# Getting started in showing



## Dogless

I took Kilo back to visit his breeders again yesterday (they like to see him!) and they asked me again whether or not I would show him(always do - but not in a hassling way I hasten to add!) as they say he is looking fantastic. I said as I usually do that I wouldn't know where to start with the handling and I feel that I wouldn't do him justice - so they asked that if they handled him would I let him do a show.

This is no problem at all to me, it would make them happy and I would also enjoy seeing him shown. I go to shows to admire all the dogs sometimes but have never really taken an interest in learning more about showing. The breeders do remove their dogs from the ring if they are uncomfortable etc so I know if he hated it then they wouldn't try to make him do anything.

Yesterday I asked what I needed to do to help them and was shown how to trot with him and lengthen my stride and also to get people Kilo doesn't know to look at his teeth as only myself and the vet look at them at present.

The grooming is easy - peasy and they said he was in perfect condition with good muscle tone and stood really naturally as he was 'so well put together' - I can see there is a whole new language to learn too.

So...to the point of my post - what else do I need to do to help? Are there any books etc that you would recommend (I am a geek) to understand things a little better? If Kilo enjoys it then I may consider carrying on showing in which case I would get myself to ringcraft classes, but TBH the show world has never really appealed!!

Any advice for me from you experienced people?


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## Devil-Dogz

I would personally attend ring classes before the first show - just so you can see how he acts in such enviroments, around other dogs.

Like breeders have said, just work on his movement - getting him to move well on the lead, turning corners ect on command, stopping on command and standing when asked.
Also working on his stand, standing him correctly and a period of time..getting people to go over him is great advice, not just teeth but from behind and the like to.

Just make it fun for him lots of praise and treats ...


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## viz

Welcome to the world of dog showing - it is really addictive, I only thought I would give it a try and now two years on I have enjoyed every minute. Ringcraft is great fun as you get to see a range of dogs and meet a lot of people who share a love for dogs, which can be really interesting and you can learn a lot. Someone gave me the book Positive Training for Show Dogs: Building a Relationship for Success which is interesting as it uses the clicker to help train your dog for the show, otherwise watching others showing/handling is a great way to learn. 

Good luck with your dog


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## Dogless

Devil-Dogz said:


> I would personally attend ring classes before the first show - just so you can see how he acts in such enviroments, around other dogs.
> 
> Like breeders have said, just work on his movement - getting him to move well on the lead, turning corners ect on command, stopping on command and standing when asked.
> Also working on his stand, standing him correctly and a period of time..getting people to go over him is great advice, not just teeth but from behind and the like to.
> 
> Just make it fun for him lots of praise and treats ...





viz said:


> Welcome to the world of dog showing - it is really addictive, I only thought I would give it a try and now two years on I have enjoyed every minute. Ringcraft is great fun as you get to see a range of dogs and meet a lot of people who share a love for dogs, which can be really interesting and you can learn a lot. Someone gave me the book Positive Training for Show Dogs: Building a Relationship for Success which is interesting as it uses the clicker to help train your dog for the show, otherwise watching others showing/handling is a great way to learn.
> 
> Good luck with your dog


Thank you both; some very helpful advice - he will stand on command but all the rest I will have to work on!!


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## kaisa624

We use one treat only for shows and show practise as our breeder told us it helps them associate that with working, if you get me.

I have "showing your dog" book I think is what it's called. We started with fun shows, and just getting Holly used to being gone over before she was 6 months, so get Kilo used to randomers going over him etc... Ermm, not sure what else...


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## Dogless

kaisa624 said:


> We use one treat only for shows and show practise as our breeder told us it helps them associate that with working, if you get me.
> 
> I have "showing your dog" book I think is what it's called. We started with fun shows, and just getting Holly used to being gone over before she was 6 months, so get Kilo used to randomers going over him etc... Ermm, not sure what else...


The one treat is a good idea .

The problem with lots of randomers is that they are often afraid of Kilo..will find some fans of large dogs and enlist them maybe!


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## kaisa624

You should get my OH to help haha, he's near you till Tues


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## Tigerneko

Dogless said:


> The one treat is a good idea .
> 
> The problem with lots of randomers is that they are often afraid of Kilo..will find some fans of large dogs and enlist them maybe!


Where abouts in North Yorkshire are you? I am on the Lancs/Yorkshire border and i'd help if you're having trouble finding folk, I love big dogs and don't see enough of them where I am - we're all Yorkies and Cavs!

Don't have much show knowledge but i'd be happy to be a 'randomer' for you :lol:


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## sailor

Can`t give any advice as I know nothing about showing dogs, but wishing the best of luck 

As mentioned take Kilo to some shows, just to see what he thinks of the atmosphere etc and I bet loads of people will want to admire him and this will also means he has lots of strangers "handling" him, if you always give them a treat to hand to Kilo, he will soon associate all those strange hands with treats, so more likely to welcome any sttrange hands near his mouth and teeth in the furture... altho he might try to nibble them also lol 

It might not appeal to you, but I think intil you get truly involved in things you know little about, you don`t know if they really are for you or not.
In a few years you might be a complete show dog freak with rosettes everywhere


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## kaisa624

We're on the Lancs/Yorks border... However I think you said you'd be away when I'm up...


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## Dogless

Verbatim said:


> Where abouts in North Yorkshire are you? I am on the Lancs/Yorkshire border and i'd help if you're having trouble finding folk, I love big dogs and don't see enough of them where I am - we're all Yorkies and Cavs!
> 
> Don't have much show knowledge but i'd be happy to be a 'randomer' for you :lol:


I am near to Harrogate; will have a think ref randomers but any offers are appreciated!!


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## Dogless

sailor said:


> Can`t give any advice as I know nothing about showing dogs, but wishing the best of luck
> 
> As mentioned take Kilo to some shows, just to see what he thinks of the atmosphere etc and I bet loads of people will want to admire him and this will also means he has lots of strangers "handling" him, if you always give them a treat to hand to Kilo, he will soon associate all those strange hands with treats, so more likely to welcome any sttrange hands near his mouth and teeth in the furture... altho he might try to nibble them also lol
> 
> It might not appeal to you, but I think intil you get truly involved in things you know little about, you don`t know if they really are for you or not.
> In a few years you might be a complete show dog freak with rosettes everywhere


I am certainly not knocking showing...just never really thought about it before is all which is why it has never appealed. Will certainly take him to a few - I do anyway, just to look at the lovely dogs (and buy toys for him ) but will take a little more notice of the protocol and how people are handling in the ring. I'm glad that he will be handled for me I think first time out just to see how a professional does it!!


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## Dogless

kaisa624 said:


> We're on the Lancs/Yorks border... However I think you said you'd be away when I'm up...


I am unfortunately I think .


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## swarthy

If his breeders believe he should be shown - then I would definitely give it a go  Whilst it is easy to be 'kennel blind' - no breeder wants their dog on show in the ring unless it is a good representation of the breed 

It IS addictive - you are very lucky in some ways if his breeders are offering to start him off in the ring - presumably you will go along to watch.

What I would say is this, if he starts to do well, you could well start to feel that you want to be in there in the ring with him - it's nice seeing your dog achieve something - but there's nothing like being at the other end of the lead when it does 

Try a couple of ringcraft classes to start off - and maybe even pop along to a couple of shows - but you are, IMO, extremely lucky that his breeders are offering to kick-start his show career by taking him into the ring - go for it - and remember - enjoy 

Let us know how he gets on (and when you are likely to add number 2 because you enjoy it so much )

ETA - as you are a novice - it would be easy for me to post a load of links to all the show websites you can enter online / get schedules for - but I would speak to the breeders first and see which shows they want you to enter to start off with, and then go from there - if you do need pointing in the direction of schedule locations - just shout


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## Dogless

swarthy said:


> If his breeders believe he should be shown - then I would definitely give it a go  Whilst it is easy to be 'kennel blind' - no breeder wants their dog on show in the ring unless it is a good representation of the breed
> 
> It IS addictive - you are very lucky in some ways if his breeders are offering to start him off in the ring - presumably you will go along to watch.
> 
> What I would say is this, if he starts to do well, you could well start to feel that you want to be in there in the ring with him - it's nice seeing your dog achieve something - but there's nothing like being at the other end of the lead when it does
> 
> Try a couple of ringcraft classes to start off - and maybe even pop along to a couple of shows - but you are, IMO, extremely lucky that his breeders are offering to kick-start his show career by taking him into the ring - go for it - and remember - enjoy
> 
> Let us know how he gets on (and when you are likely to add number 2 because you enjoy it so much )
> 
> ETA - as you are a novice - it would be easy for me to post a load of links to all the show websites you can enter online / get schedules for - but I would speak to the breeders first and see which shows they want you to enter to start off with, and then go from there - if you do need pointing in the direction of schedule locations - just shout


Swarthy thank you for your help and advice, very welcome as I am a total novice (clearly!!). I do appreciate that I am extremely lucky to have such supportive breeders and the fact that they are offering so much support is really superb so I certainly want to help them as best I can. I am definately going to be there and will certainly learn all that I can. Kilo's littermate (bitch) is winning BPIS at every show she has entered so far or Best Puppy Bitch at the last one so they must think Kilo has potential too.

They asked me if I would show at 4 months (I said I would think, but just didn't feel confident enough) but didn't apply pressure. I gave the same answer yesterday which led to their offer. I would like to be in the ring with him of course, but don't think my handling skills would do the breeders justice at present...I am willing to put in the effort to learn though should I decide to carry on.

ETA; actually Swarthy, is there some sort of database of ringcraft classes? I may be being a tad thick but couldn't find any when i did a club search on the KC website !!

EDITED AGAIN; I was being thick; found some .


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## swarthy

Dogless said:


> ETA; actually Swarthy, is there some sort of database of ringcraft classes? I may be being a tad thick but couldn't find any when i did a club search on the KC website !!
> 
> EDITED AGAIN; I was being thick; found some .


You are not being thick at all - details of ring craft classes are notoriously difficult to find - if you have a link it would be quite useful if you could post it on here as it might help others 

The only note of caution I would use with RC classes is that some instances, they are not always familiar with how every breed should be stood in the ring - for example, Labs are free standing - whereas the not dissimilar Goldie is 'stacked' - I have seen people in the Lab showring stacking their dogs because this is what the RC class has taught them.

What breed have you got? (sorry if I have missed it )


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## Dogless

swarthy said:


> You are not being thick at all - details of ring craft classes are notoriously difficult to find - if you have a link it would be quite useful if you could post it on here as it might help others
> 
> The only note of caution I would use with RC classes is that some instances, they are not always familiar with how every breed should be stood in the ring - for example, Labs are free standing - whereas the not dissimilar Goldie is 'stacked' - I have seen people in the Lab showring stacking their dogs because this is what the RC class has taught them.
> 
> What breed have you got? (sorry if I have missed it )


I have a Rhodesian Ridgeback; luckily he stands naturally apparently as he is well put together (need a dictionary for show speak!!) and I had a go at doing it yesterday whilst the breeders patiently explained how he should look . They took some photos so I can try to achieve the same. I don't think I can make the classes they recommend as it is slightly too far to go after work but I certainly need guidance. I have only ever gone to shows to research breeds / breeders and buy things; wish I had concentrated on watching some of the handlers closely now rather than the dogs!!!

Let me look for the website I found and post a link.


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## Dogless

The file of ringcraft classes just opens as a PDF; anyone clever tell me how to put that on here at all? It is 7 pages so a copy and paste wouldn't be very practical .


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## swarthy

Dogless said:


> wish I had concentrated on watching some of the handlers closely now rather than the dogs!!!


If it's any consolation - first couple of shows I went to - we started with our pet bitch while we were waiting for our first showbred pup - I just dived straight in there and did it 

You have an opportunity that many would be jealous of - and I wish you the best of luck.

I judged two very nice Rhodesian Ridgebacks at a show last year - dogwise there was very little to chose between them - but quite clearly one of the owners hadn't done any handling practice and hadn't established the best way to move her dog - and rightly or wrongly - this comes across loudly and clearly when you are assessing the dog - even if she did see this, I am sure she wouldn't mind, as we did have a chat afterwards and I advised her to find a training class if she wanted to show at a higher level and she observed the other handler who clearly wasn't doing it for the first time 

In my limited experience of the breed - moving a RRB really is key - and it sounds like you are having excellent advice and guidance from the right people


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## Freyja

swarthy said:


> You are not being thick at all - details of ring craft classes are notoriously difficult to find - if you have a link it would be quite useful if you could post it on here as it might help others
> 
> The only note of caution I would use with RC classes is that some instances, they are not always familiar with how every breed should be stood in the ring - for example, Labs are free standing - whereas the not dissimilar Goldie is 'stacked' - I have seen people in the Lab showring stacking their dogs because this is what the RC class has taught them.
> 
> What breed have you got? (sorry if I have missed it )


I agree with the comment about some RC classes not being familar with some breeds. I take Buck to our ringcraft and put him on the table. Italian greyhounds pretty much free stand on the table but one man who went over him moved his feet so he was stacked like I would my whippets. On his defence he hadn't seen me with Buck before so presumably thought he was just a whippet pup. This was a man who moaned at me for asking if his long coated dachsie was a dog or a bitch before I felt underneath it. He then procceeded to call Buck a bitch. Not as if he had anything to hide his dangly bits


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## swarthy

Dogless said:


> The file of ringcraft classes just opens as a PDF; anyone clever tell me how to put that on here at all? It is 7 pages so a copy and paste wouldn't be very practical .


There should be a web-address at the top of the PDF document that you can post - I am really intrigued now - the amount of queries we get for RC classes and nothing to direct them to.

Alternatively - if you do File > Properties - you should see a weblink there you can copy and paste


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## Dogless

swarthy said:


> If it's any consolation - first couple of shows I went to - we started with our pet bitch while we were waiting for our first showbred pup - I just dived straight in there and did it
> 
> You have an opportunity that many would be jealous of - and I wish you the best of luck.
> 
> I judged two very nice Rhodesian Ridgebacks at a show last year - dogwise there was very little to chose between them - but quite clearly one of the owners hadn't done any handling practice and hadn't established the best way to move her dog - and rightly or wrongly - this comes across loudly and clearly when you are assessing the dog - even if she did see this, I am sure she wouldn't mind, as we did have a chat afterwards and I advised her to find a training class if she wanted to show at a higher level and she observed the other handler who clearly wasn't doing it for the first time
> 
> In my limited experience of the breed - moving a RRB really is key - and it sounds like you are having excellent advice and guidance from the right people


I am receiving brilliant guidance and do know that I am being given a golden opportunity; the breeder and her son are judges and have obviously been handling for a very long time so I am extremely lucky that they want my pup to be shown enough to offer to handle him for me. I bought my pup with no intention of showing but chose the breeder for their ethics and obvious commitment to the welfare of the breed and love for their own dogs.

I know we all have to start somewhere and am willing to put the work in, just hate being the new, clueless person...got lots of advice on moving a RR and will work on lengthening my stride!!


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## swarthy

Dogless said:


> I know we all have to start somewhere and am willing to put the work in, just hate being the new, clueless person...got lots of advice on moving a RR and will work on lengthening my stride!!


We have ALL been there - everyone has to start somewhere


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## Dogless

swarthy said:


> There should be a web-address at the top of the PDF document that you can post - I am really intrigued now - the amount of queries we get for RC classes and nothing to direct them to.
> 
> Alternatively - if you do File > Properties - you should see a weblink there you can copy and paste


It is a KC document but just downloads as a PDF immediately without a web address at the top. If I copy the link I clicked to get the document it sends you to the blank regional club search page, not the whole list . The properties say that content copying is 'allowed' so could do a huge cut and paste post.

Otherwise if you PM me your email address I could send you it as an attachment.


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## kaisa624

We got confused when we started showing Holly, as we were always told that she was to be stacked, however we have learnt at our second show (breed show), that she was to be stacked on the table, but freestanding in the ring, which we fail at...

Good luck hun, you are lucky to have your breeders behind you


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## swarthy

Dogless said:


> It is a KC document but just downloads as a PDF immediately without a web address at the top. If I copy the link I clicked to get the document it sends you to the blank regional club search page, not the whole list . The properties say that content copying is 'allowed' so could do a huge cut and paste post.
> 
> Otherwise if you PM me your email address I could send you it as an attachment.


If it is on a KC webpage - do you have the link to the webpage?

The other option is paste a few of the direct words on here from the PDF - this should help me find it on Google and we may be able to track back to the link page from that 

_Think that makes sense _


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## Dogless

swarthy said:


> If it is on a KC webpage - do you have the link to the webpage?
> 
> The other option is paste a few of the direct words on here from the PDF - this should help me find it on Google and we may be able to track back to the link page from that
> 
> _Think that makes sense _


It does...the link trackback sends you to the search function which only gives you regional results (I am a bit dim though at times)!! This is the google search result:
[PDF] Ringcraft Training Clubs
File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - Quick View
Frampton Cottrell & District Ringcraft Club Gloucestershire. Mrs S Crowther .... Otley Canine Society. West Yorkshire. Mrs A *****. 01132 843766 ...
The Kennel Club...


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## babycham2002

I only started showing just over a year ago and I am totally addicted, I love it
This little book is good, Showing Your Dog: A Beginner&#39;s Guide: Amazon.co.uk: Elaine Everest: Books

although I know want
Showing Dogs: The Exhibitors&#39; Guide: Amazon.co.uk: Juliette Cunliffe: Books

You're already halfway there with having great breeders and a lovely dog 
Just some ringcraft and getting out in the field now 
Companion show would give you some practice as well


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## Dogless

babycham2002 said:


> I only started showing just over a year ago and I am totally addicted, I love it
> This little book is good, Showing Your Dog: A Beginner's Guide: Amazon.co.uk: Elaine Everest: Books
> 
> although I know want
> Showing Dogs: The Exhibitors' Guide: Amazon.co.uk: Juliette Cunliffe: Books
> 
> You're already halfway there with having great breeders and a lovely dog
> Just some ringcraft and getting out in the field now
> Companion show would give you some practice as well


Thank you - will take a look at the beginner's guide .


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## swarthy

This is the nearest I could get 

The Kennel Club- Find a Dog Club


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## Dogless

Swarthy; I was being thick; just realised you can attach a file, not just pictures .


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## babycham2002

Hmmmm just found that second book on ebay for a fiver inc postage, so i treated myself to one
Bad Kilo's mum


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## Dogless

babycham2002 said:


> Hmmmm just found that second book on ebay for a fiver inc postage, so i treated myself to one
> Bad Kilo's mum


And you made me get the first one .


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## ballybee

The pup i'm getting is for showing  i thought i might as well give it a go and the breeder is going to help me with all the things i need to learn  the nearest ringcraft class to me is still pretty far to travel with a pup but we'll see how it goes, i've been training Tummel to stand on command for practice but every time i say stand he sits down  think he's just being cheeky 

You should definately show Kilo...then you can tell me how it goes 

This thread is very interesting


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## Dogless

ballybee said:


> The pup i'm getting is for showing  i thought i might as well give it a go and the breeder is going to help me with all the things i need to learn  the nearest ringcraft class to me is still pretty far to travel with a pup but we'll see how it goes, i've been training Tummel to stand on command for practice but every time i say stand he sits down  think he's just being cheeky
> 
> You should definately show Kilo...then you can tell me how it goes
> 
> This thread is very interesting


Not sure how I feel as I had never considered it at all. I will see (first and foremost) if Kilo likes it; if not I certainly won't pursue it. I'm just going to do my very best to help get Kilo ready for the breeder for the first show and maybe carry it on - really don't know!!.

He will stand on command and stands still to be brushed so I am just working on it. I will get to ringcraft to see how he fares in that environment but am a bit nervous about the whole thing.

I have to admit that I have received some excellent advice on this thread  and I am very fortunate to be so supported by Kilo's breeder.


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## ridgeback05

ballybee said:


> The pup i'm getting is for showing  i thought i might as well give it a go and the breeder is going to help me with all the things i need to learn  the nearest ringcraft class to me is still pretty far to travel with a pup but we'll see how it goes, i've been training Tummel to stand on command for practice but every time i say stand he sits down  think he's just being cheeky
> 
> You should definately show Kilo...then you can tell me how it goes
> 
> This thread is very interesting


you will get all the help you need....


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## ridgeback05

I have to admit that I have received some excellent advice on this thread  and I am very fortunate to be so supported by Kilo's breeder.[/QUOTE]

i know you told me the breeding of your dog but at this moment it has gone from my tiny mind...but i do know kilo is from top lines and your breeder would not ask you to show him if he was no good....as for the show stuff your breeder will keep you right...and after a few shows (oh yes once you do one you will want to do more) you will get the hang of things...and i can tell you that everyone i have met around the ridgeback show scene are very nice and will help you if they can....so go and enjoy yourself


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## Dogless

ridgeback05 said:


> I have to admit that I have received some excellent advice on this thread  and I am very fortunate to be so supported by Kilo's breeder.


i know you told me the breeding of your dog but at this moment it has gone from my tiny mind...but i do know kilo is from top lines and your breeder would not ask you to show him if he was no good....as for the show stuff your breeder will keep you right...and after a few shows (oh yes once you do one you will want to do more) you will get the hang of things...and i can tell you that everyone i have met around the ridgeback show scene are very nice and will help you if they can....so go and enjoy yourself[/QUOTE]

Thankyou; have PM'd you his details .


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## kaisa624

I have the first book on that list, so if you haven't ordered it, I can post you mine if you want?


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## Dogless

kaisa624 said:


> I have the first book on that list, so if you haven't ordered it, I can post you mine if you want?


Thanks; that is so kind - I have ordered it already .


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## swarthy

ballybee said:


> The pup i'm getting is for showing  i thought i might as well give it a go and the breeder is going to help me with all the things i need to learn  the nearest ringcraft class to me is still pretty far to travel with a pup but we'll see how it goes, i've been training Tummel to stand on command for practice but every time i say stand he sits down  think he's just being cheeky
> 
> You should definately show Kilo...then you can tell me how it goes
> 
> This thread is very interesting


You need to try and gently discourage the sitting - be sure you are not giving him treats at any time when he sits down, or he will think this is the right thing to do.

If you put your foot very gently under their back end and say stand - this is often sufficient for them to get the message - then once he is standing treat him - and try to spin out the time he has to wait for the treat.

Ringcraft if about learning to show and placing your dog in a similar environment to a show, i.e. hanging around etc - but it is also about showing - and getting them to stand and move correctly when there are a thousand and one distractions for them  I've got one girl, we don't show her very often - partly because she has the attention span of a gnat!!

What breed have you got?



Dogless said:


> Swarthy; I was being thick; just realised you can attach a file, not just pictures .


Thanks Dogless


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## Dogless

So, I have spoken to Kilo's breeder again; it is a trek but I am going to try and make the ringcraft that they go to on a Wednesday night so that Kilo is used to being handled by someone else and hopefully I can learn plenty about handling him myself (I need to...I know nothing at all, but my book came so that is a start!!) .


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## babycham2002

Dogless said:


> So, I have spoken to Kilo's breeder again; it is a trek but I am going to try and make the ringcraft that they go to on a Wednesday night so that Kilo is used to being handled by someone else and hopefully I can learn plenty about handling him myself (I need to...I know nothing at all, but my book came so that is a start!!) .


Its worth a go  Dont tire yourself out too much by going so far though.
Another thing I used to do is read the small print in show schedules (you'll find a couple of ringcraft) 
When you first read them they are like another language but it gradually sinks in. The schedules have lots of info on class classifications and rules that is great to know.


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## ballybee

swarthy said:


> You need to try and gently discourage the sitting - be sure you are not giving him treats at any time when he sits down, or he will think this is the right thing to do.
> 
> If you put your foot very gently under their back end and say stand - this is often sufficient for them to get the message - then once he is standing treat him - and try to spin out the time he has to wait for the treat.
> 
> Ringcraft if about learning to show and placing your dog in a similar environment to a show, i.e. hanging around etc - but it is also about showing - and getting them to stand and move correctly when there are a thousand and one distractions for them  I've got one girl, we don't show her very often - partly because she has the attention span of a gnat!!
> 
> What breed have you got?
> 
> Thanks Dogless


lol Tummels just a crossbreed, i'm hoping to get a ridgeback puppy later this year and maybe start showing. He's doing better and will stand to nibble the treat in my hand(waiting longer between the command and giving him the treat), as soon as he sits i get him up again and starts over  he's a very clever dog where treats are involved.

Theres a few ringcraft classes around here so i should get plenty of help


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## Dogless

babycham2002 said:


> Its worth a go  Dont tire yourself out too much by going so far though.
> Another thing I used to do is read the small print in show schedules (you'll find a couple of ringcraft)
> When you first read them they are like another language but it gradually sinks in. The schedules have lots of info on class classifications and rules that is great to know.


Thanks - it does all sound like a totally different language to me at the moment!!


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## jujumc

It takes some getting used to, but once you get the bug you will be addicted! lol 

For me the best thing was ringcraft. Its good socialisation and its good for different people to go over your dog and look in the mouth etc...

Also you will make friends with people there, its useful to be friends with other dog people, they all share info for shows and things and you will learn so handy tips too.

Good Luck, Im sure you will be fab


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## babycham2002

absolutely agree with above poster


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## I love springers

Dogless can i ask which ringcraft you are going to....


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## Dogless

I love springers said:


> Dogless can i ask which ringcraft you are going to....


Will send you a PM; I have had some advising me not to show etc so will keep it private .


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## I love springers

Dogless.....It is your decision as to wether or not you show....If you want to go down that road then just make sure you enjoy yourself but remember that your dog is your pet first and a show dog second.....Good Luck


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## Dogless

I love springers said:


> Dogless.....It is your decision as to wether or not you show....If you want to go down that road then just make sure you enjoy yourself but remember that your dog is your pet first and a show dog second.....Good Luck


Don't worry; he is definitely my pet first, I didn't actually buy him intending to show but went to his breeder as I knew amongst a multitude of reasons I would get a dog from health tested parents, bred for temperament and a lifetime of support if needed. I wouldn't put my best buddy through something he didn't enjoy .

I have had some very supportive PMs and informative ones too I hasten to add; in case anyone who has sent me one of those thinks I am getting at them .


----------



## swarthy

I love springers said:


> Dogless.....It is your decision as to wether or not you show....If you want to go down that road then just make sure you enjoy yourself but remember that your dog is your pet first and a show dog second.....Good Luck


I think the large majority of people who show do hold this view - I know I certainly do.

And contrary to popular belief - if your dog doesn't enjoy showing - you haven't got a hope in hells chance of continuing to show it - because unhappy show dogs can be spotted a mile off in the showring and are completely murderous to try and show - hence why you see youngsters who disappear from the ring after a few months, because it simply isn't their bag - I've been lucky with the 7 I've got here atm - because only one of them really isn't into showing - but the rest of them just love it 

Having said all that - they show 1, maybe 2 days a week during the summer - the rest of the time, you have to live with them


----------



## Ridgielover

Dogless said:


> Will send you a PM; I have had some advising me not to show etc so will keep it private .


Just out of interest (and not asking who the people are that are advising you not to show) I was wondering what reasons these people are giving when advising you not to show?

I've shown RRs for many years, since 1988 seriously, and I've met some really lovely people and dogs. If you want to go along to a show, Dogless, let me know and I'll happily introduce you to some like minded people.

I show my dogs but first and foremost they are my pets. Hadi won his first RCC up at Border Union but now he's lying on the furniture kipping like the others, after having been for a lovely walk


----------



## Dogless

Ridgielover said:


> Just out of interest (and not asking who the people are that are advising you not to show) I was wondering what reasons these people are giving when advising you not to show?
> 
> I've shown RRs for many years, since 1988 seriously, and I've met some really lovely people and dogs. If you want to go along to a show, Dogless, let me know and I'll happily introduce you to some like minded people.
> 
> I show my dogs but first and foremost they are my pets. Hadi won his first RCC up at Border Union but now he's lying on the furniture kipping like the others, after having been for a lovely walk


Thank you; they weren't people with RRs themselves- the main reason given was the nature of some other people who choose to show (trying to word things carefully). I appreciated the polite ones as it is always good to hear both sides of a story - so if anyone who sent one of those is still reading this thread, it is not aimed at you!

Anyhow; I have been to a few shows but never intended showing Kilo at all hence my late start and daft questions!! I met some lovely people at the shows I did attend but I suspect that, like all walks of life, there are some less pleasant people too - that is just life!!

At present Kilo's breeders are helping me and will also hopefully introduce me to a few people, but I will certainly let you know which show / shows I will go to and it would be a pleasure to meet you .

I am so clueless that I had to investigate what a RCC was ....now I know...very well done .


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## Dogless

Well, I went to my first ever ringcraft tonight and enjoyed it...Kilo's breeder handled him for most of it and he settled very fast for him and looked and behaved great. He let people go over him and look at his mouth too which I was pleased with as I have been working hard at that aspect.

Then I had a go at handling him (got a bit of separate tuition) and I was as expected having never done it before . Got loads of help and tips though so hope to be demonstrating some improvement by next week .


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## babycham2002

well done that sounds fab. Glad you both enjoyed yourselves


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## Dogless

babycham2002 said:


> well done that sounds fab. Glad you both enjoyed yourselves


Thanks; it was nothing like I expected but am so, so glad I had people to go with!!


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## kaisa624

Sounds like you had a good time there


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## Dogless

kaisa624 said:


> Sounds like you had a good time there


I did; it was nice and friendly. Helped so much to go with Kilo's breeders though as I could meet people through them and they were great with giving me so much advice. I need to get practising and have ordered a leather slip lead as I was borrowing one of theirs .


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## Blondie

Showing is great fun, glad you enjoyed your session at training.

I have a novice owner with one of my pups and she is really nervous already about the pups first show in Aug, SKC up at Edinburgh, lol!

I envisage having to step in and help, lol!!

But thats what its all about, I have made some great friends from all over the country showing my dogs, I love the social side of it, meeting up and catching up on the gossip etc. 

Good luck!


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## Dogless

Ceearott said:


> Showing is great fun, glad you enjoyed your session at training.
> 
> I have a novice owner with one of my pups and she is really nervous already about the pups first show in Aug, SKC up at Edinburgh, lol!
> 
> I envisage having to step in and help, lol!!
> 
> But thats what its all about, I have made some great friends from all over the country showing my dogs, I love the social side of it, meeting up and catching up on the gossip etc.
> 
> Good luck!


Thank you!

I was really nervous last night so when I had a go at handling Kilo he did a bit of jumping and mouthing which he hasn't done in ages, but didn't when his breeder handled him as he is clearly very experienced. After a few goes he settled for me too, once I was getting better at getting my stride right.

I have so much to learn, but will certainly put the practice in; I would hate to let his breeders down after they have been so supportive .


----------



## Blondie

Aye, so many people think its easy to show a dog, you just walk in the ring and stand there!! yeah, right, lol!! If only huh? 

It involves training the dog just as much as for the 'normal' obedience too.

And all dogs are different, I have slightly different ways of showing my lot, they all react to different things re training and stuff.


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## Dogless

Ceearott said:


> Aye, so many people think its easy to show a dog, you just walk in the ring and stand there!! yeah, right, lol!! If only huh?
> 
> It involves training the dog just as much as for the 'normal' obedience too.
> 
> And all dogs are different, I have slightly different ways of showing my lot, they all react to different things re training and stuff.


I have never thought it was easy, but then had never really thought about it at all - I certainly didn't buy Kilo with any intention of showing at all. I am now going to just practice what I learnt yesterday every evening and hopefully see progress....it is me that needs to learn; everyone said Kilo did really well for his first session .


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## Blondie

I remember first showing at Champ shows, and my OH said he could actually see my legs shaking in the ring, LOL!! :w00t:


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## Dogless

Ceearott said:


> I remember first showing at Champ shows, and my OH said he could actually see my legs shaking in the ring, LOL!! :w00t:


I suspect that will be me...... Kilo's breeder will handle him at his first show so at least I will be able to see how someone very competent does it!!! (Unless I show amazing progress, but I think it is safe to say I won't be a threat to anyone on the handling front for a very long time to come!!).


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## Blondie

Actually, you wanna watch some of the Junior Handlers if you can! They are fantastic and some of the adult handlers could learn more than a thing or two from them!!

If you get the chance to watch them in action at a Champ show, the quality is fantastic!


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## Dogless

Ceearott said:


> Actually, you wanna watch some of the Junior Handlers if you can! They are fantastic and some of the adult handlers could learn more than a thing or two from them!!
> 
> If you get the chance to watch them in action at a Champ show, the quality is fantastic!


There was a young girl there last night...in complete control. I was in awe of her - there is a lot to be said for learning skills whilst young.

The best thing was that Kilo wasn't the worst behaved and let people in his mouth where some dogs wouldn't (had been my worry as only me and the vet usually does that so have been putting work in on that front). I had suspected he might have trouble focussing in the face of all the distractions (dogs) but he did well.

I am going to watch as many good handlers as I possibly can and try to soak up lots of information.


----------



## viz

Glad you had a good time at ringcraft, just remember don't be afraid to ask questions if you are stuck as everyone has to start some where. I think everyone suffers with nerves before showing so don't worry about it. Good luck with Kilo


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## Dogless

viz said:


> Glad you had a good time at ringcraft, just remember don't be afraid to ask questions if you are stuck as everyone has to start some where. I think everyone suffers with nerves before showing so don't worry about it. Good luck with Kilo


Thank you; I asked lots of daft questions - luckily everyone seems to be pretty patient .

I have practised everything today that I learnt last night and Kilo trotted alongside me and turned without jumping and mouthing like he did yesterday so that is encouraging (most likely because I wasn't nervous as no one was watching me ). I will just keep practising every day and hopefully by next Wednesday I can show a bit of an improvement.


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## ridgeback05

do you have any idea when you first show will be.


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## Dogless

ridgeback05 said:


> do you have any idea when you first show will be.


Not yet, am leaving it in their hands to advise me what is best!


----------



## babycham2002

Dogless said:


> Thank you!
> 
> I was really nervous last night so when I had a go at handling Kilo he did a bit of jumping and mouthing which he hasn't done in ages, but didn't when his breeder handled him as he is clearly very experienced. After a few goes he settled for me too, once I was getting better at getting my stride right.
> 
> I have so much to learn, but will certainly put the practice in; I would hate to let his breeders down after they have been so supportive .


Im sure they wont be let down, they know how hard you are trying and probably still remember what it was like to be so new



Dogless said:


> I suspect that will be me...... Kilo's breeder will handle him at his first show so at least I will be able to see how someone very competent does it!!! (Unless I show amazing progress, but I think it is safe to say I won't be a threat to anyone on the handling front for a very long time to come!!).


:lol: I hope Im showing some improvement too, got Windsor next week 



Ceearott said:


> Actually, you wanna watch some of the Junior Handlers if you can! They are fantastic and some of the adult handlers could learn more than a thing or two from them!!
> 
> If you get the chance to watch them in action at a Champ show, the quality is fantastic!


Totally true, they are fab  
One of the girls in my breed has come up from junior handling and the rapport and what she gets out of her dogs is amazing


----------



## Dogless

babycham2002 said:


> Im sure they wont be let down, they know how hard you are trying and probably still remember what it was like to be so new
> 
> :lol: I hope Im showing some improvement too, got Windsor next week
> 
> Totally true, they are fab
> One of the girls in my breed has come up from junior handling and the rapport and what she gets out of her dogs is amazing


And thank you for your encouragement too - good luck at Windsor .


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## Ridgielover

It's the Midlands and Northern RR club championship show on 16 July at Stoneleigh - perhaps you'll come along to that one? Entries close fairly soon. I'll be there - might even take along my old boy, he'll be 11 in August but he's still full of beans. He'd love to go to a show again


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## Dogless

Ridgielover said:


> It's the Midlands and Northern RR club championship show on 16 July at Stoneleigh - perhaps you'll come along to that one? Entries close fairly soon. I'll be there - might even take along my old boy, he'll be 11 in August but he's still full of beans. He'd love to go to a show again


Not sure...will just take the advice of all the knowledgeable folk helping me! Would be nice to meet you and your old boy too .


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## AlbertRoss

I started showing this year - never done it before. We've only done 3 shows but somehow managed Best Puppy at first Open Show, Best Minor Puppy at First Champ Show and Best Junior & Best Puppy at the next Open Show!

This is despite the puppy not doing what he's told half the time in the ring (he wants to go back to 'mum' so running in a circle is a battle!) But he does stand and he lets the judge go over him without a murmur. I'm lucky, I've got a very experienced judge coaching me in handling and I practise almost every day.

Having said all that - I have 2 'rules' that I've self-imposed:

1. If I don't win or get placed then I'll _always_ congratulate the winner. I may not agree with the judge's decision - but it's their decision and the winner deserves to be congratulated.
2. No matter who wins - I ALWAYS take the best dog home with me.


----------



## Dogless

AlbertRoss said:


> I started showing this year - never done it before. We've only done 3 shows but somehow managed Best Puppy at first Open Show, Best Minor Puppy at First Champ Show and Best Junior & Best Puppy at the next Open Show!
> 
> This is despite the puppy not doing what he's told half the time in the ring (he wants to go back to 'mum' so running in a circle is a battle!) But he does stand and he lets the judge go over him without a murmur. I'm lucky, I've got a very experienced judge coaching me in handling and I practise almost every day.
> 
> Having said all that - I have 2 'rules' that I've self-imposed:
> 
> 1. If I don't win or get placed then I'll _always_ congratulate the winner. I may not agree with the judge's decision - but it's their decision and the winner deserves to be congratulated.
> 2. No matter who wins - I ALWAYS take the best dog home with me.


That is really impressive - congratulations!!

I am practising every day and receiving plenty of help from great people but not sure I'll manage to be as good as that in such as short space of time :blink:. I'll just enjoy it and see what happens...


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## AlbertRoss

Dogless said:


> That is really impressive - congratulations!!
> 
> I am practising every day and receiving plenty of help from great people but not sure I'll manage to be as good as that in such as short space of time :blink:. I'll just enjoy it and see what happens...


One thing to note - most puppy classes don't have many dogs in them, so it's usually easy to pick up one of the top 4 placings 

The other thing is to enter either the breed class or AVNSC if there's no breed class and then the AV class. If you aren't successful in the first you might easily be in the second. It's a weird quirk - if you win a breed class you go on to the next level if you remain unbeaten. So lots of people drop out of the AV class.... which gives you a second chance of getting something!

And it's not about being good (although that helps) mostly it's about having a really good dog and a bit of luck. In the last show my puppy was awful in the ring but the judge was desperate to give him the first place - because he was the best dog there. I felt quite sorry for the others whose dogs had behaved impeccably.


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## fulwood

Hi. I could have wrote your post 6 months ago. I suppose I'm at first base now, but I'm still not sure if it's going to be the hobby for me. Everyone says it 'cos it's true: Talking to your breeder, to others and going to Ringcraft is the best way. I was anti-show. Then (last year) I actually went to one. Before that, I'd only had the rescue brigade's view of showing and I'm afraid I'd taken it on board before making my own mind up. Books are OK, but they can only be 'catch all' and general unless you get a book on showing for your particular breed. If you have a breed club for your breed of dog, they will be a really great help. There's loads to learn (more than just showing). I learn best by experience and through talking to others. It seems to sink in better. Good luck.


----------



## Dogless

AlbertRoss said:


> One thing to note - most puppy classes don't have many dogs in them, so it's usually easy to pick up one of the top 4 placings
> 
> The other thing is to enter either the breed class or AVNSC if there's no breed class and then the AV class. If you aren't successful in the first you might easily be in the second. It's a weird quirk - if you win a breed class you go on to the next level if you remain unbeaten. So lots of people drop out of the AV class.... which gives you a second chance of getting something!
> 
> And it's not about being good (although that helps) mostly it's about having a really good dog and a bit of luck. In the last show my puppy was awful in the ring but the judge was desperate to give him the first place - because he was the best dog there. I felt quite sorry for the others whose dogs had behaved impeccably.


Thank you for more good advice. I am taking all my guidance ref classes to enter from Kilo's breeders who are kindly steering me through the whole process as I am so clueless - but doing plenty of reading and doing my best to learn!!


----------



## Dogless

fulwood said:


> Hi. I could have wrote your post 6 months ago. I suppose I'm at first base now, but I'm still not sure if it's going to be the hobby for me. Everyone says it 'cos it's true: Talking to your breeder, to others and going to Ringcraft is the best way. I was anti-show. Then (last year) I actually went to one. Before that, I'd only had the rescue brigade's view of showing and I'm afraid I'd taken it on board before making my own mind up. Books are OK, but they can only be 'catch all' and general unless you get a book on showing for your particular breed. If you have a breed club for your breed of dog, they will be a really great help. There's loads to learn (more than just showing). I learn best by experience and through talking to others. It seems to sink in better. Good luck.


Thank you; Kilo's breeders are being excellent and I am lucky enough to be able to go to the ringcraft they attend on Wednesdays. I agree that talking to others and practising what is needed is the best way to learn - but I like to read up too (I am a geek ).

I will just take things step by step and see how I feel about showing once I have actually tried it.


----------



## swarthy

AlbertRoss said:


> One thing to note - most puppy classes don't have many dogs in them, so it's usually easy to pick up one of the top 4 placings


That really will depend on the breed - in some breeds, 10 to 15 puppies is not unusual even at Open show level with 20 to 30 + at Championship level.

Looking at the RR Championship results for shows this year - puppy class sizes in particular are very variable but nowhere near the size of Labs and some of the other gundogs - some are cutting back on Champ Shows because they are just getting so expensive - particularly with the cost of fuel etc.

We did a 230 start on Saturday to go to Blackpool CH show, am delighted to say I qualified by baby boy which sort of over-rode the tiredness and bad back for a while  Ironically, if I hadn't promised to take my friends pup, then we probably wouldn't have gone 



fulwood said:


> Hi. I could have wrote your post 6 months ago. I suppose I'm at first base now, but I'm still not sure if it's going to be the hobby for me. Everyone says it 'cos it's true: Talking to your breeder, to others and going to Ringcraft is the best way. I was anti-show. Then (last year) I actually went to one. Before that, I'd only had the rescue brigade's view of showing and I'm afraid I'd taken it on board before making my own mind up. Books are OK, but they can only be 'catch all' and general unless you get a book on showing for your particular breed. If you have a breed club for your breed of dog, they will be a really great help. There's loads to learn (more than just showing). I learn best by experience and through talking to others. It seems to sink in better. Good luck.


Very good and interesting post - nice to hear from someone who has changed their perception of showing from actually joining in.

There is a wealth of information and knowledge to tap into in the dog show world, and as you go along, you will get to learn what works best for you.

Any ideas on first shows yet Dogless?


----------



## Dogless

swarthy said:


> That really will depend on the breed - in some breeds, 10 to 15 puppies is not unusual even at Open show level with 20 to 30 + at Championship level.
> 
> Looking at the RR Championship results for shows this year - puppy class sizes in particular are very variable but nowhere near the size of Labs and some of the other gundogs - some are cutting back on Champ Shows because they are just getting so expensive - particularly with the cost of fuel etc.
> 
> We did a 230 start on Saturday to go to Blackpool CH show, am delighted to say I qualified by baby boy which sort of over-rode the tiredness and bad back for a while  Ironically, if I hadn't promised to take my friends pup, then we probably wouldn't have gone
> 
> Very good and interesting post - nice to hear from someone who has changed their perception of showing from actually joining in.
> 
> There is a wealth of information and knowledge to tap into in the dog show world, and as you go along, you will get to learn what works best for you.
> 
> Any ideas on first shows yet Dogless?


Not yet; fairly late in the season I think as the breeder is handling some of their other dogs at most of them and they are going to handle Kilo at his first one. I'll seek their advice again when I go to ringcraft on Wednesday.


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## babycham2002

I am a geek with books too 
I love them


----------



## AlbertRoss

swarthy said:


> ..... some are cutting back on Champ Shows because they are just getting so expensive - particularly with the cost of fuel etc.


That is a major factor. My last Champ show cost somewhere in the region of £150 including entry fees, petrol, refreshments, etc. It also often involves setting off at some ungodly hour in the morning when you have a journey over a couple of hundred miles each way!



> We did a 230 start on Saturday to go to Blackpool CH show, am delighted to say I qualified by baby boy which sort of over-rode the tiredness and bad back for a while


Well done.

(NB. Generally, if you win a class at a champ show you automatically qualify for Crufts which is sort of a target to aim at. Don't be fooled though - Crufts is just another Championship show...) But it's certainly worth remembering.


----------



## swarthy

AlbertRoss said:


> (NB. Generally, if you win a class at a champ show you automatically qualify for Crufts which is sort of a target to aim at. Don't be fooled though - Crufts is just another Championship show...) But it's certainly worth remembering.


You don't - it depends on the class you are in, stud book bands and placings.

No classes with "Special" in the title are ever Crufts qualifying classes - neither are Maiden, Novice, Debutante, Undergraduate, Graduate, Minor or Mid Limit, or Special Beginners.

The only exception to this is taking a first place in a class at Crufts which automatically qualifies the dog for the following year (not sure if this applies to Special Working dog or Good Citizen classes - maybe someone can clarify).

You can also qualify by taking BOB at a Premier Open Show for specified breeds, and BIS, RBIS and BPIS are all Crufts Qualifiers (not sure about RBPIS - maybe someone can clarify?)

Not sure what I am being 'fooled' for - it's still the biggest dog show in the world and the usual entry for Labs at Crufts is around 500 to 600 + dogs - a lot of the time, it can take HUGE amount of time, effort and money to qualify - often faced with classes of 20 + dogs, many outstanding - and just three qualifying places when in the right class.

In many gundog breeds, a successful day at a CH show is often going home with a card of some description - Crufts - it's 'nice' to be able to say you have qualified - I didn't have anything really to qualify last year so missed out - but my health permitting, I will be there next year 

It took me two years to qualify my first show bitch often faced with classes of 30 + dogs in qualifying classes - the following year she went and qualified by taking BOB at a Premier Open show  - could have saved myself a fortune with a bit of telepathy :lol:


----------



## AlbertRoss

Let me qualify what I said before: For most of the classes you are likely to be entering - in your breed, as a puppy - will qualify you for Crufts if you get a 1,2 or 3 in a Champ show. You aren't likely to be entering the others unless you do so in addition to the 'main' class for your puppy. And things like 'Graduate' in the context of this thread simply don't apply.

And, as usual, Swarthy misreads things. I didn't say she was being fooled. But most people are. Crufts is simply a Championship show with special entry requirements. An award at Crufts is no different to an award at any other Champ show. You can get a CC there, or at Blackpool, or at The Ladies Kennel Club or any other Champ show and it has exactly equivalent standing. Yes, it's the biggest show. And the Best in Show usually gets his or her picture in the papers but as far as Kennel Club qualifications go it's absolutely the same as any other show.

Most people tend to think that Crufts is a sort of Champion of Champions scenario - it isn't. Nor do highly placed dogs in Crufts automatically beat all other dogs in other shows. I know of at least one of this year's finalists which has failed to place in some subsequent champs shows.

You can see the qualification requirements for 2011 here. (2012 isn't available yet).

There are many ways to qualify and if your puppy is good and shown a lot you may even qualify for a Junior Warrant - which gets you in too. (But I've only ever seen one of these and it does require a lot of point gathering).

The point is that you can qualify and it really isn't all that hard if you don't have a dog from one of the very popular breeds. If you look at results online from companies like FosseData or Dog.biz - The UK's Leading On-Line Dog Show Entries Web Site! you can see how many awards were made at different shows for your breed. In many, many cases there are 2 or less in classes for dogs under 2 years old - because there simply weren't that many entries. So, quite frequently, you can get a placing simply for turning up!


----------



## swarthy

AlbertRoss said:


> Let me qualify what I said before: For most of the classes you are likely to be entering - in your breed, as a puppy - will qualify you for Crufts if you get a 1,2 or 3 in a Champ show. You aren't likely to be entering the others unless you do so in addition to the 'main' class for your puppy. And things like 'Graduate' in the context of this thread simply don't apply.


You have now 'clarified' your point - but this is what you actually said



AlbertRoss said:


> (NB. Generally, if you win a class at a champ show you automatically qualify for Crufts which is sort of a target to aim at.


NO reference to puppy hence my response

For the record - some people DO enter their puppies in Undergraduate AND higher classes at Open and CH show level - many of these are often newcomers or chasing Junior Warrant points.

A LOT of people also automatically enter their pups into Maiden and Novice (as the majority of puppies will be out of at least Maiden by the time they are 12 months old) - neither of these are qualifying classes - however, a win if there are three or more entries often gives them much sought after JW points - it's not unheard of for people to be placed fifth in Minor Puppy / Puppy or even unplaced and then to go on and win a Maiden and / or Novice class - on the premise of your original post - that could mislead someone into believing they have qualified their dog for Crufts.


----------



## Dogless

Well, second ringcraft done; I started off really badly again but had got somewhere by the end (thanks to the endless patience and kindness shown to me by Kilo's breeders and one of the people who runs the club ). I was obviously still pretty bad - but was told I was about 200% better after my last go...so progress has been made. I am still very much the worst there and am likely to be for quite some time  . It was fun again though .


----------



## swarthy

Dogless said:


> Well, second ringcraft done; I started off really badly again but had got somewhere by the end (thanks to the endless patience and kindness shown to me by Kilo's breeders and one of the people who runs the club ). I was obviously still pretty bad - but was told I was about 200% better after my last go...so progress has been made. I am still very much the worst there and am likely to be for quite some time  . It was fun again though .


Try and relax (says she who had her OH handling for the first 4 months in the ring with my first showdog )

It IS nerve-wrecking - I often get stressed in the ring still at times after over 6 years 

I know you are going to ringcraft - and not sure where you are based - but there are LOADS of shows coming up over the next couple of months - there must be some close to you with RR classes - it might help to take some of the 'mystery' out of it and increase your confidence.

I love it when I watch a veteran class and a dog plays up (not in a nasty way) - but it shows you that all the things you think you 'might' do in the ring to embarrass yourself will have been done by someone, somewhere, and usually more than once  I've had a dog who simply refused to stand for the judge and decided she wanted a belly rub instead  - he still gave her Best Puppy  - I've had the 'pee' mid triangle (didn't get placed that day!!) - the "omg are my treats REALLY that smelly!!" in the BIS line-up where three other dogs refused to look at anyone but me 

And if you have the time to watch, even the best trained puppy or dog can have their 'moment'.

Just relax, enjoy and go for it - you really do have a marvellous starting point  - but I think if you actually saw a few shows before you get to that stage - it might help


----------



## Dogless

swarthy said:


> Try and relax (says she who had her OH handling for the first 4 months in the ring with my first showdog )
> 
> It IS nerve-wrecking - I often get stressed in the ring still at times after over 6 years
> 
> I know you are going to ringcraft - and not sure where you are based - but there are LOADS of shows coming up over the next couple of months - there must be some close to you with RR classes - it might help to take some of the 'mystery' out of it and increase your confidence.
> 
> I love it when I watch a veteran class and a dog plays up (not in a nasty way) - but it shows you that all the things you think you 'might' do in the ring to embarrass yourself will have been done by someone, somewhere, and usually more than once  I've had a dog who simply refused to stand for the judge and decided she wanted a belly rub instead  - he still have her Best Puppy  - I've had the 'pee' mid triangle (didn't get placed that day!!) - the "omg are my treats REALLY that smelly!!" in the BIS line-up where three other dogs refused to look at anyone but me
> 
> And if you have the time to watch, even the best trained puppy or dog can have their 'moment'.
> 
> Just relax, enjoy and go for it - you really do have a marvellous starting point - but I think if you actually saw a few shows before you get to that stage - it might help


Thank you; I have spectated at a few shows but obviously never participated; I do plan to spectate at a few more fairly soon if I can fit them in...I don't see things as a 'mystery' as much as just plain nerve wracking!!!. My big problem has always been (and most likely always will be!!) being hugely self critical and obsessed with 'getting it right' .


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## swarthy

Dogless said:


> Thank you; I have spectated at a few shows but obviously never participated; I do plan to spectate at a few more fairly soon if I can fit them in...I don't see things as a 'mystery' as much as just plain nerve wracking!!!. My big problem has always been (and most likely always will be!!) being hugely self critical and obsessed with 'getting it right' .


Maybe 'mystery' was the wrong word to say - what I meant really is that there is probably nothing you might do when you start showing that hasn't been done before


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## Dogless

swarthy said:


> Maybe 'mystery' was the wrong word to say - what I meant really is that there is probably nothing you might do when you start showing that hasn't been done before


Hopefully not, although knowing me it's always possible....


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## Dogless

I thought I would just update. Due to a rather sudden (and surprise ) requirement to move to NI I will not be showing Kilo. I feel as if I have let his breeders down, but they have been lovely about it - as always.

I would like to thank everyone who has contributed to this thread for all their help and support and am still glad I ventured briefly into the world of ringcraft as it was an enjoyable and valuable learning experience. Hopefully the thread has helped other folk too.


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## AlbertRoss

Dogless said:


> I thought I would just update. Due to a rather sudden (and surprise ) requirement to move to NI I will not be showing Kilo. I feel as if I have let his breeders down, but they have been lovely about it - as always.
> 
> I would like to thank everyone who has contributed to this thread for all their help and support and am still glad I ventured briefly into the world of ringcraft as it was an enjoyable and valuable learning experience. Hopefully the thread has helped other folk too.


If you are taking Kilo with you - there are lots of shows in Ireland......


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## Dogless

AlbertRoss said:


> If you are taking Kilo with you - there are lots of shows in Ireland......


Kilo is certainly coming with us . I have a huge amount on my plate though and without going into too much detail NI is not somewhere I can just give personal information such as my address.

I don't really want to show him on my own either I don't think; this prep was for the breeder to handle him in his first show and then to see how I felt about continuing. I bought him as a pet with no intention of showing, so do not feel as if I have lost out.


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## swarthy

Dogless said:


> Kilo is certainly coming with us . I have a huge amount on my plate though and without going into too much detail NI is not somewhere I can just give personal information such as my address.


Just as an aside - there is no obligation for your address to appear in show catalogues - I chose to omit mine as do quite a lot of people.

Hope all goes well for you whatever you decide to do - good luck with the move.


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## Dogless

swarthy said:


> Just as an aside - there is no obligation for your address to appear in show catalogues - I chose to omit mine as do quite a lot of people.
> 
> Hope all goes well for you whatever you decide to do - good luck with the move.


Thank you - no idea when it is yet...but pretty sharpish it seems. Thanks once again for all your help and advice; I am sorry that I have wasted it - but hopefully someone else has read your posts and reaped the benefits!!


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## BessieDog

Dogless said:


> Thank you - no idea when it is yet...but pretty sharpish it seems. Thanks once again for all your help and advice; I am sorry that I have wasted it - but hopefully someone else has read your posts and reaped the benefits!!


Just found this thread when looking for advice about stacking. I've found it really informative and have ordered a couple of the books recommended in it to hopefully help me present my girl in the ring better.

Just thought I'd post this reply for Dogless to say that at least I have got some benefits from her short lived entrance into the showing scene.


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