
> Is she home with you currently? I hope so and I hope the 15mg helps her enough to enable you to get your head around things and time to process what to do and what exactly is going on.
> 
> Sending Chewie lots of love xx


She is home. The vet said ideally they would like to refer her for further tests but she said at this point she didn't want to stress Chewie or myself.

I think my vet is starting to suspect something else is going on. 

She is still regenerating but the immune system is hell bent on destroying everything as fast as it can be regenerated.

There really doesn't seem to be a pattern, as she's been brilliant on 10 mg before ,she's been ill on 10mg before and now she's really ill on 10mg!

My vet is doing a lot of corresponding today and is going to get back to me later today.

She said she knows my insurance doesn't renew until the end of September so she wants to try and help me just keep her stable until then because she knows I'm not really financially capable of making any huge decisions at the moment, particularly after all of the money that has been spent.



Charity said:


> Oh no, that's not the news we wanted. So sorry Karl . Is this the lowest level she's been?


Thank you. It's the lowest it's been since she was first diagnosed and hospitalised. She went into the hospital and her anaemia blood levels were I think 14%. I remember when they released her back in February they got them up to 18% which is what they are today.


GingerNinja said:


> I'm so sorry @Karl43
> 
> I know I've mentioned it before but would it be worth just having a conversation with your vet about chlorambucil? I have no idea if it would be appropriate in Chewie's case but i think it is worth having the conversation to see what they think.
> 
> Hopefully you can reduce back down to 10mg in a couple of weeks xxx


Thank you 

I am sorry I never thought to ask. I'll make a note of it and run it by the vet. I hope it can be reduced again too because the last thing I want to happen is for her to develop a quick tolerance.


She's been at her water bowl non-stop for the past 15 minutes now so I know the anaemia is proper taking hold





Calvine said:


> That's very sad to hear; so sorry to hear this. It's so depressing when you are doing the best you can and seeing no improvement.


 Definitely. I was just absolutely beside myself last night .I went to see a friend and just burst into tears then I got ridiculously drunk then I came home and burst into tears again hysterically for about 20-minutes.

I really don't know what I would do without chewie


huckybuck said:


> Oh I am so sorry to hear this. I know you will do what you can to stabilise her again. Everything crossed this can be done quickly and she responds well.


Thank you ,yes we can only try .I'll do what I can.

She's had her first dose of 15 mg now and I'm to continue with the cyclosporine

She is guzzling water today like it's going out of fashion ,which is not a good sign


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

My vet has spoken to the specialist at the hospital today. She's ringing me later with the verdict


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## Mrs Funkin (Mar 12, 2018)

Oh Karl. All paws and fingers crossed here. 

(I know it's no help but Oscar has been on 10mg Pred for almost three years now, just in case she needs to stay on a higher dose forever, please try not to worry about that xx)


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Mrs Funkin said:


> Oh Karl. All paws and fingers crossed here.
> 
> (I know it's no help but Oscar has been on 10mg Pred for almost three years now, just in case she needs to stay on a higher dose forever, please try not to worry about that xx)


It actually does help because it's always been a worry this place helps a lot and it's always my go-to ,because everybody on here are the only people that really seem to understand .

They did a liver function test on chewie because of the pred and they said her liver is absolutely fine, which I think is why they nudged it up to 15mg.


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

I think that we have all been in similar situations or can at least empathise because we know how we would feel if it was our beloved pet in that predicament.

Unfortunately I'm one of the ones that had been there, as you know  I'm a bit rubbish as checking all threads but please pm me if you want to offload xx


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Even worse news now . I'm sorry for all that are emotionally involved in this.


The specialist has said he doesn't feel 15mg of prednisolone would be beneficial and chewies 
deterioration is now a negative prognostic factor for her full recovery.


@GingerNinja I don't need to have a conversation about the Chlorambucil as funnily enough that's exactly what they want to put her on now. 2mg every other day. Thankyou for the offer of pm 


I'm starting to feel this is the beginning of the end


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## bluesunbeam (Oct 21, 2021)

Very sad to read that Karl43. I won't say 'don't give up hope' because i know you won't ever give up on beautiful Chewie unless there is no other real choice. Thinking of you and Chewie and hoping for a positive reaction to the Chlorambucil.


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Karl43 said:


> Even worse news now . I'm sorry for all that are emotionally involved in this.
> 
> 
> The specialist has said he doesn't feel 15mg of prednisolone would be beneficial and chewies
> ...


Oh bloody hell, so sorry Karl. I had hoped they might have been able to give you a glimmer of good news.
Fingers and paws crossed the new drug will help.


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

Karl43 said:


> It actually does help because it's always been a worry this place helps a lot and it's always my go-to ,because everybody on here are the only people that really seem to understand .
> 
> They did a liver function test on chewie because of the pred and they said her liver is absolutely fine, which I think is why they nudged it up to 15mg.


@Karl43, I’ve had a few cats kept alive and happy by the use of steroids. Not everyone likes using them, but I consider them much more often than not, a real God-send, and I thank them for keeping my cats alive.

I’m just wondering about Chewie’s kidneys; did the vet comment on her kidneys at all? I’m so sorry you’re on this rollercoaster ride and I hope she picks up quickly on the new dose, bless her.

Edit: oh no, I’ve only just found your last update. Fingers crossed the new meds help. I’m glad your vet sounds on the ball. Come on Chewie, we all need you better xx


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TriTri said:


> @Karl43, I’ve had a few cats kept alive and happy by the use of steroids. Not everyone likes using them, but I consider them much more often than not, a real God-send, and I thank them for keeping my cats alive.
> 
> I’m just wondering about Chewie’s kidneys; did the vet comment on her kidneys at all? I’m so sorry you’re on this rollercoaster ride and I hope she picks up quickly on the new dose, bless her.
> 
> Edit: oh no, I’ve only just found your last update. Fingers crossed the new meds help. I’m glad your vet sounds on the ball. Come on Chewie, we all need you better xx


Hi I made another post above and to clarify the specialist does not want her on 15 mg so he said keep her on 10 because he seems to believe 15 won't be of benefit and he's given a poor prognosis at this point. They are changing the drug altogether and want her off prednisolone.

Her kidneys have never been mentioned.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> Hi I made another post above and to clarify the specialist does not want her on 15 mg so he said keep her on 10 because he seems to believe 15 won't be of benefit and he's given a poor prognosis at this point. They are changing the drug altogether and want her off prednisolone.
> 
> Her kidneys have never been mentioned.


 I'm so sorry to hear things are not improving - out of interest, how is Chewie herself? Is she acting normally, good appetite etc? I remember she went through a phase when you thought she seemed absolutely miserable.


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

I have everything crossed she responds to the new drug. Come on Chewie xxx


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> I'm so sorry to hear things are not improving - out of interest, how is Chewie herself? Is she acting normally, good appetite etc? I remember she went through a phase when you thought she seemed absolutely miserable.


No she's notably ill. No appetite and just sitting in the corner in the bedroom now


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

Karl43 said:


> Hi I made another post above and to clarify the specialist does not want her on 15 mg so he said keep her on 10 because he seems to believe 15 won't be of benefit and he's given a poor prognosis at this point. They are changing the drug altogether and want her off prednisolone.
> 
> Her kidneys have never been mentioned.


They should keep her on the pred alongside the chlorambucil, at least for a couple of months until she stabilises and then tapering off can begin. I expect that is what you meant anyway 
Luna was on pred for months after the course of chlorambucil finished - about 6 months, tapering for about 4 months.

Chewie will not want to interact as she must feel very poorly with that PCV. I used to give Luna whatever she wanted, Lickelix/treats etc. just so she ate something.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

GingerNinja said:


> They should keep her on the pred alongside the chlorambucil, at least for a couple of months until she stabilises and then tapering off can begin. I expect that is what you meant anyway
> Luna was on pred for months after the course of chlorambucil finished - about 6 months, tapering for about 4 months.
> 
> Chewie will not want to interact as she must feel very poorly with that PCV. I used to give Luna whatever she wanted, Lickelix/treats etc. just so she ate something.


Yes that is what I meant,they are keeping her on the prednisolone and looking to taper providing the Chlorambucil is effective. 

They are also keeping her on the cyclosporine, however I am sceptical as to whether that does anything whatsoever.

I took her a dreamie stick ( they make sticks now, they are new!) Into the bedroom and broke it up next to her and she started purring her head off

Even so,she's clearly unwell as she just sticks to that one spot in the corner of the bedroom and her very bright pink ears are now white.

Interestingly, her respiration is 24.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

She's moved out of the corner and seemed happy to see me as she changed position and rolled over










This is part of the report from the specialist way back in February. Is it just me or does he oh so delicately hint at the remote possibility she could have lymphoma???


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

It’s difficult to determine from that report - I read it that he’s saying the patterns could be similar but he thinks it’s unlikely. 
I don’t know what PARR analysis is tbh. Is this something she could have done?


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

huckybuck said:


> It’s difficult to determine from that report - I read it that he’s saying the patterns could be similar but he thinks it’s unlikely.
> I don’t know what PARR analysis is tbh. Is this something she could have done?


She could have it done but at this moment I don't feel comfortable putting her through the stress.

She's already going to be given a chemotherapy drug soon.


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

You know what’s right for her Karl. And I agree when she’s already poorly more stress won’t help.

I have everything crossed she’ll respond quickly to the new drugs.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

huckybuck said:


> You know what’s right for her Karl. And I agree when she’s already poorly more stress won’t help.
> 
> I have everything crossed she’ll respond quickly to the new drugs.


 the new drug has been ordered but doesn't look like it's arriving until next Tuesday . If I'm honest it really looks like she's began the dying process now and I'm not sure whether she will make next Tuesday


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Karl43 said:


> the new drug has been ordered but doesn't look like it's arriving until next Tuesday . If I'm honest it really looks like she's began the dying process now and I'm not sure whether she will make next Tuesday


Fingers crossed mate and keep trying to get her to eat something if you can.

If needs be can she be stabilised in hospital until they can start getting the new drug into her?
Not that we ever want to put them through that but it might help.


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

Oh stay strong Karl. Cats can look really poorly and still pull through. Chewie is a fighter and she has a life with you she loves. Keep her warm, hydrated and rested and tempt her with whatever she’ll eat. At this stage I give them anything to get food down whatever you think she’ll eat. She will feel tired so let her sleep too. 

Have the vets suggested a blood transfusion? Is this possible? Would it help her?

I will send every positive thought I can her way.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TonyG said:


> Fingers crossed mate and keep trying to get her to eat something if you can.
> 
> If needs be can she be stabilised in hospital until they can start getting the new drug into her?
> Not that we ever want to put them through that but it might help.


At this point Tony I just don't think I would do it. chewie needs a bit of dignity and peace and quiet.

I too need some peace and some normality. I'm still going around trying to pick up the financial pieces from February.

My insurance still hasn't renewed and hospitalisation is on average £1,000 per day.

I will have to put myself into even deeper debt through credit cards and/or loans.

All to prolong her life( her poor quality life may I add) for a few weeks maybe a few months at best.

I love her dearly but I'm getting to the point I need to draw a line somewhere. I've already been told her prognosis is very poor.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

huckybuck said:


> Oh stay strong Karl. Cats can look really poorly and still pull through. Chewie is a fighter and she has a life with you she loves. Keep her warm, hydrated and rested and tempt her with whatever she’ll eat. At this stage I give them anything to get food down whatever you think she’ll eat. She will feel tired so let her sleep too.
> 
> Have the vets suggested a blood transfusion? Is this possible? Would it help her?
> 
> I will send every positive thought I can her way.


I was just talking about that with a friend and I think a blood transfusion would be completely futile. 

She's just going to be traumatised by the hospital, we get the fresh blood into her and her immune system is just going to immediately resume destroying all of the red blood cells.

It's just going to delay the inevitable by about 2 to 3 weeks given I've been told her prognosis is now very poor. 

I'm not giving up on her and of course it's not just about money even though that's a factor but it's more about her quality of life and keeping her comfortable and listening to what the specialist is trying to say to me.

All of the treatments cost £5,000 and then with veterinary appointments and medicines that comes to around £200 a month.

I've been told a full recovery is implausible, so I can throw money around to extend her life from week to week but who would I really be doing that for.


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Karl43 said:


> At this point Tony I just don't think I would do it. chewie needs a bit of dignity and peace and quiet.
> 
> I too need some peace and some normality. I'm still going around trying to pick up the financial pieces from February.
> 
> ...


The sad face was for the situation, not your reply 
I really feel for you. I was in a similar situation last year although Fuzzy went downhill a lot faster than we expected, after we thought he’d actually turned a corner.

It’s a horrible horrible situation and you’re wise to consider her quality of life as well as putting her through more treatment - I must admit I struggled to see it that way, all I wanted to do was fight the damn thing. But as you say, I can be honest enough to admit that was probably more for me than for him.

Easier said than done but try not to give up all hope just yet. Let’s hope a small miracle happens and she rallies enough for the new meds to do some good.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

TonyG said:


> The sad face was for the situation, not your reply
> I really feel for you. I was in a similar situation last year although Fuzzy went downhill a lot faster than we expected, after we thought he’d actually turned a corner.
> 
> It’s a horrible horrible situation and you’re wise to consider her quality of life as well as putting her through more treatment - I must admit I struggled to see it that way, all I wanted to do was fight the damn thing. But as you say, I can be honest enough to admit that was probably more for me than for him.
> ...


If the vet's looked at me and said we can absolutely 100-percent cure her and she will live a long happy wonderful life ,well Id pay £20,000 probably more.

The sad reality is this just isn't going to happen. I've already been told if the new drug does work it will likely only work temporarily.

Everything at the moment is about extending her life by weeks and maybe months at a time and I'd be doing that for myself,probably out of selfishness because I don't want to lose her.

I can't argue her quality of life is absolutely appalling to put it mildly.

She's grossly lethargic ,sits in one spot all day, she's now developed constipation ,she's vomited 3 times which seems to be a new symptom. The only joy in life she gets is a few dreamies every now and again.

My heart wants to keep fighting ,but my head is saying stop.

I completely empathize when you said with fuzzy you thought you had turned a corner as chewie not that long ago was in a full remission. It's a rollercoaster and really messes with your head.


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## bluesunbeam (Oct 21, 2021)

Anybody that has followed the journey that you and Chewie have been on Karl knows that you would sell your soul if you honestly thought there was a realistic chance that your beautiful girl could enjoy a worthwhile life. However if your specialist is saying it's the right thing to do to say goodbye then that is the path to take and you should take it without any regret or feelings of guilt. The contrast between you and some of the awful and unthinkingly callous,selfish people that have posted about their sick animals is light-years. Chewie is lucky to have you and you have been lucky to have Chewie even if it turns out to be a fleeting relationship in this life.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

bluesunbeam said:


> Anybody that has followed the journey that you and Chewie have been on Karl knows that you would sell your soul if you honestly thought there was a realistic chance that your beautiful girl could enjoy a worthwhile life. However if your specialist is saying it's the right thing to do to say goodbye then that is the path to take and you should take it without any regret or feelings of guilt. The contrast between you and some of the awful and unthinkingly callous,selfish people that have posted about their sick animals is light-years. Chewie is lucky to have you and you have been lucky to have Chewie even if it turns out to be a fleeting relationship in this life.


 thank you ,that honestly means a lot to me. Some of my so-called friends have been quite callous and have said some terrible things to me.

One of my so-called friends even suggested I open the front door and let her out and shut the door behind her.

Other friends have said why on earth would you spend five grand on a cat, just put her down.

One of my neighbours jumped to my defence on Facebook which I found quite heartwarming especially the things she said :-


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## bluesunbeam (Oct 21, 2021)

It's reassuring to know you have such a kind, understanding and supportive friend close at hand Karl.


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Karl43 said:


> If the vet's looked at me and said we can absolutely 100-percent cure her and she will live a long happy wonderful life ,well Id pay £20,000 probably more.
> 
> The sad reality is this just isn't going to happen. I've already been told if the new drug does work it will likely only work temporarily.
> 
> ...


Yes it really does, totally agree and I’ve been there too often it seems.

All I’d suggest is be guided by Chewie. If and only if, you can extend her life by 2-3 months or whatever and they’re good months, or at least more good than bad, then give it serious thought, which I’m sure you will.

Truly gutted for you as she does seem to be heading the other way, in which case you know what’s best for her.

I’d also say don’t lock your head into a decision just yet, take each day as it comes and when you know, you’ll know, if that makes any sense?
It doesn’t seem as if there’s a road back, sadly, but cherish whatever time you’ve got with her, which I know you will, and don’t rush into anything.
Don’t drag it out either, but be guided by Chewie and by the vets.

And whatever happens, try and be kind to yourself too, you’ve done your absolute best for her.


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Karl43 said:


> thank you ,that honestly means a lot to me. Some of my so-called friends have been quite callous and have said some terrible things to me.
> 
> One of my so-called friends even suggested I open the front door and let her out and shut the door behind her.
> 
> ...


Lovely words from your friend. As for the others, if it was me, I’d have nothing more to do with them.


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## Mrs Funkin (Mar 12, 2018)

Oh Karl  I’m so sad for you and Chewie. You know her so well, why don’t you have a chat to her and ask her what she wants? Tell her if she is ready to go, that is okay, she just needs to let you know. 

I am hoping for a miracle for you both xx


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> chewie needs a bit of dignity and peace and quiet


That's exactly how I eventually felt with my Beau. I looked through the file I keep on them and was shocked to see the poor guy had been at the vets 18 times in 11 months - no kidding - (once was a big dental too). He was on a cocktail of drugs every day, and he was an absolute angel taking them, never once retaliated and that made me feel worse in a way, that he was so completely good, such a little gentleman that he didn't deserve what I was putting him through. I feel for you, Karl, really I do. You must feel totally overwhelmed. xx


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> One of my so-called friends even suggested I open the front door and let her out and shut the door behind her.


 Unbelievable, but it happens. I know someone whose next-door neighbour died, and, being an animal lover, he was concerned what would happen to her old cat (her constant companion). He's an ex-policeman, and when he heard banging coming from the back of her empty house, went out to investigate in case it was someone breaking in. It was one of her sons nailing up the cat flap, so asked him what would happen to her cat. The son replied that he did not know and cared even less , so he took the cat himself (to add to the two dogs he took when his mother died).


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

Yes I can totally see that Karl. I wouldn’t do anything that wasn’t going to give her the ability and time to recover either. There’s a fine line between quality of life and extending life and only you (and the vets) know what’s best for her. 

I think I was just trying to exhaust all avenues in case something hadn’t been thought of.


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## Little paws (7 mo ago)

Sorry you’re going through this Karl x


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Oh @Karl43! I have nothing new to offer, except to say I'm thinking of you and Chewie.

You know her best, but we're here for you, no matter what happens.


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

Keeping Chewie and you in my thoughts Karl. Xx


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## bluesunbeam (Oct 21, 2021)

How are you and Chewie doing Karl?


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> That's exactly how I eventually felt with my Beau. I looked through the file I keep on them and was shocked to see the poor guy had been at the vets 18 times in 11 months - no kidding - (once was a big dental too). He was on a cocktail of drugs every day, and he was an absolute angel taking them, never once retaliated and that made me feel worse in a way, that he was so completely good, such a little gentleman that he didn't deserve what I was putting him through. I feel for you, Karl, really I do. You must feel totally overwhelmed. xx


18 times, that's crazy . In an ideal world we shouldn't be taking them that many times in a lifetime 

That's got me thinking, so I've looked back at chewies notes. She's been to the vet's 11 times including 2 hospitalisations in 6 months.


bluesunbeam said:


> How are you and Chewie doing Karl?


Hello and thank you for asking. Very little change with chewie. Still very pale. Pale ears, pale gums, extremely lethargic ,low appetite, but at least not getting any worse. Interestingly her respiration is quite healthy at around 24 to 30.

She's probably faring better than I am. I've sunk into a depression and all I want to do is sleep. I've not even been to work for a week, self-employed so I do have that luxury, however I still don't get paid for not going.


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## blackislegirl (Mar 12, 2021)

This such sad reading. It is the hardest, most horrible part of having such a loved animal companion. You have obviously always done your best for her, and always will. Look after yourself too.


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## bluesunbeam (Oct 21, 2021)

At least her red cell count must be staying reasonably stable Karl. Depression is truly awful and impossible to understand unless you have experienced it yourself ; i am sure you have your own coping mechanism to try and deal with it as best you can. I won't comment further other than to say that we are all thinking of you and Chewie.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

bluesunbeam said:


> At least her red cell count must be staying reasonably stable Karl. Depression is truly awful and impossible to understand unless you have experienced it yourself ; i am sure you have your own coping mechanism to try and deal with it as best you can. I won't comment further other than to say that we are all thinking of you and Chewie.


 yes her red cell count must be levelling off thank goodness.

I won't go too much into it but me and chewie have a bit of a backstory which makes all this even more difficult.

I suffer with depression anyway. I have done for many years, but you wouldn't think it because I deal with it really really well . A few years ago I was in a bad relationship and she left and left me in a mess and someone suggested, why don't you get a kitten. I was sceptical at first.

Introducing chewie:-

She gave me a completely new lease of life. She gave me hope and happiness back and unconditional love. She gave me a reason to make something of myself and a reason to smile and get up in the morning. She effectively saved me.

That's why losing her will be all the more tragic and difficult


blackislegirl said:


> This such sad reading. It is the hardest, most horrible part of having such a loved animal companion. You have obviously always done your best for her, and always will. Look after yourself too.


Thank you, I like to think I've done my best for her. Not doing a great job looking after myself though


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

She's just had her first dose of chlorambucil let's see what happens


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

I sent this email to the vet just to throw it out there . I feel better now it's off my chest

Hello again Julie,

I'm just going to get this out there . I do need to have a frank, honest and open discussion with you at some point about when euthanasia becomes morally the right thing to do in chewies case.

My only concern is her quality of life .I think any quantity of life is out of the window if we are both honest.

Sleeping 22 hours a day in a different room to me does not constitute a quality of life for a 2-year old cat in my opinion.

I refuse to just keep throwing money at Chewie in order to extend her life by 2 weeks here or 3 weeks there.

It's not fair on me ,because my quality of life is suffering enormously ( I'm self-employed and I've not even been to work for 9 days because I just feel completely grief-stricken and sick) and it's certainly not fair on Chewie.

If somebody said to me she could be 100% cured and live a long happy life ,I would pay 20- £30,000 to make that happen, but it's unrealistic ,especially after what Mark said.

If we can discuss at the next appointment that would be good.

Karl


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

I'm sorry for the double post but a bit of an update. I'm not going to start doing cartwheels and it might be a wild coincidence but she's had her first dose of chlorambucil and she is a bit brighter than she has been in a while


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

Any glimmer is absolutely fantastic! 

I just read your earlier post and was really sad (totally understand where you are at but it was sad to read) 

So then this - I will be cautiously optimistic.


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Karl43 said:


> I'm sorry for the double post but a bit of an update. I'm not going to start doing cartwheels and it might be a wild coincidence but she's had her first dose of chlorambucil and she is a bit brighter than she has been in a while


Fingers crossed Karl, as said, any glimmer is good news.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

huckybuck said:


> Any glimmer is absolutely fantastic!
> 
> I just read your earlier post and was really sad (totally understand where you are at but it was sad to read)
> 
> So then this - I will be cautiously optimistic.


It was sad for me to write that post. Incidentally as soon as I mentioned the word euthanasia, I've had radio silence from the vets. I touched on the subject even before that email I sent and nothing whatsoever, so I don't know if they've took it the wrong way and think I'm just giving up on her . it's certainly not the case.

I just think any responsible pet owner needs to speak about euthanasia at some point in the journey and put it on the table ,at least for discussion if nothing else.


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

I think you're right to discuss it with the vets, but hopefully the decision will be a long way off yet.

I don't think they think you're giving up on her, they will understand where you're coming from, but they won't want to force the issue, especially as she's just started new meds.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Deguslave said:


> I think you're right to discuss it with the vets, but hopefully the decision will be a long way off yet.
> 
> I don't think they think you're giving up on her, they will understand where you're coming from, but they won't want to force the issue, especially as she's just started new meds.


And that is all I want from them, a discussion. I'm not an expert on these matters by any means. I don't know when "the right time" is and it would be nice to have some input from a professional.

I think what set me off is hearing the words, negative prognosis


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Vets, like doctors, have to err on the side of caution so as not to give false hope.

If its of any help, I once had a vet say to me 'you'll know when its time' and I did, there was no doubt about it. Its that connection you have with your pet which tells you when they've had enough and are ready to go.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Deguslave said:


> Vets, like doctors, have to err on the side of caution so as not to give false hope.
> 
> If its of any help, I once had a vet say to me 'you'll know when its time' and I did, there was no doubt about it. Its that connection you have with your pet which tells you when they've had enough and are ready to go.


I think sometimes due to the nature of her illness it can be so confusing. One minute she is seriously ill and then she can perk up out of the blue.

The last time I spoke to the vet all I heard was, hospitalisations ,drips ,expensive medications

And today she's bright  

The whole thing really messes with my mind


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

I know, I've had that particular roller coaster with several pets, and it just drains you.


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

I'm sorry I've not been on much since last week @Karl43 , and somehow with the new forum layout I miss things that I thought I was following 

With hindsight, and looking at my posts on here from when Luna was ill, I was constantly doing what you are doing. Reading things into the slightest little thing that she did/didn't do (not that I am saying that you are wrong), but it is exhausting mentally. I had the same dilemma about quality of life and actually rang my vet to advise that I wouldn't be bringing her in but that I was beginning tapering off the steroids, because she seemed so tired with life and was living in her cave bed. I know exactly how you feel and know that you too will do what is best for Chewie 🤗

Give her a few weeks to see how she responds to the new drug, then you can re-evaluate.

I wish I was better at expressing myself but I really do send you and Chewie all the love and best wishes in the world. x


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

I am so glad to hear she bright again. 

I do think a talk about euthanasia when a pet is quite well (it’s not imminent) and emotions are level is actually best practice. 

I have had a brief chat with my vets during a routine vaccination because I had one very bad experience (it was putting me off the thought of it ever again) and I needed to know it wasn’t the norm.

I think it’s perfectly reasonable to have a discussion about it at some point and it’s a responsible thing to do as a pet owner. I would hope that the vets get back to you with a phonecall and talk you through it. If not I might be looking at speaking to a different vet.


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## Mrs Funkin (Mar 12, 2018)

I agree @huckybuck - I think many pets need to be PTS, vs dying naturally. We know it’s a possibility, especially when a beloved animal has a condition. I think it’s only sensible to have that conversation (and in fact I have said to our vet to please let me know if she thinks I am going too far. She has promised me that she will).

All that said, Karl, I’m so glad to read that she is perkier. Long may that particular trend continue!


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

GingerNinja said:


> I'm sorry I've not been on much since last week @Karl43 , and somehow with the new forum layout I miss things that I thought I was following
> 
> With hindsight, and looking at my posts on here from when Luna was ill, I was constantly doing what you are doing. Reading things into the slightest little thing that she did/didn't do (not that I am saying that you are wrong), but it is exhausting mentally. I had the same dilemma about quality of life and actually rang my vet to advise that I wouldn't be bringing her in but that I was beginning tapering off the steroids, because she seemed so tired with life and was living in her cave bed. I know exactly how you feel and know that you too will do what is best for Chewie 🤗
> 
> ...


You express yourself just fine honestly. I think there's only so much expression that can be demonstrated via text.


I've still not heard from the vet, which I'm starting to find incredibly concerning. Maybe they don't believe in euthanasia until the very last moment, but there is no way I'm watching chewie have an anaemic crisis and start gasping for her breath and collapsing all over the place. When she passes away I want it to be peaceful and pain free.




huckybuck said:


> I am so glad to hear she bright again.
> 
> I do think a talk about euthanasia when a pet is quite well (it’s not imminent) and emotions are level is actually best practice.
> 
> ...


Thanks for that .I think we are on the same wavelength and it's nice to hear you understand my viewpoint on it.

Like you say, I think it's best to think about these things whilst our pets are still reasonably well and not until the very last minute. I do like to prepare and I know exactly what I'm going to do and what I want when she does pass away .I've got all that planned out.

I still feel that if she could speak English to me she would say, can you please just let me sleep and not wake me up because I'm fed up.

Having said that, she earlier successfully hunted down a fly and gobbled it right up. Is that enough? No .But in my head it says she still has a tiny little zest for life ,or ...would she do that regardless as it is a cats predatory instinct?

When I say she's brighter, I do mean it in the most rudimentary sense




Mrs Funkin said:


> I agree @huckybuck - I think many pets need to be PTS, vs dying naturally. We know it’s a possibility, especially when a beloved animal has a condition. I think it’s only sensible to have that conversation (and in fact I have said to our vet to please let me know if she thinks I am going too far. She has promised me that she will).
> 
> All that said, Karl, I’m so glad to read that she is perkier. Long may that particular trend continue!


I agree and I think if she died naturally, as in succumbed to her illness, it would just not be pretty. It would either be death from anaemia, which looks horrendous, or death from secondary infection as a result of low neutrophil count.

I don't think there is anything peaceful about what she has ,so I simply must think about euthanasia.


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

I am against over treating animals because they do not understand what is going on. I can only tell you what I have experienced, and Luna was very much acting like chewie, and say that as long as she is not suffering/in pain then it is worth waiting a few weeks to give the new drugs a shot xx


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> She's just had her first dose of chlorambucil let's see what happens


Hopefully some positive response, Karl. I used to find it annoying when, like in your case, a vet decided Chewie might well benefit from x, y or z med then tells you they can't get it for another 2, 3 or 4 days during which time you are biting your nails and praying there is no delay. I can see in Chewie's case it's likely a drug not in general use, but mine was for a cat with HT ( a common enough condition) who had gone blind with high BP (also a common side effect of high BP with HT) which could have been treated with Amlodipine and might well have restored some of her vision - they took days to get it, despite my having paid for it well in advance. Hope it's having some effect?? XX


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> Hopefully some positive response, Karl. I used to find it annoying when, like in your case, a vet decided Chewie might well benefit from x, y or z med then tells you they can't get it for another 2, 3 or 4 days during which time you are biting your nails and praying there is no delay. I can see in Chewie's case it's likely a drug not in general use, but mine was for a cat with HT ( a common enough condition) who had gone blind with high BP (also a common side effect of high BP with HT) which could have been treated with Amlodipine and might well have restored some of her vision - they took days to get it, despite my having paid for it well in advance. Hope it's having some effect?? XX


I think it is that which sent me down the rabbit hole a bit. On one hand they were saying she was really really ill, yet on the other hand they were saying ,well you can't have the new meds for 5-days.

Worse yet ,they never contacted me to tell me they had arrived at the practice. I had to actually go out of my way to ask them and they said, oh yes they are here to pick up

The drug she is on is a chemotherapy primarily given to patients with lymphoma, so probably not commonly prescribed.

Oh my goodness your cat went blind ?? The poor little one 

This drug is making a marginal difference. She was sat on the floor at the end of the bed practically all day every day. She has stopped doing that now


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

Showing interest, catching and gobbling a fly is definitely a good sign. The cats that I have had to PTS would never have done that. 
I’m not even sure Huck would be interested in a fly now lol But there are other signs he shows of stuff that does interest him thank goodness!


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> I think it is that which sent me down the rabbit hole a bit. On one hand they were saying she was really really ill, yet on the other hand they were saying ,well you can't have the new meds for 5-days.
> 
> Worse yet ,they never contacted me to tell me they had arrived at the practice. I had to actually go out of my way to ask them and they said, oh yes they are here to pick up
> 
> ...


Yes, blindness is a common side effect of high BP which is a common side effect of HT - but the Amlodipine does restore their vision up to a point, not perfectly, but well enough that they can see shapes and not walk into walls etc. She did start to see things again, whereas she'd been as blind as a bat before. I think these drugs sometimes have a short date - I remember looking at the (two pages long!!) dental bill for one of mine and all the drugs listed had an expiry date, which in almost every case was short - so I guess they won't overstock, even on the more common meds or they'll likely be stuck with something they can't use? Glad to hear that Chewie has livened up to a point - is she eating well? - I always think that's one of the main things that give you hope.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Just had a response from the vet who says the kindest next step if this drug doesn't work will be to euthanize


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

@Calvine no she is not eating well at all her appetite is pretty awful. Also what she has started doing now if I give her a treat she chomps down on it and let's half of it land on the floor without actually consuming it.

Her third eyelid is showing for very long periods now and has been constipated for a while as well.

At this point I want to make this post and say thank you to everybody for the incredible support and people that donated a while back towards chewies care. 

I've decided it will be in her best interest and my best interest as well to have her euthanized.

This may happen as early as next week. My vet is off work until Wednesday, so I may try to get her in Wednesday.

Due to her hatred of cyclosporine and it repeatedly makes her sick because of the taste I'm considering withdrawing the cyclosporine treatment, not that anything is working anyway. 

I also want to offer my condolences to anybody that has followed my story and is upset by this.

I feel like I've done my best for her. I'd put myself in a ridiculous amount of debt, I've sold items beloved to me to raise funds, I've invested a lot of emotion and risked my own mental health.

My chewie is miserable and this is not the life I envisioned for her when I first got her. 

I'm sorry


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Oh heavens, Karl, that's not what you want to hear. Saying that, I have five of them here, and apart from breakfast, not one of them has moved and inch in this heat; in fact they have all gone back to the exact place they were lying comatose for the past two days. Hope you see some improvement when the weather cools down. 
ETA Our posts just crossed . . . we are all praying for a miracle. It's so unfair. XX


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

I'm so sorry Karl.
Keeping Chewie and you in my thoughts. Xxx


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

I’m so sad and sorry to read this update @Karl43 

I really was hoping the new drug would see some improvement.

You know what’s best for Chewie (I’m assuming you’ve looked at the Quality of Life scale posted by Ceiling Kitty?) and I know you have her best interests at heart.

I hope that there is a turnaround for her but if not then I will definitely be thinking of you both on Wednesday.

I know you will but make her feel loved and safe and cared for til then.

Take care.









Time to say farewell?


I was looking through some of my old copies of JFSM yesterday and 're-stumbled' across the AAFP Position Statement on feline hospice/palliative care, which contained information I thought might be useful on here. I've jiggled it around a bit and added some of my own thoughts - I hope others will...




www.petforums.co.uk


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

huckybuck said:


> I’m so sad and sorry to read this update @Karl43
> 
> I really was hoping the new drug would see some improvement.
> 
> ...


33


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

I'm sorry @Karl43 we are here to support you and know that you will do whatever is in the best interest for your Chewie
I absolutely agree to not giving her meds that make her sick at this time. Let her be and give her lots of cuddles xx


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## Mrs Funkin (Mar 12, 2018)

I’m so gutted for you Karl, I know you’ve done everything you can for your beloved girl. I shall continue to send love and positive thoughts xx


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## lorilu (Sep 6, 2009)

No one could have done more for your precious Chewie. I, too, would stop the nasty meds. Why cause her more stress. When it's Love and Cheese Danish time, comfort meds, yes, all others can be put aside. xx


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

I am so very very sorry @Karl43. I doubt you could have done more.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Thank you for your input everybody and can I apologise if any of my responses seem curt at this time.

I am going to continue with the prednisolone for the simple fact it would probably send her into some sort of deepening of her anaemic crisis if I stopped it, amongst potential other issues.

I'm also going to continue with the chlorambucil because it seems to give her a little boost.

All of these drugs are tablets and whilst she perhaps doesn't find it pleasant, it's only a matter of swallowing a tablet once a day.

The cyclosporine is a different matter. Firstly, I've never been convinced of its effectiveness.

And secondly it's a liquid , it's just so nasty and she's vomited on numerous occasions immediately after it has been administered.

It also can cause a 24-hour nausea and irritations in the mouth which I think are happening. It also has to be administered twice a day

Based on my own opinion and now the supportive opinions of a few people on here, I will be stopping the cyclosporine entirely as of today.


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## Little paws (7 mo ago)

I’m so sorry to hear this Karl. You have done everything possible for Chewie. I will be thinking if you both. Take care x


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> Thank you for your input everybody and can I apologise if any of my responses seem curt at this time.
> 
> I am going to continue with the prednisolone for the simple fact it would probably send her into some sort of deepening of her anaemic crisis if I stopped it, amongst potential other issues.
> 
> ...


Just out of interest, Karl - did the vet give you any idea how soon you might expect to see an improvement with the most recent meds (chlorambucil)?


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Calvine said:


> Just out of interest, Karl - did the vet give you any idea how soon you might expect to see an improvement with the most recent meds (chlorambucil)?


None whatsoever ,however with these drugs its usually between 2 and 4 weeks ,4 weeks being optimum in my experience.

The last 24-hours she has shown tiny little sparks nothing big and I'm not doing cartwheels but as it stands right now this second ,I would not be comfortable euthanizing her at all.

I still realise she's not going to recover .I've been told by people that know what they're talking about like the specialist and I'm staying pessimistic ,but I'm not rushing into any euthanasia based on the last 24-hours. I'll just bullet point a few things

Purrs when stroked or cuddled
Drinks normally
Urinates in the litterbox normally
Appetite not great but will eat treats enthusiastically
Greets me when I come home and takes interest in my shopping bags 
Since taking her off the cyclosporine presenting far more relaxed


She is due a blood test on the 23rd as that will be 2 weeks ,but I am not taking her for that blood test. Reason being I think 2 weeks is too early also she hates the vets so why stress her when she is relaxed enough at home


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## Mrs Funkin (Mar 12, 2018)

That's a good update Karl. FWIW I agree about the bloods - if it would change the treatment plan, than fine, do it. If the plan doesn't change as a result of those bloods and it is still the same meds and you closely monitoring Chewie, then I'd also not do it.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Mrs Funkin said:


> That's a good update Karl. FWIW I agree about the bloods - if it would change the treatment plan, than fine, do it. If the plan doesn't change as a result of those bloods and it is still the same meds and you closely monitoring Chewie, then I'd also not do it.


This is the thing, if I do the bloods on the 23rd if there's no improvement they are just going to say euthanize. If there is improvement they are just going to say continue what you're doing.

I'm just monitoring her ,checking her respiration, checking her appetite and general mood.


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

Mrs Funkin said:


> That's a good update Karl. FWIW I agree about the bloods - if it would change the treatment plan, than fine, do it. If the plan doesn't change as a result of those bloods and it is still the same meds and you closely monitoring Chewie, then I'd also not do it.


I 100% agree with this! I never again took Luna to get bloods done after I decided to taper the steroids because it would not have changed anything. Either she was doing well, or she wasn't. I was not willing to put her through any more stress.

@Karl43 just love your girl now, I promise you that you will know what to do xxx


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

I’m glad to hear there are some sparks Karl.
All those things you mentioned are all reasons to think she’s not ready to go just yet. 
Showing interest in anything esp shopping bags is very good. As is purring when cuddled and coming to greet you. None of the cats I had to PTS would have done any of that.

I agree with GN her happiness is imp at this stage and I am sure that if/when the time comes you will know. But as you said it doesn’t sound like it’s quite yet which is wonderful to hear.


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

@Karl43 you know her best and you have such a strong bond between you that you will both know when the time is right.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> None whatsoever ,however with these drugs its usually between 2 and 4 weeks ,4 weeks being optimum in my experience.
> 
> The last 24-hours she has shown tiny little sparks nothing big and I'm not doing cartwheels but as it stands right now this second ,I would not be comfortable euthanizing her at all.
> 
> ...


I was hoping you would say that, and mainly why I asked the question. When the Drama Queen and previous DQs were diagnosed with HT, the blood test after starting meds was three weeks (more if you couldn't make it, but not less). When I insisted that a T4 of 10 was causing her to be lethargic (and, I suspected, HypoT) they reluctantly agreed to lower the dose to 5 (they knew that I'd do it myself anyway if they didn't agree). Their parting shot was that if it was lowered she'd need another BT (£165) in yes, you guessed, three weeks after the reduction started. That was in May. She has *not* had a second BT (I consider 2 x £165 in three weeks to be too much {unless I am concerned that the reduced dose is causing problems then I would adjust it and if still concerned, fork out another wad}). I took it upon myself to reduce it from 10 to 7.5 rather than 5, with which she seems much brighter and generally more herself. She has been on that for three months and I may drop it to 5 and see how she goes. If she starts to show signs of HT on the lower dose, then she'll go back up to 7.5. I realise that it's a totally different set-up with Chewie's condition, but she's your cat and you know her better than anyone and know what to look for.
One thing about the surgery I am at, it's not a chain, it's an independent practice, but in the two and a half years she's been going there - five visits I think - I have not seen the same vet twice, which irritates me. So not sure if these are permanent staff or locums or what, but totally gobsmacked the last time I took her in for BT and prescription review (all she's ever been there for) and the vet looked me straight in the eyes and asked (no kidding), ''Well, how is Margaret today?''. Margaret replied that she was very well thank you, at which point the vet asked, ''Is she on any meds at all?'' She was wearing a mask so I thought maybe I had misheard, but when I stared blankly back at her she repeated it. I was talking to a neighbour, different independent vet and she reckons she's never seen the same one twice either. All very odd.
Glad she's showing a slight improvement, Karl; you've both been through a rotten time. XX


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

I'm sorry everybody, my chewie passed away at 11am this morning. I'm absolutely devastated so that's all I'm saying just thought I'd let you all know


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## 1507601 (Jun 26, 2020)

I'm so sorry, Karl.


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## bluesunbeam (Oct 21, 2021)

So sorry that Chewie finally lost her battle Karl. She was blessed to have you as her guardian and you could not have done more for each other.
RIP beautiful Chewie.


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

I'm so very sorry @Karl43 

Rest in peace little one, safe in the knowledge that you were loved, will be missed and that your human daddy did all he could.


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## Mrs Funkin (Mar 12, 2018)

I’m so sorry Karl. Oh Chewie, run free, beautiful girl. Go well, safe in the knowledge that you are truly loved xx

Be kind to yourself, Karl, you loved her so much - I send you strength to get through the coming days and weeks xx


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## Bertie'sMum (Mar 27, 2017)

Karl43 said:


> I'm sorry everybody, my chewie passed away at 11am this morning. I'm absolutely devastated so that's all I'm saying just thought I'd let you all know


Although I haven't replied on this thread @Karl143 I have been following Chewie's story and dreading what I feared you would eventually post. Having been in a similar situation more than once I do understand the emotions you are going through and I feel your pain.

Chewie was very special to you and always will be - but now she's in a happier place where she is fit and well, no longer in any pain or discomfort. You did all you could for her whilst she lived and now you must do your best for her and carry on your life - you know she will always be near you, the ones we love never really leave us.

_"Weep not for me though I am gone into that gentle night. 
Grieve if you will, but not for long upon my soul's sweet flight. 
I am at peace, my soul is at rest, and there is no need for tears. 
For with your love I was so blessed for all those many years. 
There is no pain; I suffer not, the fear now all is gone. 
Put now these things out of your thoughts, in your memory I live on. 
Remember not my fight for breath 
Remember not the strife. 
Please do not dwell upon my death, but celebrate my life."_

Copyright 1992 Constance Jenkins


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

I'm so sorry Karl
RIP beautiful Chewie


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

I can't imagine how you are feeling at the moment, Karl. We all know what Chewie meant to you; if your love could have saved her, she would still be here. RIP gorgeous girl. XXX


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

Oh Karl. I am so so sorry to hear this. 

You have been such a wonderful Dad to her even though your time together was short. Take comfort from that xxx


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## Nealh (12 mo ago)

Oh bless little chewie R.I.P, a brave girl who had a lot on her plate to contend with. Run free and be forever in Karl's heart.
As other's have said be kind to your self Karl you have nothing to reproach your self for as you did everything possibe for her.


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## blackislegirl (Mar 12, 2021)

It is awful to lose a young cat to serious illness, such rotten luck, I am so sorry. Give yourself time and look after yourself. You could not have cared for her better.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

This was one of the last photos I took. At this point she had already passed away .


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

She looks peaceful.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

For those wondering what happened. I'll just put in a trigger warning as I'm describing my day at the vets and euthanasia and I know this can be hard for others to read.

She went dramatically downhill rather quickly

She started really struggling to eat and not even fully eating treats. I began to realise she had some issue with her mouth on top of everything else and concluded she had a painful mouth.

She started opening and closing her jaw for no particular reason and started making a horrible grinding noise.

Water intake increased dramatically going from water bowl to water bowl and back again. She also developed a huge obsession with ice cubes and having spoke to the vet she said it was probably anaemia related pica.

I checked inside her mouth and her gums were pure white and she looked pale overall with extremely slow movements. Most of the time when trying to meow she would open her mouth and nothing would come out.

She began presenting more aneamic than when I very first took her to the vet back in February. I wouldn't like to guess at her blood count but I bet it wasn't much above 11 or 12 yesterday.

It became clear to me her anaemia was advancing ,despite medication.

I rang my vet and had an in-depth conversation and she said it really would be in chewies interest to euthanize.

I got the opinion of a friend as well who has known her from a kitten ,so she came round to see chewie and immediately said she's ready and has no quality of life and I agreed.

I took her to her appointment at 11 a.m. this morning and the whole experience whilst upsetting was so amazing ,they could not have been better.

They offered me a cup of tea, there was no waiting in reception they pulled me straight into the back despite me being 20 minutes early.

Blankets had already been laid out on the table

There was no rush whatsoever. I was actually there an hour and a half and my vet was happy to speak to me as long as I wanted.

Firstly she took her behind the scenes and explained it might be best with chewie to give her a quick jab of sedation first. So she did that and she was a little bit noisy, but soon settled down.

She fixed her eyes on me and very very slowly the sedation started to work and I had 10-minutes talking to her .I told her not to worry if I get any other cats ,because she would always be my best number one girl.

The vet then shaved her leg and administered the general overdose. She went extremely quickly. The vet whispered " she's gone already" after about maybe 10 to 15 seconds.

She took me some clippings of her fur and put them in little tiny jars.

I was halfway through texting the cremation place I had earlier contacted and the vet said, don't worry they're already here.

I met that lady who put her in the basket ,which is the picture above and she spoke to me for about 15 minutes.

The cremation has actually already taken place, they were very quick.

I'm now just waiting for confirmation of when I can bring Chewie home. I've had a box purchased with a plaque.

I've never felt such a gaping emptiness within myself . I cannot stop crying and I've been physically sick four times. At one point doing both at the same time with my head down the toilet.

It's the most intense grief I've ever experienced.

Thank you so much for everybody's support over the last 6-months. Everybody here has always been kind and never judged. This place really has been a lifesaver.

I can't express my gratitude enough and may I extend my condolences to you as well, because I know some of you will be very saddened by the news today after following chewies roller coaster journey.❤💔


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## Deguslave (12 mo ago)

Oh @Karl43 it sounds like she was so ready to go.

I've been through the symptoms you describe and my cat died in front of me because it was late at night and I couldn't get her to the emergency vet in time. You made her passing as peaceful as possible, at the time that was right.

You will be in shock, even though you knew how ill she was, and you need to allow yourself time to grieve. You've nothing to reproach yourself for, you did everything you could, but it wasn't to be. She will always be with you and you will always love each other.

Another cat will never replace her, you both know that, but Chewie will send you one or maybe two, who need a wonderful human daddy to look after them and give them a good home.

Take care of yourself and remember the good times you had together.

Hugs!


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

Oh, I’m so so sorry Karl, it really isn’t fair but you did your absolute best for her and made her passing peaceful.
I’ve been dreading seeing this post and have been thinking of you both for the past few days.
For what it’s worth I think it was definitely time and you really couldn’t have done any more.
As horrible as it is, they’re right in that it’s the last gift we can give them, when it’s time.

Take your time, you’ve nothing to beat yourself up about and if you can, speak to good friends who understand what you’ve gone through.
And of course we’re always here if you want to talk, whether on the forum or via pm.

And when you’re ready for another little cat, I think Chewie will have a paw in choosing one for you.
You may find sooner is better than later, it was for me, as it gave me some distraction and something to focus on when I was very lost, but we’re all different, so it’s whatever is right for you.

In my thoughts.

Best wishes, Tony


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## blackislegirl (Mar 12, 2021)

Karl, try each day for a few minutes to bring the good times into mind, the days before Chewie became ill. At the moment you are in shock, but it will ease with time. She will never be replaced, and will always be your number 1 girl. In due course, another little creature will enter your life and become his or her own person, and you will love and care for them as well as you did for Chewie.


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## Mrs Funkin (Mar 12, 2018)

Thank you Karl for sharing your experience of your last hours with Chewie. It was difficult to read but I'm glad you've posted it. 

Take time to grieve for your beloved girl. I am thinking of you and hope that the pain eases soon xx


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## GingerNinja (Mar 23, 2014)

I am so sorry Karl, you could not have done more nor loved Chewie any more. She went peacefully with you at her side and she would have felt your love and devotion to her right to the end.

Sleep tight beautiful girl xx


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

I've got her back with me already very good service from the cremation company. She was even passing my house more or less so dropped off for free.

I am wrestling with the overwhelming feelings of guilt that's all I'm getting guilt guilt guilt.

Was she happy?
Did I get stressed out and it's stressed her out and caused her illness to get worse?
Did that one time I got annoyed transfer to her and make all of this happen?
Did administering all that medication make her hate me?


I'm just laden with guilt. It's unshakeable


When I finish the grief process i'll ask for this thread to be closed out ,not sure how long that will take.


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## Linda Weasel (Mar 5, 2014)

@Karl43 . Please be kinder to yourself. All deaths, however they occur, seem to come with guilt. We seem to have this inbuilt compulsion to go through all the ‘what ifs?’ Even when our sensible head says that we did the very best we could with the information/circumstances we had at the time.

You did the very best that you could do for Chewie, gave huge amounts of love and commitment; you fought for her to the very end, and that’s what counts.


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## SbanR (Jun 16, 2017)

Oh Karl, thank you for your post.
As you said, it was very difficult reading and I had tears in my eyes.
But your vets and the cremation service sound very caring.
You have nothing to feel guilty about. You love Chewie dearly and always had her well being at the forefront of your mind. 
You did the very best you could for her, right up to the very end.
Sending you love and strength.


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## Mrs Funkin (Mar 12, 2018)

Karl, you did everything you could for her. Guilt is part of the grief process, unfortunately. Please try not to let these thoughts in, keep the thoughts in there that should be there. That you loved Chewie so much, that you did all you could for her, that you literally spent every penny you had on her, that you were strong enough to let her go when you knew the time was right. You will always love her and she will be with you until the end of your days but please try to be kind to yourself xx


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## TonyG (Oct 25, 2020)

The others have said it all really Karl.

I really don’t think anything you have done would have added to or caused her illness.
One moment of anger wouldn’t have done anything and although cats obviously don’t enjoy meds, they don’t hold it against us.
She was just very, very ill.

In fact, you did everything in your power to try and help her - there wasn’t really anything more you or anyone could have done.

As said, guilt is very natural with grief but you have nothing here to blame yourself for.
It’s the worst feeling in the world and it will take time, let the grief flow as much as you like but you really have nothing to be guilty for.


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## Little paws (7 mo ago)

I’m so very sorry Karl. You loved her so much and did everything you possibly could for her. What has struck me is how carefully you thought through every decision you needed to make, so you did what was best for Chewie at all times. Even though you were probably in bits. I hope you can feel some comfort in the coming days and weeks, knowing that people care. Chewie will never really leave you - she is in your heart. Take care and try to be kind to yourself x


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

TonyG said:


> you really couldn’t have done any more


Absolutely - we are all of the opinion that no owner could have done more than Karl did. Chewie was so lucky to have him - as sad as it is. I am very glad that the vets were understanding at the end.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Karl43 said:


> Did that one time I got annoyed transfer to her and make all of this happen?


No, Karl, she was a poorly girl (for whatever reason) and with anyone other than you she would likely have passed earlier . . . I know with Teddy (vet 18 times in 11 months {excluding PTS}) when he stopped eating I would optimistically put out a great smorgasbord of about six or seven tempting delights and I'd be encouraged to see him run to them, sniff the whole lot as though he was about to eat one of them, then turn his face away in disgust and walk away eating nothing at all. Sometimes I had to leave the kitchen and close the door so I didn't weep or scream at him. No-one could have done more for Chewie than you did; it was obviously her time. xx


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

All a cat wants from life is to feel safe, warm, well fed and loved. You did all that and more for Chewie. 

I am very glad her passing was so peaceful and the vets were kind and gentle. 

All the grief and guilt is completely normal - well it’s normal when you have loved a little cat so very much.

How sad and awful it would be if you didn’t feel these overwhelming thoughts and feelings. That this is all so raw and strong is because she did mean the world to you. This will never change because she’s made such an impact in your life. But I hope that it does become easier to accept with time.

I still have days when I sob for Cinders (it’s been 17 years now since I lost her) but most of the time I can now remember her with such happiness and love. And, because of her I now have Huck, Hols, Grace and Little H. It took me a long time but I realised she opened my eyes to just how amazing cats are.

RIP dear dear Chewie knowing you have been, are and will be loved so much.


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## Nealh (12 mo ago)

I have found the news of Chewies demise quite up setting as was Karl's description at the vets which mirrored mine late last December when my Button at 13 was pts, a lovely boy who I keep thinking off and often stand at his burial site in the garden for a minute or two.
Saying goodbye is never easy but in our hearts we know any suffering that may be occurring has to end as it is not fair they should suffer more then neccessary.
In my case the blessing is I still have Mr Tom and now though not a replacement, Tigger is now firmly at home as she has become Mr Toms new house mate. For not the passing of Button then Tigger would not be part of our life here now.
Fore the life and memories of those gone before can not be erased.


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## Cully (May 16, 2018)

Oh Karl, I've only just heard and am so very sorry to hear about Chewie. 
Take comfort from all the kind words and know you are not alone in your grief. So many of us have walked the same path and understand how you must feel.
Sending much love at this sad time (hug).


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

Nealh said:


> we know any suffering that may be occurring has to end as it is not fair they should suffer more then neccessary.


And that's the important thing. I think in the end she was suffering far more than anyone really knew, because she was such a strong girl and hid it incredibly well. The vets always use to describe her as a Marvel all the way through.

I've spoken to the vet since and she said on top of the immune disorder the grinding of the teeth was no doubt due to periodontal ligament damage as a result of her illness.

Also when she passed away, blood started pouring from her nose and the vet said this was probably again related to her illness and platelet levels.


So her illness really was taking hold of her. The morning of her passing when she was at home,I did take a photo of her and she just looked dreadful.

I truly believe had I kept her home, she would not have lasted a week or two and most likely would have suffered a nasty death.

I feel I did the right thing ,but the grief feels insurmountable. I've lost human family members and grieved many many times ,but nothing has ever hit me like this. I sometimes feel like I can't even breathe.

I'm sorry you have found this upsetting as well and I'm sorry for your loss of Button, but I'm so glad Mr Tom has a new housemate  

Take care 🙂


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

It can be so much harder with a pet because we have “helped” the passing and they could not communicate with us what they wanted or were feeling.

I always have a terrible guilt/crisis of conscience that we are playing God.

But I truly believe the cat would understand that we are ultimately doing what we believe is best for them (as we have done their whole life with us).

And even if the decision is wrong or it wasn’t the right time - the fact it’s come from absolute love they would completely understand why we did it. They would forgive and still love us no matter what.

Our grief is simply awful but it’s because we love them so much that it’s so so painful. I would never want to feel less.


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## Karl43 (11 mo ago)

huckybuck said:


> It can be so much harder with a pet because we have “helped” the passing and they could not communicate with us what they wanted or were feeling.
> 
> I always have a terrible guilt/crisis of conscience that we are playing God.
> 
> ...


Regarding euthanasia I kept remembering a quote I heard whilst deciding

"It's better one month too early than one hour too late"


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## TriTri (Oct 31, 2017)

So very sorry for your loss @Karl43.

R.I.P sweet, wonderful, beautiful and brave Chewie, with much love Tri-Tri & Max xx


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