# Did I stress him out too much?



## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Hi, I'm new here. I just started my journey on syrian hamster ownership and found this place to be an excellent place for advice!

I have a worry that I hope someone can help me or tell me how I should approach this.

Tonight I came home to my hamster and he was active for a while so I gave him some food and a treat stick. He ran on the wheel for a while and as he went off to eat his treat stick I heard and thunk and he was just lying still. He had his head in the paper tube and I thought he died. When. I tried to investigate he jumped and squeaked at me aggressively. Did I stress him out too much? I am so scared of getting him wet tail or my home is unsuitable for him. Will he forever hate me? Please help! :'(
He has come out of his house but is super still and won't go do anything I'm super worried about him 

Thank you in advance

Edit:
I think the dehumidifier noise was a bit too much for him. I have moved it around the corner and moved him into a corner and placed a pillow and cardboard around the back of his cage to try to minimise the sound and vibration noise. He's come back out of his house and is now rabbidly running on the wheel. Fingers crossed I wake up to less watery windows and a happy hamster...


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

He may have fell off a shelf/bars/wheel and scared himself. Kind of like if we fall over we kind of sit/lie there for a bit to process what's happened and to determine if we're hurt. Same sort of thing.

How long have you had him? How long has he been in the room with the dehumidifier? 

It's likely he just scared himself silly so I wouldn't worry 

I have 4 hams so if you need any help just shout. 

What's his cage setup like? Can I have a photo? As you're new to hamster ownership there may be a few things you may not be aware of. For example proper cage size, proper wheel size. Safe bedding and toys etc.


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> He may have fell off a shelf/bars/wheel and scared himself. Kind of like if we fall over we kind of sit/lie there for a bit to process what's happened and to determine if we're hurt. Same sort of thing.
> 
> How long have you had him? How long has he been in the room with the dehumidifier?
> 
> ...


Thank you so much for coming back to me on this. I had him since Saturday and I thought I read up all I could and have prepared myself for it. I had the dehumidifier since last night and he ran all night on the wheel with the dehumidifier on slightly further away and I put cardboard around his cage to try to isolate him from the sound. I even bought sound proofing foam for that (arriving in a couple days time) so that I can have the washing machine on over the weekend etc. I really want to be able to take great care of him, I know my studio isn't the most amazing place and I am ready to engineer it to suit him.
The cage is a large cage from Pets at Home and said to be Syrian ok, about 55cm long, 30cm wide and 20cm deep I think...I will add a picture when I get home tonight. He's got a few chew and wooden toys and a paper tube from Pets at Home too.
I am looking at a larger silent wheel for him, since he's Syrian and the wheel with the cage is just shy of 7 inches it is just ok for him for now and I want something he can grow into. Any silent spinner suggestions?
Also how much is 10g of hamster feed for him if using Harry Hamster Tasty Mix? I have so many questions! Sorry!!!

Thank you again!

Also I am still looking for a name for him....


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

Knighterist said:


> Thank you so much for coming back to me on this. I had him since Saturday and I thought I read up all I could and have prepared myself for it. I had the dehumidifier since last night and he ran all night on the wheel with the dehumidifier on slightly further away and I put cardboard around his cage to try to isolate him from the sound. I even bought sound proofing foam for that (arriving in a couple days time) so that I can have the washing machine on over the weekend etc. I really want to be able to take great care of him, I know my studio isn't the most amazing place and I am ready to engineer it to suit him.
> The cage is a large cage from Pets at Home and said to be Syrian ok, about 55cm long, 30cm wide and 20cm deep I think...I will add a picture when I get home tonight. He's got a few chew and wooden toys and a paper tube from Pets at Home too.
> I am looking at a larger silent wheel for him, since he's Syrian and the wheel with the cage is just shy of 7 inches it is just ok for him for now and I want something he can grow into. Any silent spinner suggestions?
> Also how much is 10g of hamster feed for him if using Harry Hamster Tasty Mix? I have so many questions! Sorry!!!
> ...


Hello,

I recommend this wheel: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Kaytee-Spi...1433421&sprefix=silent+spinner,aps,220&sr=8-1


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Ok the cage is too small. 80x50cm is the minimum size agreed upon. You could get a indoor rabbit cage and mesh the bars. You're right about the wheel, biggest size I've seen a pet shop stock is 7". I'll link below the one my lot use.

Sawdust/woodshavings is controversial but generally advised against as the phenols (what give pine the smell) are toxic and can cause resp issues. Kiln dried can be reactivated when urinated one, again releasing phenols. I'd suggest paper bedding carefresh or Kaytee clean and cosy. Amazon sell fitch in huge bags as well as megazorb (wood pulp) and aubiose (hemp marketed for horses).

For the meantime I'd fill the base to the top with bedding. Shredded plain paper and tissue will work as bedding materials too. I'll add photos of my setups below, if you see something that you like I'll find a link for it or tell you where I got it from.

As for the mix I'd suggest getting some electronic kitchen scales. Not only to weigh food but to also weigh your ham. I'd aim for 1-2 times a month. Any drastic change in weight can be a sign of problems before they become obvious. Adult Syrians (6+ months) are anywhere between 150g-250g.

Don't worry about all the questions, it's the best way to learn  as for names...as soon as I saw the pic I thought pipsqueak or Pablo. Just ideas 

He may not be used to the noises of the household yet, that'll come with time. My robo had a mini heart attack when I first used the hoover, now he doesn't batter an eyelid. Take your time, it's all new to him, he will adjust.

The wheel: Trixie 61011 Rotating Ferris Wheel Hamsters, Plastic, ø28 cm, Assortment: Random Colors https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00365P9NY/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_P4BqEb5V5BXQZ


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Thank you everyone so far! I got super worried he will hurt his back overnight and popped into pets at home and they recommended a fly n saucer which I obviously bought because I wanted a silent wheel asap and wanted to make sure he's not hurting his back tonight. It doesn't bend his back upwards but he now runs at an angle! He seems to be enjoying it (until dehumidifier came on I guess).
Regarding cage size Pets at home assured me that the cage size is fine. I think I'll give him a little while in this one before getting a bigger one since I'm still home furnishing tetrising for a good spot for him (seriously I moved the bed and everything around on my own just for him).

Regarding his cage layout I feel the new saucer definitely has a huge foot print...









I'm still trying to find the best place to put him...I have placed him in a quiet corner which I hope will isolate him from the noises of the bathroom fan and dehumidifier. The problem is I am trying to deal with my landlord's denial of a damp issue as well and I think he doesn't like that noise at all since he stopped playing now...

Regarding the bedding, I got wood chippings in bales for substrate and paper shreds as bedding. The same as he has lived in during his time at Pets at Home...I thought maybe it would make it one less thing for him to stress and get used to it I keep to the kinda substrate and bedding he is used to and know...

I got a better picture maybe of him, he seems to be ok with me opening the cage door and taking pictures of his handsome self...








He looks like marble textured...Anyone think the name Marble would suit him or does it just not to off the tongue as well as Ham or Hammy?

Thank you again!!!


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

I'll reply propaly tomorrow, but just wanted to say I love the name Marble.


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

ForestWomble said:


> I'll reply propaly tomorrow, but just wanted to say I love the name Marble.


Thank you! I shall call him Marble!


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

We can only advise you, we can't tell you what to do. Not everyone has the space or money in the beginning or its circumstances so don't worry.

Pets at home advice is a bit iffy. They told me the metal bar gerbilarium (their small one) would be fine for him as well as a mouse cage...I wouldn't even fit all his things in there  as I said they're there to sell you a product and their knowledge is out of date. They've tried to sell me fluffy bedding and said if he couldn't reach the water bottle don't bother putting it in just throw in some kiwi everyday o.o 

As I mentioned pine is controversial some say kiln dried is safe, others say it's not. If it works for you it works  in time I'd still upgrade the cage. When everything is sorted as you won't be able to fit a 11" wheel in the current cage.

Marble sound like a great name


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

Knighterist said:


> Thank you everyone so far! I got super worried he will hurt his back overnight and popped into pets at home and they recommended a fly n saucer which I obviously bought because I wanted a silent wheel asap and wanted to make sure he's not hurting his back tonight. It doesn't bend his back upwards but he now runs at an angle! He seems to be enjoying it (until dehumidifier came on I guess).
> Regarding cage size Pets at home assured me that the cage size is fine. I think I'll give him a little while in this one before getting a bigger one since I'm still home furnishing tetrising for a good spot for him (seriously I moved the bed and everything around on my own just for him).
> 
> Regarding his cage layout I feel the new saucer definitely has a huge foot print...
> ...


The wood chips and paper bedding are fine, minus one hamster I've used wood chips with all my hamsters and gerbils and never had a problem, I feel that wood shavings are the best option, unless the individual has an allergy to it of course, as I found paper substrate which I used for one hamster was smellier and had to be changed more frequently, also I feel the hamsters and gerbils can make better tunnels in wood shavings. 

Keeping Marble in his current set up for a while is fine, but I would recemmened getting a bigger cage as soon as you can, as he is stressed at the moment keeping changes to a minimum is what you need to do, hopefully having placed him in a quiet corner he will get used to the noise of the dehumidifier after a while.

How is Marble today?


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Thank you for all the advice! I woke up to the pitter patter of Marble thundering away on the wheel this morning! He is so happy with that wheel I think more than the old one.

I did chicken out last night and bought new bedding off Amazon (Kaytee clean & cozy, apparently pets love the softness). So maybe he can have cozier evenings (I've left storage heater running all day and night for him and I installed new DIY curtains to hopefully help keep my home warm for him. I got so worried it got cold last night that I chucked a whole load of paper bedding into his cage.

Just now he was standing on the same spot for ages after he chattered his teeth beforehand. I went through the whole "omg what did I do wrong is he unwell/scared/stressed?" So I turned off dehumidifier and I popped two pieces of carrots in his cage and he bounced onto it swiftly...I topped up his dish and he was sniffing my hand as I put the dish back in. Is he being picky or greedy? There was still food in his dish and he jumped right into the bowl when I put it in?! I thought since he's got food already surely he isn't hungry but he was so eager to get his bowl filled! He has picked out the good stuff like sunflower seeds and green biscuit bits but left a lot of stuff in the bowl so was just just wanting the "good stuff"?

I think he's still insecure about the dehumidifier and bathroom fan sounds since I turned it back on and he's back to standing still  I guess I'll have to run it for a little bit every night and a bit more and more rather than as a constant thing. Also that being pretty inactive outside his little house should it be a cause of concern? I read many people say that hamster not curious of surroundings etc is a bad sign or sign of illness. :O

I have stuck some foam into a piece of cardboard and put that around the side of his cage that faces the room, a bit like his privacy screen...Would that make him feel too isolated and not want to be friends with me? Or maybe he'll get bored looking at cardboard scenery?

I never asked what are your hamsters called and what are they like?


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

One thing you'll learn with hamsters is there's no such thing as too much bedding! He'll probably be very snuggly in it and make a nest and you won't see him for a while. But that's normal.

Chattering the teeth has many meanings. Sometimes it can be that they're not happy about something. Or simply wearing their teeth down. Or a clicking sound means that they're happy. Note this clicking sound is different if it's because of resp issues.

The standing still means he feels threatened but if they're like a meerkat when they do it, it means they're trying to figure out whats going on.

Oh food bowl, rookie mistake which every hamster owner is guilty of. Don't refil the bowl until it's COMPLETELY empty. This will force them to eat the bits they're not keen on. Sunflower seeds are very fatty hence why they like them. 

Everything is new to him at the moment so him being hidden away and not coming out much is pretty normal... I didn't Niko much for the first couple of weeks and I rarely saw Ghost. He just needs time to settle. 

Personally I wouldn't have bothered with the screen. May work for the settling in period though help dampen the sound and eventually he won't need it.

Niko my robo is so laid back he's practically horizontal. Complete opposite of what a robo should be. Very friendly and will happily sit on your shoulder while you watch TV. He craves human interaction.

Lilith is one of my female Syrians and she too loves human interaction. When I first got her she was very skittish but now she's chill and is very curious to what's going on.

Ghost is skittish at the moment but we have some nice cuddles when he's feeling brave. Getting there slowly with him. He's a Syrian.

Athena is my other female Syrian and she's quite vocal, especially when in heat (which is every 4 days with hamsters). She was quite shy when I got her but will now come to the door and jump out onto my lap. She's quite active and likes lots of enrichment as she gets bored easily.


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> One thing you'll learn with hamsters is there's no such thing as too much bedding! He'll probably be very snuggly in it and make a nest and you won't see him for a while. But that's normal.
> 
> Chattering the teeth has many meanings. Sometimes it can be that they're not happy about something. Or simply wearing their teeth down. Or a clicking sound means that they're happy. Note this clicking sound is different if it's because of resp issues.
> 
> ...


I think he was scared or something because of all the noise I turned it all off last night and I figured maybe I need to lay off a little like not going to try to interact with him so much when I get home maybe he's still trying to settle in. He seems to get very still when I try to approach him sometimes so maybe he just feels that I'm too much. It's the first week so I think maybe I need to really just back off to just a daily hi and a treat.

How did you manage to tame your hammy family? I feel that maybe I'm going about it wrong and so Marble doesn't like me lurking about him. I read a long lost somewhere that you can leave a scented (of self) tissue in his cage and he can get used to your smell...Are tissues safe with hammies? Will that be too "dusty"?

Oh that food bowl I will not give him more tonight xD I felt so conned by Marble!!!! I did give him fresh water last night and replaced a bit of bedding I'm the corners of the cage since I thought maybe he thinks he smells and he's upset about it.


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Here is what I do for taming. I can't say if one thing works better than the other. I always make sure the ham is comfy before going to the next step.

Always put scented (my own) tissue in the cage. Leave ham Alone for 3 days. During this time only refill food and water as needed. Talk to hamster so they get used to your voice.

After, put your hand in the cage with food on it, wait a couple of minutes if ham doesnt approach, pop treat on the ground and leave. Do this a couple of times a day until ham gets curious and comes over and takes the treat off your hand.

From there try scooping ham up slowly then go from there


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> Here is what I do for taming. I can't say if one thing works better than the other. I always make sure the ham is comfy before going to the next step.
> 
> Always put scented (my own) tissue in the cage. Leave ham Alone for 3 days. During this time only refill food and water as needed. Talk to hamster so they get used to your voice.
> 
> ...


Ohh the tissue trick...I have been "wearing" a tissue all day...Going to it in his cage tonight. Should I just rip off a piece of the tissue I'm wearing and put that in there and contunue to "wear" the tissue? (Now that I wrote it out I think out of context it sounds gross and weird...The things I do for Marble...)

Edit: guys I'm worried about Marble...He hasn't come out of his house today after running around the wheel this morning...I am wondering if it has something to do with the standing still thing...I heard some scratch noises but not sure if it's my junk in the room I'm quietly moving or its him  is he going to be ok? I've put tissue in there already.

Edit 2: nose spotted poking out of the mass of bedding he has stuffed into his little house sniffing loudly and going back in. Marble's alive!!


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Nah just put the whole tissue in and add some more in a few days.

Don't worry about not seeing him you probably did hear him moving about. Hamsters do sleep a lot and mostly during the day. Just leave him be, if you disturb him and wake him up you'll make him grumpy and more likely to bite...that's how I got bit by ghost...hamsters aren't morning people. He can hear you, it's all part of the process. It's fine, honestly.


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> Nah just put the whole tissue in and add some more in a few days.
> 
> Don't worry about not seeing him you probably did hear him moving about. Hamsters do sleep a lot and mostly during the day. Just leave him be, if you disturb him and wake him up you'll make him grumpy and more likely to bite...that's how I got bit by ghost...hamsters aren't morning people. He can hear you, it's all part of the process. It's fine, honestly.


I read him a book as well very softly...It's 7pm ish so I was half expecting him to be getting to his daily hamster business such as conning me into giving him fresh food and running his wheel :s
Haha I got bit by him already once in the shops when I wanted to see how his temperament is to strangers and once when I was told I can handle him on day 2 ([email protected] maybe I shouldn't have believed that...My fault).

Edit: he's now sitting on his wheel munching on last night's carrot chunk...Yea Marble, don't waste food!


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Yeah. It depends on the individual Hamster. More confident ones you can start to handle sooner. Niko would take food off me on day 3, ghost didn't do it until day 9. Ghost has only just started to come to the bars when I'm there and come out voluntarily, Ive had him a month. Sometimes it's slow progress and that's ok. 

You'll find that each ham has a different routine and it will change between now and when he's settled in. I only really heard Athena and Lilith at night when I first got them. Now I know Lilith will get up mid afternoon and go back to bed around 6pm and will then be back up at 11-12 and will go to bed at 8am.

Niko is different. He was more active at night when I first got him. Now I know he'll be up 10am to midday, then again at 4-5pm and will get up at 11pm and be running all night until 5-6am.


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> Yeah. It depends on the individual Hamster. More confident ones you can start to handle sooner. Niko would take food off me on day 3, ghost didn't do it until day 9. Ghost has only just started to come to the bars when I'm there and come out voluntarily, Ive had him a month. Sometimes it's slow progress and that's ok.
> 
> You'll find that each ham has a different routine and it will change between now and when he's settled in. I only really heard Athena and Lilith at night when I first got them. Now I know Lilith will get up mid afternoon and go back to bed around 6pm and will then be back up at 11-12 and will go to bed at 8am.
> 
> Niko is different. He was more active at night when I first got him. Now I know he'll be up 10am to midday, then again at 4-5pm and will get up at 11pm and be running all night until 5-6am.


Oh wow I am so ignorant at this...Genuinely thought it was like nocturnal as in night comes and he's like party time! 
So far I've been getting off work around 6 but running cross town getting more and more DIY or hamster related stuff and get back by 8 something so tonight I was early and freaked when I didn't hear much or see him.
I guess I need to observe him more and learn more...You know your hamsters so well!!!
Right now hrs staring blankly at outside world at the top shelf of his cage. Not sure if he is scared of my scent and avoiding my tissue that I put in the middle of his cage...:s


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Knighterist said:


> Oh wow I am so ignorant at this...Genuinely thought it was like nocturnal as in night comes and he's like party time!
> So far I've been getting off work around 6 but running cross town getting more and more DIY or hamster related stuff and get back by 8 something so tonight I was early and freaked when I didn't hear much or see him.
> I guess I need to observe him more and learn more...You know your hamsters so well!!!
> Right now hrs staring blankly at outside world at the top shelf of his cage. Not sure if he is scared of my scent and avoiding my tissue that I put in the middle of his cage...:s


You're not wrong. Nocturnal means active at night. In the wild hamsters would be nocturnal, excluding the roborovski which is crepuscular, which means awake at dawn and dusk. It's how they've managed to adapt in the wild. They're mainly desert animals or living on the edge of deserts in semi vegetative habitats.

Syrians became domesticated in 1930s. While the uk first saw robos in the early 90s. They can adapt to our routines. There's no threat to stop them coming out during the day 

They only way to know them is to observe and spend time with them! He's probably curious to what's going on. He'll get used to the tissue don't worry :3 he's probably thinking what is it and How'd it get there?!


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> You're not wrong. Nocturnal means active at night. In the wild hamsters would be nocturnal, excluding the roborovski which is crepuscular, which means awake at dawn and dusk. It's how they've managed to adapt in the wild. They're mainly desert animals or living on the edge of deserts in semi vegetative habitats.
> 
> Syrians became domesticated in 1930s. While the uk first saw robos in the early 90s. They can adapt to our routines. There's no threat to stop them coming out during the day
> 
> They only way to know them is to observe and spend time with them! He's probably curious to what's going on. He'll get used to the tissue don't worry :3 he's probably thinking what is it and How'd it get there?!


You know so .Much about them! Thank you so much for teaching me so patiently. I went to get dinner (late I know xD more room rearrangements took too long) and bought some precut curly kale. Washed a prime piece for him and he seems happy about it...He's running on his saucer and occasionally taking a bite...Until it got flung behind him and I think he's looking for that piece of kale every time he stops wondering what happened to his tasty kale!


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Knighterist said:


> You know so .Much about them! Thank you so much for teaching me so patiently. I went to get dinner (late I know xD more room rearrangements took too long) and bought some precut curly kale. Washed a prime piece for him and he seems happy about it...He's running on his saucer and occasionally taking a bite...Until it got flung behind him and I think he's looking for that piece of kale every time he stops wondering what happened to his tasty kale!


I know quite a bit but I still have a lot to learn. Knowledge evolves. I've learnt through experience and talking to other more experienced owners. Reading until my brain turns to goo and just watching hamsters.

YouTubers I highly recommend watching are:
-Erins animals
-Munchies place
-Victoria Rachael
-Hopping Hammy

It's no problem. Any more questions feel free to ask. My lot love kale. Don't give too much though as it may upset his tum as it's a new food. Maybe just give a little bit every couple of days to begin with.


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> I know quite a bit but I still have a lot to learn. Knowledge evolves. I've learnt through experience and talking to other more experienced owners. Reading until my brain turns to goo and just watching hamsters.
> 
> YouTubers I highly recommend watching are:
> -Erins animals
> ...


Oh I saw Victoria Rachel that's where I heard not to feed them too many new stuff!
He finished the kale I think. He's gotten even faster on the wheel and looked like he was slipping off it. I got scared his little hands get caught between the wheel and the ramp so I moved it slightly at an angle now hes gone and burrowed under it and popped back up. His butt is very cute. 









Edit: I adjusted it back because he seemed to want to dig under the wheel and when I moved it back he hopped on almost instantly and back to running speedily on it. Having said that he did wait around for me to adjust it back and passed my arm and I felt hamster hair first time ever, it's so freaking soft! I can almost cry of happiness of knowing the softness of Marble's fur! And he also stepped in my hand briefly deciding if he wanted to bypass me via cage or under me.

Edit:
He must have tired himself out on the wheel...Or that's his routine lately of around midnight he just goes quiet and rest maybe and he is doing it outside his house tonight I guess. He looks so peaceful I am less inclined to think that he is ill or stressed...


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Guys, I just noticed a little patch on Marble...Is he ok? It looks a bit like patch missing and area of fur around there is a bit damp...What should I do?









 I'm so sorry Marble


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

Knighterist said:


> Guys, I just noticed a little patch on Marble...Is he ok? It looks a bit like patch missing and area of fur around there is a bit damp...What should I do?
> View attachment 431364
> 
> 
> I'm so sorry Marble


Keep an eye on him tomorrow and I'd get him a vet appointment on Monday.

Here's some info about fur loss: 
https://collingswoodvethospital.com/2015/02/01/cherry-hill-vet-reasons-fur-loss-hamsters/


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

ForestWomble said:


> Keep an eye on him tomorrow and I'd get him a vet appointment on Monday.
> 
> Here's some info about fur loss:
> https://collingswoodvethospital.com/2015/02/01/cherry-hill-vet-reasons-fur-loss-hamsters/


Thank you so much. I think that patch has been on him since he came home with me but I just thought maybe he just licked it or something...I guess I'll book a vet appointment.
Just to get myself prepared for it, about how much are vet appointments like these in general? I have never been to vets :s


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

Knighterist said:


> Thank you so much. I think that patch has been on him since he came home with me but I just thought maybe he just licked it or something...I guess I'll book a vet appointment.
> Just to get myself prepared for it, about how much are vet appointments like these in general? I have never been to vets :s


It might be nothing, but its worth getting these things checked 

As for cost, it depends on the practise I'm afraid, ask when you book the appointment what the consultation fee is, remembering that you may need to pay for any treatment on top of that.


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

ForestWomble said:


> It might be nothing, but its worth getting these things checked
> 
> As for cost, it depends on the practise I'm afraid, ask when you book the appointment what the consultation fee is, remembering that you may need to pay for any treatment on top of that.


>< I see...I'm a bit scared of the costs since I have never had a pet and gone to the vets. I am also worried that I am still so green with Marble I don't know how hell take it if I need to medicate him


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

Knighterist said:


> >< I see...I'm a bit scared of the costs since I have never had a pet and gone to the vets. I am also worried that I am still so green with Marble I don't know how hell take it if I need to medicate him


I'm trying to remember how much it cost when I had to take any of my Syrians to the vet, I have a feeling you'd be looking at around £10 - £30 possibly, maybe less, could be more, it's partially going to depend where you are as some areas will be more expensive than others.

Try not to worry, I've only had to medicate one hamster and I just hid her medication in a very small amount of baby food which she loved, she lapped it right up (very small amount to make sure she ate it in one sitting)


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

ForestWomble said:


> I'm trying to remember how much it cost when I had to take any of my Syrians to the vet, I have a feeling you'd be looking at around £10 - £30 possibly, maybe less, could be more, it's partially going to depend where you are as some areas will be more expensive than others.
> 
> Try not to worry, I've only had to medicate one hamster and I just hid her medication in a very small amount of baby food which she loved, she lapped it right up (very small amount to make sure she ate it in one sitting)


Thank you so much for the encouragement! I really worry a lot like maybe I am not fit to take care of Marble or my home is not suitable for him.
I would guess I'm in an expensive area...:s but if it is less than £50 I would be most relieved!

What baby food did you use? Marble only comes to get the kale I hold and he isn't jumping away when I go and fix the wheel where my hand passes over him...So I am not sure if he will accept baby food :s

Edit: I just had another look at Marble on the side and I don't see the patch as obvious! I have a sneaky suspicion that maybe he squeezes past the water bottle to get up the platform instead of the ramp and sometimes a drop of water at the water bottle gets caught onto his side. I have rotated the bottle now, I hope that's what causing the damp bald spot.
In other news I lured him out with a small piece of kale (ok he's getting a bit more kale today but he's been the goodest boy today with the cage clean!) to have a good look at him and he came and ate it off my hand with one hand on my hand and he gave me a gentle nip on my finger too before and after taking the kale. That 20 second just made my weekend I am holding back tears of joy!


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

That worry shows you are the right person, if you didn't care, you wouldn't worry. You will relax more as you gain in confidence and learn his little ways etc. 
I can't promise, but I would imagine it wouldn't be higher than £50.

Oh gosh, I don't remember the brand I'm afraid, but I do remember I used one which was pure banana and another was apple, pear and banana. 
If you have to give any medication just put a small amount of baby food on something easily cleanable that you can use just for Marble, put the prescribed dose on the food, give it a little mix and place it in his cage. 
I used to get my hamster out and feed her on my lap, but even then I just gave her the mixture in a little hamster food bowl, as you can't hold him yet popping it in and then removing the bowl or whatever you use will be fine.


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

ForestWomble said:


> That worry shows you are the right person, if you didn't care, you wouldn't worry. You will relax more as you gain in confidence and learn his little ways etc.
> I can't promise, but I would imagine it wouldn't be higher than £50.
> 
> Oh gosh, I don't remember the brand I'm afraid, but I do remember I used one which was pure banana and another was apple, pear and banana.
> ...


Thank you again for the kind words.
I will see if I can get a vet appointment next week though with work during the day I will have to get an evening appointment :S I registered to a clinic just now and hope that I can give them a ring on Monday.
Hmmm, the apple kind of baby food it's like the puree ones I guess with no extra this and that added in...Then again maybe I can puree apples...Marble has made me go great lengths for any and everything xD


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## ForestWomble (May 2, 2013)

Knighterist said:


> Thank you again for the kind words.
> I will see if I can get a vet appointment next week though with work during the day I will have to get an evening appointment :S I registered to a clinic just now and hope that I can give them a ring on Monday.
> Hmmm, the apple kind of baby food it's like the puree ones I guess with no extra this and that added in...Then again maybe I can puree apples...Marble has made me go great lengths for any and everything xD


No problem 

Hope it goes well on Monday.

That will probably be better to just puree some veg or/and fruit, that way you know it's fine.
I think you can purree kale? (Not sure, never had kale )


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

ForestWomble said:


> No problem
> 
> Hope it goes well on Monday.
> 
> ...


Thanks again! I am having difficulties spotting the patch he had...I seriously wonder if it is really just the water bottle like you know a drop of water sits at the spout and he passes by and that rubs off. Because the spot looks a bit damp...I'll see if my small change in water bottle direction would help make the difference. Marble has now until Monday to let me know if it is the case!

I wonder about kale puree...Maybe you'd need to cook the kale and then blitz it, but I think it's a bit too fibreful to do puree, apples are more damp to give that puree texture. Or maybe, mix in finely chopping kale into apple puree?! Might be some hamster gourmet there...!


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Umm guys...I think it's his scent glands...it's ok he's rubbed up against something. They have one on each side


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> Umm guys...I think it's his scent glands...it's ok he's rubbed up against something. They have one on each side


Omg I just googled and the location looks just like where he has the baldish spot! I feel super amateur now to have been panicking about a scent gland! *Facepalm*
Marble is super grateful for his guardian angels here!!!

He has been burrowing in the new bedding and he hasn't used his wheel at all today :S guess he's too preoccupied with the new super soft and cosy bedding tonight...


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Knighterist said:


> Omg I just googled and the location looks just like where he has the baldish spot! I feel super amateur now to have been panicking about a scent gland! *Facepalm*
> Marble is super grateful for his guardian angels here!!!
> 
> He has been burrowing in the new bedding and he hasn't used his wheel at all today :S guess he's too preoccupied with the new super soft and cosy bedding tonight...


Don't worry. A lot of people go to the vets because they've found a lump or hair loss in the same area. You're not alone in thinking that.

He's probably enjoying burrowing and nest building.


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> Don't worry. A lot of people go to the vets because they've found a lump or hair loss in the same area. You're not alone in thinking that.
> 
> He's probably enjoying burrowing and nest building.


I think he does like it quite a lot! I woke up after having a weird dream about Marble travelling with me, and I saw the water bottle was empty. Turns out he must have stood on it overnight and it slid down from the holder and the ball valve got dislodged and all the water came out and into the bedding. I had to change a quarter of his new bedding from that...:S I guess bottle design wasn't the best...
He was very good when I took off the top half to replace bedding and didn't escape! Once I was done he borrowed under the wheel and slept there


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Knighterist said:


> I think he does like it quite a lot! I woke up after having a weird dream about Marble travelling with me, and I saw the water bottle was empty. Turns out he must have stood on it overnight and it slid down from the holder and the ball valve got dislodged and all the water came out and into the bedding. I had to change a quarter of his new bedding from that...:S I guess bottle design wasn't the best...
> He was very good when I took off the top half to replace bedding and didn't escape! Once I was done he borrowed under the wheel and slept there


I think I know what bottle you have and they suck. Hamster just needs to knock it slightly and it'll drop. Also if it's full it'll drop. It's a real poor design.

Have you ever thought about using a water bowl? A lot of people think that hamsters must use a bottle and that's how it has been for decades. But, they can use a water bowl too. My lot, including my tiny roborovski, use a water bowl. You have to change it everyday maybe multiple times a day if bedding gets in it.


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> I think I know what bottle you have and they suck. Hamster just needs to knock it slightly and it'll drop. Also if it's full it'll drop. It's a real poor design.
> 
> Have you ever thought about using a water bowl? A lot of people think that hamsters must use a bottle and that's how it has been for decades. But, they can use a water bowl too. My lot, including my tiny roborovski, use a water bowl. You have to change it everyday maybe multiple times a day if bedding gets in it.


I read that water bowls difficult because they can tip it over and wet the cage and themselves. I'm not sure how Marble would handle it...He's already dislodged the wheel so much from burrowing last night that it woke me up from it hitting things XD (I'm avoiding the word clumsy here since Marble is still new to things...).
How do you place things on bedding so they don't fly off when your hammy goes for a good borrow?


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Knighterist said:


> I read that water bowls difficult because they can tip it over and wet the cage and themselves. I'm not sure how Marble would handle it...He's already dislodged the wheel so much from burrowing last night that it woke me up from it hitting things XD (I'm avoiding the word clumsy here since Marble is still new to things...).
> How do you place things on bedding so they don't fly off when your hammy goes for a good borrow?


I use tealight holders and I have them on a shelf so bedding doesn't move it. I'd have a shallow end of bedding in fact just put enough to cover the base of the wheel and have the wheel directly on the cage floor.


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> I use tealight holders and I have them on a shelf so bedding doesn't move it. I'd have a shallow end of bedding in fact just put enough to cover the base of the wheel and have the wheel directly on the cage floor.


I see! Thank you so much for the advice, I will make some adjustments this weekend. The Alaska cage should be arriving today and it is much bigger than his current cage so I should be able to fit things better in there for Marble!


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Knighterist said:


> I see! Thank you so much for the advice, I will make some adjustments this weekend. The Alaska cage should be arriving today and it is much bigger than his current cage so I should be able to fit things better in there for Marble!


If you do try to use a water bowl still offer the bottle too until he's just drinking from the bowl


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> If you do try to use a water bowl still offer the bottle too until he's just drinking from the bowl


Omg this bottle is unreal. It has been dripping like mad!!! I changed the bedding around but once again. I am offering the bowl and see if Marble will drink from it. The bottle really is doing my head it, it just leaks more and more! I can't let Marble have damp bedding from this lousy bottle!!! He has so far investigated the bowl...Maybe I didn't fill it enough he leaned in and then went back to grooming and staring at his toys.

On the bright side, I realised maybe Marble self potty trained! I found he's got this little tray on his cage and the bedding in there that he hasn't dug into it yet was a bit damp! He must have been peeing in there!


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Knighterist said:


> Omg this bottle is unreal. It has been dripping like mad!!! I changed the bedding around but once again. I am offering the bowl and see if Marble will drink from it. The bottle really is doing my head it, it just leaks more and more! I can't let Marble have damp bedding from this lousy bottle!!! He has so far investigated the bowl...Maybe I didn't fill it enough he leaned in and then went back to grooming and staring at his toys.
> 
> On the bright side, I realised maybe Marble self potty trained! I found he's got this little tray on his cage and the bedding in there that he hasn't dug into it yet was a bit damp! He must have been peeing in there!


He'll get the idea soon. What have you used as a bowl? Can I have a pic of his set up now?

Syrians are pretty good at toilet training tbh. They're very house proud. All mine have a corner but you will need to dispose of soiled areas either everyday or every other day. Don't over clean though as this can cause him to mark more making it smell more.


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> He'll get the idea soon. What have you used as a bowl? Can I have a pic of his set up now?
> 
> Syrians are pretty good at toilet training tbh. They're very house proud. All mine have a corner but you will need to dispose of soiled areas either everyday or every other day. Don't over clean though as this can cause him to mark more making it smell more.


Funny thing is that the tub wasn't even in a corner and I guess he just liked peeing in a tub!

I got a ceramic bowl with the Alaska cage to get free shipping. I've put it on the level like you suggested. He's dipped his paws in there and realised it's water I think. I can't bear the fact that the bottle is leaking in his cage...I am kind of inclined to remove it asap since he gets wet walking past it and surely that's not good for him at all!  He also was doing some scratches a bit earlier on so maybe something affecting him  his coat looks fine and not flaky or losing fur (minus my mistake for the scent gland!).


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Knighterist said:


> Funny thing is that the tub wasn't even in a corner and I guess he just liked peeing in a tub!
> 
> I got a ceramic bowl with the Alaska cage to get free shipping. I've put it on the level like you suggested. He's dipped his paws in there and realised it's water I think. I can't bear the fact that the bottle is leaking in his cage...I am kind of inclined to remove it asap since he gets wet walking past it and surely that's not good for him at all!  He also was doing some scratches a bit earlier on so maybe something affecting him  his coat looks fine and not flaky or losing fur (minus my mistake for the scent gland!).
> View attachment 431485


Maybe. Is there different bedding in the tub or is there sand? Has it got a lid? My one girl pees in a jar that's half burried.

That bowl is cute. You have enough water in there and it's placement is perfect. Initially they'll try standing in it before they realise that water is in fact wet. They'll normally groom themselves after that too. Leave the bottle in there until he's 100% comfortable with the bowl. You could try wrapping the holder with string and take it under the spout like a sling to try and stop it slipping but your ham will chew through it 

Lots of hams brush up against their bottles. Providing your room doesn't drop below 15°C, he'll be fine.

Woodshavings can cause itching but it's likely it's because hes got some water on him.

Don't worry about it. You're doing fine


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> Maybe. Is there different bedding in the tub or is there sand? Has it got a lid? My one girl pees in a jar that's half burried.
> 
> That bowl is cute. You have enough water in there and it's placement is perfect. Initially they'll try standing in it before they realise that water is in fact wet. They'll normally groom themselves after that too. Leave the bottle in there until he's 100% comfortable with the bowl. You could try wrapping the holder with string and take it under the spout like a sling to try and stop it slipping but your ham will chew through it
> 
> ...


Thank you Engel!
I have added some bedding in the tub before I just thought he liked chilling in the tub and scratching at it...Turns out I've been watching him pee! XD

That's precisely what I thought of the bowl when I got it, it looks super cute with the hamster shapes on it! I love it and wish I ordered one more! I did move it into a corner rather than having a small gap so that Marble doesn't climb over it. He was walking into and climbing over the bowl.

I had to remove the bottle, it drops on its own and last night it fell again probably Marble did something and wetted the bedding around it again! I saw that because the bottle fell and I took it out he went to the bowl and licked it. I gave up with the bottle this morning when I left for work after seeing Marble licking water from the bowl. Hopefully he did ok for the day without the evil drippy bottle :S


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Yeh they'll scratch or dig then park their bum and pee. He'll probably still find an excuse to climb in the bowl. As long as you have seen him drink from the bowl, removing the bottle is fine. Remember that it'll need cleaning and refilling every day and maybe a couple of times a day if it gets mucky. Unlike with a bottle where people leave it days between washing as it holds a lot and is contained away from hammy feet.


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## Knighterist (Feb 10, 2020)

Engel98 said:


> Yeh they'll scratch or dig then park their bum and pee. He'll probably still find an excuse to climb in the bowl. As long as you have seen him drink from the bowl, removing the bottle is fine. Remember that it'll need cleaning and refilling every day and maybe a couple of times a day if it gets mucky. Unlike with a bottle where people leave it days between washing as it holds a lot and is contained away from hammy feet.


Ahhh so that is the "pee wiggle"!
I haven't seen Marble this evening but since I'm cooking he probably is hiding from the noise of the oven etc. I have broccoli and carrot bits ready for him as a treat when he does come out 
I have just also washed the bowl as well waiting for it to dry before refilling and putting it back. Thank you so much for the water bowl tip!


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## Engel98 (Oct 7, 2018)

Knighterist said:


> Ahhh so that is the "pee wiggle"!
> I haven't seen Marble this evening but since I'm cooking he probably is hiding from the noise of the oven etc. I have broccoli and carrot bits ready for him as a treat when he does come out
> I have just also washed the bowl as well waiting for it to dry before refilling and putting it back. Thank you so much for the water bowl tip!


Haha the pee wiggle. No worries


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