# Help!!!!!!!



## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

Can someone please tell me if its normal for mummy cat to move her kittens, my hubby got up this morning and couldn't find them anywhere, then found them in the little house bit at the bottom of Geri's scratch tower all seems ok with them just so worried why she has done this after 11 days in the birthing box, then she went into the garden and caught a bird which I know cats do but Geri never has, are we doing somthing wrong or is there something wrong with Geri maybe, maybe I am panicking too much but as I am new to all this not sure what to think any advice would really help thanks:

Mo xx


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## Elmstar (Apr 7, 2008)

This is perfectly normal.

However you shouldn't let mum out unless your garden is secure or you want another litter of kittens!


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

You let her go out? Are you mad?! She will have caught a bird to provide for her babies, to answer that question

She may have moved them for several reasons. If the kittening box is in a high traffic area, or something has happened in your household which means it's busier than usual perhaps?

It sounds like she is not feeling secure, so she has moved them to a nice dark secure box.

Nothing to really worry about, but do keep an eye on her, because sometimes this is the first sign of them beginning to reject their babies.

**on a side note, do I remember seeing pictures from you of the kittening box being right next to a washer/tumble drier? Or am I thinking of someone else?


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

Elmstar said:


> This is perfectly normal.
> 
> However you shouldn't let mum out unless your garden is secure or you want another litter of kittens!


Hi oh thanks for that, well we weren't letting her out because I didn't think I should and I told the rest of the family she can't go out until she been spayed now, even tho she kept asking, so I went to the vet on monday and spoke to her about having Geri spayed when it could be done etc etc and she said if she is a good mum be ok to let her into garden cos she wouldn't go far (which she hasn't) and she also said it would be too early for her to get pregnant again cos we worried about that also, so now I am more confused.
So why has she moved them and is it ok for me to move the kittens back into the birthing box or should we leave them where Geri puts them, its ok its just a rather small area and of course I can't see them in there, sorry to be a pain just really worried cos all be great so far. thanks.

Mo xxx


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

Aurelia said:


> You let her go out? Are you mad?! She will have caught a bird to provide for her babies, to answer that question
> 
> She may have moved them for several reasons. If the kittening box is in a high traffic area, or something has happened in your household which means it's busier than usual perhaps?
> 
> ...


Hi Aurelia, 
No def someone else they are and have been in the lounge with us since birth and not very high traffic area only me here during the day and hubby at night daughter & son in law live here but are always in their room really so not much to threaten really, am so upset about this now feel i have done something wrong, the vet said be ok for her to go out cos i was keeping her in so am very confused now so should I keep her in or not? Sorry am a born worrier and when am not sure about something makes me even worse.

Mo xxx


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Can you take a picture of her kittening box? Maybe we can figure out why she has moved them to start with.

It may also be wise to think about changing vets, as that advice you were given is a bit dangerous for your girl. She can get pregnant, some cats have been known to come into call again in less than 2 weeks. As for her not wandering too far, that is also a bit rubbish, if she feels the need to hunt for her kittens she will go further than your garden if there is nothing around. 

Are you supplying your girl with an endless supply of food btw? She could well be hungry, which would be another reason for her hunting the bird.


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

It is not too early for her to get pregnant again. Not sure why your vet advised that. I knew a lady whos cat escaped when her kittens were 14 days old and oops mated and pregnant again. Trust me not a good idea.

My latest girl called again when her baby was only 10days old. 

I know its hard because everyone gives different advice but id also be careful shes not bringing in nasties from the garden cos small kittens pick things up so easily.

I wouldnt worry about her moving them so long as they are safe and she seems happy with them id leave them.

Good luck and keep us posted.


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Don't feel bad about it hun. It's perfectly reasonable to put your trust in a Vet, they are supposed to know what they are talking about after all their years of training!

You haven't done anything drastically wrong, so don't worry.

Those pics of the kittening box would be great, with some of the surrounding area if possible. There may be something really obvious that's made her feel less secure, but you might not notice it as you live with it every day.


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## sequeena (Apr 30, 2009)

I'm sure it's normal. I popped Cotton and her kittens out of the box yesterday for 2 minutes to change the bedding and within seconds of me finishing she had one kitten by the scruff and was jumping back in  I helped her with the other 4 of course bless her.

I deff wouldn't let the mum out though  Not just because she can get caught but because of all the dangers (cars etc) and the babies are still feeding from her.


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

Aurelia said:


> Can you take a picture of her kittening box? Maybe we can figure out why she has moved them to start with.
> 
> It may also be wise to think about changing vets, as that advice you were given is a bit dangerous for your girl. She can get pregnant, some cats have been known to come into call again in less than 2 weeks. As for her not wandering too far, that is also a bit rubbish, if she feels the need to hunt for her kittens she will go further than your garden if there is nothing around.
> 
> Are you supplying your girl with an endless supply of food btw? She could well be hungry, which would be another reason for her hunting the bird.


Aw thanks for quick reply would u believe am sitting here in tears ,must pull myself together, as for food for Geri she is having whiskas kitten pouches and gourmet fish pouches alternating and about 4 or 5 pouches a day she is very fussy with food always has been so thought that was ok, as for the vet am so shocked they would give this advice thats really bad isn't it!! and pic of box attached hopefully, sorry to be so silly with this am just concerned for Geri and her babies, also my hubby moved them back into birthing box this morning went for his shower and when he came back down she had moved one back to the scratch box!









Mo xx


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

sequeena said:


> I'm sure it's normal. I popped Cotton and her kittens out of the box yesterday for 2 minutes to change the bedding and within seconds of me finishing she had one kitten by the scruff and was jumping back in  I helped her with the other 4 of course bless her.
> 
> I deff wouldn't let the mum out though  Not just because she can get caught but because of all the dangers (cars etc) and the babies are still feeding from her.


well not seen her pick them up at all since birth and i change the bedding in the box every day as well so just don't know why she has done this! and as for letting her out as I have said I wasn't and told rest of family not too cos i was worrid about her getting pregnant firstly, then I worried she may bring in infection to the babies so I didn't want to risk any of that then the bloody vet says oh no she will be fine let her out makes me wonder it really does so glad have all of you to give advice so quickly am so glad i joined PF

Mo xx


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## Elmstar (Apr 7, 2008)

Momo12 said:


> So why has she moved them and is it ok for me to move the kittens back into the birthing box or should we leave them where Geri puts them, its ok its just a rather small area and of course I can't see them in there, sorry to be a pain just really worried cos all be great so far. thanks.
> Mo xxx


You could try moving the kittens back but she may move them again, it just depends. As long as they're in a safe place I wouldn't worry and would leave them.

Your vet is stupid advising you to let her out, we had a Queen calling within two weeks of having a litter and if they're in call not only can they get pregnant but they will wander.

It sounds as though Geri know what she's doing so I'd leave her to it and make sure she can't get out.


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Aww hun, seriously don't get upset with yourself!

OK, one thing I can suggest, try putting a towel over the top of her box. That might just give her a bit more security. She obviously likes the idea of a dark place. I can imagine it is a tight squeeze in the scratch box, so it doesn't sound like you can leave her to it there.

When you move the kittens try and stay with her for a good few hours, just to put her at ease  Nice flask of coffee and a book. Just you, your girl and her babies.

Have you tried Tesco's Just Nature pate at all? Rilly has bee going mental for this since she gave birth. I give her a variety, some days she likes one food, the next she likes another. But this one is the one that she never really tires of. Especially the turkey one. The other benefit is the fact that it is high meat content. I do believe it also helps the kittens gain weight, as if by making mums milk more fattening. I noticed for a week where I couldn't get Rilly some the kits didn't put on half the weight daily as they did before.

It looks like this:









and I believe it's 22p a tin at the moment. You have to mash it up really well though! Not only that but I found the kittens loved this when we started weaning them ... and still do 

(((hugs)))


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

Elmstar said:


> You could try moving the kittens back but she may move them again, it just depends. As long as they're in a safe place I wouldn't worry and would leave them.
> 
> Your vet is stupid advising you to let her out, we had a Queen calling within two weeks of having a litter and if they're in call not only can they get pregnant but they will wander.
> 
> It sounds as though Geri know what she's doing so I'd leave her to it and make sure she can't get out.


Right ok will make sure she is not going out anymore can't believe I took her at her word but then u would believe a vet wouldn't you, am so stupid!!!!



Aurelia said:


> Aww hun, seriously don't get upset with yourself!
> 
> OK, one thing I can suggest, try putting a towel over the top of her box. That might just give her a bit more security. She obviously likes the idea of a dark place. I can imagine it is a tight squeeze in the scratch box, so it doesn't sound like you can leave her to it there.
> 
> ...


Hi hun aw thanks so much, feel loads better already from all of u and ur comments, right we did have the towel thats at the bottom of the box over half the box for about 5 days or so then the kittens started gettin to the bottom of the box and comin out so we rolled the towel up and put it there to stop them gettin out of the box,Geri seemed fine with it so we left it like that and all been well, so I have moved the kittens back to the birthing box whilst Geri was eating only for her to come in and move them back to the scratch box which I really feel is too small for all of them plus cant see at a glance if all ok, I did show her where they were cos she went to the scratch box and I fussed her and told her they ok there but she wasnt havin any of it so really dont know what to do now!!!

As for the food will go tesco and get some of that then as oon as someone else here to watch them all do u think what I am giving her is not good enough for her, I mean not satisfying enough with feeding the babies etc, they are gainin weight well they 101 & 102 grams at birth as of yesterday they were 274 & 266 grams so not sure if that is good enough.

Am so sad all this happening when all was going so well or at least i thought it was!!!

Moxxx


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Well Wiska's is not the best food hun. Not many will tell you otherwise. It's only about 4% meat I think, the rest is just fillers. If you can get her eating some higher meat stuff she will feel so much better for it.

Those weights don't sound bad at all, by day 14 they should of about tripled. But you may be able to get that up more if you try some higher meat food.

Have you not got something you can put over the box? Even if it's a bit of cardboard just to sit on the top. I know when ever we took the top off of Rilly's box she wasn't keen. She seemed more settled when it was covered. If it's tight in the scratch box now, imagine what it will be like in another week 

EDIT: You could also tape a bit of cardboard at the front for mum to step over and keep the kittens contained as well. About 5 inches is enough, you could get away with more though.


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

Aurelia said:


> Well Wiska's is not the best food hun. Not many will tell you otherwise. It's only about 4% meat I think, the rest is just fillers. If you can get her eating some higher meat stuff she will feel so much better for it.
> 
> Those weights don't sound bad at all, by day 14 they should of about tripled. But you may be able to get that up more if you try some higher meat food.
> 
> ...


Omg can't believe that about whiskas theres me thinkin i'm feeding my cats somethin good when in reality its not, so will sort that out then, what about the gourmet is that the same as whiskas?
so will try sort out her box see how she goes with it, they are in scratch box at the minute she keeps comin out and sittin on floor near it so she can see i spose but just now she went in the birthin box had a sniff around came out looked at me and meowed as if to say where are my babies?
then got back in the scratch box with them its all very strange behaviour!!!!

Mo xxx


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## becbec31 (Jun 26, 2009)

Jo i feed whiskas pouches to my cats also as some of the higher meat content foods give Lola a terrible tummy, may not to wise switching her food whilst shes feeding as it may give her the runs and wont help her condition at all. 

Do you feed her any dry food? Try a good quality dry as well as the pouches. I feed Royal Canin 36 kitten to my queens during pregnancy and lactation and for a few motnhs after to help them recover.

Whatever food you decide to feed introduce it gradually you dont want a lactating queen with the runs. Not good!

Try not to worry all will be fine.


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

There is no need to panic. Moving kittens is perfectly normal - and for the record (at the risk of drawing down the wrath of some of the forum) your vet is perfectly correct, it is highly unusual for a female cat with young kittens to go far let alone call. The danger of that comes once the kittens leave home (or are old enough that they would normally have been expected to leave home). I have heard of queens calling when the kittens are young but it is not common. I have only experienced it once in 18 years of regular breeding (the kittens were 2 1/2 weeks). I am not saying it is impossible that she could call again now but it is certainly unlikely, and even if she did, she would be unlikely to get pregnant if mated at this stage. I am not saying there is no risk at all, but it's certainly not a big risk.

Liz


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

Momo12 said:


> just now she went in the birthin box had a sniff around came out looked at me and meowed as if to say where are my babies?
> then got back in the scratch box with them its all very strange behaviour!!!!


This is normal too. It can be very annoying when they move them and then can't remember where they put them!

Liz


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Can you put the box beside where she put the kittens ?

With a big cover over the top for privacy and a hole in the side for her to get in/out ?

Little buggers!  (mummy cats in general that is)!


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

lizward said:


> There is no need to panic. Moving kittens is perfectly normal - and for the record (at the risk of drawing down the wrath of some of the forum) your vet is perfectly correct, it is highly unusual for a female cat with young kittens to go far let alone call. The danger of that comes once the kittens leave home (or are old enough that they would normally have been expected to leave home). I have heard of queens calling when the kittens are young but it is not common. I have only experienced it once in 18 years of regular breeding (the kittens were 2 1/2 weeks). I am not saying it is impossible that she could call again now but it is certainly unlikely, and even if she did, she would be unlikely to get pregnant if mated at this stage. I am not saying there is no risk at all, but it's certainly not a big risk.
> 
> Liz





lizward said:


> This is normal too. It can be very annoying when they move them and then can't remember where they put them!
> 
> Liz


Thanks for comments Liz been such a stressful morning, so should I let her into the garden or not she doesn't wander to be honest never has done even before the kittens, but what about risk of infection to the kittens is that possible, as for the moving think she is confusing herself, she keeps going into the birthing box coming out looking at me meowing as if to say where are my babies is she likely to move them back do u think or not, shall I leave them aloneas only thing is its a bit small in the scratch box or all of them ok for the kittens but when Geri gets in as well bit squashed haha, see it was all going so well ahd to be something to catch me out haha

Mo xxx


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## Elmstar (Apr 7, 2008)

Momo12 said:


> so should I let her into the garden or not


Mo, that's your call but unless you could cope with another lot of kittens I wouldn't.

It may be rare for them to go into call but as I said we've had it with one girl so it certainly isn't unheard of and do you want to take that risk?


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

Elmstar said:


> Mo, that's your call but unless you could cope with another lot of kittens I wouldn't.
> 
> It may be rare for them to go into call but as I said we've had it with one girl so it certainly isn't unheard of and do you want to take that risk?


To be honest don't want to take any risks of course, and it was my instinct NOT to let her out so will maybe stick with that, don't want anymore kittens, vet said could have her spayed at 8 weeks not sure if thats a bit young, will see weaning goes cos have heard milk can dry up when they are spayed. thanks for advice tho.

Mo xx


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

becbec31 said:


> Jo i feed whiskas pouches to my cats also as some of the higher meat content foods give Lola a terrible tummy, may not to wise switching her food whilst shes feeding as it may give her the runs and wont help her condition at all.
> 
> Do you feed her any dry food? Try a good quality dry as well as the pouches. I feed Royal Canin 36 kitten to my queens during pregnancy and lactation and for a few motnhs after to help them recover.
> 
> ...


Of course, I'm such a twit for not mentioning this part. Glad you saw the thread Bex 

Rilly has Wiska's occasionally, if I remember rightly she was weaned onto it (along with others), so it's not terrible, and is certainly better than no food. But there are definately better foods out there.

I'm trying to get our kits to try all different things, so hopefully they will be fine with what ever is put in front of them. So far so good, no upset tummies so far ... and yes they have had some Wiska's wet and dry!


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

It is quite simple for a vet to spay her even if she is in the early stages of pregnancy, so perhaps that is his thinking, that it is not a disaster if she does get pregnant.

I would be worried that something may happen to her when she is outside. If she got scared for some reason and ended up out of your garden and way down the road or her hormones took over and she did go a-hunting for a mate overnight then she may get run over or end up injured in some way. How would you cope with her kittens then? They are still only 11 days old.


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

becbec31 said:


> Jo i feed whiskas pouches to my cats also as some of the higher meat content foods give Lola a terrible tummy, may not to wise switching her food whilst shes feeding as it may give her the runs and wont help her condition at all.
> 
> Do you feed her any dry food? Try a good quality dry as well as the pouches. I feed Royal Canin 36 kitten to my queens during pregnancy and lactation and for a few motnhs after to help them recover.
> 
> ...


Ok Bex thanks for that so will continue with whiskas pouches & the gourmet but will get other stuff dry and higher meat and try a little now and then see how we go.



mellowma said:


> Can you put the box beside where she put the kittens ?
> 
> With a big cover over the top for privacy and a hole in the side for her to get in/out ?
> 
> Little buggers!  (mummy cats in general that is)!


Have secured birthing box a bit more now so see how it goes, little buggers indeed, think Geri likes to make me panic bless her, thanks for your comments.



Aurelia said:


> Of course, I'm such a twit for not mentioning this part. Glad you saw the thread Bex
> 
> Rilly has Wiska's occasionally, if I remember rightly she was weaned onto it (along with others), so it's not terrible, and is certainly better than no food. But there are definately better foods out there.
> 
> I'm trying to get our kits to try all different things, so hopefully they will be fine with what ever is put in front of them. So far so good, no upset tummies so far ... and yes they have had some Wiska's wet and dry!


Ok so will give other foods a try but gradually see how we go, oh and have secured box, pic attached, she has been in and out of it twice now in the last hour or so but kittens still in it so fingers crossed:thumbup::thumbup:



lauren001 said:


> It is quite simple for a vet to spay her even if she is in the early stages of pregnancy, so perhaps that is his thinking, that it is not a disaster if she does get pregnant.
> 
> I would be worried that something may happen to her when she is outside. If she got scared for some reason and ended up out of your garden and way down the road or her hormones took over and she did go a-hunting for a mate overnight then she may get run over or end up injured in some way. How would you cope with her kittens then? They are still only 11 days old.


Hi Lauren thanks for your comments, I have had the same worries as you mention from when she had the kittens and was not letting her out, it was only cos of what the vet said that I did let her out & to be honest she has not gone far and comes back to check on kittens after short time and has been in garden no further but am always worried while she is out, so prob best for all concerned if we keep her in until she is spayed now.:thumbup:







box as was this morning







box as is now

Thank you all so much for all your help & advice on these matters, I have learnt so much more today, its nice to know you are all there when needed

Mo xx


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Welcome to the brown parcel tape gang 

Can you put either a weight on the sides of the towel or just tape it to the box a little? Just to make sure it doesn't fall in on the babies. Sounds like progress though 

I am also part of the over protective society too, would you like membership?  I over think a lot of things ... in fact most things. It's who I am these days. You should see our room, the lengths we have gone to, to kitten proof things :lol: Can't hurt to be cautious, so I think you made the right decision for you, your girl and her babies


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

Aurelia said:


> Welcome to the brown parcel tape gang
> 
> Can you put either a weight on the sides of the towel or just tape it to the box a little? Just to make sure it doesn't fall in on the babies. Sounds like progress though
> 
> I am also part of the over protective society too, would you like membership?  I over think a lot of things ... in fact most things. It's who I am these days. You should see our room, the lengths we have gone to, to kitten proof things :lol: Can't hurt to be cautious, so I think you made the right decision for you, your girl and her babies


Aw thanks hun, its so useful (brown parcel tape) isn't it, have to confess I did get all the stuff sorted to do it and hubby popped in from work so I jumped in shower while he was here and keeping a watchful eye and he had done the box when I came back down bless him, and will sort towel altho when had it on before it stayed where it was its a pretty heavy towel and box but will see if can tape it, as for worrying my hubby says I worry for the world thinking of changing my name to Paranoid Worrier ha-ha thanks again for all ur help.

Hugs
Mo xxx


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

Momo12 said:


> Thanks for comments Liz been such a stressful morning, so should I let her into the garden or not she doesn't wander to be honest never has done even before the kittens, but what about risk of infection to the kittens is that possible, as for the moving think she is confusing herself, she keeps going into the birthing box coming out looking at me meowing as if to say where are my babies is she likely to move them back do u think or not, shall I leave them aloneas only thing is its a bit small in the scratch box or all of them ok for the kittens but when Geri gets in as well bit squashed haha, see it was all going so well ahd to be something to catch me out haha
> 
> Mo xxx


Don't worry, cats squash into small spaces quite happily. You could try moving them back to see what happens but I wouldn't worry too much.

As for letting her out, I agree that is your call. The risks of infection are very low, probably the biggest risk (unless you live in a very safe area indeed) is of her getting run over. I think if it were me, I would go and sit outside and let her come out to potter around, that way you can monitor her beahvaiour for a bit. If she is calling you will know immediately (and then you need to get hold of her quick!) but I think it most unlikely with 11 day old kittens. You need to balance the risks against the stress caused if you keep her in.

In the days when I routinely let my girls out and relied on a combination of Ovarid and close observation (few of my cats go out at all now that a boy racer has moved into the street), I used to let them out when they had kittens and never had a problem. I understand where others are coming from though, it is very common indeed on these forums to read that a cat is expecting her second litter because they didn't get her spayed in time. 8 weeks after birth is the norm and most cats would not have called by then. Just don't leave it any longer than that!

Liz


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

lizward said:


> Don't worry, cats squash into small spaces quite happily. You could try moving them back to see what happens but I wouldn't worry too much.
> 
> As for letting her out, I agree that is your call. The risks of infection are very low, probably the biggest risk (unless you live in a very safe area indeed) is of her getting run over. I think if it were me, I would go and sit outside and let her come out to potter around, that way you can monitor her beahvaiour for a bit. If she is calling you will know immediately (and then you need to get hold of her quick!) but I think it most unlikely with 11 day old kittens. You need to balance the risks against the stress caused if you keep her in.
> 
> ...


Oh thanks Liz, well me & hubby popped out for a short while, daughter here to keep watch and all going well back in birthing box since made it more secure so fingers crossed, as far as Geri going out we don't live right on the road live in a cul de sac and on a walk way off tht so road not an issue, so what I may do is go out with her in the mornings for a bit then get her back in then repeat this couple more times during the day see how we go with that but won't let her out of my sight and she will be spayed when babies 8 weeks old.

Mo xxx


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## lorilu (Sep 6, 2009)

Momo12 said:


> Hi oh thanks for that, well we weren't letting her out because I didn't think I should and I told the rest of the family she can't go out until she been spayed now, even tho she kept asking, so I went to the vet on monday and spoke to her about having Geri spayed when it could be done etc etc and she said *if she is a good mum be ok to let her into garden cos she wouldn't go far (which she hasn't) and she also said it would be too early for her to get pregnant again cos we worried about that also, so now I am more confused.*
> So why has she moved them and is it ok for me to move the kittens back into the birthing box or should we leave them where Geri puts them, its ok its just a rather small area and of course I can't see them in there, sorry to be a pain just really worried cos all be great so far. thanks.
> 
> Mo xxx


Bad advice and dead wrong. A nursing cat can go into heat at any time. Geesh. Was it a vet that told you that, or a receptionist?

Perfectly normal for a mama cat to move the kittens around, it is instinctual, to avoid predators.


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

lorilu said:


> Bad advice and dead wrong. A nursing cat can go into heat at any time. Geesh. Was it a vet that told you that, or a receptionist?
> 
> Perfectly normal for a mama cat to move the kittens around, it is instinctual, to avoid predators.


Hi Lorilu, 
Yes it was the vet and I was actually at the vets, talking to her in person so there you go, think we are sorted on the moving front for now, bit scary at first when u don't know tho.

Mo xxx


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

Just quick update Geri and babies have so far stayed in birthing box since 3pm yesterday, she seems to be more attentive to them as well she is getting out of the box but laying about 3 feet away then keeps popping back in, and strangely enough she has not asked to go out yet so I haven't encouraged it will see how we go. Many thanks to you all for your help yesterday:thumbup::thumbup:


Mo xx


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## KathyM (Jul 30, 2008)

I know I'm biased but I would not let her out for love nor money while she's nursing. It's not just the risk of pregnancy but all the risks of going outside can add up to motherless kittens. If you want to take the risk once she's finished with them and spayed then that's entirely your choice, as it is now, but I would personally hold off entirely until then. As for cul-de-sacs being safer for cats, I would've agreed til we found one dead on ours and lost another. Nowhere is a safe place for letting out cats, other than perhaps (?) a "catproofed" garden that she cannot get out of, or a cat run. xxx


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Momo12&#8230; I just wanted to join the chorus of &#8220;I wouldn&#8217;t let her out at all while she&#8217;s nursing&#8221; definitely not when they&#8217;re entirely dependant upon her as they are now (and even when they&#8217;re 6 weeks and older, I too would be worried she&#8217;d get pregnant again). Apart from all the other risks mentioned above, one of my biggest worries would be&#8230; well&#8230; that with all the temptations that the great outdoors has to offer, that she just decided to go walkabouts instead of keeping a good watch over the kittens. If that happened and she did go walkabouts, even if it was only for a half a day&#8230; you would need to bottle feed within a couple of hours (as well as toileting them, providing them with a source of heat and everything else that mother does). I would go out of my way to avoid that happening. 

I did want to add though that I think their weights are great and they even look podgey (meant in the nicest possible sense of the word, nothing makes me happier than slightly podgey tiny kittens) . Keep up the good work!!


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

KathyM said:


> I know I'm biased but I would not let her out for love nor money while she's nursing. It's not just the risk of pregnancy but all the risks of going outside can add up to motherless kittens. If you want to take the risk once she's finished with them and spayed then that's entirely your choice, as it is now, but I would personally hold off entirely until then. As for cul-de-sacs being safer for cats, I would've agreed til we found one dead on ours and lost another. Nowhere is a safe place for letting out cats, other than perhaps (?) a "catproofed" garden that she cannot get out of, or a cat run. xxx


Hi Kathy,

Thanks for your comments, she is safely indoors and will be staying that way for the forseeable future, it was my instinct to keep her in anyway and I think prob best to follow ur own instinct now so all is well:thumbup::thumbup:



Tje said:


> Momo12 I just wanted to join the chorus of I wouldnt let her out at all while shes nursing definitely not when theyre entirely dependant upon her as they are now (and even when theyre 6 weeks and older, I too would be worried shed get pregnant again). Apart from all the other risks mentioned above, one of my biggest worries would be well that with all the temptations that the great outdoors has to offer, that she just decided to go walkabouts instead of keeping a good watch over the kittens. If that happened and she did go walkabouts, even if it was only for a half a day you would need to bottle feed within a couple of hours (as well as toileting them, providing them with a source of heat and everything else that mother does). I would go out of my way to avoid that happening.
> 
> I did want to add though that I think their weights are great and they even look podgey (meant in the nicest possible sense of the word, nothing makes me happier than slightly podgey tiny kittens) . Keep up the good work!!


Hi Tje,
As said above she safely indoors, as for the podgy kittens I keep thinkin they are as well, do you see that as a problem or is it quite normal they are 306g and 297g now from birth weights of 102g and 101g spose they not that mobile yet to work it off so I thought that would make them a bit podgy would like to know your opinion on this

Mo xxx


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Momo12 said:


> Hi Tje,
> As said above she safely indoors, as for the podgy kittens I keep thinkin they are as well, do you see that as a problem or is it quite normal they are 306g and 297g now from birth weights of 102g and 101g spose they not that mobile yet to work it off so I thought that would make them a bit podgy would like to know your opinion on this
> 
> Mo xxx


If every foster kitten that came through my doors acheived those weights I would be DELIGHTED!!! I think they're brilliant weights. I say podgey, but I actually think it's great they weigh that much. Tripling the birth weight in a fortnight is like textbook perfect, but something I very very very rarely achieve. I think I am so used skinny malnourished kittens (often without mothers) that anything healthy and robust, I automatically label as podgey, and I really shouldn't because I would kill to have these weights on my skinnymalinkys. I've never had a vet tell me a kitten was to fat, but too skinny I hear continually. Whatever you're doing (and mother cat) you're both doing it right - keep up the good work! Great to read posts like this and see these pics. :thumbup: Give them a hug from me.


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

Aw Tje,

Thanks so much for your lovely comments makes me feel a whole lot better I can tell you & hopefully we will keep up the good work!!

As for you and skinny cats, if you are taking in rescue cats thats such an admirable thing to do and whether skinny or not at least they have someone to help and look after them so you keep up the good work as well, the world needs more people like you:thumbup::thumbup:


Mo xx


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Tje said:


> If every foster kitten that came through my doors acheived those weights I would be DELIGHTED!!! I think they're brilliant weights. I say podgey, but I actually think it's great they weigh that much. Tripling the birth weight in a fortnight is like textbook perfect, but something I very very very rarely achieve. I think I am so used skinny malnourished kittens (often without mothers) that anything healthy and robust, I automatically label as podgey, and I really shouldn't because I would kill to have these weights on my skinnymalinkys. I've never had a vet tell me a kitten was to fat, but too skinny I hear continually. Whatever you're doing (and mother cat) you're both doing it right - keep up the good work! Great to read posts like this and see these pics. :thumbup: Give them a hug from me.


I couldn't agree more. I just had my first "podgy" kitten and am delighted with him, I have never had one before and was a little bit worried about his weight at one point as he was so big.

he is 6 weeks now I am delighted with him! In 2 years he is the best we have bred!


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

mellowma said:


> I couldn't agree more. I just had my first "podgy" kitten and am delighted with him, I have never had one before and was a little bit worried about his weight at one point as he was so big.
> 
> he is 6 weeks now I am delighted with him! In 2 years he is the best we have bred!


Thanks Mellowma so all is ok then, you don't think they are too podgy or heavy, cos I keep worrying that Boo who is the first born and heaviest has a big podgy belly, but having said that if tripling birth weight in 14days is text book suppose its ok, I am a born worrier and will continue to worry silly until they are weaned fully and getting about on their own of course I will worry all the time, but am most concerned about the next 6-8weeks cos never done it before so its all new, but then again have so much help and experience on here feel so much better to know help not far away and I will be asking trust me. 

Mo xxx


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

mellowma said:


> I couldn't agree more. I just had my first "podgy" kitten and am delighted with him, I have never had one before and was a little bit worried about his weight at one point as he was so big.
> 
> he is 6 weeks now I am delighted with him! In 2 years he is the best we have bred!


I can totally understand that! There really is nothing nicer than a gorgeously podgey kitten!


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Momo12, just to give you an idea I just checked my breeder friends website, she keeps growth spreadsheets on her website, her latest litter (5 kittens) were all around the 100g at birth. On day 14 the lightest was 282 and the heaviest was 311 and that wasnt one of her particularly big litters. Its just the opposite (good) end of the spectrum than what I am used to in rescue. 

Enjoy them!!


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## Momo12 (May 11, 2010)

Tje said:


> Momo12, just to give you an idea I just checked my breeder friends website, she keeps growth spreadsheets on her website, her latest litter (5 kittens) were all around the 100g at birth. On day 14 the lightest was 282 and the heaviest was 311 and that wasnt one of her particularly big litters. Its just the opposite (good) end of the spectrum than what I am used to in rescue.
> 
> Enjoy them!!


Oh thanks for that Tje makes me feel quite proud really, but won't try to be clever have so much to learn and you all the nice helpful people on here are making that so much easier and a pleasure.
:thumbup::thumbup:

Mo xx


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