# Kyzer had his 'assesment' for his new class :)



## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

On Monday evening we took off to Rochdale - found a nice looking res walk along the way that is calling out to be explored! - for Kyzers new class with a view of starting working trials (We're attending a WT beginners day on 15th July which is ran by this place). 
We had our assessment session where the trainer chatted to us, watched us and decided which class to pop us in  There was a baby Burmese X in with us which was adorable!

Kyzer pulled like a steam train round to the training part and really showed his true colours of how bad he is at walking on lead when excited 

He wasn't too bothered about the other dog and focussed on me with the garlic sausage 

After he calmed down he walked round with me with the head collar on (after it being easier with Bob I decided to try it out on Kyzer) he's not the biggest fan of it yet but we're getting there  he also let me lure him into putting his 2 front paws onto a block and stayed in position. His recall was spot on and he even let the trainer play with him for cheese but he soon ended the play and came to me lol. We also started the beginnings of training retrieve... rewarding him for putting his mouth round the toy then onto rewarding him for picking it up off the floor.

He starts in the intermediate class next Wednesday  she said he's very demanding and I need to stop rewarding him as much  as he needs to learn to do the behaviour & wait longer for the reward (LLW I can only do with a lure at the mo and when he's sat infront of me and trainer is talking I reward him too much for staying there and he starts to 'whinge'/fidget his bum has he wants the reward) I think I mother him too much  

I am in two minds whether or not to continue bob in his other class.... as I might switch him over to these ones 

This one is also pro-raw which makes a nice change


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Sounds like you both did well, great job! 

I've been rewarding Cash everytime he offers me a nice, relaxed, down while I'm busy talking/otherwise engaged, and it can be hard to know when to faze the treats out. I'm still at the stage of dropping treats every few seconds to reinforce the behaviour. If Kyzer gets whiney/demanding for the treats you're best waiting to reward him until he's looking elsewhere/momentarily quiet etc. I'm not technically meant to be rewarding Cash for watching me but it's hard with a dog that is constantly watching


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

Sounds like it went well.


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

Sounds like you might be trainig with Cath Phillips who is a super trainer.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Sounds like you both did well, great job!
> 
> I've been rewarding Cash everytime he offers me a nice, relaxed, down while I'm busy talking/otherwise engaged, and it can be hard to know when to faze the treats out. I'm still at the stage of dropping treats every few seconds to reinforce the behaviour. If Kyzer gets whiney/demanding for the treats you're best waiting to reward him until he's looking elsewhere/momentarily quiet etc. I'm not technically meant to be rewarding Cash for watching me but it's hard with a dog that is constantly watching


Lol, sounds similar to us. I've always enjoyed the fact he can focus on me for treats as it means I'm the centre of his universe, more so than the dog playing on the field that we're passing or the sheep in another field or even when we have visitors! & I've not really thought about doing it less - oops!



smokeybear said:


> Sounds like you might be trainig with Cath Phillips who is a super trainer.


Yep, I'm thrilled to be in her classes & can't wait to get started  I loved everything she had to say on Monday night.


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

sounds really exciting for you all - I look forward to hearing updates on how it goes


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Fleur said:


> sounds really exciting for you all - I look forward to hearing updates on how it goes


Thanks  I'm sure there'll be plenty of updates - Bob's classes have made me appreciate training Kyzer & how he loves to please


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Class 1.

So today we learnt Cath is going down south for 8weeks, which is a shame but love the reasons why  so we'll have a new trainer until she returns.

Took Kyzer for a walk when we got out the car to let him blow off some steam after the 40min drive. Some lovely deserted industrial estate land through some bushes & trees at the bottom of the road so he even got offlead which was great.

5 others in the class - 1 rottie, 3 shepherd breeds (long haired GSD, & 2 Belgian looking ones ?) and then to complete the bunch.. A shitzu  & what a lovely looking bunch they are 

We did some difference paced heel work at first which didn't go amazingly as he's still getting used to the head collar & I didn't realise I could lure him (like I normally do!)

We also started on start position & finish positions. He got a bit fed up with this one.. Or my treats weren't good enough!

We then did some putting objects into a bucket by doing different stages then putting it altogether.

Also some down stays.

We had a little incident where one of the other dogs was a bit hyped up & slipped his lead and came over to have a 'handbag' moment with Kyzer, who was sat minding his own business  I think I was more shaken up than Kyzer was! But no harm done & Kyzer settled back into class nicely. 
With that happening, once the class had finished & we got to the car I let him take any pent up energy out on his ball on a bungee (literally love this.. It's so strong when normally balls come out of the rope so easily but this is amazing - bungee tennis - http://toughtugs4dogs.com/strap ball tugs.html .. He loves it so much that it gets 100% focus & even teeth chattering excitement! Perfect for practising 'leave' 'ready steady go' when he's so hyped up) so we had a really good play before the 40min drive home  I then stuffed the rest of the sausages into a kong so he settled quickly in the car.

I loved how Cath ran the class & explained everything  wish we'd of come here sooner! Looking forward to returning


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

JenSteWillow said:


> On Monday evening we took off to Rochdale - found a nice looking res walk along the way that is calling out to be explored! - for Kyzers new class with a view of starting working trials (We're attending a WT beginners day on 15th July which is ran by this place).
> We had our assessment session where the trainer chatted to us, watched us and decided which class to pop us in  *There was a baby Burmese X in with us which was adorable!*
> 
> Kyzer pulled like a steam train round to the training part and really showed his true colours of how bad he is at walking on lead when excited
> ...


I hope you meant Bernese! Burmese are cats, and I don't think anyone has started classes for working trials with cats


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Burrowzig said:


> I hope you meant Bernese! Burmese are cats, and I don't think anyone has started classes for working trials with cats


Lol, oops! I would of said 'typo' but I'd be lying  my mistake


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Sounds like a successful class @JenSteWillow


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Class 2.

There was 8 of us this week so met some lovely new dogs 

We started off walking around the concrete big square, kyzer walked really nicely to heel (with a lure) . We had to do turns, left/rights and halts which he did all of them fine just didn't manage to get him to sit directly at my side when we 'halted'.

We all then had to pop a treat in a bowl which got laid out on the grass. We had to weave in & out of the bowls without our dogs getting distracted by the treats on the floor. Nice easy one for us  

We then did some more work on 'hold' and bringing the pipe thing to me. He picks it up fine & I have to walk backwards saying 'hold' as he carries it towards me & as soon as I say 'good' he releases for the treat. Just need more practice of him bringing it to my feet instead of a step or 2 infront. But he doesn't try to bugger off or play tug with it so it's going well. & i get too excited when he's holding it, I say 'good' by accident which makes him drop it .. Bad habit  lol. Need to work on holding it whilst he's still too as we haven't conquered that yet. 

We did some down stays on a long line. He got distracted by flies though & he broke it lol. But did well after that  

Then we started on going round a cone which will build up to sending him to the cone. He got the idea in the end.. & with my accent 'round' sounds similar to 'down' so he kept going into a down as we got to the cone! Oopsie. But we worked through that hiccup  I'm hoping to practice at home with an upside down bucket, a nice tip given by one of the ladies who goes with her dog & she was helping me through each step with him  

No class for him next week as we have the beginners day for WT 10-4 on weds so I'm pretty sure doing a class in the evening would just be too much for his mind!
We had less whinging this time & he seemed more focussed which was good  even though I sent OH out for cocktail sausages for treats.. He came back with 2 jumbo sausages from the chippy!! But he didn't half bloody work for em... I won't tell OH that bit though as I was miffed at first  but that & some of his kibble.. Worked a treat  & he did well to say he'd done just under 4miles on a walk in the afternoon too.


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Sounds like you are both doing well and an interesting class - really enjoying the updates


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Class 3

Didn't go as well as the others but I wouldn't say it was disappointing 

Started off with heel work & walking past / crossing other dogs which was fine. But then a game changer happened ... At our old classes when Kyzer was a pup we were told to 'pick a side' to work our dogs & ever since them & that day... He's been on my right hand side :Arghh .. I then learnt if we do want to compete in anything he has to be on my left .. So big change needed there  I just couldn't get myself co-ordinated for him on the left & he automatically comes to my right :Bag

We got to use the clear jump & long jump from the WT .. Kyzer seemed so distracted & unfocused for most of the hour we were there .. Sniffing the grass was far more important than sitting & waiting to do the jump.  We even moved the jump to a different area he was that distracted! We had more focus on the long jump & that was fine though.

Our 'hold' just wasnt happening that night either. He'd pick it up & just spit it out at me. Even when stood still he'd hold but then try to chew it / spit it out after 4secs. Then sniffing the grass was far more rewarding 

Then we worked on our send away which is coming along nicely .. still building up distance but he gets the idea  we've now got our matt at home which we're working on 'to the matt' for feeding times / before he gets anything & then I think the idea is we shape the send away around that in class as we have to take the matt every week.

Down stay he did fine on .. Still building up our time  .

Next week I'm going to the Thursday morning class as we have WT class in afternoon - saves 90mins of car time then.

I got some big plant pots from b&q for send away work at home. Also got 6 big outdoor wooden stakes for WT stuff at home  (still waiting on OH to produce any of the jumps he's promised to make, surprise surprise )
Just need to cut my grass once it stops blummin raining then we can do more at home!

I've also ordered some new bungee toys from tugenuff  picked up some good points from the day with Kamal .. Mostly around getting Kyzer fired up & wanting to work .. Getting kyzer to focus on me.. Using toys as rewards more & how to use the treats better. Impulse stuff too. I made lots of notes on different things  & quite glad I wasn't there as a handler


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

I think you did ok, we ask big things of ourselves and our dogs at times, I do it all the time, it will all come right in the end. Our rain has stopped, hope yours has too.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Jenny Olley said:


> I think you did ok, we ask big things of ourselves and our dogs at times, I do it all the time, it will all come right in the end. Our rain has stopped, hope yours has too.


Exactly & it's not just him that's learning but me aswell, poor sod has to wait for me to soak it all in  .

No rain here  we did a walk with mini training sessions mixed in & practised using the left hand side  the field I wanted to use, where the grass has been cut, had kids on quad bikes on it though, boo 

Hope you're having a nice Sunday


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Class 4. (We had normal class at 11am and then our 2nd WT session in the afternoon)

There wasn't much going on really as it was raining so the class was held in the barn area which is a bit on the small ish side for 6 big dogs!
Weaving in and out of cones which is easy..
We did a 1min down stay with me 3m away which for the first time, he stayed put/didn't fidget!
We did walking up to a gate, sit, I opened the gate and go through and he comes through when asked, back into a sit whilst I shut the gate... by the 3rd time this was done well too.
Touched on send away - I forgot our matt!! Was very cross at myself as we've been working on it loads at home! He did fine, still need to work on distance. They're holding a send-away day next week which I'm hoping to attend.
We normally go on a weds evening so we met different dogs today and managed to keep Kyzer quite focussed on me which was good, apart from when one dog was barking and he got the hump so had to re-position ourselves so he couldn't eye up the dog 

Working Trials session, well, more of Tracking session as we didn't do the search squares or jumps today  but it went amazingly! 
First two were just straight ones and he nailed them no probs, one was 'stomped' in heavier at first then it eased off.. the other was less 'stomped' in.
Next two, we introduced right turns (90degree) and didn't 'stomp' the ground as heavy and had less food, as we wasn't really bothering over the food.. so I did the food every 10steps instead of every 5/6. We stomped the corners nice and heavy though and after the first one he followed the other 3 perfectly! 
Last two.. I laid one and the trainer laid one for him (the big 'test' ) Mine had 2 left turns in this time and not as much food again... he did brill! Then we did the trainers one :Nailbiting I could barely see where he'd walked compared to mine lol but I could see the sausage. He had included articles  to see if Kyzer would do a down on command, different turns and even 45degree turns and oh my, he did me so proud to say its only his 2nd time tracking  He picked up the scent, not as quick as mine but he still got it  he took longer to go round this one as at some points he wasn't sure but he didn't exactly stray off.. the first 45degree turn he skipped the corner as he strayed off the track but caught scent of the track which led off the corner and followed it... so not bad for a first one! Next one he did perfectly  First article he sniffed, but wasn't for going on a down... next one he sniffed but carried on right over it... the 3rd he stopped at it and I pointed for a down which he did  so not too bad  

Our trainer seems really pleased with him though  He said we should be more than ready to enter our first competition in November :Nailbiting and that he's been one of the easiest dogs he's trained on tracking as he's nice and steady, picked it up really well and the track he set he wouldn't normally set until session 5/6 but Kyzer did brill on it on his 2nd session  He was very complimentary on every track so I was very happy indeed.. I feel very proud of him  Was even better that no1 else turned up so we had a 121 session with the trainer which was nice


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

Sounds like a fab session of tracking, one of my favourite things.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Jenny Olley said:


> Sounds like a fab session of tracking, one of my favourite things.


I loved it  I'm even more hooked now it's not just straight lines heavily trampled in. Watching Kyzer work out Martyn's track was fab! He's knackered now  
I can't really make it to the demo day in Melton Mowbray on Saturday now  a promotion at work & switching where I'm based has made it difficult.. Which has made me a bit sad as I was really looking forward to it.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Ready for your first comp this Winter already! Don't think we're anywhere near that level yet 

Great job!!


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

JenSteWillow said:


> I loved it  I'm even more hooked now it's not just straight lines heavily trampled in. Watching Kyzer work out Martyn's track was fab! He's knackered now
> I can't really make it to the demo day in Melton Mowbray on Saturday now  a promotion at work & switching where I'm based has made it difficult.. Which has made me a bit sad as I was really looking forward to it.


That's a shame Barrie and Sue have some good teams lined up to do the demo's, but we can't always do what we want.
I love watching the dogs learn on the track when it's something different, I really admire their determination.


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## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

I love reading your updates - sounds like you and Kyzer are working hard and having fun


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Ready for your first comp this Winter already! Don't think we're anywhere near that level yet
> 
> Great job!!


My reply back was 'really? Are you serious?' Lol. Obviously where ever we go wrong in the comp we know then what to focus on for next time & he said it'd be good experience for us. We have until October to enter so loads of time before to train & if we don't end up ready (I'd be surprised if we are ready!) then it's no biggie 



Jenny Olley said:


> That's a shame Barrie and Sue have some good teams lined up to do the demo's, but we can't always do what we want.
> I love watching the dogs learn on the track when it's something different, I really admire their determination.


I think I'll be going to the comp in Monk Fryston (?) towards the end of sept to spectate so hopefully I'll learn a lot from that too seems as we can't make tomorrow.



Fleur said:


> I love reading your updates - sounds like you and Kyzer are working hard and having fun


Thanks  I've finally caught up with yours & ludos sessions too


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

JenSteWillow said:


> My reply back was 'really? Are you serious?' Lol. Obviously where ever we go wrong in the comp we know then what to focus on for next time & he said it'd be good experience for us. We have until October to enter so loads of time before to train & if we don't end up ready (I'd be surprised if we are ready!) then it's no biggie
> 
> I think I'll be going to the comp in Monk Fryston (?) towards the end of sept to spectate so hopefully I'll learn a lot from that too seems as we can't make tomorrow.
> 
> Thanks  I've finally caught up with yours & ludos sessions too


You might not see a lot of tracking at Monks Fryston, it is also known as the "Aberford Stand"


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

smokeybear said:


> You might not see a lot of tracking at Monks Fryston, it is also known as the "Aberford Stand"


That makes me feel even worse about not attending this day tomorrow. I really want to see what goes on properly before we attend as competitors. 
How come we won't see a lot of it?


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

smokeybear said:


> You might not see a lot of tracking at Monks Fryston, it is also known as the "Aberford Stand"


I believe PD tracking was on grass last year, not sure about the other stakes.



JenSteWillow said:


> That makes me feel even worse about not attending this day tomorrow. I really want to see what goes on properly before we attend as competitors.
> How come we won't see a lot of it?


It's just a bit of a joke, the land was considered difficult for tracking, stubble and a lot of the land used was near the road and often had loads of rubbish on it, so it got to be known as competitors just stood at the pole, ie "Aberford stand", Aberford being the place the Monk Fryston trial was based, although they do still use some of the same land. I have always tracked well there, infact I really like Monk Fryston/Aberford trial.


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

It's also probably my closest trial, which is another reason to like it.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Jenny Olley said:


> It's also probably my closest trial, which is another reason to like it.


Ah I see  so it's worth going to spectate there then? 
It's always a bonus when it's nearer to home  about 1.5hours drive for us which isn't too bad.


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

JenSteWillow said:


> Ah I see  so it's worth going to spectate there then?
> It's always a bonus when it's nearer to home  about 1.5hours drive for us which isn't too bad.


Yes, it is a championship trial, and there will be 4 stakes running, PD, WD, UD and CD, what is on will depend on what day you are going, it's also a great base and a friendly team running it.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Jenny Olley said:


> Yes, it is a championship trial, and there will be 4 stakes running, PD, WD, UD and CD, what is on will depend on what day you are going, it's also a great base and a friendly team running it.


Thanks for that  it should be my week off that week so might even manage 2days.


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

You'll be able to find out what's running when nearer the time, doesn't close for another 2 weeks, so once they have the entries in they can decide how best to work it.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Jenny Olley said:


> You'll be able to find out what's running when nearer the time, doesn't close for another 2 weeks, so once they have the entries in they can decide how best to work it.


Are you competing in it  ?


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

That is a very good question, my OH will be, I have not decided yet, I don't need the qualification (WDex), and aren't yet qualified for PD, and am working through some things I want to improve before going into ticket, and they may need me as a helper, I will probably be there in some form or another.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Well today has been 'one of them days'  my patience has been tested to say the least.

Class in the morning.

Crossing over the field with another dog coming the other way.. Human to human first then dog to dog.. Easy stuff for us so that was fine.

We then did a relaxed stay.. Which we haven't done before but another dog started barking which set another off which then got Kyzer in a huff... So didn't last long.

Then we did some clear jumps.. He was an ass. The grass must of smelt amazing as it was far more interesting than focusing on me. He did a jump in his own time.. Then got lazy & knocked a pole down as he wasn't concentrating properly. Then did a good one. 
Long jump was a bit better but still struggled to get him to focus.

He then did a 1min down stay which was good 

Then we had a 'send away' afternoon. I've got a mixed bag of feelings about this but I'll just stick to what he did (/nt) do.
Again the grass was just ever so amazing so that was far more important. Straight lines to a cone is fine.. He'll do a down in his own time.. Quicker if the foods under a cone & he knows I'll come & lift the cone once he's got into a down.
We need to do more work on being able to actually 'send him' as if he wasn't sure if there was food he just got half way then was more bothered about coming back to me.
We then did some 'up a hill' so he could just see the tip of the cone... But again, he'd only go all the way if he 100% knew there was food there waiting for him  then dilly dallyed around the cone before doing the down in his own time.
Last of our sessions was just a nightmare. He'd go, then turn around and come running back to me / jumping up.. He'd eventually do it as I got closer but it was all just a big mess & he wasn't concentrating at all. He just wanted to play 

I don't feel as if our sendaway has improved any after today which is disappointing (after 4hours, 3 sessions of it being 'our turn') as I really wanted to build on it but nvm  .

I just feel like I'm letting him down in some way by not being able to focus him. I really want to use his toys but then he gets really hyped up can't think of anything but his toys but I know he'd 'work' for them! But I don't even know where to begin with this.. We do impulse control at home for 'leave' 'out' 'ready steady' etc but I'd love the toys to enhance his drive to work too. Am I even making sence!? Just feeling slightly frustrated with myself today & also with the class set up not being what I expected this afternoon. :Bag Maybe I'm just over thinking though & need to relax


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

So is the issue Kyzer gets to worked up for his toys? hence you not using them? If he's OTT for his 'special' toys would he work for something slightly less value? Or is he the same with all toys?

Sorry you had a frustrating session today. We have our intensive day on Sunday and it seems like forever since we last went so I'm expecting the worst from Cash too!


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

One of the most difficult things when dog training is finding a usable reward, which the dog perceives as good enough to over ride the environment, my youngster doesn't have a strong natural food drive, I have worked very hard to build it to a useable level, fingers crossed I am there (mostly). There are a couple of articles on our facebook group about play which you may find helpful.

Sendaways, as a novice trainer and dog it will take you a while to get the hang of them, my OH and I spend hours & hours on S/A before we would expect the dog to have an understanding, so don't feel down about it.

Trials is hard work to train for as there are so many different exercises, in addition to getting the dog in the correct mood state to learn, don't put so much pressure on yourself, you are doing really well.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> So is the issue Kyzer gets to worked up for his toys? hence you not using them? If he's OTT for his 'special' toys would he work for something slightly less value? Or is he the same with all toys?
> Sorry you had a frustrating session today. We have our intensive day on Sunday and it seems like forever since we last went so I'm expecting the worst from Cash too!


The toy issue is that his 'reward' toys are too amazing so we only use them at the very end of a session. Then normal toys just aren't interesting enough. 
EG from a send away point of view... if I put a ball on top of the cone, he may or may not go to it to find it interesting. Food, if he knows its been put there he's straight over to it and I know what he works for the most (garlic sausage & cheese being the highest and plain cocktail sausage being a lesser value with kibble being the lowest) but say if I put his fluffy ball thing (http://tug-e-nuff.co.uk/sheepskin-ball-bungee-tug-tennis-ball.html) on the cone he'd be straight over like a shot to it but he wouldn't then concentrate on doing the down as he'd be running around in circles being a crazy cat with this toy.. then once I've got it back and put it away he's more bothered about the toy being on me or he's then too hyped up.

I guess, now looking back, would I could do is start from scratch but with the toy as the reward so even on a really short distance (as if it was our very first time), he'll go down on command and then i'll produce the toy and build it up so that he knows the down and then me being next to him means toy reward.. but then build it up so he's not anticipating the toy every time.. so after a few times I might do it every other time .. then so on? I really don't know :Wacky

What's the intensive day you've got coming up? 



Jenny Olley said:


> One of the most difficult things when dog training is finding a usable reward, which the dog perceives as good enough to over ride the environment, my youngster doesn't have a strong natural food drive, I have worked very hard to build it to a useable level, fingers crossed I am there (mostly). There are a couple of articles on our facebook group about play which you may find helpful.
> 
> Sendaways, as a novice trainer and dog it will take you a while to get the hang of them, my OH and I spend hours & hours on S/A before we would expect the dog to have an understanding, so don't feel down about it.
> 
> Trials is hard work to train for as there are so many different exercises, in addition to getting the dog in the correct mood state to learn, don't put so much pressure on yourself, you are doing really well.


I'll have a look at your group, thank-you  Your post has also made me feel slightly better too  I've seen on FB that he's running another session for it in 2 weeks so hopefully i'll feel we're more on the right track by then.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Ah ok. Maybe an idea would be to do a few 'out of reach' send aways? Our instructor often has a toy placed slightly out of reach so the dog can't get it immediately. Then like you said, the down becomes the reward. I practice this at home too. Popping his tuggy out of reach one end of the living room and sending him away from the other end. We're not doing blind send aways just now, so he runs out, I command him down, he goes down and only then once I've reached him do I give him with the toy. The only issue is to then refocus him as you say. Hopefully you'll get better tips than what I can offer lol.

Our intensive is WT too. We do a 2 hour intensive at the end of every month and 1:1's in between. We haven't yet joined the regular WT classes that are at the beginning of the month. Really enjoy it though


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

You may be better doing what I and a lot of other people do that is train sendaways and downs separately.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

smokeybear said:


> You may be better doing what I and a lot of other people do that is train sendaways and downs separately.


After reading this today - https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0264/5831/files/Trial_ReadinessFENZI2.pdf?318 - from Denise Fenzi (a name taken from another thread and post) a little quote of a sentence - ''I always work on the required base behaviors for an exercise before
worrying about a chain.''
From that I took away the idea of training the down in whole different situations/environment at different levels of arousal.. which I assume is what you mean?  I found the read quite interesting and I really think I'm rushing too much with high expectations - EG I know he can do a down, put expecting him to do one after the rush of running towards a cone for food is obviously not working for us 

Another quote that stuck out for me was - The higher quality the base behaviors, the better the chains will be. That is a fundamental
truth. Poor quality base behaviors do not magically morph into high quality chains.

Made me think, our down is obviously of 'poor quality'


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

Denise Fenzi is very good, I have her latest book Play! which is excellent, also going to see her at GoTrain! next July in Staffordshire.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

JenSteWillow said:


> After reading this today - https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0264/5831/files/Trial_ReadinessFENZI2.pdf?318 - from Denise Fenzi (a name taken from another thread and post) a little quote of a sentence - ''I always work on the required base behaviors for an exercise before
> worrying about a chain.''
> From that I took away the idea of training the down in whole different situations/environment at different levels of arousal.. which I assume is what you mean?  I found the read quite interesting and I really think I'm rushing too much with high expectations - EG I know he can do a down, put expecting him to do one after the rush of running towards a cone for food is obviously not working for us
> 
> ...


That's a great little e-book. Thanks for posting.


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

Can't comment on the use of toys for sendaways as we only ever use food for this exercise, if we have a dog who is not food driven we work on the food drive first, then start sendaways.
Agree with SB a good solid down on command with no signal away from the cone is required. In an adult dog once we have a solid down, we would then work next to the cone getting an automatic down at the cone, then commence S/A training, initially we would use 2 rewards 1 for the outrun, 1 for the stable down.
This is different to the system you are using, and it is best not to chop and change as it can confuse, dog and owner, but think you are right to go back and polish up your down.
If you are confused during your training, or you feel you are not making progress, or you don't really understand where you are going it's always best to ask your trainer, so you can get clarity.
It takes such a long for everything to fall into place, I have been at it 20 years and learn new things every day, which is why I enjoy working and training dogs.


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## Guest (Aug 14, 2015)

JenSteWillow said:


> After reading this today - https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0264/5831/files/Trial_ReadinessFENZI2.pdf?318 - from Denise Fenzi (a name taken from another thread and post) a little quote of a sentence - ''I always work on the required base behaviors for an exercise before
> worrying about a chain.''
> From that I took away the idea of training the down in whole different situations/environment at different levels of arousal.. which I assume is what you mean?  I found the read quite interesting and I really think I'm rushing too much with high expectations - EG I know he can do a down, put expecting him to do one after the rush of running towards a cone for food is obviously not working for us
> 
> ...


Sounds like you had a great epiphany 
BTW, we ALL rush in to the next piece way too fast, the great trainers have the patience not to, but us mere peons, we all rush and then pay the price in the end behavior. If you're like me, it's at that point that you realize you have rushed things, then have to go back and start over 

Generalizing is something I do like doing because it's just a fun challenge to me to figure out different scenarios. So with down, you can do all sorts of things. Down from a sit, from a stand, while walking, while backing up, on a wobble board, while you're in front of him, next to him, behind him, out of sight (in another room). Can he down at the top of the stairs if you're at the bottom? Can you get a down while he's in the car while you're driving? That sort of thing. Every one of those situations is a different picture from the dog's POV, so you have to teach the dog to down in all those different contexts. Now, once you start generalizing, it does tend to get easier for the dog, but at first you may have to re-teach the behavior all over again.

Also notice the mechanics of how he downs. If he has learned that down is a two part behavior (sit then down), moving downs are going to be harder for him. You may want to re-teach him to down by "folding" from a stand. I haven't read all the replies so this may have already been covered


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Jenny Olley said:


> Can't comment on the use of toys for sendaways as we only ever use food for this exercise, if we have a dog who is not food driven we work on the food drive first, then start sendaways.
> Agree with SB a good solid down on command with no signal away from the cone is required. In an adult dog once we have a solid down, we would then work next to the cone getting an automatic down at the cone, then commence S/A training, initially we would use 2 rewards 1 for the outrun, 1 for the stable down.
> This is different to the system you are using, and it is best not to chop and change as it can confuse, dog and owner, but think you are right to go back and polish up your down.
> If you are confused during your training, or you feel you are not making progress, or you don't really understand where you are going it's always best to ask your trainer, so you can get clarity.
> It takes such a long for everything to fall into place, I have been at it 20 years and learn new things every day, which is why I enjoy working and training dogs.


Thanks Jenny 



ouesi said:


> Sounds like you had a great epiphany
> BTW, we ALL rush in to the next piece way too fast, the great trainers have the patience not to, but us mere peons, we all rush and then pay the price in the end behavior. If you're like me, it's at that point that you realize you have rushed things, then have to go back and start over
> 
> Generalizing is something I do like doing because it's just a fun challenge to me to figure out different scenarios. So with down, you can do all sorts of things. Down from a sit, from a stand, while walking, while backing up, on a wobble board, while you're in front of him, next to him, behind him, out of sight (in another room). Can he down at the top of the stairs if you're at the bottom? Can you get a down while he's in the car while you're driving? That sort of thing. Every one of those situations is a different picture from the dog's POV, so you have to teach the dog to down in all those different contexts. Now, once you start generalizing, it does tend to get easier for the dog, but at first you may have to re-teach the behavior all over again.
> ...


I think our 'down' is stronger out of sit & down. When going 'down' he doesn't go into a sit first either. He can do a down in most low 'excitement' situations like you've described above so I'm thinking (hoping) if we start doing them out & about on walks it'll start to get stronger. Working with all different levels of excitement etc.. Like us both running then a sudden stop with a down would be the highest of excitement for him... The thought of a human running away/to/with him just boggles his little brain completely


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Just to make you feel better @JenSteWillow, Cash was pretty damn fidgety and distracted today too  so you're not the only one lol.


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

If you are still intending to go to Monk Fryston trial to spectate, just to let you know it is running Saturday and Sunday, Saturday is PD nosework, WD Full stake and CD, Sunday is UD full stake, and PD Control and patrol round. All tracking is on Stubble.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Jenny Olley said:


> If you are still intending to go to Monk Fryston trial to spectate, just to let you know it is running Saturday and Sunday, Saturday is PD nosework, WD Full stake and CD, Sunday is UD full stake, and PD Control and patrol round. All tracking is on Stubble.


Thanks Jenny  I'll be going on the Sunday as that's the only day I'm available.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

How is your training going?


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> How is your training going?


It's been on hold for 3weeks as work has taken over my life as it's been the busiest time of the year for us just before kids going back to school & all 3 of em had a tummy bug last week. Back to class Wednesday evening though  so that'll be interesting after 3 weeks of not much... Eek.

What about you ?


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

JenSteWillow said:


> It's been on hold for 3weeks as work has taken over my life as it's been the busiest time of the year for us just before kids going back to school & all 3 of em had a tummy bug last week. Back to class Wednesday evening though  so that'll be interesting after 3 weeks of not much... Eek.
> 
> What about you ?


Sorry to hear the pups had a tummy bug. Hope they're recovered now?

Erm, training is interesting here. Much more progress made at home but it doesn't always transfer to the field. Have him jumping over the mini jump in my garden with his dumbbell which is massive for him! But he's still quite unsure about the jump at the field  We get to hire the training field as and when we feel so that's always something to look forward to and get extra practice in that environment with no distractions. He did scale 4 1/2 foot the other week too, but landed awkwardly and then was reluctant afterwards. Our main focus right now is on his control work - heelwork, holds and send aways.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Sorry to hear the pups had a tummy bug. Hope they're recovered now?
> 
> Erm, training is interesting here. Much more progress made at home but it doesn't always transfer to the field. Have him jumping over the mini jump in my garden with his dumbbell which is massive for him! But he's still quite unsure about the jump at the field  We get to hire the training field as and when we feel so that's always something to look forward to and get extra practice in that environment with no distractions. He did scale 4 1/2 foot the other week too, but landed awkwardly and then was reluctant afterwards. Our main focus right now is on his control work - heelwork, holds and send aways.


Sounds like he's doing really well  well done! & that's really good about being able to hire the field! Bet your so proud 

Yeah it took a few days to clear but all better now  In laws bull dog had it the week before so must of been something going round our area.


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

WD also takes place on the Sunday, thought it was just Saturday, sorry.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Jenny Olley said:


> WD also takes place on the Sunday, thought it was just Saturday, sorry.


Sounds like a good range for me to watch then  hoping OH will enjoy it & might engage him a bit more in what I'm actually aiming towards as he hasn't been able to attend a class with us & watch what we do.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

JenSteWillow said:


> Sounds like he's doing really well  well done! & that's really good about being able to hire the field! Bet your so proud
> 
> Yeah it took a few days to clear but all better now  In laws bull dog had it the week before so must of been something going round our area.


Glad to hear they've all recovered.

He's doing ok. One thing we need to overcome more is his 'bitching' as our trainer likes to say - so much sniffing! So I'm having to interrupt that now which is helping. I have to remind myself not to get to ahead of ourselves and work at his pace. I'm one of these types of owners that sometimes finds that hard to do, but it's as much a learning experiencing for me too.

I really must get to watch a trial too!


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Glad to hear they've all recovered.
> 
> He's doing ok. One thing we need to overcome more is his 'bitching' as our trainer likes to say - so much sniffing! So I'm having to interrupt that now which is helping. I have to remind myself not to get to ahead of ourselves and work at his pace. I'm one of these types of owners that sometimes finds that hard to do, but it's as much a learning experiencing for me too.
> 
> I really must get to watch a trial too!


Lol, maybe an age thing as Kyzer seems to be chief sniffer lately! I'm attending one of @Jenny Olley 's days of 'Canine Drive' which I'm hoping will help me understand his drive more & how to motivate him to want to work, hopefully which will help me keep him focused instead of wondering what's been on the grass before him! (Hopefully, if there's places left by the time I've been paid anyway!) 
Teenagers eh  
You're way ahead of us though & I'm kicking myself for not starting sooner but obviously I knew nothing back then! Who knew chasing your puppy , for fun, trying to catch him whilst he ran away with a toy would come back to haunt me ... :Banghead !! Although he came over and threw a toy onto my lap yesterday  which got the biggest fussiet reward ever. Then he ran off and didn't bring it back & gave me his 'chase me' eyes  it was a slight glimmer of what could be! Lol. (Retrieve still not nailed at all :Sorry:Meh)


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

JenSteWillow said:


> Lol, maybe an age thing as Kyzer seems to be chief sniffer lately! I'm attending one of @Jenny Olley 's days of 'Canine Drive' which I'm hoping will help me understand his drive more & how to motivate him to want to work, hopefully which will help me keep him focused instead of wondering what's been on the grass before him! (Hopefully, if there's places left by the time I've been paid anyway!)
> Teenagers eh
> You're way ahead of us though & I'm kicking myself for not starting sooner but obviously I knew nothing back then! Who knew chasing your puppy , for fun, trying to catch him whilst he ran away with a toy would come back to haunt me ... :Banghead !! Although he came over and threw a toy onto my lap yesterday  which got the biggest fussiet reward ever. Then he ran off and didn't bring it back & gave me his 'chase me' eyes  it was a slight glimmer of what could be! Lol. (Retrieve still not nailed at all :Sorry:Meh)


Yep, I'm convinced it's his age, and our trainer seems to agree. 19 month old male, entire, lots of girly dogs around.... That Canine Drive day sounds interesting. When is it?

We're not further ahead I don't think. Remember your trainer said Kyzer would be ready to trial this Autumn!  Cash is no where near that stage. At all. I've started relatively late too. I knew I wanted to do this, but never found the right trainer/class before and therefore that held us back months and allowed bad habits to set in. I love that we're both in this as newbies together though and can share our experiences


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Yep, I'm convinced it's his age, and our trainer seems to agree. 19 month old male, entire, lots of girly dogs around.... That Canine Drive day sounds interesting. When is it?
> 
> We're not further ahead I don't think. Remember your trainer said Kyzer would be ready to trial this Autumn!  Cash is no where near that stage. At all. I've started relatively late too. I knew I wanted to do this, but never found the right trainer/class before and therefore that held us back months and allowed bad habits to set in. I love that we're both in this as newbies together though and can share our experiences


Thursday 29th Oct - this is the Facebook link with details - https://m.facebook.com/events/376250552545627?acontext={"ref":3,"action_history":"null"}&aref=3 - hope the link works?

Lol, yeah we could enter.. Doesn't mean to say we'd do well  . I'd be really surprised if I do enter him.. His tracking his great (but obviously that's not until UD level anyway, typical!) but everything else is just sloppy! & we haven't had a WT class for a little while to practise other bits either. I've got no hope for a search square.. Finding objects no problem but the bringing it to me is just a big fail. Control & agility is do-able but sloppy. So I really don't think we are ready at all  but I didn't start out to compete & need to keep reminding myself I'm only doing it as a fun activity to keep his brain busy & to take our relationship from strength to strength .. Competing would just be a bonus & something for us to work towards to show off what we've accomplished - if anything !

Your situation sounds really similar to us, except i knew of our trainer but didn't realise I would of been better going here from the beginning instead of the KC good citz classes with our old trainers. Lessons learnt. Cue our bad habits too - like working him on the wrong side of me!!

I agree, it's nice to share experiences on here knowing your going through similar as they've only got 1month age difference too  & us both being newbie handlers to this so its not just the dogs that need the training


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

Dogloverlou said:


> I really must get to watch a trial too!


There is East Anglia open trial in September, and their Championship is in January, they are probably your nearest ones.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

So today was our first day back into things since August! I was nervous so dragged OH along  

WT classes now pretty much the 2nd Sunday of every month... Now it's on a Sunday there was so many people! Some even turned up without confirming so too many really but hey ho! Our trainer has now limited the places for future ones  

So our trainer laid our track.. With bits of food & 3 articles. I could barely see any track marks so I really need to learn to trust Kyzer now as some points I just confused him as I thought he was off track  he also did a wee & a poop whilst doing it!! The monkey!! Wouldn't mind but it was the 5th poop of the morning! But nvm. He found all 3 articles & on cue laid down next to them but he stopped on them which was great as in our last class he sniffed straight over them. He skipped a corner on the last one as I think the wind carried the scent of the last article as he went straight to that instead. Trainer seemed pleased  OH was also impressed! (He hasn't seen any WT training by us until today) 
We just did the one track due to space issues with the volume of people. 

Then we did the search square & oh my god... I'm over the moon :Woot 100% improvement! Last time, I had to keep his long line on & 'reel him in' as returning items was a huge issue as he'd rather run away with it wanting to be chased! (He returned none of them & even point blank refused to give one back) This time.. He was loose.. On the first square he found all 3 articles and returned them all to me without being reeled in.. He picked them up & I used 'yes' marker then backed away saying 'come' then asked for a down as soon as he left the square, which he did & let me approach him to collect the article and treat him up!! He left the square a few times & struggled finding the green pipe but I was just over the moon at the progress of picking up and bringing to me. Even the down with the article is huge as we've been working on downs in different situations & different levels of excitement (for send aways) so this paid off here too  
On the bigger square he got a bit silly & did 2 out of 3.. Even a ball was one and I thought 'oh no he'll never return that to me' but he did!! So that made up for not picking up the glove although I thought he'd love the glove so that was weird 

We then couldn't stay for the afternoon of send aways & agility bits. 

Next Sunday is our first meet up for the North west society :Nailbiting OH is coming to that too then hopefully I will have my confidence back in doing things with him on my own  

Not sure when we'll be attending a normal obedience class again as they've moved to weds morning or evening at mo, instead of Thursday mornings which is my day off so if I missed the evening I could attend the morning & a few personal home issues thrown into the mix making juggling life & training even harder


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Well done Kyzer!! and you too @JenSteWillow. So good when you see things coming together, and even more so after a period of absence from classes. Have you spectated at a trial yet?

Cash did great today too after a 2 week break, so maybe having gaps between sessions pays off!  Cash did his search square in 1.30 which the trainer said was fab, and he also retrieved and returned all three items!


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Well done Kyzer!! and you too @JenSteWillow. So good when you see things coming together, and even more so after a period of absence from classes. Have you spectated at a trial yet?
> 
> Cash did great today too after a 2 week break, so maybe having gaps between sessions pays off!  Cash did his search square in 1.30 which the trainer said was fab, and he also retrieved and returned all three items!


No I haven't :Bag just had too much other stuff going on. I'll be at the one at end of Nov though for north west.. Either having a go at competing :Nailbiting (just to see how we do but I'm still not 100% sure as even the intro stake there's stuff we can't do 100%, think I've got until the 20th to decide, so the North west meet up on 18th will probably be the day I decide  ) - Or just spectating  as our trainer & another lady in our WT class will be competing.

Ah well done cash that's fab!! Are you not entering him into a comp yet?


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

JenSteWillow said:


> No I haven't :Bag just had too much other stuff going on. I'll be at the one at end of Nov though for north west.. Either having a go at competing :Nailbiting (just to see how we do but I'm still not 100% sure as even the intro stake there's stuff we can't do 100%, think I've got until the 20th to decide, so the North west meet up on 18th will probably be the day I decide  ) - Or just spectating  as our trainer & another lady in our WT class will be competing.
> 
> Ah well done cash that's fab!! Are you not entering him into a comp yet?


And I'll be there scribing/stewarding as my OH is judging PD, I wish I was competing.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Jenny Olley said:


> And I'll be there scribing/stewarding as my OH is judging PD, I wish I was competing.


How come no competing for you? 
I saw a post on the WT FB group about a lack of new comers not competing... So part of me feels like I should, to show there are newbies knocking around  but I just know we won't be high scoring! So I just don't know. 
Less than 3 weeks til the drive class with you, that's soon come round! Busy few weeks for us


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

The rules don't allow me to enter when my husband is the judge . Take no notice of what it says on the FB group, there are plenty of new people coming through, more always welcome.  Don't feel pressured to compete before you are ready. I've got a busy few weeks too, Kennel Club champs next week to support my OH, the following week my 1st go at TD champ with my young fella, then 1st PD open 2 weeks after.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Jenny Olley said:


> The rules don't allow me to enter when my husband is the judge . Take no notice of what it says on the FB group, there are plenty of new people coming through, more always welcome.  Don't feel pressured to compete before you are ready. I've got a busy few weeks too, Kennel Club champs next week to support my OH, the following week my 1st go at TD champ with my young fella, then 1st PD open 2 weeks after.


Ah I see  I guess that makes sence but no different than knowing the judge as a good friend really.. I guess rules are rules though eh  
How exciting for you, very busy! I can't even imagine a track 3hours old :Nailbiting I'm really looking forward to finally seeing a trial & spectating PD .. I'd really love to get to that level


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

JenSteWillow said:


> Ah I see  I guess that makes sence but no different than knowing the judge as a good friend really.. I guess rules are rules though eh
> How exciting for you, very busy! I can't even imagine a track 3hours old :Nailbiting I'm really looking forward to finally seeing a trial & spectating PD .. I'd really love to get to that level


I am very excited, taking a young dog in is always.. fun, I love the tracking. Hope there'll be a few in PD open for you to spectate, it's a bit quiet in PD open at the moment.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

JenSteWillow said:


> No I haven't :Bag just had too much other stuff going on. I'll be at the one at end of Nov though for north west.. Either having a go at competing :Nailbiting (just to see how we do but I'm still not 100% sure as even the intro stake there's stuff we can't do 100%, think I've got until the 20th to decide, so the North west meet up on 18th will probably be the day I decide  ) - Or just spectating  as our trainer & another lady in our WT class will be competing.
> 
> Ah well done cash that's fab!! Are you not entering him into a comp yet?


How exciting if you decide to enter! I definitely need to spectate beforehand I think just to get a feel for what actually happens on the day. I know Jenny mentioned my closest trial locations on the last page so I may well try and get to view their champ competition in January.

Well, not entering any comps yet but our trainer did shock me today and said she thinks early Spring he may well be ready!  but I'm not convinced lol. We have alot to still work on and tidy up. As it stands right now there are alot of minor things he'd have half a mark knocked off here and there etc so we shall see!


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

If your trainer says you will only lose half a mark here or there you must be fantastic!  Good Luck.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

smokeybear said:


> If your trainer says you will only lose half a mark here or there you must be fantastic!  Good Luck.


In various exercises that is! So all in all mounting up  and that's just in control work. He's still iffy in the agility section and its our lesser trained area right now too, so lots of training still to be done.


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

Dogloverlou said:


> How exciting if you decide to enter! I definitely need to spectate beforehand I think just to get a feel for what actually happens on the day. I know Jenny mentioned my closest trial locations on the last page so I may well try and get to view their champ competition in January.
> 
> Well, not entering any comps yet but our trainer did shock me today and said she thinks early Spring he may well be ready!  but I'm not convinced lol. We have alot to still work on and tidy up. As it stands right now there are alot of minor things he'd have half a mark knocked off here and there etc so we shall see!


The East Anglia trial has moved due to land restrictions during the shooting season, it will now run week ending the 14th Feb.


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## JenKyzer (Jun 25, 2013)

Dogloverlou said:


> Well, not entering any comps yet but our trainer did shock me today and said she thinks early Spring he may well be ready!  but I'm not convinced lol. We have alot to still work on and tidy up. As it stands right now there are alot of minor things he'd have half a mark knocked off here and there etc so we shall see!


That's amazing  
So when you compete are you aiming for a full house of marks? As, I know if I was to enter next month I know we'd be no where near great.. But I'm only doing it for fun anyway.. Where as with Cash, does it matter a lot more (to his breeder? Or cos he's KC? Etc..) ? & then that leaves me with a bench mark I can improve on the next time. 
I'm wondering if I should just leave it til I know we've got the criteria of the stake pretty much spot on  I don't want to waste anyone's judging time  (or be the trial dunce with the unruly dog ) 
but you sound like you and cash have it covered!


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

JenSteWillow said:


> That's amazing
> So when you compete are you aiming for a full house of marks? As, I know if I was to enter next month I know we'd be no where near great.. But I'm only doing it for fun anyway.. Where as with Cash, does it matter a lot more (to his breeder? Or cos he's KC? Etc..) ? & then that leaves me with a bench mark I can improve on the next time.
> I'm wondering if I should just leave it til I know we've got the criteria of the stake pretty much spot on  I don't want to waste anyone's judging time  (or be the trial dunce with the unruly dog )
> but you sound like you and cash have it covered!


No, not at all. But I want to go in with a confidence in him being able to do what is asked of him and understanding in full the exercise etc. At the moment he's hit and miss and there are a lot of things he can't do yet ( for example he doesn't really bring his dumbbell back to me ), and I think like you've said, it's just a case of us working on each exercise to a competent level I guess. I guess it's just a case of knowing when you're ready....and I doubt we'll be ready by even Spring lol.


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

Doesn't matter how long it takes to be ready, when we get a pup and know we are going to so WT, and they can't enter until they are 18 months on closing date, so really we have a minimum of 17 months, and still they are not always ready. It takes time, it will all come together, there are just so many exercises in Working Trials, I have to keep a diary to ensure everything is getting trained.


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## Twiggy (Jun 24, 2010)

Jenny Olley said:


> The East Anglia trial has moved due to land restrictions during the shooting season, it will now run week ending the 14th Feb.


I met a chap out walking his dogs where I go to agility last week who was on the committee of EAWT club. We stood chatting for ages and he invited me to join their club, or at least go and watch.

When we move I might take him up on it although I don't currently have a dog suitable to compete with, but it would be interesting to spectate.


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

Twiggy said:


> I met a chap out walking his dogs where I go to agility last week who was on the committee of EAWT club. We stood chatting for ages and he invited me to join their club, or at least go and watch.
> 
> When we move I might take him up on it although I don't currently have a dog suitable to compete with, but it would be interesting to spectate.


That would be good, was it Paul, a chap with a Cocker, Mali and GSD?


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