# Threatened birds of prey 'Vanish'...



## noushka05

Just as conservationists predicted they would:angry:

Bastards | Raptor Persecution Scotland

BBC News - Threatened birds of prey 'vanish'


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## Knightofalbion

A predictable outcome really. I don't think one pair (of harriers) would have made a discernible difference to a commercial shoot, but vested financial interests are at stake and these people obviously feel the need to prevent a predatory presence from establishing itself - or re-establishing itself I should say. (The same vested financial interests being responsible for them disappearing from their natural habitat in the first place.)
Hard to see how any such future scheme could possibly succeed given this sort of attitude.


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## simplysardonic

Knightofalbion said:


> A predictable outcome really. I don't think one pair (of harriers) would have made a discernible difference to a commercial shoot, but vested financial interests are at stake and these people obviously feel the need to prevent a *predatory presence* from establishing itself - or re-establishing itself I should say. (The same vested financial interests being responsible for them disappearing from their natural habitat in the first place.)
> Hard to see how any such future scheme could possibly succeed given this sort of attitude.


Ironic really, seeing as man is arguably the worst predatory presence in existence- for all species including ourselves!


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## ForestWomble

:angry: :thumbdown:


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## noushka05

Animallover26 said:


> :angry: :thumbdown:





simplysardonic said:


> Ironic really, seeing as man is arguably the worst predatory presence in existence- for all species including ourselves!





Knightofalbion said:


> A predictable outcome really. I don't think one pair (of harriers) would have made a discernible difference to a commercial shoot, but vested financial interests are at stake and these people obviously feel the need to prevent a predatory presence from establishing itself - or re-establishing itself I should say. (The same vested financial interests being responsible for them disappearing from their natural habitat in the first place.)
> Hard to see how any such future scheme could possibly succeed given this sort of attitude.


The only way to save this species & stop the illegal slaughter of other raptor species is to ban driven grouse moors. Theres no chance under this wildlife hating government but if Labour get in, perhaps theres hope?

I suspect you three have already signed Mark Averys petition - but just incase here it is again 

Ban driven grouse shooting - e-petitions

.


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## rona

If someone wanted to shoot them, it would have made much more sense to kill the parents before they had fed huge amounts of prey (assume including Grouse) to growing chicks

One disappeared on a non shooting estate

BASC urges caution and evidence-based investigation of missing hen harriers | The British Association for Shooting and Conservation

GWCT News & Advisory: Sadness as Hen Harrier chicks go missing


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## noushka05

rona said:


> If someone wanted to shoot them, it would have made much more sense to kill the parents before they had fed huge amounts of prey (assume including Grouse) to growing chicks
> 
> One disappeared on a non shooting estate
> 
> BASC urges caution and evidence-based investigation of missing hen harriers | The British Association for Shooting and Conservation
> 
> GWCT News & Advisory: Sadness as Hen Harrier chicks go missing


Rona - everyone predicted they would 'disappear' or be found dead. Just like all the rest have!. The ONLY way to save this species from extinction is to ban driven grouse moors.

Someone who feels GENUINE sadness at their disappearance > Natural England â are you still there?

,

,


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## rona

Well well well.................
https://basc.org.uk/blog/key-issues/media-key-issues/basc-welcomes-highlanders-return/

Highlander' fledged from an estate in the Forest of Bowland in 2014 and was successfully tracked until its tag stopped transmitting in April 2016 in the County Durham area.

The RSPB is now reporting that it believes Highlander has returned to a previous roost within 30 miles of the Forest of Bowland and is still carrying the failed tag, although they say the lack of signal makes it impossible to be 100 per cent certain of the bird's identity.

I wonder if there was a dodgy batch of tags in 2014?


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## sandy68

What happened in australia when they introduced rabbits .
Now the R.S.P.B have managed to get 30,000 peregrines just in the Yorkshire dales never mind the rest of the country just because Joe Soap the public likes to see them never mind the consequences of this act to our native species while you celebrate their management of raptors .Just remember other species are its food .... Following along with your arguement it should be alright for your dog to kill lambs in the field and the farmers should get rid of their sheep .The point is this act of wilful mismanagement interferes with our food chain as does too many raptors affect our loved wild species .The R.S.P.B. Has overstepped its mandate and should be taken to task for it .IT FAILS TO PROTECT BIRDS OF ALL SPECIES ..


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## noushka05

rona said:


> Well well well.................
> https://basc.org.uk/blog/key-issues/media-key-issues/basc-welcomes-highlanders-return/
> 
> Highlander' fledged from an estate in the Forest of Bowland in 2014 and was successfully tracked until its tag stopped transmitting in April 2016 in the County Durham area.
> 
> The RSPB is now reporting that it believes Highlander has returned to a previous roost within 30 miles of the Forest of Bowland and is still carrying the failed tag, although they say the lack of signal makes it impossible to be 100 per cent certain of the bird's identity.
> 
> I wonder if there was a dodgy batch of tags in 2014?


Crikey I didn't realise you'd revived this thread as well. Great news if Highlander has survived. Does not alter the FACT that grouse moors are responsible for the demise of our hen harrier. More proof grouse moors are sink holes for raptors from the BTO - a source you verified as FACTUAL .

https://app.bto.org/birdtrends/species.jsp?s=pereg&year=2016

Peregrine pairs in England have increased fivefold since 1981 and now, for the first time, outnumber those in Scotland (Hayhow _et al._ 2015). Illegal persecution continues to limit numbers but persecution in lowland areas decreased during the 20th century, allowing numbers to benefit from the ban on organochlorine agrochemicals (Hayhow _et al._ 2015). In northern England, breeding productivity on grouse moors has been 50% lower than at nests in other habitats, indicating that illegal persecution on land managed for Red Grouse shooting remains an important pressure on the population (



sandy68 said:


> What happened in australia when they introduced rabbits .
> Now the R.S.P.B have managed to get 30,000 peregrines just in the Yorkshire dales never mind the rest of the country just because Joe Soap the public likes to see them never mind the consequences of this act to our native species while you celebrate their management of raptors .Just remember other species are its food .... Following along with your arguement it should be alright for your dog to kill lambs in the field and the farmers should get rid of their sheep .The point is this act of wilful mismanagement interferes with our food chain as does too many raptors affect our loved wild species .The R.S.P.B. Has overstepped its mandate and should be taken to task for it .IT FAILS TO PROTECT BIRDS OF ALL SPECIES ..


Have you been reading Song Bird Survival website? Or listening to someone from the shooting community? As you have been extremely misinformed to say the least. There are only 1,505 pair of peregrine in the whole of the UK & the Isle of Man. The Yorkshire Dales are, infact,a hot spot for raptor persecution, peregrine, like other bop species, are struggling to survive here. https://raptorforum.wordpress.com/peregrine-persecution-national-parks/

_The persecution of Peregrines across the Pennines continues to have a negative impact on local populations. Despite being fully protected under the Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981 *it is now two decades since Peregrines successfully bred on grouse moors in the Yorkshire Dales.* *This statistic would be deplorable anywhere but this is a National Park and should be a safe haven for Peregrines not a 'black hole'*
_
So if you don't mind me asking, where did you get your info from?

There is no comparison between rabbits & peregrine. Firstly rabbits are not native to Australia whereas peregrine are indigenous to this county. A better comparison would be rabbits & pheasants . Pheasants are an alien species yet every year we release millions of these birds into our countryside to be shot for fun. Rabbits as a prey species have a breeding strategy to cope with predation - they reproduce quickly and have lots of babies. Peregrine as an avian predator are territorial, have one clutch of eggs, so this plus food abundance determine their population.

Peregrine population cannot get out of control. You have been fed a bunch of lies.


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