# Is this person crazy!!!!



## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

3 KITTENS FOR SALE, ONE | Friday-Ad classifieds

SOLD A MALE TORTIE KITTEN FOR £80!!!!! she could of got way more than that!! she obv dont realise how rare they are!!


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## chrissy1982 (Jan 27, 2011)

they are realy rare when 1 was born in our local rescue centre it made the local paper now will my missy have any rare ones as shes tortie and she mated with a pure ginger and girl ginger cats are rare arent they


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

So rare that I'd say someone doesn't know that they have bought a female 
Red (ginger) girls are uncommon but certainly not as rare as tortie boys.


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## buffie (May 31, 2010)

Was just about to suggest the same thing


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## gloworm*mushroom (Mar 4, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> 3 KITTENS FOR SALE, ONE | Friday-Ad classifieds
> 
> SOLD A MALE TORTIE KITTEN FOR £80!!!!! she could of got way more than that!! she obv dont realise how rare they are!!


Rare yes, but still just the same as any other cat. I don't see why anyone would pay more.

And yes its probably a girl, or if it is a boy, its a boy who could come with illnesses related to his genetic defect.

So yes why would anyone pay 'more' for a cat which is sadly likely to be ill?

On another note, red girls are apparently 25% of all red cats, nowhere near as rare as 'tortie boys'. They are just harder to get genetically, not a product of a genetic problem.


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

ive never heard of one before! especially for sale! im sure someone would pay more for it that £80, as just because its a male tortie doesnt mean it is definitely going to be ill and have problems


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## gloworm*mushroom (Mar 4, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> ive never heard of one before! especially for sale! im sure someone would pay more for it that £80, as just because its a male tortie doesnt mean it is definitely going to be ill and have problems


Why would they pay more? Just to show the cat off?

As it is a male tortie is has some syndrome called Klinefelters (sp) which can lead to various problems. So no, I wouldnt pay 'more' for a rare moggy which could have health issues.


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

id want to buy it to stop people from buying it to breed from it lots to try and get another.

well people pay lots of money for pedigrees that can have health issues dont they?


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## gloworm*mushroom (Mar 4, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> id want to buy it to stop people from buying it to breed from it lots to try and get another.


hahah they'd have a hard job, all male torties are infertile 



> well people pay lots of money for pedigrees that can have health issues dont they?


Nope, they don't if you buy from a good breeder, and I would never suggest getting a ped from a non reputable breeder


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## missmoomoo (Jul 23, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> well people pay lots of money for pedigrees that can have health issues dont they?


well to be fair any responsible breeder will have health tested animals and make sure that the stud also has this any that don't pass the health tests wouldn't be getting bred from!


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

i know they are, so if they were to be bought by someone that does not know this they may cause the animal a lot of stress by trying to get them to breed when it is impossible.

yer im doing a lot of research into the breeds i like, but i find a lot of contradictions, like one place said that scottish folds were a very natural breed. then for me to look it up and see all of the problems they have i was well and truely put off them.


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## gloworm*mushroom (Mar 4, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> yer im doing a lot of research into the breeds i like, but i find a lot of contradictions, like one place said that scottish folds were a very natural breed. then for me to look it up and see all of the problems they have i was well and truely put off them.


But surely someone who knew how rare a male tortie is would know they are infertile... They'd have to have a pretty low IQ to be aware of the uber rareness and not realise the impact that had on the genetics and fertility. I mean if they really wanted to breed more male torties they would be better purchasing the mother and father of the male tortie kitten in order to try and replicate.

There is a difference between breeding pedigree cats for various reasons, and breeding cats with genetic mutations, Scottish folds are a result of genetic mutations (which with it comes many issues with folds)

Munchkin cats (and the various other 'dwarf' cats) are also results of people breeding for genetic anomalies. Not something I would consider a responsible act.


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

exactly! people like that are trying there go at breeding when they shouldnt.

my neighbour had a cat that suffered from dwarfism and never considered breeding from it and i would not let them. people just want them to look certain ways that its not fair on the cats.

i was watching a program and it had a lot about american curls and in this place called key west they had polydactyl cats that they breed only in that location but it didnt seem right at all.


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

missmoomoo said:


> well to be fair any responsible breeder will have health tested animals and make sure that the stud also has this any that don't pass the health tests wouldn't be getting bred from!


i know but there is a lot of back yard breeders nowadays


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## gloworm*mushroom (Mar 4, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> i know but there is a lot of back yard breeders nowadays


But thats a very separate issue  You said people pay a lot for pedigrees which are 'unhealthy'

A badly bred pedigree could be unhealthy. A badly bred moggy could be unhealthy, as could ANY badly bred animal 

That is a problem with poor breeding, not a problem with pedigrees.


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

i think it needs to be raised more awareness of bad breeding as if a novice was to decided they wanted a pedigree they would not always know what signs to look at when buying the breed, like what health checks it should of had etc


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## missmoomoo (Jul 23, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> i know but there is a lot of back yard breeders nowadays


thats why thorough research is paramount


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

missmoomoo said:


> thats why thorough research is paramount


 yer, im starting my research now and i prob wont get my own dog or cat for another 10 years


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## Emma-Jayne (Apr 23, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> exactly! people like that are trying there go at breeding when they shouldnt.
> 
> my neighbour had a cat that suffered from dwarfism and never considered breeding from it and i would not let them. people just want them to look certain ways that its not fair on the cats.
> 
> *i was watching a program and it had a lot about american curls and in this place called key west they had polydactyl cats that they breed only in that location but it didnt seem right at all.*


Are you refering to 'Must love cats' That show which included the polydactyl cats of Key west showed how they were mostly strays and not being bred in breeding programs. They were more common in that area due to a legend of one landing there off a ship and passing this anomaly(?) to the area by mating with local strays.

Post 666 LOL

Em xxx


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

yer i saw it and was like that is not normal, their must be something wrong with them being like that


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## Milly Cat (Nov 20, 2010)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> yer i saw it and was like that is not normal, their must be something wrong with them being like that


As far as I am aware polydactyly doesn't have any ill effects (apart from looking a little freaky sometimes!) A friend of mine had a polydactyl cat and he was fine apart from looking like he had a pair of mittens on  Humans are born with extra fingers and toes but they are usually removed for cosmetic reasons.


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

thats good. on the program i remember seeing them having to make sure the nails are clipped as they are more prone to problems with overgrown nails is what they said


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## dagny0823 (Oct 20, 2009)

gloworm*mushroom said:


> But surely someone who knew how rare a male tortie is would know they are infertile... They'd have to have a pretty low IQ to be aware of the uber rareness and not realise the impact that had on the genetics and fertility.


Oh I don't know about that. Well, yeah, there are a lot of low IQ's out there, so I totally agree .....but I think there are also a lot of people who know *of* genetic abnormalities and the like, but have no idea what that really means. For instance, we know a couple who like to think they are educated on cat things. They really want a munchkin, however, because it's just so darned cute . They have no idea how the munchkin got that way or that there could be problems with it---they just want a wee tiny cat that looks unusual and is rare. I don't think they're an anomaly, unfortunately.


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## gloworm*mushroom (Mar 4, 2011)

dagny0823 said:


> Oh I don't know about that. Well, yeah, there are a lot of low IQ's out there, so I totally agree .....but I think there are also a lot of people who know *of* genetic abnormalities and the like, but have no idea what that really means. For instance, we know a couple who like to think they are educated on cat things. They really want a munchkin, however, because it's just so darned cute . They have no idea how the munchkin got that way or that there could be problems with it---they just want a wee tiny cat that looks unusual and is rare. I don't think they're an anomaly, unfortunately.


Maybe I give people too much credit. With female torties being fairly common I guess I just don't see why its so exciting to have a tortie with balls ya know! lol

And how can you NOT assume that its an anomoly. Cats are not ferrets!


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

excuse me but are you calling me stupid or something?


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## gloworm*mushroom (Mar 4, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> excuse me but are you calling me stupid or something?


Excuse me but who are you referring to?


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

both of you


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

because i did know they were infertile, but i know of others who do not know as much as me that do not know that they are infertile


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## gloworm*mushroom (Mar 4, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> both of you


Well as you said you knew male torties were infertile, then probably not.

We are talking about peoples ignorance of genetic abnormalities, not about you at all really. Not sure why you think that. 



> because i did know they were infertile, but i know of others who do not know as much as me that do not know that they are infertile


So why would we be talking about you? And if you know them, and know they do not know this piece of info about male torties, you could tell them


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

my girl had a female tortie and when she was old enough we gave her and a grey one to my uncle (I was only little at the time and it was an accidental litter from our rescue cat. . .we were wrongly informed "HE" had been done . . turned out SHE was a girl and wasn't aaaaaaaaanyway) but yeah we gave 2 of the kittens to my uncle when they were old enough to leave mummy and they were lovely cats but someone stole the tortie from his garden. . . he had a cat proof garden. . .but obviously not a robber-proof garden


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

sorry im just not in a good mental place today, taking everything the wrong way.


yer i do tell them, im known as the crazy cat person as i could talk about cats all day and know loads about them. so they normally have to tell me to shut up coz ill go on and on and on hahah


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

Nico0laGouldsmith said:


> my girl had a female tortie and when she was old enough we gave her and a grey one to my uncle (I was only little at the time and it was an accidental litter from our rescue cat. . .we were wrongly informed "HE" had been done . . turned out SHE was a girl and wasn't aaaaaaaaanyway) but yeah we gave 2 of the kittens to my uncle when they were old enough to leave mummy and they were lovely cats but someone stole the tortie from his garden. . . he had a cat proof garden. . .but obviously not a robber-proof garden


i had that happen to me! they got the genders round the wrong way. so as they both had been done and were of an older age you could not easy tell. so the he turned out to be a she and the she turned out to be a he hahah.


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## gloworm*mushroom (Mar 4, 2011)

Nico0laGouldsmith said:


> my girl had a female tortie and when she was old enough we gave her and a grey one to my uncle (I was only little at the time and it was an accidental litter from our rescue cat. . .we were wrongly informed "HE" had been done . . turned out SHE was a girl and wasn't aaaaaaaaanyway) but yeah we gave 2 of the kittens to my uncle when they were old enough to leave mummy and they were lovely cats but someone stole the tortie from his garden. . . he had a cat proof garden. . .but obviously not a robber-proof garden


Maybe people see them as being 'fancy' colours, the same way that torties and tabbys get snapped up from rescues and the poor black and bnw mogs stay there.

Or that people think tortie and tabby are breeds


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## pippa234 (Jul 17, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> because i did know they were infertile, but i know of others who do not know as much as me that do not know that they are infertile


OOps, I thought it was common knowledge about Torties and males and their rareness and Gingers??.. maybe as a 'non breeder' even I knew the facts.. but hey ho..
Maybe that's just cos i'm an oldie and pay attention .. it's just fact I thought???


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

gloworm*mushroom said:


> Maybe people see them as being 'fancy' colours, the same way that torties and tabbys get snapped up from rescues and the poor black and bnw mogs stay there.
> 
> Or that people think tortie and tabby are breeds


i can never understand that! if i was to get a kitten the first one i would go for would be black and bnw. silly people!

tortie and tabby a breed! people need to be more educated!


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## gloworm*mushroom (Mar 4, 2011)

pippa234 said:


> OOps, I thought it was common knowledge about Torties and males and their rareness and Gingers??.. maybe as a 'non breeder' even I knew the facts.. but hey ho..
> Maybe that's just cos i'm an oldie and pay attention .. it's just fact I thought???


I never knew about ginger females being rare as Gloworms mum is exactly the same as him lol. not as rare as the male torties though I suppose.

But yeah I'd assume if you knew enough that they were rare, you would know why they are rare.


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## gloworm*mushroom (Mar 4, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> i can never understand that! if i was to get a kitten the first one i would go for would be black and bnw. silly people!
> 
> tortie and tabby a breed! people need to be more educated!


I know when I was a kid I always wanted my animals to have 'as many colours as possible' (I am talking like 6, I had a lot of toy cats and I am fairly sure they were all calico coloured lol)


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## pippa234 (Jul 17, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> i can never understand that! if i was to get a kitten the first one i would go for would be black and bnw. silly people!
> 
> tortie and tabby a breed! people need to be more educated!


No, people need to stop judging on colour hmy: lol


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## pippa234 (Jul 17, 2011)

gloworm*mushroom said:


> I know when I was a kid I always wanted my animals to have 'as many colours as possible' (I am talking like 6, I had a lot of toy cats and I am fairly sure they were all calico coloured lol)


So tempted... lol


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## gloworm*mushroom (Mar 4, 2011)

pippa234 said:


> So tempted... lol


Tempted by what lol? A calico or to pick on me for my strange childhood


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## Nico0laGouldsmith (Apr 23, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> i had that happen to me! they got the genders round the wrong way. so as they both had been done and were of an older age you could not easy tell. so the he turned out to be a she and the she turned out to be a he hahah.


It happened to us twice both as young ones from rescues "this is a boy and he's been done" and not really knowing what the boys back ends look like after the surgery we believed them!
they both had boy's names that ended up sticking anyway (todd and simba) simba is still with us and i wouldnt change her for the world


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

i have always loved black and bnw cats. i tend not to go for colour now, i go for personality of the cat


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## pippa234 (Jul 17, 2011)

gloworm*mushroom said:


> I never knew about ginger females being rare as Gloworms mum is exactly the same as him lol. not as rare as the male torties though I suppose.
> 
> But yeah I'd assume if you knew enough that they were rare, you would know why they are rare.


I'm guessing I'm just old hun lol I just knew that just like I knew it was wrong to not say thank you, not really sure though where it came from!! xx


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

Nico0laGouldsmith said:


> It happened to us twice both as young ones from rescues "this is a boy and he's been done" and not really knowing what the boys back ends look like after the surgery we believed them!
> they both had boy's names that ended up sticking anyway (todd and simba) simba is still with us and i wouldnt change her for the world


yer i couldnt change mines names coz that would be more confusing


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## pippa234 (Jul 17, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> i have always loved black and bnw cats. i tend not to go for colour now, i go for personality of the cat


lol  laughing on a pet forum :huh:


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

pippa234 said:


> lol  laughing on a pet forum :huh:


why you laughing?


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## pippa234 (Jul 17, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> why you laughing?


Just a little bit of irony i saw in the post..


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

sorry but what?


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## we love bsh's (Mar 28, 2011)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> id want to buy it to stop people from buying it to breed from it lots to try and get another.
> 
> well people pay lots of money for pedigrees that can have health issues dont they?


they couldnt breed from a male tortie though as they are sterile i believe.


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## we love bsh's (Mar 28, 2011)

gloworm*mushroom said:


> hahah they'd have a hard job, all male torties are infertile
> 
> Nope, they don't if you buy from a good breeder, and I would never suggest getting a ped from a non reputable breeder


lol i see you have beat me to that reply


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## alisondalziel (Oct 8, 2008)

Going back to the very 1st post...

In my mind the seller wasn't crazy at all! Why charge more for a colour!

It really pi$$es me off when breeders charge more for a certain colour, or sex when it's essentially the same species, grrr!! :cursing:

The most important thing to remember when re-homing any animal is to choose the most suitable home, the home you most believe will be the most loving, and most likely to be forever.

Price has to come after this...

IMHO i really believe they should all be priced the same from any one breeder, there's no need for charging more for a certain colour etc, ridiculous!!


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## dagny0823 (Oct 20, 2009)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> excuse me but are you calling me stupid or something?


Uh, no.

I'm calling people like the folks we know who just want a "rare" or "unusual" or 
"offbeat" cat just for the rareness of it, but don't bother to find out anything else, stupid. It's pretty stupid to say "oooh, I want a munchkin next because it's so tiny and nobody else has one so people will think I'm cool".


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## MrRustyRead (Mar 14, 2011)

dagny0823 said:


> Uh, no.
> 
> I'm calling people like the folks we know who just want a "rare" or "unusual" or
> "offbeat" cat just for the rareness of it, but don't bother to find out anything else, stupid. It's pretty stupid to say "oooh, I want a munchkin next because it's so tiny and nobody else has one so people will think I'm cool".


when i first heard of scottish folds and munchkins, i thought awww i want one! but then i looked them up and saw all of the problems and thought no way am i paying money for a cat that has so many health problems coz it will encourage the breeder to breed more of them. really aint fair on the cat.


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## dagny0823 (Oct 20, 2009)

jimbo_28_02 said:


> when i first heard of scottish folds and munchkins, i thought awww i want one! but then i looked them up and saw all of the problems and thought no way am i paying money for a cat that has so many health problems coz it will encourage the breeder to breed more of them. really aint fair on the cat.


I first heard about Scottish folds when I read the "Cat Who Went to Paris" series and was really impressed by this cat's personality. Apparently as a breed they are super sweet and affectionate and I would love to have one for that reason. But I did the same thing and found out they are prone to all sorts of problems, so I wouldn't want to encourage their breeding by buying one.

Incidentally, the author of the series didn't know either--he received his kitten, at 7 weeks old, as a gift from his gf. He had never liked cats and so it is a lovely tale of how someone could go from knowing absolutely nothing and having everything done wrong from the start and turning it into a beautiful relationship. The final book makes me sob like a baby every time I read it and it's brought me a lot of comfort when I've lost one of my own. Sorry for the sidetrack


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