# At breaking point now



## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

I have a male Persian cat who has always been clean in house over last month he has started pooing & weeing everywhere. OH is getting to stage were he will make me rehome him. I have put a tray down were they sleep and they have free access threw a cat flap to the outside as well. He can be outside and still come in and do it all over floor. I know it's this 1 as others have all been inside and I have gone to let him in and it's been all over floor. It is now lifting all my floor in there room as it's laminate and he does it in night and during day when we are out so it's soaking into floor. I have scrubbed it I have used some of the odour removal stuff I have had for my dog. Nothing is working. Any more ideas before I have to make the hard decision to let him go. I have 2 kids and can't let it keep happening. :crying::crying:


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## Guest (Feb 27, 2011)

Has he seen a vet to rule out health issues, but also has anything changed in the last few months as inappropriate toileting can be a sign of stress ?


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

They were at vets not long since. There was nothing picked up then. I know about the stress side of it as my other 1 gets stressed when we go away. Nothing has changed. They are on a special diet due to urine infection a couple of years back but that is under control now. So there is nothing to warrant him doing this.


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## Gem16 (Aug 5, 2010)

i have heard about persians having toileting issues before for some reason.
But yes it could be a huge list of things, how many other cats do you have, does he get on with them?
Could he be being bullied outside making him not want to 'go' out there?
I know you said he's been to the vets but there still might be an underlying cause.
Cat's don't suddenly start this behavior for nothing, there is SOMETHING bothering him,are you sure nothing atall has changed in the last month?


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## buffie (May 31, 2010)

My first course of action would be a visit to the vet.You say this has been going on for the past month,was it during this time your cat was at the vet and was he checked with this behaviour in mind.Is he the one who had the urine infection.How old are your cats and are they neutered.As already said this kind of behaviour normally has a "reason" behind it.There may be a cat outside bullying him.


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## Colette (Jan 2, 2010)

I would also suggest a vet visit specifically with this issue in mind. Aside from that, maybe try a feliway diffuser in case it is stress related and maybe cat attract (I think that's what its called) in the litter tray.


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

buffie said:


> My first course of action would be a visit to the vet.You say this has been going on for the past month,was it during this time your cat was at the vet and was he checked with this behaviour in mind.Is he the one who had the urine infection.How old are your cats and are they neutered.As already said this kind of behaviour normally has a "reason" behind it.There may be a cat outside bullying him.


just what I was going to say, persians arent normally allowed outside due to their nature, very laidback, if another cat outside is bullying him he will be highly stressed and will do that inside to 'mark' what is his to stop said bully from coming near him!

Is he neutered? Thats another factor, if he isnt thats what males do to attract a mate!

If he is id def pop outside and look for some other cats that might live near you then buy some feliway and I know it maybe hard keep him inside? one room with the litter tray so he has to use it, not free run of the place?

re-homing a cat that is stressed will only make him worse, and you would have to tell the people who want him what his doing or they will rehome him to!


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

I don't think I can add anything to what's already been advised here. Vets to rule out any physical problem and try the Feliway at the very least. Back to litter training basics, one room with litter tray and food etc. if you see him about to wee pick him up and put him on the tray.
Try changing the litter - he may not like the feel of it if he is used to going outside.
Good luck. I know it's hard especially when you have kids too but there is a reason for his toileting issues, you just need to get to the bottom of it.


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

My daughter's cat, who had always been clean, started toileting inside after her bloody neighbour chucked water at her for going in his garden. Anything could have upset him, or if he is old he could just be going a bit wonky in the head. You need another trip to the vet with this specifically in mind first of all.


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## Gem16 (Aug 5, 2010)

Just saw you got a pup not too long ago, is the cat ok with that?


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## buffie (May 31, 2010)

Kat28 said:


> I have put a tray down were they sleep and they have free access threw a cat flap to the outside as well. He can be outside and still come in and do it all over floor.( I know it's this 1 as others have all been inside and I have gone to let him in and it's been all over floor. )It is now lifting all my floor in there room as it's laminate and he does it in night and during day when we are out so it's soaking into floor. I have scrubbed it I have used some of the odour removal stuff I have had for my dog.


Re-reading this you sayYou know it is him because the others have all been inside when you let him in and it is all over the floor.Where is he when you let him inside and what floor are you talking about.Is he doing this when shut in a room away from everyone.Im confused.


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## Gem16 (Aug 5, 2010)

And how much is 'all over the floor' are you sure their not all having ago? cats tend to do that if they smell someone else has, it could be a cycle where someone had an accident one day, then someone decided to cover the smell, then the 1st one did again etc ..


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

There are no other cats bothering him not had any others in garden since we have had dog. He is neutered was done at six months. The tray is in the room were they are all the time with the cat flap in as well. One of the cats is his brother and the other is a younger female they are all neutered/ spayed. He is 4 yrs old so not old. He has been to the vet as this started so he is ok health wise.


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

buffie said:


> Re-reading this you sayYou know it is him because the others have all been inside when you let him in and it is all over the floor.Where is he when you let him inside and what floor are you talking about.Is he doing this when shut in a room away from everyone.Im confused.


Outside in the garden or conservatory 
The floor of the conservatory were they sleep and have access to outside. My cats have free run of house when they are in so are not shut away from us.


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

Gem16 said:


> And how much is 'all over the floor' are you sure their not all having ago? cats tend to do that if they smell someone else has, it could be a cycle where someone had an accident one day, then someone decided to cover the smell, then the 1st one did again etc ..


No they are not all having a go as I clearly said the others have been in the house when he has done it.


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

Gem16 said:


> i have heard about persians having toileting issues before for some reason.
> But yes it could be a huge list of things, how many other cats do you have, does he get on with them?
> Could he be being bullied outside making him not want to 'go' out there?
> I know you said he's been to the vets but there still might be an underlying cause.
> Cat's don't suddenly start this behavior for nothing, there is SOMETHING bothering him,are you sure nothing atall has changed in the last month?


Yes I am sure


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## Doolally (Oct 12, 2010)

Have you only got the one tray for 3 cats? Some advocate the n plus one rule with one tray for each cat plus one extra, but the most important thing is positioning, they all need to be able to go to the toilet at the same time if needs be without being able to see another cat. Also away from the dog, do the cats have their own space where the dog can't go?


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

Gem16 said:


> Just saw you got a pup not too long ago, is the cat ok with that?


They sleep together and we have had her 6 months now


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

Doolally said:


> Have you only got the one tray for 3 cats? Some advocate the n plus one rule with one tray for each cat plus one extra, but the most important thing is positioning, they all need to be able to go to the toilet at the same time if needs be without being able to see another cat. Also away from the dog, do the cats have their own space where the dog can't go?


Yes they have there own space and the others use outside. They don't use the tray at all.


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## Doolally (Oct 12, 2010)

To be honest, everyone has given a lot of suggestions now, I think if you really want to get to the bottom of this and not rehome him you're going to need a feline behariourist come to your house and assess the whole situation


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## Gem16 (Aug 5, 2010)

Are you sure it's not another cat coming in and doing it? you say there is a cat flap so it's possible.


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

Gem16 said:


> Are you sure it's not another cat coming in and doing it? you say there is a cat flap so it's possible.


No it's not another cat coming in and doing it. As I said before he was in the conservatory on his own did it then scratched to come in house and we don't have any other cats coming in garden since we got the dog


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## Guest (Feb 27, 2011)

just the same as everybody else really, i would take him to the vets as something is making him do this, whether it be medical or psychological. He wouldn't do it for no reason.


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

He has been to vets and he is fine


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## Gem16 (Aug 5, 2010)

So you don't do anything, you just watched him pee and poop? does he even go over to the tray?


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## Gem16 (Aug 5, 2010)

If it isn't medical then it sounds territorial to me, something is making him feel like he needs to show it's his turf. Either a cat, dog or whatever, he is feeling insecure maybe.


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## buffie (May 31, 2010)

Agreed ,a previously clean cat will not just suddenly start being dirty without a reason ,be it physical or psychological,poor cat must be stressing about this ,as cats are by nature clean animals.If you cannot find a cause yourself,which you clearly cant,then I would suggest professional help.The longer this goes on the harder it will be to sort it out.


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

Gem16 said:


> So you don't do anything, you just watched him pee and poop? does he even go over to the tray?


I didn't watch him do it and do nothing. I have stated he was in the conservatory and when I went to let him in he had done it. I would not just stand there and watch him do it. Dont know were you have got that from.


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

Gem16 said:


> If it isn't medical then it sounds territorial to me, something is making him feel like he needs to show it's his turf. Either a cat, dog or whatever, he is feeling insecure maybe.


Nothing ha changed as I have stated before


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

It may be that you're not keeping his litter tray clean enough, it may be that something is happening outside that you're not yet aware of ... there are so many things it could be.

One thing though, if your laminate is the kind of state you describe, you'll need to replace your flooring. If his urine has soaked into the wood/mdf you won't be able to get rid of that I'm afraid. Something that might have started for another reason will now be habbit because he smells the floor and it's now his toilet.

I'd also consult the vet again.


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

buffie said:


> Agreed ,a previously clean cat will not just suddenly start being dirty without a reason ,be it physical or psychological,poor cat must be stressing about this ,as cats are by nature clean animals.If you cannot find a cause yourself,which you clearly cant,then I would suggest professional help.The longer this goes on the harder it will be to sort it out.


He has seen a vet. I have not just left him too it and done nothing. I am not some heartless owner who leaves them 2 it. They are very pampered. There is nothing happened too stress him out as I have stated before.


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Kat28 said:


> He has seen a vet. I have not just left him too it and done nothing. I am not some heartless owner who leaves them 2 it. They are very pampered. There is nothing happened too stress him out as I have stated before.


Kat, with all due respect to the vets out there they don't always get it right. They could well of missed something. It's worth another visit surely?


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

Aurelia said:


> It may be that you're not keeping his litter tray clean enough, it may be that something is happening outside that you're not yet aware of ... there are so many things it could be.
> 
> One thing though, if your laminate is the kind of state you describe, you'll need to replace your flooring. If his urine has soaked into the wood/mdf you won't be able to get rid of that I'm afraid. Something that might have started for another reason will now be habbit because he smells the floor and it's now his toilet.
> 
> I'd also consult the vet again.


His tray is very clean thank you


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## Doolally (Oct 12, 2010)

Kat28 said:


> There is nothing happened too stress him out as I have stated before.


How can you say that so confidently? Maybe nothing obvious to you, but to a cat the slightest thing can be a Big Deal.
You've asked for advice and are dismissing every single thing said to you. I think the answer is in all that has been advised, but if you are so sure it's none of these then you (your cat)need professional help, and anyone worth their money will only see you on a vet's referral.


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

Aurelia said:


> Kat, with all due respect to the vets out there they don't always get it right. They could well of missed something. It's worth another visit surely?


My vet is very good. He has done everything that he can to try and figure out what is going off. There is nothing medically wrong with him to warrant this happening and nothing has changed with in the house over last few weeks


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## buffie (May 31, 2010)

Kat28 said:


> He has seen a vet. I have not just left him too it and done nothing. I am not some heartless owner who leaves them 2 it. They are very pampered. There is nothing happened too stress him out as I have stated before.


When I say professional help this does not just mean veterinary help.I think you need to get to the bottom of the problem which sounds like it needs the help of a behaviourist.I never for 1 minute said you were leaving him to it,I said "if you cant find the cause yourself,which you cant if you have tried all that has been suggested.The only thing left is professional help from a behaviourist.


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

Doolally said:


> How can you say that so confidently? Maybe nothing obvious to you, but to a cat the slightest thing can be a Big Deal.
> You've asked for advice and are dismissing every single thing said to you. I think the answer is in all that has been advised, but if you are so sure it's none of these then you (your cat)need professional help, and anyone worth their money will only see you on a vet's referral.


Because I know what my cats are like. I am not dismissing every thing. I have just answered everyones comments


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## Gem16 (Aug 5, 2010)

Kat i feel like you are annoyed with all we are suggesting even though we are trying to help, there IS something bothering him, cats don't do it for no reason because as stated their very clean animals, we are not insulting you, but there is something stressing him out and we are just trying to figure out what it is


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## BigTourist (Feb 25, 2011)

Kat28 said:


> They were at vets not long since. There was nothing picked up then.


Hi Kat. Do you mean when he was at the vet for something else/check up that it wasn't picked up? If so, the vet may not have been looking for anything wrong with his water works and not noticed it. If you haven't done already, it would be wise to take him to the vet just for this specific reason.

Hope he gets better soon


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## newfiesmum (Apr 21, 2010)

You probably won't agree with what I am going to say, but it could even be your own and your oh's change of attitude toward him that is making matters worse. He may have toileted in the house and you have got stressed about it, which has upset him and you now say that you are at breaking point, worrying about the children, etc, and your husband/boyfriend is talking about getting rid of him, so I doubt he is being very patient. I am not saying it is your fault, just that animals pick up on feelings and if you are stressed, so will the cat be.


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## Guest (Feb 27, 2011)

As i have said previous, cats don't just start doing this behaviour for no reason and we are just trying to advise you on what we think is the best course of action. 

You have said if you dont your OH will get rid of her so you need to do something quickly i take it!!


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## Shimacat (Feb 14, 2010)

Has he been checked by the vet specifically for urinary tract infection? This is NOT something which will be picked up by a routine 'MOT'. To check for UTI, the vet needs as fresh a urine sample as possible, and they test the sample for infection, and also crystals which can form in the bladder, and make urinating very painful.

A vet will not do this test routinely. You'll need to ask them to do it.

Also, if you have recently got a dog - I read that in ano of the comments? - then that is a big change for the cat, and could well be stressing him out.


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## Kat28 (Mar 19, 2008)

Nobody has got stressed with him for doing it. My OH would never do anything to hurt him or upset him. The dog has been here six months now and they are the best of friends so it's nothing to do with her.


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## troublecat (Feb 1, 2011)

Hi, Kat,

If you are stressed then your cat will know it. You don't have to do anything to him for him to pick up on it - just how you react when you see what he's done might be enough. 

Heck, even our body odour changes when we are stressed.

I'm going through a different problem with my new rescues and the people here are very supportive. There will be a reason why your cat is doing this and getting the support of a good behaviourist will sort it out. It's what I am looking into myself.

Good luck, I do feel for you, and your cat too!

TC x


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## jenny armour (Feb 28, 2010)

if the vet has confirmed a clean bill of health then i would say that it is a behaviour problem.
you may find that your cat has been bullied by other cats outside and this is why he is doing this.
feliway can help either try a plug in and/or spray his bedding or anywhere where he is likely to sleep


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## mrswoodwoose (Jan 23, 2011)

Kat28 said:


> He has seen a vet. I have not just left him too it and done nothing. I am not some heartless owner who leaves them 2 it. They are very pampered. There is nothing happened too stress him out as I have stated before.


It may be that you weren't aware of the thing that may have stressed him - if he goes outside anything may have happened out of your eyesight.


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## islandj (Mar 12, 2011)

Hi, I hope you haven't rehomed the cat yet! I know how distressing it can be to have cat toileting problems having had several rescue cats. First of all, if the vet has ruled out a recurrence of the urinary infection (very common, particularly in cats prone to stress), try asking him/her to prescribe a short course of zyklene or similar. This is a bit like prozac for animals.Feliway is also good stuff, but you have to be patient and persistent with it. I know someone else suggested it but another litter tray would probably be a good idea (have you changed litter type recently - sometimes this can throw off toileting habits) and newspaper down until you sort out the prob. Would it be possible to separate this cat from the others for a while? I'm afraid I'm with the other respondents here in saying that something has bothered the cat big time - this kind of behaviour only really occurs in stressed, ill or old cats. Good luck and I really hope you can figure it out. Sometimes its a really small thing that us humans consider crazy - but hey, thats cats for you!!
Without wishing to demoralize you, I have a beautiful, but extremely nervy rescue cat that took me six months to litter train (I don't think she'd ever used one before!) and she still has very occasional accidents if her routine is upset.


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## islandj (Mar 12, 2011)

Hi, I hope you haven't rehomed the cat yet! I know how distressing it can be to have cat toileting problems having had several rescue cats. First of all, if the vet has ruled out a recurrence of the urinary infection (very common, particularly in cats prone to stress), try asking him/her to prescribe a short course of zyklene or similar. This is a bit like prozac for animals.Feliway is also good stuff, but you have to be patient and persistent with it. I know someone else suggested it but another litter tray would probably be a good idea (have you changed litter type recently - sometimes this can throw off toileting habits) and newspaper down until you sort out the prob. Would it be possible to separate this cat from the others for a while? I'm afraid I'm with the other respondents here in saying that something has bothered the cat big time - this kind of behaviour only really occurs in stressed, ill or old cats. Good luck and I really hope you can figure it out. Sometimes its a really small thing that us humans consider crazy - but hey, thats cats for you!!
Without wishing to demoralize you, I have a beautiful, but extremely nervy rescue cat that took me six months to litter train (I don't think she'd ever used one before!) and she still has very occasional accidents if her routine is upset.


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