# My rabbits killed/injured a cat!!!



## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

HELP HELP EMERGENCY!!! I MIGHT GO TO JAIL!! I FEEL SO GUILTY!!!?
OK im 13 and i have two female bunnies. They both recently had kits. Just now a cat came and attacked the babies!!!! My biggest bunny went after the cat and bit its tail and my other one clawed its head i went out to help then my neighbour (cat owner) started screaming at me and told me to stand where i was. She climbed over to help her cat but got scared of my bunnies. Then my biggest rabbit started Stamping the cats chest whilst the other kicked its head. I pushed my bunnies away and picked up the cat. My neighbour said she's calling the police for animal abuse! The cat was shivering and crying. Its face is still bleeding badly. It didn't even try to fight back. I think its ribs are broken. I'm trying to help but my neighbour is screaming at me (understandable) and my mum keeps saying the cat deserved it. I think its going to die!!!! Will i go to jail? My neighbour thinks i set this up to happen!!!!! Please help!!


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

And i should clarify i don't breed rabbits! The lady i rescued them from told me that they were both spayed! Up until now i believed her.


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## Amelia66 (Feb 15, 2011)

no you wont go to jail its just a accident. 

However if you rabbits have just had babies why are they somewhere where a cat can get to them?


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## Amelia66 (Feb 15, 2011)

isa jelly said:


> And i should clarify i don't breed rabbits! The lady i rescued them from told me that they were both spayed! Up until now i believed her.


how long have you had them? are you sure they are not male and female? as you will need to get them spayed/ neutered asap to stop this from happening again.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Amelia66 said:


> no you wont go to jail its just a accident.
> 
> However if you rabbits have just had babies why are they somewhere where a cat can get to them?


I didn't know they were pregnant so they gave birth in a burrow they've been digging.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Amelia66 said:


> how long have you had them? are you sure they are not male and female? as you will need to get them spayed/ neutered asap to stop this from happening again.


I've had them for over a year and in sure they are both female. Dad says i can get them spayed as soon as the babies are old enough to leave


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## Amelia66 (Feb 15, 2011)

if you have had them over a year there is no way that they are both female unless you have wild rabbits in your garden. it is actually dangerous to let them dig too much, what if their other entrance ended up in another garden and they ran away/ got picked up by someone?? how do you know they have babies if they are in a burrow? if you have seen them you need to get them out of the ground and into a safe hutch with mum where you can keep an eye on them


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Amelia66 said:


> if you have had them over a year there is no way that they are both female unless you have wild rabbits in your garden. it is actually dangerous to let them dig too much, what if their other entrance ended up in another garden and they ran away/ got picked up by someone?? how do you know they have babies if they are in a burrow? if you have seen them you need to get them out of the ground and into a safe hutch with mum where you can keep an eye on them


My best friends male bunny was over for a week last months. But i thought my Bunnies were spayed you see. In sure the burrow doesnt go into another garden because my neighbour (not the one screaming at my mum right now) re did the fence and he said it goes 8feet down and i haven't seen them dig anymore dirt up and they always come out when i call there names. The burrow is massive and deep (not deeper than the fence) so i can't reach them. There is no other exit or entrance. What should i do?


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## Ang2 (Jun 15, 2012)

Popcorn anyone?


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

isa jelly said:


> My best friends male bunny was over for a week last months.


There's your answer. 
Gestation period of rabbits is 31 days = 1 month.

While there is a duty of care on you as a rabbit owner, to protect them from predators (eg Cats), you will find that cats aren't protected in law either.

I suggest you do the best you can to get control of your rabbits and their babies, make a much more secure environment for them, and get them spayed ASAP.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

The rabbits and babies are outside where a fox could walk off with them?? Am I reading this right? Or do you let them out under supervision sometimes in daylight hours and have someone watching them while they are out?


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

You can tell school holidays are starting


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## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

isa jelly said:


> re did the fence and he said it goes 8feet down


You aren't serious :lol:


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

Jackanooooory.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

They have a massive secure hutch that is Locked at night but in the day they both have run of the garden.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Calvine said:


> The rabbits and babies are outside where a fox could walk off with them?? Am I reading this right? Or do you let them out under supervision sometimes in daylight hours and have someone watching them while they are out?


They are locked in at night where no fox could get them. My brother was supposed to be watching them when the cat sneaked in. I hadn't put them in yet because it was still light. Please understand i am a good owner and did loads of research before i got them. They even live inside half the year for winter. I just made this mistake and i do look after them properly. This shouldn't of happened.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Cookieandme said:


> You aren't serious :lol:


Seriously. We had really strong wind that took it down and he said he'd do extra for the rabbits. Hes obsessed with his flowers and would rather die than see them get destroyed. I wouldnt lie about a fence guys


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Nonnie said:


> Jackanooooory.


What does that mean? I'm stupid enough to let THIS happen, trust me I'm stupid enough to not know what that means!


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

It survived!!!!! It wont try to tackle my wild dogs again!
OK i seem to be getting a lot of hate for this. People are thinking I'm irresponsible and shouldn't have these pets. I understand why people are think this, its a very irresponsible thing to happen. But seriously it was one honest mistake after another. 
We were lied to by a previous owner who obviously wanted to get rid of them as quickly as possible. 
My bunnies and my best friends one were bonded when he was three months old. This happened when he was four months old and as soon as i saw him do anything i separated them because i thought he was asserting dominance.
Im not lying about anything because i actually want help. My rabbits are taken care of


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)




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## Blaise in Surrey (Jun 10, 2014)

Is the OP known to the forum? Is that why people are being so harsh?


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

BlaiseinHampshire said:


> Is the OP known to the forum? Is that why people are being so harsh?


Not really. I personally get sick and tired of these type of threads..It is obvious to anyone with knowledge of both cats and rabbits that this is just one big fairy tale...

We get a lot of it this time of year 

Now if I am wrong then I will apologise, however, I would place a bet that I am not wrong :thumbsup:


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

TBH this is very hard to believe.The male rabbit was with them last month. Its the 16th today. So if he had sex with them on the 1st of june they would have been born around the beginning of this month which makes them around 2 weeks old so barely leaving the nest which apparently is in an 8ft burrow. So how do you know they had both had kits when the kits are in an 8ft burrow and probably still in the nest. :confused1:
I'm kinda confuzzled : but hey ho.....each to their own!


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Lopside said:


> TBH this is very hard to believe.The male rabbit was with them last month. Its the 16th today. So if he had sex with them on the 1st of june they would have been born around the beginning of this month which makes them around 2 weeks old so barely leaving the nest which apparently is in an 8ft burrow. So how do you know they had both had kits when the kits are in an 8ft burrow and probably still in the nest. :confused1:
> I'm kinda confuzzled : but hey ho.....each to their own!


It wasn't exactly a month though. And i have seen all of the bunnies and they are starting to each pellets and such so i think they are around a month old of something. The male HAS been over before but as i said he was only three months old. And the burrow is MASSIVE. Trust me guys. We tried to see how far down it goes and it was so much. That's why my neighbour dug the new fence that deep. 
I really don't know why people are being this harsh. If i can i will try and get pictures of what happened to the poor cat. And underground pictures of the burrow (if that's possible) I'll show you the babies as well. Honestly i have told 0 lies in this entire thread. So instead of ridiculing me can you please just give me ideas of how to help the animals! I'm trying to be as mature about this as possible. Its not easy seeing your beautiful pet try to rip off another animals face. I'm as confused as you guys. I didn't know they could even do that. I've seen them attack a mop before 

The babies are OK now, they are outside in a makeshift run.

I'm going to try to get proof so people can stop thinking I'm lying.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

StormyThai said:


> Not really. I personally get sick and tired of these type of threads..It is obvious to anyone with knowledge of both cats and rabbits that this is just one big fairy tale...
> 
> We get a lot of it this time of year
> 
> Now if I am wrong then I will apologise, however, I would place a bet that I am not wrong :thumbsup:


How much are you willing to lose? 
Seriously though i didn't know rabbits could do that. Because they are prey animals i thought they would've just ran away, however the cat was one of those munchkin ones and my neighbour dangerously overfeeds it (that thing is always eating!!!) And I've never seen it run faster than a light jog. My rabbits are pretty big as well. Do you want pictures?


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## Amelia66 (Feb 15, 2011)

isa jelly said:


> It wasn't exactly a month though. And i have seen all of the bunnies and they are starting to each pellets and such so i think they are around a month old of something. The male HAS been over before but as i said he was only three months old. And the burrow is MASSIVE. Trust me guys. We tried to see how far down it goes and it was so much. That's why my neighbour dug the new fence that deep.
> I really don't know why people are being this harsh. If i can i will try and get pictures of what happened to the poor cat. And underground pictures of the burrow (if that's possible) I'll show you the babies as well. Honestly i have told 0 lies in this entire thread. So instead of ridiculing me can you please just give me ideas of how to help the animals! I'm trying to be as mature about this as possible. Its not easy seeing your beautiful pet try to rip off another animals face. I'm as confused as you guys. I didn't know they could even do that. I've seen them attack a mop before
> 
> The babies are OK now, they are outside in a makeshift run.
> ...


ok i will try to help

1. you should not be brining over a outside rabbit of either sex for a 'playdate' as this could be bad for your current rabbits bond. the only reason there were no fights is that they were un neutered with a male. please do not bring this rabbit over again there is no need.

2. it is not safe for rabbits to be in a burrow in the garden, no ifs ands or buts. *ALL* burrows have 2 entrances as its a saftey feature the fact you cant find one is worrying. fill the burrow in and do not let them make another one. fill in their attemts. if a burrow collapsed with one inside how would you feel then? unnecessary risk.

3. Baby rabbits need to stay in the hutch with mum. They are too small to be free roaming and if you want them to have outside time need to be in a secure run. being so small any predator could come along an pick them up [this include some birds too hence why they need to be enclosed]

4. if there are cats about, and you know there are then you need to make the necessary arrangements to keep them safe. weather that being making sure cats dont come into your garden or keep an eye on them when outside at all times!

5. they both need to be spayed asap.

6. Unless their was a digger involved next doors fence does not go 8ft down. this would be a massive task and involve a lot of money. just because he says he has, does not mean they have done!


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

Why is it that this keeps popping into my head 

[youtube_browser]XcxKIJTb3Hg[/youtube_browser]


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Amelia66 said:


> ok i will try to help
> 
> 1. you should not be brining over a outside rabbit of either sex for a 'playdate' as this could be bad for your current rabbits bond. the only reason there were no fights is that they were un neutered with a male. please do not bring this rabbit over again there is no need.
> 
> ...


OK thanks for actually starting to believe
1:there is NO way any other bunnies are getting into my garden! I'm not doing this again!
2: last year i saw them digging another entrance but i stopped them because i thought they 
were starting another burrow :/
3: my neighbour (the kind one) has agreed to help me catch all the babies, they are going to live in the hutch. And trust me its big enough.
4: my mum says she's going to buy that spray that keeps cats away and she might set up sprinklers for night time! 
5: dads willing to pay for the two surgeries as soon as i rehome the babies when they are old enough.
6: i remember it took ages. He got some of his friends and they dug a thin strip straight down and filled it with some liquid and he said it would harden. Then a week later he put up a new fence which is a lot more sturdy than the last one.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

StormyThai said:


> Why is it that this keeps popping into my head
> 
> [youtube_browser]XcxKIJTb3Hg[/youtube_browser]


My phones not letting me watch it. What happens?


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## maisiecat (Jul 27, 2011)

isa jelly said:


> They are locked in at night where no fox could get them. My brother was supposed to be watching them when the cat sneaked in. I hadn't put them in yet because it was still light. Please understand i am a good owner and did loads of research before i got them. They even live inside half the year for winter. I just made this mistake and i do look after them properly. This shouldn't of happened.


Foxes don't only hunt at night. I lost 2 bunnies to a fox, they were both in a secure hutch. Found a body on the lawn with a rip in the shoulder and the other huddled up in a corner, she died later.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

maisiecat said:


> Foxes don't only hunt at night. I lost 2 bunnies to a fox, they were both in a secure hutch. Found a body on the lawn with a rip in the shoulder and the other huddled up in a corner, she died later.


Yes...I've seen them take a hen in broad daylight with people around too.


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## Summersky (Aug 11, 2012)

Yes, some rabbits will chase or attack cats.

But you won't be held responsible, and you certainly won't go to prison.

Now you have to protect your rabbits, and create a more secure enclosure.

They might be the injured ones next time.

Rehome the babies responsibly when they are old enough. Where are they now? A burrow in the rain like we have had will be a very bad place. Do you know which is the Mum? Or have both had kits?

Then get your two to the vets for sexing, vaccinating (needs to be done annually) and spay/neutering.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

maisiecat said:


> Foxes don't only hunt at night. I lost 2 bunnies to a fox, they were both in a secure hutch. Found a body on the lawn with a rip in the shoulder and the other huddled up in a corner, she died later.


OK i will keep an eye out. I've never seen foxes around my area but there are loads of farms so it is a risk. Sorry about your bunnies.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Summersky said:


> Yes, some rabbits will chase or attack cats.
> 
> But you won't be held responsible, and you certainly won't go to prison.
> 
> ...


When it rains, they never get wet down there because it is soooooooo deep. It is Amazingly deep. They have both had kits. You can tell who belongs to who. My red Rex has ALL ginger babies. Every single one is red. And my cross has 5. Three black and white and two pure black ones.
They have had their vhd but they need another myxi jab. We will sort that out when they are taken back for spay surgeries. 
Thanks


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## Summersky (Aug 11, 2012)

The annual combi vaccine now covers both.

So, if the burrows are deep, and you have seen the babies, presumably they are very mobile and active.

It won't be long before they too are breeding and colonise your garden.

Please beware. We have here the products of over and inbreeding.

Very nasty.


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

isa jelly said:


> My red Rex has ALL ginger babies. Every single one is red. And my cross has 5. Three black and white and two pure black ones.


How do you know for sure which belongs to which doe? 
What colour is the father?
And what colour is your cross?

I find it unlikely that the "Red" (no such colour in rex, btw) would have had all ginger babies and the other black/black and white if they were sired by the same buck doe to the fact that "Red" (I assume you mean Orange) is Agouti based and Black is non-agouti.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

MerlinsMum said:


> How do you know for sure which belongs to which doe?
> What colour is the father?
> And what colour is your cross?
> 
> I find it unlikely that the "Red" (no such colour in rex, btw) would have had all ginger babies and the other black/black and white if they were sired by the same buck doe to the fact that "Red" (I assume you mean Orange) is Agouti based and Black is non-agouti.


She honestly did have all ginger babies. But two have black and brown points, as in nose and ears.
The father is a white and brown dutch
My cross is white and grey.
I CAN show pics if you want


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

isa jelly said:


> dutch
> My cross is white and grey.
> I CAN show pics if you want


That would be lovely


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

i'm always up for cute baby bunny pics.....lets see!

Just a point to raise.....if they are big enough to be bombing around the garden & difficult to catch, as you say, then they are probably between 4-8 weeks old. In which case housing them all in the same hutch until you rehome them is a bad idea as you will have infinite amounts of rabbits if you do not rehome them all immediately. Plus by the sounds of the litters you will need a massive hutch. Best think about boy/girl accomodation. Have you sexed them yet? 

Looking forwards to seeing the photos


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

MerlinsMum said:


> That would be lovely


OK i will show you the ones i have saved on my phone because i cant take any new ones because its quite late










That's lulu and ginger
I cant seem to put pictures of the babies because it says the pictures need a URL to post??? I haven't put them on any websites. How can i upload pictures of the babies and father?


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

As far as I know you have to upload photos to a server. For example Photobucket. Then use the URL to link. 
The photo you uploaded isn't showing on my laptop but the URL links me to a website called budgetbunny.ca .....strange...:confused1:


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Lopside said:


> i'm always up for cute baby bunny pics.....lets see!
> 
> Just a point to raise.....if they are big enough to be bombing around the garden & difficult to catch, as you say, then they are probably between 4-8 weeks old. In which case housing them all in the same hutch until you rehome them is a bad idea as you will have infinite amounts of rabbits if you do not rehome them all immediately. Plus by the sounds of the litters you will need a massive hutch. Best think about boy/girl accomodation. Have you sexed them yet?
> 
> Looking forwards to seeing the photos


In new to this. How do i add images?


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

is this the photo you were trying to share?


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

I use photobucket


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Lopside said:


> is this the photo you were trying to share?


Yeah that is lulu and ginger. They were on that website because i posted it there for a you tuber called budget bunny. I dont see why my other ones wont post.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Hopefully it will work now. Don't mind the captions i was snap chatting toy friends! These babies were so hard to catch :O









That should be baby fudge










That should be baby smoky


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Can you see them?


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

I can't, can you?


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

Hahaha I love memes! One for every situation!


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

isa jelly said:


> Yeah that is lulu and ginger. They were on that website because i posted it there for a you tuber called budget bunny. I dont see why my other ones wont post.


Lulu is a steel coloured Butterfly-pattern Lop (Dwarf Lop most likely) - Ginger is a Cinnamon Mini rex.
Do you have any photos of the "father" of their litters?


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## Summersky (Aug 11, 2012)

MerlinsMum said:


> That would be lovely


Oh we always LOVE photos on here!


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

Summersky said:


> Oh we always LOVE photos on here!


And cake...... :arf:


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

Did someone say cake???


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

i can't see them either.




so going from what you've said, babies will be 4-5 weeks old now? time to start looking another big hutch and take them all to the vet for a check over (now you can actually see them) and sexing, so you know what homes to advertise for. i'm not sure about the sexual maturity age as every site seems to give a different age (depending on breed it seems?) but i'm sure the time is approaching to separate them all off. you will need to start socializing them as well now, it will be a very time consuming job!

how is the cat now? has anyone spoken to the neighbor since? it couldn't have been even remotely serious if you knew within 30mins that the cat was ok, or did you mean it was still breathing at that time? personally, i'd be going round to check up on the cat if it was injured by my animal. but of course given your age it is your parents responsibility (as are the costs of the rabbits).
it is also their responsibility to ensure that a secure run is put in place to protect the rabbits from predators- and yes, this includes cats. 
and i'd suggest that if the burrow runs as deep as you say with only one exit then you Really need to get that filled in ASAP! if any of it did cave in with someone inside you wouldn't be able to tell in time, and digging it out would take hours. it may be a novel idea having a burrow in the garden (when my bunny burrowed the rockery i loved it, but made sure Both exits were always open, and only let her dig where heavy root growth was for wall stability) but if it runs too deep it can be dangerous.

really hoping by the time i post this there will be bunny pictures! :thumbsup:


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

I'll get Georgia to send me a picture of him. He is a brown and white dutch.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

kodakkuki said:


> i can't see them either.
> 
> so going from what you've said, babies will be 4-5 weeks old now? time to start looking another big hutch and take them all to the vet for a check over (now you can actually see them) and sexing, so you know what homes to advertise for. i'm not sure about the sexual maturity age as every site seems to give a different age (depending on breed it seems?) but i'm sure the time is approaching to separate them all off. you will need to start socializing them as well now, it will be a very time consuming job!
> 
> ...


I'll just write a link so you can see the babies OK

http://s1369.photobucket.com/user/i...ds/1404678171440_zps3432f1fc.jpg.html?filters[user]=140865155&filters[recent]=1&sort=1&o=3

That should show baby shadow if you follow the link

http://s1369.photobucket.com/user/i...ds/1404678175278_zps71439011.jpg.html?filters[user]=140865155&filters[recent]=1&sort=1&o=2

This should be baby smoky

http://s1369.photobucket.com/user/i...ds/1404678177770_zpsda8df2c5.jpg.html?filters[user]=140865155&filters[recent]=1&sort=1&o=0

And this should be fudge.

Follow the links because i cant upload pictures properly here.

My dads buying a shed to put them in with a massive run in the summer holidays!


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

kodakkuki said:


> i can't see them either.
> 
> so going from what you've said, babies will be 4-5 weeks old now? time to start looking another big hutch and take them all to the vet for a check over (now you can actually see them) and sexing, so you know what homes to advertise for. i'm not sure about the sexual maturity age as every site seems to give a different age (depending on breed it seems?) but i'm sure the time is approaching to separate them all off. you will need to start socializing them as well now, it will be a very time consuming job!
> 
> ...


I haven't spoken to my neighbour (in sure i wont be ever again) but i saw the cat in the window on the way to school. It still has scratches on its face which are still quite red. Its belly had claw marks too (it was lying down watching me) its quite a lazy cat so i cant tell if its less active than before.
The post where i was explaining what happed makes it seem a bit more intense that it actually was! I'm sorry but i was still shocked and wrote as much as i could.


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

isa jelly said:


> I haven't spoken to my neighbour (in sure i wont be ever again) but i saw the cat in the window on the way to school. It still has scratches on its face which are still quite red. Its belly had claw marks too (it was lying down watching me) its quite a lazy cat so i cant tell if its less active than before.
> The post where i was explaining what happed makes it seem a bit more intense that it actually was! I'm sorry but i was still shocked and wrote as much as i could.


aah, because the sudden recovery from broken ribs kinda smelt of bullpoop at the start!

as i said in that post, i hadn't been meaning for You to speak to the neighbor- you're a minor and it isn't up to you, but rather the legal owner of the animals- ie your parents. i think it'd go a long way to salvaging a neutral relationship with them- last thing you need is an angry, vengeful neighbor (trust me!) so once they calm down about her reaction (which i do understand, although no one was at fault more than anyone else) maybe suggest they ask if everything is ok? and explain that your rabbits will be outside at times, and if her cat gets in their run they Will defend themselves, as she learned earlier etc...

no idea when you mean by 'summer holidays' as here that is right now, but you do need to get something for separating them off when they reach the appropriate age... or are you planning on moving girls to the shed and keeping boys in the hutch and makeshift run?


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

kodakkuki said:


> aah, because the sudden recovery from broken ribs kinda smelt of bullpoop at the start!
> 
> as i said in that post, i hadn't been meaning for You to speak to the neighbor- you're a minor and it isn't up to you, but rather the legal owner of the animals- ie your parents. i think it'd go a long way to salvaging a neutral relationship with them- last thing you need is an angry, vengeful neighbor (trust me!) so once they calm down about her reaction (which i do understand, although no one was at fault more than anyone else) maybe suggest they ask if everything is ok? and explain that your rabbits will be outside at times, and if her cat gets in their run they Will defend themselves, as she learned earlier etc...
> 
> no idea when you mean by 'summer holidays' as here that is right now, but you do need to get something for separating them off when they reach the appropriate age... or are you planning on moving girls to the shed and keeping boys in the hutch and makeshift run?


I might've over exaggerated when it came to the broken ribs! Sorry i was scared! My mum will go over soon to talk to her. She says she will pay any vet fees if its that bad.

Our summer holidays start next week. We are putting all the boys in the shed and girls in the hutch because there are more girls than boys.

None of them are fighting yet, when do they start that?


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

kodakkuki said:


> aah, because the sudden recovery from broken ribs kinda smelt of bullpoop at the start!
> 
> as i said in that post, i hadn't been meaning for You to speak to the neighbor- you're a minor and it isn't up to you, but rather the legal owner of the animals- ie your parents. i think it'd go a long way to salvaging a neutral relationship with them- last thing you need is an angry, vengeful neighbor (trust me!) so once they calm down about her reaction (which i do understand, although no one was at fault more than anyone else) maybe suggest they ask if everything is ok? and explain that your rabbits will be outside at times, and if her cat gets in their run they Will defend themselves, as she learned earlier etc...
> 
> no idea when you mean by 'summer holidays' as here that is right now, but you do need to get something for separating them off when they reach the appropriate age... or are you planning on moving girls to the shed and keeping boys in the hutch and makeshift run?


Mmiigghhtt have over exaggerated when it came to broken ribs. My bad.
Our summer holidays start next week.
We are moving the boys in the shed whilst girls in hutch. There are more boys than girls. They will all get a nice new run

They havent started fighting yet. When does that happen?


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Sorry for posting the same thing twice. I thought i accidently deleted the first one :/


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

isa jelly said:


> I'll just write a link so you can see the babies OK


sorry none of the links are coming up for me


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

isa jelly said:


> I'll just write a link so you can see the babies OK
> 
> http://s1369.photobucket.com/user/i...ds/1404678171440_zps3432f1fc.jpg.html?filters[user]=140865155&filters[recent]=1&sort=1&o=3
> 
> ...


found the pictures



kodakkuki said:


> no idea when you mean by 'summer holidays' as here that is right now


summer holidays here start on tuesday



isa jelly said:


> They havent started fighting yet. When does that happen?


as soon as their hormones kick in, any where from around 10/12 weeks and up


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Lil Miss said:


> found the pictures
> 
> summer holidays here start on tuesday
> 
> as soon as their hormones kick in, any where from around 10/12 weeks and up


Yeah sorry i know i shouldn't trance them but he was like that from me checking whether he was male or female so i thought i night as well post a picture. Shall i try to get pictures of the fence so people can see that i was telling the truth about how far down it goes?


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

I wouldn't bother. The depth of your fence is not really that important in the grand scheme of things. Maybe read the notes on rabbit care instead?


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

isa jelly said:


> Yeah sorry i know i shouldn't trance them but he was like that from me checking whether he was male or female so i thought i night as well post a picture. Shall i try to get pictures of the fence so people can see that i was telling the truth about how far down it goes?


for future reference, the longer they are kept like that the more strain that's put on the heart- much better to sex them upright if you can anyway... but it is a two person task- one holding the other checking... your vet could show you how i'm sure for future reference.

as for the fence, short of digging it up im not sure how you'd manage that anyway- unless you have an underground scanner :confused1:

as lopside said, i think you need to find some good reference books and websites on rabbits- i was about your age when i started to really research different animals and their specific needs... this is where your biology classes etc will start coming in handy! :thumbsup:

i'd really, really, really recommend you get your girls spayed ASAP along with any girls you are keeping, and advise the new owners to do the same- maybe give them your rabbit-vets number? (i say this after nursing a dog all day who is suffering from a womb infection, and will be getting spayed tomorrow to remove the infection if she makes it through the night- to put her under for the op today would have killed her there and then. so we aren't just saying it to be picky, it really is a lifesaver done before anything has time to happen!)


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

kodakkuki said:


> for future reference, the longer they are kept like that the more strain that's put on the heart- much better to sex them upright if you can anyway... but it is a two person task- one holding the other checking... your vet could show you how i'm sure for future reference.
> 
> as for the fence, short of digging it up im not sure how you'd manage that anyway- unless you have an underground scanner :confused1:
> 
> ...


They will be spayed as soon as babies are old enough to leave  i read that they can get cancer if they aren't spayed and that is the worst thing ever because i love my bunnies more than anything. Im going to keep using this website to ask questions on rabbit care because even though i read tons of things before i got them, there's still thongs i need to know  thanks everyone


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## Treaclesmum (Sep 26, 2011)

Hi, can you get a rabbit run and put it over the place where the burrow is? Then hopefully the parents and babies will come up into the run and not be loose in the garden


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Treaclesmum said:


> Hi, can you get a rabbit run and put it over the place where the burrow is? Then hopefully the parents and babies will come up into the run and not be loose in the garden


We put a makeshift run there but my dads getting a big shed with a run so hopefully that will be soon. Thanks for all the help!


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

UPDATE!!! today when i was at school my mum went over to the neighbours house. The neighbour isn't angry Anymore and the cat has been to the vet. Its fine overall but might have some nasty scars on its face.


Every single baby has left the burrow and are now in the run. The WONT stop binkying. Seriously they are ALWAYS binkying. I guess they are just happy about being alive :3 
They are all starting to trust me more. When its treat time, all of gingers babies run up to me for crumb. LuLus ones still have to trust me! I think as soon as i catch one of lulus babies i must take pictures because they are the most ADORABLE things ever! Just imagen little fluffy black and white balls of floof darting everywhere!!! Thanks for everyone's help!! Apart from the people that made fun of me when i was in shock. Those guys are jerks. I don't care though  as long as the kitty and my bunnies are fine!


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

no one made fun of you, i think people were just skeptical, it did sound very far fetched and because im guessing you are still only young? it probably wasnt composed in the best way, we do get a fair few trolls on here, people joining and posting the most rediculas stories just to try and get a raise out of people

im glad they are all doing well, please try and catch them though and get them safely in a hutch not the burrow, as stated the burrow WILL have a second exit some where regardless of if you can see it or not 
this is what rabbit burrows look like









have a look at this page too, play the video at the top
BBC Nature - Underground worlds caught on camera

and yes those rabbits were actually pet domestic rabbits not wild rabbits


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Lil Miss said:


> no one made fun of you, i think people were just skeptical, it did sound very far fetched and because im guessing you are still only young? it probably wasnt composed in the best way, we do get a fair few trolls on here, people joining and posting the most rediculas stories just to try and get a raise out of people
> 
> im glad they are all doing well, please try and catch them though and get them safely in a hutch not the burrow, as stated the burrow WILL have a second exit some where regardless of if you can see it or not
> this is what rabbit burrows look like
> ...


Wow that's awesome! I actually do think that my bunnies burrow is like that because you can never put something straight down the holes go off to different sites. After the babies are gone i don't really understand why people want me to destroy the burrow. It can provide safety if something terrible happens and they don't really dig anymore. Im not saying i definitely wont fill it, i just want to know why i should. And if ANYTHING i have said in this entire thread came off as rude to ANYONE I'm sorry. I didn't want it to sound (look?) Like that


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

while a burrow could provide safety from a predator, it poses many safety risks in itself, and keeping your buns safe from a predator is your responsibility with good strong predator proof acomidation.

a burrow can collapse in on itself trapping the rabbits within and suffocating them
some predators can also fit down the holes and corner the rabbits, other predators that cant can dig up the burrow
the burrows can flood and drown your rabbits
you have no idea where the other exits are and they can easily dig out of your garden and escape or get accidentally killed by cars on roads or dogs in other gardens 

if you arent in the garden with your rabbits they should be confined to their shed and run for their own safety, and if their run is on grass you should add a layer of strong welded wire mesh, not chicken wire, under neath the turf to prevent them digging out and predators digging in


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Lil Miss said:


> while a burrow could provide safety from a predator, it poses many safety risks in itself, and keeping your buns safe from a predator is your responsibility with good strong predator proof acomidation.
> 
> a burrow can collapse in on itself trapping the rabbits within and suffocating them
> some predators can also fit down the holes and corner the rabbits, other predators that cant can dig up the burrow
> ...


D: i don't want my bunnies to suffocate!!! The burrow is going


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## Wiz201 (Jun 13, 2012)

isa jelly said:


> My phones not letting me watch it. What happens?


White rabbit jumps around killing three of the knights, its very funny!
Watership down also springs to mind with General Woundwort. Your rabbits were only doing what comes naturally to them, and I would never let them live in a burrow in the garden.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Wiz201 said:


> White rabbit jumps around killing three of the knights, its very funny!
> Watership down also springs to mind with General Woundwort. Your rabbits were only doing what comes naturally to them, and I would never let them live in a burrow in the garden.


Lol! But they have a hutch. They're just let out in the day


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

isa jelly said:


> Lol! But they have a hutch. They're just let out in the day


but they have both raised litters in the burrow, so aren't really using their hutches when given the option!

(and what LM said about predators- i have a very small dog and a cat that could easily fit down a rabbit hole. bambi could probably even outrun the bun in the burrow  (she's only 3lbs, so really small!) )


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

kodakkuki said:


> (and *what LM said about predators*- i have a very small dog and a cat that could easily fit down a rabbit hole. bambi could probably even outrun the bun in the burrow  (she's only 3lbs, so really small!) )


Rats can easily fit down rabbit holes and they can and will attack rabbits, even larger babies. You might not think you have rats around but they are more common than most people know.

As well as rats there are stoats, weasels, foxes, badgers, many birds of prey, cats, even corvids such as crows and magpies will attack young rabbits.

Some years ago a friend of mine had a distraught and angry rabbit owner came hammering at the door of my friend's house claiming his young cat had killed and taken one of their young rabbits.

His cat was a rescue (I was present when he was rescued with his littermates, only one of which survived as they had rampant calicivirus) - my friend nursed him to health but as a result the kitten had only 50% sight in one eye, with the other eye totally blind.

It turned out that of course this disabled cat had been easily able to catch and kill the young rabbits (Netherland Dwarfs) because the owner was allowing them free run of the garden with no protection from predators 

All owners of animals have a duty of care - which does include protecting them from predators as far as possible. As nice as it seems to have "free range" rabbits, you do have to counter that with the fact they may be targetted by cats,. dogs, foxes, badgers, birds of prey and the like. And if you fail to protect them, it may come under the Animal Welfare Act.


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## Blackcats (Apr 13, 2013)

To be fair, if this story is true, it really shouldn't be the OP on here seeking advice and stressing.

But the parents of the household as I really do not believe the OP is older enough and mature enough to be classed as the owner. Being so young, may be why it sounds so unbelievable. Not the OP who is the irresponsible one, but the parents IMHO.


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## farhana (Mar 15, 2014)

I'd love to see more pictures of the babies and the parents. Love to see bunny babies!

Just thought I'd add:

To attach pictures to a post you can upload it directly to the post instead of using photobucket.

Just click on Manage Attachments on the reply page, Browse for your picture (the box says choose file or browse) select it and then click upload. After you're done you can return to your reply and continue typing or just submit.

If you do use photobucket copy the code that begins with


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

Looking at other forums you were advised practically unanimously by other people to close the burrow before and after you realised that Ginger had escaped and been with next doors rabbit. There are some really knowledgeable people on this forum. Please do heed their advice, for the sake of your rabbit's wellbeing. They only have short lives, every day should be precious. Your parents seem pretty good in that they are facilitating you keeping the rabbits. If you read all the advice you are being given I'm sure you will get their support. 
In the mean time, unless you want a repeat of this situation, you need to keep all the rabbits confined to a run and hutch. A new fence may have gone up but rabbits are clever creatures and there's no guarantee that she won't escape to next doors garden again. They can get pregnant again very quickly after having a litter. Ditto with the kits. They must be coming up to 8 weeks now.they need sexing and separating.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Lopside said:


> Looking at other forums you were advised practically unanimously by other people to close the burrow before and after you realised that Ginger had escaped and been with next doors rabbit. There are some really knowledgeable people on this forum. Please do heed their advice, for the sake of your rabbit's wellbeing. They only have short lives, every day should be precious. Your parents seem pretty good in that they are facilitating you keeping the rabbits. If you read all the advice you are being given I'm sure you will get their support.
> In the mean time, unless you want a repeat of this situation, you need to keep all the rabbits confined to a run and hutch. A new fence may have gone up but rabbits are clever creatures and there's no guarantee that she won't escape to next doors garden again. They can get pregnant again very quickly after having a litter. Ditto with the kits. They must be coming up to 8 weeks now.they need sexing and separating.


Are you sure that was me? Next door do have a rabbit but in 100 percent sure it was with my friends Bunny.


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

Blackcats said:


> To be fair, if this story is true, it really shouldn't be the OP on here seeking advice and stressing.
> 
> But the parents of the household as I really do not believe the OP is older enough and mature enough to be classed as the owner. Being so young, may be why it sounds so unbelievable. Not the OP who is the irresponsible one, but the parents IMHO.


i agree that the responsibility lies with thew parents, but they are the OPs pets in the eyes of her (? sorry, assuming isa is a girl?  ) parents. whhen i was 13 my parents would tell me to go look things up for the pets, and they would trust my judgement as far as you can trust a 13yr old!!
i'm very glad that she is here asking- i'm sure that everything suggested to her she is going and telling her parents, as they have already agreed to secure a larger enclosure for the buns! 
yes, they should have done the research before getting their child pets, but now she has them she is doing her best for them... can't fault her on that one bit! :thumbup:


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

Yes I'm sure it was you. Same stories. Same names. Not that it really matters. What matters is the wellbeing of the rabbits now.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Lopside said:


> Yes I'm sure it was you. Same stories. Same names. Not that it really matters. What matters is the wellbeing of the rabbits now.


The thing is this thread is the only one i posted on this website. But did you see it on any different sites because i asked for help on a site called bun space...


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

How are they getting on today?


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

EMERGENCY!!! Lately I've been noticing lulu licking her behind excessively. My mum went to pets at home and got fly strike spray. I checked her and i was in tears. Fur is missing from her rear end behind her leg. Her bum is matted with fur. I immediately put her in a shallow tub of lukewarm water to rinse everything off but not a lot happened. I dried her and sprayed her again. In the morning the vet will be called. She has been licking the area less now. There were no maggots and i don't remember seeing any eggs. Whats wrong my my baby lu?!? Is she's going to die from this?? She has been going to the toilet normally and eating normally but im sooo scared for my baby right now. They are the first bunnies i have ever had and it breaks my heart to see her uncomfortable. Should i carry on washing her bum. Should i chop off some fur from behind? IS THE VET GOING TO PUT HER DOWN?!?! she's not acting any differently at all. I've been watching her closely. If she dies how could i or her babies or ginger cope without her :'( whats the vet going to do? Shall i carry on with the spray? Please help this is a disaster!


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## kodakkuki (Aug 8, 2011)

isa jelly said:


> EMERGENCY!!! Lately I've been noticing lulu licking her behind excessively. My mum went to pets at home and got fly strike spray. I checked her and i was in tears. Fur is missing from her rear end behind her leg. Her bum is matted with fur. I immediately put her in a shallow tub of lukewarm water to rinse everything off but not a lot happened. I dried her and sprayed her again. In the morning the vet will be called. She has been licking the area less now. There were no maggots and i don't remember seeing any eggs. Whats wrong my my baby lu?!? Is she's going to die from this?? She has been going to the toilet normally and eating normally but im sooo scared for my baby right now. They are the first bunnies i have ever had and it breaks my heart to see her uncomfortable. Should i carry on washing her bum. Should i chop off some fur from behind? IS THE VET GOING TO PUT HER DOWN?!?! she's not acting any differently at all. I've been watching her closely. If she dies how could i or her babies or ginger cope without her :'( whats the vet going to do? Shall i carry on with the spray? Please help this is a disaster!


it's ok, calm down- i'm assuming you're with her now and if you are then you being upset isn't going to help her. get a wee cuppa tea and calm a wee bit. if your mum or dad is to phone up your vets number there will be an answering machine message that will give her the number of the out of hours vet they use. you can then explain to them over the phone what the problem is and they can advise on what to do from there (there's no consultation fee for a phone call). 
i swouldn't spray her anymore though until you've spoken with the vet- just in case.


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

could it be urine scald down her legs? the vets wont put her down but you need to have a look at how you are keeping them, buns shouldnt get mucky bums or urine scald if they are being kept correctly, she could have been sitting in her own mess in the burrow and the urine can burn/irritate them, i wouldnt spray her with the rear gaurd as it could agrivate damaged skin, get her to the vets first thing tomorow and see what they say

if you can get a picture we may be able to put your mind more at rest tonight


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

Put her in a hutch on her own with a lot of clean bedding, and keep an eye on her.

If her babies are already running about then they are probably weaned - but do get them in a hutch as well, you will need to make sure and feed them appropriately.

All these rabbits need to be in hutches, on clean bedding, and fed properly right now - and also need to be monitored closely.

If they are left as they are, then you may experience some losses. There is a reason why rabbits are kept and bred as they are nowadays, as opposed to being allowed to make burrows.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Lil Miss said:


> could it be urine scald down her legs? the vets wont put her down but you need to have a look at how you are keeping them, buns shouldnt get mucky bums or urine scald if they are being kept correctly, she could have been sitting in her own mess in the burrow and the urine can burn/irritate them, i wouldnt spray her with the rear gaurd as it could agrivate damaged skin, get her to the vets first thing tomorow and see what they say
> 
> if you can get a picture we may be able to put your mind more at rest tonight


But her and ginger are never in the burrow anymore?! She runs around everywhere and never really stays still. Even at night i can hear her bouncing up and down the hutch ramp. The hutch is always clean because mum forces me to Clean it once a week in winter and twice a week in summer. Their litter trays are empties every two days. Why is this happening to my bunny? Her enviroment Is clean and tidy. She has a great diet. I don't understand this!


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

It could be a slight infection after giving birth. The babies are weaned by now so don't worry about them. Going to the vets is the correct thing. No sensible vet would put a rabbit down for stained fur. There are antibiotics he can prescribe for infections. Are you sure the baldness is not just from where she pulled her fur from nesting? It shouldn't be stained though. If you post a photo that would help. 
The vet can probably also sell you f10 ,an insecticidal spray to treat the hutch with to prevent flies.


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## Summersky (Aug 11, 2012)

Lopside said:


> It could be a slight infection after giving birth. The babies are weaned by now so don't worry about them. Going to the vets is the correct thing. No sensible vet would put a rabbit down for stained fur. There are antibiotics he can prescribe for infections. Are you sure the baldness is not just from where she pulled her fur from nesting? It shouldn't be stained though. If you post a photo that would help.
> The vet can probably also sell you f10 ,an insecticidal spray to treat the hutch with to prevent flies.


That's what I was suspecting as she has been bred from recently.

We can't really diagnose here.

If she has urine scald, that can be rectified by keeping her accommodation scrupulously clean.

If it is a vaginal discharge, she will need medical treatment.

Therefore you need to get her to the vets asap for a check up.

Remember - rabbits are a prey species and therefore hide illness, until the last possible moment.

Don't keep washing and spraying the poor thing. Get her checked first, then follow the vet's advice.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

If the bunnies are running about and probably weaned then how long till i can get them fixed? We want to keep some. Also i actually DO think the problem is urine scald but that's weird because she is always running around grazing. I even watched her go to the toilet to see if it looks like she has any discomfort but she went just fine?! Whats going on? My mum didn't call the vet yet she was puton voicemail. She left a message but we don't have a reply.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

Lopside said:


> It could be a slight infection after giving birth. The babies are weaned by now so don't worry about them. Going to the vets is the correct thing. No sensible vet would put a rabbit down for stained fur. There are antibiotics he can prescribe for infections. Are you sure the baldness is not just from where she pulled her fur from nesting? It shouldn't be stained though. If you post a photo that would help.
> The vet can probably also sell you f10 ,an insecticidal spray to treat the hutch with to prevent flies.


That sounds accurate. We will try to contact the vet again and if she doesn't pick up we might have to change vets. They need another myxi jab anyway


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

Most vets no longer stock the single jabs, most will now only stock the combi.
I wouldn't be vaccinating a possibly ill rabbit in any case as the immune system will be lowered.

Can you grab a picture of the area? We might be able to work out what it might be whilst you are trying to reach a vet.


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

isa jelly said:


> That sounds accurate. We will try to contact the vet again and if she doesn't pick up we might have to change vets. They need another myxi jab anyway


I wouldn't be waiting for her to pick up....cos she might just as well get worse, especially if its a womb infection. Vets for sure, take everyone. Get the kits sexed....how many have you got in total? It' going to be expensive....hope you have lots of pocket money!


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

The vet has been called and an appointment has been booked. My parents won't mind if it's expensive. I checked again and it looked like its gone down alot. It's became less mucky and the matts are gone. The area looks clean and it's gone back to normal color. We are still taking her for the checkup just to be sure but why has it gone down so much without any treatment other than a bum bath? Could it be just a passing thing? Also I'll see if I can snap a pic but that would be really hard because it's literally impossible to keep her still in a position that lets you see it. But I have got some ultra cute pics of 1 of lulus babies if you guys wanna see?


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

In the last one it went under my bed covers that's why the caption is get out


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

The pictures worked!!


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

isa jelly said:


> I checked again and it looked like its gone down alot. It's became less mucky and the matts are gone. The area looks clean and it's gone back to normal color.


If she had clumps of dried poo around her bottom then it is probably caused by her not eating her caecotrophs (night pellets). There are a number of causes for this - often it's too much pelleted/rabbit mix food and not enough hay or forage but it can also indicate an underlying stomach upset, an overweight rabbit, or even an issue with the teeth.

If the clumps of poo had dried in front of her urethra then she may not have been able to wee normally, which may have been making her back legs wet.


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## isa jelly (Jul 15, 2014)

MerlinsMum said:


> If she had clumps of dried poo around her bottom then it is probably caused by her not eating her caecotrophs (night pellets). There are a number of causes for this - often it's too much pelleted/rabbit mix food and not enough hay or forage but it can also indicate an underlying stomach upset, an overweight rabbit, or even an issue with the teeth.
> 
> If the clumps of poo had dried in front of her urethra then she may not have been able to wee normally, which may have been making her back legs wet.


I'm going to cut down on the pellets now. I don't want her getting fat either


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

isa jelly said:


> I'm going to cut down on the pellets now. I don't want her getting fat either


Just make sure you still give her a good daily supply of hay and forage, so she keeps eating. The babies will need pellets though.


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