# Puppy problems jumping up at people when walking



## Scottguilbert (Sep 30, 2014)

Hi I have a 5 month old springer spaniel. We thought it was time to start training him to walk without a lead. 

We started a week ago and took him to some small parks with no one around. All went fine he'd come back when called and he'd get a reward. However today we took him to a country park and it was all going fine then he saw another dog and they ran off and were playing. For some reason the dog owners wanted him to go away so I went over to get him, as I did some joggers went past and he started chasing them. He ran up behind them and they kicked him in the head. I apologised and grabbed Him and explained he was learning etc and they had a massive go at me saying I should be controlling him and if he comes over again they'll kick the sh*t out of him.

Obviously they're horrible miserable people but this incident has destroyed my confidence and I don't know how to proceed with training him. There's bound to be incidents where he runs over to people and most people are nice but it only takes 1 person to cause a big problem so my question is how would people recommend we carry on training him? Any tips for getting him to come back quicker etc?

Thanks,

Scott.


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## Amelia66 (Feb 15, 2011)

Scottguilbert said:


> Hi I have a 5 month old springer spaniel. We thought it was time to start training him to walk without a lead.
> 
> We started a week ago and took him to some small parks with no one around. All went fine he'd come back when called and he'd get a reward. However today we took him to a country park and it was all going fine then he saw another dog and they ran off and were playing. For some reason the dog owners wanted him to go away so I went over to get him, as I did some joggers went past and he started chasing them. He ran up behind them and they kicked him in the head. I apologised and grabbed Him and explained he was learning etc and *they had a massive go at me saying I should be controlling him *and if he comes over again they'll kick the sh*t out of him.
> 
> ...


If i did not like dogs and one was chasing me i would also be very annoyed. They have a right to run in the park without being bothered by others dogs.

You should not be letting him run over to people and cause a nuisance of himself. Put him on a long line until he has learned reliable recall where you can recall him back from such things and do not let him off lead until you have. If you let him run over to people it will teach him this is ok behavior. Plus he could run over to a non friendly dog, or as i mentioned someone who does not like dogs and things could end badly.

Is there any reason your waited so long to lead train him?


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## Scottguilbert (Sep 30, 2014)

He is lead trained but we thought it was time he learnt to walk without a lead. As I said it was going well he was coming back when called. This was a first time incident and I do understand what you mean about him annoying people who don't want to be annoyed but this situation must have happened to every dog owner at the start. I've had plenty of dogs come up to me and bugged me and I never reacted or hit them.

But my question is how to train them to be more obedient with recalls and not jumping up on people, not the issue of him bugging people that don't want to be bugged because I know that's an issue hence why I'm trying to prevent it for the future.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

Scottguilbert said:


> Hi I have a 5 month old springer spaniel. We thought it was time to start training him to walk without a lead.
> 
> We started a week ago and took him to some small parks with no one around. All went fine he'd come back when called and he'd get a reward. However today we took him to a country park and it was all going fine then he saw another dog and they ran off and were playing. For some reason the dog owners wanted him to go away so I went over to get him, as I did some joggers went past and he started chasing them. He ran up behind them and they kicked him in the head. I apologised and grabbed Him and explained he was learning etc and they had a massive go at me saying I should be controlling him and if he comes over again they'll kick the sh*t out of him.
> 
> ...


At just turned 5 months he is beginning adolescence where even ones that have recalled off lead before start to mess about and don't come back. Its the beginnings of the stage from eager to please, dependant pup, to more independent adolescent who will start to find other things a lot more interesting then you are, so even pre trained pups when they get to this stage the owners often find they have to go back to basics.

The problem is that the more he does it, and learns that he can ignore your calls, run off, and you cant catch him or do a lot about it the worse it will get.
Running after him to put the lead on will just probably teach him that he can run quicker then you can. Repeatedly just calling will make him just learn to ignore it. The best way is to prevent all this while training with a long line. That way he cant run off or ignore calls and you can guide him back.

The best thing is to have him on the long line, and repeatedly at intervals call him back, reward him, and then tell him to go play again. That way they learn that coming back doesn't mean end of the walk. Many people let the dog off, and don't call them back until they want to put the lead on and home. 
Also vary the rewards, different high value food treats he cant resist and keep them for recall, cheese, chicken, hot dogs, sausages or liver based stuff is usually good and favourites. Also vary the reward in other ways, sometimes, throw a ball a few times encouraging him to return it and drop for the next throw. Another time have a tug game, other things you can do is call him and run in the other direction calling him, so it becomes a chase me game. Other things you can do is hide behind something and call and reward when he finds you another way to make yourself interesting.

When you can get consistent results on the long line with holding it, you can drop it, and use it as a drag line to test him out. That way if he starts to ignore you or doesn't instantly come back you can jump on the end before he goes too far, and reel him in if necessary. Never shout at him or tell him off for not returning it will make them less likely to want to return. Use all the different rewards still to keep yourself interesting.

Finally when he is consistent on the drag line, you can start to let him off, starting in more confined areas with lesser distractions, when he has consistently passed that test, then build up to more open areas with more distractions as you go. If he fails badly at any stage then revert back to the previous stage until he is consistent again.

If he has learned to be a bit complacent at just you calling him, maybe try teaching him to come to a whistle.
You start this at home with high value treats you are going to keep for recall,
for every blow of the whistle immediately treat, walk around, he should follow you. Once he has got the concept, then try it in the garden standing by the back door when he is sniffing about, when he comes treat, you can then test it further by being inside the house when his outside and treat when he comes.
Once he can do that then use it outside, at first on the long line.

Other good exercises to teach him are wait, so that you should be able to stop him mid flight eventually, and also stays a good one, so he will learn eventually to stay put until you go and get him.

It may even be a good idea to think about classes, that way you will have a trainer on hand to teach you and help with problems. Its also a good way of training with distractions but in a more controlled environment. As you said your confidence has taken a knock now with this incident, then it may be better to help your confidence too.

The link below is one organisation where you may be able to find trainers in your area, although there are others.

Welcome to APDT - Association of Pet Dog Trainers UK


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

What is meant by a 'long' lead, is a lead that is about 10 to 15 metres long, not like an ordinary lead.
When you are in the park and want to let your dog off his normal lead, clip him onto the long lead so he has some freedom, but under your control. Keep practicing the recall, call him to you making it an exciting prospect to come to you and reward him verbally, physically and with a really tasty treat. So lots of praise, patting and stroking, maybe even a game with a special toy kept only for recall and a small piece of cooked sausage. Send him away again and recall again and again, make the whole thing one big exciting game. If he loses concentration and goes off after somebody, reel him in on the long lead and congratulate him for coming, maybe not quite so effusively as before because he didn't come when you called.
Have you not been practicing recall before? Is this the first time you have ever let your dog off the lead when out in the park?
It is a better idea to let your dog off a lead when they are still very young when you are first taking them out for little walks. At that age they want to be with you as they are scared to go too far. Then you can practice recalls, very easy to do if there are two of you walking the dog as you can recall to each other gradually widening the gap between you. By the time the puppy is as old as your is now,mthe should have a fairly good recall and want to come to you.
All is not lost, get that long lead as soon as possible and use it when you are in the park until his recall is 100%. He should not be allowed to chase runners, small children or frightened dogs.


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## Siskin (Nov 13, 2012)

Got in there before me SDH.


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## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

There are many reasons why people don't want an unknown dogs running over to them; their dog may not be comfortable with unknown dogs, their dog may be elderly, ill, recovering from surgery, etc.

Alo of people will have the embarassment of their dog b*ggering off to annoy others, (I have!) but it is still your job to keep him under control & apologise to those he does annoy (although someone threatening to kick the sh*t out of him in not acceptable).

Teaching him to recall is a great idea but unwise to simply let him offlead & expect him to come to you when there are all sorts of exciting things going on is setting him up for failure. You need to build on this until he will learn to ignore others & focus on you.

I would start training to get him to fouc on you at home initially then gradually increase the distarctions. Is he food motivated? Use some extra spewcial treats to use as rewards Or if he loves playing take his fave toy out & play with him.

I would also get a harness & long line so you can start to practice with disatnces without losing control

Some great advice already & smokeybear lists some courses & links in her post in this thread ....http://www.petforums.co.uk/dog-training-and-behaviour/382693-recall-tips.html?highlight=recall#post1063929798


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## Scottguilbert (Sep 30, 2014)

Thanks for the replies guys, some really useful stuff to work on there.

He's been on a 10m long lead for about a month now and we'd been training to recall the entire time using rewards and 95% of the time he came back. Last week we took him to an enclosed playground with no one around and tried him off his lead and he came back every time so we went there a few times this week and again all was good so we thought today we'd step it up and try the country park. Obviously I rushed it a bit and expected too much. Too many distractions etc but even today he came back every time apart from the incident I explained above so I thought everything was going well.

That information about his stage of life and having to drill in the basics more is interesting and I'll definitely take that on.

Like I said I guess I just expected too much too soon and I'll go back to work. I'd read a lot about how springers do much better off their leads then on so that's what prompted me to pursue it so soon.

Thanks for the above tips I will be working hard to make sure we get it right!


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## Scottguilbert (Sep 30, 2014)

Hi cleo38 the people who got annoyed with him were 2 mid 20s joggers and he ran upto them and was next to them for about 3 seconds before he ran back to me. Like I said above I do respect that people who don't like dogs shouldn't have to worry about being hassled but the reaction and threat in my opinion was far too much. Someone who's instinct is to kick a 5 month old puppy in the head can't be that nice a person.

I dif apologise straight away and explained that we were training him etc but after his words of abuse I lost interest in trying to say sorry. Everyone has been bothered by a dog or a child on a walk at some point, it may be annoying, even worrying or frightening but to react in that way isn't going to get them far in life.


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

I am afraid that you have been TESTING your dog and not TRAINING it and NO dog of any breed that belongs to the most gifted trainer in the world is going to be reliable off lead at this age.

You may think that the reaction of these particular people was OTT because a) it is your dog and b) you have no idea of the history these people have with out of control dogs and owners. When I walk my dogs many dog owners I see have little or no control over their dogs and their animals are constantly harassing others who are minding heir own business.

Have you attended Training Classes?

Here is a list of Kennel Club Accredited Instructors around the UK, some of them, eg John Rogerson, specialise in recall workshops, there are also specialist books, DVDs and websites.

List of Accredited Instructors â¢ The Kennel Club

Get a harness and long line and gloves!

Good Luck


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## LaceWing (Mar 18, 2014)

Put him on a twenty foot line. When you think he is good enough to not use the twenty foot, use a thirty foot. You can make a line out of curtain cord/marine cord and a clip.


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## Scottguilbert (Sep 30, 2014)

Thanks that's a good idea. I agree it was my mistake letting him off that quickly but He'd been good at coming back up to that point so I still think I had just reason to believe he would be ok. But there you go, lesson learnt.


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## HLT93 (Aug 14, 2013)

You need to have the dog on a training line or long lead. You can not have a dog running up to people.. Even if it is just a small puppy! Some people have severe phobias of dogs and you could get in a lot of trouble if they want to make a formal complaint and class your dog as out of control. 

It's a puppy, it's going to be excitable and want to meet other dogs and people but you need to do it properly and in a controlled way. You can't blame people for getting annoyed and angry with your dog running up to them and their dogs.. There dogs may well not be friendly and your dog will end up in a bad way if there not great with other dogs! 

Please train in a safe way, if your stuck and not sure what to do then get in contact with a local trainer and they can help you.


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## HLT93 (Aug 14, 2013)

Scottguilbert said:


> Hi cleo38 the people who got annoyed with him were 2 mid 20s joggers and he ran upto them and was next to them for about 3 seconds before he ran back to me. Like I said above I do respect that people who don't like dogs shouldn't have to worry about being hassled but the reaction and threat in my opinion was far too much. Someone who's instinct is to kick a 5 month old puppy in the head can't be that nice a person.
> 
> I dif apologise straight away and explained that we were training him etc but after his words of abuse I lost interest in trying to say sorry. Everyone has been bothered by a dog or a child on a walk at some point, it may be annoying, even worrying or frightening but to react in that way isn't going to get them far in life.


If your that scared of a dog though then instincts may well be to lash out unfortunately! Whether it's a puppy/small/large dog if it's running up to you and your not keen on dogs then unfortunately not everyone will be nice. There are so many stories about dog attacks people can't be too safe and will unfortunately become abusive/defensive if a random dog runs up. It's not excuse to kick a dog but if your dog is out of control then there's not really a lot you can do.


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## kenny10 (Jun 12, 2012)

Think people are making a big issue of your dog running up to people, although it certainly is not acceptable , correct me if I'm wrong but has this only happened once? I have a springer who is 21/2 years, he will push the boundaries even now if he can.90% of the time he is fantastic but no matter what training we do if he sees a bird or squirrel he will run.. They are very clever dogs and no matter what he's chasing he will be straight back to check I am still there. Just to build your confidence I would be making sure I go where distractions are kept to a minimum for now. I have dogs continually jumping up at me , they are dogs they shouldn't do it but if they smell treats on me or I have a ball I am a target to them. The amount of people who have said oh my god he's so lively how do you cope with him, they don't believe me when I say , i don't hear from him at home, once he has run off steam he is more than happy to lie at my feet.


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## Wiz201 (Jun 13, 2012)

All that stuff you've been attempting to do with your 5 month old, we've been doing from day 1 with our cockerpoo dog. Got him just at 7 weeks, recall done at first in the house running back and forth from one person to another, taught him that toys played with humans are more fun (so much so he thinks the ball is above any other dog or person) this transferred to outside in the garden (can he ignore the neighbour's cat or a squirrel?) then when we took him out on his first walks, he was let off lead first time and praised/treated with a ball or food every time he came back. He now just watches joggers then he goes back to whatever he was doing before. The so called disobedience you get at adolescence never really happened cause he was trained so early as a pup he knew what was expected of him. He is now 15 months old and his recall is better than my 10 year old Retriever.


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## Sarahliz100 (Jan 5, 2014)

I'd agree with others re using a long line until you have adequate control. Yes the people who kicked him potentially overreacted, but they do have a right to not be bothered by out of control dogs.

My dog has previously chased joggers and had moments when he's blown off his recall (probably around the 5-6 months of age mark too). We've done tons of training and he's really good now unless there is livestock or a ridiculously high concentration of dogs in one area - needless to say he's onlead in these environments until he's more reliable. But I can walk him in most places and know he will respond to me immediately. He will now ignore bikes and joggers - the only danger is he will obliviously wander across their path potentially tripping them up so I tend to recall him away anyway.

My advice would be to work tirelessly on his recall with him either on a longline or in places you know he is absolutely going to respond to you. Reward him heavily. Be really fun and exciting - play ball, hide treats etc so that being with you is really great. Work on his sit-stay if you haven't already and whenever you are going to pass a jogger/bike etc put him in a sit and shovel treats into him whilst the jogger goes past so he learns to focus on you rather than the jogger. With time you can phase out the treats. 

With time you will get to know which situations he will reliably respond to you in and he can start to be off lead or off the longline in those situations, then gradually he will be reliable in more and more situations and get to spend more and more time offlead. If in doubt have him on the longline so he doesn't mess up.

My dog responds well to mixing up what happens when I recall him. Sometimes I get him to run between my legs, sometimes he does a hand touch or a sit, sometimes I throw a ball, sometimes he gets a handful of treats thrown into the grass to sniff out. I think this motivates him more than simply giving him a single treat every time he comes back. I make sure the vast majority of the time I'm recalling him to do something fun with him so that the occasions when I'm recalling him to put him on lead are the minority.


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## Scottguilbert (Sep 30, 2014)

They weren't scared they were just nasty people. We heard him laugh that he'd kicked him in the head as they jogged off.

I know people have a right to go to places without having to worry about dogs if they don't like them but if you have a phobia surely you wouldn't go to a country park where 9 out of 10 people are walking dogs, the majority of them off lead.

If I had a phobia of something I'd avoid it as best I could, not expect the world to bend to my needs.

I've put my original message on a couple of other forums and Facebook groups and the general response has been one of sympathy, whereas on here most people seem to think that one error in puppy training is absolutely unacceptable.

You people must be like military trainers with no acceptance for mistakes.


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## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

Scottguilbert said:


> They weren't scared they were just nasty people. We heard him laugh that he'd kicked him in the head as they jogged off.
> 
> I know people have a right to go to places without having to worry about dogs if they don't like them but if you have a phobia surely you wouldn't go to a country park where 9 out of 10 people are walking dogs, the majority of them off lead.
> 
> ...


Depends where you post, how you word it, who reads, etc - you will always get different responses & can decide 
what you will/will not take on board.

Most people on here are 'ordinary' dog owners & many us have made (& in my case still do make) mistakes.

Just because someone has a phobia does not mean they should hide away. My mum doesn't mind my dogs but is terrified of unknown dogs that run over to her when she's out, why should she not walk in the countryside or go to parks simply because other people can't control their dogs?

I agree that the comments you received were completely oput of order & I would have also been furious but just take it as a warning that some people are not as understanding.

Don't worry about comments but instead concentrate on your dog


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## Sarah1983 (Nov 2, 2011)

I like dogs, doesn't mean I want other people's dog's coming up and jumping all over me. No, I wouldn't kick one if it did but then I'm not scared of them. And nobody should have to avoid public places because of dogs, dogs should be under control and not interfering with others. No dogs aren't robots and I've no doubt we've all had blips from time to time but far too many people see nothing wrong with their dog being a nuisance. It's no wonder people react so negatively to them really.


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## Scottguilbert (Sep 30, 2014)

That's fine I agree with both of those comments, but like I said, these people weren't nice people. They seemed to enjoy the fact that they got the opportunity to kick him in the head, they seemed very pleased with themselves. It wasn't a panic reflex or anything.

I hope they don't feel the same way about children, they're always running around uncontrollably.


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## Wiz201 (Jun 13, 2012)

Scottguilbert said:


> I hope they don't feel the same way about children, they're always running around uncontrollably.


actually you do have a point there, if a toddler ran up to them and they kicked a child in the head, they would be reported. Yet they think they can do that to a puppy? I agree about the owner needing to control the dog, but I'd never kick a dog in the head unless it was actually causing me harm or biting/growling etc.


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## Sled dog hotel (Aug 11, 2010)

Scottguilbert said:


> They weren't scared they were just nasty people. We heard him laugh that he'd kicked him in the head as they jogged off.
> 
> I know people have a right to go to places without having to worry about dogs if they don't like them but if you have a phobia surely you wouldn't go to a country park where 9 out of 10 people are walking dogs, the majority of them off lead.
> 
> ...


Some Joggers in some situations can be to blame for problems. I was walking along a pavement in the street with two of mine, now sadly no longer with me.
I didn't hear the idiot coming having soft running shoes that made no noise, that was until he appeared immediately on top of me at one shoulder, which not only startled me, startled Daisy who was that side. I jumped out my skin she growled at him and air snapped, and it was my fault apparently and I got a lot of abuse,
even though he saw us way before we saw or heard him and he could have averted the problem by giving a warning or give us more space seeing as it was a pavement and I had a dog either side of me on lead.

Needless to say he got some abuse back.

The same thing happened to a friend in a park with her dog, even though the jogger had the whole park and lots of space to give them the wide berth he run up straight behind them and startled them both.

So it can actually work both ways, Yes dog owners should try to be responsible but at the same time so should some joggers too.


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## Wiz201 (Jun 13, 2012)

Cyclists too if they don't use bells, they can be pretty quiet!


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

I can sympathise with you to a degree. I have a four month old labrador border collie cross who is very friendly. When we go out for walks she loves playing fetch and comes back when she is called, although in the last week she has started running up to strangers for affection and jumping up. Some people just keep walking and she goes to follow but I tell her to leave she does but others, they stop, bend down and give her praise. I repeatedly look up to these people and say please don't let her jump up, just push her down and ignore her she's learning, and they'll say "oh I don't mind" and praise her anyway! Is really annoying when people don't respect what you've asked them to do with your dog , she is a very intelligent dog and she is quickly learning that jumping up on peoples legs out walking gets her attention but I hate that behaviour and also being a muddy wet time of year, it's really not ideal for her to be jumping up and getting people dirty.
It's really annoying me because she is such an energetic cross-breed she needs to be off the lead chasing balls because she is a nightmare, it just frustrates me that she does it and that people allow her even if I say no  x


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

Morgiez17 said:


> I can sympathise with you to a degree. I have a four month old labrador border collie cross who is very friendly. When we go out for walks she loves playing fetch and comes back when she is called, although in the last week she has started running up to strangers for affection and jumping up. Some people just keep walking and she goes to follow but I tell her to leave she does but others, they stop, bend down and give her praise. I repeatedly look up to these people and say please don't let her jump up, just push her down and ignore her she's learning, and they'll say "oh I don't mind" and praise her anyway! Is really annoying when people don't respect what you've asked them to do with your dog , she is a very intelligent dog and she is quickly learning that jumping up on peoples legs out walking gets her attention but I hate that behaviour and also being a muddy wet time of year, it's really not ideal for her to be jumping up and getting people dirty.
> It's really annoying me because she is such an energetic cross-breed she needs to be off the lead chasing balls because she is a nightmare, it just frustrates me that she does it and that people allow her even if I say no  x


I think it is hilarious that you do not want your dog running to other people and jumping up on them and yet instead of preventing this occurring you are focusing your displeasure on these people! 

If you kept your dog on a long line then a) your dog would not be able to rehearse inappropriate behaviour and b) would not get reinforced for it c) you would not get annoyed and d) training would be truncated.

Many of us have energetic dogs of various breeds and non breeds and can exercise them sufficiently on a long line.

Chasing balls and long lines are not mutually exclusive.

If you hated this behaviour as much as you say you did, surely you would do something about it?

One day she may meet a person like the OP did.


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

smokeybear said:


> I think it is hilarious that you do not want your dog running to other people and jumping up on them and yet instead of preventing this occurring you are focusing your displeasure on these people!
> 
> If you kept your dog on a long line then a) your dog would not be able to rehearse inappropriate behaviour and b) would not get reinforced for it c) you would not get annoyed and d) training would be truncated.
> 
> ...


Personally I don't think that it is funny/hilarious as you put it that this happens and I am trying to correct this behaviour the best I can. I appreciate you trying to be constructive with your criticism but without knowing much about my dog and how I deal with her, I think it's the judgemental of you to write a comment that's quite so scathing. My dog is A terrible puller despite hours of my own training & going to training classes. She is still pulls so she is walked in a sporn harness at the recommendation of my dog trainer. I regularly take her to training classes and try to teach her jumping up behaviour is not acceptable but she's also been struggling with is even at the class as she just has it so ingrained in her from the breeder that she came from as she would allow the puppies to do this. To walk on a long lead would require her to be walked on her collar and she has pulled so much she has damaged my shoulder, so I have no choice but to either have her off the lead or have on a very short lead & harness in which she would get no exercise so how would you work around that? Also, when I'm walking my dog, I'm also responsible for my two year old daughter as well so by letting off the lead and allowing her to chase a ball, it gives her the extra exercise I'm not able to offer at the slow pace of the two-year-old.
I appreciate that there are further things I need to do which is what I'm looking to gain advice for, but also I do have to deal with people who are unable to listen to the instructions you give them regarding your dog. I don't care whether some people don't mind cos she's cute and she's a puppy, at the end of the day I am the dogs owner and they should respect what I say. I know this is not just me that feels it as it's been a regular subject at my training class with my trainer who has been training dogs for over 30 years so it's not so narrowminded chitchat between dog owners. I merely came on here to agree with this person and to explain my problem for constructive advice. At the end of the day, none of us are born dog experts, it's a learning curve so we look at asking for advice and I sorry but I find your response is a little condescending.


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## Jobeth (May 23, 2010)

Morgiez17 said:


> Personally I don't think that it is funny/hilarious as you put it that this happens and I am trying to correct this behaviour the best I can. I appreciate you trying to be constructive with your criticism but without knowing much about my dog and how I deal with her, I think it's the judgemental of you to write a comment that's quite so scathing. My dog is A terrible puller despite hours of my own training & going to training classes. She is still pulls so she is walked in a sporn harness at the recommendation of my dog trainer. I regularly take her to training classes and try to teach her jumping up behaviour is not acceptable but she's also been struggling with is even at the class as she just has it so ingrained in her from the breeder that she came from as she would allow the puppies to do this. *To walk on a long lead would require her to be walked on her collar *and she has pulled so much she has damaged my shoulder, so I have no choice but to either have her off the lead or have on a very short lead & harness in which she would get no exercise so how would you work around that? Also, when I'm walking my dog, I'm also responsible for my two year old daughter as well so by letting off the lead and allowing her to chase a ball, it gives her the extra exercise I'm not able to offer at the slow pace of the two-year-old.
> I appreciate that there are further things I need to do which is what I'm looking to gain advice for, but also I do have to deal with people who are unable to listen to the instructions you give them regarding your dog. I don't care whether some people don't mind cos she's cute and she's a puppy, at the end of the day I am the dogs owner and they should respect what I say. I know this is not just me that feels it as it's been a regular subject at my training class with my trainer who has been training dogs for over 30 years so it's not so narrowminded chitchat between dog owners. I merely came on here to agree with this person and to explain my problem for constructive advice. At the end of the day, none of us are born dog experts, it's a learning curve so we look at asking for advice and I sorry but I find your response is a little condescending.


A long line should always be used with a harness. It sounds like using a long line would help ensure that your dog doesn't go up to people. That way you won't have to worry about them not doing what you've asked.


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Morgiez17 said:


> Personally I don't think that it is funny/hilarious as you put it that this happens and I am trying to correct this behaviour the best I can. I appreciate you trying to be constructive with your criticism but without knowing much about my dog and how I deal with her, I think it's the judgemental of you to write a comment that's quite so scathing. My dog is A terrible puller despite hours of my own training & going to training classes. She is still pulls so she is walked in a sporn harness at the recommendation of my dog trainer. I regularly take her to training classes and try to teach her jumping up behaviour is not acceptable but she's also been struggling with is even at the class as she just has it so ingrained in her from the breeder that she came from as she would allow the puppies to do this. To walk on a long lead would require her to be walked on her collar and she has pulled so much she has damaged my shoulder, so I have no choice but to either have her off the lead or have on a very short lead & harness in which she would get no exercise so how would you work around that? Also, when I'm walking my dog, I'm also responsible for my two year old daughter as well so by letting off the lead and allowing her to chase a ball, it gives her the extra exercise I'm not able to offer at the slow pace of the two-year-old.
> I appreciate that there are further things I need to do which is what I'm looking to gain advice for, *but also I do have to deal with people who are unable to listen to the instructions you give them regarding your dog.* I don't care whether some people don't mind cos she's cute and she's a puppy, at the end of the day *I am the dogs owner and they should respect what I say.* I know this is not just me that feels it as it's been a regular subject at my training class with my trainer who has been training dogs for over 30 years so it's not so narrowminded chitchat between dog owners. I merely came on here to agree with this person and to explain my problem for constructive advice. At the end of the day, none of us are born dog experts, it's a learning curve so we look at asking for advice and I sorry but I find your response is a little condescending.


I think the point is that you shouldn't be putting either other people or your dog in a position where she has at the mercy of a stranger. Unfortunately there are plenty of people like the thread starter ran into, who would have no hesitation in hurting a dog should they run up to them and jump up. Respect is a two way street - why would they respect your wishes "as the dogs owner" when you are not respecting their right to personal space in letting your dog run up in the first place?

Not being able to control a dog on the lead is not really an excuse for letting it run off the lead out of control. Also, there is far more you can do training wise with such an intelligent cross than chasing a ball, which leads to the dog becoming more energetic and unsettled if it's done to excess.


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## Cleo38 (Jan 22, 2010)

Morgiez17 said:


> Personally I don't think that it is funny/hilarious as you put it that this happens and I am trying to correct this behaviour the best I can. I appreciate you trying to be constructive with your criticism but without knowing much about my dog and how I deal with her, I think it's the judgemental of you to write a comment that's quite so scathing. My dog is A terrible puller despite hours of my own training & going to training classes. She is still pulls so she is walked in a sporn harness at the recommendation of my dog trainer. I regularly take her to training classes and try to teach her jumping up behaviour is not acceptable but she's also been struggling with is even at the class as she just has it so ingrained in her from the breeder that she came from as she would allow the puppies to do this. To walk on a long lead would require her to be walked on her collar and she has pulled so much she has damaged my shoulder, so I have no choice but to either have her off the lead or have on a very short lead & harness in which she would get no exercise so how would you work around that? Also, when I'm walking my dog, I'm also responsible for my two year old daughter as well so by letting off the lead and allowing her to chase a ball, it gives her the extra exercise I'm not able to offer at the slow pace of the two-year-old.
> I appreciate that there are further things I need to do which is what I'm looking to gain advice for, but also I do have to deal with people who are unable to listen to the instructions you give them regarding your dog. I don't care whether some people don't mind cos she's cute and she's a puppy, at the end of the day I am the dogs owner and they should respect what I say. I know this is not just me that feels it as it's been a regular subject at my training class with my trainer who has been training dogs for over 30 years so it's not so narrowminded chitchat between dog owners. I merely came on here to agree with this person and to explain my problem for constructive advice. At the end of the day, none of us are born dog experts, it's a learning curve so we look at asking for advice and I sorry but I find your response is a little condescending.


I don't understand this .... you allow your dog to run over to other people because you have a shoulder injury & have your child with you ... & yet they are at fault for not doing exactly as you say :confused1:

You are right none of us are experts but I am confused by your logic. You do have a choice .... not to give her an opportunity to do this by keeping her on a long line (aatched to a harness not a collar) or a shorter lead if you are not able to do this. You seem to imply that your dogs freedom & exercise requirement is more improtant that someone's right not to have a dog run over to them ... maybe you don't mean it like this but this is how it reads.

None of my dogs are perfect at all, but surely if you know a behaviour is likely to happen then you should try to prevent it.

My puppy is a b*gger for jumping up at visitors so he is put on a lead when people come trhough the door so he can't do this. It's a pain but he does need to learn he can't do this & by simply asking people to ignore him doesn't work, I need to stop the behaviour from occurring at all.


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## Sarah1983 (Nov 2, 2011)

My current dog was beaten with a stick when he was a small puppy because he ran up to the wrong person. Another dog was hit in the head simply for walking past someone. And that same dog had someone purposely go out of their way to stamp on his leg while he lay quietly as we waited for a bus. For their own safety as much as anything my dogs are kept from bothering strangers. It's just not worth the risk. Not that I'd let them do it anyway, it's common courtesy not to let your dog bother others.

Yes I've had the odd blip here and there but I accept responsibility when it does happen and apologize.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Scottguilbert said:


> He is lead trained but we thought it was time he learnt to walk without a lead. As I said it was going well he was coming back when called. This was a first time incident and I do understand what you mean about him annoying people who don't want to be annoyed but this situation must have happened to every dog owner at the start. I've had plenty of dogs come up to me and bugged me and I never reacted or hit them.
> 
> But my question is how to train them to be more obedient with recalls and not jumping up on people, not the issue of him bugging people that don't want to be bugged because I know that's an issue hence why I'm trying to prevent it for the future.





Scottguilbert said:


> They weren't scared they were just nasty people. We heard him laugh that he'd kicked him in the head as they jogged off.
> 
> I know people have a right to go to places without having to worry about dogs if they don't like them but if you have a phobia surely you wouldn't go to a country park where 9 out of 10 people are walking dogs, the majority of them off lead.
> 
> ...


You've received lots of great advice already. You really need to work on a long line and practice, practice, practice recall. On a long line your dog can't NOT return to you  You start off in low distraction areas, so perhaps a remote country field with no one else around at first, and slowly build up to more busy areas.

And yes, it has happened to the best of us. My own dog has been a sod all his life for buggering off after other dogs. I've been in many an embarrassing situation. I'm also with you, that I don't find the attitude of those joggers pleasant or acceptable. I doubt very much they was scared of dogs, but simply pissed off they was disturbed which is understandable. Still, no need to threaten such violence. If anything though these unpleasant encounters help you better understand what you need to be working on. You now know this is a potential trigger for your puppy and therefore can work up to training in an environment with joggers and cyclists etc.

If your pup pulls, invest in a really good harness with a front and back attachment to give you extra control. I'm using one on my puppy and it does help enormously!

A good training class will really help too.


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## Dimwit (Nov 10, 2011)

Scottguilbert said:


> That's fine I agree with both of those comments, but like I said, these people weren't nice people. They seemed to enjoy the fact that they got the opportunity to kick him in the head, they seemed very pleased with themselves. It wasn't a panic reflex or anything.


They may not have been nice people, but that still doesn't mean it is acceptable to let your dog run up to stranger. Not all people like dogs and it is your responsibility to protect your dog as well as other people.

I used to go to a group dog walk at a country park until we were asked not to continue - not because our group caused problems but because the managers had so many reports of walkers/cyclists/joggers/fishermen being bothered by loose dogs. Yes, it was unfair as we were not responsible for the problems but as an organised group were made into scapegoats.

My dog has fairly reliable recall but he is very anxious of dogs and people (and will occasionally lunge and bark at them). If I see a dog or person I will call him back and put him on the lead. In places where I am not confident of his recall or where we could suddenly meet someone then he is just on a longline (or flexi-lead). That way he doesn't get to practice unwanted behaviours and it reduces the chance of him having negative experiences...


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

Jobeth said:


> A long line should always be used with a harness. It sounds like using a long line would help ensure that your dog doesn't go up to people. That way you won't have to worry about them not doing what you've asked.


Thank you for your response. It appears I have been lead astray by my trainer then as she said the harness is to be used with a short lead. She has also promoted letting the dog off the lead as soon as you can to practice recall. She has been fine, it's just in the last week she has begun to do this.


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

labradrk said:


> I think the point is that you shouldn't be putting either other people or your dog in a position where she has at the mercy of a stranger. Unfortunately there are plenty of people like the thread starter ran into, who would have no hesitation in hurting a dog should they run up to them and jump up. Respect is a two way street - why would they respect your wishes "as the dogs owner" when you are not respecting their right to personal space in letting your dog run up in the first place?
> 
> Not being able to control a dog on the lead is not really an excuse for letting it run off the lead out of control. Also, there is far more you can do training wise with such an intelligent cross than chasing a ball, which leads to the dog becoming more energetic and unsettled if it's done to excess.


I understand where you are coming from, she has been fine up until the last week. I think people keep wanting to stoop down and pet her no matter what I say so therefore she thinks she can now go up to every person she sees and expect attention from them. She never used to be bothered.

May I ask what else you can recommend for me to do with her instead of playing with a ball as it does become a bit tedious repeatedly throwing it for her but she has always been somewhat obsessed with it 
Wh


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

Morgiez17 said:


> Personally I don't think that it is funny/hilarious as you put it that this happens and I am trying to correct this behaviour the best I can.
> 
> *Evidently not.*
> 
> ...


I am sure you do find my response condescending, as I find your attitude totally irresponsible.


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## Jobeth (May 23, 2010)

Morgiez17 said:


> Thank you for your response. It appears I have been lead astray by my trainer then as she said the harness is to be used with a short lead. She has also promoted letting the dog off the lead as soon as you can to practice recall. She has been fine, it's just in the last week she has begun to do this.


Letting them off as soon as possible is fine. I'd just use the long line to make sure that you always have full control until they recall when you see someone. Neither of mine would run up to a person, but I now know the distance where I'd have to put them back on lead if I saw a dog. If your dog loves the ball you can use that as an additional incentive to get them to recall.


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## Sarah1983 (Nov 2, 2011)

Morgiez17 said:


> May I ask what else you can recommend for me to do with her instead of playing with a ball as it does become a bit tedious repeatedly throwing it for her but she has always been somewhat obsessed with it
> Wh


We practice obedience and fun tricks (can use a throw of the ball as a reward), play chase, play tug. We also play around with scent work, me dropping his toy or hiding it while he's distracted and sending him back to find it. Stuff that works their brain is better than just exercising their body 

And while I agree that it's best to let a pup off and practice recall from an early age once they reach the bog off stage you need to manage them so they can't bog off. The more they do it the more they'll get into the habit of doing it. And yes, always a harness with a long line.


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

smokeybear said:


> I am sure you do find my response condescending, as I find your attitude totally irresponsible.


You are entitled to your opinion, I am not being drawn into an argument with someone that I don't know and has read one comment I have written and thinks they know everything. I don't appreciate being made out to be irresponsible or any of the other things you wrote above, I think it's quite hurtful and unnecessary. No I am far from a perfect owner, I am well aware of that but I am trying to correct the problem and am following the advice of a trainer who has been going for 30 years and accredited with all the relevant bodies that everyone said to look for so if she is teaching me the incorrect things, is it any wonder I am having so many problems with my dog?
I have not set out to be a bad owner or person, maybe my post has come across that I am blaming others. I merely mean that people call her over/let her jump up despite me asking them not to do so which re-confirms the behaviour and then the cycle continues.
I don't just unclip her and let her run amok, I work her constantly with treat/ball play and if I see someone coming I call her back and work to hold her attention but they if she does go over to sniff and they bend down praising her and letting jump up, what am I supposed to do? That is when I shout over to them to please don't pet/let her jump up and they just say "I don't mind" and let her carry on?
Maybe you could offer a bit more constructive advice because after 10 8 weeks of training courses, I have evidently wasted my money and ruined my dog it appears?
I was taught the harness is used with a short lead, I was told to let her off young and practice recall which I do, I was told playing fetch was a good way to bond and exercise, I was told to tell strangers not to pet her and jump up and that they should respect my wishes as the owner of the dog?
My irresponsibility has therefore been taught to me at my own expense and then I come here and get knocked down a couple of pegs? It's hard to find help sometimes!


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

Jobeth said:


> Letting them off as soon as possible is fine. I'd just use the long line to make sure that you always have full control until they recall when you see someone. Neither of mine would run up to a person, but I now know the distance where I'd have to put them back on lead if I saw a dog. If your dog loves the ball you can use that as an additional incentive to get them to recall.


Ah ok, sounds as if I have been taught incorrectly then, when you say long lead, do you mean a training lead or extending lead? I have been incorrectly told I need a short lead because a long one would lay over their back and encourage them to drop their bum down (sled bum or something similar she called it)
Disappointing that the trainer I found who has been doing so for 30 years and fully accredited seems to be teaching me incorrectly


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

Sarah1983 said:


> We practice obedience and fun tricks (can use a throw of the ball as a reward), play chase, play tug. We also play around with scent work, me dropping his toy or hiding it while he's distracted and sending him back to find it. Stuff that works their brain is better than just exercising their body
> 
> And while I agree that it's best to let a pup off and practice recall from an early age once they reach the bog off stage you need to manage them so they can't bog off. The more they do it the more they'll get into the habit of doing it. And yes, always a harness with a long line.


Ok thanks, I will work on some of those games/tricks with her the.  we do play find the ball which she is good with but didn't think of doing tricks we do at home, out  she definitely needs the mental stimulation. I do think she is now hitting the bog off stage, she used to stay very close but is obviously having a confidence boost 
I'll try her on the harness with the long line, so annoyed I have been advised incorrectly


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## Jobeth (May 23, 2010)

I used a long line (not extending lead) with my first dog. It never made him drop down. Make sure that you wear gloves and put knots in it. Have a chat with your trainer. Smokeybear knows some good trainers and if you are happy to let them know your general location they can recommend someone.


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## Sarah1983 (Nov 2, 2011)

I use both a 10 or 20m line and a flexi, depends on the situation. Some walks and weather conditions just suit the flexi better lol. Both have their pros and cons. I prefer the long line over the flexi generally though, I have better control.

I find that without me engaging with Spen on walks he has a tendency to bog off. So we do short periods of "work" or play followed by short periods of him doing his own thing before he comes back to do some more stuff with me.

Not sure why a long line will encourage them to drop their bum down  It's not something I've noticed with any dog I've seen on a long line. Did you get any explanation about it? The reason for only using a long line or flexi with a harness is because of the potential for injury if a dog hits the end of a 10m (or longer!) leash at speed on a collar. And on a head collar would be even worse, you'd be asking for a broken neck! Really not sure why your trainer has said to only us a short leash with a harness. Unless it's a no pull harness? I wouldn't use a long line or flexi with either the usual no pull harnesses that tighten or on a front ring personally. Back ring is fine though.


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

Cleo38 said:


> I don't understand this .... *you allow your dog to run over to other people because you have a shoulder injury & have your child with you* ... & yet they are at fault for not doing exactly as you say :confused1:
> 
> *I don't allow her to rub up to people because of my shoulder, I said my shoulder was the reason I was unable to walk her with just a collar and lead as I was not made aware by my trainer I can use a long lead with a harness until today. I'm not using my daughter as an excuse for that either I just advised by letter off the lead and play fetch because it's very slow work with two-year-old so chasing the ball gives my dog a bit of extra exercise. I don't intentionally allow her to run up to anybody at all*
> 
> ...


*In regards to this technique, may I enquire how you do this and how long for etc? Lily is terrible for wanting affection from people. She is very submissive and urinates if people talk to/touch her when they first arrive, but she will jump up to get affection and even when she sits nicely and someone begins to stroke her, she still feels the need to put a paw on them to touch them. I say ahh ahh and break contact until a four are back on the floor and she sits nicely, but she is just not getting that she does t jump up?*


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

Morgiez17 said:


> You are entitled to your opinion, I am not being drawn into an argument with someone that I don't know and has read one comment I have written and thinks they know everything. I don't appreciate being made out to be irresponsible or any of the other things you wrote above, I think it's quite hurtful and unnecessary. No I am far from a perfect owner, I am well aware of that but I am trying to correct the problem and am following the advice of a trainer who has been going for 30 years and accredited with all the relevant bodies that everyone said to look for so if she is teaching me the incorrect things, is it any wonder I am having so many problems with my dog?
> I have not set out to be a bad owner or person, maybe my post has come across that I am blaming others. I merely mean that people call her over/let her jump up despite me asking them not to do so which re-confirms the behaviour and then the cycle continues.
> I don't just unclip her and let her run amok, I work her constantly with treat/ball play and if I see someone coming I call her back and work to hold her attention but they if she does go over to sniff and they bend down praising her and letting jump up, what am I supposed to do? That is when I shout over to them to please don't pet/let her jump up and they just say "I don't mind" and let her carry on?
> Maybe you could offer a bit more constructive advice because after 10 8 weeks of training courses, I have evidently wasted my money and ruined my dog it appears?
> ...


You have been given constructive advice

Keep dog on harness and long line.

This solves all your problems.

You can exercise your dog
You can play fetch
your dog cannot run off
your dog cannot bother other people
People cannot call your dog over
your dog cannot jump up at people
you will no longer need to give instructions to people

Simples.


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

Sarah1983 said:


> I use both a 10 or 20m line and a flexi, depends on the situation. Some walks and weather conditions just suit the flexi better lol. Both have their pros and cons. I prefer the long line over the flexi generally though, I have better control.
> 
> I find that without me engaging with Spen on walks he has a tendency to bog off. So we do short periods of "work" or play followed by short periods of him doing his own thing before he comes back to do some more stuff with me.
> 
> Not sure why a long line will encourage them to drop their bum down  It's not something I've noticed with any dog I've seen on a long line. Did you get any explanation about it? The reason for only using a long line or flexi with a harness is because of the potential for injury if a dog hits the end of a 10m (or longer!) leash at speed on a collar. And on a head collar would be even worse, you'd be asking for a broken neck! Really not sure why your trainer has said to only us a short leash with a harness. Unless it's a no pull harness? I wouldn't use a long line or flexi with either the usual no pull harnesses that tighten or on a front ring personally. Back ring is fine though.


Yes sorry it is a sporn no pull harness, I mentioned at the beginning she is a terrible puller but I think that got lost in translation. So it's either short lead with harness or off of the lead. Maybe if I try some other more stimulating exercises when out walking it may keep more focus on me instead of other walkers though?


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

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http://ahimsadogtraining.com/blog/teaching-come/

http://www.dog-secrets.co.uk/how-do-...y-dog-chasing/

http://drsophiayin.com/blog/entry/come-at-the-park

http://drsophiayin.com/blog/entry/te..._to_you_on_cue

http://drsophiayin.com/blog/entry/be...me-when-called

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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

smokeybear said:


> You have been given constructive advice
> 
> *Keep dog on harness and long line*.
> 
> ...


I said from the outset to you that she is in a no pull harness because she pulls so badly, so I can't use a long lead. Maybe you should read more thoroughly before attacking me and my trainer next time...simples 

Although thanks for the other links, they may be helpful


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

Morgiez17 said:


> I said from the outset to you that she is in a no pull harness because she pulls so badly, so I can't use a long lead. Maybe you should read more thoroughly before attacking me and my trainer next time...simples
> 
> Although thanks for the other links, they may be helpful


Millions of people manage a dog on a harness and long line, perhaps you ought to spend more time TAKING instructions rather than GIVING them and you might learn something?

Swap the Sporn anti pull harness (horrible design) for a static design harness as previously suggested preferably one with a front ring attachment as well as a back one (TTouch or Perfect Fit) and you will find you can.


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

smokeybear said:


> Millions of people manage a dog on a harness and long line, perhaps you ought to spend more time TAKING instructions rather than GIVING them and you might learn something?
> 
> Swap the Sporn anti pull harness (horrible design) for a static design harness as previously suggested preferably one with a front ring attachment as well as a back one (TTouch or Perfect Fit) and you will find you can.


What instructions have I GIVEN precisely? I seem to have TAKEN everyone else's advise quite happily as they are polite and have manners. Maybe you should take stock of this? I don't recall saying I cant manage her with a long lead & harness, I have stated that I cannot use one with the harness she is in? How you feel so qualified to instruct me on what to use and how to walk her when you haven't even seen her or how she walk baffles me! I don't appreciate people bossing me around just because they know a little more and won't be taking it from you I am afraid. Why you feel the need to be so abrasive and rude, I cannot fathom. Perhaps you should refrain from commenting on my question as we clearly don't see eye to eye and I don't wish to keep going backwards and forwards with you. I will take the advice given by everyone else and hopefully correct the problem and look for another dog trainer but no more from you please!


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## Sarah1983 (Nov 2, 2011)

Personally then I'd get a different harness for use with a long line. Something like the Mekuti or Perfect Fit would be my choice where you've got the front or side ring to aid with pulling issues but also just the regular back ring and no tightening action so you can use it with a long line. But even just a regular harness from Pets at Home or somewhere would work although it would mean more messing around and switching of harnesses if you still wanted to use the no pull one.

It really is vital to prevent her running up to people if you want to teach her not to do it. The more she does it and is rewarded for it the more she'll carry on doing it. I do find with Spencer that keeping him focused on me really helps. It's not fail safe though. He'll happily ignore people, other dogs are our issue, and he still has to go back on leash if we're going to pass close by one. I usually just pop him on his regular leash for a few minutes though as he won't run back once we've passed.


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

Morgiez17 said:


> What instructions have I GIVEN precisely? I seem to have TAKEN everyone else's advise quite happily as they are polite and have manners. Maybe you should take stock of this? I don't recall saying I cant manage her with a long lead & harness, I have stated that I cannot use one with the harness she is in? How you feel so qualified to instruct me on what to use and how to walk her when you haven't even seen her or how she walk baffles me! I don't appreciate people bossing me around just because they know a little more and won't be taking it from you I am afraid. Why you feel the need to be so abrasive and rude, I cannot fathom. Perhaps you should refrain from commenting on my question as we clearly don't see eye to eye and I don't wish to keep going backwards and forwards with you. I will take the advice given by everyone else and hopefully correct the problem and look for another dog trainer but no more from you please!


You see your responses demonstrate exactly WHY people do not "respect" your "instructions" to them.

You cannot TAKE instruction, so do not GIVE it when you are clearly unable and unwilling to recognise constructive advice.

You can continue on your high horse and continue to face the same problems as you are doing now and people will continue to ignore you, just as your dog does.

I am certainly not going to take any instructions from you! ROFLMAO


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## labradrk (Dec 10, 2012)

Morgiez17 said:


> I said from the outset to you that she is in a no pull harness because she pulls so badly, so I can't use a long lead. Maybe you should read more thoroughly before attacking me and my trainer next time...simples
> 
> Although thanks for the other links, they may be helpful


If she is pulling so badly in a no pull harness, the no pull harness ain't working.  These contraptions aren't really designed to stop them pulling per say, as a determined dog can pull into ANY piece of equipment, but rather make them easier to control by taking some of their momentum away.

The Sporn harness isn't the best. Get yourself one of these: The Mekuti Balance Dog Harness: stop your dog pulling on the lead. while working on loose lead work.


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

smokeybear said:


> You see your responses demonstrate exactly WHY people do not "respect" your "instructions" to them.
> 
> You cannot TAKE instruction, so do not GIVE it when you are clearly unable and unwilling to recognise constructive advice.
> 
> ...


if it makes you feel better to be an a** then please continue, there is always one like you on any forum you go to. Be as rude and derogatory as you like but it falls on deaf ears I am afraid. You don't know me or my dog so judge away. You are as foolish as the idiots who encourage my dog to jump up on them then look shocked when she does it and she is dirty


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

Sarah1983 said:


> Personally then I'd get a different harness for use with a long line. Something like the Mekuti or Perfect Fit would be my choice where you've got the front or side ring to aid with pulling issues but also just the regular back ring and no tightening action so you can use it with a long line. But even just a regular harness from Pets at Home or somewhere would work although it would mean more messing around and switching of harnesses if you still wanted to use the no pull one.
> 
> It really is vital to prevent her running up to people if you want to teach her not to do it. The more she does it and is rewarded for it the more she'll carry on doing it. I do find with Spencer that keeping him focused on me really helps. It's not fail safe though. He'll happily ignore people, other dogs are our issue, and he still has to go back on leash if we're going to pass close by one. I usually just pop him on his regular leash for a few minutes though as he won't run back once we've passed.


Ok thank you. I will work on keeping her more mentally stimulated and focused on me when people draw nearer and maybe pop her on the lead if that doesn't work when they approach. I really want to nip it in the bud because yes she is cute and they don't mind at the moment but they will when she is a bigger girl  not quite such a cute habit then  she just loves attention.

She doesn't pull with the sporn halter, I just can't have her on a long lead, so it's either at heel or off the lead. I like the idea of a normal harness with a long line. I don't mind swapping them over more often, if it helps to teach her the correct behaviour


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

labradrk said:


> If she is pulling so badly in a no pull harness, the no pull harness ain't working.  These contraptions aren't really designed to stop them pulling per say, as a determined dog can pull into ANY piece of equipment, but rather make them easier to control by taking some of their momentum away.
> 
> The Sporn harness isn't the best. Get yourself one of these: The Mekuti Balance Dog Harness: stop your dog pulling on the lead. while working on loose lead work.


No she doesn't pull now she is in the sporn harness but it does mean I can't use a long lead. I may try the above recommendation of a normal harness with a long lead to teach her not to approach people as well as keeping her mentally stimulated and focused on me with treats and her ball.


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## Dogloverlou (Dec 8, 2013)

Morgiez17 said:


> Thank you for your response. It appears I have been lead astray by my trainer then as she said the harness is to be used with a short lead. She has also promoted letting the dog off the lead as soon as you can to practice recall. She has been fine, it's just in the last week she has begun to do this.


It is preferable to start off lead training from the very beginning, so your trainer isn't giving you the wrong advise as such, but once pups gain their confidence and start losing that dependency they once had it's all to common to find them running off after more exciting and interesting things. What you're experiencing isn't unusual. Some simple management tips as you've been given here and reinforcing your training will help you through your pups adolescence


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

Dogloverlou said:


> It is preferable to start off lead training from the very beginning, so your trainer isn't giving you the wrong advise as such, but once pups gain their confidence and start losing that dependency they once had it's all to common to find them running off after more exciting and interesting things. What you're experiencing isn't unusual. Some simple management tips as you've been given here and reinforcing your training will help you through your pups adolescence


That's great thanks. Feel slightly less incompetent now  . I do constantly work with her and it's not like she is an untrained dog, it's just all new to me as my last dog was a rescue and older. There wasn't much training involved with him, just coaxing hun out of his shell.
She is a very good pup and does well in her class, she is the youngest one as she is now in the junior because I wanted help with pulling so she went straight into the junior class, it's just in the last week the clever little monkey has worked out that people will give her affection if she goes to them 😊 and most of the people we pass are dog owners so they fawn over her as she is a puppy and cute. I do have an extending lead though, so I will practice teaching her to leave people and holding her attention with treats and ball work.
Thank you x


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## smokeybear (Oct 19, 2011)

Morgiez17 said:


> if it makes you feel better to be an a** then please continue, there is always one like you on any forum you go to. Be as rude and derogatory as you like but it falls on deaf ears I am afraid. You don't know me or my dog so judge away. You are as foolish as the idiots who encourage my dog to jump up on them then look shocked when she does it and she is dirty


Evidently it does not fall on deaf ears cos you keep on posting! 

You are the one who is foolish and an a*** by insisting everyone else is wrong and you are right.

When you have found in this thread that nothing could be further from the truth.


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

smokeybear said:


> Evidently it does not fall on deaf ears cos you keep on posting!
> 
> You are the one who is foolish and an a*** by insisting everyone else is wrong and you are right.
> 
> When you have found in this thread that nothing could be further from the truth.


Oh smokeybear! Please do hush and give it a rest, you are making yourself look a pretentious idiot now keeping up this silly argy bargy! I have taken the advice given by other people on here, held my hands up and said I don't know the answers so asked for further information and put it in to practice today on our walks with great success (a big thanks to everyone for their advice 😊). Everyone else has answered with a appropriate level of social decorum (something you would do well to invest in). If they have misunderstood something I have said, I have re-explained it in order to get the correct advice to proceed, not to pick fights but because there is no tone in the written word and sometimes I have not explained things as well as I could have. I have not said anyone is wrong at all, I have merely stated that you act like an ass and continue to do so. You proceed to keep trying to insult me and what you have written above is a lot of twaddle my dear. Please do show me an example of where I have to quote you "insisted everyone else is wrong and I am right"? 
It appears to me you really need to let it go and move on to another thread and start picking a fight elsewhere as you are just making yourself look silly now


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## Wiz201 (Jun 13, 2012)

okay Morgiez17 would you give it a rest now? You keep on posting and reacting to Smokeybear, would you take this outside the thread please?


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

Wiz201 said:


> okay Morgiez17 would you give it a rest now? You keep on posting and reacting to Smokeybear, would you take this outside the thread please?


Um I'm sorry but Smokey Bear is the one who continues to be rude and not let it lie. I have been happily chatting with other helpful people on here. Please could you direct this to smokey instead, I'm not being blamed for something that I didn't start or continue thank you very much!


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## Wiz201 (Jun 13, 2012)

Smokeybear gave you some good advice on using a perfect fit harness rather than the sporn one which I agree with. This is all I'm going to say on the subject now, I'm bowing out.


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

Wiz201 said:


> Smokeybear gave you some good advice on using a perfect fit harness rather than the sporn one which I agree with. This is all I'm going to say on the subject now, I'm bowing out.


Well please direct your attention to all the other comments she made before you make judgements. That was one of the last things she said. Don't go jumping in just to jump out once you have said an incorrect statement. 
Plenty of people have private messaged me advising that smokey is rude and they all just put her comments on ignore because she is ignorant; well sorry but if someone is rude, I will tell them so. End of


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## Sarah1983 (Nov 2, 2011)

For all smokeybear May come across as rude to some her advice is well worth heeding imo. In general, not just on this thread.


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## Guest (Dec 14, 2014)

Morgiez17 said:


> What instructions have I GIVEN precisely? I seem to have TAKEN everyone else's advise quite happily as they are polite and have manners. Maybe you should take stock of this? I don't recall saying I cant manage her with a long lead & harness, I have stated that I cannot use one with the harness she is in? How you feel so qualified to instruct me on what to use and how to walk her when you haven't even seen her or how she walk baffles me! *I don't appreciate people bossing me around *just because they know a little more and won't be taking it from you I am afraid. Why you feel the need to be so abrasive and rude, I cannot fathom. Perhaps you should refrain from commenting on my question as we clearly don't see eye to eye and I don't wish to keep going backwards and forwards with you. I will take the advice given by everyone else and hopefully correct the problem and look for another dog trainer but no more from you please!


Sorry but I found this funny too 

You dont appreciate people bossing you around but youre happy to boss around people who let your puppy jump up on them?

Listen, the odds of the general public listening to your instructions about how to interact with your dog are slim to none. Thats not just you, thats anyone. 
Just head it all off at the pass by not allowing your pup to get in a position where she is close enough to interact with anyone unless you are there to control her. 
Or simply keep her away from people unless its someone you know will cooperate with your training.

You say you have a young daughter, does the pup jump on children too? There are actually some techniques you can use to teach the pup a default sit (instead of a default jump up) when approaching children, and your daughter can even help you with that training.


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

Sarah1983 said:


> For all smokeybear May come across as rude to some her advice is well worth heeding imo. In general, not just on this thread.


That's fair enough, I am sure she is extremely helpful; trouble is there is a correct way of saying things without the need to be rude which she didn't choose to do. If she wants to be a little offhand with her responses that is her choice entirely but then don't be surprised if people react to it is all.


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

ouesi said:


> Sorry but I found this funny too
> 
> You dont appreciate people bossing you around but youre happy to boss around people who let your puppy jump up on them?
> 
> ...


Of firstly, I said I didn't appreciate Smokeybears way of coming across. Most people have answered in a way that is polite and constructive, she didn't. It got my back up. That's all there is to that I am afraid, I won't change how I feel about it as I found it rude.
Secondly, I don't boss people around when I am out on walks. I take full responsibility that she shouldn't do it and since being given help by others on here, I have changed my methods and seen an improvement. I fully appreciate some people don't want my dog to jump on them, however some people have been more than happy to bend down and encourage her to jump up, I have even had one person who scooped up her in her arms off of the floor because a long time she had her own puppy and even though I asked her to put her down she didn't, so although it may have come across wrong what I wrote wasn't saying everybody should do what I say I was merely trying to sympathise. 
I know some people have read my response and think that I wander along with my dog running out of control, jumping on every single person that passes while I lazily shout at them "oh...don't let her do that" without thinking I need to do anything but I couldn't be further from the truth. I work as hard as I can with my puppy, I take her to training classes and I put in as much time as I can spare to train her. My response was taken out of context as I was just saying to the OP yes people are annoying lol. 
My point was that if I ask someone not to bend down and encourage her to jump up, surely they should listen. I have experienced this both on and off the lead which is frustrating. If someone walked up to feed your dog and you said no, then they carried on, how would you feel? You aren't bossing them around, it's your dog and your choice.
To be honest, when I first posted, I was merely responding to the OP to just agree with them that sometimes people can be annoying when it comes to dogs. People let their children run-up to dogs without checking with the owner or pet them or feed them without permission and I was just agreeing. Originally, I wasn't asking for advice I was nearly just agreeing to the frustrations. 
Smokey was unneccessarily rude in her response without knowing anything about me, my dog or my training methods and proceeded to lecture me when I hadn't asked for advice, I was just sympathising with the OP.
Other people have offered help once they had obtained further information from me and my circumstances and I was more than grateful for this and have put it into practice, I have not argued with anybody's opinions I have not rubbished them; I have been grateful to these people and I have said that to them. Although Smokey may have been helpful towards the end, she began by being rude and I am afraid it just got my back up.
No my dog doesn't jump on children, as they are the only generation who ask before they approach and if I say no, they listen.
I'm doing everything I can and no I don't get it right all the time, I just didn't need the attitude.


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## Rafa (Jun 18, 2012)

I walk my Jack Russell on a Puppia Soft Mesh Harness and a 15 metre training line.

That combination works very well for us and it means I have complete control of her, should she see a squirrel and try to run.

I'm sure we would all like to be able to allow our dogs complete freedom but the majority of dogs are not 100% reliable or predictable.

There will always be people who will react badly to a dog and even try to hurt it and that isn't right, but you can't control the actions of others, however unreasonable, all you can do is control your own dog.


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## Old Shep (Oct 17, 2010)

I use a Mekuti harness all he time, for ordinary walks and with a long line and a flexi (though not at the same time!)


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## Guest (Dec 14, 2014)

Morgiez17 said:


> My point was that if I ask someone not to bend down and encourage her to jump up, surely they should listen. I have experienced this both on and off the lead which is frustrating. If someone walked up to feed your dog and you said no, then they carried on, how would you feel? You aren't bossing them around, it's your dog and your choice.


But people dont listen. So there you go. You can sit here and bitch about how people suck and dont listen (and you would not be wrong), or you can do something thats actually constructive, and approach the problem from the end you do have control over - you and your dog.

There is not a thing we can do to control the actions of other people, we can however work towards controlling our dogs.

If someone walked up to my dogs and tried to feed either of them, I would recall my dogs away from the strange people offering them food (thats actually a recall-proofing exercise we do in class - can you call your dog away from a friendly stranger offering hot dogs). Or I could just cue my dog to leave it, or keep my dog close enough to me to physically block the person from feeding the dog.

Are you going to be successful 100% of the time? Of course not. But youll be far more successful focusing on your dog than the oodles of random people you might run in to and the strange things they might do to your dog.


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

Sweety said:


> I walk my Jack Russell on a Puppia Soft Mesh Harness and a 15 metre training line.
> 
> That combination works very well for us and it means I have complete control of her, should she see a squirrel and try to run.
> 
> ...


Hi,

Is that just a harness or a no pull type harness? x


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## Morgiez17 (Sep 29, 2014)

ouesi said:


> But people dont listen. So there you go. You can sit here and bitch about how people suck and dont listen (and you would not be wrong), or you can do something thats actually constructive, and approach the problem from the end you do have control over - you and your dog.
> 
> There is not a thing we can do to control the actions of other people, we can however work towards controlling our dogs.
> 
> ...


Fair point and I understand where you're coming from, as I have said I have been working with my dog using the new techniques everybody has mentioned above and I'm beginning to see an improvement with her.
Again, my original comment was only just agreeing with the OP. In regards to the annoying habits strangers may have, it was more of just a moaning session between dog owners, I really didn't expect it to become quite such a heated debate. Think maybe I wrote it incorrectly and people took too much from it?


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## Rafa (Jun 18, 2012)

Morgiez17 said:


> Hi,
> 
> Is that just a harness or a no pull type harness? x


It's an ordinary harness. I like them because they're not made up completely of straps.

They have a yoke which goes over the head and sits around the neck and a strap which fits around the chest and back.

Rosie has never been able to get out of it and she is a little expert at backing out of harnesses and it doesn't shift around, whichever way she runs or moves.


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## Jamesgoeswalkies (May 8, 2014)

Morgiez17 said:


> My point was that if I ask someone not to bend down and encourage her to jump up, surely they should listen. I have experienced this both on and off the lead which is frustrating. If someone walked up to feed your dog and you said no, then they carried on, how would you feel? You aren't bossing them around, it's your dog and your choice.


This is the bain of most puppy owners to be honest and we have discussed this on this forum before.

Yes, get a long line, yes get a good harness (I train on a Mekuti) and yes work at impulse control. Training will help your young pup achieve this.

Now Joe Public are a whole different category. Do not expect someone to ignore your dog if they run up to them or jump up when off lead ..most can't or simply won't. So it's your role to prevent that happening wherever possible. Thus the long line or keeping within recall distance. {Whenever I hear the 'I don't mind' comment I usually add 'You will when he is fully grown, soaking wet and muddy'  )

On the lead is a different matter. Again there is at least one thread on here about this. As someone who brings up Cavalier puppies I am well used to passers-by wanting to gush over my pups ...so i ensure that they don't have the chance. They can look but not touch! If I am walking past people and my pups are on the lead, I always give space or ask for a sit away from the humans. I also put my hand up to prevent anyone thinking this is their moment to approach. I smile at people ... but apparently I have a 'don't touch my dog look on my face'. It works btw 

So we can ask people to help us in this matter and when on the lead I don't expect anyone to over rule me (they never have) but don't expect blanket co-operation as most people have no idea what you are training 

J


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## speug (Nov 1, 2011)

I had a brilliant day with my pup yesterday at our club's agility competition. Every single person who came over to speak to him insisted he had to be sitting first, and they all had different treats so he was well rewarded for good manners and totally ignored for anything less than acceptable. It does make life so much simpler when other people get what you're trying to do.


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