# : ( my poor poor bunny



## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

Has just choked on her pellets! I am devastated and scared silly to let the others eat their dinner, she was only 7 months old a big blue Conti girl called Luna : ( it was so quick literally a few minutes and I couldn't do the bunny Heimlich manoeuvre she is just too big to be able to do it properly and I couldn't dislodge the pellet. 
there was nothing I could do I feel awful I just want to cry : ( 

**Crying now**


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## Funky (Dec 8, 2012)

Oh no I feel so sorry for you. 
I cannot blame you that you are scared feed others-maybe keep them on hay for now so you don't have to stressed every time you feed them. Bunnies diet can be hay and water only.
Take care-you couldn't do anything. It is just so unfair but don't blame yourself. 
My thoughts are with you!!!


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## vickie1985 (Feb 18, 2009)

heart breaking 

doesnt bare worth thinking about for me, i can imagine you are a mess  
been there but for other reasons only 3 weeks ago  

big hugs xx


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## metame (Sep 25, 2009)

I'm so sorry :-(


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

Thank you everyone for taking the time to post I really appreciate it, I just keep going over what I could have done, plus I was going to feed them earlier than usual but decided not to so thinking if I had it might not have happened silly really but I can't it.
I am thinking of stopping the pellets but as I have giants and plus litters sometimes I would need a feeding plan, I have really good hay here plus Timothy hay, readigrass, oat straw chaff, green oat hay, alfalfa & herbs I can also feed various supplements and barley rings and oats.
Does anyone have any experience with feeding giant bunnies and babies like this? Without pellets, I know it's possible but don't want to cause any nutritional imbalances especially with nursing and growing babies.
Am I overreacting? It's doubtful it would happen again I know but if it did I would never forgive myself.

Indie is looking for her sister : (


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## Summersky (Aug 11, 2012)

Oh my. I am so, so sorry that this has happened. I am sure it was just one of those freak accidents that can happen - and I am sure that there was nothing you could do. And you are certainly not to blame.

If you read Funky's post on her rabbit jumping over her shoulder at the vets, you'll see that sometimes freak things happen.

We once had a rabbit that choked on a pellet - she grabbed one, ran away, then jumped in the hutch - as she did she choked, then absolutely poured mucus - all the way to the emergency vet. Amazingly, we were able to rush her to the vets, as she could still breathe - the vets gave her oxygen, diuretics and antibiotics, and she pulled through. She was oh so lucky.

Could I ask what pellets you feed?

At the local rescue, there was a rabbit who used to choke on a particular type of pellet. Only him. But often. In the end, they changed him to smaller pellets. He was OK with them, but later developed a huge tooth abscess - we wondered whether, looking back, this was the underlying problem.

It could be that you rabbit had a problem with her teeth, that stopped her eating properly, which then caused the choke?

I would feed the other rabbits the normal amount, but for peace of mind, you could break the pellets up a bit, and scatter feed, so they can't eat too much at a time.

Run free at the bridge little rabbit. You are loved and missed, but we know you will have fun.


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

I know far to many freak 'things' happen it doesn't make it any easier, 
it was a case of she dived in to greedily I think, no teeth problems.
I am feeding Dodson & Horrell which are a daft size and shape really now I think about it. 

Thing is I really am scared one of the others might do the same now, my little yorkie nearly choked just 3 days ago but I got her quick and thank goodness she was ok.

It happened so quick I was in shock she must have completely blocked her airway I always feed grass and hay mixed in with pellets too so they have to 'hunt' for them but obviously that's not enough to prevent things like this happening.

Well if anyone does have any info on feeding giant buns & babies without the use of pellets I am all ears.


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## happysaz133 (Jun 5, 2008)

So sorry to hear what happened  sadly I've been hearing this too much from various forums, I wonder sometimes if its because rabbits are only meant to have such a small amount of something they enjoy so much they eat too quickly and choke.

Than again, there really isn't anything that can be done, other than trying another pellet. I'm sure any bunny can choke on any pellet, it really is just a tragic accident. For what its worth, I mix Pets at Home's own with Country Value, and never had any bunny choke, but what suits mine, might not suit others.


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## Summersky (Aug 11, 2012)

This is one for StormyThai, as she's our guru!

I am quite sure that there are ways to feed a balanced diet without pellets, but personally, I wouldn't suddenly stop feeding pellets, as you have baby buns, albeit giants. Babies are best kept on the same diet in the early weeks, as their tummies are vulnerable to change.

But I would scatter widely (although I know some buns positively hoover up the pellets anyway!). If the pellets are big, I would also be inclined to break them up. I don't know this make of pellet.

Once the babies are older, you might like to look at gradually changing them all across to a different pellet - we ususally recommend Science Selective or Allen and Page, but I believe that there have been some incidents of rabbits choking on SS too.


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

I am so sorry for the loss of Luna, I would suggest though you contact the people who make the food and inform them of Luna's death, they may then change the shape of the food if they are told.


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

Oh sorry I didn't explain I don't have babies at the moment but I do breed the giants, I have looked in to it before feeding without pellets and to be honest my buns don't get many at all, most of the diet is made up of greens as in grasses, herbs, plants etc.. and different hays but I would need to do some more research before I took away the pellets completely.

I did think about contacting them and explaining about the shape etc... not sure if they would change their feed just for little ol me though.

The rabbits and the chickens are the only ones that get 'pellets' I feed the dogs and cats mostly RAW.


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## Summersky (Aug 11, 2012)

katie25 said:


> Oh sorry I didn't explain I don't have babies at the moment but I do breed the giants, I have looked in to it before feeding without pellets and to be honest my buns don't get many at all, most of the diet is made up of greens as in grasses, herbs, plants etc.. and different hays but I would need to do some more research before I took away the pellets completely.
> 
> I did think about contacting them and explaining about the shape etc... not sure if they would change their feed just for little ol me though.
> 
> The rabbits and the chickens are the only ones that get 'pellets' I feed the dogs and cats mostly RAW.


Maybe not, but if you let them know, and others do too, then they might just consider it.


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## DKDREAM (Sep 15, 2008)

Summersky said:


> Maybe not, but if you let them know, and others do too, then they might just consider it.


they could well change it as surely they wouldn't want the same happening again? it is worth letting them know Luna could help protect others from dying the same way.


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

Could you give me a list of the different type of veggies, herbs and forage you feed as of now please?

You may find what you feed now is a good enough varied diet that taking the pellets away (gradually of course) will do no harm. Rabbits can happily flourish on a hay only diet (so long as their is a mixed variety of hay on offer) but with you breeding your does they need that little bit extra.

Unfortunately choking on pellets isn't uncommon  If you need to keep pellets in the diet then I would probably recommend looking at changing to a smaller pellet, something like Allen and Page Breeder grower pellets.


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

Hmm I feed Dodson & Horrell which are the same shape but now I look at them obviously didn't think about it before I would say being so small they would cause more of a choking risk than say burgess which are expensive & would rather use the money to feed fresh whole foods, shall I PM you with what they are fed on average on a regular day


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

katie25 said:


> Hmm I feed Dodson & Horrell which are the same shape but now I look at them obviously didn't think about it before I would say being so small they would cause more of a choking risk than say burgess which are expensive & would rather use the money to feed fresh whole foods, shall I PM you with what they are fed on average on a regular day


What ever you do, do not switch to Burgess. As much as soom rabbits do well on it, I would never recommend it due to the low fibre content and they use egg shell for calcium which many believe is the cause of excess cecotropes in some rabbits.

Feel free to pm or put on here what you feed


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

Yes I noticed that actually on a bag a friend had which struck me as weird...
I wasn't planning on it but was just commenting on nugget size.

OK will just post on here then if thats alright, not now cause I am shattered and off to bed soon but I will sit down tomorrow and come up with a full list.


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## Funky (Dec 8, 2012)

StormyThai said:


> What ever you do, do not switch to Burgess. As much as soom rabbits do well on it, I would never recommend it due to the low fibre content and they use egg shell for calcium which many believe is the cause of excess cecotropes in some rabbits.
> 
> Feel free to pm or put on here what you feed


I know they are not good pellets (burgess) and I have switched mine to selective science but Funky doesn't tolerate it-he never had poop problems on burgess.


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## Roger Downes (Sep 17, 2013)

Sorry to hear of your loss, it is absolutely devastating when we lose one of our pets, especially when it is unexpected, my thoughts are with you.


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

Funky said:


> I know they are not good pellets (burgess) and I have switched mine to selective science but Funky doesn't tolerate it-he never had poop problems on burgess.


Some rabbits do fine on it, but I will never recommend it.


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## Cruella De Vil (Sep 25, 2013)

Funky said:


> I know they are not good pellets (burgess) and I have switched mine to selective science but Funky doesn't tolerate it-he never had poop problems on burgess.


My friend fed her bunnies on excell they were always ok, but apparently her new baby bun is fed rabbit royal, which we can't find in small bags, so maybe she'll change to just feeding that, as she'll get quite a big sack for around £8.

I had no idea rabbits could choke on rabbit food though, as they don't seem able to open their mouths big enough to scarf things down like say a dog.


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## Funky (Dec 8, 2012)

This thread is very hard to read - seeing what you have seen Is awful. I am paranoid about choking (people, pets). My puppy was choking few weeks back I just didnt know what to do but by picking her up pushing her tummy She managed to pass it through-the noise she made when she was choking omg
I have heard horrid stories about people choked to death and since one of the stories I am quite scared.
I am feeling very sorry for you-losing pet it is devastating (know lately too much about that). Take care. 
Is there anything what can be done in choking situation?


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

Cruella De Vil said:


> My friend fed her bunnies on excell they were always ok, but apparently her new baby bun is fed *rabbit royal,* which we can't find in small bags, so maybe she'll change to just feeding that, as she'll get quite a big sack for around £8.


Another very poor food, but worse than Burgess with only 14% crude fibre and added molasses. When looking for rabbit pellets you need a bare minimum of 18-19% crude fibre, the higher the level the better for the gut flora


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## emzybabe (Jun 30, 2009)

Very sorry to hear you had to see this must have been hugely upsetting
I have heard of several similar chockig disasters on other forums.

You could try the feed FibaFirst its sticks made from chunky bits of hay and seeds there too big to be swallowed whole and arnt as compressed as pellets. Some pets at home now stock them and so do pampered pets or you can buy online from the hay experts. Here they are 
FibaFirst Rabbit | Foods | The Hay Experts

Your other simple option is to put their pellets in a bowl and soak them in just enough hot water so they turn into mush and then feed when cooled.

The Allen and page pellets are fantastic plenty of fiber in them they do a breeder option as well as a normal version. Most equine shops will order them in for you a sack is under £10. They have no soya or GM crops in them which is why I use them.


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

Considering the very small amount of dry feed you are supposed to feed bunnies does it really matter?? we say rabbit food should contain a certain amount of fibre and automatically think of dried food, if we feed mostly good hay, forage, barks, roots, plants etc... then pellets can be seen as treats.
I think you shouldn't be feeding your rabbit that many pellets where the fibre content really matters, I feed BOSS as a treat and Barley rings and the fibre content on them is very low, I am not saying bunnies don't need fibre they DO lots of it, we know that but it shouldn't be coming from the dry food.

Feel much better today so am working on that list of food stormythai, if you can take a look and see what you think, if I am missing anything or to much of something etc.. etc... Thanks :smile5:


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

emzybabe said:


> Very sorry to hear you had to see this must have been hugely upsetting
> I have heard of several similar chockig disasters on other forums.
> 
> You could try the feed FibaFirst its sticks made from chunky bits of hay and seeds there too big to be swallowed whole and arnt as compressed as pellets. Some pets at home now stock them and so do pampered pets or you can buy online from the hay experts. Here they are
> ...


A&P are good I have used in the past, they are the same shape though.
I have been looking in to feeding naturally for a while and this just makes it so much easier to decide to do it.

Poor Lunas sister is looking very sad bless her


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

katie25 said:


> Considering the very small amount of dry feed you are supposed to feed bunnies does it really matter?? we say rabbit food should contain a certain amount of fibre and automatically think of dried food, if we feed mostly good hay, forage, barks, roots, plants etc... then pellets can be seen as treats.
> I think you shouldn't be feeding your rabbit that many pellets where the fibre content really matters, I feed BOSS as a treat and Barley rings and the fibre content on them is very low, I am not saying bunnies don't need fibre they DO lots of it, we know that but it shouldn't be coming from the dry food.
> 
> Feel much better today so am working on that list of food stormythai, if you can take a look and see what you think, if I am missing anything or to much of something etc.. etc... Thanks :smile5:


I can see where you are going but I'm afraid that is the wrong train of thought 
Pellets should always be seen as a treat, my lot have one day a week where they get no pellets at all (for the ones that still get pellets that is lol)..

The fibre content in the pellets should not replace any natural fibre the rabbit may eat, however to keep the gut flora level as balanced as possible and to make sure they are digested effectively they NEED to have a high fibre content. Reduce the fibre content in the pellets and you will see a huge difference in the shape, colour and size or any droppings.

So to sum up, me saying pellets need to have a certain amount of crude fibre is not saying that we feed those so we can reduce any other form of fibre. It is me saying that for a rabbit to digest effectively and and to remain as healthy as possible (bar any other health issues not related to diet) for as long as possible we need to feed as high as possible when it comes to crude fibre and the key word is crude.....If you believe the bumpf from Burgess then you would think that they contain over 30% fibre.......yeah well that is a load of rubbish as beneficial fiber is a marketing ploy and the actual crude fibre content is 19% 

So yeah, when deciding on what pellets to feed you need to go for the highest crude fibre content possible not looking at any below 19% otherwise you will find all manner or other fillers in the food to replace such as mollasses, egg shells and such like


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

StormyThai said:


> I can see where you are going but I'm afraid that is the wrong train of thought
> Pellets should always be seen as a treat, my lot have one day a week where they get no pellets at all (for the ones that still get pellets that is lol)..
> 
> The fibre content in the pellets should not replace any natural fibre the rabbit may eat, however to keep the gut flora level as balanced as possible and to make sure they are digested effectively they NEED to have a high fibre content. Reduce the fibre content in the pellets and you will see a huge difference in the shape, colour and size or any droppings.
> ...


I wasn't really directing at you just in general - of course we should feed our pets the best for them that we can so the best forage, the best pellets, supplements etc... BUT we should be focusing on hay & forage as the main part of the diet, say the word rabbit food to someone and they will think of a bag of 'rabbit food' or ask what do you feed your rabbit - you get burgess excel or Russell rabbit etc... what I mean is this feeding your rabbit a tablespoon full of Russell rabbit food probably wont do them any harm IF they have the other stuff - good hay/grass etc... available all the rest of the time
BUT feed them nothing but a high fibre pellet and you will start having problems somewhere along the line (I know that is not what you are saying to do) But don't feed Russell rabbit anyone cause it is crap!


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

OK this is what I feed my bunnies - 

Hay - meadow from a local farm
Timothy hay chop
Readigrass
Oat straw chop (v high fibre)
Green oat hay
Alfalfa chop (for lactating & growing bunnies, its a 15-16%% protein alfalfa)

That's about all the dry hay/forage I feed and then I add dry herbs such as
Plantain
Blackberry
D&H hedgerow herbs
Some dried rose petals
Dandelion
Usually whatever I collect and dry in the garden etc... but also buy in some of them, I also feed fresh & dried willow bark, sometimes raspberry sticks, apple sticks & birch.

Fresh they have large pens which I have put down paddock grass seed mix and some timothy grass I have also sown in there some wild flowers such as cornflower & mallow & clovers.

For treats/supplements I feed the pellets at the moment - about tablespoon to egg cup for my minis and a very small hand full for the giants but also feed sometimes whole oats, BOSS & Occasional barley rings.
Plus golden wheatgerm oil sometimes & entracare (aqua)

I think that's about it.........


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

katie25 said:


> I wasn't really directing at you just in general - of course we should feed our pets the best for them that we can so the best forage, the best pellets, supplements etc... BUT we should be focusing on hay & forage as the main part of the diet, say the word rabbit food to someone and they will think of a bag of 'rabbit food' or ask what do you feed your rabbit - you get burgess excel or Russell rabbit etc... *what I mean is this feeding your rabbit a tablespoon full of Russell rabbit food probably wont do them any harm IF they have the other stuff - good hay/grass etc... available all the rest of the time*
> BUT feed them nothing but a high fibre pellet and you will start having problems somewhere along the line (I know that is not what you are saying to do) But don't feed Russell rabbit anyone cause it is crap!


And that is where we will have to disagree I am afraid, due to the low fibre content and the added molasses (among other things) could very well cause problems, such as bloat, stasis due to upset gut flora levels, teeth issues due to the added sugar, behavioural issues (which could lead to injuries) due to added sugar and I could continue...

I would have to say I would prefer to see someone feed a hay only diet than feeding crap pellets (with or without hay), I get to see what long term damage all these crappy pellets and mixes do to our rabbits over time (obviously other environmental factors will play a part too) so for me I would rather see hay, hay and more hay than anything else


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

katie25 said:


> OK this is what I feed my bunnies -
> 
> Hay - meadow from a local farm
> Timothy hay chop
> ...


That all looks and sounds great  
As you have no lactating or pregnant does you could actually start to drop the pellets as of now and then observe any changes, if you notice any weight loss then you know you need to up the forage (dried or fresh), and weight gain then reduce slightly (all common sense really). If you want to keep pellets in for now then one thing I can suggest which may help is to keep the pellets back for hand feeding only and give them one or two pellets several times a day, but with what you feed I would be more than happy to reduce/stop the pellets as it stands


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

PROBABLY wont do them any harm, but again yes you are right it COULD cause some health issues, a very small amount Is unlikely to though I mean I eat a good diet 95% the time so a little bit of something 'bad' Is unlikely to do any harm, I am in no way advising feed dry food of poor quality just pointing out that Hay & forage should be what bunnies are eating & pellets seen only as a treat, I had a woman come to me who thought I was starving my bunnies! she could not understand how I could feed them what I do, I did explain well look at wild rabbits... but she couldn't make the connection, her bunnies have excel available ALL THE TIME.
I agree better to feed just hay than crap pellets/dry food.


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

StormyThai said:


> That all looks and sounds great
> As you have no lactating or pregnant does you could actually start to drop the pellets as of now and then observe any changes, if you notice any weight loss then you know you need to up the forage (dried or fresh), and weight gain then reduce slightly (all common sense really). If you want to keep pellets in for now then one thing I can suggest which may help is to keep the pellets back for hand feeding only and give them one or two pellets several times a day, but with what you feed I would be more than happy to reduce/stop the pellets as it stands


I have 1 pregnant doe- Lulu and she is due in a few weeks ?? 
no babies or lactating does though.

Winter is coming up and fresh is harder to feed as everything is pretty much dead.
I forgot to add 3 times a week they get spring greens, parsley, carrot tops, watercress etc.. but only a little and only the adults.

Do you think I should keep Lulu on her usual amount of pellets...??


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

katie25 said:


> I have 1 pregnant doe- Lulu and she is due in a few weeks ??
> no babies or lactating does though.
> 
> Winter is coming up and fresh is harder to feed as everything is pretty much dead.
> ...


I would keep Lulu as she is, no point in messing with her diet whilst she needs that little bit extra to help her through  You could look at changing her once the kits have been weaned 

In winter I use my storage of dried forage that I had picked throughout the summer, and make sure I keep a track of their weight, if any start losing anything then I add porridge oats, barley rings and soaked or rolled barley (make sure you restrict the barley tho as it adds weight around vital organs so can cause issues there) but so long as you make sure they have a good enough variety of seasonal forage you should be good to go


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## Summersky (Aug 11, 2012)

Katie - all the advice that Stormy gives is sound, and based on solid research and her immense knowledge. 

Even a little junk can upset a rabbit's guts.

All our rabbits here are fed hay rich diets (of course - hay/grass should always be the major part of a rabbit's diet), with only minimal (Science Selective) pellets (given as a daily treat, to check they are eating).

Some also have Pro Fibre pellets - without them, they have severe gut problems - these are 2 rabbits with complex problems). 2 of our rabbits have one pellet only a day (aah). We do not feed fresh other than occasional treats of apple or blackberry leaves, dandelions, basil or parsley. Once in a blue moon, they might get a bit of fruit.

We have fed Fiba First sticks, but found that these seemed to aggravate our dental issues - several of our rabbits are dental, some with abscess issues.

When we did have a rabbbit with respiratory problems, who could not eat hay at all eek, we cultivated grass in the garden, grew tubs and tubs of wheat grass, supplemented with apple leaves, etc., and fed Fiba First plus a few pellets. Then Fiba First was a lifeline. He too had been a dental bun for several years, but the diet did the trick for his last months, and amongst all his other problems,he did not need a dental.


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## Cruella De Vil (Sep 25, 2013)

StormyThai said:


> Another very poor food, but worse than Burgess with only 14% crude fibre and added molasses. When looking for rabbit pellets you need a bare minimum of 18-19% crude fibre, the higher the level the better for the gut flora


Would my friend be better feeding her new baby on the same stuff she feeds hers on then? Will it eat it if its used to something else? What exactly is wrong with rabbit royal? Oh and I forgot its mixed with some bagged grass or something too. Is that the same as garden grass which it'd eat when outside anyway? Will hay do indstead? Cos neither me or my friend can find it as there's no big pet shops about, unless its burgess fibreglass .


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

My post explains what is wrong with RR, quite clearly I thought 
Sorry but I am a little confused, are you saying you can't source hay? Or are we talking pellets here?


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

Correct me if I am wrong but I think rabbit royal contains molasses ? 
Which is v. high in sugar a big no for bunnies.


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

Fibreglass is prob not good for bunnies either Lol  Sorry


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

katie25 said:


> Correct me if I am wrong but I think rabbit royal contains molasses ?
> Which is v. high in sugar a big no for bunnies.


You are correct, that is what gives it that sticky texture


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## emzybabe (Jun 30, 2009)

katie25 said:


> A&P are good I have used in the past, they are the same shape though.
> I have been looking in to feeding naturally for a while and this just makes it so much easier to decide to do it.
> 
> Poor Lunas sister is looking very sad bless her


I mean feed the Allen and Page wet so there's no chocking risk at all.


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

So does that mean I have to throw the big bale of fibreglass I've just bought into the skip???


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## katie25 (Sep 13, 2013)

Lopside said:


> So does that mean I have to throw the big bale of fibreglass I've just bought into the skip???


Yup sorry


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## Summersky (Aug 11, 2012)

Cruella De Vil said:


> Would my friend be better feeding her new baby on the same stuff she feeds hers on then?[/B] Will it eat it if its used to something else? What exactly is wrong with rabbit royal? Oh and I forgot its mixed with some bagged grass or something too. Is that the same as garden grass which it'd eat when outside anyway? Will hay do indstead? Cos neither me or my friend can find it as there's no big pet shops about, unless its burgess fibreglass .


[The baby rabbit should be kept on the same diet to begin with as it was with the breeder, as the move is stressful enough. An upset stomache at this age can be a rapid killer.

This is hard when you know that they are on a poor diet. A good breeder will always send a supply of food with the new rabbit.

Then after a couple of weeks, it is best to make a very gradual switch across to better pellets. Also avoid too much fresh (unless the baby was alreadyweaned onto fresh). 

*?? What's this please? Am I being dense? Sounds like something that goes in the loft.*

You can order specific pellets on the internet if you can't find them locally.

Hay is available everywhere. The cheapest way to get it is buy the farmer's bale. Wherever you get it from, you have to check it is of good quality, and not dusty or musty.


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## Cruella De Vil (Sep 25, 2013)

StormyThai said:


> My post explains what is wrong with RR, quite clearly I thought
> Sorry but I am a little confused, are you saying you can't source hay? Or are we talking pellets here?


No not hay, my friend says its bagged grass. Never mind, I'll tell my friend to not buy rabbit royal, good job I asked, she was going to buy a huge bag of it! There's really not much choice in the shop, there's some cheapo pellets, rabbit royal, excell, rabbit superfruiti in a really small packet (which I'm assuming is a sprinkled on topping as it wouldn't last a week otherwise) and something new called something like contipig or cunnipig (but is rabbit food). And that's about it. So she's always fed excell.



katie25 said:


> Correct me if I am wrong but I think rabbit royal contains molasses ?
> Which is v. high in sugar a big no for bunnies.


Molasses is basically treacle or syrup sugar, why would it be in rabbit food?



katie25 said:


> Fibreglass is prob not good for bunnies either Lol  Sorry


 its meant to be fibregrass, autocorrect has changed it! Its one of the hays they've got in, along with vitakraft dandelion and something.


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

Cruella De Vil said:


> No not hay, my friend says its bagged grass. Never mind, I'll tell my friend to not buy rabbit royal, good job I asked, she was going to buy a huge bag of it! There's really not much choice in the shop, there's some cheapo pellets, rabbit royal, excell, rabbit superfruiti in a really small packet (which I'm assuming is a sprinkled on topping as it wouldn't last a week otherwise) and something new called something like contipig or cunnipig (but is rabbit food). And that's about it. So she's always fed excell.
> 
> Molasses is basically treacle or syrup sugar, why would it be in rabbit food?
> 
> its meant to be fibregrass, autocorrect has changed it! Its one of the hays they've got in, along with vitakraft dandelion and something.


Where abouts do you live? Are you not near any good equestrian or farm feed places?


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## Summersky (Aug 11, 2012)

Cruella De Vil said:


> No not hay, my friend says its *bagged grass.* Never mind, I'll tell my friend to not buy rabbit royal, good job I asked, she was going to buy a huge bag of it! There's really not much choice in the shop, there's some cheapo pellets, rabbit royal, excell, rabbit superfruiti in a really small packet (which I'm assuming is a sprinkled on topping as it wouldn't last a week otherwise) and something new called something like contipig or cunnipig (but is rabbit food). And that's about it. So she's always fed excell.
> 
> Readigrass perhaps??
> 
> The Range near us sells Science Selective pellets, if you have one of those near you.


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## Cruella De Vil (Sep 25, 2013)

Lopside said:


> Where abouts do you live? Are you not near any good equestrian or farm feed places?


That is the choice in the farm feeds and equine store! There's no pet shops anymore, they've gone, so they turned part of the farm store in to a pet section.



Summersky said:


> Readigrass perhaps??
> 
> The Range near us sells Science Selective pellets, if you have one of those near you.


Yes that's it! Couldn't remember what she called it! I've just had a look for it and it looks exactly like garden grass, is it the same?


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## Summersky (Aug 11, 2012)

Where hay is dried, Readigrass goes through a different process, and is "baked" I believe. 

There are varying opinions re whether it should be fed freely or limited - some say it is too high in calcium, and should only be fed occasionally; other, that it can be fed daily.


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

Cruella De Vil said:


> That is the choice in the farm feeds and equine store! There's no pet shops anymore, they've gone, so they turned part of the farm store in to a pet section.
> 
> Yes that's it! Couldn't remember what she called it! I've just had a look for it and it looks exactly like garden grass, is it the same?


Don't they sell Allen and page there then? It's usually a popular farm shop food. It feels kind of weird talking to cruella.....lol.....kind of goes against my principles!


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## StormyThai (Sep 11, 2013)

If you go to a farm shop then ask for Allen and Page naturals, they may not have it in but they will be able to order it in. I just phone my merchants a week before i need it and they get it in for me 

Also they will be able to source bales of hay or if not most certainly bags of hay. Some rabbits cope fine with eating readigrass everyday but they need hay for a variety of reasons.

Mainly because readigrass does not give the teeth a good enough work out as it is much softer than hay so doesn't take as much to grind up.
And just as importantly the way readigrass is prepared it holds onto the calcium content of the grass and because of the way a rabbits guts work they will absorb every last drop of calcium, which can lead to bladder sludge/stones in some rabbits.

It really is in the best interest of the rabbits to source a supplier or good quality hay, if you are in the Uk there really is no excuse especially as you can order bags of hay online.


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## Cruella De Vil (Sep 25, 2013)

Lopside said:


> Don't they sell Allen and page there then? It's usually a popular farm shop food. It feels kind of weird talking to cruella.....lol.....kind of goes against my principles!


I've never heard of Allen and page, there's something there in a big bag called Dobson & Horrells on the shelf tag, but all I can see in the space is bags of chudleys lol, so I think they've mixed up. They do have quite a few different hays in though, including some birch bark or something, looks like it might be good for teeth. They are a lot better than the pet shop was, their bunny food looked like a bag of red and yellow smarties with flat squashed peas in it, which must have been so boring to eat day after day.

 I actually detest real fur worn, expect on the animal it was meant for, though I do like the fake stuff, and am hoping to get lucky on eBay with a nice one for the winter. I do like CDV from the live films though as I love Glenn Close as an actress, thought she bought her to life brilliantly. Its weird as I love dogs, so should hate CDV, but no harm came from liking a fictional character


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## sskmick (Feb 4, 2008)

Oh love, I wish I could throw my arms around you. Try not to beat yourself up, your bunny had a better chance than mine do, I wouldn't have a clue what to do if that happened to mine.

The fact that the pellet lodge and the technique couldn't be done really is a freak accident.

That won't make you feel any better, though.

I am not going to hyjack this thread but take a look at mine when I manage to do it and take heart that your bunnies are well cared for and loved.


RIP little one


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