# possible queen?



## bengalbeauty (Apr 11, 2009)

Hi, 

After lots of research we think we may have found our first little girl, we are going to see her this Sunday. The breeder is really lovely and we have been in correspondence by e-mail almost every day since we first enquired. As far as I can tell from the pictures ( will obviously have to have a good look when we go ) she meets all of the points on the bengal breed standard. Ive managed to find a good power point which gives some visual indicators as to what and what doesnt meet the standard which has really helped. The only thing that may be a problem is that the standard says the head must be longer than it is wide . . . . I think she is cutting it close. 

Am i allowed to post a picture of her on here? it could be that it is just the angle of the pictures . . . could do with the opinion of someone with a more experienced eye for these things . . . dont want to make any mistakes.

xxx


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## Saikou (Apr 2, 2008)

I don't breed bengals, but with regard to her head, I would say it depends how old she is. Siamese and oriental kittens heads lengthen in proportion to the width of their heads as they grow. You get a better idea of the proportion they will end up with around 12/13 weeks. Very young kittens have a 'rounder' looking head.


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## bengalbeauty (Apr 11, 2009)

I thought that might be a factor meant to ask in the first post  

she is only 9 weeks at the moment, mum and dad have good heads so far as i can tell.

xxx


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

Are you going to show her? She doesn't have to be perfect to be a good breeding girl.


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## bengalbeauty (Apr 11, 2009)

Would like to show her too, I'm going to try and attend a few shows in May (before she is ready to leave), however it may be the case that if we want her we have to put the deposit down this weekend.

xxx


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

Do the breeders show their cats?


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## bengalbeauty (Apr 11, 2009)

No although she told me it is something that she wants to do when her children are a bit older. She says the kitten's best feature is her tummy which is really white and has lovely spots and that this will stand out when showing, she has also been handling her occasionly as if she was at a show so she will get used to it because she really wants her to be shown.


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## Saikou (Apr 2, 2008)

There are no guarantees that a kitten who exhibits show potential, will actually fulfil that early promise. Its a gamble.

I would also be wary about taking a breeders word on show quality if they haven't actually shown themselves, theory vs in practice. The two don't always match up.


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## Jen26 (Apr 22, 2008)

Hi I dont breed bengals but I started out showing neuters, Iam no expert but I think I can tell a good bengal from a not so good one. 

There are a few bengal breeders on here who will be able to advise you, iam sure they will be along later.

Do you have her picture?


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## bengalbeauty (Apr 11, 2009)

I do have some pictures, am i ok to post them here, even though she isnt my kitten?


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## Jen26 (Apr 22, 2008)

Ye, i cant see why not


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## Saikou (Apr 2, 2008)

Do you know an experienced bengal breeder who could go with you to see the kitten ? Pictures can be deceptive, I have seen bunny siamese and oris turned into show stoppers in a picture just because of the angle it was taken.


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## DiamondDust (Nov 3, 2007)

bengalbeauty said:


> Hi,
> 
> After lots of research we think we may have found our first little girl, we are going to see her this Sunday. The breeder is really lovely and we have been in correspondence by e-mail almost every day since we first enquired. As far as I can tell from the pictures ( will obviously have to have a good look when we go ) she meets all of the points on the bengal breed standard. Ive managed to find a good power point which gives some visual indicators as to what and what doesnt meet the standard which has really helped. The only thing that may be a problem is that the standard says the head must be longer than it is wide . . . . I think she is cutting it close.
> 
> ...


post the pictures I don't mind taking a look for you )


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## bengalbeauty (Apr 11, 2009)

Don't know any breeders that could go with me, we seem to be the only people for miles around that want to breed bengals, its going to be a three hour drive just to see the kitten.

Here are a couple of pictures . . .. the thumbnail one was taken when she was a bit younger and still quite fuzzy,


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## DiamondDust (Nov 3, 2007)

the pictures are way to small to make many comments, she has from what I can see good contrast to her rosetting, she does look whited but you will not know if this will stick until she is at least 1 year old and above. 

What is the breeding of this girl?


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

to be honest if i wanted to show her i'd be reluctant to buy from someone who doesn't show themselves. though if you are not fussed on whether she does great at shows then it wouldn't be a prob. 

it must be very hard buying a bengal i would thing as there are so many dodgy breeders out there.

is she charging you what sounds like a fair price? does she sell many cats for breeding? how long has she been breeding?


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## DiamondDust (Nov 3, 2007)

very good points you made there, I'd just like to add that the show quality has changed lots recently and if the breeder does not show herself she may not be best to advise you on a "show quality kitten" my honest opinion is if she is charging you less than £1100 then this kitten is not of show and breeding quality, breeding girls start at around £900 and show breeders from £1100 to £1500 top quality you are looking more the £1500 mark.


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## LucyCat (Apr 5, 2009)

Hi,

Her coat shows nice contrast and clarity especially for her age, but without a close-up of her, especailly her head/face, it is difficult to make a fair judgement.

I would agree with there being a lot of 'dodgy' Bengal breeders out there.
There seem to be growing numbers of new breeders that have far too many cats, and little knowledge, so be very careful and selective.


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## Jen26 (Apr 22, 2008)

What lines is she from? From what I can tell on the photos she doesnt look too bad, although she does have some linkage to her rossettes and her ears look a tad big, but like I said Iam definatly no expert.

Whats her tail like, have you checked she has a level bite?


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## bengalbeauty (Apr 11, 2009)

Hmmm, good point. 

Sorry Diamondust what do you mean re. her breeding, her pedigree or what colours etc. mum and dad are?

From what you have said about pricing it isnt in the show range . . . the breeder has been breeding for a fair while.

think will have to reserve judgement for when we have seen her . . . . anyone got any good suggestions of questions to ask when we go?

xxx


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## bengalbeauty (Apr 11, 2009)

Hi Jen, 

She comes from Millwood and Silvergene lines, havnt had a chance to check her out that closely yet, thats my job for Sunday


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## DiamondDust (Nov 3, 2007)

Jen26 said:


> What lines is she from? From what I can tell on the photos she doesnt look too bad, although she does have some linkage to her rossettes and her ears look a tad big, but like I said Iam definatly no expert.
> 
> Whats her tail like, have you checked she has a level bite?


Kittens can grow into their ears, but I do see that they are on the larger side, I personally would not retain a kitten for my programme with large ears, but one thing I do know is the camera angle does not always work well with ears lol 

You have a very good point RE the linkage in her rosetting although its not to much there is some, and in the show ring i'm sorry but perfection is needed 

I couldnt tell from the pictures what her tail was like as its all fuzzy in the first picture and from the way she is being held in the other 2 pictures her tain is tucked up under her, I personally would not scruff a kitten to take a picture but thats just my own opinion


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## Jen26 (Apr 22, 2008)

bengalbeauty said:


> Hmmm, good point.
> 
> Sorry Diamondust what do you mean re. her breeding, her pedigree or what colours etc. mum and dad are?
> 
> ...


Names of parents, and ancesters further back. Does she carry snow , or marble etc


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

Do you know if she's sold any kittens for show before? and how they have done?


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## bengalbeauty (Apr 11, 2009)

To be honest I havnt heard mention of her prefix in any shows . . . 

Here are a few of the names in the pedigree:-

StarwindsUK Big News, Millwood Jag, SGC Starbengal Rosetted Banderas, GRC Millwood French Lace, Silvergene Rapture, Glitterglam Moondancer, 

However the champions are the great grandparents.


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## DiamondDust (Nov 3, 2007)

bengalbeauty said:


> Hmmm, good point.
> 
> Sorry Diamondust what do you mean re. her breeding, her pedigree or what colours etc. mum and dad are?
> 
> ...


Yes her breeding her pedigree, Mum and Dad who are they.. Just beacuse a breeder has been breeding a long time does not make them know everything, in 3 years I still don't know it all and some who have been breeding for 10 + years don't know it all, things change so much in the breeding world the breed evolves and changes all of the time.

There is many things you need to take into account when you visit the first thing for me is the kittens are they all in tip top health, no runny eyes or noses or bums. 
also the room the kittens are in is it clean and tidy, ok so kitten make a bit of mess but the litter trays should be clean, the kittening pen should also be clean fresh food and water, and in my opinion the room should not smell of feces or urine, the kittens should all be happy and well socialised, they should be curios and want to interact with you, a kitten afraid to come out to you is not in my opinion well socialised.

Questions to ask. 
How long have you been breeding?
What made them decide to breed Bengals?
How they came to breed Bengals? 
Their breeding aims ( what they are working towards )
How many cats have they sold for breeding and showing
you should also ask about the history of the parents how old mum and dad is and the hstory of the kittens they have produced.

I will think of more and will post them as and when


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## DiamondDust (Nov 3, 2007)

bengalbeauty said:


> To be honest I havnt heard mention of her prefix in any shows . . .
> 
> Here are a few of the names in the pedigree:-
> 
> ...


no prefix so she could be working with admin prefix's of the GCCF EG Admilsh and so on...

but the names you have mentioned are good cats French Lace carries for the whited tummy gene


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

From her pedigree and parents, which I have found out, I would say it is very, very unlikely that she will retain her whited tummy.

They do have a prefix, but it is not one I am familiar with.


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

Hiya I have heard of a few in her ped. What is there prefix do they have a webiste who you want to buy her from? PM it to me if you want?


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

lauren001 said:


> From her pedigree and parents, which I have found out, I would say it is very, very unlikely that she will retain her whited tummy.
> 
> They do have a prefix, but it is not one I am familiar with.


do you breed Bengals?


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## LucyCat (Apr 5, 2009)

Taylorbaby said:


> Hiya I have heard of a few in her ped. What is there prefix do they have a webiste who you want to buy her from? PM it to me if you want?


You should be able to find the prefix yourself TB; it's quite easy to locate from the ped names that have been given


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

LucyCat said:


> You should be able to find the prefix yourself TB; it's quite easy to locate from the ped names that have been given


It sure is.


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

lol didnt realize I had to do all of the work to find them! :hand: :hand:

Ive never heard of them, but then you dont know everyone!
Love their F1 girl & F2 litter look lovely!


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

LucyCat said:


> You should be able to find the prefix yourself TB; it's quite easy to locate from the ped names that have been given


What do you breed? 



lauren001 said:


> It sure is.


what do you breed?


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## DiamondDust (Nov 3, 2007)

lauren001 said:


> It sure is.


don't you breed Bengals  i'm sure you do!


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## DiamondDust (Nov 3, 2007)

lauren001 said:


> It sure is.


wait I got it...


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

Ah, you guys have me flumoxed but I found them too. What's all the 'in' styff about?


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## Leah100 (Aug 17, 2008)

Before you invest in a Queen, why not go along to some shows and have a chat to some exhibitors and breeders? Will give you a chance to learn a lot about the type you want to aim for, and help you get an 'eye' for the potential of any new Queen?

Welcome to the Governing Council of the Cat Fancy

Show Diary for TICA cat shows in the UK

Felis Britannica - UK FIFe Cat Shows and Pedigree Registrations


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## bengalbeauty (Apr 11, 2009)

I did know the name of the breeders but the mum and dads names didnt follow the usual layout for pedigree names so didn't know if the breeder name was her prefix .. . . hope that makes sense

really do want to go to some cat shows very soon! 

The breeder so far hasnt given me any reason to doubt her (except maybe her take on a show quality kitten), I will be on the look out for those things and ask those questions that you suggested Diamondust, thank you. I think it may be a bad omen to not buy a kitten from a small breeder just because they are not well known as we will be in the same position ourselves once we get started! 

xxx


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## Janee (May 4, 2008)

This is useful

PawPeds


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## Saikou (Apr 2, 2008)

It is very difficult to find that right first bred/show girl. If you buy from a small or a larger breeder there are still no guarantees. A larger more established breeder even if they do show is no more likely to tell you the truth about the quality of a kitten than a smaller less established breeder. Probably less so as they would be keeping a really typey girls themselves or have a network of close breeder friends that would be top of the list.

I think you have to trust yourself. If you do enough research and visit a number of shows to get as much info together as you can, then look for a kitten that YOU like the look of, that has the potential to give you the look and type of kittens that you want to produce, regardless of what anyone else says.

At the end of the day, any show career especially for a breeding queen is very short. Even a breeding 'career' is relatively short in a cats over all life, and if you want that cat to be a pet first and foremost, then she should be the kind of type you like, as its hopefully going to be a 15yr plus relationship, unless you want to be one of those ship 'em in, use them for a litter or two and ship 'em out kind of bengal breeder - but hopefully not.


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## puddywat (Apr 14, 2008)

A note for bengal beauty I have PM'd you....


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## bengalbeauty (Apr 11, 2009)

Hi Puddywat, 

Thanks for your message, I have tried to PM you back but your message box is full! :001_smile:

Thanks everybody for your comments they have been really helpful and will bear all in mind when we go to view tomorrow xxx


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## puddywat (Apr 14, 2008)

i have cleared my box please try again


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## tina clarke (Jan 23, 2009)

bengalbeauty said:


> To be honest I havnt heard mention of her prefix in any shows . . .
> 
> Here are a few of the names in the pedigree:-
> 
> ...


omy my ajays grandad is millwood jag


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