# The stork actually is coming this time



## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

So remember I picked up those 4 girl rats and the woman was offering 2 boys aswell?

Long story short, they got together and now Oracle is pregnant.

Worst thing is I text the woman to say is there a chance they could've got together and she said it could've happened when I cleaned them out. She was a good mum last time though

 :scared: and :eek6:


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Sudden realisation- I knew I'd seen her posting on preloved before. Why? Those babies.....


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## Snippet (Apr 14, 2011)

I'm already giving you advice on GM, but good luck with them.


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Yup, and I really appreciate it, thanks 

Just thought I'd let everyone on here know that I was right about there being something fishy with that woman. It felt weird, and definitely was. 
She text me saying that she knew Oracle used to slip out of the bars to get to the boys!
How stupid can you be?


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

Which female is it maltey?
She knew exactly what she was doing the witch.

Well question is what's going to happen to all the babies??
And we will need pics!


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## chrisd (Aug 25, 2011)

blade100 said:


> She knew exactly what she was doing the witch.


Lol. I really don't understand this thread. Sorry it's early and I'm tired can someone please explain?


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

Chris I'll let maltey explain. Lmao.


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Ok, so basically I was feeling a bit of GGMR and saw an ad on preloved for 4 girlies literally just down the road from me. That was on the Sunday but I couldn't pick them up til Saturday. On Monday or Tuesday she posted an advert for 2 boys needing a home too, which I really wanted to help out but knew I couldn't take in. I posted a lot on here about them because something just didn't feel right about it.
By the time I went to collect the girls on Saturday the boys were gone so I felt better about it, brought my girls home and everything's been going fine.
Until I realised that one of the new girls is pregnant.
I text her to say is there any chance the girls and boys could've met and she said perhaps when I was cleaning them out. It has happened before and she was a brilliant mum.
Then I text her saying do you remember which day you cleaned them out so I could try and guesstimate a due date and she said well she used to slip out through the bars to go and see the boys- the girls cage was on top of the boys!! How irresponsible.
The other new girls are all definitely girls- I've checked them a billion times, and as far as I can tell none of the others are pregnant.
The boys were adopted out about the 16th/17th April so I've got absolute maximum 5 days left, but judging by her behaviour I'd say it's going to be tonight or tomorrow.

O, and as for the second part, I felt weird about it mostly because I only ever search on preloved for rat things and I'd seen her name crop up a few times but I couldn't remember why- obviously she was selling those babies.

Blade, it's the black berkie. Thankfully not Mishka- I think that would've killed her. As for the babies, I'll see how many she has. I've got room in the cage for another couple, if she has a large litter I'll have to adopt them out, and I'll have to adopt all the boys out because I don't want a repeat of this!! I did enquire into neutering this morning which may be an option but I'm just going to see what happens.
Definitely there's going to be tons of pics- this is not an experience I want to repeat so I need as many memories as possible!
As far as Oracle's concerned she's doing pretty well. Built herself a nest and is fast asleep in the middle of it.
She's put on 40g in 4 days!


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## Claireglynn (Dec 9, 2011)

Hi,

You do seem to be taking it rather well :scared:

However, im sure it will be a great experience to watch and look back over.
Shame you live so far away, would love babies from you (rats that is!) i'm sure they will be extremely well looked after and have the very best start in life.

Just when you thought 9 was alot........


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Erm, I'll be honest and say I had a major hissy fit last night, pacing up and down, freaking out and mumbling to myself! (Mostly cursing this woman!)
This morning I've come to accept the fact that this is going to happen and I'm not going to do the best for her if I'm freaking out about it.
I'm sure it will be a nice experience once she's had them and we see milk bellies and then I'll enjoy the babies. Until the point where I know she's not going to have any complications (because she is over 12 months) I'll be a little stressed. 

Claire, do you drive at all? Because obviously I don't want these babies going to any old home where this might happen again so I'm willing to meet you half way if everything goes well.
By the looks of her I wouldn't say it's going to be a huge litter. I was up til 3am studying weight charts and graphs and for her sort of weight gain I'm expecting 6-10 ish. Difficult to say how much is baby weight and how much is weight that I was trying to put on her since she was a bit skinny. Also, the skinniness isn't going to contribute to a good baby size so.. I don't know really.
As soon as they've popped I'll post an ad in the adoption thread and try an drum up some good homes, but if anyone (ie Claire!) says they would like some then I can reserve them for you.

What sort of adoption fee do you think is good? I don't want it too low so the wrong people buy them (even though I'll be doing a questionnaire thing) but I don't want it too high because they aren't special breeder rats or anything.
I was thinking perhaps I could sew up some hammocks for them and include them in the adoption so the fee is kind of going towards that rather than it looking like me trying to make a profit from the babies? What do you think?


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## chrisd (Aug 25, 2011)

Will the woman not take the babies back? Or do you not want them going back to her? Also if this is a new rat she might not be comfortable with you handling the babies etc i don't really know how it works but I'd say be careful!

I'd put an adoption fee of 2 rats for £18 (slightly higher than [email protected]) but include a free hammock and maybe a care sheet?


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

No way is that woman having the babies back.
I was actually a bit worried about telling her (when I was asking about the boys) incase she demanded them back. It'd only happen again.

Oracle's pretty good-natured on the whole. She was very sweet the first day I brought them home and has been so ever since, apart from yesterday when she gave me a warning bite when I tried to move her into the new cage (hormones eh?!)
Today though I've been stroking her through the bars* when she comes out and she's been fine. The woman said she was a good mum and that she herself had handled the babies from day 1, so I think she'll let me.

Care sheet's a good idea- hadn't thought of that.

*This is only temporary, just incase she'd had the babies last night. I'm going out this afternoon to buy a suitable nursing cage.

Here's a video of mummy making her nest if anyone's interested


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## chrisd (Aug 25, 2011)

Fair enough. Well I hope it goes ok! Like Claire said it's a shame you're so far away!


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

aww bless her.
looks like she knows what she's doing.
how long are you going to leave the other girls in with her?


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Well someone on another forum suggested leaving a docile doe in with her for company and removing her once the babies were born. Harley's such a big sop so I left them overnight, but this morning Oracle didn't want anything to do with her and Harley was sort of outcast so she's back with the others.



blade100 said:


> looks like she knows what she's doing.


Well she's got experience


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

poor girl. 

i hope she goes on ok and doesn't have any complications.

i hear female rats get quite hormonal when pregnant....is that the same for humans too? lol


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Lol.

I meant to mention a while back when you asked about the babies that the brother-in-law-to-be used to keep rats, and really wants some again but has a cat so isn't sure.

If he could take some that'd be amazing since he lives round the corner and we could visit!


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## Snippet (Apr 14, 2011)

Maltey said:


> Lol.
> 
> I meant to mention a while back when you asked about the babies that the brother-in-law-to-be used to keep rats, and really wants some again but has a cat so isn't sure.
> 
> If he could take some that'd be amazing since he lives round the corner and we could visit!


I've got a cat and rats, and as long as the cat can't poke it's feet in the bars and is out of the room during free range then there's no problem.


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

This is what I keep telling him!
He lives with his Dad so he'll have to get round him aswell (he isn't adverse to the rats as such, more their upkeep. He says he got left to clean out the other ones, but the BIL was only 7 at the time so that's hardly an excuse!)

I know he'd look after them well, especially with me bossing him round 

I've seen their old cage and I'm pretty sure it had narrow bars- too small for a cat paw. Here's hoping!


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## Snippet (Apr 14, 2011)

I don't know how old your BIL is, but maybe he could write down a list of what they will cost and save up so he has some kind of vet fund, then write a rota that shows what he would do daily/ weekly and stick to it.


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

He's nearly 19. His grandad just gave him a ton of money, so money isn't an issue at all. He keeps looking for things to spend it on so having some ratties will help that burning hole 

He first mentioned it about July time, when I took some of mine over there for a couple of hours whilst we moved. It rekindled his love and he was going on and on about it and his dad said just wait until you get your money from your grandad, I think incase it was just a fad. But he's still banging on about it nearly a year later, so who knows? His Dad is generally pretty laid back....


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Oooo, I think it may well be tonight. I just went to check on her and there was a piece of tissue/kitchen roll with a couple of spots of blood on it.She doesn't seem porphy at all, so I think it's probably that.
:scared:


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## Snippet (Apr 14, 2011)

Good luck!!


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## chrisd (Aug 25, 2011)

Hope everything goes smoothly!


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## LynseyB (Jan 30, 2012)

Oooo...very exciting 

The poor girl shouldn't have gotten pregnant in the first place, but at least she's with someone like you!!

Keep us updated!


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## metame (Sep 25, 2009)

sounds exciting and terrifying.
hope everything goes ok and keep us updated, of course!


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## Rubythedog (Mar 5, 2012)

Poor girl...hope everything runs smoothely  Good luck


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

Awww fingers crossed all goes well.
Remember after she's given birth she will need plenty of protein foods like egg,chicken and fish to help build her up and give her strength as the babies will be taking it away from her whilst she's nursing.


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Bought some eggs and broccoli yesterday 
More and more I'm thinking it's going to be tonight.
I'm out from 6-9 and I can't do anything about it- I really hope she waits until I get home!
Just bought a mini duna and she's all settled in that now. Thanks for your good wishes everyone!


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Things haven't gone well for Oracle. I slept for two hours and in that space of time the amount of blood doubled. She seemed very listless and inactive this morning so she's at the vets now. He said he doesn't think there's any pups in there and that perhaps she ate them but he'll probably do an X-ray this afternoon. 
I really thought I was going to lose her this morning- let this be a lesson to anyone who breeds for 'fun'


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## chrisd (Aug 25, 2011)

Sorry to hear that. Why would she eat them?


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## LynseyB (Jan 30, 2012)

I'm so sorry Maltey  Poor girly.



chrisd said:


> Sorry to hear that. Why would she eat them?


I think when the female rat senses problems with the birth or babies, she will eat them. Someone knowledgeable will come along and give a proper answer soon, but I do know it happens.


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

I have no idea. Especially since the woman said she was a good mum last time. 
I don't think she did- when I left her she didn't seem to be pushing much or really be in the middle of labour. I don't think she would've had the force to push them out. Plus she was still bleeding heavily this morning, so I don't really know.


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

oh poor oracle,do you think she just sort of miscarried?
maybe it was the move to a new home? and she didnt feel safe? i know of a couple of bad breeders who have let forum members experience a rat giving birth and letting them help bring up a litter, for the mum rat to mis carry because of change of enviroment.

please keep us informed of how oracle is doing today x


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Possibly. I did wonder that, but I couldn't have left her in the normal cage- it just wouldn't have been safe. Poor girly.


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## LostGirl (Jan 16, 2009)

Shame poor girl


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Just spoke to the vet and the babies are still in there. She's lost a lot of blood though and they're not sure why so she's being spayed. She said there were only a few babies- maybe like 3 or 4. 
I text the woman to tell and she just said ok.... *sigh*

Good news is the vet said she's perked up a lot from the meds and fluids so she should be ok


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

Poor girl, glad she is perking up.

If I were you I wouldn't spk to that woman again. She don't seen to care anyway does she 

So the babies have they survived?


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Yeah I'm not going to. I told her to see if she'd care that her ex-pet who she claimed to be sad at having to let go was going through massive surgery thanks to her irresponsibility but she didn't. 
The vet said the chances of the babies surviving are slim, but she's going to do a c-section and see if she can revive some. So who knows how many rats I'll be bringing home this evening!


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

Aww well let's hope it's the best outcome for her.
Whether or not she would feed thr babies is another thing.
She may not take to them if she feels she's not given birth naturally.
But if she does produce milk and the babies suckle you will see milk bands on there bellies.

Fingers crossed all goes well for oracle.


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Just spoke to the vet- everything went well with oracle- yay! 
In other news, there was only one big baby, which is why she couldn't give birth naturally. It's full term so they're going to show me how to hand rear it and see if it survives!


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## LostGirl (Jan 16, 2009)

wow one big baby! Fingers crossed they both pull through he/she would be a very very special little rattie xx


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

Hand rearing is going to be a full on job!
I think they need feeding every 2 hours, they need stimulation around there bellies before you start feeding them and after and then stimulation on the private parts to make them poo and wee.

It may be best if either you find a temp foster mummy rat or try your own mummy rat to see if she accepts her and feeds her.


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Well the good news is that I literally about 10 minutes ago handed in the last of my uni work, so as if now I'm free 24/7. 
I'm going to keep them together and hope she feeds it and also be prepared to hand rear it. 
With foster mums do they integrate them into their own litter or is it a mum whose litter is just being weaned? 
I hope it does pull through- it would be a special ratty indeed!


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

Here's some info if you do decide to hand rear and what you'll need.
How to Hand Raise Rat Babies | eHow.com


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

It's best to find a mum that's just given birth or a mum who has a litter that's a week old. Try asking on fancy rats forum.


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Thanks for that blade. So the baby goes to live with them?

ETA: is it possible that she'll mother it I.e keep it warm, help it to go to the toilet etc but she just can't feed it?


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Just got a call- baby didn't make it


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## Whitehologram (Apr 28, 2012)

Maltey said:


> Just got a call- baby didn't make it


I'm so sorry. I've been reading along and really hoped for the best. I'm glad the mum is ok and that she's away from the foolish woman.


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

I hope you don't think I'm mean when I say this but maybe it was for the best 
How is oracle doing? Has she been spayed?


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## Rubythedog (Mar 5, 2012)

poor baby  hopefully Oracle makes a full recovery though


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

So she's home now. She started picking her stitches out whilst we were waiting for the receptionist so I got a collar put on her- she's not happy about that -at all-

But she's been eating, as well as she can manage with the collar, and seems much better.
They let me see the baby- it was pretty big. About 2 inches long!
She's on Metacam, Baytril and some other AB with a really long name beginning with T. I hadn't yet switched over to a new vet- was just checking there was nowhere better. Turns out this vet is amazing. 2 of their team are exotics specialists, their prices are reasonable (this whole ordeal cost me £120 ) but best of all their customer service is amazing. She called me back a billion times throughout the day to tell me what was going on, none of the staff were like 'it's just a rat', they were all very caring and generally pleasant. Knowledgeable too.

I'll be honest, when she brought her out in the collar I burst out laughing. She looks so sad and pathetic that it's funny! So it wouldn't be fair if I didn't post pics


























It's a shame about the baby- I've never seen anything so sweet looking. It was so perfect. But, if she wasn't lactating then it was probably for the best. That's not mean at all Blade, it probably wouldn't have made it anyway.


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

Oh bless her, I'm Sorry maltey I too laughed at the pics. 
The last pic she looks really peeved off.

I've never known a rat have a collar on. Can she use her bottle?
I think tomorrow let her have a little company and poss takenthe collar off for an hour whilst under close obs.

I'm glad she's on the mend.


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

I had her and some of the others out for a bit of free-range but she didn't seem that fussed by them. The vet said technically she could go back in with the girls tonight, but she just wants to sleep or play with her stitches so I'm going to wait until she's settled down a bit. She said she should have settled down and started forgetting about them tomorrow so the collar can come off and then I'll put her back in.
I haven't seen her drink yet- she's curled under a blanket with me, but I think it shouldn't be a problem.


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

Awww give her a gentle kiss from me.
Such a good girl.

How old is she maltey?


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## Maltey (Nov 29, 2011)

Not exactly sure. The woman said about a year.
And she's getting plenty of kisses


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## sully (May 3, 2008)

Sad about the baby but glad Oracle is doing well!


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## LostGirl (Jan 16, 2009)

hee hee bless her little mini cone of shame i didnt even realise they did rat sized ones! She is lookin very well considering what shes been through

rip to the little baby who didnt make it


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## metame (Sep 25, 2009)

just cught up with this, im sorry about the baby, Maltey.
glad Oracle is home and doing well though


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