# one of kittens losing weight help.



## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

the first born kitten who seemed so full of energy when it came out hence name gizmo, is just sleeping a lot today when all others are feeding, i felt him and he was cold so decided to weigh him and hes lost 11 grams, all the others have gained 15 grams plus.

what can i do?

do i get the milk myself from the pet shop and bottle feed him, or do i remove the other 3 to give him a chance?


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## rottiesloveragdolls (Nov 2, 2007)

*What ever you do you need to KEEP him WARM! he will loss the fight if he gets to cold and try bottle feeding him with Lactos Milk dont take the others away from mum as she may reject them. 
Sorry but it dont sound good if he is getting cold and sleeping a lot he needs to be kept warm and fed at least every 2 hours?

I hope the poor little mite makes it ok x*


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## rottiesloveragdolls (Nov 2, 2007)

*If you have a hot water bottle wrap it in a blanket to keep the baby warm, if you havent got a water bottle then use an empty juice bottle fill it with hot water and wrap that in the blanket to help keep him warm *


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## Elmstar (Apr 7, 2008)

I echo the above, the most important thing is to warm him up as he'll die if you try to feed him now.

Next, consult your vet.

Don't remove the others as it may cause them problems.


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## Guest (Aug 29, 2009)

Another Echo here


Keep him warm, dont attempt to feed him until he is warmed through.

While your waiting for the vet to phone you back, do a couple of checks, - is his meow much louder and different to the others?, has he definatly got a bottom? 

Its normal for a kitten to lose a little bit in the first 24hours, but no more than 10% and they should never be cold.


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

hes not icy just cooler then others, ive put hot water bottle in and hes cuddling into his mum, the other 3 are so greedy! and all fighting for front teets. ill phone vet now see what she says. hes 48 hours now. hes not miaowing. i checked their bottoms yesterday and didnt see anything untoward? what would it look like if it didnt definately have one?


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

Are you able to look into his mouth? Check he hasn't got a cleft palate.


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

is it best to warm him up in the nest with his mum? ive placed hot water bottle under where he is.


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

MerlinsMum said:


> Are you able to look into his mouth? Check he hasn't got a cleft palate.


hi hun, ill check that too, at moment i dont want to pick him up because hes snuggled into his mum, and thats got to be best place if hes getting warmed there?


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## Elmstar (Apr 7, 2008)

kitties said:


> is it best to warm him up in the nest with his mum? ive placed hot water bottle under where he is.


That sounds ideal, keep checking him though and make sure he doesn't get too hot and can move away from the hot water bottle.


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## sjreilly72 (Jan 8, 2009)

Arrr bless little Gizmo. Hope he is feeling better soon. Please keep us informed while you can I know it must be a stressful time.


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

I could cry it was all going so well!! I keep putting him to the nipple but he just doesnt latch on. Ive given him some lactol how many ml at a time should I be giving him?


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

billyboysmammy said:


> Another Echo here
> 
> Keep him warm, dont attempt to feed him until he is warmed through.
> 
> ...


not sure what you mean by does he have a bottom? ive had a look and all looks ok in that region.



MerlinsMum said:


> Are you able to look into his mouth? Check he hasn't got a cleft palate.


weve had a look and cant see any hole, does that mean hes ok there?


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## Elmstar (Apr 7, 2008)

I think you should get him checked by the vet.

They do go downhill very quickly when something is wrong.


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## colliemerles (Nov 2, 2007)

fingers crosed here for the little one,xx


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

have u any kittystim?
KittyStim Kitten Probiotic & Colostrum - £8.80 : Vet UK: Selling Hills Prescription Diet, Frontline Spot On, Royal Canin, Feliway, DAP, Drontal, Hills Science Plan, Seraquin, James Wellbeloved for less.

have you syringe fed him? if he has a cleft palate the milk can bubble out of his nose.

is he feeling any warmer? def get him warm before you try hand feeding him.

how is mum with him?

he will need energy to suckle.

you can also get nutro drops.


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## Guest (Aug 29, 2009)

what i meant by bottom is did he have an anus - if everything looks to be in place then that probably means it is.

My comment about his cries is because of the risk of a cleft palate. Cleft palate kittens tend to not latch on, get neglected by mum (they sense something is wrong) and have a distinctive cry.

If he isnt feeding and youve got him warm properly, then i would get him to a vet asap today rather than tomorrow, and get the little fella checked over properly.

Remember its bank holiday too, so if you end up havng to see a vet tomorrow or monday its going to cost alot more.... not saying you wouldnt see a vet - just giving you a reminder of the bank holiday.


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## bimbleweb (Apr 15, 2009)

All the necessary advice has been given.

I do hope the little one is ok? Poor little Gizmo 

Sending lots of positive thoughts and love xx


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

well the good news is ive done as the vet said and the first supplement feed I gave him he did have it but wasnt really sucking, but ive just done another one now, and he drank it and sucked! the vet is happy, and said just to keep topping up

PLEASE HOW MUCH SHOULD I GIVE IT IN MLS? for each feed.

my next neighbour is a doctor and shes given me some shringes to use, the teat wasnt working, but might tomorrow?


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## NicolaC (Apr 14, 2009)

I had to feed one of our last kittens with a syringe for the first 24 hrs, I used cimicat and think he had about 3mls every 2 hours?? I still have the tub so will go check for you.


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## Elmstar (Apr 7, 2008)

Hi, around 2mls per feed. Hope it goes well, sounds like you're doing a good job.


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## Guest (Aug 29, 2009)

The kitten will take anywhere between 1.5-4ml a feed.... give them as much as they will take - remember to stimulate the bowels and bladder after each feed, and some kittens need burping!


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

oh thankyou!! he had 2 ml on the first feed then 3 ml on the last one just getting ready for next just was scared to over fill him. his mum is doing the rest for him cleaning him when i put it back. i keep saying him its probably a she.


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

if i feed it every 2 hours how long will it take before it perks up?


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

it's a v positive sign he is feeding and suckling from the syringe so hopefully once he gets some energy he'll perk up. you may have to hand feed him for a couple of days.


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

Thank you I just weighed him before I put him back after that feed of 3ml, and he had put on 5 grams. So heres hoping. Thank you to you all for your advice, I really really mean that. It means such a lot to us.


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## Guest (Aug 29, 2009)

no problem



are you remembering to stimulate the bowels and bladder? Its not uncommon for kittens on formula to get constipated so the stimulation is ultra important.

Its a fantastic sign that he is feeding, with any luck after the weekend he'll be back feeding off mum again.

keep up the good work! Your in for a long night tonight!


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

It's been a long time, but I have had kittens like this in the past (two, I think, in 9 litters). They seem extra energetic and move around a lot crying, and never seem to be nursing. I always had an electric heat pad under the nest so I didn't notice them being cold. In both cases I immediately started supplementary feeding, even took one into work with me once! Happy to say that after three days or so of feeding, they started to nurse by themselves. I kept up the extra feeds for a few weeks and by 6 weeks they had caught up.

I found a small syringe was fine - I did faff about with special feeing bottles and special teats but never found them great - the bottle gave too much too fast, and I could never get the hole in the teat quite right. The syringe was fine since you quickly learn to give enough gentle pressure to suit the kitten without drowning it!

The last kitten of this type went to my sister & died about 4 years ago aged oover 16!!!

I've no idea why some are like this; I did wonder years ago whether some are born with a temporary disturbance to their sense of smell and can't quite work out how to latch on. They are certainly real little fighters though and determined to live!

best of luck to Gizmo, now you know it's not uncommon and in a few days he should be feeding from mum on his own, fingers crossed xxx

PS: I used Cimicat but you can also use evaporated milk diluted 50/50.

PPS: re Billyboysmammy - mum should help clean the baby herself, no need to keep him away from her as long as you know which one he is, he can stay with the others and keep warm between feeds.


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

mum is cleaning him as soon as i put him back. and this last feed when i picked him up he was much warmer (ive been having to warm him up before feeding before) and he suckled very well, told me when he had enough at 3ml.

my worry is he wont ever feed off his mum, if he gets used to my feeding him?


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

he will. once he's stronger to fight for the nipple with his litter mates.


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

kitties said:


> my worry is he wont ever feed off his mum, if he gets used to my feeding him?


As Biawhiska said, he will... he won't be able to do all the lovely kneading with his front paws while drinking from a syringe!


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

oh thats good, why do they all want the front nipples? whats wrong with the back ones? theres only 4 of them!


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

kitties said:


> oh thats good, why do they all want the front nipples? whats wrong with the back ones? theres only 4 of them!


Do you know, I have no idea! 
I always understood the rearmost nipples were the most sought-after as they produced more milk, obviously not so. Could it be quality over quantity? Or just wanting to be nearer Mum's face and getting more cleaning or attention from her?


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

yeah i thought that the stronger kittens when nearer to mum where as the weaker ones were pushed near the tail nipples. i also though the bottom nipples were more sought after  strange


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

Biawhiska said:


> yeah i thought that the stronger kittens when nearer to mum where as the weaker ones were pushed near the tail nipples. i also though the bottom nipples were more sought after  strange


Have a feeling that the foremost nipples may produce a higher quality and more concentrated milk. I've not had a proper search but a brief google pulled this up:
_Abstract: 
Milk from 11 domestic shorthair cats (Felis catus; n=7 fed dry low-fat diet, n=4 fed dry high-fat diet) was collected weekly for 6 weeks following parturition, and analysed for total solids (TS), crude protein (CP), fat, lactose and ash. Samples were collected in 1-ml sequential fractions to determine whether within-sampling changes in composition existed. Samples of extracted milk fat were also analysed for fatty acid content. Two commercial kitten milk replacers were analysed according to the same procedures utilized for milk samples. In statistical analyses individual cat, diet, stage of lactation, litter size, *and teat position influenced concentrations of milk components*; parity and sequential sampling had no effect. Averaged cat milk was 27.9% TS, and 8.7% CP, 12.7% fat, 4.2% lactose and 1.3% ash (on a wet basis). Milk protein percentage increased over lactation for both diet groups, but fat percentage increased only for queens fed the high-fat diet. Milk replacers were lower in fat and protein content than milk from queens, and had considerably lower levels of arachidonic acid. Data from this study contribute to the limited information available regarding the composition of domestic cat milk, and give possible reasons for poor growth occasionally observed in kittens fed unsupplemented commercial milk replacers.​_(the bold is mine).
Ref:
Influences of stage of lactation, teat position and sequential milk sampling on the composition of domestic cat milk (Felis catus). | Jacobsen, K. L., DePeters, E. J., Rogers, Q. R., Taylor, S. J. | Journal of Animal Physiology and Animal Nutrition |


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

interesting thanks for that.


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

oh isnt that funny? do all of yours go for the front ones as well? ive tried placing the stronger ones on the back but they arent interested.

well 6.30 am update!!

came down to his feed, and all the babies were asleep and he was latched on to mummy! so i came away, so happy!! will weigh him/her at 8.30 (really need to find out what it is!) will take a pic of bottom so you can tell me.

at 2.30 am hadnt really gained anything, but as my wise little girl said yesterday, if hes poorly mum, as long as hes not losing then thats the best we can hope for!! wise 11 year old! shes really got attached to it already. To be honest, i was convinced we had lost him, so I am just happy hes alive today!


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## rottiesloveragdolls (Nov 2, 2007)

*hope all is well with little one, sounds like you were doing a great job  well done *


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

came down at 8.30 and he was back on mums front nipple! beat the rest! so chuffed!! hes put 9 grams on, hes still way behind the others, but after thinking he was gone yesterday and i really did, im so chuffed, its all up from here.

the others are right fattys!!!

the ginger is 143 grams! (put 17 grams on since yesterday)
the black and white is 147 grams(put 23 grams on since yesterday)
the other tabby and white is 128 grams (put 19 grams on since yesterday_)(there was only 4 grams between that one and the poorly one on day 1)_
and the poorly one is 91 grams but has put 9 on so im happy its going in right direction. hes learning to fight, and im watching all the time to make sure the others arent winning.

Thank you all again for your time and advice, I really really appreciate it. You helped me keep me calm, without you all he could have gone now.


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## rottiesloveragdolls (Nov 2, 2007)

*Thats great news, im sure he will soon catch up with the others well done  *


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Glad he is doing well. Well done you.


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## Lumpy (Jun 5, 2008)

That's brilliant news. Do you think you will keep him now you've got so attached?


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## Elmstar (Apr 7, 2008)

Brilliant news, you're doing a great job


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

Ive just given him/her a little top up cos was restless when all others were sleeping, and he took another 4 ml. Ive weighed him again and hes over his first day weight now, so everything is looking good.

Do you think he would have died if I hadnt intercepted?

Dunno about keeping him, my neighbour wanted the two tabbys and they are very alike so Ill see them all the time. I still really love the ginger one, but I know once they are up and about with eyes open they will look completey different again. How do you decide?

The ginger is massive! his head is so big! but he has a white face, white under his chin, and white feet, he seems a bit fluffier then the others as well.


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## colliemerles (Nov 2, 2007)

aww good news, glad all is ok,


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## Milly22 (Sep 15, 2008)

Glad all is well!


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## Elmstar (Apr 7, 2008)

kitties said:


> Do you think he would have died if I hadnt intercepted?


Possibly, the most important thing was to warm him up when he was cold.


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## bimbleweb (Apr 15, 2009)

That's great news, I'm glad he is doing well now.
What a relief for you.If you hadn't have intervened I'm sure he/she wouldn't have made it this far. 

Well done you!  xx


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## abbscats (Nov 8, 2008)

Well done you xx Glad he is picking up and putting back on his weight and that is down to your hardwork. keep it up and well done


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

Thank you all hes doing great. I tried to get a picture of its bottom, so you can tell me if its a he or a she, but kept coming out blurry. 

Hes doing really well, fighting the others now to latch on and is happily asleep with the others.

Thank you all for being concerned and helping us out.


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## ellie8024 (May 4, 2009)

thats great news


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

just an update, hes still fighting his corner, getting the front teet they all seem to want so much, and ive just weighed him again (im obsessed) and hes 100 grams now! so put 20 grams on since yesterday when he was poorly. oh and had a quick look and im sure he is a she!!


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

day 4 and my baby has put on 13 grams, so I think its fine now. Should I still be suplementing her do you think? (im pretty sure its a her now)


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

if she is suckling well with the others see how she goes but check her weigh, play it by ear really.


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

should i weigh her every day? its making me paranoid! today she had gained more then all the others on any other day so i was chuffed, but checked her tonight and was the same.

I go away tomorrow for 3 days and my hubby is in charge, and im worrying myself sick over her.


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

The one losing weight is 155 grams today (day 10) shes 75 grams smaller then her siblings. Shall I just top her up once a day with a bottle? She loves the bottle and really enjoys her feed. (so do I!)


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

yes, cute pic!


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

Yes I would carry on until she's able to lap milk for herself & is eating solid food, then you can relax a little.


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

Thank you both! You have been so helpful, I really really appreciate it xxx


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

You're the one doing all the hard work, you should feel very proud of yourself. I so love that photo with the bottle, so sweet x


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

Biawhiska said:


> You're the one doing all the hard work, you should feel very proud of yourself. I so love that photo with the bottle, so sweet x


I am loving every minute. I am quite sad I will never get to do this again.


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

Well shes enjoying the top up..... Shes put 10 grams on since last night, so im really happy.


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## rottiesloveragdolls (Nov 2, 2007)

*thats brillaint hun keep up the good work  *


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

kitties said:


> I am loving every minute. I am quite sad I will never get to do this again.


Have you thought of being a foster carer for mums and kittens?!


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## Angelic1 (Jun 19, 2009)

Just reading this for the first time...well done you! Glad the little one is ok..loved the picture with the bottle. Hope the little one continues to thrive...probably end up being one of the biggest in the litter! 

Great support and advice from everyone....petforum at it's best!


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

Biawhiska said:


> Have you thought of being a foster carer for mums and kittens?!


no how do we do that?


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

Angelic1 said:


> Just reading this for the first time...well done you! Glad the little one is ok..loved the picture with the bottle. Hope the little one continues to thrive...probably end up being one of the biggest in the litter!
> 
> Great support and advice from everyone....petforum at it's best!


Hear Hear!! .... and thank you x


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## Angelic1 (Jun 19, 2009)

> Quote:
> Originally Posted by Biawhiska
> Have you thought of being a foster carer for mums and kittens?!
> 
> ...


Lol....Looks like you started something now Biawhiska! But what a great idea!


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## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

kitties said:


> no how do we do that?


Get in touch with you local cat's protection, or any local cat rescues... they'd be glad of your help i'm sure.


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

kitties said:


> Hear Hear!! .... and thank you x


Hey, give us some rep then :001_tt2:

What a great idea about being a fosterer! 

If I had a bigger place then I wouldn't hesitate to foster cats. I can't now but that's no reason not to think about the future. At present though, I do have facilities to foster other animals, and would like to do so.


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## kitties (Aug 1, 2009)

MerlinsMum said:


> Hey, give us some rep then :001_tt2:
> 
> What a great idea about being a fosterer!
> 
> If I had a bigger place then I wouldn't hesitate to foster cats. I can't now but that's no reason not to think about the future. At present though, I do have facilities to foster other animals, and would like to do so.


how do i add rep>?


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