# Aggression



## Emmastace (Feb 11, 2011)

Hi
I am usually in the dog forum but thought I would ask in here about a problem my son's girlfriend has with her rabbit.
They bought her from a pet shop in January and they were told that she was 3 months old and that she had been homed twice before but both owners had brought her back because she would not let them pick her up. 
When you go to pick her up she grunts very loudly then scratches with her front feet and bites.
Once she has been picked up she settles and seems to enjoy being stroked and held. She appears relaxed and isn't rigid as I would expect her to be if she was scared, but then I know nothing about rabbits.
I haven't tried to pick her up but she has scratched and bitten me when I have been putting food in her run. She is now 7 months old. Would having her neutered help with this or can you suggest other ways to make her less aggressive. 
We think she is either a lionhead or lionhead x


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## hazyreality (Jan 11, 2009)

Hiya,

I would say having her spayed would make a big difference to the behaviour, the biting when putting your hand in the hutch is basic teratorial behaviour and spaying should calm that down  A neutered male friend would also calm her down if of course there is room, rabbits are very sociable and can get aggressive when kept on their own, particulary outdoors. 

Rabbits on the whole dont like being picked up, they much prefer fuss and contact on their level, picking them up makes them panic as they would usually be picked up by something trying to kill them, they are a prey animal.

What sort of size hutch does she have? Does she have a run, attached or seperate?

Lionheads usually are a very docile breed I've found


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## Rhi (Feb 19, 2011)

hazyreality said:


> Hiya,
> 
> I would say having her spayed would make a big difference to the behaviour, the biting when putting your hand in the hutch is basic teratorial behaviour and spaying should calm that down  A neutered male friend would also calm her down if of course there is room, rabbits are very sociable and can get aggressive when kept on their own, particulary outdoors.
> 
> ...


Completely agree apart from the Lionhead point. I had a lionhead who was absolutely bonkers


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## hazyreality (Jan 11, 2009)

Rhi said:


> Completely agree apart from the Lionhead point. I had a lionhead who was absolutely bonkers


Lol, I ment friendly, they can be nuts, Hope my Lionhed X was the worst I've had for escaping!

*Heidi*


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

spaying will really help her, at 7 months old she has hit bunny puberty and has very high levels of hormone surging through her body (rabbits have much higher hormone levels then most other animals, this is belived to be one of the reasons why 80% of unspayed does will get uterine cancer)

also, most rabbits really dont like being picked up, they enjoy attention on their terms much more, picking a bun up can be a very scary experience for a bunny


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## Rhi (Feb 19, 2011)

hazyreality said:


> Lol, I ment friendly, they can be nuts, Hope my Lionhed X was the worst I've had for escaping!
> 
> *Heidi*


I've actually met an aggressive castrated lionhead male who just wanted to protect his lady. My girl was very highly strung too. I find larger bunnies a bit more laid back but then again if you go to a rescue the bun will be neutered already and staff will know about their personality so it would be down to the original rabbit and not the breed.


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

Rhi said:


> I've actually met an aggressive castrated lionhead male who just wanted to protect his lady. My girl was very highly strung too. I find larger bunnies a bit more laid back but then again if you go to a rescue the bun will be neutered already and staff will know about their personality so it would be down to the original rabbit and not the breed.


tell that to my conti!!! she will nip you if she doesnt get her own way :lol: :lol: :lol:

what a rabbit is like is very much down to their individual personalities and characteristics, they are all very unique


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## Rhi (Feb 19, 2011)

Lil Miss said:


> tell that to my conti!!! she will nip you if she doesnt get her own way :lol: :lol: :lol:
> 
> what a rabbit is like is very much down to their individual personalities and characteristics, they are all very unique


Definitely! I have 2 girls at the mo who are cross-breeds that I adopted together and have lived together for years. One is the friendliest bun I have ever met and demands attention at every possible opportunity. The other is petrified of people and will do anything to not even be looked at by humans.


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## Emmastace (Feb 11, 2011)

Thanks for all that info, you are obviously as great in here as they are in the dog forum.
Marmite is in a hutch with an attached run. It is outside but in an enclosed sheltered area. She is secured in the hutch at night but let out in the run all day.
I think getting her spayed would be a good next move and if necessary look into a bigger hutch and run and a male if that doesn't work.
Problem with all that is that the kids would be even more vocal about getting a companion for the dog and I wouldn't have an argument if I had done that for the rabbit.


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## wacky (Jan 23, 2011)

i agree with lil i have a conti doe who can be agresive when she wants and a conti buck whos like a baby just likes to be loved nither are neuted i think does are more agresive natched


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## Rhi (Feb 19, 2011)

Emmastace said:


> Thanks for all that info, you are obviously as great in here as they are in the dog forum.
> Marmite is in a hutch with an attached run. It is outside but in an enclosed sheltered area. She is secured in the hutch at night but let out in the run all day.
> I think getting her spayed would be a good next move and if necessary look into a bigger hutch and run and a male if that doesn't work.
> Problem with all that is that the kids would be even more vocal about getting a companion for the dog and I wouldn't have an argument if I had done that for the rabbit.


That sounds good. The absolute minimum size the RSPCA recommend is a 6ft x2ft x2ft hutch with 24:7 access to a 6ft x4ft x2ft run however the bigger the better. I have a dog kennel which I prefer as you can get in it to clean it. I find hutches a bit of a pain but it is all personal preference. Just wanted to let you know that hutches and runs are not the only option.

As far as the dog goes he has you guys for company. A rabbit will get lonely out in a hutch on it's own.


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

Emmastace said:


> Thanks for all that info, you are obviously as great in here as they are in the dog forum.
> Marmite is in a hutch with an attached run. It is outside but in an enclosed sheltered area. She is secured in the hutch at night but let out in the run all day.
> I think getting her spayed would be a good next move and if necessary look into a bigger hutch and run and a male if that doesn't work.
> Problem with all that is that the kids would be even more vocal about getting a companion for the dog and I wouldn't have an argument if I had done that for the rabbit.


How big is the hutch/run?

My frenchie Teddy was very hutch aggressive when i resuced him mainly out of frustration that he was on his own and didnt have enough room. My suggestion would be get her spayed, let her hormones settle and then go to a rescue and find a neutered male to bond her with. They really need a hucth 6x2x2ft with a permenant 6x2x2ft run


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## Emmastace (Feb 11, 2011)

Rhi said:


> That sounds good. The absolute minimum size the RSPCA recommend is a 6ft x2ft x2ft hutch with 24:7 access to a 6ft x4ft x2ft run however the bigger the better. I have a dog kennel which I prefer as you can get in it to clean it. I find hutches a bit of a pain but it is all personal preference. Just wanted to let you know that hutches and runs are not the only option.
> 
> As far as the dog goes he has you guys for company. A rabbit will get lonely out in a hutch on it's own.


The hutch and run are big enough then, but is that for just one rabbit? would it need to be bigger for two? I won't risk leaving her to go in and out of the run at night because there are too many foxes around here. She is let out around 6.30am when I open up to serve breakfasts and is locked away at about 10pm after I take the dog out for her late walk. I just feel she is safer with two barriers to get through for the foxes.


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## hazyreality (Jan 11, 2009)

The bigger the better  Another small bunny would proberly be fine in that size, but if you can have bigger then it would be better, even if you could add another run on would be great  6.30am - 10pm is pretty good going, I dont blame you for being worried about the foxes! 

*Heidi*


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## Rhi (Feb 19, 2011)

Emmastace said:


> The hutch and run are big enough then, but is that for just one rabbit? would it need to be bigger for two? I won't risk leaving her to go in and out of the run at night because there are too many foxes around here. She is let out around 6.30am when I open up to serve breakfasts and is locked away at about 10pm after I take the dog out for her late walk. I just feel she is safer with two barriers to get through for the foxes.


That's for 2. The RSPCA don't have minimum sizes for 1 as they say that all rabbits should have company so why would they say what a single rabbit requires?

Is the run on slabs? If so that would be good night time accommodation for a pair with access to a larger enclosure during the day to enable running around. I personally think a 6ft x4ft run is too small to enabling binkying but is fine for stretching their legs.


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## Emmastace (Feb 11, 2011)

Rhi said:


> *That's for 2. The RSPCA don't have minimum sizes for 1 as they say that all rabbits should have company so why would they say what a single rabbit requires?*
> 
> Is the run on slabs? If so that would be good night time accommodation for a pair with access to a larger enclosure during the day to enable running around. I personally think a 6ft x4ft run is too small to enabling binkying but is fine for stretching their legs.


My apologies for the stupid question. I know nothing about keeping rabbits and only have this one as my son's girlfriends father arrived here one Sunday morning with it and all it's stuff in his van and said that we either kept it here or he would set it free on the M4 on his way home.
I didn't really think it was a good idea as we have a rescue GSP, that is a prolific hunter with loads of issues that we are trying to rehabilitate, and I was worried that having a rabbit on the premises might be one step too far for her. So far we have managed it well from the point of view that the rabbit is still alive but I don't know what is going on in the dogs head with a rabbit so close.
As it is on my property I want to make sure that it is looked after the best way we can but it isn't mine.


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## Emmastace (Feb 11, 2011)

I think that's my cue to retire to the dog forum.
Thanks for all the constructive help though x


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

Emmastace said:


> I think that's my cue to retire to the dog forum.
> Thanks for all the constructive help though x


aww hun you dont have to retire to the dog forum, we are a nice bunch here really, just very passionate about our fluffs

rhi chick, not every one knows all that much about rabbits, the OP has already said its not her bunny, she is here to learn, even to me your tone did sound a bit harsh there hun, it wasnt a stupid question, it was a very valid one, if you dont know it is much better to ask then just do

if foxes are active in your area i dont blame you for shutting bun away, nothing is fox proof, a fox can make very short work of the mesh on a run, it might be worth sending a bloke out to wee around the edges of the garden, human male urine is a natural fox repelant :lol:


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## Rhi (Feb 19, 2011)

Lil Miss said:


> a
> rhi chick, not every one knows all that much about rabbits, the OP has already said its not her bunny, she is here to learn, even to me your tone did sound a bit harsh there hun, it wasnt a stupid question, it was a very valid one, if you dont know it is much better to ask then just do


I didn't mean it in a condescending way at all hence my comment about the dog not necessarily needing doggy company as he has company. So wish you could imply tone in text . Not got my head round these smileys either which doesn't help.

I literally did mean that there is no guidance for single rabbits as the RSPCA don't endorse it.

I apologise if I caused offence, I was trying to help and offer encouragement not scare you away .


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## Ozzboz (May 10, 2010)

My Boy rabbit was VERY agressive when his hormones kicked in. After neutering and about 6 weeks he became a different rabbit. I think its cos I still spent time with him and would stroke him everytime he was noshing his food and spoke gently to him to build trust. I used thick gloves to handle him if I had to (he bit through one of them). She sounds terratorial and like she has trust issues too! 

When their trust is won these can make the best rabbits. I would get her used to you, she may have been ill treated in the past and be fearful showing it with aggression. It may take alot of time and patience but I am sure she'll be worth it in the end. Be prepared when she is spayed for her to be poorly. A spaying is massive compared to a neuter if you help her get well again it may build her trust in you aswell. I do have a Boy and a Girl both neutered/spayed but they were only reunited a few months ago. Being patient worked for me and my Boy and now he is really sweet (but only with me) cos he's a mummy's boy! LOL


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## Lil Miss (Dec 11, 2010)

haha, the lack of tone on forums can be a right pain in the bum!!! everyone reads things differently too, so easy to take offence or cause offence without meaning too

i do agree though, bunnies are so much better off with company


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## Rhi (Feb 19, 2011)

Lil Miss said:


> haha, the lack of tone on forums can be a right pain in the bum!!! everyone reads things differently too, so easy to take offence or cause offence without meaning too
> 
> i do agree though, bunnies are so much better off with company


Definitely. Didn't mean to sound like a narky cow at all. Marmite sounds like she's in great hands and I was just trying to agree that she was being looked after well and offer info that could make the OP's life easier and maybe give her a some company and a bit more space if it's available


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

Emmastace said:


> I think that's my cue to retire to the dog forum.
> Thanks for all the constructive help though x


no, come back!!!!


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## Emmastace (Feb 11, 2011)

Got over my huff and all apologies gratefully received. 
I am OK with time and patience to help this little one as I have had enough practice with Mia. She is a deeply traumatised rescue Pointer that was puppy farmed then chained in a yard with no shelter and no company, human or animal, from a baby. We have had her almost a year from 16 months old and she is the sweetest, most loving animal but terrified of everything outside of our property because the world is new to her. It would be the same as someone born and growing up in a dungeon suddenly flung out into the world at 21 years old, every noise, smell and sight is scary.
With the help of you guys I will do my best to guide my son's girlfriend into helping Marmite and doing the best for her. I seem to have already taken on the job of letting her out every morning but I have to encourage the real owner to take responsibility. 
I have one more question.......she built a nest and lined it with fur last week. Is that the teenage hormones kicking in? If so, is it OK to spay at any time?


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

Emmastace said:


> Got over my huff and all apologies gratefully received.
> I am OK with time and patience to help this little one as I have had enough practice with Mia. She is a deeply traumatised rescue Pointer that was puppy farmed then chained in a yard with no shelter and no company, human or animal, from a baby. We have had her almost a year from 16 months old and she is the sweetest, most loving animal but terrified of everything outside of our property because the world is new to her. It would be the same as someone born and growing up in a dungeon suddenly flung out into the world at 21 years old, every noise, smell and sight is scary.
> With the help of you guys I will do my best to guide my son's girlfriend into helping Marmite and doing the best for her. I seem to have already taken on the job of letting her out every morning but I have to encourage the real owner to take responsibility.
> I have one more question.......she built a nest and lined it with fur last week. Is that the teenage hormones kicking in? If so, is it OK to spay at any time?


Oh good, we are nice really honest! 

Yes shes hormonal bless her, a good rabbit savy vet will spay once shes mature enough which can be as early as 4 months sometimes, however many vets like to wait until they are 6 months old for does.  All animals that have been traumatised or had a difficult past need that time and patience, bunnies are the same, they need the right life enrichement/living conditions to be happy. So you have the right attitude which is a great start, its much harder though as this bun isn't really your responsibility, nice that you want to do your best for her.


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