# Europe wants us to experiment on domestic pets.



## petcoach (Apr 18, 2010)

A story in the Daily Mail led me to a Government website, which is advertising a consultation as to whether they should allow experiments on domestic pets.

As a result, I have just set up a Government e-petition, which includes a link to the consultation paper: Do not let Europe force us to allow experiments on domestic animals - e-petitions

I do hope you will sign this petition and circulate it to your friends. Please also submit a view to the Home Office.

If enough people do sign the petition and comment, the Government are likely to oppose the idea. If nobody objects, then in a year or two's time we might find puppy farms being set up to breed cats and dogs for experiments.

The consultation paper can be found at: Animal testing consultation | Home Office


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## Lulus mum (Feb 14, 2011)

Have signed-and will pass on to friends
good luck -hope lots of P.F members sign
really need signatures-only 27 so far
this cannot go ahead!!!
Maureen


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## MoggyBaby (Mar 8, 2011)

May I suggest that this petition be put into General Chat, Dog Chat & Cat Chat to ensure that a broad spectrum of Forum members get to see it. 

I only happened to find it tucked away here by chance........


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## Sonybear (Feb 1, 2011)

Ive signed it.


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## buffie (May 31, 2010)

Signed it.


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## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

As in your other thread; where does it say that Europe wants to force us to experiment on domestic pets? :huh:


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## petcoach (Apr 18, 2010)

Thanks to everyone who has signed the petition.

There is a link on the actual petition to the consultation page. You need to click on that link and it will take you to the Home Office page and the consultation documents.

I have emailed most of the big animal charities about this. The only one who replied was the Battersea Dogs Home. They said they will be replying to the consultation. The deadline is early September.

You would have thought that all of the charities would have been publicising the consultation so it would be meaningful....

Sue


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## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

petcoach said:


> Thanks to everyone who has signed the petition.
> 
> There is a link on the actual petition to the consultation page. You need to click on that link and it will take you to the Home Office page and the consultation documents.
> 
> ...


I did click on the links - can you advise where it states that the UK will be forced to experiment on domestic pets?

This is copied from the link .....

"The government is asking you to have your say on how EU rules on testing are introduced in the UK.

An EU Directive on animal testing regulations will strengthen the protection of animals used in scientific procedures across Europe.

The UK already has very high standards of protection in this area, but wants your views on how best to incorporate provisions into our existing legislation.

Highest standards
Home Office minister Lynne Featherstone said: *'The government welcomes this new Directive which strengthens the protection of animals used in scientific procedures in the EU and promotes work to "Replace, Reduce and Refine" the use of animals in research.*
'We expect and require the highest standards in animal research in the UK. I want to ensure we transpose the Directive in the best possible way for us; that is why I am launching this consultation today.

'I would like the general public, the research community and those working on the welfare and protection of animals used in scientific procedures to give us their views on the options for transposition.' "

From what I have read so far (not alot granted so would be grateful if someone could exoplain if I am misunderstanding) but this appears to be tightening up existing laws regarding the use of animals in scientific procedures ..... so are you against that? I'm confused!!!


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## ClaireandDaisy (Jul 4, 2010)

I tend to assume anything in the Daily Mail is a work of fiction. :huh:
So no, I`m not signing until I get confirmation it`s true from a reputable source.


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## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

Here is the link to the proposal http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2010:276:0033:0079:ENDF

I'm amazed that people are against a new directive that is in fact tightening up existing laws for all EU countries. This will improve the lives of many animals used in research


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## hobbs2004 (Mar 12, 2010)

I am going to reply quite uncharacteristically for me with: What a load of tosh. 

It is quite clear to me that instead of reading the actual directive (or even just searching for the word domestic within it if you cannot be bothered to read the whole, exceedingly dry document), you have taken the DM and the Sunday Express as your sources of information. Never a good thing to do imo without double-checking the original document.

The directive makes reference to "domestic" about 4 or 5 times; always in relation to feral or abandoned animals of domestic species. However, they are named to make clear that these are not going to be experimented on unless there is clear medical need to use this population (transmitted diseases from the feral population).

Overall, the way I read this is that this is a TIGHTENING of regulations that PROTECT animals more so than it has before for countries that have so far only signed up to the most minimal of protection. Any regulations that a country already has that are even tighter than what is included in the doc here will remain in place.


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## petcoach (Apr 18, 2010)

This is the consultation page - information about how to respond is on the link on my petition. Seems to me that the Home Office wanted to bury this consultation over the summer holiday.

What it seems to mean is that the rest of Europe test on domestic animals and they want to bring us in line with that standard.

The full text of the directive is on the Home Office site, but you have to search for it:

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2010:276:0033:0079:EN:PDF

Sue

From the Home Office site:

Directive 2010/63/EU on the protection of animals used for scientific purposes - WMS

Consultation on European Directive 2010/63/EU on the protection of animals used for scientific purposes - WMS

This written ministerial statement was laid in the House of Commons on 13 June 2011 by Lynne Featherstone, and in the House of Lords by Baroness Browning.

The parliamentary under secretary of state for equalities and criminal information (Lynne Featherstone): The Home Office is today publishing a consultation paper seeking views on the options for transposing European Directive 2010/63/EU on the protection of animals used for scientific purposes. Directive 2010/63/EU will replace Directive 86/609/EEC on which current United Kingdom legislation  the Animals (Scientific Procedures) Act 1986  is based. In common with other member states, the UK must transpose the provisions of the new directive into legislation by 10 November 2012. The consultation paper invites views on the options for transposing the new directive and on the accompanying impact assessment.

The government welcomes the new directive, which strengthens the protection of animals used in scientific procedures and promotes the development, validation, acceptance and implementation of methods and strategies that replace, reduce and refine the scientific use of animals (the 3Rs). It also sets down detailed rules to ensure harmonisation and the proper functioning of the internal market. These are intended to rectify variations in the implementation of Directive 86/609/EEC which have tended to create barriers to trade in products and substances developed using animals in research and testing.

The consultation paper seeks views on the detailed provisions of the directive with a view to informing the preparation of transposing legislation. The consultation closes on 5 September 2011. A copy of the consultation paper and related impact assessment will be placed in the House Library.

Monday, 13 June 2011


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## hobbs2004 (Mar 12, 2010)

Perhaps, it would be prudent to also post this:

EUROPA - Press Releases - Questions and answers on the new directive for the protection of animals used for scientific purposes

and the tabloid story debunker site:

Tabloid Watch: The EU doesn't really want your 'pets' for drug testing


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## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

hobbs2004 said:


> I am going to reply quite uncharacteristically for me with: What a load of tosh.
> 
> It is quite clear to me that instead of reading the actual directive (or even just searching for the word domestic within it if you cannot be bothered to read the whole, exceedingly dry document), you have taken the DM and the Sunday Express as your sources of information. Never a good thing to do imo without double-checking the original document.
> 
> ...


Agreed!!! I can't believe that people are signing up to say they are AGAINST tightening up EU laws, that they are AGAINST all EU countries conforming to high standards, that they are AGAINST animals lives being improved - mad


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## petcoach (Apr 18, 2010)

Please don't ignore the message because the messenger was the Daily Mail, it was in other newspapers too and was discussed on LBC and someone said they also heard it on the BBC too.

The whole point of the exercise is to standardise treatment across Europe, but we have higher standards here in the UK. As the Tabloid Watch article said: our laws are far more humane than in the rest of Europe. If the directive is implemented, then we will be just the same as every other country.

Applying European standards to us may mean that in some ways animals who are experimented on have better conditions - on mainland Europe - but in the UK, the story appears to be different, which is why I put up the petition.

This isn't about banning animal experiments - that is another debate - but it is about encouraging pet lovers to join in the Home Office's consultation, whether they are for the proposals or against them, and if anyone agrees with my analysis of the working paper, then I hope they will also sign my petition. The Home Office consulation ends on 5 September. Their website does not make finding the paper easy, but you can at least get to the right area if you follow the link on this page and then you can work your way to reading the entire directive, if you so choose.

One thing I did check, before putting up this post was the definition of 'feral'. This means any stray domestic animal. At present local authorities must care for stray cats and dogs for seven days to give owners time to reclaim them. Unfortunately, some local authorities are forced by a lack of funding to euthanase them after that, unless a charity is willing to take them in. If this proposal is adopted, the 'feral' stray could be picked up by a laboratory and used for testing. And once the principle of experimenting on domestic animals is established, and again as the articles you quote say - it is likely that the scientific industries will want _cleaner specimens _for their experiments and this is bound to mean an increase in puppy farms.

Look, I don't want an argument about this - I put up my comments and my petition in good faith and if you believe it is tosh, then I hope you will take the time to join in the consultation and explain how it will improve the lot of animals being experimented on in the UK.

Sue


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## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

I really don't know what else to do as you are obvciously not reading the directive or understanding it!!! You are asking animal lovers to vote against a directive to improve the lives of animals :cursing:

here is a section copied & pasted regarding the changes & a link should anyone want to read about it in more depth

EUROPA - Press Releases - Questions and answers on the new directive for the protection of animals used for scientific purposes

*What are the aims of the new directive?*

The main objectives are to *considerably improve the welfare of animals used in scientific procedures, to ensure fair competition for industry, and foster research activities in the European Union*. The directive is based on the need to Replace, Reduce, and Refine animal testing  the Three Rs principle. *The Commission believes strongly in the need to find alternative methods to testing on animals*. Where this is not possible the number of animals used must be reduced or the testing methods refined so as to cause less harm to the animals.

Why was it necessary to revise Directive 86/609/EEC?

Legislation on the protection of animals used in scientific experiments (86/609/EEC) had a variety of weaknesses, and a number of Member States have passed laws that *have led to a widening gap in sta*ndards. The *Commission felt it was necessary to address these issues whilst ensuring further improvements were made to the welfare of animals used in scientific procedures*. Our knowledge of animal welfare requirements and their capacity to experience pain, suffering and distress has increased since 1986 and the research environment has also evolved. Many provisions of the directive currently in force are open to interpretation and some are more political than regulatory in nature. It does not include ethical reviews or requirements to obtain authorisations for experiments. In addition, EU legislation has never before explicitly addressed the internationally recognised Three R concept of Replacement, Reduction and Refinement (Russell and Burch 1959) which aims to minimise the use of experimental animals. Since upholding animal welfare is now integrated in the EU Treaties, this must be taken into account in all policy areas.

*Revising the directive has strengthened the legislation in the area of animal experimentation in the EU. The aim is to reduce the use of animals in scientific experiments and ensure that those that are still used receive appropriate care and humane treatment*.

*How does the new directive differ from the old directive? *

The revised directive will make it compulsory to carry out ethical evaluation and require that experiments where animals are used be subject to authorisation;

It will widen the scope of the directive to include under its protection specific invertebrate species and foetuses in their last trimester of development as well as animals used for the purposes of basic research, education and training;

It will set minimum housing and care requirements;

The revised directive requires that only non-human primates of second or higher generation be used, subject to transitional periods, to avoid taking animals from the wild for animal welfare and environmental reasons;

More clarity has been introduced into the *requirement to replace the use of animals by non-animal methods*. *Member States will be required to improve breeding, accommodation and care measures as well as methods used in procedures to eliminate or reduce to a minimum any possible pain, suffering, distress or lasting harm caused to animals*. These measures are based on the Three Rs principle: Replacing, Reducing and Refining the use of animals in experiments;

There will be an 'Animal welfare body' in each establishment to foster a climate of care and ensure a systematic application of the current Three Rs methods and techniques as well as to ensure the uptake of the new, emerging ones;

Non-technical summaries will be prepared for each project to be published by the Member States to improve transparency and understanding and a retrospective assessment of projects with high concern will be conducted;

Significant focus has been put on correct application and enforcement for example through systematic controls including unannounced inspections.


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## hobbs2004 (Mar 12, 2010)

Also worth pointing out again that any country regulations that exceed what is outlined in the directive will remain in place. No country is stepping back in terms of animal welfare as a result of the directive, but quite a few will be stepping forward as regulations are getting tightened across the board.


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