# When will I be able to tell if my kittens inherited the munchkin legs?



## OhLydia (Jul 30, 2016)

Luna, my Napoleon, just had a litter of kittens (bred with Persian), and I'm wondering when I'll be able to determine which(if any) of her babies inherited the short leg characteristic. 
Thank you!


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## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

Do you not have a mentor to ask? Otherwise perhaps a FB group dedicated to Munchkins & other short leg breeds will be more helpful


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## OhLydia (Jul 30, 2016)

spotty cats said:


> Do you not have a mentor to ask? Otherwise perhaps a FB group dedicated to Munchkins & other short leg breeds will be more helpful


It's just very difficult to find any literature on the subject, so I thought I'd ask here. Plus I like getting multiple opinions. Isn't that what this site is for?


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## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

There aren't any Munchkin breeders on here....


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## OhLydia (Jul 30, 2016)

spotty cats said:


> There aren't any Munchkin breeders on here....


How would I know that without asking, and how do you know that anyway? I don't understand why you're being aggressive about my asking for help


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## buffie (May 31, 2010)

OhLydia said:


> How would I know that without asking, and how do you know that anyway? I don't understand why you're being aggressive about my asking for help


What is aggressive about spotty cats post ?


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## OhLydia (Jul 30, 2016)

buffie said:


> What is aggressive about spotty cats post ?


Just the general tone and use of "..." 
On the internet that's aggressive lol


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

OhLydia said:


> Just the general tone and use of "..."
> On the internet that's aggressive lol


If you think .... is aggressive, you won't like this forum. Some of the members use real words! (Is ! 'aggressive'?) Spottycats knows that most of the UK breeders on this forum belong to GCCF, which will never recognise Munchkins or related breeds.


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## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

OhLydia said:


> It's just very difficult to find any literature on the subject, so I thought I'd ask here. *Plus I like getting multiple opinions.* Isn't that what this site is for?


Oh I'm sure you'll get a few opinions on those breeds on here, I'm just not sure they'll be ones you like!

Why would you intentionally breed animals with such a deformity? I can't see anywhere in your first post that the welfare of the animals is a priority, just the likelihood of the kittens inheriting this deformity, ergo novelty value/money seems to be the driving force here.

There are enough established cat breeds & this trend is trying to create ever more freakish 'hybrids' to satisfy human ego is both disturbing & wrong.

Some in the cat breeding world should maybe take a look at the mess humans have created in the dog world by breeding for ever more extreme 'type' in some breeds & perhaps reevaluate their ethics.


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## Lurcherlad (Jan 5, 2013)

Ditto


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## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

OhLydia said:


> Just the general tone and use of "..."
> On the internet that's aggressive lol


I have been around various forums for over 10 years and never heard that.


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

OhLydia said:


> Just the general tone and use of "..."
> On the internet that's aggressive lol


It is? That's new to me. No mention of that meaning on Wikipedia.


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## Tigermoon (Apr 2, 2013)

:Troll:Troll:Troll


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## Rainfall (Nov 4, 2015)

I have no help or opinion to give on breeding but I do agree that ... is usually seen as a negative thing, usually frustration or disagreement when discussing something. 
https://www.quora.com/What-does-it-...riods-instead-of-one-period-to-end-a-sentence

Interestingly called ellipsis - There is even a wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellipsis


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## QOTN (Jan 3, 2014)

Rainfall said:


> I have no help or opinion to give on breeding but I do agree that ... is usually seen as a negative thing, usually frustration or disagreement when discussing something.
> https://www.quora.com/What-does-it-...riods-instead-of-one-period-to-end-a-sentence
> Interestingly called ellipsis - There is even a wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ellipsis


What about the other suggestions in the link? They all seem possible particularly the idea that something else is to follow. In any case, frustration and disagreement are not inevitably aggressive. I hope most of us can express those feelings without aggression and frequently do on this forum. It can be a very frustrating place.


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## Rainfall (Nov 4, 2015)

QOTN said:


> What about the other suggestions in the link? They all seem possible particularly the idea that something else is to follow. In any case, frustration and disagreement are not inevitably aggressive. I hope most of us can express those feelings without aggression and frequently do on this forum. It can be a very frustrating place.


Yes of course there are different interpretations  Generally on other forums I frequent its usually interpreted as "I wanted to say more but I'll hold my tongue" or frustration, all in context. People go into arguments all the time because of it.

I don't think it was aggressive, so we now have three different views on what it meant: nothing special, aggressive and in my view perhaps frustrated (as it's not a good breed).
This just shows how easy it is to misunderstand written text online.


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## Guest (Aug 3, 2016)

Pfft... if using an ellipsis is aggressive then I’m a psychopath! 
... ... ... ...


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## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

ouesi said:


> Pfft... if using an ellipsis is aggressive then I'm a psychopath!
> ... ... ... ...


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## Rufus15 (Dec 4, 2015)

Maybe don't breed from deformed cats and you won't get rude or undesirable replies?


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## gskinner123 (Mar 10, 2010)

Do they have any inherent health problems as a result of 'the legs' ?


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## Vanessa131 (Nov 16, 2014)

gskinner123 said:


> Do they have any inherent health problems as a result of 'the legs' ?


Yes. If the kittens are homozygous munchkin they are likely to be born dead. They commonly suffer from a disorder of the spinal muscles that can cause death by three months of age. They can also have a very hollow chest where the ribs and sternum are deformed. The reason they aren't a recognised breed with gccf is because of how awful and cruel their health problems are.


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## SusieRainbow (Jan 21, 2013)

ouesi said:


> Pfft... if using an ellipsis is aggressive then I'm a psychopath!
> ... ... ... ...


Same here ... .... ...


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## ZoeM (Jul 16, 2015)

I am so ... right now.


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## Jonescat (Feb 5, 2012)

With regards to the .... I thought it used to mean "nothing further needs to be said", and was traditionally used to delicately leave the reader at the bedroom door in a certain sort of novel. I don't think it was an ellipsis in the above post as the statement was not a quote. Never heard of it being aggressive, athough language evolves all the time and I think it can represent a thought or statement trailing off, but again with the implication that there is nothing else to say.


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

My understanding of an ellipsis has always been that it indicates an omission or suppression of a word or phrase that is superfluous to the meaning of the sentence or can be understood from the context.

Ellipsis is also often used when writing dialogue to indicate a pause. e.g. "I'm not sure whether I'm going to be there tomorrow...I still haven't made up my mind"

On the internet there is something known as ellipsis abuse, which is when people use it constantly as though they were conversing in real life, e.g hi there.... how are you all today.....? I'm not too bad.....but could be better. It is considered bad form to use it this way, but no way is it regarded as aggressive!

And then there is the form of ellipsis used at the end of a sentence. It may be used with a question mark. e.g. "So you went to the gym, and...?" Without a question mark it can indicate an unfinished thought, sadness or a sense of longing. The unfinished thought may be something the writer tactfully prefers not to say, but may imply.

I have never heard of use of ellipsis being regarded as *aggressive, * not even on the internet. Even the Urban Dictionary does not give such a meaning. I think the OP is winding us up!


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## Ceiling Kitty (Mar 7, 2010)

I love a good ellipsis but never knew it could be considered aggressive.


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## chillminx (Nov 22, 2010)

Ceiling Kitty said:


> I love a good ellipsis but never knew it could be considered aggressive.


Actually I wonder if the OP is thinking of the _*context*_ in which an ellipsis is used to replace a missing word

e.g. if writing something like "Why don't you just .....off !" Which would of course be aggressive! :Stop.

Just a thought, LOL


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## spotty cats (Jul 24, 2012)

Oh dear, no aggression lol merely a trail off of thoughts, no Munchy breeders here, so refer to other post above of seeking out breeders.

I did catch up with a friend who breeds them at a recent show and got the answer, really the best way to get breed specific information is via a mentor and others within the breed.
Knowing there are no Munchkin breeders on the forum directing elsewhere was meant to helpful


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## Rufus15 (Dec 4, 2015)

Op hasn't been back since so won't read these replies unfortunately. I will never understand the desire to breed a deformity, with so many wonderful breeds already established and lovely, *healthy* breeds like the Toyger coming in as assessment, there is no need whatsoever to breed unhealthy kittens that will have a life full of pain.


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## havoc (Dec 8, 2008)

chillminx said:


> I have never heard of use of ellipsis being regarded as *aggressive, * not even on the internet.


I use them if I copy and paste from another source to make it clear I've taken a small amount from a much larger document. How is that aggressive?


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## Kotanushka (Oct 25, 2013)

OhLydia said:


> Just the general tone and use of "..."
> On the internet that's aggressive lol


Chip on the shoulder maybe?


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## Mikal1980 (Mar 26, 2018)

Rufus15 said:


> Maybe don't breed from deformed cats and you won't get rude or undesirable replies?
> Maybe you should get a life munchkins are adorable and healthy to boot so


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