# Adult cat keeps biting kitten on neck!



## TurkishVanMama

I recently acquired a new female kitten which is now 6.5 weeks old, I've had her since 4 weeks as she was a rescue kitten. Recently my 4 year old neutered male keeps biting her on the neck. It looks terrifying!! He will be watching her for 15 minutes and she will continue to do the same thing she is doing, playing with a toy or just walking around and NOTHING will change then BAM he goes into predator mode and pins her down to the ground by her neck and won't let go. Once he even bit her face. Never is there blood, never does he break the skin. He sometimes is resistant to let go and drags her away a bit by the neck skin.

I've resorted to spanking my older cat every time he does it which I hate. I'm really worried, this seems a bit more than just saying 'I am boss'. It scares me and I want to know if this is normal behavior. Other than the spaced out 'attacks' he seems to be totally ok with her. He just won't stop stalking and prowling her. But he won't play with her. They sniff each other, walk into and past each other without confrontation, so it makes his scary behavior all the more confusing. Please help! If anyone has anything to let me know what the hell is going on.


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## Jonescat

I think I would be keeping them separate until she was a fair bit bigger. 

Is he mounting her as well? In which case it could be dominance behaviour by a cat feeling a little bit threatened.Is he stalking her, orwatching and then marching up to her?

Also, please don't hit your cat.It won't stop the behaviour you don't want but it will hurt him and ruin your relationship with him.


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## TurkishVanMama

I can't honestly tell if he is trying to mount get cause she is so tiny just under a kilo and my adult cat is almost 5kg. I only had to resort to spanking on the occasion that he won't release her from his jaws and even then it's not hard enough to hurt but more to startle when loud noises aren't enough. I'd say he's stalking her 75% and just watching then marching up to her 25% of the time. To be honest he looks somewhat of a creeper because he follows her everywhere lol.

It's strange to me because when she charges him and bats at him trying to play, he is quick to jump backward in retreat and makes great effort to avoid being touched by her. He does seem to smell her behind quite ofren. Also his pupils are always completely dilated while switching from watching to stalking.

I just don't understand why the aggression is intermittent, and portrayed say when she simply walks by, yet when she instigated he avoids confrontation.


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## TurkishVanMama

By the it looks like my 4 year old Toki and your Alfred could be almost pass as long lost siblings lol!


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## Jonescat

Aelfred does not need a twin to encourage him!I hope for your sake Toki is slightly better behaved than Aelfred  (Aelfred is currently trying to chew the suckers off the new bath mat). 

I am not sure either about triggers but I think that there are others on here who are much better at cat psychology than I am so hang on a bit and hopefully they will turn up.

Toki does sound a bit unsure about the kitten so maybe he just doesn't know how to react yet? When Alfred and Bugsy arrived, Heimdall, then 5, had to relearn his play behaviour and was very clumsy to start with, also a bit self-conscious! He spent a lot of time watching them playing and then would try to join in by copying, but he has got there in the end.


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## TurkishVanMama

I really hope that he gets along with her, I know that older cats bite kittens on the neck as a way of disciplining her but the aggression of the scene makes it hard to gauge. Especially since from what I read they want the kitten to submit and lay still and then they will let go and carry on, however she does quite the opposite constantly whining and wriggling to escape. This makes me worry as the incidents become drawn out and intensified which force me to intervene out of fear.
Here's a pic of the little one.


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## ForeverHome

So you've had the kitten 2 and a half weeks, and she is only 6 and a half weeks old. Did you put them together straight away or has there been some gradual introduction time? Do you ever separate them, eg for the night or while you're out? 

It's very hard to picture the scene from what you describe because obviously you feel scared for the kitten so the words you use are associated with your fear. But the way your cat jumps away form the kitten if she approaches him sounds like he is still wondering what this little furry bundle is and what to make of it. Sniffing bottoms - mine have been together a year and they still sometimes sniff bottoms and oddly tails as well. If he is 'mounting' her he would grab her scruff then shuffle his body over her. If it's discipline, more likely he would grab her from the side then either try and lift her or just hold her still. 

Predatory behaviour could be play - play can be frighteningly realistic with cats. The purpose of play with kittens is to teach hunting and fighting skills, so pinning down and pretending to deliver the fatal bite can be vital teaching. But how is the kitten responding? Does she ever stalk and pounce on him? When he pins her down does she wriggle or just go limp? 

Please do not ever smack a cat. They don't understand this kind of behaviour from humans, though a mother cat will cuff kittens sometimes if they step out of line, it's not something an adult cat would recognise. A loud hand clap of sharp pshht to distract him is better if you need to. 

Another thing - is he holding a pinch of her scruff, or is he taking her whole neck and head or neck and shoulders into his mouth?


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## carly87

I have found that, as a very big generalisation, boys are not great with very tiny kittens. They find it hard to disassociate the prey drive when something tiny and quick is zipping around squeaking, so the urge to hunt and stalk gets really, really demanding. Girls don't seem to be quite so bad, and I guest this is because they're hardwired for kittens. Please note, folks, I know I'm generalising and that some boys are great with kits, but not all of them.

It may just be this that's coming into play. Either way though, I'd say that your kitten is still a little small to be being bundled by a 5 KG cat. If she's almost a KG though, she's doing amazingly well for her age!


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## TurkishVanMama

I put them together straight away as long as I was there to supervise, but anytime I'm at work she gets sprayed into a large carrier. At night she sleeps in the room with the Toki (the 4 year old male). 
She looks like she wants to play with him but acts very weary, however if she is in a hyper mood she will smack him mostly missing, or go after his enticing tail which he will quickly retreat annoyed. When he has her by the neck get entire neck is in his mouth for the most part and she wriggles a bit and cries, I've tried to let it pan out but it doesn't look like he had plans of letting go and his eyes have that hunting look I'm aware of. Once I take her from him she lays limp for 30 sec or so before going about her business. You can tell she acts more cautious around him since this started happening. 
Like I've said it try to let it pass but it looks far more aggressive than it should be and I'm worried that even if he doesn't mean to truly hurt her perhaps she is so small he may end up doing damage.


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## carly87

I really would separate them until she's a lot older. As I say, I'd not be leaving kittens that small with a fully grown male. I don't even let my home-grown babies mix with my other girl cats, or any cats come to that except mummy, until they're at least 6 weeks, and only then after lots of time to sniff and pat paws and get to know each other through the mesh of the kitten pen.


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## ForeverHome

TurkishVanMama said:


> I put them together straight away as long as I was there to supervise, but anytime I'm at work she gets sprayed into a large carrier. At night she sleeps in the room with the Toki (the 4 year old male).
> She looks like she wants to play with him but acts very weary, however if she is in a hyper mood she will smack him mostly missing, or go after his enticing tail which he will quickly retreat annoyed. When he has her by the neck get entire neck is in his mouth for the most part and she wriggles a bit and cries, I've tried to let it pan out but it doesn't look like he had plans of letting go and his eyes have that hunting look I'm aware of. Once I take her from him she lays limp for 30 sec or so before going about her business. You can tell she acts more cautious around him since this started happening.
> Like I've said it try to let it pass but it looks far more aggressive than it should be and I'm worried that even if he doesn't mean to truly hurt her perhaps she is so small he may end up doing damage.


Ok, her actions ought to be your warning then. He sounds very unsure of this new arrival and ok he's retreating when he's annoyed but it sounds better not to let him get annoyed. Kitten ought to be having a positive experience with some boundaries - the line between your boy setting boundaries and lashing out in anger could be a fine one. As Carly says I think it's wise to be managing this introduction much more. As they say, absence makes the heart grow fonder 

Oh he's a Van is he? Possibly the only breed I would be tempted with, is he a swimmer?


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## chillminx

I agree ^^ - too risky to be leaving such a young kitten with an adult male. Not fair on either of them.


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## TurkishVanMama

Thanks for the advice. I will make an effort to separate them more, although they are always separated if no one is home to watch that she is safe. I guess I expected him to be nice because he came from a home that had many cats and he got along well with them before I recieved him at 10 months. He likes to play with water and is very good about baths, a very good boy! I don't have anything deep enough for him to swim in so not sure if he could but he is so smart and always full of surprises.


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## ForeverHome

Aw if I had one I'd just have to run a bath and see!

I see where you're coming from, but then he has been away from his old home a long time, and also this is a kitten which can be a bit different, and on his territory as well. Hope all goes well with a more gradual introduction


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## carly87

As I've said though, a kitten to a male is very different than a bigger, young cat. That prey drive is very, very powerful and difficult for them to control.


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## TurkishVanMama

I also want to ask, when the incident happens again should I let it pan out or should I intervene? I suppose if he really wanted to damage her he could have done it already 10 times over. If I intervene every time will she not learn some innate sort of "discipline" that can only be instilled by a cat?


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## chillminx

No, I would not allow that kind of aggression from the older cat towards the kitten. Apart from being potentially harmful to the kitten it could establish a bullying type of relationship that could continue once the kitten has grown up. 
That is not what you want. 

Both cats must learn to respect each other's space. If they were both kittens they would learn respect from each other, but your two are not evenly matched in size and age, so you need to step in immediately it looks as though the older cat may grab the kitten, and remove the kitten from the area, perhaps place her on a cat tree out of harm's way or remove her from the room.


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## Polski

TurkishVanMama said:


> I also want to ask, when the incident happens again should I let it pan out or should I intervene? I suppose if he really wanted to damage her he could have done it already 10 times over. If I intervene every time will she not learn some innate sort of "discipline" that can only be instilled by a cat?


I wouldn't give him the chance to let it happen again. If he's looking at her as prey it could end in absolute disaster. They need to be totally separated and introduced gradually over a period of several weeks. Not just separated when you're not there...totally. Kitten in one room, adult in the rest of the house. No meetings for a while.


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## carly87

Why would there be another incident? You've been advised that your older cat is potentially confusing your kitten with prey... I'd not be allowing them together for quite some time yet full stop. Separate them completely until the kitten is a fair bit older and bigger, i.e, at least another 3 or 4 weeks. Then introductions need to be slow and gradual.


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## ForeverHome

Discipline from another cat would be a hiss, a cuff or a specific short snappy "mwak!" - not being pinned down like a rat. You have advice from some very experienced and knowledgeable people, please take it before this escalates into a dangerous situation or a pattern of lifelong problems.


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## carly87

I've been thinking about this all day and it has be quite worried and upset. I really, really hope the advice is taken.

I currently own the most gentle, soppiest stud boy that I have ever seen. He wouldn't hurt a fly, and I do mean literally. Even when he catches toys, he just holds them very carefully either in his mouth or his paws, never crushing, just holding, and gives them up readily at the slightest ask from me... And I still wouldn't leave him with kittens.

Boys really, really can't help themselves, and this is going to be just as stressful for him as it is for the poor kitten.

I really feel for them both.


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## chillminx

carly87 said:


> Boys really, really can't help themselves, and this is going to be just as stressful for him as it is for the poor kitten.
> 
> *I really feel for them both*
> 
> 
> 
> Me too Carly
> 
> I do hope the OP is taking the situation seriously.
Click to expand...


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## spotty cats

My boys are all lovely with young kittens, they sit in the bed with them grooming, or watch them play and gently join in. But I don't leave them unattended, hopefully it'll only be 3-4 weeks and you can slowly introduce your cats again.


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## TurkishVanMama

Thank you all so much for all the helpful experiences and advice. They no longer sleep in the same room at night; kitten sleeps with my hubby and I in the bedroom with the door closed. Also I've set it up so kitten stays in the room with door closed and my older one has free range of the rest of the house. I felt bad the first day since my boy Toki spends a lot of time in my bedroom, but he didn't seem to mind too badly. 

Also there was a very supervised and brief moment of reintroduction for a few minutes today. Kitten went for his flicking tail, and would you believe it he layed there and yawned in response! A few minutes later he did charge at kitten during their short encounter, but has soon as he got in her bubble he stopped and sniffed licked then went about his business. I know progress won't be quick but that reaction is already leaps and bounds above their last encounter.

It's silly that this separation seems to be stressing me out more than the little ones. I love my big boy and I hate to feel I am banishing him. He is a very loving boy and loves to snuggle in my arms every night when it's time for bed, and to top it off he gets anxiety when doors are closed and I'm in the other side. (He makes it his life mission to try and open the door and will meow sadly on the other side) but it clearly bothers me more than him! Lol. I would put kitten in a spare room but the only extra room I have is my sister's room as she is staying with us for a little. I am aware this is for the best so I will suck it up lol. And will try to resist rushing further reintroductions.


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## carly87

That's really good progress. Well done for taking this step.


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## ForeverHome

That's great news, you're doing the right thing. Please try to relax - your boy is not anxious, he is fine, so you need to relax. Cats are so sensitive to our emotions. If you are anxious he will know something is wrong but he has no way to understand what is making you anxious, so he will become anxious too. You see how well it works, so you can relax


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