# not KC registered



## Jess_king (Feb 17, 2009)

Hiya Guys
Well im buying a cavalier king charles pup from someone off pets4homes and the pups are NOT kc registered, the breeder said they dont register there pups because they dont want then enterted in shows and to be breed.

They do come with there five generation pedigree pappers, 6 weeks free insurance with Petplan, full vet check, worming, a small supply of food and a puppy information pack. 

Also they will not give the pup her first injections.

Now i have been to meet the breeder and the pup and they seem very nice gen people. 

I am just woundering if people think i should trust this breeder coz i will be paying alot of money for the new family member


Thanks xXx


----------



## Tula (Nov 2, 2008)

Jess_king said:


> Hiya Guys
> Well im buying a cavalier king charles pup from someone off pets4homes and the pups are NOT kc registered, the breeder said they dont register there pups because they dont want then enterted in shows and to be breed.
> 
> They do come with there five generation pedigree pappers, 6 weeks free insurance with Petplan, full vet check, worming, a small supply of food and a puppy information pack.
> ...


Pups arent registered but you get a 5-gen pedigree:confused5:
Might I suggest they breed simply for the money.. I smell a rat sorry


----------



## Jess_king (Feb 17, 2009)

the pups mum isnt kc registered infact i dont think any of the dogs are, i was told the only reason there not is because they want the pups to be pets and nothing else


----------



## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

Hmmmmmm

I dont get why people say 'I dont want them to be bred so no KC reg'

Like this somehow 'stops' people from breeding?! 

How much are the pups? £650 sounds right for healthy health checked kc reg pups. Thats how much mine will be and she is a top breeder I have known for a year.

if its Cav make sure it is Eye & Heart & Syringo MRI scanned clear.

Anyone can get 6weeks free insurance arranged crosses/peds 

the injections, well are normally done by new owners but some breeders do it themselves.

5 gen-could be made up? who knows they could have printed it off the Internet what the point in having it if there not reg? 

They might have more than 1 litter per year.........like 2 litters & reg them then one in between & not reg them for a bit of 'money'

Its up to you really! but seeing as though you are asking you are obviously having doubts........

Just read your next post none of them are KC reg..........ah well thats why they dont KC them cos they CANT! 
If they want them to be pets so much why are they bloody breeding them? no...thats a no form me! how do you know that one of them isnt crossed?........!


----------



## Guest (Feb 17, 2009)

That sounds like rubbish, if the pups were kc registered they would be able to put restrictions on the pups to stop them being bred from, DONT buy a pup from them its a poor excuse to make x


----------



## Jess_king (Feb 17, 2009)

she is gonna cost £500 yeah i am having doubts after reading some of the threads on here, the main reason i am having doubts now is i have 2 young kids and i dont want us all the get attched to the new pup for something bad to happen or go wrong, 

also i dont wanna hand over a load of cash to some one out to make a quick pound. 

i really dont know what to do now!!

i must say tho i wanted to take the pup (i keep callin her a pup as we havent got a name for her yet my little girl cant make her mind up) home the other day but the breeder wouldnt let me coz she said she was 2 young and we could have her next month when she's 8weeks.

this is whats so hard theres gd point and bad points i think.


----------



## JANICE199 (Feb 1, 2008)

*Hi there..Personaly KC reg doesnt mean much to me, one of my poodles is not KC reg. but i know his pedigree.*


----------



## Dundee (Oct 20, 2008)

> she is gonna cost £500 yeah


OMG that's a rip off for a non KC registered untested bitch.

Most important thing is health tests - eye, heart and and mri scan for SM. The reality is that few if any non kc dogs are health tested, so for that reason alone it is worth sticking with KC registered dogs (but make sure they are health tested too as not all are).

Oh, and the reasons she gives for not registering them are commonly used by byb and puppy farmers...heard it all before unfortunately.

At the bottom of the KC breed standard page is a list of breed clubs - your best bet would be to contact them they will be able to advise you and most breed clubs also run a puppy register

PS - sorry, I can't see any good points with this breeder - CKCS have possibly more health problems than most breeds, so it is very important that any dogs bred from are health tested (and I mean health tests, not just a health check by the vet).


----------



## Dundee (Oct 20, 2008)

> ..Personaly KC reg doesnt mean much to me, one of my poodles is not KC reg. but i know his pedigree.


Whilst it doesn't matter that KC reg doesn't mean anything the fact is that very, very few non KC registered dogs are health tested. Almost all dogs that are health tested are KC registered (although not all KC registered dogs are health tested). The exceptions tend to be cross breeds anyway. In a breed like CKCS which do suffer health problems it is very important to get a puppy from health tested parents (who will be KC registered).


----------



## Dundee (Oct 20, 2008)

> the pups mum isnt kc registered infact i dont think any of the dogs are, i was told the only reason there not is because they want the pups to be pets and nothing else


So.... they don't register them because they don't want them to be bred from and want them to be pets and nothing else.... and yet they bred from their non registered dogs......

I too smell a rat


----------



## Ejay (Jan 9, 2009)

I can only echo how important finding a good breeder who health tests is, especially with a cavalier. I am sat here at the moment with my 10 month old pup who is extemely ill, she became ill the day i picked her up, and i have had no help or support from her breeder. She appeared to be a very caring lady, however this has somewhat been disproved since.

So many cavaliers suffer from MVD that heart tests are sooooo important, as are eye and MRI scans. All these tests should be done by specialists and the breeder should be able to provide you with the certificates to look through. You my pay another few hundered pounds, but for all the heartache you could go through, i am positive it is worth it ten fold.

My 10 month old cavalier is at a point where we are having to consider whether it is fair to keep her going, she is very poorly. I would hate for anyone to go through the heartache we are at the moment. Please make sure you buy a health tested pup, you will save yourself and your children so much heartache.


----------



## raindog (Jul 1, 2008)

To put it bluntly, I wouldn't touch a non-registered litter with a bargepole - as simple as that.

Mick


----------



## Guest (Feb 17, 2009)

Dundee said:


> So.... they don't register them because they don't want them to be bred from and want them to be pets and nothing else.... and yet they bred from their non registered dogs......
> 
> I too smell a rat


The excuse given as to why they don't KC reg them imo is a load of tosh - there's nothing to stop prospective owners from breeding the pups.
More likely the reason they are not registed is that they are not eligable for KC registration one of the common reasons being that the dogs have been overbreed from -i.e breed to young or too many litters.

The five generation pedigree is pretty worthless also - as basically the breeder can put pretty much anything they like on here . Have you googled any of the Affixes on any of the dogs named on the pedigree?

I was is a very 'difficult' position recently whereby I managed to presuade someone who had looked at an 'iffy' litter to look elsewhere - The lady did end up turning her back on the pups and I often ask myself what right did I have to deprive that pup of a good home To this day I often wish I had kept my opinions to myself, but sadly every pup that is breed and sold by ' shall we just say irresponsible breeders' creates misery for the next litter and the next as so on it goes . At the end of the day, you have seen this pup, the decision has to be yours,

Whatever you decide - looking forward to seeing pictures.
DT


----------



## Jess_king (Feb 17, 2009)

THANK YOU ALL SOOOOOOOOOOO MUCH GLAD I ASKED NOW xXx


----------



## Lucysmom (Feb 13, 2009)

go to the breed clubs spend a bit more and hopefully get a healthy dog.
ask around and dont get that pup

hugs

Rachel and the girlies


----------



## clueless (May 26, 2008)

Jess_king said:


> THANK YOU ALL SOOOOOOOOOOO MUCH GLAD I ASKED NOW xXx


Hopefully you will find a wonderful new Cavy Puppy to add to your family. Research the breed intensely as stated they do have a lot of issues and there is still a lot of Bad Breeders of this lovely Breed out there.
KC may not be the be all and end all but with this breed especially it is a must imo as the KC documents will have health results printed and not just hear say from the Breeder. Good Luck


----------



## noushka05 (Mar 28, 2008)

Ejay said:


> I can only echo how important finding a good breeder who health tests is, especially with a cavalier. I am sat here at the moment with my 10 month old pup who is extemely ill, she became ill the day i picked her up, and i have had no help or support from her breeder. She appeared to be a very caring lady, however this has somewhat been disproved since.
> 
> So many cavaliers suffer from MVD that heart tests are sooooo important, as are eye and MRI scans. All these tests should be done by specialists and the breeder should be able to provide you with the certificates to look through. You my pay another few hundered pounds, but for all the heartache you could go through, i am positive it is worth it ten fold.
> 
> My 10 month old cavalier is at a point where we are having to consider whether it is fair to keep her going, she is very poorly. I would hate for anyone to go through the heartache we are at the moment. Please make sure you buy a health tested pup, you will save yourself and your children so much heartache.


aww i'm so sorry for you & your little pup

please take note of this post you could save yourself a lot of heartache.


----------



## jeanie (Nov 11, 2007)

I also have a five gen pedigree for one of my dogs but no Kc reg i also got health tested vets papers on pup and parents and all the usual things he was not vaxinated i had that done on getting him , and he is a very healthy smashing dog, funny i know but the one i have with KC reg has exema is very hyper and nowhere near as healthy as the other dog the vet says as he hasent lost the exema with age hes 18mths it must be in parents genes as his brother whos my sons dog also has the same thing from the same litter so i really dont think KC is needed as long as they are health checked pups and the people are not bsb, so thats two totally different stories


----------



## cav (May 23, 2008)

hi
i own cavs ,please do not buy a none registerd dog as most good breeders register there pups.
im in the midlands and i can point you in the right direction if you are not to far from me.(im a member of the breed club)
make sure the dogs have been heart and eye tested ive also had one of mine mri scanned all this imformation is on the kc forms ive also got certificates,please make sure you see all this.
as members have pointed out cavs can suffer health problem so i is so important to go to a good breeder.
a cavalier is the most perfect family dog im glad you doing all this reserch and not just buying the first one you see.:thumbup:


----------



## Luvdogs (Aug 15, 2008)

Dundee said:


> OMG that's a rip off for a non KC registered untested bitch.
> 
> Most important thing is health tests - eye, heart and and mri scan for SM. The reality is that few if any non kc dogs are health tested, so for that reason alone it is worth sticking with KC registered dogs (but make sure they are health tested too as not all are).
> 
> ...


Completely agree, certainly making sure both parents are health tested is a must.


----------



## cav (May 23, 2008)

Ejay said:


> I can only echo how important finding a good breeder who health tests is, especially with a cavalier. I am sat here at the moment with my 10 month old pup who is extemely ill, she became ill the day i picked her up, and i have had no help or support from her breeder. She appeared to be a very caring lady, however this has somewhat been disproved since.
> 
> So many cavaliers suffer from MVD that heart tests are sooooo important, as are eye and MRI scans. All these tests should be done by specialists and the breeder should be able to provide you with the certificates to look through. You my pay another few hundered pounds, but for all the heartache you could go through, i am positive it is worth it ten fold.
> 
> My 10 month old cavalier is at a point where we are having to consider whether it is fair to keep her going, she is very poorly. I would hate for anyone to go through the heartache we are at the moment. Please make sure you buy a health tested pup, you will save yourself and your children so much heartache.


arr sorry to hear this

where did you get your dog from?
have you been back to the breeder?


----------



## Ejay (Jan 9, 2009)

cavrooney said:


> arr sorry to hear this
> 
> where did you get your dog from?
> have you been back to the breeder?


I can't state where i got her from, as i am currently trying to get the breeder to refund me her vet bills - needless to say the breeder is not really responding, i am in touch with cnsumer direct who have advised me of my next steps, and if i still don't get any joy then trading standards are likely to take the case on.

It's such a battle, it just highlights why it is so important to pick a good breeder.


----------



## justenuf (Jan 3, 2009)

We have Chloe, who although rescued was KC registered and so was the sire...... We have registered them today with the KC and it has cost us £78 for registration and pedigrees.......... We have no health tests on Chloe, for obvious reasons. The pups have been raised to the best of our abilities and seem healthy, but obviously, we would do all we could, in the future to help out anyone who has a problem due to breeding. I am not asking a fortune for them, just enough to cover (well nearly) costs......... I don't know what to say about not registering ......... I always do, I am proud of my pups.....I hope my faith proves me right with Chloes babies........... Good luck on whatever you decide x


----------



## candysmum (Jan 18, 2009)

Jess_king said:


> Hiya Guys
> Well im buying a cavalier king charles pup from someone off pets4homes and the pups are NOT kc registered, the breeder said they dont register there pups because they dont want then enterted in shows and to be breed.
> 
> They do come with there five generation pedigree pappers, 6 weeks free insurance with Petplan, full vet check, worming, a small supply of food and a puppy information pack.
> ...


HI

I am having a litter of dalmatians in the next 27 days or so. these will be Unregistered.

My reason is at the time i didn't know mum wasn't registered its a long long story thats on a thread here somewhere.

A reg Dally normally goes between £500 and £600 unregistered you can get them from £250 to £400 i have seen both. I have priced mine at £300 but i have told everyone the details of why these pups aren't going to be registered they have all been out to meet candy now before the litter is born. they all know IF i win my court case and get my KC paperwork for candy their pups will then get registered but its a bonus to them all.

what you have told us in this thread (i have only read a few post) i would question everything that has been said. the stories you have dont add up.

I was going to put an endorsement on my pups when i registered them but of course now i know they can be registered this wont happen unless i win my case. This endorsemen stops people breeding for money (or should it means the litter can't be registered that is bon to that dog)

i guess what i am trying to say is something doesn't ring true with me and the price is to much for an unregistered pup. i would hold off and buy from someone else.

they can't go home until 8 weeks is right though some people might let them go at 7weeks but 8 weeks is the normal thing.


----------



## Guest (Feb 17, 2009)

candysmum said:


> HI
> 
> I was going to put an endorsement on my pups when i registered them but of course now i know they can be registered this wont happen unless i win my case. This endorsemen stops people breeding for money (or should it means the litter can't be registered that is bon to that dog)
> 
> ...


I think we are still hoping that you do manage to get the registration sorted out in time for the pups going to their new homes - fingers crossed!

Re the breeding endorements- I do not know if I am right but have been told that these are pretty useless - unless you get a solicitor to prepare an indivual contract between yourself and each of the owners, (named)obviously the cost of this is going to be quite high.

Also policing such a contract I feel would be rather difficult 
regards
DT


----------



## Jess_king (Feb 17, 2009)

HELLO again..

i would just like to thank you all for your messages they have been a great help.. THANK YOU

just abit of an update...

i phoned the breeder this morning and asked if she would KC the pup for me i told her she can put endorsements on as i will not be breding or useing as a show dog (the pup will be a family pet)

And she said no she doesnt want them reg. 

and so i will NOT be buying my pup from them..


----------



## candysmum (Jan 18, 2009)

Jess_king said:


> HELLO again..
> 
> i would just like to thank you all for your messages they have been a great help.. THANK YOU
> 
> ...


its nice to hear we helpped somehow.

good luck in your search i know we have some CKC breeders on the forum.

maybe you could get in contact with someof them. i know one posted on this thread.

x


----------



## Guest (Feb 17, 2009)

Check out Chloes pups thread - they are registered - the story if you read it all will explain the situation surrounding these 'worthy' pups!
Every forum member is routing for these babies!!!
love
DT


----------



## Taylorbaby (Jan 10, 2009)

£500?!

Who ever buys them esp not health checked are crazy! 

not reg normally sell for £350? 

Id just pay a bit more for a top dog, fully health tested, you can find them about for less than that if you are willing to tavel


----------



## cav (May 23, 2008)

Ejay said:


> I can't state where i got her from, as i am currently trying to get the breeder to refund me her vet bills - needless to say the breeder is not really responding, i am in touch with cnsumer direct who have advised me of my next steps, and if i still don't get any joy then trading standards are likely to take the case on.
> 
> It's such a battle, it just highlights why it is so important to pick a good breeder.


well good luckhope you get some of the money back
im glad to hear you have reported her,breeders like her need a good slap


----------



## Biawhiska (Mar 28, 2008)

Jess_king said:


> Hiya Guys
> Well im buying a cavalier king charles pup from someone off pets4homes and the pups are NOT kc registered, the breeder said they dont register there pups because they dont want then enterted in shows and to be breed.
> 
> They do come with there five generation pedigree pappers, 6 weeks free insurance with Petplan, full vet check, worming, a small supply of food and a puppy information pack.
> ...


wouldn't touch with a barge pole


----------



## cav (May 23, 2008)

thanks for the pm
i will send you another with contact details.
carnt find a blenheim but ive found a ruby girl,the breeder shows her dogs.
she will be at crufts with her dogs this year so these are realy nice quality puppys
this is a good breeder.


----------

