# Parasites: Giardia



## reevo24 (Apr 16, 2008)

Hello everyone,

I've been concerned about my 11 month old Hugo for a while now. He has had a lot of trouble with bloody,runny poos since we got him. He has also had nasty worms which the vet originally put the diahhorea down to. He has been wormed religiously but the problems have continued.

Last week we managed to get a stool sample to the vets and he has been diagnosed with giardia. The vet precribed him with Panecur, which I thought was just a wormer, and we have just finished the treatment. During the treatment the stools were still bloody and I am worried the Panacur is not working. I am keeping my fingers crossed we see an improvement.

Does anyone know of Panecur and its usefulness? Also, what sort of diet would help his tummy which has probably taken quite a battering over the past few months? We have used Applaws with pumpkin, but that is expensive, and am feeding him on rice and chicken at the moment.

Their normal food is Sainsburys meat and Hills Science Plan kitten. I know Sainsburys is probably not a good diet but the others are so expensive!

What would you advise as a wet food?

Many, many thanks


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## helz (May 24, 2008)

You are right to be concerned, Panacur is often used to treat this, but it may not clear it up 100%, I assume you have been given an extended dose of the panacur (more than if it was worms).

I think the problem you have hear, is sometimes cats can remain carriers of the infection, and I think if re-infection occurs, you just have to re-start the treatment.

Sorry I couldn't offer you more advice.


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## Guest (Aug 27, 2008)

Hi

3 of my cats have had chronic diarrhoea for weeks now and I am just waiting for the results of a fecal sample after all the usual treatments didn't work!

I have a horrible feeling it is going to turn out to be either giardia or Tritrichomonas Foetus, as we have run through every other option!!!

Is your cat well in himself as mine are displaying no other symptoms other than the diarrhoea.

FCL


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## BlackCat (Feb 17, 2008)

Panacur is one of the most effective drugs against Giardia, but unfortunately it can take a little while to clear the diarrhoea regardless. How long has Hugo been on the chicken and rice for now? I'd keep him on this for another week or so and feed little and often to help to guts settle.


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## reevo24 (Apr 16, 2008)

The Panecur treatment they gave was for 3 days. During the treatment there was still blood but in the couple of days since it has been ok, touch wood!

I agree helz, I think this might be a bit of an on going problem! From what I've read cats tend to deal with such parasites the older they get, but as soon as I see blood again I'm going to be on the phone to the vets. I wasnt happy that when we went to pick up the Panecur and get Hugo weighed we didnt see the vet but a nurse who was as good as useless at answering our questions!

FCL, he appears fine in himself and has displayed no other effects. Its probably more disturbing for us finding the blood!

Again, any tips on diet would be gratefully received!


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## reevo24 (Apr 16, 2008)

BlackCat said:


> Panacur is one of the most effective drugs against Giardia, but unfortunately it can take a little while to clear the diarrhoea regardless. How long has Hugo been on the chicken and rice for now? I'd keep him on this for another week or so and feed little and often to help to guts settle.


Thanks blackcat!

He's been on the chicken and rice since the weekend and the start of treatment and we try the little and often approach. Running out of chicken now but I understand tinned fish is also ok? How long can you keep cooked rice in the fridge???

Thank you


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## Cerridwen (Jul 26, 2008)

There are different types of Giardia! Panacur is very efficiant against one of the types but ineffective against the other type. You'll need to medicate with metronidazole if you're dealing with the other type.


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## reevo24 (Apr 16, 2008)

Cerridwen said:


> There are different types of Giardia! Panacur is very efficiant against one of the types but ineffective against the other type. You'll need to medicate with metronidazole if you're dealing with the other type.


 Thanks for the info!

Im guessing and hoping that the vets, given the results from the lab test, knew what type it was and prescribed Panacur accordingly?

I'm not convinced though!


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## audrey1824 (Aug 1, 2008)

reevo24 said:


> The Panecur treatment they gave was for 3 days. During the treatment there was still blood but in the couple of days since it has been ok, touch wood!
> 
> I agree helz, I think this might be a bit of an on going problem! From what I've read cats tend to deal with such parasites the older they get, but as soon as I see blood again I'm going to be on the phone to the vets. I wasnt happy that when we went to pick up the Panecur and get Hugo weighed we didnt see the vet but a nurse who was as good as useless at answering our questions!
> 
> ...


They need the Panacur liquid for a week to 10 days.

Audrey Magical -Magical cats.
Friendly Felines :: Index
Friendly Felines Show Results.................The place other sites come to get their results! :: Index


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## Cerridwen (Jul 26, 2008)

I've read and heard about different ways to treat Giardia. I don't know how specific the analysis is, if they can tell one type of Giardia from the other. In Sweden it seems quite common that at least catteries are recommended to treat with Panacur for 3 days and metronidazole for 7 days. That usually does the trick.

Some tougher cases need Panacur for 3 weeks.


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## BlackCat (Feb 17, 2008)

reevo24 said:


> Thanks blackcat!
> He's been on the chicken and rice since the weekend and the start of treatment and we try the little and often approach. Running out of chicken now but I understand tinned fish is also ok? How long can you keep cooked rice in the fridge???
> Thank you


The rice could really be kept for about 24-48 hours at the most in the fridge. Fish is good but you may find tinned fish causes more diarrhoea because of the oil. Can you get some frozen coley or something and take one out as you need it?

This must be really frustrating for you (and Hugo!)-what did the nurse tell you? Did the vet or nurse mention about the use of antibiotics as well? Generally the labs add a recommendation of treatment to the result so chances are your vet is following this, but if nothing seems to be improving, it would be worth speaking to your vet again about this.

Hope things start to improve soon.


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## reevo24 (Apr 16, 2008)

Thank you all for the advice.

Yes, 3 days does seem short but I'm hoping the vet knows what they are doing. As I said, the nurse was a bit useless and seemed to have less knowledge on the subject than myself. It seems once they have your money they are not too bothered!

We have left the claim open with the insurance company so as soon as signs return I'll be speaking to the vet.

*Cerridwen*, when you say 2 types do you mean some float and some attach to the intestine? Also, I'm guessing Panacur contains Fenbendazole?


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## Cerridwen (Jul 26, 2008)

reevo24 said:


> *Cerridwen*, when you say 2 types do you mean some float and some attach to the intestine? Also, I'm guessing Panacur contains Fenbendazole?


I don't know the exact difference between the two types, I only know that there are two different types. One thats sensitive to metronidazole and one that's sensitive to fenbendazole.

When using fenbendazole the treatment program usually lasts somewhere between 10 and 21 days.


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## LadyDiva (Aug 5, 2008)

Humans can contract Giardia too


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## audrey1824 (Aug 1, 2008)

And if you have more than one cat you have to treat all of them at the same time, it is highly contageous.

Audrey Magical -Magical cats.
Friendly Felines :: Index
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## reevo24 (Apr 16, 2008)

LadyDiva said:


> Humans can contract Giardia too


Yes, so I've read. Sound lovely. I think the main way people can contract it is through contaminated water (not a big problem in the UK). I think as long as you keep litter trays etc clean and wash hands after touching the cats and toys etc you'll be fine. In fact, again from what I've read, there is no actual proof of gardia being transmitted directly from a cat to a human. Better safe than sorry though!!!!

I'm thinking I will buy some more Panacur of the web (I'm sure the 17.5% paste is the same as the vet gave us) and give them both a dose. Not sure how long to wait to give him another course though????


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## SavannahKitten (Mar 9, 2008)

Panacur is used to treat Giardia - but if there's a known Giardia problem then all cats have to be treated - and for at LEAST five days - seven to ten is more realistic. Three days is just for regular worming and is not likely to clear it.

Change his water regularly - I would recommend switching to bottled water - it's only 17p a bottle in Tesco. I believe because Giardia isn't a recognised problem in the tap water in the UK, we do not test our water supply for it - I may be wrong - but if it's not tested it can't be all clear, can it. It's certainly a problem in other European countries.

When you clean his food bowls allow them to air dry thoroughly.

Giardia is a waterborne virus - the way to remove the virus is to remove the water.

It's not a massive emergency and CAN be easily treated if you know what you're doing. He'll be back to his old self in no time at all.


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## ChrisTheGerbilGuy (Aug 9, 2008)

just make sure its treated fairly quickly. as giardia leads to a cat becoming anemic which is obviously very bad. 

A cat of ours that we rescued had giardia (we wern't aware of her condition at the time). it showed up a couple of weeks later but it was already too late. she became anemic and the vets had to watch her 24/7. it wasn't enough though and she passed away.

R.I.P Jasmin


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## SavannahKitten (Mar 9, 2008)

I hadn't heard of it causing anaemia - how strange. 

Certainly dehydration is probably the biggest killer of young cats and kittens, so any diarrhoea has to be stomped on quickly.


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## audrey1824 (Aug 1, 2008)

It can cause IBS and only the Panacur liquid kills it.

Audrey Magical -Magical cats.
Friendly Felines :: Index
Friendly Felines Show Results.................The place other sites come to get their results! :: Index


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## reevo24 (Apr 16, 2008)

Well, over the weekend and today again more bad poos. I knew it was going to happen.

Have spoke to the vet today and they suggest a second treatment with Panacur, so will purchase some online as its a bit cheaper. I hope it works better this time. The vet still says to only use it for 3 days again though.

To make it worse the insurance company are being a bit awkward and I dont think we'll be covered for these parasites. Oh dear!!!


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## sullivan (Aug 29, 2008)

Dont keep your rice to long it is renowned for causes of food poisoning especially if you are warming up the rice and its left down to long.


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## kozykatz (May 18, 2008)

are they quite sure it's giardia, because tritrichomonas foetus can be mistaken for it on microscopic examination. Metronidazole would be good to try if the panacur isn't working, you'd have to ask the vet about that ofcourse. Ronidazole is the only thing that works for TF.



reevo24 said:


> Well, over the weekend and today again more bad poos. I knew it was going to happen.
> 
> Have spoke to the vet today and they suggest a second treatment with Panacur, so will purchase some online as its a bit cheaper. I hope it works better this time. The vet still says to only use it for 3 days again though.
> 
> To make it worse the insurance company are being a bit awkward and I dont think we'll be covered for these parasites. Oh dear!!!


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## ErbslinTrouble (Sep 1, 2008)

here's a cool informative article on it for you

Giardiasis is an intestinal infection of man and animals. It is caused by a protozoal parasite called Giardia intestinalis. It is widely known as the source of "travelers diarrhea." These single-celled parasites are not to be confused with the common intestinal parasites: roundworms, hookworms, and tapeworms.

Giardiasis is an important cause of illness in animals and man. Fortunately, even though the infection rate is high in cats and dogs, clinical disease is less common.

Which cats are likely to get giardiasis?

Infection is relatively rare in healthy cats. It is more common in densely-populated groups of animals, such as in a cattery, pet store, or animal shelter. Also, kittens have been shown to shed more Giardia cysts in their feces than older cats.

What are the clinical signs?

These microscopic parasites attach themselves to the intestinal wall and cause an acute (sudden-onset) foul-smelling diarrhea. The stool may range from soft to watery, and occasionally contains blood. Infected cats tend to have excess mucus in the feces. Sometimes, vomiting can occur.

How do cats get infected with giardia?

Ingestion of the cyst stage of the parasite leads to infection. Once inside the cat's intestine, the cyst goes through several stages of maturation. Eventually, the cat is able to pass infective cysts in the stool, where they can contaminate the environment and infect other cats.

Infection can also occur from drinking water which has been contaminated with the cysts.

How is the diagnosis made?

Because of the prevalence of Giardia in the cat, the presence of cysts in the stool does not necessarily indicate that a problem is present. When the cysts are present in a cat with diarrhea, it is important. In particular, kittens and debilitated adult cats are at risk for death from dehydration associated with the diarrhea.

Although a fecal examination is needed for diagnosis, the routine flotation test may fail to detect these small cysts. A special solution may be needed for accurate identification of the cysts in the stool. Occasionally, the parasites may be seen on a direct smear of the feces. A test is available for detection of antigens (cell proteins) of Giardia in the feces. A delay of several days may occur as the test is only performed in select laboratories. The reliability of this test in the cat remains under investigation.

What is the treatment?

Metronidazole is the drug most commonly used to treat Giardia. It is a tablet which is given orally for 5-7 days. Other drugs may be needed as supplemental therapy should diarrhea and dehydration occur.

Another antiparasitic drug, fenbendazole, is being investigated as a potentially useful treatment. It appears to be very effective and may be used in cats with refractory diarrhea as a means of diagnosing and treating Giardia.

What is the prognosis?

The prognosis is good in most cases. Debilitated or geriatric animals and those with incompetent immune systems are at increased risk for death.

Can Giardia affect me or my family?

Giardiasis is the most common intestinal parasitic infection of man. In the past, it has been assumed that cats and dogs served as the source of infection for humans. Current research is beginning to indicate that perhaps cats and dogs do not serve as an important reservoir of the disease for man. Some scientists are suggesting that human-to-human transmission may be the more important factor. In cities which do not have water treatment facilities with a sand filtration system, Giardia may not be removed from the drinking water.

Nevertheless, until the issue of transmission is resolved, caution is advisable when a pet has been diagnosed with giardiasis. Humans with immunodeficient states (AIDS, chemotherapy) should use extreme care.

For environmental disinfection, a cup of chlorine bleach in a gallon of water is effective. Be sure that the surfaces and premises can be safely treated with bleach.


if the panacur(fenbendazole) isn't working for you maybe ask your vet about the Metronidazole??


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## ErbslinTrouble (Sep 1, 2008)

SavannahKitten said:


> I hadn't heard of it causing anaemia - how strange.
> 
> Certainly dehydration is probably the biggest killer of young cats and kittens, so any diarrhoea has to be stomped on quickly.


many parasite infections can cause anaemia.


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## ErbslinTrouble (Sep 1, 2008)

sullivan said:


> Dont keep your rice to long it is renowned for causes of food poisoning especially if you are warming up the rice and its left down to long.


it's ok if you bring the rice back to the boil  it's only when you eat the rice with out heating it up completely. pop it in some boiling water again and it should be fine.  i had a horrible bout of FP and my ex husband used to study bacteria and yeast in uni at Oxford. He's rather helpful now as he works for the top medical journal The Lancet as a pharmacologist and editor


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## reevo24 (Apr 16, 2008)

Thank you for all the information, very helpful!

My girlfriend spoke to the vet yesterday and said she was about "as useful as a chocolate teapot". She said the vet had to go and read a book when asked about the parasite! I am a bit annoyed because when the results of the stool test came back we weren't able to talk to the vet. All we had at the time was a nurse "yeah, hes got Guardia, here's some Panacur"

He still seems fine in himself (except his eye, which looks like its got some infection) and I dont think there is any sign of anaemia(how would you tell?)

So, I think we'll go with the second course of Panacur and if it continues the vet wants to do more tests for allergies etc.

This will rumble on I fear. Hope the insurance company are forgiving!!

Thanks again, David


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## reevo24 (Apr 16, 2008)

Finished the second course of treatment for BOTH my little ones yesterday. It made Chloe, who hasn't had any real problems, vomit quite a lot of worms. I'm guessing this was because she hasn't had Panacur before and a different, stronger wormer really sorted her out.

However, Hugo is continuing with the runny poos with blood in it. It cant be doing him any good, and to be honest I've had enough of clearing the mess up. I still dont know if the insurance company will cover it and we simply cant afford too much more investigation by the vets if not covered. The last time we spoke to the vet she said she would like to test for allergies.

Could a food allergy really cause there to be blood and mucous in stools? I'm just starting to feel a little bit sorry for poor little Hugo.


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## bee112 (Apr 12, 2008)

I've put Alfie on Hills Natures Best dry biscuits..

It wouldnt normally be my first choice in food but it has sorted his tummy out straight away. I also give Alfie steamed white fish and boiled chicken. Maybe worth giving it a try?

What food is Hugo eating at the moment?


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