# just curious to breeders!!!



## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

once youve breed what do u do with the kittens? and why do u breed? just curious


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## Teddyandmia (Jan 5, 2011)

Give them to responsible pet owners who look after them


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## RetroLemons (Nov 11, 2010)

:lol: Fabulous question the first :lol:

Obviously the second only breeders can answer :thumbup:


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

im just a little curious becasue ive heard from a lot of breeders telling us non breeder about how many cats there are etc so i was wondering then why do u breed?


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## RetroLemons (Nov 11, 2010)

I don't and agree there are far too many kitties out there.

However I don't disagree with ethical breeding with a purpose of improving the species. As I don't wish to see pets disappear which is was a full ban would do in a perfect world. However as we don't live in a perfect world pet breeding would go underground leaving us with sickly, badly bred animals.

So I would assume most ethical breeders do it due to their love of cats, and wanting to have healthy lines


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

ok thanks its very interesting as there is 2 sides to the coin.:thumbup:


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## RetroLemons (Nov 11, 2010)

mycatroxy said:


> ok thanks its very interesting as there is 2 sides to the coin.:thumbup:


Yep! I find myself thinking about it frequently. for a while I wondered if I should be against breeding due to the large numbers of unwanted pets in the UK and across the world. The sad thing is anything banned doesn't disappear. Simply goes underground, so imagine cat/puppy farms the only place where people could get a kitten.


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

mycatroxy said:


> once youve breed what do u do with the kittens? and why do u breed? just curious


What do you think happens to the kittens?


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## WindyCity (Dec 18, 2010)

Taylorbaby said:


> What do you think happens to the kittens?


You keep them all and live like a smelly/wee-ey old cat lady - by the sea, of course.


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## vanessa.xx (Dec 28, 2010)

mycatroxy said:


> once youve breed what do u do with the kittens? and why do u breed? just curious


Love this question and hate the hostility on this forum, although it is strangely quite in here


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

Taylorbaby said:


> What do you think happens to the kittens?


why do u answer with such hostility?


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

RetroLemons said:


> I don't and agree there are far too many kitties out there.
> 
> However I don't disagree with ethical breeding with a purpose of improving the species. As I don't wish to see pets disappear which is was a full ban would do in a perfect world. However as we don't live in a perfect world pet breeding would go underground leaving us with sickly, badly bred animals.
> 
> So I would assume most ethical breeders do it due to their love of cats, and wanting to have healthy lines


yeah thats a very good point. its just that i would think even those littens who are breed perfectly do get abandoned too theres pros and cons.


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

how many litters do each cat produce when breeding?


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## Abcynthia (Sep 12, 2010)

I, myself, am not a breeder. I do however completely agree with responsible ethical breeders. If there was no responsible breeders of cats...or even dogs for that matter we would lose so many breeds. We would stop ever seeing a beautiful Maine Coon or a big eyed BSH. These kind of people breed to improve that breed and keep the lines going. I think this is important and I would hate to say to my daughter we had a cat called a Maine Coon, but that breed is now extinct. 

Now I love moggies  They are all so unique, but I think the homing of them should be left to rescue centres and I don't think there is a need to keep adding to them when we have so many homeless kitties out there. It would help if we could ban pet shops selling them as this could at least be policed and stop people buying them on a whim. I think if you want to be annoyed at anyone you should look to people who say let your cat have one litter as it is good for them. Why? That one litter will then take away more homes that a needy rescue kitten or cat could have went to live in. 

Most responsible, ethical breeders will home their kittens to a home that will be as responsible in the care of their little ones. The majority will also make sure that if something should go wrong they have the space to keep the kittens with them if they can't find a home or should they be returned. 

Sorry, just my two cents


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

WindyCity said:


> You keep them all and live like a smelly/wee-ey old cat lady - by the sea, of course.


each to their own!


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## RetroLemons (Nov 11, 2010)

mycatroxy said:


> yeah thats a very good point. its just that i would think even those littens who are breed perfectly do get abandoned too theres pros and cons.


You are correct, unfortunately there will always be pro's and con's. Ethical breeders try their hardest to home their kittens to responsible owners, and are willing to take them back if it doesn't work out. However nothings perfect, I wish to see laws tightening on who can breed but even this is open to abuse.

Perhaps I have a very limited view on the subject, but until people's general view changes you will always get the split between breeders and rescues will always be needed.


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## YesWeCat (Nov 29, 2010)

The thing is that those who buy a specific breed are not interested in having a cat in general. They are looking for some features that they can only have choosing a particular cat.

I don't like a furry cat, I love an obsesive and always present cat, I love to talk with my cats, I love big big big ears and green eyes. I fell in love with havanas and I like cats but I love havanas and I decided that in my life I could only live with this kind of cat.

I know that there are several kittens looking for home but I don't think that breeding my cats means stealing families to them.

So to answer the question breeders sell their kittens to loving families or they sell them to other breeders to go on with the selection. Breeders are those who work on a breed to fix some features and improve the quality of the kittens. (not those who keep mating the same male and female to sell kittens and make money)

(sorry for my english but today is not my english day and it's worst than ever)


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Abcynthia said:


> I, myself, am not a breeder. I do however completely agree with responsible ethical breeders. If there was no responsible breeders of cats...or even dogs for that matter we would lose so many breeds. We would stop ever seeing a beautiful Maine Coon or a big eyed BSH. These kind of people breed to improve that breed and keep the lines going. I think this is important and I would hate to say to my daughter we had a cat called a Maine Coon, but that breed is now extinct.
> 
> Now I love moggies  They are all so unique, but I think the homing of them should be left to rescue centres and I don't think there is a need to keep adding to them when we have so many homeless kitties out there. It would help if we could ban pet shops selling them as this could at least be policed and stop people buying them on a whim. I think if you want to be annoyed at anyone you should look to people who say let your cat have one litter as it is good for them. Why? That one litter will then take away more homes that a needy rescue kitten or cat could have went to live in.
> 
> ...


can I also just add one thing to what you say (and say beautifully btw) ... I have never ever, not once, in my whole life, came across an ethically bred litter of moggy kittens. If moggy breeders jumped through all the hoops that good ethical responsible pedigree breeders jumped through, I would happily buy a moggy. Truth is though, they don't. All they do is put an unneutered female together with an unneutered male and hope for the best. That per definition is ... well, not good breeding ethics.


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## Izzie999 (Nov 27, 2008)

vanessa.xx said:


> Love this question and hate the hostility on this forum, although it is strangely quite in here


Sadly the cat breeding thread always gets hostile which is sad! Alot of people get angry when people come on with the "I thought it would be fun to just have one litter" without any thought to the health of their cats and the problems of finding them good homes etc.

Back to the question though. I think ethical breeding is ok, to better your chosen breed and also to provide people with lovely HEALTHY,well socialised kittens. Unfortunately there are lots of bybs out there who give us breeders a really bad name.

Izzie


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

thank you to those who have just answered my questions nicely, im just interested and didnt no anything about breeding (not that id ever be a breeder i am one i have 4 children lol) so thank you a very interesting topic.


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## WindyCity (Dec 18, 2010)

mycatroxy said:


> each to their own!


I was being sarcastic, I cannot help it, it just flows out at times.

Most breeders sell their kittens as pets, some they keep back if they think it will better the breed (whatever breed that may be).

It also becomes slightly addictive and I would advise anyone to think seriously and weigh up vet bills/vaccs/microchipping/neutering before thinking of it as it can be very expensive.

It is great when you see the look of surprise on the vets face at their weights and how well they are etc, it's almost like being a proud mum all over again or when you produce a perfect example of the breed. It is also difficult not to keep them all!!


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## celicababe1986 (Jun 22, 2009)

mycatroxy said:


> thank you to those who have just answered my questions nicely, im just interested and didnt no anything about breeding (not that id ever be a breeder i am one i have 4 children lol) so thank you a very interesting topic.


Just to say, 'you would never be a breeder', but your cat is in kitten~thus making you a breeder


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

mycatroxy said:


> why do u answer with such hostility?


How is that hostile? I simply asked what you Thought happened to the kittens that are bred, you asked breeders, Im asking you, what do you think happens to them?


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

WindyCity said:


> I was being sarcastic, I cannot help it, it just flows out at times.
> 
> Most breeders sell their kittens as pets, some they keep back if they think it will better the breed (whatever breed that may be).
> 
> ...


I think its lost on here


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## lymorelynn (Oct 4, 2008)

YesWeCat said:


> The thing is that those who buy a specific breed are not interested in having a cat in general. They are looking for some features that they can only have choosing a particular cat.
> 
> I don't like a furry cat, I love an obsesive and always present cat, I love to talk with my cats, I love big big big ears and green eyes. I fell in love with havanas and I like cats but I love havanas and I decided that in my life I could only live with this kind of cat.
> 
> ...


your English is perfect :thumbup: and your post sums up my feelings exactly. If I thought I could not find good homes for my kittens I would stop breeding.


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

WindyCity said:


> I was being sarcastic, I cannot help it, it just flows out at times.
> 
> Most breeders sell their kittens as pets, some they keep back if they think it will better the breed (whatever breed that may be).
> 
> ...


i no you was!


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

Taylorbaby said:


> How is that hostile? I simply asked what you Thought happened to the kittens that are bred, you asked breeders, Im asking you, what do you think happens to them?


ok im sorry if this time you wasnt but you do come across that way in most of your replies to other threads!! maybe you should think about how you word things!

i dont no why you breed them or what you do with them thats why i asked. for all i no you keep the lot i dont no. ive never met a breeder.

can i ask how many litters do you breed per cat?


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

maybe its the way you have read them, certainly not hostile, maybe truthful, forthright and passionate  its hard to read things over the internet, there is no visual face / tone to look out for.


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## MatildaG (Nov 8, 2010)

Taylorbaby said:


> maybe its the way you have read them, certainly not hostile, maybe truthful, forthright and passionate  its hard to read things over the internet, there is no visual face / tone to look out for.


I've never seen hositility from Taylorbaby 

Lots of cute pics though


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

MatildaG said:


> I've never seen hositility from Taylorbaby
> 
> Lots of cute pics though


lol thanks!  ive updated the other thread lots of piccis on that lol!


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## WindyCity (Dec 18, 2010)

See no hostility or sarcasm.  :lol:


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

mycatroxy said:


> ok im sorry if this time you wasnt* but you do come across that way in most of your replies to other threads!! maybe you should think about how you word things!*


pot calling the kettle black?????

if you don't like how TB responds, don't read her posts.

and since you have no problems telling others how they should act or how they should post, maybe *you* should think how *you* post!!


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## WindyCity (Dec 18, 2010)

Did I post too soon.  :lol:


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## GeordieBabe (Apr 7, 2009)

WindyCity said:


> Did I post too soon.  :lol:


:yesnod::nono:


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

Tje said:


> pot calling the kettle black?????
> 
> if you don't like how TB responds, don't read her posts.
> 
> and since you have no problems telling others how they should act or how they should post, maybe *you* should think how *you* post!!


i started this thread! but out.


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

Taylorbaby said:


> maybe its the way you have read them, certainly not hostile, maybe truthful, forthright and passionate  its hard to read things over the internet, there is no visual face / tone to look out for.


your right. sorry i have just read it in the wrong tone.


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

mycatroxy said:


> i started this thread! but out.


What's that got to do with anything? Or are you saying because you started the thread you get to instruct people how to reply? Not having a pop at you, genuinely curious.


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

Aurelia said:


> What's that got to do with anything? Or are you saying because you started the thread you get to instruct people how to reply? Not having a pop at you, genuinely curious.


she said not to read her posts but i started the thread so im going to read them because she has replied to it. thats what i meant if that makes sense lol


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Well that doesn't mean you have to read someones reply hun. There is an ignore feature which means whoever you put on ignore ... well, you would have to click on a link to view their post.

Though I would recommend not putting her on it because you'd then miss out on a lot of very helpful advice, which you might need one day


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

look above in the post before yours i have already said sorry for mis-reading so i wont do that i was just replying to Tje


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

Aurelia said:


> Well that doesn't mean you have to read someones reply hun. There is an ignore feature which means whoever you put on ignore ... well, you would have to click on a link to view their post.
> 
> Though I would recommend not putting her on it because you'd then miss out on a lot of very helpful advice, which you might need one day


thanks lol I do try! 



mycatroxy said:


> your right. sorry i have just read it in the wrong tone.


thats ok


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

mycatroxy said:


> i started this thread! but out.


dream on sweetheart!!


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## WindyCity (Dec 18, 2010)

:lol: :lol:

You have to laugh, we could just go on for days, possibly weeks until we get locked or something naughty like that. It comes with the territory.

Don't breed cats.  :lol:


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## Cat Lover Chris (Jan 11, 2009)

mycatroxy said:


> once youve breed what do u do with the kittens? and why do u breed? just curious


Having been on this forum for a while now, and read various threads on varying subjects, I am intrigued by this very straightforward question.

The answer to the first question is obvious; you do what I did and find good homes for the kittens.

Having read some of the vitriolic comments on other threads by regular breeders, It is interesting to note an apparent silence from most of the parties that usually berate "accidental breeders" or "hobby breeders".

Whilst I expected to see the usual comments about improving the breed etc, very little has been said by "the professional breeders".

All I can say to other readers of this forum is to "draw your own conclusions" :thumbup:


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## messyhearts (Feb 6, 2009)

I thought there was only one professional cat breeder on here?


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

messyhearts said:


> I thought there was only one professional cat breeder on here?


now that DID make me laugh!! :lol:


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

mycatroxy said:


> once youve breed what do u do with the kittens? and why do u breed? just curious


I think the main reason for anyone breeding cats is to make _some_ money. 
They may say they are _improving the breed_, but one look at their cats would tell you that they are either in it for the long term or that reason is complete nonsense. For some it would take them forever and a day to _improve_, using the cats they have.
They may say they want to produce healthy kittens, but fail to do the most basic of health tests.
They may say they love cats, but breeding is never really about loving cats. Is putting a cat through pregnancy twice a year, about love?
They tend to have a few different breeds or multifarious colours. Is that because they want to _improve_ all the breeds/colours they breed or is that just to provide more variety and choice for their kitten customers?
They may say they do not make one bean out of breeding cats, but unless they are very unlucky with vets bills or ill cats or just very bad at maths, then buying one cat, who produces 3-8 kittens all at £250-£2000+ each depending on the breed, often at least twice a year, makes me think that there may be some profit somewhere! even if you deduct upkeep, vet bills, vaccination and stud fees.

A few breeders are truly in the breed as a serious attempt to _improve_ a breed or as a serious attempt to _improve_ health in a breed without thinking of the money aspect. But they are IMO the minority.


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

yes that is what i was just thinking. the breeders on here do you do it as a living?
and how many litters do you allow one cat to have as my vet told me that it is un-healthy for a cat to continusly breed?


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

mycatroxy said:


> yes that is what i was just thinking. the breeders on here do you do it as a living?
> and how many litters do you allow one cat to have as my vet told me that it is un-healthy for a cat to continusly breed?


Only one breeders does, I 'lost' over £1,300 on my last litter and ive only broken even once.

of course it is, back yard breeders will have 5 litters a year as soon as the cat gives birth kittens go to new homes at 5-8weeks. or people who keep having 'acccidental' litters or lots of moggie litter or crosses, are normally lining their pockets more than a reputable breeders who spends out a hell of a lot more on their litters before they are even born.
its normally 1 per year for about 1-4years of age and they keep back from the litters to.

also depends on the cat, she maybe infertile, she may need a c-section - 700squid, may need to be spayed due to illness, may only have 1 kitten, there are lots of sernarios it isnt just 'buy a cat mate it'


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

thanks for answering im genuinely interested! how did you get into breeding taylorbaby?
btw i watch your youtube vids and they are adorable.


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## Guest (Jan 8, 2011)

mycatroxy said:


> yes that is what i was just thinking. the breeders on here do you do it as a living?
> and how many litters do you allow one cat to have as my vet told me that it is un-healthy for a cat to continusly breed?


Are you asking so many questions so you know many litters to allow your girl to have? Or just curious?

I do believe its hard to make a living from breeding unless you have been breeding for many, many years.....even then...things go wrong.


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

shetlandlover said:


> Are you asking so many questions so you know many litters to allow your girl to have? Or just curious?
> 
> I do believe its hard to make a living from breeding unless you have been breeding for many, many years.....even then...things go wrong.


why is everyone so paranoid around here?? No im just curious ive never come across this before and im just interested! roxy is having the one she is carring and then im getting her spayed. i dont have time to breed i have 4 children im far too busy and wouldnt want to put my cat throw several pregnancies as i no how hard it is lol.


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## Guest (Jan 8, 2011)

mycatroxy said:


> why is everyone so paranoid around here?? No im just curious ive never come across this before and im just interested! roxy is having the one she is carring and then im getting her spayed. i dont have time to breed i have 4 children im far too busy and wouldnt want to put my cat throw several pregnancies as i no how hard it is lol.


Not paranoid but its the type of question that a person with a pregnant cat should be asking....

You may not have time to breed but you are now a breeder....the new owners of any kittens you sell will be coming to you for advice, help or returning the kittens for any number of reasons (ill health of the cat, ill health of the owner, my kids dont like cats, we are having a baby and dont want the cat anymore).

So you need to clue up a bit so that if/when the new owners need advice you have the answer.

So its good that you are asking these questions before its to late.


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

mycatroxy said:


> thanks for answering im genuinely interested! how did you get into breeding taylorbaby?
> btw i watch your youtube vids and they are adorable.


make sure you sell them with contracts that they have to be neutered and send you the proof. first vet visit at 8weeks with first in jections then second vet visit at 12weeks with 2nd injections, they can go after that, about a week.

if you havent got time to breed you are in for a shock its 24/7, say you have to feed the kittens every 2hours through the day afternoon & night for 3weeks? ........that is not easy,mum wont like being left alone anmd it needs to be very quiet when she gives birth, in a nice quiet place with you there. make sure you weigh them everyday and see how much they gain, buy in cimi-cat and feeding equitment, so much more but im really tired and cant think.


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

shetlandlover said:


> Not paranoid but its the type of question that a person with a pregnant cat should be asking....
> 
> You may not have time to breed but you are now a breeder....the new owners of any kittens you sell will be coming to you for advice, help or returning the kittens for any number of reasons (ill health of the cat, ill health of the owner, my kids dont like cats, we are having a baby and dont want the cat anymore).
> 
> ...


well i have no intention of "breeding" anymore. and god forbid any of the kittens were to be ill or be given back then id look after them! we are keeping one anyway and my auntie is having another and now possibly my sister inlaw, so they will most likely be in the family anyway.


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

Taylorbaby said:


> make sure you sell them with contracts that they have to be neutered and send you the proof. first vet visit at 8weeks with first in jections then second vet visit at 12weeks with 2nd injections, they can go after that, about a week.
> 
> if you havent got time to breed you are in for a shock its 24/7, say you have to feed the kittens every 2hours through the day afternoon & night for 3weeks? ........that is not easy,mum wont like being left alone anmd it needs to be very quiet when she gives birth, in a nice quiet place with you there. make sure you weigh them everyday and see how much they gain, buy in cimi-cat and feeding equitment, so much more but im really tired and cant think.


if mother is unable to feed then i will look after them im used to no sleep and am a very good multi tasker(you have to be with a 6,4,2 and 6month old) so will do what is nessasary. im sure i will be fine.


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

Read as much as you can, do not expect your girl to do it all by herself. She may need you to step in and help, so know as much about kittening as possible, know the stages and when to call the vet if things aren't going to plan. You may save her or her kittens lives.
Weigh the kittens daily to make sure they are getting enough, suckling time may be deceptive as spending time suckling on a teat with no milk is no good and the kitten may be too far gone before you notice.

HAND REARING KITTENS - kitten care
Kittening - birth

Put your vets number on speed dial so that you can call him quickly in an emergency. Better to ask for help sooner rather than later and if at all in doubt just phone the vet.


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## mycatroxy (Jan 5, 2011)

lauren001 said:


> Read as much as you can, do not expect your girl to do it all by herself. She may need you to step in and help, so know as much about kittening as possible, know the stages and when to call the vet if things aren't going to plan. You may save her or her kittens lives.
> Weigh the kittens daily to make sure they are getting enough, suckling time may be deceptive as spending time suckling on a teat with no milk is no good and the kitten may be too far gone before you notice.
> 
> HAND REARING KITTENS - kitten care
> ...


thanks this is very helpful!!!!


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Cat Lover Chris said:


> Having read some of the vitriolic comments on other threads by regular breeders, It is interesting to note an apparent silence from most of the parties that usually berate "accidental breeders" or "hobby breeders".
> 
> Whilst I expected to see the usual comments about improving the breed etc, very little has been said by "the professional breeders".
> 
> All I can say to other readers of this forum is to "draw your own conclusions" :thumbup:


huh??? you have lost me completely. I can't say I have ever read a single post berating hobby breeders on this forum.

In fact I can only think of one breeder on this forum who doesn't class himself as hobby breeder, but prefers the title professional breeder. As far as I am aware no other breeder on here sees themselves as professional breeders.

I think you might be getting muddled up with terminilogy here....

a hobby breeder can be someone who breeds pedigree cats in an ethical fashion as a hobby (i.e. they don't live off the profits they make from breeding, quite often they will run at an overall loss)

an accidental breeder is VERY different to this, these are just people whose unneutered cats accidentally get pregnant.

A hobby breeder isn't always ethical, no... not by a long shot -- some of them are terribly unethical, but a breeder of accidental litters is never ethical. A hobby breeder can range from great/fantastic to terrible/irresponsible.


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## Cat Lover Chris (Jan 11, 2009)

Tje said:


> huh??? you have lost me completely. I can't say I have ever read a single post berating hobby breeders on this forum.
> 
> In fact I can only think of one breeder on this forum who doesn't class himself as hobby breeder, but prefers the title professional breeder. As far as I am aware no other breeder on here sees themselves as professional breeders.
> 
> ...


Don't worry TJE; If you are lost, I will buy you a map :lol:

Muddled with terminology I am not !! 
I am fully aware of what the difference is.
I will not be drawn into un-necessary arguements because we have all seen what happens on this forum !

Life's experiences have made me very cynical and I question people's motivation for their actions. Nuff said ! 
Time to go and lay on the beach; UK freezing, me, already getting a tan !!!:thumbup:


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Cat Lover Chris said:


> Muddled with terminology I am not !!


ok fine, but I still don't get you. I have never seen a hobby breeder get hassle on this forum, providing they were doing all the necessary testing etc and breeding for the right reasons as opposed to breeding just to see what a MC/RD X would look like or letting their queens go out to be mated by the local tom cat. But then again, generally those folks are referred to as BYBs and not hibby breeders.



Cat Lover Chris said:


> I am fully aware of what the difference is.


I still think one of us MUST be using a different set of terminology then. Or at the very least, interpreting the terms differently.



Cat Lover Chris said:


> I will not be drawn into un-necessary arguements because we have all seen what happens on this forum !


I am not trying to draw you into an arguement, necessary or unnecessary, I just have no idea what you are on about. You make statements. I don't understand what you mean. But you won't elaborate. You just make more vague statements. Surely if you have the courage of your convinctions then you would elaborate on what you meant... or are you posting provocative one liners to illicit a response???


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## Aurelia (Apr 29, 2010)

Cat Lover Chris said:


> Don't worry TJE; If you are lost, I will buy you a map :lol:
> 
> Muddled with terminology I am not !!
> I am fully aware of what the difference is.
> ...


I just wonder if maybe your view is a little skewed because you've been pulled up by ethical breeders yourself ... don't you breed Bengal crosses?

BTW it's quite warm here today, not that really is anything to be envious of  I'd rather be cool than hot personally :thumbup:


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Aurelia said:


> I just wonder if maybe your view is a little skewed because you've been pulled up by ethical breeders yourself ... don't you breed Bengal crosses?


dohhh now the penny drops! I really thought I was just having another of my bad English days.

Is that true CatLoverChris, do you breed in a ....... dodgy manner? is that why you get irked at breeders with standards? And just for the record, if you do breed with a bengal cross (female I am assuming) .... who does she mate with and do you do any form of health testing on both queen and stud?

And I now also understand that you probably refer to yourself as a hobby breeder. See... I don't. Hobby breeders to me are people like GSkinner, TaylorBaby, WindyCity, Aurelia, Raggs (all responsible ethical breeders) .... not people with crosses who just happen to breed them.


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## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

Tje said:


> dohhh now the penny drops! I really thought I was just having another of my bad English days.
> 
> Is that true CatLoverChris, do you breed in a ....... dodgy manner? is that why you get irked at breeders with standards? And just for the record, if you do breed with a bengal cross (female I am assuming) .... who does she mate with and do you do any form of health testing on both queen and stud?
> 
> And I now also understand that you probably refer to yourself as a hobby breeder. See... I don't. Hobby breeders to me are people like GSkinner, TaylorBaby, WindyCity, Aurelia, Raggs (all responsible ethical breeders) .... not people with crosses who just happen to breed them.


ahhh im not happy about seeing ben croses i have to say  esp wit the hcm / blood grouping 

anyway im 100% not a 'professional' 'business' person/breeder, i think that only person on her is that TT?

im a 'hobby breeder' i guess, although after reading someone (a breeder also) say that she hated the term 'hobby' breeder as bringing a life into the world isnt really a hobby, I feel the same, yet I dont have any other word for it?


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## lauren001 (Jun 30, 2008)

I think cross cats are like cross dogs, there is nothing wrong with the cats themselves.
Owners of moggies and cross breeds get upset and defensive as what is wrong with a moggie? but it is the breeders of these animals that are the problem and how they conduct their business that is the issue.

Whether you breed high class Persians or black and white moggies there is nothing to stop them being kept for 13 weeks, have both vaccinations and the necessary vet checks, if the breeders real reason for breeding is to have healthy kittens. Many of these cross bred pedigree kittens go for enough money to cover these costs anyway and if it is merely an oops litter then hopefully the "breeder" thinks enough of her kittens to do the best for them.


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## Tje (Jan 16, 2010)

Taylorbaby said:


> ahhh im not happy about seeing ben croses i have to say  esp wit the hcm / blood grouping


the way I see it is, if a mother cat is bengal cross, and the father cat is a moggy.... then all you get are yet more moggies. And surely the world is already overflowing with moggies which can't be rehomed?



Taylorbaby said:


> anyway im 100% not a 'professional' 'business' person/breeder, i think that only person on her is that TT?


I think he prefers that title yes.



Taylorbaby said:


> im a 'hobby breeder' i guess, although after reading someone (a breeder also) say that she hated the term 'hobby' breeder as bringing a life into the world isnt really a hobby, I feel the same, yet I dont have any other word for it?


Me neither. If you do something more for love than for money, to me it's a hobby. But if I let my unneutered female out twice a year to mate with the neighbourhood tom, then I wouldn't call myself a hobby-breeder (not sure what I would call myself though, muppet, moron, numptie would be the words that spring to mind BUT I am very conscious of not upsetting the people who do just let their females moggies get pregnant :lol:. So I guess I have to think up a new term, )



lauren001 said:


> Whether you breed high class Persians or black and white moggies there is nothing to stop them being kept for 13 weeks, have both vaccinations and the necessary vet checks


couldn't agree more. All kittens can and should be ethically raised, and I would prefer a degree of ethics to come in to the mating process too, even with moggies. I really would have zero problem with moggie litters and cross litters if the people who bred them followed very basic rules. Leaving aside the health risks of "just letting your female wander" .... heck some/many of the stray tom cats I come across... well really their temperament sucks and you don't really want to pass that down through the generations. Some places I have lived the feral toms in the neighbourhoods.... nahhh, not good daddy material for health or temperament!!


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## koekemakranka (Aug 2, 2010)

Tje said:


> .... heck some/many of the stray tom cats I come across... well really their temperament sucks and you don't really want to pass that down through the generations. Some places I have lived the feral toms in the neighbourhoods.... nahhh, not good daddy material for health or temperament!!


:lol: How true. At one of my colonies, there is an old tom called Batman. He is the grumpiest animal imaginable. The filthy looks he gives us, even though we've been feeding him and his clan for years! :lol: And all his children (he has since been given a vastectomy) are equally nasty. Definitely a grumpy gene.


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## WindyCity (Dec 18, 2010)

Tje said:


> dohhh now the penny drops! I really thought I was just having another of my bad English days.
> 
> And I now also understand that you probably refer to yourself as a hobby breeder. See... I don't. Hobby breeders to me are people like GSkinner, TaylorBaby, WindyCity, Aurelia, Raggs (all responsible ethical breeders) .... not people with crosses who just happen to breed them.


Why thank you!

Rise above 90% comments on here or let it go over your head, it works for me, usually without even trying!


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## lizward (Feb 29, 2008)

lauren001 said:


> I think the main reason for anyone breeding cats is to make _some_ money.


:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:


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