# Cesar Milan....



## cupcake (Feb 19, 2008)

I'm watching it now,
I LOVE it and I swear by the tecniques. What does everyone else think? Do you use the tecniques? If so how do they work for you? Are you anti cesar millan? 

Do you even know who he is ? x


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## Guest (Mar 19, 2008)

I think its quite interesting to watch his methods seem to work,bet he wouldnt use a e-collar!


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

clare7577 said:


> I think its quite interesting to watch his methods seem to work,bet he wouldnt use a e-collar!


Yes he does, he used one not long ago to stop an austrailian cattle dog chasing the farm vehicles, it had already lost an eye through doing this, and the owners were concern he might die.


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## Guest (Mar 19, 2008)

i havent seen many of his programmes,he just didnt strike me as being the type of person to use one.i stand corrected.


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## Guest (Mar 19, 2008)

I wouldnt have thought he would either. Thought he was better than that. I've watched a few of his programmes and was impressed but I dont regularly sit down and watch tv so I dont watch it unless it happens to be on!


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## Guest (Mar 19, 2008)

dh.dti said:


> I've never seen him but i'd heard he'd used e-collar's & to be honest "imo" any one who needs to use a device like that aint worth watching!


ive never seen him but dont feel im missing anything now


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## carol (Nov 2, 2007)

Jenny Olley said:


> Yes he does, he used one not long ago to stop an austrailian cattle dog chasing the farm vehicles, it had already lost an eye through doing this, and the owners were concern he might die.


poor dog loss of a eye, next time could of got killed or worse.


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## guineapigqueen (Jan 12, 2008)

I am a big fan of Cesar if only he could come over to the UK and sort my Pei out, lol! I have tried using his techinques for other things, but not his agression towards other dogs. I have been to a trainer to stop Chance from being so dog agressive, something I would never try on my own and they gave up on him. 

Its not Chance's fault really he was never socialised as a pup and on his first walk with us he was attacked by another dog so that set him back. We didnt get him until 18wks and I took him to socialisation classes but was asked to leave and the 2nd one wasn't very good IMO, so we were recommended a personal trainer and still no luck.

Emma x


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## Guest (Mar 19, 2008)

What kind of piggy are they????


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

carol said:


> poor dog loss of a eye, next time could of got killed or worse.


sometimes the end does justify the means, you will never stop a dog in high prey or defence drive with a treat, no matter how palatable the treat and the method may be, the digestive system basically shuts down as the dog goes into survival mode.


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## foxylady (Jan 16, 2008)

We watch Cesar every night


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## melanie (Feb 18, 2008)

I think Cesar Milan is fantastic. I am addicted to The dog whisperer, I watch it every night religously. Nothing could move me from the tv when its on(Johnny Depp would be an exeption).


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## Jonsville (Feb 5, 2008)

*Yep- another Fan here too!!!*


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## Guest (Mar 20, 2008)

dh.dti said:


> I've never seen him but i'd heard he'd used e-collar's & to be honest "imo" any one who needs to use a device like that aint worth watching!


Totally agree!


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## Fade to Grey (Nov 10, 2007)

melanie said:


> I think Cesar Milan is fantastic. I am addicted to The dog whisperer, I watch it every night religously. Nothing could move me from the tv when its on(Johnny Depp would be an exeption).


dont blame you Johnny Depp is beautiful, i have a signed picture of him as Jack Sparrow above my bed


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## Fade to Grey (Nov 10, 2007)

oh and refering to the dog whisperer, i thought he was pretty good when i saw it.


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## Guest (Mar 20, 2008)

Fade to Grey said:


> oh and refering to the dog whisperer, i thought he was pretty good when i saw it.


Im put off by the fact hes used one of these e-collar things!


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## Fade to Grey (Nov 10, 2007)

the electric collar?
i tested on of those on myself and my friends on the highest voltage, they don't actually hurt


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## Guest (Mar 20, 2008)

Fade to Grey said:


> the electric collar?
> i tested on of those on myself and my friends on the highest voltage, they don't actually hurt


Oooooooookay, thats quite a normal thing to do!


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## Fade to Grey (Nov 10, 2007)

dh.dti said:


> what you do in the bedroom is your business young lady o'er...


HAHAHA! it was nothing kinky. I just wanted to know if they'd hurt or not


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## Fade to Grey (Nov 10, 2007)

ajshep1984 said:


> Oooooooookay, thats quite a normal thing to do!


Yup completely normal


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## Guest (Mar 20, 2008)

Fade to Grey said:


> Yup completely normal


What else have you tested in the bedroom then? Obviously we don't wanna know about the kinky things!


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## Fade to Grey (Nov 10, 2007)

I haven't tested anything in my room, it was in the living room!
and Carol was laughing at me


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

Fade to Grey said:


> the electric collar?
> i tested on of those on myself and my friends on the highest voltage, they don't actually hurt


Now ththat someone else has confesed, I've tried one on me too, but I didn't like to say in case you thought I was wierd !


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## Fade to Grey (Nov 10, 2007)

Jenny Olley said:


> Now ththat someone else has confesed, I've tried one on me too, but I didn't like to say in case you thought I was wierd !


Haha oh good i thought i was the only mad person to try it on myself.


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## Guest (Mar 20, 2008)

Jenny Olley said:


> Now ththat someone else has confesed, I've tried one on me too, but I didn't like to say in case you thought I was wierd !


I think your both weird, but in a good way  Okay then what else have you tried in the living room Fade To Gray?


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## Fade to Grey (Nov 10, 2007)

skateboarding into the door, what one is stupid! 
anyway im off to watch tv 
laters all x


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## Jenny Olley (Nov 2, 2007)

Fade to Grey said:


> Haha oh good i thought i was the only mad person to try it on myself.


I don't feel able to comment on something unless I've tried it, my kids have tried one too, but before you all ring the NSPCC, they are adults.


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## karen (Feb 28, 2008)

Cesar's the man I my book. He's used "e collars on the collie and also to stop his and Jada picketts dogs from rattle snake attacks. She lost her 14 year old dog because it went after a rattler and she had all hers and cesars dogs aversively trained to avoid using it. They've never lost another dog becuase of it. I too have held the collar and turned it up too full It didn't hurt me either. Like I've said before it's like a tens machine.


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## Guest (Mar 20, 2008)

Fade to Grey said:


> Haha oh good i thought i was the only mad person to try it on myself.


so what did it feel like??? was it like a shock or a tingle???


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## clairemac9 (Jan 14, 2008)

Seattle Dogworks(SeattleDogs) on Capitol Hill, Local Favorite, Dog Training of Seattle, Seattle Dog Training, Puppy Training - Capitol Hill, Dog Training of Seattle, Offers Seattle Dog Training and Puppy Training by Certified Dog Trainers on Capitol


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## annieb (Feb 26, 2008)

To be honest. I think Cesar Millan has a real gift with dogs. He is right you know......most of the time it is the human who needs training

I would like to see him work with a collie. We used his techniques with Jazz and he is now so laid back he is very easy to train. He used to drool a lot in the car, but doesn't now. He also used to try and attack cars that are passing us going the other way and we managed to stop him doing that too.

Cesar has the right attitude and uses his expertise and tools indiviually i.e. the right tool for the right job.

We bought his book too, and that is also very interesting and easy to follow.


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## cupcake (Feb 19, 2008)

I have been using his techniques now for a few days. I excersise Archie before each meal, never let him in front of me and hes not allowed on the furniture or on laps and we claim the door when he barks to stop him barking and attacking the post.

He still gets all the love and attention of before, but hes now being calmer and barking less. He does as hes told all the time, and on walks even off the lead he will stay behind me even if we run.

This is a huge deal because he used to bark all the time, jump on everyone, nip heels and pull on the lead. This was without commands and brute force and treats. He goes behind me and by my heels by himself without being told. 
xx


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## karen (Feb 28, 2008)

clare7577 said:


> so what did it feel like??? was it like a shock or a tingle???


Feels like abit of both really.


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## karen (Feb 28, 2008)

clairemac9 said:


> Seattle Dogworks(SeattleDogs) on Capitol Hill, Local Favorite, Dog Training of Seattle, Seattle Dog Training, Puppy Training - Capitol Hill, Dog Training of Seattle, Offers Seattle Dog Training and Puppy Training by Certified Dog Trainers on Capitol


I've seen this banded about and used alot 
Frankly it's a poor piece of work.
I'd advice anyone to read his books and make their own mind up!
So he's not the positive trainer that some people seem to think is a big deal... Problematic dogs need different kinds for handling and He is fluid in that handling. He uses what ever method he thinks is best suited for the dog. He DOES NOT apply aggressive and fear tactics to dogs... He's does everything but. Only to an uneducated eye would this conclusion be made. Flooding workis and moves the right dog on quickly aversion theraphy also moves dogs on fast.
IMO short term discomfort for long term balance is exceptable. 
He gets to the problem asap and deals with it there and then... Maybe the so called positive trainers dislike him because he can and does get results fast. So theres no long drawn out massively expensive charges. He's the man who can help everyone understand there dogs. peopel need to stop with the negative Vibes man... Peace and loves people..
And oooohhhh he hasnt any "formal " quilifications.... AND Knowledge is not just attained via schools and uni. People who break the mould don't learn that from others they pave there own path through blood and sweat.
Did the first man who told his dog to sit have to have a degree to be able to do so? NO. Give the man a break.


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## annieb (Feb 26, 2008)

I have just been watching Cesar Milan on TV whilst eating lunch. He was working with a collie who was really very aggressive. It was a joy to watch and he worked well with him and achieved the desired results. It gave me a few pointers too. The next dog was one that had been used in a laboratory to test animal veccines. No relationship, just very clinical surroundings and people wearing suits with head masks on, so no eye contact either. This dog was rescued and had been with the foster family for four years (the lady worked in the kennel where he ended up). Cesar sat with his back to the cage, which the dog was in, after opening it's door and eventually backed himself into the cage with the dog whilst speaking to the camera (if you know what I mean) The dog was calm and oblviously picked up Cesar's energy. The whole things was wonderful to see and the lady who owned the dog just couldn't believe how much the dog changed in just two hours.

Cesar does not have qualifications.....but he has something most of us doesn't have................a natural affinity with dogs He has lived in close contact with dogs since he was born and his grandfather taught him well about animal behaviour. Cesar is also very able to pass on his teachings and understanding of dog behaviour so that the people who own them don't take it as an insult. He get's my thumbs up anytime.


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## Boccia Boy (Mar 24, 2008)

Ive seen him a few times and its interesting what he does but my question is if his methods are so good why dont all dog trainers use it??


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## griffpan (Feb 2, 2008)

I'm not that fussy on him really using an e collar is a massive put off in my books.

To be honest though i'm getting a bit sick of all the training programmes, they're getting to be like cooking and diy to much of them. And no i can't cook or diy either


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## Ladywiccana (Feb 24, 2008)

*I think he is great!*


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## bullbreeds (Jan 14, 2008)

I think he's good too.


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## Magik (Jan 30, 2008)

cupcake said:


> I'm watching it now,
> I LOVE it and I swear by the tecniques. What does everyone else think? Do you use the tecniques? If so how do they work for you? Are you anti cesar millan?
> 
> Do you even know who he is ? x


I think his techniques are Ideal for owners of dogs that have the pack mentality such as Pittbulls, bull breeds etc... it doesn't work for all breeds. But what he does is good!!


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## discusdan (Mar 21, 2008)

AMAZING  my family like him and so does my dog lol


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## LetsTalkPetFoods (Feb 11, 2008)

dh.dti said:


> I've never seen him but i'd heard he'd used e-collar's & to be honest "imo" any one who needs to use a device like that aint worth watching!


I agree, many of his methods are not only suppressive, dominate and unloving, but also, downright dangerous! I want my dog to love me and *want* to do what I ask, not to be so scared of me that he does it out of fear!

Here area just a couple of articles about him.but I have more to put up yet.

Dog Whisperer-Cesar Millan


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## karen (Feb 28, 2008)

Yawn yawn yawn Yawn!
Because what he does works many other bevahiourists are getting scared. Just MO ofcourse. I use alot of his techniques and i have never failed to rehabilitate a dog. Oh and i have'nt broke one either.


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## cupcake (Feb 19, 2008)

In those articles it really over exaggerates.



> Several instances of cruel and dangerous treatment -- promoted by Millan as acceptable training methods -- were documented by American Humane, including one in which a dog was partially asphyxiated in an episode. In this instance, the fractious dog was pinned to the ground by its neck after first being "hung" by a collar incrementally tightened by Millan. Millan's goal -- of subduing a fractious animal -- was accomplished by partially cutting off the blood supply to its brain.


Firstly, the dogs on the show are never "hung", you get more control over the dog if the collar/leash is higher on the neck.

As for pinning the dog down by its neck and cutting off the blood supply to the brain, I use this technique on my dog and you never have to use alot of force, once the dog is down you don't have to choke the dog!

These accusations are outrageous. He is a great man with a greater understanding for dogs and how they work. All he does is use the techniques dominant dogs use in a pack.


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## Guest (Mar 31, 2008)

The man is world renowned as the worlds greatest dog trainer.end of thread!


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## cupcake (Feb 19, 2008)

Don't end my thread, it was just getting interesting


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## karen (Feb 28, 2008)

garryd said:


> The man is world renowned as the worlds greatest dog trainer.end of thread!


INDEED What more can be said.
Anti Millan people are such muppets!


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## bullbreeds (Jan 14, 2008)

Magik said:


> I think his techniques are Ideal for owners of dogs that have the pack mentality such as Pittbulls, bull breeds etc... it doesn't work for all breeds. But what he does is good!!


All dogs have a pack mentality magik, they'r dogs! Dogs have a pack instinct.


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## bullbreeds (Jan 14, 2008)

Cesar Milan is the nuts! 
Is he gay?


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## Guest (Apr 3, 2008)

dh.dti said:


> ...are you suggesting i'm a muppet...


yeh i think she is


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## Guest (Apr 3, 2008)

dh.dti said:


> ...are you suggesting i'm a muppet...


....that's outta order *stir stir*


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## Guest (Apr 3, 2008)

dh.dti said:


> ...are you suggesting i'm a muppet...


Yep in a word she said ur a muppet. 

go tell her off kermit


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## bullbreeds (Jan 14, 2008)

Eolabeo said:


> Yep in a word she said ur a muppet.
> 
> go tell her off kermit


....................


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## Nina (Nov 2, 2007)

Cesar Milan is one of the few dog whisperers that uses body language to re-train a dog.

Having said this however, his main focus is on training the owner! 

Personally, I love the man and anyone that keeps such a large pack of dogs living in harmony is amazing. Testament to his methods.


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## Guest (Apr 4, 2008)

dh.dti said:


> ...are you suggesting i'm a muppet...





garryd said:


> yeh i think she is





ajshep1984 said:


> ....that's outta order *stir stir*





Eolabeo said:


> Yep in a word she said ur a muppet.
> 
> go tell her off kermit





bullbreeds said:


> ....................


i think we should slap that b**** down  picking on our darren like that


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## Guest (Apr 4, 2008)

garryd said:


> i think we should slap that b**** down  picking on our darren like that


whats the plan???


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## Guest (Apr 4, 2008)

ajshep1984 said:


> whats the plan???


alan i am only joking mate dont start rubbing your legs again


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## Nina (Nov 2, 2007)

Just trying out my new avator, is it working? Fresh start and all that lol


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## Nina (Nov 2, 2007)

What's going on, I have changed it twice and still its not working. Bother!


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## Nina (Nov 2, 2007)

YEA, its working.


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## Guest (Apr 4, 2008)

Nina Cole said:


> YEA, its working.


oi theres rules about threadjacking you know!?!


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## Nina (Nov 2, 2007)

Alan, I LOVE Cesar Milan, he pretty cute too!


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## Guest (Apr 4, 2008)

Nina Cole said:


> Alan, I LOVE Cesar Milan, he pretty cute too!


What???


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## Nina (Nov 2, 2007)

Well, he IS. He certainly charms me


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## Guest (Apr 4, 2008)

Nina Cole said:


> Well, he IS. He certainly charms me


Does your OH know how entusiastic you are about him???


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## Ladywiccana (Feb 24, 2008)

I love cesar too, but i think i've seen all his shows. Are there any new ones on now!


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## sskmick (Feb 4, 2008)

I have never seen him. Although I was advised to by one of the trainers at the Dog Training Club, I attended.

I watch most dog training programmes because they are a good source of information. I have also found what works for one dog will not necessarily work for another.

My son rates him very highly.

Sue


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## catzndogz (Mar 12, 2008)

Nina agree i think Cesar Millan is cute also


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## Guest (Apr 4, 2008)

sam&meg said:


> Nina agree i think Cesar Millan is cute also


Do you prefer Cesar or Magik??


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## catzndogz (Mar 12, 2008)

ajshep1984 said:


> Do you prefer Cesar or Magik??


I'll have to think about that one


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## jackson (May 22, 2008)

I found this quite upsetting and informative. I find I am asked a lot of the questions if I mention I am not a fan!

Cesar Millan - The Dog Whisperer: Critics Answers


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## Guest (Jun 18, 2008)

Interesting reading, glad there's a bit of a backlash going on. I'm not a fan either.


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## Guest (Jun 18, 2008)

awww that poor dog cowering in the corna  thats evil


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## andrea 35 (Nov 22, 2007)

I must be one of the only people who hasnt watched this programme, lol


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## rach1980 (May 1, 2008)

when i first watched the show i thought he was a miracle worker, the way he helped the dogs was amazing. But the more i watch the more i see flaws in what he does. Sometimes he refers to them as calm submissive but in my opinion they are to scared to react to anything


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## Guest (Jun 18, 2008)

andrea 35 said:


> I must be one of the only people who hasnt watched this programme, lol


You must be the only one that hasn't wasted your time then! 



rach1980 said:


> when i first watched the show i thought he was a miracle worker, the way he helped the dogs was amazing. But the more i watch the more i see flaws in what he does. Sometimes he refers to them as calm submissive but in my opinion they are to scared to react to anything


Same here, to start with I was impressed but as you watch more of it you see why it's just not right.


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## Bobbie (May 3, 2008)

As most of the dogs he sees have issues and most folks would give up on them he does a good job sorting them out. I myself always train mine with the calm reward method which gets slower results but get there in the end. Most of all my dogs still love me not fear me.


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## jackson (May 22, 2008)

The good old Cesar Milan debate......

For any 'fans' you may want to read these links to get both sides of the story. 

Dog Whisperer, Dog Psychology and Cesar Millan

Cesar Millan - The Dog Whisperer: Critics Answers


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

i have read these things before.....nd yes i think i must have seen all of his shows...and i still think he does great job..a lot of the dogs he ha got ould have been pts had it not been for him.i personaly would trust him with any of my dogs. i know lots of people dont like his methods but each to there own


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## bullbreeds (Jan 14, 2008)

I think for every trainer/dog expert there will always be people in the shadows waiting to critisize.
i personally think Cesar Milan is very good.


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## Guest (Jul 10, 2008)

I have read both links just now.

I have only seen 2 of Cesar Milan shows... so I don't know too much about him. I admit, I thought he was good and the dog seemed "changed"

But in them articles, they are saying changed... but does it last? Even if the owners stick with it.



> "It worked on my dog. Every time he does [enter behavior], I just give him a correction and tell him "Tsssht" and he stops."
> 
> Note the words, "Every time he barks." This indicates that the dog is still repeating the behavior. The idea behind behavior modification is not that the dog simply stops the behavior momentarily, but that the behavior changes so that the dog's reaction in that environment is different, like looking at you instead of barking. Suppression of a behavior is not changing the behavior, itself. If the owner has to continually repeat the "correction" the behavior isn't changing.


So now I am not too sure on what I think.


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## jackson (May 22, 2008)

To be honest, I think better a dog PTS than be too scared to behave like a normal dog. That is the only reason his methods work. He frightens dogs into submission and bullies them. Having said that, how do you know the dogs would have been PTS? A more knowledgable, kinder behaviorist/trainer could have still got good results fromt he same dogs. 

I would NEVER Allow anyone to trap my dog cowering in a corner, or yank it along by it's lead. WHY do so when there is a kinder way of getting the same result? Or worse, kill it on a treadmill? (he has done this!) 

As I said, anyone who is very knowldegable is dog behaviour shuns his methods. If you undertsad dog body language, watch one of his videos (plenty there) on You Tube witt he sound off, then with it on. What he says the dog is doing is very different to what it is actually doing.


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## paws (Jun 16, 2008)

Yes ive watched his shows and like some things and not others


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

Kay2008 said:


> I have read both links just now.
> 
> I have only seen 2 of Cesar Milan shows... so I don't know too much about him. I admit, I thought he was good and the dog seemed "changed"
> 
> ...


all i can say is, watch a few more shows and you will come to your own conclusions...and he has done shows where he has gone back to see the progress of the dogs and most are fine.if they are not then he goes through it again until the owners get it right...and he doesnt take money until the people are happy....


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## Guest (Jul 10, 2008)

JANICE199 said:


> all i can say is, watch a few more shows and you will come to your own conclusions...and he has done shows where he has gone back to see the progress of the dogs and most are fine.if they are not then he goes through it again until the owners get it right...and he doesnt take money until the people are happy....


Are his shows still on telly at the moment?

I watched a couple a few weeks back at about 4am I think on Skythree (I think).


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

Kay2008 said:


> Are his shows still on telly at the moment?
> 
> I watched a couple a few weeks back at about 4am I think on Skythree (I think).


yes he is on at 6pm i think sky1 i believe.and also about 7am...not sure what channel but thats when my sister watches it...


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## Fade to Grey (Nov 10, 2007)

well this is going to turn into an argument then


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## bullbreeds (Jan 14, 2008)

Fade to Grey said:


> well this is going to turn into an argument then


Oh ye of little faith


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

Fade to Grey said:


> well this is going to turn into an argument then


lol not by me.thats why i say..each to their own.it wouldnt do for us all to think the same now


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## Fade to Grey (Nov 10, 2007)

these kinda debate threads tend to end up with someone being bullied. I have no opinion of him myself - then again i think most behaviourist are a load of ******** anyway


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## jackson (May 22, 2008)

JANICE199 said:


> lol not by me.thats why i say..each to their own.it wouldnt do for us all to think the same now


While I am all for eac to their own, where it crosses a line regarding animal welfare, I tend to disagree.

However, I don't see why people can't discuss sensibly and have strong views without things getting unpleasant.


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

Fade to Grey said:


> these kinda debate threads tend to end up with someone being bullied. I have no opinion of him myself - then again i think most behaviourist are a load of ******** anyway


pmsl well thats one way to look at it


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## jackson (May 22, 2008)

Cesar Millan: The Dog Whisperer? The history, background and reputation of Cesar Millan.

Some more info, including Mialn using a shock collar, which was not shown to the viewing public and resulted in the dog turning on it's owner and biting her. Also a case of a dog being partially asphixiated by his methods,a nd another left bleeding from the nose.

Also some comments from some very well known and respected dog behaviourists on his methods. Ian Dunbar polite and tactful as always! 

If anyone can show me a respected behaviourist condonign his methods, I'd be interested.


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## Fade to Grey (Nov 10, 2007)

haha yeah
an out of control dog is usually down to the owner being weak and they dont punish it themselves. getting a behaviourist is the easy way our for these people.


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## Fade to Grey (Nov 10, 2007)

jackson said:


> If anyone can show me a respected behaviourist condonign his methods, I'd be interested.


i dont think anyone's condoning his methods... this thread is another one of many of the same agenda

http://www.petforums.co.uk/dog-chat/3784-what-do-you-think-cesar-millan-dog-whisperer.html


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

Fade to Grey said:


> i dont think anyone's condoning his methods... this thread is another one of many of the same agenda
> 
> http://www.petforums.co.uk/dog-chat/3784-what-do-you-think-cesar-millan-dog-whisperer.html


i hadnt seen that thread before.but made good reading thankyou


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## CJAnderson (Jul 10, 2008)

He has a DW Season 1-3 Episode guide out now (season 4 is still in progress thanks to the writers strike), which lists 4 episodes for collie breeds and 4 for shelties! His teaching on how important their herding instinct was was such an epithany for me, if only I had understood how my sheltie was acting that out with his circling behavior! Now I am working wth another herding breed has had problems nipping and I can see and work with it so much easier now.



annieb said:


> To be honest. I think Cesar Millan has a real gift with dogs. He is right you know......most of the time it is the human who needs training
> 
> I would like to see him work with a collie. We used his techniques with Jazz and he is now so laid back he is very easy to train. He used to drool a lot in the car, but doesn't now. He also used to try and attack cars that are passing us going the other way and we managed to stop him doing that too.
> 
> ...


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## CJAnderson (Jul 10, 2008)

Actually I would have to respectfully disagree!
I do problem dog rescue and have helped foster Best Friends (Dog Town) dogs when they come into town for their weekend adoptathons. I always ask for the most high energy challengeing adult dogs to work with. I also have helped with rescue transports so that over the last 3 eyars I have been able to help motify the behavior of about 30 rescue dogs many who would otherwise have been euthanized because of their problems!

You can see some of the movies of how I have used Cesar's way on them at my youtube site:
YouTube - cjanderson's Channel



***** said:


> I think his techniques are Ideal for owners of dogs that have the pack mentality such as Pittbulls, bull breeds etc... it doesn't work for all breeds. But what he does is good!!


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## CJAnderson (Jul 10, 2008)

It always saddens me to see such articles because of the need to sensationalize as well as the misinformation that is written and not challenged because readers do not know any better.

For instance, in the first article, the comment about pitting Ian against Cesar - this is a media ploy that Ian has been very successful in using to get press time that he otherwise would not. Do you notice the phrasing for instance "Ian points out..."? You NEVER see Cesar speak out against or negatively about anyone or any solutions. In fact, the article is a LIE from this position because Cesar has been documented in many sources saying "ALL ways are good that do NOT harm the dog!" AND "use the LEAST amount of energy needed when working with the dogs!

For sites like those quoted in the original post. I ALWAYS challenge them to produce any kind of medical documentation from anywhere, supporting their claims that ANY of the dogs that Cesar has helped directly have ever been harmed in anyway by his solutions! So for instance, in the second referenced site, where it talks about the ever famous episode of JonBee the Jindo wild dog, that the OWNERs have actully posted a letter for all to read in the DW Season 1-3 Episode guide that not only did Cesar NOT hurt JohnBee in any way, but was actually willing to risk harm to himself to help that dog. And again, Cesar being bitten by the dog he is working with is shown in MANY of the episodes around the more agressive behavior dogs.

Sites like this are only interested in promoting one side of the coin and NOT in presenting accurate information even when the errors are pointed out. 
or instance in the second site, where it starts with:
BUT IT WORKS...the response I quote is
"I have not seen changed behavior on the show. I do see dogs with suppressed behaviors; dogs walking on very tight leashes, dogs that are stiff and immobile after being rolled onto their sides by force, dogs that are in almost every case restrained or shut down in some form or another. "

This statement demonstrates to me that this individual is ONLY looking at the problem description part of the show OR ignoring the FULL solution explanation/demonstration.
Cesar is COMPLETELY clear to the open mind that he NEVER allows the dog to be walked on a tight leash as a solution although most of the time, that is part of the problem eplaination. He NEVER allows the episode to be wrapped unless the owner demonstrates successful loose leash walks in front of environmental distrations.

As far as the rigid dog on the side, stiff and imobile again - he ALWAYS demonstrates how to watch for the dog's shift in energy, which DOES happen in a matter of minutes and more importantly, how to reward that dog's relaxation with "positive treats" such as massage.

I could spend the rest of the day counteracting each of the negative points brought up by people who offer no verifiable documentation for their positions and have themselves suspect positions for why they take an opposing position when one has never been sought and infact rigorously avoided by Cesar Millan.

 On the other hand, the long term success of the changes are doumented in the DW Episode Guide Season 1-3 book. Further, if you go to:
DogWhispererFans : Dog Whisper Fans and Friends-Problem Dog
you can review the open archives of over 60,000 messages from ordinary people like you and me requesting help for their dogs and the resulting sucess stories from using Cesar's way to change their own dogs behaviors!

All Cesar cares about, is the welfare of the dogs -and if Ian's (and other opposing "professionals") efforts and solutions works, then Cesar will give a standing ovation!

I never needed Cesar's way for the first 45 years of my life being surrounded by family good dogs, including my parent's show dogs.

The day AFTER the first episode of Cesar's I stepped up to SAFELY rescue a redzone chowchow for which animal control had been called to capture and destroy. You can see his story and many of the other 30 problem dogs I have been able to help rehab and rehome at my youtube site. YouTube - cjanderson's Channel using Cesar's behavior solutions. I only work with problem dogs now who have no hope without solutions like Cesar's to rehabilitate them so they can find and live in a good forever home!

**************************************



jackson said:


> The good old Cesar Milan debate......
> 
> For any 'fans' you may want to read these links to get both sides of the story.
> 
> ...


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

well!!! i will stick to my guns on this one...he's the best in my oppion. and watching him on tv i think he works wonders...plus i think he is cute


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

CJAnderson said:


> It always saddens me to see such articles because of the need to sensationalize as well as the misinformation that is written and not challenged because readers do not know any better.
> 
> For instance, in the first article, the comment about pitting Ian against Cesar - this is a media ploy that Ian has been very successful in using to get press time that he otherwise would not. Do you notice the phrasing for instance "Ian points out..."? You NEVER see Cesar speak out against or negatively about anyone or any solutions. In fact, the article is a LIE from this position because Cesar has been documented in many sources saying "ALL ways are good that do NOT harm the dog!" AND "use the LEAST amount of energy needed when working with the dogs!
> 
> ...


great post THANKYOU


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## carol (Nov 2, 2007)

CJAnderson said:


> It always saddens me to see such articles because of the need to sensationalize as well as the misinformation that is written and not challenged because readers do not know any better.
> 
> For instance, in the first article, the comment about pitting Ian against Cesar - this is a media ploy that Ian has been very successful in using to get press time that he otherwise would not. Do you notice the phrasing for instance "Ian points out..."? You NEVER see Cesar speak out against or negatively about anyone or any solutions. In fact, the article is a LIE from this position because Cesar has been documented in many sources saying "ALL ways are good that do NOT harm the dog!" AND "use the LEAST amount of energy needed when working with the dogs!
> 
> ...


great post. yeah some only see one side of things


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## jackson (May 22, 2008)

You will NEVER convince me that it is OK to frighten, harm or hurt a dog in the name of rehabilitation and training. You will also never convince me there is no other way and you will never convince me that Cesar Millans methods do not employ bullying tactics or end up in a shut down dog. 

A friend of mine gives a good example of how his behaviour works, and how it works compared to positive methods, this is roughly it:

I am scared of spiders. I hate them, and every time I see one, I panic and start to scream and run round. Along comes the 'trainer'. Everytime I see a spider, and am scared, so make a 'fuss', they punch me in the face. hard. After this has happened a few times, (and it might not take long, I am a sensitive soul!) I stop running around and screaming when I see the spider. I am still terrified of the spider, but I am more terrified of being punched in the face. So, I stay very still to try and avoid being punched. I am still, quiet and terrified, instead of noisy and terrified. Terrified of the spider and terrified that if I move in the slightest I might get punched. I might start to hate spiders even more, as if I wasn't careful, I got punched when I saw them. 

Now, how about if the 'trainer' gave me a £50 note when I saw a spider? I'd probably still be scare dof the spider, but I might stop running around screaming to get my £50 note. After a while, I might even start to think 'Hmm, not that keen on spiders at all, but every time I see one, someone gives me £50, so maybe they aren't that bad after all'. In fact, I might even startt o like seeing a spider, because I knew someone was going to give me £50. I might still be scared, but there would be a plus side. Also, if I got really scared and couldn't help but scream, all that would happen would be I wouldn't get £50, nothing bad. 

If you think electric shock collars, prong collars, choke chains, dragging, pushing, shoving, pinning down and suppressing a dog is a way to train it and have a happy dog, that worries me. If you think ths is the only way to train a dog that is likely poorly socialised, underwalked and likely has problems because it is owned by numpties and has never had any formal training, that worries me even more.


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## jackson (May 22, 2008)

carol said:


> great post. yeah some only see one side of things


What other side to physically oppressing a dog, using electric shock collars, prong collars, choke chains, dragging it along by the neck and frightening it is there to see?


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## jackson (May 22, 2008)

JANICE199 said:


> well!!! i will stick to my guns on this one...he's the best in my oppion. and watching him on tv i think he works wonders...plus i think he is cute


Oh well, as long as he is cute...... 

Do you agree with using aversives/punishent to train dogs them Janice? Electric shock collars, prong collars, choke chains and the like?


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## carol (Nov 2, 2007)

well ive been watching his programmes for a while and nothing ive seen to make me say that shouldnt be done

if you dont like the way he trains then dont watch it simple.


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## jeanie (Nov 11, 2007)

I have watched lots of his programs and have never seen him use force on any dog, he says he uses the collars the customers are using, i havent seen him use a prong collar , i think i would trust my dogs with him , as long as i could be there too, most of the dogs he trains would have been pts if it had not been for him, so im all for it, but of course thats my thoughts only, everyone thinks differenly


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## jackson (May 22, 2008)

carol said:


> well ive been watching his programmes for a while and nothing ive seen to make me say that shouldnt be done
> 
> if you dont like the way he trains then dont watch it simple.


Well, the american humane society have a problem with it. Some of what happens never gets to our screens.

I don't watch it anymore, because it upsets me far too much. However, it bothers me, and it bothers me that people who don't know any better wil watch his show and not see any problems with it.

If you know anything about canine body language, and watch some of his stuff on You Tube first with sound off, then on, you will realise that what he is saying is happening and what is actually happening are two different things. If I could get on Youtube at te moment, I'd post an example. (PC won't play videos)

Of course, nothing I think or say is likely to make any difference, as people will make their own decision. But just like me hating puppy farming will never make any difference. doesn't mean I'll just forget about it, or stop speaking out about it at any given opportunity.


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

jackson said:


> Well, the american humane society have a problem with it. Some of what happens never gets to our screens.
> 
> I don't watch it anymore, because it upsets me far too much. However, it bothers me, and it bothers me that people who don't know any better wil watch his show and not see any problems with it.
> 
> ...


i have said it before and i will say it again.( because we have freedom of choice) i think he has ,and does, do a great job...as i stated before ..but for him many a dog would have been pts....


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## CJAnderson (Jul 10, 2008)

Sigh, of course anything can be taken out of context unfortunately because there is almost no way to ask follow up questions.

 The behavior DOES change, sometimes in minutes, sometimes in days when the environment, conditions and the human responses,are consistent! So for instance, I am a 54 year old emale home alone most of the day. Some one comes to the door. I seldom answer! I WANT the dogs to bark. 
I let this go on for a minute or two and then make my sound ("tsst") - they stop. Immeidately.

Water man just came by. They know the sound of his truck, they know the sound of his voice, even though it is only once a month.

Not one peep from them.

Someone comes into my home led by me, they no longer bark -at all.

Someone comes into my home without me (like a repair man did last weekend to use the bathroom) they are all over it because I am not with him. So when environments and situations change then they dont know what to do and so I lead them by sounds (of whch I actually have two - the tsst when I am close, and a kinda honk "EH' when I am on the other side of the house.

The other consideration which the writer COULD have followed up to find out about if he was interested in an accurate commentary rather then the superficial one given on superficial information, is that the longer a dog has gone without behavior trainng, the longer to unhook him from the patterns that have worked. The issue really is mostly from the inconsistency which come from the human who has not entirely changed their behavior as well.

I experienced this as well in two ways

First, when I rescued Signal Bear, the redzone feral chow chow. Because I did not know of any Cesar type trainers in those early days, I HAD to be 24/7 Cesar's way to have any hope of permanaent change. I did this because back then, I didnt UNDERSTAND Cesar's way, any more then I understand how a car works, but I know if I do certain things in a certain way, it works. Compare that to my two twelve year old dogs who both had cancer at the same time I rescued the chow chow, that I kinda sorta half heartedly applied Cesar's way until I felt sorry for them and turned them back into my humanized babies, every other day or so! I finally decided to just give them a get out of Cesar's school free card and just enjoy their last days.

Second, my partner has NOT been Cesarized for the first 2.5 years, (he is inially seeing the light and getting on board). He only wanted to be dog's friends, until he gots tired of their misbehavior and gets mad! (lol) The challenge is that there is inconsistency in the house for behavior protocols and that always makes the speed of the solutions more challenging. So it does take longer in the second challenge but they learned to follow my direction wile they coninued to ignore my partners.

So I hope this offers a different perspective for you to consider!



Kay2008 said:


> I have read both links just now.
> 
> I have only seen 2 of Cesar Milan shows... so I don't know too much about him. I admit, I thought he was good and the dog seemed "changed"
> 
> ...


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## carol (Nov 2, 2007)

i know lots about body language and lots more beside, ive seen the most worse cases possible.
and some things that if wasnt for poeple like him or a few others i know who are all top trainers they would be put to sleep without even given a chance.


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## jeanie (Nov 11, 2007)

That was very interesting, i too have a problem with oh ,he thinks they can train them selves , i use the tssst when they are close to me and hey when they are out of reach and misbehaving, they stop at once and come running , they jump at my oh when he gets up in a morning but never at me hes now learning to ignore them until they stop doing it so we are getting somewhere at last, hes learning we have to as hes a bleeder and they scratch him then he bleeds bad, but im all for doing some of the things Cesar does and i havent seen him ill treat any dog, , one thing i have learned from him is he never gives up i try to follow that, and hes very cute can visit me anytime lol .


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

and you have to admit he is cute


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## carol (Nov 2, 2007)

JANICE199 said:


> and you have to admit he is cute


lol lol lol a little


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## CJAnderson (Jul 10, 2008)

You know Bobbie, that is the piece that most people seem to miss! The dogs on his show are "last chance" dogs where people have exhausted local resources for help which didnt work, and turn to Cesar as their last hope before abandoning the dog to the shelter as someone elses problem to fix or destroy, or just plain before deciding to euthanize those dogs.

There ARE many solutions he does use in thise cases (particularly with the agressive "red-zone" dogs) that require way more knowledge and skill that the general dog owner does not have. They have made a point in many shows to show Cesar being bitten (even to redoing in slow-mo to demonstrate how dangerous this can be)!

But there are so many solutions that are completely and easily replicatable for behavior problems like, jumping, barking, charging, claiming the space (furniture windows, etc) distractions, pulling, traveling, vet vsits... and so much more.

The wonderful thing is that now with the DW Season 1-3 Episode guide and the Episodes being out on DVD's that you can look up the problem by problem or by dog breed and review the sows as many times as you like to see how to reach the solution in your own unique environment. Further, there is a yahoo dog whisperer email list that you can talk about where you are having challenges in getting the desired solution to work, with people from trainers to og owners like you and I, to help you apply those solutions to your own unique circumstances.


Bobbie said:


> As most of the dogs he sees have issues and most folks would give up on them he does a good job sorting them out. I myself always train mine with the calm reward method which gets slower results but get there in the end. Most of all my dogs still love me not fear me.


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## CJAnderson (Jul 10, 2008)

Yes another website completely, full of misinformation because they are quoting someone who quoted someone etc.

So perhaps the biggest mis-information in the paragraph: "the producer's dog was delivered to the Cesar Millan Traning Center..." is actually absolutely true - 
as far as it goes as a half truth.

What that little commentary does NOT say, is that a trainer friend of Cesar's asked to use Cesar's facility for that trainer's client - the producer! 
That trainer was NOT an Employee of CMI he just wanted to use Cesar's treadmill! 
Cesar was not even in town!
The little paragraph indicates the lawsuit is still going, and yet it was resolved along time ago!

Yes the dog was injured - by that Trainer NOT Cesar or his staff! I always challenge people like that, to produce any kind of documents provided by an animal hospital, vet or emergency room showing that ANY dog that Cesar has directly helped has been harmed in any way, and of course they cannot, but then they cannot be bothered to change their website either.

This kind of behavior by the owners of these websites, tends to reinforce my personal perspective that they are dealing with professional jealously and fears about loss of status or even revenue in the dog communities as owners to whom these type of pros, many times who have told these types dog owners that there is no hope for their dog and recommend euthanizing the problem dog.

As to the non approved agencies mentioned. The ASPCA has no official statement posted about Cesar, infact, if you do a search on their website, you will see nothing but postive statements from different contributors. About the HSU I have no idea who this author is referring to unless it is the HSUS, who also has posted no official position about Cesar anywhere on their website. In fact I work with the State Director of Arizona HSUS here out of Phoenix with my efforts for problem dogs using Cesar solutions, and this starting this summer will be become a certified volunteer instuctor for three of their HSUS classes - Animals in Disaster,Emergency Animal Sheltering and Compassion Fatigue for Animal Caregivers.

As for the AHS which is NOT affiliated with the Humane Society at any level. Their position is not based on direct review or investigation activity either.

I know they have been invited to come down to watch Cesar doing the filming last fall which they have not responded to as of a few months ago.

How do I know? When this came up last fall, I asked Cesar Millan Inc. So even THEY (the AHA) do not want to take a chance that their perspective might be wrong enough to do even a fair investigation of their own position! 



clairemac9 said:


> Seattle Dogworks(SeattleDogs) on Capitol Hill, Local Favorite, Dog Training of Seattle, Seattle Dog Training, Puppy Training - Capitol Hill, Dog Training of Seattle, Offers Seattle Dog Training and Puppy Training by Certified Dog Trainers on Capitol


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

i wonder if he's got a fan club


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## Fade to Grey (Nov 10, 2007)

jackson said:


> doesn't mean I'll just forget about it, or stop speaking out about it at any given opportunity.


can you just keep everything about cesar milan in this one thread then... other wise we'll have another 10 in the next week. i mean you've already started two and probably more have been deleted.


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## tashi (Dec 5, 2007)

Fade to Grey said:


> can you just keep everything about cesar milan in this one thread then... other wise we'll have another 10 in the next week. i mean you've already started two and probably more have been deleted.


No I have actually merged them all into one


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

tashi said:


> No I have actually merged them all into one


pmsl tashi....i've been looking for the other thread..i'm glad i'm not completley mad


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## CJAnderson (Jul 10, 2008)

Actually Jackson, Cesar is the first to say to use the softest "positive" energy possible to teach the dog, and for people with good dogs - there are alot of them out there, that is a wonderful solution for people who will take the time to do this the right way the first time.

There are also many people who agree with you and is why tens of thousands of dogs are destroyed every year in the US alone. There are even groups of people who want dogs destroyed just because they are the "wrong breed" with the appearance of dangerous behavior and so they destroy them all, like they have with the over 1100 dogs in Denver, CO who were ripped out of their homes having done nothing wrong other then being the wrong breed to be euthanized:
Pit Bull - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia the reference for the statistics is half way down the page (do a control +F they type in "1100" and also is referenced here:
^ USATODAY.com - Critics assail Denver's pit bull ban (may need to copy and paste link/remove spaces.

It is terribly unfortunate that there are so many people who do not know how to do this and so the dog's behavior escalates to the point that when the dog is abandoned to shelter or turned out on the streets, that the shelters do not have this luxery of time to rehabilitate them and so they are euthanized to make room for the "good dogs".

All these problem dogs are preventable of course. So I will simply and respectfully, agree to disagree with your position that these dogs cannot be saved, rehabbed without pain and suffering and placed in good homes to live out the rest of their lives. I work with thousands of others who also feel this way, not that that makes my position have more value then yours!

For the thousands of us who chose to work with these lost souls, to not give up on them, Cesar's way offers solutions that are long term, humane and can be done in safety, (although there are many who will push the safety edge because they do not have enough knowledge or skill - but the alternative is that without stepping up and trying, the dog WILL be ethanized because there IS no one else to help locally).

Jackson, Cesar is completely clear in both DVD's his books and shows. If what is done harms the dog, it is NOT Cesar's way, no matter what anyone says.

I hate to correct anyone, but the statement you made about him killing a dog is completely wrong and you will not be able to produce a document from a vet, an animal clinic or an emergency animal hospital from any owner who has been helped by Cesar directly, documenting that his efforts has physically or psychologically harmed a dog.

I have already in another post addressed the mis-information that is constantly put out by people looking to destroy Cesar Millan's efforts to help problem dogs, about the ONE lawsuit brought by a television producter to a Trainer who borrowed Cesar's facility while Cesar was out of town and that person, who was NOT an employee of CMI was responsible for the damage to the dog.

By the way, treadmilling dogs are completely safe when done correctly. I have converted ALL my rescue problem dogs to "leashless treadmill dogs" within minutes to help them with exercise at an intensity and speed that my 54 year old body cannot provide. You can see pictures of many of them at my youtube site YouTube - cjanderson's Channel. I then use my time with the now calm dogs to work with their disapline such as therapy dog training or obedience.

There are also follow up stories going back from the earliest episodes four years ago about the long term successes of the hundreds of dogs who were helped on Cesar's Dg Whisperer epsisodes that anyone can read in the Dog Whisperer Season 1-3 Episode Guide!

Perhaps the coolest out come of many stories, is that when some of the family members realized that they would not sustain the solutions put in place by Cesar during the epsiode, that the dog would be re-homed into a home and lifestyle with people who WOULD follow through with the needed solutions, and so the dogs who would have bee abandoned or actively euthanized, are still alive, healthy, well cared for and loved today. (Actually a couple have died from health complications like cancer).



jackson said:


> To be honest, I think better a dog PTS than be too scared to behave like a normal dog. That is the only reason his methods work. He frightens dogs into submission and bullies them. Having said that, how do you know the dogs would have been PTS? A more knowledgable, kinder behaviorist/trainer could have still got good results fromt he same dogs.
> 
> I would NEVER Allow anyone to trap my dog cowering in a corner, or yank it along by it's lead. WHY do so when there is a kinder way of getting the same result? Or worse, kill it on a treadmill? (he has done this!)
> 
> As I said, anyone who is very knowldegable is dog behaviour shuns his methods. If you undertsad dog body language, watch one of his videos (plenty there) on You Tube witt he sound off, then with it on. What he says the dog is doing is very different to what it is actually doing.


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## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

why tens of thousands of dogs are destroyed every year in the US alone. There are even groups of people who want dogs destroyed just because they are the "wrong breed" with the appearance of dangerous behavior and so they destroy them all, like they have with the over 1100 dogs in Denver, CO who were ripped out of their homes having done nothing wrong other then being the wrong breed to be euthanized:

i have copied and pated this part of the text...because i feel it highlights the NEED for good breeding..which this forum is allways saying.


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## Guest (Jul 10, 2008)

CJAnderson said:


> Actually Jackson....................


Do you work for Cesar?


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## CJAnderson (Jul 10, 2008)

Some of the stories are so touching. The one that was my turning point that I had to at least TRY to work with these kinds of dogs was almost the very beginning - Coach. One of the ones who was going to be eithanized for his behavior because the family didnt know what else to do.

Their young son, who loved Coach so much asked them to take some of his fur and wanted him to be put asleep in the sons blanket so the dog would know how much he was loved inspite of being a neghborhood bad dog.

But the reason I am responding here, is that Cesar has never been paid by the clients of the Dog Whisperer show for his effort there. He is paid by the show which was purchased by Nat Geo Channel. He never closes a case until he is satisfied the owner can sustain the soution. There are several epsiodes where the comment was made that Cesar returned MONTHS later to follow up on the most challenging cases to make sure the effort needed for that problem solution was both solid and sustained.

You know, it is one thing to have the owners say how much the dog is changed, but when neighbors, co-workers, vets, evenunsuccessful trainers, etc say this when they were originally menaced for me is really an attention getter!



JANICE199 said:


> all i can say is, watch a few more shows and you will come to your own conclusions...and he has done shows where he has gone back to see the progress of the dogs and most are fine.if they are not then he goes through it again until the owners get it right...and he doesnt take money until the people are happy....


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## CJAnderson (Jul 10, 2008)

Here is a link to what season is being shown where:
Cesar Millan - Dog Whisperer TV



JANICE199 said:


> yes he is on at 6pm i think sky1 i believe.and also about 7am...not sure what channel but thats when my sister watches it...


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## CJAnderson (Jul 10, 2008)

Jeanie, he uses tools that the owners would use but for hims self, his first choice is NO tool! NO leash, - controlling the dog by energy alone. Next, he uses a string leash, the smallest lightest one he can find (he calls his a 25 cents leash) when he has his choice. If he recognizes that the owner needs a more supportive tool, then he will teach that owner how to use that tool with the dog SAFELY, to ensure that that dog suffers no harm through its use.

My favorite epsiode in this was in Season 3 Molly and the Farmer. This farm dog was completely obsessed and attacked anything with wheels and in fact had been rolled under a tractor tire and lost one eye.

The family had used the electronic collar - incorrectly.
Cesar came and set up the collar at 40%!

Use the button TWICE for dversion therapy.

The dog jumped, ~did not yelp, hollar, writh in pain.
The collar has never been needed again. Now if the dog looks at a tire, all the family has to do is call the dog who will come.

Cesar and Team Millan used this episode to demonstrate how to safely use this tool for the FIRST step of a long term solution for a dog for whom no other solution had worked. Again, many would say - there are plenty of good dogs out there, so just put down the ones who cause problems and get another. I just have another philosphy beause these dogs always in my experience turn out to be such GOOD loving dogs once they get this kind of behavior direction for their lives.

They also wanted to make a point that if the dog owner does not have experience with this kind of tool, then to go to a professional is well worth the time and support for the progress it gives the dog which many times, will save their lives!



jeanie said:


> I have watched lots of his programs and have never seen him use force on any dog, he says he uses the collars the customers are using, i havent seen him use a prong collar , i think i would trust my dogs with him , as long as i could be there too, most of the dogs he trains would have been pts if it had not been for him, so im all for it, but of course thats my thoughts only, everyone thinks differenly


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## CJAnderson (Jul 10, 2008)

Hi, no I am not an employee of any affiliate of Cesar's Team, which means Cesar Millan Inc, The Cesar and Ilusion Millan Foundation, MPH Entertainment or Emory/Sumer Productions, IMG National Geographic Channel or even Petco which has sponsored his show
so faithfully since it began 4 years ago.

I did take over a fan email list on yahoo and shifted it more from a celebrity (isnt he cool/cute...) kind of email list to a list devoted to helping people with problem dogs because I say all the people over on his Nat Geo blog crying heart broken because they had problem dogs they couldnt find help for. So I had this email list devoted to people who saw the value of Cesar's way who wanted to help others like you and me learn how to do what he did.
I did attend one of Cesar's seminars last September in 2007 and have met some of his staff and also Cesar, his incredible wife, Ilusion and two boys and actually got to hug his pitbull Daddy's net (now THAT is a doggie star I am goofy over he is SUCH a buddy that adorable dog - lol!!!)

My business for the last 30 years has been safety and health, I have lots of clients like National Safety Council, Maricopa Community College where I work with businesses to help with safety and environmental health problems. (You can read more in my profile which talks about my passion for the lost ones and plans for the future to turn rescue dogs into therapy dogs for others. I am very blessed that the success of my safety business allows me to put som much of my energy into helping dogs and their owners, in these kinds of ways! Now that I am past 50 years old, I do this for me!

I am nobody in the dog community, just someone who wants to save the problem dogs being euthanized right now because there is no one else who is able to help, Rescues in Arizona do bring problem dogs to me that they cant help but will be euthanized is the problem isnt changed, so I have experienced first hand what a person with a little knowledge and tools can make for these dogs that are being killed because there arent enough of people like me.

I was very fortunate that apparently someone from Cesar's team was watching what I was doing and how hard we were working to help people learn how to change problem dog behavior. (This is also Cesar's great passion - to teach people how to fish so they can help themselves) and so in June of 2006 they started referring people who were willing to work on correcting their own bad habits with their problem dogs over to my yahoo email list which I privately own.

It was a great honor. I insist that everyone is respectfully treated and not judged, condemmed or ridiculed for their choices or mistakes. So right now we are at about 2650 members with another 14,500 who have come in solved their problems and left our high volume list.

The archives are open to the public as I mentioned in another post, so one can get answers and ideas without even joining the high volume list, (we sometimes will have 150-175 posts a day).

DogWhispererFans : Dog Whisper Fans and Friends-Problem Dog

So I have been living eating and breathing CEsar's way for four years now as I have turned my hobby and passions into learning better how to not only save the dogs that you may have seen at my youtube site:
YouTube - cjanderson's Channel
but if you watch the Ten examples of using Cesar's way, you will hear my story and what I do. The first video of Choe is an example of a dog who had been badly abused who I have been working with who has very special needs for adoption. I have used Cesar's way to help her get so much better but she does not show well at adoptathons. 
So I have created a video of her to show how she would bein someone;s home, then I have a best friends page for her: Chloe's Diary
dogster page for her:Dog profile for Chloe, a female Breed Unknown/Keeshond


ajshep1984 said:


> Do you work for Cesar?


Her blogs are mini lessons of how I have been applying Cesar's way to her unique fears and needs. I do all this as a volunteer and want to teach others how to do this to help with the unique needs of these dogs who dont show well in a cage of a shelter or adoptathon.

So I have been learning teaching my self how to market these more challenging dogs to help rescues present them n a way that someone may want to adopt them.

I also took a Best Friends (Dog Town) dog and converted her into passing her Therapy dog test in under thirty days.
June bug had been very difficult to adopt, because she didnt show well. She will be my poster dog to encourage others in our retiring baby boomer generation to do this as well to help at risk kids, in hospitals and hospices, nursing homes, etc.
So these are the kinds of things I am about helping those kinds of dogs that the "positive trainers" don't have the time or energy or solutions for. You can also learn more about me personally from my website at:Paradigm Thoughts


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## jackson (May 22, 2008)

*All these problem dogs are preventable of course. So I will simply and respectfully, agree to disagree with your position that these dogs cannot be saved, rehabbed without pain and suffering and placed in good homes to live out the rest of their lives. I work with thousands of others who also feel this way, not that that makes my position have more value then yours!

For the thousands of us who chose to work with these lost souls, to not give up on them, Cesar's way offers solutions that are long term, humane and can be done in safety, (although there are many who will push the safety edge because they do not have enough knowledge or skill - but the alternative is that without stepping up and trying, the dog WILL be ethanized because there IS no one else to help locally).

Jackson, Cesar is completely clear in both DVD's his books and shows. If what is done harms the dog, it is NOT Cesar's way, no matter what anyone says.*

I have cut and pasted as your posts are SO long winded they make mine look short! However, I admire your dedication. 

I never said the dogs could not be saved. I said that I believed PTS was the better option than submiotting them to cruelty. I have never seen a dog that could not be rehabilitated but positive methods.

The REASON these dogs are in rescue in the first place is because of irresponsible BYB's and puppy mills. It has little to do with training, as if the pup[py came froma responsible breeder, they would be on hand to help the owners, or take the puppy/dog back.

As for the last bit. What Cesar says, and what I see happening are two different things. Getting bitten by a dog means something is going wrong. Regardless of how 'viscious' the dog was in the first place, and I reiterate, you will NEVER convince me here is ever a need for getting physical with a dog, be that yanking it's lead or pinning it down. You will also never convince me that pack or dominance theory is anything other than a load of tosh.


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## tashi (Dec 5, 2007)

I am now going to close this thread I think that the poster CJAnderson has put across some very good points in Ceasar Milans favour and personally I admire the man to be able to run a pack of dogs, as he does altogether all coming from bad backgrounds.

I think this thread is now exhausted as the original poster is not taking on board what is being said.

As has been said on this forum once before we are all entitled to our own views and once we have put those across it is time to listen to others views.


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