# I'm worried about Frontline, Advantage and Stronghold...



## lady_r0gue (Jul 22, 2009)

I've been using Frontline... but the vet seems to think that the fleas round here are immune to it. He recommends Stronghold, people on here recommend Advantix... but it peeves me that all these companies are vivisection baddies and all the ingredients seem pretty lethal! I'm also worried about the fact that my dog is still nibbling himself and has a rash by his tail despite the fact that the fleas seem to have gone... I thought perhaps it's all the chemicals in the spot ons.

Then I found this... page 3 shocked me...

http://www.apnm.org/publications/resources/fleachemfin.pdf

I'm shampooing him with hibiscrub which seems to help a little...

He's due for his defleaing again in three days though and I don't know whether to use up the frontline I've got or not...

Does anyone use diatomaceous earth or any flea treatments that contain it and can they advise me how well it works, how to use it and where to get the best deal on it? Thanks xx


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## Spaniel mad (Jul 17, 2009)

We have used frontline for years and years and never had a health problem

recently the fleas do seem immune to it so we have moved to advantage and its great


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

I don't like putting toxic chemicals on my dog, so although I've never had a flea problem (other than when visiting my friend's infested house) I'm trying Billy No-Mates from CSJ. It's a herb blend you mix in the food, supposed to make them unpalatable to fleas. So far, so good - about 3 months since last treated with Advantix.


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

If he's nibbling by his tail, could his anal glands be full/impacted?


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## LostGirl (Jan 16, 2009)

Burrowzig said:


> I don't like putting toxic chemicals on my dog, so although I've never had a flea problem (other than when visiting my friend's infested house) I'm trying Billy No-Mates from CSJ. It's a herb blend you mix in the food, supposed to make them unpalatable to fleas. So far, so good - about 3 months since last treated with Advantix.


Im buying some of this as it can be used with cats aswell Glad someone else has tried it and thinks its good. Very good prices aswell!


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## nat1979 (Jan 2, 2009)

They garlic is good to keep fleas away


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## lady_r0gue (Jul 22, 2009)

Nonnie said:


> If he's nibbling by his tail, could his anal glands be full/impacted?


No, it was just a flea allergy - he's not nibbled himself raw this time though he did the other summer - it's the third time I've taken him in for this - each time it's after he has been deflead, he carries on itching and has to have an antihistamine jab. (Once the vet said the frontline we had bought off them hadn't killed cat fleas (?) so he had to have their super duper £40 stuff? That was before we had cats.)
This time he's had his antimhistamine jab and while as I said he's not raw, he's still nibbling and i can see little sore bits under his fur near his tail. the hibiscrub seems to work well. But yeah I just wondered about the earth as from what I've found out it seems like the perfect product... anyone???


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## moboyd (Sep 29, 2009)

I use garlic for my dogs always have, and they have never had fleas, whether this is because I am just lucky I dont know, the only thing is, garlic is no good for ticks. I give them a garlic and brewers yeast tab each day.

Mo


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## Jazzy (Apr 15, 2009)

I used to always use Stronghold for our older Bichon but have recently changed to Frontline for a change. Never had a problem with any of them.


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## lady_r0gue (Jul 22, 2009)

Well after doing some research and reading quite a few testimonials from professionals who've used it I've bought some of this diaomataceous (sp?) earth from Animal Kingdom - The Complete Online Pet Store for the Animal in your Life I wanted to try it on the kittens as well as they are due flea treatments in 3 days as well  I'll let you know how we get on!


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## moboyd (Sep 29, 2009)

lady_r0gue said:


> Well after doing some research and reading quite a few testimonials from professionals who've used it I've bought some of this diaomataceous (sp?) earth from Animal Kingdom - The Complete Online Pet Store for the Animal in your Life I wanted to try it on the kittens as well as they are due flea treatments in 3 days as well  I'll let you know how we get on!


it has to be whats called human grade, so make sure you get the right one, I was considering this, but apparently its also good for slug as it has sharp slithers in it that slugs find difficulty travelling over, this had me thinking of the downside, ie actually damaging the lungs if breathed with its abrasive action, someone posted details about it and I will try to find it, but to be honest it put me off. .here we go.

Natural diatomaceous earth (DE for short) is the remains of microscopic one-celled plants (phytoplankton) called diatoms that lived in the oceans that once covered the western part of the United States and other parts of the world. Huge deposits were left behind when the water receded. They are now mined and have several important uses in toothpaste, beer filtering, and swimming pool filters. DE is approximately 3% magnesium, 86% silicon, 5% sodium, 2% iron and many other trace minerals such as titanium, boron, manganese, copper and zirconium. Natural DE also makes a very effective natural insecticide. The insecticidal quality of DE is due to the razor sharp edges of the diatom remains. When DE comes contact with the insects, the sharp edges lacerate the bugs' waxy exoskeleton and then the powdery DE absorbs the body fluids causing death from dehydration. Said more simply, DE kills insects by drying then up. You'll see how drying DE is if you handle it with bare hands. There is no residual danger of contamination. In fact, DE is actually beneficial to the soil. It's loaded with trace minerals. However, there are a few precautions. Diatomaceous earth is very dusty and can cause lung problems if breathed heavily, so when applying it dry always wear a good dust mask or stand up wind. The second precaution is that DE sold for swimming pool filters is ineffective for insect control because it has been heated and chemically treated. It won't kill insects and it is very dangerous to breathe. Finally natural DE will kill beneficial insects too, so use it sparingly to kill problem infestations of harmful insects and don't use it too often.

Diatomaceous earth can be applied in a variety of ways. to use for flea and tick control, apply a light dusting over the lawn, in dog runs, around pet bedding or favorite resting spots and sprinkle a little on your pet between baths of a mild herbal soap..........

Mo


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## Lulu's owner (May 1, 2009)

lady_r0gue said:


> I've been using Frontline... but the vet seems to think that the fleas round here are immune to it. He recommends Stronghold, people on here recommend Advantix... but it peeves me that all these companies are vivisection baddies and all the ingredients seem pretty lethal! I'm also worried about the fact that my dog is still nibbling himself and has a rash by his tail despite the fact that the fleas seem to have gone... I thought perhaps it's all the chemicals in the spot ons.
> 
> Then I found this... page 3 shocked me...
> 
> ...


By the way, was the article about non-poisonous flea control mentioned at the end of the article included on your post? It looked as if it would be interesting but I don't know if it was attached and I had missed it or not.


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## lady_r0gue (Jul 22, 2009)

Yes I made sure of that before I bought it... apparently its safe for anything with an exoskeleton although its not recommended to breathe it in if you have lung problems? I found an informative testimonial here Food Grade Diatomaceous Earth Helps Eliminate Worms & Parasites
I'm also looking at buying some of the beneficial nematodes for sprinkling on the lawn - anyone used these?


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## lady_r0gue (Jul 22, 2009)

Lulu's owner said:


> By the way, was the article about non-poisonous flea control mentioned at the end of the article included on your post? It looked as if it would be interesting but I don't know if it was attached and I had missed it or not.


Sorry - it wasn't - i can't seem to find that but I've found quite a few testimonials online including the one above ... I'm thinking if it's food grade and is recommended to put in their food daily then surely that's much more of an appropriate substance to use on dogs and cats fur than those awful pesticides? I read somewhere that it was recommended for putting in cat litter as well so they get some on their feet.

Thanks Mo for ur research!

I'm going to try it.. I'm just going to look up the effects if used on sore and broken skin xx


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## Lulu's owner (May 1, 2009)

lady_r0gue said:


> Sorry - it wasn't - i can't seem to find that but I've found quite a few testimonials online including the one above ... I'm thinking if it's food grade and is recommended to put in their food daily then surely that's much more of an appropriate substance to use on dogs and cats fur than those awful pesticides? I read somewhere that it was recommended for putting in cat litter as well so they get some on their feet.
> 
> Thanks Mo for ur research!
> 
> I'm going to try it.. I'm just going to look up the effects if used on sore and broken skin xx


Thanks. I just thought of googling Kathleen Dudley effective non poisonous flea control and found stuff by her straight away.


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## lady_r0gue (Jul 22, 2009)

Ooh yh I just found this - Powered by Google Docs

It doesn't mention using the earth directly on the animals but she does give both the earth and the nematodes props for use outside.

I phoned my vet and the receptionist doesn't knoiw anything about it, I'm gonna push on with this I think and see if it works. (I've found that the probs with the dust getting into the lungs can apparently be sorted by putting it in water and spraying it on... and I've got him on a wheat free diet and I'm going to up his amount of BARF days per week and start putting garlic in his diet again at the same time... I'll keep you posted on the results


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## Lulu's owner (May 1, 2009)

lady_r0gue said:


> Ooh yh I just found this - Powered by Google Docs
> 
> It doesn't mention using the earth directly on the animals but she does give both the earth and the nematodes props for use outside.
> 
> I phoned my vet and the receptionist doesn't knoiw anything about it, I'm gonna push on with this I think and see if it works. (I've found that the probs with the dust getting into the lungs can apparently be sorted by putting it in water and spraying it on... and I've got him on a wheat free diet and I'm going to up his amount of BARF days per week and start putting garlic in his diet again at the same time... I'll keep you posted on the results


That link is interesting. I never thought about keeping the grass mowed really short, must start doing it. I've always suspected that my two cats who died of oral cancer were killed by flea stuff, they were always licking just after I'd applied it.


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## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

moboyd said:


> I use garlic for my dogs always have, and they have never had fleas, whether this is because I am just lucky I dont know, the only thing is, garlic is no good for ticks. I give them a garlic and brewers yeast tab each day.
> 
> Mo


For ticks you can use DynaMite spray based on essential oils. I've got some but not tried it yet.
Just thought, no ticks either since using Billy No-mates.


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## gwen/jess (Mar 18, 2011)

hi,well im fed up.ihate using chemicals on my dogs, but none of the "natural"things work,ive spent loads on various things,billy no mates deffo didnt work,one of my dogs scratches and nibbles at herself all the time,id consider allergies,but ive been bitten,so i presume ive just not noticed the fleas-i havent seen one on any of my dogs!really fed up,i spray the house with acclaim,and treated dogs with fipronil with exactly the same results-scratching!now trying brewers yeast tablets which"repel"fleas-but where are they repelled to?exactly,your carpet,to breed.sob


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## Jackien4 (May 16, 2015)

Like any medication on humans or dogs they can have side effects. I used advocate on my dog for years and he didn't seem to have any bad reaction to it . Sometimes when it was first put on he would scratch for a few days. But he never had fleas . Think the benifits out way the risks.


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## Ceiling Kitty (Mar 7, 2010)

gwen/jess said:


> hi,well im fed up.ihate using chemicals on my dogs, but none of the "natural"things work,ive spent loads on various things,billy no mates deffo didnt work,one of my dogs scratches and nibbles at herself all the time,id consider allergies,but ive been bitten,so i presume ive just not noticed the fleas-i havent seen one on any of my dogs!really fed up,i spray the house with acclaim,and treated dogs with fipronil with exactly the same results-scratching!now trying brewers yeast tablets which"repel"fleas-but where are they repelled to?exactly,your carpet,to breed.sob


Advantage.


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## gwen/jess (Mar 18, 2011)

just got some advocate,fingers crossed x


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