# Puppies Due 19th July



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Hi, i have a staffordshire bull terrier, not kc registered but rescued form a friends neighbour. 
When i got her i was told she had been spayed/neutered, so when she came into heat i was quite shocked.
I kept her inside throughout it and 10 days after i thought it had finished, however this wasn't long enough and she mated with another staffordshire.
Looking through this forum has been a great help in getting everything ready for the pups arrival and i think i have everything sorted.
The problem is i wont be able to get much time off of work to look after the pups in there first few weeks.
I'm going back to live at my mums for the birth and weaning procees and this will mean there will be somebody there alot more of the time but not always.
Is there any precautions i can take to try and limit dangers to mum and the pups when they will be on there own. it will brobally be a maximum of 3-4 hours they might be on there own.
i know i should of been more careful with her and she should not of been able to get into a situation where she could breed, but it has happened now and i just want to try and make ssure everything will be ok.
Thanks in advance.


----------



## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

hi welcome. how do you know for sure it was a staffy that mated her?


----------



## Guest (Jul 2, 2010)

dexter said:


> hi welcome. how do you know for sure it was a staffy that mated her?


Ditto.............could it be possible that she mated with a larger dog?


----------



## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

.....................


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

i new the dog we was at the park with, a soon as they stopped being "joined together", i took her home and she didnt go out for another 3 weeks. tokk her to the vet a few weeks later and she was pregnant. it the only dog it could be

Sorry for a long time to reply, i'm at work and don't get alot of time to check the internet


----------



## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

Why were you walking an in season bitch in public? Why didn't you get a mismate  
That's all rescue needs is yet another 'accidental' litter of staffies.


----------



## Sam1309 (May 18, 2010)

he clearly stated he believed her season to be over. some people are not aware how long a season can last esp if never owning a bitch before!!

he's came here to ask for help and support mentioned nothing about putting the puppies into a shelter........

he could have alwasy just abandoned the dog, people on here can be to quick to judge and put people down.


----------



## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

bigmick474 said:


> Is there any precautions i can take to try and limit dangers to mum and the pups when they will be on there own. it will brobally be a maximum of 3-4 hours they might be on there own.


Yes - taken her to the vets when you realised she had tied with a dog  and all this could have been prevented.

I can't advise you on leaving the pups I'm afraid, as in three litters, mine have been left once for four hours when they were about 6 weeks old - and then 'my dog lady' did an extra shift inbetween to feed and clean them.

Hopefully someone will be able to give you more advice on this - but personally, I wouldn't be leaving them at all until they are at least three weeks old - and no, I don't have the luxury of being able to be with them 24x7 - but I make sure someone is.

I suggest you invest in "The Book of the Bitch" by JM Evans and Kay White - quickly and READ it

Book of the Bitch: Amazon.co.uk: J.M. Evans, Kay White: Books


----------



## luvmydogs (Dec 30, 2009)

There's not much you can do to limit the damgers apart from make sure the whelping box has a pig rail. It all depends on the bitch as to how she copes. I've had bitches who need no help and actually do better alone, and bitches who need you there 24/7.


----------



## Lucy1012 (May 23, 2010)

Sam1309 said:


> he clearly stated he believed her season to be over. some people are not aware how long a season can last esp if never owning a bitch before!!
> 
> he's came here to ask for help and support mentioned nothing about putting the puppies into a shelter........
> 
> he could have alwasy just abandoned the dog, people on here can be to quick to judge and put people down.


Glad you posted that as I was just thinking the same, but too guttless to post it.

as for the mis-mate jab, until i started researching breeding i didn't know such a thing existed and there is a possibility that the vet did not offer it.

I am pretty thick skinned so peoples negative comments towards anything i do would not deter me from staying on this forum and seeking needed advice. But I am surprised that from some of the 'witch hunts' i read, that any new members stick about.

You may have strong views about staffies, rescue dogs and accidental litters, but that give you no right to be so blatantly rude to someone asking for advice. At least they are asking for help, rather than just winging it. Got to give them some credit for that.


----------



## bucksmum (Jul 19, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> Hi, i have a staffordshire bull terrier, not kc registered but rescued form a friends neighbour.
> When i got her i was told she had been spayed/neutered, so when she came into heat i was quite shocked.
> I kept her inside throughout it and 10 days after i thought it had finished, however this wasn't long enough and she mated with another staffordshire.
> Looking through this forum has been a great help in getting everything ready for the pups arrival and i think i have everything sorted.
> ...


The main dangers in the early days are pups getting chilled and crushed.
Try to rig up a heat lamp or get a heated pad to fit under the bedding.Vet bed is a good choice of bedding.

Try to fit some rails around the edge of the whelping box to avoid mum crushing pups against the sides of the box and if you can sleep with her and pups for at least the first week as this will get them through the most dangerous time for being crushed.

I expect you've already got it but 'The book of the bitch' by White and Evans 
will help you alot.

Good on you for rescuing her and hope she has a trouble free whelping.


----------



## rocco33 (Dec 27, 2009)

> he clearly stated he believed her season to be over. some people are not aware how long a season can last esp if never owning a bitch before!!
> 
> he's came here to ask for help and support mentioned nothing about putting the puppies into a shelter........


He waited 5 weeks before taking her to the vet after witnessing the mating !
The responsible thing would have been to take her to the vet after it happened, not wait 5 weeks!



> he could have alwasy just abandoned the dog, people on here can be to quick to judge and put people down.


I think it's just a case of getting jaded by how much irresponsible breeding and pet ownership goes on. I think I've been on this forum too long.


----------



## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

Lucy1012 said:


> You may have strong views about staffies, rescue dogs and accidental litters, but that give you no right to be so blatantly rude to someone asking for advice. At least they are asking for help, rather than just winging it. Got to give them some credit for that.


So - if you bought / rescued a bitch who was thought to be neutered and she started bleeding, you would just accept it would you?

You wouldn't think to go to the vets in case there was something wrong?

If you subsequently then found your bitch attached to a dog in the park, you would take her home and not leave her out for another 3 weeks and not go to the vets for a further two?

It's easy to stand at the sidelines and criticise others for being negative - it's not just staffies - my response would be the same whether it was Labs, Chis, Papillons, Wolfhounds - ANY BREED.

You don't need to know about the mismate jab to realise that it might be a good idea to take your dog to a vet immediately if

a) she starts bleeding when she's supposed to be neutered
b) you find her back end attached to the rear end of another dog in your local park.

==============================

I've been here a short time, and I am just despairing - because, in the majority of cases, when these things happen - people are brazen and blase about it - and there's nothing to be brazen or blase about - if some people were a little more humble about it, then maybe some would be a bit more sympathetic.

Every time I take a dog for a health test, a mate, for the 9 weeks a bitch is pregnant, during whelping, and the 8 weeks the puppies are there - my whole mind is focussed on that bitch and the effect it is having on her - my primary concern being for her health and well being, and once the babies are here, their long term wellbeing.

It makes you wonder why the hell we bother TBH - let's just let everyone get on with it and be over-run with unregistered unhealth tested dogs of god knows what breed - I am sure life would be much easier 

If these threads make just ONE person think twice, then they will have achieved something - because I really do despair


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

rocco33 said:


> Why were you walking an in season bitch in public? Why didn't you get a mismate
> That's all rescue needs is yet another 'accidental' litter of staffies.


I've found homes for the puppies when they come so they wont be going to a shelter. maybe i was wrong taking her out early but she's the first dog I've owned since being a child. all I'm trying to do is care for her and her pups, but people like you put me off asking advice and could put a lot of other people off too. 
You make it wrong to ask questions, and if you can't ask questions, you can't learn.
Retrospect's a great thing but on this occasion, I cant have it.

Thanks sam1309, luvmydogs and lucy1012.


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

rocco33 said:


> He waited 5 weeks before taking her to the vet after witnessing the mating !
> The responsible thing would have been to take her to the vet after it happened, not wait 5 weeks!
> 
> I think it's just a case of getting jaded by how much irresponsible breeding and pet ownership goes on. I think I've been on this forum too long.


i took her to the vet 2 weeks after but he couldnt tell me if she was pregnant without a blood test and said it woul be better to come back a few weeks after because it would be cheaper as i dont earn a lot of money. as soon as the tie happened i started looking for owners for the pups and now have 12 people who want, and will care for them. (not that she'll have 12 pups, but better too have too many than too few)


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

bucksmum said:


> The main dangers in the early days are pups getting chilled and crushed.
> Try to rig up a heat lamp or get a heated pad to fit under the bedding.Vet bed is a good choice of bedding.
> 
> Try to fit some rails around the edge of the whelping box to avoid mum crushing pups against the sides of the box and if you can sleep with her and pups for at least the first week as this will get them through the most dangerous time for being crushed.
> ...


Thanks. Ive got the "pig rails" and a heat mat, and i will be sleeping next to her/them. i ordered the book on tuesday so hopefully it will be here tomorrow and then i can read it and learn from that too.
Its nice to have a answer which tells me what i can do, rather than what i should have done.
Thanks again


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

swarthy said:


> So - if you bought / rescued a bitch who was thought to be neutered and she started bleeding, you would just accept it would you?
> 
> You wouldn't think to go to the vets in case there was something wrong?
> 
> ...


i took her to the vet, thats how i knew she was on heat.
i took her to the vet not long after the tie
i'm trying my best to care fir the well being of mum and pups.
i was naive in not knowing when to take her out, but am doing every thing i can now to try and look after all of them.

All the negative comments make me wish i never asked and just went about it alone, hope for the best, and see what happens.
I ask for advice and get treated like a irresponsible breeder. it was a MISTAKE but im trying to do the best by it now and thought this would be a good place to ask advice.
obviously I was wrong.


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

before anyone mentions the fact i dont earn eonough money to have pups, since the tie ive been saving and now have a few quid to look after them. i also have a few friend i can borrow off of if needed


----------



## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

bigmick474 said:


> i took her to the vet, thats how i knew she was on heat.
> i took her to the vet not long after the tie
> i'm trying my best to care fir the well being of mum and pups.
> i was naive in not knowing when to take her out, but am doing every thing i can now to try and look after all of them.
> ...


Look - you WILL get the advice you need from a few members on here, but unfortunately, if you look around the forums, and the rescues, you will see why people get frustrated.

Believe me, if you went on a breed specific forum, you would think even the criticism on here is gentle.

------------------------------

If you went to the vets who confirmed she was in season



Did you not think to ask how long a season lasts?

If the vet knew there was a tie of an in season bitch at her most fertile, which she would have been at the time, particularly if the bleeding has stopped - did he not suggest an anti-mate injection or emergency neutering to stop any pregnancy?

 I've just seen one of your other posts - I am speechless your vet told you to come back because it was too early to confirm pregnancy - didn't he tell you ALL this could be stopped? Yes, sometimes bitches experience unpleasant side effects from these jabs, but nothing compared to the risks and side effects of having a litter.

------------------------------------------

It's not about whether you have got enough money - to my mind, there IS a concern about time, but maybe some other breeders will disagree - maybe I err on the side of caution.

------------------------------------------

You've been advised to get "the Book of the Bitch - I included a link in my first post on here.

Try thinking about it from another angle for a minute. Your depth of knowledge about bitches and seasons is lacking - you now have to be able to, amongst many other things,


recognise the signs of a bitch going into labour

when she might be in danger

when to get veterinary intervention

how to feed a bitch weaning a litter

when the pups are not thriving

how to know a pup if a pup going to die

what signs of infection there might be

how to find homes for what could be anything from 1 to 12 or so puppies

The simple facts are


Your bitch could quite easily die

The pups could die

You could be left with a litter of pups needing homes at 12 weeks +++ - even in my own breed, the most popular in the UK and the world - responsible breeders sometimes have pups unsold at 12 weeks +

================

Assuming the mating was unavoidable, all the above which will undoubtedly cause heartache to you and your family, could have been avoided if your vet had been responsible from the outset - and if, as you indicate, you did go to the vets on each occasion, and none of the above was told to you, then my last post of despair simply doesn't cover it 

I do hope your bitch and puppies are safe, basically because I am a softie at the end of the day who doesn't like to see any animal suffer - but I do fear for the long term future of the pups.

Once your girl has had her pups, PLEASE get her neutered.

I am sure you will get the support you need - but if you are adult enough to stand up to the responsibilities you now face, then please also recognise that there is going to be an element of criticism which is borne totally out of exasperation that this situation continues to happen week in, week out - and ultimately, it is the dogs and their offspring that suffer the most.


----------



## Guest (Jul 3, 2010)

you shouldnt leave the mother alone with the pups for at least the 1st 4 weeks, if you cant watch them yourself you will have to get someone to come in and sit with them bitches can be clumsy and easily crush puppies by lying on them or she may not even be very maternal, also in the run up to her having the pups you shouldnt leave the bitch alone incase she goes into whelp you have to be their she shouldnt be left to whelp alone, please be aware complications are quite common and the cost of a ceasarian is extemely expensive if there is time i would advise you take her for the mis mate jab and book her in to be spayed.


----------



## Guest (Jul 3, 2010)

Shamen said:


> if there is time i would advise you take her for the mis mate jab and book her in to be spayed.


It is too late for the mismate shamus!


----------



## Guest (Jul 3, 2010)

DoubleTrouble said:


> It is too late for the mismate shamus!


oh dear:frown:


----------



## Lucy1012 (May 23, 2010)

swarthy said:


> So - if you bought / rescued a bitch who was thought to be neutered and she started bleeding, you would just accept it would you?
> 
> You wouldn't think to go to the vets in case there was something wrong?
> 
> ...


I am not criticising your negative views, I actually share some of them, it's the way they are put them across that gets me. The sheer rudeness. Every accidental, cross bred litter that gets mentioned on this site people are jumped on and torn to shreads. What I or you or any other breeder on here would do is not important this guy needs help and advice and surely he should get it, how does making him feel bad and irresponsible help when his bitch is 11 days off her due date.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

OP I am glad you have sought advice. Read as much as you can and prepare yourself for every eventuality. There is a good list on here somewhere about supplies you may need, (maybe someone will be kind enough to point you in the right direction to find that)

I too suggest that you arrange for someone to be with the pups when you can't. We have started to leave ours a little now and they are 6 weeks old. I come home to find the puppy room filthy and water bowls knocked over within 2 hours (this is longest they are alone) In his heat especially it would also be a good idea to have someone around to open windows, turn on fans etc.

I truly hope it all goes well for you, and well done for seeking advice and finding them homes. I wish you the best of luck. What's done is done and all you can do now is deal with it. Then get her spayed ;-)


----------



## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

Lucy1012 said:


> I am not criticising your negative views, I actually share some of them, it's the way they are put them across that gets me. The sheer rudeness. Every accidental, cross bred litter that gets mentioned on this site people are jumped on and torn to shreads. What I or you or any other breeder on here would do is not important this guy needs help and advice and surely he should get it, how does making him feel bad and irresponsible help when his bitch is 11 days off her due date.


Firstly, I am FAR from the only one who criticised - and if what the owner says about the vet is true, my opinions are not rude, they are unprintable


----------



## Sleeping_Lion (Mar 19, 2009)

BigMick, unfortunately a lot of people post through ignorance about breeding, and don't realise just what danger they put a bitch and pups in, simply by having a litter in the first place. Some are even worse, and an *oops* litter turns out to be a planned one simply for the cash, and people posting trying to pull the wool over members eyes to get the advice they need. With rescue organisations putting dogs to sleep every hour because they are overwhelmed, you can see how the subject of breeding is emotive, particularly with a breed such as a staffy, because they are one of the most abused breeds unfortunately. Your first post had scant information, and since then you've added more info about vet trips etc, it's a shame your vet didn't tell you about the mismate when you took your bitch in, please do not rely on your vet for advice about whelping as they are not, in most cases, very knowledgeable about these things. Take the advice you can get from experienced folk on here, and if you can take the criticism about having an accidental litter, then you're a better person than many who come on here. 

As for being rude, I haven't seen one post I'd count as rude, perhaps I hang around on forums too much but no-one has been personally critical, just critical of yet another accidental litter through ignorance - and I use that word not to describe someone as being stupid, but not having the knowledge they needed to prevent this from happening in the first place (just in case anyone thinks I'm being rude). 

As swarthy put, if threads like these stop just one accidental litter from happening in the future, all the better. If we lose valuable members who have experience and knowledge from a forum, just for being honest, then the forum is diminished imo. I say keep up the honest, but fair comments!!


----------



## Lucy1012 (May 23, 2010)

swarthy said:


> Firstly, I am FAR from the only one who criticised - and if what the owner says about the vet is true, my opinions are not rude, they are unprintable


and I wasn't singling you out... it was just a genralisation.. and I am the first to admit that maybe I am too trusting in people. Maybe we will have to agree to disagree... 

But I do sometimes feel as though 'we' are all very quick to judge on here at times. Sadly accidental and irresposible breeding is something that happens and always will. I have made mistakes with my first litter and learnt from them. So hopefully other will have the same experience. I have definitely learnt it is not for the faint hearted. lol


----------



## Guest (Jul 3, 2010)

Lucy1012 said:


> and I wasn't singling you out... it was just a genralisation.. and I am the first to admit that maybe I am too trusting in people. Maybe we will have to agree to disagree...
> 
> But I do sometimes feel as though 'we' are all very quick to judge on here at times. Sadly accidental and irresposible breeding is something that happens and always will. I have made mistakes with my first litter and learnt from them. So hopefully other will have the same experience. I have definitely learnt it is not for the faint hearted. lol


I have to say that by quoting Swarthy's post it did look to me as though you were singling them out aswell.

and im afraid im with others on this thread who are totally despairing at all these threads about accidental and irresponsible matings its depressing, but ive not seen any rudeness on this particular thread just some people giving it straight!


----------



## Lucy1012 (May 23, 2010)

hahahhaha you have got to be kidding... If you read back she quoted my post and commented, so I replied. 

Just goes to show maybe it is all in the way the posts are perceived and not written, and I say what I have read was rude whether intended or not. This is me telling it straight.


----------



## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

Can there be less bickering between members over what people can and can not say/post, and more help for the op please.


----------



## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

Lucy1012 said:


> and I wasn't singling you out... it was just a genralisation.. and I am the first to admit that maybe I am too trusting in people. Maybe we will have to agree to disagree...


Maybe I've just be around the forums too long 



Lucy1012 said:


> But I do sometimes feel as though 'we' are all very quick to judge on here at times. Sadly accidental and irresposible breeding is something that happens and always will. I have made mistakes with my first litter and learnt from them. So hopefully other will have the same experience. I have definitely learnt it is not for the faint hearted. lol


I've said on a number of threads that when it comes to accidental matings, as someone who keeps entire dogs and bitches under the same roof, I always say "there but for the grace of god".

I can MAYBE understand someone believing that when a bitch has finished bleeding she has finished her season - and for my girls, this would be spot on - as they bleed right through - but it's not for a lot, who stop bleeding when they are actually at their most fertile.

I can maybe understand a slipped mating happening in the park between a dog and bitch that goes un-noticed.

Having had a bitch have such a severe phantom which 'appeared' and made me convinced my boy had got to her - even though I knew he hadn't - I can even understand a pregnancy not being recognised until the very last minute (and I know for a fact this has happened both ways to highly experienced breeders)

What I CANNOT understand however, is that - take for example, the OP on this thread, he was asked why he didn't go to the vet when the season occurred and after the mating - it now appears apparently he did.

So - in my own mind now, if the vet didn't strongly recommend the alternatives to proceeding with an unwanted litter - if he didn't - to my mind he is a disgrace to his profession and has done the OP, staffies and the wider dog world a dis-service.

I am not heart and flowers, I never have been and I am not going to start now - I'm also not perfect by any stretch of the imagination - and neither is anyone else - everyone has their faults.

What I do care passionately about however is the number of unwanted puppies being born and often dumped, drowned, shifted from home to home until they end up with behavioural difficulties that make them unsuitable for ownership and then PTS - what sort of life is that?

What I also care about is dogs who develop early bad health conditions as a result of indiscriminate breeding - which MIGHT have been prevented if responsible steps had been taken at the outset. I care about the heartache it brings to families, the discomfort for the dog - and the impact it has on things such as insurance cover for each and every responsible dog owner out there.

Ultimately, what is going to happen is dog insurance will become unaffordable - the number of people buying puppies will not fall - but the number of people giving them up will - adding more pressure to rescues etc

Someone, somewhere HAS to take action and quickly - because from where I am sitting, the situation is getting worse - and that applies not only to BYB and PF - but people in these situations.

The alternative is we will end up like some American states where it is an offense to own and entire dog or bitch without a license - which would then penalise those responsible pet owners who do everything by the book when breeding their bitch - and would actually serve to make PF and BYB even more appealing to those trying to find a puppy - vicious circles spring to mind 

===================================


----------



## bucksmum (Jul 19, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> i took her to the vet, thats how i knew she was on heat.
> i took her to the vet not long after the tie
> i'm trying my best to care fir the well being of mum and pups.
> i was naive in not knowing when to take her out, but am doing every thing i can now to try and look after all of them.
> ...


Please don't dissapear bigmick.

You are obviously trying to deal with the situation in the best way possible now and i don't see the point in going over and over what 'should' have been done.

Having read through it sounds like your vet should have explained to you how long seasons last and her most 'dangerous' time and also maybe discussed the mismate jab with you but didn't so leaving you in this position.

She is so close now to her due date that surely the best thing we all can do is pull together and offer all the help we can leading up to,during and after the whelping


----------



## Sam1309 (May 18, 2010)

how is the mum to be coping today then????


----------



## Horse and Hound (May 12, 2010)

bucksmum said:


> Please don't dissapear bigmick.
> 
> You are obviously trying to deal with the situation in the best way possible now and i don't see the point in going over and over what 'should' have been done.
> 
> ...


Agreed! Sounds like you got some really crap advice from a vet bigmick. So I'd change the vet and go to a different one once the pups have been born.

I wouldn't have a clue what to do but good on you for sticking by your dog and good luck with the pups. Hope it all goes well and let us know how you go on!


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Thanks. I've changed vets and took her for a check up yesterday. everything seems fine with her and the pups.
I spoke to the vet and he told me he has had a few people come to him after being given the wrong/bad info from my last vet.
He's told me he will come and check on stella and the pups at my mums house once the are born for the cost of a normal check-up, no call out/home visit fee, as he understands the problems i have and my mums is less than a mile from his practice.
I probably should have done some research and asked people about finding a vet before i joined the one closest to my flat, as after asking a few people, ive not heard alot of good things about my local vet, but have heard nothing but good things about the new one


----------



## bucksmum (Jul 19, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> Thanks. I've changed vets and took her for a check up yesterday. everything seems fine with her and the pups.
> I spoke to the vet and he told me he has had a few people come to him after being given the wrong/bad info from my last vet.
> He's told me he will come and check on stella and the pups at my mums house once the are born for the cost of a normal check-up, no call out/home visit fee, as he understands the problems i have and i live less than a mile from his practice.
> I probably should have done some research and asked people about finding a vet before i joined the one closest to my flat, as after asking a few people, ive not heard alot of good things about my local vet, but have heard nothing but good things about the new one


Hi,nice to see you back 

Glad to hear Stella is doing well and that you've found a more helpful vet.

Won't be long now and i really wish you all the best


----------



## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

bigmick474 said:


> Thanks. I've changed vets and took her for a check up yesterday. everything seems fine with her and the pups.
> I spoke to the vet and he told me he has had a few people come to him after being given the wrong/bad info from my last vet.
> He's told me he will come and check on stella and the pups at my mums house once the are born for the cost of a normal check-up, no call out/home visit fee, as he understands the problems i have and my mums is less than a mile from his practice.
> I probably should have done some research and asked people about finding a vet before i joined the one closest to my flat, as after asking a few people, ive not heard alot of good things about my local vet, but have heard nothing but good things about the new one


 it really does sound like you had a bum deal with the vet you chose - unfortunately, none of us know how good they are until we use them - it does sound like he needs considerable re-educating in some areas  I know most vets are not up on breeding and pregnancy - but he takes the biscuit 

Glad you have now got a vet who can help you.

Don't forget to buy "The Book of the Bitch" by J M Evans and Kay White if you haven't done so already - it's the breeder bible.

Book of the Bitch: Amazon.co.uk: J.M. Evans, Kay White: Books


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

It arrived yesterday. I'm frantically reading it so I know what to look out for and what to expect


----------



## Sleeping_Lion (Mar 19, 2009)

Glad to see you're back, the best advice you will get is off experienced breeders. Having had a couple of vets who have been a lot less than acceptable, I can empathise.


----------



## Lex (Jun 11, 2010)

bigmick474 said:


> It arrived yesterday. I'm frantically reading it so I know what to look out for and what to expect


Book of the bitch was very helpful for the first time for me and my Staff ,would recommend it to anyone. Unfortunately it didnt cover much on the unlikely event of hand rearing but from conception to whelping and onwards it was top.

Good luck with the pups ect. Hope it all goes well!


----------



## slbrown2108 (Sep 15, 2009)

hey sorry for what u are going through from certain forum members. i can see where they are coming from but u cant change what happened to your dog. all i can say is good luck for the upcoming delivery of puppies and hope everything goes according to plan. Here is a list of certain things u will need in order to make the whelping easier.


newspapers for when the bitch's waters break
blankets to wrap puppies in and help stimulate breathing by rubbing them
thermometer to check the bitch's temperature. it will drop slightly before labour happens
scissors incase u need to cut the umbilical cord if the mother doesnt. be careful u need to clamp the blood supply first a few centimeters from the belly button of the pups.
a heat lamp to keep pups warm
the vets phone number incase anything goes wrong.
feeding bottles and formula puppy milk incase the bitch rejects pups i think its called lactol u can buy it from pets at home
the bitch can be fed glucose or ice cream but nothin else during the whelping i could be wrong



You should have also been worming the bitch from day 42 in order to prevent any worms she may have ingested passing over the placenta and into the pups. the farmer i got my pup from didnt do this and my pup was very ill and near deaths door when i got her. She also needs to be wormed until two days after the birth aswell.

Make sure u record the weight of each puppy from birth and everyday there after to make sure they are putting on weight. This is vital to no incase any puppies are ill.


Check that the pups are not born with a cleft palate ( this is when the roof of the mouth does not fuse together and when the pups suckle the milk will run down their nose) its not fair for pups to suffer with this condition and generally it is kinder to put them to sleep asap. 


I think i have mentioned everything. I am not a dog breeder and have never had any pups to deal with but this is all what i was taught as part of my college course. 

So please do ur best for the bitch and pups which im sure u will and please keep us updated of her progress. Good luck and all the best xx


----------



## slbrown2108 (Sep 15, 2009)

oooo and another thing make sure ur bitch is being fed a puppy diet NOW as this will give her all the nutrients and minerals she will need for the developing puppies xx


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

slbrown2108 said:


> hey sorry for what u are going through from certain forum members. i can see where they are coming from but u cant change what happened to your dog. all i can say is good luck for the upcoming delivery of puppies and hope everything goes according to plan. Here is a list of certain things u will need in order to make the whelping easier.
> 
> newspapers for when the bitch's waters break
> blankets to wrap puppies in and help stimulate breathing by rubbing them
> ...


Thanks. I have everything except for the puppy milk formula. i will get that Friday when I get paid.
I have a heat mat instead if a lamp too.
She has been wormed and has been eating puppy food for the last 4 days. I've ordered a 15kg bag of puppy food too which hopefully will arrive today and see her through most of the whelping/weaning process.


----------



## slbrown2108 (Sep 15, 2009)

thats great well hopefully everything goes well. If u need any more help feel free to pm me


----------



## Sam1309 (May 18, 2010)

glad to see your on top of it, Stella can be proud and happy to knwo she is in safe hands. One lucky pup


----------



## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

I have to say I admire you for coming back - rep coming your way for that  and yes, I know I was one of your biggest critics when you first posted.

I cannot change my principles to view what has happened as a good thing - however, I really do think from what you say, you have been short changed by professionals that should know better 



bigmick474 said:


> She has been wormed and has been eating puppy food for the last 4 days. I've ordered a 15kg bag of puppy food too which hopefully will arrive today and see her through most of the whelping/weaning process.


I don't know how much Staffies eat / increased volume they require when feeding, but it is important you don't short change her on this.

I don't know what food you are using, or whether the dog food companies sign up owners of unregistered bitches for breeders schemes - however, if money is tight, this is worth looking at - as some schemes give free food while others offer heavily discounted supplies through local outlets / or will deliver to your door - and some also offer discounted vouchers to the new puppy owners and even give you food for them to take home.

For the first couple of weeks, I always supplement my girls diet with fresh meat / fish / eggs etc - again, if money is tight, you could speak to the butchers about meat offcuts etc. and Sainsburys basics for products like tuna fish are fine (not in brine though )

When weaning, we were giving rice pudding to my last litter as one of their meals - on top of evertything else, it nearly bankrupted us - so we ended up going 50/50 Sainsburys basics and a much better quality product.

=============================

I hope everything goes smoothly for you - and that mum and the babies come through safely


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

swarthy said:


> I have to say I admire you for coming back - rep coming your way for that  and yes, I know I was one of your biggest critics when you first posted.
> 
> I cannot change my principles to view what has happened as a good thing - however, I really do think from what you say, you have been short changed by professionals that should know better
> 
> ...


she has jame's wellbeloved normally, and is now eating james wellbeloved puppy food (£50 for 15kg, thats why i'm skint atm). Meat i can get alot of as i work in a pub kitchen. (mainly steaks, but the odd lamb sholder or chop aswell) whatever she needs i will get, weather ive got to beg, borrow or steal, she's my baby girl and i'll do anything for her


----------



## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

bigmick474 said:


> she has jame's wellbeloved normally, and is now eating james wellbeloved puppy food (£50 for 15kg, thats why i'm skint atm). Meat i can get alot of as i work in a pub kitchen. (mainly steaks, but the odd lamb sholder or chop aswell) whatever she needs i will get, weather ive got to beg, borrow or steal, she's my baby girl and i'll do anything for her


It might be worth contacting JWB and seeing if they do any type of scheme for breeders that you can sign up to - it will save quite a chunk on the cost of food - failing that - look around for offers online - you can save quite a bit


----------



## bucksmum (Jul 19, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> she has jame's wellbeloved normally, and is now eating james wellbeloved puppy food (£50 for 15kg, thats why i'm skint atm). Meat i can get alot of as i work in a pub kitchen. (mainly steaks, but the odd lamb sholder or chop aswell) whatever she needs i will get, weather ive got to beg, borrow or steal, she's my baby girl and i'll do anything for her


Hello Bigmick,

Good to hear from you again  Not long to go now.

She's going to be one happy girl with the diet you've got lined up for her 

I'm sure you already know this but if you give her any meat on the bone make sure it is raw,never give her cooked bones,sorry i'm sure you've already thought of that


----------



## Horse and Hound (May 12, 2010)

One week left to go!

I hope you post loads of updates and photos for us!


----------



## tiddlypup (Oct 4, 2008)

id buy goats milk,you can get it from most supermarkets near the carton longlife stuff,soak puppy food,add the milk,far better than any dairy or weetabix etc
cool if she had them on the 17th,not that its my birthday or anything


----------



## RockRomantic (Apr 29, 2009)

not long to go! just wanted to wish you good luck and i hope you keep us updated


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Thanks. I've never given her any cooked bones, my local butcher saves bones for me so she has a 1 or 2 (depending on the size) a week as a treat.

I'll get some goats milk this week, and get more every week so i'll have a lot of it.
I'll try and get her to give birth on the 17th, just so you can share a birthday with them. I dont think i have much choice on the day though, lol

She just sleeps a lot at the moment. I take her out as often as i can, but she'll only walk for 10-15 minutes at a time.

I'm taking her temperature twice a day since yesterday, day 56, as it says in the book of the bitch, so hopefully i'll have a bit of notice before she goes onto labour.


----------



## celicababe1986 (Jun 22, 2009)

good luck with Stella!! would love to see some piccies of her !


----------



## bucksmum (Jul 19, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> Thanks. I've never given her any cooked bones, my local butcher saves bones for me so she has a 1 or 2 (depending on the size) a week as a treat.
> 
> I'll get some goats milk this week, and get more every week so i'll have a lot of it.
> I'll try and get her to give birth on the 17th, just so you can share a birthday with them. I dont think i have much choice on the day though, lol
> ...


Hi Bigmick,

Thanks for updating us  sounds like Stella's in good hands with you


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

any one got any ideas on how i can take her temperature easier? i've only been doing it a few days, but she seems to know when i want to take it so runs away and hides. i dont really blame her in fairness, but ive got to take it.
All i'm doing atm is tempting her into a room with a dog biscuit, closing the door and struggling for a few minutes to take it. Then she gets the treat, but the panic she show's when she see's the thermometer cant be good for her and the pups.


----------



## mitch4 (Oct 31, 2009)

Hi there good luck with the pups

If shes getting that stressed over her temp being taken it may be best to leave it, if shes due on the 19th, your taking it too early unless you are seeing other signs of possible labour starting


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

mitch4 said:


> Hi there good luck with the pups
> 
> If shes getting that stressed over her temp being taken it may be best to leave it, if shes due on the 19th, your taking it too early unless you are seeing other signs of possible labour starting


Thanks,
The 19th is 63 days, but in the book of the bitch, it says to take her temperature twice a day form day 56 as they can come early or late.
I dont want her to go into labour and be stuck at work so i was hoping that by taking her temperature i would have a bit of notice.


----------



## vizzy24 (Aug 31, 2008)

Hi Good luck with the pups, the best thing is to keep persisting with the temperature, try and take it when you are both calm (easier said than done) maybe ask someone to hold her and give her treats whilst you are doing it, she will eventually get used to it and probably wont bat a eye lid in a few days. The temp drop is by far the best way to predict imminent labour. Have you got any pics of her and her expanding belly?:thumbup:


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Her temperature dropped from between 37.2-37.7°C to 36.8°C for 2 readings.
Is this the drop?? She was sick last night at about 11 and has been digging/nesting since, unfortunately she's not doing this in her whelping box, but wants to do it on the sofas or beds.
I was up all last night with her but nothing else happened.
She's still eating and doesn't seem too restless, she was still keen to go for a walk this morning but went to sleep as soon as we got back.
Thanks

Edit: 1 more thing, at work we use a spray sanitiser. It's totally food safe and human safe, would i be able to use this to clean the whelping box or am i better staying with a bleach/water solution?
Thanks, again


----------



## Sleeping_Lion (Mar 19, 2009)

From what I've read about breeding, this is a sign that it's imminent, but she could well keep you guessing for a while yet. Try not to worry, someone more experienced will be along to help you soon, I'm sure


----------



## deb53 (Jun 4, 2009)

Sounds like she could be on her way.....but this can certainly go on for a good while. Some bitches for a couple of days.

At this stage she certainly shouldn't be left at all. Regarding the sickness, most bitches do this and a little and often is best.

You don't want to stress her with the temp taking but just soothe her and make sure thermometer is well lubricated.

Good luck and keep us all updated wont you.

xxx


----------



## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> Her temperature dropped from between 37.2-37.7°C to 36.8°C for 2 readings.
> Is this the drop?? She was sick last night at about 11 and has been digging/nesting since, unfortunately she's not doing this in her whelping box, but wants to do it on the sofas or beds.
> I was up all last night with her but nothing else happened.
> She's still eating and doesn't seem too restless, she was still keen to go for a walk this morning but went to sleep as soon as we got back.
> ...


Oooh excellent, sounds like things are on the move.


----------



## celicababe1986 (Jun 22, 2009)

Good luck :thumbup:


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Thanks. I've taken today off of work and for the next few weeks there will be somebody at the house all the time. 
Since ive got the new, quick thermometer, she doesn't seem too mind it quite as much. Still not loving it but she knows it only takes a few seconds.

I'll try and get a camera so i can upload some pics. The problem is going back to my flat to pick it up when Stella's here, I don't want to leave her when I don't have to.


----------



## Lucy1012 (May 23, 2010)

has she settled in her whelping box yet?? I have a dog called Stella... 

It may help her for you to sit in there with her, if she will allow it. Maisie was much more comfortable in the box once I sat with her a calmed her down. 

Hope this stage doesn't last too long for you both, it was about 14 hours with Maisie's litter. Good luck....


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Lucy1012 said:


> has she settled in her whelping box yet?? I have a dog called Stella...
> 
> It may help her for you to sit in there with her, if she will allow it. Maisie was much more comfortable in the box once I sat with her a calmed her down.
> 
> Hope this stage doesn't last too long for you both, it was about 14 hours with Maisie's litter. Good luck....


she's not in the yet. She's taken a duvet off of one of the beds and has made herself a little den. She looks quite cute in there 
I'll try sitting in the box with her and see if that works.
If not, its a homemade whelping box with a door. Should i lock her in it and stay in the room trying to comfort her, or will that just freak her out?


----------



## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

bigmick474 said:


> she's not in the yet. She's taken a duvet off of one of the beds and has made herself a little den. She looks quite cute in there
> I'll try sitting in the box with her and see if that works.
> If not, its a homemade whelping box with a door. Should i lock her in it and stay in the room trying to comfort her, or will that just freak her out?


None of my bitches have starting whelping their pups in the whelping box - preferring the sanctity of the crates - only moving into the whelping box once I have moved the babies in there after delivery 

Try and keep a close but safe distance (if that makes sense)

You don't want to leave her in case you are needed, but you also don't want her to feel as if she is crowded.

With my first litter, mum was pacing around digging etc for ages - I eventually went into the other room to ring the vet for advice - and while there, she delivered the first pup 

Good luck


----------



## Werehorse (Jul 14, 2010)

Good luck bigmick, good luck Stella.


----------



## bucksmum (Jul 19, 2009)

Bigmick, i normally let them have first puppy where they feel comfortable then when she has got over the 'shock' and realised it's her little pup pop puppy in the whelping box with her and they normally then stay in there to deliver the rest.

Just going back to your disenfectant query,i'm not sure about bleach,i never use it round pups,not sure about the fumes.

I tend to use virkon (available from agricultural store and very animal safe) but expect other posters may have suggestions as i think there are many animal safe ones on the market.

Hope all is going smoothly


----------



## Lucy1012 (May 23, 2010)

We use detol or milton as a disenfectant.


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Thanks for the info. throughout the day i've been phoning people, friends, family the vet making sure i had every one ready and on call if/when i need them. then on her last temperature reading, she's up to 37.1, only just below her normal range for the last week.
It was low all day, and now its close to normal again.
does this mean deliveries been postponed, or is this normal. 
I took her for a walk a while ago but we didn't get 300 yards before she had enough. she seems to have stopped nesting now. she's not eaten a lot thought.
I'm not sure if the temperature will drop again tonight, but if it does, I'm going to struggle to stay awake after 1.5 hours sleep last night after watching her. I suppose I should go to the shop and stock up on red bull and pro plus.


----------



## bucksmum (Jul 19, 2009)

Bigmick i find that my girls temp goes back up just a few hours before whelping. My last litter her temp went back up to 37.3 ,7 hours before first puppy so the red bull and coffee sounds a good idea


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

bucksmum said:


> Bigmick i find that my girls temp goes back up just a few hours before whelping. My last litter her temp went back up to 37.3 ,7 hours before first puppy so the red bull and coffee sounds a good idea


did they seem different in any way, because Stella seems normal, just tired. if she's likely to give birth tonight, i need to move her because she's taken charge of my mums bed. My mums not too happy I've moved back to hers for a few months, she'll be even more annoyed if my dogs stolen her bed


----------



## bucksmum (Jul 19, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> did they seem different in any way, because Stella seems normal, just tired. if she's likely to give birth tonight, i need to move her because she's taken charge of my mums bed. My mums not too happy I've moved back to hers for a few months, she'll be even more annoyed if my dogs stolen her bed


I would say they seem restless,keep changing position(normally on the sofa  ) refuse food several hours before.You may notice her licking herself alot and see a gooey discharge or you may get a puddle when her waters break.

Don't always rely on seeing lots of panting and contracting before first pup,sometimes all they give is a very subtle 'shivering'.If i have a bitch getting close i normally curl up with her on the sofa for the night and when she gets really restless i know to get up and make coffee as she's getting very close.
I then sit up with them by whelping box but if she won't settle in box it may be an idea to let her have first pup wherever she likes and then pop it in the box with her and she should then stay there


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

1ST PUPS HERE!!!!! A little girl.
Not in her whelping box but on a duvet. 
I tried moving the pup to the box once stella had cleaned her up, but she just took it out again. I'll try moving them when there all here.


----------



## LouJ69 (Feb 28, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> 1ST PUPS HERE!!!!! A little girl.
> Not in her whelping box but on a duvet.
> I tried moving the pup to the box once stella had cleaned her up, but she just took it out again. I'll try moving them when there all here.


Aw that's great that she's started-hope you have your red bull ready!!!lol Keep us posted-I'll be waiting!:lol:


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

LouJ69 said:


> Aw that's great that she's started-hope you have your red bull ready!!!lol Keep us posted-I'll be waiting!:lol:


Red bull, coffee, pro plus, i've got the lot! 
2nd ones here, a boy:thumbup:


----------



## LouJ69 (Feb 28, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> Red bull, coffee, pro plus, i've got the lot!
> 2nd ones here, a boy:thumbup:


Glad to hear everything's going ok so far.......


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

is it possible she could have just 2 pups? its been 1.5 hours since the last one and theres been no pushing, panting or straining. It was just under just over 1.5 hours between 1st and 2nd, but i could see her pushing. Maybe i'll take her for a quick walk, see if that does anything. If not i'll call the vet to make sure every things ok.


----------



## LouJ69 (Feb 28, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> is it possible she could have just 2 pups? its been 1.5 hours since the last one and theres been no pushing, panting or straining. It was just under just over 1.5 hours between 1st and 2nd, but i could see her pushing. Maybe i'll take her for a quick walk, see if that does anything. If not i'll call the vet to make sure every things ok.


Well, I'm not entirely sure, but I reckon it is possible for a bitch to only have 2 pups, in fact-some only have 1. I'm not sure if taking her for a walk would be a good idea though-just in case any drop out while you're walking her!:lol:


----------



## LouJ69 (Feb 28, 2009)

There is a girl on here who is a vet, in fact she's online now if you wanna ask her: http://www.petforums.co.uk/members/dr-marie.html


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

LouJ69 said:


> Well, I'm not entirely sure, but I reckon it is possible for a bitch to only have 2 pups, in fact-some only have 1. I'm not sure if taking her for a walk would be a good idea though-just in case any drop out while you're walking her!:lol:


i just walked her in the back garden, had clean towels ready just in case 1 fell out. she seems to be nesting and panting again now so hopefully i'll have another pup soon.
If theres nothing within the next hour i'll go to the vet.
This is going to sound like a stupid question, but how do i send a private massage to the vet you linked to?


----------



## LouJ69 (Feb 28, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> i just walked her in the back garden, had clean towels ready just in case 1 fell out. she seems to be nesting and panting again now so hopefully i'll have another pup soon.
> If theres nothing within the next hour i'll go to the vet.
> This is going to sound like a stupid question, but how do i send a private massage to the vet you linked to?


It actually doesn't look like you can send her a private message!:confused1: Weird! I can have a quick look to see who's online & see if any of them have experience with birth if you like? They might be able to answer your questions.


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

LouJ69 said:


> It actually doesn't look like you can send her a private message!:confused1: Weird! I can have a quick look to see who's online & see if any of them have experience with birth if you like? They might be able to answer your questions.


Thanks, i think the walk round the garden might of done the trick because she's really restless again now.


----------



## LouJ69 (Feb 28, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> Thanks, i think the walk round the garden might of done the trick because she's really restless again now.


Ooh, good luck-keep us posted!


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Hows your girl doing now?


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

archielee said:


> Hows your girl doing now?


still no 3rd puppy. I'm going to take her to the vet to get her checked out.
What's the best way to transport pups?


----------



## LouJ69 (Feb 28, 2009)

archielee said:


> Hows your girl doing now?


Ah, at last-someone who has had pups-well not you personally, but you know what I mean!lol


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> still no 3rd puppy. I'm going to take her to the vet to get her checked out.
> What's the best way to transport pups?


What time was the last pup? i would take then in a boxs, what breed sorry not read the posts


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

LouJ69 said:


> Ah, at last-someone who has had pups-well not you personally, but you know what I mean!lol


He he i know what you mean hun:lol:


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

she's not been pushing either. shes just started panting and nesting/digging again so i'll give her 20 minutes and if nothing happens, i'll take her straight to the vet.


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

archielee said:


> What time was the last pup? i would take then in a boxs, what breed sorry not read the posts


last pup at 3.50. she's a staffy


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

What time did the last pup come?


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

have you got someone with you to help


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

archielee said:


> What time did the last pup come?


1st 1 was at 2.35, 2nd at3.50


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

archielee said:


> have you got someone with you to help


no. i thought i would of had someone, but they went out and got drunk last night instead.


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Ok did you get her scannd to see litter size,


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

the first pup (girl) weighed 215g
the second (boy) weighed 260g
i dont know whether thats big or small for a staff.


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

archielee said:


> Ok did you get her scannd to see litter size,


the vet couldn't tell me, he just told me the average size.
edit: 4-6, thats why im concerned that shes only had 2


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Are the 2 pups ok is she feeding them


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

I will PM my number if you need it


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

archielee said:


> Are the 2 pups ok is she feeding them


there feeding fine and shes looking after them. when i took her in the garden, she had a wee and ran straight back up stairs to make sure they were ok


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Ok thats good


----------



## LouJ69 (Feb 28, 2009)

Yay! At last someone here who knows stuff!! Panic over!


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

LouJ69 said:


> Yay! At last someone here who knows stuff!! Panic over!


Thanks hun, i so carn't wait till Lyla has her next litter


----------



## LouJ69 (Feb 28, 2009)

archielee said:


> Thanks hun, i so carn't wait till Lyla has her next litter


Ha, ha-don't tell me that this has you broody already!


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Whats she doing now


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

LouJ69 said:


> Ha, ha-don't tell me that this has you broody already!


Haha iv been broody from when the pups went


----------



## LouJ69 (Feb 28, 2009)

archielee said:


> Haha iv been broody from when the pups went


I can imagine! At least you got to keep one so it's not too bad lol


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

archielee said:


> Whats she doing now


she was panting and digging, the 1 of the pups started squeaking, so she took care of it, stopped panting for a few minutes, and has now started again


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

are you leaving pups with her, when she starts again i would have pups in a box next to her, not in the same box but so she can still see them, if you get me


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

LouJ69 said:


> I can imagine! At least you got to keep one so it's not too bad lol


Yep i now, i will be keeping one from next litter too, omg will have 5 then lol


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

archielee said:


> are you leaving pups with her, when she starts again i would have pups in a box next to her, not in the same box but so she can still see them, if you get me


she hasnt used her box. she's been fine sleeping in it for the last few weeks, but as soon as it started, she took my mums duvet off her bed and had the pups on that. i tried to move her and the pups into the box, but she just picks them up and takes them back to the duvet.


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

i just got a box to keep them separate from mum, but all she did was pick them up and take them out again.


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

how can i get mum and pups into the whelping box? every time i try, she just picks them up and takes them out again. theres a door on it and it has sides high enough so that stella cant jump over, but if i lock her in with the pups, the pups just scream. i dont know whether its in pain, or just because they dont like being picked up, but as soon as i hear it i just open the door and let stella take them where ever she wants.
Shes been fine sleeping in it for the last few weeks so i dont know why she wont stay in there with the pups


----------



## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

Cover her box with a sheet, they like to feel safe and secure, keep lighting to a minimum too. Stay with mum at all times, don't leave her for a minute. If you have to go to kitchen etc, take her with you.


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Tanya1989 said:


> Cover her box with a sheet, they like to feel safe and secure, keep lighting to a minimum too. Stay with mum at all times, don't leave her for a minute. If you have to go to kitchen etc, take her with you.


theres a cardboard top on it. should i lock her in the box, or will that just stress her out, which could harm the pups?
she's in the middle of a bedroom floof atm. no hiding away, just sort of sunbathing as it shines through the window.
everytime stella picks them up, the scream. if i put them in the box she picks them up. i'm worried shes hurting them so i let he back out again


----------



## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

Try and get mum in the box and leave babies outside it for a few minutes. If you can get her to lie down and keep fussing her, keeping her calm, then latch babies onto her, fussing her all the time. She'll start to settle in the box.

Have you taken the card off the top. She maybe one of the few that are claustrophobic?


----------



## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

Tanya1989 said:


> Try and get mum in the box and leave babies outside it for a few minutes. If you can get her to lie down and keep fussing her, keeping her calm, then latch babies onto her, fussing her all the time. She'll start to settle in the box.
> 
> Have you taken the card off the top. She maybe one of the few that are claustrophobic?


None of mine will accept a cover over the whelping box - I've had similar problems getting mum and babies into the whelping box - and on all occasions, only been able to do it when labour has finished (although we did have a surprise delivery 6 hours later with the first litter )

I've never made the box so that mum can't get in and out easily if she wants.

I think you said you've bought a heat pad? I always keep a box alongside with my version of a heat pad in it (covered with towels) and move pups into that if mum is delivering / digging.

I've been lucky that my whelping box is huge - and I keep it in the corner of the whelping box if I need to use it after whelping so mum can see it at all times.


----------



## deb53 (Jun 4, 2009)

How is mum and pups?

Any news

xx


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

there now all in the whelping box. i've locked them in for a while so she doesnt take them out again, but she seems quit settled in there now. I took them all to the vet earlier and the pups are healthy and it was only a litter of 2, none stuck inside mum, which is good.
Thanks to everyone who has given advice, it's really appreciated. 
So 1 girl, 1 boy. I'm going to keep the girl and i've found a good home for the boy.
I'm glad that parts over though. I dont think i could of put up with the stress for too much longer. 
Now for stage 2. I might be asking for alot of advice in the upcoming months. 
I'll try and get some photos on here today, show off the proud mum and her pups.


----------



## deb53 (Jun 4, 2009)

Glad everything is ok :thumbup:

You just don't realise how stressful whelping is.

Look forward to seeing pics of the pups

xx


----------



## swarthy (Apr 24, 2010)

Glad to hear everything went smoothly, and that you also have homes sorted for the pups


----------



## bucksmum (Jul 19, 2009)

Congratulations Bigmick and Stella  glad it all went well


----------



## RockRomantic (Apr 29, 2009)

congratulations to you and Stella!!


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

not the best pics, but the camera has died
the lighter ones the boy, i'm keeping the girl. Any ideas on names?


----------



## Tapir (Mar 20, 2010)

Oh they are gorgeous!!! congrats!


----------



## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

Very sweet. I recommend that you take mums collar off though. I've seen too many pup deaths from getting stuck on mums collar.


----------



## archielee (Jan 30, 2009)

Congrats so happy it went ok, 2 puppies thats a small litter for a staff oh well as long as mum and pups are healthy thats all that matters


----------



## xxwelshcrazyxx (Jul 3, 2009)

Oh I have only just seen this thread, wow beautifull puppies, isnt it funny how all puppies look the same breed when they are new born, your light coloured one looks like my chihuahua puppy lol. I love the colours too. Well done.


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Tanya1989 said:


> Very sweet. I recommend that you take mums collar off though. I've seen too many pup deaths from getting stuck on mums collar.


Taken the collar off. As soon as it was off she decided she wanted to go for a wee, so i had to put it straight back on again


----------



## Lucy1012 (May 23, 2010)

not the best pics said:


> It's got to be Becks lol


----------



## missnaomi (Jun 4, 2010)

Such beautiful babies! x


----------



## Werehorse (Jul 14, 2010)

Aw well done bickmick, well done Stella. Cute pups. :thumbup:


----------



## kaisa624 (Mar 5, 2010)

Very cute pups


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Thought i'd keep you updated.
Stella and the pups are doing good. Their gaining weight well.
Occasionally stella will lie on 1 of the pups and they just screech. I'm paranoid she's going to crush 1 though, so i've only had about 10 hours sleep since thursday. Every time i hear a noise, form the pups or not, i wake up and check on them.
Am i right in thinking i don't worm mum again till the pups are 2 weeks old?
I'm thinking of calling the girl redemption, Red for short. I think having her from "new", will change my outlook on life. I've had a few things in the past what are not too good, spent abit of time in prison (no major crimes, just stupidity), but i think seeing a new life bought into the world changes whats important. I know its only a dog, not a baby, but the principles the same.
Redemption is seen as a religious word, i'm not religious, but i think what the word can mean applies to me.
What do you think, a good name or should i keep thinking??


----------



## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

I like it. 
You are right to be paranoid about pups being squashed. 10hours sleep in 6 days is about 4 hours more than I get. Squashing puppies is the biggest cause of fatalities in puppies.


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Tanya1989 said:


> I like it.
> You are right to be paranoid about pups being squashed. 10hours sleep in 6 days is about 4 hours more than I get. Squashing puppies is the biggest cause of fatalities in puppies.


it's just draining all the energy from me. at least i'm gettin mor than you though 
i'm slacking at work du to tiredness though. making a few basic mistakes, and ive still got a while to go. when are the pups big enough so i dont have to worry as much about the getting squashed?
The boy isnt too bad, he likes lying against the walls so the pig rails protect him, its the girl. she always wants to be close to mum.


----------



## Tanya1989 (Dec 4, 2009)

I am more relaxed once their eyes are open and they are up on their feet... a while to go yet


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Tanya1989 said:


> I am more relaxed once their eyes are open and they are up on their feet... a while to go yet


The eyes open around 2 weeks and they stand up around 3 weeks??:confused1:
There worth the lack of sleep. There lovely little things, and seein stella care for the make me love her more. She's a real member of the family, and i think she knows it :thumbup:


----------



## bucksmum (Jul 19, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> Thought i'd keep you updated.
> Stella and the pups are doing good. Their gaining weight well.
> Occasionally stella will lie on 1 of the pups and they just screech. I'm paranoid she's going to crush 1 though, so i've only had about 10 hours sleep since thursday. Every time i hear a noise, form the pups or not, i wake up and check on them.
> Am i right in thinking i don't worm mum again till the pups are 2 weeks old?
> ...


Lovely post  and i love the name,it suits her as well as having meaning for you.

The lack of sleep will be worth it and it's not for too much longer.As already said they are much less of a worry when they have there eyes open and also Stella will probably spend less time in with them as they get more active.

Yes,worm Stella again when you worm pups at 2 weeks old.


----------



## top-totty-rotti (Nov 5, 2009)

I totally agree with the name & I wish you all the very best in the future!! 

P.S I think the puppies are gorgeous!!! :thumbup:


----------



## missnaomi (Jun 4, 2010)

I've really enjoyed reading this - those dogs are lucky to be a part of your family 
Naomi x


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

thanks for the replies. Redemption it is. 
Stella's looking after the pups well but has adopted a small teddy bear too. she always keeps the pups in the whelping box but takes the teddy every time she leaves. Is this normal??
I cant see it doing any harm, the pups a fine and she's happy with them. is it a kind of security blanket. 
She rarely leaves the pups, only to toilet in the garden, and about a 15-20 min walk a day, as it says in the book of the bitch. 
The pups seem huge now though, in relation to when they were born anyway. especially the boy. He's a fat little fella  the girls really cute though. she's got into the habit of falling asleep whilst suckling/feeding. Next time she does it i'll try and get a pic. 
I think i've read somewhere that i should trim the pups nails as they can scratch mum when feeding. have i got to do this with staff pups? i think there nails grow quite slowly and they can be weaned quit early. thats just reading on the net so it might all be rubbish.


----------



## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

bigmick474 said:


> have i got to do this with staff pups? i think there nails grow quite slowly and they can be weaned quit early. thats just reading on the net so it might all be rubbish.


You are quite right, thats complete rubbish.

I really wouldnt be walking her outside of your property, regardless of what a book says. She could pick up all manner of bugs and pass them onto the pups, which could either make them seriously ill, or even kill them.

Are you wiping down her feet and teats?


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Nonnie said:


> You are quite right, thats complete rubbish.
> 
> I really wouldnt be walking her outside of your property, regardless of what a book says. She could pick up all manner of bugs and pass them onto the pups, which could either make them seriously ill, or even kill them.
> 
> Are you wiping down her feet and teats?


every time i take her out, in the garden or the street i wipe her down, using diluted dettol as someone said the used it on here. she doesnt walk too far anyway outside. 5 minutes and then i have to really encourage her to walk, as long as shes back to red and the boy within 20 mins, she seems fine.


----------



## alaun (Jul 21, 2009)

Ripley's dad is called Redemption:thumbup:


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

alaun said:


> Ripley's dad is called Redemption:thumbup:


i thought redemptin was original. lol . its still a cool name


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

It's there 10 day birthday.
The boys eyes ar opening








The girls aren't yet








video: YouTube - Pups


----------



## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

They look lovely and fat! Mums doing a great job.

You might want to think about cutting their nails (if you havent already done so) they look rather sharp.


----------



## dexter (Nov 29, 2008)

fat so n so's lol. agree with Nonnie those nails look like razors lol . mum would definately be happier if they were cut xx


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Nails have been cut. I don't know if I've done them short enough, but i didn't want to go too short. I've taken the sharp hooked end off and used a emery board to file them down a bit more and smooth them


----------



## LouJ69 (Feb 28, 2009)

Aw, it's great to see pics of them-after all, I was practically there while they were being born!!!:lol: Well, I was on here anyway!


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

LouJ69 said:


> Aw, it's great to see pics of them-after all, I was practically there while they were being born!!!:lol: Well, I was on here anyway!


lol. I was glad there was someone on here when it happened. In some ways it feels like the were born yesterday, but it also feels like i've had the pups for ages.
The boys nearly walking now too. I say nearly walking, its more like trying to stand up, taking a wobbly step or 2 and falling over again.
I'll try and get a video of that too, everytime i have a camera he just lies there but as soon as its out of reach, he's trying to walk everywhere. Maybe he's camera shy


----------



## Horse and Hound (May 12, 2010)

You know what mate, well bloody done!

You got some stick on here originally after being given some shoddy advice but hats off to you for sticking by your dog and the pups.

They look like they are thriving and I think Redemption is a great name for her, or you could call her Sally, short for Salvation?


----------



## bigmick474 (Jul 1, 2010)

Horse and Hound said:


> You know what mate, well bloody done!
> 
> You got some stick on here originally after being given some shoddy advice but hats off to you for sticking by your dog and the pups.
> 
> They look like they are thriving and I think Redemption is a great name for her, or you could call her Sally, short for Salvation?


Thanks.
a few more pics now there eyes are open and they've started moving about
















They were taken on my phone so the qualities not that good


----------



## celicababe1986 (Jun 22, 2009)

absolutly gorgeous!:thumbup:


----------

