# Buying a British Shorthair - Price & Breeder recommendations?



## rossyl (Jul 17, 2014)

Hi, 

I've been looking for a Tabby Silver/Black British Shorthair. 

One thing that has surprised me is the size of the Boys. Some saying 8+kg, others 7+kg, other 6-7kg. I suppose you just look at the parents and try and guess. 

One thing I have been surprised about is the price - £600-670 for a kitten is quite expensive in my book. This is in the South East, but still a lot more than I expected to pay for a cat.

The other thing is knowing when you have found a good breeder or not. I have seen a variety of different people with quite different personalities who are breeders. Also, different standards in terms of facilities. 

I was wondering if anyone could recommend a breeder? 

If anyone has any pearls of wisdom that they'd be happy to share, I'd be really grateful. 

Thanks
R


----------



## slyon5 (May 11, 2014)

I've just bought my first british shorthair boy, he's 13 and a half weeks and he's just stunning. Couldn't recommend the breed enough! My boy was £500 from Torridonian British Shorthairs near Edinburgh, and they breed all sorts of colours. I'd highly recommend them  
Yes the boys do get big as far as I'm aware, my boys dad is massive. The girls are smaller though so you could maybe consider getting a girl if the size is an issue? Although I've heard that the girls can sometimes be a bit less affectionate than the boys but all cats are different so it's probably not true in all cases! I've always had boy pets so was drawn to a boy, that's the only reason I chose a boy.


----------



## jill3 (Feb 18, 2009)

If you go onto the British short hair cat club and click on to the breeders list. Scroll down to Leicestershire and there is one Breeder only on the list. ( Wellmar British Short hairs)
She has been breeding British for 30 years. Lovely Lady and Beautiful cats and kittens

If you look at my picture of the silver Red Tabby he came from her last year.:thumbsup:


----------



## rossyl (Jul 17, 2014)

Thanks very much. 

How far did you both travel to the respective breeders. Was Edinburgh local to you slyon, and Jill are you near Leicestershire? 

Unfortunately, Wellmar don not seem to have a website. Do they advertise kittens anywhere, or did you phone them? 

Thanks


----------



## Bluefluffybirmans (Jun 9, 2014)

I wanted a cat from a breeder that brought them up in the home, being well socialised was paramount for me! Other then that I was looking for all the health checks, happy, healthy cared for cats, I met both parents and someone who was willing to answer my questions.


----------



## slyon5 (May 11, 2014)

I live in Dundee so it's just over an hour from me, so not very far at all. The breeder I bought from sells to people all over Europe though so people seem to go far to get the right kitten! Personally I just looked for one not too far from me, and also agree that it's super important that they're well socialised. I think that goes for all kittens, not just Brits. My boy was super well socialised, brought up in a busy house and he's been exposed to lots of "scary" stuff. Now he doesn't flinch at anything, the Hoover, hair dryer, loud noises, new people, car rides. He's great! Possibly it's the breed, they're renowned for being laid back and easy going, but I'm just so smitten with my boy it's ridiculous! Haha! I might need to try to figure out how to put some photos in my signature to show him off!  x


----------



## georgypan (Mar 31, 2014)

My Lilacs were £400 each and although they were not properly socialised as young kittens, for a variety of family reasons on the part of the breeder, I met both parents and they were very calm and friendly cats so I have high hopes that my Henry, who is more timid than his sister Bluebell, will become more friendly and less timid as he ages because of his genetic inheritance. He's already showing many signs of being happier with us, but it has been an uphill task and it's not over yet. He is very wary of people other than me and my husband but he's starting to tolerate my son and his family fairly well. Socialisation is very important and if I'd known how hard it is to socialise them after the age of 9 weeks, I would have waited for the next litter, but I'm in love with my two now and wouldn't change them for anything. 

What I'm really saying is that you should be sure that your new BSH kitten is friendly and happy to be handled by a variety of different people by the age of 13 weeks when you would be bringing him home. 

I understand that the silver tabby BSH is smaller as an adult than the other colours. My 8 months old kittens are already nearly 4kg each so I wouldn't be surprised if they are half as heavy again or even, in the case of Henry, twice that weight when they are adults.


----------



## Susan M (Feb 20, 2013)

I have silver spotted BSH girls, my breeder breeds pure classic silver tabbies and spotteds in Kent. I paid £595 last year, she's a fantastic breeder, but I know she has no more kittens available this year now. My older girls breeder is Sargenta, she's in Kent also. 

As for size, I have two girls, retired breeding Queen and daughter, my big girl is approx 5.5kg fully grown, my 16 month old is 6.1kg already, her dad is a big boy so I guess she's taking after him a lot


----------



## Bluefluffybirmans (Jun 9, 2014)

I travelled about 40 mins. There was a closer breeder (birman not bsh) but the fact mine were brought up with children was important, they are fantastic with my little boy. My mother in law has two bsh that were timid as kittens, one is ok now but the other hides if anyone goes around and they are now five. She couldn't get over how friendly my two are when she met them.


----------



## jill3 (Feb 18, 2009)

rossyl said:


> Thanks very much.
> 
> How far did you both travel to the respective breeders. Was Edinburgh local to you slyon, and Jill are you near Leicestershire?
> 
> ...


Yes the Breeder is not far from me but that was not the reason for buying from her. She has been breeding for 30 years and knows all there is to know.
she has not got a website but if you look on the list on the British short hair cat club web site, I mentioned in my previous post you will see her Telephone number. Why not give her a ring
I cannot give her details on here but I know that it is on there as I have just checked it. I know she has kittens too
Ollie who I got from her has turned out to be a beautiful and good natured Boy I am so pleased I got him from her. We have even been to a cat show together I paid £450 and he is worth every penny:thumbsup:


----------



## rossyl (Jul 17, 2014)

Susan M said:


> I have silver spotted BSH girls, my breeder breeds pure classic silver tabbies and spotteds in Kent. I paid £595 last year, she's a fantastic breeder, but I know she has no more kittens available this year now. My older girls breeder is Sargenta, she's in Kent also.


Please can you let me know the breeder in Kent. Thanks


----------



## rossyl (Jul 17, 2014)

Thanks so much for the responses. 

It sounds like there is a partial gut feeling about breeders. But also that they are bred in a very sociable environment. 

What is the view of breeders who are by themselves. So no family life interaction? 

Also, keen for any other recommendations in the South East. 

Thanks


----------



## Jonescat (Feb 5, 2012)

In my view a breeder who has the same life style as you can help - so with dogs and children if that's what you have  No issues with a breeder who is by themselves though, all of mine came from adult households, but if your house is lively it will help if the kittens have already been bombproofed!

There has to be a gut feeling as well as some logical and sensible observation - have no qualms - they are assessing you too  Think of it as an arranged marriage, where both parties have a quite a hard-nosed list of criteria that have to be met, after which you can all have a lovely time.


----------



## rossyl (Jul 17, 2014)

I think it is tough for someone new to all this. 

Do I need GCCF registration? 
What vaccinations do the kittens need, apparently there are two sets of vaccinations, but there are others as well such as leukemia. 
Should you ask for medical reports on the parents for hereditary diseases? 
Some breeders say 9 weeks, some 10weeks, some 13 weeks - they all say that it will be vet approved, but which is right? Is the GCCF just over cautious. 

Any anyone can recommend a SE Breeder that would be great.


----------



## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

rossyl said:


> I think it is tough for someone new to all this.
> 
> Do I need GCCF registration?
> What vaccinations do the kittens need, apparently there are two sets of vaccinations, but there are others as well such as leukemia.
> ...


A kitten from a good breeder will be registered probably with the GCCF. It doesn't have to be, except that if the breeder does as they should with the GCCF they would have to give the new owner the paperwork that would let them register, and that new owner could put them on the active (for breeding) register. Unless a kitten is being sold for breeding it will be on the non-active register. If you want to show as a pedigree the kitten must be registered.

It should be at least 13 weeks old, vaccinated (core only - FPV, FCV & FHV), wormed, free of fleas. The vet will have checked it twice, once at each vaccination, and that includes listening to it's heart. Some might neuter their kittens before they leave.

Breeders letting the kitten leave before 13 weeks can't be vaccinating (1st vaccination is 9 weeks, 2nd 12 weeks), and I personally would use the phrase BYB for anyone selling an unvaccinated kitten.

A kitten should also come with some of the food they are eating, some of the litter they are using, and maybe a blanket and a toy or two.

Leaving for a new home is stressful enough for the kitten without changing food and litter.

I don't know what specific health tests are advisable for BSH, but I'm sure someone else here does.

I also wouldn't give the leukaemia vaccine to any of my cats. They don't come into contact with other cats so are not at risk - I have a cat-proofed back garden so they live there and in the house, as they please.


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

My BSH were older kitten when I adopted one and bought the other. Cookie was 7 months and April 10 months, I travelled 4 hours to see April.


----------



## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

rossyl said:


> Thanks very much.
> 
> How far did you both travel to the respective breeders. Was Edinburgh local to you slyon, and Jill are you near Leicestershire?
> 
> ...


Phone her - her name is Jill Martin, and she's a lovely woman. I met her when a friend took a cat to stud.


----------



## Zephodi (Jul 2, 2014)

jill3 said:


> Yes the Breeder is not far from me but that was not the reason for buying from her. She has been breeding for 30 years and knows all there is to know.
> she has not got a website but if you look on the list on the British short hair cat club web site, I mentioned in my previous post you will see her Telephone number. Why not give her a ring
> I cannot give her details on here but I know that it is on there as I have just checked it. I know she has kittens too
> Ollie who I got from her has turned out to be a beautiful and good natured Boy I am so pleased I got him from her. We have even been to a cat show together I paid £450 and he is worth every penny:thumbsup:


I can second this, I'm having a lilac tabby at the end of August. 
She's very friendly and visiting is no problem, she'll even microchip your kitten if you ask (I'm having Zephyr done, because her vet is a lot cheaper than mine)!
Any questions or concerns she's always ready to answer and I feel the kittens are well looked after.

She's only half an hour's drive away and for me it was important to get a kitten from someone close, mainly because I don't want to travel very far for the kitten's sake and also because it's nice in case the breeder would want to come and visit.
Also, she regularly has people over to interact with the kittens and whenever I visit we take out a couple of Zeph's brothers and sisters as well, which I assume she does with other potential owners too, so the kittens have plenty of exposure.

She has got an email address as well, which should be on one of the British Shorthair clubs, just search for her name and prefix


----------



## Susan M (Feb 20, 2013)

rossyl said:


> Please can you let me know the breeder in Kent. Thanks


My breeders prefix is Tigatails, but as I said you'd be looking at next year now, the lady at Sargenta has been breeding silver tabbies, spotteds and black smokes for almost 30 years now, she has several breeding Queens. There's also Tufton cats and Countrystyle cats who breed silvers, I believe in Kent/south east, they all have websites.

I think you'll know when you find the right breeder for you, I researched several and when I found the one I just knew it, I waited months for her kittens to be born because I knew I wanted one from her.


----------



## kellyrich (Jan 8, 2009)

rossyl said:


> Hi,
> 
> I've been looking for a Tabby Silver/Black British Shorthair.
> 
> ...


Hi there, I have 3 BSH males and im a big fan of them they are fantastic cats and all well worth their money! 

I love the tabbys and i was going to get one earlier this year and looked at a few and came across a very good breeder in Essex just where i live who has loads of spottys and tabbys and he is very knowledgable and has some stunning cats! I would definitely recommend him, if you are interested then i can pm you his name - im not sure if i can say on here?

BSHs do grow very big, two of mine are huge and cuddly lol but tabbys are known to be the smallest of the BSH but from the ones ive seen they are still nice big cats.

Good luck with your search!


----------



## Idalia (May 14, 2014)

~Revodna British Shorthairs~

Not sure where in the SE you are, but this breeder is in Andover, Hampshire. She breeds stunning BSH, my dear departed blue and white came from her years ago.


----------



## henryscat (Jul 2, 2014)

Please adopt a cat from a rescue - there are so many cats already in existence without a home. Buying a cat from a breeder increases the cat population and does nothing for those without a home.


----------



## jill3 (Feb 18, 2009)

henryscat said:


> Please adopt a cat from a rescue - there are so many cats already in existence without a home. Buying a cat from a breeder increases the cat population and does nothing for those without a home.


I know there also can be BSH cats in rescue too. It is a good idea and worth a look.
I did once adopt an 11 month old British but sadly lost him at the age of 3 years due to HCM.

Buying from a breeder is because people want a particular breed.
While I love BSH,
I love moggies too but it is the fault of people not getting their kittens neutered and giving them up when times get tough or a new Baby comes into the household. That is why now there are so many in rescue
I have had many moggies and will have another one in the future. When I do, it will be neutered and will be with me for life.
I don't think we can blame Breeders but I think that there should be some why of keeping numbers in some sort of order as not to over breed


----------



## sharonbee (Aug 3, 2011)

jill3 said:


> I don't think we can blame Breeders but I think that there should be some why of keeping numbers in some sort of order as not to over breed


If Breeders do it right we cannot over breed our cats as we are only allowed by the GCCF to let each of our Queens have 3 litters in every 2 years. Ours will be spayed around 5 years old if not before.


----------



## moggie14 (Sep 11, 2013)

henryscat said:


> there are so many cats already in existence without a home.


Agreed, but this is not down to pedigree breeders. It is purely the result of irresponsible moggie owners not having their cats neutered. The number of pedigrees in this country must be very small compared to the population of moggies


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

If the OP would like a kitten then they are unlikely to find a BSH kitten in a rescue . However if they would like an older kitten or young adult there are rehome sections of the breed websites. There is also a fabulous Facebook site for rehoming pedigree cats. 

I was very tempted by a blue boy a couple of weeks ago, thankfully he doesnr seem to be on FB anymore so I am sure he now has a fabulous new home arranged.


----------



## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

sharonbee said:


> If Breeders do it right we cannot over breed our cats as we are only allowed by the GCCF to let each of our Queens have 3 litters in every 2 years. Ours will be spayed around 5 years old if not before.


This has been discussed many times. The GCCF doesn't have any stipulation as to how often a queen can be bred, the Kennel Club does for bitches.


----------



## rossyl (Jul 17, 2014)

Thanks everyone.

I'd rather keep this focused on what to look for when buying kittens, and silver spotty /tabby recommended breeders.

Rescue vs. Bred kittens is a different topic. 
* 
Has anyone had a bad experience with a kitten bought from a breeder *


----------



## Citrineblue (Sep 28, 2012)

No all five of mine have come from three different breeders all of whom were extremely caring. These are and have been their babies for twelve weeks.

I did do my research though........

I did several visits and we got to know each other.

When I collected them it was only ever at 13/14 weeks. Fully vaccinated. Fourth/ fifth generation pedigree given. Fully registered as non active with GCCF. Then given goody bags of toys, food etc.

We always update with photos as to how their cats are developing and one of mine has been a tower of strength regarding information on coat maintenance etc.


----------



## jill3 (Feb 18, 2009)

rossyl said:


> Thanks everyone.
> 
> I'd rather keep this focused on what to look for when buying kittens, and silver spotty /tabby recommended breeders.
> 
> ...


Sadly as with everything else there are good and bad out there.
Jill Martin who has been mentioned in this thread is on the committee of the British Short hair Tabby cat Club if you speak to her she might be able to guide you in the right place as to where to start. You can even find out when she is at a show and meet her there. She has her own Stud called Otto:001_wub: Or go to a BHS Tabby cat show.
I know you would perhaps like to find a breeder near to where you live but you are only going to Buy once and hopefully he/she will be with you for many years so I would put that into all the things concerned before you make a commitment. 
I have Travelled all over to get my Cat family. Good excuse for a Day out and a Day from work

I wish you all the best in your search for your British Baby I know you won't regret it. 
Be warned one is never enough:wink:


----------



## Zephodi (Jul 2, 2014)

rossyl said:


> Thanks everyone.
> 
> I'd rather keep this focused on what to look for when buying kittens, and silver spotty /tabby recommended breeders.
> 
> ...


I wouldn't say it was an entirely bad experience but in hindsight it left a very bad taste in my mouth.

When I first started looking for a kitten I knew what to look for in the kitten (health and behaviour wise) but unfortunately didn't know what to look for in a breeder. I was new to being a cat owner, I've only ever had dogs and rabbits at my parents' house but never owned any myself. Looking back I think I very much dealt with a backyard breeder.

On the phone everything sounded fine and when I visited everything seemed fine too, Odi was a healthy and socialized kitten so I was happy to take him.
However (and I realize now I should've paid more attention), the breeder told me Odi's litter wasn't supposed to happen; the mum and dad had incompatible blood groups so she kept them separate and the mating happened because one of her grandchildren didn't close the doors behind him. Because of that, the kittens withered after they were born and Odi was the only one that survived.

I cringe when I look back at it now, after reading comments from actual professional breeders about what breeding entails. 
But like I said, I didn't have a clue back then and must've had some pretty darn good earmuffs to drown out the alarm bells that should've been ringing.
However, she clearly loved all her cats and took care of them (aside from her breeding antics) so I did take Odi home with me (and I realize how lucky I am he's healthy, now).

It was only a few months ago when I got a real knot in my stomach though; the breeder was on my Facebook, so she could see updates on Odi's progress with us and she let me know that Odi was going to be a big brother.
Aside from the fact that she told me that she had given up breeding after Odi's litter, I thought she meant that his mum was having another litter.
But nope, it was the same parents, despite what happened to their last one!
Strangely enough she defriended me once I posted pictures of Zephyr...

So, to make a long story short, paying attention to what a breeder says and does is just as important as making sure the kitten is well, too. 
I'm glad everything turned out alright with Odi, but I wouldn't ever do it again and fully recommend going to a reputable breeder who's fully transparent about their practices.

And be warned, one really is never enough.
When we got Odi my husband said one would be plenty. I said one would be plenty. And now we're 5 weeks away from picking up Zephyr :aureola:


----------



## sharonbee (Aug 3, 2011)

sharonbee said:


> If Breeders do it right we cannot over breed our cats as we are only allowed by the GCCF to let each of our Queens have 3 litters in every 2 years. Ours will be spayed around 5 years old if not before.





OrientalSlave said:


> This has been discussed many times. The GCCF doesn't have any stipulation as to how often a queen can be bred, .


They wont allow us to register more than 3 litters per two years though will they? If they do then I have misunderstood somewhere, even so we wouldn't breed any of our queens more than that.


----------



## chazey7 (Aug 26, 2013)

I have known prices in my area was £650 for a smokey coloured one that was gccf none active.


----------



## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

sharonbee said:


> They wont allow us to register more than 3 litters per two years though will they? If they do then I have misunderstood somewhere, even so we wouldn't breed any of our queens more than that.


There is no specific rule and what is too much for one queen might be perfect for another.


----------



## Twogirlcats (Jul 6, 2014)

Does it have to be a breeder?
We got ours from The Mayhew animal home. They have kittens as well as adult cats. They all leave with their relevant jabs, chipping as well as neutering. Worth considering as you get a great pet with 'service history' (excuse the expression) and they are cheaper.
Hope that helps your query?


----------



## rossyl (Jul 17, 2014)

Hi Everyone

I have learnt a lot from you all.

There are a couple of things we are struggling with....
- Cost. £600 is out of price range, some of these cats go for £650 (as chazey7 has paid).

- Markings. We'd like a spotty and a stripey. Unfortunately, out of the same litter that seems rare. With most breeders concentrating on the classic tabby markings. 

Any thoughts on either of these...

I've then got to tackle my next issue. Automatic feeders/water/litter trays (I love gadgets!)


----------



## Zephodi (Jul 2, 2014)

rossyl said:


> Hi Everyone
> 
> I have learnt a lot from you all.
> 
> ...


I suppose price depends on where you are, it's £450 where I am (Leicestershire). I have heard it's more expensive down in the south of the country but I wouldn't be able to tell you about that.
The litter that Zephyr is from has him and his brother, who are both lilac tabbies, and a blue spotty girl, so it does happen 

I would say it also depends on how set you are on a certain colour and/or pattern and how far you're willing to travel for that which would be a factor in the cost as you'll have the fuel to account for, too.


----------



## henryscat (Jul 2, 2014)

rossyl said:


> I'd rather keep this focused on what to look for when buying kittens, and silver spotty /tabby recommended breeders.
> 
> Rescue vs. Bred kittens is a different topic.


It isn't - it is very relevant in this context. I would urge anyone thinking of buying any cat or kitten from a breeder to reconsider in light of the number of rescue cats without a home. Every cat bred by a breeder potentially represents a lost home for a rescue cat that is already in existence - it is as simple as that.

Edit - to add: Also, if people have several hundred pounds to hand over to a breeder, please think of the difference that would make if you adopted a cat/kitten and gave that money as a donation which would help other rescue cats rather than a breeder's wallet.


----------



## henryscat (Jul 2, 2014)

moggie14 said:


> Agreed, but this is not down to pedigree breeders. It is purely the result of irresponsible moggie owners not having their cats neutered. The number of pedigrees in this country must be very small compared to the population of moggies


Any cats bred by a breeder (pedigree or otherwise) ultimately means homes taken up that could otherwise be given to rescue cats. It matters not to a rescue cat why they are in a rescue - that is irrelevant - what matters is that they are here today and need a home. I quite agree that neutering is important. However, blaming "irresponsible owners" doesn't change that there is a large homeless cat population and that morally it is owed to those cats to give them a home.


----------



## oliviarussian (Sep 2, 2010)

henryscat said:


> It isn't - it is very relevant in this context. I would urge anyone thinking of buying any cat or kitten from a breeder to reconsider in light of the number of rescue cats without a home. Every cat bred by a breeder potentially represents a lost home for a rescue cat that is already in existence - it is as simple as that.
> 
> Edit - to add: Also, if people have several hundred pounds to hand over to a breeder, please think of the difference that would make if you adopted a cat/kitten and gave that money as a donation which would help other rescue cats rather than a breeder's wallet.


Although I admire your promotion of a rescues I really don't think it is any of your business to tell the OP on what or where she should spend her own hard earned money!


----------



## rox666 (May 22, 2012)

henryscat said:


> Any cats bred by a breeder (pedigree or otherwise) ultimately means homes taken up that could otherwise be given to rescue cats. It matters not to a rescue cat why they are in a rescue - that is irrelevant - what matters is that they are here today and need a home. I quite agree that neutering is important. However, blaming "irresponsible owners" doesn't change that there is a large homeless cat population and that morally it is owed to those cats to give them a home.


So are you suggesting that all cat and dog (and other pet) breeders should stop doing what they are doing and that everybody from now on only takes on unwanted animals. Effectively sanctioning the validity of backyard breeders and championing the non-neutering of pets?

Don't get me wrong, I have rescues myself and cannot stand to see cats/dogs in rescue centres awaiting homes, but, surely people still have the right to choose and often people will choose a particular breed of pet (dog, cat, rabbit etc) based on characteristics/personality traits that are suited to them, something that is not so easily done when taking on a rescue.

It's a debate that could go on for a long time and being the owner of both rescue moggies and pedigree cats I can see both sides of the coin and I think people shouldn't be made to feel guilty whichever way they choose.


----------



## rossyl (Jul 17, 2014)

It is such a heated debate, it is why I requested we did not get sidetracked as my question would have slipped between the cracks and been lost. Breeder kitten vs. Rescue Cat is worth a new thread. 

As it happens, this thread has been extremely helpful as I have mentioned before. I didn't have the right gut feeling about one breeder and have walked away. I've spoken to a number of other breeders and asked a bunch of questions. 

One thing I possibly differ on with some others who have responded is distance for buying a kitten. I just don't think it would be a good first experience for the kitten to be driven 3-4 hours in a little box in a car. 

I'm hopefully in line to get a kitten soon, but I won't celebrate till they are in my house!


----------



## sharonbee (Aug 3, 2011)

Hope all goes well and you get the right cat for you, if you want a pedigree from a breeder then go for it, it is your decision and I think if you want a pedigree it wouldn't be wise to go for a rescue cat. That is how so many rescues end up in rescues again because it wasn't the owners first choice and they regretted it. 
I would say to anyone wanting a cat or kitten go with what you want, if you want to give a home to a rescue then do but if you have your heart set on a pedigree then choose a reputable good breeder.

I have given a home to many a cat in need of a home from rescue centres etc, I loved them all and although we are now breeders we will still in the future offer homes to cats in need once we retire from breeding. We also have lots of pedigrees of different breeds too because we wanted pedigrees.

Also I would just like to point out to Henryscat quote below... the money we get from selling pedigree kittens rarily see the sides of our wallets! We do it for the love of the breed.



henryscat said:


> if people have several hundred pounds to hand over to a breeder, please think of the difference that would make if you adopted a cat/kitten and gave that money as a donation which would help other rescue cats rather than a breeder's wallet.


----------



## Jellypi3 (Jan 3, 2014)

I just want to add a word of warning, make sure you research your breeder fully, 100%, get recommendations from others who have bought kittens from them, because you don't want to be stung and end up with a poorly kitten.

I can't help with BSH's, but I know that my Ragdolls Breeder (who is a member on here - Taylorbaby) used to breed BSH's and she's in Essex, so she will probably know decent BSH breeders in the South East. 

The last thing you want is a sick / unsocialised kitten


----------



## moggie14 (Sep 11, 2013)

henryscat said:


> Any cats bred by a breeder (pedigree or otherwise) ultimately means homes taken up that could otherwise be given to rescue cats. It matters not to a rescue cat why they are in a rescue - that is irrelevant - what matters is that they are here today and need a home. I quite agree that neutering is important. However, blaming "irresponsible owners" doesn't change that there is a large homeless cat population and that morally it is owed to those cats to give them a home.


I've had rescue cats all my life up until recent years when I got my present cats. They were all adults and having just gone through hell with two elderly moggies I wanted kittens this time.
Many rescue centres have rules (some of which, in my opinion are ridiculous) therefore I didn't qualify to 'rescue' a kitten.
Blaming irresponsible owners may not change the homeless cat population but ultimately it is their responsibility - not people who choose to buy a pedigree cat.


----------



## Susan M (Feb 20, 2013)

I love how people with pedigree pets get made to try and feel guilty for not being the ones to clear up the mess caused by irresponsible owners. I won't feel bad for wanting to know the health history and background of my cats. 

I hope you find your breeder soon OP, it may be worth visiting a show if you don't have any luck


----------



## Britishshorthairbabies (Sep 12, 2012)

Interesting thread, just sorry the side tracking which was attempted. 

I am looking to jill for my next bsh, as her reputation proceeds her. Plus Ollie is so beautiful, Jill better keep him locked in before I cat nap him! Cut out the kitten years! &#9786;


----------



## henryscat (Jul 2, 2014)

Susan M said:


> I love how people with pedigree pets get made to try and feel guilty for not being the ones to clear up the mess caused by irresponsible owners. I won't feel bad for wanting to know the health history and background of my cats.


It is the cats that matter - the actions of other people are irrelevant in that consideration.

As a factual matter, pedigree breeds are more prone to health issues than are moggies. Some of these are caused by the breeding of certain characteristics - e.g. Persians and breathing difficulties. Pedigree breeding is an extreme form of domestication - but all domestication represents exploitation. All domestication is only for human benefits not animal benefit. Pedigree breeding involves breeding characteristics that humans value, so pedigree breeding can never ever be in the interests of animals.


----------



## henryscat (Jul 2, 2014)

moggie14 said:


> Blaming irresponsible owners may not change the homeless cat population but ultimately it is their responsibility - not people who choose to buy a pedigree cat.


Every person who choses to buy a pedigree cat by definition is not giving a home to a cat already in existence that needs one. There seems to be a lot of evading on this which saddens me immensely. Morally, humans owe it to animals already in existence to take care of them and not to breed more.


----------



## rossyl (Jul 17, 2014)

While you may be trying to help the cat rescue situation, your comments are now becoming self defeating. I am sure you are stoking the fire waiting for an argument on Pedigree vs. Rescue Cats. 

I hope no one rises to that. 

I would suggest that you think about whether what you are saying is benefitting the cats. Is it making it more or less likely for people to take a rescue cat? People don't like being lectured or told that they are wrong. I would also suggest, if you aren't already, to volunteer at a pet rescue place. If you are I suggest you do more. A person from Battersea Cats and Dogs was knocking door to door, extremely polite and receiving a lot of help. 

That's a couple of ideas. Ranting on here does not help Rescue Cats.


----------



## henryscat (Jul 2, 2014)

rox666 said:


> So are you suggesting that all cat and dog (and other pet) breeders should stop doing what they are doing and that everybody from now on only takes on unwanted animals. Effectively sanctioning the validity of backyard breeders and championing the non-neutering of pets?


I am certainly not sanctioning backyard breeders and non neutering. Quite the opposite in fact. By breeders, I meant any breeder of any description. As I said in another post, morally there is a duty of care to animals already in existence and to not breed more.



> Don't get me wrong, I have rescues myself and cannot stand to see cats/dogs in rescue centres awaiting homes, but, surely people still have the right to choose and often people will choose a particular breed of pet (dog, cat, rabbit etc) based on characteristics/personality traits that are suited to them, something that is not so easily done when taking on a rescue.
> 
> It's a debate that could go on for a long time and being the owner of both rescue moggies and pedigree cats I can see both sides of the coin and I think people shouldn't be made to feel guilty whichever way they choose.


People's "right to choose" is mentioned a lot by a number of posters.

I do not see how anyone can seriously say that their "right to choose" is more important than the needs of animals here today that need a home. It isn't. Talking about personal choice is all very nice, but this is a moral matter and not one of personal choice. Every time a choice is made to buy from any breeder rather than adopt, that choice has a very real negative impact on all the animals needing a home. I have no doubt that the majority, if not all, of people that buy pedigree cats do love their cats but not withstanding that, it still doesn't get away from the effect that choice has on homeless animals.


----------



## jill3 (Feb 18, 2009)

henryscat said:


> Every person who choses to buy a pedigree cat by definition is not giving a home to a cat already in existence that needs one. There seems to be a lot of evading on this which saddens me immensely. Morally, humans owe it to animals already in existence to take care of them and not to breed more.


This thread is all about Buying A British Short hair.
I know what you are saying but maybe another Thread might help.
I could also say the same about people having Babies when there are Thousands a round the world starving and also Children needing homes in this Country too! So every person who chooses to have a Baby you are denying a child in care from having a home!

All to do with choice


----------



## henryscat (Jul 2, 2014)

rossyl said:


> While you may be trying to help the cat rescue situation, your comments are now becoming self defeating. I am sure you are stoking the fire waiting for an argument on Pedigree vs. Rescue Cats.


It isn't a matter of me wanting an argument. I believe all animals of all species matter - that is why I have posted what I have and for no other reason at all.



> I would suggest that you think about whether what you are saying is benefitting the cats. Is it making it more or less likely for people to take a rescue cat? People don't like being lectured or told that they are wrong.


I would hope that people reading give the issue greater thought as it is extremely important and I would be reasonably confident in saying that some readers will think about it whether or not they participate in the thread. Whether or not you think I'm "lecturing", that in no way invalidates the point being made.



> I would also suggest, if you aren't already, to volunteer at a pet rescue place. If you are I suggest you do more. A person from Battersea Cats and Dogs was knocking door to door, extremely polite and receiving a lot of help.


We currently have three adopted cats, I donate to cat rescues and I do a lot of work to advocate for animals. We will be in a position to adopt some more animals in the not too distant future. I stand by my moral beliefs and don't eat or consume any animal products whatsoever. So, I already do a lot for animals.



> That's a couple of ideas. Ranting on here does not help Rescue Cats.


My experience is that contributing to discussion can often do more than you think, so I think it is very unfair to be dismissive about that.


----------



## jill3 (Feb 18, 2009)

Britishshorthairbabies said:


> Interesting thread, just sorry the side tracking which was attempted.
> 
> I am looking to jill for my next bsh, as her reputation proceeds her. Plus Ollie is so beautiful, Jill better keep him locked in before I cat nap him! Cut out the kitten years! ☺


Bit confusing with both our names being Jill:lol:
Thank you for your kind words about Ollie.
I Do love him to bits and so glad we went for number 3.
Ollie, Archie and Chloe are always locked in our house when we go out, even though we have a cat proof garden.

So no cat Napping LOL!!
Here's a Picture of him to tease you with xx


----------



## moggie14 (Sep 11, 2013)

What a shame that the OP's originally question is completely lost within a moggie v pedigree debate started by one poster. I apologise to OP for getting drawn into that 
As someone else has already mentioned, if you wish to start a conversation about that issue please start your own thread henryscat. It's quite rude to hijack someone else's, especially as it is entitled 'buying a british shorthair' to which you have nothing helpful to contribute.
I do hope OP has not been put off by yet another individual trying to ram their opinions down other peoples throats :angry:


----------



## Mia mouse (Jun 16, 2014)

Just wanted to say that I have just bought a BSH, a wee lilac spotted girl, she cost £500 and the breeder I used lives about 2 1/2 hours away. I went to a local cat show to have a look at other BSH breeders but more importantly to meet a lady that was showing one of my breeder's cats and ask her lots of questions  She actually has 3 cats from the breeder and couldn't speak highly enough of her. I also contacted lots of breeders online and then by phone and asked if they didn't have kittens if they could recommend a breeder AND I even asked the ones I felt comfortable with if there were any breeders that they would avoid  

The silver ones are a bit more expensive, the breeder I'm using does have a litter of silver kittens and I think they were an extra £50

I want to get a male red or cream kitten to join Daisy in a few months so am looking around now, unfortunately my breeder won't be having anymore kittens just now but I have another breeder that I really trust helping me so fingers crossed Daisy won't have to wait too long for her wee "brother" 

Hope you find your kitten soon but meanwhile check out cat shows and make as many phonecalls as you can...you can normally tell on the phone if you would want to take it further and meet the breeder. Also you could ask the breeder if there is anyone near you that has one of her kittens and if she could give them your number to speak to them??


----------



## Isi (Oct 13, 2009)

Hi Rossy,

I'm a bit late to the conversation but I got our two BSH kittens from a breeder in Surrey five years ago. They cost £450 each back then. The litter contained a mix of colours/coat patterns and I don't remember there being a price difference between any of them. 

We came away with a beautiful (I'm biased ) calico girl and her gorgeous black and white brother. Both cats were impeccably brought up by their mother and have been the perfect pets since day one. 

The prices you've mentioned seem steep to me but then I don't know what may have changed since 2009. I don't know if the lady I went to is still operating as a breeder, but if you want me to send on her details to you just let me know. 

Good luck with your hunt - they really are the most fabulous creatures.

(P.S. It's actually my cats' birthday today, and since they're not living with me right now and I miss them so much, I have added a picture  )


----------



## rossyl (Jul 17, 2014)

Hi Isi - unfortunately I cannot Private Message yet, so would be grateful if you could please let me know the name of breeder.

Many thanks


----------



## chazey7 (Aug 26, 2013)

Some people are just lucky to live close by to a breeder but some people do have to travel, when I pick my little girl truffle was only 1 hour bus ride rhats going at rush hour.
Daisy she will be a good 12 hour day trip to fetch her by train as I do not drive. 
There are a few british short hair breeders on Pets4Homes it just depends on how far you want to travel, I once was going to go to Aberdeen for a persian that was a long time a go by national express lol someone talked me out of it. 
I do not want to sound selfishly but some people will not pay £500 for a pedigree cat but other people are not willing to pay £20 from a rescue centre its peoples choice breeder or rescue.
When my girl haves a litter a donation from each kitten will go to my local rescue centres.
I have had trouble from a breeder whom I was going get my first persian boy she wanted bank statements, vet numbers ect even wanted me to sign a consider every time I took the xat to the vet she was aloud to be informed

I did not go to that breeder again.


----------



## henryscat (Jul 2, 2014)

moggie14 said:


> What a shame that the OP's originally question is completely lost within a moggie v pedigree debate started by one poster. I apologise to OP for getting drawn into that
> As someone else has already mentioned, if you wish to start a conversation about that issue please start your own thread henryscat. It's quite rude to hijack someone else's, especially as it is entitled 'buying a british shorthair' to which you have nothing helpful to contribute.
> I do hope OP has not been put off by yet another individual trying to ram their opinions down other peoples throats :angry:


As I've said, the issues I've raised are entirely relevant to this thread. However, it is something that I will post about in further detail in a separate thread when I've assembled all my thoughts together.

On the subject of British Shorthairs - I am actually very familiar with them. When growing up, we had two colour point British Shorthairs who were half brothers. They were both really lovely cats, completely adorable and I loved them both dearly. Before them we had two Siamese. However, since that time my thinking about animals has moved on and is now much more informed. Even though I have lived with pedigree cats all those years ago, there is still no way I would advocate having them now for reasons I've already given.

I haven't "rammed" any opinions. I have put my thoughts down in a written post which people can choose to accept or not. It is very common to receive the "ramming opinion" accusation where discussions on moral thinking around animals are concerned. There is no force in what I am saying, but breeding any animal for specific characteristics is unquestionably an act of forcing human desires upon animals. I'll expand upon that separately too.


----------



## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

henryscat said:


> <snip>
> I haven't "rammed" any opinions.
> <snip>


If you were having a real world conversation with someone and someone else came along and started telling you you were wrong or trying to move the conversation onto something else (rather than letting it move naturally) you would feel they were ramming their viewpoint down your throat - that they were being rude.

You have high-jacked the OP's thread, that is one thing that on-line ramming is.

You are also not very happy at people ignoring / not accepting your point of view - you say it again louder. That's another form of ramming.

Starting your own thread is the polite way to go about it, not tagging onto someone else's beyond (maybe) a post pointing people at your thread.


----------



## Soozi (Jun 28, 2013)

I don't know how the moderators of this forum would feel but maybe we should have an "Off Topic" thread whereby any posts not relating to the OP's topic get moved to the Off topic thread and any arguments or differences of opinions can be continued there. :idea:


----------



## henryscat (Jul 2, 2014)

Soozi said:


> I don't know how the moderators of this forum would feel but maybe we should have an "Off Topic" thread whereby any posts not relating to the OP's topic get moved to the Off topic thread and any arguments or differences of opinions can be continued there. :idea:


I've taken on board the suggestion for a new thread and posted in detail here for those interested:

http://www.petforums.co.uk/cat-chat/374207-pedigree-cats-moral-issues.html

The issues raised on the new thread are related to and relevant to the title of this thread, as I have previously said.


----------



## rossyl (Jul 17, 2014)

Thanks very much, seems like the best option.


----------



## spid (Nov 4, 2008)

Kittens tend to sleep when picked up - and can travel quite long distances in comfort. As you are after very particular colour and markings I would not worry about distance but more about the breeder and making sure they are right for you.

I have three kittens due to go to their new homes in a week - one is going to Cheshire, one to Leeds and one just down the road in Wiltshire. I have no qualms at all about the distances they will travel.


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

spid said:


> I have three kittens due to go to their new homes in a week - one is going to Cheshire, one to Leeds l.


[gets dick Turpin mask out and lies in wait on M6]


----------



## Lene (May 23, 2015)

jill3 said:


> If you go onto the British short hair cat club and click on to the breeders list. Scroll down to Leicestershire and there is one Breeder only on the list. ( Wellmar British Short hairs)
> She has been breeding British for 30 years. Lovely Lady and Beautiful cats and kittens
> 
> If you look at my picture of the silver Red Tabby he came from her last year.:thumbsup:


Just seen your post - we bought our boy Sapphire Blue Boy of Wellsmar 16 yrs ago from Jill in Leicester, he was amazing, the best friend and companion ever, especially with our 2 dogs. Jill was very helpful and it is lovely to see that she is still breeding her cats. Unfortunately we lost Saffy recently and miss him dreadfully, we would definitely go to Jill again for another kitten.


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

I now have an addition to our family since I originally posted. I bought a one year old boy 2 weeks ago. This was taken today .










Forgot to say he is from Becky @ Alfiebritz


----------



## CAPA7 (Jun 23, 2012)

I have 2 BSH girls and I paid £400 for each. Their breeder was Busykitz in Dorset (they have a website and breed different colours including some stunning silver tabbies), we had to travel 3 hours to get them but I think once you have found the right breeder and kitten(s) distance doesn't matter. The breeder asked me lots of questions when I went to visit them. I stayed well over an hour, she showed me the parents as well as other cats they have, etc. When we went to collect them, we again spent over an hour with the breeder, she was keen to explain everything amd you could tell it was hard for her to say goodbye to the kittens. 
I got them at 14 weeks - it feels like ages to wait but it is TOTALLY worth it, do not be tempted to get younger kittens. They came to use well-socialised, litter-trained, well-behaved and vaccinated. 
If you can, consider getting two kittens together, I am really glad I did as they always have each other for company if we are at work all day. Plus, if you want to get a second cat at some point, it's easier to get two siblings together (as they are already used to each other) rather than have to introduce a new cat and not knowing how it will go.


----------



## BSH1 (May 27, 2015)

Hi all, new to the forum... Glad I came across this thread. 

Looking to purchase my first ever british shorthair kitten. Ideally would like a pure blue or lilac boy. I have similar questions as the OP regarding the breeder and what to look for when buying my new boy. 

Also, if I'm wanting a good example of the pedigree, do I look at the parents? Do both parents need to be big cats for me to end up with a big bah with all the usual features/characteristics? Also, are there any good breeder in or around the Yorkshire area? 

Thanks in advance


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

I used to check out this site http://www.bestofbritishshorthairs.co.uk. I know you mentioned Yorkshire but if you have transport, look further a field for the breeder and the colour you are looking for. I live on the manchester side of the Pennines and all 3 of mine have come from East of the Pennines. Doncaster, S****horpe and a few weeks ago Lincoln.

My new boy came from Alfiebritz in Lincoln and she had some lovely kittens. I would definitely check out their webpage. My boy is absolutely wonderful and was spotted on Pets4Homes as he is just a year old.

Perhaps check out a local show and speak to the breeders there, although the couple of shows I visited I found the breeders a little intimidating. However all 3 of mine have been over 7 months old.


----------



## BSH1 (May 27, 2015)

Cookieandme said:


> I used to check out this site http://www.bestofbritishshorthairs.co.uk. I know you mentioned Yorkshire but if you have transport, look further a field for the breeder and the colour you are looking for. I live on the manchester side of the Pennines and all 3 of mine have come from East of the Pennines. Doncaster, S****horpe and a few weeks ago Lincoln.
> 
> My new boy came from Alfiebritz in Lincoln and she had some lovely kittens. I would definitely check out their webpage. My boy is absolutely wonderful and was spotted on Pets4Homes as he is just a year old.
> 
> Perhaps check out a local show and speak to the breeders there, although the couple of shows I visited I found the breeders a little intimidating. However all 3 of mine have been over 7 months old.


Hi Cookieandme. Thanks for your reply. I'm prepared to travel and so far I have been looking at pet4homes but not sure I'm finding the best examples on there! Might consider visiting shows but will be sure to check out the above website for breeders. Is there anything else that I need to look out for? And am I right in thinking that many breeders are likely to keep cats that are of show quality for either showing or breeding?


----------



## Cookieandme (Dec 29, 2011)

There are quite a few breeders on here and will be able to advise you better than I. There are breeders who advertise. Just seen this one http://www.pets4homes.co.uk/classif...horthair-blue-kittens-available-keighley.html. I don't know who the breeder is (this is not a personal revommendation) you could then check out the GCCF list to check for suspensions etc.

My new boy was shown and has a 2nd at the Supreme and a 3rd (who was that judge) at a smaller show, he has also sired a litter of kittens.

Are you looking to show or breed from the kitten ?


----------



## BSH1 (May 27, 2015)

I look forward to their replies. Thanks for linking that ad and no not looking to breed or show but still want a very good example of either a pure blue or lilac. 

Would like a big boy. Am I right in thinking if both parents are big cats, would that give me a good chance of ending up with a big boy? 

Congrats on your boy getting 2nd and 3rd, seen a pic of your 3 and they all look amazing. Defo good examples


----------



## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

Strongly recommend you consider looking further afield as you will get more choice.

If you want a big cat you want a boy, the boys are usually a fair bit bigger than the girls especially the neuters.

Do you want to show? Make sure the breeder knows. Not all the show quality kittens can be kept, and there are plenty of people who have a lovely neuter male they show. If you don't want to show then not sure why you would want 'the best example' - or are you talking about the breeder there?

Plenty of reputable good breeders advertise on pets4homes, kittenlist, preloved and so on. I looked at the website mentioned above and can't see any indication of any requirements of breeders on it, so apart from it being a specialist website I'm not sure it offers any more security than p4h etc.

You have to think about the advert - will the kittens be registered? If not walk away. If you find a breeder who neuters as well before the kittens leave you have probably got a good breeder.

Read all the information on the GCCF website about buying a kitten. http://www.gccfcats.org/buying.html

Check the breeder's prefix exists (http://www.gccfcats.org/prefixes.html) and make sure they aren't on any of the banned / suspended lists (http://www.gccfcats.org/suspend.html).

Expect to visit at least once before you take your kitten home. Also expect to pay a deposit on your kitten, and don't be surprised if the breeder wants cash or bank transfer rather than cheques or paypal. Breeders have been scammed with the later forms of payment.

The kittens should be growing up in a normal domestic environment, and if your house is busy & noisy (kids, dogs, etc.) look for one from a similar house. The mother should be with them, the father might be outside in a stud pen or might be someone else's cat.

It should come with a pedigree, their GCCF registration card, a receipt, a care leaflet, 4 weeks insurance and some of their normal food. Most breeders provide more than that - mine also come chipped & neutered, and I supply some of the litter they are using, a toy or two and a comfort blanket that has been in the nest for a few days so it smells of home.

Finally if there is no-one at home for most of the day a great many breeders would be wary of homing a single kitten to you.


----------



## BSH1 (May 27, 2015)

Thanks for that reply. Regarding the GGCF prefixes, I've spoken to a few breeders over the last few weeks but could not find their prefixes on that list you linked. Is that an up to date list? Or would you recommend contacting the GCCF directly? 

Reason I asked for a good example was because thats what I'd like, in terms of the features, size and characteristics even if I'm not going to show. After all I will be spending a good sum of money and so would want a decent example. More than anything, I really want that big teddy bear look that the BSH is famous for.


----------



## OrientalSlave (Jan 26, 2012)

BSH1 said:


> Thanks for that reply. Regarding the GGCF prefixes, I've spoken to a few breeders over the last few weeks but could not find their prefixes on that list you linked. Is that an up to date list? Or would you recommend contacting the GCCF directly?
> 
> Reason I asked for a good example was because thats what I'd like, in terms of the features, size and characteristics even if I'm not going to show. After all I will be spending a good sum of money and so would want a decent example. More than anything, I really want that big teddy bear look that the BSH is famous for.


The few prefixes at the bottom of the page are new ones people have applied to. There are two lists, A-M and N-Z:

http://www.gccfcats.org/pdf/prefixesAtoM.pdf
http://www.gccfcats.org/pdf/prefixesNtoZ.pdf


----------

