# My Ninjas little family



## Chloeh (Apr 1, 2010)

My beloved Ninja had a litter of kittens a week ago.

She was huge before she gave birth and now we know why she had 6 in there! It was her first litter and shes a fab mum!

Ninja is black with a tiny patch of white on her tummy and her kittens look so much like her! We have a mixture of black/white/ginger kittens (I know Ninja was the only black kitten in her litter rest were tabbys) so I think they got this from her aswell.

Here are the kitties!










Kitty 1:










Kitty 2:










Kitty 3:










Kitty 4:

This one has opened its eyes before the rest, they look a little red so I'm watching it. They are all going to the vets tomorrow anyway for a check up.










Kitty 5:

This is my favourite little ball of fluff 










Kitty 6:










Mummy and babies:










Kitty Pile:


----------



## 2lisa2 (Apr 30, 2010)

awww their so cute


----------



## MissyMV6 (Aug 5, 2010)

Omg they are all scrummy 

Angie x


----------



## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

what breed is she?


----------



## Chez87 (Aug 11, 2010)

Taylorbaby said:


> what breed is she?


Looks like a moggie?


----------



## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

how sweet are you keeping any?


----------



## Nicky10 (Jan 11, 2010)

Very cute kittens


----------



## Chloeh (Apr 1, 2010)

Yes shes a moggy I rescued last year. I would keep all 6 if it were possible were keeping 2 and the rest are going to homes with our neighbours who are brilliant people and so Ninja can be close to them. 

She is getting spayed after she is finished feeding. Would have been done sooner but my mother believed in letting her have the experience of having kittens, shes a fab mummy couldn't ask for a better one.

We seem to have 3 boys 3 girls, all the black and white kittens are boys and the muticoloured ones girls. Checked this morning and we now have 3 with their eyes open. Cute little things


----------



## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

did you find a stud or just let her outside? Not all cats needs litters of kittens, that is a very old myth  And esp a rescue cat to then breed her, I hope that the kittens all find good homes, if you breed you need to be prepared to keep All the kittens that mum has, dont rely on neighbours/friends, you will find once the kittens become a reality...they soon disapear. Just make sure they go at 12weeks old fully vac wormed and with a contract that they are to be neutered at 5/6months old, if one cat produces 6kittens who all have '1litter each' and that contains 6kittens....well you can see where im going!


----------



## Chloeh (Apr 1, 2010)

I understand that and thats why I was weary about posting on here to say that she had but since my mother had to take care of Ninja while I went away to uni she became her cat. I researched everything and Ninja and her kittens are fine I wouldnt let any harm come to her or any of them.


----------



## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Chloeh said:


> Yes shes a moggy I rescued last year. I would keep all 6 if it were possible were keeping 2 and the rest are going to homes with our neighbours who are brilliant people and so Ninja can be close to them.
> 
> She is getting spayed after she is finished feeding. Would have been done sooner but my mother believed in letting her have the experience of having kittens, shes a fab mummy couldn't ask for a better one.
> 
> We seem to have 3 boys 3 girls, all the black and white kittens are boys and the muticoloured ones girls. Checked this morning and we now have 3 with their eyes open. Cute little things


She's a rescue cat and you let her breed?  Did you not sign a contract with the rescue you got her from to agree not to let this happen?



Chloeh said:


> I understand that and thats why I was weary about posting on here to say that she had but since my mother had to take care of Ninja while I went away to uni she became her cat. I researched everything and Ninja and her kittens are fine I wouldnt let any harm come to her or any of them.


If you'd have researched properly you would have known this is a big no no. You didn't do any health testing (not health checking, completely different) so if no harm comes to her or her kittens, you have ONLY been lucky.

They are cute, no doubt about that ... all kittens are. But seriously you've just contributed the the rescue crisis.

Sorry to rain on your thread, but it's a shame more folk don't research properly and ask question before making daft (at best) decisions


----------



## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

OMG I've just also realised you're in Ireland!



We had a massive and desperate situation on these boards not so long ago involving the dire state of welfare over there regarding kittens.

Think I best step away now.

I wish you all the best, I hope they thrive and you will at least raise them to Ped standards. Please ensure they get the full 12-13 weeks with their mum.


----------



## Sparkles87 (Aug 30, 2010)

Hello!
The kittens are (of course) gorgeous 

I have very little to no knowledge of cat breeding, but I do read the threads from time to time (in the hope I get some education ). 

If Ninja is now one year, one week and 4 days old this means she got pregnant when she was approximately ten months old? (very rough, I know). From what I've read (internet cannot always be relied upon, so please correct me if I'm wrong) I understand it to be the case that cats should not be allowed to fall pregnant before turning at least one year old? Is it the case that this is an oops litter in that you/your mum simply let her outside unspayed and your mum is now trying to convey it as a belief that cats should be 'allowed' one litter? I'm sorry if I'm being presumptuous, it's just I don't notice a mention of the father. 

Either way, what's done is done and I hope the kittens grow up to be healthy and happy.


Sparkles
x


----------



## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

Sparkles87 said:


> Hello!
> The kittens are (of course) gorgeous
> 
> I have very little to no knowledge of cat breeding, but I do read the threads from time to time (in the hope I get some education ).
> ...


not really it depends on the girl, from around 10months so they give birth at 1year old, but some dont mature, like one of my girls until later so Ive made her wait for extra calls until she is older.

for anyone reading please neuter at 5-6months old, cats DO NOT NEED to have '1 litter' then be neutered.

Also 'oops & accident' litters dont exsist, a accident is something that you cant prevent, you CAN neuter your cats BEFORE (Which is best) they become sexually active from 6-8 months 'normally'

You cant let a cat that is 6-10 months old have a litter at that age, I wish TJE were here to tell you her hand rearing 20odd years of how rubbish young mums are, they must mature first.

Just wish people would neuter their pets instead of openning the back door 
for god sake if they are neutered at 5-6months of age the 'oh my partner openned the back door' or 'i forgot' 'i wanted a litter' 'fancied some kittens 'cant afford neutering' wouldnt flippin happen!!! come on people!! :frown:

cant afford to neuter? There is help, cant afford to neuter? cant afford a litter of kittens!!!! :frown: 

TJE its sooo easy you just 'close the door'


----------



## Sparkles87 (Aug 30, 2010)

> not really it depends on the girl, from around 10months so they give birth at 1year old, but some dont mature, like one of my girls until later so Ive made her wait for extra calls until she is older.
> 
> for anyone reading please neuter at 5-6months old, cats DO NOT NEED to have '1 litter' then be neutered.
> 
> Also 'oops & accident' litters dont exsist, a accident is something that you cant prevent, you CAN neuter your cats BEFORE (Which is best) they become sexually active from 6-8 months 'normally'


Sorry TB, I wasn't too sure if I was correct or not, it was just what I had read online. I also just want to clarify that I wasn't saying I agree with 'oops' litters or that they are unpreventable or justifiable in any way shape or form 

Sparkles
xx


----------



## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

Sparkles87 said:


> Sorry TB, I wasn't too sure if I was correct or not, it was just what I had read online. I also just want to clarify that I wasn't saying I agree with 'oops' litters or that they are unpreventable or justifiable in any way shape or form
> 
> Sparkles
> xx


No I know!  just incase anyone looking for advice reads the thread, hopefully might see it


----------



## nursequigs (Feb 13, 2011)

Congrates on your new fluffy family! They are lovely. 

From what I have read on this forum it seems breaders believe only they should bring cats into the world and I understand that some places have big problems with unwanted kittens and cats.. however, it sounds like you did all the right things in keepin your cat healthy and have done a good job with the kittens so far, you have good homes for them etc so I don't see what the harm is. How some people have the right to tell you what to do with moggies but they actively bread cats does confuse me a little!

Enjoy your kittens while you have them, these early weeks are the best part


----------



## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

nursequigs said:


> Congrates on your new fluffy family! They are lovely.
> 
> From what I have read on this forum it seems breaders believe only they should bring cats into the world and I understand that some places have big problems with unwanted kittens and cats.. however, it sounds like you did all the right things in keepin your cat healthy and have done a good job with the kittens so far, you have good homes for them etc so I don't see what the harm is. How some people have the right to tell you what to do with moggies but they actively bread cats does confuse me a little!
> 
> Enjoy your kittens while you have them, these early weeks are the best part


If you read a bit more, and get more involved with the rescue crisis you will understand 

Plus if you had been around when the Irish kitten incident happened you would understand the extra  here!


----------



## RetroLemons (Nov 11, 2010)

This is so sad, I mean don't get me wrong I am happy the kittens are healthy but there are already too many cats in rescue etc without litters being bred for nothing.

When we found Bagel on the streets and contacted all the rescues they just had no room. It wasn't until 3 months later that we heard that they had some space opening up, but by then we where keeping her.

Unfortunatly these kittens have now taken away a home from a rescue cat


----------



## Chloeh (Apr 1, 2010)

Ahhhhhhh this has got way out of hand!

When I said i rescued her I didn't say she was a rescue cat!!! Obviously you all took it the wrong way. I said rescued as the people who gave her to me at 6 weeks old which was way too early! were going to put her in a shelter because no one wanted her from the litter being the only black one even though shes gorgeous and I love black cats! She was never on the streets so got no deseases I don't know about!!

The minute I got her i took her to the vets to get checked over and at 8 weeks I got her vaccinations because the previous owner was not wise and didn't get them all vaccinated before giving them away way too early from their mother! I have basically been like a mother to Ninja since she was seperated from hers, she slept in my bed with me since 6 weeks and follows me around constantly even when I've been away at uni for a few weeks! 

I wanted to get her spayed but she is my mothers cat now I have no say WHATSOEVER in her decisions. I do take her to the vets everytime I possibly can just for check ups even when she isn't unwell because I love her. 

The kittens are fine all have waiting homes which they won't go to until they are 12 weeks old and vaccinated! I have turned away a few people that want one because I don't find them suitable. If I hadn't found homes I would have definitly kept all of the kittens because I am very protective over Ninja and now over her kittens aswell.

When it became apparent she was pregnant she was straight to the vets who examined her and said she was young but a VERY HEALTHY cat who will have no problem having the kittens. I read all about delivery and if I needed to step in to help I was well aware how to and had the vet on the end of the phone if I needed emergency help. 

I haven't harmed any people with Ninja having her kittens, just because I don't breed cats that seem to be more special than moggies and have a huge price tag over their heads doesn't mean a normal moggie can't have kittens. If Ninjas mother hadn't fallen pregnant I would have never found my daughter which is what she is to me. So I believe the love the kittens will give their new owners is like the love that ninja gave to me during hard times in my life what with my grandfather and mother falling ill last year. If so, then I have given 4 families the ultimate gift in letting them share in our special time.


----------



## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Chloeh said:


> Ahhhhhhh this has got way out of hand!
> 
> When I said i rescued her I didn't say she was a rescue cat!!! Obviously you all took it the wrong way. I said rescued as the people who gave her to me at 6 weeks old which was way too early! were going to put her in a shelter because no one wanted her from the litter being the only black one even though shes gorgeous and I love black cats! She was never on the streets so got no deseases I don't know about!!


Hun she doesn't need to go out to pick up problems. She could have been infected by her mother, and also hereditary conditions should be thought about. Did you have any tests done, except for the usually physical tests?

That alone is one reason why I'd NEVER breed a moggie. It's difficult enough breeding peds when you can test for some thing, but it's not fool proof, it still has risks.



Chloeh said:


> The minute I got her i took her to the vets to get checked over and at 8 weeks I got her vaccinations because the previous owner was not wise and didn't get them all vaccinated before giving them away way too early from their mother! I have basically been like a mother to Ninja since she was seperated from hers, she slept in my bed with me since 6 weeks and follows me around constantly even when I've been away at uni for a few weeks!


That's a lovely relationship to have with your girl. So why spoil it by letting her have kittens, and believe me it will. By the time your girls babies go to a new home she will have changed, her personality will not be the same. Even once spayed she will still not be the same as what she was before. She may come close, but not quite the same.



Chloeh said:


> The kittens are fine all have waiting homes which they won't go to until they are 12 weeks old and vaccinated! I have turned away a few people that want one because I don't find them suitable. If I hadn't found homes I would have definitly kept all of the kittens because I am very protective over Ninja and now over her kittens aswell.


It really doesn't matter that you have homes lined up. The simple fact is that for every kitten born a home is needed. Even if that is your own home it still doesn't matter.

If you can take on another kitten then you can provide a home for one of the thousands already living and in dire need of a home (especially in Ireland!  ... this is a good reason why the Irish kitten threads should have remained). The same goes for any home you find elsewhere for them. If those people are looking for a kitten to home, they are capable of rehoming a kitten in rescue, instead of adding to the rescue problems like this, I really wish you'd done a bit more research .. you AND your mum.



Chloeh said:


> When it became apparent she was pregnant she was straight to the vets who examined her and said she was young but a VERY HEALTHY cat who will have no problem having the kittens. I read all about delivery and if I needed to step in to help I was well aware how to and had the vet on the end of the phone if I needed emergency help.


When you say 'young', how young do you mean? :scared:



Chloeh said:


> I haven't harmed any people with Ninja having her kittens, just because I don't breed cats that seem to be more special than moggies and have a huge price tag over their heads doesn't mean a normal moggie can't have kittens. If Ninjas mother hadn't fallen pregnant I would have never found my daughter which is what she is to me. So I believe the love the kittens will give their new owners is like the love that ninja gave to me during hard times in my life what with my grandfather and mother falling ill last year. If so, then I have given 4 families the ultimate gift in letting them share in our special time.


A completely unfair statement. Given the lengths good pedigree breeders go to, to ensure good health (as far as humanely possible) along with all the other aspects of raising a litter ... Well that kind of statement just isn't fair.

Until such a time as moggie breeding can be done ethically and responsibly to match (at least) the standards of good pedigree breeding, it will never be OK IMO. That isn't going to happen for a long time. Please have a look at this thread to get an idea of what I mean, and please read it thoroughly .. http://www.petforums.co.uk/cat-chat/148273-responsible-moggy-breeding.html


----------



## koekemakranka (Aug 2, 2010)

Chloeh said:


> *When I said i rescued her I didn't say she was a rescue cat!!! *Obviously you all took it the wrong way. I said rescued as the people who gave her to me at 6 weeks old which was way too early! were going to put her in a shelter because no one wanted her from the litter being the only black one even though shes gorgeous and I love black cats! She was never on the streets so got no deseases I don't know about!! .


What difference does it make? Don't you see, you are just perpetuating the wrongness. Nobody wanted your cat, and she has babies that will have babies that will have babies that no-one will want....:scared:



Chloeh said:


> The kittens are fine all have waiting homes which they won't go to until they are 12 weeks old and vaccinated! *I have turned away a few people that want one because I don't find them suitable*.


I am sorry, but I find that impossible to believe.



Chloeh said:


> I haven't harmed any people with Ninja having her kittens, just because I don't breed cats that seem to be more special than moggies and have a huge price tag over their heads doesn't mean a normal moggie can't have kittens. .


But you have probably added future unwanted cats to a world that doesn't need any more. You are indirectly affecting every single person working in rescue. This is irresponsible and you should own up to it, not blame your mother. Take a stand, woman!

O dear oh dear oh dear.............


----------



## RetroLemons (Nov 11, 2010)

Chloeh said:


> I haven't harmed any people with Ninja having her kittens, just because I don't breed cats that seem to be more special than moggies and have a huge price tag over their heads doesn't mean a normal moggie can't have kittens. If Ninjas mother hadn't fallen pregnant I would have never found my daughter which is what she is to me. So I believe the love the kittens will give their new owners is like the love that ninja gave to me during hard times in my life what with my grandfather and mother falling ill last year. If so, then I have given 4 families the ultimate gift in letting them share in our special time.


Your right you havent harmed any person, just the cats rotting away in rescue's or the ones being pts because there aren't enough homes for the cats already out there.

Im sorry to say but a breeder who breeds to improve the health and temperament of their breed is very, very different to someone who breeds a moggie of unknown origins just because they want kittens?!

The harsh reality is you have helped the problem with the rescue cats, and those families who get the joy of a kitten? Well they would get the same joy from a kitten or cat in rescue. I love Bagel, she is my world but if I had the choice to go back in time I would rather she wasn't dumped by some irresponisible owner. I would have missed out, but atleast she wouldn't have been starving on the streets due to rescues being full...


----------



## Sparkles87 (Aug 30, 2010)

Hi Chloeh. 

I understand what you're saying about your relationship with Ninja; I could say the same thing about the great relationship I have with my kitten who I too got at 6 weeks old (very, very, very, very bad by the way). I, like you, took him to the vets right away, got him vaccinated, wormed etc - needless to say these are responsible actions, but that doesn't mean you can then do whatever you want and justify this by listing all the decent things you have done for her. It's a very extreme example but I couldn't boot William out on the street just now for the night then say 'Oh it's ok, because I love him very much and took him to the vets today to get a wee cut on his face checked out'. One good doesn't necessarily negate a bad, especially when it's as bad as letting your young moggie get pregnant

Please don't infer that people here are simply against breeding moggies just because they think pedigrees are more 'special' or have a heftier price tag. As a moggie owner I can definitively assure you that this is NOT the case. If you educate yourself further on the actual problems then you may just see what people are talking about with regards to moggies being pregnant. I also think you shall find that they would have a similar reaction to somebody breeding an unregistered and non health tested Ragdoll, BSH, Bengal etc, despite that fact that rescue centres aren't generally overflowing with these cats. 

Nobody is having a go at you, they are just passionate about animal welfare and people comprehending the effect which they have. I always feel a tad hypocritical when discussing issues similar to this as I myself bought a 6 week old moggie, but I can now recognise my mistake and the detrimental nature of it. 

Please do some research, if you do you may find yourself understanding where everyone is coming from 

Best of luck with the kittens! 
Sparkles
x


----------



## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

Chloeh said:


> When it became apparent she was pregnant she was straight to the vets who examined her and said she was young but a VERY HEALTHY c*at who will have no problem having the kittens*. I read all about delivery and if I needed to step in to help I was well aware how to and had the vet on the end of the phone if I needed emergency help.
> 
> .


WOW!!! I want him as a vet is he psychic????? can tell that a cat wont have problems giving birth?!!? WOW!!! Would he had told me the same if I took my very healthy health tested girl in when she became pregnant? but then needed a c-section?? ended up with injections luckily!

NO ONE CAN tell you that a cat will be OK giving birth, untill the day happens.

How do you know she is healthy? if she has certain elements that can lie dorment passed on from mum and not come out in only times of stress...

so she is a rescue, just a kitten you got at 6weeks old and bred her? by letting her outside? I dunno! I feel like giving up!


----------



## CDC (Jul 20, 2010)

I am a Moggie advocate all the way - I have three of them, all rescued from local centres who will have promptly filled their bed with another poor cat in need of a home.

From what I have read on here, the pedigree breeders (the good ones) go to such efforts to produce the healthiest cats they possibly can. You pay for what you get - a full history, health screening etc. 

For pedigrees, the breeders often have waiting lists and many expression of interest in future litters - for moggies, it is the rescues that have the waiting lists. 

Kittens grow into cats at which point some selfish people no longer regard them as cute and turf them out. Others get older and older in rescues until they are alo no longer the fluffballs some people are looking for and they get passed by. I watched one couple walk past some beautiful cats at my local rescue because they wanted a kitten - when they were told they didn't have any in at that moment (all beds full with adults!) the couple left despite some of those cats being less than a year old and still technically kittens! 

Whilst I am sure you are doing your upmost to do right by all your cats and you should be given credit for trying to do the best with the situation, ultimately your efforts will never be viewed in the most positive light given the current dire rescue situation.


----------



## koekemakranka (Aug 2, 2010)

Nobody here is against moggies, least of all me. I have two rescue moggies. But as wonderful as they are, I could never consider breeding more. IMO, it is wrong, plain and simple.


----------

