# Cat Advice needed by non-cat owner



## Chez999 (Aug 22, 2012)

Dear All

I wondered as Cat Owners if you would be willing to give me some advice?

I should explain, I am not a cat owner - nor do I particularly like cats - but that said I do not like and will not advocate cruelty to animals.

I live in a block of 4 flats, 2 up, 2 down. Mine is the downstairs flat. My upstairs neighbours have 2 cats each and after 18 months of us all living together have decided that their "indoor" cats now need to be let out.

At first I didn't have a problem. Yes they come into the garden etc but they are not really a nuisance unless they start messing - which I am told they probably won't do because they tend not to "mess in their own back yard" which they may adopt.

My problem is that as the flats do not have cat flaps they are gaining access to and from their home properties via the one downstairs porch window each upstairs flat has. 
I think this has led to the cats' presumption that all open windows are for them. 

They come in during the day through any open window - even if only slightly ajar - (Damn are their heads strong and pushing things open or ajar) and scratch my furniture and generally moult hair wherever they have been - normally my bed or sofa. But worse still they are coming in through our bedroom windows (because we are downstairs) sometimes 15 times a night. The answer would to "close the windows" of course - but are flats are new builds and even in winter the insulation is so good the average room temp is 21 degrees! We HAVE to have windows open.

I have spoken to our neighbour and can see it from their point of view - they want to put their cats out - especially at night - but what can I do?

I just want some sleep!

So - I wondered if you lovely cat owners could tell me of some deterrents or things that you would do? I have researched the internet and found "cat-deterring" plants (no good in my bedroom window), ideas about citrus smells (not sure how to apply) to extreme "Am-tech" deterrent spikes for intruders and animals - supposedly maximum discomfort without harming.

As I said I do not want to hurt them. I feel sorry for them - as I don't think they have the best life in all truth, but if I wanted a cat in my home, I would get one - not 4, and not someone else's!

What do you think?

Chez


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## Kyria (Oct 29, 2011)

Hi there,

Gosh that sounds a nightmare...what about cat proofing your windows...If you go on a site called zooplus they have things on there that may help you. But it may be expensive 

Hopefully someone else will come on with more ideas...What about putting some net up at the windows? Maybe B&Q will have something.

Poor cats I feel sorry for you and for them.


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## Wiz201 (Jun 13, 2012)

Can you not just open your windows on a narrow 'security width?' I can open mine downstairs so they are wide enough to let fresh air in but nothing else can get in.


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Hi Chez, welcome to the forum Sorry to hear you are having all this hassle with your upstairs neighbour's cats! Sounds a bit of nightmare being woken up by the cats umpteen times a night, and I must say I think you are being very patient about it all.

The best protection would be to have some mesh insect screens fitted on the inside of your windows -- they are not too intrusive looking and have the advantage of keeping insects out as well as unwanted cats. I have some fitted on my windows, though in my case it is to keep my cats from climbing *out* rather than in. (They are obsessed with open windows even though they have a catflap!)

The screens are strong enough to resist a cat trying to push their way in.

I believe there may be a sticky on the boards about cat-proofing windows. But if not, then your try googling window screens.

In my case my OH made ours quite cheaply out of wood and mesh, painted the wood white, then fitted the screens to the window frame with hinges and put a catch to fasten on the other side from the hinges. The screens open inwards into the room so you can get to the window to open and close it, or clean it. You may not feel it is necessary to have the screens fitted to every window, just the ones the cats are prone to use as a short cut.

In an ideal world one would hope your neighbours would help with the cost of the screens, but by the sounds of it they are not the most considerate of neighbours, so it seems unlikely they will chip in.


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

What abut some netting on your windows that won't let anything in?


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## Guest (Aug 22, 2012)

You could get the toddler catches, that only allow the windows open 2" You could ask them to erect a climbing ladder, directly to their entry point. You could get a decorative grill for that window, but cats are much safer indoors. Could they pay for an enclosurebuilt around their window/porch?


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## Chez999 (Aug 22, 2012)

Hi All

Thanks for all your comments.

I am going to try the netting on the window idea to see if that will stop them coming in. I'll keep you posted!

Thanks again for taking the time to help!

Chez


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## Chez999 (Aug 22, 2012)

Hey Folks

I thought you might like an update following all your advice....

I tried the Mosquito type netting on the windows and once I found some Industrial Velcro sturdy enough to withhold their attempts to push through it, it has more or less done the trick.

I gave up trying to stop them coming into my home during the day when the back door was open - at the end of the day if they just sat on the sofa and slept, I figured who were they disturbing.....

I soon realised after a few days, that they weren't being fed at all, along with the two kittens that were also in the property above me and so started to leave out biscuits, whilst pouring biscuits for the kittens through her letterbox just in case they weren't either.

On Friday - the owner was evicted. Hoorah! But guess what? She abandoned all 4 cats. 

I took them all in that day as the bailiffs had just dumped them outside. I quickly realised I was not able to look after the two kittens - they were petrified - so called in a friend who knew a vet. I was told these 4 month old kittens were the size of 3 week olds - shocking. If I'd had any idea I would have called the RSPCA long ago.

The kittens have now been rehomed safely and happily. I contacted the Cats Protection League and the RSPCA regarding the other two, who are overfilled with unwanted cats and so cannot take them or rehouse them for me.

So in the space of two weeks I have gone from "Person who wants to keep Cats out of her home" to Cat Owner!!!

Leo the youngest is super mischievous and loves to claw my black leather sofa - I'm not too impressed by that. But he loves my husband and will sit for hours on his lap, snuggled into or licking his stubbly chin!!
Shadow at approx 3 years old is a ladies man, liking nothing more than to curl next to me for fussing or just to be close.

I am told by my Cat loving friends that the fact they both sleep stretched out and often "tummys up, legs akimbo!" means they are happy and feel safe. That's nice.

What next? Who knows. As I said before, I have never had animals, am not overly keen but would never be cruel. We have had donations of cat toys, feeding bowls, litter trays etc from our generous friends but I am not quite ready to let them stay for good.

We'll take care until new homes can be found. I have purchased cat food and will next be looking to get some kind of flea/tick protection. They don't have any, but as with live in the sticks with lots of fields I think it might be best - lots of foxes, badgers, rabbits and mice who could give them something!
I guess I also ought to seek out a vet who can tell me if they have had jabs and things - I do know they have been "done", whatever that means, so one less job. Although this may have to be delayed as money is not something we have a lot of. (I only work part time due to recovering from Cervical Cancer)

Poor things - how can people be so cruel? It just doesn't comprehend with me. They have done no harm, and whilst, Leo in particular seemed very aggressive, a couple of weeks of proper food and affection and he's a real cutey. They just want to be loved.....and cuddled lots!

I hope you all think I am doing the right thing - any advice or stories you may have gratefully recieved.

Just remember. I don't like cats. ahem. :blush:

Chez


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## MollyMilo (Feb 16, 2012)

What a fantastic outcome for you and those lucky cats! 

Who are you kidding.. They are there to stay 

Welcome aboard the mad house, any photos?


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## Wiz201 (Jun 13, 2012)

Wish I could take one on but I'm already saddled with two cats, one whose just been introduced, but I can offer any advice. I'm glad in a way she abandonded them, at least they've ended up in a better place.


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Chez -- thank you very much for updating us

I think it is absolutely wonderful you have taken in these abandoned cats! Well done you:thumbup: Particularly as you were never looking for any animal companions.

You sound like a lovely person, and thank goodness there are people like you in this world, with compassion and a good heart, to step in when other human beings behave shamefully to animals, like your neighbour did. 

I am sorry to hear that Leo is attacking your leather sofa I would suggest acquiring several good sturdy scratching posts/climbing frames and placing them around the house, putting one near the sofa. Rub the scratching posts with powdered catnip. Then every time either of the cats goes to scratch the sofa, lift them up and carry them to the scratch post, and then gently paddle their paws up and down to mimic a scratching action. I have trained new cats very quickly using this method, but you must be on to them immediately they go to scratch the sofa, and go through the procedure. Just shouting "no" is not enough 

Zooplus has some excellent scratching posts, and here is one my cats really like.

Diogenes XXL Scratching Barrel: Great Deals on Cat Trees at zooplus!

I know it looks a bit pricey, but it is well worth it, if it saves your expensive furniture. You would only need one of these and then one or two smaller (cheaper) ones. Even tho you may not be keeping the cats long term, it is still best to have some proper scratch posts for them, to encourage them to develop good habits. 

I look forward to updates on their progress, when you have the time


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## Summersky (Aug 11, 2012)

Somehow I doubt they are going anywhere!!

We too found ourselves reluctant cat owners, when a man upped and offed, leaving his cat behind to fend for herself. She arrived in our garden and lived with us for several years, before she had to be put to sleep. 

Two years later, another cat arrived. No chip, no reply to posters and adverts, nothing at local vets and rescue centres, so here she stays. The centres are fit to burst. She is friendly and house trained, so goodness knows what her story is.

So, reluctant cat owner, I suspect there are many of us out here!! Too soft to say no.

I am sure they will have a great life going forward. Do be absolutely sure that they are done though - wasn't sure where the babies came from. Our local RSPCA gave us a voucher to use at the vets for a spay.


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## Wiz201 (Jun 13, 2012)

with scratching, I find catching them in the act also works making a noise or distracting with toys. But I do provide mats for them - have a couple of door mats from ikea that I let them scratch because they're so tough.


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## jill3 (Feb 18, 2009)

Well done to you for taking them in.
As Chilliminx says a sratching post is well worth the money.
I think these little souls will grow on you:001_wub:

As you are recovering from Cancer which I am sorry to hear, these little guys will help you.
Cats are very good for your health. They relieve stress.
I am not just saying this it has been proved. 
So what you pay out for them in keep they will repay you back two fold.

If they need neutering you could contact that cats protection or the RSPCA i think they give you a voucher or a very good discount.

Will look forward to seeing some photos of them


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## Chez999 (Aug 22, 2012)

Hi Everyone

Thanks for your comments and advice. Scratching posts it is next then!

Your comments are really lovely - glad you think I am doing the right thing so far!!

As for pictures see attached.

Leo is the one with the white paws, approx 18 months with a penchance for my Hubby's stubble and our bed.
Shadow is approx 3 years - all black apart from a flash of white under his chin, and likes hunting in the fields - disappearing for hours and then coming for cuddles at night. He has declared his permanent bed as my hubby's gaming chair.

Chez


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## egyptianreggae (May 26, 2012)

Oh, they are gorgeous! How anybody can abandon such wonderful animals is beyond me. Everyone looks so happy in the photos


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Kyria said:


> Hi there,
> 
> Gosh that sounds a nightmare...what about cat proofing your windows...If you go on a site called zooplus they have things on there that may help you. But it may be expensive
> 
> ...


Yes, sure there are some things like grilles you can put over a slightly open window, like you can if you want - not on a hot day - to leave a car window open but don't want the dog to be able to get out.


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

Chez999 said:


> Hey Folks
> 
> I thought you might like an update following all your advice....
> 
> ...


Lovely you...but word of warning, don't involve the RSPCA as they will kill them. Cats Protection are the ones, great that you did that!


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## Chez999 (Aug 22, 2012)

I have loads of questions which I will pick your brains with as and when I need to but here's a couple for now..

When does a Kitten become a cat? I have been buying Cat food but have seen "kitten food" too. As Leo is 18 months - should I be getting kitten products instead for him? Neither are large cats - they individually sit easily on your lap, but if I was to say so I'd say Shadow was a "Cat" and Leo - a "Teenager?!" with attitude to match - boy does he like to wind up Shadow, or just randomly jump on him when passing him when he's fast asleep.

Also what is the right amount of food a day? I have read a few posts on here and they all seem to be different.
I have started with a wet food serving mid morning and evening and then keeping their biscuits topped up all day.

Is that about right or should it be more/less?

Thanks 

Chez


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Chez -- a good quality high meat content wet cat food is fine for both cats, they don't need kitten food, which is really just a marketing ploy anyway.

Many forum members prefer to feed our cats an *entirely* wet food diet, and leave one of the meals in a timed autofeeder if we are going to be out at work all day. (autofeeders can be bought from amazon)

Other members like to feed a *mainly * wet food diet with perhaps a handful of dry food kibble ("biscuits") left down during the day time.

It is up to you, but the consensus of opinion here is that a mainly wet food diet is better for cats' long term health. Also dry food can cause dehydration as cats are not good drinkers (having a low thirst drive), and have evolved to get most of their fluids from their food (or prey).

As for quantities, the 18 mth old is still growing so he may need more than the 3 yr old, though this is not a hard and fast rule as it depends on the individual metabolism. I would expect to feed an 18 mth old neutered male cat about 4 pouches of a high meat content wet food a day. The 3 yr old may be OK on about 3 pouches.

Best thing is to start feeding that amount and if they leave food on the plate you can cut the portions down a bit. If they scoff everything and still seem hungry, then you may need to increase the wet food a bit. I have a 2.5 yr old neutered male who eats the equivalent of 5 pouches of wet food a day (some of it in raw food), and he is not overweight, but is very active and lively, so burns a lot of it off!

Which wet foods are you feeding atm?

If you do decide to continue feeding some dry food, it's best to get one that is low in carbs, as cats do nor digest carbs easily, and they pass straight through their gut making for smelly poos!. Good quality grain free makes of dry food are e.g. James Wellbeloved, Applaws, Orijen, Acana.


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## MollyMilo (Feb 16, 2012)

Gorgeous relaxed cats!

I think if you rehome them, they will come back!


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## Guest (Sep 21, 2012)

Wet food is better. You can even add a tablespoon of water to that. You can try chicken necks, RAW not cooked. NO cooked bones, which will help with teeth cleaning.


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## Kah (Jul 20, 2012)

What a great ending for the cats - and I think you have been wonderful in caring for them so well. wish they were moe people like you in the world.
A word of warning though - I didn't want a cat either - and then Gatsby appeared on my doorstep! Couldn't imagine him not being around now


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## Chez999 (Aug 22, 2012)

Well here we are, 5 months since my first post and enquiry.

And you were ALL right. Despite my protestations about not being interested in animals, let alone specifically cats, they have converted me.

We had a cute and cuddly Christmas, have had thorough health checks with a local vet and now my medicine cupboard shelf shares the paracetamol with room for worm tablets and flea drops, my living room always has some kind of toys strewn somewhere, I have been up close and personal (Xmas day, I think Cat Santa had been on my pillow!) with various degrees of living and dead mice - very gross - there's been a hole cut in my back door for a very well used Cat Flap and my hubby has gone as soft as Marshmallow.

What am I going on about? Yes Shadow and Leo remain with us. Shadow has proven to be a ladies man and follows me EVERYWHERE. He curls up beside me (or on me) at every opportunity and loves to pin my head to floor so he can lick my hair - vet tells me he is grooming me....?"

Leo is getting there - being the worse of the two abused, we have kept giving him deadlines - "if his behaviour hasn't improved by the end of the month... well the end of next month... next month..." And it was worth the wait. He is still a little aggressive during play, biting and scratching. He still chases and pounces on Shadow but maybe just 3-4 times a day but does not constantly fight with him, and he is affectionate now. He loves to sit on mine or his "daddy's" lap to sleep. He will let us stroke him now without injury, and at night sleeps on my hubby's head which by morning has become his chest with the old lick of his morning stubble!

I never would have said that the little angry bundle would turn so cuddly - but now he is and chirps away like a little bird when he's really in a cuddly mood!

Me? A Cat Lady? Its crazy but its true. My family are stunned!

Those pesky fluffy 4 legged buggers did it! 

Thanks for all your advice and help everyone. I feel I can now use this forum without guilt or feeling silly now. I have cats! And I can admit it now!

Chez xx:crazy:

The photo is "not so angry anymore" Leo on my lap and "Ladies Man" Shadow sat next to us.


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## carly87 (Feb 11, 2011)

Ah, I see you've caught the dreaded disease. Ah well, we're all sufferers on this forum, so you can share your obsession with us and we'll hold your hand and understand.

Welcome to the world of cat ownership!

I kne wyou'd keep them, even before I got to the end of the thread. They sound like such little sweeties!


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## AvaRags (Jan 5, 2013)

Ahhhh such a lovely story, it has had me smiling all the way though, and no you didn't fool me with your 'I'm not a cat person' talk 
Your cats look so very happy and grateful to have such a loving family.
I hope your health is good and you continue to update us with your new life with cats :biggrin5:


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## Grace_Lily (Nov 28, 2010)

Thank you for keeping us updated, you've put a big smile on my face! It's so lovely that you've taken the little ones on, thank you for being so kind hearted and welcome to cat ownership! There's no turning back now, you'll be hooked for life! 

They sound like absolute darlings and have landed on their feet with you. Look forward to hearing more about them


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## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww


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## anjo19 (Nov 17, 2012)

Welcome convert! You sound very much like me; I've always liked animals but never had pets, I liked the idea but never wanted the inconvenience. To be honest, I always preferred dogs (possibly because I was exposed to them more and had a couple of bad cat experiences as a child), so a cat was certainly never an option for us, until one night this cat turned up and we realised she was on her own and underweight. I wanted her to go back home, I wanted to not have a problem with a stray cat...but as I realised I was crying because I didn't like the idea of her being outside alone, I was opening up a tin of tuna and letting her in.... 

As I type this now, she is sprawled out along my legs fast asleep. 

And yes!!...use the forum guilt free...I was the same but sooo over it now xx


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## MollyMilo (Feb 16, 2012)

Oh I just knew it 

My heart feels all warm and glowy 

Gorgeous boys, they chose you and had no intention of going anywhere else!!!
Is the mesh still on the window? :001_smile:


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

Well done to you for stepping in and rescuing these cats. It makes me so mad that people can get away with abusing animals in this way.

Are you ABSOLUTELY POSITIVE they have been done? Otherwise, you will soon be saddled with even more 

Good luck and I am sure you will find lots of advice on this forum. 

I hope there IS such a thing as karma, and the scumbags get what they deserve!


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Chez -- you are so right about the way cats steal their way into our hearts! 
Entrancing creatures that they are! 

I'm very pleased to hear you decided to keep those two gorgeous cats! They have fallen on their feet, and found a lovely home, which they truly deserve. I'm so happy for them. 

Thank you for updating us!


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## Kyria (Oct 29, 2011)

I so agree with Chillminx about cats stealing our hearts. I never had any interest in cats atall thought they were very unfriendly animals, always had dogs all my life and my husband, well dont think any animals appealed to him much especially cats. Than one day last summer Tipsy decided to move in. Never believed I could love this little furball creature so much since than we got another cat Nemo. My husband has absolutely fallen in love with both of the cats and they love him dearly too Our children and our life would be empty without our fur babys....Your story has a beautiful ending. Enjoy a happy life together.
Kyria x


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## Kiwi (Nov 18, 2010)

We were adopted by our cat and I can tell you now that she turned us into cat lovers for ever. Even her pooing in the garden doesn't bother me as she is meticulous about digging it in (unless left deliberately to mark her territory to warn other cats). Repping you for taking care of the 2 kittens but not for the ones you kept because they will be their own reward!  Good luck with your recovery x


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## Chez999 (Aug 22, 2012)

What lovely comments. Its so nice to be part of such a supportive group. Your words mean a lot.

Thank you all! 

Chez, Leo & Shadow!


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## Paddypaws (May 4, 2010)

What a wonderful story! I have just read it all the way through and seem to have something making my eyes water.
I love the picture of the Tuxedo cat on your lap....his 'arms' are stretched out grabbing onto you as if to say 'mine, ALL mine, ahhhhh'


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## merlin12 (Jun 24, 2011)

Really, really happy how this turned out


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## MLG (Jan 25, 2013)

You sound like a wonderful person and I wish you all the best and hope the Cats will bring you a lot of happiness


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## ChinaBlue (Feb 3, 2008)

Well done you both for taking on these babies and sticking with them. They look adorable. Hope you stay with the forum and keep us updated.


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## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

Just reading this for the first time, what a lovely story.

I grew up a cat hater, and only got one in my mid twenties as the (now ex) husband wanted a kitten. 
Can't imagine my life without cats now, so can relate to how they've won you over.


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## Chez999 (Aug 22, 2012)

Wow! Can't believe it's been nearly 2 years since I asked you all for some advice on this thread.

I am now 100% a cat Mummy. I am embarrassed to refer to myself as mummy and am smitten by "my Boys".

Leo is still "Baby Leo" but less mischievous is his old age of 3. He loves his Daddy most, and sleeps on his pillow at night, licking his stubble being the favourite pastime. Shadow is now about 7 and is Mummy's boy. And Shadow seems aptly named now. Wherever I am. He is. He follows me everywhere and I adore him so much.

We haven't holiday'd since having them - how do you leave them?? I sing in a band and had a festival in July which required a travel and sleep over. My "lil" brother of 27 stayed over as I worried considering their past they would think they'd been abandoned again and WE spent the whole night in our tent missing their cuddles!!  They were like "You've been away? Whatever - Uncle Ash gave us fish from his takeaway!" 

I now understand you all. Pussy Cats are the best thing ever. Despite the daily "presents" of mice, voles and birds which break my heart to see yet another innocent death at the paws of my boys, I can't now remember why I didn't like animals and in particular cats?!!

My other problem is now, how do you stop spending? Every shopping trip finds me wandering down the "cat aisle" of the supermarket or looking out for a new pet shop. My cats have a toy box!! WHAAATT?? 2 years ago I would have scoffed and said how silly!!

Ultimately - I now find myself constantly talking about my boys - or should that be boring anyone that stand stills for longer than 5 minutes about my boys :yesnod: I talk to any cat on the street with "Hello my lovely! Aren't you gorgeous!"

Glad I found this site. Glad I found Pussy Cats!


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

How lovely to hear from you! 

Thank you so much for coming back and updating us. It sounds as though your boys are doing wonderfully well, and that you have joined the ranks of "crazy cat people" just like the rest of us!  

I understand and sympathise with you not wanting to go on holiday and leave them - My OH and I haven't taken a holiday together for many years, as we can't bear to leave our cats without one of us at home to look after them.  I doubt I would ever go away at all if I had to leave them in the care of a stranger. 

It would be lovely to see recent pics of your two boys if you could manage it?


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## Calvine (Aug 20, 2012)

They do say that cats always land on their feet and your two certainly have!! I love stories like this!


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## huckybuck (Jan 17, 2014)

This is the first time I've read this thread and it's made me overjoyed!!!! There's been a lot of sadness and negativity on the forums recently and it's wonderful to read something totally positive and uplifting and heartwarming.

What a LOVELY person Chez99 is not least that she keeps coming back to update as well


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## Chez999 (Aug 22, 2012)

As requested, recent photos of Leo (white paws and whiskers) and older "brother" shadow.

Chez xx


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Aww thanks for the photos Chez! Very handsome boys!:001_wub: They look the picture of contentment.


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## LostSoul (Sep 29, 2012)

what handsome boys :001_wub:

it sounds like they knew you needed some kitty love and made it their job to give it to you...and im so happy everything worked out.
cats do have a sneaky way of clawing their way into our hearts they know we'll love them even before we know ourselves! xxx


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