# Advice on german shepherd pups



## TOTO (Sep 20, 2009)

Hi all,

Its certainly not a definite just as yet, that we're getting a german shepherd pup, but as i do with anything whilst were looking into it etc im trying to research and learn more about the breed.

You see i have this image in my head of how a german shepherd looks as an adult, but ive seen alot of adverts for pedigree pups and the parents dont really look like what i expect.

I really like these dogs for there good looks, and every one of them ive met has had a great temprement! So this is really the kind of dog i hope to bring into our house. Obviously as a pup first.









So are there only 2 types of german shepherds? Short haired and long haired? Would you suggest that if i want a dog that looks like the pic above, it is short haired black and tan, or is there more specific breed types?

Thanks for any light you can shed on the subject. It could be a couple of months away we actually get one but i like everything to be just right and not rushed into, so that i can be properly prepared etc


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

If I were thinking of buying a first GSD I would be looking at spending a year + studying the breed, different types and lines


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## bingblazenskyla (Jan 9, 2011)

i think it depends on where you are looking - if you are looking on epupz ect then i wouldnt think that was the BEST place to find a good quality lined dog 

i would be looking for specific GSD breeders 

i can point you to a forum which is mainly GSD based and has a couple of good quality GSD breeders on there if u like? just send me a PM


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## TOTO (Sep 20, 2009)

I would think its more important, how much you look into them. Rather than the length of time it takes you to do so. But thanks i kind of understand where your coming from, dont go in blind folded etc


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## TOTO (Sep 20, 2009)

Thankyou, PM sent. Your dog looks absolutely gorgeous by the way!!


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

TOTO said:


> I would think its more important, how much you look into them. Rather than the length of time it takes you to do so. But thanks i kind of understand where your coming from, dont go in blind folded etc


Research into lines and breeders can make the difference of getting the dog of a lifetime or a liability. If things go wrong with big guarding breeds they can go wrong in a big way.


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## Guest (Jan 9, 2011)

hawksport said:


> Research into lines and breeders can make the difference of getting the dog of a lifetime or a liability. If things go wrong with big guarding breeds they can go wrong in a big way.


This is good advice from someone who knows, I suggest the OP takes it.


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## TOTO (Sep 20, 2009)

Thanks hawk, taken on board!


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

Oh, do carry out loads and loads of research into the breed. Good look at the parents, grandparents, as far back as you can go. And those hipscores need to be spot on.

I have seen gsd adults who look more like overgrown mongrels and I know they didn't start out that way. My neighbour once had a lovely little pup, you could straight away what he was, but as an adult he really did not look the part at all.

I know what you mean. This is one breed that can easily turn out to be not quite as you expected looks wise. I love them too, but I don't have the right sort of conditions for one.


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

...............


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## Nicky10 (Jan 11, 2010)

Do careful research before you get one. Most are wonderful dogs but some lines are more difficult than others to own. You also have to ensure they're from fully health tested lines. Have a look at the different types there's a big difference in the look of the breed depending on what they were bred for, decide which type you like then research that. The type I like for example is the one that takes the most work and I know I couldn't handle that yet.


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

Can i just point out following your dogs left at home thread that German Shepherds are proned to Seperation anxiety and may not tolerate being left for long periods very well 

It is vitally important when bringing a pup into your life that you get the right dog for your lifestyle and for you rather than just wanting a certain breed and making it "fit"

Sorry to sound preachy but as i have said on the other thread, been there done that and i wouldnt recommend it to anyone. 

GSDs IMO are a high energy breed that require alot of stimulation, exercise and like company. The reason they are used to do the work they do is because they crave human company and thrive in an environment where they are working closely with their owner.

Believe me a bored, lonely GSD is not a happy one.


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

.................


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

cutekiaro1 said:


> This is very true for some GSD's especially the working ones, however I have a showline female and work full time (OH doesnt start work until 1pm though) she is left for 5 hours a day (with parents going round to let her out) so it can be done, it just takes a lot of time to build up the periods in which they are left alone..... but some lines (working etc) would not tolerate it and this is where research comes into it.
> 
> The red statement is very true and if they feel like that they will become distructive very quickly


I totally agree and it would be wrong to generalise on an entire breed as all dogs are individual however i saw the flip side with the GSD cross we had who suffered from severe SA and after 18 (ver difficult) months of trying to make things work for her we had to accept she would be better off elsewhere. Was a heartbreaking decision and one i still feel awful about.

Tilly

Howled constantly when left
Ate various armchairs and sofas
Was never housetrained in 18months due to the stress of being left
Tore an old wiring loom out of the walls of the house
Chewed an enormous hole in the front door
Developed aggression

If the OP can read that and see solutions then great but most people would see the above as unacceptable but must accept this could happen .

This is a great thread to read

http://www.petforums.co.uk/dog-chat/134055-thinking-getting-dog-puppy-realities.html


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

...............


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

cutekiaro1 said:


> that sure could happen and worse.... I think Hawksport has had some experience with a GSD female who was aggressive?
> 
> They are hard work and take a heck of a lot of training but if you do it right and have the time and patience to do it properly you will be rewarded with a lifelong happy buddy :thumbup:


Just a little. It's not nice for dog or owner when something as simple as letting out for a wee has a safety procedure that needs to be followed


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## PoisonGirl (Oct 24, 2008)

Some great replies 

I agree... more researching into the breed, before lookng for a certain coat type.

I met my first gsd when I was 6. I fell in love with the breed. I learned as much as I could over the years. I've spent alot of time around the breed, I've worked with them, fostered, walked. I'm now fostering another lovely boy.

It has taken me this long (I am nearly 26) to be in the position to have my own gsd puppy. I've had dogs, puppies, fosters but never the time space or money for a german shepherd to come into my life yet. 
There are probably still things I don't know.

But I have managed to find a breeder who does relevant health tests and is a breeder of longhaired gsd. Of course coat type/colour should be the last thing you look at, I am not fussed what colour my pup is though I prefer not solid black (though with mum bi-colour and dad black and tan there is little chance of solid black).

There are many many variations of the gsd coat, this page gives examples of them.. GSD Patterns, Colors, Coat Lengths & More

but as far as coats go, there is the short coat









the 'plush' coat









the long coat









then the colourings...
the average saddle









large saddle









extra large saddle, or 'blanket'









bi colour









small saddle









extra small saddle


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

cutekiaro1 said:


> that sure could happen and worse.... I think Hawksport has had some experience with a GSD female who was aggressive?
> 
> They are hard work and take a heck of a lot of training but if you do it right and have the time and patience to do it properly you will be rewarded with a lifelong happy buddy :thumbup:


I adore the breed, probably my favourite if i am honest BUT i understand what comes with them which is why i don't have one .... YET 

Sometimes what you want and want you can have are not compatible but you make the right decision for the animal involved 

A cocker is not very high up on my list of favourite dogs but he was the right choice for us at this time and he suits our lifestyle really well and is perfect for us which in turn means we are perfect for him


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## TOTO (Sep 20, 2009)

Hello and thanks again for the helpful replies.

Im learning more and more about the breed each day and have been speaking to some experienced GSD breeders today. 

Once we find the right pup from the right breeder it will actually only be at home on its own for around 3 hours per day, which is surely okay? Managed to swap shifts at work as of next month which is great  

As much as people tell me, they need alot of exercise you know it doesnt put me off in the slightest. As with my last dog it will get an hours walk in the morning, same in the afternoon by my girlfriend, and i plan on taking it with me jogging at night time. Plus the usual visits to parks and beach etc on weekends, so im fairly confident we can give them enough exercise.

Anyway, still not rushing into anything and continue to read and learn. Thanks for all the help. It is appreciated!!


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## PoisonGirl (Oct 24, 2008)

Yes, 3 hours a day *should* be fine, so long as you get him/her use to being alone gradually.

Excercise at first you will need alot of things to keep him/her mentally active, you need to be really careful about over exercising due to the hip problems that can develop. Jogging should not be done until at Least 12-18 months, the later the better. You can get them hip scored by a vet at 12 months, which I will be doing with mine before I even think about joining an agility class.. as if her hip scores come back high then there will be no jogging or agility for me. 
No running up and down the stairs or jumping things either.


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## TOTO (Sep 20, 2009)

Marinita German Shepherd Dogs, Breeders Of German Shepherd Dogs Puppies, supplier of Kanine Komplete Dog Food and Owners of quality Sports Horses

This is the breeder i've been talking to today, they seem to be very healthy dogs with good hip scores and i think they are gorgeous. Especially Marinita Maara.

What sort of hip scores would you be aiming for? Marinita Maara has a total hip score of 8 and elbows 0. From what i have learnt so far thats fairly good, how rare is it you find a hip score of 0-0?


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## PoisonGirl (Oct 24, 2008)

They look good, like the fact they have the test results on the web page too.

Do you want me to ask on the german shepherd forum what they think? x


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## GeordieBabe (Apr 7, 2009)

loads of good advice here, do all your research first unlike this person selling this pup 

Tillie is a 6 month old bitch, shes had all her jabs Ive got her book saying what and when she had her jabs. i haven't got papers for her, nor have i had her hip scored, shes a brilliant guard dog. 
i don't want to let her go as shes a brilliant pup, but as shes boisterous on the lead i cant manage her and cant take her for walks hence why shes skinny cos shes not getting all the exercise that she needs, I'm actually breaking my heart as i writing this but i have to be fair on Tillie, she needs someone who can handle her on the lead and take her for loads of walks and who can stop her jumping up at strangers and barking a them while shes out on the lead.
Tillie is very playful and very loving she will harass you till you give her cuddles, she wont catch a ball if you throw it but she will happily pinch a ball or toys. shes been brought up with another dog (even though when shes out she will go for other dogs), shes also been brought up with cats and tends to play roughly with them. Ive also got 4 kids and shes great with them.
she loves being in and out the house all day she tends to get bored easy and pinches things especially out the bin and toys, she is a real joy and pleasure to have.
i would like her to go to a permanent home (i don't want her to get passed to pillar to post), and to someone who has had German shepherds and understands them i don't want any time wasters to get in touch i want her to go to someone who is going to love her as much as i do and who's going to look after her properly, I'm not getting rid of her for the money, the asking price is the money i paid for her and her jabs, I'm re-homing her cos i cant walk her and give her the exercise she needs.


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## TOTO (Sep 20, 2009)

Thanks poisingirl ive joined the websites you sent to me yesterday via PM, waiting for activation from an admin though. If you dont mind and get a minute just to ask what sort of hip scores they would consider good? One of the mums on that page has a total hip score of 18 so thats quite a jump from 8. Although the one ive fallen in love with is the one with 8 shes gorgeous.

Thanks love!



The person advertising the pup above makes you so sad. Just hope she finds a good home to someone who is much more suited. If i was ever stupid enough to make the mistake that person has, i certainly wouldnt be asking for the money back i paid plus the jabs etc that is ridiculous, they should be so sorry that theyve affected this pup in a bad way (skinny, no walks) that they should be giving her free to the best possible, experienced home. Horrible horrible people


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## PoisonGirl (Oct 24, 2008)

I've asked, got a bit of a b1tchy reply from one of them because the breeder I chose breeds long coats and to them that is not ''proper''


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## TOTO (Sep 20, 2009)

So why they having a pop at you, its not you breeding them?
Ive got to be honest, some people on these pet forums, not just this one, but all, whether it dogs cats horses etc, im a member on all, but you just have to ignore some of them. Seem detatched from reality.

One person was bitchy at me for thinking about getting a dog, let alone a GSD as i work. They told me that its cruel to get any type of dog whilst working full time. It made me wonder, how do all these people manage to not work and have dogs? Ok food and jabs isnt too expensive but if you weren't working, and had a 3 grand vet bill (god forbid) they would be nackered!

Sorry rant over just come across a few 'odd ones' recently on a number of different forums lol.

Thanks for asking i hope the other poster doesnt give you any more bitchy remarks.


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## GeordieBabe (Apr 7, 2009)

TOTO said:


> Thanks poisingirl ive joined the websites you sent to me yesterday via PM, waiting for activation from an admin though. If you dont mind and get a minute just to ask what sort of hip scores they would consider good? One of the mums on that page has a total hip score of 18 so thats quite a jump from 8. Although the one ive fallen in love with is the one with 8 shes gorgeous.
> 
> Thanks love!
> 
> The person advertising the pup above makes you so sad. Just hope she finds a good home to someone who is much more suited. If i was ever stupid enough to make the mistake that person has, i certainly wouldnt be asking for the money back i paid plus the jabs etc that is ridiculous, they should be so sorry that theyve affected this pup in a bad way (skinny, no walks) that they should be giving her free to the best possible, experienced home. Horrible horrible people


I was rather shocked when i saw the ad mind, skinny from no exercise more like no food ,shes a gorgeous pup mind


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

TOTO said:


> Hello and thanks again for the helpful replies.
> 
> Im learning more and more about the breed each day and have been speaking to some experienced GSD breeders today.
> 
> ...




3 hours is fine but it needs to be done gradually during the settling period. There are lots of ways you can reduce the likelihood of SA and actually it involves leaving them for short periods from very early on and then gradually extending  Sounds simple but its amazing how many people spend the whole settling period never leaving the dog once then wonder why the dog doesnt want to be left 

Will this 3 hours be the maximum total daily time or will the pup be left for 3 hrs with a visit then left again during the same day ??

If it is only for 3 hours a day i would highly recommend a crate and puppy pen. This will help the pup feel secure in its surroundings, will help with toilet training and limit any destructive behaviour. I know you said you werent a fan but used correctly a crate can be a fantastic place for the dog where it feels settled and safe, reducing stress and making training easier.


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## PoisonGirl (Oct 24, 2008)

TOTO said:


> So why they having a pop at you, its not you breeding them?
> Ive got to be honest, some people on these pet forums, not just this one, but all, whether it dogs cats horses etc, im a member on all, but you just have to ignore some of them. Seem detatched from reality.
> .


I think I might just leave that forum  the 'leader' is so up herself its unreal.

I got into a bit of a spat with her 2 years ago, because I fell under the spell of a byb and was sticking up for them. I was going to have one of their puppys and argue everyone til we were blue in the face there was nothing wrong. 
I nearly got banned off the place then, but since was cleared up and I said sorry etc and they were right and that was that. But I left anyway because I was no longer getting a gsd and didn't need to be on there.
But she has now said ''omg just realised who you are'' blah blah and is making childish b1tchy remarks.
I'm holding my tongue (or should that be figers?) at the moment but I'm likely to say something that will get me banned, because she's stupid like that.

Anyway, I shall post it on the other, nicer gsd forum I use :lol:


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Don't forget you should be looking for a good training class for when your new puppy is innoculated. They're not all the same.


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## PoisonGirl (Oct 24, 2008)

Someone else replied, not too good I'm afraid

''Well as its dam has a score of 14:4 I wouldnt even go there way too uneven - from data I have collected over the years you find that an extremely uneven scored dog goes on to produce High and Uneven scores it sometimes misses a generation but always comes back down through the line. It would be interesting to see what its sibblings are scored at!''


You want to stay away from dogs with really uneven scores cause like she said, it can come out further down the lines.


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## PoisonGirl (Oct 24, 2008)

''If they want working lines then Tyguard in Clifton near Swinton TYGUARD GERMAN SHEPHERDS , if they want showlines as those in the link then nothing around Manchester, again *if they want just pet lines stay clear of Breeders around here particular South Manchester*
Otherwise look at Katrina - Kesyra German Shepherds - GSD Breeders of german shepherd puppies - sable or black and gold

Tracy at Agios - AGIOS GERMAN SHEPHERDS.Super quality home reared German shepherd puppies at times and fabulous proven German Shepherd stud dogs

Carol at Antilli - Antilli German Shepherds - breeder of top quality German Shepherds.

In Scotland Heather at Conbhairean - Conbhairean German Shepherd Dogs :: UK hobby breeder of german shepherd puppies in Scotland

All Health Information is available all these show line breeders breed for good health, low scores''


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## GSDlover4ever (Feb 21, 2009)

Just wondered have you thought about getting a GSD from a rescue?


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## TOTO (Sep 20, 2009)

Thanks posiongirl will look at them links when i get home.
I have thought about looking for a rescue one but there all going to be older i persume, and if there are any pups theyll go fast. I wouldnt really want anything like 3 year old for example because of my cats, and i want to start training it from an early age.


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## hawksport (Dec 27, 2009)

Nice to see someone taking good advice :thumbup:


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## Nicky10 (Jan 11, 2010)

Rescues get puppies in all the time especially in a breed like gsds I would guess with so many being bred. So you could have a look or even look at adult cat-proof ones


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## GSDlover4ever (Feb 21, 2009)

A lot of people assume that rescue animals with some how be old.... or damaged in one way or another.... most arent, some of the animals that go into rescue are because of: death of their owner, marriage break up, working longer hours.....

Here are a list of GSD rescue in the UK.
ARAS and German Shepherd Inn: Bedford: http://www.arasrescue.co.uk: Mainly German Shepherds, but all needy dogs are taken in and given care and attention until they can be rehomed. Always have German Shepherds of varying ages requiring new homes. 
Biggsd: Biggsd - German Shepherd Rescue - gsd rescue Biggsd helps to coordinate the rescue and rehoming of GSDs throughout the UK. There are always many GSDs (and a few other breeds) featured on the site looking for new homes. There is also an active community of GSDs lovers and experts offering advice on the forum. 
Cefni German Shepherd Rescue: National: Cefni German Shepherd Rescue German Shepherd Rescue rehoming of dogs nationwide volunteers with excellent knowledge of the breed, behavioural problems, dog handling, alsation and GSD breeds considered too. 
German Shepherd Dog Rehoming~ North East: Newcastle: index North East based GSD rehoming organisation 
German Shepherd Forum: Leeds, Yorkshire, UK: GERMAN SHEPHERD FORUM - HOME Not just a forum, this is a web site with a forum attached. For all German Shepherds, Owners and Enthusiasts. Includes online forum and rescue page 
German Shepherd Rescue Scotland: http://german-shepherd-rescue-scotland.org.uk: Rescuing and re-homing German Shepherds in Scotland. Also have an online store selling great GSD gifts. 
German Shepherd Rescue South: Ashford, Middlesex: German Shepherd Rescue South based in Hampshire - Rescuing and Re-homing German Shepherd Dogs in the South of England Home rescue,re-homing unwanted German Shepherd Dogs in Home Counties, Hampshire, Surrey, Bedfordshire, Kent, Berkshire 
German Shepherd Rescue UK Ltd: Scotland/North England/Birmingham: German Shepherd Dogs and German Shepherd Puppies German Shepherd rescue and rehoming service 
German Shepherds UK: German Shepherds UK • Index page Forum all about the breed of German Shepherds 
HUGS Rescue: Powys/Wales: HUGS Welsh German Shepherd Dog Rescue in Wales (Alsatian) Hope and Understanding for German Shepherd dogs. A newly formed rescue, based in mid-Wales, dedicated to the rescue, assessment & rehoming of gsds. 
Maggies pet rescue & rehoming service: Pitsea Essex: MAGGIES PET RESCUE - GERMAN SHEPHERD RESCUE Rescue and where possible rehoming of healthy german shepher dogs. 
Second-Chances gsd rescue: Edinburgh, Scotland: Second-chances for German Shepherds German Shepherd rescue organisation for Scotland and north england, we are a registered Scottish charity No 28175 
Southern Counties GSD Rescue: Home Counties: German Shepherd rescue | GSD rescue and Alsatian rescue dogs | Southern Counties German Shepherd Rescue re-homing stray, abused, and unwanted German shepherd dogs and poundies throughout the home counties 
Sussex German Shepherd Rescue: National organisation: http://www.sussexgermanshepherdrescue.co.uk Rescue and re-homing throughout the UK and Ireland please come and join our forum. 
Lancashire gsd rescue: Preston lancashire: TED KEWLEY Rescuing and rehoming German Shepherds in Lancashire and surrounding areas and North Wales. Please note that we are unable to take dogs with behavioural problems but can give you names of good dog trainers in our area 
UK German Shepherd Rescue: National Organisation http://www.ukgermanshepherdrescue.co.uk/: Rescuing & rehoming German Shepherd dogs & puppies throughout the UK. 
Watford German Shepherd Help and Information: Watford, Hertfordshire: Watford GSD Help & Information We offer free help and advice to German Shepherd dog owners on topics such as Health and behaviour issues. 
Wiltshire German Shepherd Rescue: http://www.wiltshiregermanshepherdrescue.co.uk: Rescue for German Shepherds in need of a new home in Wiltshire and the South West. (Forum style site)

You never know you might get lucky and get a GSD that is young and good with cats.


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

I agree with the above. I have seen some FAB GSDs up for re homing  Lots of them are well under 3 yrs old and may already be used to being left a few hours a day


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## GSDlover4ever (Feb 21, 2009)

What about:

Juke









Juke is 2yrs entire and vaccinated. He is a fantastic dog who gets on with other dogs is currently *living with* a toddler and a *kitten* and they are his *best friends*! He has been to training as a puppy and has very good manners,walks well on and off lead, is house trained and can be left on his own. He needs an active home as he is still young and would thrive on obedience work or agility. Juke will fit into any family and his owners are devastated at having to give him up can you provide him with his forever home?

From: german shepherds for rehoming in the south east

A wee bit older








Jet is 5yrs *good *with children of all ages, other dogs and *also cats*. Jet is very polite with strangers, is good when left alone and travels well. She has good basic commands on and off lead. Jet loves people and will suit any family, she has had two litters of puppies with her current owners but is in very good health, she needs a new home due to a relationship breakdown.


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

GSDlover4ever said:


> What about:
> 
> Juke
> 
> ...


JUKE looks Perfect !!!!!!

Would have him myself if it wasnt for the Grumpy one


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## Nicky10 (Jan 11, 2010)

Juke lovely sounds like a great dog I want him.


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

Nicky10 said:


> Juke lovely sounds like a great dog I want him.


I love that website, OH has banned me from going on it though :lol:

he isnt a million miles from me either. Do you reckon i could just say i found him in the CP and am waiting for the owners to claim him


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## Nicky10 (Jan 11, 2010)

Yeah you're just looking after him while you try to find the owner. Pretend to be looking of course then when no one claims him just say you can't let him go now


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

Nicky10 said:


> Yeah you're just looking after him while you try to find the owner. Pretend to be looking of course then when no one claims him just say you can't let him go now


Not sure the Rescue would be happy to let him go under those circumstances though :scared:

Bet he gets snapped up soon though. Looks in great health


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## Nicky10 (Jan 11, 2010)

No I hope they wouldn't. I'm sure he'll be snapped up no problem he sounds like a great dog


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## RAINYBOW (Aug 27, 2009)

To the OP, alot of rescues Hip Score too so you know what you are getting in that area with a slightly older dog too rather than the lottery of a puppy


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## GSDlover4ever (Feb 21, 2009)

Cindy - S****horpe










This little girl is 6mths old Cindy a GSD x, what a little beauty! Cindys current owner saved her from an awful man who was beating her in the street, other people just walked by but the lady intervened and after a mouthful from him she bought the dog off him. She is now in perfect health after vet treatment. However, the owner needs to re-home her as Cindy is an extremely nervous dog and is finding life in a busy family home difficult. Cindy needs a quiet, loving home to bring her out of her shell and become an even lovelier little dog.


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## GSDlover4ever (Feb 21, 2009)

Lily - Stratford










1 year old, B/T, short coat, unspayed, petite lady GSD. Lily is rather timid and shy and very nervous of toddlers and strangers. She has only been used to a small number of family members. As an only pup in the litter, she was removed and rehomed at 12 weeks and then kept in a kennel on her own which goes some way to explain her nervousness of strangers, dogs and likely other animals. She has not lived with dogs or cats or had much socialisation with other dogs. She is not intrested in livestock near her home. House trained and crate trained and she has wonderful manners - only too willing to please. This little lady needs stability, a firm but gentle hand and lots of socialistion with people and other dogs - slow but sure to build her confidence. She has no aggression and has not bitten.


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## Nicky10 (Jan 11, 2010)

Aw she's adorable. Cindy that is


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

i know tracy of agios gsd's and she has some super beauties there!

anything considered over 20 hip score is not good and no breeder would breed from a gsd with that score.

are you looking to travel if so i used to work for this kc reg breeder and look after his german shep's.
now they are stunning!

he takes his to the german sigers and the british one.
his are all tatooed and parents hip elbow scored,hemo tested too.
some of his gsd's are imported over from germany.

this is his link they are nr derby.

WELCOME TO DECHSLINE GERMAN SHEPHERDS AND WEST HIGHLAND WHITE TERRIERS BASED IN BURTON AT OUR DOVESIDE LUXURY BOARDING KENNELS Page 2.


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## blade100 (Aug 24, 2009)

german shepherds for rehoming in central


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## marinita maara (Feb 21, 2011)

Hi was reading through the forum and noticed you mentioned Marinita Maara, and that you had been in contact with Marinita Kennels. Marinita Maara was bred by Marinita Kennels but is owned by myself and is due to have pups in a couple of weeks. The father is Tramella Xamp. If you would like more information, please contact us at: [email protected] Many thanks, Mark Evans


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## Guest (Feb 21, 2011)

hawksport said:


> Research into lines and breeders can make the difference of getting the dog of a lifetime or a liability. If things go wrong with big guarding breeds they can go wrong in a big way.


excellent point.


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## Guest (Feb 21, 2011)

"I'm not getting rid of her for the money, the asking price is the money i paid for her and her jabs,

Talk about CONTRADICTION :lol:


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## Guest (Feb 21, 2011)

PoisonGirl said:


> I've asked, got a bit of a b1tchy reply from one of them because the breeder I chose breeds long coats and to them that is not ''proper''


no reputable gsd breeder breed FAULTS ( long hair) on purpose.

got it!


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## PoisonGirl (Oct 24, 2008)

kunzy said:


> no reputable gsd breeder breed FAULTS ( long hair) on purpose.
> 
> got it!


Just because they are not able to be shown properly, does not make them wrong. White GSD are 'faults' they use to be killed at birth I bet you agree with that too


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## paşa's mummy (Feb 5, 2011)

PoisonGirl said:


> Just because they are not able to be shown properly, does not make them wrong. White GSD are 'faults' they use to be killed at birth I bet you agree with that too


whites are not faults, they were killed because hilter saw them as inferior and it envolved from there. They arnt allowed into show ring because this stigma stayed with them long after hitler was gone. its a shame and really annoys me that people still have this misconception. The majority of GSD's were actually white and the darker colours were bred in to serve different purposes in the jobs they enrolled. unfortunatly for white gsd's there seems to be a shotage of devoted breeders whom health check etc and so we see poor examples of the breed filtering through.

the above looks like am having a really bad rant at you, please dont take offence i wasnt meaning it at you i just get annoyed by people still thinking they are inferior and bad. they are just as much a GSD as a black and tan or sable, where i live they are rare. but are often bought as a novelty, mistreated and end up in the rescue centres< as do alot GSD's.

please dont take offence

amy


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## PoisonGirl (Oct 24, 2008)

oh no, i wasnt meaning it against the whites, i love them. just the previous poster seems to be having a pick at me


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## paşa's mummy (Feb 5, 2011)

PoisonGirl said:


> oh no, i wasnt meaning it against the whites, i love them. just the previous poster seems to be having a pick at me


i love them all, all shades, lines, coat length. ive got a white puppy. ive loved them all my life< think its cos i was brought up with them. its taken me a long time to be ready to beable to give them everything they need but i got so excited when i went to buy her. i chose white because where i live black and tans are often bought as a statis dog and i didnt want to be tied into that group, plus a i fancied a change as we had a black and tan through my childhood. glad you didnt take offence


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## thedogsmother (Aug 28, 2008)

paşa's mummy;2225849 said:


> whites are not faults, they were killed because hilter saw them as inferior and it envolved from there. They arnt allowed into show ring because this stigma stayed with them long after hitler was gone. its a shame and really annoys me that people still have this misconception. The majority of GSD's were actually white and the darker colours were bred in to serve different purposes in the jobs they enrolled. unfortunatly for white gsd's there seems to be a shotage of devoted breeders whom health check etc and so we see poor examples of the breed filtering through.
> 
> the above looks like am having a really bad rant at you, please dont take offence i wasnt meaning it at you i just get annoyed by people still thinking they are inferior and bad. they are just as much a GSD as a black and tan or sable, where i live they are rare. but are often bought as a novelty, mistreated and end up in the rescue centres< as do alot GSD's.
> 
> ...


Dont worry I doubt you will find many anti white gsd people on here, everybody is lovely about my Henrick, It wasnt Hitler btw, Max von Stephanitz who is belived to be the creator of the breed decided that white gsds were unsuitable for their job as they were too easily seen at night and not easily enough visible in the snow so he ordered white pups culled as inferior.


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## paşa's mummy (Feb 5, 2011)

thedogsmother said:


> Dont worry I doubt you will find many anti white gsd people on here, everybody is lovely about my Henrick, It wasnt Hitler btw, Max von Stephanitz who is belived to be the creator of the breed decided that white gsds were unsuitable for their job as they were too easily seen at night and not easily enough visible in the snow so he ordered white pups culled as inferior.


sorry my mistake i got my wires crossed i knew it was a load of bull either way lol love the name Henrick lol ive never heard that before. i love all GSD's, i think they are very misunderstood breed


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## paşa's mummy (Feb 5, 2011)

i found this little guy on here. he is adorable and deffinatly young enough to train. i'd be tempted myself but couldnt afford another dog if anything went wrong so i cant.
amy

http://www.petforums.co.uk/dog-rescue-adoption/148972-morgan-11-week-old-germanshep-x-puppy.html


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## Shrap (Nov 22, 2010)

I don't see why it's a load of bull? They weren't fit for purpose.. Of course it depends what you mean by culling. Culling culling, or culling from the breeding pool? I'm not well versed on how the whites were treated back then. Of course it would have been smarter to just not breed from them.... No dog deserves to be drowned or anything like that 

I'm not anti white or long coat. I will be getting a long coat myself (I think). I do however disagree with the breeding practices of long coat breeders or those who breed for colour. I've yet to see a breeder like this who health tests all through the lines and doesn't have epilepsy or other diseases present. I spent so long looking at every long coat breeder I could find but just wasn't happy with with health testing practices and how far they were from the breed standard conformation wise. I mean, what were they breeding for? Coat length and colour obviously. Not a good reason to breed.

Luckily (thanks to someone on the GSD forum) I found a well respected standard coat breeder who throws long coats, although I'm now not sure whether I'll be getting a long coat or short coat! Her standard coats are so beautiful as well.

I haven't even asked my chosen breeder how much I will be paying yet 

I hope you find a great GSD pup!


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## billie jo (Feb 17, 2011)

Please, please, please go for a pup whose parents have straight backs. I was horrified to see some footage of Crufts. Some of the 'top breeders,' have managed to breed the GSD until it has back legs which resemble 'frogs legs.' Awful, poor dogs! These dogs were winning their classes and they couldn't even walk properly!


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## thedogsmother (Aug 28, 2008)

Shrap said:


> I don't see why it's a load of bull? They weren't fit for purpose.. Of course it depends what you mean by culling. Culling culling, or culling from the breeding pool? I'm not well versed on how the whites were treated back then. Of course it would have been smarter to just not breed from them.... No dog deserves to be drowned or anything like that
> 
> I'm not anti white or long coat. I will be getting a long coat myself (I think). I do however disagree with the breeding practices of long coat breeders or those who breed for colour. I've yet to see a breeder like this who health tests all through the lines and doesn't have epilepsy or other diseases present. I spent so long looking at every long coat breeder I could find but just wasn't happy with with health testing practices and how far they were from the breed standard conformation wise. I mean, what were they breeding for? Coat length and colour obviously. Not a good reason to breed.
> 
> ...


One of the original dogs used to create the breed was white, there are white genes in the gsd and they will crop up every now and then even if non white dogs are used for breeding. I prefer whites, you prefer standard long coats, Im not planning to show my dog (although I could in white shows if I chose to) so whats the problem with them existing? I travelled a long way and payed a lot of money to get a dog whos parents had fantastic health test results and his breeder did breed for colour because she (like me) prefers whites, his father was imported for his test result and his temperament. I also own a standard colour bitch and shes absolutley wonderful too, I cant see why some people cant have it in them to appreciate beaty in different (non standard) variations. If being a white dog meant that Henrick was open to health issues that he wouldnt have being a standard colour then I would never have bought him, this is a cosmetic issue only.


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## paşa's mummy (Feb 5, 2011)

how can you say its not a load of bull that they were killed purely because some people saw them as being inferior. i would not change my WHITE gsd for any other gsd in any other colour. whites created the GSD you are ment to be in favour of today. they have no known increased health issues or behaviour problems< just bad owners normally! which is what people usually try throwing at me when i dare to speak out about the way these dogs are disregarded purely on being a different colour. if you do your research you will see the only reason these dogs are not in the breed standard is because its 'always' been like that and not enough people will protest to change is! however there are white fans all over the world who have their own shows and in my opinion these dogs are simply devine. handsome, intellegant and loyal. the fact that not as many people have whites< where i live, means Pasha is adored everywhere i take her. rant over!

and yes please get a straight back. its a shame these dogs are been bred to drag their rear ends on the floor and for what oh yeah fashion!


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## GSDlover4ever (Feb 21, 2009)

billie jo said:


> Please, please, please go for a pup whose parents have straight backs. I was horrified to see some footage of Crufts. Some of the 'top breeders,' have managed to breed the GSD until it has back legs which resemble 'frogs legs.' Awful, poor dogs! These dogs were winning their classes and they couldn't even walk properly!


Do your research first..... Some people have no idea....

Have you personally had experience of the "crippled" dogs.... or do you believe everything you see on TV?


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## GSDlover4ever (Feb 21, 2009)

paşa's mummy;2227271 said:


> how can you say its not a load of bull that they were killed purely because some people saw them as being inferior. i would not change my WHITE gsd for any other gsd in any other colour. whites created the GSD you are ment to be in favour of today. *they have no known increased health issues or behaviour problems*< just bad owners normally! which is what people usually try throwing at me when i dare to speak out about the way these dogs are disregarded purely on being a different colour.* if you do your research *you will see the only reason these dogs are not in the breed standard is because its 'always' been like that and not enough people will protest to change is! however there are white fans all over the world who have their own shows and in my opinion these dogs are simply devine. handsome, intellegant and loyal. the fact that not as many people have whites< where i live, means Pasha is adored everywhere i take her. rant over!
> 
> *and yes please get a straight back. its a shame these dogs are been bred to drag their rear ends on the floor and for what oh yeah fashion*!


Firstly I think you have to do more research.... especially with regards to the last section....

Also as a result of breeders breeding for colour, sadly there are a lot of health problems in these dogs. Many breeders didn't health check there dogs.... producing bad hips and elbows. Epilepsy and other health problems.
Also as a result of breeding any dog with another.... they produced a lot of dog with week nerves... temperament issue.

I thought this was quite intresting. 

The German Shepherd Dog, breed history


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## Shrap (Nov 22, 2010)

You really didn't read anything I said did you :S

I said I don't understand how it's a load of bull that Max von Stephanitz thought of them as inferior, it's true in the sense they weren't as good for their WORKING purpose. I didn't say they are any less beautiful or less of a GSD. Nor did I say I thought it was right to kill them, in fact I believe I said they just shouldn't have been bred from when they crop up, not killed. And when I say that, I meant back in the day.. You know, when they were for working. What I DID say, was that I don't agree with the breeding practices nowadays. And even if you go miles and spend loads it doesn't matter if the breeder health tests now, because i'm pretty sure there are going to be some dogs from BAD breeders in the lineage. I haven't ever said that the white colour is directly responsible for any health or temperment issues. But the fact there are so many bad breeders who don't take into account health or temperment when breeding. Just as the white GSDs will "crop up", so will the health or temperment issues. The same with a lot of black and tan standard coat dogs. That's why I've gone so far out of my way to look back over more than just the 5 gen pedigree for hip scores, elbow scores, haemophilia testing, breed survey results, schutzhund qualifications.

It's your choice whether you get a breed standard colour or coat length or not. I have no problem with your dog existing TDM, both your GSDs are gorgeous. All we're talking about here is whether they were fit for their purpose when they originally came about.

As for the straight back vs frog debate. We really don't want to get into this. All i'll say is that after looking at English line straight backed dogs, and believe me, I looked at every one I could find. There was FAR more hip dysplasia and more health problems in those lines, than in the German lines with (not a roach or banana back) but the CORRECT back. Gently sloping with a good croup. Roach backs are not desirable in the ring. I do still find myself in disbelief at that GSD with the poor hocks as well, but that is not what most breeders aim for.
The straight backed dogs, although the may look beautiful, are not correct to the breed standard. They are oversized, more often have a hind end higher than the withers, and in my experience, aren't actually capable of the work they were supposed to be bred for. Banana backs and supposed straight backs are just as bad as each other.

I'm sure I've probably missed some stuff but I have to leave soon for Maroon 5


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## thedogsmother (Aug 28, 2008)

Shrap said:


> You really didn't read anything I said did you :S
> 
> It's your choice whether you get a breed standard colour or coat length or not. I have no problem with your dog existing TDM, both your GSDs are gorgeous. All we're talking about here is whether they were fit for their purpose when they originally came about.
> 
> I'm sure I've probably missed some stuff but I have to leave soon for Maroon 5


I did read your post but obviously misread what angle you were coming from, I think my query with the reason for them not being bred is that how can you say they are too easily seen in one situation and not easily enough seen in another, either you want a dog who is easily seen or one who isnt unless non white gsds are colour changing. Anyway Im not going to hog the thread anymore, now I know youre not being mean to my baby so Im happy, enjoy Maroon 5 .


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## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

thedogsmother said:


> I did read your post but obviously misread what angle you were coming from, I think my query with the reason for them not being bred is that how can you say they are too easily seen in one situation and not easily enough seen in another, either you want a dog who is easily seen or one who isnt unless non white gsds are colour changing. Anyway Im not going to hog the thread anymore, now I know youre not being mean to my baby so Im happy, enjoy Maroon 5 .


aw how could anyone be mean........white/pink/green/black he is still beautiful and I would steal him if I could. Im sure Akira would love a henrick shaped playmate


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## billie jo (Feb 17, 2011)

GSDlover4ever said:


> Do your research first..... Some people have no idea....
> 
> Have you personally had experience of the "crippled" dogs.... or do you believe everything you see on TV?


As a dog handler I like my dogs to at least be able to jump and run - what is now being shown in the ring by some, not all, 'Top Show Breeders,' - cannot even walk properly! Do not make excuses for these people - it is shameful and deplorable! The truth cannot be hidden - it is there for all to see.


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2011)

A GSD in your life you will not regret, but be prepared to put in time and effort to get the pet you want...still miss my Max...


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## GSDlover4ever (Feb 21, 2009)

billie jo said:


> As a dog handler I like my dogs to at least be able to jump and run - what is now being shown in the ring by some, not all, 'Top Show Breeders,' - cannot even walk properly! Do not make excuses for these people - it is shameful and deplorable! The truth cannot be hidden - it is there for all to see.


So you have had personal experience with these dogs that apparent ally can't walk and run?

Or have you just seen some very bad examples of show dogs on TV with week hocks.....?

Just because you have seen some bad examples picked on purpose for the TV program.... To show a negative impute on show dogs. Does not make them all like that.....


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## billie jo (Feb 17, 2011)

I am not having a 'pop' at the breeders - just the ones who breed the extreme dogs. You have to admit the tendency for the severe sloping backs is not good. Its been done over a period of time. Its man interferring again and thinking they know better than mother nature! In answer to your question, yes I do have experience with crippled dogs - I own one! She's a rescue, her name is Nell. It breaks my heart that she can't run with the others. But she's happy with us and she does have a good quality of life. My working dogs are Mali's. Both ex police. One ex Belguim/Kent police, the other ex Met. DJD is not something to be triffled with - it brings heartache for the owner and distress for the dog.


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## GSDlover4ever (Feb 21, 2009)

billie jo said:


> I am not having a 'pop' at the breeders - just the ones who breed the extreme dogs. You have to admit the tendency for the severe sloping backs is not good. Its been done over a period of time. Its man interferring again and thinking they know better than mother nature! In answer to your question, yes I do have experience with crippled dogs - I own one! She's a rescue, her name is Nell. It breaks my heart that she can't run with the others. But she's happy with us and she does have a good quality of life. My working dogs are Mali's. Both ex police. One ex Belguim/Kent police, the other ex Met. DJD is not something to be triffled with - it brings heartache for the owner and distress for the dog.


Does she have HD or ED?

I know a number of GSD's who don't have straight backs and the ones most people automatically assume as being unable to walk.... They are able to run all day long without a problem, some of them are so fast I can't even manage to get a good photo of them running, even though I have tried a million times. lol 
One of these dogs being my GSD rescue show line bitch.

Some people also assume that week hocks, none straight back.... means they will have bad hips, which isn't the case.

Personally I don't like extreme dogs, I prefer working line GSD's who are able to work.


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## billie jo (Feb 17, 2011)

Lol It took some time but we got there in the end - we both agree!

Not too sure about Nells - I think its her back, result of an injury. She had quite an horrific start. Brought into the practice where I was working, for xrays. After some questioning the demonic son of the breeder confessed he had thrown her on the floor to try and break her legs! He succeeded - he broke one of her back legs! He was only five - too young to prosecute! So I took the pup. All seemed well for a while, then she started walking weirdly. My vet then treated her for meningitis - we didn't do the spinal tap tho. But there was no temperature, the antibiotics did nothing. We have even tried hydro-therapy - no good - she panics too much in water. She's the sweetest little thing, I call her my gentle Nell. One of my friends is a vet and she has suggested an orthopedic vet that she knows - so that's the next step.

Dogs eh? What with Sammy, my Mali getting a gastric torsion and Nells, We are having a right time of it at the moment!! Sam is fine now, so time to concentrate on Nelly again - glad you like the working line of the GSD - I do too - very much.

Take care

Kaz


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## pamela Renfrew (Jun 9, 2010)

Ok..... I have just sat and read through this entire thread............. I would just like to say that I have had GSD's (All, All Black, Long Haired Males) for many, many years...... I can honestly say that no two are alike........ all completely different personalities..... why ? Because every one of them was brought up in completely different circumstances........ I am a great believer in that it is the owner and trainer who make the dog....... I have never had any trouble with any of my boys..... they have all been very healthy throughout their lives..... (Eukanuba).... very loyal and very faithful dogs who are always keen to please...... I just cant praise the breed enough..... As far as I am concerned, they are the best dogs in the entire world and hopefully I will never be without one..... I have never had a destructive dog either...... and believe me, being in the hotel trade for 25 years my dogs were left for 10 hours sometimes....... Not in the house though..... in their run and kennel outside... plenty of toys and rawhide.......
Anyway, I could go on and on and on about how wonderful these dogs are....... Go for it... get your puppy and enjoy every minute of its life with you......I have always had a pedigree GSD but, never even enquired about hips, elbows, eyes etc etc...... just picked my pup and taken him home and given him a wonderful life.......as they have given me wonderful memories.....that I will treasure for ever..... Pamx


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## logansmum (Feb 23, 2011)

Being a GSD owner too i have read through this entire thread with interest.

A GSD is a working breed, needs on going training and socialisation with all things, people and dogs. They grow into big strong dogs, loyal, bold, curious and protective. A mentally stimulated, worked, well nuorished GSD is a happy one.

My boy is now 3, german lines, stunning to look at and a temperment of pure gold. It taken alot of time, patience and consistant persistant training to mold him into the well mannered dog he is today.
His Sire is Euro Champion 2007 and hi Dam is also Sch 3.

Guess what? I got him from Ron at Sussex German Shepherd Rescue as an 8 month old! 



I hope you find a good sound pup... and enjoy!


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## AlphaPets (Feb 4, 2008)

Hi All,

I to would like advice on reputable breeders please. I have owned two GSD's in the past. My most recent dog a lovable Rhodesian Ridgeback, passed away. So I would like to carry out some extensive research with breeders, bloodlines, hip scores, temperament etc. 

My partner and I know quite a bit about puppy farms, as we help with various dog rescues. So will avoid puppy farms like the plague. 

When I researched Ridgebacks, the Dam and Sire's owners had me vetted first, so I would expect similar checks by GSD breeders.

Looking for recomendations that I can look into to avoid wasting time with internet searches that are breeding just for the money and not the breed.

Thanks


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