# Babies



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

Do you think it's your right to have a baby even if you have to have medical help, when people can't get jobs our country and the world is so over crowded.


----------



## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

You havent said your views on this, would be interested to see them!

A friend of mine is wheelchair bound, has a full time carer, a loving husband and 2 gorgeous children.

Her kids are well adjusted, polite and have everything they could need. They have more tolerance for peoples differences due to their mums condition, why the hell should she be denied parenthood because some nutter on a motorbike crashed into her and caused spinal injuries?



I also know a family with one parent who has cerebral palsy. They now have 4 children (2 of which are grown and have kids of their own), again a lovelier family you couldnt wish to meet! 

My son also has mild CP so I find these sorts of discussions quite personal, I see absoloutly no reason why my son should be denied parenthood when he is of age.

The alternative would be mass sterilisation of anyone with a physical or mental disability.... the world went that way before, and the thought of going back there is horrific!


----------



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

Sorry, if you can't have children, that's it you can't.


----------



## GoldenShadow (Jun 15, 2009)

I don't like to think of it as a right. I think you're lucky to have kids if you have them and I think most people see it like that too.

If I could afford to have kids and provide for them myself I see no reason why I shouldn't be allowed to have them, but in the same breath if I was struggling money wise or didn't have a job (by this I mean if I had no savings or partner and nothing to live off including no income) then I wouldn't consider the idea. Providing both parents are capable of helping to bring the children up between them in some way shape or form and can afford to do so I think its OK.

But I don't like to think its a 'right'...

ETA: In regards to the likes of IVF I'm undecided. I think there definitely needs to be an age limit which is I think 39 now, I go along with that.


----------



## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

Happy Paws said:


> Sorry, if you can't have children, that's it you can't.


what part of disability means you cant physically have children? disability is a different thing from infertility!


----------



## billyboysmammy (Sep 12, 2009)

edit my fault for not reading the question properly (ive done a DT)

I dont think having children is a right, its a blessing!


----------



## vickie1985 (Feb 18, 2009)

tough one for me and my partnerdue to not being able to have children.

The medical treatment is out there and widely out there, so why shouldnt it be in your rights to try?? We will never know the joys of labour, child birth, that instant love. 

So many people take it for granted. I would love to be in the shoes of a woman with birth children.


----------



## CharleyRogan (Feb 20, 2009)

I think it would be my right to try! If I was successful in having children, they would be a blessing.


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

Happy Paws said:


> Sorry, if you can't have children, that's it you can't.


Utter crud - the technology out there to help women get pregnant is absolutely fantastic and a god send to those who are having trouble to concieve- for many its not so cut and dry - sometimes its the males who have the fertility problem - sometimes its the womens fallopian tubes that are blocked or they do not produce enough eggs etc - fertility treatment is there to help those who cannot concieve naturally - to deny that right is wrong imo - as one of those women who needs fertility help (due to male fertility factor) I find what you are saying highly offensive - do you know what its like to yearn to have a child?? the ache inside you never goes and its the most heartwrenching soul destroying thing to go through - maybe it is not every womans RIGHT to have a child but its also no one else's RIGHT to deny that opportunity either.


----------



## LostGirl (Jan 16, 2009)

why isnt a right tho? 

i do believe everyone has a right to be a parent if they wish to and use whatever means they need to, to do so. 

just as anyone who doesnt want children has that right


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

Daynna said:


> why isnt a right tho?
> 
> i do believe everyone has a right to be a parent if they wish to and use whatever means they need to, to do so.
> 
> just as anyone who doesnt want children has that right


Exactly !!


----------



## cheekyscrip (Feb 8, 2010)

if you cannot conceive else other problems and there are solutions - when why not? 

If you have a disability which may mean your child might be an orfan berofe grows up -then I personally would not risk it...

Also if my disorder was hereditary, if cannot be checked for it...

Or if I had major psychotic disorder I would not have chosen to have children - but that is me...


----------



## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Happy Paws said:


> Sorry, if you can't have children, that's it you can't.


Do you have children?


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

Aurelia said:


> Do you have children?


My guess is NO she hasnt and probably dislikes them intensely ! hence the utter disregard in posting such utter crap


----------



## Barney (Feb 24, 2008)

Happy Paws said:


> Sorry, if you can't have children, that's it you can't.


I dont think people like you shouldnt have children if that is the sort of crap ya would drill in to them


----------



## vickie1985 (Feb 18, 2009)

if she does have children...she must be one of the most insensitive mothers ever!


----------



## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Well I was thinking that maybe she does, which is why she won't ever understand what it's like to have to do more than lay there thinking of England.

:lol: BTW That's not to say that many children aren't conceived during a magical union of two people very much in love ... with love, passion, multiple positions and such a care free attitude that means you really don't care about sleeping in the wet patch, until morning that is when the sheets decide to get up with you ...


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

vickie1985 said:


> if she does have children...she must be one of the most insensitive mothers ever!


V true Vicky - all I can say is thank god all the women on the fertility forum I go on are not on here they would skin her alive!


----------



## vickie1985 (Feb 18, 2009)

suzy93074 said:


> V true Vicky - all I can say is thank god all the women on the fertility forum I go on are not on here they would skin her alive!


haha ff by any chance??


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

vickie1985 said:


> haha ff by any chance??


:thumbup::thumbup:


----------



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

billyboysmammy said:


> what part of disability means you cant physically have children? disability is a different thing from infertility!





Aurelia said:


> Do you have children?





suzy93074 said:


> My guess is NO she hasnt and probably dislikes them intensely ! hence the utter disregard in posting such utter crap





vickie1985 said:


> if she does have children...she must be one of the most insensitive mothers ever!


No I don't have children because I can't and at one time it was really hard, but after a few years and talking about it we decided not to try any more. But I also think it's natures away of keeping the population down otherwise at this rate half the world is going to starve, it won't be us that suffer, but it could their your children's children.

It was not meant to get you touchy lot mad, it was just a question.


----------



## ClaireLily (Jul 8, 2008)

I think its everyones right to have children *IF* they have the means to support them without relying on state handouts. Regardless of disabilities or difficulties nobody should be denied the opportunity whether that involves assistance or not. I'm 30 and am undecided as to whether or not I want kids, I've been on birth control for 14 years and am fully aware that by the time I decide it may be too late. 
At the moment I choose not to conceive, my partner is not in stable employment and I wouldn't take the risk of not being to cope financially.

If/when we decide to go ahead and it turned out we needed assistance I'd be right at the clinic or the social workers for adoption.

Should my decision to be responsible and ensure stability for my future children mean that I should miss out on the experience because I was too old?

That said this is a push button thread, someone deliberately set the cat amongst the pigeons, must be nothing on the telly this aft (or they don't watch rugby)


----------



## LostGirl (Jan 16, 2009)

Happy Paws said:


> But I also think it's natures away of keeping the population down otherwise at this rate half the world is going to starve, it won't be us that suffer, but it could their your children's children.
> 
> 
> > Do you agree with china? one child per couple? taking baby girls away at birth leaving them to die, having childrens homes full of tiny babies who are left because they are girls?


----------



## Bexy (Apr 11, 2010)

I am gonna need help conceiving and if it were to be done privately it would cost a fortune due a chromosone abnormality my partner has. 

Some people have the view that the NHS cannot afford to be handing out fertility treatment as having children is not life threatening. However, we are in this position through no fault of our own and feel I should have the same opportunity to motherhood that comes oh so easily to others. 

I have the means to support a child I am lucky enough to be blessed with, I don't think it is natures way I think it is very bad luck I am in this position.

Not only do I have the emotional heartache but I need to prove myself more than the majority of parents who do not need assistance eg healthwise.

I really wish I didn't care and could just 'put up' with this card i've been dealt, my life would be a hell of a lot easier.


----------



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

Daynna said:


> Happy Paws said:
> 
> 
> > But I also think it's natures away of keeping the population down otherwise at this rate half the world is going to starve, it won't be us that suffer, but it could their your children's children.
> ...


----------



## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

You did however insult many ladies who do have trouble conceiving for whatever reason.


----------



## noogsy (Aug 20, 2009)

thank god we live in a free country,
women here can choose whether they have babies.
and disabled people have rights 
people who need help to be looked after
should be able to choose how they want to live there lives
and we should help the most vulnarable people:thumbup:
its outrageous to say they cant CHOOSE to have kids
lets put all the disabled people into institutions and not let them have choices:scared:
back to the bad old days?????????
a very strange idea:scared:


----------



## Kammie (Apr 4, 2009)

I'll probably get shot down for this but I agree with Happy Paws. Hope I haven't misread and am taking it as people who can't conceive due to infertility not because of disability. The world is so over populated in my opionion because of the advances in science both keeping people alive and fertility treatment. 

I'm in the thought that we should let nature have its control back and if due to infertility you can't have children then its not meant to be, that isn't to say people with disabilies shouldn't have children if they are able to conceive. 

A little off topic but taking it further with advances in science keeping people alive I think we should be able to make the decision to be euthanised when it gets to the point of not being happy, as we think with our pets is there a quality of live there or are they just being kept alive for the sake of it by medicine? When someone is no longer able to live a fulfilling life as they once did due to illness would it be right to make them live whether through lifelong medicine or life support or should the deicision be made to let that person go and remember them for how they once were?

I know things aren't black and white but every case should be taken on its own standing not to generalise everyone into categories of how, what and why?


----------



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

Aurelia said:


> You did however insult many ladies who do have trouble conceiving for whatever reason.


You really are reading to much into what I said, and as I've said I can't have children either.


----------



## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Kammie, you're pregnant ... so of course you can stick your neck out and say that because it wont affect you. Would you still have that opinion if you weren't? Or if you had tried years and years for a baby ... and not just had an accidental pregnancy because you were switching pills and didn't think to take other precautions?


----------



## nicola1980 (Oct 5, 2008)

Kammie said:


> I'll probably get shot down for this but I agree with Happy Paws. Hope I haven't misread and am taking it as people who can't conceive due to infertility not because of disability. The world is so over populated in my opionion because of the advances in science both keeping people alive and fertility treatment.
> 
> I'm in the thought that we should let nature have its control back and if due to infertility you can't have children then its not meant to be, that isn't to say people with disabilies shouldn't have children if they are able to conceive.


I'm sorry but what a load of tosh!
I see you are having a baby at the moment but if you think the world is that much over populated then why did you choose to have a baby?
People that are having/had trouble conceiving would love to be in your shoes and I find it very wrong what you are saying!

Yes I think it's my right to try and have a baby and if for what ever reason it don't happen then I will try everything in my power to make sure it dose!


----------



## Kammie (Apr 4, 2009)

Aurelia said:


> Kammie, you're pregnant ... so of course you can stick your neck out and say that because it wont affect you. Would you still have that opinion if you weren't? Or if you had tried years and years for a baby ... and not just had an accidental pregnancy because you were switching pills and didn't think to take other precautions?


Its just my opinion whether I'm able to have kids or not would be the same. Yes this is an accidental pregnancy but I wasn't changing pills I was taking the same pill I had been taking since I was 16 and it failed. I've never been of the thought that I have a right to have children whether I'm fertile or not. At the end of the day everything happens for a reason and if some people aren't meant to have children then so be it thats how it was meant to be and nature shouldn't be messed with. If all the advances in science had never happened and we still lived as our ancestors did then there wouldn't be any thought of artificially inpregnating someone who isn't able to conceive naturally. I just think we should let nature have its control back and to stop messing with it.

I've got nothing against anyone that thinks differently but thats my opinion and how I live.


----------



## paddyjulie (May 9, 2009)

Every women has the right to try and have a child.. if they want one..the medical science is there so it should be used...


----------



## Lulu's owner (May 1, 2009)

To me the issue is who pays for fertility treatment. I have no objection to people paying privately but I really don't believe it should be on the NHS. The NHS is there to help manage and cure sickness and disease, not assist with lifestyle choices such as parenthood.


----------



## ClaireLily (Jul 8, 2008)

Kammie, I find it quite unbelievable that you think a couple who cannot conceive naturally should not get help to conceive as the world is over populated however it's fine for you to add to the over population with an accidental pregnancy? How bloody hypocritical!

Also, say I was infertile, should my OH leave me and find a woman who can have kids rather than lose out on being a dad? Utter rubbish!


----------



## MissShelley (May 9, 2010)

Kammie said:


> Its just my opinion whether I'm able to have kids or not would be the same. Yes this is an accidental pregnancy but I wasn't changing pills I was taking the same pill I had been taking since I was 16 and it failed. I've never been of the thought that I have a right to have children whether I'm fertile or not. At the end of the day everything happens for a reason and if some people aren't meant to have children then so be it thats how it was meant to be and nature shouldn't be messed with. If all the advances in science had never happened and we still lived as our ancestors did then there wouldn't be any thought of artificially inpregnating someone who isn't able to conceive naturally. I just think we should let nature have its control back and to stop messing with it.
> 
> I've got nothing against anyone that thinks differently but thats my opinion and how I live.


I wonder if your opinion will change when you have had your child, and your mothering instinct has kicked in  Your not a Mum yet, believe me you will view the world a lot different when you do and know that inbetween the black and white there's grey 

I'm a Mum and I feel so much for anyone who will never feel that joy of having created a life. Everbody should be able to pursue whatever option they wish to acheive their dreams of being parents... And we as parents shouldn't ever never deny them


----------



## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Kammie said:


> Its just my opinion whether I'm able to have kids or not would be the same. Yes this is an accidental pregnancy but I wasn't changing pills I was taking the same pill I had been taking since I was 16 and it failed. I've never been of the thought that I have a right to have children whether I'm fertile or not.* At the end of the day everything happens for a reason* and if some people aren't meant to have children then so be it thats how it was meant to be and nature shouldn't be messed with. If all the advances in science had never happened and we still lived as our ancestors did then there wouldn't be any thought of artificially inpregnating someone who isn't able to conceive naturally. I just think we should let nature have its control back and to stop messing with it.
> 
> I've got nothing against anyone that thinks differently but thats my opinion and how I live.


Like you say, everything happens for a reason ... along with some folks who think 'if it's meant to be, it's meant to be'. This can apply to fertility treatment too. After all if it's not meant to be it wont be.

If it was so against nature, nature would have put a stop to it long ago. If it was against God's will, then God would have stopped it a long time ago, or prevented it from being possible at all. Or he/she would have made it so everyone is fertile, or those who aren't don't have the burning need to become a biological parent.

.


----------



## jenniferx (Jan 23, 2009)

> nature shouldn't be messed with


We do mess with nature in pretty much every capacity to be fair. Any kind of treatment is messing with nature- from paracetamols to chemotherapy. If there were birthing complications then medical intervention would be messing with nature also.

I haven't tried to have a baby yet but I know if I struggled I would go for treatment. It's just such a basic instinct in me, not being able to do it ever would destroy me. I know that sounds extreme but it's how I feel, and it's how a lot of women feel. I suppose you can either empathise with that or not.


----------



## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

its not only about the children though, what about the childrens children? i am lucky to be blessed with 5 healthy children, 1 grandson and another little grandchild on the way the bond i have with my grandson is second to none and such a lovely feeling to have this little person from one of my own children. with no children, there would be no grandchildren,no great grandchildren either, thats a very sad thought! a grandchild lights up your life in later years,well , mine does anyway i think if anything is available to help those that cannot have children experiance this wonderful thing then it should be given without a second thought


----------



## MissShelley (May 9, 2010)

Kammie said:


> nature shouldn't be messed with.


So, your having a natural birth then without the use of pain relieving drugs and your going to give birth at home yeah?

What about if you have complications in labour? Would you refuse an emergency cesarean section???

See what i'm getting at? If your going to make such a statement then please try and think about the bigger picture. Doctors and scientists havent messed with nature, nature has just provided them with the necessary tools and knowledge to find answers to problems, what's wrong with that?


----------



## Kammie (Apr 4, 2009)

I'm going to back out of this one now. I've stated my opinion and that is all it is an opinion, I've not said its right or wrong but some people getting all hett up and name calling over an opinion is just going to get the thread closed. 

I can't say my opinion won't change once I've had this baby but for now thats how I feel. Would it have been right or wrong of me to have an abortion since the baby is accidental? This baby happened even with contraception and to me that means its meant to be. 

Just to put it out there to all those who say the instinct is overwhelming when you can't conceive, how do we know our pets don't have those feelings as well? Should every dog, cat or hamster be given the right to have babies? We neuter our pets to help prevent overpopulation and illness among other things but how do we know they don't have that yearning for babies and we take it away from them. 

Anyway I'm stepping out of this now before it becomes more of an argument than sharing opinions.


----------



## AmberNero (Jun 6, 2010)

I'm just wondering- as I know little about the science behind these things, but is the fertility of a person affected by their genes- by their parents fertility? I think everyone should be able to try for a child, with or without the help of science, as long as they are in a position to care properly for any children they do have...but then you enter the territory of how you decide what constitutes being in a positon to care properly- and that is a slippery, creepy, governmental-involved thought process. It's such a personal decision it's always going to include heavily emotional debate.

But back to my first question- if a childs fertility is affected by that of their parents, is it fair to start debating whether it is fair on the child of low-fertile parents to grow up and in their turn have possibly more trouble conceiving? It's such a diffcult question, involving peoples rights, responsibilities and also peoples own beleifs and morals, that I don't think there is any correct answer or decision. We can only respect each others wishes and desires...


----------



## Leah84 (Jun 22, 2009)

i don`t think it`s for anyone else to decide who should and shouldn`t have a child. just because someone is infertile doesn`t mean they shouldn`t have as much chance as the rest of us! you get junkie scum running round having more kids than hot dinners and dumping them places but i don`t see you shouting out about sterilising them yet you seem to think that people who could genuinely give a child a great life and would do anything for a kid shouldn`t be given that chance due to genetics?? i think i seen somewhere that people have said disabled people should have as much right to have kids? well isn`t infertility just another form of disability? i would say it was in some way therefore you`re contradicting yourself on that one


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

Lets just clear something up here .........it is VERY rare for someone to actually be INFERTILE in most cases of couples who have fertility problems its a factor making it more difficult to concieve and in actual fact half of the couples seeking treatement is down to male factor -ie low sperm count poor mobility of sperm or they have Y chromosome which is a heriditory disease passed on which is in their genes - azoozpermia where no actual sperm is found is also another reason due to blockages or low testosterone - in women its that their eggs are not forming properly,blocked fallopion tubes or they are not ovulating or have irregular periods - a lot of these problems can be solved through medical treatment/surgery - so the question on this thread itself is a load of ******!! it is much more complex than a woman just not being able to get pregnant.....for those of you of the opinion that the NHS should not provide treatment - im speechless tbo!!

Kammie I find your posts extremley upsetting - you accidently get pregnant and then have the front to say those that cannot naturally get pregnant shouldnt!  a very cold and very sad look on life you have and I hope TO GOD that if and when u decide you do want another child by CHOICE that you CAN get pregnant again because if you cannot and you desperately want that child then maybe just maybe you will know how I feel right now - dont take being pregnant for granted.


----------



## jenniferx (Jan 23, 2009)

Well I can't see any issue in comparing the rights of a hamster with a woman..... no issue at all. Sigh. 

This thread is so depressing it's crazy!


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

Happy Paws said:


> No I don't have children because I can't and at one time it was really hard, but after a few years and talking about it we decided not to try any more. But I also think it's natures away of keeping the population down otherwise at this rate half the world is going to starve, it won't be us that suffer, but it could their your children's children.
> 
> It was not meant to get you touchy lot mad, it was just a question.


For you to not try and look into the reasons why you couldnt concieve is your choice !!! just as it is others to try evrything they can - I find your posts about keeping the population down alarming and sounds like something from the hitler days and concentration camps  -


----------



## Snuggles (Nov 17, 2008)

Happy Paws said:


> But I also think it's natures away of keeping the population down otherwise at this rate half the world is going to starve, it won't be us that suffer, but it could their your children's children.


In the same vein though, disease and illness are also natures way of 'keeping the population down' yet we use medication, blood transfusions and organ transplants to regularly lengthen people's lives. Where do you draw the line :confused1:

My personal thoughts are each to their own and I'm glad I live in a country where people have the choice.


----------



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

Freedom of speech for some and not others. and I know I've rubbed some of you the wrong way but there is NO need for person insults.


----------



## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Where are the personal insults?


----------



## jenniferx (Jan 23, 2009)

The biggest insult I have seen on this thread is the suggestion that those with infertility problems shouldn't have the right to do anything about it.


----------



## ClaireLily (Jul 8, 2008)

jenniferx said:


> The biggest insult I have seen on this thread is the suggestion that those with infertility problems shouldn't have the right to do anything about it.


Agreed 100%


----------



## GoldenShadow (Jun 15, 2009)

Aurelia said:


> If it was against God's will, then God would have stopped it a long time ago
> 
> .


Sorry but I hve to jump in here. You can't say god would stop it if it was against his will because last time I checked murder was against his will but he hasn't stopped that 

I go for the if it's meant to be it will be, but that could be via fertility treatment or naturally. I think as long as kids can be provided for by their parents financially and hopefully emotionally then fine.


----------



## mitch4 (Oct 31, 2009)

suzy93074 said:


> Utter crud - the technology out there to help women get pregnant is absolutely fantastic and a god send to those who are having trouble to concieve- for many its not so cut and dry - sometimes its the males who have the fertility problem - sometimes its the womens fallopian tubes that are blocked or they do not produce enough eggs etc - fertility treatment is there to help those who cannot concieve naturally - to deny that right is wrong imo - as one of those women who needs fertility help (due to male fertility factor) I find what you are saying highly offensive - do you know what its like to yearn to have a child?? the ache inside you never goes and its the most heartwrenching soul destroying thing to go through - maybe it is not every womans RIGHT to have a child but its also no one else's RIGHT to deny that opportunity either.


I havent read all the posts yet but will do, the above says a lot, i cant have children and feel exactly as the above post discribes, i didnt go for IVF as when i was younger and of an age where it may have been possible it wasnt on the nhs. I have come to live with this now and my dogs, although not child substitutes do help me give my maternal instincts and mothers love to a living creature that relys on me, its the most sould destroying feeling if you want children to be told you cant, its twenty odd years ago that i was told and this thread has bought tears to my eyes as i remember the day the time and the doctors matter of fact way in which he told me my life would never go the way i thought it would.

So I think it is every womans right to be able to try anything possible to have a child

If your talking about over population and want to be contraversial, we could talk about all the single mothers who openly have babies to provide a lifestyle of no work and benefits but i think thats again a very touchy and individual issue and could lump every single mother in to the same pot, so i wont go there as thats not my intention as some very wonderful single mums out there, sorry its just this threads topic is a very emotive subject


----------



## harley bear (Feb 20, 2010)

Happy Paws, 

In all honesty i find your posts slightly disturbing.... you clearly have NO CLUE what your on about!

You said infertility was a way of keeping population down(or whatever, i drifted off at some point) Everyone has the RIGHT to be a parent if they wish it has NOTHING to do with anyone else how they come to be a parent! Whether it be IVF on the NHS or accidental pregnancy.

Dogs are overpopulated (im sure ive read ur a breeder) shouldn't you be more responsible and keep their population to a minimum:confused1:


----------



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

harley bear said:


> Happy Paws,
> 
> In all honesty i find your posts slightly disturbing.... you clearly have NO CLUE what your on about!
> 
> ...


NO.........................................................................................


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

Happy Paws said:


> Freedom of speech for some and not others. and I know I've rubbed some of you the wrong way but there is NO need for person insults.


You have every right to express your opinion and I have every right to disagree with it ! - no where have I or anyone else got personal with you - you have chosen to do a thread which is of a very personal matter that is obviously going to affect many women on here - how many members do you know going thru fertility treatment?? or who cannot have children???exactly you dont so to post such a sensitive subject in such an UN sensitive way ...well u reap what you sow hun!!


----------



## harley bear (Feb 20, 2010)

Happy Paws said:


> NO.........................................................................................


No what?

My point is ur soooo bothered about the over population of the planet by humans (of which this younger generation will end up paying taxes ie paying for your NHS treatment in old age and pension!)

I had problems trying to concieve and i couldnt get any help as i wasnt old enough.. I now have two beautiful boys and i would have stopped at NOTHING to get them! And yes i would love another 2. Is it any of your business? NO!!!

If i have problems again then i would try medical treatment but i wouldnt go to the extent that i would have before.
You chose not to go down the medical route... your choice! NOT gods will


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

mitch4 said:


> I havent read all the posts yet but will do, the above says a lot, i cant have children and feel exactly as the above post discribes, i didnt go for IVF as when i was younger and of an age where it may have been possible it wasnt on the nhs. I have come to live with this now and my dogs, although not child substitutes do help me give my maternal instincts and mothers love to a living creature that relys on me, its the most sould destroying feeling if you want children to be told you cant, its twenty odd years ago that i was told and this thread has bought tears to my eyes as i remember the day the time and the doctors matter of fact way in which he told me my life would never go the way i thought it would.
> 
> So I think it is every womans right to be able to try anything possible to have a child
> 
> If your talking about over population and want to be contraversial, we could talk about all the single mothers who openly have babies to provide a lifestyle of no work and benefits but i think thats again a very touchy and individual issue and could lump every single mother in to the same pot, so i wont go there as thats not my intention as some very wonderful single mums out there, sorry its just this threads topic is a very emotive subject


Huge Hugs I would rep u for this post but ran out ......xxxx


----------



## mitch4 (Oct 31, 2009)

Thank you Suzy


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

mitch4 said:


> Thank you Suzy


Your very welcome xxx


----------



## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

suzy93074 said:


> Huge Hugs I would rep u for this post but ran out ......xxxx


well , i will rep mitch that was very sad to read and makes me realise again how lucky i am


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

archiebaby said:


> well , i will rep mitch that was very sad to read and makes me realise again how lucky i am


lol thank u  x


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

Just want to state -as is in my case, where its the male who has problems - does this mean I give up my dream of being a mother? no it doesnt - it means as a couple we have decided to do everything possible to have a child because its something we both desperately want and I will not give up that HOPE because that is all I have right now and without it I would be a wreck this decision tests not only you as a person but also your relationship with your partner - it can make or break one and you have to work very hard at not letting it destroy you. All im saying is nothing is black and white there are always grey areas and people who have never dealt with this should at least have a bit of respect in how they say things for those that have.


----------



## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

suzy93074 said:


> Just want to state -as is in my case, where its the male who has problems - does this mean I give up my dream of being a mother? no it doesnt - it means as a couple we have decided to do everything possible to have a child because its something we both desperately want and I will not give up that HOPE because that is all I have right now and without it I would be a wreck this decision tests not only you as a person but also your relationship with your partner - it can make or break one and you have to work very hard at not letting it destroy you. All im saying is nothing is black and white there are always grey areas and people who have never dealt with this should at least have a bit of respect in how they say things for those that have.


i do really feel for you and really hope your dream comes true you must be a very strong couple and that will get you through, well done


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

archiebaby said:


> i do really feel for you and really hope your dream comes true you must be a very strong couple and that will get you through, well done


Thank you so much xx - we have our moments lol but on that subject we are always united  I have a feeling next year is gonna be our year x


----------



## Sarah+Hammies (Jul 20, 2009)

This is a very emotive subject!

I am not against IVF or other fertility drugs/treatments as my cousin wouldnt have had her triplets if it wasnt for IVF, she paid for the treatment herself and now is back at work doing the best she can to support her family, as is her husband.

I have no problem with people doing everything possible to become parents however my issue is when they dont have the finances to fund their treatment and the bringing up of their child/ren but that would take us back to the benefits debate again 

I am very lucky to have had 3 children and the maternal side to me is a very powerful and emotive side. I cannot imagine anyone telling me that i couldnt have children because of fertility issues, be it the man or womans fertility issues!

Also, my son has mild cerebral palsy and i would like to think that when he is older he would have the option of becoming a parent.


----------



## Lulu's owner (May 1, 2009)

Until very recently people would just accept that they couldn't have children for whatever reason and get on with the rest of their lives and try to be good aunties and uncles or friends to neighbours' children. I don't understand why that is so hard. (I'm not speaking from a position of ignorance by the way.)


----------



## harley bear (Feb 20, 2010)

Lulu's owner said:


> Until very recently people would just accept that they couldn't have children for whatever reason and get on with the rest of their lives and try to be good aunties and uncles or friends to neighbours' children. I don't understand why that is so hard. (I'm not speaking from a position of ignorance by the way.)


I dont think anyone will understand until they have felt the longing for a child. Maybe not ugnorance just lack of understanding.


----------



## Sarah+Hammies (Jul 20, 2009)

Lulu's owner said:


> Until very recently people would just accept that they couldn't have children for whatever reason and get on with the rest of their lives and try to be good aunties and uncles or friends to neighbours' children. I don't understand why that is so hard. (I'm not speaking from a position of ignorance by the way.)


I think the main issues come around as technology advances. The technology is there and is readily available so why not?


----------



## harley bear (Feb 20, 2010)

Ignorance


----------



## Lulu's owner (May 1, 2009)

harley bear said:


> I dont think anyone will understand until they have felt the longing for a child. Maybe not ugnorance just lack of understanding.


What I'm saying is that people have to get over longings for all sorts of things, including children. Without going into intensely personal stuff why does that show a lack of understanding? To me it's realism.


----------



## sequeena (Apr 30, 2009)

Oh god... staying out of this.


----------



## MissShelley (May 9, 2010)

Lulu's owner said:


> Until very recently people would just accept that they couldn't have children for whatever reason and get on with the rest of their lives and try to be good aunties and uncles or friends to neighbours' children. I don't understand why that is so hard. (I'm not speaking from a position of ignorance by the way.)


Because everybody thinks differently that's why.... If someone wants to fight tooth and nail to get what they want in life then why shouldn't they?


----------



## harley bear (Feb 20, 2010)

Lulu's owner said:


> What I'm saying is that people have to get over longings for all sorts of things, including children. Without going into intensely personal stuff why does that show a lack of understanding? To me it's realism.


Your right people do long for lots of things. But on the subject of babies its a longing that no one will 'understand' unless you have been in that position. People shouldnt just have to accept it as gods will or whatever, If something can be done then why not? If not then there are lots of other options for a couple to become parents.


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

Lulu's owner said:


> Until very recently people would just accept that they couldn't have children for whatever reason and get on with the rest of their lives and try to be good aunties and uncles or friends to neighbours' children. I don't understand why that is so hard. (I'm not speaking from a position of ignorance by the way.)


But how do you know they really accept it?? I honestly doubt that deep down they do - I think is called a coping mechanism I know I for one throughout my years have put on numerous fronts esp when yet another family member is pregnant or friend is - u coo and ooo and ahhhh in all the right places but inside you are dying .....im not saying at some point after trying many medical procedures that fail that that decision has to be made but to just accept without trying all just imo is very rare.

On a site im on one woman has lost 7 babies(((( but she kept trying and now has a gorgeous son - she never gave up because she so desperately wanted a baby - I guess like everything in life evryone is different and withstand emotional stuff more than others.


----------



## mitch4 (Oct 31, 2009)

archiebaby said:


> well , i will rep mitch that was very sad to read and makes me realise again how lucky i am


Thank you


----------



## sequeena (Apr 30, 2009)

suzy93074 said:


> But how do you know they really accept it?? I honestly doubt that deep down they do - I think is called a coping mechanism I know I for one throughout my years have put on numerous fronts esp when yet another family member is pregnant or friend is - u coo and ooo and ahhhh in all the right places but inside you are dying .....im not saying at some point after trying many medical procedures that fail that that decision has to be made but to just accept without trying all just imo is very rare.


I know a woman who has lost 6 children and she still tries and tries. Should she give up? HELLO NO! She will get her beautiful rainbow baby I just know it!

We can't just look at the women who pop out kids purely to avoid work as the majority of women in this world. They are definitely the minority.

I want children, I've already lost 3 and for my mental health we're currently on a break. Doesn't mean it's not always at the back of my mind though. Every month when the cramps start I die a little 

So much for staying out of it


----------



## mitch4 (Oct 31, 2009)

suzy93074 said:


> Just want to state -as is in my case, where its the male who has problems - does this mean I give up my dream of being a mother? no it doesnt - it means as a couple we have decided to do everything possible to have a child because its something we both desperately want and I will not give up that HOPE because that is all I have right now and without it I would be a wreck this decision tests not only you as a person but also your relationship with your partner - it can make or break one and you have to work very hard at not letting it destroy you. All im saying is nothing is black and white there are always grey areas and people who have never dealt with this should at least have a bit of respect in how they say things for those that have.


I really do hope, you guys can work through this and realise your dream, you will make a wonderful mum, your determination will get you there xxx


----------



## Miss.PuddyCat (Jul 13, 2009)

My mom told me this saying the other day " You can never afford to have kids, and you can always afford them "

I would love to have kids one day (currently 21) Would like be a young mom but would be happy if I was older 

I would go all out for birthdays, christmas (I hate christmas), school, slumber parties, picnics, walks, etc I would like to think Id be a great mom.

I would be happy with 2 or 1 kids.

I would be devasted if I couldnt have kids, I might not show that I really care about kids ( I can be awkward with young kids I dont know) but I would break down crying and most likely go into a bad depression again :frown:

My mom I think would make a fantastic gran from what I have seen with my little cousins. She has even said shell be there if I need a night out on the town unlike her own mother who never stepped up to help.


----------



## mitch4 (Oct 31, 2009)

sequeena said:


> I know a woman who has lost 6 children and she still tries and tries. Should she give up? HELLO NO! She will get her beautiful rainbow baby I just know it!
> 
> We can't just look at the women who pop out kids purely to avoid work as the majority of women in this world. They are definitely the minority.
> 
> ...


Its very sad when this happens, i cant quite imagine how wretched you must feel at this point, i may not be able to conceive but to conceive and lose your baby must be the most painful thing in the world xxx

I know its the minority of woman who have babies to stay out of work, i was just a bit over emotional when i stated this as i said in my post some wonderful single mums out there


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

sequeena said:


> I know a woman who has lost 6 children and she still tries and tries. Should she give up? HELLO NO! She will get her beautiful rainbow baby I just know it!
> 
> We can't just look at the women who pop out kids purely to avoid work as the majority of women in this world. They are definitely the minority.
> 
> ...


----------



## FREE SPIRIT (Jul 8, 2009)

Happy Paws said:


> Do you think it's your right to have a baby even if you have to have medical help, when people can't get jobs our country and the world is so over crowded.


*Yes i do think people have the right to have a baby with medical assistance even in this current climate. As for the over crowding part....I know alot of people that should be put down. That might even the balance? *


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

MissShelley said:


> Because everybody thinks differently that's why.... If someone wants to fight tooth and nail to get what they want in life then why shouldn't they?


This is exactly how I feel - im currently overweight for my treatment to commence so have been dieting and have lost two stone nearly - never had such a great incentive!! I WILL succeed and try with every fibre of my being because this is something I want more than anything - its amazing how many people are going thru fertility problems as well i tell you i would never have guessed so many do.


----------



## harley bear (Feb 20, 2010)

FREE SPIRIT said:


> *Yes i do think people have the right to have a baby with medical assistance even in this current climate. As for the over crowding part....I know alot of people that should be put down. That might even the balance? *


Lol Im right with ya on that one! I could write a list as long as my arm


----------



## sequeena (Apr 30, 2009)

Oh I didn't mean you mitch xx I think it's an excuse thrown about willynilly when the subject of kids arises. It's not a valid argument imo.

I've come to terms with my losses. Everything is down to chance. You have a 1/4 chance of conceiving each month (according to my doctor) and you are very lucky if you get to a positive pregnancy test. Getting to 8 weeks is even harder. You can relax a bit at 12 weeks but as Lily Allen sadly proved there is no knowing what may happen. Then after the birth there's the chance of SIDS etc. It's neverending!!

But I would do it all without a grumble 

I'm hoping 2011 will be my year. It would be a nice 22nd birthday present


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

FREE SPIRIT said:


> *Yes i do think people have the right to have a baby with medical assistance even in this current climate. As for the over crowding part....I know alot of people that should be put down. That might even the balance? *


:thumbup::thumbup: love it Ony I can think of a few too! loves ya!xxxx


----------



## sequeena (Apr 30, 2009)

FREE SPIRIT said:


> *Yes i do think people have the right to have a baby with medical assistance even in this current climate. As for the over crowding part....I know alot of people that should be put down. That might even the balance? *


Yeah me too Janice, would quite happily do the deed myself :thumbup:


----------



## FREE SPIRIT (Jul 8, 2009)

suzy93074 said:


> :thumbup::thumbup: love it Ony I can think of a few too! loves ya!xxxx


*lol, Suzy...you know me, straight to the point as always 
Loves ya too mate....xxxx *


----------



## FREE SPIRIT (Jul 8, 2009)

sequeena said:


> Yeah me too Janice, would quite happily do the deed myself :thumbup:


*Janice?  :lol:*


----------



## sequeena (Apr 30, 2009)

Bloody hell Ony sorry, I thought you were your mum because of the colour of your font


----------



## FREE SPIRIT (Jul 8, 2009)

sequeena said:


> Bloody hell Ony sorry, I thought you were your mum because of the colour of your font


*lol....Phew, thought i'd been forgotten already  *


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

sequeena said:


> Yeah me too Janice, would quite happily do the deed myself :thumbup:


Get in line LOL:lol::lol:


----------



## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

FREE SPIRIT said:


> *Yes i do think people have the right to have a baby with medical assistance even in this current climate. As for the over crowding part....I know alot of people that should be put down. That might even the balance? *


Rep for you young lady:thumbup:


----------



## FREE SPIRIT (Jul 8, 2009)

simplysardonic said:


> Rep for you young lady:thumbup:


*Thank you kind lady.   xxxx*


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

FREE SPIRIT said:


> *lol....Phew, thought i'd been forgotten already  *


:eek6: You!! nahhhh


----------



## FREE SPIRIT (Jul 8, 2009)

suzy93074 said:


> :eek6: You!! nahhhh


*Im never far away.  *


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

Lets just hope the OP looks through this thread and realises that everyone is different and that noone has the right to make or take others choices away from them!


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

FREE SPIRIT said:


> *Im never far away.  *


:thumbup::thumbup:


----------



## archiebaby (Feb 25, 2008)

suzy93074 said:


> Thank you so much xx - we have our moments lol but on that subject we are always united  I have a feeling next year is gonna be our year x


oh , i so hope so


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

archiebaby said:


> oh , i so hope so


Bless ya thanks xx


----------



## Starlite (Sep 9, 2009)

Being pregnant myslef all i can say is wow!

I feel quilty alot of the time that i fell pregnant so quickly (within a few weeks) as i know there are people struggling.
My wee one was planned, we both work and my OH pays full support to his wee girl with his ex. She also stays with us some weekends 

If i had a genetic disorder which could pass on and hurt my child it would have broke my heart but i would have had my tubes tied. Saying that, I do have mental health problems which i worry about passing down 
Having a disablility DOES NOT mean you cant be a good parent imo, and all this crap "its against God". Well he gave humans free will so we can do what we want 

Nature shouldnt be messed with? If nature was so against medical assistance with conceiving then it would NEVER take would it? We mess with nature every day, alot of us here are dog/cat breeders!

Every person who can afford a child should be able to try, they are a blessing and these kids and the current ones will be paying for your retirement remember!!!!


----------



## simplysardonic (Sep 1, 2009)

I guess I shouldn't be here really, I nearly died having my 2nd child, & him along with me, would have done if not for the amazing advances in medical technology we have- this would have left my oldest son without a mother but hey, I'm sure he would have understood growing up that it was just natural selection


Starlite said:


> If i had a genetic disorder which could pass on and hurt my child it would have broke my heart but i would have had my tubes tied. *Saying that, I do have mental health problems which i worry about passing down *


so do I hun & I worry about all mine all the time


----------



## harley bear (Feb 20, 2010)

Starlite said:


> Being pregnant myslef all i can say is wow!
> 
> I feel quilty alot of the time that i fell pregnant so quickly (within a few weeks) as i know there are people struggling.
> My wee one was planned, we both work and my OH pays full support to his wee girl with his ex. She also stays with us some weekends
> ...


Dont feel guilty about getting pregnant straight away! It took us years to have our first little boy and we didnt want to wait very long so started to sty again almost straight away. We fell pregnant the month we were trying our little man was 11 weeks old at the time.

You have made some good points in your posts but also is nature was so against medical assistance then man kind wouldnt have the intelligence to produce the medical assistance we have today.


----------



## LostGirl (Jan 16, 2009)

I didnt say You did Happy paws Just stating thats a goverments way of dealing with over population and that no women has a "right" to be a parent of more then one child. many Places are over populated, under fed e.t.c doesnt mean those people shouldnt have children Most mothers will fight tooth a nail to provide for thier children/grandchildren e.t.c 

I had struggles with pregnancy not so much getting pregnant but keeping pregnancy should i have seen it as natures way for me not to be a mother? 

should my sister who is struggling at the moment to have a baby give up because nature gave her cancerous cells at 24yrs old? 

If its the case that its natures way, then nothing should ever be treated cancer/flu e.t.c any illness that needs treatment shouldnt be treated as its natures way of lowering the population.


----------



## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

GoldenShadow said:


> Sorry but I hve to jump in here. You can't say god would stop it if it was against his will because last time I checked murder was against his will but he hasn't stopped that
> 
> I go for the if it's meant to be it will be, but that could be via fertility treatment or naturally. I think as long as kids can be provided for by their parents financially and hopefully emotionally then fine.


That was exactly my point  I'm not a 'believer', but I know it's what some folk say when they try to reason situations.

I believe nothing is impossible, but some things can be very very difficult.


----------



## MissusMayhem (Aug 14, 2010)

i just want to point out that a few months back i found out that it might be possible that i may not be able to have children its not certain 
but its a hard thing to come to terms with at 19 years old that there may well not be children in my future....

personally i think if you want to be a parent and want to do a good job of it 
do everything in your power to get there 
and i will be doing! weather it means ivf or adoption i will try everything 
and i think that if people think badly of me for that they can stuff it


----------



## ClaireLouise (Oct 11, 2009)

suzy93074 said:


> Bless ya thanks xx


Suzy- Some people are ment to be parents and your one of them :thumbup: :thumbup:

I believe regardless of fertility issues some people will make great parents and deserve children, if in becoming parents they need help it should be provided, every woman has the right to be a mum, especially in this day in age with all medical advances availible.


----------



## FREE SPIRIT (Jul 8, 2009)

ClaireLouise said:


> every woman has the right to be a mum, especially in this day in age with all medical advances availible.


*Believe me i know quite a few people who definitely DON'T have the right to be mothers. An example: someone i know is a p!ss head, had 5 children and they all ended up in care. One of which i ended up fostering for a few months.
Then you get those who DO deserve to be mums but might be facing many problems. All those that ARE deserving though, deserve all the help available. *


----------



## Leah84 (Jun 22, 2009)

simplysardonic said:


> I guess I shouldn't be here really, I nearly died having my 2nd child, & him along with me, would have done if not for the amazing advances in medical technology we have- this would have left my oldest son without a mother but hey, I'm sure he would have understood growing up that it was just natural selection
> 
> so do I hun & I worry about all mine all the time


i have to third this! i have mental health problems but i would never make them known to my daughter. granted she`s seen me rushed to hospital and worried but i`ll try my very best for her and do what i can.

i almost died too with her, i had severe pre eclampsia which lasted 2 weeks after birth and also haemorraged badly to the point i lost consciousness, it`s scary but doesn`t mean it`d put me off having another! everyone should be given the chance an i find it sickening to read some posts on this thread! my friend has actually asked me if i`d be a surrogate for her, she had an op go wrong when she was younger meaning it`s unlikely she can conceive so does that make it wrong that she wants a baby? if the time comes when she`s ready and settled then it`s something i`d need to consider and talk with my oh about. but i think she deserves a child just as much as i did with my gorgeous daughter!


----------



## staceydawlz (Jun 8, 2009)

oh my!! i think this has really gone a bit wild she/he asked for views on it not to be jumped down on!!...i have a little girl she is my life and wont bother posting my views as i think some of you are taking this all a bit to heart xx


----------



## vickie1985 (Feb 18, 2009)

suzy93074 said:


> Huge Hugs I would rep u for this post but ran out ......xxxx


i have given rep from us both


----------



## vickie1985 (Feb 18, 2009)

MissusMayhem said:


> i just want to point out that a few months back i found out that it might be possible that i may not be able to have children its not certain
> but its a hard thing to come to terms with at 19 years old that there may well not be children in my future....
> 
> personally i think if you want to be a parent and want to do a good job of it
> ...


i was 19 when testing started, i know exactly how you feel hun.


----------



## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

staceydawlz said:


> oh my!! i think this has really gone a bit wild she/he asked for views on it not to be jumped down on!!...*i have a little girl *she is my life and wont bother posting my views as i think some of you are taking this all a bit to heart xx


Which is probably why you think some of us are taking this a bit far?

Besides anyway, I don't think anyone is?


----------



## staceydawlz (Jun 8, 2009)

no i have a little girl but i think some of you are questioning a question no one mention babies iin china but it was brought up in a question some of you have told us ur lifes...which i great a proper view towards the question being asked but when ur jumping down peoples throat i think its been taken too far i think everyone has a right to have a child or more but with a right comes a responsibility!! and that should always be thought about first xx


----------



## mitch4 (Oct 31, 2009)

Vickie and missusmayhem I hope you get your dream xxx


----------



## FREE SPIRIT (Jul 8, 2009)

Kammie said:


> The world is so over populated in my opionion because of the advances in science both keeping people alive and fertility treatment.
> 
> I'm in the thought that we should let nature have its control back


*Slight contradiction wouldn't you say? If the world is over populated because of fertility treatment, how do you account for contraception? Surely if left to nature with no contraception the world would be even more over populated? *


----------



## jenniferx (Jan 23, 2009)

Sequeena, Vicky, Missusmayhem and Suzy- I sincerely hope it all works out for you girls. I really do. I am so scared that I will run in to difficulties when I start to try  

People that do everything, try so hard and are so dedicated through all the ups and downs that come with fertility treatment are just the kind of people to be wonderful parents IMO. The babies could not be more loved or cherished.


----------



## FREE SPIRIT (Jul 8, 2009)

jenniferx said:


> Sequeena, Vicky, Missusmayhem and Suzy- I sincerely hope it all works out for you girls. I really do. I am so scared that I will run in to difficulties when I start to try
> 
> People that do everything, try so hard and are so dedicated through all the ups and downs that come with fertility treatment are just the kind of people to be wonderful parents IMO. The babies could not be more loved or cherished.


*Totally agree with you. *


----------



## mitch4 (Oct 31, 2009)

jenniferx said:


> Sequeena, Vicky, Missusmayhem and Suzy- I sincerely hope it all works out for you girls. I really do. I am so scared that I will run in to difficulties when I start to try
> 
> People that do everything, try so hard and are so dedicated through all the ups and downs that come with fertility treatment are just the kind of people to be wonderful parents IMO. The babies could not be more loved or cherished.


good post


----------



## Staysee (Oct 19, 2009)

I dont have a child and would like to have children in the future, im only 24 at the mo and still enjoying my single life

I've been there as a friends suffered, before i met her she had had 2 misscarridges. Then one day i was in work with my parents [we had a cafe] and i saw her running to our door, i knew something was up. She ran into the shop and hugged me crying and said quietly "i think i've lost the baby" we told her to go to the toilet, cool herself down and i'd take her down to the hospital, just a 5min walk away. When we got there they didnt really ask much, just heard and immediatly called for an ambulance to take her over to a larger hospital, i ran round to her flat to pick up some clothes incase she was kept in and was with her as she was taken to hospital and waited as she was checked over. They confirmed she had another misscarridge. She just went silent, it was so upsetting as she was always lively, bubbly and talkative. She was kept in and i went home. About two weeks later i went back with her again as they wanted her back to check up on her and everything was fine in her [fine as they could be].

I'd never seen someone suffer so much, she was amazing with children, always the one who babysat for her friends. Altho there was this one woman....who i did like, then while she was pregnant, just after she announced her 3rd pregnancy this woman said to her

"Its not fair that you can get pregnant and i cant, your not even good with children" she also made a comment that my friend would be a rubbish mother if she did give birth, seeing as she "couldnt keep a pregnancy for so long"

She eventually after many arguments with her fella, split with him and found it really hard to cope.

She found a new guy and just accepted the fact she may never have kids. She fell pregnant again, this time by accident but didnt announce it til she was quite far gone along, so as not to risk anything. She's now a very proud mother to a gorgeous little girl who she dotes on every second.

I dont think anyone should be denied the chance to have a child or children. Like someone else said....if its meant to be, it'll happen....wether its naturally or through treatment, maybe the treatment will just kick a little something into place and that'll be it


----------



## RockRomantic (Apr 29, 2009)

wow. im shocked and a bit upset by this thread actually, 

me and my husband cannot have children naturally. i'm 22. 
i'm desperate to be a mum. he has children already, as much as i love them it kills me to know i will not be able to just ive my husband a child.

Maybe i should stop dreaming.

maybe i should stop spending most nights being upset over it and just accept it's natures way of keeping population down.


----------



## haeveymolly (Mar 7, 2009)

Havnt read many of the posts, waaayyyy too many so sorry if ime repeating but this is my view and not prompted by others.

To be quite honest to deny anyone the joy of being a parent would be to me one of the cruelest things anyone could do, i feel lucky to have had the pleasure of babies, toddlers, teenagers and now young men going out there and finding their own way i wouldnt have missed it for the world, so denying someone that to me is unthinkable.

I can say if someone has to have an assisted pregnancy through an ilness and that ilness was going to mean they will die while the child is still young then no, because afterall we have to think not only of the poor mum but the child going through their young life having lost their mum, that i feel is wrong, but other than that everyone should be allowed to have all the help they can to have a baby.


----------



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

suzy93074 said:


> You have every right to express your opinion and I have every right to disagree with it ! - no where have I or anyone else got personal with you - you have chosen to do a thread which is of a very personal matter that is obviously going to affect many women on here - how many members do you know going thru fertility treatment?? or who cannot have children???exactly you dont so to post such a sensitive subject in such an UN sensitive way ...*well u reap what you sow hun!!*


*I was not the one who mentioned killing baby girls locking them up in homes or concentration camps and to say that I would even think like that, is a insult.

I think I made a some point about over population a simple question "I thought".
*


----------



## vickie1985 (Feb 18, 2009)

luckily for me 7 years down the line from when testing started.........

as some of you know (well most infact) myself and my dear OH will be bringing home out daughter in January. 

it will not be instant love or bond, but i know adoption will blossom into as much love as going through IVF and coming out the other end with the gift of life. 
Our daughter is a beautiful soon to be 1 year old, and has the most cutest smile and her eyes light up when she smiles. She is chunky and healthy and just so cheek pullingy snuggable. Developing a cheeky personality and is one of the most placid babies ive ever known. Her foster carers are 2 very special people and worth their weight in gold and more! They have made our daughter what she is today, and when she comes to us she will be in a loving stable home, we will be privlidged to be chosen for her. We will do everything in our power to give her the love, support and education she needs to become a functioning member of sociaty.

(sorry for spelling mistakes, i will get a dictionary on order for her 1st xmas with us lol)


----------



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

vickie1985 said:


> luckily for me 7 years down the line from when testing started.........
> 
> as some of you know (well most infact) myself and my dear OH will be bringing home out daughter in January.
> 
> ...


What is your little girl's name? 
I wish the three of you a very happy life together.


----------



## vickie1985 (Feb 18, 2009)

Happy Paws said:


> What is your little girl's name?
> I wish the three of you a very happy life together.


we cant publish her name onto the internet for identity purposes.


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

ClaireLouise said:


> Suzy- Some people are ment to be parents and your one of them :thumbup: :thumbup:
> 
> I believe regardless of fertility issues some people will make great parents and deserve children, if in becoming parents they need help it should be provided, every woman has the right to be a mum, especially in this day in age with all medical advances availible.


Thank you Claire - great post and totally agree xxxx



FREE SPIRIT said:


> *Believe me i know quite a few people who definitely DON'T have the right to be mothers. An example: someone i know is a p!ss head, had 5 children and they all ended up in care. One of which i ended up fostering for a few months.
> Then you get those who DO deserve to be mums but might be facing many problems. All those that ARE deserving though, deserve all the help available. *


Great post xxxx



vickie1985 said:


> i have given rep from us both


Thank you xx



jenniferx said:


> Sequeena, Vicky, Missusmayhem and Suzy- I sincerely hope it all works out for you girls. I really do. I am so scared that I will run in to difficulties when I start to try
> 
> Thank you xxx im sure u will be fine if not the treatments available are brilliant xx
> 
> People that do everything, try so hard and are so dedicated through all the ups and downs that come with fertility treatment are just the kind of people to be wonderful parents IMO. The babies could not be more loved or cherished.


Great post!xx



RockRomantic said:


> wow. im shocked and a bit upset by this thread actually,
> 
> me and my husband cannot have children naturally. i'm 22.
> i'm desperate to be a mum. he has children already, as much as i love them it kills me to know i will not be able to just ive my husband a child.
> ...


Never give up hoping and trying hun fight till the end you have right to xxx



Happy Paws said:


> *I was not the one who mentioned killing baby girls locking them up in homes or concentration camps and to say that I would even think like that, is a insult.
> 
> I think I made a some point about over population a simple question "I thought".
> *


 I never mentioned killing baby girls I said your quote about keeping the population down "reminded" me of hitler and concentration camps - you my dear made those other assumptions - and on this subject which is so emotive to others it is never a simple question maybe u should have thought about that before u posted in such a hostile way. I took your post personally because im going thru this right now in my life and I will NOT accept your cruel outlook on life and I have every right to make that known for myself and others on here who are going thru the same thing who might read your posts and then feel guilty for having treatment! you have no right to make people feel like that intentionally or not!



vickie1985 said:


> luckily for me 7 years down the line from when testing started.........
> 
> as some of you know (well most infact) myself and my dear OH will be bringing home out daughter in January.
> 
> ...


:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup: sooo soooo happy for you vicky u and your partner will be giving this little girl an amazing life of love and happiness and imo thats all a lot of kids out there need.:thumbup:


----------



## charlie9009 (Nov 24, 2008)

I haven't read the whole thread, so sorry if I'm repeating anything anyone else has said.

I think that it was very insensetive to start this thread. Many women, and men, go through this and why shouldn't they have help to have children? I know people that have been through this and their children are the most well looked after children I know, as they are even more precious to them. I also know people that can have children, and have, but really don't care for them very well. Why is it ok for them to have children, but not other poeple just because they can?

And saying that it is natures way is just silly. So every person who has cancer or any other diesease should be left to die, not get treatment? That is natures way! Well I hope no one you know will ever get anyting like that!!


----------



## dobermummy (Apr 4, 2009)

suzy93074 said:


> I never mentioned killing baby girls I said your quote about keeping the population down "reminded" me of hitler and concentration camps - you my dear made those other assumptions - and on this subject which is so emotive to others it is never a simple question maybe u should have thought about that before u posted in such a hostile way. I took your post personally because im going thru this right now in my life and I will NOT accept your cruel outlook on life and I have every right to make that known for myself and others on here who are going thru the same thing who might read your posts and then feel guilty for having treatment! you have no right to make people feel like that intentionally or not!
> 
> :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup: sooo soooo happy for you vicky u and your partner will be giving this little girl an amazing life of love and happiness and imo thats all a lot of kids out there need.:thumbup:


i agree Vicky will be an amazing mum, as will you wahen you get the chance

you are an amazing, special person suzy and will be a fantastic mum

xx


----------



## JohnMorris (Oct 15, 2010)

I think everyone is entitled to have the right to a baby and whether they need medical help ect is irrelevent. As you know we are unable to have children and are hoping to adopt. If we can then there may be a time when I have to give up work to help look after said children due to Katie's health problems and I would do that willingly. Wishing vicky1985 and her husband all the love and best wishes for January and your new daughter; although must admit I am so jealous. I don't think this thread is insensitive per se; there are several of us on here who have problems with having kids and it isn't something that should be hidden under the carpet in this day and age. I think some people's replies have been slightly insensitively written but they are giving their opinions like we all can do. If only I had a magic wand and could give everyone the children they desire.


----------



## Bexy (Apr 11, 2010)

suzy93074 said:


> Just want to state -as is in my case, where its the male who has problems - does this mean I give up my dream of being a mother? no it doesnt - it means as a couple we have decided to do everything possible to have a child because its something we both desperately want and I will not give up that HOPE because that is all I have right now and without it I would be a wreck this decision tests not only you as a person but also your relationship with your partner - it can make or break one and you have to work very hard at not letting it destroy you. All im saying is nothing is black and white there are always grey areas and people who have never dealt with this should at least have a bit of respect in how they say things for those that have.


Totally agree with you. I think any couple who has to go through fertility treatment are stronger than your average couple. The strain in puts on the relationship can be so painful but I know after facing this me and my husband could face anything together and still come out stronger than ever.

Like you our infertility is with my partner. According some posts nature says I should be a mother but my partner shouldn't be a father but i am not off out find myself a super fertile man. I want a baby but I want a baby with the man I'll spend the rest of my life with and whom together we can provide a loving stable family life to raise this child with.

I am grateful I live in the UK and the NHS is able to try and give people like me the opportunity which is taken for granted by others. Hopefully it'll work within the limit of the 2 goes I get with the NHS but if not I will go private and beg, borrow and steal the money such is my desire to be a mother.


----------



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

vickie1985 said:


> we cant publish her name onto the internet for identity purposes.


I understand, never thought about that. 
It must seem a long wait for you, lets hope the next couple of months fly by, then lots of pictures I hope.


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

Bexy said:


> Totally agree with you. I think any couple who has to go through fertility treatment are stronger than your average couple. The strain in puts on the relationship can be so painful but I know after facing this me and my husband could face anything together and still come out stronger than ever.
> 
> Like you our infertility is with my partner. According some posts nature says I should be a mother but my partner shouldn't be a father but i am not off out find myself a super fertile man. I want a baby but I want a baby with the man I'll spend the rest of my life with and whom together we can provide a loving stable family life to raise this child with.
> 
> I am grateful I live in the UK and the NHS is able to try and give people like me the opportunity which is taken for granted by others. Hopefully it'll work within the limit of the 2 goes I get with the NHS but if not I will go private and beg, borrow and steal the money such is my desire to be a mother.


Everything crossed for you hun - great post - sums up my thoughts exactly - lots of baby dust for evryone:thumbup:


----------



## mitch4 (Oct 31, 2009)

vickie1985 said:


> luckily for me 7 years down the line from when testing started.........
> 
> as some of you know (well most infact) myself and my dear OH will be bringing home out daughter in January.
> 
> ...


Absolutely wonderful news, one lucky little baby girl, you will have great fun times ahead xxx


----------



## mitch4 (Oct 31, 2009)

Bexy said:


> Totally agree with you. I think any couple who has to go through fertility treatment are stronger than your average couple. The strain in puts on the relationship can be so painful but I know after facing this me and my husband could face anything together and still come out stronger than ever.
> 
> Like you our infertility is with my partner. According some posts nature says I should be a mother but my partner shouldn't be a father but i am not off out find myself a super fertile man. I want a baby but I want a baby with the man I'll spend the rest of my life with and whom together we can provide a loving stable family life to raise this child with.
> 
> I am grateful I live in the UK and the NHS is able to try and give people like me the opportunity which is taken for granted by others. Hopefully it'll work within the limit of the 2 goes I get with the NHS but if not I will go private and beg, borrow and steal the money such is my desire to be a mother.


Good luck


----------



## Staysee (Oct 19, 2009)

Oh and the 'Natures Way of keeping the population down' comments. That hurts me!

I had to have heart surgery as a baby, cos if i didnt i would of died, so should nature of just been allowed to carry on and i should not be here now typing this?

Should then all the people with cancer be shuned away for treatment, cos its just natures way of keeping the population down?

Meningitus - Guess we should let that just kill people too.

Along with all the different strains of flus that kill.



If someones not meant to have kids, they wont, even with medical help, its unfortunate and my heart would really go out to them, also to the couples struggling to have a child, my heart goes out to them.

Whatevers meant to happen will happen, no matter how much we tamper with it using medicine or not using medicine


----------



## Bellarina (Feb 4, 2009)

This thread has really got to me perhaps in a different way to alot of you. My desire to have children is so strong that I have walked away from a man I love very much because he says he never wants any. And I am questioning my decision as I'm totally heartbroken.

We met exactly a year ago (our anniversary was saturday and we broke up on saturday) and he always said he was never sure about having children, we have been very happy but as time has gone on his thoughts on the subject have got stronger due to particular things happening around us, but as everything else was so good I put it to the back of my mind. I have always wanted a family and as much as I love him I have to know that I may someday have the opportunity to do that in whatever way I can.

I don't know if I will ever be physically able to have children but I have walked away from a wonderful man to give myself that chance. So I think for many people the desire to have children will make you do whatever you have to do.


----------



## turkeylad (Mar 1, 2009)

Absolutely not a right but it is every persons right to try for a child. Dont underestimate the role of adoption. Even if the security forces (Social Services) have stupid criteria.

Personally would just be grateful that i couldnt -cannot stand kids!!! especially other peoples.


----------



## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

*I've just come across this thread and yes i do think people have the "right" to have children.As for the person who said years ago those that couldn't have children just accepted it and got on with life,i say, we have moved on in the medical world and imo all should be given the help they need to be able to have children.I might add, i think it should be free as well.*


----------



## cheekyscrip (Feb 8, 2010)

just to say, Janice deserve arep..and as to keep the population down...some people choose not to have children and that is the best way...give and respect that choice!!!!
*Who wants children should be given any help avaiable and who do not should not be ever belittled for it.....*


----------



## BeagleOesx (Oct 9, 2009)

I think anyone who wants children should not be denied that right in the same way we should respect anyone who doesn't want children - that is their right also. Not everyone have the same maternal instincts and feelings towards having a family but if you do and you are unable to fulfil that naturally then I feel that every assistance should be given to help.

I have been very lucky in that I have 2 beautiful (now grown up) children and I have always felt blessed. Because of this quite a few years ago now, when I was 30 I decided to donate some eggs so that the opportunity could be given to other couples who were desperate for a family. It was not an easy road with the medication I had to take and frequent visits to the clinic but the day they successfully 'harvested' my eggs I felt a degree of self-satisfaction that somewhere someone would be able to get that chance of a family they longed for. Obviously it is all done anonomously but during follow up checks with the hospital they did tell me that some of the eggs had been transplanted to a recipient and that they were successful:thumbup:


----------



## JohnMorris (Oct 15, 2010)

Bellarina said:


> This thread has really got to me perhaps in a different way to alot of you. My desire to have children is so strong that I have walked away from a man I love very much because he says he never wants any. And I am questioning my decision as I'm totally heartbroken.
> 
> We met exactly a year ago (our anniversary was saturday and we broke up on saturday) and he always said he was never sure about having children, we have been very happy but as time has gone on his thoughts on the subject have got stronger due to particular things happening around us, but as everything else was so good I put it to the back of my mind. I have always wanted a family and as much as I love him I have to know that I may someday have the opportunity to do that in whatever way I can.
> 
> I don't know if I will ever be physically able to have children but I have walked away from a wonderful man to give myself that chance. So I think for many people the desire to have children will make you do whatever you have to do.


Be strong and know that you did the right thing if he didn't want children and your desire is so strong. He isn't going to change his mind and if you stayed with him you would always feel unwhole. You will find the right man and have children - if you'd stayed with him, you wouldn't. Good lcuk.


----------



## JohnMorris (Oct 15, 2010)

We are desperate for children and as I have already said on this forum, we are unable to have children due to Katie's illness and so are hoping to adopt. Neither of us can imagine life without childrena dnif we are unsuccessful in the UK then we shall try in other parts of the world as there are children as desperate for a loving home as we are to give one.


----------



## lil muppet (Apr 4, 2008)

not sure if this has been said before because i really cba to look though 11 pages!!  and i know its not really bang on topic but...

just because you can have kids does not mean you will make a good parent and just because you cant have kids does not mean you wont be a good parent!!... just watch the jeremy kyle show  some people dont deserve children when others would make 100000 x better parents but cant have kids


----------



## vickie1985 (Feb 18, 2009)

JohnMorris said:


> We are desperate for children and as I have already said on this forum, we are unable to have children due to Katie's illness and so are hoping to adopt. Neither of us can imagine life without childrena dnif we are unsuccessful in the UK then we shall try in other parts of the world as there are children as desperate for a loving home as we are to give one.


im sure you will be fine adopting in the UK, Theres a lot to it, and it can be upsetting at time, but it will be worth it when you get to our stage! If you have any questions myself and my partner will be happy to help, let me know if you would like my e-mail address.


----------



## vickie1985 (Feb 18, 2009)

lil_muppet said:


> not sure if this has been said before because i really cba to look though 11 pages!!  and i know its not really bang on topic but...
> 
> just because you can have kids does not mean you will make a good parent and just because you cant have kids does not mean you wont be a good parent!!... just watch the jeremy kyle show  some people dont deserve children when others would make 100000 x better parents but cant have kids


that is usually the case


----------



## JohnMorris (Oct 15, 2010)

vickie1985 said:


> im sure you will be fine adopting in the UK, Theres a lot to it, and it can be upsetting at time, but it will be worth it when you get to our stage! If you have any questions myself and my partner will be happy to help, let me know if you would like my e-mail address.[/QUOTE]
> 
> THanks, that is very kind of you. I will pm my email address to you.


----------



## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

Happy Paws said:


> Do you think it's your right to have a baby even if you have to have medical help, when people can't get jobs our country and the world is so over crowded.


No, if you can't have one you can't have one. If people want to have IVF and fund it themselves then I have no problem but I do not agree with it being funded on the NHS.


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

Biawhiska said:


> No, if you can't have one you can't have one. If people want to have IVF and fund it themselves then I have no problem but I do not agree with it being funded on the NHS.


I have paid NI for 21 years and feel I am entitled to be funded - in fact they advise you to go NHS first!! - If mine are unsuccessful I will then go private


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

BeagleOesx said:


> I think anyone who wants children should not be denied that right in the same way we should respect anyone who doesn't want children - that is their right also. Not everyone have the same maternal instincts and feelings towards having a family but if you do and you are unable to fulfil that naturally then I feel that every assistance should be given to help.
> 
> I have been very lucky in that I have 2 beautiful (now grown up) children and I have always felt blessed. Because of this quite a few years ago now, when I was 30 I decided to donate some eggs so that the opportunity could be given to other couples who were desperate for a family. It was not an easy road with the medication I had to take and frequent visits to the clinic but the day they successfully 'harvested' my eggs I felt a degree of self-satisfaction that somewhere someone would be able to get that chance of a family they longed for. Obviously it is all done anonomously but during follow up checks with the hospital they did tell me that some of the eggs had been transplanted to a recipient and that they were successful:thumbup:


What a wonderul thing to do  It is definetly something I would look into doing as well when I have had my treatment :thumbup:


----------



## sequeena (Apr 30, 2009)

I think they are scrapping IVF from the NHS... or talking about it anyway... I dunno it was being discussed elsewhere.

I have no objections funding my own IVF.


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

Glad mine isnt IVF then I think this will only be applicable in certain areas - I know where I am the hospital has a huge dept for fertility oh and I dont object to self funding either but if I can apply for at least one treatment via NHS then I will


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

Also as I was told from my clinic - their was an age limit going to be put in place - anyone over the age of 36 would have to pay for treatment - this has now been scrapped and the age limit is again 40 - and there is even talk of this being scrapped as there are many women trying for children later in life and doctors/hospitals fear being sued for age discrimination


----------



## harley bear (Feb 20, 2010)

suzy93074 said:


> Also as I was told from my clinic - their was an age limit going to be put in place - anyone over the age of 36 would have to pay for treatment - this has now been scrapped and the age limit is again 40 - and there is even talk of this being scrapped as there are many women trying for children later in life and doctors/hospitals fear being sued for age discrimination


I dont think they should scrap IVF but i think they should make age limits. Its a well known fact that a womans body is at its peak mid 20's -early 30's. I was told when we were advised to have IVF that i was not alloud to go on the register until i was 29!!! WTF?Its reduculous that they put the age limit to even get on the register that high. There should be only one round of IVF alloud on NHS IMO. 
When it comes to women deciding to have IVF late 40's and older then they should be made to pay something towards it. Its one thing being in your prime and trying for a child and there being something wrong with either partner, but its a whole different ball game when women leave it THAT long to try for a child that its just not naturally possible for them to have a child.


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

harley bear said:


> I dont think they should scrap IVF but i think they should make age limits. Its a well known fact that a womans body is at its peak mid 20's -early 30's. I was told when we were advised to have IVF that i was not alloud to go on the register until i was 29!!! WTF?Its reduculous that they put the age limit to even get on the register that high. There should be only one round of IVF alloud on NHS IMO.
> When it comes to women deciding to have IVF late 40's and older then they should be made to pay something towards it. Its one thing being in your prime and trying for a child and there being something wrong with either partner, but its a whole different ball game when women leave it THAT long to try for a child that its just not naturally possible for them to have a child.


Yeah I can see what you are saying - I think they are looking at it this way because a lot of women are having childen or not thinking of having children until their thirties etc - due to change in society etc so a lot of women feel they are being discriminated because they choose to have one later on in life but yeah I think at 40 or over then paying is more viable


----------



## harley bear (Feb 20, 2010)

suzy93074 said:


> Yeah I can see what you are saying - I think they are looking at it this way because a lot of women are having childen or not thinking of having children until their thirties etc - due to change in society etc so a lot of women feel they are being discriminated because they choose to have one later on in life but yeah I think at 40 or over then paying is more viable


Thats true, silly really because its like them saying that nature is descriminating against them because they wanted to wait. But its not only problems getting pregnant its the health of the baby aswell. I was shocked when i read that something like 20% of IVF babies were aborted due to abnormalities and even because people just changed their mind!


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

harley bear said:


> Thats true, silly really because its like them saying that nature is descriminating against them because they wanted to wait. But its not only problems getting pregnant its the health of the baby aswell. I was shocked when i read that something like 20% of IVF babies were aborted due to abnormalities and even because people just changed their mind!


Oh yes thats one of my main worries really at 36 (just) I really am worried about health of the baby etc but I guess its something you have to deal with as it happens - there are always going to be risks with IVF - and disappointments many women I know have had IVF been told BFP and then lost the baby a few days or weeks later - sad but just nature I guess - have to be really strong


----------



## cutekiaro1 (Dec 15, 2009)

I think it is every womans right to try for a baby, its not a case of if you cant, you cant tough.

I think unless you have been in the situation where you cant have kids, your opinion is going to vary.

I know I would be devestated if I couldnt have kids (dont have any yet) and I dont think I would be able to give up without a fight.

I could understand people saying 'give up' if the likes of IVF were unproven or there were many cases of a deformalities but as it is so well proven and makes many peoples families complete....... Who is to say they shouldnt keep trying?



I would far rather my taxes being spent on deserving people who want a baby and would think the world of it than the scroungers who have kids to get everything paid for them ............... These are the people I despise (sp) when there are families out there crying out for a child who genuinely want one


----------



## harley bear (Feb 20, 2010)

suzy93074 said:


> Oh yes thats one of my main worries really at 36 (just) I really am worried about health of the baby etc but I guess its something you have to deal with as it happens - there are always going to be risks with IVF - and disappointments many women I know have had IVF been told BFP and then lost the baby a few days or weeks later - sad but just nature I guess - have to be really strong


Nomatter how tough it gets dont give up! I know it sounds silly coming from someone who has kids but i knew a couple who tried and tried for years!, 18 yrs later they were about to give up ang got pregnant miracles can happen. I really hope everything works out for you and all the ladies that are trying for a baby


----------



## suzy93074 (Sep 3, 2008)

cutekiaro1 said:


> I think it is every womans right to try for a baby, its not a case of if you cant, you cant tough.
> 
> I think unless you have been in the situation where you cant have kids, your opinion is going to vary.
> 
> ...


Good post!:thumbup:



harley bear said:


> Nomatter how tough it gets dont give up! I know it sounds silly coming from someone who has kids but i knew a couple who tried and tried for years!, 18 yrs later they were about to give up ang got pregnant miracles can happen. I really hope everything works out for you and all the ladies that are trying for a baby


Thank you :thumbup:


----------



## JohnMorris (Oct 15, 2010)

If someone needs help getting pregnant then it should be available for them. Someone with appendicitis has the right to surgery; people with Diabetes have the right to Insulin. I do disagree about people being allowed to have plastic surgery like a boob job on the NHS though or a gastric band because they can't control their eating or eat a healthy diet.


----------



## haeveymolly (Mar 7, 2009)

The only time i would be against IVF on the national health would be age i do think its irresponsible to have children too old, but ime sure this is already in force anyway isnt it, these silly women that have had babies in their sixties surely had to pay for it didnt they, then i dont think it should be allowed.

But yes everyone should be allowed to try for a child.


----------



## Bellarina (Feb 4, 2009)

JohnMorris said:


> Be strong and know that you did the right thing if he didn't want children and your desire is so strong. He isn't going to change his mind and if you stayed with him you would always feel unwhole. You will find the right man and have children - if you'd stayed with him, you wouldn't. Good lcuk.


Thank you, I have to keep telling myself that and hoping that I have made the right decision. Right now it all seems so pointless, but hopefully one day I will be able to look back and see it was for the best. Thankyou for your kind words. And good luck to you, life is never simple is it?!


----------



## Bexy (Apr 11, 2010)

haeveymolly said:


> The only time i would be against IVF on the national health would be age i do think its irresponsible to have children too old, but ime sure this is already in force anyway isnt it, these silly women that have had babies in their sixties surely had to pay for it didnt they, then i dont think it should be allowed.
> 
> But yes everyone should be allowed to try for a child.


Yeah that have upper age limits, think it varies between different health boards but ranges from 35 to 40.


----------



## Bexy (Apr 11, 2010)

BeagleOesx said:


> I think anyone who wants children should not be denied that right in the same way we should respect anyone who doesn't want children - that is their right also. Not everyone have the same maternal instincts and feelings towards having a family but if you do and you are unable to fulfil that naturally then I feel that every assistance should be given to help.
> 
> I have been very lucky in that I have 2 beautiful (now grown up) children and I have always felt blessed. Because of this quite a few years ago now, when I was 30 I decided to donate some eggs so that the opportunity could be given to other couples who were desperate for a family. It was not an easy road with the medication I had to take and frequent visits to the clinic but the day they successfully 'harvested' my eggs I felt a degree of self-satisfaction that somewhere someone would be able to get that chance of a family they longed for. Obviously it is all done anonomously but during follow up checks with the hospital they did tell me that some of the eggs had been transplanted to a recipient and that they were successful:thumbup:


That's lovely to hear, when I do IVF I plan to do egg sharing. Knowing what it is like myself to need help I feel I should do what I can to help others.


----------



## haeveymolly (Mar 7, 2009)

Bexy said:


> Yeah that have upper age limits, think it varies between different health boards but ranges from 35 to 40.


I thought they would


----------



## Bexy (Apr 11, 2010)

haeveymolly said:


> I thought they would


I agree with upper age limits but feel 35 is a little low in this day and age and think there should be consistency accross all health boards, some don't even offer funding for fertility treatment but the postcode lottery is probably another debate for another day


----------



## haeveymolly (Mar 7, 2009)

Bexy said:


> I agree with upper age limits but feel 35 is a little low in this day and age and think there should be consistency accross all health boards, some don't even offer funding for fertility treatment but the postcode lottery is probably another debate for another day


Ye a bit unfair i think


----------



## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

JohnMorris said:


> If someone needs help getting pregnant then it should be available for them. Someone with appendicitis has the right to surgery; people with Diabetes have the right to Insulin. I do disagree about people being allowed to have plastic surgery like a boob job on the NHS though or a gastric band because they can't control their eating or eat a healthy diet.


yay, glad they'll pay for my insulin. :thumbup:


----------



## JohnMorris (Oct 15, 2010)

haeveymolly said:


> The only time i would be against IVF on the national health would be age i do think its irresponsible to have children too old, but ime sure this is already in force anyway isnt it, these silly women that have had babies in their sixties surely had to pay for it didnt they, then i dont think it should be allowed.
> 
> But yes everyone should be allowed to try for a child.


*I totally agree with that - these women in their 60s ect are imo selfish and unnatural.*


Bellarina said:


> Thank you, I have to keep telling myself that and hoping that I have made the right decision. Right now it all seems so pointless, but hopefully one day I will be able to look back and see it was for the best. Thankyou for your kind words. And good luck to you, life is never simple is it?!


*No it never is but then it moulds us to make better people through our problems doesn't it? However much you hurt now, how would you feel in 20 years time having wasted 20+ years on a man with different desires than you and having no children and being too late for them?*


Biawhiska said:


> yay, glad they'll pay for my insulin. :thumbup:


Life saving stuff. Mind you, I do have a bugbear that Katie needs inhalers and Asthmatics have to pay for them but every other life saving drug taker gets free prescriptions and Asthmas sufferers don't. She would die without her anti-rejection drugs and her inhalers - she had a heart and lung transplant hence why she cannot have children.


----------



## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

i dont understand that either


----------



## Ditsy42 (Aug 13, 2010)

I count myself exremely lucky and privilaged 2 have had 2 wonderful children as there r fertility problems within my family, I can't even begin 2 imagine wot some of u guys r going through and have been through already in trying 2 reach your dream and I wish u all the luck in the world  

nobody has the right 2 say u can't have children or even b given the right or opportunity 2 try, this in my view is selfish and uncaring, which unfortunately is a common theme within our society nowadays!


----------



## NicoleW (Aug 28, 2010)

I got told at 16 years of age that I could probably not have children due to trauma of my insides. I now have two beautiful children who I love with all my heart and I am absolutely disgusted that you think that having children is anybody's business but the persons.

Who the hell do you think you are to say who can and can not have children?


----------



## JohnMorris (Oct 15, 2010)

My neice was told the same and that if she wanted kids she'd better try before she was 25 as her mum, aunts and gran all went through early menopause. Luckily at 26 she has 4 wonderful children and is completely worn out but happy!


----------

