# Is it Acceptable to Keep Dogs in a Garage?



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

I have 2 large dogs, a boxer and a bullmastiff. The bullmastiff is 3 and I'd constantly chewing furniture, windowsills etc, we've only had him for a few weeks off a guy who never properly trained him or walked him or let him into the family room. at the moment both dogs live in the conservatory with a gate across the wide opening into the kitchen diner. our garden is quite buggy and whenever we let them out they come back in and cover the conservatory with mud. they also smell really bad which doesn't work well with my open plan house. sprays and plug ins don't cover it. we do love our dog's and they come into the family room with us every evening and during the day when I'm around. they get walked twice a day and have decent dry food, toys and daily chew treats. but they are destroying my house (which i am trying to sell). 
one solution I am thinking about is to house them in our detached garage when I'm working in the day and overnight to sleep. they would still spend time with us when we are home and they can be supervised. we would obviously remove any hazards from their part of the garage. and I could give them access to the garden during the day. is this a humane solution? I worry a bit about my boxer who is 9 and used to having the freedom of the house as he is very well behaved.


----------



## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

Not really acceptable, no. How would you like to be stuck in a garage all day? Cold, bored, isolated from you. How would it help improve the behaviour inside a house? Where's your training? You say the bullmastiff came from someone who hadn't done any training, then propose to leave him in a garage all day. Do you call that an improvement in the dog's situation?


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

You would need to make sure the garage was safe and warm - so like you say move all hazards and put in some sort of safe heater.
You would also need to introduce the garage as a nice place to be and slowly build up the time they are left alone there - I would feed dinner, play games and snuggle out there and when they like being there start to leave them for short periods.
My worry would be that they would bark being somewhere they are not used too and security (garage doors are much easier to break into than front doors)
As long as they are not left out there all the time but spend plenty of time in the house with you when you are home then I don't see a problem especially as a short term solution whilst you try and sell the house.
I don't see that if comfortable out there it's any different than being shut in the house.
Do you take them out before and after work? How long are you away in the day do they get a break mid way?


----------



## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

Are neither of them crate trained? Could you not crate them during the night and day but have the crates in your house and not a garage?


----------



## Spookypigs (Feb 2, 2014)

evanique said:


> I have 2 large dogs, a boxer and a bullmastiff. The bullmastiff is 3 and I'd constantly chewing furniture, windowsills etc, we've only had him for a few weeks off a guy who never properly trained him or walked him or let him into the family room. at the moment both dogs live in the conservatory with a gate across the wide opening into the kitchen diner. our garden is quite buggy and whenever we let them out they come back in and cover the conservatory with mud. they also smell really bad which doesn't work well with my open plan house. sprays and plug ins don't cover it. we do love our dog's and they come into the family room with us every evening and during the day when I'm around. they get walked twice a day and have decent dry food, toys and daily chew treats. but they are destroying my house (which i am trying to sell).
> one solution I am thinking about is to house them in our detached garage when I'm working in the day and overnight to sleep. they would still spend time with us when we are home and they can be supervised. we would obviously remove any hazards from their part of the garage. and I could give them access to the garden during the day. is this a humane solution? I worry a bit about my boxer who is 9 and used to having the freedom of the house as he is very well behaved.


If I were in your situation I'd get a training crate for the mastiff. That way he can't chew anything other than the safe toys you provide for him. I had a GSD cross who chewed and scratched in the kitchen. He also took the plaster off the walls in the cellar when I kept him down there out of desperation. Habits need to be broken so the crate was the only way. Destruction is often a symptom of separation anxiety. It worked. It broke habits, and instead of feeling abandoned he felt safe in his own controlled space. I'd often find that he'd taken himself into his crate for a nap. He'd hide bones and toys in there too so I was comforted that it wasn't seen as a place of punishment. That said never use the crate as a punishment tool. It's a secure bed or basket, their place, a safe place. They learn to settle and nap until you return.


----------



## donnas1977 (Feb 7, 2010)

Absolutely no. What about training classes for the bullmastiff, we rehomed a mastiff late last year and they are hard work. They need discipline and training. She came from being kept in a kennel and was crate trained. She now enjoys house life. We used crate for a little while and now it's gone. Crate training is a good thing as it's their own space when they want time out and is a safe place for them to go.


----------



## lilythepink (Jul 24, 2013)

I have a bullmastiff and she has done some really harsh damage too but hopefully she is past all that now.

You won't be teaching your dogs anything by shutting them up in a garage and they won't stop behaving as they are doing now.

I have 2 large dogs, both are crated at night and 1 is still crated when I go out.

Mud is an ongoing problem in wet weather so I limit time outside and if I had to, I would walk them where it isn't muddy to keep the mess down.

I usually give dogs a bone in a crate.....not everyone does but it works for us. bedding is a piece of vet bed cos everything else got chewed up


----------



## donnas1977 (Feb 7, 2010)

Rogue hasn't been to bad on chewing, she likes to steal things though and take them to her bed. Her fav thing to tear is the mail


----------



## shirleystarr (Mar 22, 2009)

I would not do it its not very fair on the 9 year old boxer you have had in the house all the time he will be confused I would take the other dog to training class and get a crate for the other one


----------



## Sarah H (Jan 18, 2014)

evanique said:


> I have 2 large dogs, a boxer and a bullmastiff. The bullmastiff is 3 and I'd constantly chewing furniture, windowsills etc, we've only had him for a few weeks off a guy who never properly trained him or walked him or let him into the family room. at the moment both dogs live in the conservatory with a gate across the wide opening into the kitchen diner. our garden is quite buggy and whenever we let them out they come back in and cover the conservatory with mud. they also smell really bad which doesn't work well with my open plan house. sprays and plug ins don't cover it. we do love our dog's and they come into the family room with us every evening and during the day when I'm around. they get walked twice a day and have decent dry food, toys and daily chew treats. but they are destroying my house (which i am trying to sell).
> one solution I am thinking about is to house them in our detached garage when I'm working in the day and overnight to sleep. they would still spend time with us when we are home and they can be supervised. we would obviously remove any hazards from their part of the garage. and I could give them access to the garden during the day. is this a humane solution? I worry a bit about my boxer who is 9 and used to having the freedom of the house as he is very well behaved.


You've only had the mastiff a short while and say he's had no training? Get him to a training class. You can't expect a dog that's been neglected (in terms of training) to behave and know what he can and can't do in a new home. He just needs time to adjust and for you to put the work in that his previous owners didn't. That way he might become less anxious in the house and create a better bond with you too.

Remember all of us probably have muddy, boggy gardens at them moment, i know I do! Maybe put down some mats/towels or hose the dogs off before you let them come in.

It sounds like the mastiff has got some SA, so putting him in the garage with little human interaction isn't an ideal situation. He may get worse and find something dangerous to chew instead of a chair. As already suggested try crate training. He can then have a secure little safe area to go in when anxious and won't destroy your furniture. It's not fair on your older boxer to suddenly make him sleep in the garage after all this time.

When they come in and 'destroy the house' (you don't say whether it's just mud or whether they're chewing things), first hose them off, then towel them down to dry them a bit, then give them a frozen kong each (or similar) to keep them occupied. They'll soon learn the routine and will keep them and you happy. If you give the mastiff his kong and treats in his cage then he'll associate it with nice things are become a really useful tool if you need to keep him calm, especially if you've got people over to view your house. If they see nice calm dogs then that's going to be a big help, rather than anxious ones in a garage.

Hope we've given you some ideas


----------



## rottiepointerhouse (Feb 9, 2014)

Some great advice already given. You haven't had the bullmastiff very long, only a few weeks so he needs to bond with you and learn the routine and rules of your home. I don't see how he will learn that if you keep them in the garage and do agree it wouldn't be very fair on your older boxer.

We gave up on our back garden being a mud bath a few years ago and had the lawn up and covered everywhere with slates. If the dogs are muddy after a walk then a quick hose down and towel off and leave them to dry in the kitchen with some towels or old quilt covers on the floor usually does the trick. I've taught mine that after theor walk they get a chew or a kong and this is their sign to "settle down".

Good luck, things can be a bit fraught and stressful when trying to settle a new dog into the home and routine. We've all been through that "what have I done" feeling.


----------



## lozzibear (Feb 5, 2010)

I think it depends on the garage... is it warm? Does it have windows? If it does then I don't see the difference between that or a living room, kitchen etc.


----------



## L/C (Aug 9, 2010)

When does the chewing occur? Where is it concentrated? I would be reluctant to diagnoae separation anxiety or an attachment problem - it could be boredom or just generalised stress relief from all the upheaval. Does he have appropriate things to chew?

With regards to the garage what do you plan to do to make it warm and safe for them? How much time will they get with you if they live in there? Are they just going to go in there when you are out of the house or all the time? How are you going to introduce them and build up the time in the garage?


----------



## Dogsbody53 (Oct 10, 2011)

I would rather you had them in a garage than crated all night & when you are at work all day but what I don't like is the idea of a 9 year old well behaved Boxer having to go from a warm house (you said they could be in when supervised) in the evening to a probably cold garage.

If you feel that when you move you may still not have a home that you can all live in together maybe consider rehoming now through a breed rescue.


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

like my original post says, I would only put them in the garage when we are at work or in bed so they would have no less human interaction than normal. they would come back into the house when we are there to supervise. there is a heater in the garage and I would section off the area for storage so they couldn't get to it. the mastif is chewing furniture, the room divider, the windowsill and trunking concerning electrical cables. I am worried he will do himself harm. I have moved most of the furnature out but that's when he started chewing the plastic. I've been out to buy Kong's today to try and keep them amused. he does sometimes go toilet in the house but it's not a big problem.

in reply to the first post, he is most definitely in a better environment, he gets 2 walks a day, plenty of time with the family in the evenings and quality food. none of that would change if we put his bed in the garage. he had none of these things in his old home!

with regards to create training, is that just for toileting or does it work for chewing too? I don't feel right about leaving him in a crate, do they even make them big enough for bullmastiff?


----------



## ClaireandDaisy (Jul 4, 2010)

No it is not acceptable to shut animals up in a poorly ventilated, unheated, windowless brick box for 8+ hours a day. Or a crate.
There are better ways of coping with dogs - dog walkers, dog, sitters, rehoming.....
If you think is is acceptable - shut yourself in there for a few hours and try it?


----------



## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

I'm sorry but I really don't understand how you could think it would be acceptable 

If it were me, I'd clear a room for them and leave their beds (and obviously things like water, toys etc) and something like an old sofa that it doesn't really matter about - put a baby gate over it and they have the run of that room when they can't be supervised around the rest of the house


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Lilylass said:


> I'm sorry but I really don't understand how you could think it would be acceptable
> 
> If it were me, I'd clear a room for them and leave their beds (and obviously things like water, toys etc) and something like an old sofa that it doesn't really matter about - put a baby gate over it and they have the run of that room when they can't be supervised around the rest of the house


You could do all of this in a heated garage and it would be no different?

The dogs will be in the house when to OP is home so as long as the garage is heated, safe and the dogs are introduced carefully so they are relaxed in the garage I don't see it as any different than being shut in one room of the house?

The room to move about in a garage is better than a crate IMO and the OP has said she is trying to sell her house so un-dogiefying it is difficult the garage if introduced and done correctly could be a good solution.

But only if done properly with care for the dogs and the dogs are bought into the house whenever someone is home.


----------



## Picklelily (Jan 2, 2013)

I think it depends on the garage perhaps you could explain the setup you intend for the garage?


There are a couple of other questions I would have

1) you say the dogs are smelly? What are you feeding them? Have you checked ears, feet and teeth to make sure there is nothing there that would cause them to smell bad.

I find my dog is particularly smelly when they need grooming, even the short haired dogs. Getting rid of the dead hair and skin in the coat helps. Tooth brushing is great for smelly dog breath. Some foods make them smell more than others. I did once have a problem with my elderly dog smelling awful the vet recommended tea tree shampoo, lather up and leave for 1 minute then rinse. It worked brilliantly.

Also to get the mud off and damp a microfiber towel or dry dog bag works brilliantly.
You could always take them to a groomer for a wash and scrub up.


The chewing what do you provide as alternative chewing? I imagine this dog is quite anxious at the moment and using chewing to sooth him. Try upping his exercise, using an adaptil collar and spray then giving him things like a stuffed frozen kong. Feed all food in a treat ball or buster cube to keep him busy.

I too think a crate could be the easiest answer, that way you aren't shutting out your elderly boxer (they always seem to feel the cold.), because of your new dog. I was very against crates until this dog. I have found my dog loves it, using the crate as a safe den.

Finally I used an aromatherapy oil burner when selling my house, I burned lemon and lavender oils. The lady who purchased my house, commented that she chose mine over another identical house because mine always smelled fabulous.


----------



## lilythepink (Jul 24, 2013)

My bullmastiff ate the kitchen floor....twice and the kitchen cupboards.

These dogs have such strong jaws that they can do a lot of damage in a very short time.

The first kitchen floor she chewed was done when I was hoovering the next room. 2nd time she did it I had walked down the hallway to answer the phone. there was no 3rd time cos I had tiles laid.

Kitchen cupboards were chewed whilst she was chewing a bone.....must have got fed up of bone and fancied a change. It was all done so fast. Never interested in toys but always has a bone knocking about somewhere.

I stopped leaving her anywhere on her own, even if I was just in the next room. The only thing that saved the rest of the house was her crate........but she did chew up the metal floor in the crate.

Bullmastiffs also have big hairy feet. They are very short coated so mud doesn't stick to the coat.....but it does get trapped between toes and that makes a real mess if she has been out in mud.

Mine doesn't particularly feel the cold either so a garage wouldn't be a problem apart from the fact she would be on her own....so would never get to learn what she was doing wasn't acceptable. Also, they do like human company, much happier when they can see people even if they are not touching them.


----------



## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

Fleur said:


> You could do all of this in a heated garage and it would be no different?


I get what you're saying but ......

Where did it say the garage was heated as I must've totally missed that 

It's also dark and TBH I can imagine being shut in one would be absolutely vile - pitch black and I bet sounds really echo in them



ClaireandDaisy said:


> it is not acceptable to shut animals up in a poorly ventilated, unheated, windowless brick box for 8+ hours a day. Or a crate.


I totally agree with ClaireandDaisy


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

Lilylass said:


> I get what you're saying but ......
> 
> Where did it say the garage was heated as I must've totally missed that
> 
> ...


My garage has electricity and a window - so a light and heater would not be any issue.
A bit of old carpet or a cheap off cut on the floor will stop any echoing - an old sofa a radio and a couple of dog beds long with water, toys etc is to me no different to being shut in a conservatory or utility room when the owners are out a t work and plenty of members do that so I really can't see if set up correctly it would be any different in fact could well be more comfortable.

I agree being shut up anywhere for 8hrs + without human company should not be an every day occurrence so a fog walker or popping home at lunch time would be better if possible.
At night my dogs sleep in their own beds downstairs in the dark with out humans so again I don't see how it would be any different to be in a warm, comfortable, heated garage.


----------



## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

Fleur said:


> My garage has electricity and a window - so a light and heater would not be any issue.
> A bit of old carpet or a cheap off cut on the floor will stop any echoing - an old sofa a radio and a couple of dog beds long with water, toys etc is to me no different to being shut in a conservatory or utility room when the owners are out a t work and plenty of members do that so I really can't see if set up correctly it would be any different in fact could well be more comfortable.


Sorry but now I'm even more 

We're not talking about your garage - we're talking about the OPs garage and they've certainly not said that it's heated OR has windows in it 

I very much doubt if they're not wanting to make alterations to the house as they're selling it, that they'd be wanting to make alterations to the garage either

If a garage was heated, had proper flooring, windows, ventilation etc etc etc then it may be OK for short periods of time - but I still wouldn't leave a dog in it for anywhere near 8 hours at a time


----------



## Nicky10 (Jan 11, 2010)

I don't see anything wrong with them sleeping in a heated comfortable garage but spending 8+ hours a day there too is too much. And being crated for that long is cruel


----------



## LinznMilly (Jun 24, 2011)

evanique said:


> like my original post says, I would only put them in the garage when we are at work or in bed so they would have no less human interaction than normal. they would come back into the house when we are there to supervise. there is a heater in the garage and I would section off the area for storage so they couldn't get to it. the mastif is chewing furniture, the room divider, the windowsill and trunking concerning electrical cables. I am worried he will do himself harm. I have moved most of the furnature out but that's when he started chewing the plastic. I've been out to buy Kong's today to try and keep them amused. he does sometimes go toilet in the house but it's not a big problem.
> 
> in reply to the first post, he is most definitely in a better environment, he gets 2 walks a day, plenty of time with the family in the evenings and quality food. none of that would change if we put his bed in the garage. he had none of these things in his old home!
> 
> with regards to create training, is that just for toileting or does it work for chewing too? I don't feel right about leaving him in a crate, do they even make them big enough for bullmastiff?


ClaireandDaisy might have been a bit blunt, but I do agree with what she says - would you be happy to be cooped up in a garage all day, and then again at night? Have you tried? How would you feel if you were an octogenarian living with a younger relative, hadn't done a thing wrong in your life and that relative suddenly started to take you by the hand and led you to the garage at least twice a day, leaving you there for potentially hours on end? Wouldn't you rather be in the warm, dry, safe house with your family? I know I would.

Whenever I read these kinds of threads, I'm always reminded of "out of sight, out of mind". I'm not saying you would neglect them and it's probably my sieve for brains memory but I imagine myself in that situation and knowing me, I'd come in, make myself a coffee, settle down and suddenly, perhaps hours later, think "Oh chuff! I've left the dogs in the [_insert appropriate dog house here_]"  

The mastiff's only been with you for a few weeks - poor thing's probably still settling in. On top of that, you have the stress of trying to sell your house, so at times, your house is a show-home rather than _home_. Poor dog probably doesn't know if he's coming or going, been or went. 

A crate will cause almost no disturbance to your elderly boxer (hence the octogenarian comparison) and next to no effort on your part. If introduced correctly, the dog should settle in there with an appropriate chew and be quite content. I do agree with another poster who's advised perhaps investing in a dog walker too, but that depends on how long the dog is going to be in the crate day to day (not everyone works an 8hr shift ).

Absolutely none of this is intended to be read as me "having a go" at you.   I've been there myself - I'd like to bet that the vast majority of members here have been too. I've mentally sized up my (tiny) garden for a heated kennel for Milly when she was still toilet training and chewing (thoroughly unrealistic but it helped me put things into perspective). The easy option is often so tempting, isn't it? The _compromise _is a properly introduced crate ... I was tempted to say "or a dog proofed room" but maybe once you've settled in to you new home.


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

evanique said:


> like my original post says, I would only put them in the garage when we are at work or in bed so they would have no less human interaction than normal. they would come back into the house when we are there to supervise. *there is a heater in the garage* and I would section off the area for storage so they couldn't get to it. the mastif is chewing furniture, the room divider, the windowsill and trunking concerning electrical cables. I am worried he will do himself harm. I have moved most of the furnature out but that's when he started chewing the plastic. I've been out to buy Kong's today to try and keep them amused. he does sometimes go toilet in the house but it's not a big problem.
> 
> in reply to the first post, he is most definitely in a better environment, he gets 2 walks a day, plenty of time with the family in the evenings and quality food. none of that would change if we put his bed in the garage. he had none of these things in his old home!
> 
> with regards to create training, is that just for toileting or does it work for chewing too? I don't feel right about leaving him in a crate, do they even make them big enough for bullmastiff?





Lilylass said:


> Sorry but now I'm even more
> 
> We're not talking about your garage - we're talking about the OPs garage and they've certainly not said that it's heated OR has windows in it
> 
> ...


I agree 8 hours alone during the day everyday is a long time without someone at least checking in.
I mentioned my garage as I think it is wrong to assume the garage is dark and cold, I used mine as an example that some garages have windows, heating, lighting etc and maybe the OPs does to.
The OP doesn't say there isn't a window  But she has said the garage has a heater 
I have advised that if she chooses to do this that it is done with care for the dogs and they are introduced to the environment slowly. that if the garage is suitable there are simple and cheap things that can be done such as an off cut of carpet, an old sofa, a radio etc to make it more 'homely' whilst helping keep her house presentable to sell.
My dogs would not cope, they don't even like being shut in the kitchen, but it doesn't mean it wouldn't be suitable for someone elses dogs.
The dogs will be with people when they are home - if done correctly putting them in the garage is no different than shutting them in the lounge, kitchen or utility room whilst the people are out which is what most people do anyway.


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

Burrowzig said:


> Not really acceptable, no. How would you like to be stuck in a garage all day? Cold, bored, isolated from you. How would it help improve the behaviour inside a house? Where's your training? You say the bullmastiff came from someone who hadn't done any training, then propose to leave him in a garage all day. Do you call that an improvement in the dog's situation?


yes I do. he gets 2 walks a day, time with the family every evening, love and quality food. none of this would change if I moved them into the garage. as I said, they would come.into the house with us whenever we are home.


----------



## lilythepink (Jul 24, 2013)

evanique said:


> like my original post says, I would only put them in the garage when we are at work or in bed so they would have no less human interaction than normal. they would come back into the house when we are there to supervise. there is a heater in the garage and I would section off the area for storage so they couldn't get to it. the mastif is chewing furniture, the room divider, the windowsill and trunking concerning electrical cables. I am worried he will do himself harm. I have moved most of the furnature out but that's when he started chewing the plastic. I've been out to buy Kong's today to try and keep them amused. he does sometimes go toilet in the house but it's not a big problem.
> 
> in reply to the first post, he is most definitely in a better environment, he gets 2 walks a day, plenty of time with the family in the evenings and quality food. none of that would change if we put his bed in the garage. he had none of these things in his old home!
> 
> with regards to create training, is that just for toileting or does it work for chewing too? I don't feel right about leaving him in a crate, do they even make them big enough for bullmastiff?


They make crates big enough for bullmastiffs and bigger than that too.

We still have a crate set up for our girl, its up to her if she goes in or not and she is in the sitting room now if we go out......she did get out of the chewing stage but she is now nearly 3.

Crating stops them chewing cos they can't physically reach anything outside the crate to chew....so ours ate the bottom tray on hers....some going cos it is really hard plastic stuff that its made from.

Its early days for you, it takes time for them to stop old habits.


----------



## lilythepink (Jul 24, 2013)

evanique said:


> yes I do. he gets 2 walks a day, time with the family every evening, love and quality food. none of this would change if I moved them into the garage. as I said, they would come.into the house with us whenever we are home.


How much damage could a dog do in your garage? and would he be able to chew his way out or escape?


----------



## Owned By A Yellow Lab (May 16, 2012)

Just my personal view but I would not want to keep two large dogs in one room together for hours at a time. Really sorry, just how I feel. I think I would continue to let your original dog have the run of the house as you say he's pretty good - yes it's muddy now but this is something we're all having to cope with 

For the new dog, I think I would choose *one* room OR get a crate and use that for when you're not home. I would never use a crate for hours on end though.


----------



## lozzibear (Feb 5, 2010)

Wow, there are A LOT of assumptions on this thread... Garages can have various set ups. They do not have to be windowless, they do not have to be cold!! I don't know the OPs garage set up but other people seem to be assuming that they do!


----------



## missnaomi (Jun 4, 2010)

I work with someone who keeps their dogs in a pleasant, heated, carpeted, garage with windows at night time (their house can't fit 2 extra large crates in it) and when they are out (obviously for dog-appropriate amounts of time) the environment in the garage is basically the same as the house (as in it's pleasant, has light and a nice floor and is warm) and for them I see no difference to this than for example, crating the dogs in the utility room at night and when they go out. They do it because their house is too small for the crates the dogs need and they can't be trusted when left out of them - not to hurt themselves or each other! 

However, when the family is home and the dogs are not crated, they are in the normal house with the family, it's only for crate-time they use the garage due to the space issue, so both dogs are learning to behave properly with each other and in the house for most of the time with their family just like normal dogs, and are in the garage when most people would leave them crated somewhere like the kitchen for example. 

It wouldn't be the same in a dark, unheated garage for example, or if the dogs were there because they were naughty in the house or had separation problems or so they could be "out of the way". From their point of view I don't think the dogs care what room they are in for bedtime, just that it's warm and comfortable and they feel safe and happy and that they are well looked after and walked etc.


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

ok here's more info: he's not too bad with toilet training, getting better at that. it's the chewing that's concerning me, he's chewed the furniture and when I've removed most of it from the room, he chewed the windowsill. there were chunks of plastic on the floor when I came down thismorning. I'm worried he's going to harm himself. he has pulled the trunking off the wall in the kitchen that covers electrical cable too. 

I am usually out of the house mon-fri for 4 to 8 hours a day. with regards to the garage, there is a heater in there and I would section of the storage area so the dogs can't get to anything. 

a few of you have mentioned crate training but I feel it would be cruel to leave him in a crate for any length of time. the crate would need to be huge as he is a 47kg dog! he needs to be able to get up and walk around/stretch without risking himself by literally eating the conservatory, which is why I am considering the garage. I mean he can't chew breeze blocks can he?


----------



## Owned By A Yellow Lab (May 16, 2012)

evanique said:


> ok here's more info: he's not too bad with toilet training, getting better at that. it's the chewing that's concerning me, he's chewed the furniture and when I've removed most of it from the room, he chewed the windowsill. there were chunks of plastic on the floor when I came down thismorning. I'm worried he's going to harm himself. he has pulled the trunking off the wall in the kitchen that covers electrical cable too.
> 
> I am usually out of the house mon-fri for 4 to 8 hours a day. with regards to the garage, there is a heater in there and I would section of the storage area so the dogs can't get to anything.
> 
> a few of you have mentioned crate training but I feel it would be cruel to leave him in a crate for any length of time. the crate would need to be huge as he is a 47kg dog! he needs to be able to get up and walk around/stretch without risking himself by literally eating the conservatory, which is why I am considering the garage. I mean he can't chew breeze blocks can he?


Four to eight hours is a long time for any dog to be left - no offence meant at all, just speaking candidly.

I can't recall if you said the dogs would have access to the garden from the garage?

Also I would be worried if it's a *free standing heater - what happens if your dog tries to chew that or knock it flying?*

Could someone pop in and spend half an hour with them during your work days?


----------



## lilythepink (Jul 24, 2013)

he can't chew breeze blocks? that was my point, his jaw probably is strong enough to crunch on them./


----------



## missnaomi (Jun 4, 2010)

evanique said:


> I mean he can't chew breeze blocks can he?


actually...maybe? No joke!!
When I was a kid, my next door neighbour had a dobe, who converted their living room/dining room into one :scared::yikes:

And it only took an afternoon whilst the were out at a funeral as I recall! Ok so that wasn't breeze blocks but it was a wall!

Apologies if you've done this, but could you try bitter apple, redirecting the chewing, upping the exercise, giving interactive games and all that stuff? My first two dogs were crate trained from being young and never really chewed, but my current pup (bullmastiff x) doesn't use a crate but hasn't destroyed anything, but I think that's because I keep him too tired/busy/relaxed for him to consider it?

I don't want you to think I am trivialising the issue but I am sure there are ways of redirecting his energies.


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

The garage has a clear window in the side door and a concrete floor. I plan to cover the floor with old rugs and add extra bedding. I will put a portable heater in the storage side so they can't get to it. they will have toys and treats too. I could put the lights and radio on in the day.


----------



## Owned By A Yellow Lab (May 16, 2012)

evanique said:


> The garage has a clear window in the side door and a concrete floor. I plan to cover the floor with old rugs and add extra bedding. I will put a portable heater in the storage side so they can't get to it. they will have toys and treats too. I could put the lights and radio on in the day.


I'm sure you'll do all you can to make your dogs comfy 

Just wondering how they go to the loo if they're at home for up to eight hours with no garden access?


----------



## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

evanique said:


> there is a heater in there and I would section of the storage area so the dogs can't get to anything.


What kind of heater?

Personally I wouldn't leave them with a free standing heater that could be knocked over, have its wires chewed or that they may burn themselves on

*Does the garage have a window for light and ventilation?
*

If not, then it's an absolutely no from me

If it does have a window then it's a maybe - but only for a very short period of time (and certainly nowhere near 8 hours)

What is on the floor?

What else is in there?

I have to say that I live in a street with 65 houses - each with a garage and not a single one has a window so I certainly wouldn't say it's the 'norm' for garages to have one & if someone doesn't specifically say they have one I wouldn't imagine they did!


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

evanique said:


> ok here's more info: he's not too bad with toilet training, getting better at that. it's the chewing that's concerning me, he's chewed the furniture and when I've removed most of it from the room, he chewed the windowsill. there were chunks of plastic on the floor when I came down thismorning. I'm worried he's going to harm himself. he has pulled the trunking off the wall in the kitchen that covers electrical cable too.
> 
> I am usually out of the house mon-fri for 4 to 8 hours a day. with regards to the garage, there is a heater in there and I would section of the storage area so the dogs can't get to anything.
> 
> a few of you have mentioned crate training but I feel it would be cruel to leave him in a crate for any length of time. the crate would need to be huge as he is a 47kg dog! he needs to be able to get up and walk around/stretch without risking himself by literally eating the conservatory, which is why I am considering the garage. I mean he can't chew breeze blocks can he?


If he is chewing that much you would need to think carefully how you section off your storage area.
If there natural light into the garage?
Is the heater safe from being chewed?
Can you lay some old carpet, leave a radio on - maybe put an old sofa in there?
You would need to introduce the garage slowly - spening time in there with them, feeding, playing and snuggling so they get used to it and then build up the time you leave them alone.
I believe a determined and powerful chewer could probably destroy breeze block.
An XXXL crate may be a safer option for your Mastiff


----------



## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

Owned By A Yellow Lab said:


> Just wondering how they go to the loo if they're at home for up to eight hours with no garden access?


Maisie sometimes goes up to 14 hours without a pee eg overnight and often when I come home at lunchtimes she doesn't go even if let out - so if the dog's used to it and happy with it, then I personally don't have a problem with that side of things

Obviously arrangements would have to be made if it's say unwell and might need to go out more often


----------



## gorgeous (Jan 14, 2009)

My suggestion would be to take your dogs to doggy daycare whilst you are out. They will both have interaction, stimulation and supervision. Plus by the time you get them home they will probably zonk out...too tired for any misdemeanours!


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

can anyone recommend a crate suitable for a 47kg bullmastiff?
This is a light hearted question for bullmastiff owners - are they naturally clumsy due to their size? he is always knocking things over and bumping into things bless him and I was just curious if it's a bullmastiff trait or because he has been constantly locked in 1 room and never learned spatial awareness?


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

I've just been having a quick google and this is the biggest I could find
I don't know how strong it is
CK54 - XXL dog cage 54" for Great Danes etc (biggest on the market) | eBay

Good luck in whatever you decide to do


----------



## lilythepink (Jul 24, 2013)

missnaomi said:


> actually...maybe? No joke!!
> When I was a kid, my next door neighbour had a dobe, who converted their living room/dining room into one :scared::yikes:
> 
> And it only took an afternoon whilst the were out at a funeral as I recall! Ok so that wasn't breeze blocks but it was a wall!
> ...


I squirted fairy liquid on the chewed kitchen cupboards hoping it would put the dog off chewing......she licked the fairy liquid off then chewed some more.


----------



## Sarah H (Jan 18, 2014)

evanique said:


> can anyone recommend a crate suitable for a 47kg bullmastiff?
> This is a light hearted question for bullmastiff owners - are they naturally clumsy due to their size? he is always knocking things over and bumping into things bless him and I was just curious if it's a bullmastiff trait or because he has been constantly locked in 1 room and never learned spatial awareness?


I know a few mastiffs and they are all unaware of their size and seem to have minimal spatial awareness! So yes, this is pretty normal! 

In terms of the garage I would be wary of using a standing heater with a mastiff that has a chewing habit, unless you are 100% sure he couldn't get to it. Along with a window for light there needs to be some air flow/ventilation in the garage too. I think 4 hrs is OK, but I wouldn't leave them for 8 in a garage if I'm honest.

Wouldn't a crate be better than converting your garage? As you're moving house you can take it with you and he'd still have his nice safe crate during and after the upheaval.

Mastiffs can be very chewy (as you have discovered!) so hopefully now you've got kongs and other boredom busters that will help with his chewing, though he should grow out of it as he's just about reached maturity at 3, but all dogs are different.

You have to be patient, he's only just moved in with you and dogs can take a while to settle. Someone also suggested a dog day care or dog walker? You don't need to use them every day but if you know you're going to be out for 8 hours one day then wouldn't that be a better option?

Hope your house isn't too muddy today - we've not had any rain yet so luckily the dogs haven't brought it in!


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

been down the park for a run today, its much less muddy there than in my garden  ventilation in the garage would be a problem as the window doesn't open. I could leave the door open so they get more light, ventilation and access to the garden. we are in a safe area and the garden is enclosed. I'm thinking maybe playpen instead of crate? has anyone had experience using a playpen for an xl dog?


----------



## Picklelily (Jan 2, 2013)

evanique said:


> ok here's more info: he's not too bad with toilet training, getting better at that. it's the chewing that's concerning me, he's chewed the furniture and when I've removed most of it from the room, he chewed the windowsill. there were chunks of plastic on the floor when I came down thismorning. I'm worried he's going to harm himself. he has pulled the trunking off the wall in the kitchen that covers electrical cable too.
> 
> I am usually out of the house mon-fri for 4 to 8 hours a day. with regards to the garage, there is a heater in there and I would section of the storage area so the dogs can't get to anything.
> 
> ...


----------



## Picklelily (Jan 2, 2013)

evanique said:


> been down the park for a run today, its much less muddy there than in my garden  ventilation in the garage would be a problem as the window doesn't open. I could leave the door open so they get more light, ventilation and access to the garden. we are in a safe area and the garden is enclosed. I'm thinking maybe playpen instead of crate? has anyone had experience using a playpen for an xl dog?


We had the same thought at the same time.

I wonder what the runs on kennels is made from and where you purchase it? Perhaps somebody can help there.


----------



## Sarah H (Jan 18, 2014)

Picklelily said:


> We had the same thought at the same time.
> 
> I wonder what the runs on kennels is made from and where you purchase it? Perhaps somebody can help there.


I also thought play pen! I've not seen any that would be big or strong enough for a mastiff, but I'm sure you could google it & find out. I'm sure there must be some sort of panelling that you could find to suit you...

About the ventilation, I'm not sure it would be a problem this time of year so much, or for short periods of time...you used to get those bricks for pantries and things that had those little holes in for ventilation...I wonder if your garage has one...if you're happy to let them have the run of the garden then that's fine, but I'm not a fan of leaving dogs in gardens while your out. Could you not leave the garage door open slightly? I don't know your set up so it's hard to think of things...


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

My concern with a play pen is if he tries to jump out and most play pens are pretty flimsy
I have one of these for sectioning off areas when needed - but it would easily be knocked over by a powerful dog
Budget Puppy Pen by PetPlanet Large 61 x 107cm on Sale | Free UK Delivery | PetPlanet.co.uk

I'm not sure if this would be any better?
Barkshire Heavy Duty Dog Pen 6 panels x 80cm high on Sale
and you can get extra panels to make it bigger - but would it be strong/tall enough

Or I found this - a bit pricey - but again would it be tall enough?
Lucky Low Profile Dog Kennel Run 5ft x 5ft x 4ft | Dog Runs


----------



## Picklelily (Jan 2, 2013)

Dog Runs | Dog Run Panels | Dog Kennels | dogrunpanels.co.uk

here you go you could get these sort of panels to section off the garage or your playpen.

Good luck, you have obviously take on a herculean task and are working hard to sort out the problems.


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

Picklelily said:


> Dog Runs | Dog Run Panels | Dog Kennels | dogrunpanels.co.uk
> 
> here you go you could get these sort of panels to section off the garage or your playpen.
> 
> Good luck, you have obviously take on a herculean task and are working hard to sort out the problems.


Thank you, I've been thinking about the run idea and remembered I have spare run panel's to use. with insparation from you all I have created a 6' x 8' run out of the panels and playpen divider and some cable ties. this way they get to stay in the house but will not be able to get to the sills or furniture. I'm not sure if it will actually containtain them but it's worth a try. I can reinforce the joins with screws once I'm convinced


----------



## goodvic2 (Nov 23, 2008)

Fleur said:


> You could do all of this in a heated garage and it would be no different?
> 
> The dogs will be in the house when to OP is home so as long as the garage is heated, safe and the dogs are introduced carefully so they are relaxed in the garage I don't see it as any different than being shut in one room of the house?
> 
> ...


Good post

I hate crates. How is a garage worse than a cage??

Yes it's a shame for the boxer but if this is the difference between both dogs having a home (I.e not rehoming one cause of the destruction) then go for it 
As long as the garage is adequately ventilated/heated etc

Sometimes we can't offer our dogs perfection but u have tried to help out this bullmastiff and rightly do not want your house wrecked.

Good on you for offering this dog a home.

(Pls don't resort to caging your dog unless there r no alternatives)


----------



## Sarah H (Jan 18, 2014)

evanique said:


> Thank you, I've been thinking about the run idea and remembered I have spare run panel's to use. with insparation from you all I have created a 6' x 8' run out of the panels and playpen divider and some cable ties. this way they get to stay in the house but will not be able to get to the sills or furniture. I'm not sure if it will actually containtain them but it's worth a try. I can reinforce the joins with screws once I'm convinced


Ooh that's brill! What a great solution!

Along with nice distracting treats and chew toys this should hopefully do the trick!


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=279498645539613&set=pcb.279498668872944&type=1&permPage=1


----------



## Lilylass (Sep 13, 2012)

Sounds like a great idea & keeping everything crossed it works 

Unfortunately the link doesn't work for me


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

Lilylass said:


> I'm sorry but I really don't understand how you could think it would be acceptable
> 
> If it were me, I'd clear a room for them and leave their beds (and obviously things like water, toys etc) and something like an old sofa that it doesn't really matter about - put a baby gate over it and they have the run of that room when they can't be supervised around the rest of the house


that is exactly what I had done! my problem is he is eating the sills in the room and the divider gate. he has a 3x3m conservatory with water, food and toys. but he is literally eating the conservatory. I wish people would stop jumping to the conclusion that I am mistreating my dogs an read my posts properly. I have stated several times that the garage has a window, a light and a heater. I also stated I would use old rugs to cover the floor. I don't see the difference in them being kept in the conservatory or the garage?! it would be safer as there is nothing to chew except walls and their toys. and people are suggesting it would be more humane to put him in a crate?!
ps my bullmastiff is currently lying on top of me on the sofa while my boxer is cuddled up next to my husband. what cruel people we are!!!


----------



## Howl (Apr 10, 2012)

I just wonder if you have time to commit to this dog. I am not being rude but if after a few weeks you are considering them staying in the garage... I just think maybe your happy boxer might wonder what has happened. 
It isn't really about the garage its about excluding your dog from the family area for long periods of time. I think this separates you from the dog and their needs like toileting or needing comfort. 
I just wonder if things are this bad if it isn't worth rehoming your mastiff and going back to life with your boxer. I say this so as to prevent the dog forming then breaking a bond with you. 
If you had lots of time for classes, training etc then obviously that is the best option. I feel training will give your dog the mental stimulation that it might need. 
My guess is that if daycare and a dog walker are not options either then perhaps 2 dogs is too much. 

I stay in one room in the house with my dogs at a time. This supervision means that many behaviour issues like chewing can't develop. My youngest did chew and probably would if left alone but with this supervision she has stopped.


----------



## SixStar (Dec 8, 2009)

I think your title is perhaps badly worded and ruffled a few feathers from the off, but having read the whole thread, I personally can't see why some people are getting so upset 

If the garage is heated, has lighting and a window then I cannot see how it is any different to leaving a dog in a kitchen for example whilst working or overnight, that's fairly common place and no body seems to have much of an issue with that.

A standard sized garage is going to offer plenty of room for them to mooch about in - FAR better than a crate! It's worrying to see some people think confining a dog to such a small space for so long is preferable just because it's going to be inside a house?! 

8 hours left alone is not ideal but if needs must, so be it. Prior to retirement, whichever dog I had at the time was left for the working day. A good walk before I left, another one on my return, and then plenty of play and training, evenings spent with us and weekends revolving around them. Frowned upon here I know, but we needed to work - dogs were perfectly happy.

Offering garden access from the garage would be great - however, if not, 8 hours is not unreasonable to expect adult dogs to go without toileting. It's probably shorter than the overnight period!


----------



## lozzibear (Feb 5, 2010)

Howl said:


> It isn't really about the garage its about excluding your dog from the family area for long periods of time. I think this separates you from the dog and their needs like toileting or needing comfort.


The OP said it will only be for when she (sorry if you are male, OP ) is at work and during the night, so the dogs would be left regardless of whether it is in the conservatory or garage. When they are at home, and awake, the dogs will be in the house with them. Many people have that kind of set up, where the dogs are left while at work and in another room during the night.


----------



## lilythepink (Jul 24, 2013)

Sarah H said:


> Ooh that's brill! What a great solution!
> 
> Along with nice distracting treats and chew toys this should hopefully do the trick!


I give my bullmastiff bones and not chews cos anything she can fit down her throat she swallows it. She has swallowed chews before now and I have always been a bit concerned about a ball so she only gets bones.....and now she only wants bones..bigger the better then I know she won't swallow that.

This is a dog that can eat a slice of warburtons toasty bread in one swallow....she swallows chicken thighs and wings so we only give her a full leg....she gives that 1 maybe 2 crunches and its gone. Her favourite toy is a bucket for feeding horses that we took the handle off.....she likes space hoppers but she pops them.

Have to pick carefully what you give to chew....and she isn't slowing down any as she gets older.lol


----------



## Sarah H (Jan 18, 2014)

lilythepink said:


> I give my bullmastiff bones and not chews cos anything she can fit down her throat she swallows it. She has swallowed chews before now and I have always been a bit concerned about a ball so she only gets bones.....and now she only wants bones..bigger the better then I know she won't swallow that.
> 
> This is a dog that can eat a slice of warburtons toasty bread in one swallow....she swallows chicken thighs and wings so we only give her a full leg....she gives that 1 maybe 2 crunches and its gone. Her favourite toy is a bucket for feeding horses that we took the handle off.....she likes space hoppers but she pops them.
> 
> Have to pick carefully what you give to chew....and she isn't slowing down any as she gets older.lol


Haha I agree! You have to pick the right chews for your dog and it's chewing habits, a nice big bone will keep him happy for sure


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

Howl said:


> I just wonder if you have time to commit to this dog. I am not being rude but if after a few weeks you are considering them staying in the garage... I just think maybe your happy boxer might wonder what has happened.
> It isn't really about the garage its about excluding your dog from the family area for long periods of time. I think this separates you from the dog and their needs like toileting or needing comfort.
> I just wonder if things are this bad if it isn't worth rehoming your mastiff and going back to life with your boxer. I say this so as to prevent the dog forming then breaking a bond with you.
> If you had lots of time for classes, training etc then obviously that is the best option. I feel training will give your dog the mental stimulation that it might need.
> ...


I have been training him I am just concerned where his chewing will lead. are you suggesting that people who work, shouldn't have dogs?


----------



## LinznMilly (Jun 24, 2011)

evanique said:


> that is exactly what I had done! my problem is he is eating the sills in the room and the divider gate. he has a 3x3m conservatory with water, food and toys. but he is literally eating the conservatory. *I wish people would stop jumping to the conclusion that I am mistreating my dogs an read my posts properly*. I have stated several times that the garage has a window, a light and a heater. I also stated I would use old rugs to cover the floor. I don't see the difference in them being kept in the conservatory or the garage?! it would be safer as there is nothing to chew except walls and their toys. and people are suggesting it would be more humane to put him in a crate?!
> ps my bullmastiff is currently lying on top of me on the sofa while my boxer is cuddled up next to my husband. what cruel people we are!!!


I must have missed something.  I don't think anyone here has accused you or even hinted that you're mistreating your dogs. You have asked for our opinions on whether we think keeping dogs in a garage is acceptable and then appear to be getting defensive when not everyone agrees with it? Why ask if you don't want to hear people's opinions? Perhaps you're taking something that I said a bit too personally? I said that if it were _me_, knowing _my _poor memory, I'd probably end up forgetting they were out there (I've locked Milly in her crate to feed her, got distracted and only remembered she was locked in there when she whined at me half an hour later - and her crate is in the same room as me  so Dog knows how long she'd have been left there if she were in the garden and I couldn't hear her  )

A room in a house/crate versus a garage:

A dog-proofed room/crate - centrally heated, appropriately ventilated, within the main family living area frequented by one or more members of the family, secured on exit. Specifically during the night, should anything happen to one or both of the dogs, or they need to go out for toileting, you're actually within the same building so more likely to wake up and hear anything out of the ordinary.

A garage: Isn't centrally heated, so relying on a heater, poorly ventilated because the window doesn't open, not nearly as frequented as the main living area, not as secure as the house (not that long ago, an intruder scaled a number of fences to get to a particular house/garden just a few blocks from me, so even if the garden is only accessed directly from the house, I'd worry about the actual security of the garden, and if it does have a gate, what's to stop a tall enough intruder from reaching over and unlocking the gate?). Specifically during the night, the dogs are locked in the garage, so you're less likely to hear them whine/howl/bark and there's more chance that the first you hear of anything wrong is when neighbours call the police for noise disturbance - or when you go to them in the morning.

OP mentions the mud that the dogs trail into the house, then suggests leaving them in the garage with access to the garden?  How's that going to stop them trailing mud into the house when you come to collect them?

Again, that's just my take on it.


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

lilythepink said:


> I give my bullmastiff bones and not chews cos anything she can fit down her throat she swallows it. She has swallowed chews before now and I have always been a bit concerned about a ball so she only gets bones.....and now she only wants bones..bigger the better then I know she won't swallow that.
> 
> This is a dog that can eat a slice of warburtons toasty bread in one swallow....she swallows chicken thighs and wings so we only give her a full leg....she gives that 1 maybe 2 crunches and its gone. Her favourite toy is a bucket for feeding horses that we took the handle off.....she likes space hoppers but she pops them.
> 
> Have to pick carefully what you give to chew....and she isn't slowing down any as she gets older.lol


I got him an xl Kong and a large long for my boxer, no I'm worried he will swallow.my boxers Kong!


----------



## SixStar (Dec 8, 2009)

evanique said:


> I got him an xl Kong and a large long for my boxer, no I'm worried he will swallow.my boxers Kong!


I would go with XXL for both - I think my Mastiff could swallow a large Kong as if it was little more than a biscuit!


----------



## donnas1977 (Feb 7, 2010)

SixStar said:


> I would go with XXL for both - I think my Mastiff could swallow a large Kong as if it was little more than a biscuit!


Am with six star go for the xxl, my mastiff could swallow many things, we need eyes in back of our head at times with her. They are so rewarding though when you work through the issues


----------



## lilythepink (Jul 24, 2013)

SixStar said:


> I would go with XXL for both - I think my Mastiff could swallow a large Kong as if it was little more than a biscuit!


yes....exactly this


----------



## Kirstyrebe (Jan 20, 2014)

I know of a couple of houses near my way that the garage side door is off the kitchen one of which my friend lets her dogs in there that's their room, it's carpeted well insulated, windows and everything they need(she keeps her car on the drive) it's pretty much a lovely room for the dogs, I thought it was a fab idea, but she rarely closes the door unless she's out or asleep, the dogs seem to love it it's their own special safe place bedroom lol


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

LinznMilly said:


> I must have missed something.  I don't think anyone here has accused you or even hinted that you're mistreating your dogs. You have asked for our opinions on whether we think keeping dogs in a garage is acceptable and then appear to be getting defensive when not everyone agrees with it? Why ask if you don't want to hear people's opinions? Perhaps you're taking something that I said a bit too personally? I said that if it were _me_, knowing _my _poor memory, I'd probably end up forgetting they were out there (I've locked Milly in her crate to feed her, got distracted and only remembered she was locked in there when she whined at me half an hour later - and her crate is in the same room as me  so Dog knows how long she'd have been left there if she were in the garden and I couldn't hear her  )
> 
> A room in a house/crate versus a garage:
> 
> ...


there is no way I can dog proof my conservatory - he is eating the windowsill! I will not put him in a crate, thats not fair on him. I have now made a pen out of run panel's and a baby play pen with a gate. this is almost as big as the room itself so they have plenty of room. I was asking for ideas and solutions on how to make this work. instead I get several peolpe saying I should rehome him. If I didn't care about his welfare I would not be asking for advice in the 1st place. we already have a bond with him and are training him as best we can. he has already learned to walk well on a lead and his recall is ok, and is more or less toilet trained now. I'm just trying to get around the chewing issues. I know mess is inevitable, I'm just trying to figure out how to contain it. I have adjusted his food intake as previous owners were feeding too much cheep food and it was causing bad flatulance. we are overcoming most of the problems except the chewing. if this pen doesn't work we're back to square 1.


----------



## donnas1977 (Feb 7, 2010)

Mastiffs are known for wind issues. Rogue was horrendous, again her previous owners had a cheep food. Only way we resolved it was going raw or grain free . I would recommend getting the dog some training . We are attending an 8 week training class the now with rogue and I must say since starting her issues have certainly died down. She still steals stuff, hides or destroys but no where near as bad, good luck with your mastiff. The end result will be worth it


----------



## Howl (Apr 10, 2012)

evanique said:


> are you suggesting that people who work, shouldn't have dogs?


Not at all I just think if you are asking us if it's ok then obviously you have doubts about it. 
Many people work full time I work 50 hours + and my OH 40 hours most of which is from home.Many people also put in place dog walkers or day care which have been reccomended. I leave mine alone while at work 2 days a month in the house. They are tired before I go out and when I get back they go on a mock hunt. So go back to sleep when I am in the house. 
Sometimes a long walk is not enough. I am not saying you aren't training your dog but perhaps it needs to be more so your dog is mentally very tired. This was the case with mine. It did involve us going out every evening for hours when she needed to learn how to adapt to living in a home. She was a puppy and it took a long time we were all exhausted but it is worth it. 
I just worry that when a garage becomes an option and the behaviour doesn't improve, perhaps deteriorates in both dogs to the point where they don't adapt to staying back in the house. Why feed them inside when it's messy, if they sleep in the garage then they can't wreck things, weekends its easier or when people come around and so on and so on. 
After a hard days work and there isn't long once you have got home, walked them and cleaned up before bed. 
My worry is that you see many steps like these becoming a downward spiral. I personally would never leave any type of space heater on unattended especially in the same room as my pets even if it is seperate or out of reach. 
My first option would be use bitter apple or similar with breed specific mental stimulation games with you, then toys for them to be left with and a dog walker/day care. 
Failing that I would get a behaviourist and start something like agility/obedience etc. a couple of times a week (this is what mine needed).


> I have been training him I am just concerned where his chewing will lead.


 Getting a rehome dog takes work and more than a couple of weeks work all I am reading is there is concern for your house not the well being of why the dog is doing this. SA? Boredom? etc. 
I just don't think it is in anyones dreams when owning a dog to keep it in a garage. If you have decided then you don't need approval or anyones opinion so why ask?


----------



## lorilu (Sep 6, 2009)

evanique said:


> there is no way I can dog proof my conservatory - he is eating the windowsill! I will not put him in a crate, thats not fair on him. I have now made a pen out of run panel's and a baby play pen with a gate. this is almost as big as the room itself so they have plenty of room. I was asking for ideas and solutions on how to make this work. instead I get several peolpe saying I should rehome him. If I didn't care about his welfare I would not be asking for advice in the 1st place. we already have a bond with him and are training him as best we can. he has already learned to walk well on a lead and his recall is ok, and is more or less toilet trained now. I'm just trying to get around the chewing issues. I know mess is inevitable, I'm just trying to figure out how to contain it. I have adjusted his food intake as previous owners were feeding too much cheep food and it was causing bad flatulance. we are overcoming most of the problems except the chewing. if this pen doesn't work we're back to square 1.


I think you've been admirably patient with everyone, it does seem that many aren't even bothering to read you posts, though you have posted the same information several times over throughout the thread. I think, with your level of caring, patience and determination, everything is going to work out okay, and that dog, in spite of his rocky beginnings, is going to have a nice long happy loving life, thanks to you.

I know you've decided to try the inside the house thing, but if you do turn to the garage, even if only for the rescue boy, a heated garage with access to a protected yard sounds pretty darn nice to me. 

Good luck with the sale of your house, hope it goes quickly! x


----------



## Blitz (Feb 12, 2009)

I can't see what the fuss is about. A well set up garage would be far better than a crate. How can anyone think it is ok to leave a dog in a crate for hours on end but not to build a dog what would basically be an indoor kennel in a garage. Sounds an ideal set up to me. Lots of people kennel their dogs when they are out, what is the difference.


----------



## donnas1977 (Feb 7, 2010)

Howl said:


> Not at all I just think if you are asking us if it's ok then obviously you have doubts about it.
> Many people work full time I work 50 hours + and my OH 40 hours most of which is from home.Many people also put in place dog walkers or day care which have been reccomended. I leave mine alone while at work 2 days a month in the house. They are tired before I go out and when I get back they go on a mock hunt. So go back to sleep when I am in the house.
> Sometimes a long walk is not enough. I am not saying you aren't training your dog but perhaps it needs to be more so your dog is mentally very tired. This was the case with mine. It did involve us going out every evening for hours when she needed to learn how to adapt to living in a home. She was a puppy and it took a long time we were all exhausted but it is worth it.
> I just worry that when a garage becomes an option and the behaviour doesn't improve, perhaps deteriorates in both dogs to the point where they don't adapt to staying back in the house. Why feed them inside when it's messy, if they sleep in the garage then they can't wreck things, weekends its easier or when people come around and so on and so on.
> ...


Totally agree howl, rogue was a rehome and she has tested us to limits at time. Now she is coming good. I've had her 5 months but it does take work and patience.


----------



## tinaK (Jun 12, 2010)

so it's OK to leave a dog in a crate for 8+ hours, but not a garage that's been sorted and is safe for a dog


----------



## Goblin (Jun 21, 2011)

Yep, garages have to be horrible place...

https://www.google.de/search?q=gara...9OdDNsgaP74CgAQ&ved=0CCkQsAQ&biw=1920&bih=969


----------



## LinznMilly (Jun 24, 2011)

evanique said:


> there is no way I can dog proof my conservatory - he is eating the windowsill! I will not put him in a crate, thats not fair on him. I have now made a pen out of run panel's and a baby play pen with a gate. this is almost as big as the room itself so they have plenty of room. I was asking for ideas and solutions on how to make this work. instead I get several peolpe saying I should rehome him. If I didn't care about his welfare I would not be asking for advice in the 1st place. we already have a bond with him and are training him as best we can. he has already learned to walk well on a lead and his recall is ok, and is more or less toilet trained now. I'm just trying to get around the chewing issues. I know mess is inevitable, I'm just trying to figure out how to contain it. I have adjusted his food intake as previous owners were feeding too much cheep food and it was causing bad flatulance. we are overcoming most of the problems except the chewing. if this pen doesn't work we're back to square 1.


Yes, I understand that, I did read your post about the play pen and I hope it works for you.  I do understand your predicament - I've been there myself with my lurcher. For me, a crate works well. I understand that for you it may not.

He's eating the windowsill in the conservatory. What if he decides to eat the breeze-blocks in the garage? People have said that they've known/owned dogs that have so it's not altogether far-fetched.

OK, people are suggesting rehoming - that's a far cry from accusing you of mistreating your dog. They also suggested doggy day care or dog walkers. Some people on another forum suggested I rehomed Milly sooner rather than later if I decided I couldn't cope. 3 years later and she's lounging on my couch as I type.  As hard as it can be to read, what they're saying is, if you're struggling to cope, if you decide you can't deal with his issues, it's better for the dog to be moved on now and find his forever home, rather than get settled, develop an even deeper bond with you, then a year down the line, you decide things aren't improving so put him up for rehoming - breaking a deeper bond than you'd be breaking now. Or, get settled, you "keep him" through loyalty and later end up resenting the dog (general you, not specifically you).

Only you know how much time and commitment you can devote to this dog and his issues. Only you know how far you're willing to go for this dog. We can give you our opinions, but we're strangers on a forum. Should you log off and take your dog down to the garage, how are we to know any different?

People mistreating their dogs don't usually take the time to ask whether what they're thinking of doing is acceptable for their dog


----------



## donnas1977 (Feb 7, 2010)

8 hours plus is far too long for a dog to be left along, I know folk work,and am lucky I have someone in house all day with dogs. What about a dog walker or someone who could let out during day ?


----------



## lemmsy (May 12, 2008)

Just to mix it up a bit:

Our dog room is our "converted" garage. It's a large garage (attached to the house) and has a partition up which separates it. The bit where the dogs' stuff is, has been insulated, kitted out with a tall cabinet that contains all things dog (training kit, treats/foods on top shelves, meds, coats, toys etc), doggy themed hooks for hanging walking kit on (harnesses, leads, collars), their freezer (for their raw food), which also has a fridge compartment for defrosting stuff in, a table/work-top (with chopping board used for prepping raw food and room for the dehydrator), their covered crates (one fits snuggly under the work-tops and the other in the corner), water bowls etc. 
We are thinking about putting on old sofa in there for them too. 

Since we are geeky, they even have a little "Doggy den" sign on the door! 

They naturally sleep in there overnight. During the day they have the run of downstairs (and often the whole house); hanging with the humans (when not out on walks/training). 
When we are out for reasonable periods they have the run of their room (door left open) and the dining room (garage leads on to DR). It's a massive space that they are comfortable in. 
One in particular loves his den and frequently takes himself off there to chill (when he isn't stretching out on the sofa). 

As such, nothing wrong with having the dogs' base in the garage. 
Keeping dogs in any kind of confined space for unreasonable periods with no company or enrichment however is wrong.


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

I am out for 8 hours at time maybe once a week tops, other days it's shorter and most days I get to pop back home to check on them. they get a walk before work and I take them in the evenings. I am looking into training classes. the dogs are in the pen now for the night and hopefully he will not escape and eat something he shouldn't. I am determined to make this work and give my dogs a good standard of living. Thank you to everyone who bothered to read my posts, and offered advice. good night


----------



## Cinnebar (Nov 8, 2011)

While we were building our house we lived in a caravan - with 3 Border Collies !!
When the lack of space and smell of wet dog got too much for us I would put them for a few hours into a stable that I converted for them. 
It was deep litter shavings to dig in and suspended from the rafters were a tuggy rope and a tyre. They spent hours leaping about and hanging from them and I knew that they were safe.

Not as plush as the ones on the link, but my son converted our garage into his band room where the lads congregated to play dreadfully loud music on their guitars. They had carpet and sofas and were really happy in there so much so that they have been known to flakeout on said sofas and sleep there


----------



## scruffsntuffs (Feb 16, 2014)

Day ar big dogs man,as long as its warm,dry ov course its ok.
Dogs ar ment to live in a dog house,not ur house.
Dont understand people who molly coddle there dogs by lettin dem sleep in der beds,sit on der couches and basically stink there homes out wid out consideration for visitors leaving coverd in dog airs.
some av lovely breeds ov dogs day walk around de local green wid,day in day out,killin der dog a little more each day.dogs wanna run in de pack lettin rip der primal instincts.
garage iz just fine my friend az long as dogs and you are appy.


----------



## Dogless (Feb 26, 2010)

scruffsntuffs said:


> Day ar big dogs man,as long as its warm,dry ov course its ok.
> Dogs ar ment to live in a dog house,not ur house.
> Dont understand people who molly coddle there dogs by lettin dem sleep in der beds,sit on der couches and basically stink there homes out wid out consideration for visitors leaving coverd in dog airs.
> *some av lovely breeds ov dogs day walk around de local green wid,day in day out,killin der dog a little more each day.dogs wanna run in de pack lettin rip der primal instincts.*
> garage iz just fine my friend az long as dogs and you are appy.


I az a lovely breed ov dog and dogs allowed to let rip der primal instincts is wot kills mine (and me) a little more each day when I walk close to home. I am sure mine wud love to let em rip but der would be far fewer cats n sheep n maybe small dogs n my dogs wud probably av been shot by now.

Mine r molly coddled n can sit on de sofa as much as dey like but dey don't stink cos they hav a gud diet an we don't av visitors anyway really so problem solved. Despite dem bein mollycoddled dey r actually trained an so far dey have not made a bid to overthrow me an rule de house.

OP: For what it is worth I think that a suitably converted garage would be fine.


----------



## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

scruffsntuffs said:


> Day ar big dogs man,as long as its warm,dry ov course its ok.
> Dogs ar ment to live in a dog house,not ur house.
> Dont understand people who molly coddle there dogs by lettin dem sleep in der beds,sit on der couches and basically stink there homes out wid out consideration for visitors leaving coverd in dog airs.
> some av lovely breeds ov dogs day walk around de local green wid,day in day out,killin der dog a little more each day.dogs wanna run in de pack lettin rip der primal instincts.
> garage iz just fine my friend az long as dogs and you are appy.


:confused5:  :001_huh:


----------



## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

Dogless said:


> I az a lovely breed ov dog and dogs allowed to let rip der primal instincts is wot kills mine (and me) a little more each day when I walk close to home. I am sure mine wud love to let em rip but der would be far fewer cats n sheep n maybe small dogs n my dogs wud probably av been shot by now.
> 
> Mine r molly coddled n can sit on de sofa as much as dey like but dey don't stink cos they hav a gud diet an we don't av visitors anyway really so problem solved. Despite dem bein mollycoddled dey r actually trained an so far dey have not made a bid to overthrow me an rule de house.
> 
> OP: For what it is worth I think that a suitably converted garage would be fine.


:lol::lol::lol:


----------



## Kirstyrebe (Jan 20, 2014)

:biggrin: had to laugh


----------



## Blitz (Feb 12, 2009)

donnas1977 said:


> 8 hours plus is far too long for a dog to be left along, I know folk work,and am lucky I have someone in house all day with dogs. What about a dog walker or someone who could let out during day ?


The OP has said that she/he is out between 4 and 8 hours a day, not 8 hours plus. And yes, you are lucky to have someone home all day with the dogs - many dogs are quite happy being left alone for 8 hours every day.



Dogless said:


> I az a lovely breed ov dog and dogs allowed to let rip der primal instincts is wot kills mine (and me) a little more each day when I walk close to home. I am sure mine wud love to let em rip but der would be far fewer cats n sheep n maybe small dogs n my dogs wud probably av been shot by now.
> 
> Mine r molly coddled n can sit on de sofa as much as dey like but dey don't stink cos they hav a gud diet an we don't av visitors anyway really so problem solved. Despite dem bein mollycoddled dey r actually trained an so far dey have not made a bid to overthrow me an rule de house.


Don't encourage the moron :ciappa: Hope they get bored and leave soon.


----------



## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

*Sounds to me the OP is doing all they can to make sure their dogs are going to be safe and comfortable. I can't see why people are being so judgemental.
As for not dogs should not be left for 8 hours, rubbish. When i worked mine were left, and it didn't have any adverse affects on them.*


----------



## Milliepoochie (Feb 13, 2011)

scruffsntuffs said:


> Day ar big dogs man,as long as its warm,dry ov course its ok.
> Dogs ar ment to live in a dog house,not ur house.
> Dont understand people who molly coddle there dogs by lettin dem sleep in der beds,sit on der couches and basically stink there homes out wid out consideration for visitors leaving coverd in dog airs.
> some av lovely breeds ov dogs day walk around de local green wid,day in day out,killin der dog a little more each day.dogs wanna run in de pack lettin rip der primal instincts.
> garage iz just fine my friend az long as dogs and you are appy.


I'm not sure I understand what the size of a dog has to do with it?

Certainly in my house my dog lives as part of the family - And yes is currently curled up asleep on the sofa and No my house doesn't stink as I am not to lazy to do housework and I own a hoover so my house isn't covered in dog hair 

My dog is walked in a controlled manner although not on the local green and certainly isn't allowed to 'run in de Pack letting rip her primal instinct's'.

Some of the comments you have made are quite judgemental and I hope by reading the forum that you could learn which could be of benefit to any dog you currently own or will in the future.

Now off to walk my dog or kill her a little bit more whichever term one would prefer :thumbup1:


----------



## redroses2106 (Aug 21, 2011)

evanique said:


> I have 2 large dogs, a boxer and a bullmastiff. The bullmastiff is 3 and I'd constantly chewing furniture, windowsills etc, we've only had him for a few weeks off a guy who never properly trained him or walked him or let him into the family room. at the moment both dogs live in the conservatory with a gate across the wide opening into the kitchen diner. our garden is quite buggy and whenever we let them out they come back in and cover the conservatory with mud. they also smell really bad which doesn't work well with my open plan house. sprays and plug ins don't cover it. we do love our dog's and they come into the family room with us every evening and during the day when I'm around. they get walked twice a day and have decent dry food, toys and daily chew treats. but they are destroying my house (which i am trying to sell).
> one solution I am thinking about is to house them in our detached garage when I'm working in the day and overnight to sleep. they would still spend time with us when we are home and they can be supervised. we would obviously remove any hazards from their part of the garage. and I could give them access to the garden during the day. is this a humane solution? I worry a bit about my boxer who is 9 and used to having the freedom of the house as he is very well behaved.


I haven't read all the thread because it is really long  but I did skim a bit of it so sorry if I repeat anyone

the garage has a window and heater - where is the heater? does it have wires? could the dog chew it and electrocute himself? this for me would be the main concern regarding the garage - I personally think the garage if it was warm and has light would be far better than a tiny crate all day. but only if it's safe, a crate would be better if it is not safe.

I think you need to work with your dog - find out why he is chewing everything, could it be some form of separation anxiety, boredom, or just simply not been trained. 
what do you do with your dog apart from walks? do you do any other training with them, have you considered taking them to some fun training classes get their brains working too, mental stimulation is just as important as physical exercise, often not being challenged enough and boredom can lead to destructive behaviour.

if he is being left for very long periods of time this could be causing stress and anxiety, have you considered getting a dog walker in to break up the day a bit? take him for an hours walk half way through just so it's not such a long time to be left alone, or maybe try some calming plug ins, thunder coats, all things said to ease anxiety

if it's just lack of training then perhaps find a good behaviourist to help you, one that uses positive methods, I am sure the problems could easily be sorted out with a bit of hard work and effort 

but for now popping a dog in a well light well ventilated and warm comfortable garage whilst you are at work is better than leaving him to ruin your whole house and injure himself

I personally do not agree with keeping dogs kennelled and out of the home 24/7 but if it's just whilst you are not home then it's certainly a good idea as a short term solution but you will have to try to get to the bottom of why he is destructive and work with him very hard to try to get through his issues, it will make life easier for everyone concerned


----------



## springerpete (Jun 24, 2010)

Whilst some may find it O.K. I certainly wouldn't I'm afraid.


----------



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

*What on earth do you mean dogs should live in kennel (dog house) not in your home. I've never heard anything so stupid in my life.

I own a large breed and it should never be shut out in a kennel they need human company as do all other breeds.

If your going to shut a dog outside you shouldn't have one. :mad5:*


----------



## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

Happy Paws said:


> *What on earth do you mean dogs should live in kennel (dog house) not in your home. I've never heard anything so stupid in my life.
> 
> I own a large breed and it should never be shut out in a kennel they need human company as do all other breeds.
> 
> If your going to shut a dog outside you shouldn't have one. :mad5:*


*But the dogs in question are not going to be shut out all day and night.
Did you not read the whole thread?*


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

good news, the pen is still standing this morning :thumbup1:


----------



## cbrookman (Jun 12, 2011)

JANICE199 said:


> *But the dogs in question are not going to be shut out all day and night.
> Did you not read the whole thread?*


Think Happy Paws was replying to the brudder (if that is the term )not the OP!


----------



## Burrowzig (Feb 18, 2009)

evanique said:


> yes I do. he gets 2 walks a day, time with the family every evening, love and quality food. none of this would change if I moved them into the garage. as I said, they would come.into the house with us whenever we are home.


Except at night, as you said. If it were just during the day when you're out, I can't see it as being worse than a crate apart from the implications for noise affecting your neighbours more than if the dog was in a crate inside the house. Also, the changing the living conditions of your Boxer by putting him in the garage too seems unfair. It's worth bearing in mind that garages can get hot under sunshine, mainly if the roof is metal and it's unlikely to have the same level of insulation as a house. The conservatory will over-heat even more. Leaving a dog in a conservatory when the sun's out is could quickly kill them. Your conservatory is the same size as mine and I know how hot it can get.



evanique said:


> ok here's more info: he's not too bad with toilet training, getting better at that. it's the chewing that's concerning me, he's chewed the furniture and when I've removed most of it from the room, he chewed the windowsill. there were chunks of plastic on the floor when I came down thismorning. I'm worried he's going to harm himself. he has pulled the trunking off the wall in the kitchen that covers electrical cable too.
> 
> I am usually out of the house mon-fri for 4 to 8 hours a day. with regards to the garage, there is a heater in there and I would section of the storage area so the dogs can't get to anything.
> 
> a few of you have mentioned crate training but I feel it would be cruel to leave him in a crate for any length of time. the crate would need to be huge as he is a 47kg dog! he needs to be able to get up and walk around/stretch without risking himself by literally eating the conservatory, which is why I am considering the garage. I mean he can't chew breeze blocks can he?


He could easily chew through breeze blocks. Many dogs do so.


----------



## Fleur (Jul 19, 2008)

The OP appears to of found a workable solution of building a large pen in the conservatory keeping the dog away from anything they can destroy and keeping them in a place that is familiar to them.

Fingers crossed it works out and the dogs are happy and safe and her house stays standing


----------



## happysaz133 (Jun 5, 2008)

I don't see how an adapted garage is any different from a kennel, as long as the dog is will stimulated. Personally I would heat it though, if I were in your situation and have it insulated (if it isn't already) as its not fair especially on the older dog. 

However, personally, I'd try other options, such as crating or gating to one room.


----------



## Nicky10 (Jan 11, 2010)

Buster sleeps in the kitchen at night and the rare occasion he's left alone I don't see the difference between that and a garage :skep:. 

The pen seems a good solution at least. I hope it holds up


----------



## Happy Paws2 (Sep 13, 2008)

JANICE199 said:


> *But the dogs in question are not going to be shut out all day and night.
> Did you not read the whole thread?*


The part in red was what I was talking about. 


scruffsntuffs said:


> Day ar big dogs man,as long as its warm,dry ov course its ok.
> *Dogs ar ment to live in a dog house,not ur house*.
> Dont understand people who molly coddle there dogs by lettin dem sleep in der beds,sit on der couches and basically stink there homes out wid out consideration for visitors leaving coverd in dog airs.
> some av lovely breeds ov dogs day walk around de local green wid,day in day out,killin der dog a little more each day.dogs wanna run in de pack lettin rip der primal instincts.
> garage iz just fine my friend az long as dogs and you are appy.


----------



## SLB (Apr 25, 2011)

Owned By A Yellow Lab said:


> I'm sure you'll do all you can to make your dogs comfy
> 
> Just wondering how they go to the loo if they're at home for up to eight hours with no garden access?


The same as dogs that are left in the house for up to 8 or more hours when their owners have to work..  The answer being - they don't.

I only work part time but when I do work, mine are walked a good walk before hand.. they don't get one after which could be anything up to 10 hours because I am not walking them at 1-3am in the morning.

They get let out to the loo, come in and are happy to come and sleep - which is what they were doing when I unlocked the door anyway. If I work during the day and I know it's going to be a long one then I will ask a friend to pop in.

But not at night because generally I'm home before it's an 8 hour time period but if something goes wrong, or there are road works then it can take me over but I'm not going to get someone to pop in at 9-10pm to let them out, because most dog sitters have finished their working day by then and most of the people I do ask are having a drink or getting ready for bed by then. As far as I'm concerned they have a good walk before, they have their treat toys out and they have each other for company..

I can also assure you that even when I'm in the dogs, who have been trained to ask to go to the loo, probably only ask in the morning to go out and can go way over 10 hours without needing it.



SixStar said:


> I think your title is perhaps badly worded and ruffled a few feathers from the off, but having read the whole thread, I personally can't see why some people are getting so upset
> 
> If the garage is heated, has lighting and a window then I cannot see how it is any different to leaving a dog in a kitchen for example whilst working or overnight, that's fairly common place and no body seems to have much of an issue with that.
> 
> ...


This - exactly this ^

I cannot understand how a garage - which has to be large enough to fit a car is considered more cruel than a crate which only fits the dog. Also, don't some people cover their dogs crates too.. :skep: In which why would a windowless garage be any worse?

As it is the OP has since sorted something out. But just felt I would share my thoughts.


----------



## HappyWag (Aug 25, 2012)

I agree with SLB Cannot see what all the fuss is about, the garage is not as small as a crate, which some are saying is better!? I know which I would prefer.
To the OP I hope you manage to get things sorted, and well done for re-homing the dog in question.Good luck x


----------



## tinamary (Aug 17, 2008)

I would be concerned about what you are going to do with the dogs in the summer. You could not leave them in a conservatory. I would consider daycare so you dont have to worry about them.


----------



## evanique (Nov 5, 2012)

tinamary said:


> I would be concerned about what you are going to do with the dogs in the summer. You could not leave them in a conservatory. I would consider daycare so you dont have to worry about them.


hi, yes I have thought of that. i we are still living here I will move them into the kitchen diner as the conservatory does get really hot in the Sumner, even with the Windows open.


----------

