# Have we made a mistake? I feel like I'm in over my head with our first puppy.



## Spookymuffin (Jan 4, 2013)

My husband and I decided to adopt a puppy to add to our current zoo; we have two cats and some small animals (5 degus, 4 gerbils and fish) already.

We brought our pup home about a month ago when he was eight weeks. He's a red setter/flat coat retriever cross and cute as a button.

I was prepared for a lot of the work involved (early starts and cleaning a lot of messes) but there are some aspects of his behaviour that are becoming more and more distressing.
He is always full of energy and over excited (which is not surprising) but he expends this energy by biting my husband and I. He bites hard. He bites hands. He bites faces. He grabs mouthfuls of my hair and pulls violently.

We try to redirect him, giving him toys to chomp on instead but he bores of them quickly and goes back to trying to remove our skin :/

I've tried every piece of advice that I can find on the internet to deal with it, but nothing seems to help. I have been consistent in yelping and cutting off play when he bites but it just seems to make him more excited/aggressive. Putting him in a time out doesn't seem to help either, it usually just starts him barking :mad2:

He also isn't really affectionate with us. I know that he probably needs more time to bond with us, but I don't see how to begin bonding with a puppy only seems to want to bite us.

I'm getting worried. He's getting bigger and stronger every day, and his bites are hurting more and more. I'm scared for the safety of my cats and any future children we will hopefully have in the next year or two.

Please help, I feel like we made a terrible mistake in bringing him into our home. Any advice is much appreciated.

I'm feeling more and more like a cat person with each passing day!


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## Fluffster (Aug 26, 2013)

I'm afraid this is all normal puppy behaviour! Puppies really should come with a warning label 

The good news is that the playbiting passes, the bad news is, it can take a few months, it's just a case of persevering with what you are doing. It's important that he DOES play bite in fact, as it's how he will learn bite inhibition. But I know how horrible it is to be covered in bruises and scratches.

Re: the affection, Daisy has only lately started getting cuddly and wanting to be cuddled on the sofa etc, and she's seven months.

I think most of people have had the puppy blues at some point!


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## Twiggy (Jun 24, 2010)

You are not alone I promise you. I think there are many of us that feel the same at times dealing with little puppies and I know with several of mine I've doubted I've made the right decision.

Remember your pup spent several weeks honing his skills at playbiting with his siblings and now he just has you and your husband to practice on...!!

Many pups are also prone to temper tantrums, much the same as young children, but that doesn't mean your dog won't mature into a sweet natured and well behaved adult.

Persevere with what you're doing and it will get better - honestly.


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## BoredomBusters (Dec 8, 2011)

Spookymuffin said:


> My husband and I decided to adopt a puppy to add to our current zoo; we have two cats and some small animals (5 degus, 4 gerbils and fish) already.
> 
> We brought our pup home about a month ago when he was eight weeks. He's a red setter/flat coat retriever cross and cute as a button.
> 
> ...


I feel your pain, I'm looking after 3 puppies at the moment, and one is a bouncy munch monster, and I only see her half an hour a week. The first question I ask is usually how much sleep is the puppy getting? Because usually it's not enough. How much time are you interacting with puppy in one go? Usually that's too much.

The first thing I would do is UP the sleep (18 to 20 hours a day at that age) and LOWER the amount of interaction at one time - 10-15 minutes at a time. If pup is well behave for 10 mins then starts biting they are telling you they've had enough so stop interacting at 8 mins.

Try that for a few days and it should diminish the biting - unless someone in the family is allowing pup to chew on their hands (and that's usually teenage boys or Dad) so pup thinks that's how he is supposed to play. Distracting with toys is rewarding the biting. Once you've raised sleep and lowered interaction periods, if puppy starts biting or jumping he should have a consequence, and usually I use a 10 second time out at that age. 3 lots of time out in less than 2 minutes and puppy needs a proper nap. Good luck...


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## Sarah1983 (Nov 2, 2011)

I've felt in way over my head with both my dogs initially and they weren't puppies! You'll get through it, it's just a case of being consistent and keep plugging away.

What do you do with him? You have a mix of two active, intelligent breeds and young as he is he's going to need mental stimulation. What sort of exercise is he getting each day? Lots of people make the mistake of trying to physically tire out a puppy and it often backfires and you end up with the canine equivalent of an over tired toddler.

My dog is not the cuddly, sit on your lap and be hugged and kissed type. He'd rather lie on the floor at your feet than sit on the sofa with you and if interacting with you much prefers to be doing something than sitting being stroked. It took a bit of getting used to as my previous dog was a 35kg lapdog and spent most of his life draped over me, leaning on me or otherwise attached to me.


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## delca1 (Oct 29, 2011)

A new pup is always hard work but great fun too.
When we got Indie we used to say 'a-a' and gave her a toy as a distraction if she started biting, not such a good plan as she soon caught on that the quickest way to get a toy was to bite!!
So, it became an a-a followed by a few mins in another room which worked really well. At first if she whined or barked we didn't let her back till she was quiet, luckily she only made a noise for a second or two.

It will get better!


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## BenBoy (Aug 31, 2013)

Totally normal feeling!!! 

You have a high energy breed with the setter and Labradors like to be stimulated physically and mentally to.

Are you doing training exercises and games, this will help tire the pup out.

Oh and where are the pictures


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## Rafa (Jun 18, 2012)

Hang on in there, things will get better.

You've just described my JRT, Rosie, to a tee. She was a manic pup, never slept during the day and devoted her endless energy to biting and destroying. I've had a lot of pups over the years, but never one that bit the way she did.

It is difficult to love a puppy or form a bond when they behave this way. They never seem to give you a moment of calm, when you can actually get to know them.

Once I was able to walk Rosie, she improved no end.

All pups bite this way. Some are worse than others, but they do ALL grow out of it.

For what it's worth, my Rosie is now the most wonderful little girl. She lives life to the full and greets everyone and everything with enthusiasm, but she is very lovable and will happily lie calmly on my knee and be stroked.


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

My pup is nearly seven months old and we had the same as you with the biting. When we bought her home, she was such a sweet little thing all warm and cuddly and falling asleep. The next day a blonde crocodile appeared. Who swapped her during the night!! 
I did the yelping thing and that worked to a degree, she would stop and stare at me with this mad look in her eye, then carry on. I spent an awful lot of time stood in the corner, arms folded staring at the ceiling. Eventually she began to get the idea that biting us hard was not the thing to do and then slowly she realised she shouldn't be biting us at all. When she gets excited she has a habit of trying to hold your hand, but no more then that. If you don't have one get a crate and a baby gate so you can escape. Crates are new to me this time round with a puppy and have been an absolute life saver. If your puppy is getting over the top and is overtired, put him in the crate with something to munch on and leave the room with a glass of wine in your hand and sit somewhere peaceful for a while. Crates are great for house training at night as it is rare for a dog to mess in its sleeping area.
I promise you it does pass and you will forget quite how awful it was and will be on this part of the forum sympathising with new puppy owners and giving them advice.


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## Riff Raff (Feb 12, 2013)

I think the answer that asked if you had started training hit the nail on the head. With very young pups there is a limit to the amount of hard physical exercise you can provide, but you can get stuck into positive reinforcement training straight away. This teaches your pup how to interact with you in a way you will like, how to earn attention in ways that don't involve biting, builds the relationship between you, and provides much needed mental stimulation for the pup. Have you signed up for a puppy class yet?

In addition to training, have a look at the management you are using. Things like child gates, x pens, crates can all be sanity savers. Preparing stuffed kongs and treat balls are great forms of environmental enrichment for the pup and are much more interesting than eating from a bowl. Providing nylabones and similar chew toys is a good idea, as is teaching a 'settle'.


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## MerlinsMum (Aug 2, 2009)

Spookymuffin said:


> I've tried every piece of advice that I can find on the internet to deal with it, but nothing seems to help.


There is an AWFUL lot of information out there online, and not all of it is good, or constructive.

This may be one you haven't yet read - 
The Bite Stops Here by Dr Ian Dunbar

...or, if you have read it, it's the one I'd really try to stick to. Sometimes it's just about consistency, with all your family members doing the same thing - it can take time for the penny to drop with a young pup, and trying new things is counter-productive.


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## Sleeping_Lion (Mar 19, 2009)

What breed is your pup, and how old is he? Apols if I've missed this, I'm a bit of a skip reader.


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## Flamingoes (Dec 8, 2012)

Sleeping_Lion said:


> What breed is your pup, and how old is he? Apols if I've missed this, I'm a bit of a skip reader.


First post you t1t  

_'He's a red setter/flat coat retriever cross and cute as a button.'_

There  :lol:


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

A bit of clicker training might help if your pup is food orientated. A good small thing to teach is not to mug the hand for food. Most pups will try and grab a treat from your hands without a care for your fingers, teaching a dog to wait before you give them a treat and not snatching helps then to learn not to bite you. Feed your pup a couple of small tasty treats, then hold one in your fist and don't allow the pup to have it if they are nibbling your hand, pawing at the hand or doing anything at the hand. The moment they stop, click and give the treat. If you don't have a clicker, say yes. You need to be very careful to click or say yes at the right time. The right time is when the pup moves back from the hand and probably just looks at it. Keep doing this until the pup stop mugging the hand and waits until you click or say yes. What you want is for the pup never to mug the hand and gently take food from you. It does seem to encourage taking food gently rather then snatching. Clicker gaining is a very useful training tool with young dogs as they understand the concept quickly. Do something right, a click happens and food is given. Go,onto YouTube and search for Kikopups. She is a fantastic trainer using clicker and her videos are so good at explaining clicker training. Keep training sessions short and sweet, and hopefully you will have a tired puppy afterwards.
To help a puppy learn what you mean by settle down, well how I did it with my pup. Sit quietly when you feel your puppy is getting to the point where he will be feeling sleepy and hopefully is going to lie down. As he does so, say in a quiet calm voice "settle down, settle down now" a few times. You will need to do this as often as you can when he goes to settle down naturally and within a few days he will catch on when you say those words he will start to lie down. It takes time and you need to get your timing right, but it is effective and my girl will now go and settle when I tell her to.


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## ButterflyLordette (Nov 3, 2013)

DONT PANIC and dont give up! We brought my dog home from dogs trust and everything went downhill from there, he turned out being fear aggressive to dogs and strangers and started rather painfully biting me no matter what I attempted training wise. We tried for a good few months in countless different and expensive ways before calling the centre back up saying we cant put up with him around three children, the day before he was destined to go, however, my dad's fiancé died of cancer which meant us not leaving the house for a long time, and thus Tux stayed. Im not sure how long it took but day by day it got better as he settled in more and got used to how things are and now we've had him for two years and he is a great indoor pet (still is aggressive to dogs and strangers unfortunately). My advice is never give up with your pet, especially when you have a puppy who can be taught, with perseverance, easier than a rescued year old labrador XD


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## Spookymuffin (Jan 4, 2013)

Thank you so much everyone. I'm glad to hear that this is normal enough and, most importantly, will pass.

I have tried to do a little training with him, but it's difficult when he's so hyper! He knows how to sit, he responds to his name and I'm currently trying to teach him "off" (which he only responds to when I have a food reward).

When it comes to play time I'm confused about how to handle biting. Some sources say to discourage biting hands altogether, while others say to encourage it so you can teach them not to bite hard progressively over time.

He doesn't have a crate, but he does have a room that his bed and toys are in. It's a small downstairs bathroom.

As for pictures, I only have ones from when he was sleepy. He doesn't stay still long enough to take a picture when he's excited!


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## BoredomBusters (Dec 8, 2011)

I choose not to let pups put teeth on human skin at all. 

Others as you say do see the value in allowing pups to learn exactly how hard they have to bite a person to make it hurt. Or maybe they phrase it as 'learning inhibited biting' - but I would rather dogs had inhibitions about biting people completely, especially as English law is so strict on the issue.


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## Sarah1983 (Nov 2, 2011)

BoredomBusters said:


> I choose not to let pups put teeth on human skin at all.
> 
> Others as you say do see the value in allowing pups to learn exactly how hard they have to bite a person to make it hurt. Or maybe they phrase it as 'learning inhibited biting' - but I would rather dogs had inhibitions about biting people completely, especially as English law is so strict on the issue.


But that's what the teaching them to bite progressively softer and softer works towards, the end goal is to have no biting at all. It just teaches them to control the force of their bite along the way. I prefer this method personally but I do think it's personal choice and neither is right or wrong.


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## Sleeping_Lion (Mar 19, 2009)

Is he definitely a flatcoat/setter cross? He's very small, more *spanielish* looking, which might explain some of the manic behaviour, working cockers can be very active! 

Anyway, lots of sound advice, personally, for me, the only things I concentrate on with pups and training is a few manners and recall. Even now, if my dogs want something, they know the best way to get it is to sit nicely. They all jump up and play with me but they know that when I ask for a sit, they do this straight away. 

I'm also not as bothered as some might be about them mouthing, they are very good at judging quite how much they can *hold* my hands, without causing me to squeak. Tau has always held my hand, it's something her sire apparently did, and now her daughter also does the same - all Labradors. 

My flatcoat girl is very calm, she has small giddy fits every now and then, usually when I arrive home, or there's a visitor. But as I dabble with gundog stuff, I need them to be calm and listen to me when I ask. Rhuna has always been pretty calm, since I brought her home at 14 weeks of age, although flatcoats are known to be complete clowns and spend much of their life upside down! 

Fingers crossed the 'orrible teethy stage is soon over and with patience he will calm down for you.


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## springfieldbean (Sep 13, 2010)

He is beautiful! And as Sleeping_Lion says, he does look very working cocker-ish - just like my boy when he was a pup  Everyone always asks if Sherlock is a small red setter though, so they can look very similar! He also sounds very similar temperament-wise; Sherlock never stopped jumping up and down and hanging onto clothes, and he never slept much during the day like other puppies seem to.

I did have many moments of doubt and stress, but he is just totally lovely now and I wish I hadn't worried so much.

For the biting, squealing or even saying "no" really didn't work with Sherlock. The only thing that seemed to worked over time was ignoring as soon as he bit too hard - just turning round silently and not interacting at all for a few minutes. It does take a long time, but it will stop. 

Good luck - try not to worry because he will grow up one day! I don't think there's a lot that you can do very wrong at this stage to be honest, as long as you love and socialise him


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## Spookymuffin (Jan 4, 2013)

My husband saw his parents when he went to go pick up the pup; the dad was a red setter and the mam was a lovely black, fluffy flatcoat retriever. The pictures don't really do him justice when it comes to his size, he looks almost exactly like a red setter pup just in a non traditional colour. 

He's going for his second vaccination on Xmas eve and will be starting a socialisation/basic training course in early January. I just hope that we can manage until then!


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## Hanwombat (Sep 5, 2013)

I cried nearly every night with Io for the first month or so. 
And for the first few months I couldn't even cuddle her as she constantly wanted to bite my face off - I thought it would never get better but its amazing how it does and especially how you don't even notice

She was forever trying to eat our wires and then one day I said to my partner 'haven't you noticed that Io hasn't gone for the wires all week' 

Its amazing how you don't notice it and then when you realise how amazing it is 

Io is only 22 weeks and has gone a bit bitey again but only because she is teething. I can't believe I ever used to cry every night and believe me you'll think the same sooner or later


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## MontyMaude (Feb 23, 2012)

I think everyone feels like this at some point, I am currently feeling bad for wishing away my boy's puppyhood as I can't wait for him to grow up and become the dog I know he can be, puppies are blinking hard work but are a bit like babies I think in that you soon forget what horrors they really were, I know I made the mistake of thinking Hector was much more naughty and hard work than my last dog, but actually he isn't I just forgot how bad she was and on remembering she really was a naughty puppy, I think puppies are totally cute and adorable when they belong to someone else


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## delca1 (Oct 29, 2011)

What a gorgeous pup, I love his colour and markings  Did I miss his name?
Not convinced there are enough piccies though......


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## Spookymuffin (Jan 4, 2013)

I feel like we've already had a small breakthrough with the biting. He seems to be paying more attention when I let him know he's hurting me. It's a baby step, but at least it's in the right direction!



delca1 said:


> What a gorgeous pup, I love his colour and markings  Did I miss his name?
> Not convinced there are enough piccies though......


His name is Alistair, after a character from the Dragon Age video games. 

More pictures? Sure 


















And from the night when we first got him. It's crazy seeing how much he's grown already!


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## delca1 (Oct 29, 2011)

:001_wub:
I love puppy tummys, so pink and more-ish :biggrin: They grow too fast, Indie seemed to be a puppy for such a short time really, make the most of it!
Glad you feel he's learning about the biting, it really is just a puppy thing


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## BenBoy (Aug 31, 2013)

Oh my word...that is one of the cutest puppies I have ever seen


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## Buzzard (Aug 10, 2012)

So so incredibly cute. Mac was a nightmare with the biting. He also would grab our clothes and try to tug on them. Sounds like you are doing all the right things, so hang in there. He has stopped now, although still 'gently' mouthes new people which I don't like as visitors do not like this. I think we know he will only ever do it gentlybut putting myself in a visitors position I can see how it could be un nerving. Good luck.


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## bay20 (Aug 14, 2013)

firstly HOW CUTE! you will look back and miss those days when he was that small. and great name just to echo what everyone has said above really, totally normal to mouth like that, we had it as well, the yelping thing didnt really work for us but getting up and walking away seemed to. he realised it ended the game if he tried to bite things/us. There will be lots of new challenges along they way and you will feel like once youve overcome one another springs up but its TOTALLY worth it. i echo boredrom busters advice on the sleeping. make sure hes getting enough of it. re the affection thing at the moment hes far too interested in all the new things around him he finds every day, at 1 year old and 27kg mines only just decided he wants to be a lap dog and not tear around the room picking up remote controls, cushions, wires etc! use this forum to vent any worries or frustrations. its a sanity saviouir when you realise you arent the only one


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## Lopside (Mar 20, 2012)

He's a really sweet puppy, but where does the white blaze come from if the parents are flat coat & red setter?? I don't get that! haha
I think the age before a pup has his final jab & can go out is the most difficult as they are full of beans and raring to go! Have you tried a kong stuffed with yummy things like egg & tuna paste & kibble? Its so important to teach a pup that there are times in life when they need to have a calm time out


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## polishrose (Oct 26, 2011)

He's gorgeous!!


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## Spookymuffin (Jan 4, 2013)

Lopside said:


> He's a really sweet puppy, but where does the white blaze come from if the parents are flat coat & red setter?? I don't get that! haha


Both of his parents had small bits of white in their coats, although nowhere near as much as this little guy! His parents are pets that aren't used for showing, I'm a little clueless about this kind of stuff but I'm sure that they deviate from the breed standard a little


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