# New Rattie boys



## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

I was gonna start this thread later with a bombardment of pics, but thought I'd hey This bit out of the way now 
Later today after I'm finished work I'm king to get Gideon his new brothers... The issue being i'll be getting them for [email protected] There is only one registered breeder in Ireland and whilst I am in her waiting list, Gid has been alone since the start if December and I cannot watch him be lonely any longer. I'm going to search all the adoption centres within driving distance and if there are no boys then I'll be buying two babies for him; the store I'm going to get them from is second to none in terms of their animals welfare and quarantine regulations, so I can start intros ASAP with the boys!

So yea, watch this space!!


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

Sooo, I've done it! I can't say I liked it, but I bought two boys from [email protected] On our journey home I was crapping myself about trying to tame them as they were soo skittish in the shop (and I had to teach a manager how to sex them  ) but once they got home, calmed in their box for 15 mins and checked out the other animal sights sounds and smells... Well, see for yourself! 
























Within One hour of being bought that's how they felt about me and their new home :blush: :001_wub:

Please excuse the quality of pics and mess of my hair!  oh, and that stupid childish grin that I can't get off my face! It's been Soo long since I've had babies- I forgot how small they are!
(All my rats in the past 6 years have been fully grown rescues!)


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## rainstars (May 3, 2012)

They're so adorable!  Congratz.


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## halfeatenapple (Jan 2, 2013)

Cuties... we are three weeks down the line and only just getting to that stage so i envy you.


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## niki87 (Nov 18, 2009)

Awww they are cute!! Hope Gideon vets on with his new company xx


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## LittlePaws AnimalRescue (Sep 11, 2012)

They are so cute, and so small!
I hope Gideon and these 2 all get along.


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

Gorgeous babies.
Has gid smelt them yet? I mean with his nose in the air sensing new ratty smells.


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

blade100 said:


> Gorgeous babies.
> Has gid smelt them yet? I mean with his nose in the air sensing new ratty smells.


Oh yes- he even had a go at bar chewing!  he's Ben say in his hammock with his head on the side all morning listening to them potter about! Something tells me this is going to go smoothly... :blush:


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## Guest (Mar 2, 2013)

Very cute, I love babies, my three younger girls still ping around the cage hehe


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

When are you introing them?


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

blade100 said:


> When are you introing them?


30 mins ago! 
My Gideons' a total sweetheart!









































I dont think anything will phase these boys! I'm starting to worry about the bar spacing on the cage though- may need to mesh it  it's 2cm(ish)


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## Wobbles (Jun 2, 2011)

They're very cute:001_wub: Love the little black/grey and white one, he looks like a little Badger


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## thedogsmother (Aug 28, 2008)

I just adore the smile on Gideons face hes so happy with his new family isnt he, I know its not ideal to get them from [email protected] but in your circumstances I would definately have done the same .


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

Agree with tdm 

And your Gideon is a beauty.

You've def done the right thing for him.


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

Thanks for saying! I did feel horrible condoning their breeding practices, but it's So worth me feeling like sh!t about that; he's just So happy. He hasn't been as interested in his surroundings in months; he's gonna be a great big brover



Wobbles said:


> They're very cute:001_wub: Love the little black/grey and white one, he looks like a little Badger


Apparently that's what Reid looked like as a baby... I'm hoping he keeps his colour though! 
That little boy is now named Prentis, and the solid black is Rossi
:001_wub:


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

kodakkuki said:


> Thanks for saying! I did feel horrible condoning their breeding practices, but hideous worth me feeling like sh!t about that; he's just So happy. He hasn't been as interested in his surroundings in months; he's gonna be a great big brover
> 
> Apparently that's what Reid looked like as a baby... I'm hoping he keeps his colour though!
> That little boy is now named Prentis, and the solid black is Rossi
> :001_wub:


Unfortunately prentis will fade as he's a roan he may loose all his colour like my wally has and he was black as your hat when a baby he's now white!


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## jaderosehere (Feb 9, 2013)

Aww so happy for you  it must be very rewarding seeing him happy  hope all goes well for your new little group


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## Wobbles (Jun 2, 2011)

blade100 said:


> Unfortunately prentis will fade as he's a roan he may loose all his colour like my wally has and he was black as your hat when a baby he's now white!


That's a shame as he's really pretty. Is it possible to buy ones like that that won't fade?


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

Yes there called badger Badger « Hawthorn Rat Varieties


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## Laura123 (Aug 6, 2012)

Your boys are lovely and I'm glad the intros are going well. Better with 3 happy rats than 1 sad rat and following ethics all the time I would have done the same in your situation.


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

Well the boys spent the night in gideons house last night- I just rechecked an they are curled up in the den together! Gid and prentis had a fair few wee play last night and I was nearly in tears at how happy he was (cuz I'm That type of person  ) I'm just about to add a hammock n all! And poor wee Rossi is just cuddling up to whoever is there if I try to fuss- he's still quite handshy...

Would they be able to eat some seafood sticks? I asked mum to get me a wee packet but she got a 24 pack! No way me b the dogs can make our way through that!


I think I know what prentis' markings will be then I'd he's gonna fade- he has a dark cap and lone down his back, so I'd assume they'll stay?


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## niki87 (Nov 18, 2009)

Aww glad there is a happy ending  !!!!


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## Guest (Mar 3, 2013)

kodakkuki said:


> Well the boys spent the night in gideons house last night- I just rechecked an they are curled up in the den together! Gid and prentis had a fair few wee play last night and I was nearly in tears at how happy he was (cuz I'm That type of person  ) I'm just about to add a hammock n all! And poor wee Rossi is just cuddling up to whoever is there if I try to fuss- he's still quite handshy...
> 
> Would they be able to eat some seafood sticks? I asked mum to get me a wee packet but she got a 24 pack! No way me b the dogs can make our way through that!
> 
> I think I know what prentis' markings will be then I'd he's gonna fade- he has a dark cap and lone down his back, so I'd assume they'll stay?


A couple of fish sticks should be ok, never given mine anything like that because I won't eat them but I'm sure the odd one or two won't hurt 

As for Prentis' markings, they will fade to nothing. He might keep a tiny shadow of the markings but that will be about it.


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

B3rnie said:


> A couple of fish sticks should be ok, never given mine anything like that because I won't eat them but I'm sure the odd one or two won't hurt
> 
> As for Prentis' markings, they will fade to nothing. He might keep a tiny shadow of the markings but that will be about it.


I know this sounds odd, but I'd really hope he wouldn't look too much like Reid; I miss that boy so much and don't want to seem like I'm replacing him! 
Ah well, I'm sure he wouldn't mind.
My fav variety is definitely hoodeds, but goodness they seem scarce these days!

Want more pics later!? Cuz I have babies and y'all don't!? :001_tt2:


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## Wobbles (Jun 2, 2011)

B3rnie said:


> A couple of fish sticks should be ok, never given mine anything like that because I won't eat them but I'm sure the odd one or two won't hurt
> 
> As for Prentis' markings, they will fade to nothing. He might keep a tiny shadow of the markings but that will be about it.


Will he go and look like Storm Bernie? Cos she was that slate greyish colour to start with, but as it shows in your pics, she's now white. And she was the darkest one. If I put a pic up of her from then you wouldn't think she was the same rat!


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## Guest (Mar 3, 2013)

kodakkuki said:


> I know this sounds odd, but I'd really hope he wouldn't look too much like Reid; I miss that boy so much and don't want to seem like I'm replacing him!
> Ah well, I'm sure he wouldn't mind.
> My fav variety is definitely hoodeds, but goodness they seem scarce these days!
> 
> Want more pics later!? Cuz I have babies and y'all don't!? :001_tt2:


Yeah hooded's are boring so don't really sell, same as agouti so you won't find as many around 

And as if you need to ask if we want more pics 



Wobbles said:


> Will he go and look like Storm Bernie? Cos she was that slate greyish colour to start with, but as it shows in your pics, she's now white. And she was the darkest one. If I put a pic up of her from then you wouldn't think she was the same rat!


Most likely yes, Kali is really starting to fade now too, there is a definite difference even in the short time I have had them lool


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## Wobbles (Jun 2, 2011)

B3rnie said:


> Yeah hooded's are boring so don't really sell, same as agouti so you won't find as many around
> 
> And as if you need to ask if we want more pics
> 
> Most likely yes, Kali is really starting to fade now too, there is a definite difference even in the short time I have had them lool


Different areas must have different sorts then, because the [email protected] round here usually have nothing but hoodeds (if their the ones with a dark head and white body), they rarely have anything else in. I assumed it was because they were the easiest to get.

Do they keep fading throughout their lives then? I thought they'd stop once their a certain age, that Kali and Venus would stay as they were. At least if she's faded more though you'll be able to tell them apart easier:lol:


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## Charleigh (Nov 9, 2012)

They're very sweet  

I wondered when I saw Gideon, then I saw Prentis and Rossi, that perhaps you're a criminal minds fan?  

JJ is my favourite in the show  

Good luck with them they are very cute


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

I've never been angrier at myself.
You know the way I said how skittish they were? Well in the shop I showed her the difference between boy and girl, and prentis then went straight into my carrier. She then lifted out another, checked it herself and held it to me to have a look. I Know I should have taken it to hold and check, but it was already squealing in fear so I didn't. But asthe rat was held out to me there was a bulge where the scrotum would be and a lack of hair parting were the nipples would be (which I noticed on Elle immediately!) 
It's a girl. I think she'd just badly needed a poo when I looked.
Today was the first time I could get her on her back long enough to have another check. she has a vaginal discharge (and huge urethra!) ... Needless to say she is separated an I'm on baby watch 
I'm so angry at myself I'm nearly crying! She's only 10 weeks- it's Emily and Jenny all over again- only I Know this girl has been with boys.
Any help greatly received. Just please don't yell- I don't think I could take it right now.


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

Charleigh said:


> They're very sweet
> 
> I wondered when I saw Gideon, then I saw Prentis and Rossi, that perhaps you're a criminal minds fan?
> 
> ...


Oh yes- they're my bau!
Well Rossi is now gonna need renamed to go and live with Jenny, Emily and Elle... What do you think of garcia (cia for short)? Or could I have two named after jj (Jenny and jj)?


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## thedogsmother (Aug 28, 2008)

Im probably going to get shouted down for this but would you consider finding a capable vet and neutering her? As far as misexing her goes, we all make mistakes, stop beating yourself up, it was an accident


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

thedogsmother said:


> Im probably going to get shouted down for this but would you consider finding a capable vet and neutering her? As far as misexing her goes, we all make mistakes, stop beating yourself up, it was an accident


I'm hoping to get a paren to take me with all my girls to the best exotics et in the country (over an hours drive each way though) to get checks and talk it over. I didn't think spaying was an option since she is soo young and tiny, but yes I would certainly consider it if possible...
It's just the fact I yelled at the store for doing the same exact thing as I've now done!

Eta- she is over 15g heavier than her slightly larger litter mate- the actual boy who is 98g...


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

I agree with gill as regards spaying,that way she can stay with her brother and Gideon. Plus it will also stop a poss huge litter that you may struggle to find homes for and she could Also have a complicated pregnancy.
Yes there is a risk with spaying but as I say she could have a bad pregnancy.


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

blade100 said:


> I agree with gill as regards spaying,that way she can stay with her brother and Gideon. Plus it will also stop a poss huge litter that you may struggle to find homes for and she could Also have a complicated pregnancy.
> Yes there is a risk with spaying but as I say she could have a bad pregnancy.


That's what I'm worried about- I couldn't bear anything happening to her. But just yesterday the college boy rat died recovering from anaesthesia for lump removal- and he was 6 times the size of my baby. I don't have the credit to call the vets tonight (and don't think they'd appreciate a text!) so will call tomorrow for an apt to see if he'd do it... I'm not sure anyone else you be rat savvy enough for me to trust though. :crying:

Wit the discharge it isn't looking good is it; she has probably been mated hasn't she?
Shall I keep her separate (alone) for now or try to intro to my other girls? or just put back in with the boys


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## Wobbles (Jun 2, 2011)

I'd contact [email protected], they should pay for any expenses, as they sold you a missexed pet. They should also take any babies off you, I know they did for my friend with guinea pigs, especially as you ain't had them long.


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## Guest (Mar 6, 2013)

I'm actually in the camp for spaying her, the op will be far less stress than raising a litter at her age.

If you can't get her spayed I most certainly wouldn't be handing the babies over to [email protected], but I'm sure you know that lol


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

Not a chance in hell I'm sending babies to pets at home; not after this amount of [email protected](k ups! I'd keep them all if it came to it- I'm treating myself to two explores anyways if I have the room...
So spaying would be safe enough? She feels quite sense round her belly, would that and the discharge mean she's far along? Because I'm not sure when I can get to the vets I'm talking about- its somewhat too far for a taxi!

Will [email protected] be any help even though I confirmed the other was male? I hadn't thought they would


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## Guest (Mar 6, 2013)

All ga's hold a risk but with a rodent savvy vet spaying is the better option IMHO.
It's your call at the end of the day but you will need to make the decision sooner rather than later.

I'm not sure if [email protected] will offer anything but I would certainly try, even tho you confirmed the sex, you as the customer shouldn't have to, they are supposed to be the experts (pahh made myself laugh there) so they shouldn't have sold them to you.

I would push for help with the vet bills if it was me.


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

B3rnie said:


> All ga's hold a risk but with a rodent savvy vet spaying is the better option IMHO.
> It's your call at the end of the day but you will need to make the decision sooner rather than later.
> 
> I'm not sure if [email protected] will offer anything but I would certainly try, even tho you confirmed the sex, you as the customer shouldn't have to, they are supposed to be the experts (pahh made myself laugh there) so they shouldn't have sold them to you.
> ...


Think ill have to speak to a manager tomorrow then- as long as it isn't the cow I had to deal with when Elle was sold as a boy (ex stock in adoptions)

Do you think I could talk to a different store or would it have to be the one I got them from? That manager Does NOT like me one bit... Probably because I know she's an incapable idiot!
I know the belfast store would be of help you see!


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## Guest (Mar 6, 2013)

kodakkuki said:


> Think ill have to speak to a manager tomorrow then- as long as it isn't the cow I had to deal with when Elle was sold as a boy (ex stock in adoptions)
> 
> Do you think I could talk to a different store or would it have to be the one I got them from? That manager Does NOT like me one bit... Probably because I know she's an incapable idiot!
> I know the belfast store would be of help you see!


You could try the other store, if you get no luck there I would email head office.


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

Cool!

You guys are great; you know that right!?  







She's sitting in her carrier atm, do I just keep her there or where do I put her!? I can borrow a cage from college if needed I think!


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## Charleigh (Nov 9, 2012)

Oh no  

How awful, but don't beat yourself up, when I had mice it took me ages to even identify what sex he was let alone doing it in the shop when she's squirming. I would definitely contact them and make a complaint! 

I don't know much about rats so I can't offer any advice, I just hope all goes well and she is healthy. Xx



I quite like those names  Garcia is so funny, I cried when Emily left  I don't like the new woman


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

That discharge could be either male sperm,pyometra (infection of uterus which would need to be spayed anyway as that's the only solution) I don't think she would be that far gone into the pregnancy. Does she have a rounded tummy?

I agree as regards not giving them to pets at home if you did decide on letting her have the babies. 

I think just keep her in the cage she was in with the others if your getting her spayed and sorting it all out within the next few days.
That's what I'd do anyway. What's done is done now as long as you are going to get her spayed otherwise I'd keep her separate and keep a pregnancy watch on her.


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## Wobbles (Jun 2, 2011)

I would definitely try and get them to pay for any vet costs if it was me. It's their fault your in this mess. Its worth a try, you've nothing to lose. They might tell you to get lost, but unless you try, you'll never know. And as its a girl in a tank of boys, couldn't you try arguing that they sold you a pregnant animal if their not helpful?

Regarding giving them any babies, what I meant was, surely its better that they have some off you rather than their "supplier"? That if you give any, that's one less "order" needed from said supplier? Ergo one less rat farm getting or gaining on a request? At least that was my way of looking at it anyway, making it so that their "supplier" looses out on a "sale". With an added bonus of helping you out if you end up with a batch of babies.


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

Ok, I really don't know what to do. She has gained almost 30g in 3 days where her brother gained 12; I'm assuming she's quite pregnant now 
The vets I'm in contact with are being fab- admitted that while they can spay her the risks involved are greatly increased from blood supply to the uterus and her age and size, where as her body condition could suffer terribly from having the litter.
My college heart rat passed away during anaesthetic recovery earlier this week and he was a big boy with great health other than his lump. So that's of course made me more anxious about putting her under. 

What do I do? I just don't know. There are a lot of rat people in my class that may home any kits I can't keep (and ill be asking a breeder for their questionnaire etc to hopefully use) 
Ill be speaking to the vet again this afternoon after he has looked into it further, but with her belly being quite big and the weight gain she seems fairly far along and I really am worrying she'd bleed out. She now weighs 142g...

I don't do well with if, bits and maybes where my babies are concerned.


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

Ok, after much thought the vet wouldn't be comfortable spaying her asshe is soo small young and pregnant...
So looks like I'll be raising a litter 

Any and all help and advice is incredibly welcome- I'm out of my depth here!
Thinking I was gonna spay her she is still with the boys- who seem to be looking after her pretty well (gideons doting something shocking on her!) I'd just love to know how far along she would be with that amount of weight gain...


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## thedogsmother (Aug 28, 2008)

kodakkuki said:


> Ok, after much thought the vet wouldn't be comfortable spaying her asshe is soo small young and pregnant...
> So looks like I'll be raising a litter
> 
> Any and all help and advice is incredibly welcome- I'm out of my depth here!
> Thinking I was gonna spay her she is still with the boys- who seem to be looking after her pretty well (gideons doting something shocking on her!) I'd just love to know how far along she would be with that amount of weight gain...


If you trust your vet and that is his decision then I would go with that, I would start another thread asking about help for a pregnant rat, just in case people miss this thinking that its a new ratty thread and they have already replied to it. 
I have never had a pregnant rat but I have had pregnant mice, the advice was to keep them warm and clean, in a cage without too many toys in as the babies could get hidden behind them and lost. The protein amounts also have to be watched as they can cause the babies to grow too big, but once the babies are born the protein amounts have to be increased to help with the milk production. With mice you can leave them with other females who will help take care of the babies, but with this girl I wouldnt do intros before the birth, its too risky in my opinion. 
Hopefully someone else will come along who has experience with rat births


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

thedogsmother said:


> If you trust your vet and that is his decision then I would go with that, I would start another thread asking about help for a pregnant rat, just in case people miss this thinking that its a new ratty thread and they have already replied to it.
> I have never had a pregnant rat but I have had pregnant mice, the advice was to keep them warm and clean, in a cage without too many toys in as the babies could get hidden behind them and lost. The protein amounts also have to be watched as they can cause the babies to grow too big, but once the babies are born the protein amounts have to be increased to help with the milk production. With mice you can leave them with other females who will help take care of the babies, but with this girl I wouldnt do intros before the birth, its too risky in my opinion.
> Hopefully someone else will come along who has experience with rat births


Thankyou; I'll start the new thread now...


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## spoiled_rat (Mar 24, 2008)

kodakkuki said:


> She feels quite sense round her belly, would that and the discharge mean she's far along?


A pregnant rat should not have any discharge.


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## spoiled_rat (Mar 24, 2008)

kodakkuki said:


> Ok, after much thought the vet wouldn't be comfortable spaying her asshe is soo small young and pregnant...
> So looks like I'll be raising a litter
> 
> Any and all help and advice is incredibly welcome- I'm out of my depth here!
> Thinking I was gonna spay her she is still with the boys- who seem to be looking after her pretty well (gideons doting something shocking on her!) I'd just love to know how far along she would be with that amount of weight gain...


You can use galastop to make the doe reabsorb the litter. I do wonder from your other post about discharge, is if she has pyometra (explains the swelling and discharge, and weight gain).


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## Guest (Mar 9, 2013)

spoiled_rat said:


> You can use galastop to make the doe reabsorb the litter. I do wonder from your other post about discharge, is if she has pyometra (explains the swelling and discharge, and weight gain).


This makes a lot of sense actually, the discharge threw me a bit but as I've not had any pregnant does here I don't have first hand knowledge.


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

blade100 said:


> That discharge could be either male sperm,pyometra (infection of uterus which would need to be spayed anyway as that's the only solution) I don't think she would be that far gone into the pregnancy. Does she have a rounded tummy?
> 
> I agree as regards not giving them to pets at home if you did decide on letting her have the babies.
> 
> ...


I did mention pyometra earlier in to this thread. Press on her belly gently to see if any discharge comes out. That's if she still has any present although saying that it could be closed pyo too.


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