# its getting VERY stressy around here!!



## frags (Feb 5, 2009)

so much biting and moaning!
have you all noticed how we dont get as many visitor on the rabbit forum? i think its because no matter what people say someone always has a problem with it!
wether its where they get there buns, the sizes of the hutches etc surely all that matters is that people care and love there rabbits? people here arent throwing them on the streets or into rescues yet there are some telling others off  what gives them the right? 

TBH nearly every thread now has a comment like it on it and its getting boring!

think i need a break from this place as a few are ruining it for others! the friends i made on here i no longer see regular as i know there fed up with it here too as we have spoke via pm's.
so if my friends arent here and all i see is comments on peoples ways that are peeing me off whats the point of being here?


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## kellyrich (Jan 8, 2009)

Totally agree with your Frags, its getting beyond a joke and im sure it scares some of the newbies off!

All i can say is just ignore the bitchyness and take note of the nice comments and advice that is given by the friendlier people x
We all love our buns and that is why we come on here for advice and to share our stories so lets keep it at that x


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## stacey11 (Feb 27, 2009)

I've been thinking the exact same thing for the last few days, so sick of reading it, it's enough to scare all the newbies off! I might not post that much on here but I love reading all the different posts but there's too much negativity now!!


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## emzybabe (Jun 30, 2009)

this is defiantly getting annoying, I think this is why the crazy4criters site was set up, but really cant stand to stare at their colour scheme. 

I appreciate that people mean well, with their comments, however some are deliberately worded harshly.The majority of the people on here just want to swap ideas and advice and help people out as well as a good off topic chat. Giving non constructive comments to people and putting them down, makes everyone who reads the comment feel bad. There are far nicer ways to word suggestions, and i feel if you really have issues with something then you should pm the person. However u are still likely to put that person off using the forum again which we dont want to do as that person might be a lifeline to us if we have a problem in the future.

Thank u frags for having the guts to bring this up


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## Peppa (Jul 8, 2009)

I know i am quite new on here but the first post i put on about my 2 rabbits someone said the hutch was too small, even though it is only for a single rabbit and its a 2 storey one and he gets free roam of my big yard all day!

It did put me off posting as much as i would like, asi felt like i was being told off and not looking after my rabbits so i know what you mean!


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## emzybabe (Jun 30, 2009)

Just ignore them peppa, I'm sure u do more for ur rabbit than most owners and i'm sure he/she is very happy living with u.


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## Kammie (Apr 4, 2009)

Agreeing here too, was disappointed at getting my thread hyjacked when introducing my new bun its made me feel bad about getting him. We need to advice people in the right direction rather than tell them off for what they're doing wrong. Need to remember not everyone here knows everything about rabbits and are coming for advice to better themselves rather than being made to feel bad at what they're doing. 

Here's an example, my first rabbit I was given as a present when I was five. Being five I didn't have a clue how to look after him but done my best, he was fed and watered everyday. Yes he was in small hutch with a run but I didn't know any better and mum didn't know a lot about buns either. He died aged six and I had him from a two year old, he was happy and got lots of cuddles everyday but he wasn't in the best conditions possible. My next rabbit Sophie I was given when I was 10, for her I read up about rabbits from the leaflets the breeder gave us and I became more interested in reading up on caring for her and giving her the best I could. My only mistake with her was she was never spayed, but she never had any problems and not being told about the cancer issue I didn't think she needed to be spayed since she was on her own. She died aged eight having to be put to sleep after an agressive infection in her mouth that we couldn't get rid of after god knows how many courses of antibiotics. After losing Sophie and learning so much from her and the books I was a mess and desperately wanted another rabbit so my sister found me Rosie who needed rescuing. Rosie has no front teeth and behaviour issues because of where she came from, she's been spayed and vaccinated. But Rosie seemed lonely because I was now at college and couldn't give her the time as I did with Sophie so I Got Charlie. Charlie as you know has died and Rosie was again unhappy so now I'm preparing to bond her with the new boy I have George. Missing Daisy out from this because I aquired her from work as the owner was going to give her up to charity.

So I like most new rabbit owners didn't know what was best but from advice and reading I learnt over time and now I think I'm doing a good job with the lot I have now.

Don't bite peoples heads off over mistakes and this isn't meant as a rant just my opinion and example. 

Sorry for the wall of text.


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## Michelle666 (Jun 12, 2008)

frags said:


> wether its where they get there buns, the sizes of the hutches etc surely all that matters is that people care and love there rabbits? ?


In order to care about and love somthing surely you should treat it properly, including the right home, food and lifestyle.

Its an opinion, that isn't against the law. Sometimes its a suggestion made in order to be helpful, theres nothing wrong with that - well at least I didn't think there was! :001_unsure:


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## EmzieAngel (Apr 22, 2009)

Totally agree frags, I don't come into this section much, but when I have read threads, I feel like saying, "just give them a break." Some people are always making petty comments about the smallest details sometimes, very annoying.
x


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

> surely all that matters is that people care and love there rabbits?


Love means nothing to a rabbit. You can keep a rabbit in a tiny hutch and still love it, doesnt mean it will be happy and have a good quality of life.

Many people on here, myself included, feel very strongly about the health and welfare of rabbits. I dont post on forums to make "friends" i post to share my knowledge and experience.

If i feel someone isnt housing their rabbit correctly, or is feeding it incorrectly, i feel i have every right to say so. I wont ever condone the cruel confinement of ANY animal.

Id hate for any new owner to come on here and think certain hutches and housings are acceptable when they quite obvisouly arent. Its about educating people.


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## Jazzy (Apr 15, 2009)

frags said:


> so much biting and moaning!
> have you all noticed how we dont get as many visitor on the rabbit forum? i think its because no matter what people say someone always has a problem with it!
> wether its where they get there buns, the sizes of the hutches etc surely all that matters is that people care and love there rabbits? people here arent throwing them on the streets or into rescues yet there are some telling others off  what gives them the right?
> 
> ...


Yes I keep well away from here now after being attacked as soon as I first posted in here.


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## Michelle666 (Jun 12, 2008)

Nonnie said:


> Love means nothing to a rabbit. You can keep a rabbit in a tiny hutch and still love it, doesnt mean it will be happy and have a good quality of life.
> 
> Many people on here, myself included, feel very strongly about the health and welfare of rabbits. I dont post on forums to make "friends" i post to share my knowledge and experience.
> 
> ...


Got it in one! I never mean to sound horrible, its purely advice and suggestions!


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## Jazzy (Apr 15, 2009)

Peppa said:


> I know i am quite new on here but the first post i put on about my 2 rabbits someone said the hutch was too small, even though it is only for a single rabbit and its a 2 storey one and he gets free roam of my big yard all day!
> 
> It did put me off posting as much as i would like, asi felt like i was being told off and not looking after my rabbits so i know what you mean!


I have just looked at your hutch and it looks absolutely fine to me. I have two dwarf rabbits in 4ft two storey hutches with a run attached and they are absolutely fine.


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## Kammie (Apr 4, 2009)

Its not so much about telling people whats right and wrong thats perfectly fine and good to do but its the way some people are putting it across. 

Simple examples completely fictional: How not to advice someone
Random new rabbit owner - I just got a rabbit and keeping her in a 4' hutch.
Random Forum member - You can't keep your rabbit in a 4' hutch its too small and unfair on the rabbit.

How best to advice someone
Random new rabbit owner - I just got a rabbit and keeping her in a 4' hutch.
Random forum member - It may be worth getting a bigger hutch, a 4' hutch is too small to give a bun enough space to move, I'd advice at least 5' for a small breed.

Which would you prefer to hear being new on a forum like this?


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## BeckyLH (Jun 2, 2009)

I agree that it is about education but there are ways and means to go about educating people which does not include comments such as "your hutch is disgustingly small". Surely it would better to say, "your hutch looks a little on the small side, rabbits need a lot of exercise, have you considered..." The fact that people come on here ususally means they are caring owners who would like some advice about their pets and they don't need to be hounded as soon as they get here.

When I was a child a kept a nethie in a 4ft cage for 5 years. Yes it had exercise and handling everyday but it was wrong. It was not spayed or vaccinated because I didn't know and was far too young and ignorant to have the responsibility. I am now a very responsible owner who knows and provides exactly what my rabbits need. Everyone has to start somewhere.


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## EmzieAngel (Apr 22, 2009)

Kammie said:


> Its not so much about telling people whats right and wrong thats perfectly fine and good to do but its the way some people are putting it across.
> 
> Simple examples completely fictional: How not to advice someone
> Random new rabbit owner - I just got a rabbit and keeping her in a 4' hutch.
> ...


Completely agree with you.
If people used the first example, it's usually when others go on and on and on and on making the owner feel worse.


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

Either one is absolutely fine imo.

I will agree that sometimes things arent always put across in the best of ways. But this is the internet and should not be taken seriously enough to upset someone in real life.

If someone is actually offended and hurt by the written word of a faceless stranger, then maybe the internet is not for them.


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## BeckyLH (Jun 2, 2009)

Nonnie said:


> Either one is absolutely fine imo.
> 
> I will agree that sometimes things arent always put across in the best of ways. But this is the internet and should not be taken seriously enough to upset someone in real life.
> 
> If someone is actually offended and hurt by the written word of a faceless stranger, then maybe the internet is not for them.


I disagree. On this basis how can you expect someone to take your advice seriously?


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

BeckyLH said:


> I disagree. On this basis how can you expect someone to take your advice seriously?


I dont. Most people ignore everything that is said to them on a forum.

Only a small percentage will take on board any advice that is offered to them.

The same goes for those trying to educate from with the pet industry. No matter how much you try to educate people on basic animal welfare, ultimately they will do what they think is best. They will still get the smaller hutch, they will still buy the cheaper food, they will still leave bun in all day when it rains. This is why i got out of breeding, and out of the pet industry, as people really dont care.


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## kellyrich (Jan 8, 2009)

Just reading through this thread and its just happening again.

All i can say is i love my bun and i know everybody on here does too and my advice would be to just ignore the comments and people that you want to, even though it does get very frustrating. Ive been on the other end of it a few times even though Stan gets treated like gold. i think the good friendly people know who they are so just stick together! 

Its getting very silly and to be honest a total waste of time cos the nasty comments that are being made are making people ignore the advice even more cos of the way are put across! And i dont blame them!


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## Guest (Aug 4, 2009)

At the end of the day there is not 1 single person on here that is perfect, yes they may OFFER advice and think they know it all. But they dont live in YOUR life and dont live with YOUR animals. 

So you just thank them for there advice and that is it. Everybody is different and we all have different ideas i suppose on how to look after animals. 

I dont get into any debates or arguments on here anymore it is not worth it, i just mainly try and stay in the general section now. xxx


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## frags (Feb 5, 2009)

Nonnie said:


> Either one is absolutely fine imo.
> 
> I will agree that sometimes things arent always put across in the best of ways. But this is the internet and should not be taken seriously enough to upset someone in real life.
> 
> If someone is actually offended and hurt by the written word of a faceless stranger, then maybe the internet is not for them.


so if we are not to take hurtful comments from a faceless stranger why should we take advice from 1?

people DO get upset by peoples comments, some people have no body in life and the internet is there only communication, ie agraphobia and depression.


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## Kammie (Apr 4, 2009)

With the first example the random forum member didn't give advice in a way that would help the new owner just saying its bad. The scond example advices a better alternative suggesting the size they get. 

Thats the difference and I would much rather be given that sort of advice rather than just be told what I'm doing is wrong with no suggestion as to how to make it better.


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## emzybabe (Jun 30, 2009)

I disagree completely, the first example is not constructive in anyway, it is likely that person will then ignore the comment. The second example is friendly and inviting for discussion.

I find it highly offensive that people are willing to critisize people without even welcoming them to the forum. In my opinion I really dont see why these know it alls bother, no one wants to make conversation with them. The forum is for friendly advice and help and banta, not harshly written abuse.


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

frags said:


> so if we are not to take hurtful comments from a faceless stranger why should we take advice from 1?
> 
> people DO get upset by peoples comments, some people have no body in life and the internet is there only communication, ie agraphobia and depression.


I personally dont think the first comment was hurtful. It was a simple statement of facts.

I suffer from mental illness and rarely leave my house. Yet im able to seperate real life from online fantasy.

I reply to questions and queries, as thats what a forum is about, i dont think im rude or hurtful. Its easy to take on the good and ignore the bad.

I share what i know, and learn about what i dont.


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## Guest (Aug 4, 2009)

frags said:


> so much biting and moaning!
> have you all noticed how we dont get as many visitor on the rabbit forum? i think its because no matter what people say someone always has a problem with it!
> wether its where they get there buns, the sizes of the hutches etc surely all that matters is that people care and love there rabbits? people here arent throwing them on the streets or into rescues yet there are some telling others off  what gives them the right?
> 
> ...


very true i have lots of animals rabbits and ferrets birds but i would never give advice on here becouse someone will allways say its wrong


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## Michelle666 (Jun 12, 2008)

The thing what gets me is, yet again another thread has been set up to moan about other people moaning! 

Perhaps people shouldn't bother talking to one and other, most don't like recieving advice or listen to it regardless of how its written!


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## emzybabe (Jun 30, 2009)

it would be much more respectful of the other persons feelings to comment constructively.
the use of the internet in this case is very real life, because people are asking for advice it is not a novel. 
I'm sure if we ran a poll their would be more people selecting friendly comments only.


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

Michelle666 said:


> The thing what gets me is, yet again another thread has been set up to moan about other people moaning!
> 
> Perhaps people shouldn't bother talking to one and other, most don't like recieving advice or listen to it regardless of how its written!


This is why i dont post much down here anymore.


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

Yeh your right Frags crikey whats wrong with me as long as people 'love' their rabbit and feed and water it who cares that it lives in a tiny hutch and cant stretch its legs.

Who gives a **** about rabbit welfare hey. ut:

Thats it you stay here with your cruel 'breeders' and i'll stay at the forum where people actually do give a **** about rabbits. :cursing:

I give constructive advice and it still comes across as if im having a go, that breeder should know what hutch size rabbits need before setting up a whole rabbit breeding business, these people are supposed to know what they are doing, and judging from the replys she just doesnt care, ignorance is what annoys me, she didnt come here for advice she came to sell rabbits.


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## Kammie (Apr 4, 2009)

Can we call a truce? I have my opinions, Frags has hers, Crofty has hers and so on. No one will ever agree on everything, it would be pretty broing if we did.


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## emzybabe (Jun 30, 2009)

its not what is being said its how its being said everyone on this forum has the right to respect


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## kellyrich (Jan 8, 2009)

emzybabe said:


> its not what is being said its how its being said everyone on this forum has the right to respect


Totally agree and it was said earlier by somebody that we all have different opinions and nobody else really knows our own animals better than ourselves and we all treat them differently! So just nice friendly comments and advice and banter should be on here to make it the nice place that it used to be! x


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

Kammie said:


> Can we call a truce? I have my opinions, Frags has hers, Crofty has hers and so on. No one will ever agree on everything, it would be pretty broing if we did.


No clearly this thread is started to have a go at me, I do my best to help with advice and i get it thrown in my face. I'll miss the people that I caht to on here but ive had enough.


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

crofty said:


> No clearly this thread is started to have a go at me, I do my best to help with advice and i get it thrown in my face. I'll miss the people that I caht to on here but ive had enough.


Thats a pity crofty. You are one of the few people on here who's posts i enjoy reading and who ive felt ive learnt from.


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## Kammie (Apr 4, 2009)

Where was it stated that it was to have a go at you? We've probably all said the odd comment thats offended someone but its happened a lot recently and thats what I've seen this thread as being aimed at not at any one person in particular. I'm pretty sure I've said something thats upset someone since I've been here, but no ones perfect.


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## Michelle666 (Jun 12, 2008)

Nonnie said:


> Thats a pity crofty. You are one of the few people on here who's posts i enjoy reading and who ive felt ive learnt from.


Ditto to that!!


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## emzybabe (Jun 30, 2009)

it wasnt aimed at anyone! it was aimed at the harsh comments which i'm sure we have all posted at least 1 of


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

I think this thread has stemmed from some comments some of us made in the thread made by a new breeder.


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

Kammie said:


> Where was it stated that it was to have a go at you? We've probably all said the odd comment thats offended someone but its happened a lot recently and thats what I've seen this thread as being aimed at not at any one person in particular. I'm pretty sure I've said something thats upset someone since I've been here, but no ones perfect.


Because I had a go at the breeder that keeps her rabbits in 3ft hutches and 45ftx2ft runs and Frags doesnt like it. I dont take any of that back and seeing as others think thats ok this is not the place for me to be, its too upsetting, im in tears and wonder why these b***** people bother keeping rabbit at all. I bite my tongue to stop having a go at these irresponsible people that breed pet buns for the sake of and dont care where they go, I try and explain myself without it turning personal. I care about all rabbit and i just hate to see them abused and bought like disposable toys, hardly anyone in on this forum seems to care??

This doesnt matter now anyway, Im going, problem solved Frags.

Nonnie and Michelle, I will miss you, thankyou for your comments xx


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## emzybabe (Jun 30, 2009)

I agree with u that in that case they were too small, but their is no point having a go at that person and scaring them off, u are much better to use constructive criticism


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## Kammie (Apr 4, 2009)

If you think about it though scaring someone off through comments may in fact cause more problems for the rabbit in the long run. Yes the hutches were too small but in giving advice nicely they may change and get bigger hutches or they may not. By making nasty comments though it may scare the person off for good so the hutches probably won't be changed and maybe down the line something else happens that they need advice about but they think "oh I won't go back there for advice they just say nasty things". At least if people stay around here we can offer advice that they may or may not decide to use but if they don't stay its a case of out of sight out of mind where the rabbit may in the long run be worse off.


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## emzybabe (Jun 30, 2009)

completely agree kammie


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

Well emzy's constructive comment was simply ignored and Frags was defending her, that breeder knows exactly what shes doing. Im not going to apologise for what i said, anyone who thinks its ok to keep a rabbit in a 4ftx2ft 'run' should not have them and certainly should not be breeding them! IM absolutely horrified by some people that say they love rabbits here.

But like I said its obvious I'm not liked so I have no reason to stay here.


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## petforum (Oct 30, 2007)

Hi All,

This problem has happened previously time and time again on this forum, mainly in the Dog Breeding section, where there was several members very in to responsible breeding who would give their opinions to newbies which looked like it was being very harsh. We tried to bring in rules to prevent the arguing but it didnt really help.

All I can say is we all need to work together to make the forum section a better place for all to be, including new members who should be made welcome.

There is totally nothing wrong with trying to educate people, but in my opinion the way some people go about it will only make the problem worse by scarring the people off who will then never listen to your advice.

The best way to educate people is to be welcoming and give your advice in a friendly mannor, as most people will listen to this advice.

I havent spent much time in the rabbit section, but woulkd love to hear peoples opinions of how we could resolve any problems like this in future.

Maybe we could create a sticky thread (if there isnt one already), with details on the size of hutches rabbits need and the amount of exericise etc they shoudl have. If we had a good detailed and positive document, we could just refer new members to read that.

Please remember that people are more likely to listen to advice that is put across in a positive manor. 

Thanks
Mark


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## frags (Feb 5, 2009)

this thread wasnt having ago at you crofty! it was about the negative comments towards people i just want it turned around!
as you can see the highest % of people on this thread are from people agreeing with the ways things are said even a pet forum reg borderer (sorry if spelt wrong lol) has said he/she wont come along here because of the comments.

im trying to make it a nice place to visit and welcome new people not scare them away!

crofty you know i feel about rabbits space myself hence why i have pens but i do feel a few people here are a bit too harsh on the way things are said to others.

why cant we just all be a nice group and give friendly advice? crofty i have seen recently you have been giving your advice alot better than you used to by saying the buns need bigger space and showing links to better hutches whcih is fab but ive also seen the negative post from you about pet shop buying, yes you are passionate about rescue's like alot of people are but you kind of enforce your views and put people down for buying from pet shops.


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## Kammie (Apr 4, 2009)

I like the sticky idea a lot, maybe making a post between us that details everything a rabbit needs and putting it all in one locked, stickied thread.


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

petforum said:


> Hi All,
> 
> This problem has happened previously time and time again on this forum, mainly in the Dog Breeding section, where there was several members very in to responsible breeding who would give their opinions to newbies which looked like it was being very harsh. We tried to bring in rules to prevent the arguing but it didnt really help.
> 
> ...


Oh Ive tried Mark you know I have rescued rabbits from a member here in the past and had to bite my tongue to get them. Im not going to sit here and have a thread started to have a go at me when I have told a member its not acceptable to keep rabbits in such tiny accomodation. I have adviased other members and will admit things sometimes get taken the wrong wat and id be the first to apologise and vice versa. I dont want to leave but I dont see another option here. I dont mind a debate but again people take it personally.


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## frags (Feb 5, 2009)

yes i think a sticky would be great and then when people arrive for the 1st time we could put the link to sticky in there threads.

and crofty i think maybe you should make the sticky thread about the hutch size etc


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

frags said:


> this thread wasnt having ago at you crofty! it was about the negative comments towards people i just want it turned around!
> as you can see the highest % of people on this thread are from people agreeing with the ways things are said even a pet forum reg borderer (sorry if spelt wrong lol) has said he/she wont come along here because of the comments.
> 
> im trying to make it a nice place to visit and welcome new people not scare them away!
> ...


I wasnt forcing my views on anyone??? I was explaining why I dont like petshops i did state throughout 'in my opinion' which im entitled too. You defended that breeder making out her accomodation was acceptable???


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## frags (Feb 5, 2009)

crofty said:


> I dont mind a debate but again people take it personally.


i feel you have taken this personally! it wasnt aimed at you it was aimed at the attitude towards people.
i want this forum back to how it was a couple of months ago "happy and friendly"

like ive said the percentage of people on this thread have agreed it is getting worse here


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

frags said:


> yes i think a sticky would be great and then when people arrive for the 1st time we could put the link to sticky in there threads.
> 
> and crofty i think maybe you should make the sticky thread about the hutch size etc


No forget it Im too upset. You do what you want.


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## frags (Feb 5, 2009)

i didnt actually defend i said that her hutches were prabably bigger than most breeders.
besides why do we have to have ago at her for?


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## mimi g (Mar 10, 2009)

Havent been able to get on here as much as poss recently and have just read through this :-(

I do completely understand where Frags is coming from as when I first joined the same happened to me.....I first talked about going to a rescue and everyone loved me but when I didnt see a rescue bun that I thought would be right for me or the ones I did like were reserved I moved on to looking at getting a baby from a breeder and was shot down abit.
Thankfully Normi turned out to be a little star in the making and everyone seems to love him now!

I agree that people do need educating we just have to remember that when people first post here they are usually posting because they are EXTREMELY excited and giddy about getting a new rabbit or showing off what rabbits they have. 
If you feel the way their rabbits are kept isnt correct then giving very blunt advise will just dis-hearten them and scare them away and they probs wont change a thing but if you give advise in a nice manner and explain the reasonings then fingers crossed they will warm to the idea........(remember they got their advise originally from someone else so may not realise what they are doing is wrong). 

Dont want to fall out with anyone just wanted to hopefully sit on the fence and give my view looking at both halves of the argument!

xxx


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## petforum (Oct 30, 2007)

crofty said:


> Oh Ive tried Mark you know I have rescued rabbits from a member here in the past and had to bite my tongue to get them. Im not going to sit here and have a thread started to have a go at me when I have told a member its not acceptable to keep rabbits in such tiny accomodation. I have adviased other members and will admit things sometimes get taken the wrong wat and id be the first to apologise and vice versa. I dont want to leave but I dont see another option here. I dont mind a debate but again people take it personally.


Crofty,

Im not totally sure that this thread is aimed at yourself. By reading the thread, it does look like there is a problem that is affecting several people and im not saying this problem is caused by any particular person but I think everyone, as users of the rabbit section, who enjoy using the site should try to work together to make this a better place for everyone. I know not everyone agrees with each other but we can all help to put our individual messages across to each other better.

I dont think leaving the forum would benefit either yourself or our other members.

I think the first step as mentioned would be to create a sticky thread about the health and welfare of rabbits for new members to read, with input from all our members. Maybe we could create a new thread about this and then you can all give your input. We will then get one person to create the new thread combining all information and I will make it a sticky.

Thanks
Mark


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## Nonnie (Apr 15, 2009)

frags said:


> i didnt actually defend i said that her hutches were prabably bigger than most breeders.


If this is the case, then why do people constantly tell those looking to buy a rabbit, to go to a breeder and not a pet shop?

It seems to me that those having the odd crossbred litter, may actually be looking after their rabbits better than the so called knowledgeable breeders.


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## emzybabe (Jun 30, 2009)

I'm pretty sure my comment wasnt ignored, it just didnt scream at them, and as mark has stated people are more likely to listen to positive adivce


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## BeckyLH (Jun 2, 2009)

It's my personal opinion that you should have to apply for a licence before intentionally breeding any animal and i honestly believe back yard breeding should be banned. However, I also understand that many people will disagree and all we can do is educate about rabbit welfare. This forum has a vast number of different people on it from different circumstances. If you prefer somewhere more single minded stick with somewhere like RU.


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## Kelly Brown (Aug 3, 2009)

Frags is keeping me here by a thread at the moment - because I really do not like this forum - I asked a simple question about advertising and all I got back from certain :cursing: (people) is how my rabbits are being poorly kept etc. To be honest people do not need to be abused in any context, If they are really concerned about peoples rabbits report them the proper way (rspca) and stop the abuse on the Internet, This site will go down hill if you don't have newbies on here. Rabbits do need to be loved, cared for and be sociable and some free space to frolic around in, but for example :- whats the point of having a 8ft cage for a nethie who is scared to death- unhappy and un social and un handled?


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## Adz_T (Jul 30, 2009)

Hello,

I have only made 1 thread and I was advised, by Crofty actually that the hutches I keep my rabbits in are too small. At first I took it offensively as I do love my rabbits and I do the best I can for them. After reading it again, Crofty was only advising me on what my next step for the rabbits should be, a bigger hutch and a big run. I apologized to her and we then discussed the best solution for my rabbits.

I believe that the advice given on here can be taken the wrong way, I am a perfect example of that but we are all mature adults, I read through the lines of the advice given to me. So should every other new member or breeder on here.

Thanks for reading


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## frags (Feb 5, 2009)

BeckyLH said:


> It's my personal opinion that you should have to apply for a licence before intentionally breeding any animal and i honestly believe back yard breeding should be banned. However, I also understand that many people will disagree and all we can do is educate about rabbit welfare. This forum has a vast number of different people on it from different circumstances. If you prefer somewhere more single minded stick with somewhere like RU.


see there i agree with you, i think us breeders should need a licence to breed and have yearly inspections but this would not stop people thinking oh it would be nice for bunny X to breed with my friends bunny.


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## emzybabe (Jun 30, 2009)

the amount of time this would take and the costs involved would certainly put people off rabbits unless they really new what they were putting themselves in for, however i feel that something like this would have to start with dogs, cats, rabbits and then where does the line get drawn, also what would happen to accidental litters, they would have to go to rescues because the owners wouldnt be able to sell them. also their would be plenty of black market breeding going on, and at least if its open any cruel people will be noticed quicker


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## Peppa (Jul 8, 2009)

I just think everyone has their own opinion and its up to the individual themselves but i just think some advice could be put across a bit better and not so bluntly as people come on here for friendly advice!


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

Right

I have had time to calm down.

Firstly this 'breeder' did not come here for advise as she started her thread asking if she could sell kits. She has defended the fact she keeps them in these tiny hutches, she doesnt care what other people think.

Secondly I agree everyone has their own opinion BUT 3ft hutches and 4ftx2ft runs is a rabbit welfare issue, currently there is nothing the RSPCA can do but im sure in time that will change. 

Thirdly I dont just sit here and moan at people i do my best to advise and have held my hands up when i have come across in the wrong way however recently it has been the aggressive response to my critism that has annoyed me whilst debating certain subjects such as petshops. I have got off my arse and helped rabbits in danger from this very site which admin kindly helped me with so you cannot accuse me of just moaning.

Finally I will be staying to talk to the people that care about rabbits and the welfare of other rabbits not just their own. If you dont like me dont speak to me but I dont want to lose talking to people like umber, nonnie and michelle or newbies that come here wanting advice that I may be able to help with. I was emotional today anyway with personal stuff but im clear headed again now and realise how daft i am getting upset over somethings i have no control over, i just pitty those buns that suffer.

Thats all I have to say, I do not want to argue so people wanting to have a go at me save your breath and speak to someone that cares what you think.


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

Adz_T said:


> Hello,
> 
> I have only made 1 thread and I was advised, by Crofty actually that the hutches I keep my rabbits in are too small. At first I took it offensively as I do love my rabbits and I do the best I can for them. After reading it again, Crofty was only advising me on what my next step for the rabbits should be, a bigger hutch and a big run. I apologized to her and we then discussed the best solution for my rabbits.
> 
> ...


Thankyou hun  x


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## hazyreality (Jan 11, 2009)

Totally agree with you Frags, think the way things are put across makes a huge difference to whether people will take the advice, or at least think about it and stay about for more, or just say stuff it and run!
You are not always going to get people to change the accomodation or whatever it is that is wrong, partly because they have proberly been told by someone in "real life" that it is ok, but at least it gives them something to think about.:idea:

I also think a Sticky with guidelines would be a good place to send newbies.



Kammie said:


> Agreeing here too, was disappointed at getting my thread hyjacked when introducing my new bun its made me feel bad about getting him. We need to advice people in the right direction rather than tell them off for what they're doing wrong. Need to remember not everyone here knows everything about rabbits and are coming for advice to better themselves rather than being made to feel bad at what they're doing.


Sorry for my part in hyjacking that thread :blushing:, I just felt it was wrong that you were made to feel bad about getting him, because of where he was from. Especially when you were so excited about getting him, as everyone is when they get a new pet!!! 

*Heidi*


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

Can this thread be closed now before I get anymore snide remarks aimed at me? Think its served its purpose.


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## Guest (Aug 4, 2009)

its been a lovely day nice and warm


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

borderer said:


> its been a lovely day nice and warm


Really its been tipping it down here lol my washing got wet


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## Guest (Aug 4, 2009)

crofty said:


> Really its been tipping it down here lol my washing got wet


will send wind and sun tomorrow:smilewinkgrin:


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## frags (Feb 5, 2009)

borderer said:


> its been a lovely day nice and warm


LOL has it? i dunno ive been stuck in doors


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## Guest (Aug 4, 2009)

frags said:


> LOL has it? i dunno ive been stuck in doors


why are you hmyoorly


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## frags (Feb 5, 2009)

yer just a bit but nothing major  

do you have magic medicine?


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## crofty (May 2, 2008)

borderer said:


> will send wind and sun tomorrow:smilewinkgrin:


 Will be gratefully recieved although could you make it thurday, im working tomorrow.... in my holiday time


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## Guest (Aug 4, 2009)

frags said:


> yer just a bit but nothing major
> 
> do you have magic medicine?


ye laughterxxxxxxxxxxxx


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## hazyreality (Jan 11, 2009)

Been raining here too  could you send some sun this way borderer?

I think laughter would work Frags - watch a funny film, thats a good cure, I suggest anything animated  or a happy go lucky film like Patch Adams - I love that film! He thinks laughter is the best medicine. I'm watching Pirates of the Carribean 3 at the moment - which is fairly funny at times!

*Heidi*


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## umber (Feb 15, 2009)

Personally I suggest a yummy bowl of ones favourite icecream come rain or shine that always makes my day!


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## cassie01 (Jul 11, 2008)

this is funny i didnt come on yeaterday because certain threads and people have been getting me down lately, im just sick of hereing the same nasty comments again and again. im glad im not the only one whos getting bored of it as i wasnt sure i was going to post in the rabbit section again for a good long while. Lets hope it will end, theres no need for it.


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## Guest (Aug 5, 2009)

cassie01 said:


> this is funny i didnt come on yeaterday because certain threads and people have been getting me down lately, im just sick of hereing the same nasty comments again and again. im glad im not the only one whos getting bored of it as i wasnt sure i was going to post in the rabbit section again for a good long while. Lets hope it will end, theres no need for it.


been nice warm day today:smilewinkgrin:


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## cassie01 (Jul 11, 2008)

borderer said:


> been nice warm day today:smilewinkgrin:


i know my dogs have loved it!! wasnt trying to start anything btw, just wanted to say im glad its sorted and i hope things can stay nice from now on!! i always miss the arguments lol especially in the dog chat!! so annoying but at least i get to stay out of it.


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## Jazzy (Apr 15, 2009)

borderer said:


> been nice warm day today:smilewinkgrin:


:laugh:

Could have done without the flying ants though.:


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## petforum (Oct 30, 2007)

Hi All,

Thanks to everyone who's contributed and written the new rabbit information thread which is now a sticky in this section.

This contains lots of excellent information for rabbit owners and new and existing members of the rabbit forum section, including recommended sizes for rabbit hutches, rabbit runs etc..

If new members join who dont have the recommended size hutches etc... please refer them to the sticky and try to educate them in a good positive way.


Thanks everyone


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## frags (Feb 5, 2009)

petforum said:


> Hi All,
> 
> Thanks to everyone who's contributed and written the new rabbit information thread which is now a sticky in this section.
> 
> ...


thank you mark for all your help and advice.


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## hazyreality (Jan 11, 2009)

as frags said, thanks Mark for helping out and making this forum a nice place to be 

*Heidi*


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