# Poorly after worming??



## MaggiesMom (Oct 13, 2016)

So over night Maggie has unfortunately had VERY bad diarrhea :Yuck
The last time this happened she had had her worming tablet and I had also done her flea treatment within 48 hours which I now know you are not supposed to do with some products (but at the time I thought it was something she had eaten).
That was back in September and I gave her a worming tablet last week (I think) and now we have the same type of awful runny poo.
Is this a coincidence or could it be the worming product?
I used Beaphar worm clear - http://www.wilko.com/dog-healthcare...-wormclear-dog-up-to-20kg-2-tabs/invt/0446054

She's currently feeling very sorry for herself


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Poor Maggie  
Quite possibly then. Some wormers are not full effect until 4-9 days, so perhaps now the wormer is fully in her system, she's rejecting it? This is just a guess btw.


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## MaggiesMom (Oct 13, 2016)

The 4-9 days part makes sense then arghhh 
Should I bin these and try something else? Could my vet advise a product over the phone?


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

I would try something else if it were me. Yeah I'm sure you vet could advise


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

I discovered that Isla became off colour with certain workers like Drontal, she was either sick or had the runs or both. Found one she is fine with now


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## Jobeth (May 23, 2010)

My oldest dog is violently ill on one wormer. The vet's no longer stock the one that he can have and so order it in for me. He also reacts badly to a certain antibiotic, so be aware of that just in case.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

MaggiesMom said:


> So over night Maggie has unfortunately had VERY bad diarrhea :Yuck
> The last time this happened she had had her worming tablet and I had also done her flea treatment within 48 hours which I now know you are not supposed to do with some products (but at the time I thought it was something she had eaten).
> That was back in September and I gave her a worming tablet last week (I think) and now we have the same type of awful runny poo.
> Is this a coincidence or could it be the worming product?
> ...


Could be the wormer, or probably more precisely the one you are using she is sensitive or intolerant too. Ive had a couple over the years when given drontal they will vomit and become nauseous after taking it and I think one did have loose motions/ diarrhoea too. Those were OK on Panacur wormer and that didn't cause any issues. Panacur at least the liquid can even be given to bitches from day 40 of pregnancy unlike other wormers so I would assume that would indicate its probably one of the safer/gentler ones as many you cant give during pregnancy.

In all honesty you are usually safer and better off using a veterinary wormer or flea treatment then a pet shop/over the counter one.


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## MaggiesMom (Oct 13, 2016)

Ahh thanks all I'm relieved to a degree, I had no idea wormers could make a dog ill. I've binned that stuff and when she's next due I'll speak to my vets. I think her booster will be due at a similar time so will have a chat then.
Just got home from work, more runny poo but I had laid out an old blanket to cover the floor so saved myself some work there. 

Maggies lying next to me & not even interested in my lunch. I haven't fed her anything since last night so it'll be 24 hours by tea time, thinking of giving her some boiled white rice & scrambled egg, should be safe?


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

MaggiesMom said:


> Ahh thanks all I'm relieved to a degree, I had no idea wormers could make a dog ill. I've binned that stuff and when she's next due I'll speak to my vets. I think her booster will be due at a similar time so will have a chat then.
> Just got home from work, more runny poo but I had laid out an old blanket to cover the floor so saved myself some work there.
> 
> Maggies lying next to me & not even interested in my lunch. I haven't fed her anything since last night so it'll be 24 hours by tea time, thinking of giving her some boiled white rice & scrambled egg, should be safe?


If she doesn't seem bothered at the moment I would leave her until this evening and as you say try something light and easily digestible, you can use boiled or grilled or dry oven baked chicken but don't give the skin as its full of fat, or white boiled fish no skin and check for small bones obviously first is another good one, or as you say plain scrambled egg is also Ok, any of these is OK with a bit of plain boiled rice.

Whats also handy to keep in and give with the resting diet is protexin prokolin you give it when you see the loose motions and until they are back to normal
it contains pectin and koaln and a pro biotic to soothe the gut, firm up the poop and put back good gut bacteria. Don't know if pets at home stores do it, I think I may have seen someone in the cue with it once, you can get it on line from reputable veterinary pharmacies otherwise and of course the vets usually have it.

Obviously though if symptoms do persist, they get a lot worse or especially if other symptoms appear aswell always wise to consult your vet in that case, because although a lot of non specific tum upsets do resolve and pretty quickly with the resting diet and prokolin if you have it, occasionally you do get issues that need a bit more veterinary help.


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## Shikoku (Dec 16, 2013)

You could test her to see if she actually needs worming? I use www.wormcount.com. If the results come back and she does need worming treatment go to your vet and use the most appropriate treatment since no product covers every worm.

I really think people should test more rather than treating for something that your dog might not even have :Bag


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## MaggiesMom (Oct 13, 2016)

That's great thank you so much! 
I had no idea you can test before worming, I shall look into that. I'm going to get some protexin prokolin too , always handy to keep something in for such instances.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Well, I went down the worming route after discussing using wormcount. The reason being is Muttly is a crap eating, grass munching, puddle drinking monkey and I thought at one point he had worms. 

I had checked his poos because he was going at his bum a fair bit and seemed hungrier and I was convinced I saw something, but not 100% sure. But I went ahead and Wormed him using the Panacur I already had.
I carried on checking his poo for weeks after.

What I saw was also in only 1 of 5 poos I checked, which is what bothered me a bit about wormcount. They can't give a 100% 'no worms at this time' diagnosis, as they would need to check several poos over a few days, which they don't do. So imo, I didn't think it was too accurate.

He still needs a flea treatment in the warmer months which is why in the end and after looking through lots of wormers, I opted to use Advocate spot on wormer. It gives him his flea treatment and worms in one go. 

He had Panacur in Oct, Advocate in Nov and Dec. I'm giving it break now until Spring.

Oh and not side effect off either. He was quite ill on Bob Martin wormer a few years ago. I only use prescription wormer on him now.


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## MaggiesMom (Oct 13, 2016)

Yes I've heard lots of bad things about bob Martin in the guinea pig world (my other fur babies) and to be fair I only use stuff straight from the vets for them. 
As she has had diarrhea does this mean the wormer has not been effective?


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

Muttly said:


> Well, I went down the worming route after discussing using wormcount. The reason being is Muttly is a crap eating, grass munching, puddle drinking monkey and I thought at one point he had worms.
> 
> I had checked his poos because he was going at his bum a fair bit and seemed hungrier and I was convinced I saw something, but not 100% sure. But I went ahead and Wormed him using the Panacur I already had.
> I carried on checking his poo for weeks after.
> ...


When I got Kobi as a pup I was given a worming certificate to say when and what he had and when next due. Then he was itching a bit and although we couldn't see fleas or dirts they gave me advocate in case of anything because its broad spectrum and does mites as well. When his next worming was due, I asked about wormer and was told because he had had the advocate recently it wouldn't be needed as it does worms too, so would be OK for a while.

Shortly after he swallowed a sock so had to have the injection to vomit it back up, and up with the sock apparently came worms. I wormed him the next day with tablets the vet gave me, and dead and dying worms were coming out when he pooped. So moral of the story you don't always see worms in the poop if they have them. He must have had a hell of a load to have vomited them up with the injection and then for dead and dying ones to come out once I wormed him.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Sled dog hotel said:


> When I got Kobi as a pup I was given a worming certificate to say when and what he had and when next due. Then he was itching a bit and although we couldn't see fleas or dirts they gave me advocate in case of anything because its broad spectrum and does mites as well. When his next worming was due, I asked about wormer and was told because he had had the advocate recently it wouldn't be needed as it does worms too, so would be OK for a while.
> 
> Shortly after he swallowed a sock so had to have the injection to vomit it back up, and up with the sock apparently came worms. I wormed him the next day with tablets the vet gave me, and dead and dying worms were coming out when he pooped. So moral of the story you don't always see worms in the poop if they have them. He must have had a hell of a load to have vomited them up with the injection and then for dead and dying ones to come out once I wormed him.


Oh god how horrible!

The thing is no wormer does ALL types does it? So I tried to go for the one that does the most, plus the flea. But I am very aware that Advocate doesn;t do tapeworm, which worries me....and why I was looking at wormcount. But worms have a month cycle don't they, so you could test for worms one day, nothing, then a week later, they've got them. So unless you are worming every month with 2 wormers , you can't know if they are totally free
What do you do, it's a minefield


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

Muttly said:


> Oh god how horrible!
> 
> The thing is no wormer does ALL types does it? So I tried to go for the one that does the most, plus the flea. But I am very aware that Advocate doesn;t do tapeworm, which worries me....and why I was looking at wormcount. But worms have a month cycle don't they, so you could test for worms one day, nothing, then a week later, they've got them. So unless you are worming every month with 2 wormers , you can't know if they are totally free
> What do you do, it's a minefield


He had roundworm the one that you tend to find is the most common especially in pups. Roundworm is passed out as eggs in the faeces of infected dogs, and they are very resilient and can survive in the ground and environment for long periods. A dog can then ingest them when they are investigating the ground and get infected that way. Pups often get them from Mum if she has them via the placenta and as larvae passed in the milk. If mum hasn't been wormed correctly she can pass them on, but sometimes even if she is wormed and eggs are missed, or sometimes even the pregnancy may activate any dorminant ones she is carrying.

Tape worms are different. Unlike roundworm dogs cant pick them up directly they usually need an intermediate host, so would have to either eat meat infected with the tapeworm, or if they say eat a dead rabbit or other small animal they may find as carrion that's infected.

There are several life stages/ stages of development in the worms life cycle and I believe some wormers will not only cover different types or worm but also cover more life stages then others too. The total life cycle is about 3/4 weeks from memory. So as you say it is possible to worm a dog and after being wormed they can then re-infect themselves.


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## Muttly (Oct 1, 2014)

Sled dog hotel said:


> He had roundworm the one that you tend to find is the most common especially in pups. Roundworm is passed out as eggs in the faeces of infected dogs, and they are very resilient and can survive in the ground and environment for long periods. A dog can then ingest them when they are investigating the ground and get infected that way. Pups often get them from Mum if she has them via the placenta and as larvae passed in the milk. If mum hasn't been wormed correctly she can pass them on, but sometimes even if she is wormed and eggs are missed, or sometimes even the pregnancy may activate any dorminant ones she is carrying.
> 
> Tape worms are different. Unlike roundworm dogs cant pick them up directly they usually need an intermediate host, so would have to either eat meat infected with the tapeworm, or if they say eat a dead rabbit or other small animal they may find as carrion that's infected.
> 
> There are several life stages/ stages of development in the worms life cycle and I believe some wormers will not only cover different types or worm but also cover more life stages then others too. The total life cycle is about 3/4 weeks from memory. So as you say it is possible to worm a dog and after being wormed they can then re-infect themselves.


Totally. This was also a plus point for the Advocate as it covered the life stages of the worms, whereas some I was looking at didn't. I am happy with Advocate, but sometimes wonder if I should give him a Tapeworm pill now and again..But then if he has them, the way you issue the treatment is different isn;t it from just a dose that you do monthly/quarterly.

Muttly is no longer raw fed and he never picks up any dead animals we find. But he does eat wild animal poo, so if they have eaten something infected I the poo will be won't it?

It makes my head spin a bit....:Wacky


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

Muttly said:


> Totally. This was also a plus point for the Advocate as it covered the life stages of the worms, whereas some I was looking at didn't. I am happy with Advocate, but sometimes wonder if I should give him a Tapeworm pill now and again..But then if he has them, the way you issue the treatment is different isn;t it from just a dose that you do monthly/quarterly.
> 
> Muttly is no longer raw fed and he never picks up any dead animals we find. But he does eat wild animal poo, so if they have eaten something infected I the poo will be won't it?
> 
> It makes my head spin a bit....:Wacky


After the episode with Kobi as a pup where he had advocate instead of being wormed with tablets and should have still been covered and then coughed up live worms when he was given the injection to vomit up the sock and then loads of dead and dying ones come out for 3 or 4 poops after I had given it, to be honest I'm sceptical just how good it is for worming to. They were definitely round worms the most common one, and it obviously does appear to have done the job with him. Prior to that and since I have always used a good veterinary wormer tablet, and when these were pups they did have panacur paste. These are wormed routinely now just using tablets that do round and tapeworm.


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## Piguinn (Nov 21, 2016)

Oh no... poor Maggie. Our vet did warn us that diarrhea may happen after worming/flea pills, and told us not to starve her if it happens and feed her bland chicken and rice. Fortunately, she only had soft poop several times before going back to normal.


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