# Crufts: Live



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Just getting this up nice & early ready for discussions on all the happenings on the Live YouTube stream 

Link to watch here - http://www.crufts.org.uk/content/whats-on/watch-crufts-live/ and follow to YouTube.

Everyone attending, whether for show or shopping, enjoy!


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## Biffo (Mar 14, 2016)

Thank you, getting exciting now!


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Biffo said:


> Thank you, getting exciting now!


Me too!


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## Katalyst (Aug 11, 2015)

I've been a bit bouncy all day with excitement. All the way up to about 15 mins ago when I got in bed to cuddle my dogs and realised that I'm leaving them with a friend and my other half for the next five days.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Katalyst said:


> I've been a bit bouncy all day with excitement. All the way up to about 15 mins ago when I got in bed to cuddle my dogs and realised that I'm leaving them with a friend and my other half for the next five days.


 But you'll make up for it with all the pizzle you're bringing back 

I'm excited that tonight is my last work night for the next 5 days  I've took more time than needed to prepare lol.


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## Calum Mills (Dec 6, 2016)

is it not on TV? We could have gone but its a huge drive for us and our puppy would have been left for a long time. Although I am sure my mum wouldnt have minded doing dog sitting.


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## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

Our girls are being dropped off at kennels on route , hoping to see one or other of Reena's offspring in the ring. 
They will be bought *lots* of treats and goodies to make up for their abandonment .OH is coming this time to carry the shopping.
Will look out for the Pizzle wagon and hitch a ride !


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Calum Mills said:


> is it not on TV? We could have gone but its a huge drive for us and our puppy would have been left for a long time. Although I am sure my mum wouldnt have minded doing dog sitting.


It is, yes. Channel 4 and More4 I believe. But the live streaming is better IMO as it's all unedited.


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## kittih (Jan 19, 2014)

Calum Mills said:


> is it not on TV?


Starts at 4pm on TV but is usually edited highlights of the days events.


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Can't wait! Me and my coworker who does agility too are tempted to have a sneaky peak at agility over our lunch break tomorrow Quite gutted I'm not going as everyone keeps talking about how great the Scottish agility group is at being the loudest and most supportive bunch at crufts haha!... oh well, there's next year!


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

I'm kinda jealous that I'm not going now! I am off on Friday but can't afford it as all monies going towards a puppy! So hoping to go again next year 
I'll have to try and watch the live streaming whilst at work tomorrow


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## Guest (Mar 8, 2017)

I will be watching the live streaming on youtube.


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## Guest (Mar 9, 2017)

We can't watch the live streaming it isn't on youtube.


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## BrackenFlight (Mar 9, 2015)

Its starting in 8 minutes i think?


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## Guest (Mar 9, 2017)

BrackenFlight said:


> Its starting in 8 minutes i think?


It said it was starting at 8.30. It is 8.33 now and nothing is happening.


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## BrackenFlight (Mar 9, 2015)

danielled said:


> It said it was starting at 8.30. It is 8.33 now and nothing is happening.


Ive noticed that. Possibly a technical problem on their end.


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## BrackenFlight (Mar 9, 2015)

In the description it says the schedule starts at 8:45. Maybe thats when it begins.


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

I'm all geared up for the crufts teams agility. My club has a team in the final.


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Burrowzig said:


> I'm all geared up for the crufts teams agility. My club has a team in the final.


Sitting at the office with my phone all ready to watch it! Am a bit annoyed that I didn't just take a couple of days off to watch it at home properly... I will have to surpress a lot of huffs and squeals here :Arghh


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Ive just put it on but no sound LOL

Love watching the agility! Totally hoping my new puppy this year will really get us both into agility


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

That agility course seemed to confuse a lot of dogs/handlers didn't it? Really good to watch a hard course.


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

All the lovely staffies!

Oooh its the trainer from Battersea


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> That agility course seemed to confuse a lot of dogs/handlers didn't it? Really good to watch a hard course.


It was interesting to watch the new distance regulations in action. I think the course wasn't too complicated as there were a lot of straight lines there and most mistakes were made because of the handlers being a bit off with their cues... then it all went down hill from there.
Personally I wasn't a big fan of a couple of older dogs running... they were a bit heavy and seemed to bunny hop


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## Guest (Mar 9, 2017)

shadowmare said:


> It was interesting to watch the new distance regulations in action. I think the course wasn't too complicated as there were a lot of straight lines there and most mistakes were made because of the handlers being a bit off with their cues... then it all went down hill from there.
> Personally I wasn't a big fan of a couple of older dogs running... they were a bit heavy and seemed to bunny hop


I noticed the bunny hops in some dogs.


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## sesmo (Mar 6, 2016)

Can just imagine what my agility instructor would have said about a few bits of the handling  Must be difficult though to perform in that sort of an arena and under pressure, I'd never manage it. I've only trained with the new distance regulations, it feels like miles between some of the obstacles.


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## sesmo (Mar 6, 2016)

Also, was that a Groenendael in the activities bit? Gorgeous dog. Wouldn't fancy grooming it though


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

That little Chi showing it can perform as well as the big dogs


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> That little Chi showing it can perform as well as the big dogs


Its well cute!


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Just watching 15 minutes in silence during my break at work.
Wish i'd taken the day off now to watch it all


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Ive got it on in the background lol


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

Enjoyed watching a bit of the agility


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

My favourite part so far was the scottish terrier with the guy in tracksuits doing agility. little blighter was barking all the way round


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

I enjoy the HTM - but looking forward to seeing more agility.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

AlexPed2393 said:


> My favourite part so far was the scottish terrier with the guy in tracksuits doing agility. little blighter was barking all the way round


Oh missed that!


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Oh missed that!


Me too


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Hanwombat said:


> Me too


Scottie too! Never seen them in agility.


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## Shikoku (Dec 16, 2013)

I'm just watching the agility part on youtube, I am glad you can rewind. Although I did briefly see the long haired Chi doing HTM? He/She was adorable! I have a real soft spot for long haired Chi's


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Loving the boxing HTM


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Hanwombat said:


> Loving the boxing HTM


It was great wasn't it?


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> It was great wasn't it?


Such a great idea!!


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

Dogloverlou said:


> Scottie too! Never seen them in agility.


I was a bit confused seeing the little dog, it had a skirt and everything


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## Guest (Mar 9, 2017)

Is it me or does Logan look a bit like Pudsey?


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Loving the shelties


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Hanwombat said:


> Loving the shelties


Speedy little things


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## kittih (Jan 19, 2014)

sesmo said:


> Also, was that a Groenendael in the activities bit? Gorgeous dog. Wouldn't fancy grooming it though


Just been talking at the lady at discover dogs about her Groenendael. She said grooming wasn't too bad. Just a quick brush every day. She told me that she are a mistake with her first dog by bathing and brushing it too much and when she showed it the judge said it had no undercoat left.

The two I met weren't particularly long coated - a lot less than I thought but the fur doesn't lie as flat as some breeds giving them a more fluffy appearance.

I used to be desperate to own one when I was 12 and seeing one in the flesh has reignited that. The Aussie's at DD were gorgeous too.


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Speedy little things


Zoom Zoom ZOOMMMMMMMM


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

Loving that Mallinois


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

AlexPed2393 said:


> Loving that Mallinois


My favourite dog so far...


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

I missed the large runners


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

PLEASE tell me that I'm not the only one who thought Foxie Botts movement was bloody terrible  it cannot be a hop of a healthy dog!


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

All the ickle dogs are getting tired halfway round


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

HERE IT IS!!!
THE SCOTTIE


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

I'm just back tuning in now


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

Hanwombat said:


> I'm just back tuning in now


If you can rewind it, some really good runs in there


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## BrackenFlight (Mar 9, 2015)

Im excited for the flyball!


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## kittih (Jan 19, 2014)

BrackenFlight said:


> Im excited for the flyball!


It's going to loud :-D


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

AlexPed2393 said:


> If you can rewind it, some really good runs in there


Just seen the scottie


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> PLEASE tell me that I'm not the only one who thought Foxie Botts movement was bloody terrible  it cannot be a hop of a healthy dog!


Looks like the dog had no spine! Very stiff and straight.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

I've missed everything you're talking about and the Scottie AGAIN!  I was bathing Cash  

Am going to have a break from the live streaming & watch the Ch4 coverage now.


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Just settled down on the sofa and putting the Ch4 highlights on now 
Only managed the odd glimpse of the live stream as I wasn't supposed to have it on.


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## BlueJay (Sep 20, 2013)

Terrier judging 
Come on smooth fox.......


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## Pappychi (Aug 12, 2015)

BlueJay said:


> Terrier judging
> Come on smooth fox.......


I really like the smooth this year!


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## BlueJay (Sep 20, 2013)

Pappychi said:


> I really like the smooth this year!


Their little straight legged walk and itsy bitsy stubby paws are the best
Tootle tootle tootle


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## Pappychi (Aug 12, 2015)

Get in! Reserve in group to the Westie!


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## BlueJay (Sep 20, 2013)

ROBBED!!!
Rory is devo'd


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## Guest (Mar 9, 2017)

Westie is gorgeous. But then I own one so judge there you have it, I love westies.


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## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

SusieRainbow said:


> Our girls are being dropped off at kennels on route , hoping to see one or other of Reena's offspring in the ring.
> They will be bought *lots* of treats and goodies to make up for their abandonment .OH is coming this time to carry the shopping.
> Will look out for the Pizzle wagon and hitch a ride !


Reena's daughter Bella won Highly Commended (4th) in a very strong adult class of around 15 dogs. She behaved beautifully and I was proud to be there.


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## Westie Mum (Feb 5, 2015)

Well the westie was gorgeous obviously but OMG i am so in love with the little jack Russell ..... stunning!! Shame she didn't place but really a great example of the breed


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## Colette (Jan 2, 2010)

Really liked the gbgv that took the hound group, he looked so cheerful


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Pleased with the two winners so far, both rare breeds in their own rights, and it's nice to see less common breeds in the spotlight.

Not sure whether it was just me but I wasn't keen on the standard Dachshund's colouring/face marking. It just looked off....


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

Just a question on the hound judging.

It seemed a lot of the dogs were not happy one bit with the judge being close to them, I don't know why but a few had a look on their face like GTFO


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

Dogloverlou said:


> Pleased with the two winners so far, both rare breeds in their own rights, and it's nice to see less common breeds in the spotlight.
> 
> Not sure whether it was just me but I wasn't keen on the standard Dachshund's colouring/face marking. It just looked off....


The long haired daschund had a really broad head i was a bit . Still looked lovely


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## Guest (Mar 10, 2017)

Says day 2 live streaming starts at 8.30 and again it isn't starting. Maybe they should have fixed that yesterday.


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

danielled said:


> Says day 2 live streaming starts at 8.30 and again it isn't starting. Maybe they should have fixed that yesterday.


Making mistakes is human. Does it cause you any serious inconvenience to miss the first 4 - 5 minutes?


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

The labrador who just won the ABC large agility.. flew the course!


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## Pappychi (Aug 12, 2015)

Hanwombat said:


> The labrador who just won the ABC large agility.. flew the course!


This is completely unrelated to Crufts but sat watching around the dog world at Manchester Champ Show and a tri colour Smooth Collie took the group. You and bigby popped into my head :Hilarious


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## Guest (Mar 10, 2017)

shadowmare said:


> Making mistakes is human. Does it cause you any serious inconvenience to miss the first 4 - 5 minutes?


Yes it is but twice it has happened. I didn't miss anything so seems the clocks at their end are slow.


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Tri sheltie running is one of my breeders offspring


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Pappychi said:


> This is completely unrelated to Crufts but sat watching around the dog world at Manchester Champ Show and a tri colour Smooth Collie took the group. You and bigby popped into my head :Hilarious


Maybe it WAS Bigby LOL LOL


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

danielled said:


> Yes it is but twice it has happened. I didn't miss anything so seems the clocks at their end are slow.


For goodness sake danielled, no dog show... in fact NO show or event ever works to a minute. Especially agility shows. Making sure that the ring is set up properly, is safe and the distances are all correct takes time. It is not a case of someone's watch showing incorrect time. It's just how real life works.


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## Guest (Mar 10, 2017)

shadowmare said:


> For goodness sake danielled, no dog show... in fact NO show or event ever works to a minute. Especially agility shows. Making sure that the ring is set up properly, is safe and the distances are all correct takes time. It is not a case of someone's watch showing incorrect time. It's just how real life works.


It wasn't livestreaming at all though, that is entirely the point. Usually we see them setting it up on the livestreaming but nothing. Yesterday people thought it was a glitch at crufts end, today it seems to be somehow my fault there might have been a glitch or clocks were slow despite the fact I don't run it lol. Clocks can be wrong. Glitches can happen.


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## Pappychi (Aug 12, 2015)

Hanwombat said:


> Maybe it WAS Bigby LOL LOL


Unless Mr Bigby is now Miss Bigby I don't think so


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Thanks for that link!
I can catch up as I missed the Agility and I want to see the Toy Judging tonight


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

Hanwombat said:


> The labrador who just won the ABC large agility.. flew the course!


Just rewound it and saw it, apart from that one really slow turn it was a missile


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

Question.

Does you dog have to be a pedigree to run in the agility at Crufts?


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

AlexPed2393 said:


> Question.
> 
> Does you dog have to be a pedigree to run in the agility at Crufts?


No. It can be a crossbreed. If I'm not mistaken in U.K. any dog can compete at any level. I think pedigrees are only exclusive to WAO and European champs?


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

shadowmare said:


> No. It can be a crossbreed. If I'm not mistaken in U.K. any dog can compete at any level. I think pedigrees are only exclusive to WAO and European champs?


Just wondering because some of those cockers were teeny tiny


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## steveshanks (Feb 19, 2015)

Is it just my lack of knowledge or where there a couple of porkers in the terrier group, thinking of the standard EBT particularly


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

Watching agility is giving me itchy feet, I so, so want to try agility with Bungo, I think he'd be great  (not sure about me though :Bag)


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## Nettles (Mar 24, 2011)

Bloody springer noses :Hilarious


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## sesmo (Mar 6, 2016)

Animallover26 said:


> Watching agility is giving me itchy feet, I so, so want to try agility with Bungo, I think he'd be great  (not sure about me though :Bag)


If you think he'll enjoy it, give it a go. The club I go to is great, lovely bunch of people and as we are all beginners, we're all rubbish together. The dogs are great though, just a shame about the handlers.


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## Guest (Mar 10, 2017)

steveshanks said:


> Is it just my lack of knowledge or where there a couple of porkers in the terrier group, thinking of the standard EBT particularly


Not just you, I'm wondering the same thing especially with the standard EBT like you.


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

danielled said:


> Not just you, I'm wondering the same thing especially with the standard EBT like you.


That was a barrel of a dog


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## Guest (Mar 10, 2017)

AlexPed2393 said:


> That was a barrel of a dog


I know, just how much was that dog fed I wonder?


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Been out all morning, so just now tuning in


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## Guest (Mar 10, 2017)

Ooohhh Ollie that looked like it hurt. Jumped over a jump knocked it and nose dived the end ewsult nose planting the green carpet, he didn't look bothered though.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Anyone in the NBN FB group or aware of Absolute Dogs will recognize Lauren Langman running in Agility just now


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

That course looks a bit more technical than yesterday, can see some handling errors creeping in especailly on the jump coming out of the tunnel near the end


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

i been busy all day. will 
watch ch4 crufts at 4pm


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Smooth Collie in the vulnerable breeds final @Hanwombat!


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## kittih (Jan 19, 2014)

And smooth collie wins !


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Yay, lovely win for the breed. Attractive too. A tri like your Bigby @Hanwombat


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Yay, lovely win for the breed. Attractive too. A tri like your Bigby @Hanwombat


Woo go Trevor and Petra  mega happy


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Its crazy to think there was only 89 KC registered smooth puppies last year... compared to over 33,000 labradors


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Hanwombat said:


> Its crazy to think there was only 89 KC registered smooth puppies last year... compared to over 33,000 labradors


Wonder why they're not more popular. They seem to have all the attributes that people look for in a family dog.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

You see that Bulldog in the Utility line up is worse IMO than the Eukanuba final one from North Korea. I know @Pappychi & I were discussing that one last night.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Canaan dog is lovely!


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## Pappychi (Aug 12, 2015)

Dogloverlou said:


> You see that Bulldog in the Utility line up is worse IMO than the Eukanuba final one from North Korea. I know @Pappychi & I were discussing that one last night.


I just don't like them! :Hilarious


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Wonder why they're not more popular. They seem to have all the attributes that people look for in a family dog.


I looked at the statistics for smooth reg puppies since 2017 and last year was prob the highest at 89 puppies. Bigby being born in 2014 was the lowest at just 33 puppies!! 
Compared to the frenchie who went from over 600 puppies in 2007 to over 21,000 in 2016... shocking!!


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Pappychi said:


> I just don't like them! :Hilarious


No, me neither  I still like to judge them though


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

I fleetingly contemplated a Eurasier at one point!


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Hanwombat said:


> I looked at the statistics for smooth reg puppies since 2017 and last year was prob the highest at 89 puppies. Bigby being born in 2014 was the lowest at just 33 puppies!!
> Compared to the frenchie who went from over 600 puppies in 2007 to over 21,000 in 2016... shocking!!


Numbers are on the rise then? That's a positive 

Frenchie numbers are insane!


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Numbers are on the rise then? That's a positive
> 
> Frenchie numbers are insane!


Its crazy with the frenchies


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> I fleetingly contemplated a Eurasier at one point!


Omg  haha


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Hanwombat said:


> Omg  haha


I know! So glad I didn't. Spitz are just not my thing so don't know what I was thinking lol


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## kittih (Jan 19, 2014)

Aah he's totally mispronounced kooikerhondje.

Was lovely to see these at discover dogs.


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## BlueJay (Sep 20, 2013)

The frenchies nostrils (lack of!!!) were disgusting


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Kooikerhondje are pretty.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

kittih said:


> Aah he's totally mispronounced kooikerhondje.
> 
> Was lovely to see these at discover dogs.


Really? lol I pronounce it the same way  it's a hard one, that one.


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> I know! So glad I didn't. Spitz are just not my thing so don't know what I was thinking lol


I used to be really into spitzs... almost got a keeshond and then there was Asta the German spitz... never again!!!


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Hanwombat said:


> I used to be really into spitzs... almost got a keeshond and then there was Asta the German spitz... never again!!!


Oh yeah! Asta gave you a lot of bother in her short time with you didn't she!


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## kittih (Jan 19, 2014)

Dogloverlou said:


> Really? lol I pronounce it the same way  it's a hard one, that one.


Koy-ka-hond-yuh
Literally Duck hunting dog little


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

kittih said:


> Koy-ka-hond-yuh
> Literally Duck hunting dog little


Ah, thank you


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## kittih (Jan 19, 2014)

Dogloverlou said:


> Oh yeah! Asta gave you a lot of bother in her short time with you didn't she!


Have you kept in touch with her @Hanwombat ?


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

kittih said:


> Have you kept in touch with her @Hanwombat ?


The breeder/owner isnt on facebook much as she has a lot of health issues  but a few months back she was on there and posted some photos, some with Asta and she looked well


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Oh yeah! Asta gave you a lot of bother in her short time with you didn't she!


Yeah it was a big mistake! 2 years on i would have been able to handle it, i wasnt as knowledgeable back then but glad I didnt keep her. Would never gotten my Wolfie


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

I'm sorry, but for some reason that Schipperke really makes me think of that poor GSD with the deformity -


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Hanwombat said:


> The breeder/owner isnt on facebook much as she has a lot of health issues  but a few months back she was on there and posted some photos, some with Asta and she looked well


That's lovely she's still with the breeder & doing well


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## Pappychi (Aug 12, 2015)

I love Poodles! 

There I said it


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## BlueJay (Sep 20, 2013)

The shar pei has crappy slits for nostrils too

...digging toy poodle lady's shoes


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

That Shar Pei looks an improvement on most!


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## Pappychi (Aug 12, 2015)

Yaaaaay a Poodle! 

Love that Miniature.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Pappychi said:


> I love Poodles!
> 
> There I said it


They're always so flashy. But my fave was the Standard.


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## Pappychi (Aug 12, 2015)

Dogloverlou said:


> They're always so flashy. But my fave was the Standard.


I may need one :Facepalm


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Pappychi said:


> I may need one :Facepalm


Haha, I couldn't handle that coat!  Would have to keep it clipped.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Griffons are my guilty pleasure breed :Joyful


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

The Pekingese looked worse than Donald Trump's hair


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## Pappychi (Aug 12, 2015)

shadowmare said:


> The Pekingese looked worse than Donald Trump's hair


I. Hate. Pekes.

Like why? Honestly.


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Pappychi said:


> I. Hate. Pekes.
> 
> Like why? Honestly.


I have a strong dislike because I was attacked by one when I was very young... but otherwise to me they're just like any other small breed whose I appeal I personally don't get haha!...
However, this one didn't just look poor in the face, but the coat was a bit like a wig that just came out of a tumble dryer 
On the same note - didn't like the look of king charles either... where was his nose?


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## kittih (Jan 19, 2014)

shadowmare said:


> The Pekingese looked worse than Donald Trump's hair


They've changed so much in 100 years... I am not a fan of dogs bred that can barely walk. :-(


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

kittih said:


> They've changed so much in 100 years... I am not a fan of dogs bred that can barely walk. :-(
> 
> View attachment 302811


It looked to me that his coat was just a mess and that's why he was walking that way. It looked like the bottom was too long and so matted?


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> The Pekingese looked worse than Donald Trump's hair





shadowmare said:


> I have a strong dislike because I was attacked by one when I was very young... but otherwise to me they're just like any other small breed whose I appeal I personally don't get haha!...
> However, this one didn't just look poor in the face, but the coat was a bit like a wig that just came out of a tumble dryer
> On the same note - didn't like the look of king charles either... where was his nose?


:Hilarious :Hilarious

What was up with it's feet too? Looked like it had more hair sprouting from each foot lol.


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Have to admit that I have a bit of a soft spot for Papillons. If I had to choose one toy breed I would ever agree to own that is the one. Though I prefer the sable or red rather than black...


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

That Japanese Chin's eyes looked like they look in different directions! :Wtf


----------



## kittih (Jan 19, 2014)

shadowmare said:


> Have to admit that I have a bit of a soft spot for Papillons. If I had to choose one toy breed I would ever agree to own that is the one. Though I prefer the sable or red rather than black...


I used to admire them but next door has got one that bark hysterically quite a lot. I know it is only one example of the breed but the yapping is quite annoying sometimes. His staffy brother in contrast only barks when the postman comes which is quite useful.


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Commentator: "Originally spaniels had longer faces, but in the 19th century..."
Me:"...they decided breathing is overrated? Oxygen is not necessary? Long lasting dogs are a waste of money in the long run?..."


----------



## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Im not a fan of walking rugs.. pekes are depressing


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

I always feel so sorry for Peke's. That one just now looked like it had a stroke or something with it's tongue hanging out and it's awkward movement


----------



## BlueJay (Sep 20, 2013)

Fab shortlist there, no freaky deakies


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

I love the spirit of Maltese. They always seem such happy, eager little things, putting their all into showing


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Oh I love that Yorkie


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Aaaww the yorkie owner is adorable  and the yorkie is looking cute and healthy (not a tiny rodent with 3 hairs...)


----------



## Julie Crowther (Mar 10, 2017)

AlexPed2393 said:


> Question.
> 
> Does you dog have to be a pedigree to run in the agility at Crufts?


Yes Alex it does


AlexPed2393 said:


> Question.
> 
> Does you dog have to be a pedigree to run in the agility at Crufts?


Yes Alex all dogs at Crufts have to be KC registered and as such have to be pedigrees!


----------



## Mirandashell (Jan 10, 2017)

That's not right. A lot of the agility dogs are crossbreeds. According to the commentator yesterday anyway.


----------



## Guest (Mar 10, 2017)

Julie Crowther said:


> Yes Alex it does
> 
> Yes Alex all dogs at Crufts have to be KC registered and as such have to be pedigrees!


Not for the rescue dog agility they can be crosses, mutts and mongrels etc.


----------



## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Spat my tea out at the Yorkie's owner, "she like to bite small dogs" when asked to describe her character. Brilliant. Hope they win!


----------



## kittih (Jan 19, 2014)

Julie Crowther said:


> Yes Alex it does
> 
> Yes Alex all dogs at Crufts have to be KC registered and as such have to be pedigrees!


@AlexPed2393

As I understand it from the kennel club website the dogs participating in kennel club agility have to either be on the kc pedigree register or on the kc activity register. Any breed or cross breed / Heinz 57 can be on the activity register. Excerpt for the kc website:

Agility was first introduced to the UK at Crufts 1978 and the structure of the competition has not changed very much over the years. It's a comparatively new form of dog competition, where the animal's fitness and the handler's ability to train and direct the dog over and through certain obstacles are tested.

It is fast, furious and a great favourite with competitors and spectators alike. Your dog does not have to be a pedigree dog to take part, but it must be registered with the Kennel Club on either the Breed Register or the Activity Register.


----------



## Mirandashell (Jan 10, 2017)

Thank you! I knew they had to be registered with the KC to take part but not on the same register as the show dogs. I would imagine they have to win a fair few competitions to even get to Crufts, don't they?


----------



## kittih (Jan 19, 2014)

Mirandashell said:


> Thank you! I knew they had to be registered with the KC to take part but not on the same register as the show dogs. I would imagine they have to win a fair few competitions to even get to Crufts, don't they?


From the crufts website:

*AGILITY CHAMPIONSHIPS AT CRUFTS 2017.*

A dog is eligible for entry if it has won a Kennel Club Agility Certificate (Large, Medium and Small Dogs) at a show held between 18th January 2016 and 23rd January 2017.


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Julie Crowther said:


> Yes Alex it does
> 
> Yes Alex all dogs at Crufts have to be KC registered and as such have to be pedigrees!


You registered an account and posted your only post just to give misleading information?.... Dogs do not have to be pedigree. They have to be registered with KC either through pedigree registry or through KC activity registry for which, you can register any dog.


----------



## Julie Crowther (Mar 10, 2017)

shadowmare said:


> You registered an account and posted your only post just to give misleading information?.... Dogs do not have to be pedigree. They have to be registered with KC either through pedigree registry or through KC activity registry for which, you can register any dog.


Ok I am sorry didn't mean to mislead!


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

I don't know why I read comments on youtube or crufts FB page... I swear, some people moan for the sake of moaning. "The judge should've chosen the akita because poodles always win" "XXX breed won last year/ two years ago/ always wins and they should choose something new" "....insert any sort of complaint about the individual's breed not winning yet again....".... For lords sake, this is effectively a dog beauty contest. This is not a show where the rarest breed/ cutest bow owner wins. If last year a poodle won because it was in the group, and this year yet again the poodle was the most worth to win, then sucks to be your favourite breed. Maybe f the show was happening a month ago and the poodle was a bit chubbier at that time he wouldn't have won. Maybe it then would be akita. Or maybe it would be a different poodle  it's not kindergarten. You don't get a gold star for good effort 
P.S. seen someone have a melt down because "How KC can allow docked dogs show up here? That french bulldog has no tail! I thought we don't allow such things in UK???"


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> I don't know why I read comments on youtube or crufts FB page... I swear, some people moan for the sake of moaning. "The judge should've chosen the akita because poodles always win" "XXX breed won last year/ two years ago/ always wins and they should choose something new" "....insert any sort of complaint about the individual's breed not winning yet again....".... For lords sake, this is effectively a dog beauty contest. This is not a show where the rarest breed/ cutest bow owner wins. If last year a poodle won because it was in the group, and this year yet again the poodle was the most worth to win, then sucks to be your favourite breed. Maybe f the show was happening a month ago and the poodle was a bit chubbier at that time he wouldn't have won. Maybe it then would be akita. Or maybe it would be a different poodle  it's not kindergarten. You don't get a gold star for good effort
> P.S. seen someone have a melt down because "How KC can allow docked dogs show up here? That french bulldog has no tail! I thought we don't allow such things in UK???"


I was just scanning similar posts actually myself. Noticed lots of angry faces at the Utility winner so was wondering what the reaction was for, and yes, lots of 'the judge is biased' 'they all know who they like already' etc etc. Some people just love to complain no matter what


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> I was just scanning similar posts actually myself. Noticed lots of angry faces at the Utility winner so was wondering what the reaction was for, and yes, lots of 'the judge is biased' 'they all know who they like already' etc etc. Some people just love to complain no matter what


Whenever I see posts like these, I just think that even if the judge had to make a public explanation of why one or another dog is chosen, these people wouldn't understand it because the concept of a 'breed standard' and what best of show means is just going over their heads... that's what annoys me about people who criticize shows - it's almost like in most of their heads it's a purely bias matter-of-taste contest. I know that there are some crap judges out there, but these moans mostly come from people who have no clue at all... Someone on youtube yesterday kept shouting about the bulldog having a fault and being outraged by the fact that the bulldog has a fault... I just wanted to slap the person and inform them that a fault is just that - a fault and not a trait that merits a disqualification.


----------



## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

QUOTE, Dogloverlou:

Haha, I couldn't handle that [Poodle] coat!  Would have to keep it clipped.

/QUOTE
.
.
nah - go for corded.  Easy to keep up, no combing, just twiddle the growing hair in at the bottom of the cords. 
.
.


----------



## Julie Crowther (Mar 10, 2017)

Julie Crowther said:


> Yes Alex it does
> 
> Yes Alex all dogs at Crufts have to be KC registered and as such have to be pedigrees!


Hi Alex, sorry misread what you were asking, my reply was about the show rings at Crufts! I have a German shepherd
and the breeder I got her from qualified for best long coat German Shepherd last year! Many apologies Julie


----------



## Julie Crowther (Mar 10, 2017)

shadowmare said:


> You registered an account and posted your only post just to give misleading information?.... Dogs do not have to be pedigree. They have to be registered with KC either through pedigree registry or through KC activity registry for which, you can register any dog.





shadowmare said:


> I don't know why I read comments on youtube or crufts FB page... I swear, some people moan for the sake of moaning. "The judge should've chosen the akita because poodles always win" "XXX breed won last year/ two years ago/ always wins and they should choose something new" "....insert any sort of complaint about the individual's breed not winning yet again....".... For lords sake, this is effectively a dog beauty contest. This is not a show where the rarest breed/ cutest bow owner wins. If last year a poodle won because it was in the group, and this year yet again the poodle was the most worth to win, then sucks to be your favourite breed. Maybe f the show was happening a month ago and the poodle was a bit chubbier at that time he wouldn't have won. Maybe it then would be akita. Or maybe it would be a different poodle  it's not kindergarten. You don't get a gold star for good effort
> P.S. seen someone have a melt down because "How KC can allow docked dogs show up here? That french bulldog has no tail! I thought we don't allow such things in UK???"


Actually think you should get a life, I walk my dog for at least 4 hours a day! If you love dogs so much stop commenting on here and have a good time with your dog!


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Julie Crowther said:


> Actually think you should get a life, I walk my dog for at least 4 hours a day! If you love dogs so much stop commenting on here and have a good time with your dog!


Not sure what your post has to do with anything with what me and Dogloverlou were discussing but ok...  Seeing as it's after midnight my dog has been walked a few hours ago but thanks for your advice and extra info... that once again had nothing to do with what we were talking about


----------



## Nettles (Mar 24, 2011)

Julie Crowther said:


> Actually think you should get a life, I walk my dog for at least 4 hours a day! If you love dogs so much stop commenting on here and have a good time with your dog!


So you joined to give incorrect information on a subject you knew nothing about and then insult a long term member for correcting you? Wow.

But congratulations for walking your dog for 4 hours a day. I walk my dog for an hour a day. That must make you 4 times better at owning a dog than me


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

4 hours a day? Err.. why?


----------



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

Julie Crowther said:


> Actually think you should get a life, I walk my dog for at least 4 hours a day! If you love dogs so much stop commenting on here and have a good time with your dog!


Wow, that's judgemental for a Newbie. 

I wish we could walk Dillon for 4 hours "the poor hard done by dog" has to put up with 1 hour, but at our age his lucky to get that. But his loved, well feed and gets lots of play at home so he'll just have to put up with that, the poor thing.


----------



## steveshanks (Feb 19, 2015)

I haven't watched all the show but Wow the Manchester terrier was just gorgeous  and how cute was the JRT, though if thats the JRT KC Standard Pip has no chance of ever winning LOL


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## steveshanks (Feb 19, 2015)

Oh and the Yorkie that won toy was stunning too, mind you if she came to live here she'd be getting a haircut LOL


----------



## Guest (Mar 11, 2017)

I spy another westie.


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## Mirandashell (Jan 10, 2017)

steveshanks said:


> Oh and the Yorkie that won toy was stunning too, mind you if she came to live here she'd be getting a haircut LOL


I think that about all the long-haired dogs!


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Loving the small team agility this morning


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Went to bed late last night so making myself a cup of tea and breakfast to much on while watching agility instead of HTM


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Julie Crowther said:


> Actually think you should get a life, I walk my dog for at least 4 hours a day! If you love dogs so much stop commenting on here and have a good time with your dog!


Huh?? That's totally random & off topic to what shadowmare had posted about?


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Haven't started any live feed yet. Have a busy day ahead & have to walk the dogs shortly. Hopefully I'll be able to catch it in between what I need to be doing


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## fernlady (Feb 27, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> Went to bed late last night so making myself a cup of tea and breakfast to much on while watching agility instead of HTM


@shadowmare you mean you actually dare to eat, drink tea & watch TV! Surely you should be out on your 4 hour walk


----------



## fernlady (Feb 27, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Haven't started any live feed yet. Have a busy day ahead & have to walk the dogs shortly. Hopefully I'll be able to catch it in between what I need to be doing


@Dogloverlou make sure you get at least 4 hours in! 

I've been food shopping, hubby has taken Mylo out, we've had a bacon sandwich & I'm just thinking about putting all of my Crufts haul away!


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

fernlady said:


> @shadowmare you mean you actually dare to eat, drink tea & watch TV! Surely you should be out on your 4 hour walk


Ah my good for nothing unloved dog is only allowed 20 minute on lead walks currently so I have all the time in the world  
Loved watching the international runs! I find it especially fun watching the Scottish competitors as I had a chance to meet them in competitions last year when I was on the ring party... I actually just thought "Oohh it's Euan and Sweep! I got to hold their lead last summer!" :Shamefullyembarrased


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Just switched on.


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

fernlady said:


> @Dogloverlou make sure you get at least 4 hours in!
> 
> I've been food shopping, hubby has taken Mylo out, we've had a bacon sandwich & I'm just thinking about putting all of my Crufts haul away!


 They was out for about 30 mins, terrible owner I am!


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

I'm timing walks to tie in with the breaks


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Fleur said:


> I'm timing walks to tie in with the breaks


I did that yesterday lol


----------



## Moobli (Feb 20, 2012)

Currently eagerly anticipating the West Mids Police Dog display on the live stream at 15.50


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Oh dear lord! The poor lab owner at fly ball!!!!! :Facepalm I know I shouldn't laugh but I just can't help it :Hilarious


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Dogloverlou said:


> I did that yesterday lol


Planning the same tomorrow  but at least there is a good long break 2pm to take the dogs out in


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> Oh dear lord! The poor lab owner at fly ball!!!!! :Facepalm I know I shouldn't laugh but I just can't help it :Hilarious


Same! :Hilarious And the dog just kept going too!


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Same! :Hilarious And the dog just kept going too!


That was the worst part of it! It's bad enough when your dog decides to poop indoors in front of 6000 people... but you can chalk it up to just one of those things that happen... but when he kept going and going and going... :Hilarious I would've probably ran out of there without the dog and never leave my house :Arghh this will be doing rounds on internet for days or even weeks


----------



## Moobli (Feb 20, 2012)

West Midlands should be very proud of all their handlers and police dogs. Another cracking display. Can't beat the WL GSDs


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Moobli said:


> West Midlands should be very proud of all their handlers and police dogs. Another cracking display. Can't beat the WL GSDs


Totally loved the long coated dog! I have soft spot for dark long coats even though I stopped dreaming of a GSD a decade ago!... really enjoyed the display and watching the dogs do their jobs well!


----------



## fernlady (Feb 27, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> Oh dear lord! The poor lab owner at fly ball!!!!! :Facepalm I know I shouldn't laugh but I just can't help it :Hilarious


Aaghh, what's happened? I must have missed that whilst taking Mylo for his 2nd 4 hour walk!


----------



## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

Ahhhhh, the Southern Golden Retriever display team. Lovely


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Siskin said:


> Ahhhhh, the Southern Golden Retriever display team. Lovely


Thought of you as I watched them


----------



## Moobli (Feb 20, 2012)

fernlady said:


> Aaghh, what's happened? I must have missed that whilst taking Mylo for his 2nd 4 hour walk!


https://www.facebook.com/pg/Crufts/videos/?ref=page_internal


----------



## fernlady (Feb 27, 2013)

Moobli said:


> https://www.facebook.com/pg/Crufts/videos/?ref=page_internal


Thanks @Moobli, i definitely missed it!


----------



## fernlady (Feb 27, 2013)

Siskin said:


> Ahhhhh, the Southern Golden Retriever display team. Lovely


I've just watched it, they were very good. I just wished they didn't have to have mood lighting/flashing lights, it makes my eyes go funny!


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Aw so pleased for the agility guy from China! I know he's not going to win, but am happy that he travelled all the way here and got a clear round


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

As an agility dog owner and coincidentally a single lady... Can't stop thinking of one thing here... Simon from Switzerland - can I have his number?? :Sorry:Shy


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

shadowmare said:


> As an agility dog owner and coincidentally a single lady... Can't stop thinking of one thing here... Simon from Switzerland - can I have his number?? :Sorry:Shy


I just got in from walking the dogs - sounds lie I missed something good


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Fleur said:


> I just got in from walking the dogs - sounds lie I missed something good


Haha oh it's just me feeling a bit love struck hahahaha! :Hilarious The winner of international agility was quite an attractive guy! (And after finding him on Instagram I now know we're meant to be, because he's got an Aussie back home :Hilarious :Shamefullyembarrased) 
On a more serious note though, it is something that I noticed - there's definitely a "gap" in dog sports in U.K. For more 20-35yo males! There's a lot of boys in YKC and older gents though  I may have been born in the wrong decade haha!


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> Haha oh it's just me feeling a bit love struck hahahaha! :Hilarious The winner of international agility was quite an attractive guy! (And after finding him on Instagram I now know we're meant to be, because he's got an Aussie back home :Hilarious :Shamefullyembarrased)
> On a more serious note though, it is something that I noticed - there's definitely a "gap" in dog sports in U.K. For more 20-35yo males! There's a lot of boys in YKC and older gents though  I may have been born in the wrong decade haha!


We need a screenshot or something for those of us who missed him!


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Bonnie is fat!  Wow.

Go Fleur!!


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Bonnie is fat!  Wow!


Exactly what I thought... the poor dog can barely move


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Dogloverlou said:


> Bonnie is fat!  Wow.
> 
> Go Fleur!!


Even my hubby who has little interest in dogs commented how fat the dog was!


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> Exactly what I thought... the poor dog can barely move


And enjoys going over the A-frame? I'm surprised she can get over it tbh. If 'health' is one of the things these judges are looking for, then she'd not be a worthy winner IMO.



Fleur said:


> Even my hubby who has little interest in dogs commented how fat the dog was!


Yeah, you can't really miss the fact!


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> We need a screenshot or something for those of us who missed him!






__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10155104558394878


Loved his handling too! Think he's done really well the past couple of days


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

I really enjoyed the young handlers competition on a short while ago


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> And enjoys going over the A-frame? I'm surprised she can get over it tbh. If 'health' is one of the things these judges are looking for, then she'd not be a worthy winner IMO.
> 
> Yeah, you can't really miss the fact!


I suspect there might be a bit of backlash on social media about this dog... I never understand owners who actually miss such a fact.
A girl I know owns 2 aussies. The first one was always slightly on the heavy side, but the younger one is simply fat. He is generally quite big boned and not my type, but he is now 3 yo and just fat... the thing is that she is seeing it herself and admits that he is fat to the extent that he started losing in shows because of this... and yet she is not taking any actual measures. She posts about how they went for a run or a very long (10km) walk etc but it's all on the same level as a person who wants to lose weight goes to the gym once every few weeks but continues doing the same crap... it just pees me off :Shifty especially since she is studying veterinary!:Bored


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> __ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10155104558394878
> 
> 
> Loved his handling too! Think he's done really well the past couple of days


I like it, although I have no clue how it gets judged!


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> __ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10155104558394878
> 
> 
> Loved his handling too! Think he's done really well the past couple of days


Ohh not bad


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> I suspect there might be a bit of backlash on social media about this dog... I never understand owners who actually miss such a fact.
> A girl I know owns 2 aussies. The first one was always slightly on the heavy side, but the younger one is simply fat. He is generally quite big boned and not my type, but he is now 3 yo and just fat... the thing is that she is seeing it herself and admits that he is fat to the extent that he started losing in shows because of this... and yet she is not taking any actual measures. She posts about how they went for a run or a very long (10km) walk etc but it's all on the same level as a person who wants to lose weight goes to the gym once every few weeks but continues doing the same crap... it just pees me off :Shifty especially since she is studying veterinary!:Bored


Yep, there was some people on the YT comments section commenting on the dog's weight and then being told to stop being so cruel 

I fail to see how you can not do anything if you actively know your dog is fat. Of course, if there is underlying health issues making the dog overweight that's different, but that's often not the case. Just owner ignorance.


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Yep, there was some people on the YT comments section commenting on the dog's weight and then being told to stop being so cruel
> 
> I fail to see how you can not do anything if you actively know your dog is fat. Of course, if there is underlying health issues making the dog overweight that's different, but that's often not the case. Just owner ignorance.


I especially hate the excuse (though I'm not sure if you can even call it that) "Oh well my family/husband/children are really soft hearted so even if I put him on a diet, they will constantly give him extra treats anyway"... well ffs! Are you not an adult? Put your foot down. There's always a way.


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

I was going to attend one of Liz Dunhill's handler workshops a couple of weeks back, but bottled out  Heard great things about her though & her Shiba's are very nice looking there.


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Defitely thought shibas would win
Love watching Aussie bums <3 not a fan of such pale merle though... but it might just be my eyes so used to the high contrasted Axel.


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> Defitely thought shibas would win
> Love watching Aussie bums <3 not a fan of such pale merle though... but it might just be my eyes so used to the high contrasted Axel.


Axel looks lovely based on your pictures you posted. There is a few at my ringcraft class but they all seem really broad & 'heavy' looking. Axel looks lighter in bone maybe?


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

I have the stream playing in the background and I could have sworn that's Peter Kay talking


----------



## Matrod (Dec 22, 2014)

So behind with it today, just caught up with the police dog display, thought it was fantastic


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Axel looks lovely based on your pictures you posted. There is a few at my ringcraft class but they all seem really broad & 'heavy' looking. Axel looks lighter in bone maybe?


Axel is very off standard with his structure  his structure is more like a BC's than an Aussie. That just cropped up from his father's working lines. He has no chest and is slab sided so if you put him next to an average australian shepherd he will be naturally leaner looking. I actually love that about him though as it makes him a fast and flexible agility dog. There's too many heavy boned aussies IMO or those that are barrel sided.


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> Axel is very off standard with his structure  his structure is more like a BC's than an Aussie. That just cropped up from his father's working lines. He has no chest and is slab sided so if you put him next to an average australian shepherd he will be naturally leaner looking. I actually love that about him though as it makes him a fast and flexible agility dog. There's too many heavy boned aussies IMO or those that are barrel sided.


Ah I see. I think it's a better look IMO. Breed standard Aussies always trick you into believing they're heavier than they probably are because of their stocky look. Sounds like my Cash too. He's narrower & slighter in frame than others, probably also because of his working lines making him sportier. As a result I don't see him doing well tomorrow, but it's the experience that counts


----------



## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

I haven't seen any crufts today  too busy walking dogs etc  hoping for more time tomorrow for my favourite day


----------



## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Hanwombat said:


> I haven't seen any crufts today  too busy walking dogs etc  hoping for more time tomorrow for my favourite day


Hope your pizza was nice? 

I haven't caught all that much today either. Busy getting ready for tomorrow!


----------



## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Ah I see. I think it's a better look IMO. Breed standard Aussies always trick you into believing they're heavier than they probably are because of their stocky look. Sounds like my Cash too. He's narrower & slighter in frame than others, probably also because of his working lines making him sportier. As a result I don't see him doing well tomorrow, but it's the experience that counts


Cash is still young though? He might fill out just a bit more over another year? I've given up on hoping for Axel to develop a chest haha! But yes, the experience is what counts. And just the fact that you got to this stage is a great achievement and I'm sure the breeder is proud of Cash too  Good luck for tomorrow!


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> Cash is still young though? He might fill out just a bit more over another year? I've given up on hoping for Axel to develop a chest haha! But yes, the experience is what counts. And just the fact that you got to this stage is a great achievement and I'm sure the breeder is proud of Cash too  Good luck for tomorrow!


Well he's three now. I don't think there is much more physical development to be done to be honest. An experienced judge last year told me he would have thought him much younger as he looks as immature as the youngsters! But I personally think he's more stunning than some of the others, and I'm not just being biased lol.

Thanks! Looking forward to it regardless.


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Hope your pizza was nice?
> 
> I haven't caught all that much today either. Busy getting ready for tomorrow!


It was thank you  I'm not on my laptop at the moment so haven't replied to your message yet  but GOOD LUCK TOMORROW!! I'll be thinking of you and Cash


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Well he's three now. I don't think there is much more physical development to be done to be honest. An experienced judge last year told me he would have thought him much younger as he looks as immature as the youngsters! But I personally think he's more stunning than some of the others, and I'm not just being biased lol.
> 
> Thanks! Looking forward to it regardless.


It does depend on the lines too. I know that Axel's father didn't completely finish filling out until he was 4. Axel is just a couple of months shy off that age and I can see that he will not become any broader anymore. Still, I can definitely see that he's changed a bit since last year.

Hmm not impressed with the gun dog group today. Don't think any of them caught my eye at all...


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

I liked the flattie or pointer.. but none of them really wowed me as I'm not into gundogs.


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Love how it's the least gundog like gundog that always seems to win :Hilarious


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## Moobli (Feb 20, 2012)

My choices were the beautiful Flatcoat or the English Pointer. Disappointed to see what should essentially be in the toy group win the gundog group!


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## Nettles (Mar 24, 2011)

labradrk said:


> Love how it's the least gundog like gundog that always seems to win :Hilarious


I was really disappointed with it. Can you imagine that fluffy American Cocker working all day in the field  It's skirt would be tangled in the first bramble it walked near.


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## Nettles (Mar 24, 2011)

Daft question.. Are there show labs and WL labs? That one was the chunkiest headed lab I've ever seen


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Nettles said:


> Daft question.. Are there show labs and WL labs? That one was the chunkiest headed lab I've ever seen


Yes  oh you mean as a seperate breed? Looking at below post? That case no.


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Nettles said:


> Daft question.. Are there show labs and WL labs? That one was the chunkiest headed lab I've ever seen


Not as a separate breed no.......

But yes they are very different. I prefer the more moderate show type personally, he had slightly too much substance for my liking. Still not as bad as what the USA are producing though!


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Moobli said:


> My choices were the beautiful Flatcoat or the English Pointer. Disappointed to see what should essentially be in the toy group win the gundog group!


I thought the Flatcoat or the GWP who looked super.....

I want the Yorkie to win unless something super in Working or Pastoral groups takes my fancy. Can't wait to see the GSD winner after the uproar last year


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## fernlady (Feb 27, 2013)

Why did the co-owner insist on holding the poor dogs mouth shut!?


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## Colette (Jan 2, 2010)

I really liked the vizsla and the weimaraner, and the German wirehaired Pointer. 
Personally I thought most of the retrievers looked fat. It's become normal to see flabradors in the show ring but the flat coat and the Toller both looked porky too.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

I loved the GWP. It just showed itself off so brilliantly IMO. Was glad they got 4th, but was equally as disappointed about the American Cocker to be honest.


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## Nettles (Mar 24, 2011)

Hanwombat said:


> Yes  oh you mean as a seperate breed? Looking at below post? That case no.





labradrk said:


> Not as a separate breed no.......
> 
> But yes they are very different. I prefer the more moderate show type personally, he had slightly too much substance for my liking. Still not as bad as what the USA are producing though!


No, didn't mean as a separate breed. I meant different lines as in how a working springer and show springer look completely different. 
Think I must just be used to seeing working black labs.


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

QUOTE, Nettles:

Daft question... Are there *show Lab [lines]* and *Working Line Labradors*? ...
That one was the chunkiest-headed Lab I've ever seen. 

/QUOTE
.
.
that would be Yes - there are hunting lines / kennels that breed them, & show or pet lines / breeders that specialize in them.
.
In the USA, there are 5 recognized head / body types, within the overall breed, 'Labrador Retriever'. Some are heavy & cylindrical, others athletic & moderately proportioned - not leggy, nor squat & blocky. // Personally, i like the moderate dogs - not the FlabLabs, not the Brit show-lines or pet lines, but hunting lines who are well-angulated in the rear, not chesty, with elegant heads.
.
.
.


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Enjoying the agility this morning


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## Moobli (Feb 20, 2012)

Saw this on FB this morning. So refreshing to see that at least some American Cocker Spaniels can work 

https://www.facebook.com/yellowdog8/photos/rpp.385744324826824/1270471946354053/?type=3&theater


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## Moobli (Feb 20, 2012)

Nettles said:


> No, didn't mean as a separate breed. I meant different lines as in how a working springer and show springer look completely different.
> Think I must just be used to seeing working black labs.


Yes! There are many working breeds that have a show variety and a working variety - and they are often miles apart in terms of looks and drive.


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Loving the fact that the dogs and humans are all shapes and sizes in the canicross demonstration


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

3 hours now to take the dogs out on a great adventure 
Looking forward to this evening


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Just catching up with agility now and I really can't put my finger on it but I have a weird dislike for Ashley and her dogs 
Glad to see that there aren't any hopping dogs today either so the only ones I've seen were on the first day of the show...


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> Just catching up with agility now and I really can't put my finger on it but I have a weird dislike for Ashley and her dogs
> Glad to see that there aren't any hopping dogs today either so the only ones I've seen were on the first day of the show...


I find Ashley very up her own arse... well its the impression I get at times.


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## Moobli (Feb 20, 2012)

Gutted that this dog wasn't placed in the GSDs today.

http://www.freelindreamsleonwilson.be/298346550


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Moobli said:


> Gutted that this dog wasn't placed in the GSDs today.
> 
> http://www.freelindreamsleonwilson.be/298346550


He's gorgeous! How was the breed ring? Are the ones placed deserving of their places?


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Just read someone on YT saying "Not all reputable breeders need to health test" and "You don't need to health test if you know the dog's pedigree". Actually felt sick to my stomach. This is how urban myths spread by bybs are born...


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> Just read someone on YT saying "Not all reputable breeders need to breed" and "You don't need to health test if you know the dog's pedigree". Actually felt sick to my stomach. This is how urban myths spread by bybs are born...


*facepalm*


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

shadowmare said:


> Just read someone on YT saying "Not all reputable breeders need to breed" and "You don't need to health test if you know the dog's pedigree". Actually felt sick to my stomach. This is how urban myths spread by bybs are born...


What a real shame 
I've only just put it back on so missed these comments - were they said by the commentators?
Wouldn't be so bad if they had been challenged

Edited; Sorry just realised you said "read" I turn the live chat off - ignore my reply above


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## bowwowwoof (Jan 27, 2017)

shadowmare said:


> Just read someone on YT saying "Not all reputable breeders need to health test" and "You don't need to health test if you know the dog's pedigree". Actually felt sick to my stomach. This is how urban myths spread by bybs are born...


I think reading YT comments is bad for one's mental health for basically any video/subject for this kind of reason..


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Fleur said:


> What a real shame
> I've only just put it back on so missed these comments.
> Wouldn't be so bad if they had been challenged


I actually only saw the comments as I was changing from a different website. I normally have it on full screen so don't see the comments... I immediately thought of saying something but then I thought: a) i can't remember my YT log in and b) i know for a fact that if i get involved my mood will just get ruined because of people's stupidity.

Glad Ashley didn't win small agility..... Glad with the large winner as they were brilliant at every round! can't wait for pastoral group judging now!


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Working group judging now!


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

The rottie looked tiny after all those mastiffs came out


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Fleur said:


> The rottie looked tiny after all those mastiffs came out


The rottie sure did - I'm assuming a bitch as looked very small - looked lovely though


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Haha love a bit of a cheeky look in the Great Swiss dog when he's munching on his treat and the judge comes up  one of the breeds I hope to own one day...


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

I really hope these last 2 groups pick a good worthy winner as I'm not feeling the current other winners up for BIS


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Really like the bitch that won the breed in GSD's, she's an Elmo daughter:


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

NEWFIEEE


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

COME ON SMOOTH COLLIE PETRA


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

@Hanwombat 
The winner of the KC vulnerable breeds - took this pic on Thursday and meant to post it for you then but forgot, maybe the breed will do a double or evenue triple win


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

labradrk said:


> Really like the bitch that won the breed in GSD's, she's an Elmo daughter:


Not a fan sadly - better than last year but still not happy.


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## ladyisla (Apr 19, 2014)

We are doing some very good not barking at any dogs on screen practice tonight


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Fleur said:


> @Hanwombat
> The winner of the KC vulnerable breeds - took this pic on Thursday and meant to post it for you then but forgot, maybe the breed will do a double or evenue triple win
> View attachment 302941


Yes I saw it on live streaming  same dog in the group class now


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Hanwombat said:


> Yes I saw it on live streaming  same dog in the group class now


I thought it was


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Fleur said:


> I thought it was


So many lovely breeds! best group


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Hanwombat said:


> Not a fan sadly - better than last year but still not happy.


How come?


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Another Aussie bum :Kiss still find this one too light for my liking again, but he had a much nicer head and face than the aussies from yesterday's breeders contest. 
Good to see a healthier representative for GSDs this year!


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

labradrk said:


> How come?


I'm just not a fan of slopped backs, like straight backs. Though the dog doesn't look as bad on the live streaming.


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Hanwombat said:


> I'm just not a fan of slopped backs, like straight backs. Though the dog doesn't look as bad on the live streaming.


GSDs shouldn't have a straight back though? As in a flat level top line, that would be incorrect for the breed. The actual back as in the spine is straight on this dog but the stack makes it look more angulated


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

labradrk said:


> GSDs shouldn't have a straight back though? As in a flat level top line, that would be incorrect for the breed. The actual back as in the spine is straight on this dog but the stack makes it look more angulated


This GSD does look better, but just seen it on the live streaming and still not happy really. I prefer working type anyways, like Kirsty's or Natasha's.


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Hanwombat said:


> This GSD does look better, but just seen it on the live streaming and still not happy really. I prefer working type anyways, like Kirsty's or Natasha's.


Working types don't have straight backs either? This is a pure working line dog in the same stack, very similar angulation?


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Haha love going from Komondor to Lancashire heeler Some size difference!


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## Firedog (Oct 19, 2011)

I was hoping the Bernese Mountain Dog was going to win the group.


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

labradrk said:


> Working types don't have straight backs either? This is a pure working line dog in the same stack, very similar angulation?
> 
> View attachment 302950


Oh god forget I said anything :Arghh:Bag I just don't like the look :Woot


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> Haha love going from Komondor to Lancashire heeler Some size difference!


I do like little heelers


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Not happy really with any of the group winners for BIS.. OES to win!


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Hanwombat said:


> Not happy really with any of the group winners for BIS.. OES to win!


I know very little about dogs and confirmation   
But i'm going for Yorkie with OES in reserve


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

I actually liked the GSD movement and the handler. Dog and the guy both looked confident and fairly relaxed considering he is fully aware everyone will be scrutinising every inch of the dog and just how sloppy it is or is not.
Not sure about the winner. Know nothing if the breed and with all that fluff it's hard to say anything about the movement or dog's structure. I do find it interesting how some of the best of breed even in the breeds that are native to U.K. have come from outside...


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Hanwombat said:


> Not happy really with any of the group winners for BIS.. OES to win!


It will have to be the Newfie for me...


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Im not a fan of any of the breeds and only choosing OES as its pastoral.. but not fussed now on who wins.

Well its not that I'm not a fan but not breeds I'm remotely interested in.


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Loved Mary Ray's routine 
So amazed that she got 2 dogs doing different things at the same time!!


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Oh Lordy... Axel started barking at the ladies singing!


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

shadowmare said:


> Oh Lordy... Axel started barking at the ladies singing!


Im surprised Bigby hasnt reacted to ANYTHING this year! Not enough the flyball  not that I'm complaining


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## Westie Mum (Feb 5, 2015)

Anyone heard how @Dogloverlou or @Tyton got on today ?


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Westie Mum said:


> Anyone heard how @Dogloverlou or @Tyton got on today ?


Laura won Best Puppy with Samuel and looking on fossedata I believe Louise got third in her class  but not confirmed so could be wrong.


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## Westie Mum (Feb 5, 2015)

Hanwombat said:


> Im surprised Bigby hasnt reacted to ANYTHING this year! Not enough the flyball  not that I'm complaining


Mine are fast asleep lol


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## Westie Mum (Feb 5, 2015)

shadowmare said:


> It will have to be the Newfie for me...


Newfie for me too!



Hanwombat said:


> Laura won Best Puppy with Samuel and looking on fossedata I believe Louise got third in her class  but not confirmed so could be wrong.


Well done to both !!


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Im going with the hound to win actually because its a breed I know nothing about lol


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Naw why don't we get to see the funny moments??? I don't want to look at the stinky trophy!


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

Westie Mum said:


> Mine are fast asleep lol
> 
> View attachment 302974


Same here! Completely uninterested!


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

Not sure who I want to win .... none are really my favourite breeds 

The poodle really showed himself off well .... American Cocker was nice but I prefer them in black


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

The 4 I like best are the yorkie, oes, newfie and grande basset griffon...


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

Dammmm I'm blubbing now


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Newfie apparently comes from not too far from me so i've decided to support the newfie to win


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Im supporting hound!


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## BlueJay (Sep 20, 2013)

Team Terrier! Goooooo Alan!!!


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Just realised that the poor judge this year has a tough job of going over all the hairy dogs haha! Almost all of them are long haired or floofy balls of fur


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

ohhh I do like Australian Shepherds


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## bowwowwoof (Jan 27, 2017)

I was rooting for the little yorkie but oh well, great show  all the dogs were gorgeous


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Ach I suspected the cocker would win but oh well... don't really know anything about the breed so can't say what I think about it... it was a good show nonetheless!


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Worse result lol! Least dog I wanted to win! Oh well! Agility was the most fun


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

Lilylass said:


> Not sure who I want to win .... none are really my favourite breeds
> 
> The poodle really showed himself off well .... American Cocker was nice but I prefer them in black


mmmmm why can't I pick like that when it's for money lol!


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

I do think the American Cocker is a beautiful dog and is obviously a great example of the breed bit I don't see how the breed can be classed as a gun dog, i'm sure with all that fur it would be impossible.
Both winners presented well and their handlers did a great job.
Just not my favourites.


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

Fleur said:


> I do think the American Cocker is a beautiful dog and is obviously a great example of the breed bit I don't see how the breed can be classed as a gun dog, i'm sure with all that fur it would be impossible.
> Both winners presented well and their handlers did a great job.
> Just not my favourites.


Like lots of others, in RL they're very rarely left with their coat as it was intended to be and are clipped

eta you'd be hard placed to realise they're the same dog imho!


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## JoanneF (Feb 1, 2016)

I have a totally irrational dislike of American Cockers, based solely on the fact that a pet shop we visit very occasionally has three or four and it smells awful. I know; not the dogs' fault and certainly not the breed's fault but you know when you just can't get past something?


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## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

Loved the Newfoundland and the Lakeland didn't really like the winner. Still there always next year


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## Westie Mum (Feb 5, 2015)

Pfffft ..... yep, roll on next year!


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Fix ! 
Well IMO! The AM cocker won the group.. with the judge being a breeder of AM cocker and I heard the handler of the dog is in the KC board? Plus from what people are telling me.. hes horrible!


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## AlexPed2393 (Oct 5, 2016)

Hanwombat said:


> Fix !
> Well IMO! The AM cocker won the group.. with the judge being a breeder of AM cocker and I heard the handler of the dog is in the KC board? Plus from what people are telling me.. hes horrible!


When that was mentioned in the interview we all were a bit confused

We though the wire haired pointer or the long haired retriever would get it for the gundogs


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## Apollo2012 (Jun 10, 2013)

Pretty disappointed this year. Didn't really like any of the group winners apart from the newfie. 

I really wish in groups like working they would show dogs as what they would look like working not all frufru with super long coats for showing but that's just my opinion.


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## shadowmare (Jul 7, 2013)

Hanwombat said:


> Fix !
> Well IMO! The AM cocker won the group.. with the judge being a breeder of AM cocker and I heard the handler of the dog is in the KC board? Plus from what people are telling me.. hes horrible!


I don't really agree that judges who breed dogs in the same group they judge shouldn't judge that group... It's actually harder to show under a person who breeds your breed because they will be much more clued up on the breed. I would hate to show under a judge who breeds something like Shi Tzus and only sees pastoral group every couple of weekends...
And even if whoever says he is horrible is right, it is still a dog show. It's not a personality contest so terrible people with good handling skills and good dogs will win.


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## mrs phas (Apr 6, 2014)

the flat coat was much better than the acs in group, but the acs had 'flashiness' going for it, had it been a more 'normal' black or red it wouldnt have even placed
imho, and only from tv veiwing, the grande basset griffon vendeen shouldve won the cup it was well on point and moved wonderfully
never seen one in the flesh though so i could be completelyl wrong


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## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

mrs phas said:


> the flat coat was much better than the acs in group, but the acs had 'flashiness' going for it, had it been a more 'normal' black or red it wouldnt have even placed
> imho, and only from tv veiwing, the grande basset griffon vendeen shouldve won the cup it was well on point and moved wonderfully
> never seen one in the flesh though so i could be completelyl wrong


Yup i liked it 

Met a load of them at a show last year but never seen one in everyday life


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## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

It would be hard to get a judge that would be comletely indepentant (sorry spelling) as they are picked over a year before, so noone has any idea of what breeds are going to be in the the last seven.


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## Apollo2012 (Jun 10, 2013)

mrs phas said:


> the flat coat was much better than the acs in group, but the acs had 'flashiness' going for it, had it been a more 'normal' black or red it wouldnt have even placed
> imho, and only from tv veiwing, the grande basset griffon vendeen shouldve won the cup it was well on point and moved wonderfully
> never seen one in the flesh though so i could be completelyl wrong


I loved the flat coat, I thought he/she should've won the group


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## 3dogs2cats (Aug 15, 2012)

Didn`t particular like any of the finalists but then I have been in a huff since Thursday when the Hound group winner was not tall, pointy, skinny and non hairy 
My ideal line would be Hound: Grey, Ibizan, Pharaoh or Sloughi , Terrier: Jack Russell (with long legs!) Toy: Italian Greyhound, Utility: Standard poodle with a skinhead haircut Pastoral: Smooth Collie, Working: Doberman. Oh well maybe next year!!


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## leashedForLife (Nov 1, 2009)

QUOTE, labradrk:

GSDs shouldn't have a straight back though? 
As in a *flat level top line*, that would be *incorrect for the breed.* The... spine is straight on this dog, but the stack makes it look more angulated.

/QUOTE
.
.
actually, a dog's TOP LINE isn't the length of the back - withers to base of tail; TOP LINE is the crest of the neck to the tail-tip.
.
IOW, it's the dog's upper outline minus the head - as see here: https://www.silverhillrottweilers.net/about/dog-show-glossary/
Quote,
"_*Top line*_
_The outline of the dog *from ears to tail root*. This term is often misused to mean the *backline*. The *backline* is the outline from the *end of the withers to the tail root*."_
.
.
As for "correct for the breed", *a sloping spine, dropped croup, & low-set tail* serve no useful function in any dog - especially a herding breed, which should be built for long-distance endurance & efficiency.  
The dog's rear is their ENGINE - a widdle biddie butt attached to a massive chest, neck, & head, as seen on GSDs in USA breed rings, is lousy structure for movement, & disastrous for energy-efficient locomotion. Those "splendid" heads are attached to BODIES - which are supposed to _*move *_athletically, & that's impossible with a sloping lumbar spine, a tail down where the anus used to be, over-angulation, & low-set hocks that leave the dog spraddling like a toddler trying to walk with a poop-filled diaper. 
.
.
.


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## Nettles (Mar 24, 2011)

I'm still bitter that the American Cocker won the gundog group  If it had won the toy group I'd have thought it was lovely and a worthy BIS winner 
Would have preferred to see the Weimarner or Vizsla go through from the gundogs


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## ladyisla (Apr 19, 2014)

Westie Mum said:


> Mine are fast asleep lol
> 
> View attachment 302974


Ohhhh how I envy this scenario!!! :Bored We'll get there eventually, I hope...


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Nettles said:


> I'm still bitter that the American Cocker won the gundog group  If it had won the toy group I'd have thought it was lovely and a worthy BIS winner
> Would have preferred to see the Weimarner or Vizsla go through from the gundogs


This is how I feel - the toy group (my favourite ) is where froo-froo dogs should be  dogs that are bred to be a companion and sometimes part of that companionship is time spent grooming 
Working dogs should be more practical and if the fur is rather froo-froo should be shown in a practical working clip.
I personally prefer the look of the working lines in all of the dogs where there is a divide.


----------

