# protection training



## tazsdad (Jun 13, 2011)

can anyone who knows rob Metcalfe dog trainer wakefield give feedback on his training.
many thanks


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## popapei (Jul 1, 2016)

http://www.closeprotectionworld.com/k9-forum/81364-urgent-help-dog-handling-sounds-fishy.html

?

ed: Found by Googling "rob Metcalfe dog trainer" and clicking the second result. Encase there's any more stuff you might find useful.


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

They look absolutely dreadful based on their website!

First video is of two obese GSD's that a waddling duck could outrun, biting some guy who's flapping around wearing hidden sleeves......

The second is of a scared look GSD mutt type being stomped around the streets "obedience training" while being yanked frequently on a choke chain....

And they are charging £2,500 for a 14 week old puppy, and £4,000 for a 12 month old who has been trained "to a very high standard" without stating in what! which I doubt, because no 12 month old pup will ever be a finished product enough to justify a 4k pricetag.....


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

The morbidly obese protection dogs if anyone wants a laugh....


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## Magyarmum (Apr 27, 2015)

labradrk said:


> The morbidly obese protection dogs if anyone wants a laugh....


OMG What was that all about? I had to turn it off before the end because Gwylim leapt off the chair he was sleeping on and ran up to the TV thinking the noise came from there, and Georgina rushed in from outside all of a huffle until she realised it was just me on the computer!


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## Kimmikins (Apr 9, 2016)

I just. I have no words...


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

Extremely well trained...think I lost count how many "out" cues were ignored before the sleeve was yanked from her mouth 

None of the dogs looked that well trained at all...average at best IMO


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

labradrk said:


> The morbidly obese protection dogs if anyone wants a laugh....


So many wrongs in that vid! Not only the fact the dogs are grossly fat, but the fact they also don't seem anywhere near ready to practice 'biting'. The amount of times the owner has to tell the dog out! Surely a good out should be In place before you do the bite work? Then the dog rips the arm of the 'helper' and seems to not have a full hold on the sleeve, just by the skin of its teeth.

Not to mention the weird looking helper who made me laugh with odd posturing and lack of protective gear lol.


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## Magyarmum (Apr 27, 2015)

When we used to go to training during the week I'd often stay behind for a while because I liked watching our trainer working with some of the dogs who'd been bought as potential security dogs. So very different from that video which as far as I could see was a total shambles!


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## Guest (Jul 4, 2016)

labradrk said:


> First video is of two obese GSD's that a waddling duck could outrun,


That made me laugh and then you posted the video... :Hilarious
472 "out Foxy, out" later, and she still never outs and just rips the shirt instead LOL. OMG it's like a bad parody of protection training!


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## LoopyL (Jun 16, 2015)

I would avoid him like the plague  vid looks more like encouraging dog to attack than stopping it


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## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

OMG, that is hilarious!!!


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Also some incredible obedience training here:






Never seen anything so inspiring, really innovative, and the dog is so happy and engaged......oh wait.


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## Pappychi (Aug 12, 2015)

labradrk said:


> The morbidly obese protection dogs if anyone wants a laugh....


I just lolled out loud :Hilarious:Hilarious

I would have no fear in getting away from these 'protection dogs', a quick spurt of energy and you'd be well away whilst those two wheezed into a trot .

That's like watching a shitty, yet hilarious parody enguin


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Pappychi said:


> I just lolled out loud :Hilarious:Hilarious
> 
> I would have no fear in getting away from these 'protection dogs', a quick spurt of energy and you'd be well away whilst those two wheezed into a trot .
> 
> That's like watching a shitty, yet hilarious parody enguin


I right, right down to the "decoy" (phrase used incredibly lightly) strutting around like he's crapped his pants.


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## Pappychi (Aug 12, 2015)

labradrk said:


> I right, right down to the "decoy" (phrase used incredibly lightly) strutting around like he's crapped his pants.


He was my favourite part!

:Hilarious

Such an oddly hysterical video for all the wrong reasons :Lurking


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## MiffyMoo (Sep 15, 2015)

OMG, is that for real? Quite possibly the fattest dogs I've ever seen


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## tazsdad (Jun 13, 2011)

thanks all keep the replies coming I have taken on a 11mthh old gsd who is a dog aggressive saw robs page asked if he could help.took my boy for a few hours then demanstrated how to drag him round on a choke collar.disgusted he walked fine before.also wants extreme money.


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## MiffyMoo (Sep 15, 2015)

tazsdad said:


> thanks all keep the replies coming I have taken on a 11mthh old gsd who is a dog aggressive saw robs page asked if he could help.took my boy for a few hours then demanstrated how to drag him round on a choke collar.disgusted he walked fine before.also wants extreme money.


You need a good behaviourist. Whereabouts are you? I'm sure someone will be able to recommend somebody near to you


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## Nataliee (Jul 25, 2011)

Where abouts are you?


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## tazsdad (Jun 13, 2011)

I'm in Barnsley yorks.take him to group training and is ok just when we go out he wants to attack every dog we see.as a rescue I understand he is now very protective towards me,but walks are a nightmare


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

tazsdad said:


> I'm in Barnsley yorks.take him to group training and is ok just when we go out he wants to attack every dog we see.as a rescue I understand he is now very protective towards me,but walks are a nightmare


If he's ok at training classes then I doubt he wants to "attack" every dog he see's, particularly given his age. It's more likely to be a fear based reactivity, which is pretty common in GSD's and can be helped. It won't be protective behaviour either, he's protecting his own back, not yours!

I'm at the other end of the country so can't help with a behaviourist recommendation, but hopefully some else can.


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## tazsdad (Jun 13, 2011)

yes class trainer says its fear aggression but hard to overcome


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

tazsdad said:


> I'm in Barnsley yorks.take him to group training and is ok just when we go out he wants to attack every dog we see.as a rescue I understand he is now very protective towards me,but walks are a nightmare


I can personally recommend Morag

http://www.wellconnectedcanine.co.uk/

Angela

http://iabtc-courses.co.uk/

Jane

http://janehanshawdogtags.co.uk/

All three are well respected, reputable and qualified to help you


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## tazsdad (Jun 13, 2011)

smokeybear said:


> I can personally recommend Morag
> 
> http://www.wellconnectedcanine.co.uk/
> 
> ...


many thanks will certainly see what they say


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## applecrumlin (Mar 8, 2015)

labradrk said:


> The morbidly obese protection dogs if anyone wants a laugh....


Are you sure the dogs aren't wearing protection suits?


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## tazsdad (Jun 13, 2011)

I'm in Barnsley yorks.have been recommended sheps dog training centre trainers edwinstowe notts.hear they are gsd specialists behaviourists and trainers including rescue dogs.anyone know about them.many thanks td


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## Guest (Jul 5, 2016)

tazsdad said:


> I'm in Barnsley yorks.have been recommended sheps dog training centre trainers edwinstowe notts.hear they are gsd specialists behaviourists and trainers including rescue dogs.anyone know about them.many thanks td


I think I would contact the people @smokeybear recommended first.
Even if they are too far, they might be able to recommend someone closer to you.


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## tazsdad (Jun 13, 2011)

ouesi said:


> I think I would contact the people @smokeybear recommended first.
> Even if they are too far, they might be able to recommend someone closer to you.


ok many thanks


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

I have never heard of this establishment and on looking at the website there is no information about the trainers ie who they are, what qualifications they possess and what professional bodies they belong to?


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## Guest (Aug 10, 2018)

Hi all, I appreciate this is a really old post, but I'm putting this on in the hopes that anyone reading this stays as far away from Bob / Rob Mecalfe as is absolutely possible, he has a facebook page, (personal protection dogs) unfortunately he operates around my area, he is renouned for being cruel, a conman, he has no formal training qualifications, but does keep spouting on about his handler qualifications, which to be honest, whoever passed him needs to give their head a bloody good wobble, he is an absolute disgrace, has no morals, & couldn't give a monkey's about the dogs in his care, he has had more hate campaigns against him on facebook than anyone I know, so please anyone, anywhere for the sake of your dog, spread the word far & wide, this man is a deluded nightmare, go to his page & give him hell, for eveyones sake


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## O2.0 (May 23, 2018)

Andy Denby said:


> Hi all, I appreciate this is a really old post, but I'm putting this on in the hopes that anyone reading this stays as far away from Bob / Rob Mecalfe as is absolutely possible, he has a facebook page, (personal protection dogs) unfortunately he operates around my area, he is renouned for being cruel, a conman, he has no formal training qualifications, but does keep spouting on about his handler qualifications, which to be honest, whoever passed him needs to give their head a bloody good wobble, he is an absolute disgrace, has no morals, & couldn't give a monkey's about the dogs in his care, he has had more hate campaigns against him on facebook than anyone I know, so please anyone, anywhere for the sake of your dog, spread the word far & wide, this man is a deluded nightmare, go to his page & give him hell, for eveyones sake


Well, it didn't take much for the members of PF to suss him out based on his videos alone. Not sure what the point of telling people to go to his page and give him hell is though...
Do you have personal experience with him? Have you taken it up with the relevant authorities?


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## Guest (Aug 11, 2018)

O2.0 said:


> Well, it didn't take much for the members of PF to suss him out based on his videos alone. Not sure what the point of telling people to go to his page and give him hell is though...
> Do you have personal experience with him? Have you taken it up with the relevant authorities?





Andy Denby said:


> Hi all, I appreciate this is a really old post, but I'm putting this on in the hopes that anyone reading this stays as far away from Bob / Rob Mecalfe as is absolutely possible, he has a facebook page, (personal protection dogs) unfortunately he operates around my area, he is renouned for being cruel, a conman, he has no formal training qualifications, but does keep spouting on about his handler qualifications, which to be honest, whoever passed him needs to give their head a bloody good wobble, he is an absolute disgrace, has no morals, & couldn't give a monkey's about the dogs in his care, he has had more hate campaigns against him on facebook than anyone I know, so please anyone, anywhere for the sake of your dog, spread the word far & wide, this man is a deluded nightmare, go to his page & give him hell, for eveyones sake


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## Guest (Aug 11, 2018)

Yes more than enough experience
Apologies, the comment was for those like the gent from Barnsley who may not be as au fait with the industry etc, & yes I have more than enough experience with this fella, & have reported him more than enough which doesnt seem to make any difference, like I said he operates in my area, I have had clients that have come to me from Mr Metcalfe, & the reason I mentioned going to his page is because for a while now he seems to be reluctant to put anything in his own name ( pages etc) & relies on the unsuspecting members of the public & industry for his client base, anyway I seem to have over stepped the mark, my apologies it wont happen again.


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## moossy (Nov 23, 2018)

Hi all. I have literally made an account on this forum just to let everyone know about my experience with the guy.

So i called him up about getting my 1 year old akita trained in advanced obedience and my 12 week old dutch herder trained in protection. So he gives me an expensive quote, but it is cheaper than his going rate, so fair enough. He said he'd train my akita in protection, which i found a bit odd given that the breed isn't renowned for its protection work. Nevertheless he assured me that the course would last 20 weeks and i would have 2 fully trained protection dogs in that time. I told him that the quoted price is a little too expensive and i would prefer to work on a biweekly basis. He then offered to come to my house just so we could chat face to face and i would get to know exactly what i would be investing in, and he also dropped the price to something i was happy to pay.

So he comes to my house and gives me the breakdown. Tells me that he would train both my dogs - spend about 30-40 minutes PER dog and then leave me to work on things over the week before our next appointment. He didn't really like it when i told him i had a couple of other trainers i was speaking to and wanted to decide between them all before committing to him. He told me how busy he is and that he needs to know now so he could plan his trips to glasgow (apparently my location was convenient to him as he had a client he was going to see in glasgow for the next 20 weeks so he could drive through my area on the way every weekend). To be honest his urgency and willingness to drop his price should have been a red flag. Anyway so we agree to meet for an assessment.

He comes to my house and the first thing he does is puts 2 choke collars on my dogs and we start walking with them in a park about 2 minutes from my house. We literally did nothing but walk up and down for about 50 yards while he told me how great of a trainer he is and all about his achievements and how he has clients from all over the world and how he supplies police dogs - but not UK police dogs. His methods literally shocked me - for example he told me to NEVER give treats which is bizarre, especially on a 12 week old puppy - but at the time i trusted the guy. So essentially for the assessment, the guy took a nice sum of money for 40 minutes of walking 50 yards up and down and telling my dogs to sit.

Oh but he gave me 2 choke collars that cost £7 each..

And if you think we did anything differently the next week, we did not. It was exactly the same. Any question you have for him he would just reply with 'we'll go through that next week'. The lesson lasted a maximum of 40 minutes. None of this 30 minutes per dog, as per our agreement. He again went off with my money after doing nothing and teaching nothing. Unfortunately it was my partner who saw him that week, otherwise i would not have paid a penny for what he offered. I sent him a text message expressing my dissatisfaction. His response was him telling me how great of a trainer he is and how it was my partner's fault as she'd walked the dogs that morning and how great his teaching is and i should check out his youtube videos (which now that i've looked at them with my head screwed on, are average at best and touching on reckless and dangerous). Oh and he also mentioned how it costs him £50 in petrol to get to my house, as though that's new information that i threw at him after he agreed the discounted price for 2 dogs.

All in all, it wasn't just his terrible, terrible training. The guy was simply unprofessional. He would agree a time and then show up about 30 minutes after that. My girlfriend told him not to message me until the morning as i was at work and he literally leaves her and calls me within a minute. Shocking service and unfortunately it was money wasted. But at least the choke collars will be of use.

I opted for a far superior IPO trainer and i'm actually enjoying the process.

Hope this helps ANYONE who even wants to consider Rob Metcalfe Dog trainer. it would have saved me a some money had i dug a bit deeper at the start. Thankfully it wasn't a huge amount of money wasted. 

You live and you learn.


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## Guest (Nov 23, 2018)

That's Bob Metcalfe, every dog he touches goes on a french / dominance collar, he is the king of the sit stay / down stay shot & has no formal teaching/ training qualifications, he is a NASDU handler, but that does not a trainer make!! But of course you cant tell him that, he's been a nightmare for years, exceptionally delusional, unfortunately for dog & the unsuspecting client he knows no other way, I am sorry for your experience.


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## moossy (Nov 23, 2018)

Andy Denby said:


> That's Bob Metcalfe, every dog he touches goes on a french / dominance collar, he is the king of the sit stay / down stay shot & has no formal teaching/ training qualifications, he is a NASDU handler, but that does not a trainer make!! But of course you cant tell him that, he's been a nightmare for years, exceptionally delusional, unfortunately for dog & the unsuspecting client he knows no other way, I am sorry for your experience.


What shocks me is the positive reviews he has on his website.


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## Guest (Nov 23, 2018)

moossy said:


> What shocks me is the positive reviews he has on his website.


 Again from people who are either duped by him, believe his retoric, or simpky just don't know any better either for themselves or still live in the dark ages when it comes to dog training! What you will find is that the qualified professional trainers & long established handlers know who Mr Metcalfe is & normally will not give him the time of day, there are other things that I cannot possibly go into here, allI would say to any prospective client is 1. Check your trainers qualifications, credentials & what professional bodies they belong to, check their insurance, & ask to see either their trained dog, or dogs & clients they have trained, ( & watch how the dog reacts & relates to them because its not always about just what a dog will do) any trainer worth their salt shouldn't have a problem with any of this.. but thats just my opinion


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## Guest (Nov 23, 2018)

Andy Denby said:


> Again from people who are either duped by him, believe his retoric, or simply just don't know any better either for themselves or still live in the dark ages when it comes to dog training! What you will find is that the qualified professional trainers & long established handlers know who Mr Metcalfe is & normally will not give him the time of day, there are other things that I cannot possibly go into here, all I would say to any prospective client is 1. Check your trainers qualifications, credentials & what professional bodies they belong to, 2. check their insurance, & 3. Ask to see either their trained dog, or dogs & clients they have trained, ( & watch how the dog reacts & relates to them because its not always about just what a dog will do) any trainer worth their salt shouldn't have a problem with any of this.. but thats just my opinion & of course if you are concerned about the positive reviews he has 1. Dont forget some of those can come from friends & fake accounts... if you know what I mean & 2. As long as you are truthful & factual, you can always place the opposite to help those not so savvy folks


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## moossy (Nov 23, 2018)

Yeh you're right. So what exactly are those qualifications? He kept going on about them. What do they mean exactly?


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## Guest (Nov 23, 2018)

moossy said:


> Yeh you're right. So what exactly are those qualifications? He kept going on about them. What do they mean exactly?


The only qualifications Mr Metcalfe has is a NASDU ( National Association of Security Dog Users) level 2 General purpose security dog handler qualification, which in real terms is just above entry level depending on how you look at it? & he has a NASDU level 3 detection dog handler certificate, & thats it, he does bang on about explosive dog quals, thing is hes not qualified? He bangs on a lot, about a lot, but its all smoke & mirrors, like I say there is a lot that I cannot go into for various reasons, there is no evidence to my knowledge that he has ever trained dogs for any police prison, or anyone else here or abroad, but at the very best Mr Metcalfe is a handler (& not a very good one) not a trainer, he has no teaching or trainer qualifications at all, I doubt he is insured, & I doubt he has a fully trained dog, he has a reputation for being cruel, I have had half a dozen of his former clients come to me & the tales are not very pleasant, but rest assured you have made the right decision, he will also tell you how long he's been operating & how many dogs he's trained, well even a broken clock is right twice a day, if you consider the revolutions a hampster does on a wheel but never goes anywhere, thats the sum of Mr Metcalfes knowledge.


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## Guest (Nov 23, 2018)

I forgot to mention if you go to his Facebook page Personal Protection dogs you will see more fantastic footage of his handy work etc, scroll through, theres even footage of him putting to sleep a dog who he says is like his brother that he has had for years! & he does this why?? To show that he cares!!! That is Mr Metcalfe, he's as mad as a box of monkeys


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## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

I'm not convinced that this public forum is the appropriate place for 'outing ' a trainer so I'm closing this now.


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