# 5 month bsh kitten, not eating well - dietary advice needed



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

When I first got my BSH kitten she wolfed down every bit of food that came her way. I have been feeding a combo of good quality kitten complete wet foods, raw mince and Royal Canin kitten kibble. 

However she has now stopped eating wet foods and raw meat and is just nibbling at kibble, she has always enjoyed drinking lots of water and is still doing so. She is lively and playing although does sleep quite a lot. She has definitely grown but is a slightly skinny. I am now at a loss to sort out her appetite and wondered if she may be constipated. She is pooing but her stools are very small although this may be due to just eating small amounts. Does anyone have any ideas what's wrong with her appetite? I have offered her everything I can to tempt her to eat. As soon as she wakes up she seems to head for a wall or floor and licks, could she be teething (or just being a weirdo - my last cat licked plastic bags!) 

Any ideas, any suggestions of what I can try?


----------



## Paddypaws (May 4, 2010)

How long has she been off her food like this for?
I know when a couple of mine were kittens they seemed to go through a stage of being off food, either when teething or maybe when the girls were coming into season and needed to be spayed.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

This not eating much been gradual, probably over a week now. She doesn't appear to be ill, but obviously I am getting worried she is just picking at food. She was born October 31st - do you think she could be coming into season already and should I be getting her spayed? How do you tell if she is teething? Sorry I seem to be so clueless, I am very experienced with cats, just not used to having such a youngster!


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Definitely could be coming into season. Although it would be young for the breed, it wouldn't be unheard of. I'd also suspect teething as she's the right age for that too. Does she have smelly breath? She may be licking at walls to try and cool her mouth. With an older cat I'd suggest a nutritional insufficiency with this behaviour, but given the varied diet you're offering, I doubt this is the cause. I'd suggest giving her McDonalds straws to chew on. I don't know why, but McDonalds are the best for this, and favoured every time by every litter I've ever bred, and every teething kitten I've ever had under my roof. Who knows why! They help them cut their teeth nice and quickly though, and relieve some of the urge to chew. I'd also be tempted to remove the kibble from her diet as it may be she's becoming picky as the dry food tastes so much better to them than the wet. I'd do this once her apetite improves mind you.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

I'm thinking it is teething, she has just been sitting next to me grinding her teeth so they must be bothering her! Mc Donald straws lol who would have thought it! Wow, it would be worth the 60 mile round trip to our nearest Maccy Dee's to get them! Thanks for your suggestions, much appreciated.


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

I know, they're weird little beasties, aren't they! Ikea straws are also good although McDs are still the favourite. The other brands appear to be softer, so less satisfying for them.

Really can't think of much else that mine like to cut their teeth on. Well, I can, but I'm sure you wouldn't want to donate walls, furniture, kitchen chairs, spoons, etc etc to the mouth of your chewy kitten! These straws always satisfy the urge and seem to bring real relief to my lot.


----------



## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

Still get her spayed asap even if not the cause of your issue at them moment, it's best to get them done before their first heat cycle.


----------



## Paddypaws (May 4, 2010)

spotty cats said:


> Still get her spayed asap even if not the cause of your issue at them moment, it's best to get them done before their first heat cycle.


yes, of course.
I despaired of Mitzy's appetite between 4 and 6 months, but once she was spayed it returned with a vengeance and she is a right little porker now.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Yes I do intend to get her spayed and will be making an appointment with our vet. Regarding the teething, she is not very chewy so I cannot get her to accept anything to teethe on. I gave her a straw and she looked at me as if I had lost my marbles! Will probably get appointment for spay and get teeth checked at same time, although I would prefer to get her eating to boost her resources before she has an operation.


----------



## Paddypaws (May 4, 2010)

tie the straw into a knot and then throw it for her, she might find that more appealing


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

I drag straws across the floor, thread ribbon through a few and tie a secure knot in the end so they can drag it, all sorts.


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

When my girls were kittens I knotted several plastic straws together, so they had points like a star, and they loved them for chewing and playing with.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Thanks for suggestions, have tried knotted straws but she is more interested in patting them than chewing, she is eating a little bit more but still licking walls. I have managed to get her to chew pieces of semi frozen shell free prawn, she really crunches and grinds her teeth together when chewing the bits, but I have only given her the one prawn as I am not sure whether she should have prawns.


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

It won't do her any harm to have prawns, as long as it's not all the time!


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Ok so she is booked in to be spayed. Meanwhile I thought I would check her weight and now I think she is very underweight. She was born October 27th 2015 and she is now weighing approx 1355 grams which is just under 3 pounds. Looking at kitten weight charts she should be twice that weight. She has started eating a bit more but nothing like what she used to. She doesn't appear to be sick and there are plenty of tiny poos in the litter tray. I feed her a variety of foods but she has been just nibbling recently but she was quite skinny when I got her. Does anyone think there is cause for concern, or is she too underweight to be spayed?


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

I'd be quite concerned at that. Mine normally achieve that weight at about 10 weeks old! BSH cats are bred to be heavy and stocky, so at her age, I'd expect her to be at least 2.5 KG or there abouts. She may just be a very very tiny cat, but given her small apetite and her low weight, it wouldn't hurt to have a vet visit. Does she feel skinny and bony?


----------



## MissKittyKat (Jan 23, 2016)

My boy is 3 months older and over 4kg. When he was about 6 months he went through a big growth spurt and was just over 3kg.

I do have a small BSH variant girl who hovers between 4-4.5kg. 

But your girl does sound small. Have you checked her against a body condition chart rather than weight?


----------



## gskinner123 (Mar 10, 2010)

I would be a little concerned with her lack of appetite and very small size/low bodyweight. Not all BSH are big, chunky cats and depending upon the breed line (and to some extent her colour) some may even be quite small.. so it may be that she is a reasonable weight if very small in stature.

I cannot remember the last time one of my kittens (I breed BSH) left for their new home at 13 weeks weighing less than 3lbs. Your girl's weight, in itself, I don't think would pose a problem for spaying/anaesthesia but, were she mine, I think I would want to delay surgery until a while after her appetite had returned to normal (I also think the licking of walls/floors is a slight concern) and meantime have the vet check her over.


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

I have a small BSH at barely 4kg, she was just under 2.5kg when I got her at around 10 months old. So your girl is coming up to 6 months old, has the vet checked her mouth and teeth ? Her mouth might be sore.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Her appetite has miraculously returned, yesterday and today she has been eating well at last. She was checked by our vet when we got her, and I will be getting her checked again when she is spayed. She is skinny but seems happy and lively otherwise. The breeder did say that her litter was hand reared because the mother rejected the litter so perhaps she didn't get off to the best start. I was surprised when I saw the birth date on her injection certificate!


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Cookieandme said:


> I have a small BSH at barely 4kg, she was just under 2.5kg when I got her at around 10 months old. So your girl is coming up to 6 months old, has the vet checked her mouth and teeth ? Her mouth might be sore.


She had a general check by our own vet when I got her. I will certainly get her mouth checked thoroughly when she goes to be spayed next Friday.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

S


gskinner123 said:


> I would be a little concerned with her lack of appetite and very small size/low bodyweight. Not all BSH are big, chunky cats and depending upon the breed line (and to some extent her colour) some may even be quite small.. so it may be that she is a reasonable weight if very small in stature.
> 
> I cannot remember the last time one of my kittens (I breed BSH) left for their new home at 13 weeks weighing less than 3lbs. Your girl's weight, in itself, I don't think would pose a problem for spaying/anaesthesia but, were she mine, I think I would want to delay surgery until a while after her appetite had returned to normal (I also think the licking of walls/floors is a slight concern) and meantime have the vet check her over.


She is a blue cream, her photo is on my icon, her mother was a smallish cat a tri-colour mainly cream so she is perhaps just going to be small. I am becoming convinced the licking is just because she likes to, my last cat an Exotic used to lick plastic bags because he liked the texture.


----------



## Irimina (Apr 13, 2016)

Sorry to chim in, may I ask why is it better to spay a female cat before her first heat cycle?
We have a cat that has already been spayed, at 4 months old, and a 2 months old kitten. We were thinking to spay her around 6 months. Too late?


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

carly87 said:


> I'd be quite concerned at that. Mine normally achieve that weight at about 10 weeks old! BSH cats are bred to be heavy and stocky, so at her age, I'd expect her to be at least 2.5 KG or there abouts. She may just be a very very tiny cat, but given her small apetite and her low weight, it wouldn't hurt to have a vet visit. Does she feel skinny and bony?


You now have me very worried! As someone suggested I have looked at the body condition charts. She feels a bit bony and light, but if I just assess her condition by sight, no bones protrude or are visible, she has a good thick coat, only thing I would say her back legs are visibly skinny.


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

She definitely shouldn't be skinny at her age. Lanky maybe but not skinny. Really would suggest having her checked.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

carly87 said:


> She definitely shouldn't be skinny at her age. Lanky maybe but not skinny. Really would suggest having her checked.


She will be getting checked again, there are no visible ribs or anything, just her back legs a bit long and thin, suppose you could say that is lanky.


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

She is very pretty, how old is she in your profile pic and do you have an up to date photo


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

The icon photo was taken a few weeks ago, I am posting a photo taken yesterday.


----------



## pipje (Jun 29, 2011)

I suspect she might be younger than 5 months. 1.355 is really very, very light. As some have mentioned, that is the weight of 10 -week old girls. She looks a little skinny but not too emaciated. When did you get her?


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

I got her on 17th February, she had just had her second injection and was with the rest of her litter. I was surprised to see her age on her vaccination certificate as being born on October 27th.


----------



## ZoeM (Jul 16, 2015)

I have nothing to add here really - apart from just keep an eye on the weight and if she doesn't put any on after two weeks - definitely get her checked again at the vets?

She is absolutely beautiful. I would love a BSH myself and the colouring on her is stunning!

Z x


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

pipje said:


> I suspect she might be younger than 5 months. 1.355 is really very, very light. As some have mentioned, that is the weight of 10 -week old girls. She looks a little skinny but not too emaciated. When did you get her?


I don't think you can use emancipated, she is small but she looks a similar build to my April.

@SueTh you mentioned her DOB on vacination certificate, it does match with her pedigree registration ?


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Cookieandme said:


> I don't think you can use emancipated, she is small but she looks a similar build to my April.
> 
> @SueTh you mentioned her DOB on vacination certificate, it does match with her pedigree registration ?


I do not think she is registered, I expected her to be an unregistered kitten from registered parents although the breeder said she would forward paperwork but nothing arrived. I am not really bothered about pedigree, although it is always nice to know the lineage. I will contact the breeder again to try to confirm DOB but to be honest I don't think she will reply, I am starting to think she may be less than truthful, although I don't understand why.


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

As long as she is healthy, she will put a bit of weight on in time. My little April who is a very picky eater is just about 4kg and she 4 next week.


----------



## pipje (Jun 29, 2011)

1.355kg is exceedingly light for an almost 6 month old- it's just not normal and definitely not healthy. Since she doesn't look emaciated,I'm guessing she might be 8-9 weeks old when she went to leave with you which makes her about 17 weeks old now. Still lighter than any British Shorthair kitten I've ever bred/know but at least not a scarily light 6 month old...

Do you have pictures of when you first got her? We'll have a better idea on age then


----------



## pipje (Jun 29, 2011)

The smallest British Shorthair girl in my last nest :

Birth weight: 93g
Weight @ 1 week old: 203g
Weight @ 2 weeks old: 294g
Weight @ 3 weeks old: 367g
Weight @ 4 weeks old: 452g
Weight @ 5 weeks old: 565g
Weight @ 6 weeks old: 654g
Weight @ 7 weeks old: 774g
Weight @ 8 weeks old: 925g
Weight @ 9 weeks old: 1098g
Weight @ 10 weeks old: 1223g
Weight @ 11 weeks old: 1373g
Weight @ 12 weeks old: 1500g
Weight @ 13 weeks old: 1690g

Sue: your girl is pretty, not trying to upset you about it but I do think if she is truly almost 6 months and only 1.355 kg, then there might be something else going on.

Cookieandme: a 4kg adult female is not small, totally normal


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

pipje said:


> The smallest British Shorthair girl in my last nest :
> 
> Birth weight: 93g
> Weight @ 1 week old: 203g
> ...


I agree something here is definitely not making sense. I will re-weigh her when she wakes up and double check her weight, I think the age on her vaccination certificate is wrong, I would have expected her to be 12 weeks when I got her. Don't worry everyone - she will see vet again and get fully checked. Just weighed her, yes my weighing was correct.  very very worried now...


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

Please don't worry too much. I cannot think the date of birth on the vaccination certificate can be very wrong because the vet should have checked the kitten at both vaccinations, unless you think the certificate is not genuine. That would be possible to check with a phone call to the practice. What did she weigh when you registered her with your vet? Was there any cause for concern at that time?


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

SueTh said:


> very very worried now...


Please don't worry, worst case she is a little younger than you thought she was. Shame the breeder can't confirm


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

QOTN said:


> Please don't worry too much. I cannot think the date of birth on the vaccination certificate can be very wrong because the vet should have checked the kitten at both vaccinations, unless you think the certificate is not genuine. That would be possible to check with a phone call to the practice. What did she weigh when you registered her with your vet? Was there any cause for concern at that time?


My vet did weigh her and didn't make any remarks on weight at the time, but perhaps she didn't realise it was very low. The vaccination certificate looks genuine but only first set of injection carries the vaccine label, second entry does not. I cannot get the breeder to answer but I think now she is probably a liar anyway. Can a vet test to see if vaccinated? So many questions now, I trusted this breeder but now I really wonder... Guess I'm off to the vets on Monday and probably cancel the spaying until I know what's going on


----------



## pipje (Jun 29, 2011)

Don't worry too much- if she looks and acts fine, she's probably ok. She's probably just younger than she really is (in which case, the vaccinations might be fake- it wouldn't be the first time).



SueTh said:


> I agree something here is definitely not making sense. I will re-weigh her when she wakes up and double check her weight, I think the age on her vaccination certificate is wrong, I would have expected her to be 12 weeks when I got her. Don't worry everyone - she will see vet again and get fully checked. Just weighed her, yes my weighing was correct.  very very worried now...


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

SueTh said:


> My vet did weigh her and didn't make any remarks on weight at the time, but perhaps she didn't realise it was very low. The vaccination certificate looks genuine but only first set of injection carries the vaccine label, second entry does not. I cannot get the breeder to answer but I think now she is probably a liar anyway. Can a vet test to see if vaccinated? So many questions now, I trusted this breeder but now I really wonder... Guess I'm off to the vets on Monday and probably cancel the spaying until I know what's going on


For your peace of mind I think on Monday you should phone the vet practice that did the vaccinations. Yes your vet can do a blood test to test for panleukopenia antibodies. That could tell you she was not vaccinated (zero titre) or if she mounted an adequate immune response when she was vaccinated. If she was vaccinated very young there is also a chance it would not have taken because the mother's antibodies can interfere with the vaccine if they are still present when the kitten is vaccinated. The lab will say on the test result if they consider she is protected or requires another jab.


----------



## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

SueTh said:


> I do not think she is registered, I expected her to be an unregistered kitten from registered parents although the breeder said she would forward paperwork but nothing arrived. I am not really bothered about pedigree, although it is always nice to know the lineage. I will contact the breeder again to try to confirm DOB but to be honest I don't think she will reply, I am starting to think she may be less than truthful, although I don't understand why.


Sounds like she was purchased from a BYB, not a breeder registered with TICA or GCCF. I hope the parents had the breeds required health tests?

Could it be the first vaccination with the sticker is correct and the next was the intended date of second vac?


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Who knows! If someone lies through their teeth you just don't know what to expect. I didn't see this coming, I went to her house, met family, chatted for a long time, played with the kittens, I had researched her and couldn't come up with anything against her. She was a formerly registered breeder with GCCF inactive status. I feel stupid, but would I do it again YES - I love my kitten and if she is unwell she has come to a good owner who will hopefully get her fixed. Actually looking at her today she has played very vigorously for nearly 6 hours since first light and is now feeding reasonably well, but she will go to vets tomorrow. I will let you know what happens...


----------



## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

I don't doubt that your kitten is in a loving home, but please don't support byb's again, they do nothing to further the breed, often lie about various things and don't tend to health test. They exist because people buy their kittens or feel sorry for them in some situations.

I hope you figure out what's going on with her age and weight, she doesn't look underweight in the photo but the figure on the scale is unusual.


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Whether she is younger than you were told or not, the skinny comment bothers me a lot. Especially as you've had her for a good long time and I'm assuming you feed as much as she wants she should really now be nicely padded and roley poley. Think baby fat on young kids, so not fat, but well padded. I do think a check up is the best way forward really. I'd also now weigh her weekly and see if or what she puts on. you're looking for an average of 100G weekly.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

spotty cats said:


> I don't doubt that your kitten is in a loving home, but please don't support byb's again, they do nothing to further the breed, often lie about various things and don't tend to health test. They exist because people buy their kittens or feel sorry for them in some situations.
> 
> I hope you figure out what's going on with her age and weight, she doesn't look underweight in the photo but the figure on the scale is unusual.


Sorry didn't know she was a BYB she was inactive GCCF which I always thought was a valid status...


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Well everyone you will be pleased to know Grace has seen the vet today for a thorough check, there is nothing obvious, she is definitely teething with her second teeth, she has put on weight since her last visit to vet, but she is now booked for a detailed scan and blood tests. Thanks for your help and advice, this forum has been invaluable, I don't think it would have dawned on me so quickly that anything was particularly wrong. She is fit and lively so hopefully she will be okay.


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

There are no 'active' GCCF breeders so there can also be no 'inactive' breeders. In recent years breeders who choose to pay a yearly fee and meet certain conditions can apply to be on the GCCF Breeder Scheme but relatively few breeders belong to this.

Anybody who belongs to a cat club can pay a fee to register a prefix to identify the kittens they breed. The only reference to 'active' in GCCF cats applies to cats registered as breeding cats. These are the only cats whose offspring can be registered with the GCCF. Any cat on the 'non-active' register is not for breeding and no progeny will be registered.


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Do keep us informed of the outcome of her tests. Have been thinking about her a lot today.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Well, after a traumatic and very worrying day, things have eventually turned out to be very good. After all her tests, scans etc we had a meeting with the vet to go over the results and there is nothing obviously wrong with Grace, she is a bit anaemic but that is all they can find. Her bloods have been sent away for a full check and I get final results next week. Phew panic over for time being! Vet says I may just have the smallest cat in the world... Just hope she puts some weight on soon, she may be thin but there is nothing too wrong.

BTW I eventually got a reply from her breeder yesterday who confirmed that both her parents were PKD free so that was something that made me feel a little bit better.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

QOTN said:


> For your peace of mind I think on Monday you should phone the vet practice that did the vaccinations. Yes your vet can do a blood test to test for panleukopenia antibodies. That could tell you she was not vaccinated (zero titre) or if she mounted an adequate immune response when she was vaccinated. If she was vaccinated very young there is also a chance it would not have taken because the mother's antibodies can interfere with the vaccine if they are still present when the kitten is vaccinated. The lab will say on the test result if they consider she is protected or requires another jab.


Turns out vaccination certificate is correct, DOB is correct, she is just very small for some reason...


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

just reading through this thread... how is Grace doing?

She looks absolutely gorgeous! Is she a blue cream tortie? (LOVE blue creams). Hope she continues to put on weight...


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

pennycat said:


> just reading through this thread... how is Grace doing?
> 
> She looks absolutely gorgeous! Is she a blue cream tortie? (LOVE blue creams). Hope she continues to put on weight...


Not sure if she is could be classed as a full tortie, the cream runs through her coat with more in certain areas. The weight doesn't look likely, she is really not interested much in food, I have to keep reminding her to eat. I am wasting loads because most foods she won't touch. At the moment the favourite is Applaws Kitten Tuna, I almost got her to eat a whole 70g tin the other day which is the most she has ever managed.


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

SueTh said:


> Not sure if she is could be classed as a full tortie, the cream runs through her coat with more in certain areas. The weight doesn't look likely, she is really not interested much in food, I have to keep reminding her to eat. I am wasting loads because most foods she won't touch. At the moment the favourite is Applaws Kitten Tuna, I almost got her to eat a whole 70g tin the other day which is the most she has ever managed.


The red gene which causes her 'tortieness' is inherited randomly in every cell of her body. Some girls will have loads of red cells, others hardly any at all, although the tortie will tend to show more as she gets older. A dilute tortie, in this case blue, will have two shades of cream dispersed throughout her coat.


----------



## Elaine b37 (May 25, 2014)

Sue, if she likes Applaws have you tried Canagan which is very similar? I have just tried some with Cody (also BSH!) and he loves it, I have also discovered two independent pet shops near me who stock it which meant I could try out a few flavours first, I see you are in Hexham, I am in the North East as well and if you are ever shopping in Newcastle, Robinsons in the Grainger Market are one of the places which have a good variety of flavours!


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Elaine b37 said:


> Sue, if she likes Applaws have you tried Canagan which is very similar? I have just tried some with Cody (also BSH!) and he loves it, I have also discovered two independent pet shops near me who stock it which meant I could try out a few flavours first, I see you are in Hexham, I am in the North East as well and if you are ever shopping in Newcastle, Robinsons in the Grainger Market are one of the places which have a good variety of flavours!


Alas, she is back to eating nothing again, I am really despairing, I don't think she will ever eat, just hope the vet finds out quickly what is wrong, it is awful being the mother of an anorexic


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Sue, when she is refusing food will she at least drink milk? Goats milk is usually better tolerated than cows milk.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

chillminx said:


> Sue, when she is refusing food will she at least drink milk? Goats milk is usually better tolerated than cows milk.


No she won't even have milk, have tried 2 sorts kitten milk and watered evaporated milk. I have ordered some nutribound liquid feed so hopefully I can get some of this into her, but I am really running out of options.


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

SueTH is she eating anything ? My tortie is a very picky eater, she will eat dry and Applaws tuna pouch and very occasionally she will have a day or two on raw pork. 

At one stage she was barely eating 10gms of dry a day. I know your kitten is much younger and worrying she isn't eating much. Hopefully she is eating and drinking something.


----------



## moggie14 (Sep 11, 2013)

Sorry I've not read the whole thread, but has a vitamin B injection been mentioned / given? x


----------



## Elaine b37 (May 25, 2014)

you could also try Liquivite http://www.liquivite.co.uk/ it is like a nutritious soup for kittens and cats


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Cookieandme said:


> SueTH is she eating anything ? My tortie is a very picky eater, she will ear dry and Applaws tuna pouch and very occasionally she will have a day or two on raw pork.
> 
> At one stage she was barely eating 10gms of dry a day. I know your kitten is much younger and worrying she isn't eating much. Hopefully she is eating and drinking something.


Thanks for that comment, it is good to know there are others in a similar situation that survive. I am getting so depressed by this situation, it is very hard when an animal seems hell bent on departing this world...


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Elaine b37 said:


> you could also try Liquivite http://www.liquivite.co.uk/ it is like a nutritious soup for kittens and cats


Thank you Elaine, I have sent for some, anything is worth a try at this stage...


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

I wonder if she has eaten so little for such an extended period of time that she no longer has hunger pangs. Does your vet know how worried you are? Perhaps you could ask the vet for an appetite stimulant if a vitamin B injection does not work. You might only have to use it for a few days to kickstart her into eating again. I think you said she ate when you first brought her home.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

QOTN said:


> I wonder if she has eaten so little for such an extended period of time that she no longer has hunger pangs. Does your vet know how worried you are? Perhaps you could ask the vet for an appetite stimulant if a vitamin B injection does not work. You might only have to use it for a few days to kickstart her into eating again. I think you said she ate when you first brought her home.


The vet is just holding off at the moment, hoping she will improve this week, I see them again on Friday for results of bloods so that we will know for definite what is what, at that point we will agree a course of action. Meanwhile I have ordered appetite stimulant and other stuff to encourage her to eat, got her to nibble a tiny bit this morning. Fingers crossed things get better, if things get any worse we will get an emergency appointment for either me or the kitten, not sure who in going to conk first! x


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

SueTh said:


> The vet is just holding off at the moment, hoping she will improve this week, I see them again on Friday for results of bloods so that we will know for definite what is what, at that point we will agree a course of action. Meanwhile I have ordered appetite stimulant and other stuff to encourage her to eat, got her to nibble a tiny bit this morning. Fingers crossed things get better, if things get any worse we will get an emergency appointment for either me or the kitten, not sure who in going to conk first! x


Fingers crossed for a big improvement.


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Sue, I really sympathise, it is so worrying when they won't eat. The one thing I've found that's always worked in the past is to sprinkle powdered cat nip on top of a bit of their wet food. Assuming your kitty is one who likes cat nip of course!  Not all do.


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

CM, this little girl will be way, way too young to react to Catnip I'm afraid. Normally they don't start reacting until about 6 months, but in my experience, BSH take much longer before they notice it.

I'm wondering about a portosystemic shunt? The timing's about right for symptoms to appear but other than inappetance, there's not much to go on, and I've never experienced it in any of my cats so can't really comment.

Sue, I find that none of mine will eat Liquivite. IF I have a poorly tiny or a momma cat or similar who won't eat, my tried and tested methods are these.

NutriDrops: Really good for getting into cats, particularly tiny kittens, who refuse to swallow. A few drops every few hours is what I use when they're not eating or only picking.
NutriPlus gel or NutriCal paste: I squirt a goodly amount of this into reluctant mouths 3-4 times daily. Many will come to look at it as a treat and will ask for it, but normaly it has to be administered if they don't fancy food. Like the NutriDrops, it has lots of calories and nutrients to keep them going.
A tin of Hills A/D diluted with a little water then warmed in the microwave: This glop normally sends them wild. It can give them the runs so I tend to only use it to get their tums kick started again. Normally the smell is enough to tempt them to eat on their own, but if not, I pack a syringe with it and then force feed. It's normally enough to get them started as they have food in their tummies.

Manuka honey: This is a bit of an alternative one. I can't claim that it starts them eating, but I use it to keep them hydrated in between force feedings. Many of them like it as it tastes nice and sweet, and, once mixed with boiled water that is allowed to go to warm, not cool, it syringes in really nicely. I normally put a nice big tablespoon in with a ramakin of warm water. Sorry, this one isn't scientific at all, but has kept kittens going for me before.

Goats milk: Again something you will need to force feed, but really excellent stuff.

If she's not eating at all, I wouldn't leavt it until Friday to get back to your vets. Mirtazepine or similar is a really excellent apetite stimulant, but I'd also ask for an antacid as often, the acid build up from not eating will make them feel ill, thus prompting them not to eat, and so the circle goes.


----------



## MissKittyKat (Jan 23, 2016)

carly87 said:


> I'm wondering about a portosystemic shunt? The timing's about right for symptoms to appear but other than inappetance, there's not much to go on, and I've never experienced it in any of my cats so can't really comment.


Is this the same as a liver shunt? I wondered if it might be this but as I only have my own experience and not a vet wasn't sure if to mention.

One of the kittens in Gizmos litter had 3! In fact it was this kitten I had chosen as he just seemed lovely and cuddly when I first visited at 8 wks and no different to the others, it was only when I was about to pick him up we found out he was ill. Originally thought to be IBD, this was at 12 wks and then liver shunts confirmed at about 15 weeks.

I saw him again at about 7months and he was tiny compared to my Gizmo and still not very well.

I'll never forget my breed saying how snugly he was and how he slept a lot with them close, unlike some of the other kittens.

Might be worth asking the vet about but will keep fingers crossed all ok.

X


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

carly87 said:


> CM, this little girl will be way, way too young to react to Catnip I'm afraid. Normally they don't start reacting until about 6 months, but in my experience, BSH take much longer before they notice it.
> 
> I'm wondering about a portosystemic shunt? The timing's about right for symptoms to appear but other than inappetance, there's not much to go on, and I've never experienced it in any of my cats so can't really comment.
> 
> ...


Definitely not liver shunt, she has had scans etc done last Friday, was at the vets for a day of tests, nothing detected other than slight anaemia...


----------



## MissKittyKat (Jan 23, 2016)

SueTh said:


> Definitely not liver shunt, she has had scans etc done last Friday, was at the vets for a day of tests, nothing detected other than slight anaemia...


Oh that's good x


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

carly87 said:


> CM, this little girl will be way, way too young to react to Catnip I'm afraid. Normally they don't start reacting until about 6 months, but in my experience, BSH take much longer before they notice it.
> 
> I'm wondering about a portosystemic shunt? The timing's about right for symptoms to appear but other than inappetance, there's not much to go on, and I've never experienced it in any of my cats so can't really comment.
> 
> ...


Carly, thanks you have given me lots to try, my only problem now is getting any of this stuff fast enough...


----------



## Elaine b37 (May 25, 2014)

have you tried good old plain poached chicken? with a little of the cooled water?


----------



## gskinner123 (Mar 10, 2010)

SueTh said:


> Definitely not liver shunt, she has had scans etc done last Friday, was at the vets for a day of tests, nothing detected other than slight anaemia...


This - the anaemia - is why I previously said that wall, etc, licking was a concern. I'm sorry, I cannot recall whether she is your first ever kitten or if you have owned cats from kittenhood previously.. but if the latter, would you say that other than the obvious inappetance, that she behaves like a normal kitten, ie a livewire in between sleep, active and energetic etc?


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

gskinner123 said:


> This - the anaemia - is why I previously said that wall, etc, licking was a concern. I'm sorry, I cannot recall whether she is your first ever kitten or if you have owned cats from kittenhood previously.. but if the latter, would you say that other than the obvious inappetance, that she behaves like a normal kitten, ie a livewire in between sleep, active and energetic etc?


I haven't had a kitten for a while but I always have cats, she is normally lively from 1st light although since spending a day at the vets on Friday and having had an anaesthetic has been more subdued than normal. So it is now hard to tell whether she is worse or it is effects of vet interventions. She is nibbling at food but really not eating much, I am trying very hard but finding the whole thing very worrying. Everyone is giving me advice but it is hard to pinpoint exactly what is going on, even the vet doesn't know yet, it is not obvious. BTW vet doesn't think licking wall is anything significant, he says she is feisty and has plenty of fight in her, so didn't seem too worried, unlike me...


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Elaine b37 said:


> have you tried good old plain poached chicken? with a little of the cooled water?


Yep, it was refused.


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Sue, you should be able to order most of this stuff online. The Nutridrops you can definitely get on next day delivery. Same with the pastes, or get your vet to order them. A/D you can pick up from any vet. Royal Canin do an alternative but I wouldn't bother with it. The Manuka honey you can get from the likes of Holland and Barret. I never go with one with a strength lower than 10. Expensive buy, but well worth it in my experience, and if you don't use it, it can go on toast! Or burns!


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

How's she doing?


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

just hanging in there... It is really sad, she's been back to vets, treated with antibiotics, vitamin B3 injection, now on iron, still not eating much other than a few licks. We are trying so very hard, but there must be something very wrong. Waiting for blood chemistry, things have been ruled out but no real diagnosis. We thought she was getting better because the antibiotics perked her up but the improvement is not really good enough.


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Have you ordered the stuff I mentioned lovely? This will really help her at least remain in good nutrition while you sort all of this out.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

carly87 said:


> Have you ordered the stuff I mentioned lovely? This will really help her at least remain in good nutrition while you sort all of this out.


Yes, I have loads ordered but the bxxxxxers haven't delivered it yet, I have paid for next day some was ordered at the weekend and it's not here yet. Have manuka and goats milk but that's all, she is wont come near me now and is very scared, I have been having to force to take iron drops and everything else, I honestly do not think we can keep her going, there is something serious going on...  I think she is on the way out, it's up to her now, we are just trying to keep her comfortable, food and drink are there if she wants it, didn't think I would be saying goodbye so soon...


----------



## moggie14 (Sep 11, 2013)

Would 24 hours on IV fluids at the vet help?


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

moggie14 said:


> Would 24 hours on IV fluids at the vet help?


May do but I really think this would just postpone the inevitable, she has just got out of her bed and lapped up some liquid off her cat food, so she is can still do it if she wants. She will see the vet again tomorrow if she lasts through the night. This may sound callous but we have done everything we can, like humans you get to the point where it is just palliative care and keeping her comfortable, she does not appear to be in any pain.


----------



## Paddypaws (May 4, 2010)

oh Sue, I am sending wishes and prayers.
I do agree that IV may be worth a go to at least support her. The vet nurses may even be able to syringe feed her a little.
xx


----------



## moggie14 (Sep 11, 2013)

SueTh said:


> May do but I really think this would just postpone the inevitable, she has just got out of her bed and lapped up some liquid off her cat food, so she is can still do it if she wants. She will see the vet again tomorrow if she lasts through the night. This may sound callous but we have done everything we can, like humans you get to the point where it is just palliative care and keeping her comfortable, she does not appear to be in any pain.


If fluids have not been tried yet I really do think it's worth a go.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

moggie14 said:


> If fluids have not been tried yet I really do think it's worth a go.


Thank you all for your thoughts, but what you have to consider is the wider picture of what is wrong. IV fluids may help but it will no solve the underlying problem. She was only 1.1kg when I got her at about 4+ months old so she was not thriving, she has only gained 200g over the time I have had her, she is not well, she is not eating for a reason. She is anaemic for no discernible reason, there has to be some underlying disease process, she has already been treated for an infection which is probably due to an immune deficiency. It is not the normal obvious suspects. To force feed her would be very cruel and I think would probably lead to heart failure.


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

oh no, that's so sad 

did the vet try an appetite stimulant?


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

pennycat said:


> oh no, that's so sad
> 
> did the vet try an appetite stimulant?


They could only offer a tablet which was far too big for her to swallow, I ordered drops some 7 days ago but has not arrived yet. She has had B3 injection. Don't think it would really help now, this is all too sad, I am heartbroken, I only just lost my furry boy before I got this kitten, no more pets for me now.


----------



## moggie14 (Sep 11, 2013)

Fluids can really help with appetite which is why I suggested it. I fully understand where you are coming from though.


----------



## Cazzer (Feb 1, 2010)

Will be thinking of you both.


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Sue, Mirtazepine can and should be cut into quarters which are really, really small so shouldn't be a problem to get down her. I do agree that there is probably an underlying issue, but would urge you not to give up until you have tried everything. 24 hours at the vets isn't necessarily a bad thing, even if it does end with a less than positive outcome. Where there is hope, things should be tried, and as she's still running around as normal up until a few days ago, I really think you shouldn't give up yet. Fluids, force feeding and apetite stimulants would be my next suggestion, and they don't cost a lot.


----------



## Cazzer (Feb 1, 2010)

Agree with Carly I take mirtazapine and the tablet I take is the 15mg which is the size cut into quarters for cats. It is small.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

carly87 said:


> Sue, Mirtazepine can and should be cut into quarters which are really, really small so shouldn't be a problem to get down her. I do agree that there is probably an underlying issue, but would urge you not to give up until you have tried everything. 24 hours at the vets isn't necessarily a bad thing, even if it does end with a less than positive outcome. Where there is hope, things should be tried, and as she's still running around as normal up until a few days ago, I really think you shouldn't give up yet. Fluids, force feeding and apetite stimulants would be my next suggestion, and they don't cost a lot.


Not worried about any cost. She is at vets tomorrow if she lasts the night. We are 60 miles from vet, very rural so hard just to decide at this moment in time we are going to vets again because the service is not available. It is the same for us humans living out in the wilds, OK for townies who have someone on doorstep, our services are at the best part time, no emergency cover really, we are on our own.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Cazzer said:


> Agree with Carly I take mirtazapine and the tablet I take is the 15mg which is the size cut into quarters for cats. It is small.


Ok look at the reply below, we are on our own here, out in the wilds with not many options, I have spent this week and more back and forwards from vet, it is not a case of appetite any more, this is a seriously ill kitten, there is something underlying the symptoms we are seeing. She has had loads of tests, but to get a secondary infection on top we really have to question what this disease process is. We are back at vets again tomorrow if she holds out.


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

Oh Sue this is so sad, I am really sorry to hear she is so poorly 

She is such a pretty little kitty.


----------



## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

I would try syringe feeding her, with A/D or any similar food that can be mixed down with liquid (warm oral rehydration fluid warm or kitten formula) so you can suck it up into a syringe. It would be a small amount - say 10ml - every 2 hours from when you get up to when you go to bed. However I agree her situation sounds grim. 

And if she needs fluids, subcutaneous is far easier on a small kitten than having someone try to put a needle in a tiny vein.


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Until you know what the underlying condition is don't give up hope. It might be treatable. Hugs and hoping she can make it through the night xx


----------



## ZoeM (Jul 16, 2015)

Oh no Sue.. you must be out of your mind.

I hope so much she makes it through the night, but whatever happens, you have done your best for this little sweetheart and shouldn't blame yourself. 

I would be getting that breeder closed down - it makes me so angry.that someone could put not just the animals through this but their awfully worried caring owners, there aren't enough words.

I know you have tried so much with her, but in regards to the tablets and medication, have you tried webbox chicken lik-e-lix? My cat can be picky at times but he loves this stuff - its like chicken flavoured yoghurt, you can crush and mix tablets with it as well as liquid pain killers. I'd be lost without it with my boy.

I am thinking of you and sending your little one so many healing thoughts.

Zoe xx


----------



## moggie14 (Sep 11, 2013)

I hope you get some positive news at the vets today x


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Well she made it through the night and has managed a few licks of cat food and about 7 Nutribooster kitten bites... Hopefully all the good stuff I ordered last weekend will arrive today. We are seeing vet later and may have an idea from the blood chemistry of exactly what is going on. She has surprised us with the fight she has, where there's life there's hope... Please send healing thoughts for her.


----------



## Matrod (Dec 22, 2014)

I've been following this thread from the start, sending heaps of healing vibes to your little girl. I really hope she can recover from whatever is causing this x


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Sue, sending many, many healing thoughts for your little one today. x


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Claws crossed all day for you


----------



## ZoeM (Jul 16, 2015)

Thinking of you both today xx

Snafu sends a little headbump.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

The latest on Grace - blood chemistry not showing anything very much so we have now been referred to the Vet College at Edinburgh for further investigation and probably tube feeding. We are taking her on Monday if she can last the weekend, if she starts going downhill our vet will get her admitted there as an emergency. She has had a steroid injection to keep her going, vet wouldn't give her the appetite stimulant because it is human dosage and hard to measure the exact dosage for her very small weight. Keep sending healing thought and keep everything crossed for her...


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

SueTh said:


> Not worried about any cost. She is at vets tomorrow if she lasts the night. We are 60 miles from vet, very rural so hard just to decide at this moment in time we are going to vets again because the service is not available. It is the same for us humans living out in the wilds, OK for townies who have someone on doorstep, our services are at the best part time, no emergency cover really, we are on our own.


It is hard to imagine anywhere in England that is 60 miles from a vet. How do you manage in real emergencies?


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

SueTh said:


> The latest on Grace - blood chemistry not showing anything very much so we have now been referred to the Vet College at Edinburgh for further investigation and probably tube feeding. We are taking her on Monday if she can last the weekend, if she starts going downhill our vet will get her admitted there as an emergency. She has had a steroid injection to keep her going, vet wouldn't give her the appetite stimulant because it is human dosage and hard to measure the exact dosage for her very small weight. Keep sending healing thought and keep everything crossed for her...


oh I so hope she makes it through the weekend..


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Latest on Grace, our vets managed to get her an emergency referral to the Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies Small Animal hospital at Edinburgh, we took her up there last night. She will be stabilised over the weekend and they will start their investigations on Monday to find out what is going on. Fingers crossed everyone xxx


----------



## Elaine b37 (May 25, 2014)

SueTh said:


> Latest on Grace, our vets managed to get her an emergency referral to the Royal (Dick) School of Veterinary Studies Small Animal hospital at Edinburgh, we took her up there last night. She will be stabilised over the weekend and they will start their investigations on Monday to find out what is going on. Fingers crossed everyone xxx


Goodness did you have to drive up overnight? Sue who is your vet? my work colleague lives in your part of the world and is very impressed with her vet's care of their dog, I was just thinking that once Grace has been diagnosed and treatment has started you will need to continue that at home


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Oh that's good news...keep us updated. All claws crossed for grace xx


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Elaine b37 said:


> Goodness did you have to drive up overnight? Sue who is your vet? my work colleague lives in your part of the world and is very impressed with her vet's care of their dog, I was just thinking that once Grace has been diagnosed and treatment has started you will need to continue that at home


Edinburgh is only 1.5 hours from where we live (Redesdale), to be honest we are with the best vet here, we have 3 times a week mobile vet to our area, plus I have heard they have purchased a building in a nearby small town so we should have a much better service soon hopefully. Out of interest which vet does your friend use?


----------



## Elaine b37 (May 25, 2014)

SueTh said:


> Edinburgh is only 1.5 hours from where we live (Redesdale), to be honest we are with the best vet here, we have 3 times a week mobile vet to our area, plus I have heard they have purchased a building in a nearby small town so we should have a much better service soon hopefully. Out of interest which vet does your friend use?


Ah if you are in Redesdale you are much further into Northumberland than I thought, I thought you were in Hexham, lady I work with lives in Hexham town centre, they had a very worrying time with their dog recently and she couldn't praise their vet enough, I can ask her on Monday the name but it is probably going to be too far away for you anyway, and if you are happy with your current vet I would stick with them, have you had to leave Grace in Edinburgh and come home?


----------



## MissKittyKat (Jan 23, 2016)

Sending all the best good luck vibes we can x


----------



## ZoeM (Jul 16, 2015)

Oh gosh, what good news. Your little furbaby in safe hands and all investigations commencing. Fingers crossed for the best outcome, which has to happen with all the PF vibes coming her way x


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Hope she did OK over the weekend x


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

pennycat said:


> Hope she did OK over the weekend x


Thanks for asking Pennycat, they have her stabilised, she has been on fluids, they have taken her off today and apparently she has been nibbling enough food to maintain her weight. She has had more blood tests this morning and we are waiting results later today hopefully. They are amazing at the Dick, I have had a phone call from them every day to keep me informed of what is going on, I can't praise them enough, our poor NHS can't do that...


----------



## Cazzer (Feb 1, 2010)

That is sounding more positive, hope you get some answers soon and she continues to improve


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Hi Sue, glad to hear she is stabilised, and eating a little. Hope you get some answers from the blood tests.


----------



## ZoeM (Jul 16, 2015)

Baby Steps I guess is the key here if she's not been eating for a little while - I bet the fluids have made her feel so much better though.

Fingers crossed they find out whats going on with her soon.

Thinking of you both. x


----------



## Zoe Norquoy (Apr 27, 2016)

Is she okay? Have read your thread and worried about her weight...

How is she doing?


Kind regards,
A Dog Day Afternoon


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Zoe Norquoy said:


> Is she okay? Have read your thread and worried about her weight...
> 
> How is she doing?
> 
> ...


Ok, hanging in there, just waiting for further test results


----------



## Zoe Norquoy (Apr 27, 2016)

All the best to you.


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Any news on the little blue cream? x


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

pennycat said:


> Any news on the little blue cream? x


Thanks for asking Pennycat, the hospital was scanning her today to take a closer look for themselves. Our vet said it wasn't liver shunt but the hospital says it may not be visible. They are also looking for signs of inflammation or thickening. I am just worried now that it may eventually turn out to be FIP. They are phoning me later with results and we may be able to bring her home soon, a frightening prospect, but it will be lovely to see her again.


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Claws crossed they find out what it is and it's treatable - keep us updated x


----------



## Forester (Dec 2, 2012)

I've only just seen this thread but wanted to send positive vibes Grace and ((( hugs ))) for you, Sue.


----------



## Charity (Apr 17, 2013)

Me too. Just read this from the beginning. I do hope they find out what the problem is and can treat it.


----------



## ZoeM (Jul 16, 2015)

All my fingers crossed for the little mite.

Z


----------



## Matrod (Dec 22, 2014)

Topping up the positive vibes for your little girl x


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Sending many good wishes Sue, and hoping and hoping it is not FIP but something treatable.


----------



## MissKittyKat (Jan 23, 2016)

We are all sending out good luck vibes X


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

I received a phone call from the hospital last night to update us after today's tests - 
The scan is negative again for liver shunt. It may be FIP but there is no evidence - lymph nodes normal, no signs of inflammation and no fluid build up anywhere however this does not completely rule it out. Other possibilities - digestive enzyme disorder, digestive intolerance, a rare genetic condition, a pituitary defect causing dwarfism (although I don't understand if it is this how she is ill with fever etc). Bloods are being to sent away to check for presence of corona virus antibodies a lack of these would completely rule out FIP but they could get a positive result for antibodies but it may still not be FIP because the virus is present in many cats but doesn't always go on to produce FIP.
So to summarise - we still don't know what is wrong and she is coming home on Thursday, I just hope we can manage to nurse her...


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Oh how frustrating you still don't know what's wrong 

At least she'll be home soon. Is she eating anything yet?


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

pennycat said:


> Oh how frustrating you still don't know what's wrong
> 
> At least she'll be home soon. Is she eating anything yet?


Well according to the hospital yes, but when I ask if she's really eating they say well she is licking the food and is now nibbling bits of kibble - so I would say no. She is maintaining her hydration and weight which I suppose is something. I may find out more today. It is all very puzzling indeed, and very frustrating that they are no further forward than we were a week ago, although we do know now that she does not have iron deficiency anaemia or a liver shunt or any of the other things my vet had previously ruled out. Only good thing is her breeder has now confirmed a few things and has promised to send me her pedigree papers because the hospital want to look at genetics.


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

I am sorry to hear there are no clear answers yet as to the cause of little one's problems, though it is good that certain conditions have been ruled out. It must be very difficult and exasperating for you. I really sympathise. I do hope kitty is going to eat once she comes home.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Just had another useful phone call from the hospital, they have now put her on a special sensitivity diet to see if that helps. One diagnosis is that she has GI problems perhaps caused because she was hand reared. Also the fact she was hand reared (the mother cat wouldn't accept the whole litter) means that she didn't receive colostrum so that has implications as well. Her bloods have been sent off now to check for missing digestive enzymes and we are still waiting to see if we can completely rule out possibility FIP with a negative corona virus antibody test (fingers crossed for that). Because she is so tiny there is not a camera small enough to look at her gut so the part of GI diagnosis will have to be try the diet for a few weeks and see if she improves... However if this is so, the rest of her litter mates are normal so why is only Grace affected?


----------



## gskinner123 (Mar 10, 2010)

SueTh said:


> Just had another useful phone call from the hospital, they have now put her on a special sensitivity diet to see if that helps. One diagnosis is that she has GI problems perhaps caused because she was hand reared. Also the fact she was hand reared (the mother cat wouldn't accept the whole litter) means that she didn't receive colostrum so that has implications as well. Her bloods have been sent off now to check for missing digestive enzymes and we are still waiting to see if we can completely rule out possibility FIP with a negative corona virus antibody test (fingers crossed for that). Because she is so tiny there is not a camera small enough to look at her gut so the part of GI diagnosis will have to be try the diet for a few weeks and see if she improves... However if this is so, the rest of her litter mates are normal so why is only Grace affected?


Has your vet mentioned an 'FIP profile'? Let's pray it is not FIP but there is always the chance, with a cat very sick with FIP, that the coronavirus test will show a negative (zero) result. I'm sure your vet has mentioned that there is no definitive test for FIP but the 'profile' is one of the best tools available for ruling it in/out.


----------



## Elaine b37 (May 25, 2014)

This might sound completely mad and hopefully has already been ruled out, but if the main problem seems to be that she isn't interested in food other than a few licks and a nibble of dry food, has an issue with her teeth been ruled out? is it possible her adult teeth are impacted or unable to get through? I cant see how putting her on a special sensitivity diet is going to help if she isn't eating, and if she isn't showing any signs of tummy upset, or have I missed something?


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

gskinner123 said:


> Has your vet mentioned an 'FIP profile'? Let's pray it is not FIP but there is always the chance, with a cat very sick with FIP, that the coronavirus test will show a negative (zero) result. I'm sure your vet has mentioned that there is no definitive test for FIP but the 'profile' is one of the best tools available for ruling it in/out.


She is in the Royal Dick in Edinburgh so I am sure they know what they are doing, they did say it is very difficult to diagnose and I will leave the interpretation of test results up to them, they have some very eminent practitioners up there... They have not seen any specific evidence of FIP yet although it is so tricky it cannot be completely ruled out.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Elaine b37 said:


> This might sound completely mad and hopefully has already been ruled out, but if the main problem seems to be that she isn't interested in food other than a few licks and a nibble of dry food, has an issue with her teeth been ruled out? is it possible her adult teeth are impacted or unable to get through? I cant see how putting her on a special sensitivity diet is going to help if she isn't eating, and if she isn't showing any signs of tummy upset, or have I missed something?


My own vet weeks ago said teething alone doesn't make an animal as sick as she was, I did ask...


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

SueTh said:


> Only good thing is her breeder has now confirmed a few things and has promised to send me *her pedigree papers because the hospital want to look at genetics*.


I am intrigued to know what relevant genetics would be apparent to any vet looking at a pedigree.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Just had the hospital on the phone and it is not very good. Grace is not eating again and they are intending to send her home with a feeding tube. She is on a few different medications which may work over night if she is not eating by tomorrow the tube goes in tomorrow morning and is to keep her going until a diagnosis is reached. I am now back at the point of thinking intervention is going too far, an animal who will not eat has something seriously wrong and we are delaying the inevitable by not letting nature take its course. I am very scared of bringing her home with a feeding tube, I really do not think I can honestly cope with this. Does anyone have any experience of nursing an animal at home with a feeding tube? What do you all think about this current situation, what would you do?


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Oh no! 

Sounds like a horrible situation. I've never fed a cat with a feeding tube but I would definitely try it, for a short while at least...there are lots of reasons why an animal won't eat...unfortunately the vets have not reached a diagnosis yet but I wouldn't give up hope quite yet. Hugs  xx


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Why would they send her home if she continued to be inapetant, and inappetance is the reason they admitted her in the first place?

Sasha?


----------



## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

QOTN said:


> I am intrigued to know what relevant genetics would be apparent to any vet looking at a pedigree.


I imagine they are looking for in-breeding, but a 4-generation pedigree is nowhere near enough for that.


----------



## Forester (Dec 2, 2012)

SueTh said:


> Just had the hospital on the phone and it is not very good. Grace is not eating again and they are intending to send her home with a feeding tube. She is on a few different medications which may work over night if she is not eating by tomorrow the tube goes in tomorrow morning and is to keep her going until a diagnosis is reached. I am now back at the point of thinking intervention is going too far, an animal who will not eat has something seriously wrong and we are delaying the inevitable by not letting nature take its course. I am very scared of bringing her home with a feeding tube, I really do not think I can honestly cope with this. Does anyone have any experience of nursing an animal at home with a feeding tube? What do you all think about this current situation, what would you do?


I believe that @Vienna1 had a cat who had a feeding tube inserted for a while. I know that she's had problems getting onto the forum recently but , if she's around, I have no doubt that she would give you advice.


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

OrientalSlave said:


> I imagine they are looking for in-breeding, but a 4-generation pedigree is nowhere near enough for that.


In any case inbreeding itself is not necessarily detrimental. It may not be desirable for all sorts of reasons but none of that would be clear on a pedigree without knowing the individual cats,


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

carly87 said:


> Why would they send her home if she continued to be inapetant, and inappetance is the reason they admitted her in the first place?
> 
> Sasha?


Several of us were wondering when you might comment.


----------



## ZoeM (Jul 16, 2015)

I regularly look after a little girl with a tube that goes into her stomach and feed her using this.

I would imagine the tube will remain in place and you will simply have to mash up food or use a food substitute. You pour it or suck it up into a syringe and then just slowly push the syringe plunger, doing it over about 20 minutes little by little into the tube. It shouldnt be too difficult as long as he's restrained and comfortable and I'm sure the vets will show you what to do.

I'm so sorry he's going through this, it is so so sad, and I think all our thoughts are with you... You will know yourself when to say no more, but I would certainly give the tube feeding a go as you're already committed to all the tests and you do want to give him the very best change.

All the best,

Z


----------



## gskinner123 (Mar 10, 2010)

SueTh said:


> She is in the Royal Dick in Edinburgh so I am sure they know what they are doing, they did say it is very difficult to diagnose and I will leave the interpretation of test results up to them, they have some very eminent practitioners up there... They have not seen any specific evidence of FIP yet although it is so tricky it cannot be completely ruled out.


Yes, of course, I'm sure she is receiving the very best of care and that they will be interpreting results as a 'whole picture'. I simply wanted to point out that a zero titre in a very sick cat does not, sadly, rule out an FIP diagnosis. I'm sure they have told you this and I appreciate you cannot repeat word for word here everything they've said.


----------



## Elaine b37 (May 25, 2014)

SueTh said:


> Just had the hospital on the phone and it is not very good. Grace is not eating again and they are intending to send her home with a feeding tube. She is on a few different medications which may work over night if she is not eating by tomorrow the tube goes in tomorrow morning and is to keep her going until a diagnosis is reached. I am now back at the point of thinking intervention is going too far, an animal who will not eat has something seriously wrong and we are delaying the inevitable by not letting nature take its course. I am very scared of bringing her home with a feeding tube, I really do not think I can honestly cope with this. Does anyone have any experience of nursing an animal at home with a feeding tube? What do you all think about this current situation, what would you do?


 What are the different medications Sue? other than a reluctance to eat has she any other symptoms?


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Elaine b37 said:


> What are the different medications Sue? other than a reluctance to eat has she any other symptoms?


They are giving her something against parasites just in case, she is now on folic acid just in case and something else which was for GI just in case, sorry but when I am given chemical names over the phone I cannot remember them. No real obvious symptoms, weakness, lethargy not eating and she had high temperature when with us which was not controlled by antibiotics, very low weight.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

OrientalSlave said:


> I imagine they are looking for in-breeding, but a 4-generation pedigree is nowhere near enough for that.


They did ask me for names of father and mother which I couldn't tell them, this will be on a pedigree certificate although why I don't know.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Latest bulletin is that she is now coming home without a feeding tube. Apparently she is now eating again, I suppose I will just have to wait and see myself what is going on, so many mixed messages, I am not convinced. I just hope someone has not made the decision to just send her home and see what happens assuming she will be better at home. This would always be true for an older established cat, but Grace is a kitten, she has not been with us for long enough to have built up the trusting relationship you normally have with your cat. Fingers crossed it goes ok.


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Hope so...did all the stuff you ordered arrive?


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

pennycat said:


> Hope so...did all the stuff you ordered arrive?


Yes, but she is now on special diet and anti-nausea meds so will have to stick to that.


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Keeping everything crossed Sue that she will continue eating once she gets home.


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

SueTh said:


> *They did ask me for names of father and mother* which I couldn't tell them, this will be on a pedigree certificate although why I don't know.


If the vets at Edinburgh are clairvoyant, I am surprised they even need to know the names of sire and dam.


----------



## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

QOTN said:


> I am intrigued to know what relevant genetics would be apparent to any vet looking at a pedigree.


Me too. I also know the pedigree names of all my cats' parents without looking at their papers.


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

QOTN said:


> If the vets at Edinburgh are clairvoyant, I am surprised they even need to know the names of sire and dam.


In what way is that a helpful comment?


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Ok, I am not posting any more, it really isn't helpful to post sarcastic comments between yourselves, I feel that I am now being mocked for my lack of knowledge, which is not kind or helpful. To others, thanks so much for your support and help.. Bye


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

What a shame  I can't really believe some of the snide comments myself.


----------



## gskinner123 (Mar 10, 2010)

I don't believe they ARE snide commens. It is very frustrating, especially in a desperately worrying situation such as this, when the the cat's owner chooses to either ignore or become defensive over very pertinent questions/input which could potentially be of great help. If one feels that others' questions are of no relevance and possible benefit and that their vet has everything perfectly in hand... then why post on a forum at all?


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

What pertinent questions were being ignored though?


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Why the kitten was being sent home last night despite the fact htat she still wasn't eating, this being the sole reason she was admitted to a specialist centre in the first place, and they still didn't know what was wrong. Why the owner didn't have the names of sire and dam if this is all the vet wanted, as surely this would have been on registration paperwork at the time of sale. Why the vet wanted a pedigree to establish whether there were any genetic components at work here, as, unless the vet breeds BSH, they would not know the genetic propensities of certain lines. None of this is published online, or at least, very little, with most of the information being confined to kidney and heart scans, and not every breeder even publishes those!

I think the comments were frustrated, not sarcastic, but would dearly love the above to be answered. Quite apart from anything else, if specialist centres have got to the point where their involvement with pedigrees to inform their diagnosis is standard, then whether the answer is helpful to the OP or not, it would be helpful to everyone else who has a pedigree cat, as they would know to pack the pedigree along with kitty's favourite blanket and food!


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Now I don't know anything about pedigree cats as I've only ever owned moggies, but the OP had already stated she didn't get any paperwork with the kitten when she bought her (sadly it sounded like the kitty was from a BYB) so how could she have known the parents' names? (Or am I being thick - as I said I don't really know how it works with pedigree cats).

She also said she wasn't sure why the vet wanted that info.

Agree I was wondering why the kitten was being released so soon, but other than that everything asked appeared to be answered or the OP said she didn't know the answer. The comments about clairvoyant vets sounded a bit mean to me given to circumstances. If I was in the OP's position I'd have thought I was being mocked too.


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Not thick at all, but if it was a BYB, then they wouldn't have agreed to send paperwork across just because Kitty was sick, so something here just doesn't make sense... Or perhaps it's me who's the thick one! Normally, if it's a true BYB, once they have their money, they cut off all communication with the new owner, and if a kitten turns out to be sick, they work doubly hard to cover their tracks! If it was a genuine breeder who, for some strange reason, hadn't got round to sending the paperwork yet, then the OP would have been told the sire and dam at least, or could have given the vets the number of the breeder to ask immediately, as the situation was obviously quite urgent. Again, the vets are now sending the cat home despite still not knowing what was wrong, and not having the genetic paperwork they asked for to look at the genetic link portion of the diagnosis, so again, there's another bit that I don't understand.


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

SueTh said:


> Ok, I am not posting any more, it really isn't helpful to post sarcastic comments between yourselves, I feel that I am now being mocked for my lack of knowledge, which is not kind or helpful. To others, thanks so much for your support and help.. Bye


SueTH I do hope you come back and let us know how she gets on, but if you feel you would rather not post, I would like to wish you and the little one the best of luck.


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

carly87 said:


> Not thick at all, but if it was a BYB, then they wouldn't have agreed to send paperwork across just because Kitty was sick, so something here just doesn't make sense... Or perhaps it's me who's the thick one! Normally, if it's a true BYB, once they have their money, they cut off all communication with the new owner, and if a kitten turns out to be sick, they work doubly hard to cover their tracks! If it was a genuine breeder who, for some strange reason, hadn't got round to sending the paperwork yet, then the OP would have been told the sire and dam at least, or could have given the vets the number of the breeder to ask immediately, as the situation was obviously quite urgent. Again, the vets are now sending the cat home despite still not knowing what was wrong, and not having the genetic paperwork they asked for to look at the genetic link portion of the diagnosis, so again, there's another bit that I don't understand.


The OP said this with regard to buying the cat: "I expected her to be an unregistered kitten from registered parents although the breeder said she would forward paperwork but nothing arrived". Not really sure if that answers anything, but I had assumed that the OP just couldn't answer all the questions. It does all seem rather confusing, but I didn't get the impression the OP was deliberately trying to avoid answering questions, or was "Sasha" as I saw someone say, given the amount of photos of the same kitty posted, the style of the posts etc. I would love it if I was wrong...hate the thought of a kitten starving to death


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

pennycat said:


> *The comments about clairvoyant vets sounded a bit mean* to me given to circumstances.


I am afraid I can sometimes be a bit 'mean' when my intelligence is insulted to this extent. The 'pedigree' posts are just ridiculous. I was simply incredulous that Edinburgh Referral Vets would contemplate a diagnosis on a sick kitten actually in their care by looking at a pedigree. Would they have been unable to treat a DSH in a similar condition because they did not know its sire or dam?

Scientists deal in hard facts. A pedigree is simply a document which may or may not be accurate regardless of the fact it contains virtually no definite genetic information.


----------



## gskinner123 (Mar 10, 2010)

For the reasons that QOTN has pointed out, the pedigree is completely irrelevant. However, even if a pedigree had some relevance to diagnosis it would still be of no help whatsoever as the kitten is unregistered; obviously the only way of verifying the correctness of a pedigree is via registration. Anyone can create a 'made up' pedigree and a certain element frequently do.


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

So - you think the OP is lying? Why would she lie?
I thought somebody here said the vets might have been looking for evidence of inbreeding? As I said, don't know exactly what info goes on a pedigree certificate but would that be a possibility? 


QOTN said:


> Would they have been unable to treat a DSH in a similar condition because they did not know its sire or dam?


I'm also not sure where you've got that from, presumably the vets are trying to clutch at any straw they can..?


----------



## Rainfall (Nov 4, 2015)

.


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

pennycat said:


> So - you think the OP is lying? Why would she lie?
> I thought somebody here said the vets might have been looking for evidence of inbreeding? As I said, don't know exactly what info goes on a pedigree certificate but would that be a possibility?
> 
> I'm also not sure where you've got that from, presumably the vets are trying to clutch at any straw they can..?


As I said before, inbreeding is not of itself, necessarily detrimental. A pedigree is simply a list of a cat's ancestors usually 4 or 5 generations, although pedigree obsessives like me can trace my cats back probably over 20 generations. Sometimes a pedigree will have the breed numbers of all or some of the cats and an official GCCF pedigree must contain all the registration numbers of the first three generations. Of course, all these things can be faked so cannot be relied upon without verification. Unless you know the intimate history of all or some of the cats, it is impossible to tell anything further and even them much would have to be surmised only.

I would be very dissatisfied with any referral vet clutching at such straws! I would consider my shedloads of cash ill spent.


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

If the OP really is a reincarnation of "Sasha" she has gone to new levels of risk taking as she posted a photo of herself with her kitten recently on this thread: 

http://www.petforums.co.uk/threads/what-do-you-look-like.426709/page-5#post-1064537540


----------



## Rainfall (Nov 4, 2015)

.


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

chillminx said:


> If the OP really is a reincarnation of "Sasha" she has gone to new levels of risk taking as she posted a photo of herself with her kitten recently on this thread:
> http://www.petforums.co.uk/threads/what-do-you-look-like.426709/page-5#post-1064537540


Carly's reference to Sasha was not a suggestion that the OP was a reincarnation. I am not internet literate but I have read (on the BBC website, no less,) that pics are frequently stolen and reproduced elsewhere. I am not suggesting this has happened here but I suppose it is possible.


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Rainfall said:


> I'm not saying it's actually Sasha (but who knows). I just have the same alarm bells ringing here as before.It
> 
> Obviously I can be totally wrong but at least I put it out there.


I understand. I agree the scenario sounds rather strange, but I had not put the oddness of the situation down to deliberate obfuscation on the part of the OP. However now she has disappeared so quickly I am not sure what to think tbh.  .


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

QOTN said:


> Carly's reference to Sasha was not a suggestion that the OP was a reincarnation. I am not internet literate but I have read (on the BBC website, no less,) that pics are frequently stolen and reproduced elsewhere. I am not suggesting this has happened here but I suppose it is possible.


Yes, it is possible and I suppose if one of us on the form was highly savvy with the ins and outs of such things we would know how to trace the original source of the photo on line (if it is not a genuine one of the OP and her cat I mean).


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

chillminx said:


> If the OP really is a reincarnation of "Sasha" she has gone to new levels of risk taking as she posted a photo of herself with her kitten recently on this thread:
> 
> http://www.petforums.co.uk/threads/what-do-you-look-like.426709/page-5#post-1064537540


that's why i think it's genuine, and I also didn't detect any deliberate question-avoidance from the OP, more genuine confusion. Of course, I might be wrong, but would rather give someone the benefit of the doubt...:S


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

QOTN said:


> Carly's reference to Sasha was not a suggestion that the OP was a reincarnation. I am not internet literate but I have read (on the BBC website, no less,) that pics are frequently stolen and reproduced elsewhere. I am not suggesting this has happened here but I suppose it is possible.


I'm sure it's possible but all the pics posted look exactly like the same cat - same markings etc.. Maybe I'm a gullible idiot but I feel it's genuine.


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

@pennycat, I don't think you're a gullible idiot, you just want to give this OP the benefit of the doubt  I felt the same, but then 3 experienced breeders, all of them well-respected forum members, whose opinions I value, all felt that something in the info given didn't stack up. So I have to say in the light of that it does give me pause for thought......


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

yeah, i know. i think i might have to ask my vet friend what she thinks! if it's genuine I hope the kitten is ok...


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

I was questioning all this as early as post 20 but if you compare post 76 with post 80, this really started to ring warning bells. On May 5th the same day as post 80 the talk is of 'palliative care.' From then onwards it was all pretty unbelievable to me but I carried on reading! @pennycat please do ask your vet friend what they think of the care and treatments supposedly given Grace when she was referred and ask her if she would recommend Edinburgh as a referral centre on the strength of this.


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

In her defense I must say she sounded perfectly genuine when she first posted in February about the loss of her exotic cat. But in this thread something seemed to go awry part way through.  As QOTN says.


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

chillminx said:


> In her defense I must say she sounded perfectly genuine when she first posted in February about the loss of her exotic cat.


If she is genuine I feel very sorry for her because she must wish she had stuck to her original plan of rescuing an Exotic or Persian instead of buying Grace only three days later. (I call that very hasty to say the least.)


----------



## Rainfall (Nov 4, 2015)

.


----------



## LizzieandLoca (Jun 30, 2014)

Alarm bells are ringing for me (no surprise!)... 

Although the writing style does seem different this time, the turn of events/ overall pattern is very similar! 

The kitten's date of birth changes at one point too...


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

I thought this was genuine from the beginning until just recently, when the stuff ordered dint' arrive and OP was not traipsing around all ove the joint looking for stuff. However, I like others wasn't sure enough, and still am not to be honest, hence the veiled reference to "Sasha" just to see what others thought, and to help those more sensitive souls among us realise that all may not be as it seems and to stop fretting over the cat. I continued to give what I believed to be good advice just in case I was wrong, and would love to be proved so, as I wonder if I'm now seeing things around every corner which don't exist! However, the acceptance that the cat is going to pass no matter what is done and the reference to "nature taking its coarse" or whatever it was, just rang very true to other threads. The pedigree was a step too far for me. If it's genuine, then the treating vet needs a swift kick up the bum for requesting this and believing it is relevant in any way! As someone else said, this shouldn't inform treatment at all, both for the reasons I've already listed, and the fact that they shouldn't rely on this as what if the cat was a mog? If the cat is unregistered, then there is no official pedigree in any case, so a vet who knows enough about cats to ask for a pedigree would surely realise that and see the pedigree as invalid in any case. In-breeding is irrelevant in this case. All it tells you is that the cat *might* not definitely will, be susceptible to certain genetic conditions. What those conditions are is anyone's guess, as without intimate knowledge of the previous generations, and I do mean intimate, i.e, they're your cats or you treated every single one of them as a vet, then the information is completely useless.


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

[QUOTE="Rainfall, post: 1064541162, member: 1431489".Not saying it is in this case - but for situations like this it could be part genuine. Like the person is real but the truth is twisted. You hear about people faking illness and all sorts for sympathy. Some people just love misery..[/QUOTE]

As in Munchausen's Syndrome and Munchausen's Syndrome-by-proxy.


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

Blimey I am normally the cynical one, was I seduced by a BSH kitten


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

Cookieandme said:


> Blimey I am normally the cynical one, was I seduced by a BSH kitten


The trouble with these threads is there is no way of finding out for sure. I felt I had to say something because It seems cruel that so many people get involved and upset when it could all be fiction.


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

I must admit to thinking living 60 miles from a vet a little odd.


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Cookieandme said:


> I must admit to thinking living 60 miles from a vet a little odd.


But when someone queried such a big distance didn't she say there was a new vet opening in the nearest town shortly? (Or I am I confusing this thread with a different one?) I do recall thinking momentarily that her comment jarred a bit.


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

chillminx said:


> But when someone queried such a big distance didn't she say there was a new vet opening in the nearest town shortly? (Or I am I confusing this thread with a different one?) I do recall thinking momentarily that her comment jarred a bit.


I had no response to my disbelief on the 60 mile distance. Later the mobile vet etc appeared after the OP changed her location to Redesdale. I know I am a sad person but I can only walk about for a short time, so, in one of my frequent rests, a quick google satisfied several of us that Hexham has three vets, one runs a mobile clinic and has 24 hour emergency cover. There is also a veterinary hospital in the vicinity and Hexham is still not 60 miles from Redesdale.


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Redesdale is about 50km from hexham, but I am prone to exaggerating too sometimes.

Oh well, I guess we will never know, hmm.


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

pennycat said:


> Redesdale is about *50km from hexham, but I am prone to* *exaggerating too sometimes*.Oh well, I guess we will never know, hmm.


Is 50km 27miles? If so, you are not exaggerating. (I am hopeless with kms.)


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

Yes, think it's about that.


----------



## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Yeah, 50 km = about 31 miles.  

No wonder you found holes in the story QOTN, with those kind of glaring inaccuracies in the thread. And ones that could be checked so easily too.


----------



## Elaine b37 (May 25, 2014)

Well this is my part of the world so the suggestion that Hexham was so remote was a bit surprising! Redesdale is more towards the border with Scotland but still in Northumberland and only an hour by car to Newcastle upon Tyne.

The photos don't really add much, I have photos of a young friend and her kitten which I could post here on various threads passing them off as my own, anyone who knew me in real life would be astounded as my friend is in her twenties and I left my twenties behind many years ago! but posters here would be none the wiser.

The symptoms I thought were vague, a poor appetite is something many of you here have struggled with with your cats and kittens, serious and worrying I know but if the kitten is eating _something _and not showing any other symptoms, would this warrant a six day stay at a veterinary hospital so far from home? only to be sent home in exactly the same position with medication for parasites which may or may not exist and a supply of folic acid?? (incidentally I read a few months back that folic acid is a useful supplement to take to relieve symptoms of the menopause, my Dr looked amused when I told her but said it would do no harm - I tried it for about three months - not the slightest bit of difference! - sorry - about as far off topic as you can get :Shy)

I want to believe that Grace (and Sue) exist, and there is a different writing style to sasha the wonder cat and the cat about to be arrested but the common denominator is the expression of doom - letting 'nature take it's course', pining to death over not yet dead dad, resigned to kitty being arrested by the cops and returned to the neighbours from hell - and that online signature oh my!

Sue if you are still reading this - and I know I would be, genuine or not - could you ask the vets at Edinburgh to e mail you the print out of the results and medication they have compiled so far and post it here? it might allay our fears about your not being real, but more importantly there are a lot of very knowledgeable people here who might be able to help interpret the medical terminology and help you decipher what is going on with Grace and where to go from here?


----------



## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Hexham to Jedburgh is 49 miles and the route goes past the redesdale arms pub.


----------



## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

OrientalSlave said:


> Hexham to Jedburgh is 49 miles and the route goes past the redesdale arms pub.


The AA told me 27 miles or I would not have had a clue.


----------



## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Think 27 to redesdale. Have driven the a68 many times


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

I was just wanting to check some of the more useful advice given to me on here and copy it for reference. I cannot believe all of these postings. Some of you really need to get out more! This is all genuine, any conflicting stuff is because I am getting mixed messages from vets and probably over reacting at the time it is given due to anxiety. Rest assured Grace is absolutely safe. I now have her back home and without a feeding tube. She is eating small amounts, vets had calculated that just before she left hospital although she is only managing small amount it is about 200% of her needs for the body weight she has. We are awaiting exact diagnosis which we will have shortly. If I have any worries I can take her back anytime or phone for advice, these vets are lovely and very helpful. It is just a case that my little kitty is presenting with something quite puzzling. From my understanding of what I have been told It looks like it is most likely going to be a GI disorder with perhaps an immune difficiency . Cannot believe some of you being so nosey that you have even tried to trace me, thank god I didn't log in with Facebook, although I have nothing to hide. Some of you have very over active imaginations and it is a good laugh seeing you try to analyse my motivations, get a life... 2015 with a question mark btw is because she is still living nothing more lol. Would you like my full address - it is a 60 mile round trip to the vets.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

OrientalSlave said:


> Think 27 to redesdale. Have driven the a68 many times


Please feel free to pop in and visit me on you way past...


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Elaine b37 said:


> Well this is my part of the world so the suggestion that Hexham was so remote was a bit surprising! Redesdale is more towards the border with Scotland but still in Northumberland and only an hour by car to Newcastle upon Tyne.
> 
> The photos don't really add much, I have photos of a young friend and her kitten which I could post here on various threads passing them off as my own, anyone who knew me in real life would be astounded as my friend is in her twenties and I left my twenties behind many years ago! but posters here would be none the wiser.
> 
> ...


Elaine, they are e-mailing me full summary of everything today but post it here, you must be joking, knowledgeable people don't go round jumping to wild conclusions, God knows what diagnosis would be made, all I can say there are some very sick people about


----------



## Jansheff (Jan 31, 2011)

SueTh said:


> , all I can say there are some very sick people about


Hi Sue, I haven't posted before, but I have been following your posts. You're right, there are some very sick people about and what you probably don't realise, as you haven't been around very long, that unfortunately there has been a run of them posting on here recently.

Kind heartened members have sympathised, offered advice and help, only to end up feeling totally gullible and stupid when they realise the entire story has been a fabrication and they have been taken in.

It's made longer standing members very wary and suspicious. And, although it's probably wrong, it's understandably made people err on the side of caution and approach new posts from the viewpoint that they might not be genuine until proved otherwise. I admit, I do the same, it's only natural when you have already been made a sucker and have fallen for it before.

These posts have usually taken on a similar pattern, cat off colour, cat gets sicker, gets a bit better, goes downhill again, owner starts predicting the worst and asking if they should put to sleep .... all to be met of course by loads of sympathy and offers of advice and help. Because people on here are generally a very sympathetic, caring, knowledgeable and supportive bunch. It's a great forum. But unfortunately those qualities mean they can be taken in by people seeking to amuse themselves by investing hours and hours into making up a sob story. What might seem like "wild conclusions" to you are actually people trying to weigh up if it's happened yet again.

That's really unfortunate and sad for the genuine people who come along, especially if those people are really in need of support. But unfortunately it's a sad sign of the times. People will only be taken in so many times before it has an effect like we have seen here.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

ok so here is Grace today, I am so very happy to have her back home, she is missing a bit of fur here and there but all in all looking very well.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

Jansheff said:


> Hi Sue, I haven't posted before, but I have been following your posts. You're right, there are some very sick people about and what you probably don't realise, as you haven't been around very long, that unfortunately there has been a run of them posting on here recently.
> 
> Kind heartened members have sympathised, offered advice and help, only to end up feeling totally gullible and stupid when they realise the entire story has been a fabrication and they have been taken in.
> 
> ...


Thanks Jan, that explains it, however surely better for them to have that conversation off thread personally rather than posting publicly, I would have thought a Moderator should step in and block libellous postings, or am I being too harsh?


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Sue, genuine question here, but could you ask the vet what they were hoping to find from the pedigree? As per the reasons I posted above, I really wonder what they were hoping to achieve by asking you for this, and would dearly love to know. If we, as breeders, are unaware of a trick that could potentially help our own cats or the kittens that leave us for new homes, then that is knowledge well shared.


----------



## SueTh (Feb 14, 2016)

carly87 said:


> Sue, genuine question here, but could you ask the vet what they were hoping to find from the pedigree? As per the reasons I posted above, I really wonder what they were hoping to achieve by asking you for this, and would dearly love to know. If we, as breeders, are unaware of a trick that could potentially help our own cats or the kittens that leave us for new homes, then that is knowledge well shared.


Carly, it wasn't the pedigree they were asking for, one of them asked if I knew the names of her parents. I have been trying to get paperwork from Graces breeder and it just hasn't materialised, which is why I was peed off with the breeder, and that probably comes across, especially when I was accused on this forum of using a BYB which I still don't think she is. I am not bothered by pedigree or not. When I then contacted the breeder again and explained the situation she apologised and said would send pedigree. Sorry if my posting was confusing in any way, I am very confused by the whole thing, and this particular issue seems to have sparked off a lot of response that I have found quite offensive. I will ask the lovely vet who was looking after Grace why she asked that question if I get the opportunity, but to be honest it is really not my priority.


----------



## ZoeM (Jul 16, 2015)

Hi Sue, 

Glad she's perking up a bit 

Z


----------



## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

I do appreciate it's not your priority, but if you speak to her, it would be very good to know, as I really can't fathem out why they would even think to ask for this info as it will tell them nothing.

Hope everything's well and she continues to eat.


----------



## pennycat (Jan 5, 2016)

I personally didn't see a problem with the signature. Don't think it means death and doom, just that Grace is Sue's current cat no?

I know there have been some weirdo trolls on this forum lately and i understand concerns that people have raised, and that stuff posted has been confusing. but also (understandably) I think there's also been a case of looking for things that aren't there, perhaps?

Sue, glad she is doing OK at the minute.


----------



## Cazzer (Feb 1, 2010)

How is Grace doing?


----------

